Speaker 1: After we did our show in New Orleans, you guys
Speaker 1: left and rad show.
Speaker 2: By the way, my family came and met me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was such a fun, such a good show.
Speaker 1: Yeah, New Orleans. They came, brought the energy it was.
Speaker 1: It was a smaller crowd than we've had in other cities,
Speaker 1: but louder.
Speaker 4: Than absolutely and even more fun. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, such a blass.
Speaker 1: But then after my family came and met me, so
Speaker 1: Indie and uh my wife and then my sister in
Speaker 1: law were there and we did a swamp tour the
Speaker 1: next day.
Speaker 3: Was this on it?
Speaker 5: But we've talked about this, Was this on a fan boat?
Speaker 5: Like did you do the whole thing an airboat?
Speaker 3: Oh my god. I didn't know what to expect.
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, like like I swamps now, I
Speaker 1: think are beautiful there, maybe strangely gorgeous. I mean part
Speaker 1: of it is that the boat itself, I've never experienced
Speaker 1: something like because you're you're on the surface of the water,
Speaker 1: but you're going so fast and something about the way
Speaker 1: you're moving.
Speaker 6: It feels like you're flying.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're you know, like we kept sliding like you know,
Speaker 3: you took and it was like.
Speaker 7: Dad, it's Louisiana drift because like, you know, it's like
Speaker 7: Tokyo drifting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's Louisiana drift. But then, okay, so here's something
Speaker 1: I realized about myself, which is kind of absurd but true.
Speaker 1: Anytime in a landscape there's moss or lichen.
Speaker 6: I'm happy.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And so you're going through these trees that are hanging
Speaker 1: over you and they have that like moss hanging from
Speaker 1: it that you only get in the South, you know
Speaker 1: I'm talking about, like yeah, and.
Speaker 3: I look up and I'm just like, I am so happy.
Speaker 1: And it's the same with like, if there's ever like
Speaker 1: a pathway and has like moss growing on it, on
Speaker 1: the rocks or whatever, I'm happy. So I'm just really like,
Speaker 1: you know, you start, you get older, you start figuring
Speaker 1: out your your likes and dislikes.
Speaker 6: Me moss and liking. And there's moss a liking.
Speaker 5: I think I think it's your I think it's the
Speaker 5: mosses is telling you to root yourself.
Speaker 3: That's what is.
Speaker 5: As much as you like to wander, you know, when
Speaker 5: you sit, you grow the moss. So there's something inside
Speaker 5: of you that's saying.
Speaker 3: Settle down a little bit.
Speaker 5: Yeats, plants and roots and make it nice reading.
Speaker 8: I like it.
Speaker 3: Thank you. We also got to hold a baby alligator, which.
Speaker 4: Was crazy, just right out of the swamp.
Speaker 1: No, so you know, they they have they have when
Speaker 1: we like we you know, we do little sections. We're
Speaker 1: driving around and then they stop and then like a
Speaker 1: twelve foot alligator comes up to the boat and we're feeding.
Speaker 3: At marshmows and it's like mellows.
Speaker 4: Yeah they eat marshmallows.
Speaker 1: Yes, well they'll lead anything, but these tour guides throw
Speaker 1: marshmallows to you know, get But the second the boat stops,
Speaker 1: the alligators know it's.
Speaker 6: Coming, so they come for feeding time.
Speaker 3: It's crazy. I learned a lot about alligators.
Speaker 1: That's you know, at the point of the tour, and like,
Speaker 1: you know, you have one big alligator that has a territory,
Speaker 1: and then any other alligator has to be under six
Speaker 1: feet because the second the other alligators get over six feet,
Speaker 1: the big ones will eat them and just kill them.
Speaker 1: So like one big male that dominates the territory and
Speaker 1: then all these other little alligators so the big ones and.
Speaker 6: They can live to be like one hundred and twenty
Speaker 6: years old.
Speaker 3: Why it's crazy.
Speaker 1: But anyway, so you know, about like two thirds of
Speaker 1: the way through the tour, the where he's giving us
Speaker 1: all the information about alligators and we're learning all this stuff,
Speaker 1: and then he reaches under his seat until like a
Speaker 1: little bucket and pulls out a one year old baby alligator,
Speaker 1: which is just the cutest little lizard, and we all
Speaker 1: get to hold it. India almost drops it, which would
Speaker 1: have been a disaster because it's like, you know, then
Speaker 1: it would be in the boat and I.
Speaker 3: Don't know, but it was.
Speaker 1: It was fine, and you just hold it by its
Speaker 1: tail and they don't have like their bite. They haven't
Speaker 1: developed like a bite reaction yet, so they don't try
Speaker 1: and bite you or anything.
Speaker 6: They just they're just like a little lizard. He gets
Speaker 6: a hold and they're really soft.
Speaker 1: The alligator's skin would be like scaly, but at that
Speaker 1: is it's like super.
Speaker 6: Soft, and especially underneath especially I know.
Speaker 1: It's just it was one of those experiences that I
Speaker 1: love where at the beginning of the tour you see
Speaker 1: this twelve foot alligator swimming to the boat and everybody
Speaker 1: is screaming and running to the other side of the boat,
Speaker 1: including Indie, who's like, you know, I'm like, it's fine,
Speaker 1: it's fine. And then by the end of the tour,
Speaker 1: you're like holding a baby alligator. You've heard all about it,
Speaker 1: and you're like, I.
Speaker 6: Kind of think alligators are really special and need to be.
Speaker 1: Saved, and like, you know, it's just that classic like right,
Speaker 1: that's the point of this kind of educational exponential thing,
Speaker 1: is like. And then of course the ride home India
Speaker 1: and I are just pitching we've come up with an
Speaker 1: alligator video game where you're a baby alligator you hatched
Speaker 1: and you have to you know, we were going through
Speaker 1: the whole life cycle of an alligator, which is pretty brutal.
Speaker 1: There's only fifteen percent of them make it past maturity.
Speaker 8: You know.
Speaker 1: It's such a rough life. Yeah, because they're just born.
Speaker 1: There's no mom or the bomb lays the eggs and
Speaker 1: then just leaves them. So once they're born, you're on
Speaker 1: your own and then you're fighting for your life.
Speaker 3: Sometimes the mom.
Speaker 1: Will eat the babies if they're hungry enough, so you
Speaker 1: got to like, yeah, it's a rough.
Speaker 3: So they're all Shanes.
Speaker 4: Baby.
Speaker 5: In all fairness, I would swim up to any boat
Speaker 5: anytime if everyone in the boat just started throwing the marshmallows.
Speaker 3: Right, well that was Andy was like, well can we
Speaker 3: eat the marshmallows?
Speaker 1: He was upset and they were throwing into the alligators.
Speaker 9: Is there any downside to giving an alligator marshmallows? It
Speaker 9: doesn't seem like it has high nutritional value, Like they
Speaker 9: don't get they just digest.
Speaker 1: Them well, and these things are struggling to survive, like
Speaker 1: I think, you know, keeping them fed in any capacity
Speaker 1: is probably better than hot.
Speaker 9: Okay, all right, wow, well that sounds like a hard
Speaker 9: pass for me, But I'm so glad you had a
Speaker 9: good time.
Speaker 3: You wouldn't go. You wouldn't go fan boating.
Speaker 4: I would. It's just I wouldn't enjoy it, probably, but
Speaker 4: I would go.
Speaker 2: That's the point.
Speaker 3: I felt the same way. I was like, what is this?
Speaker 1: Like you say swamp and my mind is just like
Speaker 1: I think it's Dagoba and I'm miserable.
Speaker 3: But then I was in it. It was beautiful. It's
Speaker 3: it's it's someone says swamp to you.
Speaker 5: The first place you go is the Daga bus system,
Speaker 5: Yoda's planet.
Speaker 3: That's really in your mind. The first place you go
Speaker 3: is the fictional planet.
Speaker 9: No idea what he said, I just thought that was
Speaker 9: some weird word. I had never heard.
Speaker 5: Daga bus not just a planet, it's actually a system.
Speaker 5: But that's okay, we'll get okay.
Speaker 6: I haven't spent much time in swamp.
Speaker 1: I've never spent any time in swamps the Everglades in
Speaker 1: Florida or any of that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3: No, so this was it, Like, yeah, and this is
Speaker 3: about the first part of the Pirates of the Caribbean ride.
Speaker 3: That's all swamp.
Speaker 4: I like that.
Speaker 3: That's's a fictional ride supposed to tame thing. Yes, exactly.
Speaker 1: My reference points are not real, so having a real
Speaker 1: reference point isn't nice.
Speaker 3: That's the point of traveling, right, Yeah, yeah, you know,
Speaker 3: they're cool.
Speaker 5: I did that in the Everglades, and you kind of
Speaker 5: start you do the same thing, and you learn about
Speaker 5: all the nature and and about the animals around you,
Speaker 5: and it's the same thing. We're looking at the alligators
Speaker 5: and all that stuff, and then you end at a
Speaker 5: restaurant that serves gator and frog legs and all that
Speaker 5: kind of stuff, and you eat a basket of it
Speaker 5: and you're like, you're kind of sad is doing it,
Speaker 5: But at the same time, it's like this all taste
Speaker 5: like chicken.
Speaker 1: Well, we got a lot of conversation about sustainable farming
Speaker 1: of alligators, which is done, and they have a fifteen
Speaker 1: percent of bible rate. They return them to the wild.
Speaker 1: They raise them, and then they return fifteen percent of
Speaker 1: them to the wild. And they have proven that if
Speaker 1: they are raised in captivity and they are then released
Speaker 1: to the wild, they survive perfectly fine in the wild.
Speaker 1: So they're actually raising them at the same rate that
Speaker 1: they're actually surviving in the wild. So you know, they're
Speaker 1: released at six feet and they never they never for
Speaker 1: leather and for food.
Speaker 3: They don't ever kill them after they're six feet long,
Speaker 3: so they.
Speaker 1: Know it's the same. It's sustainably done. It's really interesting
Speaker 1: to cool.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I hear swamp and I think spiders, which is
Speaker 9: the main reason why I wouldn't want to go. And
Speaker 9: I just know if there are spiders, hot wet areas
Speaker 9: like just seem like screaming.
Speaker 5: So jungle doesn't work. See, I think jungle's more spider.
Speaker 5: I think swamp is more snake.
Speaker 9: Yeah, okay, all right, that you saved me. That sounds better.
Speaker 9: I'm not really that scared of snakes.
Speaker 6: Okay, there you go.
Speaker 4: I'm in Welcome to Pod Meets World, I'm Daniel.
Speaker 3: Fishl, I'm Right or Strong, and I'm Wilfredoe.
Speaker 9: So a few months back, when we listed off members
Speaker 9: of the elite Boy Meets World Three Timers Club, a
Speaker 9: group composed of actors who appeared on the show three
Speaker 9: times but played three different characters, the guys immediately thought
Speaker 9: of Willie Garson, Hillary Tuck, and possibly Phil Leads. Then
Speaker 9: we inducted Katie Johnson aka fish Girl, to the club.
Speaker 9: But then we remembered this week's guest. During our season
Speaker 9: two recaps in the absence of one Stuart Minkus, we
Speaker 9: noticed that producers appeared to want to keep some nerds around,
Speaker 9: and they did that with one actor. Whether he was
Speaker 9: named Herbert Simon or Alvin, this kid was every dork
Speaker 9: and he played it well and for good reason. Ironically,
Speaker 9: he may have been the most accomplished child actor we
Speaker 9: cast at that point in the show, arguably ever, at
Speaker 9: just twelve years old, he took Broadway by storm in
Speaker 9: the musical Falsettos as the original Jason, a role that
Speaker 9: would make him one of the youngest Tony Award nominees ever.
Speaker 9: He'd return to Broadway a few years later in the
Speaker 9: Diary of Anne Frank as the original Peter Van Dnn
Speaker 9: opposite Natalie Portman. Then would find himself joining the national
Speaker 9: tour of The Graduate, taking over for one Rider Strong
Speaker 9: and playing the role of Benjamin for nine months and
Speaker 9: three Missus Robinson's did I mention he studied drama at
Speaker 9: Stanford and Yale and is a member of Mensa, And
Speaker 9: yet for some reason, this theatrical wonder kind joined Our
Speaker 9: Little Friday Night Show for four season two episodes as
Speaker 9: three characters back to School, the Uninvited, I Am Not
Speaker 9: a Crook and on the air. He'd also appear on
Speaker 9: Babylon five, Brotherly Love, The Blacklist, and Lawn Order SVU.
Speaker 9: Where get this he played three friend characters.
Speaker 2: That's a New York tradition.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was, of course.
Speaker 9: We are proud to welcome to Pod meets World. Someone
Speaker 9: it took over one year to track down. It's Jonathan C.
Speaker 4: Kaplan.
Speaker 3: I always get Mensa and Menudo, which is probably why I'm.
Speaker 9: I think it's way easier to be in Menudo.
Speaker 1: The high level of sophistication on our podcast, Welcome.
Speaker 3: To see Man, Welcome than you.
Speaker 9: We are so thrilled that you are here, and we
Speaker 9: probably look slightly obsessed because we truly hunted you down.
Speaker 9: You saw our message over a year after we had
Speaker 9: originally sent it, right.
Speaker 2: That's right, because I checked Facebook Messenger almost never, So
Speaker 2: that's a healthy way to be here.
Speaker 9: We tried other means it just thankfully the Facebook messenger
Speaker 9: finally made it.
Speaker 3: How old are we were?
Speaker 5: It's like you didn't You didn't see our I am like,
Speaker 5: get this.
Speaker 9: Well during our season two rewatch, we were so happy
Speaker 9: to see you so frequently. Did you know that you
Speaker 9: had played three different characters in one season.
Speaker 2: There's a good question throughout the season. My name's kept changing, right,
Speaker 2: like Alvin Simon and I didn't quite have a Theodore,
Speaker 2: but I was yeah, but the full set, but it
Speaker 2: was I didn't realize that going into it, but it
Speaker 2: was a nice surprise. Every time I'd show up and
Speaker 2: have like a new character name, I'd be like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is fun, but essentially the same character, right essentially?
Speaker 8: Yeah? Right?
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 9: So in your intro, we went over your truly remarkable
Speaker 9: resume as a child actor, and we wondered how you
Speaker 9: felt being around true professionals on Broadway and then coming
Speaker 9: to work with us, did you notice a difference at all.
Speaker 2: Well, I have to say that, like there are there
Speaker 2: are pluses in both categories, right, Okay, So the Broadway
Speaker 2: performers are it's very much like a machine, right you
Speaker 2: you are. I think other actors have talked about this
Speaker 2: recently when they when they do eight shows a week,
Speaker 2: it's like they do nothing else outside of those eight shows,
Speaker 2: because it takes your everything, right, And then we got
Speaker 2: onto the set for Boy Meant's World, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is fun. It was not that Broadway isn't fun,
Speaker 2: but it's it's a lot of work, right. Youre constantly
Speaker 2: like concerned about your instrument and like keeping everything healthy.
Speaker 2: And meanwhile I get to set, you know, with you guys,
Speaker 2: and it's like, oh, this is actually like there's a
Speaker 2: fun element to this. It's like it's just as exciting
Speaker 2: as being in front of a live studio audience. It's
Speaker 2: also incredibly fun at the same time. Like we're doing
Speaker 2: you know, schooling together, we're doing the takes together. And
Speaker 2: each scene that we did, particularly the one where I
Speaker 2: was hit by the each of the doors was you know,
Speaker 2: one of the highlights of my career. I never thought
Speaker 2: i'd say that, but because it was so.
Speaker 9: Fun, right, Yeah, you know, writer went on for years
Speaker 9: still to this day. If given a good opportunity, Writer
Speaker 9: will do the door and a doorsmack it doors.
Speaker 3: I love it.
Speaker 4: It's one of his favorite things ever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a great party trick.
Speaker 3: It is.
Speaker 9: So do you remember auditioning for Boy Meets World? Were
Speaker 9: you familiar with the show at all?
Speaker 2: So? I was familiar with the show. I knew what
Speaker 2: it was. I knew, I knew about it, you know,
Speaker 2: I knew. I knew you're going to ask about the audition.
Speaker 2: And it's so funny. I heard you guys talking about
Speaker 2: this earlier, and it's so true. The things that we
Speaker 2: remember from from that time period makes zero sense. Like
Speaker 2: I can tell you about the car ride to the audition.
Speaker 2: I can tell you about what happened. I remember, like
Speaker 2: going and talking to the security guard beforehand, like while
Speaker 2: getting onto the set, and it was like I remember,
Speaker 2: I remember those kinds of experiences, But I couldn't tell you.
Speaker 1: Were you coming from New York or like, so, were
Speaker 1: you moved? Were you already living in LA Like how
Speaker 1: did that happen?
Speaker 2: Okay? So, I have a roundabout history. So I started
Speaker 2: in Northern California. And I was going to say this
Speaker 2: to the end, but I do have to tell you
Speaker 2: that my most heartbreaking loss as an actor came at
Speaker 2: the ripe ol day age of nine, when I was
Speaker 2: living in Northern California, and I just happened to audition
Speaker 2: for Le Miz. Oh no, And I don't know if
Speaker 2: you're aware of this, but the other person who actually
Speaker 2: ended up booking it is on this call right now.
Speaker 4: Oh, you auditioned for Gavroche.
Speaker 8: Time.
Speaker 2: I am positive we saw each other writing. Yeah, we
Speaker 2: must have auditioned in the same room. We must have
Speaker 2: seen each other and other auditions then. Oh but it
Speaker 2: was like I was like your name and I was like,
Speaker 2: no way, it's the same writer Stromp And so it
Speaker 2: was like it was so cool, Like the the idea
Speaker 2: of like the opportunity to like work with you again
Speaker 2: would be like fantastic. So that's amazing.
Speaker 1: Okay, So but that's funny because then Aaron Metchick, who
Speaker 1: also ended up a guest starring on our show. He
Speaker 1: auditioned that same day in San Francisco, so like three
Speaker 1: of us, Oh my god, that's so crazy.
Speaker 3: That's so crazy, yo.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it was great, Like it was literally not
Speaker 2: like I think that it was. It was the least
Speaker 2: competitive I've ever been, But it was like started in
Speaker 2: northern California, moved to New York, did Falsettos and a
Speaker 2: bunch of off Broadway shows in New York, then moved
Speaker 2: back to California to go to high school. And while
Speaker 2: like junior high and high school, and then while I
Speaker 2: was out there, I was doing The boy Mets World.
Speaker 1: So did you move to New York to pursue a
Speaker 1: theater career like your family?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 2: Wow, kind of like we moved for a summer to
Speaker 2: see what would happen. Because I had done like twenty
Speaker 2: two shows in the Bay Area, like in two years,
Speaker 2: just like one college production after another, just like back
Speaker 2: to back Shakespeare musicals. I did the opera, the San
Speaker 2: Francisco Opera at twelve. I was literally nine.
Speaker 5: Oh man, you did reverse pilot season. You went to
Speaker 5: New York to see what was going to happen.
Speaker 2: It's exactly such a thing to do, exactly. I was
Speaker 2: following the theater like tailwa, so I was. I went
Speaker 2: to New York to try it out there, and I
Speaker 2: booked Rags, which is the off railway version of what
Speaker 2: they were hoping to bring to Broadway again. That was
Speaker 2: performed at the American Jewish Theater, which then became the
Speaker 2: Opera Citizens Brigade Theater, which is built underneath a supermarket,
Speaker 2: so during all the quiet moments, you can hear the
Speaker 2: carts being pushed. Oh, what's on special that day? Happens
Speaker 2: like just after the intro, but yeah it. So I
Speaker 2: went to New York to do that and then got Rags.
Speaker 2: And after Rags, was called in by the Weislers to
Speaker 2: audition Foot Pauls. And the audition for Falsettos was like
Speaker 2: a two month process. Oh my god, just memorize a
Speaker 2: different song for every audition, and then by the time
Speaker 2: we got to the rehearsal, we knew the whole score.
Speaker 1: Oh geez, you were such a pro. When you showed
Speaker 1: up on our set, we cannot believe.
Speaker 7: Wait, but had you been on Nickelodeon, like let's I
Speaker 7: can't believe. And we had no idea, Like I still
Speaker 7: had no idea until we got the notes for today.
Speaker 3: We were like Tony Tony nominated what before he was
Speaker 3: on Boy beats World, Like, wow, is this big? And
Speaker 3: now you're Yeah, I cannot believe.
Speaker 1: The level of professionalism that you were walking under our set.
Speaker 1: We must have just seemed like the craziest group.
Speaker 5: Can We also, though, very briefly, talk about how great
Speaker 5: the casting director was for Ley Miss up North.
Speaker 3: I mean, everybody auditioned for that became it was it
Speaker 3: was an open casting call, dude.
Speaker 1: So it was literally just every kid who was doing
Speaker 1: theater at that age, just like we lined up. I
Speaker 1: got there like five in the morning and it was
Speaker 1: just a line of kids.
Speaker 2: But yeah, think about what was in the water, like
Speaker 2: that much kind of of northern California at that time.
Speaker 2: Oh man, I look at the other actors who I
Speaker 2: knew from that that period, you know, and some of
Speaker 2: them are still in the business, but like they're all
Speaker 2: incredibly accomplished, you know. It's it's fascinating.
Speaker 9: I mean, you had way more in common with Bill
Speaker 9: Daniels any of us.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like on her set too, it was just
Speaker 3: Quinn a little bit different.
Speaker 9: But wow, okay, I do I do want to talk
Speaker 9: about the Tony a little bit. You were nominated for
Speaker 9: a Tony at twelve years old, and we talk a
Speaker 9: lot about our experience being on TV and our teens,
Speaker 9: But what was it like being a part of such
Speaker 9: such a successful Broadway show at such a young age?
Speaker 9: What is the atmosphere of being there?
Speaker 2: Like, well, it's it's really like the theater community as
Speaker 2: a whole is incredibly welcoming, right, So I just rely
Speaker 2: went to a Sardi signing for Chip sign where he
Speaker 2: got his picture up on the Sardi's wall, and it
Speaker 2: was just like everyone from his career came to celebrate
Speaker 2: him as part of this like grand you know, gesture,
Speaker 2: and it was amazing to see like the extent of
Speaker 2: his career, how many shows he had been in, and
Speaker 2: like the actors who came to this thing were amazing.
Speaker 2: But that's really what the artistic community was like for
Speaker 2: the theater anyway. They're incredibly welcoming. It's this big you know,
Speaker 2: everyone knows each other and is excited for other people's success.
Speaker 2: Like some of the actors who were there had to leave,
Speaker 2: you know, at six thirty because they had a curtain
Speaker 2: at seven and they were walking across the street to
Speaker 2: the theater and it was just like it's what you did,
Speaker 2: you know, And the Tonys were an exciting thing because
Speaker 2: I don't think they do this anymore. I'm not really sure.
Speaker 2: But when we did it then it was obviously a
Speaker 2: live recording and we were performing after the you know,
Speaker 2: awards were announced, performing live a number from Falsetto's, and
Speaker 2: they would announce where the Tonys were being seen and
Speaker 2: by how many millions of people in every country after
Speaker 2: they would announce it, so it was like today in
Speaker 2: the United States, seventy two million people are watching the Tonies.
Speaker 9: Wow.
Speaker 2: Oh you can feel like the pressure and the nerves
Speaker 2: like start to get to your stomach as they're announcing
Speaker 2: these things, and you're like, okay, all right, I've done this,
Speaker 2: done this on hundred times. You should be able to
Speaker 2: be able to do it now. Sure.
Speaker 4: How did your parents deal with all of this?
Speaker 2: Good questions? So one of them was always working on
Speaker 2: the opposite coast. So my dad at the time was
Speaker 2: going to Stanford to business school, and my mom was
Speaker 2: a corporate lawyer before, and so she took time off
Speaker 2: to take us to New York and like follow where
Speaker 2: in New York. Uh, and my dad stayed in California
Speaker 2: started a business there.
Speaker 8: Uh.
Speaker 2: And then my when I got old enough, I had
Speaker 2: to take over my own career. My mom then stayed
Speaker 2: in California and my dad started a business in Alaska.
Speaker 2: So it was like they're constantly working like all over
Speaker 2: the place. It was a it was a constant game
Speaker 2: of taghow And were they into theater?
Speaker 3: Is that where it came from?
Speaker 2: Like they got you? And yeah, they were both the
Speaker 2: community theater. And I remember my first role was in
Speaker 2: a community theater production of All the Way Home, which
Speaker 2: is I don't know if anyone knows it, but it's
Speaker 2: a very sad show about the depression. Uh, And I
Speaker 2: played a five year old child with no lines. My
Speaker 2: whole role was to run on stage, play with the
Speaker 2: main kid, hug my grandmother, and run off again. And
Speaker 2: being that I was five years old, I had a
Speaker 2: smile on my face the entire time. That sounds fun,
Speaker 2: I like playing. So I ran on stage, huge smile
Speaker 2: and all the old ladies thought it was adorable. So
Speaker 2: a lot of pinches on the cheek after.
Speaker 5: That, of course, And that's what coming you said, You
Speaker 5: said us, did you have a brothers and sisters that
Speaker 5: were doing this with you?
Speaker 2: Or yes, yes, my sister she essentially become a very
Speaker 2: successful psychologist at Stanford, and she is now like she
Speaker 2: she did nor in Northern California. She did Tale of
Speaker 2: Two Cities. She's like on the on the cover of
Speaker 2: the publication for the San Francisco Weekly or whatever. She's
Speaker 2: like being held as the child who is hit and
Speaker 2: title Tale two Cities.
Speaker 9: Wow, Oh my gosh, Okay, I want to go back
Speaker 9: to Boy Meets World now for just a little bit.
Speaker 9: So your first episode is back to School, which was
Speaker 9: a bit of a reset for us on the podcast.
Speaker 9: We had going from season one into season two, we
Speaker 9: had what we called dropshock big time. So your playing
Speaker 9: a nerd named Herbert. Do you remember anything about that week?
Speaker 2: I remember a lot of the physical stuff, right, It
Speaker 2: was like there was the doors and the being hit
Speaker 2: by the various doors. I also remember, and I know
Speaker 2: you guys were like totally joking about about the professionalism,
Speaker 2: but I like, as soon as I got onto set,
Speaker 2: I was like, Oh, it's it's a whole different ballgame here,
Speaker 2: Like this is completely different from like anything else that
Speaker 2: I'd ever done. Because you guys had such great chemistry.
Speaker 2: It was like all I had to do was just
Speaker 2: kind of show up and do my thing, and you
Speaker 2: guys were like fireworks all the time, because mostly most
Speaker 2: of the time it takes like, you know, a month
Speaker 2: of rehearsals for actress to get together to find that
Speaker 2: chemistry make that work on stage. But by the time
Speaker 2: I got there, you guys were like, on it done.
Speaker 9: We also had for season two was still David Trainer.
Speaker 9: I was going to say, I wonder if Jeff McCracken,
Speaker 9: we were so yeah, so David trainor was was still
Speaker 9: our director. Then you're back just four episodes later for
Speaker 9: The Uninvited. Again you're playing a nerd, but now you're
Speaker 9: named Simon and you're connecting with Sean about being left
Speaker 9: out from a party. Do you remember how that episode happened.
Speaker 9: You didn't have to audition again, did you.
Speaker 2: No, No, they would just call me back. And I
Speaker 2: remember that Boyman's World was one of the ones that
Speaker 2: was relatively short notice. So I was essentially like, like
Speaker 2: on the Wednesday of like the week before, they were like,
Speaker 2: so you're gonna come in, You're gonna do another another episode,
Speaker 2: Like okay, okay, again, this is like early on in TV,
Speaker 2: so I was like, I guess this is how it works.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's so interesting to think about because Michael
Speaker 1: Jacobs was such a theater guy and theater fan, and
Speaker 1: he must have just been so impressed with you that.
Speaker 3: He was like, let's get him on here, let's let's
Speaker 3: bring him back, let's get get it, and you like
Speaker 3: must have been on hit. But it's so funny, be Causina.
Speaker 1: We never knew that, like, it never occurred to us,
Speaker 1: but I'm sure he was like, get that kid.
Speaker 9: Well, I'm sure Michael saw his resume. So the first
Speaker 9: time he auditioned, Michael probably saw your resume and was just.
Speaker 4: Like, whoa, this is amazing.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we have to start keeping a list of all
Speaker 5: the incredible things we were completely and totally oblivious to
Speaker 5: as kids, so many things, because it's just it would
Speaker 5: be miles long at this point, unbelievable. Do you remember
Speaker 5: Michael did he Did he talk to you about theater
Speaker 5: at all.
Speaker 2: Or do Yeah? Yeah, we did have conversations about theater,
Speaker 2: and he asked about like specific people. He'd be like, so,
Speaker 2: how is you know Michael doing or something like that. Wow, Michael,
Speaker 2: But again it's you know, a conversation from thirty years ago.
Speaker 2: I remember, I remember the dressing room, but I can't remember,
Speaker 2: you know, exactly what we talked about.
Speaker 4: You know, right, I don't remember the dressing room.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I kind of do for season two, but this
Speaker 5: is so I'm not sure we asked this, and we
Speaker 5: probably should then because you're right, you never know what
Speaker 5: sticks in your brain, what doesn't stick in your brain,
Speaker 5: what goes. What's your strongest memory from being on the
Speaker 5: set of Boy mel Okay?
Speaker 2: So I remember, uh, I remember the bullies, remember shoes
Speaker 2: that we had on our episodes. They were like, again,
Speaker 2: he's had a very successful career since but like the
Speaker 2: larger bully like he's he has been, you know, so
Speaker 2: great to see his career like and where it's gone.
Speaker 2: But he walked onto that set and was like, Oh,
Speaker 2: that's You've got this this part down. It is like
Speaker 2: the question is to like what you're doing. And he
Speaker 2: revised that role over and over again on the episode,
Speaker 2: and I was like, Oh, it's it's almost like watching
Speaker 2: you know, somebody like step into a shoe that's made
Speaker 2: for them, right, It's like it's just it just happens.
Speaker 2: It just works. And I remember like coming on to set,
Speaker 2: particularly with Boy Meets World and it just kept happening,
Speaker 2: like the people would would match their role so incredibly
Speaker 2: well and you didn't have to think.
Speaker 9: About it right and that Yeah, I mean the casting
Speaker 9: was incredible. That was Ethan's first job, in his first
Speaker 9: episode of his first job ever. First day, Yeah, was
Speaker 9: was there and we all felt the same way.
Speaker 3: It's like, oh, these guys are good, right, yeah, to.
Speaker 5: The point where my dad thought I was gonna be
Speaker 5: written off the show because they were so good.
Speaker 4: These are the guys, these are the guys.
Speaker 2: Happening.
Speaker 9: So at this point, as we've mentioned, you had already
Speaker 9: been nominated for a Tony, but TV was newer to you.
Speaker 9: So was it cool then to see yourself on TV?
Speaker 9: Did you watch the episodes when they aired initially?
Speaker 2: Yes? I did because I thought it was, you know,
Speaker 2: kind of fun to do. And you get like a
Speaker 2: little group together and you watch together and you're like,
Speaker 2: that was cool.
Speaker 7: Uh.
Speaker 2: And you know, I've heard you guys talk about this
Speaker 2: before on the podcast, but you see these things and
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, man, I wish I could redo that take.
Speaker 2: Like there's certain moments and again it's not the entire thing,
Speaker 2: but you're like, you see a moment you're like, oh,
Speaker 2: miss that one. Right, it's so so there. There is
Speaker 2: that that keep talking about the big mouth character of
Speaker 2: like the regret master, right, and but it's you have
Speaker 2: this this thing that comes in and you're like, oh, man,
Speaker 2: I really I shouldn't watch myself anymore. So I actually
Speaker 2: I've stopped watching or listening to myself, and it's it's
Speaker 2: healthier that way. Think.
Speaker 4: Yeah, writer discovered that as a team as well.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, stop watching. I only watched a little bit
Speaker 3: of the first season.
Speaker 2: I was like, no, exactly right.
Speaker 5: I watch everything I've been in, and in my head
Speaker 5: I put myself and stuff I wasn't in.
Speaker 3: That's good God, it was incredible Star Wars. This is damn.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 5: But speaking of that, because of the way I am
Speaker 5: with television and my memory of TV, which episodes of
Speaker 5: s VU did you do? Were you old school SVU?
Speaker 5: Were you Olivia Benson's now the captain of the squad
Speaker 5: s VU? Where did you.
Speaker 3: Fall in in this this category?
Speaker 2: So again talking about great casting directors, right, So Jonathan
Speaker 2: Strauss is the casting rec means cast directed prayers for
Speaker 2: you and he's great, Like I had a class with
Speaker 2: him very early on in kind of my time in
Speaker 2: New York, and we just kind of kept in touch, right,
Speaker 2: and every once in a while a random part would
Speaker 2: show off and he'd be like, Jonathan, come on, come
Speaker 2: on in for this. And I'd auditioned for something and
Speaker 2: I was like, there's no way I'm going to get this.
Speaker 2: This is like a you know, a husband's who's taking
Speaker 2: care of his pregnant wife and we're going to the
Speaker 2: hospital to take care of somebody else. And I auditioned
Speaker 2: for it and it goes really well, and I have
Speaker 2: no idea what character, like I am personally right, but
Speaker 2: he clearly sees something different. It's just great casting. And
Speaker 2: I've been SVU from the early days to the mid days,
Speaker 2: not so much in the later days, but like.
Speaker 3: Who are you in the early ones? Which episode did you?
Speaker 9: I need to know the specific episode.
Speaker 3: I want to know what it is.
Speaker 2: So there was one where I was playing like a
Speaker 2: paralegal and we were talking about like a possibly corrupt
Speaker 2: judge and we were talking about the ins and outs
Speaker 2: of like the our day to day and Benson was
Speaker 2: talking to me about some detail and I had a
Speaker 2: response that they did this like double pan with two
Speaker 2: cameras on either side to like not catch each other
Speaker 2: like one continuous take that we had to do. Okay.
Speaker 2: And and the thing I love and can't stand about
Speaker 2: TV is that everyone talks about this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, everyone, especially on copy.
Speaker 2: So if you're standing in a big room and have
Speaker 2: like wait for someone's cue to like pick up your line,
Speaker 2: you're like, I have no idea I'm supposed to be.
Speaker 3: You didn't watch yourself on the episode? Did you know?
Speaker 2: I didn't.
Speaker 8: I was going to say, you still have not told
Speaker 8: me what episode it is? You don't know what episode.
Speaker 3: I wish these people would project. We're some good old
Speaker 3: theater training. These TV actors don't know so much fun.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna have to google Google now. Okay.
Speaker 9: So then towards the end of season two, you come back,
Speaker 9: this time in a much bigger role, now as Alva
Speaker 9: running against Corey in the school election.
Speaker 4: For I am not a crook, and.
Speaker 9: This felt more like a role your talent deserved. Finally,
Speaker 9: do you remember this week at all? And and do
Speaker 9: you have any memories from that week?
Speaker 2: I do. I do remember like playing Alvin because Alvin
Speaker 2: was where it felt more like an actual.
Speaker 3: Characters.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it had some I had some like conflict and
Speaker 2: there was some some actual scenes happening, and you know,
Speaker 2: rather than just being kind of the slapstick comedy, it
Speaker 2: was like, Okay, I get to work with these actors.
Speaker 2: And I remember really relishing in that because it was like, oh, okay,
Speaker 2: I've gotten to have some fun up until now. Now
Speaker 2: let's kind of dig in.
Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, finally you had you had something to do.
Speaker 9: So when we recapped the episode, Will shared kind of
Speaker 9: a dropped a bombshell on me with something he remembered
Speaker 9: that I absolutely did not remember, which was that during
Speaker 9: the live studio audience taping, I kept in that part
Speaker 9: where I kind of jump up to filibuster a speech,
Speaker 9: I had a bit of a breakdown and I left
Speaker 9: stage crying, and I was wondering if you remember any
Speaker 9: of that.
Speaker 2: I do remember something about like I remember seeing like
Speaker 2: some commotion happening, but I do remember you breaking down.
Speaker 2: But I do remember you like leaving. Yeah, okay, I
Speaker 2: don't don't remember the breakdown though.
Speaker 4: Oh that's okay, that's all right. Listen, we all have.
Speaker 9: We all have things happened anyway. Almost if you walk down,
Speaker 9: it doesn't affect you. Everyone knows that if the trauma
Speaker 9: is so severe, you block it out.
Speaker 2: I woke up today, so everything's yeah, right.
Speaker 5: Just don't approach Dan y'all from her left side or
Speaker 5: make any sudden movements, and you're fine, no trauma at all.
Speaker 4: Do you ever get recognized for Boy Meets World.
Speaker 2: Only because the not because of anything else I have?
Speaker 2: I have to say, So, what I've been doing a
Speaker 2: lot recently is I've been working at a high school.
Speaker 2: I'm directing their theater productions, and it's been a real
Speaker 2: lovely shift to like being able to introduce a lot
Speaker 2: of students to the things that I love about theater.
Speaker 2: And I have to say that I've kind of been
Speaker 2: blindsided when somebody comes up to me is like I
Speaker 2: saw you as Alvin yesterday, and I'm like, oh, okay,
Speaker 2: all right, I'm still out there. Right, It's it is
Speaker 2: still out there. And I love when that happens because
Speaker 2: it's like the kids. I realized that, like all these
Speaker 2: episodes were filmed before the kids were even born. Yes,
Speaker 2: crazy right, yes, yes, but like it's really nice to
Speaker 2: see that it still has a reach, see that like
Speaker 2: that these episodes are still making their way into the
Speaker 2: the viewing, you know, population of like, what what are
Speaker 2: the high schoolers right now? Yeah? Yeah, oh yeah not
Speaker 2: ski vide Ohio. That's all I have to say about that.
Speaker 9: Yeah, it is still my favorite thing that happens when
Speaker 9: very young people recognize me and I will think, how
Speaker 9: is it possible that they know about Boy Meets World?
Speaker 9: But then they'll come up to me and they'll say,
Speaker 9: excuse me, are you the mom from Girl Meets World.
Speaker 9: It's like a right, a full solid you don't even
Speaker 9: know about Boy Meets World, or if you do, it's
Speaker 9: only because your parent walked in while you were watching
Speaker 9: Girl Meets World and said, you know, the one you
Speaker 9: should be watching is this one, and then directed them
Speaker 9: back to Boy Meets World.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's still happening.
Speaker 1: I feel like everybody I meet now, if they've watched
Speaker 1: Girl Met World, they've gone back to Boy Meets World,
Speaker 1: Like I feel like it's been enough time. Like when
Speaker 1: it was on the air, I can see that, But
Speaker 1: now I feel like everyone knows the.
Speaker 4: Association, right, Not not.
Speaker 3: Sure people that just are girl fans.
Speaker 9: Yes, I get people that know me specifically because they've
Speaker 9: only watched Girl Meets World.
Speaker 4: And they know that I'm the mom on that show.
Speaker 9: And even then it's like it's it's I actually love
Speaker 9: it because they're very aware that, like I'm not the
Speaker 9: star of the show. It feels like, yeah, you were
Speaker 9: on that that show. I love that show. I love
Speaker 9: those kids, and you were there. It's great.
Speaker 5: By the way, just for the record, you were on
Speaker 5: in two thousand and six episode called Gone Going for.
Speaker 3: SBU that is that is the one that is the
Speaker 3: takeaway I can still get the residual checks, the names
Speaker 3: them all. Yeah, that five cents fifteen.
Speaker 5: Yeah, this is based on the Natalie Holloway case, so
Speaker 5: they you know, because everything, of course is ripped from
Speaker 5: the headlines.
Speaker 2: Oh right, that was That was the one where I
Speaker 2: was taking care of my pregnant wife to the hospital
Speaker 2: and she comes in it is yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, the one I think we're taking your pregnant life.
Speaker 3: That's witness.
Speaker 2: That's witness.
Speaker 5: That's right, that's Witness because that's the one where they
Speaker 5: have to find nartily to come back.
Speaker 3: To Can you quote lines from it?
Speaker 7: Will?
Speaker 3: Can you do you want to? So?
Speaker 5: So she gets cut in the hands during Witness and
Speaker 5: she ends up getting MRSA and he says well, how
Speaker 5: bad is it? And she goes if she has family,
Speaker 5: you have to call them now, and she ends up
Speaker 5: dying like ten seconds later, gone, which which seemed you
Speaker 5: want me to do this sadness.
Speaker 4: I don't understand this is true.
Speaker 3: I think in TV. I think in TV.
Speaker 2: Day like as your day happens, does it like start
Speaker 2: to come out in like final script or like how
Speaker 2: does that? How does that work?
Speaker 3: It is? It's I don't.
Speaker 5: I God love my wife. I don't know how she
Speaker 5: does it? Sometimes because I do. I think in TV,
Speaker 5: I can literally when I looked up all three of
Speaker 5: your episodes, I am now in my head watching all
Speaker 5: three of your episodes.
Speaker 1: I mean literally, and so is that because you watched
Speaker 1: them over and over like you have watched it.
Speaker 5: I haven't watched SVU in years, but once I see
Speaker 5: something that I've seen more than once, then it just
Speaker 5: pops into my head again.
Speaker 3: So yeah, so gone is?
Speaker 5: I mean I can see the powder blue shirt that
Speaker 5: you're wearing and the green jacket that you have over
Speaker 5: your shirt when you come in with your wife.
Speaker 3: Okay, only you could.
Speaker 6: Harness this to some.
Speaker 3: Like program where we needed answers.
Speaker 7: We should get me will for now on the line,
Speaker 7: we need to know what episode you What was the line?
Speaker 5: Yeah, he comes in because she's hitting on she the
Speaker 5: wife thinks he's hitting on her on him, honestly.
Speaker 4: If he doesn't get it out, we have to deal
Speaker 4: with it later.
Speaker 3: And then.
Speaker 5: And Witness was also important because it was it was
Speaker 5: the Da, the woman who plays a DA.
Speaker 3: It was her final episode for a while.
Speaker 5: She comes and she actually disappears for a while and
Speaker 5: then comes back.
Speaker 4: Anything else will.
Speaker 2: I think?
Speaker 3: I'm good?
Speaker 4: Okay, okay, I'm good for now.
Speaker 5: I'm We won't get into Beautiful Frame, which was your
Speaker 5: third episode, but there you go.
Speaker 3: Okay, So I'm good, I'm all right.
Speaker 4: Okay.
Speaker 9: So taking it back to some of your characters from
Speaker 9: Boy Meets World, were you going out for a lot
Speaker 9: of nerd roles back then?
Speaker 2: Yes, So, you know, because because this is how you're
Speaker 2: kind of people see that you're successful in one role
Speaker 2: like pigeonholed. I want to say that, let's make it
Speaker 2: a term, right. They see that you're successful in one
Speaker 2: role and they're like, oh, okay, let's let's keep him
Speaker 2: going on that treadmill. So essentially I came out for
Speaker 2: a lot of nerd roles and continue to play kind
Speaker 2: of nerdy characters in a lot of the different shows
Speaker 2: that I did.
Speaker 5: Were you a nerd? Because as a nerd, I'm curious
Speaker 5: were you? I mean did you like fantasy and comic books.
Speaker 8: And D and D?
Speaker 3: And was this year?
Speaker 2: Yes a thousand percent? And I I mean the production
Speaker 2: that I just directed at the high school was She
Speaker 2: Kills Monsters, which is all about D and D. So
Speaker 2: you know, it's like it is I that is my wheelhouse.
Speaker 2: I love it. And I guess I'm a nerd. I mean,
Speaker 2: I am a member of MENSAH great like, yeah, it's true.
Speaker 2: I don't know, it's nerd used to have that kind
Speaker 2: of like negative connotation, but it's really become part of
Speaker 2: the pop culture now cool.
Speaker 3: You know, can we talk a little bit about MENSA.
Speaker 4: It is the first rule that you're not supposed to
Speaker 4: talk about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, club or I don't know how it is?
Speaker 5: Well, how do you can anyone join if you hit us?
Speaker 3: Is it about IQ? Do you have to test to
Speaker 3: get in?
Speaker 2: So you test? You test? You take an IQ test
Speaker 2: and I took it very young, so the you know,
Speaker 2: qualifications were very different. But but the the you take it.
Speaker 2: You take a test to get in and if you
Speaker 2: if your IQ is at a certain level, then you
Speaker 2: can become a member of MENSA by paying the annual
Speaker 2: dues and you can go to the annual meetings.
Speaker 8: Uh.
Speaker 2: They have this like big get together in like one
Speaker 2: place where you have everything from like astrophysics workshops to
Speaker 2: like chalk but making. You know, it's like it's completely bizarre,
Speaker 2: but it's like your imagine like MENSA members to do.
Speaker 2: It's all in one place, right, Wow, So just to
Speaker 2: show that, like, actually this is kind of fun and cool.
Speaker 4: So wow, Will's gonna Can you apply online? Can you
Speaker 4: take the test online?
Speaker 3: I wouldn't know how to get to the website. I'd
Speaker 3: already be I'd.
Speaker 4: Already fail because you're an old man smile.
Speaker 3: I would never would never be able to get into MENSA.
Speaker 3: But what can I ask? What's the number you need
Speaker 3: to get in?
Speaker 2: So I believe when I when I first tested, I
Speaker 2: think it was needed to be like above one thirty
Speaker 2: and I was like marginally over So uh yeah, but
Speaker 2: I bet you could do it. Will, I'm sure. I'm
Speaker 2: sure that I will see you at the chocolate making.
Speaker 9: Is there an SV remembering category TV category, like.
Speaker 5: He's Alvin Einstein. If that's what they say to me,
Speaker 5: I mean, come on.
Speaker 1: Will if you just like watched videos, like seriously, if
Speaker 1: you watched lectures about subjects.
Speaker 3: You would be able to test on any subject.
Speaker 5: It would depend what it was. It would depend because numbers.
Speaker 5: My brain doesn't hone numbers. I truly do have a
Speaker 5: calculating my brain numbers.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I q is.
Speaker 1: I remember trying to take like an IQ test, and
Speaker 1: it's like a really interesting set of reasoning. It's like
Speaker 1: it's it's a logic reasoning, Like it's hard to take one.
Speaker 9: In college, I was a psychology major, so I also
Speaker 9: had to take one.
Speaker 4: Yes, I don't know that they're super accurate accurate.
Speaker 2: It's again I think that it depends on what you know,
Speaker 2: states you're in when you go to take it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of factors at play. Yes, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't claim to be smarter than anyone else. I
Speaker 2: think we do.
Speaker 4: We claim that for you, Yes, you.
Speaker 2: Smarter than checks in the mail, But again, I think
Speaker 2: that really depends on like just finding your group, right,
Speaker 2: because what what MENSA feels like is like the nerdy
Speaker 2: parts of Reddit right, So it's like it's like build
Speaker 2: me a PC, but I want to see the people version.
Speaker 5: All right, cool, Okay, interesting, I'm going to crash the
Speaker 5: next MENSA meeting.
Speaker 3: I'm just gonna be that guy. They're going they'll know
Speaker 3: the second.
Speaker 9: I walk in, Like then they're gonna have astrophysics, chocolate
Speaker 9: making and tv TV category with will producer.
Speaker 3: Yes, TV TU.
Speaker 2: Like tell me an episode.
Speaker 3: I don't know exactly now that I'll do all day.
Speaker 9: So I want to talk to you a little bit
Speaker 9: about because you worked opposite another child prodigy in Natalie Portman,
Speaker 9: who was sixteen when she made her Broadway debut in
Speaker 9: the Diary of Anne Frank with You. What was that experience?
Speaker 2: Like that was great? Natalie is a real gem. She
Speaker 2: is incredibly focused, one of the most focused actors that
Speaker 2: I've ever worked with. I mean, you could tell I
Speaker 2: was seventeen. She was sixteen at the time, and like
Speaker 2: tenfold what I would you know bring to a production
Speaker 2: like laser focused on these kinds of things. She was
Speaker 2: like testing, preparing for the college exams. She was taking
Speaker 2: like Japanese I think at the time as well, and
Speaker 2: all of this in addition to playing like and Frank
Speaker 2: on Broadway. Unbelievable focus for Natalie also incredibly kind and generous,
Speaker 2: like for the high Holy Days the she would mite
Speaker 2: me over to her house and would celebrate together, and
Speaker 2: it was really really nice. But such an incredible actress,
Speaker 2: Like I really can't say enough about her.
Speaker 3: Wow, how long were you doing the show?
Speaker 2: So I did Falsettos for a little under a year
Speaker 2: and then and Frank for about a nine months.
Speaker 3: Wow, so much worse.
Speaker 2: And I have to say that, like all of my understudies,
Speaker 2: this is this is a fascinating thing. All minor studies
Speaker 2: for the big things that I've done are now huge superstars.
Speaker 2: And I think that I should just start renting out space.
Speaker 2: So you really want to be a big superstar, please be.
Speaker 4: My understudy your understudies.
Speaker 2: So, my my under study for Falsettos was Andrew Leads,
Speaker 2: who's like a big, a big superstar in the TV world. Now.
Speaker 2: My uno study Fan Frank was Eddie K. Thomas, Oh
Speaker 2: my gosh. And and my my under study for the Graduate,
Speaker 2: which is the tour I did after college, was Nate Qudry,
Speaker 2: who's like's brother and like a success doing a bunch
Speaker 2: of shows, right now. But it's like all these people
Speaker 2: made it into like like series regulars, like just after
Speaker 2: they finished with me, and I think that I had
Speaker 2: something to do with it.
Speaker 4: It's a group effort.
Speaker 9: Since the stage is such a sophisticated and adult form
Speaker 9: of entertainment.
Speaker 4: Was it easy to still be a kid?
Speaker 2: Great question, that's a great question. So that was part
Speaker 2: of the reason why I kept coming back to California
Speaker 2: to like try to go to school, right. I kept
Speaker 2: wanting to be normal, right. I wanted to say like, Okay,
Speaker 2: I really enjoy this, but it takes a lot. Like this,
Speaker 2: it's a big time commitment. You know, you disappear for
Speaker 2: three months when you're doing a film, and you come back,
Speaker 2: everyone else is already moved on, right, They're already their
Speaker 2: lives have already gone, and you're like, I was in
Speaker 2: you know, Ontario for three months, and yeah, uh, it's
Speaker 2: a lot. So I kept trying to come back to
Speaker 2: be like a normal kid again. But after a few months,
Speaker 2: like the bug starts to get you again, and then
Speaker 2: you find yourself like, all right, well i'll do your audiobook. Okay, fine,
Speaker 2: maybe I'll do this this one role on this thing,
Speaker 2: all right, Fine, I'm back in a whole hog.
Speaker 8: You know.
Speaker 2: It's like there's no stopping it.
Speaker 8: It is.
Speaker 2: It is a bug that I want to constantly, like
Speaker 2: you know, have go away, but I but it keeps
Speaker 2: coming back, and I don't. I don't mind. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: love that fact, like that's part of what you know.
Speaker 2: Directing is for me now, It's like I get to
Speaker 2: introduce the joy to like the younger.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've heard it put like you know that to
Speaker 1: tell young actors. If you can do anything else, do
Speaker 1: something else. But if you can't not act, you're an actor,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: It's like, you can't you can't avoid it.
Speaker 1: If if it's just gonna always be a part of
Speaker 1: then you just have to start working your life around it.
Speaker 3: In some capacy.
Speaker 2: I can see that you're reading a lot. So that's
Speaker 2: that's really good. The books behind the shows.
Speaker 4: The writer is officially said he's done with acting.
Speaker 3: We yeah, he loves directing. I mean, I love working
Speaker 3: with actors. I just yeah, don't want to.
Speaker 2: And you know I do. I do readings every once
Speaker 2: in a while now to kind of get the bug again.
Speaker 2: And it's a different experience that I have with it now.
Speaker 2: Like as a director and as an older actor now
Speaker 2: not older but I mean middle age actor. Now it's
Speaker 2: it's it's a different feeling than it was when you know,
Speaker 2: we were younger, and there's nothing wrong with that. It's
Speaker 2: just kind of a it's what it is, what it is.
Speaker 2: But I do have to say one of my favorite
Speaker 2: things to do show wise, I used to do this
Speaker 2: show called Gravid Water and it was an actor and
Speaker 2: an improviser that we get together and the actor would
Speaker 2: memorize all the lines of one character of a two
Speaker 2: person scene, and the improviser had never heard the scene before.
Speaker 2: So I worked. I worked with some of the biggest
Speaker 2: names in like you know TV right now, like Tom
Speaker 2: Middle Bitch to work with uh work, Shareo, Terry. I mean,
Speaker 2: like a bunch of different like I work at Chevy
Speaker 2: Chase once. But again it's like they were the improvisers.
Speaker 2: I was doing all the lines of one character and
Speaker 2: you have to justify it, right.
Speaker 3: So you have to keep returning to the lines.
Speaker 2: Is the idea.
Speaker 3: I want to see that.
Speaker 2: That's so it's it's such a great show. So after
Speaker 2: COVID it kind of shut down. But like I'm they're
Speaker 2: hoping to get it back on the ground again. So
Speaker 2: but that is like, because it's immediate, you have to
Speaker 2: have everything has to be there, and then, right, nothing's
Speaker 2: going to be the same after it. Right.
Speaker 5: What's your when you look back on on especially your
Speaker 5: stage career, is there a show that stands out for
Speaker 5: you as your favorite?
Speaker 2: Question? Yeah? I mean I love the story of Falsettos.
Speaker 2: That was a really beautiful story to tell over and
Speaker 2: over again, especially you know, Happy Pride by the way,
Speaker 2: it was a story that needed to be told, and
Speaker 2: I'm really glad it was told when it was. I
Speaker 2: have to say that, like all of the proessions that
Speaker 2: I've done have been worthwhile in some way, right, And
Speaker 2: it's really hard for me to pick a favorite because
Speaker 2: I was in a different place personally for like each one.
Speaker 2: I really loved doing Shakespeare. We toured that around the
Speaker 2: country with the acting company and played in theaters that
Speaker 2: had not seen a stage play before, let alone Shakespeare.
Speaker 2: So it was like we were performing in these like
Speaker 2: really really small, you know, like ninety nine seat houses
Speaker 2: that were like transformed from barn. We had to like
Speaker 2: restage the entire thing based on like the parameters of
Speaker 2: like what we have for entrances and exits and like
Speaker 2: that was really fun. But you know, like gravid water,
Speaker 2: like I talked about, is immediately it's then and there.
Speaker 2: So they all have value. And I would also say
Speaker 2: like the directing, like as you as you know writer,
Speaker 2: it becomes you value that just as much.
Speaker 9: Yeah, and you and writers share experience as Benjamin in
Speaker 9: the touring company of the Graduate. What was that like
Speaker 9: then when you guys crossed paths. Did you have a
Speaker 9: lot of interaction at that time?
Speaker 2: We didn't know. So again they were like we were,
Speaker 2: we were shipping in the night, so we completely like
Speaker 2: missed each other as we were exchanging roles there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because you also you never did it with Jerry Hall,
Speaker 1: did you?
Speaker 2: Just after Jerry left, so there was a whole new cast.
Speaker 3: Basically, so you were Nate Corgie went along and the
Speaker 3: rest of the cast went with you.
Speaker 1: But me, Yeah, me and Jerry. So you were rehearsing
Speaker 1: in LA while we were finishing up our leg right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly exactly, audition in New York, rehearsed in LA
Speaker 2: and then came back to me.
Speaker 9: Wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 9: Jonathan worked with Lorraine Brocco, Linda Gray and Kelly McGillis
Speaker 9: as the Missus Robinson's and writer.
Speaker 4: You worked with.
Speaker 1: Jerry Hall, Jerry Hall, and that was it, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: because then then I went back and did it again.
Speaker 1: Did you know that, Jonathan, I went and did it
Speaker 1: in Australia's seven years later it was, and did it
Speaker 1: with Jerry again.
Speaker 3: It was it was crazy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's cool. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Is being in a touring company even harder work?
Speaker 2: Is it harder work? Yes? And no, it's because you
Speaker 2: don't have your like family or you know, support network
Speaker 2: around all the time. With the acting company, they had
Speaker 2: these signs that were made right like with arrows pointing
Speaker 2: like to the dressing room or like to the stage
Speaker 2: right without which we would be completely lost, like some
Speaker 2: of us would still be backstage right now. But because
Speaker 2: like when you're going on a touring company, you're there
Speaker 2: for like a few weeks, you know some now they're
Speaker 2: doing like split weeks, and so like you're there for
Speaker 2: a couple of days and then you go on to
Speaker 2: the next theater and they set up overnight and you
Speaker 2: come to the show for a weekend and they pick
Speaker 2: up and you're you know, out on the road again.
Speaker 2: On Monday.
Speaker 1: The graduate was so much work too, because as Benjamin,
Speaker 1: we had one scene that we weren't in the rest
Speaker 1: of the time, We're on stage the entire You're carrying
Speaker 1: the entire show, and I just remember like being exhausted,
Speaker 1: like it was. It was like running a marathon every night.
Speaker 1: And then didn't Wasn't there a night where you hit
Speaker 1: your head and Nate had to go on halfway through
Speaker 1: the show? Yeah, well I remember because Nate hadn't ever,
Speaker 1: he never got to go on for me. Uh and
Speaker 1: and then he was that first I think that was
Speaker 1: the first time he went on.
Speaker 3: He took over for you. Yes, what it was halfway
Speaker 3: through a show. She had to simulate sex and rider.
Speaker 2: But like, so the bed it was a single bed, right,
Speaker 2: a single bed made up sheets like like sewn on
Speaker 2: on the corner. Was this was a bedside table, right,
Speaker 2: And there's a scene when we flopped back and we're like, oh,
Speaker 2: we're reacting like something that you know, our dad has said, uhh.
Speaker 2: And the table is connected to the side of the bed,
Speaker 2: so like there's no movement in it. And so one
Speaker 2: night I just was off just a slight bit, and
Speaker 2: so I flapped back at like on the corner of
Speaker 2: the bedside table in my head so hard. That was
Speaker 2: like allowed badang right, And I don't remember this writer,
Speaker 2: but like that set was the whitest set I've ever
Speaker 2: worked on.
Speaker 3: It's all white. It's literally cream colored, like loo every windows.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I spent the rest of the and I'm wearing like
Speaker 2: a white shirt with like khaki pants and and I'm
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh man, my head hurts. And I come
Speaker 2: back to my hands full of blood. Right, so I'm
Speaker 2: like to finish the scene, and so I'm like holding
Speaker 2: my head like you know, trying to like stop the
Speaker 2: blood is I'm like backing up toward the exit and
Speaker 2: and like sure enough, it's coming like down my neck
Speaker 2: all over my all my things. People are like, I
Speaker 2: think somebody actually got really worried about my safety. In
Speaker 2: the front row. One was like, I'm a doctor, is
Speaker 2: he okay? And coming back to me now? So this
Speaker 2: was a yell and and uh we went to yell
Speaker 2: hospital intermission while Nate got into my clean version of
Speaker 2: my clothes and then finished the rest of the show.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, what did you end up eating? Stitches?
Speaker 2: Staples? I got staples, Oh.
Speaker 3: Connecticut we do staples and.
Speaker 1: Hacktic because you never have a break, like you there's
Speaker 1: not a moment, there's not a scene where you are
Speaker 1: off stage and that entire play.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's so hectic.
Speaker 2: Oh my yeah.
Speaker 9: Well, as you mentioned, you are now teaching and directing
Speaker 9: for kids, sometimes in the age group of when you
Speaker 9: were running around Broadway being nominated for awards. What is
Speaker 9: the best piece of advice you try to pass on
Speaker 9: to the kids you work with?
Speaker 2: So the best piece of advice that I try to
Speaker 2: pass on to the kids is, well, there's a lot,
Speaker 2: but it really comes down to kind of the fundamentals.
Speaker 8: Of like.
Speaker 2: What it is that we do? Right? Like, well, like
Speaker 2: I'm going to ask everyone in this room, like, like,
Speaker 2: what does acting mean to you? Right? What is it?
Speaker 2: What is acting?
Speaker 1: That's a really tough question at this point. I you know,
Speaker 1: I've had so many different answers. But to me, it's
Speaker 1: it's it's embodying a story. It's it's it's it's taking
Speaker 1: all of your humanity, your body, your voice, your artistic
Speaker 1: expressive capacities and telling a story that was already written
Speaker 1: before you. Like you're not, I mean, imbrobbing is like
Speaker 1: creating a story. But like I think acting just the
Speaker 1: purest form is that you're embodying a story in some
Speaker 1: commit Yeah.
Speaker 4: O character, I'll take what he said.
Speaker 2: Do you think, well any difference.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well I came to a pretty.
Speaker 5: I don't I wouldn't say horrible realization, but a realization
Speaker 5: that I'm not an actor. And I came to that
Speaker 5: realization a while ago because I think acting is about
Speaker 5: the craft, like writer was talking about and kind of
Speaker 5: internalizing the story and embodying the character, and I never
Speaker 5: did that. I care only about the reaction of the
Speaker 5: audience and making sure the audience has a good time.
Speaker 3: So I realized I was an entertainer more than I
Speaker 3: was an actor.
Speaker 5: Because that's all I had to do, if I had to,
Speaker 5: if I have to flop down and knock my head
Speaker 5: against something like you did to get the reaction from
Speaker 5: the audience, and that's what I'm gonna do.
Speaker 3: You bleed, I'll bleed.
Speaker 5: So yeah, So I realized that I didn't have the
Speaker 5: kind of you know, the emotionality, intensity and the connection
Speaker 5: within myself to be an actor, whereas I'll go out
Speaker 5: and do what I have to do to get the reaction.
Speaker 3: From the audience. So I always classified myself more as
Speaker 3: an entertainer.
Speaker 2: Which is I think that's totally valid, and I think
Speaker 2: that there's there's a place for both, right, Right, I
Speaker 2: always tell my students acting fundamentally is living truthfully in
Speaker 2: given circumstances. Right, two separate things, right, So, the given
Speaker 2: circumstances are what you are given in a script. It's
Speaker 2: the who, what, when, where, why, and how it's done
Speaker 2: by the by the screenwriter, the playwright, whatever you happen
Speaker 2: to be doing. Right, But there's a second part to it.
Speaker 2: It's incredibly important that it's the most fundamental thing for
Speaker 2: the child professional actors that I work with, and that's
Speaker 2: to live truthfully. We all have to bring so much
Speaker 2: more of our selves, our own experiences into the things
Speaker 2: that we do, into that intentionality, because that that is
Speaker 2: what makes an incredibly fascinating audition. Right when you see
Speaker 2: someone and you're like, I have no idea what they've
Speaker 2: just done, but it's completely changed my view of this script. Right,
Speaker 2: that's that because it's because they brought themselves. There's something
Speaker 2: in every actor that they have. There's so much more
Speaker 2: power in the experiences that they've had that I really
Speaker 2: try to stress to my students to like find and
Speaker 2: I break it down for them and we go through
Speaker 2: like the beats and you know, the fundamentals. But finding
Speaker 2: more of yourself in these characters is fundamental. That's great.
Speaker 4: I love it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I do too.
Speaker 5: You know what I'm gonna ask next, don't you write, Danielle?
Speaker 5: What's the thing that I have to know about every person.
Speaker 2: That we talked to?
Speaker 4: Where he grew up?
Speaker 3: Where are you now? I have a location thing?
Speaker 2: Are you?
Speaker 3: Do you have a pick?
Speaker 4: Can you send him a pin?
Speaker 3: Are you in New York or la?
Speaker 2: Right, I'm in New York.
Speaker 3: I'man you are okay?
Speaker 2: So it is afternoon.
Speaker 4: If you think that's going to be enough, you're wrong.
Speaker 3: Exactly a New York art.
Speaker 2: I'm happy to talk about this. No, I haven't been
Speaker 2: getting suspicious packages anymore so, but no, I live in
Speaker 2: Croton on Hudson's It's about forty five minutes to an
Speaker 2: hour north of the city, and it's in northern Westchester,
Speaker 2: so right on the kind of the border beautiful trails here.
Speaker 2: The whole reason we moved up was because I really
Speaker 2: liked trail running, and it's equally dangerous and you know exciting.
Speaker 3: So I like it too.
Speaker 5: I'm a big failed trail running as well. That's a
Speaker 5: tough one to say, yeah, because it is.
Speaker 2: It's the thing I like about it is like no
Speaker 2: one cares about your time. Like any time you say
Speaker 2: I've done a fifty k and you know, on a trail,
Speaker 2: they're like, wow, that's awesome. How long did you know?
Speaker 2: It's like like fifty k, that's amazing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's cool.
Speaker 9: So looking back now, thirty years since your episodes on
Speaker 9: Boy Meets World, what advice would you like to give
Speaker 9: young Jonathan c kaplan if you had it, if you
Speaker 9: you had the time machine and you could go back,
Speaker 9: what would you tell yourself?
Speaker 2: Okay, uh, it doesn't get better. As a next fan, no,
Speaker 2: no it doesn't. I mean I wasn't paying attention then.
Speaker 3: You know, I was like exactly.
Speaker 2: But but as a young Jonathan professional actor, I say, like,
Speaker 2: doesn't get better. For the Mets, I'd say to really
Speaker 2: like enjoy the ride. So it's so hard to do
Speaker 2: as a kid because like you're doing the things that
Speaker 2: you're kind of signed but also excited about, but it's
Speaker 2: all you know, you're kind of like a goldfish you know,
Speaker 2: in these kinds of situations where it's like you're really
Speaker 2: excited about that, and all of a sudden it's done.
Speaker 2: You're like, Wow, you're really excited about the next thing.
Speaker 2: Every every project, it becomes like a new toy.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And so you know, talking about the episodes of like
Speaker 2: Wyman's World or Brotherly Love or you know, Platypus Man,
Speaker 2: like all the Random show existed in the nineties. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, I think about the experiences I had with
Speaker 2: people more than I do about the roles. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: I'd say like to hold onto those as much as
Speaker 2: I could.
Speaker 9: So great, Shonathan, Thank you so much for spending your
Speaker 9: time with us this morning. It was you were truly
Speaker 9: one of the most fascinating guests we've we've had. We
Speaker 9: so enjoyed our time with you. Uh and so thank
Speaker 9: you so much for coming here and sharing with us.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, guys will great, Thank you too.
Speaker 4: By Wow. Absolutely everything about him is interesting.
Speaker 5: It really Yeah, makes me feel bad about myself some
Speaker 5: of these guests we've been having on lately, Danielle, can
Speaker 5: we have a stinker once in a while, please?
Speaker 3: So interesting. You have not believed his resume before boy
Speaker 3: meets world like and that we have we didn't know
Speaker 3: anything about it.
Speaker 1: Doing this recap, we were like, oh remember that kid,
Speaker 1: and we're like, oh, yeah, he was around a bunch,
Speaker 1: and then he comes back like he was around a lot.
Speaker 1: And then now to realize, like, oh he was such
Speaker 1: a pro Like he was, he must have just been
Speaker 1: like what is happening?
Speaker 9: I can't even imagine what our set must have felt
Speaker 9: like to him. I can in Shining. He seems to
Speaker 9: be the type of person who wouldn't want to make
Speaker 9: it sound negative, So I'm going to do what he
Speaker 9: would do and just frame it as a positive. Truly,
Speaker 9: how fun must it have been to be a twelve
Speaker 9: year old who has normally been in very high pressure,
Speaker 9: high stress controlled giving it your all eight performances a
Speaker 9: week around with a bunch of adults who are also
Speaker 9: taking themselves very seriously and their roles very seriously, to
Speaker 9: then come on to our set that felt like playtime
Speaker 9: with a group of young kids who who thoroughly enjoyed
Speaker 9: each other and found fun everywhere. And for your scripts
Speaker 9: to be how can we make this more fun? How
Speaker 9: can we find more funny? And for him to be
Speaker 9: a character who's getting laughs and how do we how
Speaker 9: do we like? What a great feeling that must have
Speaker 9: been and a change of pace, So.
Speaker 4: So cool.
Speaker 9: I'm so glad he he was willing to come and
Speaker 9: talk with us, just like he was willing to come
Speaker 9: and be a part of our little show a little.
Speaker 5: Was willing to come and be Yeah, you're coming from
Speaker 5: to Tony Awards to on a set where we're probably like, hey,
Speaker 5: catch this twizzler in your mouth.
Speaker 3: Like I mean, watch will catch throw a grape?
Speaker 2: It's like, it's what we're doing.
Speaker 1: It's so interesting that, like, you know, if you're on
Speaker 1: TV or if you do movies, it's so easy to
Speaker 1: find out somebody's resume, but when you do theater, it's gone.
Speaker 1: Like the fact that he's done like fifty productions of
Speaker 1: all this stuff, we like, we can't find that information nowhere.
Speaker 1: I guess there's like a there's a Broadway database for
Speaker 1: like Broadway shows, but like off Broadway shows, like little
Speaker 1: little underground theater projects. Like he's working all the time
Speaker 1: and you never hear about it. It's just you know,
Speaker 1: if you're not there that night.
Speaker 3: So cool.
Speaker 9: Well, thank you all for joining us for this episode
Speaker 9: of pod Meets World as always. You can follow us
Speaker 9: on Instagram pod Meets World Show. You can send us
Speaker 9: your emails pod Meets World Show at email dot com,
Speaker 9: and we have merch.
Speaker 5: In the criminal justice system, the people are represented by
Speaker 5: two separate yet equally important groups, the police who investigate
Speaker 5: crimes and the district attorneys to prosecute the offenders.
Speaker 3: These are their merch.
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Speaker 3: We love you all, pod dismissed.
Speaker 1: Podmeets World is an iHeart podcast producer hosted by Danielle Fischel,
Speaker 1: Wilfridell and Ryder Strong Executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman,
Speaker 1: Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor,
Speaker 1: Tarasubasch producer, Mattie Moore engineer and Boy Meets World Superman
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