Speaker 1: Burrow ready for the shotgun snap. Joe has the football,
Speaker 1: He'll look to throw. Fires a pass god by Joe
Speaker 1: twenty Simty Tad touchdown Bengals one on one.
Speaker 2: To go.
Speaker 1: A forty yards strike to Jabar Chase.
Speaker 3: Oh, the Bengals finally got one late twenty seven to twenty.
Speaker 3: That was our friends Dan Hord and Dave Lapham on
Speaker 3: w c k Y. I'm Greg Rosenthal here on NFL Daily,
Speaker 3: and I've seen the Bengals blow so many games and
Speaker 3: so many big spots, including in primetime this season, that
Speaker 3: it was nice for once to see they're two great players.
Speaker 3: Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase hookup for a game winner.
Speaker 3: Jamar Chase ends up with fourteen catches for one hundred
Speaker 3: and seventy seven yards and two touchdowns. And I don't know, Nick,
Speaker 3: if it means anything in the big picture, but the
Speaker 3: Bengals seemed extremely relieved to get their fifth win of
Speaker 3: the season in a weird game in Dallas.
Speaker 4: At least it was entertaining, Yeah, entertaining.
Speaker 5: Joe Burrow captured it best, I think when talking with
Speaker 5: ESPN's LEAs Assaulters after the game, which was we needed
Speaker 5: a break we haven't gotten many of those this season,
Speaker 5: and they haven't, and for a long period there I
Speaker 5: thought they weren't going to until the Cowboys screwed up
Speaker 5: a blocked punt situation that gave the Bengals second life.
Speaker 5: And it reminded me of the one constant theme that's
Speaker 5: on the positive side for the Bengals this season, which
Speaker 5: is death taxes and Joe Burrow to Jamar Chase for
Speaker 5: a big play. He makes that catch, he scores that touchdown,
Speaker 5: and finally, even if it doesn't mean much in the
Speaker 5: big picture, because they're now five and eight, it at
Speaker 5: least prevents the Bengals from securing a losing season for
Speaker 5: at least one more week.
Speaker 4: Hey, they're not eliminated yet.
Speaker 3: Neither's Dallas for that matter, although both of them can
Speaker 3: be eliminated next week, and when that's even possible in
Speaker 3: week fifteen, it means you're probably not going to stay
Speaker 3: off elimination for long. Us give Jamar Chase some love
Speaker 3: for a second, and Joe Burrow. Jamar Chase has six
Speaker 3: hundred and twenty five yards after the catch that it's
Speaker 3: most in the NFL according to Next Gen Stats. He
Speaker 3: caught nine of the eleven targets tonight that he had
Speaker 3: on outbreaking routes for one hundred and twenty two yards
Speaker 3: and two touchdowns. That is the most of anyone in
Speaker 3: the game all season. That is absolutely outrageous, and it
Speaker 3: points to something I was thinking throughout this game, which
Speaker 3: is that Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase make those opposite
Speaker 3: hash out routes look easier than any two people in
Speaker 3: the NFL. That should not be an easy play, and
Speaker 3: Joe Burrow makes it look so easy, and he only
Speaker 3: does it in part because Chase is so good and
Speaker 3: is exactly where he's supposed to be and gets so
Speaker 3: open on those plays. And todight, even though we saw
Speaker 3: a lot of the reasons why the Bengals are five
Speaker 3: and eight, and we can get to those reasons, like
Speaker 3: we can just appreciate a little bit of greatness on
Speaker 3: our Monday Night football, even especially when on the other
Speaker 3: side it's like Cooper Rush is involved.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, that's not very intriguing, but you said
Speaker 5: it's the most in a game this season. It's the
Speaker 5: most in a game in seven seasons. An outbreaking route
Speaker 5: is not a route that usually produces a massive gain
Speaker 5: It's a throw that you make to move the chains.
Speaker 5: It's a throw that you make because the coverage dictates
Speaker 5: you to go there and hopefully you're gonna make it happen.
Speaker 5: They make it look elementary, and they have throughout their career,
Speaker 5: and it speaks back to their time together at LSU
Speaker 5: and the rapport that they built in college and how
Speaker 5: they've cared at the NFL. And I might be talking
Speaker 5: about old news at this point, but their relationship and
Speaker 5: why it's so vital to this Bengals, you know, existence
Speaker 5: now in their future can be captured in one moment,
Speaker 5: and it's right after the game. They hand Joe Burrow
Speaker 5: a box of donuts because it's Simpson's Night on the
Speaker 5: alternative broadcast, and he takes a donut and instead of
Speaker 5: eating it, he grabs it. He looks at it, He
Speaker 5: looks up at Jamar Chase, and he smashes it in
Speaker 5: his face because they love each other and that is
Speaker 5: expressed on the football field with their great success. It
Speaker 5: is a tandem that I feel like we haven't seen
Speaker 5: produce at this rate in a long time, and it
Speaker 5: really bums me out that they're not a better and
Speaker 5: more complete team because they should beat in the playoffs,
Speaker 5: because this is them alone are fun to watch.
Speaker 4: I want to wear my biases on my sleeve.
Speaker 3: When Joe Burrow and the Bengals were punting with what
Speaker 3: was it a minute and fifty three left or something
Speaker 3: like that, after having a fourth and twenty six because
Speaker 3: multiple just boneheaded penalties from their teammates was forcing them
Speaker 3: to kick the ball back to the Cowboys, I was thinking,
Speaker 3: I can't freaking believe they are going to lose.
Speaker 4: This game again.
Speaker 3: And as great as Joe Burrow is and he's one
Speaker 3: of the best quarterbacks in the league, this game had
Speaker 3: so many elements of why this team is where they were.
Speaker 3: They were great in the first half. They come out
Speaker 3: a halftime. Burrow did have a curious interception as receiver
Speaker 3: gets bumped off he's anticipating it.
Speaker 4: That's in the third quarter.
Speaker 3: They have a field goal drive where they settle after
Speaker 3: like a ball hits Jamar Chase in the helmet and
Speaker 3: Burrow can't find t Higgins, you know, connect on a
Speaker 3: one on one in the end zone. So they settle
Speaker 3: for a field goal, and then they punt a couple
Speaker 3: times in the fourth quarter, including that punt and I'm
Speaker 3: thinking this is a travesty that this team is losing
Speaker 3: to the Cowboys, that they are wasting this quarterback and
Speaker 3: this receiver and t Higgins together, and it should be
Speaker 3: a five alarm fire in Cincinnati.
Speaker 4: What's happening?
Speaker 3: And I don't believe Zach Taylor is the right quarter
Speaker 3: the coach for them.
Speaker 4: I really don't.
Speaker 3: And I thought, you know what, I don't want them
Speaker 3: to lose in a way, but maybe they need to
Speaker 3: like get even worse to really get the ownership's attention,
Speaker 3: because to me, Zach Taylor feels like a good enough
Speaker 3: coach that is getting propped up by two first ballot
Speaker 3: Hall of Fame talents, And you shouldn't just be accepting
Speaker 3: good right here, smack in the middle of the prime.
Speaker 4: It should be a five alarm fire.
Speaker 3: But once again, like they get saved by the Cowboys ineptitude,
Speaker 3: and then they get saved by Joe Burrow and Jamar
Speaker 3: Chase's brilliance on that last touchdown. And maybe it's not
Speaker 3: the national conversation, but maybe it should be, Nick, what
Speaker 3: do you think?
Speaker 5: No? I actually had that same thought right when the
Speaker 5: Cowboys scored that touchdown pass to Brandon Cooks. That was
Speaker 5: the first time it occurred to me that, like, wait,
Speaker 5: this Bengals team is nowhere near what they should be. Like,
Speaker 5: I'm watching replays of Rico Dabble ripping off big gains
Speaker 5: on the ground, and I'm just thinking, God, this is
Speaker 5: such a disappointment. This is a team that should have
Speaker 5: been so much better. I thought back to our preseason
Speaker 5: predictions and how I raved about the Bengals, and if
Speaker 5: everything goes right, they have a solid roster and everything else,
Speaker 5: and it just hasn't worked out for them. And then
Speaker 5: I thought, maybe Zach Taylor actually is at risk of
Speaker 5: losing his job, maybe he isn't the right guy. So
Speaker 5: I think you're totally right in at least considering that,
Speaker 5: because how else do you explain You can't explain away
Speaker 5: this entire season with all our defense was bad. That's
Speaker 5: an operational failure on the part of the front office
Speaker 5: and the coaching staff. And this is a team that
Speaker 5: also has a highly regarded defensive coordinator lou and Arimo
Speaker 5: who's just been grasping its straws trying to find answers.
Speaker 5: So I think you're absolutely right. And yet I tweeted
Speaker 5: it in the fourth quarter. It's really fun. It's kind
Speaker 5: of satisfying in a way to watch losing teams find
Speaker 5: new ways to lose. And that's the only thing that
Speaker 5: saved them in this game was the fact that the
Speaker 5: Cowboys out ineptituded them. If that's not even a word,
Speaker 5: but I just made it up.
Speaker 4: Even the final drive Cooper rush on the fourth down.
Speaker 3: I mean, he has an open receiver and he's facing
Speaker 3: a little bit of pressure, but he just misses throws.
Speaker 3: And he doesn't make bad decisions, but he just misses
Speaker 3: too many throws for a guy who isn't physically talented,
Speaker 3: and you see it week after week, like he is
Speaker 3: a below average backup I would say, not the worst
Speaker 3: backups in the league, but not an asset. They need
Speaker 3: to be looking to upgrade there. But I really believe
Speaker 3: that with Taylor, and it doesn't feel like it doesn't
Speaker 3: feel like he's held to the same standard as other places.
Speaker 3: If Ben Roethlisberger in the middle of his career just
Speaker 3: went five and eleven or six and ten one year
Speaker 3: with with Bill Cower, Mike Tomlin, like not that he
Speaker 3: had Bill Kower, but with Mcalin, Like you.
Speaker 4: Think Tomlin wouldn't have been on the hot seat.
Speaker 3: Like if if Sean McDermott was five and eight this year,
Speaker 3: he would be fired. Like we would just assume it
Speaker 3: because you have this infrastructure that you've been building. You
Speaker 3: have these guys at their prime, and yeah, like the
Speaker 3: margin for Aris small and he just maybe it's watching
Speaker 3: that nd season hard knocks, it just feels.
Speaker 5: Like I know where you're going.
Speaker 4: No, I don't know where I'm going.
Speaker 3: He's fine, Like he's a fine coach, he's like the
Speaker 3: Kirk Cousins coaches. He's above the Dalton scale. He's above average.
Speaker 3: He's gonna make a lot of money. But you've had
Speaker 3: a franchise for how long whatever, forty fifty years. This
Speaker 3: is easily the best quarterback you ever have, might be
Speaker 3: the best quarterback you ever will have. And he's alongside
Speaker 3: Jamar Chase and you mentioned all the reasons. Who's you know,
Speaker 3: maybe the best receiver you've ever had. And they have
Speaker 3: this connection and you have t Higgins there too, and
Speaker 3: it's just like why not you try to be as
Speaker 3: great as those players are trying to.
Speaker 5: And I think for a long time the excuse is personnel, Well,
Speaker 5: we're not good enough, we don't have the quarterback. Well,
Speaker 5: then they got the quarterback. And I think the things
Speaker 5: that are saving them is a lower standard of expectation,
Speaker 5: because let's think back to the Carson Palmer, Chad Johnson,
Speaker 5: Slash o Cho Sinco, TJ. Husman Zada teams that like
Speaker 5: were good enough and then always found ways to lose
Speaker 5: in the playoffs. The birth of West of Us came
Speaker 5: from that, right And then you also think about the
Speaker 5: time that they made the Super Bowl a few years ago,
Speaker 5: and like that has won him enough goodwill for that
Speaker 5: to not be mentioned in the conversation.
Speaker 4: It's also a.
Speaker 5: Weird period right now where he's not the only coach
Speaker 5: who is safer than he probably should be. Just go
Speaker 5: up up North in the same state, Kevin Stefan. He's
Speaker 5: in a similar spot with the Browns where they're not
Speaker 5: good but he's safe.
Speaker 4: He's he's shown me more though he had.
Speaker 5: But he hasn't got to a super Bowl and Zach
Speaker 5: Taylor has. So like that's their argument.
Speaker 4: I get it. I get it. Check.
Speaker 3: I think Jack Zach Taylor's contract extension how long it
Speaker 3: lasted during this game, and I think it's through twenty six,
Speaker 3: So there's there's two more years on it. We're just
Speaker 3: talking here. I don't I don't think it's that realistic.
Speaker 3: But I just think Joe Burrow is that special and
Speaker 3: you just can't assume that like this is gonna last forever.
Speaker 3: You've had all those you know before, There's been excuses,
Speaker 3: there's injury plagued years, there's different ways that the season ended.
Speaker 3: This year, they've been more than healthy enough. He Burrow
Speaker 3: has been healthy and that's the key. Let's let's circle
Speaker 3: back to that moment though, where they were bailed out
Speaker 3: a little bit by the Cowboys. So to just set
Speaker 3: it up again, like I said that, the Bengals had
Speaker 3: punted twice in a row in a tie game. There
Speaker 3: a close game in the fourth quarter, and I was thinking, man, like,
Speaker 3: as great as Burrows been, there's been too many of
Speaker 3: these spots where they give the ball to the other
Speaker 3: team if Cooper Rush does it, That's where I was
Speaker 3: starting to lose my mind. But the Cowboys saved them,
Speaker 3: and only the way the Cowboys can.
Speaker 1: Let's listen Rico punting for the third time. He's averaged
Speaker 1: fifty three and a half yards per punt. The snap
Speaker 1: is good here, comes the punt and it's blocked. Can
Speaker 1: you believe it? It's rolling forward. The Cowboys may have
Speaker 1: touched it. If that's the case, the Bengals would get
Speaker 1: the ball. They got it coloss so much steak by
Speaker 1: the Dallas Cowboys. They just needed to get out of
Speaker 1: the way after blocking that punt. One of their players
Speaker 1: touched it and the Bengals recovered a colossal blunder.
Speaker 4: By Dallas oh Man.
Speaker 3: Great call there by Dave Laughman, Dan Horde, Yeah, they
Speaker 3: blocked the punt. The game was just about over all
Speaker 3: they gotta do. The Cowboys is not touched that ball,
Speaker 3: and they're going to have the ball and plus side
Speaker 3: of the field. They've been moving the ball fairly well tonight,
Speaker 3: by the way, like everyone does against the Bengals. I
Speaker 3: mean they put up twenty points, They got three hundred
Speaker 3: and twenty two yards. They actually average five and a
Speaker 3: half yards or play, which is an amazing but it's
Speaker 3: pretty good for the Cowboys with Cooper Rush, and I
Speaker 3: would have given them a strong chance of, you know,
Speaker 3: getting them in field goal right for Brandon Aubrey. They
Speaker 3: basically already were. But I believe it was Owarie who
Speaker 3: hit it. And you feel for him, and you give
Speaker 3: Joe Burrow one more chance, and this time they capitalized.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I don't like to revel anybody's misfortune because I think
Speaker 5: karma comes around for all of us. And I'm not
Speaker 5: trying to get caught like that. But I'll say, for
Speaker 5: as tough of a season as has been for the Bengals,
Speaker 5: it warmed my heart to hear Dan Hord be able
Speaker 5: to make that call because he was basically just absolutely
Speaker 5: desponded when he realized that they had the punt blocked
Speaker 5: and then instantly he's like, wait, they have the ball back,
Speaker 5: they have new life, and then he's able to call
Speaker 5: the touchdown. Like, Dan's one of my favorite guys in
Speaker 5: this business. He's an amazing individual. So in a tough season,
Speaker 5: for him to get that moment, that was great for
Speaker 5: the Bengals to be to come away with a win,
Speaker 5: that was great. Even if it was weird, even if
Speaker 5: it was kind of gifted to them, they still took advantage.
Speaker 3: I I if there's any Begals fans here listening and wondering, like,
Speaker 3: why you're going so negative when.
Speaker 4: You're talking about Zach Taylor.
Speaker 3: First of all, I know our friend spice Rack is
Speaker 3: not thinking that because he's won of Zach. He's thought
Speaker 3: Zach Taylor is getting propped up by these guys for
Speaker 3: very long.
Speaker 4: It's more that's more important to me.
Speaker 3: Big picture, We're not going to take this time to
Speaker 3: talk about the Bengals in this sort of way the
Speaker 3: rest of the season and them winning this game. Sure
Speaker 3: it's nice, their fans should enjoy it, but the bigger
Speaker 3: picture is kind of where is this team going. They
Speaker 3: have a lot of questions on their defense. I was thinking,
Speaker 3: how can a team with Trey Hendrickson have this bad
Speaker 3: a pass rush?
Speaker 4: Like it makes no sense.
Speaker 3: Hendrickson had four quick pressures tonight, seven pressures overall. The
Speaker 3: rest of the team actually did have a decent amount
Speaker 3: of pressures. They weren't terrible in this game, but there
Speaker 3: were just plays where because Hendrickson's double teamed, where there
Speaker 3: just nothing. And so I know they had a decent
Speaker 3: amount of pressures. The pressure it was okay tonight, but
Speaker 3: the plays where they didn't have pressure, it was like
Speaker 3: Cooper rush just there's no one anywhere near them, and
Speaker 3: that's why they were able to move the ball. Michael
Speaker 3: Parsons on the other hand, we got to give him
Speaker 3: some love before we give him a little bit of grief.
Speaker 4: My god, is he an amazing player.
Speaker 3: He had nine pressures in this game, six quick pressures,
Speaker 3: which is under two and a half seconds, which is
Speaker 3: up there for the best performances of the season in
Speaker 3: terms of quick pressure.
Speaker 4: So he is getting it done week after week.
Speaker 3: And that's why you don't hold it too much against
Speaker 3: him when he makes a big spectacle of himself after
Speaker 3: that block punt that Nick I'm sure you saw on
Speaker 3: the telecast and if you're watching on YouTube, you can
Speaker 3: see it now, and he is just going absolutely through
Speaker 3: it on the sidelines, does not knowing what happened, so mad,
Speaker 3: and then at the end of the game he stomps
Speaker 3: off the field. And I was watching this game actually
Speaker 3: with my son and his friend James, who's a great athlete,
Speaker 3: and Butt said, Walker's like, Oh, that's kind of like
Speaker 3: you at the end of the games.
Speaker 4: You're a poor sport too.
Speaker 3: I was like, PG moment, it's kind of true, like
Speaker 3: he is showing up his teammates a little bit. It's
Speaker 3: a little bit like, hey, look at me, I care
Speaker 3: more than you. But I do think it comes from
Speaker 3: a genuine place. He was in tears after the game too,
Speaker 3: talking about Demarvi and Overshan's knee injury. I think he
Speaker 3: really does care that much. It makes him good, but
Speaker 3: ultimately it's it's also kind of showing up your own
Speaker 3: teammates a little bit, maybe my being like an old
Speaker 3: fuddy duddy.
Speaker 4: What do you think I mean?
Speaker 5: First off, I would never use fuddyduddy to describe anybody,
Speaker 5: including you, So we'll take that away right now. Strike
Speaker 5: that from the record. Now, I understand. I do understand
Speaker 5: his disappointment in his frustration because he is one of
Speaker 5: the game's best rushers. He's a great player, and he's
Speaker 5: stuck on a defense that basically had maybe two other
Speaker 5: contributors on the field, one of them being overshown. He
Speaker 5: leaves an injury, and it's like it already got bad.
Speaker 5: The season itself is bad, and now it was just
Speaker 5: getting worse because we can't even execute this. We make
Speaker 5: a great on special teams, we block a punt that
Speaker 5: we were able to block because the defense got to
Speaker 5: stop late in a tie game, and then you go
Speaker 5: and blow it like that. I understand. I totally understand
Speaker 5: why to be upset but as a teammate you kind
Speaker 5: of have to control your emotions to a degree because
Speaker 5: it is kind of showing them up at the end.
Speaker 6: Of the day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I thought they were game, you know edric Eric
Speaker 3: Kendricks flying around. It's just disappointing because Overshown possibly has
Speaker 3: a serious injury, just based on Michael Parson's reaction how
Speaker 3: it looked in the moment.
Speaker 4: There's no.
Speaker 3: Word on it, but for Parsons to be that emotional
Speaker 3: and say Overshown doesn't deserve this, and he's battled through injuries,
Speaker 3: you have to fear the worst and we'll we'll probably
Speaker 3: have an update.
Speaker 4: On that on our next show.
Speaker 3: Cooper Bebe their their rookie center also got got injured
Speaker 3: in this scheme before we throw it to break, Like
Speaker 3: just little things like like why did it take the
Speaker 3: Cowboys so long to know that Rico Daddle was their
Speaker 3: running back? Like this is this is one of the
Speaker 3: reasons why I can't trust you Cowboys, Like Rico data
Speaker 3: has been great the last month, and you were splitting
Speaker 3: carries between him and Lipke and Deuce Vaughn and Zekiel
Speaker 3: Elliott for the rest of the season and now when
Speaker 3: you actually give the ball the guy kind of everyone
Speaker 3: was like, isn't that just our best guy? He's reliable,
Speaker 3: he's solid. You do that to him for a month
Speaker 3: and he's great.
Speaker 5: Yeah. He Actually he's reset his career high for a
Speaker 5: single season, their single game high in two games straight.
Speaker 5: He went over one hundred yards last week. He goes
Speaker 5: even higher than that this week. Like it's He finishes
Speaker 5: with one hundred and thirty one yards on eighteen attempts,
Speaker 5: averaging seven point three yards per carrier. And I know
Speaker 5: it's the Bengals defense, so it's a perfect time to
Speaker 5: have a career best.
Speaker 4: He wouldn't be doing that.
Speaker 5: He wouldn't. He wouldn't. He hits the hole with burst.
Speaker 5: He's a fast guy. And yeah, I agree.
Speaker 4: I don't know.
Speaker 5: It points to the Cowboys season in a nutshell. They're
Speaker 5: just making dumb decisions to start in the off season
Speaker 5: with their personnel moves or lack thereof, and it just
Speaker 5: continued through the season and now when their backs are
Speaker 5: all but I mean they're against the wall, they're basically done.
Speaker 5: They now find a way. Oh, let's give it to him.
Speaker 5: You know, enough times we're going to make a difference.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we've probably spent too much time on this. Before
Speaker 3: we go, I mentioned how special it was to have
Speaker 3: Chase and Burrow together and Higgins as well, and the
Speaker 3: reason I'm not including Higgins as much as I'm just
Speaker 3: assuming Higgins is going to be gone because that's what
Speaker 3: the Bengals do. They sometimes let great players leave, and
Speaker 3: it's assumed that Chase is going to be the only
Speaker 3: one that gets his money. Joe Burrow after the game
Speaker 3: had some interesting quotes about that.
Speaker 7: You know, those discussions are ongoing, and I'm confident that
Speaker 7: I think we're gonna be able to do what it
Speaker 7: takes to bring Tea back, and you know, I know
Speaker 7: that I'm going to do what it takes to get
Speaker 7: him back, and so is he. We've had those talks.
Speaker 7: So I.
Speaker 3: Watched T Higgins get asked about it, and they were
Speaker 3: gentle kind of how they were framing it, not almost
Speaker 3: trying to not get too into his business. And he
Speaker 3: kind of said, Okay, you know, I never ruled out
Speaker 3: coming back here, and kind of like that's always been
Speaker 3: the hope and a little bit of like I'll believe
Speaker 3: it when I see it. But those comments make me
Speaker 3: think there's a bigger chance than we thought. That Joe
Speaker 3: Burrow is maybe willing to push some money into the
Speaker 3: future or whatever that's going to be, and or it's
Speaker 3: Joe Burrow putting a little more public pressure on his
Speaker 3: ownership to get something done. Either way, good job Joe Burrow, because.
Speaker 5: That's if I played the lottery with this type of confidence,
Speaker 5: I would be putting pressure on the lottery board to
Speaker 5: you know, grease the skids for me and give me
Speaker 5: the numbers. Yeah, okay, I don't know the Bengals the
Speaker 5: way they operates a franchise like that. We've known that
Speaker 5: they're not a team that spends a ton of money.
Speaker 5: Legacy ownership essentially, Like there's a number of reasons why,
Speaker 5: and it's hard.
Speaker 3: I will make the point that Bengals fans are probably
Speaker 3: screaming right now. This is one of the most expensive
Speaker 3: teams in the NFL. It's one of the reasons why
Speaker 3: they're so disappointing.
Speaker 5: But that's also one of the reasons why they probably
Speaker 5: won't pay him.
Speaker 3: Their defense is expensive, Like they've been spending some cash
Speaker 3: and they got to pay you know, obviously they had
Speaker 3: to pay Joe Joe Burrow, and they got to pay Chase,
Speaker 3: and just the math makes it.
Speaker 4: It makes it difficult.
Speaker 3: Jamar Chase, by the way, going for the triple crown,
Speaker 3: and so he's going to be the highest paid receiver
Speaker 3: in the league when he signs that next contract. He
Speaker 3: has six more receptions than anyone in the NFL, one
Speaker 3: hundred and forty nine more yards than anyone in the NFL,
Speaker 3: and six more touchdowns receiving than anyone in the NFL.
Speaker 3: He has a great chance to do what Cooper Cup
Speaker 3: did just a few years ago and get that triple crown,
Speaker 3: which is which is pretty special.
Speaker 5: That and the run after catchability is really what stood
Speaker 5: up for me the most this year. This is a
Speaker 5: guy who will catch a pass over the middle for
Speaker 5: ten or twelve yards and is a threat to take
Speaker 5: it sixty yards to the house every time. He's special
Speaker 5: in that area, among many others.
Speaker 3: If you take just his best four games of the season,
Speaker 3: he has seven hundred and fifty yards and eight toiouns
Speaker 3: four games. Yeah, outrageous. All right, let's take a quick break.
Speaker 3: We are going to little news. We're gonna do our
Speaker 3: Offensive Rookie of the Year later and we're gonna give
Speaker 3: out our Players of the week right after this, back
Speaker 3: on NFL Daily, we highlighted some AJ Brown comments on
Speaker 3: the recap show Shook.
Speaker 4: I thought they were notable. I thought they were from
Speaker 4: a player that wanted to.
Speaker 3: Do more to help his team and was frustrated with
Speaker 3: the passing game. And it was all understandable on Monday.
Speaker 3: It remains understandable, but it remained and now it is
Speaker 3: a little bit more interesting of a story because of
Speaker 3: what one of the teammates of both AJ Brown and
Speaker 3: Jalen Hurt said about it. This is courtesy of the
Speaker 3: ninety four WIP Morning Show with the Camera and Richie.
Speaker 3: It's Brandon Graham on his regular spot on that show.
Speaker 4: Courtesy of Odyssey.
Speaker 6: I know that one is trying, and I mean Elevin
Speaker 6: could be a little better with how he respond to things.
Speaker 6: And they was friends before this. It's like, man, but
Speaker 6: things have changed, and I understand that because life happens.
Speaker 6: But we got to it's the business side that we
Speaker 6: have to make sure that we don't let the personal
Speaker 6: get in the way of the business. And that's what
Speaker 6: we got to do better as right now because we
Speaker 6: know it's an issue. Everybody's seeing some things, but we
Speaker 6: need to be able to talk talk things out as men.
Speaker 6: You know what I'm saying, But we need to let
Speaker 6: personal stuff go and let's get right for this game,
Speaker 6: because man, it's like a lot of stuff. Most of
Speaker 6: the time, it's just a conversation that just need to
Speaker 6: be had. But the person with the problem got to
Speaker 6: want to talk to the person other than others.
Speaker 5: It's a lot of talking around the matter without like
Speaker 5: getting the specifics, but also alluding to some internal strife
Speaker 5: and conflict between receiver and quarterback.
Speaker 3: Look, he got right into it. My read on that
Speaker 3: is Brandon Graham. I feel for him because he's going
Speaker 3: to realize he opened up a can here. Was almost
Speaker 3: assuming that the public understood a little bit more of
Speaker 3: the subtext and what's going on in AJ Brown's statements
Speaker 3: than we actually did. And when he when he mentions
Speaker 3: that they you know, they have a friendship and you
Speaker 3: can't let the personal get in the way.
Speaker 4: Oh well, that's that's interesting.
Speaker 3: And after him saying that, you you just start thinking
Speaker 3: about it and there is frustration I think just on
Speaker 3: a football level that is understandable just from watching the
Speaker 3: film from AJ Brown specifically, and I would put them
Speaker 3: on to Smith in this as well of Jalen Hurts
Speaker 3: just not throwing the ball when it's there. That's like
Speaker 3: that he's open enough and he's looking at him and
Speaker 3: he's just not throwing it. So I'm taking away all
Speaker 3: the personal stuff that he kind of opened up. That
Speaker 3: adds a different window into this. But knowing that you
Speaker 3: could see where some frustrations if you have some frustrations
Speaker 3: on the personal side and then the football side that
Speaker 3: I do think a close football watcher can see that
Speaker 3: creates some issues. And by the way, it makes people
Speaker 3: like me start thinking about how the way last season
Speaker 3: ended and all the weird stuff that they never really
Speaker 3: quite talked about what the issues were going on, and
Speaker 3: they would talk around it. It's just like, oh man,
Speaker 3: here we go again.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And there was the whole like does aj Brown
Speaker 5: want in a town or not issue as well that
Speaker 5: they had to kind of clear up wins cover up
Speaker 5: for a lot and let's you know, let's not beat
Speaker 5: around the bush. The fact that this is an eleven
Speaker 5: and two team that has been.
Speaker 4: On an appence.
Speaker 5: So they won here and they won Sunday, but the
Speaker 5: receiver is not getting the ball enough to make him happy.
Speaker 5: It's interesting. I thought the most interesting part was that
Speaker 5: they were friends, Like they're not friends now, Like that
Speaker 5: is concerning to me for a team that looks like
Speaker 5: it's on its way to winning the division wants to
Speaker 5: make a playoff push, Like what if that bubbles over
Speaker 5: in the worst possible time in the playoffs, Because yeah,
Speaker 5: he's not getting a lot of attention. Sa Kwon Barkley
Speaker 5: is the star of the show right now, but at
Speaker 5: one point they're gonna need you, and they've needed you
Speaker 5: in stretches, and this is not encouraging for a team
Speaker 5: that record wise should be very encouraged right now.
Speaker 3: Now, Brandon Graham, just as we were, like late as
Speaker 3: we're taping this, there was an update to a Tim
Speaker 3: McManus at AESPN spoke with Graham who wanted to clarify
Speaker 3: some of the statements and said, I made a mistake,
Speaker 3: and I assumed it was something that it wasn't. I
Speaker 3: just want to win so bad that I don't want
Speaker 3: to use the media when we need to talk about
Speaker 3: something and we can fix the problem ourselves. Ironic, I
Speaker 3: didn't add to it in a good light, So that's
Speaker 3: my bad.
Speaker 5: Somebody in the pr department, got a hold of Brandon
Speaker 5: Grammont said clean this up now.
Speaker 3: Well or aj or Jalen just texted him and we're like,
Speaker 3: what the hell man, because we don't know it could
Speaker 3: be Brandon Graham's interpretation of the situation. What I would
Speaker 3: say just is the chemistry on the field between Hurts
Speaker 3: and his wide receivers could be more consistent, could be better.
Speaker 4: And this just added a.
Speaker 3: Whole stew for the Philadelphia media crew to dive into
Speaker 3: for the next week or a month or season, depending
Speaker 3: on how.
Speaker 4: It goes off.
Speaker 3: Sason right, speaking of how wide receivers you know, weren't
Speaker 3: happy after Sunday's game. This is a sound from Garrett
Speaker 3: Wilson after losing to the Dolphins.
Speaker 2: Losing period sucks, and you know, when you're up in
Speaker 2: the fourth quarter, all of a sudden, it starts to
Speaker 2: feel like you have a losing problem. It's like you
Speaker 2: have like a a gene. So it's not like we're
Speaker 2: just going out there and getting our butt be from
Speaker 2: start to finish, you know, No, No, we have a
Speaker 2: chance to go win the game. We're supposed to win
Speaker 2: the games in our favor, and we're finding a way
Speaker 2: to lose.
Speaker 6: The game.
Speaker 2: So it's just frustrating for sure.
Speaker 4: O A losing gene is brutal.
Speaker 3: And I bring this quote up because there was an
Speaker 3: article about it from Zach Rosenblat in The Athletic which
Speaker 3: said previously, there was some speculation among league source people
Speaker 3: inside the Jets that thought Wilson might want to ask
Speaker 3: out if things don't go well. And things have certainly
Speaker 3: not go well. So teams were actually calling about Wilson
Speaker 3: at the trade deadline, wondering if he's going to be
Speaker 3: someone that would be available and just something to watch
Speaker 3: going into the offseason. I can't imagine the Jets would
Speaker 3: want to trade Garrett Wilson. If there's one part of
Speaker 3: their offense that they feel great about, it should be him.
Speaker 7: No.
Speaker 5: But my read on this, I don't think it's that uncommon, actually,
Speaker 5: because think about the program that Garret Wilson came from
Speaker 5: out of Ohio State, the only loser gene and that
Speaker 5: entire program as their head coach Ryan Day against Michigan. Otherwise,
Speaker 5: all they do is win. All he knows is success. Yes,
Speaker 5: I know, I'm gonna let my Ryan Day Vendett out
Speaker 5: here and he's going to get to the NFL to
Speaker 5: a team like the Jets, who can't shed that, who
Speaker 5: haven't amble shed that in years, haven't been the playoffs
Speaker 5: in years, And he plays hard, he risks it all.
Speaker 5: He finally thinks he's going to get the quarterback in
Speaker 5: Aaron Rodgers. It's going to get him there. And they
Speaker 5: continue to lose, and even in a game in which
Speaker 5: they played well enough to win, they had offensive success
Speaker 5: in the fourth quarter, that pressure mounts. It's a thing
Speaker 5: that's part of your culture when you It's like those
Speaker 5: losing teams that I think about the Browns, for example.
Speaker 5: A year after year, you lose and lose and lose,
Speaker 5: and when he gets tight, you think, how are we
Speaker 5: going to blow it this time instead of let's go
Speaker 5: win the football game, which is kind of what he said.
Speaker 5: And ultimately it plays out like that because that's the
Speaker 5: mentality you have, and it's so foreign to him. I
Speaker 5: could totally understand his frustration, and I can understand if
Speaker 5: he wanted out too.
Speaker 4: Well, see if he pushes that.
Speaker 3: But I just thought that that was one thing just
Speaker 3: kind of put in the NFL Daily Listeners and you know,
Speaker 3: think about it in mind. We'll see if it becomes
Speaker 3: a bigger story. It is crazy how many times Garrett
Speaker 3: Wilson has been opening Aaron Rodgers has missed him. Aaron
Speaker 3: Rodgers has not been consistent, He has not always been accurate.
Speaker 3: His completion percentage over expected is actually the worst in
Speaker 3: the NFL among starters other than Watson, and I'm forgetting,
Speaker 3: but he was third to last, and it basically among
Speaker 3: guys who had over one hundred and fifty, and I
Speaker 3: swear half of those are to Garrett Wilson. Like it's
Speaker 3: always Garrett Wilson that he misses, So maybe that's partly
Speaker 3: what he's frustrated about. Let's fly through a bit of
Speaker 3: news and talk a little offensive. Rookie of the Year
Speaker 3: Derek Carr is going to be out multiple weeks, according
Speaker 3: to Ian Rappaport, likely the season. The Saints are not
Speaker 3: announcing who will start. Jake Hayner came in briefly for Carr,
Speaker 3: so it could be Jake Hayner, it could be Spencer
Speaker 3: ratt With the agenda, Yeah, well my guess it'll be
Speaker 3: Both'll they'll start with Hayner and they'll n Rattler or
Speaker 3: vice versa. Either way, it's not going to change our
Speaker 3: lives too much, except if you're assigned to a Saints
Speaker 3: game on Sundays. Jonathan brooks Uh tore his ACL again,
Speaker 3: the Panthers rookie running back who was probably the number
Speaker 3: one prospect at the position coming into the draft until
Speaker 3: he tore his ACL at Texas and man, what a
Speaker 3: what a disappointing turn events. You just hate to see this,
Speaker 3: and you you always worry with these rookies that have
Speaker 3: the you know, another quick injury, whether they rushed back,
Speaker 3: even if it's not a rookie like Jalen Phillips. This
Speaker 3: year seemed like he rushed back and then immediately got
Speaker 3: hurt again with a different injury, and it's really disappointing
Speaker 3: for a good runner.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's a barer because he had just gotten back
Speaker 5: and he had just started to show some flashes of
Speaker 5: you know and kind of proved why they took him
Speaker 5: and why he was regarded so highly before he had
Speaker 5: hurt his knee in his final season in college. And
Speaker 5: this is the type of stuff that does happen from time.
Speaker 5: It's it's super unfortunate because the one thing you don't
Speaker 5: want to do is watch these things pile up. I
Speaker 5: think about Deonta Foreman. When he came into the NFL,
Speaker 5: he kind of experienced a similar, you know, turn of events.
Speaker 5: He didn't come in injured, but he experienced injuries. And
Speaker 5: now he's bounced around the NFL and had a promising
Speaker 5: start to his career before he got hurt. I hope
Speaker 5: the same is not true for Brooks, and it's it's
Speaker 5: one of those negatives in what has been a really
Speaker 5: kind of fun month or so for the Panthers. But
Speaker 5: you'll have those.
Speaker 3: No one's having more fun losing than the Panthers. There's
Speaker 3: still three intensements like so close everywhere. The one disappointing
Speaker 3: part of the Brooks injury on a on a bigger
Speaker 3: picture level for the Panthers is they actually haven't gotten
Speaker 3: a ton out of this rookie class.
Speaker 4: League at is solid.
Speaker 3: I think he has potential, You're not really sure which
Speaker 3: direction he's gonna go. And they you know, Jatavian Sanders,
Speaker 3: their fourth round tight end.
Speaker 5: Looks like I love him. Yeah, he's solid.
Speaker 3: But man, when you're a team like that, you need
Speaker 3: to you need to really have some doubles and home
Speaker 3: runs in your draft class. Maybe this this class will
Speaker 3: turn into that, but disappointing for them. The Bucks got
Speaker 3: some bad injury news. Antoine Winfield is out again with
Speaker 3: maultaultiple weeks. Not for the season, but he's had an
Speaker 3: injury plague season, part of the reason their their secondary
Speaker 3: has not looked great. The Browns are sticking with Jamis
Speaker 3: at least for another week. Kevin STEFANSI confirmed a O'Connell
Speaker 3: he might not be out yet. We got the Raiders
Speaker 3: in primetime next week and this Monday night doubleheader they got.
Speaker 3: We got Raiders Falcons as one of the two games.
Speaker 3: Vikings Bears is the other one, So we might be
Speaker 3: talking a little in O'Connell next week. Not Desmond Ritter,
Speaker 3: we'll see. And the Chiefs are checking on DJ Humphries.
Speaker 3: They're recently signed tackle got hurt right away. He's getting
Speaker 3: an m MRI. And the Packers' safety Javon boulderd is
Speaker 3: week to week. That is your quick update. I wanted
Speaker 3: to fly through that shook because we got a talk
Speaker 3: offensive Rookie of the Year ladder. I think this one
Speaker 3: is fascinating. This might be the best offensive rookie class
Speaker 3: in my lifetime.
Speaker 4: I like to go three.
Speaker 3: I don't know man like the immediately I'm thinking, like,
Speaker 3: who are the other good rookies on offense in twenty
Speaker 3: twelve when it was you know, Luck, RG three, Russ
Speaker 3: and Tannehill. You know, Tannehills down the list, but pretty
Speaker 3: solid for a rookie quarterback. Like and that's just the
Speaker 3: quarterbacks alone. I'm trying to think who else was part
Speaker 3: of that class, like A. J.
Speaker 2: Green.
Speaker 4: Let's talk.
Speaker 3: Let's talk two thousand and twenty four. I'm gonna go
Speaker 3: through it. You you you start out at five, and
Speaker 3: then I'll go, well, let's go back from five.
Speaker 5: Okay, So it's I don't know if it's the best,
Speaker 5: like you said, but it's definitely intriguing. And really it's
Speaker 5: because there's like two tiers to this, and if we
Speaker 5: start at the bottom the second tier, I could throw
Speaker 5: like three different guys in here. In fact, I have
Speaker 5: I think a total of six players that I've written
Speaker 5: up here. Okay, and the receiver group specifically comparable numbers,
Speaker 5: they're like really similar. You have like the guys like
Speaker 5: I'm gonna say Lad McConkey and Molik neighbors numbers wise
Speaker 5: very similar. But the guy that I have in front
Speaker 5: of both of them. Is Brian Thomas, and I'm gonna
Speaker 5: put him there fifth because he's playing in an offense
Speaker 5: that has had like no stability. Trevor Lawrence has gotten
Speaker 5: hurt a couple of times, and yet he's been able
Speaker 5: to make big plays. But he almost pops up out
Speaker 5: of nowhere. You forget he's there sometimes because they just
Speaker 5: have an issue with getting the ball down the field.
Speaker 5: But when he makes plays, man, it's special. Fifty four catches,
Speaker 5: eight hundred and fifty one yards, six touchdowns. I would
Speaker 5: put him in fifth just because he's done a little
Speaker 5: bit better statistically, but like Neighbors and mccakey, both look
Speaker 5: different from him too. Neighbors is a guy who've got
Speaker 5: fed a ton of targets early with Daniel Jones, they've
Speaker 5: gone through the quarterback carousel. He's disappeared at times. He
Speaker 5: only has three touchdown catches. Two of them were in
Speaker 5: the same game that was against the Browns, so it's
Speaker 5: been very hit or missed. But at times he's single
Speaker 5: handedly kept that offensive float. But I'm going to go
Speaker 5: Thomas over him just because I like Neighbors more as
Speaker 5: a player, but I like Thomas's production a little bit
Speaker 5: more at five.
Speaker 3: Okay, so Thomas is in my top five as well.
Speaker 3: I came up with eight names that were really strong
Speaker 3: candidates to me, and that's it was. There was very
Speaker 3: little separate or nine names, I should say, there was
Speaker 3: very little separation.
Speaker 4: For me between like four and nine on this list.
Speaker 3: Yeah, am I gonna am I being a homer to
Speaker 3: put Drake May already number five?
Speaker 4: I mean he's I feel it.
Speaker 5: I heard in your voice right now, Actually, like, do
Speaker 5: I am I wrong? It's there a little bit now
Speaker 5: You're like, maybe maybe I'll maybe I'll wait four more weeks.
Speaker 3: But yeah, here's what I think. He's elevating a team
Speaker 3: around him. I think if you just were saying who's
Speaker 3: playing quarterback at a better level like him or Bo
Speaker 3: Nix or Caleb, I think there's a pretty strong argument
Speaker 3: to say Drake May's playing paying better.
Speaker 5: All Right, it's gonna get interesting.
Speaker 4: Then I'm gonna not put man. I changed my mind off.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna get really hipster here, and I'm actually doing
Speaker 3: it off of people that I trust. People Ali Connelly
Speaker 3: and John Ledyard have been banging this drum, Nate Tice.
Speaker 3: I've talked to people inside of the league a little bit too.
Speaker 3: They think Zach Fraser of the Steelers is one of
Speaker 3: the eight best centers in the NFL right now. And
Speaker 3: so I think, just because we have this platform too,
Speaker 3: and we haven't mentioned Zach Fraser the whole freaking season,
Speaker 3: that to come in. And I know he missed a
Speaker 3: couple of games, but when he's been out there be
Speaker 3: maybe the best player on an really improving offensive line
Speaker 3: at a traditionally a very difficult position. Let's just give
Speaker 3: him a little bit of love. He is number five
Speaker 3: on my list. I will mention the guys that did
Speaker 3: not make my top that I think deserve a lot
Speaker 3: of mention is Neighbors. I can't believe Neighbors is not
Speaker 3: on my list. And then Joe Alt I think deserves
Speaker 3: a little bit of love play has played really solid
Speaker 3: at tackle. And then Drake May And now now I'm
Speaker 3: really in a tough bind, but yes, I'm putting Zach
Speaker 3: Fraser there at number five.
Speaker 5: I agree with the Fraser sentiment. Obviously, an offensive lineman
Speaker 5: is not going to get offensive Rookie the Year consideration.
Speaker 5: But here on show, we make the rules and we're
Speaker 5: gonna make it for Yeah, I agree we.
Speaker 4: Can though, like, why can't they? We we can do it.
Speaker 4: The os will be listening to this.
Speaker 3: You never like if people who have the articles and
Speaker 3: you write an NFL dock, I can just start putting
Speaker 3: it on.
Speaker 4: Then maybe some people will put him four or five.
Speaker 5: Oh okay, all right, grassroots campaign starts right here at
Speaker 5: NFL Daily. Okay, cool, it's I think it actually points
Speaker 5: to a really good comparison, at least an interesting comparison
Speaker 5: how the Steelers have drafted the offensive line because Broder
Speaker 5: Jones at tackle was a guy who I really liked
Speaker 5: the combine who has not fared well, has not lived
Speaker 5: up to expectation for the Steelers so far. Then they
Speaker 5: come back and they double down. They say, we're gonna
Speaker 5: invest the offensive line again, but we're gonna start inside out.
Speaker 5: We're gonna sign Isaac sam Malow, We're gonna draft Zach Fraser,
Speaker 5: We're gonna draft Mason McCormick. And suddenly you have an
Speaker 5: offensive line that is working well enough for both Naji
Speaker 5: Here and Jalen Woarn in smaller spurts to find success
Speaker 5: and for Russell Wilson have time to throw. And that's
Speaker 5: a big reason why they are where they are. I
Speaker 5: think Fraser is a key part of that center. Is
Speaker 5: really hard to come in and immediately find success. Usually
Speaker 5: if you do, you're an elite talent. And I very
Speaker 5: much agree with this. I just wish that offensive line
Speaker 5: got more love.
Speaker 4: There we go, so we're going to give it to it.
Speaker 3: By the way, I said twenty twelve, and that was
Speaker 3: what I was thinking because I thought about the quarterbacks,
Speaker 3: But the rest of that class actually was a bit
Speaker 3: of a disaster.
Speaker 4: With Trent Richards and whatnot.
Speaker 3: Two and eleven is the gold standard for draft classes
Speaker 3: in the modern era, and as rookies, they were outrageous
Speaker 3: on both sides of the ball. But let's give you
Speaker 3: some options of the players. Cam Newton one of the
Speaker 3: best rookie quarterbacks of all time. Jason Kelcey immediately stepped
Speaker 3: in and was at an extremely high level. Julio Jones
Speaker 3: is in that class. Tyrone Smith came in great in
Speaker 3: that class. Andy Dalton was a sneaky good rookie. He
Speaker 3: had his buddy AJ Green on that same team. That
Speaker 3: is a nice little rookie class. Randall Cobbs in the mix.
Speaker 3: I might take that class over.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I thought that was the green class.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's defensively they're even better, but even offensively it's good.
Speaker 4: All right, go to number four.
Speaker 5: Number four. I this is where it gets crazy. And
Speaker 5: this isn't biased, but I just love watching him play
Speaker 5: and I love the run he's had recently, and he
Speaker 5: also started as a non primary player. Bucky Irving for
Speaker 5: the Buccaneers back thirty seven rushes, seven and thirty five
Speaker 5: rushing yards, six touchdowns, has almost definitively taken control of
Speaker 5: the lead back role. Now, he got hurt in Sunday's
Speaker 5: game and Rashat White had to take over. But like,
Speaker 5: he's a guy who has proven to be capable of
Speaker 5: sifting his way through traffic, ripping off big runs. He's
Speaker 5: been consistent. He's helped open up the entire Buccaneers offense,
Speaker 5: starting from the backfield. They went into this draft knowing
Speaker 5: they need to be better as a running team, and
Speaker 5: they went and got Bucky Irving for that purpose, and
Speaker 5: I think he's delivered so far. He's another guy that's
Speaker 5: not gonna land on the radars of a lot of people,
Speaker 5: but like to avoid the whole wide receiver logjam that
Speaker 5: I encountered there and to avoid going quarterback too early.
Speaker 5: I thought he's a nice little pick there. He's players
Speaker 5: I've really enjoyed watching in that backfield, which is kind
Speaker 5: of a three headed backfield. If you throw Sean Tucker
Speaker 5: into the.
Speaker 3: Mix, that's fun. I'm glad you put a player that
Speaker 3: I wasn't going through. Our lists are going to be
Speaker 3: very different. I struggled with what to do with bow Knicks, Like,
Speaker 3: in my heart, I'm trying to think of how to
Speaker 3: give this award. In my heart, I believe Brian Thomas Junior,
Speaker 3: for instance, is better at his position now than bo Nix's.
Speaker 4: And it's not most Valuable Player.
Speaker 3: So yeah, quarterbacks get a little extra credit because their
Speaker 3: positions more important, But are you excellent at what you
Speaker 3: do now? It's not the most valuable rookie. So I
Speaker 3: wrote down Knicks fourth because I'm afraid of the Broncos
Speaker 3: fans if I don't list him at all. But as
Speaker 3: I'm talking it through, I don't really believe it, and
Speaker 3: I got I gotta do what I believe. Shook, I'm
Speaker 3: putting Brian Thomas in here.
Speaker 5: Okay. I thought you're gonna go Drake May for a second.
Speaker 3: Now, May give him four more games. People act like
Speaker 3: he missed the whole season. He didn't miss that much.
Speaker 3: I think May is playing playing at a great level.
Speaker 3: But I'm gonna go Brian there. I'm going to go
Speaker 3: Brian Thomas Junior here at the at the fourth spot.
Speaker 3: This makes for great podcasting me changing my mind mid stream.
Speaker 3: I just I just think as good as Nicks has been,
Speaker 3: and he's getting better and better, the first month counts
Speaker 3: when he was playing at a below average level, and
Speaker 3: he's for a starting quarterback, and he's very, very good
Speaker 3: for a rookie starting quarterback. But we don't have to
Speaker 3: give the award to a quarterback just so, and we
Speaker 3: have other options at quarterback anyways, in the in this class,
Speaker 3: if you really want to go there, and so I
Speaker 3: think Brian Thomas Junior is already a plus plus starting
Speaker 3: wide receiver.
Speaker 4: He's going to go number four for me? What what? What?
Speaker 4: What's next?
Speaker 6: For you?
Speaker 5: I like that logic, and it kind of blows up
Speaker 5: the logic that I already laid out there because I'm
Speaker 5: putting Nicks third, and it's because of the way he's
Speaker 5: played recently, and I think a lot of these season awards,
Speaker 5: what you did later in the season ends up mattering
Speaker 5: more than what you did earlier. I mean, look Lamar
Speaker 5: last year, he closed his MVP season with the last
Speaker 5: five weeks of the season, and because Dak Prescott blew
Speaker 5: a tire in that game against Buffalo, obviously different awards,
Speaker 5: but it just kind of speaks to the minds of voters.
Speaker 5: Recncy matters, and you're the voter here.
Speaker 4: You can decide whatever you want. I don't want you.
Speaker 5: What I like is that he grew. He's grown within
Speaker 5: you know, under Sean Payton's you know, oversight this season,
Speaker 5: and they're they're using him in most games where he's best,
Speaker 5: which is out in the perimeter. I think he's developing
Speaker 5: as a decision maker. He's an athletic player who can
Speaker 5: extend plays and pick up solid games on the ground
Speaker 5: with his legs. I feel like he's just trending upward
Speaker 5: and by the end of the season, like he threw
Speaker 5: two picks in that Browns game, they still win that game.
Speaker 5: He didn't look great, but he still looks good enough.
Speaker 5: He was still spinning it at times. I think he's
Speaker 5: just going to continue on this path to where by
Speaker 5: the end of the season I don't think he's going
Speaker 5: to enter the top two conversation here, but people are
Speaker 5: going to look at him and say, bright future, he
Speaker 5: can be the guy for them. And that's really all
Speaker 5: I'm looking for at quarterbacks specifically, because it's so much
Speaker 5: harder to be a really successful quarterback as a rookie
Speaker 5: that it is at other positions. And he's been on
Speaker 5: a good path for me, so I'm going there. Twenty
Speaker 5: eight hundred passing yard, seventy to eight touchdown intercept ratio,
Speaker 5: added three hundred four yards in the grounds, got four
Speaker 5: rushing touchdowns, doing a little bit of everything. I like
Speaker 5: him at three.
Speaker 3: See TD in interception ratio. For a while on around
Speaker 3: the NFL, I would just rail against passer rating and
Speaker 3: just say it's useless, like we don't need to use
Speaker 3: pass rate, And then I just stopped even ever mention it,
Speaker 3: like that's the best way to just just ignore it.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And now I'm getting there with TD to intercept ratio.
Speaker 3: It could just I mean, I know that's basically what
Speaker 3: informs the QB radio anyways, Like camleb Williams right now
Speaker 3: has a great TD interception ratio sixteen to five and
Speaker 3: anyone from Denver would get mad that Bo Nick's on this.
Speaker 3: So it's like Caleb Williams is not on this list either.
Speaker 3: His numbers are actually quite good, but it's it's partly
Speaker 3: because of all the throws he's not making. That he's
Speaker 3: holding the ball and taking those sacks and he's avoiding
Speaker 3: mistakes and that's really important, but that does not an
Speaker 3: offensive Rookie of the Year make. So I don't have
Speaker 3: Nicks or Caleb Williams on my list, even though I
Speaker 3: had Nicks written down and I just wasn't feeling it.
Speaker 3: I have Lad McConkie three. I love it, talk about
Speaker 3: getting better throughout the course of the season. I did
Speaker 3: not think he could get as open on the outside
Speaker 3: as often as he has. He's had to carry a
Speaker 3: big load in that offense, and he's made me rethink
Speaker 3: of whether he can be a true one, whatever that means.
Speaker 3: We heard this conversation about Nico Collins for a minute too.
Speaker 3: I don't think he's quite Nego Collins, but for him
Speaker 3: to be this good as a rookie, as long as
Speaker 3: he can stay healthy, you can keep getting better at
Speaker 3: the NFL. That's what Nico Collins started to do. And
Speaker 3: when they gave Nico Collins that contract last year, I
Speaker 3: was like, well, he's definitely a top twenty twenty five
Speaker 3: receiver in the NFL, and that was after his second year.
Speaker 3: And I kind of think mcconkey's there right now, and
Speaker 3: so why can't he keep getting better and evolve really
Speaker 3: into a number one. He's better than I expected. I
Speaker 3: think he's just having a fantastic rookie season and is
Speaker 3: a plus plus starter for a team that's winning.
Speaker 4: So McConkie gets my number three.
Speaker 5: I love Lad McConkie.
Speaker 2: He is.
Speaker 5: In the last couple of years, I've had a couple
Speaker 5: of really favorite receivers that weren't in that like elite
Speaker 5: group that everybody was talking about at the combine two
Speaker 5: years ago. Is Tank Dell. This year it's Ladd McConkey.
Speaker 5: He was at Georgia forever, so if you follow college football,
Speaker 5: you knew who he was. But I also actually I
Speaker 5: thought he was going to make an impact pretty quickly
Speaker 5: as long as he was in the right system. He's
Speaker 5: not in the right system, but he has the right
Speaker 5: quarterback and we saw how important he was to that
Speaker 5: offense when they went out and played against the Chiefs
Speaker 5: and they didn't have him and they had to turn
Speaker 5: to Stone Smart to move the ball down the field.
Speaker 5: He's fantastic. My comparison, though, talking about number one receivers,
Speaker 5: I made infamously made a comment to a former colleague
Speaker 5: who did not let me live it down over the
Speaker 5: next four years. Terry McLaurin when he was a rookie
Speaker 5: reminded me a lot of Ladd McConkey as a rookie.
Speaker 5: Just the way that's a great colly is that they
Speaker 5: made And I said, great number two. Don't know if
Speaker 5: he could be a number one. Well, he's clearly a
Speaker 5: number one. He's clearly a number one. Can Lad be
Speaker 5: a number one? If if Terry McLaurin is the law,
Speaker 5: then yes, he could be a number one.
Speaker 3: I think that's a I think that's an awesome comp
Speaker 3: I think they win in similar sorts of ways. I
Speaker 3: do think they also could be in the same sort
Speaker 3: of place in the NFL ecosystem.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're not going to be in.
Speaker 3: That top five list, probably, but you really raised the
Speaker 3: floor of what your passing game is going to be
Speaker 3: and you're going to be a consistent top twenty receiver
Speaker 3: throughout your career.
Speaker 4: So we'll see, all right, what's you're up to. Number two.
Speaker 5: Let's go number two. Jayden Daniels, a guy who I
Speaker 5: thought was going to run away with the award. Earlier
Speaker 5: in the season, they ran into some struggles offensively. Everybody
Speaker 5: blamed Cliff Kingsbury or Jaden and daniels mysterious rib injury
Speaker 5: or whatever it was. He's gotten back in track in
Speaker 5: recent weeks. The numbers don't quite suggest it anymore because
Speaker 5: of those lulls. Twenty one hundred passing yards, you know,
Speaker 5: fifteen to six touchdown in interception ratio sounds a lot
Speaker 5: like bo Nix, But visually we know the difference that
Speaker 5: he makes in this offense. He is a guy who
Speaker 5: is very much capable of handling all the stresses and
Speaker 5: pressures of playing quarterback in the NFL. He's got another
Speaker 5: five hundred nine yards on the ground in six rushing touchdowns.
Speaker 5: He opens up that offense. He's going to be a
Speaker 5: star for years to come. And if they hadn't hit
Speaker 5: that lall, I think he'd be the leader in the
Speaker 5: clubhouse right now. But because they did, it's going to
Speaker 5: get interesting up there. But he's my clear number two.
Speaker 3: Let's us have our conversation about Jaden versus Brock Bowers,
Speaker 3: because that's our that's our top two. I have Jadan
Speaker 3: Daniels one. I have Bowers too. It was close. You
Speaker 3: clearly have Bowers one. I respect it the whole I
Speaker 3: want to count the whole season, and Jadan Daniels was
Speaker 3: a top five quarterback for about a third of the season. Man,
Speaker 3: that does hold a lot of weight for me. I
Speaker 3: know he took a step back and he could lose
Speaker 3: this award and in my rankings over the last month,
Speaker 3: but where we stand now, his EPA for play numbers
Speaker 3: are still fantastic, Like they're not that close with Nicks.
Speaker 3: His QBR is top five, Like that's not close with Knicks. No,
Speaker 3: and yeah, is he arguably the best player at his
Speaker 3: position in the league like Bowers. No, he's not there,
Speaker 3: but he's he's high enough where many he might be
Speaker 3: a pro bowler or something like that. And as a
Speaker 3: rookie quarterback, that's enough where I guess I just said
Speaker 3: I have a conservative streak in me. I'm giving it
Speaker 3: to Jayden over Brock. But I love that you have
Speaker 3: Brock number one.
Speaker 5: So convince me, well, yeah, because Jadeen his position kind
Speaker 5: of reminded me of CJ. Stratus. So CJ's finished stronger
Speaker 5: than Jaden has so far. Still have a month left,
Speaker 5: so we'll see. Brock Bowers, Greg, you have been the guy,
Speaker 5: yeah on the brock Bowers train.
Speaker 3: I am.
Speaker 4: I haven't like six weeks.
Speaker 5: I was so happy he got that primetime Black Friday
Speaker 5: game against the Chiefs that everybody America who had nothing
Speaker 5: better to do than to watch a Black Friday football
Speaker 5: game got an introduction to the kid from Georgia who
Speaker 5: everybody in college has been raving about for years do
Speaker 5: the same thing in the NFL. He's got eighty seven catches,
Speaker 5: nine hundred and thirty three receiving yards. He's first in
Speaker 5: the NFL in receptions, by the way, nine hundred threy
Speaker 5: three receiving yards, fourth in the NFL. It's got four touchdowns.
Speaker 5: He's third in yack. He's tenth in yack over expected.
Speaker 5: He's eleventh in receiving yards over expected. He's a tight
Speaker 5: end in an offense it's playing with eight and O'Connell, Gardner,
Speaker 5: Minshew Desmen, Ritter. They have no running game. He's doing
Speaker 5: incredible things. This guy is a fantastic player and he's
Speaker 5: gonna be around for a long time and you're gonna
Speaker 5: know his name if you don't know it by now.
Speaker 5: And I think despite all the challenges that he faces,
Speaker 5: he makes enough spectacular plays in a terrible offense that
Speaker 5: he just may win the Offensive Rookie of the Year award.
Speaker 3: I love it, and I'm with you. It really raises
Speaker 3: good questions about what is this award for if it's
Speaker 3: just for pure excellence at what you're asked to do.
Speaker 3: Bowers has a strong case because I think it's between
Speaker 3: him and kill as the two all as the All
Speaker 3: Pro tight end. I might lean Kittle still because of
Speaker 3: the blocking and because Kittle's having a great season two
Speaker 3: catching the ball, but those are the two. So you're
Speaker 3: telling me he is a top two at his position
Speaker 3: as a rookie.
Speaker 4: That just doesn't It just doesn't happen. I'm sorry.
Speaker 3: That's that's future Hall of Famer type of stuff. Without
Speaker 3: getting you two over our skis, that's like, that's the
Speaker 3: type of stuff hall of famers, do you know what
Speaker 3: I mean? And it doesn't happen too much at the
Speaker 3: tight end position. Yeah, you might have convinced me. I
Speaker 3: got four weeks left to think about it, and these
Speaker 3: are just written in light pencil that we can erase.
Speaker 4: I love it.
Speaker 3: You kind of did convince me, but commit Jayden right
Speaker 3: in pen Jayden's having a fantastic offensive rookie season as well.
Speaker 3: This is a great class. I stand by my statement.
Speaker 3: It's one of the best that we've seen. And it
Speaker 3: makes since because the first round and the early second
Speaker 3: round even of this draft were dominated by offensive players,
Speaker 3: especially skill position players. But yeah, some of the linemen
Speaker 3: have turned into studs right away as well, So yeah,
Speaker 3: get give them some love as well. Let's wrap it
Speaker 3: up here with a little Captain's corner. It is time
Speaker 3: for the Captain's Corner, presented by Captain Morgan.
Speaker 5: Get us going, Nick, All right, Well, we're gonna go
Speaker 5: to a guy who attracts a lot of attention in
Speaker 5: the offseason year round three hundred and sixty five days.
Speaker 5: But he hasn't had a great year this year, whether
Speaker 5: it's not having his quarterback, dealing with injuries, whatever, it is,
Speaker 5: just hasn't really quite been there. Like his fantasy managers
Speaker 5: won him two. But fantasy managers be damned. Because Tyreek
Speaker 5: Hill had ten catches for one hundred and fifteen yards
Speaker 5: and a touchdown, and the overtime went over the Jets.
Speaker 5: And I know the overtime period was the Johnas Smith Show,
Speaker 5: but they got there in part because of Tyreek Hill.
Speaker 5: It made me really happy to see him break one
Speaker 5: hundred receiving yards and play a significant role in this
Speaker 5: offense when he hasn't been able to from this year.
Speaker 5: Why we can unpack that later, but for one day,
Speaker 5: he was once again a captain for the Dolphins in
Speaker 5: a must win game.
Speaker 3: Well, why is it like your fantasy team it got you,
Speaker 3: like into the playoffs or something like that.
Speaker 5: No, it's just why. No, I'm saying, why hasn't he
Speaker 5: played as big of a role off Who knows it's
Speaker 5: up and down?
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, I'm gonna go with the obvious one. I
Speaker 3: try to go through my notes and who would be
Speaker 3: a fun guy to pick up all the games that
Speaker 3: I watched on Monday since we last talked, and I
Speaker 3: went through the Rams Bills game closer and I knew
Speaker 3: it's just one of It's just one of the best
Speaker 3: wide receiver performances as great as Matthew Stafford was in
Speaker 3: that game, and I'm sure we're going to talk about
Speaker 3: him with Jordan rod Riege in the studio on Tuesday.
Speaker 3: Have of a fun show plan. As great as Stafford was,
Speaker 3: that was a special wide receiver performance by Puka Nakua,
Speaker 3: who in an age of just elite wide receiver play
Speaker 3: the way aj Brown is playing this year when he
Speaker 3: has a chance to catch the ball, the way Jamar
Speaker 3: Chase is playing. Obviously, the run that Justin Jefferson is on,
Speaker 3: Puka offers a different flavor and that game showed how
Speaker 3: much he's improved since his rookie year when he buy
Speaker 3: the numbers was the best rookie wide receiver in the
Speaker 3: history of the sport. And when he's healthy, and he's
Speaker 3: healthy now, he belongs right there with those names. And
Speaker 3: I think he's still getting that fifth round tax just
Speaker 3: a little bit that maybe you don't think of him
Speaker 3: like right at that level. But he's so unique. He
Speaker 3: has such good vision as a runner. Chase has this too,
Speaker 3: but they're both such fantastic runners in terms of setting
Speaker 3: up their blocks, and his hands and his body control,
Speaker 3: everything is just top top elite, and he's developed into
Speaker 3: an even better player than he was as a rookie,
Speaker 3: which I didn't think was possible, and I thought maybe
Speaker 3: he'd take a step back this year. It is the
Speaker 3: total opposite. So he is my Captain Morgan Captain of
Speaker 3: the Week.
Speaker 5: Credit Cooper Cup allowing him to throw up on his
Speaker 5: front lawn during off season workouts.
Speaker 4: For getting there. There you go.
Speaker 3: That was the Captain squarter presented by Captain Morgan. It's
Speaker 3: delicious and Chris perfect for game day with your friends.
Speaker 4: Spice it up.
Speaker 3: Visit Captain Morgan dot com to find a Captain near you.
Speaker 4: Please drink responsibly. That is it.
Speaker 3: Let's get out of here. We've honked too long on
Speaker 3: this Monday night. We got to get shook to, you know,
Speaker 3: go watch some games.
Speaker 4: What are you gonna watch? First?
Speaker 5: Shook play their music. We're gonna watch Chicago San Francisco.
Speaker 5: Why not Rock Purdy back on the horse, baby.
Speaker 3: This is always fun having Shook. We've done this every
Speaker 3: Monday night all season long. I've absolutely loved it. We've
Speaker 3: got three to go. We've got a doubleheader next week.
Speaker 3: That should be fun until Tuesday's show with Jordan and
Speaker 3: Colleen Wolf and then another little special guest. Yeah, When
Speaker 3: we're breaking down offensive Rookie of the Year, you know
Speaker 3: football is back.