Speaker 1: Welcome to Night Call, a production of I Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: It's one nineteen am on the Love Boat in Rio
Speaker 1: de Janeiro and you're listening tonight Call. Hello everybody, and
Speaker 1: welcome to Night Call podcast for your strange days and
Speaker 1: lonely nights. I'm Molly Lambert and with me as always
Speaker 1: our Tess lynch Aunt Emily Orshita, and joining us today
Speaker 1: is our special guest, Heather have Rulesqui. Heather is the
Speaker 1: author of the Ask Polly advice column in New York
Speaker 1: Magazine and the Ask Molly newsletter. She's also the author
Speaker 1: of three books, um and a longtime Internet writer, cool
Speaker 1: person all around, a long time legend legendary blogger. Welcome Heather, Hi,
Speaker 1: I'm so happy to be here. How they're going to
Speaker 1: talk to us today about the Love Boat for Spooky
Speaker 1: Romance February, Because what's spookier than love at sea? Trapped
Speaker 1: on a boat, what is spookier than anything at sea?
Speaker 1: There's no escape. But first we're going to take a
Speaker 1: night call, actually a night email. Hey, night Call. I
Speaker 1: have had a couple night call relevant experiences recently. I
Speaker 1: am writing to share sleep. Podcasts are certainly one expansion
Speaker 1: of the podcast medium. But I was visiting my parents
Speaker 1: last week when my mom informed me of the existence
Speaker 1: of dog podcasts, which you put on for your dog
Speaker 1: when you're gone. I'm not sure if there's more than one,
Speaker 1: but the one She the Dog uses features random British
Speaker 1: actors telling your dog it's a good dog and various
Speaker 1: as as well as dropping random quotes from historical figures
Speaker 1: that they follow up. I don't think they were talking
Speaker 1: about dogs, but I think it still applies. I told
Speaker 1: a dog owning friend this and she was like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's also dog TV now. So this is the decade
Speaker 1: of dog media apparently. Hopefully the dogs will be inspired
Speaker 1: to create media of their own and ultimately save us all.
Speaker 1: Best Charlie Heller, Thank you, Charlie. Thanks Charlie, what a
Speaker 1: great night email. Did either of you guys listen to
Speaker 1: the dog's favorite sounds or something? It's not a dog,
Speaker 1: but it's favorite with a you. Um. It's funny because
Speaker 1: they Charlie linked, which we will link to an article
Speaker 1: in the Streets Times. It's like very British. It's like
Speaker 1: a a Singapore news site, so it was like very
Speaker 1: British oriented. But I just thought that was funny. It
Speaker 1: is like Game of Thrones actors just saying like you're
Speaker 1: such a good boy, Like when you look at me
Speaker 1: like that, I'm just so happy. I just want the
Speaker 1: very best for you. I guess you just leave it
Speaker 1: on in your living room when you have to leave
Speaker 1: a dog alone. Because it's three hundred and some minutes.
Speaker 1: I did not listen to all minutes. Do you think
Speaker 1: people are listening to this that are not dogs? Um?
Speaker 1: I can see I used for it. I mean it
Speaker 1: has an smr Q. Yeah, it's like very I I
Speaker 1: listened to I forget the name of the actress who
Speaker 1: was reading it, but it was very sup like it
Speaker 1: was in a very like low like I'm just I'm
Speaker 1: just speaking to you, like the the voice that you
Speaker 1: would use if you had the dog, like right in
Speaker 1: front of Dog Tamber. Yeah, Dogtamber, you're smells delicious. Have
Speaker 1: you been in your greeniece? Right? Is it like a
Speaker 1: fellow dog talking to you or is it a person?
Speaker 1: I think it's just supposed to be like the best
Speaker 1: person you could leave your dog with is a British
Speaker 1: person who speaks to them calmingly, apprently. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: the dog media stuff and a dog TV that's not
Speaker 1: new like I remember there used to be I definitely
Speaker 1: remember cat Cat TV remember and cat vhs is. It
Speaker 1: was a lot of aquariums. Dog TV is the greatest
Speaker 1: channel in the world. I don't know where it comes from,
Speaker 1: but my parents got it as like a preview for
Speaker 1: a few a week or two world, and my mom
Speaker 1: got obsessed with it, and then I also got obsessed
Speaker 1: with it because it was like programmed with shows. But
Speaker 1: the shows were like a center pete on the wall
Speaker 1: with lights on it, and then another show would be
Speaker 1: like birds in the park. So dogs and Stoner's have
Speaker 1: a It was really good slow TV. It was, you know,
Speaker 1: and some of them were like from the point of
Speaker 1: view of a dog, just like a shot of like
Speaker 1: a dog running around the beach um. But the idea
Speaker 1: was you're supposed to leave it on for your dog
Speaker 1: when you left the house. That is what I would
Speaker 1: think a dog podcast would be like the It would
Speaker 1: be like more of a field recording. Yeah. No, I
Speaker 1: think it's not meant to be disorienting in that way.
Speaker 1: It's not supposed to take you to another place as
Speaker 1: a dog like you stimulating and you don't want the dog.
Speaker 1: It's to play kate the dog. What if the dog
Speaker 1: is like a strange British man is in the house
Speaker 1: trying to me away from my true owners. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's probably good they have like both male and female
Speaker 1: voices on it, just so that you know you can
Speaker 1: if your dog responds better to two women, and you
Speaker 1: know you can hear a nice lady talking or whatever,
Speaker 1: which is definitely a thing. Do you have pets that
Speaker 1: respond to media? My mom just sent me a picture
Speaker 1: that her cat, Satsky, has just discovered video, like has
Speaker 1: started responding to it for the first time. She had
Speaker 1: a YouTube video that's playing on our laptop on the bed,
Speaker 1: and like she showed me a picture of like the
Speaker 1: cat just like pulling at the screen, which was like,
Speaker 1: and she's kind of she's she's not young, Like she's
Speaker 1: like nine years old or something like that, and like
Speaker 1: this just feels like a late breaking thing for her
Speaker 1: to be tuned into. She saw the monolith. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: like suddenly, just like the fourth wall broke down. How
Speaker 1: they're deer dogs watch TV? They do I feel like dogs.
Speaker 1: I mean when I was younger, dogs they didn't My
Speaker 1: dogs did not see things on TV. But then my
Speaker 1: last set of dogs who are dead now God rest
Speaker 1: their souls a um, but they but I have two
Speaker 1: replacement dogs, God bless them. One of them is definitely
Speaker 1: a dopple, like a recruited rescue doppelganger of the other dog, um,
Speaker 1: and the the other one was named Potas and she
Speaker 1: was really really aloof like president Yeah nice um. But
Speaker 1: but the new one is named fig and she's really needy,
Speaker 1: so it's sort of like um, but they look that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm like the dog pervert that gets the dog that.
Speaker 1: I mean, people do that, they get the same breed, right,
Speaker 1: But with rescue dogs actually have to like scour the internet,
Speaker 1: whereas my dog that looks like my other dog. Um.
Speaker 1: But but my both of my dogs now, one of
Speaker 1: them is kind of a Jack Russell choua and the
Speaker 1: other ones, I don't know something, but they look at
Speaker 1: animals when an animal appears on the TV. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: think there's something about like the movement of wildlife that
Speaker 1: translates like even though it's out of context. And yeah,
Speaker 1: one of my cats definitely will pose at the screen
Speaker 1: when an animal appears. Actually a bird um which one draxxel. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but also yesterday I was watching a cat documentary and
Speaker 1: one of the cats at least definitely like perked up
Speaker 1: and started watching it. Was it for the cats? It
Speaker 1: was not, it was for me. Well, people just want
Speaker 1: to see themselves. I only got halfway representations. It was
Speaker 1: a cat documentary. I think it was called hashtag Me Out,
Speaker 1: but it was just it was on Netflix. I think
Speaker 1: it was about the history of cat memes. So it
Speaker 1: started with like end cat and like it kind of
Speaker 1: was actually interesting. I did stop watching it halfway through,
Speaker 1: but the first half was like there was this pre
Speaker 1: gentrified Internet where cats got famous organically, like little bub
Speaker 1: then they were like and then there was a shift
Speaker 1: at a certain point where people were like I'm getting
Speaker 1: a cat to try and make it famous on the Internet. Um,
Speaker 1: so that was fascinating. But there was like a person
Speaker 1: who's like the cat meme archivist at the Museum of
Speaker 1: the Moving Image. Wow, that's there, that's a title, I believe. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's fascinating that. I feel like they're doing the good
Speaker 1: work there. Yeah, they were like, this is the one
Speaker 1: thing that remains like a constant on the Internet is
Speaker 1: the animal memes. It's like the one thing everyone can
Speaker 1: agree is like a good thing on the Internet. There
Speaker 1: aren't enough animal memes on Twitter lately. I feel like
Speaker 1: it's all just gloom and dim and there's I want more. Um.
Speaker 1: You see that owl that can run? No, I posted
Speaker 1: it today. I liked the robocat. He was a victim
Speaker 1: of frostbite, Siberians robotic legs. Yeah, that was That was
Speaker 1: a good animal meme. I have now eliminated all of
Speaker 1: the suggested topics from Twitter, so it's only weather in cats.
Speaker 1: Just very disorienting that I have to say. And also
Speaker 1: the cream doesn't necessarily rise to the top with the
Speaker 1: cats that become popular on Twitter. I have to say, like,
Speaker 1: not to shame these cats, but not the best cats
Speaker 1: I've seen. And I'm not even that picky, but some
Speaker 1: of those cats are really low tire. It's true that,
Speaker 1: like I've seen that there has been a downturn in
Speaker 1: the quality of cat Like I feel like the most
Speaker 1: cat that you see now is the one that's sitting
Speaker 1: at the table opposite Taylor arm Strong in that name
Speaker 1: of like the white cat, the white cat cat. There
Speaker 1: are some famous ones, but this documentary was also like
Speaker 1: no cat will ever be as famous again as a
Speaker 1: Little Bub, like universally famous like the two on the
Speaker 1: dog side, but also like Marnie and Little Bub, we're
Speaker 1: both like rescue pets with sort of like weird health conditions,
Speaker 1: which is also what made them like love of Balls.
Speaker 1: You were like, oh, you genuinely just got like like
Speaker 1: the guy who does a Little Bub was just like no,
Speaker 1: I wasn't like trying to like, yeah, now that the
Speaker 1: rescues they're like scouring the rescues for fun faces. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I did an event with Marnie once where I interviewed
Speaker 1: her on a stage. I interviewed I interviewed her caretaker
Speaker 1: Shirley bra Hot, who is cool, and it was like
Speaker 1: I just was like asking her questions about Martie, like
Speaker 1: when did you get her? And you know, what does
Speaker 1: she like to eat? Questions. But it was an audience
Speaker 1: of mostly kids. It was at the Echo Plex. It
Speaker 1: was like Beatlemania, Like the kids were just like go
Speaker 1: Like Marnie just walked around on the stage and the
Speaker 1: kids were like were they all trying to take pictures?
Speaker 1: And then she would like stick her tongue out and
Speaker 1: they'd freak out again and then should like flop over
Speaker 1: it was amazing. It's hilarious. The most fame I've ever
Speaker 1: been around. Yeah. Um, it was a beautiful experience. You're
Speaker 1: all transformed, Beautiful experiences that transform everyone who passes through them.
Speaker 1: How there you came to talk to us about a
Speaker 1: little show called the Love Boat. Yes, I did. That's
Speaker 1: I'm here to speak of the Love Boat. We were
Speaker 1: going to do this anyway for Spooky Love February. But
Speaker 1: then also Fred Silverman just passed away. Who is this
Speaker 1: TV executive who's famous for green lighting, among other things,
Speaker 1: the Love Boat. He is known for doing the Rural
Speaker 1: Purge where they canceled Green Acres and the Beverly Hillbillies,
Speaker 1: Uh to go after a more sophisticated audience. The Cruisers. Well,
Speaker 1: he he greenlight Love Boat and Charlie's Angels, so he, like,
Speaker 1: you know, it was responsible for this whole genre. But
Speaker 1: he also green like all in the Family and the
Speaker 1: Jeffersons and stuff like. He's a big figure in TV.
Speaker 1: So it's almost like there's actually a reason that we're
Speaker 1: talking about the Love Boat. Amazing. We searched Tie and
Speaker 1: Love for a reason, and look, yes, you know what,
Speaker 1: there are so many times our powers are too strong.
Speaker 1: The Love Boat. Well, okay, so I was born in
Speaker 1: nineteen seventy. Someone recently told me, you really shouldn't tell
Speaker 1: people your age anymore. It's done. Yeah, like I said
Speaker 1: that to you. A woman said that to me in
Speaker 1: the public eye. She was like, no more, no more
Speaker 1: speaking of your age, just forget your age. I was like,
Speaker 1: oh no, it's kind of fun to flip people out
Speaker 1: a little. I don't really get it. But the Love
Speaker 1: Boat in the seventies, okay, so it was on from
Speaker 1: seventy seven to nine, eight seven, those were the years
Speaker 1: that I was, uh, seven to seventeen. I did not
Speaker 1: watch it when I was seventeen. I think you'll find
Speaker 1: that reassuring. Um. But at the age of seven. Um,
Speaker 1: I think Star Wars came out in seventy six. So
Speaker 1: Love Boat and Star Wars, I feel like, are sort
Speaker 1: of akin because the Love Boat was a show because
Speaker 1: they're both on ships. They have ships, they're they're both
Speaker 1: on yes, neither on land death star cruise ship similar. Um.
Speaker 1: But the Love Boat was a show where basically you
Speaker 1: had the rotating guests. Um it was. I guess that's
Speaker 1: called what is it called like a serial where they're
Speaker 1: rotating people in and out right and anthology because it
Speaker 1: always is the same ship. Captain. Yeah, like you have
Speaker 1: the set characters kind of like Law and Order, right, Like,
Speaker 1: you have these rotating storylines and typically Okay, so the
Speaker 1: quintessential story is two people come to the love boat
Speaker 1: with It's a little bit like Fantasy Islands. Fantasy Island
Speaker 1: was on after the love boat, but to a couple
Speaker 1: comes and one of them is secretly dying, okay, but
Speaker 1: she doesn't want to tell her partner. They just keep
Speaker 1: Basically like almost every other scene is just a couple
Speaker 1: on the deck of the love boat, clinking little champagne glasses. Um.
Speaker 1: It was sort of like an escapist luxury, you know,
Speaker 1: akin to Um, Dynasty, Dallas, Falcon's crest Um. It was
Speaker 1: sort of like the middle class vision of what luxury was.
Speaker 1: I feel like I didn't watch a lot of these shows,
Speaker 1: but they still completely shaped my idea of what is
Speaker 1: like luxury. Ye, Like, when I think of rich people,
Speaker 1: I'm still like Dynasty. That is like how you should
Speaker 1: dress if you like crazy hair, um, flushed, strange, overly
Speaker 1: tanned faces, shoulder pads, um, low cut shit, I'm dressed like, wait,
Speaker 1: so who are the who are the main cast of
Speaker 1: the love boat is like the crew of the ship.
Speaker 1: The crew of the ship. So there's Gavin McLeod who
Speaker 1: was We wouldn't we know from such things as Tyler
Speaker 1: Moore show he was Murray, Um there is I didn't
Speaker 1: write down the other ones. There's the oh yeah Isaac, okay,
Speaker 1: so I know the character names. Yeah there there weren't like, yeah,
Speaker 1: Isaac was a bartender. I went to camp with his son.
Speaker 1: You went to camp? Yeah, And so Isaac and Gopher
Speaker 1: or like the two goofy like, um, hey, let's have
Speaker 1: a party. Hey, check out the girls kind of guys
Speaker 1: on the Gophers like the I don't know, he's like
Speaker 1: a lower down on the on the ship. Isaac is
Speaker 1: the bartender and he, you know, in the opening credits
Speaker 1: he's like, I mean, it's sort of like the opening
Speaker 1: credits that people spoof now on you know, Bachelor in Paradise,
Speaker 1: like shaking the shape he points, Hey, Bachelor in Paradise
Speaker 1: is totally a love boat rip off. Yeah, you're right exactly,
Speaker 1: And people there's a similar amount of melodrama. Um, there's
Speaker 1: the classic shot. At least four or five times per episode.
Speaker 1: There's just a shot of tits or ass like asses
Speaker 1: walking like butt cheeks walking by in a bikini and
Speaker 1: then you know Gopher our Isaac are like, whoa, there's
Speaker 1: an ass right there. That's probably the first time you
Speaker 1: could do that on television because again I did read
Speaker 1: a lot about Fred Silverman and they were like he
Speaker 1: pioneered jiggle vision with shows like that and Charlie's Angels,
Speaker 1: So jiggle visions just like check out the ass. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like shows that people thought were stupid, but lots of
Speaker 1: people watched because they had like t n A and
Speaker 1: they were very like comforting in their regularity. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: like decorative TENA. Though it wasn't like plot driven. It
Speaker 1: was just like oh, in between scenes you might see
Speaker 1: a butt right and then like the end point is Baywatch, yes,
Speaker 1: but there's not driven ten there's a purpose to those
Speaker 1: down the beach. Those asses have a goal. I mean,
Speaker 1: which what else doesn't have a even the assts of
Speaker 1: dog It all comes back, um, But there wasn't any dirtiness. Yeah,
Speaker 1: people like would sort of like talk about making love.
Speaker 1: I guess you know it was making love. It seems
Speaker 1: very soft rock. Yeah, yeah, soft porn software. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's like middle class romance. Like but see, you gotta
Speaker 1: put it in the context of like the movies of
Speaker 1: the time, like did you ever see Okay, what is
Speaker 1: the name of that movie? The quintessential kind of like
Speaker 1: shitty eighties movie to me is this Michelle Pfeiffer and
Speaker 1: Mel Gibson fall in love. They I just remember this
Speaker 1: scene where they make love in a hot tub, yeah,
Speaker 1: Tequila Sunrise, and then they burst out of and it's
Speaker 1: like storing sacks and they burst out of the hot tub.
Speaker 1: Wo fucking and you're like, fucking, It's not like that one.
Speaker 1: I'm saying. There were a lot of like okay, so
Speaker 1: can we talk about love scenes? Have you guys ever
Speaker 1: talked about just the existence scene? Yeah? The existence etic
Speaker 1: That was all yeah, all erotic thrillers. But from what era?
Speaker 1: From early yeah, nineties, I would say from from about
Speaker 1: the time probably right around there. Suddenly, okay to show
Speaker 1: that the nine and a half weeks era, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: well I feel like the I just had this epiphany
Speaker 1: one day where I was like, what happened to sex scenes?
Speaker 1: You know, like they used to be long but love
Speaker 1: but was sort of like worked around that with It
Speaker 1: was mostly really about the cheesiness of like, oh God,
Speaker 1: I just love you so good, You're just so It
Speaker 1: still had to be about love in order to pass standards,
Speaker 1: but the time was like a secret between the couples
Speaker 1: or some sort of like mortal. There was usually some
Speaker 1: stupid twist like I'm dying and I can't There was
Speaker 1: usually yeah, it was usually like I can't really tell.
Speaker 1: It was not the era of let's process our emotions
Speaker 1: together on this deck with our champagne. It was more like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go change into something more comfortable, you know,
Speaker 1: you know, like everything happened behind closed doors. Like but
Speaker 1: you know, you imagine I'm just having the most grueling,
Speaker 1: gruelingly dull missionary sex and their little terrible beds. People
Speaker 1: are repressed on the love boat. Um yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: you know, it was like they were all wearing lip gloss,
Speaker 1: Like how hot could it get? I mean it seems,
Speaker 1: you know a lot of people get sea sick. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there wasn't. I feel like, there wasn't a lot of
Speaker 1: like realism. There was a lot of vomiting over the side. Um.
Speaker 1: The idea of having sex on a cruise ship. I've
Speaker 1: never been on a cruise ship or if I had
Speaker 1: sex on a cruise ship, obviously, but the idea yet
Speaker 1: see night call Um. But I'm confused if that's like
Speaker 1: an erotic thing. Those those little tin the beds very small,
Speaker 1: like the beds tend to be too smaller beds pushed
Speaker 1: together kind of wire. You in the mile Long Club,
Speaker 1: no comments. Maybe that's why they were having a mile
Speaker 1: high club. Is in the air. It should be like
Speaker 1: like League submarine. It would be amazing. I went to
Speaker 1: the estate sale of Geraldine Saunders, who's the woman who
Speaker 1: wrote the book that The Love Boat was a spinoff of.
Speaker 1: You know, I got tipped about her estate sale. It
Speaker 1: was in Glendale, and it was just a really amazing
Speaker 1: Glendale estate sale of this woman who was like the
Speaker 1: self made mogul who had written this book. She had
Speaker 1: like Thennis tried to be a celebrity astrologer. She was
Speaker 1: married to I think his name is Omar Star or something.
Speaker 1: She was married to another super famous astrologer, and they
Speaker 1: sort of pioneered like being celebrity astrologers. And then she
Speaker 1: became the first female cruise director. She had this obsession
Speaker 1: with like I want to work on a cruise and
Speaker 1: be in charge, and she did, so they were like
Speaker 1: selling they Yeah, they had her cruise director jacket for sale.
Speaker 1: But she wrote this book about it called The Love Boat,
Speaker 1: about using astrology to like match make on the cruise.
Speaker 1: Um the back of the book is amazing. I think
Speaker 1: I talked about it here once before because it's like
Speaker 1: this vivacious, volaptuous virgo from Glendale takes you on a
Speaker 1: romantic cruise and like, who knows what will happen on
Speaker 1: a ship, like people might find love on the love Boat.
Speaker 1: And then somebody bought it. The general taken an ip
Speaker 1: in turning it into a show, and she had a
Speaker 1: love boat lifesaver around her pool. Oh my god, the
Speaker 1: book club. Did she have artifacts other artifacts from the
Speaker 1: actual show. No, it was more artifacts from her astrology
Speaker 1: career that they had and a million copies of The
Speaker 1: Love Boat. Which I was she already like wealthy just
Speaker 1: from being an astrologer before that or is that? Like
Speaker 1: it seems like she was just sort of a NonStop hustler,
Speaker 1: like she was a girl boss. She was like a model,
Speaker 1: and then she like just kept finding ways to sort
Speaker 1: of like try to get famous exactly like that. I
Speaker 1: feel like now she would have just done an astrology cruise,
Speaker 1: done the wellness cruise. Well she had she invented this
Speaker 1: like alternate Uigi board that they had all these prints
Speaker 1: of that. I bought one up and put it up
Speaker 1: over I forget, but I'll send you a photo. It's
Speaker 1: totally weird. It's just like it's own thing. It's very
Speaker 1: a cult. Is it the alphabet or is it something
Speaker 1: else there. It's like it's its own kind of like
Speaker 1: wheel with like zodiac and then like maybe chakras and
Speaker 1: different parts of the parts of the body and sun
Speaker 1: signs and stuff. It's very weird. Have you try to
Speaker 1: use it? No, I'm a little scared of it. But
Speaker 1: I didn't buy it and put it in my house,
Speaker 1: so not already now you have to use or last
Speaker 1: she was also her whole life story was super interesting.
Speaker 1: She was married to a guy who was like mysteriously
Speaker 1: murdered who I think he wrote the wild bunch um.
Speaker 1: She was married to a bunch of interesting dudes. And
Speaker 1: then she also at her house had a million headshots
Speaker 1: of hot guys current day because she was like working
Speaker 1: on some projects and she had some other romance novels
Speaker 1: she'd written. So it was like all these romance novel
Speaker 1: looking guys, like contact sheets of them, like running on
Speaker 1: the Beach. Did she so she was a super horny gal. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she defined the horny nous of the seventies. Yeah, she
Speaker 1: was a groundbreaking human totally. And this, like her house
Speaker 1: was amazing because it was like a dream like seventies
Speaker 1: party palace for like a self made like you know, lady.
Speaker 1: It was just totally Was she single when she died?
Speaker 1: No idea? And was it a was it a did?
Speaker 1: It seemed like a party house like at an active use.
Speaker 1: It seemed like a party house from the nineteen sixties,
Speaker 1: but like the early nineties. It felt more like my
Speaker 1: grandparents house than like a swing in like Austin Powers
Speaker 1: Bachelorrette pad. But I don't know. It was just fascinating.
Speaker 1: How many times do you think she was married? Could
Speaker 1: you tell? Well, at least three. I think that's a
Speaker 1: very l a archetype. Yeah, like someone with a kind
Speaker 1: of obscure career that you're like, what what the hell
Speaker 1: what did you do? WHOA you didn't and you make
Speaker 1: a fortune and then you're just like I think I'll
Speaker 1: just funk a lot of guys. Yeah, and live in
Speaker 1: the hills of Glendale. This is exactly like me that woman.
Speaker 1: For a while in the in the early two thousand's,
Speaker 1: I had a series of parties called fuck He's drunk Boat,
Speaker 1: and sometimes we get confused and call it drunk Boat.
Speaker 1: So the emphasis was either on fucking or getting drunk
Speaker 1: depending um. And people really responded to that name, and
Speaker 1: it was they were always good parties and people always
Speaker 1: got drunk and people I'm going to say that people
Speaker 1: always fucked. I didn't see it. So what you're saying
Speaker 1: is The Love Boat did inspire really classy corollary house
Speaker 1: in like y to Carera debauchery. It was. Were there
Speaker 1: any episodes of The Love Boat that particularly stuck with you?
Speaker 1: For the one about Okay? So pretty much the experience
Speaker 1: of watching The Love Boat was just like, especially at
Speaker 1: age seven, was like who the fund is? That was
Speaker 1: like the primary feeling you had because Ernest Borg nine,
Speaker 1: you know who's that. It's like the people who are
Speaker 1: too old for you to understand who they are. They
Speaker 1: were all on that show for me, and some of
Speaker 1: them were like, um, you know, borderline silent era because
Speaker 1: it's the seventies, right, so like they're still hanging around.
Speaker 1: David Hasselhoff, Gene Kelly, gene Kelly, Yes, yes, Betty White,
Speaker 1: Marie Osmond, Florence Henderson. I mean that's Brady Munch right,
Speaker 1: Carol Channing, Yeah, I think everybody's duke. You only have
Speaker 1: to do it for like a day or ever a day.
Speaker 1: And I'm sure that the casting director was someone who
Speaker 1: just like you, just wanted to appease. Maybe that is
Speaker 1: a really smart idea. It feels like there aren't, like,
Speaker 1: are there any shows like that now that we're just
Speaker 1: I will say, actually, this is like I've gotten obsessed
Speaker 1: with Below Deck on Bravo, which is like a semi
Speaker 1: documentary real reality show. It's the work Boat. It's the
Speaker 1: work Boat. Well, it's a show about people who work,
Speaker 1: who live and work on a boat that's like a
Speaker 1: luxury yacht. And then they have a different person on
Speaker 1: every week and they are sometimes like semi famous people,
Speaker 1: but they're like Bravo leparties, like Bravo famous people, so
Speaker 1: like the only people I knew who they were. One
Speaker 1: of them was the Queen of Versailles, the woman who
Speaker 1: there was a documentary about her building this insane house. Um,
Speaker 1: are they supposed to be themselves? Are they just show
Speaker 1: up and there are they just? Yeah, it's it's a
Speaker 1: real show about like the chafts are always divas. It's
Speaker 1: fascinating because it's also like it's very unglamorous to work
Speaker 1: on the boat, but people spend so much money to
Speaker 1: go on the boat and if the weather is bad,
Speaker 1: there's just nothing they can do about it. It really
Speaker 1: conveys how actually cramped it is. Yeah, it's not a
Speaker 1: luxury version of like showing Yeah, it's not like, oh,
Speaker 1: and they live in a cool apartment on this boat.
Speaker 1: It's like no, they live in this dorm, have to
Speaker 1: be undercover after hours. And so they kind of hate
Speaker 1: each other. Probably, yes, they're getting huge feuds. They hook
Speaker 1: up with each other a lot. Um, it's got it's
Speaker 1: better do they hook up? I mean that's kind of
Speaker 1: that's like that's the question. They hook up in the
Speaker 1: book up in a bunk bed. You make your just
Speaker 1: pick the Yeah, you just to college. But they all
Speaker 1: are like stressed out about it because they're like if
Speaker 1: we hook up them, we're trapped on a boat together afterwards.
Speaker 1: And that almost always causes problems. I don't think there's
Speaker 1: been any like successful relationships to come out of it.
Speaker 1: On the show is the whole series one? Is there
Speaker 1: a different person every episode? Yeah, And there's three franchises
Speaker 1: now there's three branches of the below deck franchise. There's
Speaker 1: regular below deck, below deck med and which Mediterranean, And
Speaker 1: they just introduced another one that's like a smaller boats
Speaker 1: below deck yacht or something. The smaller boat for me. Actually,
Speaker 1: they're all anchored around, like the captain is a really
Speaker 1: interesting sort of salty dog on all of them. Uh,
Speaker 1: isn't the same guy? Know, it's a guy on one
Speaker 1: on the main one, and then it's like this this
Speaker 1: woman on the other one. Um, and then the person
Speaker 1: who's like the head, like the director of the cruise
Speaker 1: or whatever. Uh, gets totally screwed by everybody else. Like
Speaker 1: everybody hates them because they're the person who has to
Speaker 1: tell everyone to do their job all the time. But
Speaker 1: they're really interesting, both of the women on both of
Speaker 1: like both of that show. It's like you have to
Speaker 1: be such a specific type of person to be like,
Speaker 1: I want to spend my life on the sea away
Speaker 1: from everyone else. Yeah, it's like a rescue dog lady. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like rescue shelter ladies specific. Yeah, it's not just the
Speaker 1: rescue dogs, the rescue cats too. Yeah, it's like I
Speaker 1: don't like your hat. You can't rescue this yet. One
Speaker 1: of the You definitely get the sense that they're like
Speaker 1: running from something, and then sometimes you like find out
Speaker 1: what it is. It's a great show. Me and Steven
Speaker 1: Soderberg agree it was. It was all over his things
Speaker 1: he watches list. It's so funny. But it's very popular
Speaker 1: obviously because there are three different Yeah, and it kind
Speaker 1: of another The vander Pump Rules cast is a little
Speaker 1: bit older and more settled. It delivers more of the
Speaker 1: sort of like people hooking up and getting drunk. It's
Speaker 1: very chaotic. Was Love Boat was that shot on location
Speaker 1: ever at all? Or was it all on stages? Oh? Um?
Speaker 1: I think a lot of stages. Like I remember the balcony,
Speaker 1: you know, it was sort of like blue screen of
Speaker 1: ocean behind like that. But then they'd have like the
Speaker 1: we're going to Australia, you know, like stunt and then
Speaker 1: they'd actually go and they'd actually go and they'd be like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, it's Sydney Harbor. One of people walking
Speaker 1: down a street like on location. Yeah, but we went there.
Speaker 1: The koala on their shoulder, a nice ass and some
Speaker 1: tight white pants. She's Australian. You're also I just really
Speaker 1: want to read that book now, like full of Boat. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I wonder if it's anything like the show though, you know,
Speaker 1: if it's cheesy, it's just like I think it's also
Speaker 1: more about like astrology based matchmaking, which I'm so into,
Speaker 1: especially if you can't escape, because then you have to
Speaker 1: submit to the suggestion that you're preordained to be with
Speaker 1: this person who's also on the boat. It seems like
Speaker 1: fade automatically. Right. We're going to get right back into
Speaker 1: after this quick ad break. Welcome back tonight. Call Emily
Speaker 1: has been beamed up temporarily. Uh, but we are still
Speaker 1: here with how they have Rulesqui, I'm still here talking
Speaker 1: about spooky Love. Today's Spooky Love main course. Uh. Two
Speaker 1: stories about two couples, the Culti couple, the Culti couples
Speaker 1: that will will the best kind put their way in
Speaker 1: your heart. So we're going to start off with listener
Speaker 1: Marit shared an article from Vice about a YouTube cult
Speaker 1: that is a very nightcall story. Um, So there's this
Speaker 1: online spirituality school that's in scare quotes called Twin Flames
Speaker 1: Universe that was started by a pair of YouTubers named
Speaker 1: Jeff and Chiliah Um, also known as Enders. Show you
Speaker 1: a picture of them, how, Oh yeah, I'd like to
Speaker 1: see that as well, because she was like, are they
Speaker 1: polished looking? And I was like, no, no, they look
Speaker 1: just like New a G YouTubers. So they charge more
Speaker 1: than four thousand dollars a month um for access, or
Speaker 1: maybe just four thousand dollars period. I guess you how
Speaker 1: it's kind of like you're you're choosing from a menu
Speaker 1: of services. Oh yes, okay, so yeah these people do
Speaker 1: that fit that fits for me. They look like they're
Speaker 1: they're basking in the warm glow of the look. They
Speaker 1: might sell you some mushrooms at a fish show or something,
Speaker 1: but they're selling you much more than that guy. It's
Speaker 1: not that we would ever go to fish shows. I
Speaker 1: would know. I would not sort of nerdy, little a
Speaker 1: little nerdy for for a YouTube or not. I just
Speaker 1: look kind of on the Jesus or something. Um. So
Speaker 1: they have a menu of services that costs more than
Speaker 1: four thousand dollars a month um, it's new ag videos
Speaker 1: workshops something called mind alignment Therapy. Yes, the two day
Speaker 1: ascension workshop, during which which sounds exactly like our Patreon.
Speaker 1: By the way, a lot of this is formulated exactly like,
Speaker 1: well it all sounds just like our patriot does. Um,
Speaker 1: but we're not cutting you off from your families. Well,
Speaker 1: so the goal that you go somewhere, No, this is
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think so. From what I from
Speaker 1: Canada it said, I will read from the story. Yeah,
Speaker 1: twin Flames Universe, led by two glassy eyed Michigan YouTubers
Speaker 1: calling themselves Jeff and Chilea Virchell, a thirty year old
Speaker 1: single mom, bought tickets for a two day ascension workshop
Speaker 1: in Canada. Yeah, so there's some of those marketing materials
Speaker 1: for the event promised participants would experience heaven on Earth.
Speaker 1: But it's also so the twin Flames thing is that
Speaker 1: they the YouTubers, are claiming that they will help you
Speaker 1: find your soul mate, your twin flame. But there's also
Speaker 1: like they also own the domain life purpose class dot com.
Speaker 1: Oh they beat us to it, so unfair dot net
Speaker 1: yeah dot org. Um, so the article features a couple
Speaker 1: of different people who have been involved with this group.
Speaker 1: One of them is the single mom named Linna. So
Speaker 1: she became a community member. Um, there's kind of like
Speaker 1: an MLM element to this. You have to once you join,
Speaker 1: a lot of your time is volunteer work to spent
Speaker 1: recruiting other members, calling members and trying to sell them stuff.
Speaker 1: So she was looking for her twin flame, and she
Speaker 1: became convinced that it was this guy from her gym
Speaker 1: who was married and not interested in her. But because
Speaker 1: the tactic they're they're like if you find them and
Speaker 1: you know, that's your twin flame, like, don't give up,
Speaker 1: you go for it. So she said she was surprised
Speaker 1: that she wasn't served a restraining order. She was like,
Speaker 1: I stalked this Yeah, she showed up about his work. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she would, and just be like you need to accept
Speaker 1: that we're twin flames. Yeah. Um. And was he what
Speaker 1: did he do? He just said no, he was like nothing,
Speaker 1: I'm married. Um, but I think it would seem to
Speaker 1: me that if you're that deep in this call, you're
Speaker 1: giving off such a a vibe that probably hopefully makes
Speaker 1: people kind of sensitive to you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: Like he just sounded like he didn't want to go
Speaker 1: after her, but she kind of implied without stating directly.
Speaker 1: I think that other people in the cult had been
Speaker 1: you know, people had been much firmer. The couple leading
Speaker 1: Twin Flames Universe openly called themselves the Master Christ and
Speaker 1: their associates are now attempting to start a tax exempt
Speaker 1: church based on their teachings. But they're they called the
Speaker 1: two of them called themselves the Master the Master Christ.
Speaker 1: It's technically the Master Christ, eternal ruler of all creation
Speaker 1: by God's loving hand. Oh my God, that's what it
Speaker 1: says on my business cards. So that's why I think
Speaker 1: they might be my Twin Flames um. But also there
Speaker 1: were I guess people on Reddit started ex members started
Speaker 1: kind of talking about this, which may have led to,
Speaker 1: you know, the article being written in the first place.
Speaker 1: But they were really encouraged to disconnect from their families
Speaker 1: unless the family members gave them money that they would
Speaker 1: then give to the Twin Flames people. So parents, I
Speaker 1: think a lot of these people are in their twenties
Speaker 1: and thirties. It's a love cult. It's like, this is
Speaker 1: super interesting. It says Twin Flames Universe conflates romance and
Speaker 1: enlightenment in disturbing ways. X members say achieving harmonious union
Speaker 1: with a twin flame was promoted as a cure all
Speaker 1: for life problems, while sickness or romantic failure was attributed
Speaker 1: to not aligning with God or the group. The mind
Speaker 1: alignment element, to me is the scariest. I mean stalking
Speaker 1: people's no good. How scarious aligned with what alignement well. Also,
Speaker 1: they claimed that they healed um stage four terminal breast
Speaker 1: cancer with their mind alignment. They also claim to be
Speaker 1: able to help PTSD and seriously severe depression, which they
Speaker 1: clearly could not. So there have been stories about people
Speaker 1: not doing well after involved involvement with the There's a
Speaker 1: story about somebody committing suicide that they saw as it
Speaker 1: was because they used the cult for therapy instead of
Speaker 1: getting real therapy. Yeah, and then they had to put
Speaker 1: disclaimers on their Facebook and say if you really are
Speaker 1: They did put a disclaimer being like if you're suicidal,
Speaker 1: called the suicide hotline, like don't ask us. They are
Speaker 1: still running this cult and say that they have done
Speaker 1: nothing wrong. Who um. Somebody tried to leave and they
Speaker 1: were like said, some really fucked up things and then
Speaker 1: they were like, we're just exposing you to the real world.
Speaker 1: This is what it's like if you leave Twin Flames
Speaker 1: as long as you're not aligned your jerk. Did do
Speaker 1: they want to know? Do they pay four thousand a month?
Speaker 1: So okay, remember I lied about the four thousand dollars.
Speaker 1: So it's part two hundred a year I think package.
Speaker 1: But then there's get in but that's part of it.
Speaker 1: But they encourage you to like up sell to other members,
Speaker 1: so you can get that, but then you also might
Speaker 1: want to take like a bunch of course work that's
Speaker 1: you know, extra. So they said it can easily become
Speaker 1: more than four thousand dollars. And I maybe it was
Speaker 1: a month, maybe not, but I didn't want to even
Speaker 1: if it's a year, that's scary. Some other cultus we've
Speaker 1: talked about where it's like essentially they're just like a
Speaker 1: for profit university offering classes in their own made up stuff.
Speaker 1: It reminds me of a forum. Yeah, did you guys
Speaker 1: do the forum at all? It was that kind of
Speaker 1: a partially, I think it's a California thing. There was
Speaker 1: something there was a controversy involving cafe gratitude doing it
Speaker 1: being associated with Landmark Forum Landmark for um. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's Warner. Wait a minute, I do think they get
Speaker 1: the name wrong. Werener a card or something like that
Speaker 1: at car Tool? I don't know, I gotta look it up.
Speaker 1: I did the forum when I was a kid. Really,
Speaker 1: it's the forum. It was that different from Landmark Forum,
Speaker 1: can you Well, let's explain in case people don't know
Speaker 1: what the Landward for Him is view from inside. My
Speaker 1: experience with with it was that my mom had just
Speaker 1: gotten divorced and was kind of vulnerable and a friend
Speaker 1: of hers. You know. It's sort of like that middle age, um,
Speaker 1: new age kind of thing that was happening in the eighties, right, So, um,
Speaker 1: it's sort of like you, I don't know, divorces, middle age, UM,
Speaker 1: the eighties. Uh, these things align, it's a mind aligned alignment. Um.
Speaker 1: But but basically, you go to this hotel, right, You're
Speaker 1: in like a hotel conference room, and this very authoritative
Speaker 1: person stands at the front of the room and you're
Speaker 1: you have to ask to use the bathroom. You're supposed
Speaker 1: to log all of your tile and all if you
Speaker 1: take to you know, you're not supposed to take anything
Speaker 1: you're supposed to be clean, and you have to ask
Speaker 1: permission to get your asthma meds or whatever. Um. And
Speaker 1: then there's a lot of like I just remember and
Speaker 1: I think, I think you have to sign something says
Speaker 1: you'll never tell anyone about the technologies that you learn.
Speaker 1: You know how they always use ridiculous words for things
Speaker 1: like the special technology. It's like, you mean, what the
Speaker 1: refrigerator magnet poetry you did in front of the room
Speaker 1: that technology. Um. But basically the idea was sort of
Speaker 1: like you have to own everything that's happened to you.
Speaker 1: You take responsibility for everything in your life, so you're
Speaker 1: not a victim, so you're not playing the blame game.
Speaker 1: And you're also just like as if I chose. So
Speaker 1: then I just remember someone standing up and saying I
Speaker 1: did not choose to get cancer. I'm not taking responsibility
Speaker 1: for my cancer for them, and this guy was. You know,
Speaker 1: it's always like kind of like a authoritative, like ex
Speaker 1: military guy like gets in your face and it's like no,
Speaker 1: you know, it'll help you, and blah blah blah, and
Speaker 1: then then everyone cries and holds hands and and some
Speaker 1: people hate it and they're like this sucks, and there's
Speaker 1: they're like there's a little bit of fomenting of like
Speaker 1: rebellion within the I mean it's it's it's sort of
Speaker 1: like effective in some ways, Like you there are these
Speaker 1: touching moments and you're in a group, and there's like
Speaker 1: you can be manipulated in a group. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: I just remember doing something where you stare at someone
Speaker 1: really close. That's like, um, that's an excellent thing supposedly
Speaker 1: to where you have to feel you know, you're just
Speaker 1: like silently feeling your connection with someone. So much of
Speaker 1: this is just like acting class. It is what happens. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and everything feels like it should end and fucking but
Speaker 1: it never does know about a lot unless it does.
Speaker 1: I guess it does, but it does. Maybe what was
Speaker 1: your response? Did you like it? Um? I was kind
Speaker 1: of into psychology. I think I was maybe I feel
Speaker 1: like I might have been a freshman in college and
Speaker 1: I was sort of into like the fact that everyone
Speaker 1: was getting straight to the facts of their lives, like
Speaker 1: the ship. Yeah, I mean, you're not around that that
Speaker 1: much at age, you know, nineteen, so it sort of
Speaker 1: refreshing that way. But it's also kind of creepy because
Speaker 1: you're like nineteen and you're in a room full of
Speaker 1: forty five year olds and they're like, tell me you know,
Speaker 1: and and like a forty five year old can hold
Speaker 1: eye contact with you for a long time, and when
Speaker 1: nineteen years stop it, you feel your awkwardness a lot
Speaker 1: in that scenario. I don't know. I thought it was
Speaker 1: I thought it was kind of a cult, honestly, But
Speaker 1: it's sort of helped my mom a little, like she
Speaker 1: got something out of it, and it was it was
Speaker 1: almost like a vehicle for her to talk to me
Speaker 1: about her feelings and for me to talk about my feelings,
Speaker 1: and so that it was kind of like a door
Speaker 1: opened in a way. But but then we both kind
Speaker 1: of thought it was bullshit. Afterwards, You're like, we could
Speaker 1: have done this at home. Oh yeah, no. But see
Speaker 1: that's the thing, that's why these things exist. It's like,
Speaker 1: if we did that at home, we just do it
Speaker 1: over a glass of wine on it given night. But
Speaker 1: that was not the that was not the context of
Speaker 1: the way. I was rich, they're weird, that would have
Speaker 1: been creepy. Are you kidding our house? Let's have a
Speaker 1: real talk. But I think there's something really reassuring about
Speaker 1: being told what to do and being given rules and
Speaker 1: so in a way especially I think if if you're
Speaker 1: a single mom, like the you know person in the
Speaker 1: Vice article, was you just like when you feel out
Speaker 1: of control and like you need like a strong community.
Speaker 1: Sometimes having rules makes you feel as though your interaction
Speaker 1: is more authentic somehow, I think, But it also makes
Speaker 1: you feel fragile and vulnerable. I mean they only break
Speaker 1: you down, right, you can't take a bathroom break. You're
Speaker 1: like a child that go to the bathroom taking your
Speaker 1: medicine away. Like that seems kind of there's something. There
Speaker 1: was a lot of aggression towards questioning, and it seems
Speaker 1: a little bit like we're testing your free will, right,
Speaker 1: your commitment to free will? Do is it still going? Isn't?
Speaker 1: I just looked it up to see um apparently Panda
Speaker 1: Express training involves it because it's also likely so it
Speaker 1: has like a corporate l Yeah, because it's like people
Speaker 1: use it all the time for like corporate retreats. Really yeah,
Speaker 1: that is where it still thrives. That was the Cafe
Speaker 1: Gratitude thing. They sell it as like a program to
Speaker 1: companies being like so your employees can get to know
Speaker 1: each other. Imagine working at Panda Express knowing like this
Speaker 1: is probably like one of many jobs like this in
Speaker 1: a line kind of thing, and having to bond with
Speaker 1: your coworkers that intensely and then being like peace, yeah,
Speaker 1: come up to the next I do think that is
Speaker 1: a lot of just all corporate retreats I think are
Speaker 1: weird in that way, Like anyone I know who's had
Speaker 1: to go on when it is like they, you know,
Speaker 1: put you in a hotel away from everybody else, and
Speaker 1: then you have to do like trust falls. Even if
Speaker 1: it's not like hippie stuff anymore, it's still like these
Speaker 1: weird group bonding exercise. Well, escape rooms were popular for
Speaker 1: that purpose for a while, really corporate escape room because
Speaker 1: you have to it's all strategy and like how how
Speaker 1: are you under pressure? Right? How can you work in
Speaker 1: a team? This is why I work from home for
Speaker 1: the last went five years. Back home is the ultimate
Speaker 1: escape room. We should do it. We've done up. We
Speaker 1: did a one day podcast was like really more like
Speaker 1: three hours of podcasting retreat and then we were like, look,
Speaker 1: it's just like we're podcasting and no one look at that.
Speaker 1: Learned so much you should have like stood in the
Speaker 1: parking lot and stared at each other really closely. I
Speaker 1: do an escape room with you guys, they wouldn't mind.
Speaker 1: I'm usually anti escape room. We should push ourselves to
Speaker 1: the limit, more like having to do during during fun.
Speaker 1: Would you do a task on a cruise? Cruises sponsor? Nil?
Speaker 1: Just dropping another one? Do anything? Were sponsors? Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: See on a boat with a goat? I don't even think.
Speaker 1: I'm trying to think if I've been on like a
Speaker 1: big boat of her, have you? Yeah? Maybe we should
Speaker 1: watching New England. How you had a love boat experience? No,
Speaker 1: I I've been on one cruise. I went on a
Speaker 1: short cruise to the Bahamas for spring break one year,
Speaker 1: and it was pretty cool. And when I got it
Speaker 1: like it was I think, No, I think it was
Speaker 1: only like three hours. It was like Florida to um
Speaker 1: Newport or something. Wasn't that it wasn't. I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know if I'm getting that distance right, if it
Speaker 1: was three hours or six hours, but it was. We
Speaker 1: didn't spend the night, but there was a lounge, there
Speaker 1: was like a there was entertainment, and I think there
Speaker 1: might have been like slots and ship like yeah and
Speaker 1: super corn syrupy drinks, which is you know, I went
Speaker 1: on a boost cruise like this, but I don't remember
Speaker 1: if it was it was also in spring break, if
Speaker 1: it was in the Bahamas or in Florida. Um, but
Speaker 1: I got on had like three drinks like boom boom
Speaker 1: boom and smartest Yeah. Yeah, I wouldn't know. I think
Speaker 1: they were hurricanes yeah and uh and then they started
Speaker 1: throwing up. Stop for the rest of that cruise. That's amazing.
Speaker 1: Wasn't rolling it? Oh? Yeah, are you do get seas? No?
Speaker 1: But I throw up from drinking. Um, we're not done
Speaker 1: talking about you. Guys have a more somber called to
Speaker 1: talk about, which is um, the most suspicious couple in
Speaker 1: the world. They're like Robert Durst level suspicious. Um and
Speaker 1: it's but it's sad. So I have to do away
Speaker 1: with like the Jinks thing because that that was also sad.
Speaker 1: But we all can laugh at Robert dust now. But
Speaker 1: over at the cut. Amanda Arnold recently reported on Lorie
Speaker 1: Valo and Chad day Bell, the Idaho couple who have
Speaker 1: been getting a lot of media attention after valos two
Speaker 1: children went missing at some point and they were last
Speaker 1: seen in September. They still haven't been located as of
Speaker 1: our recording right now. Um, the couple fled to Hawaii,
Speaker 1: I believe after they've been questioned by law enforcement about
Speaker 1: where their kids were and they were like, oh, they're
Speaker 1: in Arizona, the family member. Um, but they couldn't locate
Speaker 1: the kids, and then Lori and Chad fled to Hawaii.
Speaker 1: And so then people started kind of digging around in
Speaker 1: Lori and Chad's lives and they found out that they
Speaker 1: were preppers. But that wasn't even the weirdest thing. It
Speaker 1: was they had like three other mysterious deaths connected to them,
Speaker 1: and they're like, you know, they're very serious proppers. So
Speaker 1: they laure at least believes that the end times is
Speaker 1: going to be like this coming July. You guys have
Speaker 1: any plans. Yeah, there are members of a group called
Speaker 1: Preparing a People m HM, which sounds like dinner thing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this story delicious. It was really depressing. I knew it
Speaker 1: was going to be. This is a story you wish
Speaker 1: you could talk about if it happened in the past.
Speaker 1: You were going to say you wish you could not
Speaker 1: have read. You wish you could not well, but you
Speaker 1: don't know yet what the still like. Maybe it's fine.
Speaker 1: So the children are missing, yeah, And but also there
Speaker 1: were murders associated with killed their own spouses allegedly allegedly
Speaker 1: one of them their spouse died. Okay, wait, I'll tell you.
Speaker 1: So Valo's brother was named Alex Cox, and so he
Speaker 1: allegedly shot and killed Lori's ex husband in July when
Speaker 1: it was it was reported to be in self defense.
Speaker 1: Cox died of unknown causes five months later. So that's
Speaker 1: two suspicious. So Lorie's brother brother allegedly might have been
Speaker 1: involved in the murder of her ex. Yes. And then
Speaker 1: Lorie's brother shows up dead one of no one know why.
Speaker 1: And then two weeks before Chad and Laurie got married,
Speaker 1: Chad's then wife died. Yeah, Tammy died of supposedly natural causes.
Speaker 1: But then in the wake of all of this stuff,
Speaker 1: they have exhumed the bodies of those two to see
Speaker 1: what really went on. But then also, and I interject
Speaker 1: with one odd odd thing about this Tammy. When she died,
Speaker 1: the authorities were interested in possibly doing an autopsy, but
Speaker 1: Chad said, no, I don't think that's necessary. And the
Speaker 1: authorities said that's okay, Yeah, you're kidding. They were they
Speaker 1: were according to this, I read kind of I didn't
Speaker 1: read the cut article. I read like a list of
Speaker 1: facts that was on fast facts. You need to know.
Speaker 1: It was like kind of long, but it was just
Speaker 1: a garb. It wasn't like a well, it wasn't like
Speaker 1: a narrative. It was strange, but you really got the
Speaker 1: headlines that what what well? So then did you see
Speaker 1: I think this was pretty recent. Um, I think it
Speaker 1: was reported by a Utah Fox affiliate said that Lorie's niece,
Speaker 1: whose name is Melanie Boudreau, did you see this? Okay?
Speaker 1: So Melanie Boudreau had apparently joined the Prepper community after
Speaker 1: Lorie joined, and there were some nine one one calls
Speaker 1: excuse me placed by her ex husband. So her ex
Speaker 1: her husband was like, I don't like that you're being
Speaker 1: involved in this crazy proper call. He took their kids
Speaker 1: and fled, and then he kept calling the police and
Speaker 1: being like, someone just shot my window. I'm like convinced
Speaker 1: it's my crazy ex wife. So it's it's like spread
Speaker 1: into like other facets of the family. But he was
Speaker 1: at some point he said, I'm concerned that she's gonna
Speaker 1: harm our children. So all of that's very strange because
Speaker 1: like I don't know if that's connected to the end times,
Speaker 1: if it's like they're trying to spare their children from
Speaker 1: the wrath of God. Like it's so there's there you
Speaker 1: could just fall into, like the black hole of all
Speaker 1: of this. Yeah. And also Lorie when she was married,
Speaker 1: got really into Chad's books about the end time, so
Speaker 1: he's a doomsday author, right. It has so much of
Speaker 1: this reminded me of the Staircase to Our Staircase person
Speaker 1: that happened in my hometown Durham, North Carolina, that I
Speaker 1: was obsessed with that case. It was I mean, it's amazing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that documentary is just so good yeah, because you
Speaker 1: flip your mind back and forth. Yeah, although the slant
Speaker 1: of the documentary was messed up because if you followed
Speaker 1: it in the news and if you're from Durham, it
Speaker 1: was sort of like, yeah, this guy's for sure obviously
Speaker 1: did well. They were definitely on his side. But it's
Speaker 1: such a good documentary. Oh my god, it's so good.
Speaker 1: Do you believe the owl theory? No? No, not no, no, no.
Speaker 1: I thought when when they discovered the first the first woman, right,
Speaker 1: who also fell down the stairs that he knew and
Speaker 1: he was the last person he did it, but he Yeah.
Speaker 1: It just makes you be like, oh, I guess I
Speaker 1: can't tell who's guilty from like listening to them talk, right,
Speaker 1: because you thought at first he wasn't guilty. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: he does because he seems so genuine. Well, it's it's
Speaker 1: a long time. I mean it's like four series. It's
Speaker 1: it's long. And so you think that at some point,
Speaker 1: like with the Jinks, when eventually they crack, you would
Speaker 1: whom he would crack. But and then there was the
Speaker 1: whole like second season of that, right, I didn't. Actually
Speaker 1: it's good. I mean it's also like it is one
Speaker 1: of those cases where, uh, he probably did it, but
Speaker 1: also the cops sucked it up really bad. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: like didn't you know, case the crime scene correctly, and
Speaker 1: they had this blood spatter expert in the trial who
Speaker 1: was then like stripped of his he was owners. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that guy turned out to be kind of a quack,
Speaker 1: because there is a lot of quackery in stuff like
Speaker 1: you know, forensic psychology, and there's like a lot of
Speaker 1: sort of pseudoscience. I feel like, uh with stuff like
Speaker 1: that where somebody can come in and be like, I'm
Speaker 1: the blood spatter expert. But I didn't like how the
Speaker 1: French documentarians we're sort of like putting these I mean
Speaker 1: they had a lot of shots of like the kind
Speaker 1: of small town Durham. Yeah, you know, prosecutors who would
Speaker 1: say like now just like this, you know, and there,
Speaker 1: and it was like this was making a gay parn
Speaker 1: and that before he murdered, he is web and cool
Speaker 1: blood and you kind of had that like, oh god,
Speaker 1: like it's easy to watch that and you know, and
Speaker 1: then the documentary the filmmakers are like, oh, we don't
Speaker 1: believe stupid, stupid red Knicks. Definitely that was true. Well,
Speaker 1: my boyfriend showed me the staircase because one of his
Speaker 1: best friends i think, went to again summer camp with
Speaker 1: one of the daughters who is on Michael's side. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what makes it hard to argue adopted
Speaker 1: daughters adopted by the first from pushed downstairs, and the
Speaker 1: fact that they would side with him is interesting. Allegedly
Speaker 1: allegedly yeah, that they would side with him, Well yeah,
Speaker 1: but they didn't have you had that like, well, they
Speaker 1: didn't have a parent left because their parents, you know,
Speaker 1: he was their parents, and they loved him. People liked
Speaker 1: him in that neighborhood, and my mom was friends with
Speaker 1: a few people in the neighbor hill who were like,
Speaker 1: he was a nice and he seemed well. He wrote
Speaker 1: books about murdering and murders and how fun murders not
Speaker 1: and how fun. I mean, the thing is, it's different
Speaker 1: when you read it in the paper and you're like
Speaker 1: a man who wrote books about murdering. It was looking
Speaker 1: at gay porn, and then he would I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: looking at gay porn, and then his wife discovered it,
Speaker 1: and then I mean they had a story around it
Speaker 1: and it was you know, of course it was like
Speaker 1: homophobic and there was it was like bad redneck take
Speaker 1: on the whole thing. Yeah, but every time the information
Speaker 1: came out, like there are a bunch of points in
Speaker 1: that story where you're like, now he's gonna crack, and
Speaker 1: the right he just never he's like, well, I was
Speaker 1: looking at gay porn, so we we had an open marriage.
Speaker 1: Like who you know, you can't prove that's not true
Speaker 1: because she's dead now. Um, it kind of seems like
Speaker 1: he doesn't think that he's guilty, like he's a little
Speaker 1: I think that's it. I think he's sumpressed. I think
Speaker 1: that might be true also, but yeah, he passes a
Speaker 1: lie detector test. Yeah, and I think he's a former
Speaker 1: marine or something like that, right, might I think he No, No,
Speaker 1: I think you're right because I if I recall he
Speaker 1: had some like PTSD kind of issues or he just
Speaker 1: had like a traumatic period of his life that he
Speaker 1: was kind of like, you know, yeah, there's a lot
Speaker 1: going on with it. It's just such a kid proclaimed
Speaker 1: to be in touch with documentary. Like a lot of
Speaker 1: the other true crime documentaries don't have that impact. But
Speaker 1: like the reason that one's really good is because it
Speaker 1: really just like indicts the viewer. Yeah, you're watching this
Speaker 1: and you're like finding this guy charming and like he
Speaker 1: probably killed his wife and it's confusing and it's confusing,
Speaker 1: and you're also like taking documentary as fact, which is
Speaker 1: like it's also obviously super constructed. Yeah, and you're trusting
Speaker 1: the French never terrible idea. Um, well, Heather, thank you
Speaker 1: so much for guessing. I loved it. Were big fans,
Speaker 1: and I'm sad that I didn't sing the love vote theme.
Speaker 1: Now is your time? Love exciting and new bored. We're
Speaker 1: expecting you love did It Do? That's important to this
Speaker 1: promises adventure for everyone the love did it Did It Do?
Speaker 1: Soon we'll be doing another I got that wrong. It's
Speaker 1: rex for adventure you mind on a new Roman. I
Speaker 1: was born to sing this song. It's so much like
Speaker 1: the Commander to me. You know you could just go
Speaker 1: right romance. We may be putting knees on our mix,
Speaker 1: so if you subscribe to our Patreon at patreon dot
Speaker 1: com forward Slash Nightcall, you can have access to our
Speaker 1: mix and a bunch of other fun rewards. Um. Also,
Speaker 1: if you'd like to follow us on social media, we
Speaker 1: are in Call pod on Twitter, Nightcalled Podcast on Instagram
Speaker 1: and Facebook and Heather. Where should people find you want
Speaker 1: them to? Well to Cut New York Magazine, Ask Pauli.
Speaker 1: If you do a little search on ask Folly, all
Speaker 1: my stuff will pop up. And I'm also on Twitter,
Speaker 1: but my name is very long h ever Leski, So
Speaker 1: who knows you'll never find me. That's doable. It's better
Speaker 1: for you if you don't find me. Well. Thanks again
Speaker 1: for joining us and we will be back next week.
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