Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly
Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small
Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions
Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, doctor Joy hard and Bradford,
Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or
Speaker 1: to find a therapist in your area, visit our website
Speaker 1: at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you
Speaker 1: love listening to and learning from the podcast, it is
Speaker 1: not meant to be a substitute for a relationship with
Speaker 1: a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much
Speaker 1: for joining me for session four sixty one of the
Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls Podcast. We'll get right into our
Speaker 1: conversation after word from our sponsors. Y'all know, I'd love
Speaker 1: to chat with our producer team about the latest in
Speaker 1: pop culture, and this week we're talking all things the
Speaker 1: Drama and You, Me and Tuscany. For different reasons, both
Speaker 1: of these films starring beloved black women have taken over
Speaker 1: the conversations we're having on social and in our own circles.
Speaker 1: What do these new age black rom coms say about
Speaker 1: how we currently look at love and relationships and who
Speaker 1: gets to tell those stories. We get into all of
Speaker 1: that and more in today's episode, but first we are
Speaker 1: desperately in need of an emergency pop culture check in
Speaker 1: a lot, maybe even too much has occurred. And as
Speaker 1: a therapist but also someone who appreciates and loves pop culture,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't be me if I didn't dig into the
Speaker 1: mental health aspect of all of this. There are spoilers ahead,
Speaker 1: so if you haven't seen the movie, make sure you
Speaker 1: do before you listen to today's episode, and if you
Speaker 1: want to share your thoughts on them, please do so
Speaker 1: on social media using the hashtag TVG in session, or
Speaker 1: join us over in Patreon to talk more about the episode.
Speaker 1: You can join us at community dot therapy for Blackgirls
Speaker 1: dot com. Thank you for indulging in my pop culture musings.
Speaker 1: Now let's get into our conversation. So I am very
Speaker 1: excited to be here with Bria, our production assistant, for
Speaker 1: our to be named in the future segment all about
Speaker 1: pop culture. It just feels like there's always so much
Speaker 1: going on around pop culture that I have some thoughts about,
Speaker 1: particularly this week, and so Bria and I slid into
Speaker 1: the booths, so to speak, for an emergency recording to
Speaker 1: kind of get some things off of our chest and
Speaker 1: to weigh in on some of the topics that we
Speaker 1: know that you are talking about, but of course with
Speaker 1: a psychology standpoint. So, Brio, what do we have on
Speaker 1: the list to chat about today?
Speaker 2: For sure is a lot to talk about. First things First,
Speaker 2: is the Michael Jackson movie. So, the new Michael Jackson
Speaker 2: movie premiered this weekend. It revisits his rise to fame
Speaker 2: and notably the complicated relationship with his father, Joe Jackson.
Speaker 2: The film specifically highlights how Joe's intensity and his push
Speaker 2: for perfection helped create a global icon, but might have
Speaker 2: come at the cost of Michael's childhood and emotional well being. So,
Speaker 2: from your perspective, how do we distinguish between healthy encouragement
Speaker 2: as parents in causing emotional and psychological damage? oOoOO, that's a.
Speaker 3: Big question, Brian.
Speaker 1: So first of all, have you seen the movie?
Speaker 2: Yes?
Speaker 1: I talked, Okay, okay, so I haven't seen it yet,
Speaker 1: but my kids really want to see it. Do you
Speaker 1: feel like it is PG friendly?
Speaker 3: Like, is it kid friendly?
Speaker 4: I would say so, I would say so.
Speaker 2: They didn't touch on a lot of the scandals and
Speaker 2: the things that he was accused of. I think they
Speaker 2: had to actually cut that out, so it took a
Speaker 2: lot of money and time to do that.
Speaker 1: But oh, that was initially included in an estate.
Speaker 2: Cut it out, so including that so it really was
Speaker 2: just like him as a child, like how he kind
Speaker 2: of stepped to his father and stuff like that eventually.
Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, So the question is what's the line from
Speaker 1: like encouraging your child to be great and kind of
Speaker 1: be a star versus like psychological damage. Yes, exactly, And
Speaker 1: I feel like that's probably a pretty well, I don't
Speaker 1: know if it's a pretty clear line. I mean, because
Speaker 1: I think when you listen to stories or when I've
Speaker 1: heard accounts of people who go on to have kids
Speaker 1: who are like stars, right like Michael Jackson and Serena
Speaker 1: Williams and you know, Tiger Woods, like I feel like
Speaker 1: we've heard accounts from their parents who talked about recognizing
Speaker 1: that there was something special there very early on, and
Speaker 1: that always feels like a struggle for me, because yes,
Speaker 1: you may recognize that, like your kid has some particular
Speaker 1: skill or talent, but it feels like what happens when
Speaker 1: we push them to this level is that they lose
Speaker 1: like all sense of childhood, right, And so I feel like,
Speaker 1: for me, the line as a psychologist feels very different
Speaker 1: given what I know about child stardom and you know,
Speaker 1: just like the things that I think are important for
Speaker 1: kids to develop, I don't know that in good conscious
Speaker 1: I feel like I could make that decision to kind
Speaker 1: of say, Okay, we're going to forego a more classic
Speaker 1: childhood to kind of lean into like this, this talent.
Speaker 1: But on the other hand, like these these people may
Speaker 1: not have developed into who they were going to be
Speaker 1: without this. But I feel like there has to be
Speaker 1: a line of Okay, we can lean into their greatness,
Speaker 1: but it doesn't have to teeter then onto psychological damage, right,
Speaker 1: Like yeah, kay, we sign up for the extra practices,
Speaker 1: we let them do the singing classes, we let them
Speaker 1: perform or whatever. I think Joe Jackson is a special
Speaker 1: kind of for sure, you know, outlier, right, because I
Speaker 1: think it wasn't just about like leaning into his greatness,
Speaker 1: Like there was also like accounts of abuse and like
Speaker 1: you know, really went to far. So I think there's
Speaker 1: a way to kind of lean into your child's special
Speaker 1: talent and gifts and kind of allow them to share
Speaker 1: that without it becoming an abusive situation. But I think
Speaker 1: the greater question is what is the line around leaning
Speaker 1: into a talent and then how much of their traditional
Speaker 1: childhood is robbed by always being in a practice, always performing,
Speaker 1: always doing those kinds of things. And as somebody who
Speaker 1: knows enough about mental health to kind of know where
Speaker 1: that line is, it feels like it would be a
Speaker 1: no for me. But I am curious to hear about
Speaker 1: from other parents maybe who have recognized that your childlike
Speaker 1: is great at something. What is the line for too
Speaker 1: much for you? I'd love to hear because I don't
Speaker 1: necessarily have a definitive answer just what I think I
Speaker 1: might do for myself.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, that's great, and I think it kind of opens
Speaker 2: a broader question also because in that same vein, what
Speaker 2: are some of those long term emotional effects where you're
Speaker 2: growing up in an environment where the love might feel conditional,
Speaker 2: or on achievement of how well you two, whether in
Speaker 2: school or events or with your talents too.
Speaker 3: That is such a good point.
Speaker 1: I hadn't even thought about that, right, I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: because I think we know the stuff around kind of
Speaker 1: people feeling like their childhood is arrested.
Speaker 3: So this arrested.
Speaker 1: Development kind of thing, right, like you almost stay the
Speaker 1: age that you were before, like all this stardom happened,
Speaker 1: And so we know that there tends to be difficulty
Speaker 1: connecting with peers because maybe they have not been able
Speaker 1: to develop like those kinds of relationships skills with their peers.
Speaker 1: But I hadn't even thought about the idea that once
Speaker 1: your child is maybe like bringing in a stream of
Speaker 1: income and if the family is dependent on this income,
Speaker 1: then how does that change your relationship to your child.
Speaker 3: That's a very different kind of thing.
Speaker 1: And I think that's a part of the conversation people
Speaker 1: are often having with like child influencers or like children online, right,
Speaker 1: like should your child and like who they are and
Speaker 1: their interests be the thing that keeps the lights on
Speaker 1: for the house. And I think that that probably is
Speaker 1: a very unhealthy kind of dynamic because now you have
Speaker 1: moved into an employer employee relationship as opposed to like
Speaker 1: parent child, which is very different.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that makes a ton of sense. Yeah, all right,
Speaker 2: let's move on to our next topic.
Speaker 5: We had to touch.
Speaker 4: On Meg Thee Stallion and Clay Thompson.
Speaker 2: So Meg the Stallion shared your Instagram this weekend that
Speaker 2: she was cheated on by Clay Thompson. Now, this comes
Speaker 2: after several challenging years for Meg. She lost her mother
Speaker 2: a few years ago. She went through a very highly
Speaker 2: publicized dramatic event with Tory Lanes as well. It's honestly
Speaker 2: sparked a lot of conversations about emotional resilience when life
Speaker 2: just keeps delivering setbacks, because it seems like one thing
Speaker 2: after another with her. From your perspective, what happens psychologically
Speaker 2: when someone experiences repeated emotional hits back to back.
Speaker 1: So can I just start by saying I was so
Speaker 1: heartbroken by this news crush, not necessarily because relationship goals
Speaker 1: or anything, but just because it felt like Meg genuinely
Speaker 1: was happy, yeah, and finally felt like she had some peace.
Speaker 1: He introduced her to his family, and you know, like
Speaker 1: you mentioned, like we all know the story of her
Speaker 1: parents dying very early, and it did kind of feel
Speaker 1: like she was getting the support system and like the
Speaker 1: kind of sarrogate family so to speak, that she no
Speaker 1: longer had with her. And so I think, just given
Speaker 1: all of the things we know, even publicly right like
Speaker 1: there's probably still tons that we don't know, but with
Speaker 1: the Tory Lanez case and her family members dying, like
Speaker 1: she has had an incredibly difficult several past couple of years, right,
Speaker 1: and so to have this now a heartbreak on top
Speaker 1: of all of the things when it finally felt like
Speaker 1: maybe things were turning her corner, just it just was
Speaker 1: heartbreaking because she just seems like such a sweet spirit
Speaker 1: and like so fun and like just a sweet person,
Speaker 1: and so have something like this happened so publicly, I
Speaker 1: think it's awful. Not that private would have made it better,
Speaker 1: but publicly definitely does not help. And so I think
Speaker 1: when you think about like resilience, I feel like, at
Speaker 1: a certain point, like we've developed it enough, right, like
Speaker 1: repeated awful things happening, Like I feel like, at some point,
Speaker 1: like your bounce back factor, which is what resilience is, like,
Speaker 1: you've had enough, and I feel like Meg has had enough.
Speaker 1: And so when you think about what happens after you've
Speaker 1: had repeated traumatic experiences, I think it is very easy
Speaker 1: to like withdraw, especially in romantic relationships. Who would want
Speaker 1: to sign up for something like that again?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: So I think it probably changes the way you relate
Speaker 1: in terms of romantic partners or even interest in doing that.
Speaker 1: I think that that it also could be a questioning
Speaker 1: of like am I doing something to continue to end
Speaker 1: up in this case, and Meg, if you happen to
Speaker 1: listen to this, there is nothing that you are doing
Speaker 1: in anybody, right, Like, when awful things happen, it can
Speaker 1: be really easy to turn inward because we don't often
Speaker 1: have a lot of other answers, right, and so a
Speaker 1: lot of times we turn to the easiest, most accessible thing,
Speaker 1: which is picking apart our own behavior. And so I
Speaker 1: think you can sometimes see some damage to self esteem,
Speaker 1: to feelings of worth and worthiness, some feelings of there's
Speaker 1: something that I'm doing like I'm broken or I'm defective,
Speaker 1: which is often not the case, right, Like we can't
Speaker 1: internalize other people's bad decisions and poor behavior. That's what
Speaker 1: comes to mind for me with this case is that
Speaker 1: I hope that she does not think that this is
Speaker 1: something about her or something that she did that would
Speaker 1: result in this person also not being honest and not
Speaker 1: being maybe who he presented to be to her.
Speaker 2: He touched on it on a little bit already. But
Speaker 2: if you could call Meg on the phone right now?
Speaker 2: What would you tell her? Because I think that when
Speaker 2: you're trying to give advice, how do people build resilient
Speaker 2: or stay strong when they're constantly in this mode of survival?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I would start by just saying I'm
Speaker 1: so sorry that this happened, and feel awful that you
Speaker 1: find yourself in this situation again, but that there also
Speaker 1: is no pressure to be strong, because when you have
Speaker 1: had awful things happen repeatedly like this, then I think
Speaker 1: most people would find themselves falling apart, which is totally okay.
Speaker 1: It's okay for us have human reactions to human experiences,
Speaker 1: and this is a very sadly human experience, especially given
Speaker 1: all the things that Meg has experienced. If you don't
Speaker 1: feel like you want to be strong, I think that
Speaker 1: that is okay, and strength actually probably is not going
Speaker 1: to be doing you any favors right now, right Like,
Speaker 1: it's okay to just feel the weight of how awful
Speaker 1: and sucky it is to have a heartbreak, to lose
Speaker 1: somebody who you felt connected to both him and his family,
Speaker 1: and to maybe feel maybe embarrassed, like whatever it is
Speaker 1: you are feeling, it is completely okay to feel that
Speaker 1: and to just allow yourself to feel that, but also
Speaker 1: hope that you have a support system who can rally
Speaker 1: around you and give you the space to grieve and
Speaker 1: to do what you need to do to move through this.
Speaker 4: I agree, Yeah, I hope she takes a break soon
Speaker 4: because she was performing I'm.
Speaker 2: Broad away like yesterday, I was like, you should take
Speaker 2: some time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2: Well, our last topic of the day is all about
Speaker 2: Summer House, So we're entering Bravo Land.
Speaker 5: For this one.
Speaker 2: For a little bit of con text, someone named Sierra
Speaker 2: Miller and Amanda Batula. They were on this show called Summerhouse.
Speaker 2: There is a situation where Sierra was dating a man
Speaker 2: and they decided it wasn't working. She ended up cutting
Speaker 2: it off, and then now a couple of years later, Amanda,
Speaker 2: who is very close friends with Sierra by the way,
Speaker 2: is now dating the same set man. It sparked a
Speaker 2: lot of conversation around the tensions of loyalty and boundaries
Speaker 2: and how friendships can even survive fallouts like this.
Speaker 4: So, how do you get to a place.
Speaker 2: Of honoring your emotions and healing when any opinions of
Speaker 2: others you don't deserve it?
Speaker 1: Well, why wouldn't she deserve it? First of all, So
Speaker 1: I do not watch the show. Though I'm a fan
Speaker 1: of some Bravo shows, I have not seen this season
Speaker 1: of Bravo Summer House. So did Sierra and Amanda? Did
Speaker 1: Amanda start dating this guy when Sierra and the guy
Speaker 1: were still dating? Like, is this a cheating kind of thing?
Speaker 1: Or is it like, oh, we've been broken up for
Speaker 1: two years and now she's dating him they.
Speaker 2: Were broken up for a few years, and let me
Speaker 2: like reword the question. So essentially Amanda has come forward
Speaker 2: or no.
Speaker 5: There was some leaked.
Speaker 2: Audio of the reunion and there's been like a lot
Speaker 2: of conversation that Amanda has been like, oh, well, you know,
Speaker 2: this is just like what the heart wanted and I'm
Speaker 2: in love. How can you even deny that? I think
Speaker 2: paraphrasing paraphrasing.
Speaker 4: But that's essentially what the gist is giving.
Speaker 2: So I think it's more so like honoring your emotions
Speaker 2: of this is how you feel, versus do you actually
Speaker 2: deserve to feel that way? Because that's your friend, right
Speaker 2: from this woman, this white woman's perspective, Well.
Speaker 1: Right, because that's the other nuance to this, right is yes,
Speaker 1: heah as a black woman and Amanda.
Speaker 3: Is a white woman.
Speaker 1: Feelings are valid, right, Like, so if you feel like
Speaker 1: you were in love with this man or whatever, okay,
Speaker 1: Like we can acknowledge that maybe the feelings existed, but
Speaker 1: do we need to act on all of our feelings?
Speaker 1: And I think that that is the question. And so
Speaker 1: when I think about like being a girl girl and
Speaker 1: like girl code, like anybody who my friend who has
Speaker 1: dated like you basically don't exist to me anymore, like
Speaker 1: after that relationship is over, and so you know, like
Speaker 1: I guess I could see a situation where maybe you
Speaker 1: develop feelings, but I feel like the friendship has to
Speaker 1: be stronger.
Speaker 3: And is it worth it?
Speaker 1: Right, Like there are no shortage of random men you
Speaker 1: could be dating. So I do think it questions the
Speaker 1: loyalty and the like, where does your allegiance lie if
Speaker 1: a couple of years after the breakup? Now, especially if
Speaker 1: this was a significant relationship. This wasn't like a one
Speaker 1: time like oh, we went to dinner and got some
Speaker 1: appetizers and you know it was a loose kind of
Speaker 1: thing Like this sounds like we have a significant relationship
Speaker 1: that she probably cried to her friend about and like
Speaker 1: she knew intimate details, and so to me, a pre
Speaker 1: existing relationship with a girlfriend supersedes any kind of like,
Speaker 1: oh I got feelings for this person because my girlfriend
Speaker 1: was there first. So I think it is like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you can be loyal to your feelings, acknowledge that maybe
Speaker 1: you have some feelings, but I don't think we have
Speaker 1: to act on all of our feelings. And in the
Speaker 1: situation of dating a friend's X, I just don't think
Speaker 1: that that's aligned that should.
Speaker 3: Ever be crossed.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and you touched on the nuance a little bit already.
Speaker 2: But Sierra is a black woman and Amanda is a
Speaker 2: white woman, and I think from the leaved audio there's
Speaker 2: been a lot of conversation on is she actually responsible
Speaker 2: for concealing those feelings? But I feel like that same
Speaker 2: grace isn't really being extended to Sierra. It's almost an
Speaker 2: expectation that like, Okay, if that was really your friend,
Speaker 2: you should be glad that she's happy now, Like there's
Speaker 2: been a lot of conversation on social media that isn't
Speaker 2: exactly aligned like with what I risally.
Speaker 4: Would feel about it. But from your perspective, how do
Speaker 4: you release.
Speaker 2: That expectation to take everything on the chin, especially when
Speaker 2: you're experiencing a lot of hur I think from Sierra's
Speaker 2: point of view, I think everyone's kind of picking sides
Speaker 2: right now, and there's almost this expectation as a women
Speaker 2: that like, your feelings don't matter, Like maybe this person's
Speaker 2: feelings take priority.
Speaker 4: So how would you naviget that?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think she needs to take anything on
Speaker 1: the chin, right, I think historically black women have had
Speaker 1: to take a lot on the chin. And something that
Speaker 1: is such a personal attack or is such a personal experience,
Speaker 1: like your friend dating your ex, Like, who wouldn't be
Speaker 1: upset about that? I mean, I guess maybe some people
Speaker 1: wouldn't be, but I think most people would feel some
Speaker 1: kind of way about it. Now, some people might eventually
Speaker 1: get to a place where they're like, oh, you know, okay, fine,
Speaker 1: like we are done and it's okay for you to
Speaker 1: do that. But I think most of us would feel
Speaker 1: some kind of way about a friend dating an ex.
Speaker 1: And so again, you know, just like we talked about
Speaker 1: with Meg, like it's okay to have a human reaction
Speaker 1: to a human experience, and so if you are hurt,
Speaker 1: you don't do yourself any favors and you're healing any
Speaker 1: favors by like trying to suck it up and like
Speaker 1: pretend like it's okay. Or I understand why she might
Speaker 1: not want to be super vulnerable on the internet, and
Speaker 1: you know, social media definitely doesn't deserve that. But in
Speaker 1: her private circles, I hope that she is able to
Speaker 1: talk about how much it sucks and that she's.
Speaker 3: Not okay with it.
Speaker 1: And I don't think that she should lean into the like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm okay with it if she actually isn't, just so
Speaker 1: that like people won't paint her as a villain, because
Speaker 1: it's likely people are doing that anyway, just because she's
Speaker 1: a black woman. Yeah, Like you know that, people and like,
Speaker 1: narratives are often fun to make black women the villains
Speaker 1: in a story, and in this case, I don't think
Speaker 1: she is, and so I don't think that there's a
Speaker 1: reason for her to kind of lean into that or
Speaker 1: leaning into forgiving her moving past it if she is
Speaker 1: not actually ready.
Speaker 3: To do that.
Speaker 2: Definitely, I could talk all day about how black women
Speaker 2: are treated on reality TV, but the conversation.
Speaker 1: A couple of episodes, so we maybe do for another
Speaker 1: one soon. So thank you so much for sharing Thoseria.
Speaker 1: I definitely had some thoughts and clearly have lots of
Speaker 1: thoughts around pop culture stuff.
Speaker 3: But if there's something that.
Speaker 1: You see or watch in the world, then you would
Speaker 1: like us to weigh in on for this to be
Speaker 1: named segment of our culture to talk, please send that
Speaker 1: to us. You can send it to us at Therapy
Speaker 1: for Blackgirls dot com slash mailbox and let us know
Speaker 1: what you are paying attention to and we might include
Speaker 1: it in a future segment. Also, if you have ideas
Speaker 1: for what we should call this segment, what name should
Speaker 1: we give it. If you can think of a catching
Speaker 1: name for this segment, let us know that too. Again,
Speaker 1: you can share that in the mailbox at Therapy for
Speaker 1: Blackgirls dot com slash mailbox, or you can leave it
Speaker 1: in an Instagram comment send us a DM. We are
Speaker 1: checking all of those. Oh well, I am very excited
Speaker 1: to be back with the team today for another one
Speaker 1: of our pop culture conversations always.
Speaker 3: Some of my favorites.
Speaker 1: So we will do quick introductions so that people who
Speaker 1: have not met the team can read the team. So
Speaker 1: we will start with you.
Speaker 3: Bria.
Speaker 2: Hi, everyone, my name is Bria. I am the production
Speaker 2: assistant for TVG.
Speaker 6: Hi everyone, my name is Elise. I'm our director of podcast.
Speaker 6: Fancy way to say like senior producer, but you know
Speaker 6: I'm always excited for from I.
Speaker 3: Love end Day Same.
Speaker 5: Hi everyone, I'm happy to be back here with our
Speaker 5: little group.
Speaker 6: I'm in Day and I'm a producer. I'm the podcast
Speaker 6: sking here at TVG A.
Speaker 7: Tari I am the resident he him at TBG and
Speaker 7: a podcast producer for both the podcasts.
Speaker 5: And tbgu perfect.
Speaker 1: So the team has taken the opportunity to start off
Speaker 1: the summer with some movie watching. You know, that's one
Speaker 1: of my favorite topics to talk about, and so we
Speaker 1: are going to be talking today about some of the
Speaker 1: new age rom coms and the two latest introductions to
Speaker 1: this genre, I guess are The Drama and You Me
Speaker 1: and Tuscany. So we will start with the Drama. So
Speaker 1: I will admit that I did not complete out my
Speaker 1: homework assignment.
Speaker 3: I did not get a chance to actually watch the drama.
Speaker 1: I did see You Me and Tuscany, So I'm probably
Speaker 1: going to be more on the just facilitating this part
Speaker 1: of the conversation, but everybody else on the team watched it.
Speaker 1: So how would you rate the film on a scale
Speaker 1: of one to ten and day.
Speaker 6: We will start with you first. I'll say we will
Speaker 6: be spoiling. There's nothing to talk about these movies without spoiling.
Speaker 6: So if you haven't seeing them, then just come back,
Speaker 6: come back and listen.
Speaker 5: I'm gonna give the drama. I'll give it an eight.
Speaker 5: I'll give it a solid eight.
Speaker 1: It's pretty high. What about you at least?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm gonna have to agree. I'm given an eight
Speaker 6: eight and a half. It was big, it was messy,
Speaker 6: it was fine. It was controversial, like this is why
Speaker 6: I literally feel like you add for the AMC. But
Speaker 6: this is why people go, oh, okay, yeah, I have
Speaker 6: a good time.
Speaker 5: It's like it was like a ride.
Speaker 7: It was I'm gonna go seven point five. I think
Speaker 7: that it was strong performances from the cast. It definitely
Speaker 7: approached a subject matter that is under discussed, and it's
Speaker 7: certainly like an interesting, I think way of doing getting
Speaker 7: like this modern context. It just didn't have the like
Speaker 7: extrao that I think makes a film like a plus
Speaker 7: to me. But it was really solid and I would
Speaker 7: rewatch it, okay, And.
Speaker 3: What about you, Riya?
Speaker 2: I was gonna say eight too. I really liked the
Speaker 2: performances from the car. I just did not like the end.
Speaker 3: He will.
Speaker 1: I feel like this is a very strong rating from
Speaker 1: this group, in particular because y'all notoriously do not like
Speaker 1: very many things, and so to have it be like
Speaker 1: a seven to eight range is very impressive. So I
Speaker 1: feel like at some point I'm definitely going to have
Speaker 1: to see it. Somebody give me a quick synopsis, just
Speaker 1: so that I can be a little bit informed without
Speaker 1: what's the log line?
Speaker 7: Y'all heavy are engaged, and over the course of their engagement,
Speaker 7: they have a group discussion with friends around deeply unlikable
Speaker 7: things about them, and the revelation from Zundeia's character about
Speaker 7: a deeply unlikable thing for her puts her at odds
Speaker 7: with not only her friend group.
Speaker 4: Oh no, we can spoil it.
Speaker 6: Yes, they are at so a week before, a week before,
Speaker 6: a week before, they.
Speaker 4: Are at their menu tasting.
Speaker 2: Everyone is tipsy, leaning on drunk, and one of the couples,
Speaker 2: who's also in an interracial couple, says, what something we
Speaker 2: did before we got married was shared the worst thing
Speaker 2: we've ever done. So they all go around and share
Speaker 2: it and zendayas is that she planned a school shooting.
Speaker 2: It's not funny, but the movie is like supposed to
Speaker 2: just but it's very interesting because everything else.
Speaker 6: That like, she didn't do the school shooting obviously, but
Speaker 6: everything else that everyone shares is terrible. Like the things
Speaker 6: that they did are also I mean, and you might
Speaker 6: think of it in a small way.
Speaker 4: Like one of the one woman.
Speaker 2: She literally lost what you're supposed to like was like
Speaker 2: a disabled kid in a closet and abandoned him and
Speaker 2: he like there was a search for.
Speaker 6: Him, like and she said he was found. You don't know,
Speaker 6: you can't say anything about it. The other guy, a
Speaker 6: dog was attacking him and his girlfriend. He used his
Speaker 6: girlfriend as a human shield and then knew that he
Speaker 6: was going to break up with her, like doing that.
Speaker 2: And then Robert Pattinson, Zendia's fiance, cyberbullied the kids so
Speaker 2: bad that like he had to leave Tom.
Speaker 6: They are all, yeah, they all actually did those things,
Speaker 6: but of course yeah, when Zendia shared that, they were
Speaker 6: like and so the whole movie is about like the
Speaker 6: reaction to that leading up to the wedding, and then
Speaker 6: there's a whole bunch of drama at the wedding in
Speaker 6: the film in that's really And so this.
Speaker 1: Movie was billed as a rom came because because I
Speaker 1: think I was very confused about what this movie was,
Speaker 1: even like in the promo and I was.
Speaker 4: Like, what, you knew it was gonna have levity?
Speaker 2: Like I knew it was going there was because the
Speaker 2: way people talk about like that there was some shocking
Speaker 2: twist it's a twenty four.
Speaker 4: I was like, Oh, I feel like it's gonna be
Speaker 4: on the darker.
Speaker 2: There have been rumors on like Reddit and stuff that
Speaker 2: it was a school shooting, and then like the week
Speaker 2: before a parent, like a Columbine parent made a comment
Speaker 2: about it, and so it was like okay.
Speaker 4: But from the jump, I.
Speaker 6: Kind of knew that it was gonna have some type
Speaker 6: of like quirkiness or levity to it.
Speaker 4: So I don't think it was built as a traditional wrongcom.
Speaker 2: But when you pick apart the elements of the film,
Speaker 2: like it's romantic, it's drama, is romantic because there's a wedding,
Speaker 2: there's like.
Speaker 7: A but it is funny all the way through.
Speaker 2: I do think there are romantic parts to the film
Speaker 2: though for sure. Yeah, when you see like their story
Speaker 2: of like how they met and things like that, Like
Speaker 2: in the beginning, I'm like, Okay, this is cute.
Speaker 5: Yeah, at the beginning, I'm really stuck here, y'all.
Speaker 1: Like I I I feel like this would be I'm
Speaker 1: struck by this being like a plot line in something
Speaker 1: that I mean, I guess in some ways it is
Speaker 1: a very sad reality of like our life. But like,
Speaker 1: clearly I gotta see the movie. Yeah, but but it
Speaker 1: feels like I would have trouble moving past the fact
Speaker 1: that she has planned this school shooting and like all
Speaker 1: of these other awful things been done.
Speaker 2: I think, Yeah, the film, yeah, he does not treat
Speaker 2: any of it likely you see like a younger version
Speaker 2: of today, which is probably like some of the funniest
Speaker 2: parts of the film.
Speaker 4: It implied that.
Speaker 2: Like she was kind of like abandoned as a kid,
Speaker 2: like parents not around, bullied in school. There's like a
Speaker 2: racial aspect to that, like like I had.
Speaker 5: Say, too much internet access, like yeah, controls.
Speaker 2: Well, rental controls. Her dad was in the military. She's
Speaker 2: clearly like radicalized online. She has like posters of like
Speaker 2: little Wayne toning guns in.
Speaker 4: Her room, like you.
Speaker 2: I think they do a good job at explaining like
Speaker 2: how did someone even get to this point?
Speaker 4: And then she doesn't do it, and she.
Speaker 6: Also becomes like a gun from activist or just crazy.
Speaker 4: It's not like Oh.
Speaker 2: I think the film does a good job of like
Speaker 2: easing you into it throughout, so it does feel like
Speaker 2: now that you know what happened, it doesn't move on
Speaker 2: at all.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and it just continues to bring up points that
Speaker 6: ask the question, like if our feet were held to
Speaker 6: the fire for like the things that we like almost
Speaker 6: it's like what is the line of almost and like
Speaker 6: it's almost a thought like at what point does it
Speaker 6: become something to be like charged for almost or like
Speaker 6: like like publicly shamed for. I think it brings up
Speaker 6: a lot of points about that and how we just
Speaker 6: kind of shape our own morality, especially now when everything
Speaker 6: is your opinion is either a or it's and like
Speaker 6: that's it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you bring up a good point.
Speaker 7: I think one of the things that stuck out to
Speaker 7: me about even that whole scene where they're admitting to
Speaker 7: their like the most terrible things is that all of
Speaker 7: them the size Indaya harmed a marginalized community and then
Speaker 7: they were all also outraged by a woman of color
Speaker 7: even having the thought of farming back. So there's like
Speaker 7: a lot of conversation and context around like feminine rage
Speaker 7: and black women being outraged or be reactionary to the
Speaker 7: harm that's performed. It gets them. That doesn't necessarily it
Speaker 7: isn't overtly spoken about in the movie, but I do
Speaker 7: think it's hard to ignore when you.
Speaker 6: Watch totally, Like you know, it's like hard to have
Speaker 6: the conversation without acknowledging that she was bullied. And I
Speaker 6: saw some people online saying like, well, she wasn't bullied
Speaker 6: that bad, but when you're bullied that, I don't know,
Speaker 6: how was she thirteen?
Speaker 5: Like it doesn't take.
Speaker 2: Much in other because you look different, Yeah, I know,
Speaker 2: like Zendaya presence is has more like I'm going to
Speaker 2: say she's white passing, but she's more like convinole might
Speaker 2: not be automatical that like she was like a black woman,
Speaker 2: like they may not read her that way, but the
Speaker 2: younger character is undeniable. I think that's where when we
Speaker 2: think of like school shooters, we do have this like, oh,
Speaker 2: they're in other they're an outcast. And I think what
Speaker 2: I did enjoy about the film is in a very
Speaker 2: subtle way, it explored like how a black person could
Speaker 2: also feel that way. And I don't think when we
Speaker 2: talk about like bullying and then like the bullying to
Speaker 2: like violent rage pipelon, it's not saying like, oh, we
Speaker 2: don't get represented that way because like, but I'm like,
Speaker 2: I think it's fair to say, like maybe people have
Speaker 2: felt that way before. And I thought it was almost
Speaker 2: like it was interesting that they explort that, and I
Speaker 2: appreciated it because I don't think, yeah, we don't see
Speaker 2: black people do school shootings, but who's to say that
Speaker 2: people have not felt that kind of like level of
Speaker 2: isolation before. Yeah. I also thought it was interesting that
Speaker 2: when they explored like why she didn't go through with it,
Speaker 2: it wasn't that she had a moral like oh I
Speaker 2: can't do this. It was because someone did the school
Speaker 2: shooting first, and she was like, well I guess it.
Speaker 5: Or it was like at all or something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm saying so it's like she just I
Speaker 2: think it was like a double It was a double
Speaker 2: thing where someone did it first.
Speaker 4: But also she saw.
Speaker 6: How like repulsed people were the client and was like, well,
Speaker 6: this would other me further. And then her school has
Speaker 6: her like group therapy and like healing circles and things
Speaker 6: like that, and through that you see her become more
Speaker 6: connected to people in her school community. She starts like
Speaker 6: organized around like gun reform, and people like her and
Speaker 6: they're like complimenting her. And I think it also shows
Speaker 6: you the power.
Speaker 2: Of community and feeling included in seen because it totally
Speaker 2: changed the trajectory of her life.
Speaker 4: So I thought that was really interesting too.
Speaker 2: But I like it looked funny because she's just like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna do it someone, and then.
Speaker 6: Her excitatehood and then when she shared that when they
Speaker 6: were when she or I don't know if she shared
Speaker 6: it in that moment or if she shared it later
Speaker 6: with Robert Pattinson, Like why she didn't end up going through.
Speaker 4: With it, it.
Speaker 6: Was like even more of a reason to be like wait,
Speaker 6: so like it was like a thing that she didn't
Speaker 6: have this moral come around And then I don't know,
Speaker 6: it's just interesting because the high girl, I don't know
Speaker 6: her real name alone, Alana. Yes, she's like, well, my
Speaker 6: cousin is paralyzed from a school shooting, and so it
Speaker 6: became like a personal thing for her. We can we'll
Speaker 6: talk more about like the down the line of it all,
Speaker 6: But I think it's interesting to see like where everybody
Speaker 6: pulled from when it came to like talking about what was
Speaker 6: z India like almost did or ide eated or you
Speaker 6: know whatever, and then like why she decided not to
Speaker 6: do it.
Speaker 7: It's a little off base now that to what Elise
Speaker 7: was bringing up about school shootings, because when I watched
Speaker 7: the initially, and as I think about Zendaya in every
Speaker 7: world that she plays, I go, oh, this isn't meant
Speaker 7: to be a black woman, so because obviously we think
Speaker 7: black people don't do school shootings. But then I did
Speaker 7: some research afterwards, and there's not so much that black
Speaker 7: people don't do school shootings. It's just the way that
Speaker 7: we report on them once they happen. So it's never
Speaker 7: a school shooting. It's it's gang violence, or it's reframed.
Speaker 7: That's something that wouldn't offer you a sympathetic you point
Speaker 7: for the shooter, which is a whole other thing that
Speaker 7: kind of definitely applies to the movie.
Speaker 1: More from our conversation after the break.
Speaker 4: I'm curious that your joy I have a question for you.
Speaker 2: So the movie brings up to me an interesting question
Speaker 2: around how much would you be sharing. I mean, you're
Speaker 2: not a marriage counselor, but like with your partner before
Speaker 2: you get married, and like what is the line between
Speaker 2: withholding something or something just like it hasn't come up before,
Speaker 2: Like this is a big thing.
Speaker 4: But honestly, if I was so ashamed of it have
Speaker 4: like buried it, I would.
Speaker 6: Just be like I should tell you this because it's
Speaker 6: also like I was young and full of rage, Like
Speaker 6: haven't we all been young?
Speaker 5: And maybe not to that point, but I do think it.
Speaker 6: I think I do think it matters that it wasn't
Speaker 6: done and then you and then if that's what we're
Speaker 6: talking about, then that just like widens the pool of
Speaker 6: like who else has been in that same position anyways,
Speaker 6: But that was your question, doctor Joyce.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I feel like this is a tough
Speaker 1: question because this feels like something I would definitely want
Speaker 1: to know of my potential partner. I do think, like
Speaker 1: you said, like it counts for something that it didn't
Speaker 1: actually happen, but what was the after fact? Right, Like,
Speaker 1: because to me, if you get to the point of
Speaker 1: planning something like this, then that does speak to a
Speaker 1: lot of rage and like the need to be talking
Speaker 1: to somebody about how we got to that place and
Speaker 1: what other things can happen, right, And it sounds like
Speaker 1: she did by getting involved with like gun reform and
Speaker 1: you know, like a lobbying against the thing that she
Speaker 1: was going to do, which is where she found her
Speaker 1: sense of belonging. And I think for a lot of
Speaker 1: these cases, that's what you hear, right, like that these
Speaker 1: people feel very outcast and really othered and need some
Speaker 1: sense of community in a place to be seen. So
Speaker 1: I think it's good that she got to that place.
Speaker 1: But I think that that is definitely something I would
Speaker 1: want to know. And so I think there isn't really
Speaker 1: any like hard and fast rules about the kinds of
Speaker 1: things that you feel like you have to share with
Speaker 1: a potential partner. But I think in the idea of
Speaker 1: like people making informed decisions, like if that would make
Speaker 1: a difference but about whether you would marry this person
Speaker 1: or not, then that may be an indication that it
Speaker 1: is something that needs to be shared, right like that.
Speaker 3: I don't feel proud of this.
Speaker 1: Here's how I turned my life around after this, but
Speaker 1: this is something I feel like you should know in
Speaker 1: the interest of like making a decision about who you
Speaker 1: want to build a life with.
Speaker 6: Well, they all need to be asking those questions then,
Speaker 6: because I think locking a human being in a class, yeah,
Speaker 6: like maybe pretty awful.
Speaker 5: Example, even during the.
Speaker 4: Movie, I was like what would I say?
Speaker 2: And I think I was like just thinking about the
Speaker 2: things that they sound like these are rejectively bad.
Speaker 5: Like yeah, I don't have anything that touches up.
Speaker 2: Like two things I would bring up and be like okay,
Speaker 2: like it's.
Speaker 7: Not that bad, but there's certainly a question of when
Speaker 7: and how all. So, Doctor Lloyd, a platform that you
Speaker 7: should know is today's character is death in one eared
Speaker 7: and this is as a result of her practicing the
Speaker 7: school shooting. One of the bullets went off and made
Speaker 7: her death. So a whole part of her development with
Speaker 7: Robert Patterson romantically is that he tries to speak game
Speaker 7: em her but she can't hear any of it because
Speaker 7: she's deaf. So he's kind of embarrassed behind that. But
Speaker 7: he knows that she's deaf, he just doesn't know why,
Speaker 7: and so had he ever inquired as to the why,
Speaker 7: uh huh, that he would know this then much earlier.
Speaker 7: But it is so much that you know this has
Speaker 7: impacted your life in such a way that literally you
Speaker 7: are physically impaired because of it. Why does it not
Speaker 7: come up in your relationship discussion?
Speaker 6: Mm hmm, okay, that's yeah, that's the point of like
Speaker 6: maybe it did, Like maybe maybe outside of this, like
Speaker 6: that's not something we'll ever know.
Speaker 5: I know, like, well, maybe what's the world that we
Speaker 5: don't know about? But then we can only do with
Speaker 5: what we're seeing.
Speaker 6: I wanted to say, I think we started to talk
Speaker 6: about like Zenda being black in the movie, or like
Speaker 6: Issu black in the movie, or anyone could have been
Speaker 6: in this role. But I'm wondering if, Okay, sure, yes,
Speaker 6: she wants in data to be a lead in your
Speaker 6: movie because she is who she is. I think the
Speaker 6: blackness might come secondary or tertiary. I wonder the director
Speaker 6: is a Norwegian guy, and I think as I was
Speaker 6: watching it, I was like, hmmm, I wonder if maybe
Speaker 6: going into it he wasn't really thinking about like the
Speaker 6: racial implications of her being black. But then as he's
Speaker 6: watching it, he's like, oh, this kind of plays in
Speaker 6: my favor because even like there's a moment in the
Speaker 6: movie after she drops this bomb, so to speak, where
Speaker 6: she's like making a smoothie. She's chopping up some fruit.
Speaker 6: She and Robert Pattinson are in the house and she
Speaker 6: goes to the room to ask him something and she
Speaker 6: has this big knife in her hand and.
Speaker 5: He's like, oh, like he's shook, like, oh, I thought
Speaker 5: you were gonna, I don't know, get.
Speaker 3: Me or whatever.
Speaker 6: And she's just like, why are you acting like that?
Speaker 6: Like why are you acting like I'm this harmful person?
Speaker 6: And I think us.
Speaker 5: Knowing like then Day.
Speaker 6: I don't know if other people when they watch The Day,
Speaker 6: they're like, that's a black woman, But me watching I'm like, oh, okay,
Speaker 6: I'm thinking about how her like potential to harm is
Speaker 6: being received in a way. And I just was wondering, like,
Speaker 6: if that was a black woman, would we all be
Speaker 6: receiving it the same way?
Speaker 5: And I don't think so. And so I feel like
Speaker 5: there's a fall off.
Speaker 6: I don't know if it's a benefit, but there's a
Speaker 6: fall off of like how her horror potential to harm
Speaker 6: is maybe perceived because she is black, And I just
Speaker 6: don't know if that was the intention going into the movie.
Speaker 2: I think it's interesting because there's a scene towards the
Speaker 2: end of the movie when she kind of walks out
Speaker 2: the bathroom and and her own wedding. She's like freaking
Speaker 2: out because people I think she's hearing people whisper about
Speaker 2: this and yes, oh so.
Speaker 1: The secret has also left the circle.
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay, there's a whole.
Speaker 5: There's a hole.
Speaker 3: You're okay, but it does yeh, got it? Okay.
Speaker 2: And the woman who like is whispering is outside and
Speaker 2: she's like taken aback. And it's a question that I
Speaker 2: asked him, like would someone be like objectively, it's a
Speaker 2: terrible thing to idea and plan, but if it was
Speaker 2: a white woman, would there be so much fear around
Speaker 2: like who is this person?
Speaker 4: Actually? And it just made me.
Speaker 2: Think about like when I had met people like first
Speaker 2: interactions and then years later they would say something like, oh,
Speaker 2: when I first met you, I was intimidated by you
Speaker 2: like me, That's.
Speaker 3: What I mean, Yarah.
Speaker 2: And it's very interesting because the character Alanaheim her name
Speaker 2: is Rachel in the film, who's the most punitive on her.
Speaker 2: You can see from the beginning of the film, even
Speaker 2: before the secret is revealed, that like she just didn't
Speaker 2: like her or was like jellous of her and like
Speaker 2: saying little things to try to like put her down,
Speaker 2: and to me that all felt like very racialized too.
Speaker 2: It was interesting because I'm like, yes, you once a
Speaker 2: day in your film. I think she's like legible to
Speaker 2: so many like races. But I kind of appreciated that
Speaker 2: she is a multi racial black woman because I think
Speaker 2: it made the film more complicated in a way that
Speaker 2: was entertaining and allowed people to like talk about it.
Speaker 2: I feel like there should have been one like small
Speaker 2: racial joke just to like acknowledge it.
Speaker 6: Okay, especially because the other part, Yeah, yeah, like the
Speaker 6: other couple was incial.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I thought it was interesting.
Speaker 6: I think I also appreciated, as we're looking at Rachel
Speaker 6: in the movie him and how she's interacting with Zendeya.
Speaker 5: I think I.
Speaker 6: Appreciated being able to relate to coming into contact with
Speaker 6: that type of like white feminine like rage where they're like,
Speaker 6: I feel really justified in this, and I am grandstanding
Speaker 6: in my like full morality because you did this and
Speaker 6: that's bad. My misstep or my bad thing that I've
Speaker 6: done is forgivable or understandable because X I think like
Speaker 6: most black women have come into contact with that type
Speaker 6: of white woman, and so I think I was like, oh, okay,
Speaker 6: I know exactly what this is, and I think like
Speaker 6: most black women watching movie would probably understand that too.
Speaker 2: Before we switch films, I do have a quick question
Speaker 2: for everyone, what will you answer to the worst thing
Speaker 2: that you've ever done?
Speaker 3: Leah, I don't know that we're gonna do that.
Speaker 5: Then this feels like it.
Speaker 3: Could be an hr violation of these I don't know
Speaker 3: we uh.
Speaker 1: Things like I mean, I don't even know what mine
Speaker 1: would be. I feel like like you, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: I think I stole like a pack of gum baby
Speaker 1: out of a.
Speaker 3: Drug store or something.
Speaker 4: First time, Mike, I stole like a pack of.
Speaker 2: Gum and I was as I felt so guilty.
Speaker 5: This was the first time you stole.
Speaker 6: I stole a lot of the beauty supply store when
Speaker 6: I was very for sale. I think it was someone
Speaker 6: was eating it and we went around the back and
Speaker 6: I was.
Speaker 2: Like mine, I simply remember mine was a lip gloss
Speaker 2: from Target when I was like set in remember so swissly.
Speaker 5: It's like a part of development.
Speaker 7: Right now.
Speaker 5: I never stolen, not playing there, I.
Speaker 3: Was stolen you anything.
Speaker 7: I think about it all the time now, like when
Speaker 7: I see how high season this is in the grocery
Speaker 7: store and stuff checkout. But I haven't stolen.
Speaker 4: No, maybe even that episode of the show.
Speaker 2: But I feel like so many young girls, not me,
Speaker 2: but so many young girls go through stealing phases.
Speaker 4: And I remember being in middle.
Speaker 6: School and like people were stealing from like urban outfitters,
Speaker 6: and I was like, I remember my freshman year in college,
Speaker 6: and mind you, I stole that one time when I
Speaker 6: was young, but I wasn't like a thief.
Speaker 5: My freshman year in college, I had this white friend.
Speaker 6: We would go to brandy Melville, and I remember the
Speaker 6: first time we went to brandy Meilville. We're on the
Speaker 6: train back and she's pulling stuff out of her jack.
Speaker 5: I was like, girl, you stole.
Speaker 6: That, yeah.
Speaker 5: On her like big corporation.
Speaker 6: I'm like, girl, I'm not stealing with you. We are different,
Speaker 6: but she was still all the time.
Speaker 1: That doesn't feel like maybe it could be a potential episode,
Speaker 1: because I mean, just like a lot of things, right,
Speaker 1: like kleptomania, which is the obsession with stealing, isn't of
Speaker 1: course about like not being able to afford the thing, right,
Speaker 1: It is mostly about can I get exactly get.
Speaker 3: Away with it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that may be an interesting, interesting conversation, But I'm
Speaker 1: curious because all of you did react, it feels like,
Speaker 1: so positively to the film. How do you think your
Speaker 1: reaction to the number you gave the film would have
Speaker 1: been different if, like Sidney Sweeney was the lead actress
Speaker 1: versus Zindia, Like, if this were not an interracial cast,
Speaker 1: if it were just an all white cast, do you
Speaker 1: feel like you would have liked it as much?
Speaker 4: It wouldn't have been as fun.
Speaker 2: It wouldn't have That's like the number one thing, because
Speaker 2: part of film is like you project your own fantasies
Speaker 2: and understandings on it.
Speaker 4: And I think with like an all white a.
Speaker 7: Little more like a drug addiction or something like, it
Speaker 7: wouldn't have made sense by itself.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I also think so many shows, like when I think
Speaker 2: about like big Little Lies, and even like this Imperfect
Speaker 2: women that's on Apple are like obsessed with the tragic
Speaker 2: white woman.
Speaker 4: We're like, we're sad.
Speaker 5: Too, and so I tragic too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm like feeling violent even that's like I'm
Speaker 2: not interested in that anymore. I think it's been done
Speaker 2: so many times on television or in films, so I
Speaker 2: thought this was even Robert Pattinson was in a movie
Speaker 2: last year, I'll Die My Love about like a tragic.
Speaker 4: White woman in like early in their marriage.
Speaker 2: So I think we've seen that so many times, So
Speaker 2: I do think the interracial aspect we've bened it up.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And I think also the fact that Zindea was the
Speaker 2: black woman who had planned the school shooting. I think
Speaker 2: that like added a layer of depth to it that
Speaker 2: made it a little bit different than something that we might.
Speaker 7: Expect to swing forever twenty one sting.
Speaker 5: I don't want to say Sweene no.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean she's just who I thought of.
Speaker 1: I can't take up any other like popular white actress
Speaker 1: right now, so that's just who I see it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, should we move on to Yeah.
Speaker 1: So switching gears to you Me and Tuscany, so we
Speaker 1: will also rate this one.
Speaker 3: So what was your rating for this film, Bryo.
Speaker 2: Mine, I would say like a six and a half seven.
Speaker 2: I think that I go into movies. Unfortunately, I'm just
Speaker 2: like a very realist person and some of the things
Speaker 2: and it just didn't feel realistic. I know it wasn't
Speaker 2: supposed to, so I had to like separate that, but
Speaker 2: that would be my rating.
Speaker 3: Okay, what about you? At least I'm gonna.
Speaker 4: Have to give it a five and a half. Sick,
Speaker 4: but it was an entertaining watch. Like it was I
Speaker 4: was laughing.
Speaker 2: There were definitely like some unrealistic part that took me
Speaker 2: out of it. And I do think the movie felt dated,
Speaker 2: like not every movie has to be of the A
Speaker 2: twenty four sensibility, but it did feel like, oh, this
Speaker 2: may have been written and I love Will Packard, but
Speaker 2: even his sensibilities are very much like two thousand and
Speaker 2: nine through like twenty sixteen, and so I think that
Speaker 2: was very obvious in the movie, and I think that
Speaker 2: took me out of it.
Speaker 6: Okay, what about you, Indy, I'm gonna give it a six.
Speaker 6: And that pains me because I do love Halle Bailey.
Speaker 6: I love the Bailey sisters, and so I was happy
Speaker 6: to see her on screen. But I agree as soon
Speaker 6: as the movie came on, I was like, oh, this
Speaker 6: is giving me early two thousands. Even the way it looks,
Speaker 6: it's like I don't want to be in so harsh
Speaker 6: to say like it didn't look stylistic, but it's like
Speaker 6: liked the actor and make the camera clear like it
Speaker 6: wasn't like giving me like any mood.
Speaker 5: It's just like a Erry on the nose. It was
Speaker 5: just a very on the nose.
Speaker 6: Movie, and like what you see is what you get,
Speaker 6: and you could probably predict half of it.
Speaker 5: But it was like, I don't regret watching it.
Speaker 7: I'm gonna give it a six as well. It feels
Speaker 7: like if Attica Locke and Nasty Meers came together in
Speaker 7: the most like filtered down way.
Speaker 3: But I thought it was.
Speaker 7: Really fun, like a fun watch, and I think that
Speaker 7: I we'll talk about it more. It's certainly a portrayal
Speaker 7: of a black woman in romance that we haven't seen before,
Speaker 7: which is what takes it up for me.
Speaker 3: M m hm.
Speaker 1: I also gave it a six, and I also, like you,
Speaker 1: inn Day, was thrown by something about like the lighting
Speaker 1: and like it felt hyper real.
Speaker 5: It felt like.
Speaker 1: Like a no, it felt like a three D almost
Speaker 1: and I was like, is this just my screen? Like
Speaker 1: why does it feel so bright? And so I was
Speaker 1: very confused by that. I also thought it was just
Speaker 1: fun though, right, and so I think I went into
Speaker 1: it thinking like, oh, this will just be like a
Speaker 1: fun rom com and it was that. But to your point,
Speaker 1: at least it all so did make me think of
Speaker 1: like some of the black rom coms we had in
Speaker 1: like the nineties early two thousands, like A Half Plenty
Speaker 1: or not Love Jones, because I feel like that is
Speaker 1: a separate.
Speaker 3: Genre of At least I don't think you love Love Jones.
Speaker 3: We haven't had that conversation on the podcast.
Speaker 1: But it didn't feel like that because Love Jones felt
Speaker 1: a little like grittier and moodier to me, and to
Speaker 1: your point in day, this did not. But it felt
Speaker 1: like something I would have seen in like the nineties
Speaker 1: of two thousand in like that collection of rom coms
Speaker 1: that you could see on Lifetime or whatever, and you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: this was just a fun movie. So I know, before
Speaker 1: all of us saw the film, we talked about like, Okay,
Speaker 1: how do we.
Speaker 3: Feel about this the leads.
Speaker 1: I think I've seen a lot of conversation around like
Speaker 1: the chemistry.
Speaker 3: Between the leads.
Speaker 1: What were your thoughts after watching the film in terms
Speaker 1: of chemistry between reggae, reggae, reggae, joan reggae.
Speaker 6: Yes, they had more chemistry than I anticipated. It did
Speaker 6: seem a little slow to connect for me, But for
Speaker 6: what it's worth if I'm like ignoring everything, all of
Speaker 6: the things that don't feel real about the movie.
Speaker 5: I thought they were cutish. I thought they were cute.
Speaker 5: They're working with the script that they have, and so
Speaker 5: I didn't think I wasn't like not seeing it for
Speaker 5: them in the movie. I was like, Okay, it's cute.
Speaker 6: You know, they had like a little meet cute, a
Speaker 6: little dissonance in their meet cute.
Speaker 5: Sure, and at the end I was like, okay, they're
Speaker 5: cute together.
Speaker 1: More from our conversation after the break, did anybody feel
Speaker 1: one way about their chemistry?
Speaker 3: And You're mine was changed after the film.
Speaker 4: Okay, So as.
Speaker 2: The age gap, for sure, like, yeah, he appears younger
Speaker 2: on screen, which is good, but in the press tour
Speaker 2: of it all that kind of made me nervous. Also
Speaker 2: the messy person to me, the girls on Reddit are
Speaker 2: like they don't like even like each other in real life,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, no, I don't know that. That is
Speaker 2: how I went into the film, being on Reddit and
Speaker 2: being in doctrine.
Speaker 4: I to hear that true.
Speaker 2: So then I watched the film, I was like, actually,
Speaker 2: I thought they had really good chemistry. I think, like
Speaker 2: you said in it was kind of like slow to burn,
Speaker 2: but not in a like a slow burn way, slow
Speaker 2: to connect, which I think part of it is like
Speaker 2: the point of the film, given that like this is
Speaker 2: who she's allegedly engaged his cousin brothers. I think I
Speaker 2: was like, but I think I need one or two
Speaker 2: more beats of like, why do you guys like each other?
Speaker 4: I think that's what was mittley for me.
Speaker 6: At the end when they're in the vineyard and it's
Speaker 6: raining and she's like, I want to give us a chance.
Speaker 5: I'm like, what you think language language, like give us
Speaker 5: a chance?
Speaker 6: It just feels early, like I understand it's over the
Speaker 6: course of what five six days, but I'm like, give
Speaker 6: us a chance. This is like the first real life
Speaker 6: conversation y'all are having about a nonpolatonic relationship, and give
Speaker 6: us a chance just felt like the jump. I understand
Speaker 6: we got a tile loose ends, so just like the
Speaker 6: give us a few more beats. But it was crazy
Speaker 6: because I do feel like they were heavy handed with
Speaker 6: like the energy between them.
Speaker 3: At the beginning.
Speaker 5: I'm like, okay, we get it, y'all like each other,
Speaker 5: And then it was from that, yes.
Speaker 4: That's what I'm saying. I was like a chance here.
Speaker 2: Also, like this movie really stretched my tolerance of cringe
Speaker 2: because of what of cringe. Like there were times in
Speaker 2: the theater I was like, whoa, Like the secondhand embarrassment
Speaker 2: is bally weighing on you right now. I think typically
Speaker 2: like I can not go to the bathroom, but I think,
Speaker 2: pardon me going to the bathroom during the film, like
Speaker 2: I cannot hit.
Speaker 1: What felt particularly cringey to you.
Speaker 8: There are some jokes that people would laugh and I
Speaker 8: wasn't laughing, not because I was try on a state
Speaker 8: tight lick, but I was like, oh dang, maybe I'm
Speaker 8: just like I don't know, I'm strict.
Speaker 2: My theater was like mostly white women. They were having
Speaker 2: a time in there.
Speaker 4: I mean the singing, like singing of Neo.
Speaker 3: I was like Mario, Mario.
Speaker 6: Yes, the taxi driver, the sister in law, Oh yeah,
Speaker 6: this is I'll say, the sister in law. I love
Speaker 6: when a supporting character gives it their all okay character,
Speaker 6: I gotta give it to her.
Speaker 2: The supporting characters made the film, Yeah, they definitely did
Speaker 2: make the film without them.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I do agree that the supporting characters made the film.
Speaker 7: There's something in my just like heart of hearts, militant
Speaker 7: black soul that goes two orphans having to like find
Speaker 7: love through the devices of white people feel so spiritually wrong.
Speaker 7: It's like, is there a commentary about breaking generational curses?
Speaker 7: I don't know it just I didn't like that part
Speaker 7: of it, but I liked the feelm.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna say, like that is the part
Speaker 1: that I think I appreciated probably the most, was like
Speaker 1: the grief conversations, and I feel like I would have
Speaker 1: liked to see more of that.
Speaker 3: To your point, at least right like, it feels like
Speaker 3: that was probably.
Speaker 1: A large part of the foundation of what made them
Speaker 1: so attractive to each other. But I don't feel like
Speaker 1: we got a ton of that, Not that we needed
Speaker 1: half the film, but I would have liked to see
Speaker 1: more of that. And I thought it was an interesting
Speaker 1: commentary on different responses to grief. Right he kind of
Speaker 1: threw himself into work and like went all in there,
Speaker 1: and like she ran away from it because it felt
Speaker 1: too painful, which I think is true to life. So
Speaker 1: I could have stanned to see a little bit more
Speaker 1: of how they connected around their grief if we wanted to.
Speaker 6: Talk about like connective tissue between this is I'm about
Speaker 6: to reach right now, connective tissue between the drama and you,
Speaker 6: me and Tuscany. I think it's in the field of
Speaker 6: black female representation, like underrepresentation of a black woman in
Speaker 6: an area, And for this movie, I think it's the
Speaker 6: underrepresentation of the black female hobosexual, because for the first
Speaker 6: thirty minutes, I was like, Oh, this is a hobosexual.
Speaker 6: She's just finding the next man, the next person whose
Speaker 6: hotel room she can stay in. She's flying across the
Speaker 6: world to stay in a house that she knows she
Speaker 6: had no business being in, And I was just like,
Speaker 6: you know, you don't see black women on screen doing this.
Speaker 5: Type of foolishes is that often? So I mean I
Speaker 5: appreciated the difference in there in.
Speaker 7: That I mean, I think to your point. And then
Speaker 7: it's like the connectedition for me was that and why
Speaker 7: I think both kind of are subversive Walm comms. We
Speaker 7: don't get to see black women on screen not have
Speaker 7: it together. Like usually when you see a black woman
Speaker 7: in a Walm calm, she is uber six and if
Speaker 7: she's not uper successful, she's a matriarch. And if she's
Speaker 7: not a matriarch. She's something that's like respectable and dignified,
Speaker 7: and it's almost like, well, why doesn't she have love?
Speaker 7: And then the whole plot of the movie has to
Speaker 7: humble this almost perfect person in order to justify them
Speaker 7: having like love. And I thought that it was great
Speaker 7: that in both of these films that they're like dealing
Speaker 7: with something and don't really have their shit together and
Speaker 7: they get to find love anyway.
Speaker 1: Which I think brings me to my next question is
Speaker 1: there has been so much conversation around this film needing
Speaker 1: to be successful for other people's films to be made,
Speaker 1: and like, do you think that there is room for
Speaker 1: there to be just these mediocre black women rom coms
Speaker 1: are led by a black women cas or does it
Speaker 1: always need to strive for like black excellence, Like where
Speaker 1: are we in the stage of what our films can
Speaker 1: look like at this point?
Speaker 6: I think there fully needs to be a room for
Speaker 6: like black mediocrity, And like I don't think the phrase
Speaker 6: black mediocrity is doraga because as long as we have multiples,
Speaker 6: like there's going to be a spectrum and.
Speaker 5: There is white mediocrity north, south, east and west, and so.
Speaker 6: It's just like it's only it's really only natural, like
Speaker 6: everyone's not going to hit the mark for everyone, and
Speaker 6: I think it's realistic to be like, Okay, this is
Speaker 6: just a regular black movie and some regular movie where
Speaker 6: black people are by black people, and sometimes you just
Speaker 6: want like the regular version, like and not everything needs
Speaker 6: to be high art, like it's like an entertaining little
Speaker 6: girl's night fun movie, and sometimes I think that's all
Speaker 6: things need to be.
Speaker 4: I'm gonna have to agree.
Speaker 2: I also think what I appreciate about the film, like
Speaker 2: obviously like race was a factor, but something I haven't.
Speaker 4: Loved is let's tie in.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be shading a movie, but like, let's tie
Speaker 2: in the story about gentrification with black love, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: this feels really heavy, Like is.
Speaker 3: The gentrification angle?
Speaker 4: No, I'm saying, what's this? We love Brooklyn that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I got it.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 2: I didn't like that movie. It just felt too heavy
Speaker 2: handed with some of the themes. And I do think
Speaker 2: that is what puts pressure on black films to be
Speaker 2: like excellent, because yes, it is a movie about romance
Speaker 2: in love, but it's also a vehicle to do this
Speaker 2: other type of storytelling that is about like social issues,
Speaker 2: and I think that's where people start to expect a
Speaker 2: lot of it.
Speaker 4: And it's not a bad thing and it can be
Speaker 4: done really well.
Speaker 2: But I think we've had so much of that type
Speaker 2: of film that something like this were like, wasn't that good.
Speaker 4: I'm like, guys, it's for shits and giggles, Like we literally.
Speaker 3: Something.
Speaker 1: What is the expectation of a rom com other than
Speaker 1: like I leave feeling good right like that?
Speaker 2: That?
Speaker 3: Yeah, like that is the expectation.
Speaker 2: It's unfortunate though, because I feel like the expectation beyond
Speaker 2: us is like it needs to make back the money
Speaker 2: and more. Yeah, And it's just kind of like even
Speaker 2: looking at like some of the top like black TV
Speaker 2: shows and films, it's going to target a particular audience.
Speaker 2: It's going to overserve them, but it might not serve
Speaker 2: the other audiences. And then from there they're not making
Speaker 2: the money and now it's like not a success, which
Speaker 2: is unfortunate and like not fair because to Enda's point,
Speaker 2: there is white mediocrity everywhere, especially in the TV and
Speaker 2: film industry. So it's interesting how we're like held to
Speaker 2: this different standard.
Speaker 4: But we knew this.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I thought about the movie when I was thinking
Speaker 6: about this and like black mediocrity whatever I thought about
Speaker 6: that movie speaking of Sidney Sweeney with Sidney Sweeney and
Speaker 6: Glenn what's his name?
Speaker 4: Any anyone but you?
Speaker 6: Any Yes, yes, anyone but you and I mediocre, mediocre, mediocre.
Speaker 5: And but You're like oe, yeah, literally the same.
Speaker 6: And I'm like, Okay, this movie is silly. But I
Speaker 6: think that movie made a lot of money, Like people
Speaker 6: loved that movie. So it's like a cheeky little movie.
Speaker 6: And so yeah, I agree. I think like we just
Speaker 6: deserve the same room to just do a cheeky little movie.
Speaker 5: There's no message. It's not that deep because it's like
Speaker 5: everything cannot be that deep. It's exhausting. Yeah, and I wonder.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure this is the case, but I
Speaker 1: haven't seen anything to like echo this is when like
Speaker 1: white audiences see Halle and re je do they automatically
Speaker 1: assume this is not for me, right, like that this
Speaker 1: is a black rom com as opposed to like, oh,
Speaker 1: this is just a rom com with like attractive people,
Speaker 1: which is what rom coms typically are, right. And so
Speaker 1: I think that is already like a large part of
Speaker 1: the audience that we are not going to get right,
Speaker 1: like the dollars are not going to come from them,
Speaker 1: which then puts all this pressure I think on the
Speaker 1: black community, like, oh, we got to go make sure
Speaker 1: that this film is successful because we want to continue
Speaker 1: to see these projects being made.
Speaker 3: So we talked briefly a.
Speaker 1: Little earlier about Love Jones, and so I want to
Speaker 1: wrap up now that this has to be anybody to answer.
Speaker 1: But when you think about like your foundational rom coms
Speaker 1: and like this genre for you, what film has.
Speaker 3: To be on this list for you?
Speaker 4: Obviously Love Jones. It's so good.
Speaker 2: I feel like that movie like very messy relationship, but
Speaker 2: the tone insensibilities and like, oh men, who read that
Speaker 2: was like my ners, So definitely also like throwing it
Speaker 2: way back. Pretty Woman like again a movie that the
Speaker 2: premise is very questionable, like she is a hooker, but
Speaker 2: it is able to like explore way further than that
Speaker 2: and has like really good social commentary without being very
Speaker 2: heavy handed and is hilarious.
Speaker 6: And then like without Pretty Women, you don't have like
Speaker 6: the Princess Diaries. If you've seen the movie, there's like
Speaker 6: characters in like multiple characters in Pretty Women are in
Speaker 6: the Prince's Diaries and they kind.
Speaker 4: Of play off each other.
Speaker 2: So those are really great and I have one more,
Speaker 2: but someone else go.
Speaker 5: I think in terms of black rom coms.
Speaker 6: I'm a big fan of The Last Holiday with Queen Latifa.
Speaker 5: I think love that movie.
Speaker 6: Speaking of Halle, Halle plays Halle and Chloe play like
Speaker 6: her nieces or something.
Speaker 5: There's like a quick cut o there in that movie.
Speaker 5: Fun fact. But yes, I'm a big fan of The
Speaker 5: Last Holiday.
Speaker 6: And honestly, when I was watching this movie, it reminded
Speaker 6: me of The Last Holiday because she goes across the world.
Speaker 6: She's just chilling and then she ends up meeting a
Speaker 6: guy and the blah blah, they fall in love. So
Speaker 6: I also this may be more controversial because I know
Speaker 6: people really hated this movie when it came out. I
Speaker 6: one of my comfort black rom com or yeah kind
Speaker 6: of is the photograph not It's like.
Speaker 5: I know, I know, I know, I know.
Speaker 3: I love the photography. I know I thought it was in.
Speaker 8: The theater, y'all I turn up when I'm like, I
Speaker 8: will turn on that movie.
Speaker 5: I also love the score Robert Glasper, but no fantastic.
Speaker 6: The score is great, but I really do enjoy the
Speaker 6: photograph and all of its flaws. I just take it
Speaker 6: as it is if we're just speaking rom coms in general.
Speaker 6: Five Hundred Days of Summer with Zoe Dachel and Joseph
Speaker 6: or and Levitt. Loved that movie also when Harry met
Speaker 6: Sally because I love our friends to lovers, like plotline.
Speaker 4: Huge, so you know those Circreduce also loved Jones.
Speaker 2: On my end, I feel like growing up, obviously I've
Speaker 2: changed and developed and we've grown. I would have told
Speaker 2: you it was loving Basketball when I was growing up,
Speaker 2: because I feel like everyone in that film is not good.
Speaker 4: Right, No, it's not great, and I'm feel like growing up,
Speaker 4: it's like, oh my gosh, so cute. And now I
Speaker 4: was an.
Speaker 2: Adult, I'm like, oh this is poor by Night but
Speaker 2: maybe also controversial. But one of my favorite rom coms
Speaker 2: is too Can Play That Game. I actually wrote the movie.
Speaker 4: I love that movie.
Speaker 2: I also want to shout out about Last Night and Jumping.
Speaker 4: Oh that like Stretch of Black Coms.
Speaker 2: Yeah, even what's the film with like Kevin Hard and
Speaker 2: TROGI Phmson.
Speaker 4: Like, say what you want? That is a good movie.
Speaker 5: Heavy Lifting first, I need the second one.
Speaker 6: My mom was like, you need to read Steve Harvey's
Speaker 6: act like a lady and even like at a young age,
Speaker 6: I was like, Okay, I'm not reading that, and I
Speaker 6: just something in me was just like I'm not reading
Speaker 6: that book. I never read it, but she was, She's like,
Speaker 6: you really need to read that book.
Speaker 5: I'm like, I'm not reading that.
Speaker 6: But what's also so interesting is like the movie is
Speaker 6: a promotion of the book, but it's also like telling you, like,
Speaker 6: the book does not work bs.
Speaker 1: Literal bs several arguments against them literally, I think for me,
Speaker 1: in addition to Love Jones being on the list, the
Speaker 1: Best Man is also on that list. Yeah, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of mess there, but it feels like it comes
Speaker 1: together in the end. And then like the whole trio
Speaker 1: of films, right, I think make for just great roalm,
Speaker 1: calm energy.
Speaker 5: So that was my answer is The Wood.
Speaker 6: The Wood is a rom com, right, It's the was
Speaker 6: more like Brotherhood.
Speaker 1: I don't remember what happened in the Wood. I remember
Speaker 1: them playing basketball in the park, but I don't mean
Speaker 1: I want to say.
Speaker 4: Like friendship is romantic, we can follow.
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's like twinkles of romance in there,
Speaker 6: of course, but yeah, yeah, well lots of fun with
Speaker 6: this conversation.
Speaker 1: As always, thank y'all so much for joining me again.
Speaker 1: Please share with us where people can find you on
Speaker 1: social We'll start with you, Bria, So.
Speaker 4: I am as the Fabria everywhere.
Speaker 2: I also have a pop culture page where I'm going
Speaker 2: to more this aid what Bria said too perfect.
Speaker 3: Elise, I am.
Speaker 4: On Instagram and TikTok.
Speaker 5: It's my first and last name, Elise, Elis and Indie.
Speaker 6: I'm on Instagram at day Las soul in the E
Speaker 6: y E l as you well, and I'm also on TikTok.
Speaker 6: It's just in day with a lot of It might
Speaker 6: be five, it might be six. Try and find me.
Speaker 1: Just look for the link. Well, thank y'all so much
Speaker 1: for joining me again.
Speaker 4: Thank you, I thank you.
Speaker 1: I always love when I get to chat with the producers.
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed our conversation to learn more about
Speaker 1: their work and to weigh in on your thoughts about
Speaker 1: the drama and you, me and Tuscany. Be sure to
Speaker 1: visit the show notes at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com,
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Speaker 1: our therapist directory at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com slash directory.
Speaker 1: This episode was produced by Elise Ellis, Indietubu and Tyree Rush.
Speaker 1: Editing was done by Dennis and Bradford. Thank y'all so
Speaker 1: much for joining me again this week. I look forward
Speaker 1: to continuing this conversation with you all real soon.
Speaker 5: Take it care