1 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:04,640 Speaker 1: Rube. 2 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:11,879 Speaker 2: I tried the Starbucks protein thing. You know, that was new, 3 00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 2: so I'm like, give it to me. 4 00:00:14,040 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 3: It is corporate profit over health, and I mean it's 5 00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:16,919 Speaker 3: a game. 6 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:20,640 Speaker 4: I hate the high protein trend. Everyone's trying to incorporate 7 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 4: protein into something. 8 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 5: The trend is about just we're talking about protein maxing, 9 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 5: so increasing your protein intake quite substantially. 10 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: If you spent any time online lately, you've probably come 11 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:37,240 Speaker 1: across videos pushing high protein diets. This trend, called protein maxing, 12 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:39,879 Speaker 1: really took off in twenty twenty with the rise of TikTok, 13 00:00:39,920 --> 00:00:43,560 Speaker 1: and it has not slowed down since. Now it's everywhere. 14 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 1: You'll see added protein in the pasta aisle, on the 15 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:50,479 Speaker 1: iced coffee menu, it's your local Starbucks, even in bottled water. 16 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,279 Speaker 1: And with it comes some pretty bold claims bigger muscles 17 00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:58,120 Speaker 1: and smaller wastes. Like most social media trends, protein maxing 18 00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: also comes with an army of influencers, each with their 19 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 1: own strong opinions about it. 20 00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 3: Protein was the one thing that when focused on I 21 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 3: saw results in the gym. I saw my body improve, 22 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 3: I saw myself lose weight more easily, and I felt 23 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:13,160 Speaker 3: better all the time. My skin looked better. Almost every 24 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:15,199 Speaker 3: other part of my life improved when I focused on it. 25 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 5: And doctors have some things to say so, although it's 26 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:22,200 Speaker 5: been a craze on social media, it may not be 27 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 5: as safe or effective as it's being purported to be. 28 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:28,800 Speaker 1: In this episode, the first of the Health Versus Hype 29 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: series with the American Medical Association, Welcome by the way, 30 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: we'll uncover the truth about protein maxing and answer the 31 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: questions we're all curious about. Do we really need more 32 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 1: protein in our diets, how much is too much? And 33 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,760 Speaker 1: what does the science actually say about protein maxing. We 34 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:48,200 Speaker 1: invited a social media influencer to fill us in on 35 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:50,840 Speaker 1: why the high protein diet is trending. We talked to 36 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:53,600 Speaker 1: a physician scientist to get all the health facts and 37 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 1: to round things out, we'll hear from some folks who 38 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: follow the trend. 39 00:01:56,800 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 4: Online social media. Just scrolling and I started seeing health 40 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 4: influencers posting healthy recipes and better ways to get your 41 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:04,640 Speaker 4: steps in every day. 42 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:08,520 Speaker 2: There's not so much that like a health influencer is 43 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:10,840 Speaker 2: going to be able to teach me, but they have 44 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:12,399 Speaker 2: great simple ideas. 45 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 1: I'm your host, Trace Dimingez. Join me as we find 46 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 1: out whether protein maxing is all health or just hype. 47 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 1: To understand why this trend resonates with so many people, 48 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:39,280 Speaker 1: I spoke with Joseph Abel, a social media creator with 49 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:43,119 Speaker 1: over four million followers who focuses on high protein recipes. 50 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: Here he is talking about how he found his way 51 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: to the high protein diet. 52 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:49,679 Speaker 3: I think nutrition is really complex. There's a reason why 53 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 3: people study it for years and years and years and 54 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 3: get degrees in it and everything. And for me, the 55 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 3: complexity felt very intimidating because I knew I needed to 56 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:58,240 Speaker 3: eat healthy, whatever that means, and so I think I 57 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:00,079 Speaker 3: was looking for some kind of through line where it's like, 58 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 3: what is it just eating veggies? Like is it just 59 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 3: like people say to avoid red meat? Like what's the truth? 60 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 3: Like what is the single through line that I can 61 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 3: focus on? And protein felt like it was that through line. 62 00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 3: It's obviously not everything. There's fiber, there's micronutrients, there's so 63 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 3: many other things to consider, but you know, Western diets 64 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 3: aren't really struggling for carbs and bats. The things that 65 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:22,200 Speaker 3: are tricky to get into the diet are proteins. And 66 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:26,760 Speaker 3: in realizing that, as well as realizing the crucialness of protein, 67 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 3: for muscle building and body composition goals, all things that 68 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:32,920 Speaker 3: I was really interested in, as well as satiation. Focusing 69 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:36,120 Speaker 3: on protein felt like a very simple, enough and a 70 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 3: very good approximation of what would build a healthy diet. 71 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 3: And so I realized, if I center my diet around 72 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 3: protein and focus on that, not only am I going 73 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 3: to build muscle more easily, I'm going to be more satiated. 74 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 3: A lot of sources of protein, like red meat, have 75 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 3: really good micronutrient profiles, so I'm checking those boxes as well, 76 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 3: and so rather than just going through and meticulously analyzing 77 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:57,760 Speaker 3: every aspect of nutrition, it was an easy thing to 78 00:03:57,800 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 3: focus on that would cover a lot of my bases 79 00:03:59,600 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 3: at once. 80 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 1: Do you have a different perspective on the high protein diet, 81 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: would you say than other influencers in the space. 82 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 3: I'd say, yeah. I mean so. I blew up on 83 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 3: social media a couple of times, but one of the 84 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 3: biggest blow ups I had was in March or twenty 85 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:17,360 Speaker 3: twenty four when I made a recipe series called easy Gains, 86 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 3: and it did about one hundred million views in a month. 87 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:21,359 Speaker 3: It was really eye opening for me and that the 88 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 3: entire point of that series was to teach people the 89 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:26,839 Speaker 3: high protein, low effort diet like that was the jingle 90 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 3: and it resonated with tons of people. I think that 91 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:33,599 Speaker 3: protein is a feature of many other food creators, nutritional 92 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 3: plans and diets. For me, it is a absolute requirement. 93 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 3: It is the kind of foundation of everything I'm trying 94 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:43,040 Speaker 3: to teach, because if you can just focus on having 95 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:46,080 Speaker 3: a protein set or diet, you clear out so many 96 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:48,920 Speaker 3: other problems. That is the number one thing to fix 97 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:50,279 Speaker 3: some people's diets if they're doing that. 98 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:54,680 Speaker 1: Interesting, So did you try any other diets before this 99 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: or were you kind of like I'll just try different 100 00:04:57,400 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: things and see what works for me, or you know, 101 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,840 Speaker 1: how how did you find your way specifically to then 102 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 1: high protein? Totally? 103 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:06,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, so there were there are a number of things 104 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:09,520 Speaker 3: I tried. I tried low carb, I tried low fat. 105 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 3: I had friends that were doing keto. Everything I tried 106 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 3: left me either bloated, exhausted, or otherwise just like disappointed 107 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 3: and unfulfilled. And I'm like, if this is health, this 108 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 3: is awful, Like this cannot be what flourishing feels like. 109 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 3: You know, going low carb left me very exhausted and 110 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:30,599 Speaker 3: drained naturally because carbs are a huge source of energy 111 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 3: production for the body. Going low fat felt very unsatisfying, 112 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 3: and I was always hungry and never felt satiated. But 113 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:40,320 Speaker 3: protein was the one thing that when focused on I 114 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 3: saw results in the gym. I saw my body improve, 115 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 3: I saw myself lose weight more easily, and I felt 116 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 3: better all the time. My skin looked better. Almost every 117 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:49,320 Speaker 3: other part of my life improved when I focused on it. 118 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:52,480 Speaker 1: Are there downsides to the high protein diet? 119 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, so there can be if you're and this is 120 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 3: what I feel like. The tricky part is protein is 121 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:03,000 Speaker 3: a little monolithic's we know it's in chicken, we know 122 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:05,160 Speaker 3: it's in stake, and so for a lot of people 123 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 3: their diet will fall down a very repetitive and uninteresting 124 00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 3: line because it takes a lot of creativity to get 125 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:12,360 Speaker 3: protein out of certain foods. 126 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:16,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, you have you nearly four million followers who are 127 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:21,039 Speaker 1: learning more about their diets from you and your experiments 128 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:23,720 Speaker 1: with yourself. And so why do you think that that 129 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: resonates with so many people if say, they may not 130 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 1: share your story or background your path. 131 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 3: I mean, my job has me basically health maxing for 132 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 3: a lot of my day, Like that's a huge privilege, right, 133 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 3: It's important for me to be honest, like when I'm 134 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:38,800 Speaker 3: not doing well, where I'm struggling with stuff or I'm 135 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 3: having difficulties, conveying the humanity of that is also just 136 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 3: a way to bridge more of a connection between me 137 00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 3: and the audience, as well as just making sure that 138 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:47,600 Speaker 3: I have my facts right, Like all of the recipes 139 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 3: that I make are vigorously macroproof to make sure that 140 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 3: our numbers are accurate. We run them through USDA food 141 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:55,599 Speaker 3: calculators and stuff. So there is a high degree of responsibility, 142 00:06:55,600 --> 00:06:57,719 Speaker 3: and I wish more creators would be really sensitive to 143 00:06:57,720 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 3: that because I think it would help kind of raise 144 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 3: the bar the way that we communicate with people. 145 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: That actually brings me to a question I was going 146 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:06,600 Speaker 1: to ask, like, do you feel responsibility toward the well 147 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 1: being of the people who are watching your videos? And 148 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:10,440 Speaker 1: what does that look like? 149 00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 3: Absolutely? Yeah, I mean I think so noos creators will 150 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 3: sort of oscillate between the stance of like, oh, I'm 151 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,240 Speaker 3: just a person doing my own thing. I'm not you know, 152 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 3: I'm not attached to the consequences of the things I 153 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 3: say or share. And I find that troubling, right, because 154 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:29,840 Speaker 3: like the truth is is that there are a ton 155 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 3: of people that I'm you know, impressionable upon as I 156 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 3: get DMS every day from people who say, hey, You've 157 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 3: changed my life, like You're the most influential person in 158 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 3: my life and I've never met them, and that's a 159 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:41,240 Speaker 3: huge amount of responsibility. 160 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: Scott Chambers is one of those people. He turned to 161 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:48,880 Speaker 1: social media for inspiration after making the decision to get 162 00:07:48,880 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 1: his health on track. He since adopted a fitness routine 163 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: and a more nutritional diet, and as a result, lost 164 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 1: over one hundred pounds. 165 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 4: Being a millennial, I love social media. I am always 166 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 4: to talk to Instagram, to Facebook. I found Joseph thanks 167 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 4: to the algorithm. One day I was just scrolling through 168 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 4: and he had shared a recipe a high protein thing. Now, 169 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 4: I am not exclusively on a high protein diet by 170 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 4: any stretch of the imagination, but I incorporate a lot 171 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,240 Speaker 4: of his recipes and his guides in helping me reach 172 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 4: my protein goals. 173 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 1: Shaida Urbani also follows Joseph on Instagram, and like Scott, 174 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: she uses social media more for inspiration than information. 175 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:31,960 Speaker 2: There's a debate around protein right and nutrition is so 176 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 2: fraught with like angry people huh, and very opinionated people. 177 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:41,680 Speaker 2: So I really had to look at the whole debate, 178 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 2: like what is generally agreed upon in science, what's mostly debated, 179 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:49,200 Speaker 2: and then make some decisions for myself. 180 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: I think at this point it would be helpful to 181 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:55,440 Speaker 1: talk about what protein is and why we even need 182 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: it in our diets in the first place. For that, 183 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 1: I asked doctor Thomas Holland, physician scientists from Rush University 184 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 1: Medical Center to help us out. 185 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 5: We generally think of protein and foods as being predominantly meat, 186 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:12,000 Speaker 5: so we're talking, you know, things across red meat lean 187 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 5: proteins like chicken, turkey, fish, but there's also going to 188 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 5: be proteins in vegetables in particular nuts and beans like legumes, 189 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 5: things like that. So if we're consuming lean proteins, then 190 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 5: we're getting really solid protein that's going to be nutritious. 191 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 1: So we're seeing kind of a rise in the high 192 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 1: protein diet, high protein products, you know, protein, water, protein lattes, protein, cereal. 193 00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:45,480 Speaker 1: We're just putting protein into everything. What do you think 194 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:47,959 Speaker 1: is behind that? What's really going on there? 195 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:51,720 Speaker 5: There's an idea that if you're in taking protein that 196 00:09:51,840 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 5: is somehow going to lead to potentially better health or 197 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:03,680 Speaker 5: you know, more muscle gain. When you're addressing different fads 198 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 5: or trends or whatever it may be, focusing on one 199 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:10,319 Speaker 5: singular food or food group is not going to be 200 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,800 Speaker 5: as beneficial as focusing on the whole dietary pattern. 201 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 1: Doctor Holland, how do you approach conversations with patients who 202 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 1: are like high protein? That's for me? 203 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 5: So I typically ask what are motivations? That's how I 204 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:31,680 Speaker 5: start these conversations. What's your motivation? Why are you leaning 205 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:36,200 Speaker 5: towards a high protein diet? Is it for muscle gain? Okay? 206 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 5: So if we're thinking about muscle gain, then it leads 207 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 5: to a natural discussion on well, if you intake proteins 208 00:10:44,400 --> 00:10:46,440 Speaker 5: in lieu of carves, how are you going to have 209 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 5: energy to maintain your physical activity? Certainly the protein can 210 00:10:52,880 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 5: be broken down and we can produce glucose then thereafter. 211 00:10:57,280 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 5: But if you're needing quick energy, how are you going 212 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 5: to achieve that on a immensely high protein diet if 213 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:10,400 Speaker 5: it's in lieu of carbs. If the motivation is just 214 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 5: from a health perspective, again, motivation what aspect of health? 215 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 5: So I'm leaning towards high protein because I don't want 216 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 5: to intake fats because I want to try to lose weight. Well, 217 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:27,320 Speaker 5: we can lean towards balancing our protein and getting good 218 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:30,200 Speaker 5: nutritious fats that are not going to be, you know, 219 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:33,199 Speaker 5: detrimental to your health. It does need to come down 220 00:11:33,280 --> 00:11:38,000 Speaker 5: to precision and the individual. How is this individual interacting 221 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:41,320 Speaker 5: with their food, because it's going to be difficult to 222 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:45,440 Speaker 5: say that a six foot two hundred and thirty pound 223 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 5: male should intake the same calorie content as a five 224 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:55,560 Speaker 5: foot one, one hundred and twenty pound female. Right, there's 225 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:58,880 Speaker 5: still that component of calories in calories out. So a 226 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:01,079 Speaker 5: lot of times when my cover stations start, we talk 227 00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 5: about the quality of the food and how they're in 228 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 5: taking those foods. And then if there is a high 229 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:12,679 Speaker 5: caloric intake, how are we reducing the calories? So what 230 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 5: type of physical activity are you doing to reduce those calories? 231 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:19,439 Speaker 5: So you know, it is a nuanced conversation. 232 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna play some clips from my conversation with Joseph 233 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 1: and I'd love for you to react to them. 234 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 3: You know, there's there's the whole carnivore movement, you know, 235 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 3: where people will just only eat meat and nothing else. 236 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:35,199 Speaker 3: And that's that to me is always raised a red 237 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 3: flag when people across any sort of diet spectrum are like, 238 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,600 Speaker 3: never eat anything but this one thing. It's always like, huh, 239 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:44,680 Speaker 3: really is that? 240 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:45,040 Speaker 1: It? 241 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,200 Speaker 3: Like, is the human body so simple that it needs 242 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,000 Speaker 3: one food and that's that's all we need? Like, you know, 243 00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:51,319 Speaker 3: and then you have the whole like, well, what it's 244 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:54,480 Speaker 3: all our ancestors eight our ancestors also drank dirty water 245 00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:57,640 Speaker 3: with that, you know that aside, Yeah, there's totally a 246 00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:59,439 Speaker 3: way to go too far in this and go overboard. 247 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:02,679 Speaker 3: You get so many nutrients from eating vegetables. You feel 248 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,960 Speaker 3: significantly better after eating them, too, and it balances the 249 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:07,319 Speaker 3: rest of your diet. You know, you can eat a 250 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:08,880 Speaker 3: lot of meat, but you still have to have fiber. 251 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 3: You need to digest your food properly. 252 00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 1: You know. 253 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:14,079 Speaker 3: Fiber is also crucial for satiation. And I can't tell 254 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 3: you how many people will push for carnivore or push 255 00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 3: to just only eat meat. And the people that get 256 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 3: on that stay with a tight level of motivation for 257 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,679 Speaker 3: a little bit, but they're never full, they're never all 258 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 3: the way satiated, and then they end up falling off 259 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 3: the wagon and getting into something. 260 00:13:27,880 --> 00:13:31,360 Speaker 1: Else, doctor Holland, how do you feel about that clip 261 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 1: now that you've heard it? Yeah? Love it. 262 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 5: You know, I think that's a very important thing to 263 00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:44,200 Speaker 5: consider that what we're consuming now is drastically different. And 264 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 5: as we have evolved, we've evolved of being able to 265 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,080 Speaker 5: consume multiple types of food. And to the point on 266 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 5: a thousand years ago, you know, they didn't call it 267 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 5: hunter gatherer for no reason. There were hunters that were 268 00:13:56,679 --> 00:13:59,320 Speaker 5: getting protein and there were gatherers that were figuring out 269 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:02,680 Speaker 5: what berries and what root vegetables and things to consume. 270 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 5: So to the point on the nutrients, an aspect that 271 00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:10,160 Speaker 5: I always like to say is whenever you're having whole foods, 272 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,960 Speaker 5: you're going to get the highest diversity of the quantity 273 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 5: and quality of nutrients in that whole food diet. So, 274 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 5: you know, I think the point being made is spot on. 275 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 5: When we're thinking about fad diets, there has to be 276 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 5: a thoughtful nature to it because at some point this 277 00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 5: isn't going to be sustainable forever. 278 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, and so. 279 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 5: You have to think about how you cycle off of it. 280 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 5: What what are you going to do as you move 281 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:39,840 Speaker 5: from this diet into your lifestyle, and how are you 282 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 5: going to reintroduce those carbs or reintroduce those fats, and 283 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 5: so being cognizant of that is very important. 284 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:48,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, would you say that that's part I mean when 285 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:50,960 Speaker 1: we say balanced diet, well, you're usually about what you're 286 00:14:51,000 --> 00:14:54,040 Speaker 1: eating as much as what you're not eating. Would you 287 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: say this like kind of cycling off as part of 288 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 1: that balance, Yeah, I do. 289 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:02,240 Speaker 5: You know, it's a and that's with everything, right, if 290 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 5: somebody's doing a fasting diet or if they're doing various 291 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:12,160 Speaker 5: types of fad diets, whether or not it's a whole protein, 292 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 5: a keto, carnivore, various components around that, it's all about 293 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 5: how you're going to move through that and what your 294 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 5: goal is. If your goal is fast weight loss, and 295 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 5: then you're going to cycle into something thoughtfully, then you know, 296 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:35,120 Speaker 5: keto diet may be very beneficial. But it's all about 297 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:37,680 Speaker 5: the modification. We always like to talk about it as 298 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 5: a lifestyle modification. So what's going to be sustainable and 299 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 5: actually usable for the rest of your life as opposed 300 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:47,040 Speaker 5: to something that is here for a good time, not 301 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 5: a long time. 302 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 1: Got it? Like a lot of viral diet trends, Protein 303 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 1: maxing promises control and results, But in some cases that 304 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,200 Speaker 1: focus on optimization cant are to look a lot like 305 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:04,640 Speaker 1: disordered eating. With nine percent of the US population or 306 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: thirty million Americans suffering from an eating disorder in their lifetime, 307 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 1: this is where the conversation gets more complicated if there. 308 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 5: Is a lot of concern about how you're looking and 309 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:20,800 Speaker 5: that's why you're leaning towards these that can lead to 310 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:24,480 Speaker 5: disordered eating, and you know, at that point definitely need 311 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 5: bring in other health professionals to help address those concerns, 312 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 5: whether or not it's cognitive behavioral therapy, how you're introducing 313 00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 5: different foods. You know, when we talk about doing dietary modifications, 314 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 5: we always have registered dietitians on board for our trials, 315 00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 5: and so we have that nuance, we have that expertise 316 00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 5: about how things are going to be modified and what 317 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 5: it's going to do to individuals as they move along 318 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 5: this spectrum of modification. 319 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think particularly in men, you see sometimes this 320 00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: discussion around disordered eating doesn't come up as off and 321 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:04,160 Speaker 1: I wondered if there are concerns around it specifically in men. 322 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:09,240 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, I think there's always this knee drink 323 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:14,000 Speaker 5: reaction of men not suffering as much from a body 324 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 5: dysmorphic issue. But there is concern whenever I'm looking at 325 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 5: muscle and fitness and I see these guys that are 326 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:25,320 Speaker 5: just shredded, and I'm looking at their diets and trying 327 00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 5: to figure out, Okay, how am I going to consume 328 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 5: just oatmeal and egg whites for a couple of weeks 329 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,320 Speaker 5: to thin out? And I have to take a step 330 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:36,760 Speaker 5: back and say, Okay, what's realistic for me? What is 331 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,000 Speaker 5: my body type require? And how do I make sure 332 00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 5: that I'm being healthy for myself. Let's look at another 333 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,480 Speaker 5: clip about macro nutrients. 334 00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 3: I do think that in improving protein content in foods 335 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:52,359 Speaker 3: is a huge step up. When you think about what 336 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 3: three macro nutrients are in food. You have carbs, fats, 337 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,200 Speaker 3: and protein. No one's struggling to get carbs and fats. 338 00:17:57,200 --> 00:17:59,159 Speaker 3: You want more carbs, Eat more bread, you want more fats, 339 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 3: Put more butter in there, put more oil in there. 340 00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:04,520 Speaker 3: It's easy to do. Protein takes finesse to eat properly 341 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 3: and to get in your diet. So I think it's 342 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,240 Speaker 3: an improvement. The one thing I would encourage is and 343 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:11,640 Speaker 3: I don't want to let perfect be the enemy of good. 344 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:13,560 Speaker 3: So for people that have to rely on fast food 345 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 3: more and are able to choose from the high protein menu, 346 00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 3: good for them. But there is almost no substitution for 347 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:22,880 Speaker 3: meals that you cook yourself at home. 348 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 1: I see you nodding a lot during that one. Can 349 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:27,919 Speaker 1: you tell me a bit about what you're thinking. 350 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 5: The ultimate point that's being made is making your foods 351 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 5: at home is going to be the best. That's where 352 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:39,200 Speaker 5: you're going to have the opportunity to produce and consume 353 00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:42,439 Speaker 5: what you're needing. So it makes a whole lot of 354 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:46,280 Speaker 5: sense when we're thinking about proteins and as he says, 355 00:18:46,359 --> 00:18:49,959 Speaker 5: the finesse of the consumption, and again I come back 356 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:54,920 Speaker 5: to quality. You could intake proteins that are high process meats, 357 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 5: you can in tate proteins that are really high and fat, 358 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 5: or you can lean towards those protein that are going 359 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 5: to be a bit more lean that allow you to 360 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 5: intake the food and get the nutrients that you're wanting 361 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 5: without risking and taking the nutrients that are not going. 362 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: To be good for you. Yeah, and you know, forgive 363 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 1: my ignorance, I guess, but is it really true that 364 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: there is really just like those kind of three legs 365 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,399 Speaker 1: of the stool. You know, protein, carbs, and fat, and 366 00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:24,679 Speaker 1: that's and you can kind of dial them up and 367 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: down and that's pretty much it. 368 00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:29,879 Speaker 5: Yeah, for the macro nutrients that is, and that's where 369 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 5: you know, he said, if you want more carbs, you 370 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,679 Speaker 5: can eat a piece of bread. Well that's okay, but 371 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 5: what kind of bread are you in taking? Are you 372 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:41,160 Speaker 5: in taking whole grain? Are you taking in seed bread? 373 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 5: Or are you in taking refined grain white bread? So, 374 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,959 Speaker 5: although those are the three major macro nutrients, there is 375 00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:53,439 Speaker 5: going to be nuanced to the components underneath each of 376 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 5: those where you can have different quality variations of what 377 00:19:57,359 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 5: you're you're eating. So he said for fats, well you 378 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 5: get and take butter or a little bit more oil. 379 00:20:03,359 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 5: Well you can take in butter and get trans fat, 380 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 5: and that's going to lead towards potentially athersclerosis and athosclerosis 381 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:12,320 Speaker 5: is a blockage of the blood vessel. Or you can 382 00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 5: intake olive oil that's going to increase your HDL content 383 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:20,320 Speaker 5: and actually help clean your vessels. So again, depend upon 384 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,360 Speaker 5: your choice at fat is going to dictate that outcome. 385 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:27,840 Speaker 1: You just heard a bit about trans fats. So let's 386 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 1: take a second to explain why this matters, because when 387 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:33,320 Speaker 1: we think about fats, we often picture things like fries 388 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,679 Speaker 1: or cookies, and we've all heard that those can raise cholesterol. 389 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:38,879 Speaker 1: But it's a bit more complex than that. So your 390 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:42,959 Speaker 1: body actually needs cholesterol. It helps build cells and make hormones, 391 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:45,200 Speaker 1: but it has to travel through your blood to get 392 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 1: where it's needed, and that's where the two types come 393 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:52,520 Speaker 1: in LDL and HDL cholesterol. That's low density lipoprotein and 394 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:57,560 Speaker 1: high density lipoprotein. LDL delivers cholesterol where it's needed, but 395 00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:01,640 Speaker 1: too much, especially from foods high in transfats, can lead 396 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,040 Speaker 1: to a build up in your arteries. That's what can 397 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:08,640 Speaker 1: cause issues like athrosclerosis, which you heard doctor Holland mention. HDL. 398 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,840 Speaker 1: On the other hand, it helps carry excess cholesterol away 399 00:21:12,160 --> 00:21:14,199 Speaker 1: back to the liver so your body can get rid 400 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:17,800 Speaker 1: of it. So in the simplest terms, more HDL is good, 401 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:21,640 Speaker 1: too much LDL can be a problem. It's really about balance, 402 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,399 Speaker 1: and that's where our food choices come in. So in 403 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: the context of our three macros, a slice of whole 404 00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 1: grain bread with olive oil is a different choice than 405 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,480 Speaker 1: a white bread with butter, even though basically you've done 406 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:36,199 Speaker 1: the same thing on a macro level. You ate a 407 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:37,080 Speaker 1: carb and a fat. 408 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:42,880 Speaker 5: That's exactly the right way to put it. Your quantity 409 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:46,600 Speaker 5: of intake may not change, but your quality of intake 410 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:51,360 Speaker 5: certainly does. Macros are going to be a good judge 411 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 5: of general consumption, and that's going to be about forty 412 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,080 Speaker 5: to fifty percent carbs, twenty five to thirty five percent protein, 413 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:02,399 Speaker 5: and about twenty to thirty percent of fat. The reason 414 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,159 Speaker 5: we're so high on carbs is that's our energy. We 415 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 5: intake carbs, and that gets converted to what's called glycogen, 416 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:12,760 Speaker 5: and that glycogen gets used in our first twenty to 417 00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 5: thirty minutes of exercise. So carbs are going to be 418 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 5: predominating that diet as far as macros because that's what 419 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:25,919 Speaker 5: we're using for actual energy production. And then proteins and 420 00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 5: fats fill in thereafter. And another thing that he said 421 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 5: that I really do appreciate is, you know, it's not 422 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:34,960 Speaker 5: about perfection. And that's one thing to always keep in mind. 423 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 5: It's not about perfection. It's about consistency. It's not trying 424 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 5: to do everything, but trying to do something that's healthier 425 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:43,160 Speaker 5: every day. 426 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:47,840 Speaker 1: Okay, interesting, let's go on to clip number three. Talk 427 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 1: a little bit about this. 428 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:52,239 Speaker 3: It takes a lot of creativity to get protein out 429 00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:53,719 Speaker 3: of certain foods. If you want to get protein out 430 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:56,439 Speaker 3: of a cheesecake, and to be clear, there's always protein 431 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 3: and cheesecake and ice cream, there's just a lot more calories, 432 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:00,639 Speaker 3: fats and sugars too. So if you want to make 433 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 3: an intelligent recipe that's optimized for the right amount of 434 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 3: protein for the calories, which is usually in my book, 435 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 3: like a ten percent ratio between calories and protein is great. 436 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,360 Speaker 3: Like five hundred calories fifty grams of protein. That's nice, 437 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:16,920 Speaker 3: that's a good choice. The danger is your diet falls 438 00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:20,239 Speaker 3: into a repetitious and uninteresting place. And the problem with 439 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:22,640 Speaker 3: that is that it's not going to last. You have 440 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:25,000 Speaker 3: to love your diet if you're going to stick with it. 441 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 3: That is that is not a perk, It is a requirement. 442 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,679 Speaker 1: Doctor Holland, Is that an accurate target ten percent between 443 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 1: calories and protein? Would you say it can be? 444 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:41,600 Speaker 5: You know, the issues or limitations that we're going to 445 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:44,800 Speaker 5: run into with a ten percent target is that one, 446 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 5: it's not going to be individualized. If somebody is generally 447 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 5: hearing that and they think, oh, I'm going to target 448 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 5: a ten percent ratio, it could be a little too much. 449 00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:59,880 Speaker 5: The other side of that is that it's not going 450 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:04,560 Speaker 5: be necessarily for sedentary people. So if you're leaning into 451 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 5: this ten percent but you're not getting up and doing 452 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:10,880 Speaker 5: physical activity, you're not doing your aerobics, you're not doing 453 00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:14,679 Speaker 5: your resistance training, it can be a little high. 454 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:18,280 Speaker 1: With all the online noise and marketing of high protein products, 455 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,040 Speaker 1: it can be pretty hard to know just how much 456 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 1: protein is the right amount. So let's switch gears for 457 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:28,240 Speaker 1: a bit and talk about the numbers high protein diets. 458 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:33,639 Speaker 5: Generally, when we're thinking about protein intake, there's going to 459 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:37,960 Speaker 5: be different recommended values that we're in taking, and usually 460 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 5: that's about zero point eight grams per kilogram per day. 461 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 5: So if we take our weight in pounds and converted 462 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,399 Speaker 5: to kilograms and then multiply that by point eight, we 463 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:52,879 Speaker 5: should be getting about that amount of protein in our diet. 464 00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:56,959 Speaker 5: Now for these high protein diets, they're in taking you know, 465 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:01,440 Speaker 5: a bit higher at maybe about twice as much. So 466 00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:04,479 Speaker 5: we're talking around a scale of one point two to 467 00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:10,320 Speaker 5: two point zero grams per kilogram per day, and that's 468 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:15,880 Speaker 5: okay for individuals that are very active and they're doing 469 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:16,919 Speaker 5: resistance training. 470 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 1: Before we move on, let's break down the math on 471 00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:24,160 Speaker 1: protein maxing for a second, two point zero grams per 472 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 1: kilogram per day. That's about one gram of protein for 473 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:31,080 Speaker 1: every pound of body weight. It's a formula that you 474 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,119 Speaker 1: see promoted all across the internet. So if you weigh, 475 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,280 Speaker 1: say one hundred and fifty pounds, your high protein goal 476 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:40,560 Speaker 1: would be one hundred and fifty grams a day. For context, 477 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,440 Speaker 1: that's like twenty ounces of cooked meat or twenty four 478 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:48,760 Speaker 1: large hard boiled eggs or two dozen eggs. 479 00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 5: That's a big omelet for the run of the mill individual. 480 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,440 Speaker 5: It may be a little too much. If we're thinking 481 00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:59,160 Speaker 5: about just how we are going to be functioning with 482 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:00,280 Speaker 5: that protein. 483 00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:01,679 Speaker 1: Why would you say it's too much? 484 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:09,200 Speaker 5: So yeah, so our bodies can only utilize protein when 485 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:13,040 Speaker 5: it needs to be utilized. We work out, the muscles tear, 486 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:16,440 Speaker 5: we have protein, It allows that muscle to build back up. 487 00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:19,879 Speaker 5: And if we're intaking too much, what's eventually going to 488 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:24,639 Speaker 5: happen is that protein can be converted into storage forms, 489 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,400 Speaker 5: so we can actually convert it into glucose to use 490 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 5: for energy, and at that point it can also be 491 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:34,120 Speaker 5: converted into fat. So if you're intaking too much protein, 492 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:37,879 Speaker 5: it can lead to some weake in it may not 493 00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 5: be the weight gain that you're desiring. And then on 494 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,480 Speaker 5: the other side of that, if you're going to be 495 00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:45,399 Speaker 5: intaking a lot of protein, you want to make sure 496 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,320 Speaker 5: that your kidney function is good. So generally speaking, if 497 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 5: you're in taking too much protein and your kidneys are healthy, 498 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 5: that's going to be fine. But if there is a 499 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,880 Speaker 5: potential issue with your kidneys, it can lead to more 500 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:00,320 Speaker 5: damage to those kidneys. 501 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,760 Speaker 1: Let's quickly go through some of the most widely spread 502 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:08,160 Speaker 1: claims online about protein maxing. We'll start with a big one. 503 00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:12,639 Speaker 1: Does eating more protein automatically mean you'll build more muscle? 504 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,960 Speaker 5: No, it doesn't. If you want to increase muscle mass, 505 00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 5: you need to be doing resistance training along with the 506 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 5: protein intake. 507 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:24,080 Speaker 1: Got it. Does high protein mean faster weight loss? 508 00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:24,920 Speaker 3: Not? 509 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:30,119 Speaker 5: Necessarily Dependent upon the quality of your protein intake, it 510 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 5: may mean weight gain, So it's nuanced, but generally again quality. 511 00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:42,240 Speaker 1: Are higher protein diets best for everybody? No? 512 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:47,679 Speaker 5: No, this comes down to again precision medicine and or 513 00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 5: individualized dietary intake. 514 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 1: Yeah. Is there a group that it would benefit kind 515 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:57,399 Speaker 1: of across the board, you know, age or sex or 516 00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:58,160 Speaker 1: anything like that. 517 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 5: There has been some research that in older individuals a 518 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,640 Speaker 5: little bit more protein can be beneficial, especially as both 519 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:12,080 Speaker 5: male and female move into you know, hormonal changes and 520 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:17,200 Speaker 5: redistribution of fat and muscle, and so having a higher 521 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,480 Speaker 5: protein diet can be beneficial. 522 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,120 Speaker 1: Does animal protein cause cancer? 523 00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:30,119 Speaker 5: It can so dependent upon the preparation of it, especially 524 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 5: if there's smoked meats or overcooked meats, they can become carcinogenic. 525 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 5: So again nuance there with how you're preparing your meats. 526 00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:44,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, and then is plant protein not as good a 527 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,000 Speaker 1: protein as animal protein? 528 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,200 Speaker 5: Plant protein is just as good as animal protein. Again, 529 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,640 Speaker 5: being thoughtful about how you're intaking it, you can achieve 530 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 5: the same quantity of your protein intake. 531 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: Amazing you mentioned hormonal bound I thought that'd be interesting 532 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:02,960 Speaker 1: to touch a little bit more on. 533 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 5: So now the I guess the point that I was 534 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,520 Speaker 5: trying to get at both male and female. We usually 535 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 5: think of female perimenopause and moving into menopause as very 536 00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 5: female specific and there's a drop in estrogen increase in testosterone. Well, 537 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 5: the opposite is true for male, and we go through 538 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:31,640 Speaker 5: a similar hormonal change as we h where our testosterone 539 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 5: gets lower. That's the commercials all around about low T right, 540 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:39,920 Speaker 5: So our testosterone decreases and our estrogen increases. Now, when 541 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 5: it comes to hormones, proteins are going to be very 542 00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:50,680 Speaker 5: important because they are supporting our hormone regulation. So adequate 543 00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:53,239 Speaker 5: protein intake is going to help with stabilization of our 544 00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 5: blood sugar, it's going to help with reducing insulin spikes, 545 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:00,680 Speaker 5: and it's going to also help with you know, liver functionality. 546 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 1: Yeah. Would you say that Americans are consuming enough protein generally? 547 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:11,360 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, for the most part, you know, general individuals 548 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 5: that are walking around. From a dietary perspective, we're getting 549 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:19,640 Speaker 5: an appropriate amount of protein. Now, again that's from a 550 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:23,320 Speaker 5: quantity perspective. Quality side may not be as good if 551 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 5: we're talking about processed foods or high fat meat, But 552 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:32,520 Speaker 5: generally speaking, yeah, most individuals in America are getting a 553 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 5: good amount of protein. 554 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. There's an idea online that there's no such thing 555 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:38,480 Speaker 1: as too much protein. 556 00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:43,960 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, from an over consumption of protein, I 557 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:47,560 Speaker 5: think it depends on how you're getting it. What are 558 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 5: you in taking to get to that high protein I 559 00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 5: tell my students this all the time. Your body loves 560 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:57,760 Speaker 5: to be balanced, and it will work so so hard 561 00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 5: to maintain that balance until it can't. And that imbalance 562 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 5: at some point is because of something we're doing, whether 563 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,520 Speaker 5: or not we're we're doing enough physical activity, whether or 564 00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:12,160 Speaker 5: not we're in taking an appropriate diet. So at some 565 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 5: point in taking too much protein will have some downstream effect, 566 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 5: whether or not that is, you know, something with the kidneys, potentially, 567 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:28,120 Speaker 5: something with the liver, something with the vaculature. Something will 568 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 5: eventually happen. So, you know, just because something isn't happening 569 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 5: right now, does it mean something won't happen. 570 00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:39,320 Speaker 1: If someone's curious about a high protein diet and high 571 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 1: protein eating, what should they know? How can they approach 572 00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,400 Speaker 1: this safely if they're coming from you know, coming at 573 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:46,719 Speaker 1: it fresh. 574 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:50,080 Speaker 5: You know. I think the main thing to keep in 575 00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:54,440 Speaker 5: mind when you're thinking about opting toward a higher protein 576 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:59,000 Speaker 5: content is what the typical intake is. So if we're 577 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 5: talking about, like I said earlier, the point eight grams 578 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:07,240 Speaker 5: per kilogram per day, if you're going to increase that 579 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 5: first and foremost, do a slow increase. Our bodies love 580 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 5: to adjust to the change, so implementing one gram per kilogram, 581 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 5: then go to one and a half again. If you 582 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:28,680 Speaker 5: are increasing the protein intake, what's the motivation? Why are 583 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:30,560 Speaker 5: you doing this? Is it because you're trying to build 584 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 5: muscle and you're going to be doing resistance training than okay? 585 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 5: But if it's purely from a weight loss perspective, then 586 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:39,280 Speaker 5: there's better ways to do it. 587 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 1: And then when should someone seek medical advice? 588 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 5: So if you do have any type of organ issue, 589 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:54,800 Speaker 5: specifically kidneys, liver, heart, just speaking with your primary care 590 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:59,200 Speaker 5: doc and having that conversation, maybe sending your doc a 591 00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 5: letter on your my chart or whatever messaging system and saying, hey, 592 00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:05,680 Speaker 5: the next time I'm in, I want to talk about 593 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:08,400 Speaker 5: this and I want to make sure that I'm approaching 594 00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:13,160 Speaker 5: this appropriately. And perhaps they have the ability to refer 595 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:17,120 Speaker 5: you to a dietitian within the system that then is covered, 596 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 5: or you have the opportunity to see a dietitian on 597 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:25,800 Speaker 5: your own. You know, For me, it always comes back 598 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:30,400 Speaker 5: to understanding the motivations that an individual has and doing 599 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:32,680 Speaker 5: things safely and thoughtfully. 600 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:37,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, and then how could we learn to separate evidence 601 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 1: based guidance from hype other than maybe the person telling us, 602 00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:44,000 Speaker 1: you know, how can we figure it out from whomever 603 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 1: we're seeing it on social media? 604 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,760 Speaker 5: Yeah? My wife will come to me and say, hey, 605 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,640 Speaker 5: have you seen this on Instagram? And I'll say no, 606 00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,600 Speaker 5: and she'll say, well, research it and get back to me. 607 00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: What a resource, right, right? 608 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 5: So I will go and I will review whatever she 609 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:08,400 Speaker 5: sent me, and I'll come back to her with a 610 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:11,200 Speaker 5: one liner of yes, this is good, or no, this 611 00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,000 Speaker 5: isn't good, or maybe it needs a bit more research 612 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 5: to be had. But a lot of times, what are 613 00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:24,000 Speaker 5: these quick fifteen thirty second forty five second videos on Instagram? 614 00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:28,800 Speaker 5: Getting the main point of what the person is saying 615 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 5: and then throwing that into a Google search will generally 616 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:38,279 Speaker 5: tell you where it stands, just a very bird's eye 617 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:42,400 Speaker 5: view of things. So, you know, if it's information for 618 00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:44,799 Speaker 5: information's sake, I'm a bit more trustworthy, but I'm still 619 00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 5: going to research it. If you're trying to sell it 620 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:50,920 Speaker 5: to me, my level of trust is diminished and I'm still. 621 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,279 Speaker 1: Going to research it. Yeah that's a red flag for you. 622 00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 1: Then yeah, okay, well, doctor Holland, thank you for all 623 00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:59,440 Speaker 1: of this information so helpful. I appreciate it. 624 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,719 Speaker 5: I appreciate it and Thank you so much for the questions. 625 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:04,920 Speaker 5: I love getting the wheels turning. 626 00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,400 Speaker 1: On a scale of health to hype, I think it's 627 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:11,640 Speaker 1: safe to say protein maxing comes out somewhere in the 628 00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:14,920 Speaker 1: middle for starters. It's important to remember that the quality 629 00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,800 Speaker 1: of protein matters as much as the quantity. Adding more 630 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,680 Speaker 1: lean cooked chicken breast to your diet is a much 631 00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:25,479 Speaker 1: better choice than adding more bacon, for example. It's also 632 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:28,680 Speaker 1: helpful to understand your motives for increasing your protein and 633 00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:31,080 Speaker 1: to recognize that high protein diets are not a one 634 00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:34,239 Speaker 1: size fits all solution, which means you should have a 635 00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,520 Speaker 1: conversation with your physician before making any changes to your diet. 636 00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:39,920 Speaker 1: I mean, that's my takeaway. I'd be interested to hear 637 00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:42,239 Speaker 1: what you think. Let me know in the comments. And 638 00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:45,800 Speaker 1: thanks again to doctor Holland for helping us decode protein maxing, 639 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:48,839 Speaker 1: and thanks to Joseph Scott and Shada for sharing their 640 00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 1: experiences with us. We got to the bottom of this trend, 641 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:54,160 Speaker 1: but this is just the beginning. We have seven more 642 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 1: episodes lined up exploring some of the most confusing health 643 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,520 Speaker 1: prends out there. We'll share more storees, investigate more claims, 644 00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:06,960 Speaker 1: and separate health from Hype, so make sure to subscribe. 645 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:09,719 Speaker 1: In the next episode, we'll be exploring sleep trackers and 646 00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:12,399 Speaker 1: all the unique social media trends people are trying in 647 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:15,200 Speaker 1: pursuit of a good night's sleep. I don't know if 648 00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,360 Speaker 1: I want to try mouth taping, but kind I don't know. 649 00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:20,399 Speaker 1: We'll see, so I hope you'll join me. Until then, 650 00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:23,880 Speaker 1: visit AMA Health Versus Hype dot org for more information. 651 00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:29,360 Speaker 1: That's AMA Health vs. Hype dot Org. Thanks for listening. 652 00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:33,480 Speaker 1: Health Versus Hype is a production of Ruby's Studio from 653 00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:37,480 Speaker 1: iHeartMedia and the American Medical Association. I'm trace to Miminguez. 654 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:41,160 Speaker 1: Our producers are Matt Stillo and Pamela Lawrence. Michael Depoe 655 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,640 Speaker 1: Wilson is our writer. The show is engineered and features 656 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:47,560 Speaker 1: original music by Matthew Ernest Filler. Health Versus Hype is 657 00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,719 Speaker 1: intended for educational and informational purposes only and does not 658 00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:55,880 Speaker 1: constitute medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice 659 00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,760 Speaker 1: of your physician with any questions you may have regarding 660 00:36:58,800 --> 00:36:59,640 Speaker 1: a medical condition.