1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:05,000 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fitness Disrupted, a production of I Heart Radio. 2 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: I am Tom Holland, and this is Fitness Disrupted. The 3 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: cold hard truth about icing your injuries. That is the 4 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:23,279 Speaker 1: title of an article I was reading recently and a 5 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 1: lot of people had reached out to me about doing 6 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 1: a show on icing and cryotherapy. So here it is. 7 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,680 Speaker 1: This article phenomenal, the writer phenomenal. So she's gonna be 8 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:36,240 Speaker 1: my guest. Lindsay Barra is coming up, and we're gonna 9 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: talk all about icing and as it applies to two things, 10 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,440 Speaker 1: both injuries, icing after injury, because that's what we did, right. 11 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about that rice rest, ice compression elevation 12 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 1: that you're gonna be pretty amazed at what the doctor says, 13 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:51,840 Speaker 1: who actually came up with that. Okay, so we're gonna 14 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: talk about that end ice and cold therapy as it 15 00:00:55,800 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 1: applies to recovery from exercise, because the recovery market never 16 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 1: been bigger. Nine million ways to supposedly recover after your exercise, 17 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:09,960 Speaker 1: your workouts, and they all claim the same benefits. But 18 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:11,800 Speaker 1: what's the science behind it. We're gonna talk about that. 19 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:14,560 Speaker 1: So let me give you her bio. She is amazing, Uh, 20 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 1: Lindsay Barra is a freelance sports journalist based in Montclair, 21 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:22,279 Speaker 1: New Jersey. She contributes regularly to the sports business journal 22 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 1: Baseball America, ESPN, W Fast Company, Men's Health, New Jersey Monthly, 23 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 1: Bodybuilding dot Com, and other outlets at MLB dot com. 24 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 1: From January two thirteen through January two thousand eighteen, she 25 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:39,240 Speaker 1: established herself as an authority on baseball fitness and injuries 26 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:43,120 Speaker 1: and appeared frequently on the MLB Network to discuss her stories. 27 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 1: From two thousand twelve, she was a senior writer for 28 00:01:47,760 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 1: ESPN Magazine, covering primarily ice hockey, tennis, baseball, and the Olympics. 29 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 1: Lindsay received her undergraduate degree in journalism from the University 30 00:01:56,560 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 1: of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, where she played yes 31 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 1: varse the softball and Men's Club ice hockey. She is 32 00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: the oldest grandchild of Yogi and Carmen Barras soever her 33 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 1: last name sounded familiar, that's why she's the granddaughter of 34 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 1: the late Yogi Bearra, and she's a board member at 35 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:14,840 Speaker 1: the Yogi Barra Museum and Learning Center in Little Falls, 36 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,959 Speaker 1: New Jersey. She's amazing. I've read many of her articles 37 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 1: and she just she walks the walks, she's an athlete, 38 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:23,919 Speaker 1: she is super smart, and those are the only guests 39 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:25,959 Speaker 1: I bring on this show. So when we come back 40 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:29,119 Speaker 1: from the break, we're gonna talk all about ice. And 41 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 1: I think you're going to be pretty amazed at what 42 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: the current science tells us. So when we come back, 43 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:49,320 Speaker 1: Lindsay Bera and we are back, could not be more excited, because, 44 00:02:49,919 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: as I say all the time, I only bring you 45 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 1: the best guests. And I've been speaking with Lindsay and 46 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 1: she's amazing, And this is someone you want to talk 47 00:02:57,760 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 1: to you. She walks, the walks, she talks to talk. 48 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 1: She's an athlete. She played, as I said in her bio, 49 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 1: she played hockey, which I love. I'm a hockey guy myself. 50 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 1: But watching her clips, she knows sports. She knows injuries. 51 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 1: She knows what we're talking about. And we're gonna talking 52 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 1: about icing, We're gonna talk about cold therapy, and we're 53 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 1: gonna talk about it in two ways, right, Wendy. We're 54 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:18,200 Speaker 1: gonna talk about it when it comes to injury and recovery. Yes, 55 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: all right, And this is a this is a tough topic, Lindsay, right, 56 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 1: because people have been icing forever, right, and it's tough 57 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 1: to change. Absolutely. I was at ESPN magazine for so 58 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 1: long and then at MLB and you walk into locker 59 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 1: rooms and all you see is guys with giant, glacial 60 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: size ice packs seran wrapped two different parts of their body. 61 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 1: I'm thinking about Aaron Judge with the giant um ice 62 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 1: pack on his shoulder, Lebron James with with ice packs 63 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: on both knees and both feet in buckets of ice 64 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:54,440 Speaker 1: while he's doing his interviews. Or you've got Patrick Mahomes 65 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 1: was just in a Direct TV commercials sitting in an 66 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: ice bucket. MICHAELA. Schiffrin was in a Visa commercials sitting 67 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 1: in an ice bath. I mean it. They all still 68 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 1: think that this is great, and there is something to 69 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 1: be said if mentally you think it makes you feel better, 70 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 1: But the science is directly, you know, contradicting that feeling, 71 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:16,320 Speaker 1: you know. And I love that, and we'll talk about that, 72 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 1: because that's the thing. The messages always get mixed, right, 73 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:22,160 Speaker 1: and so does it make you feel better? Of course, right, 74 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:24,279 Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. 75 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 1: And as you say in your article, by the way, 76 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 1: and I love just the title cold Heart Truth about 77 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:31,240 Speaker 1: Ice and Your Injuries. That's what we're calling this podcast. 78 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 1: You know, just because it feels good doesn't mean it's right. 79 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:35,440 Speaker 1: And the science now, the most recent science, and by 80 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: the way, we'll talk about the guy who actually came 81 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 1: up with the rice acronym says he was wrong. Uh well, 82 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:43,280 Speaker 1: and also we're also talking about, like when we say 83 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: the most recent science, there's a study as far back 84 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:50,600 Speaker 1: as six that said when you when you apply ice 85 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 1: for a prolonged period of time, the primeability of lymphatic 86 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,279 Speaker 1: vessels increases, which causes a backflow of fluid into the 87 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 1: interstitial space and actually increases local swelling at the area 88 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:02,120 Speaker 1: of where you're putting ice, as opposed to decreasing it, 89 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 1: which is what you're trying to do. Right, So this 90 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 1: is okay, And so that's I mean, how many thirty 91 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 1: nine is a thirty four years ago, right, So it's 92 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:16,040 Speaker 1: not necessarily that we're talking about new science. There actually 93 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:21,080 Speaker 1: has not been a single peer reviewed, concrete, definitive study 94 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 1: that says that ice is good for you for anything 95 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 1: other than reduction of pain, right, And like if your 96 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 1: kid runs down the steps and smashes his base into 97 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: a doorknob, and he's screaming bloody murder, and you're gonna 98 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: put an ice pack on it because it's gonna make 99 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 1: him stop crying. Great, do it wonderful. He's not going 100 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 1: to keep it on there long enough to do any 101 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 1: damage anyway. He's gonna sit there for two minutes and 102 00:05:40,920 --> 00:05:43,599 Speaker 1: then go back to his legos. Right, So in that case, 103 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:46,200 Speaker 1: you use the ice, you know, if you're needing to 104 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:49,960 Speaker 1: stop an immediate pain response, right, But that's not what 105 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 1: we're talking about here. When we ice things after difficult 106 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 1: workouts or after surgeries and whatnot, you're generally not in 107 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:00,560 Speaker 1: this excruciating amount of pain that needs to be managed. 108 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: You're doing this for a different reason because you think 109 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 1: it's going to decrease inflammation and accelerate your healing process. 110 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 1: But the actual science says that it will actually, over 111 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 1: the course of time, increase is swelling and lengthen the 112 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:20,599 Speaker 1: healing process. So you need to have that inflammation. Every 113 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:23,840 Speaker 1: study that we have now that actually talks about inflammation. 114 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:26,040 Speaker 1: So when Dr Marken, and we'll get back to him, 115 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:30,600 Speaker 1: invented the rice protocol in the seventies, inflammation wasn't actually 116 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 1: even in the research at that point, they didn't know 117 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 1: what it was, right. So now we know that inflammation 118 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:38,719 Speaker 1: brings all the side of kinds and the I g 119 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,560 Speaker 1: F one and the things that we need to repair 120 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 1: our muscle tissue. And if you halt that inflammatory response, 121 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 1: you delay that repair and clean up crew from getting 122 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 1: into the injured area. And then once the tissue rewarms, 123 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,240 Speaker 1: the inflammatory response is going to resume anyway, So you're 124 00:06:56,320 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 1: just delaying your body's ability to fix what ails it right. 125 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 1: And your body, by the way, the most intelligently engineered 126 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,679 Speaker 1: thing we've ever seen. Just let it do its job. 127 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:10,120 Speaker 1: Like why are we all trying to you know, combat evolution. 128 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 1: You know, we figured it out and and we're and 129 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: we're trying to stop that. And I talked about that 130 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 1: all the time, lindsay that the body, as you just said, 131 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: and I used those very words, you know, really smart machine, 132 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 1: let it do its thing oftentimes. And this is a 133 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:25,920 Speaker 1: great example we we don't and the body and I 134 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 1: love in your article you even talked about like cavemen 135 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 1: didn't come home after like rolling their ankle and pack 136 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:33,880 Speaker 1: it in ice and stop moving. No, they chased after 137 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: their dinner if they wanted to eat yeah, and and 138 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 1: putting pressure that that's another study that I have in there. 139 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 1: I don't know the year, but like, there's a study 140 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:45,679 Speaker 1: that when you load damage tissue Journal of American Academy 141 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 1: of Orthopedic Surgeons, I've got your article loading damage tissue 142 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 1: accelerates the healing of bone and muscle tissue, while prolonged 143 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 1: periods of inactivity sitting on your butt on the couch 144 00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: promote aberrant tissue repair. So you don't want aborant tissue repair. 145 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:01,600 Speaker 1: You want to be able to use your tissue in 146 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 1: the way it was intended, right exactly? Was so rest 147 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: and ice not so much? And back to you were 148 00:08:08,280 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 1: talking about Dr Merkin Harvard, Uh, the Rice protocol. What 149 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 1: I love this too because people just love this. Where 150 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 1: did it originally come from? So what was the incident 151 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 1: that you talked about? So the incident that I talked 152 00:08:20,800 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 1: about in the story was in nineteen sixty two when 153 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:26,240 Speaker 1: a young kid named Everett Knowls jumped on a freight 154 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: train in Somerville, Massachusetts on his walk home from school 155 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: because he thought the freight train would you get him 156 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:33,320 Speaker 1: home a little bit more quickly, And he wasn't paying 157 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:38,120 Speaker 1: attention and he smashes his shoulder into a stone bridge structure, 158 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:41,600 Speaker 1: which this is horrific, and it severed his arm. Basically, 159 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:45,960 Speaker 1: the boy is rushed to Massachusetts General Hospital and there's 160 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: a surgeon there, Dr Ronald Malt, another Harvard guy like Merkin, 161 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 1: he makes this historic call while he's deciding how to 162 00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 1: reattach Noel's severed arm. He takes the the the arm 163 00:08:57,200 --> 00:09:00,440 Speaker 1: and puts it on ice. Right, So this works. This 164 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 1: is the first time in history that reattachment surgery like 165 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,640 Speaker 1: this is successful, and doctors begin using the same protocol 166 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: across the board to treat all damaged tissue, especially in 167 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: the sports world. Now, I do think it is worth 168 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 1: noting that whenever you like, like if someone chops off 169 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 1: their fingers with lawn mower and whatnot and you put 170 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: it in a cooler or they're saving it to be reattached, 171 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 1: they wrap that thing in like eighty seven layers of 172 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:27,240 Speaker 1: gauze and plastic to prevent the ice from touching it 173 00:09:27,320 --> 00:09:30,320 Speaker 1: because they know it will damage the tissue. Right, So 174 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 1: doctors start doing this to decrease swelling and pain from 175 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 1: sports injuries. Right. So Everett Knowles is in sixty two. 176 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,080 Speaker 1: Then there's this famous photo of Sandy Kofax that runs 177 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 1: in Sports Illustrated, I believe in sixty five with his 178 00:09:44,880 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 1: legendary left arm and a vat of ice. And it 179 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 1: kind of goes on from there in when Dr Merkin 180 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 1: writes his sports Medicine book, which kind of becomes the Bible. 181 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:59,120 Speaker 1: He basically he wasn't doing anything based on extended research. 182 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 1: He was are phrasing what doctors were doing at the time, right, 183 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:05,840 Speaker 1: They were resting, they were icing, they were compressing, wrapping 184 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 1: things tightly. And he adds the E on the end 185 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:12,199 Speaker 1: of it to make rice because Rick is just not 186 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,640 Speaker 1: that catchy, right, And then we end up with the 187 00:10:14,679 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 1: phrase rice is nice, right, And we're doing this for 188 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 1: years and years and years now. Dr Merkin who is 189 00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:23,680 Speaker 1: eighty five years old now he lives down in Florida 190 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:27,320 Speaker 1: and he's like a regular blogger and podcaster and whatnot. 191 00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 1: God bless him. And he's now telling anybody who will 192 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 1: listen that he was wrong about rest and ice, that 193 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:37,480 Speaker 1: it actually decelerates your healing process as opposed to accelerates 194 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 1: your healing process. Yeah, and another study you talk about 195 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 1: in the article two thousand ten Federation of American Society's 196 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 1: for Experimental Biology Journal again, but back what you said 197 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,319 Speaker 1: at the start. When tissues damaged, you know it's necessary 198 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:52,840 Speaker 1: to let the inflammatory response happen, and constricting the blood 199 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:55,440 Speaker 1: vessels is not the way to do it right. No, 200 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:57,840 Speaker 1: and and it also the other the other, the big 201 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:00,960 Speaker 1: studies I like these two dozen, fIF teen, fourteen and 202 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 1: fifteen ones that show that code word what our immersion 203 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: after training substantially reduces your long term gains and muscle 204 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 1: mass and strength. So basically you're negating the adaptation that 205 00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:14,240 Speaker 1: you're trying to get from a workout. Because at the 206 00:11:14,320 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 1: end of the day, this is something that I don't 207 00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:19,840 Speaker 1: really think that a lot of people understand. Soreness and 208 00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 1: injurery injury in a muscle are only different in degree, 209 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: not kind. Right. Your soreness is because you have all 210 00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: these micro tears in your muscle from your workout, and 211 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 1: then your body repairs them and the muscle comes back stronger. 212 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 1: And injury is when the tear is bigger. Right, So 213 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:37,560 Speaker 1: it's a small tear or a big tear, it's the 214 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: same stuff, just at at an accelerated rate. So athletes 215 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:44,440 Speaker 1: are like, oh, but I'm not injured. I'm doing this 216 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: so I can train harder tomorrow. And they get in 217 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: the ice bath or whatever it is that they're doing, 218 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 1: and they're negating all of the good things that they've 219 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 1: done for themselves in their workout, and it's just crazy. 220 00:11:56,600 --> 00:11:59,439 Speaker 1: See that's so interesting, and most people, as you said, 221 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:01,680 Speaker 1: don't even get to that point. Right. So we're talking 222 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:05,079 Speaker 1: about recovery and what that study and it's the two 223 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:07,920 Speaker 1: fourteen study in the Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research. 224 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:12,239 Speaker 1: And what Lindsay saying is it's it's it's um diminishing 225 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 1: the results of your workout, the effects of your workout. 226 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:18,800 Speaker 1: So that's pretty amazing, I mean, substantially reduces long term gains, right, 227 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 1: And that's crazy. The one of the things I do 228 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:22,320 Speaker 1: want to make a point of this is not to 229 00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 1: say that things like whim Hoff, like where he does 230 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:28,640 Speaker 1: like the psycho cold water immersion for a couple of 231 00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 1: minutes two and then uses the breathing to accelerate. That's 232 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:35,840 Speaker 1: a little bit of a different channel mechanism. That's a 233 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:38,200 Speaker 1: different thing. We're not like, this is not whim Hoff, 234 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,079 Speaker 1: And most people who are sitting in an ice bath 235 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:42,679 Speaker 1: for twenty minutes, you're not whim Hoff either, so like 236 00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 1: this is not that's not what we're talking about. So 237 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 1: then then the other the big question that we get 238 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:49,400 Speaker 1: to here is well, all right, if I'm not going 239 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 1: to ice my entries, what am I supposed to do? Right? So, 240 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 1: your body brings all of this stuff, The repair and 241 00:12:56,679 --> 00:13:00,440 Speaker 1: clean up crew comes in to um take care of 242 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: the damage that you've done to your tissue. And so 243 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,880 Speaker 1: you have inflammation which brings that process there, and then 244 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 1: you have swelling. And there are really two different things. 245 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:14,040 Speaker 1: Inflammation is the necessary process by which your body heals. 246 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:18,080 Speaker 1: Swelling is what happens when you let that inflammation sit 247 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 1: around and congest the area and suffocate healthy cells, and 248 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 1: you can actually cause more damage. So to decrease swelling 249 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:31,320 Speaker 1: the byproduct of inflammation, you how do you do that? Right? So, 250 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:35,440 Speaker 1: all of these particles that go in there to repair tissue, 251 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 1: they're too large to be evacuated through blood vessels and stuff. 252 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:42,600 Speaker 1: They have to be evacuated through your lymphatic system. Your 253 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:46,319 Speaker 1: lymphatic system is a passive system, and stuff is only 254 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 1: pumped through the lymphatic vessels via the contraction of the 255 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 1: muscles around the vessels. So what does that mean you 256 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:56,440 Speaker 1: have to move. Okay, So you now look, we all 257 00:13:56,559 --> 00:14:00,880 Speaker 1: understand that you're not going to be like squatting on 258 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:03,600 Speaker 1: a tour in a c L or you know, running 259 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: stuff like that. But you need to find a safe 260 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:10,680 Speaker 1: way to load the damage tissue so you can flex 261 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:14,880 Speaker 1: the muscles and and and pump out that inflammation. Right now, 262 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: no matter how bad your springing ankle is, you're probably 263 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: going to be able to like lay on your back, 264 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 1: stick your foot in their and do an alphabet or 265 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,920 Speaker 1: some ankle circles or or or foot pumps or something 266 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 1: like that, right um. And if you're so injured that 267 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 1: you can't do that, there's so many devices on the 268 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 1: market now, like the mark Pro, the Complex, the power Dot, 269 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: the Firefly, all these little stem devices that you know, 270 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 1: there you go, there's your commercial. You can put these. 271 00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 1: You can put these little stim units on there and 272 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 1: they will contract the muscles for you to pump out 273 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:50,200 Speaker 1: that inflammation. One other thing I want to say is 274 00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 1: that these things are not attends unit. Attends unit just 275 00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:57,080 Speaker 1: desensitizes the area DEADNS pain. This is a different kind 276 00:14:57,080 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 1: of frequency that creates a non fatiguing contraction and that 277 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:02,960 Speaker 1: pumps the muscles a little different than tents and and 278 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 1: most of those websites have very good comparison information on 279 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:08,520 Speaker 1: it if you were to check it out. But so 280 00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: if you're if you're so hurt that you can't find 281 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 1: a way to walk on it, or just if you 282 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,760 Speaker 1: have a sprained ankle, just stand on it, like load it. 283 00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: You don't have to jump on it. If you can't 284 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 1: find a way to do that. There's all these devices 285 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 1: out there that will do it for you. And that's 286 00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: a huge change, right when you know, I'm fifty one, 287 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 1: and I know back in the day when you got injured, 288 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 1: broke something or whatever, they told, you know, don't do anything. 289 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 1: And obviously they've changed their tune with that. You know, 290 00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: you get your hip done now and they have you 291 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 1: on a bike the next day. They want you moving 292 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,000 Speaker 1: as soon as possible, but not so with the ice, right, 293 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: so they kind of went off the rest part, but 294 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 1: not the ice part. Yeah, they're they're even things like 295 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:46,120 Speaker 1: Achilles tendon repairs and a c LS. Like, you're not 296 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: immobilized the way you used to be. They do watch 297 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:51,120 Speaker 1: you moving, but the ice and I think I think 298 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:54,320 Speaker 1: some of it is for pain, but most pain can 299 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: be alleviated if you a decongest the area or be 300 00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:00,600 Speaker 1: just put yourself into a different position, you know, like 301 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: you can. There's ways to alleviate pain. And we say, 302 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 1: like back then they didn't have the stim units and whatnot. 303 00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: But like, what did our parents always used to say 304 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 1: to us, walk it off right? It was it was 305 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 1: tough love. But there's a lot of logic in that, yes, 306 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 1: walk it off right. I think we had the same dad, right, 307 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 1: we all had the same dad in nine. But that 308 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: also went for concussions and everything else. Lindsay, well, and again, 309 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: you have to be smart, and you can't. I told 310 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:30,480 Speaker 1: you I played hockey with boys my whole life. I've 311 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 1: had seven concussions. I've been trying. I've been trying to 312 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:36,080 Speaker 1: walk that last one off for three years and I'm not. 313 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 1: That's a whole another story. If I forget your name 314 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 1: by the end of this show, that's that's my excuse, right, 315 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:44,800 Speaker 1: too many times having the bell rung. But that's what 316 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 1: I love. And again, I just love your whole philosophy. 317 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 1: And that's what this show is about. It's it's the science, 318 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:52,120 Speaker 1: it's the and I now call it my acronym Lindsay, 319 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: is the RWs real world stuff I call it. You 320 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 1: can put the other word there, but it's as you 321 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,040 Speaker 1: started the show by saying, it's like, Okay, if your kid, 322 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:01,880 Speaker 1: you know, hangs his knee, you can put ice on 323 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,439 Speaker 1: it to make him feel better in the moment, but 324 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 1: just know the science is you actually want that to happen. 325 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 1: So that's you know, that's the difference. You can feel good, 326 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:13,600 Speaker 1: but over time, you want the body to do its 327 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:17,040 Speaker 1: natural thing. And there's so many professional athletes who are 328 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,880 Speaker 1: sort of they're starting to get it. Um. You see 329 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:21,920 Speaker 1: a lot of pitchers in the big leagues now who 330 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 1: are not icing, like Corey Kluber, for example, he's in 331 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 1: the story, and that's health. He hasn't ice his arm 332 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:28,879 Speaker 1: since he made the big leagues. And Corey Kluber's pitch 333 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,240 Speaker 1: two innings for like the last eight years or something. 334 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 1: There you go, don't call me on the stats. But yeah, 335 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: So he gets he gets off the mound and he'll 336 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 1: go he does banned work to kind of flush out 337 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 1: the area, and then he'll spend twenty or thirty minutes 338 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: with a mark pro on his arm, which is one 339 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 1: of those stim units that used to be. Chip Shaefer 340 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:49,520 Speaker 1: is the performance guy for the Bulls, and he talks 341 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:52,159 Speaker 1: about how in Michael Jordan's day he used to have 342 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:55,119 Speaker 1: twenty four ice packs in the room. Bove guys put 343 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:57,399 Speaker 1: an ice pack on each knee, and he doesn't do 344 00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,159 Speaker 1: that anymore. He'd rather have you on the bike for 345 00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:01,359 Speaker 1: a little while, or or using a stem thing, or 346 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,640 Speaker 1: just doing some sort of very low level active recovery 347 00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 1: to pump out the information. Kelly Starrett I think is 348 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 1: a genius pt and he talks about even if you've 349 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:15,120 Speaker 1: already worked out in the morning, you should or at 350 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:17,080 Speaker 1: some point in the day, you should still be getting 351 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:19,960 Speaker 1: that ten to twelve thousand steps a day because it 352 00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 1: just contracts the muscles and flushes things out and keeps 353 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:26,560 Speaker 1: you from becoming sore. If you look at our lifestyles 354 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 1: the way we live now, we all spend maybe an 355 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:30,800 Speaker 1: hour working out, and then the rest of the day 356 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 1: we're basically on our butts. Back in the day, even 357 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:36,000 Speaker 1: if you worked out, jobs were you know you, people 358 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: walked and biked more. The jobs are more manual people 359 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 1: who are doing stuff moving around all day. That's not 360 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 1: the way we live our lives anymore, especially now we're 361 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:45,400 Speaker 1: all in the houses all day. You have to get 362 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: up and move and and use your muscles as God intended. 363 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:53,080 Speaker 1: I love that. And you know, my real world kind 364 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:55,160 Speaker 1: of experience was that first time I ever did the 365 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 1: Hawaii iron Man. You know, crazy, so hard, and the 366 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,879 Speaker 1: next day I'm celebrating. I'm at a you know, restaurant 367 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,560 Speaker 1: with the bloody Mary on all e drive, you know, 368 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:06,800 Speaker 1: and what do I see, lindsay, like dozens and dozens 369 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,679 Speaker 1: of athletes doing what you're talking about, running, you know, 370 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: the easy run the day after the race. You know, 371 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:15,359 Speaker 1: they're not ten hours finished or whatever it was. But 372 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:17,760 Speaker 1: we're meant to move right, we're men, and it's the 373 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: simple stuff. But you can't you can't sell that, right, 374 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 1: So there's no product. You can't sell the cryotherapy uh 375 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: as as walking, but you know that's what the science 376 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 1: and just the natural bodies mechanisms are meant to do. 377 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 1: And the other thing like people say like, oh I 378 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 1: can't go for another walker, I can't ride the bike. 379 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 1: I already worked out. I'm tired. Jesse Thomas, right elite 380 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,560 Speaker 1: tray athlete, like he's doing half iron Man races that 381 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 1: take five hours and then when he's done, he goes 382 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:45,480 Speaker 1: out on like a leisurely ride for another hour. Okay, 383 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 1: the guy's doing seven hours of activity. You can do 384 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:51,120 Speaker 1: a little something else after your thirty minute hit class, right, 385 00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:55,080 Speaker 1: like not that I'm calling everyone whimps, but like um, 386 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:57,120 Speaker 1: but and then the other thing you make a good 387 00:19:57,119 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 1: point to there's no, there's not a lot of you know, 388 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: walking is not a product. It's a technology that we 389 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 1: all have without having to buy anything. Right. I think 390 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:09,320 Speaker 1: one of the big problems that we have with this 391 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 1: whole icing message is that so many doctors, orthopedic surgeons 392 00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 1: are invested in companies that create icing products like the 393 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 1: cryle cuff and the hyper ice and all of these things, 394 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 1: and they send people who have had surgery home with 395 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,240 Speaker 1: the prescription for this thing like put your leg in 396 00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 1: the in the cryo cop do this, do that. And 397 00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: they've been doing this for decades and decades and decades, 398 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:36,720 Speaker 1: And I think part of the fear is that if 399 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:39,560 Speaker 1: the doctors come out now and say icing is wrong, 400 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:42,920 Speaker 1: we live in a very ligitious society. Everyone they've ever 401 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:45,399 Speaker 1: done surgery on who they told to go home and 402 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:48,880 Speaker 1: ice who didn't have the exact outcome, They wanted from 403 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:51,200 Speaker 1: surgery could then turn around and sue them for telling 404 00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:53,639 Speaker 1: them to use ice. They know it's wrong, they know 405 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:57,120 Speaker 1: it makes no sense, but it's become so entrenched over 406 00:20:57,160 --> 00:20:59,480 Speaker 1: these years that it's like kind of impossible to dig 407 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 1: out of that whole. I love that, so that's why 408 00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 1: it continues. Yes, I'm a fitness expert in the lawsuits 409 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 1: now all the time. It's so sad how many of 410 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:09,440 Speaker 1: these type of cases now where you know, with more 411 00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,399 Speaker 1: people exercising and more people getting hurt, and it's just 412 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 1: super sad. But that's why, you know, people say, well, 413 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,920 Speaker 1: if my doctor keeps telling me to do it, that's 414 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:18,480 Speaker 1: you know, one of the reasons. And that's what I 415 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:20,959 Speaker 1: love about this show, Lindsay is. And I've left so 416 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: much money on the table over the years. My wife 417 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:24,359 Speaker 1: wants to kill me because people reach out to me 418 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 1: all the time about products, you know, rep my product, 419 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:29,480 Speaker 1: and I go absolutely not because I don't believe. You know, 420 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 1: science says it doesn't work, and I don't care how 421 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,720 Speaker 1: much you know you're gonna pay me, I won't do it. 422 00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,359 Speaker 1: It's about the science and what we're selling here is 423 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,119 Speaker 1: the information right, and that's why I love you know this, 424 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 1: my gosh, like have you always so you're playing hockey 425 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:45,320 Speaker 1: at a young age, That's that's what sports were you playing. 426 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:49,640 Speaker 1: I played soccer, I played ice hockey, and I played softball. 427 00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 1: Growing up, I played a little basketball as well. I've 428 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 1: always been like a hiker and a cyclist and a runner. 429 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: But I played at University of North Carolina Chapel Hill 430 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,399 Speaker 1: on the tar heel. I played varsity soft ball, and 431 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,080 Speaker 1: then I played men's club hockey as well, and then 432 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 1: post college we were talking before, I'm I'm I've been 433 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:08,359 Speaker 1: doing CrossFit for about twelve years. I did a lot 434 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,959 Speaker 1: of triathlons for a long time. I am really into hiking. 435 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:14,639 Speaker 1: I've hiked in the Alps and the Dolomites and the 436 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:16,639 Speaker 1: Andies and and my brother and I had to kill 437 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: manjar O. We've we've hyped all over the world. I'm 438 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,680 Speaker 1: basically just super hyperactive, and it's getting worse as I 439 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 1: get older. So I don't know what's I don't know 440 00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:26,159 Speaker 1: what's in store for me in the next ten years. 441 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,439 Speaker 1: But I as you say, like, I've never so I 442 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:33,480 Speaker 1: had a labor repair surgery, I've I've torn calf muscles, 443 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:35,159 Speaker 1: I've had a lot of things wrong with me, and 444 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:37,560 Speaker 1: and as long as I can remember, in college, I 445 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:40,439 Speaker 1: used to fight with our trainers. I would go to 446 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:43,199 Speaker 1: my PT and do my rehab and they'd want to 447 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:45,879 Speaker 1: send me put put ice on me for ten minutes 448 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 1: before I went back out into the world. Now are 449 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: in college. Our training room was down to the football 450 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 1: stadium and I had to walk about fifteen minutes back 451 00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 1: to my dorm, and a lot of it was uphill, 452 00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:58,040 Speaker 1: and I'm like, if you put that ice on me, 453 00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna be able to move and I'm gonna 454 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,119 Speaker 1: be gimping up this hill and it's going to be terrible. 455 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 1: So I don't want the ice. I want to walk 456 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:06,639 Speaker 1: up the hill. And inevitably, when I got finished walking 457 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 1: up the hill, I always felt a little better. So 458 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 1: I think I sort of intuitively didn't like it. But 459 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:12,840 Speaker 1: also I don't know these people, like they say it 460 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:14,680 Speaker 1: makes them feel better sitting in a cold tub, is 461 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:19,040 Speaker 1: why do you want to do that? It's horrible. Yeah, 462 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:20,960 Speaker 1: I'm so with you on that. I did it once. 463 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 1: I felled, you know, after a training for an ironmy 464 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:25,439 Speaker 1: and I felled a you know, big plastic garbage can 465 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,479 Speaker 1: with ice and water. I got in it and then 466 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 1: I hurt myself getting out. It was ver I never 467 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: or like if you must, if you must, do the cold, 468 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,000 Speaker 1: like like do the freezing cold for like thirty seconds 469 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker 1: and getting the hot shower at least that simulates your 470 00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:42,160 Speaker 1: lymphatics and gets go. It's all about getting that lymphatic 471 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:46,800 Speaker 1: response so the hot cold will will pump it. Contrast 472 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 1: therapy I love. Sitting in the cold tub does nothing 473 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,639 Speaker 1: and it just it's not Also, you can't get it 474 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:57,080 Speaker 1: cold enough anyway to make it work. Like and if 475 00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: you have a problem like deep in your hip join 476 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 1: or something, and you're putting an ice pack on the outside, 477 00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:03,080 Speaker 1: like you really think that cold is going to get 478 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 1: all the way in there to where it needs to 479 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 1: be if it was cold, and I know you're just 480 00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 1: giving yourself frostbite on the outside of your hip, right, 481 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 1: It just doesn't make any sense. Yeah, No, I'm still 482 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:14,879 Speaker 1: with you and so helpful for people like That's exactly 483 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:18,480 Speaker 1: what this show is forced to give. You know, the science, 484 00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 1: and you know you've walked to walk with all the 485 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 1: professional athletes too, and you know they're gonna keep doing it. 486 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,919 Speaker 1: And for the reasons we outlined, and it doesn't mean 487 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,000 Speaker 1: it's right just because doctors are doing it, just because 488 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: professional athletes are doing it and they do it for 489 00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,040 Speaker 1: a different reason to you know, which isn't always the 490 00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 1: right reason, right. Um, how do people follow you so 491 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,880 Speaker 1: Twitter at Lindsay Barra on Twitter? You can same same 492 00:24:37,880 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 1: thing on LinkedIn. I am one of those archaic people 493 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,679 Speaker 1: who still doesn't have an Instagram. I apologize. Oh I 494 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: wish I didn't. You know, I'm too old for it. 495 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:47,880 Speaker 1: But it's the new world, and you have so many 496 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,399 Speaker 1: other articles. I'll just say, like the great one on 497 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:54,360 Speaker 1: um oh Dr Fauci that that was just in men's health. Yeah, 498 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,440 Speaker 1: he's still seventy nine years old, night working nineteen hour 499 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:00,880 Speaker 1: days on the front lines against still funding time to run. 500 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: It's important for physical health and for our sanity. So 501 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:05,359 Speaker 1: if you think you're too old or you think you 502 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 1: don't have enough time both around. When it comes to 503 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:11,760 Speaker 1: so read all of Lindsay stuff, she's amazing. Definitely gonna 504 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:13,400 Speaker 1: have you back because I want to talk more about 505 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:15,680 Speaker 1: just sports and stuff like that. Thank you so much. 506 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: I mean this has been so helpful for people like awesome. 507 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:20,719 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, all right, 508 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 1: so Lindsay Barra again. Check her at Lindsay Barra dot com. 509 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,119 Speaker 1: It's Lindsay s A Y Barra b E r r 510 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,879 Speaker 1: A dot com. Check her out. Amazing, Thanks so much 511 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:31,680 Speaker 1: and look forward to having me back. Great, thank you. 512 00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:34,520 Speaker 1: All right, we'll be right back after this short break 513 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 1: and we are back. How great is Lindsay Barrett? How smart? 514 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:55,760 Speaker 1: Oh wow? What just helpful segment. Now. I know some 515 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 1: of you are probably still saying, oh, you're gonna ice it? Well, 516 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 1: you know, this is the science. This is the science 517 00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 1: and brought to you from someone you know. And Lindsey 518 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:07,840 Speaker 1: and I were talking before the show, like she's not 519 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,400 Speaker 1: a doctor, but you know what, some of the smartest 520 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:14,119 Speaker 1: people I know are the ones who research, study, live it. 521 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:17,359 Speaker 1: You know, she's been around it obviously, being the grandchild 522 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 1: of Yogui Barrow, around professional athletes, super smart athlete herself, 523 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 1: and I love it the latest science. So there you 524 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,400 Speaker 1: have it. When it comes to cold it's gonna make 525 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 1: you feel better. But science says, and there are other studies, 526 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:32,880 Speaker 1: by the way that that go against this. I've talked 527 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 1: about contributed some articles that you know, there's some studies 528 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 1: that show this, you know, the benefits potentially, But we 529 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:46,040 Speaker 1: just went through some pretty strong arguments that the body 530 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 1: needs to heal itself naturally, and that is my overarching 531 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: philosophy to health and wellness. Keep it simple, excessive moderation, right, 532 00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 1: it's the simple stuff that works. The body is a 533 00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:01,119 Speaker 1: really smart machine. I love that she said that. You know, 534 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,440 Speaker 1: I tend to have people on that I'm gonna say 535 00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:07,640 Speaker 1: agree with, but I have the same philosophy because it's 536 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,160 Speaker 1: about simplicity. We're not selling products. And it's another thing too, 537 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,320 Speaker 1: not here hawking you know some products. I'm giving you 538 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:18,439 Speaker 1: the information. Lindsay's here giving you the information so you 539 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 1: can make the most informed choices about your health. And 540 00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:26,640 Speaker 1: we can make it sound really complicated, and we can, 541 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 1: you know, talk about stuff that's against the norm, but 542 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: this is against the norm for those reasons. And I 543 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: love that she talked about where it came from. And 544 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 1: I often say, you know, look at my old football 545 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:44,920 Speaker 1: team and coaches. They're doing stuff that long ago we 546 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: weren't probably shouldn't do it, but they do it because 547 00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,120 Speaker 1: that's how everyone else did it before them, and their 548 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: coaches did it, and so it's really hard to change. 549 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:57,080 Speaker 1: It's really hard to change. And if it feels good, 550 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:00,399 Speaker 1: you know. Quite often I'll say, if something feels good, 551 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:05,400 Speaker 1: then fine, if you know, But if it's preventing your recovery. 552 00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,879 Speaker 1: And the study she talked about, now the studies are 553 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:13,760 Speaker 1: saying it it may decrease the effectiveness of your workouts, 554 00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:18,679 Speaker 1: that's interesting. So the bottom line is I'm gonna be sore. 555 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: And I looked that she said too. I never liked 556 00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,840 Speaker 1: ice paths personally, as I said, I got in one, 557 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 1: made one and hurt myself getting out, like you know, fell. 558 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: So that's the science, and that's what this show is about, 559 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,240 Speaker 1: debunking the myths and just looking at the current wisdom 560 00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 1: and saying, is that the right thing? And the recovery 561 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 1: market has never been bigger, as I started the show 562 00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:43,320 Speaker 1: by saying, but that doesn't mean it's right. So I 563 00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 1: would rather you do things that feel good that might 564 00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:52,560 Speaker 1: not prevent the healing process and won't decrease the results 565 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,000 Speaker 1: of your workout. But that's me all right. So I 566 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 1: hope you enjoyed the show. Thank you so much to 567 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:00,800 Speaker 1: Lindsay Barra. What an amazing woman. I will definitely have 568 00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,400 Speaker 1: her back to talk about some other things. She is uh, 569 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 1: super smart in many different areas and an athlete herself, 570 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: as she talked about. So thank you Lindsey bart checker 571 00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: out Lindsay Barra dot com. If you haven't rated this show, 572 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 1: please do so, and if you have rated it, thank you. 573 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 1: And I love the comments. I've been doing whole shows 574 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: based on questions and comments, so please if you can 575 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 1: leave them, go right ahead do that as well. You 576 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,280 Speaker 1: can contact me through Fitness disrupted dot com. Go there, 577 00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:30,480 Speaker 1: shoot me an email and Tom h Fit is my Twitter. 578 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:33,960 Speaker 1: Tom h Fit is Instagram. And if you share social 579 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:38,680 Speaker 1: media about the show, which I appreciate highly, hashtag fitness disrupted. 580 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 1: All right, I am Tom Olwen. Thanks one final time 581 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:44,880 Speaker 1: to Lindsay Barra for taking the time. Talked all about 582 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:48,240 Speaker 1: the cold heart truth about icing your injuries. I want 583 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,880 Speaker 1: you to look your best, feel your best, and live 584 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: your best life as long as possible, with those years 585 00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: to be quality years. And there are three things we 586 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 1: can control, how much we move, what we put in 587 00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:05,440 Speaker 1: our mouths, and our attitudes, and that is awesome. I'm 588 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:11,240 Speaker 1: Tom Holland, exercise physiologist. This is Fitness Disrupted. Believe in yourself. 589 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 1: Fitness Disrupted is a production of I heart Radio. For 590 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i heart 591 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 592 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:30,479 Speaker 1: favorite shows.