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Speaker 1: Our Way with yours truly Paul Anka and my buddy

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Speaker 1: Skip Bronson, is a production of iHeartRadio. Hi, folks, this

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Speaker 1: is Paul Anka.

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Speaker 2: And my name is Skip Bronson. We've been friends for

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Speaker 2: decades and we've decided to let you in on our

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Speaker 2: late night phone calls by starting a new podcast.

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Speaker 1: And welcome to Our Way. We'd like you to meet

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Speaker 1: some real good friends of ours.

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Speaker 2: There, leaders in entertainment and sports, innovators in business and technology,

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Speaker 2: and even as sitting president or two. Join us as

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Speaker 2: we ask the questions they've not been asked before, tell

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Speaker 2: it like it is, and even sing a song or two.

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Speaker 1: This is our podcast and we'll be doing it our way.

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Speaker 3: I think clothes have to be I call them normalies.

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Speaker 3: I look at the way people dressed and forgetting my

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Speaker 3: own style. The chain's ad vintage. I've worn the same

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Speaker 3: style shooting in million years. But I think to me,

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Speaker 3: important things have lasting for their class suit, but they

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Speaker 3: don't go out of style. You don't have to take

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Speaker 3: a mortgage out to buy.

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Speaker 4: Oh hey, Paul, what are you eating? I can tell

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Speaker 4: you're eating something. Yeah, we'll be getting my voice like yours.

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Speaker 4: I just had a cough drop, but he still can't

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Speaker 4: match up with your tones.

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Speaker 5: But I'm I'm working on it.

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Speaker 4: We have a bad we need a bad sore throat. No, no,

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Speaker 4: not at all. I feel great. I feel great, But

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Speaker 4: I was just couldn't Aaron brought one by and he

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Speaker 4: couldn't couldn't let a cough drop go by. So we've

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Speaker 4: got my friend Mickey Drexel one that's gonna be great.

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Speaker 5: You're gonna you're gonna love it.

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Speaker 4: He is, let me say this, He's an open book.

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Speaker 4: He loves to tell his stories and he's got great

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Speaker 4: you know, as we've learned, and Jordan, our producer, has

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Speaker 4: always pointed out, you know, we need people with good stories,

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Speaker 4: but who are also good storytellers, and with Mickey Drexler,

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Speaker 4: we have both.

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Speaker 5: And he's the.

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Speaker 4: Reason why he's one of the most desired guests on CNBC.

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Speaker 4: He's got a great point of view on the world

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Speaker 4: and when he's done in fashion, and you know, he

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Speaker 4: was one of the original board members of the of Apple,

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Speaker 4: involved in the development of all those fabulous stories.

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Speaker 6: And Taylor Gap was a very successful guy.

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Speaker 4: J Crew, you know, which he turned around and made great.

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Speaker 4: Now he's got his own company with his son Alex

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Speaker 4: called Alex mill and that's his new passion.

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Speaker 5: He loves to work. This is the guy.

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Speaker 4: He's like you, and I would like to say, like me,

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Speaker 4: never going to retire. He's just going to keep working.

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Speaker 4: He loves to work. He loves the process of creating.

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Speaker 4: And I'm sure he's going to talk to you about

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Speaker 4: you know, the creative you know, eight of you, because

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Speaker 4: he's got that as well.

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Speaker 6: I look forward to it. I'm a big fashioned guy.

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Speaker 6: They're creative people and I've always had an eye for

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Speaker 6: that and I'm looking for I've heard a lot about him,

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Speaker 6: read a lot about him. It should be very cool.

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Speaker 6: I'm glad the Olympics are over. Actually I get some sleep,

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Speaker 6: but what an incredible event every night with those kids.

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Speaker 6: You got to take your hat off. They're unbelievable.

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Speaker 5: I did some selective viewing. You know, I'm a big

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Speaker 5: you know.

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Speaker 6: Oh yeah, you have to cherry picket.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm a golf fan, so I have to tell

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Speaker 4: you that golf was unbelievable.

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Speaker 5: Scottie Scheffler, the number one player in the.

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Speaker 4: World, shot a sixty two ten under par on the

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Speaker 4: last round to win the gold medal on a golf course.

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Speaker 4: It's very, very difficult. You don't shoot sixty two on

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Speaker 4: that golf course. He you know, he overtook the the

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Speaker 4: you know, the leaders and won the tournament, and that

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Speaker 4: to me was really fun and exciting. It's for no money.

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Speaker 4: You know, these guys don't get paid anything. Well, don't

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Speaker 4: keet me started on that. You're not much money's being

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Speaker 4: made by the investors.

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Speaker 6: Billions billions.

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Speaker 5: When you said the investors, what do you mean.

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Speaker 6: Investors, Well, everybody that's invested or it's behind all of

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Speaker 6: these events. They're making a fortune or not paying these

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Speaker 6: athletes anything. They make a fortune.

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Speaker 5: You didn't know that.

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Speaker 6: Oh yeah, they make a fortune villions. Let alone, what

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Speaker 6: the town wherever it's held. It's such a money machine.

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Speaker 6: And these poor athletes don't get a damn set.

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Speaker 5: And the broadcasting rights.

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Speaker 6: You know, it's oh, it's huge, huge. I mean, you'll

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Speaker 6: see the day when you look at me and say, wow,

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Speaker 6: these athletes will step up somehow and they'll get their

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Speaker 6: fair share of what I think they deserve.

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Speaker 4: Frankly, it's going to be great when they have the

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Speaker 4: Olympics in Los Angeles in twenty twenty eight because part

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Speaker 4: of the challenge for the Olympics being you know, in

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Speaker 4: another part of the world you already know, you know,

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Speaker 4: because you can't help it today with with you know,

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Speaker 4: being bombarded with media and getting your alerts on your

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Speaker 4: phone alread you know who won the gold medal in swimming,

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Speaker 4: you know who won the gold medal in gymnastics because

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Speaker 4: you get an alert on your phone. The beauty of

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Speaker 4: it here, it'll be in real time for us that

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Speaker 4: you know, living out here, so that'll I think it

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Speaker 4: makes it even more compelling.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, for sure. But the events are fantastic. I didn't

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Speaker 6: like some of the opening, which I thought was a

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Speaker 6: little bizarre, but once they got into it, got my

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Speaker 6: admiration to those kids. Kids says wonderful. Young people are

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Speaker 6: so dedicated. It's unbelievable, really unbelievable stuff. Yeah, but I'm

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Speaker 6: looking forward to to Mickey because I don't think we've

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Speaker 6: quite had anyone on that's had that kind of success story.

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Speaker 4: He's very unique, and you know, he's also been an

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Speaker 4: angel round investor in a number of companies and you know,

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Speaker 4: you got in on the ground floor and they want

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Speaker 4: him not just for the money, but also for his

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Speaker 4: own expertise in in brand building.

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Speaker 5: He's a brand building so it'd be fun to talk

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Speaker 5: to him about that.

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Speaker 4: And ask him where he thinks the puck is headed.

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Speaker 4: So I'll talk to you. Let's see, it's probably not

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Speaker 4: going to talk to you until later tonight.

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Speaker 6: Well, i'll talk to you as usually before you go

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Speaker 6: to bed.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, all right, pliny, I love you, alt.

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Speaker 6: Sleep, love you back by Ccho's.

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Speaker 2: Oh, mickey, there's my guy.

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Speaker 3: What's up?

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Speaker 5: Guys?

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Speaker 1: I guess the first question was have you and I

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Speaker 1: ever met?

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Speaker 3: But we probably a genetically acted, so you're probably right.

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Speaker 3: Where'd you grow up?

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Speaker 6: Well?

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Speaker 1: I grew up. I was New Yorker. I came down

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Speaker 1: from Canada at fifteen, worked at Brooklyn Paramount. We're about

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Speaker 1: the same age. How old are you?

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Speaker 2: Mixed?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll be eighty in two weeks.

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Speaker 1: Well I just turned eighty three a week ago.

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Speaker 3: You're a fucking amazing Skip this.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: I don't usually hang out with friends who my age,

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Speaker 3: but Skip, it's an exception.

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Speaker 7: So the rule I said, I said, for me to

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Speaker 7: interview you would be like me interviewing myself, because I

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Speaker 7: know there's nothing that you don't know about me, and

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Speaker 7: there's nothing that I don't know about you.

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Speaker 2: That's true, But I think it'll be fun for people

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Speaker 2: who don't know you to hear hear about you.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, Skip, it's like Brooklyn Bronx Jeans west

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Speaker 3: Ard three Wall, from the same ghetto. Now, where did

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Speaker 3: you live when you moved to New York.

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Speaker 1: Ball I lived in Tenafly, New Jersey. Then I lived

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Speaker 1: in New York City on fifty seventh and sixth seventh,

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Speaker 1: that building on the corner.

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Speaker 3: So he was from the man of born, Skip, fancy hardly.

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Speaker 2: He was not from the manor born anymore than you

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Speaker 2: or I were.

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Speaker 1: Then I was living in Washington, d C. Till I

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Speaker 1: became became of age.

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Speaker 2: Mickey. You know the Johnny Cash song I've Been Everywhere, No, No,

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Speaker 2: there's a great song where he lists all the cities

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Speaker 2: and that Paul. Paul's been everywhere, He's lived everywhere, He's

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Speaker 2: done everything, He's checked every box.

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Speaker 3: Well, he's he's been around. Yeah, Paul, what's your favorite

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Speaker 3: song done in your whole life? I'm curious.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'm somewhat humbled by that because we're supposed to

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Speaker 1: be interviewing you. But I'll very quickly take it away

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Speaker 1: from me and tell you my favorite song is anything

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Speaker 1: that's good?

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Speaker 3: Okay, But see you have a lot of songs then,

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Speaker 3: but there's no emotional favorite.

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Speaker 1: Well, my emotional favorite of mine? Yes, yours okay, Sammy

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Speaker 1: Davis Junior. I wrote a song for him called I'm

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Speaker 1: Not Anyone my favorite my way of course for Sinatra

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Speaker 1: and a song called do I Love You? Don't you

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Speaker 1: know by Now, which I wrote when my wife was

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Speaker 1: having our fifth child. Those are my favorites.

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Speaker 3: Wow, yeah, Well Sinatra was the king always.

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Speaker 1: He will always be the king. He will always be

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Speaker 1: the king, you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, he sure will be.

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Speaker 1: I want to know about you because Skip has obviously

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Speaker 1: ran it all down. But your input with the Gap

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Speaker 1: and you inherited that and you went to work at Gap, right,

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Speaker 1: how did you figure out what direction to go with

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Speaker 1: the Gap?

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Speaker 3: You know? It's interesting and it's probably true in your world,

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Speaker 3: in the real estate world, it's all about a vision

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Speaker 3: of what the future will look like embedded in your brain,

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Speaker 3: and it's interesting. Twelve years in department Steare is. The

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Speaker 3: first company I actually ran was Anne Taylor. That was

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Speaker 3: my first THEO job. But Antello was a good training ground.

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Speaker 3: It was very successful GAP. I had a picture of it,

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Speaker 3: and what I thought is there was no place in

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Speaker 3: America because I grew up in the bronx dollars. You

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Speaker 3: know everything you like Ralph Laurren, who I've always had

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Speaker 3: great respect for. His clothes were unaffordable in my mind,

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Speaker 3: and I still live in bronze doyles. You skip, but

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Speaker 3: I look at prices and all that. But I thought

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Speaker 3: what American needs was a place to shop where you know,

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Speaker 3: it's personal to a degree, but where you could buy

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Speaker 3: nice clothes, lots of color. Classic I called the uniforms

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Speaker 3: in America in the sense it sounds like uniforms boring,

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Speaker 3: like this Navy T shirt gray every day in my life.

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Speaker 3: And so I had a list before I got the

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Speaker 3: GAP at you of the startup that would in fact

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Speaker 3: be GAP. I didn't know I was going to work there,

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Speaker 3: but it was your startup. But it's fishing, it's always

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Speaker 3: seeing around corners. It's skating to whereas Gretzky said, to

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Speaker 3: where the puck is going. And that's what I do.

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Speaker 3: And you can't help it. You can't control the mind

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Speaker 3: about thinking every day and now you write songs. But

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Speaker 3: I assume it's saying I got a song in my head,

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Speaker 3: and so that's selling the Gap. I had a vision.

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Speaker 3: It was a nightmare the first few years to implement

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Speaker 3: the vision. Moved from you know, Manhattan to death Cisco

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Speaker 3: worked in an office park of San Bruno. But you know,

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Speaker 3: I was a young person and I was trying to

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Speaker 3: figure out where to go after working for the big

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Speaker 3: department stores where I never wanted to be a boss there.

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Speaker 3: So it's always a picture in my brain. J Crewe

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Speaker 3: Gap Old Navy, Uh Mayde, Well, you know Old Navy

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Speaker 3: started just in the brain and then named after bar

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Speaker 3: in Paris. Maybe well, I purchased the name. I'm fast forwarding,

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Speaker 3: but I purchased the name after I left GAP and

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Speaker 3: kept it. And that I joined Jay Crew and what

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Speaker 3: we when public? I said, now it's time to do

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Speaker 3: made work. And you feel it in your head. I

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Speaker 3: think it's the same in any creating world. You have

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Speaker 3: a no shame, I say, if you know, you know,

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Speaker 3: most people don't. In my opinion. My world anyway, business

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Speaker 3: and songwriting, which my wife as in. So I just

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Speaker 3: finished a documentary on Diane Warrant. I'ven't even heard any

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Speaker 3: far Peggy was a producer with others amazing. You must know, well,

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Speaker 3: very very well.

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Speaker 1: Great great songwriter.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, great songwriter. But I always say to people you're

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Speaker 3: born with things or you're not born with it. And

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Speaker 3: they say, well, how do I become an entrepreneur? There's

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Speaker 3: entrepreneurial classes and you're never going to learn that classroom

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Speaker 3: or how to write a song or taste or style.

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Speaker 3: So a lot of it is very inter it's down.

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Speaker 1: I've always said it gets down to the people that

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Speaker 1: say they're going to do something and don't and those

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Speaker 1: that say they're going to do something and do big

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Speaker 1: differential through life. I've noticed that.

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Speaker 3: Well I couldn't agree more. But the people who are

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Speaker 3: going to do something need to have the built well

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Speaker 3: in my world, in your world, I look at them

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Speaker 3: as two totally creative and in real estate that exists.

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Speaker 3: I was just a guy from Graduate Hotels looking for

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Speaker 3: a location whatever. But it gets down to those who

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Speaker 3: want to do it, and we'll get knocked down. I've

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Speaker 3: been knocked down my whole career. You get knocked down,

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Speaker 3: you get back up. And also, you're not a spoiled brat.

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Speaker 1: Remember where you came from.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, one hundred percent.

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Speaker 2: You know what, Mickey, You know, you and I know

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Speaker 2: each other so well. We speak on the phone, what

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Speaker 2: three or four times a week, just checking in, and

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Speaker 2: it's painful because you and I we grew up, we

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Speaker 2: each had a dysfunctional parent. But just to help people

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Speaker 2: who don't know you, and just to go back for

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Speaker 2: a minute at the very beginning, you know you always

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Speaker 2: we kid each other. My father was a window trimm

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Speaker 2: or your father sold buttons. You know, But tell Paul

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Speaker 2: and the other people are listening how it all started.

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Speaker 2: Where you grow up, the good the bad, you had

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Speaker 2: it both both ways, before we segue into you know,

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Speaker 2: your rather incredible career.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well you know I love that question. Skip When

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Speaker 3: I interview people now, I've learned over the many years

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Speaker 3: of running companies, I don't care where they go to college.

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Speaker 3: I don't care what the board scores are, I don't

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Speaker 3: care what their graines are. I interview them based on

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Speaker 3: who they are, and I actually prefer less privileged Ian

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Speaker 3: then the more privilege. I've just had lunch today with

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Speaker 3: someone who said, you know, you work hard. Son worksismus

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Speaker 3: in summer. He hates it, but he does it. And

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Speaker 3: I said, those are the kinds of people I identified it.

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Speaker 3: But I grew up in the Bronx. When growing up

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Speaker 3: in the Bronx, it was I didn't know what I had,

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Speaker 3: but didn't that because I lived in a ghetto. I

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Speaker 3: lived in a ground floor apartment in apart in one

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Speaker 3: bedroom with mom and dad. My father, oh ye is

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Speaker 3: all I could say. I wouldn't have chosen him if

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Speaker 3: I had any choice. On the other hand, in hindsight,

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Speaker 3: he created a lot of my ambition, a lot of

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Speaker 3: hard work and wanted to escape. And I didn't want

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Speaker 3: to be like him. Although Skip's father has the greatest

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Speaker 3: quotes in the world, I have to say that I

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Speaker 3: don't know pull those all those thoughts. But I grew

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Speaker 3: up in the Bronx. I went to elementary school. My

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Speaker 3: mother was very ill and depressed because she had breast

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Speaker 3: cancer early in her life. And my father was I

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Speaker 3: don't know. He had no emotion, he had no connection.

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Speaker 3: He was just in his own little world. And I

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Speaker 3: guess they called that on the spectrum today. He was

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Speaker 3: a big shot in his own made He was you know,

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Speaker 3: the button he bought buttons from manufactory, worked in the

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Speaker 3: shipping room. But he was a big shot and his

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Speaker 3: fansins reacted that way compared to the rest of my

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Speaker 3: family in the ghetto down the street. But he was

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Speaker 3: not encouraging. He was not happy with me and what

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Speaker 3: I did. He never really appreciated what I did. But

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Speaker 3: that's what are under the bridge, and I do thank

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Speaker 3: him for being who he was, which created a huge

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Speaker 3: tribe of escape. I lived in my fantasies. I didn't

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Speaker 3: like being at home. I used to hang out at

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Speaker 3: my ands down the street. But you know, you deal

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Speaker 3: with it because you don't realize when you're growing up

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Speaker 3: how tough it is or how tough it was. And

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Speaker 3: our kids, you know, they all grew up in a

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Speaker 3: different way. I see that. But I worked my ass

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Speaker 3: and my father in not in a nice way, always

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Speaker 3: made me work, delivered the New York Times and in

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Speaker 3: high school in towel sorting in the basement. But I

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Speaker 3: always worked in the garment business. I delivered peace goodns.

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Speaker 3: I you know, got coffee in the morning. I saw

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Speaker 3: Wilkinson's sort blades, which were hard to get then, like

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Speaker 3: come street, but I never thought twice about it, other

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Speaker 3: than as they got older, I saw the world is

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Speaker 3: very different than the world I know, and I was

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Speaker 3: starting to say, oh my god, look at this and

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Speaker 3: look at that. You know, my mom worked as a

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Speaker 3: secretary for all the years doing for a guy who

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Speaker 3: ran the YMHA in the South Bronx. I went to

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Speaker 3: the YMHA camp with sessions in the summer. She was there,

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Speaker 3: but I never thought, wow, missions whatever. So I always

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Speaker 3: lived in my dreams and I never thought, you know,

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Speaker 3: I just kept just sing in front of me in

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Speaker 3: a way, and nothing with all I lived through, I

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Speaker 3: still got up and I thought. I went to Bronze science.

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Speaker 3: I like it. Everyone was intimidated me by their grades,

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Speaker 3: and I finally realized, too many us later, there's school smart,

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Speaker 3: there's life smart, and there's hard work and discipline and

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Speaker 3: ethic work ethic, but you gotta also use your brain.

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Speaker 3: So my childhood was not enjoyable. My mom died when

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Speaker 3: I was sixteen years old, and my father, you know,

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Speaker 3: skip my seventh family. I can't even talk about this here.

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Speaker 2: But.

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Speaker 3: If I ever told the pall of the stories, you know,

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Speaker 3: and down always laughed. But it was very difficult, and

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Speaker 3: I lived in an environment that I had to escape.

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Speaker 3: I went to City College. I escaped to Buffalo because

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Speaker 3: it was important for me to get out and away

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Speaker 3: from him and the family. And so I went to Buffalo.

347
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Speaker 3: I was very happy, could have been anywhere, you know.

348
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Speaker 3: But and then I went to work. After I worked

349
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Speaker 3: in a career and I started the department store business.

350
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Speaker 3: I decided after a few years, I wasn't meeting people

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Speaker 3: who inspired me. And this is all in hindsight. You know,

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Speaker 3: you do something and then you realize, you know that

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Speaker 3: this is no I had no mentors. Everyone has a

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Speaker 3: mentor today, all these in our generation. I'm stone mentor.

355
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Speaker 3: And you know, there was never anyone who was like

356
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Speaker 3: a role model. We just in our it's again generational

357
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Speaker 3: right now, every young person. I spend a lot of

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Speaker 3: time with young people, telling them the truth about what

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Speaker 3: life is like. But a lot of them I can't

360
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Speaker 3: blame them for growing up or even our own kits

361
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Speaker 3: and growing up the way they'd grown up. You grew

362
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Speaker 3: up in the borough of West Hardford, balls and did

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Speaker 3: you say?

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Speaker 1: But making not to interrupt you, but in looking at

365
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Speaker 1: you know how amazing you faced every challenge. Every guy

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Speaker 1: that I've respected in business and that I've met, and

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Speaker 1: I've been fortunate enough to meet them on all levels.

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Speaker 1: They were all avid readers. Are you and were you

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Speaker 1: self taught and a reader?

370
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Speaker 3: Never?

371
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Speaker 1: Never?

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Speaker 3: Well, there's a Yiddish term called spilkus as in.

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Speaker 1: My hands spocus.

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Speaker 3: You had spocus, Yeah, I had spilcus. I was an

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Speaker 3: avid imagination, lived in my fantasies and my dreams and it. No,

376
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Speaker 3: I didn't read avidly, although I want to be able

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Speaker 3: to do it even today. I can't like sit down

378
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Speaker 3: and read book, but that's me. No, I wasn't an

379
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Speaker 3: avid reader and I wasn't an avid student. I never

380
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Speaker 3: used anything I've learned in school. I saw some'se tryangs, parallelograms,

381
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Speaker 3: chemistry codes. A lot of that was memorization. And if

382
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Speaker 3: you're good at memory, you didn't get good grades too.

383
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Speaker 3: I wasn't. I didn't pay attention. But no, I didn't

384
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Speaker 3: read much. I still don't, unfortunately, because.

385
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Speaker 1: I still think you're an amazing success story.

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Speaker 3: Well, uh, thank you, Paul, But you want to know

387
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Speaker 3: I think every day I still climb them that I

388
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Speaker 3: try to prove myself and I try to do better

389
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Speaker 3: than I did yesterday. And I never forget who I

390
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Speaker 3: was and I still am.

391
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Speaker 1: Then, So, Mickey, are you close to putting the flag

392
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Speaker 1: in the mountain. Do you see that?

393
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Speaker 5: Yeah?

394
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Speaker 3: No, No, because uh, you know, you keep climbing the mountain. No,

395
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Speaker 3: and Alex Mill Frankly, at this stage in my life,

396
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Speaker 3: I'm more ambitious here for it to be successful because

397
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Speaker 3: I have to leave a company to the people that

398
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Speaker 3: are going to run it that's economic, viable, thasible and

399
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Speaker 3: has a future. And we're building and I'm working. Frankly,

400
00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:48,879
Speaker 3: I think better than I've worked. It's kind of weird,

401
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:54,440
Speaker 3: but my mind is I feel more creative, but more

402
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Speaker 3: whatever because I'm not dealing with investors. I'm not dealing chairman.

403
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:06,600
Speaker 3: I'm dealing with myself and the teen and we don't

404
00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,800
Speaker 3: have any investors. So it's kind of a dream that

405
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:13,680
Speaker 3: I work for the team. Those are my bosses.

406
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Speaker 2: When you were starting out, though, you never could have

407
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Speaker 2: imagined that you'd be known as the merchant, prints, that

408
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:22,399
Speaker 2: you'd have a reputation that you created, that you do

409
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:24,600
Speaker 2: the things that you did. But did you dream about

410
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Speaker 2: being rich? Did you ever think I want to do

411
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Speaker 2: this because I want to be rich. I want a Cadillac,

412
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Speaker 2: I want to have a beach house or did you

413
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Speaker 2: never even go there?

414
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Speaker 3: You know, I never went there because I didn't know

415
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Speaker 3: what being rich was like. With my father and his

416
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:44,280
Speaker 3: generation Cadillac convertible boom. You were rich when I went

417
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Speaker 3: to sleep away camp in the wherever I went after

418
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Speaker 3: the Lafos, you know, the Cadillacs set visited rich Jeff

419
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:57,840
Speaker 3: Reave Meal to get a yellow Cadillac. Woud father worked

420
00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:03,359
Speaker 3: for an air condition whatever carrier or whatever. Wow, I

421
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 3: never thought about it, even in hindsight. Now it's really interesting.

422
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,240
Speaker 3: I sent to Peggy the other day. I said, you know,

423
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Speaker 3: I look back at our life and I never kind

424
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Speaker 3: of imagined it would. I mean, I look back, I'm

425
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:23,520
Speaker 3: very impressed with whoever he was and what he did.

426
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Speaker 3: But I still every day, what do you know, we

427
00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:30,160
Speaker 3: skip by every day. I'm trying to do better. I'm

428
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 3: very difficult of myself. I'm very self critical person of me,

429
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,879
Speaker 3: and as Skip knows, we have a lot of people

430
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Speaker 3: we are critical of. But we can't go here on that.

431
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:48,280
Speaker 3: You know, I'm just singing to the singing to the well.

432
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,959
Speaker 3: You know, I'm big shots. I rememberable when I's a

433
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 3: young person in my twenties. You know, at the department stores,

434
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Speaker 3: they were all big shots the bosses, and I thought

435
00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:05,359
Speaker 3: they're big shots, and I learned over time they're not

436
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:09,919
Speaker 3: such big shots. Titles don't mean that you are the

437
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:14,280
Speaker 3: most successful person in the world. I like people like today,

438
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 3: I had lunch with a friend Dish I'm known her

439
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:24,240
Speaker 3: bit and the waitress, Diana, was from Peru and that's

440
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:28,480
Speaker 3: my friend at Saint Ambrose across the street. She and Marco,

441
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:34,200
Speaker 3: the manager. Marco's smart for what they do. Marco, she's

442
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 3: a funny story. They hadn't The chefs on chef sell

443
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,600
Speaker 3: not chef. There's com salad on the menu. So I

444
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 3: got it about a month ago. I quote him now

445
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 3: it was hardly need bacon bits, So I said, Marco,

446
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 3: there's no baking bits hard and you can't even see it.

447
00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 3: And the cop sell. He comes out of the kitchen

448
00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:58,240
Speaker 3: with a cup of bacon bits. I said, thank you.

449
00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:02,080
Speaker 3: He goes, this is not just an ingredient. It's me

450
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 3: and great to hear. I U said all the time.

451
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 3: That just says it all. But those are the people

452
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 3: that I like. I like nice people, and I like

453
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:14,200
Speaker 3: people who have a leg down.

454
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 2: The title thing is interesting because when I started off

455
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:32,399
Speaker 2: my first legitimate job selling insurance working and hard for

456
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:36,760
Speaker 2: an insurance company. You know, the salesman, the guy that

457
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 2: ran the general agency made more money than the president

458
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,879
Speaker 2: of the company. So speaking of titles, you know, the

459
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,639
Speaker 2: title was one thing that you know, the president of

460
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 2: the company got to walk around as the president of

461
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 2: the travelers insurance company. But in terms of just sheer dollars,

462
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 2: the guy that was the head of sales made more money.

463
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,880
Speaker 2: Now today, of course, and Mickey gets offended by this, Paul,

464
00:26:57,920 --> 00:26:59,560
Speaker 2: I have to tell you up front. You know, he

465
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 2: looks at what some of these executives make the CEO

466
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:07,879
Speaker 2: pay and it infuriates him, just finds it's distasteful.

467
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:09,400
Speaker 1: It is distasteful.

468
00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 3: Well, it is distasteful. It's not based on anything. But look,

469
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 3: I don't want to go there, but I guess I'll

470
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:22,440
Speaker 3: go there. I think you know, CEOs today and probably

471
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,040
Speaker 3: in the old days, you know, they were big machers

472
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 3: watching spec and you know, I realized that if you

473
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:36,359
Speaker 3: look play the part, well, not certainly, not everyone, but

474
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,160
Speaker 3: if you're a safe bet for the board of directors,

475
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 3: if they don't have a risk of picking the wrong person,

476
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 3: it's not uncommon. And then you look at the results

477
00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 3: and they're making twenty twenty five. We got the private

478
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 3: jet they this day, and that do something for the shareholders.

479
00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:01,919
Speaker 3: I've always worked number one on the people I've worked

480
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:05,199
Speaker 3: with and the shareholders without a doubt. No, I was

481
00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:09,639
Speaker 3: in that level of crazy numbers, but on stock price

482
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 3: beyond paid for it in terms of its growth. And

483
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:20,919
Speaker 3: Steve Jobs sixteen years as his director member and his friend.

484
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:25,920
Speaker 3: That guy never one day would come in and think, oh,

485
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:30,479
Speaker 3: I'm Steve Jobs. Well, I said, you're Steve Jobs. But

486
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 3: he was just someone who cared about building a business. Yeah,

487
00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 3: we all have about quirks, but I the best in

488
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 3: the world, and he wasn't there to have a nego

489
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 3: at all.

490
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 2: Speaking of a quirk, though, You've got to do this.

491
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:50,600
Speaker 2: I have to tell Paul the story about Christmas time

492
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 2: when the board members at Apple could get like, you know,

493
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 2: a laptop, or they could get an iPhone or whatever.

494
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 3: You told me this story, right, I didn't remember it.

495
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 3: But when Steve called, Yeah, how I didn't you know

496
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:07,000
Speaker 3: that story?

497
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 2: You told it to me.

498
00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:12,719
Speaker 3: Well, he has a better memory. I guess.

499
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 6: You know.

500
00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 3: You got free things, you know, to say what Steve

501
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:20,680
Speaker 3: wasn't happy I'm using it and I, uh, what are

502
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:25,920
Speaker 3: those other things called? Before the I uh, the you

503
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:32,160
Speaker 3: know what I mean, the own black bear, right. I

504
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 3: used to have that at the border use anyway you

505
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 3: could pick free things free f r E. I didn't

506
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 3: even how to work your computer. And Steve skip reminded

507
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 3: calls me and say I ordered too many free things,

508
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:55,480
Speaker 3: and I was kind of embarrassed. I don't know, I

509
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 3: didn't know how many to order. Maybe it was fourth things.

510
00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 3: But he's telling me, I'm being a little indulgent.

511
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:04,320
Speaker 2: No matter what.

512
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:04,840
Speaker 5: He did.

513
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 2: Love to guy Paul, the guys on his board of directors,

514
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 2: the company is a rocket ship. He's concerned that maybe

515
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 2: Mickey asked for one too manything.

516
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,840
Speaker 1: He's got his eye on the ball. He's focused, right, Hey, Mickey,

517
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 1: going back to vision, which I think is imperative in

518
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:27,959
Speaker 1: business today. The whole COVID experience kind of separated the

519
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 1: men from the boys. Everybody got hit pretty badly. And

520
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,960
Speaker 1: then the evolution out of it into trying to get

521
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 1: on track again. How has it changed in your business?

522
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 1: So I know some of the players in the industry

523
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:44,920
Speaker 1: to what's happened to the malls, the online all of that.

524
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 1: Where is it landing and where's it going?

525
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 3: Mickey, Well, Paul, it's a good question, surely personal because

526
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 3: I you know, I'm not the smartest guy, and all

527
00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:00,959
Speaker 3: I can do is estimate where it's going. And I

528
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 3: think what it did shift the world up there the

529
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 3: hell out of all of us. But I think you

530
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:12,520
Speaker 3: know it's over, it's gone. I think what's happened in retail,

531
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:18,400
Speaker 3: independent of the pandemic is that the world and I

532
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 3: don't know if it's true creating song business, the world

533
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 3: of creativity, of product being number one, style, taste, quality

534
00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 3: has taken a step down. I don't think that was

535
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 3: pandemic centric. I think that you have to recognize in

536
00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 3: any business that creativity grows businesses and it's a necessary

537
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 3: ingredient to keep moving forward. Maybe not I don't know,

538
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:57,640
Speaker 3: whatever ingot business or whatever, banking business, but you know

539
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 3: it's still been necessary. And you just look at what

540
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 3: Jamie Dimond has done. But I think it allowed people

541
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:11,320
Speaker 3: to kind of hide behind the pandemic. Well, I think

542
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 3: again personally, it also seemed to have a portal little

543
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 3: water on creativity or whatever. But I think that's been

544
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:28,080
Speaker 3: going this way slowly. But surely, why do I say

545
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 3: that because investors. We had private ality investors, my friends

546
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 3: whatever at Jay Crew, and they are they won't want

547
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,200
Speaker 3: to make money. I don't blame them. If I invest

548
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 3: I want to make money too. But when you're a

549
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 3: director of a company, people are number one people who

550
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:57,760
Speaker 3: work in that company number one, and earnings are good

551
00:32:58,000 --> 00:32:59,920
Speaker 3: long term. There's no such thing as as part of

552
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 3: around in my opinion that thanks two years get the

553
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 3: stock price up, how will it stay up? But in

554
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:10,720
Speaker 3: all the years, no offense. And these are my friends too,

555
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 3: people on boards, very few with them, very few had

556
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 3: a sense of the products we were selling. If you

557
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:25,240
Speaker 3: look at a schmatta, you know, people say, well, how

558
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 3: do you know it's going to be good? And not

559
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:30,000
Speaker 3: I a would say there's something in my stomach to

560
00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 3: and my belly that kind of buzzes. It's that's what happens.

561
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 3: But in the industry today, with all the data, this

562
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 3: data does not know how to design a good best

563
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 3: seller all right, and whatever the other word is that

564
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 3: tells you how many to buy algorithms. You know, I

565
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 3: did algorithms when I was twenty three, or it's old

566
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 3: and a new buyer it blooming does I just didn't

567
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 3: call it that. I called it looking around, what's the

568
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 3: sense in the island and all that. But when you

569
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 3: lose that, you can mention any industry.

570
00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:10,919
Speaker 2: Look.

571
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 3: I think the cars around America worldwide, of like, I

572
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 3: don't know who designs them anymore. There are certain standouts,

573
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:21,720
Speaker 3: but they all have the same swoop in the back

574
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:24,520
Speaker 3: like it's all I always call it the swoop. I

575
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 3: get a kick out of it. Looks like they're designed

576
00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 3: in the same design room. And Steve again not to

577
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:34,280
Speaker 3: you know, he's a good name drop, but I always

578
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 3: admired him. He was designed with him and Johnny Eye.

579
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:42,000
Speaker 3: The screwings had to be horson the engine, that this,

580
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:46,279
Speaker 3: whatever it was, it had to be esthetically right. And

581
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 3: he was an I call him great worching in terms

582
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 3: of what he did with the shops. Did everything came

583
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 3: the best retail in the world. But I think right

584
00:34:56,400 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 3: now and as a skip nose, I connetch a lot.

585
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 3: I can find things. Every day I go to work,

586
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 3: I want to know what could be better and the

587
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 3: team sometimes what is he talking about? I went to

588
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 3: a shop today to check it out, and I knew

589
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:18,479
Speaker 3: the shop well and I saw something there. I said,

590
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 3: you know, we walked away. I don't want to say

591
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:25,840
Speaker 3: we walked away from a fab Why because competitor ish

592
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 3: uses it and I said, let's bring it back. Why

593
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:35,120
Speaker 3: who cares if a lesser competitor hasn't will make it

594
00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:39,400
Speaker 3: the ingredient this company? And you know, it's just I

595
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:43,800
Speaker 3: think the world's lost. I don't know how you feel,

596
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:47,040
Speaker 3: young Paul and Skip, you knew a lot of people,

597
00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:50,200
Speaker 3: and Skip was in the hotel business when there were

598
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:54,719
Speaker 3: great things being created, you know, and I don't know

599
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 3: where that is to except what there's always going to be.

600
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,279
Speaker 3: You know, the out riders do what they do.

601
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 1: Mickey, back to your saying design and the vision. You know,

602
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:09,799
Speaker 1: I spend a lot of time in Asia, but going

603
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 1: there for sixty years. I just got back a few

604
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: months ago. And the evolution over there, those department stores,

605
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:21,840
Speaker 1: their taste for fashion. How has that affected your business

606
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:24,600
Speaker 1: or the fashion business? When I see there's so much

607
00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:28,479
Speaker 1: focus on that they're all very small and you see

608
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 1: smaller design, clothing, et cetera, et cetera. What portion and

609
00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 1: where does that take you in terms of where Asia

610
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 1: fits into your scheme of things were never used to.

611
00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:41,480
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I don't go to Asian much anymore.

612
00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:45,359
Speaker 3: I think in the past, Tokyo and they had by

613
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:51,240
Speaker 3: far the best stops in the world creatively and product wise.

614
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 3: I understand Korea. Now soul career is the next place

615
00:36:56,840 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 3: be and it's taking over. I live in my days.

616
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:07,720
Speaker 3: I can paying attention detail I go into a shop.

617
00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 3: For me, it's not about trends as much as it's

618
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:19,240
Speaker 3: about the trend that I think is always on trend,

619
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:23,719
Speaker 3: which is clothes that don't go out of style. This

620
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 3: shirt here, for example, ten years old, I were the

621
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:31,319
Speaker 3: same body last twenty years bottomed down blue and white,

622
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 3: stripe white. I think clothes to them have lost their focus.

623
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,960
Speaker 3: Now I might create a lot of people say, oh,

624
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 3: but my senses. I only buy things personally. And even

625
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:49,000
Speaker 3: as a kid, I had a uniform. I didn't know

626
00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:52,439
Speaker 3: I was in grade school. I had to buckle back gin.

627
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,800
Speaker 3: I never thought differently except that I couldn't afford and

628
00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:00,319
Speaker 3: I didn't think about this to buy new clothesal time,

629
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 3: except because I was growing. I think I get inspiration

630
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 3: wherever I go. And I said to the team today,

631
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:14,160
Speaker 3: I said, let's go visit the shops. Even in New

632
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 3: York city in Manhattan, I went to two shops this morning.

633
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:21,400
Speaker 3: I came back with those two things and the third

634
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:26,520
Speaker 3: shop that five women. There was a very upscale fashion

635
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:30,319
Speaker 3: and company, very cool, and I mentioned, where is the

636
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:34,319
Speaker 3: alex Mill. We sell them a shell And they said,

637
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:36,720
Speaker 3: why are you asking? And I said, well I worked there,

638
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:42,359
Speaker 3: and they said, we love alex Mill. Now I gave

639
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:47,399
Speaker 3: them it was very terrific, cool company. You know when

640
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:51,319
Speaker 3: the signor world and I gave the meet sure of

641
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:55,840
Speaker 3: VIP card and I said, tell your friends. But I

642
00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:58,719
Speaker 3: think creative people. I don't know where you get the

643
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 3: song in ratio. I'm always amazing people who write songs.

644
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 3: I can't imagine worse. So I don't you know. I

645
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:09,279
Speaker 3: don't know, but I find.

646
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: Well, you learn, you learn your craft and it's very spiritual.

647
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 3: I practice my craft for forty five years. That's right,

648
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:21,799
Speaker 3: your craft and and to me and it's not like,

649
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 3: oh my god, and I did it. Some people say

650
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,319
Speaker 3: why did white work? To me, it's what I do.

651
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:32,280
Speaker 3: And I think if in an igic way, I feel

652
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:34,960
Speaker 3: I do it better now than I ust. So you

653
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 3: believe it.

654
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 1: You believe in micromanaging, Oh well, I beyond and I'll

655
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:40,919
Speaker 1: tell you what I think.

656
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 3: Micromanagings. It's a term that doesn't get respect. You know.

657
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:50,040
Speaker 3: It's like what in danger you got all respect? You

658
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,120
Speaker 3: know what it is. And I say this, I come

659
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 3: in and I say anything a customer thieves or fields

660
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:04,200
Speaker 3: and it's not right. Make it better, you know. It's

661
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 3: it's simple. And I see my nusha. I see big pictures.

662
00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 3: But I am trained being a customer all my life.

663
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,680
Speaker 3: And I know right away from a good vibe when

664
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 3: you get greeted in the restaurant. You know, big line restaurants.

665
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 3: I couldn't kill us who goes there because there's a line.

666
00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:31,800
Speaker 3: I feel it. So anyway, that's it in micromanaging. I

667
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 3: if it's I look, I said, I was at a

668
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:39,839
Speaker 3: meeting with a bunch of CEOs and my friend said,

669
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 3: yeahe it runs whatever the vision. And he said, please

670
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:48,319
Speaker 3: come and sit down and just spend some time with me.

671
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 3: Terrific guy Jeff Snfeld, who you might know, he's always

672
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:56,640
Speaker 3: on CNBC. So this is about six or seven years ago.

673
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:58,840
Speaker 3: I sat in and I don't like to go to

674
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:03,239
Speaker 3: I don't have patience to send meetings. But anyway I

675
00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 3: sat there must have been at one hundred CEOs, and

676
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 3: I'm like, I just went in twenty minutes. It's the

677
00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:13,920
Speaker 3: CEO of a car was there and they showed a

678
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 3: car think screen and Jeff said, Mickey, what do you

679
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 3: think of that car? And it was a classic car

680
00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 3: like I liked. It was design, had integrity, et cetera,

681
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:32,240
Speaker 3: et cetera. But I said, I said this, I said,

682
00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 3: but I would never buy that car. And they said why.

683
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:41,919
Speaker 3: I said, crustal wheels ruined the car. All I see

684
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:48,200
Speaker 3: is ugly wheels, and and that to me is, you know,

685
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 3: part of what the world's like. I was invited by

686
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:56,279
Speaker 3: the CEO to go to Detroit and they invited you

687
00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:59,840
Speaker 3: to go to the design room. Now the CEO, I like,

688
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 3: and I still do, didn't go with me to the

689
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 3: design room. I mean, you know, even as an inviting guests,

690
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:13,400
Speaker 3: obviously he was involved in designing his product. So I

691
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:17,360
Speaker 3: came back. He said, what do you think. I said, Well,

692
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:23,200
Speaker 3: here was seven people designing a car, and one of

693
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:26,960
Speaker 3: them did the interior, the other did grill, the other

694
00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:31,880
Speaker 3: pull street. It was like putting together like you know,

695
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:35,959
Speaker 3: I guess when Picassa painted it was his point of view,

696
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 3: and you know, I think that's what goes on creativity. Look,

697
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:48,680
Speaker 3: I might oversee to me, creativity opened this curiosity. I'm

698
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 3: a detective.

699
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 1: Very important, very important, mutually important.

700
00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 3: I am a detective.

701
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:58,319
Speaker 2: I just wrote that down because I just literally wrote

702
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 2: a note to myself about curiosity. See one of the

703
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 2: things that was fascinating Paul. I went to visit Mickey

704
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:05,560
Speaker 2: back when he was running Jay Crew, and he had

705
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 2: this gigantic building with all these people and it. He

706
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 2: had a bicycle and he actually used to ride around,

707
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,960
Speaker 2: go from place to place within the company to pop

708
00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 2: in on people, you know, and petrify everybody. But you know,

709
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:20,520
Speaker 2: one day I was sitting in his office and somebody

710
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:23,720
Speaker 2: came in. You talk about how the zeitgeist. Somebody mentioned

711
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:25,959
Speaker 2: to Mickey the lavender was going to be a really

712
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,560
Speaker 2: big color. Mickey had this PA system in the building,

713
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 2: and Micky would get on the public address system and

714
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:36,840
Speaker 2: go lavender, bring me lavender, And people would start walking

715
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:41,400
Speaker 2: into the office scarves. Somebody had scarves, somebody had skirts.

716
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 2: You know, he was looking.

717
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: At I'll give you my lavender story way off point,

718
00:43:47,239 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 1: but I never heard anymore. I moved to Italy in

719
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:54,359
Speaker 1: the sixties, because the Beatles hit town and I'd been

720
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,400
Speaker 1: an international creature, and I said, you know what, Italy

721
00:43:57,480 --> 00:43:59,560
Speaker 1: is the place. So I started a company with RCAA

722
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:04,799
Speaker 1: Victor and I'm recording. I'm doing an Italian But I

723
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 1: wanted to meet Gina. Sophia Lauren. She was the hot thing.

724
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:12,239
Speaker 1: Remember you remember the film where she was bare breasted

725
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:16,320
Speaker 1: in the sixties and no one ever seen an actress

726
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:19,399
Speaker 1: like that, And ever since I saw it, I said,

727
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:21,880
Speaker 1: I gotta meet this woman. Anyway, fade out, fade in.

728
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:25,799
Speaker 1: I'm there at noon and back then, Perry Como and

729
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:29,239
Speaker 1: Crosby and all those guys. They started everybody off with

730
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 1: those cardigan sweaters, all colors, buttoned up to here, and

731
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:36,439
Speaker 1: I bought a I must have bought a dozen, one

732
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 1: of which was lavender. So I'm getting ready at the

733
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,839
Speaker 1: hotel and I'm going into the studio and I put

734
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:46,680
Speaker 1: on my lavender sweater to impress Sophia Lauren. And I'm

735
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:50,160
Speaker 1: standing there by a mic and I'm counting the seconds

736
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:53,080
Speaker 1: and over the loud speaker in the studio, Miss Lauren

737
00:44:53,200 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 1: is coming into the building. She'll be in a minute.

738
00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:00,480
Speaker 1: I'm standing and I'm waiting and Sophia Lauren walks into

739
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:04,719
Speaker 1: the studio and starts coming towards me. Well, you know,

740
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:06,759
Speaker 1: all of us, I don't care how much money we

741
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 1: have or our experience in life, you're gonna meet that

742
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:13,359
Speaker 1: one person where you're absolutely no tongue tied. I don't

743
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:16,239
Speaker 1: care who you think you are. She walks up to

744
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 1: me and she goes, oh, oh my god, you're wearing

745
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 1: a lavender purple sweater. It's in my unlucky color. And

746
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:25,800
Speaker 1: she left the fucking studio.

747
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:28,120
Speaker 3: Too funny.

748
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 1: And I never had to. I couldn't say left unlucky number.

749
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:36,000
Speaker 3: I'm believing that is too funny for the record. Skip

750
00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:40,520
Speaker 3: would never be a lap into color that I okay,

751
00:45:40,719 --> 00:45:44,440
Speaker 3: I just wanted whatever, just the correct set the record straight,

752
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:45,719
Speaker 3: right exactly.

753
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:59,719
Speaker 2: By the way, talk about these various brands, I'm thinking

754
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:02,040
Speaker 2: about what you've done and were you know, like the

755
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:05,839
Speaker 2: companies that you've sort of followed or invested in, and

756
00:46:06,239 --> 00:46:07,239
Speaker 2: like what do you look for?

757
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:13,879
Speaker 3: Well, I'm going to be a very circumspect companies. Well,

758
00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:20,120
Speaker 3: I'll tell you about Gap. Don Fishing invented a great company.

759
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 1: It was Levi's the Gap what he and his wife right,

760
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:25,319
Speaker 1: Nicky the wife.

761
00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:31,080
Speaker 3: Also at the GAP nineteen people who found and start companies,

762
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:34,880
Speaker 3: and you know a lot of examples, they bring it

763
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:40,080
Speaker 3: to a certain point and then they don't know round

764
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 3: two or three happiness all the time. At Gap, Don

765
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 3: was smart enough to know when he hired me, not

766
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 3: that he knew I would be successful or not that

767
00:46:51,239 --> 00:46:55,480
Speaker 3: the company was in trouble, and it was in trouble

768
00:46:55,600 --> 00:47:00,960
Speaker 3: going this way. And because he invented there's a lot

769
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:05,840
Speaker 3: of inventions where the founders in a way have to

770
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,919
Speaker 3: keep telling you all own examples involved. I can't think

771
00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:13,440
Speaker 3: of it. So anyway, you know the thing, I'm not

772
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 3: a great investor in companies because when I invest in businesses,

773
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:25,320
Speaker 3: I always think, well, outdoor voices perfect example, where forget

774
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:29,800
Speaker 3: about it. When I invest in companies, I think about

775
00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:34,959
Speaker 3: then in my own vision and imagination. When I got

776
00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 3: involved in outdoor Voices, I thought that, wow, this is

777
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:46,600
Speaker 3: a competitor to lenment. But stories not pretty the end

778
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:50,800
Speaker 3: of it. But I was chairman. I was given those story.

779
00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:54,960
Speaker 3: So but anyway, you've got to look at the long

780
00:47:55,080 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 3: term and building a company never ends every single day.

781
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:07,279
Speaker 3: I was a GAP for eighteen years. One day I

782
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,839
Speaker 3: was out the next day, Steve Jobs called me at night,

783
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:17,080
Speaker 3: tomorrow's your last day. They wouldn't tell him because and

784
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:19,839
Speaker 3: this is not a secret, it's he called me at

785
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:23,320
Speaker 3: night when they had to tell him. And eighteen years

786
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 3: had to rock the year. But hello, So you know,

787
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:33,080
Speaker 3: you just got to understand what people I and I

788
00:48:33,320 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 3: integert and sensitively and working for your associates is the

789
00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:43,239
Speaker 3: number one ingredient of building a great company. But a

790
00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 3: lot of people get very self impressed by look at

791
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:50,440
Speaker 3: the chair on and on this some of that. You know,

792
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,480
Speaker 3: That's why I thank my growing up years because I

793
00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:57,239
Speaker 3: didn't know anyone who like was a big shot, was

794
00:48:57,280 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 3: a mentor who really was very nice. So I'll call

795
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:03,320
Speaker 3: the little people, which I want to.

796
00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:05,759
Speaker 2: But you talk about you know, one day, all of

797
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:07,919
Speaker 2: a sudden, you're gone. So Paul and I are big

798
00:49:07,960 --> 00:49:11,800
Speaker 2: hockey fans. We love watching hockey. And my friend Joel

799
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:14,880
Speaker 2: Quinnville was the head coach of the Chicago Blackhawks, a

800
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:17,920
Speaker 2: team that hadn't won the Stanley Cup in decades. He

801
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:24,560
Speaker 2: won three Stanley Cups, three and all. Then he had

802
00:49:24,560 --> 00:49:27,920
Speaker 2: a bad year and boom he was gone. That was

803
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 2: it had a bad year and he turned around that's

804
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,319
Speaker 2: what happens. I mean, you see it all the time

805
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:36,440
Speaker 2: in your business, right, it happens.

806
00:49:36,120 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 3: All the time. What had been done from me lately.

807
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:42,520
Speaker 2: So speaking of things being gone, because Paul touched on

808
00:49:42,560 --> 00:49:44,120
Speaker 2: this before, but I just would love for you to

809
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,320
Speaker 2: amplify this. When I started my career as a shopping

810
00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 2: center developer, and mel Simon and Herb Simon believed in

811
00:49:50,840 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: me and they gave me money to go out and

812
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:57,320
Speaker 2: start some projects, you had to have a three department

813
00:49:57,360 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 2: store or even a four department store and closed mall.

814
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:02,080
Speaker 2: That was it. If I wanted to get you as

815
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:05,359
Speaker 2: a retailer, in order to get you into that into

816
00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:07,920
Speaker 2: my shopping center, it had to have three or four

817
00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:11,200
Speaker 2: department stores in an enclosed all environment. And now, of

818
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:15,239
Speaker 2: course that's completely gone. I mean there's no such thing there.

819
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 2: I mean they're a very limited number that still even exists.

820
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:23,360
Speaker 2: But as you look forward with trends, because you know,

821
00:50:23,440 --> 00:50:26,600
Speaker 2: we had Derek Blasberg on on one of our podcasts

822
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:29,680
Speaker 2: and he was terrific and talked about quiet luxury and

823
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 2: he talked about the new phases and new concepts. But

824
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 2: from retail, is there any particular thing that you see

825
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:41,000
Speaker 2: evolving that other people maybe don't see, or that the

826
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:43,240
Speaker 2: next step in the retail world.

827
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 3: Well, you know, it's a good question. I don't, by

828
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:52,319
Speaker 3: the way, have any clue what quiet luxury is. Is

829
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:56,200
Speaker 3: it luxury that doesn't make noise? I don't know what

830
00:50:56,320 --> 00:50:58,800
Speaker 3: it is. It's can they say, kind of the screet

831
00:50:58,960 --> 00:51:03,840
Speaker 3: maybe everyone one those who's wearing whatever I think clothes

832
00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 3: have to be. I call them normalized. I look at

833
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 3: the way people dressed forgetting my own style. The chain's

834
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:17,280
Speaker 3: a vintage. I've worn the same style shoes in rolling years.

835
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:22,919
Speaker 3: But I think, to me, important things have lasting poor.

836
00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 3: They're plastic, but they don't go out of style, and

837
00:51:27,280 --> 00:51:29,920
Speaker 3: they don't you don't have to take a mortgage out

838
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:34,960
Speaker 3: to buy them. And what people say, I listen, you

839
00:51:35,000 --> 00:51:40,439
Speaker 3: know the clothes today, the prices of designer clothes kind

840
00:51:40,440 --> 00:51:46,680
Speaker 3: of forget of people's pocketbook, and then they line up

841
00:51:46,719 --> 00:51:52,640
Speaker 3: at the stores. They're buying prestige and status all my opinion,

842
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:55,160
Speaker 3: because they have this now. When I was a young

843
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:59,320
Speaker 3: guy in my late twenties, thirties, and then again I

844
00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:04,080
Speaker 3: went to Florence, I used to go there, you know,

845
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:07,040
Speaker 3: for Italy. I was a sweater bowl, and I think

846
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:11,759
Speaker 3: I waited online for Gucci buckle loaf from once and

847
00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:15,399
Speaker 3: that was a big deal. Now I don't know what

848
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:18,200
Speaker 3: the big deals are and the prices. I know what

849
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:21,000
Speaker 3: things cost, and I know a lot of people are

850
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 3: talking about the price of close, even not designer closed.

851
00:52:26,120 --> 00:52:29,960
Speaker 3: We are fair. That's my gain, always has been my paging.

852
00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:34,640
Speaker 3: Fair price is good value. And the other thing that's happening,

853
00:52:34,719 --> 00:52:39,120
Speaker 3: which is ominous, is if you start to look at

854
00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:44,919
Speaker 3: the prices of the sales that's going on, because there's

855
00:52:44,960 --> 00:52:48,440
Speaker 3: this thing happening which I hear from a lot of people.

856
00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:54,920
Speaker 3: The retailers are buying the goods, they price them at

857
00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:58,960
Speaker 3: a higher price. Why because when they go on sale

858
00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:02,040
Speaker 3: they can get their normal margin, and you know what

859
00:53:02,080 --> 00:53:05,919
Speaker 3: that does to the integering of any business. So I'm

860
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:10,239
Speaker 3: not a big proponent if in fact, people came in

861
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:14,120
Speaker 3: who didn't see you around corners, who had high integrity

862
00:53:14,160 --> 00:53:17,919
Speaker 3: and a vision, and again some of them lvah, I mean,

863
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 3: who's more, you know, more successful. On the other hand,

864
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:26,440
Speaker 3: I don't know who we pay three thousand dollars for

865
00:53:26,600 --> 00:53:31,319
Speaker 3: crue neck casume sweater, but they do. So I'm not

866
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 3: a big I'm not that optimistic. I always judge every

867
00:53:36,719 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 3: business by the people at the top, and there's always

868
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:45,920
Speaker 3: in every probably music is it's skiff been real sick.

869
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:48,960
Speaker 3: You look at who's setting the tone, and you'll look

870
00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:53,640
Speaker 3: at who's responsible, and then it goes from there.

871
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:57,160
Speaker 1: Correct, you're very informative. That will you say sales? I've

872
00:53:57,239 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 1: always abused with that because in reality, do they go

873
00:54:00,600 --> 00:54:03,319
Speaker 1: in and they say a sale item. They don't just

874
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:06,920
Speaker 1: buy that, They buy three others and it's not a sale.

875
00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:07,640
Speaker 3: Yeah.

876
00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:20,799
Speaker 8: Well, you're right, Paul is a bit of a fashionista.

877
00:54:20,920 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 2: Obviously he has to perform. But what we talked about

878
00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 2: the fact when we used to go buy these custom

879
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:28,279
Speaker 2: made suits. Now you look in New York if you

880
00:54:28,320 --> 00:54:32,000
Speaker 2: went to a lawyer's office, and let's say the nineties

881
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:35,480
Speaker 2: or even two thousand and you went to a meeting

882
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:37,520
Speaker 2: and you didn't have a coat and tie on, I

883
00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:39,239
Speaker 2: mean they look at you like there was something wrong

884
00:54:39,239 --> 00:54:39,480
Speaker 2: with you.

885
00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:39,759
Speaker 5: One.

886
00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:43,879
Speaker 2: Now, did you ever, in your wildest dreams think that

887
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 2: not only would people no longer be wearing neckties, but

888
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:50,160
Speaker 2: they would no longer be wearing suits to work?

889
00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:55,399
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I never kind of felt would say that,

890
00:54:55,440 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 3: but we did a casual Fridays at the at Wall

891
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:06,440
Speaker 3: Street and stock Market when we were at GAP and

892
00:55:07,200 --> 00:55:10,879
Speaker 3: I think people say that we have had a lot

893
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:17,799
Speaker 3: to do with the casualizing of appalling the world, and I,

894
00:55:18,160 --> 00:55:20,160
Speaker 3: you know, I think it's a nice thing to think

895
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:21,960
Speaker 3: we had a lot to do with it. But when

896
00:55:22,000 --> 00:55:25,719
Speaker 3: we did, I'll never forget that Friday. We created casual

897
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:29,520
Speaker 3: Friday and who thought it would change the world. But

898
00:55:29,680 --> 00:55:33,719
Speaker 3: over the years casual clothes. Look at today, it's rare

899
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:36,600
Speaker 3: to see someone with a tie. I'm not saying it's

900
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:39,319
Speaker 3: right or wrong. I think it's much more comfortable the

901
00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:43,640
Speaker 3: way we dress without the you know, net's been tight a.

902
00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:46,840
Speaker 2: How about how about in Europe, like in London in Paris.

903
00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:50,160
Speaker 3: You know, I haven't the last few years. I haven't

904
00:55:50,680 --> 00:55:54,759
Speaker 3: been there, so I don't have an opinion. I don't know.

905
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:58,000
Speaker 1: Well, I've seen it. I you know, I've been going

906
00:55:58,040 --> 00:56:01,040
Speaker 1: there quite a bit for years, and you'd be amazed,

907
00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:05,400
Speaker 1: Skip Mickey, I stayed at the Ritz for years, and

908
00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:09,440
Speaker 1: the complaint in the last few years from the Matre D's,

909
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:13,800
Speaker 1: the restaurants with the influx of a certain different crowd.

910
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:17,279
Speaker 1: I'll leave it at that. They're sitting there in shorts

911
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:20,759
Speaker 1: and running shoes, and because they've got money, they let

912
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:23,440
Speaker 1: them into the bar. They let him into the restaurant.

913
00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:26,120
Speaker 1: And it's the most frightening thing to see because I've

914
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,160
Speaker 1: known them through the years, the owners, etc. They say,

915
00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:31,600
Speaker 1: we don't know what to do about it. Their parents

916
00:56:31,800 --> 00:56:34,880
Speaker 1: are here and these kids have all this money and

917
00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:37,719
Speaker 1: that's the way they dress. And we get complaints.

918
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:40,160
Speaker 2: Because you'd go to Broadway, you know, back in the day,

919
00:56:40,320 --> 00:56:42,160
Speaker 2: and you know people were dressed up to go to

920
00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:45,480
Speaker 2: a play. Now you know, we were in New York recently,

921
00:56:45,520 --> 00:56:48,280
Speaker 2: went to a show. No one wearing a jacket or tie.

922
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,040
Speaker 1: Skip you know how you know how we traveled years ago,

923
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:55,319
Speaker 1: and I started traveling in the fifties, right but right

924
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:57,920
Speaker 1: for so many years. And I'm sure you guys can

925
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:05,400
Speaker 1: identify everyone the travel on an aircraft, shirt, tie, the cats,

926
00:57:05,560 --> 00:57:08,760
Speaker 1: the women were depped, they got off the plane looking

927
00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:12,960
Speaker 1: like they walked out or wherever. Unilaterally, everybody was dressed

928
00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:14,480
Speaker 1: on that aircraft.

929
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:18,640
Speaker 3: A hundred percent. I was talking about that with a

930
00:57:18,680 --> 00:57:22,520
Speaker 3: friend today. Our son, who's sixteed goes with a suit

931
00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:25,760
Speaker 3: and tie on an airplane. It's probably the only kid

932
00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:28,400
Speaker 3: in the world. But you know the world's change in

933
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:31,040
Speaker 3: that regard, and I don't you know, I don't want

934
00:57:31,080 --> 00:57:33,880
Speaker 3: to be from the man born. I'm not, but you know,

935
00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:37,720
Speaker 3: to me there's a certain amount of pride and people

936
00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:42,840
Speaker 3: you know, the closer what they are, right.

937
00:57:41,560 --> 00:57:43,080
Speaker 1: Nicky, let me ask you. I want to ask them

938
00:57:43,080 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 1: the evolution into those brilliant gap ads. How'd you come

939
00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:48,520
Speaker 1: up with that?

940
00:57:48,600 --> 00:57:49,480
Speaker 3: Who came up with that?

941
00:57:49,520 --> 00:57:50,520
Speaker 1: I assume that was you?

942
00:57:50,560 --> 00:57:55,720
Speaker 3: No, well, I don't you never do anything by your

943
00:57:56,280 --> 00:57:59,919
Speaker 3: team and a gap I never forget. The first can

944
00:58:00,160 --> 00:58:05,680
Speaker 3: pain was individuals of style and the woman I worked with, Maggie,

945
00:58:05,880 --> 00:58:09,400
Speaker 3: I kept saying, it was just you felt that I

946
00:58:09,560 --> 00:58:15,280
Speaker 3: sent our closed Gap. Look, they're very good looking clothes,

947
00:58:15,920 --> 00:58:19,960
Speaker 3: simple and they go with almost anything. And we were

948
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:26,600
Speaker 3: noticing people who fancied Dan dresses, designer clothes were wearing

949
00:58:26,600 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 3: a Gap T shirt that were wearing this from the

950
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 3: Gap and that campaign. We talked about it, saying, let's

951
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:38,720
Speaker 3: show people, I mean, this takes time to think it through.

952
00:58:39,360 --> 00:58:46,320
Speaker 3: Cool people wearing Gap clothes T shirts classics on well known,

953
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:51,640
Speaker 3: very hit people and they were free that and my

954
00:58:52,160 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 3: teen members, Maggie and I think Jeff. There were a

955
00:58:58,440 --> 00:59:02,280
Speaker 3: bunch of people there, but you know all these things

956
00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:06,520
Speaker 3: that came. Maggie came up to me one day. Jim

957
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:10,600
Speaker 3: also was there, and she should said, what do you

958
00:59:10,720 --> 00:59:15,320
Speaker 3: think of these pictures? It's called black and white campaign?

959
00:59:15,600 --> 00:59:20,760
Speaker 3: I looked by Jones and this one. Louis armsbilled that

960
00:59:20,800 --> 00:59:26,640
Speaker 3: one and that one. I said, it's effing unbelieving. It

961
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:31,880
Speaker 3: takes two or more, but you know, I might inspire.

962
00:59:33,280 --> 00:59:38,000
Speaker 3: She and her team broke and the campaigns there at

963
00:59:38,080 --> 00:59:42,960
Speaker 3: Gap at Old Nady, Richard Chrisman did Old Nandy. Old

964
00:59:43,040 --> 00:59:47,120
Speaker 3: Lady now is ten or eleven billion dollars of gaps

965
00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:52,960
Speaker 3: business and we started it on a win because Stayton Hudson,

966
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:57,720
Speaker 3: the target was opening up a competitor to Gap, and

967
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:02,200
Speaker 3: it was an article in the Times Curious tactive. So

968
01:00:02,280 --> 01:00:04,320
Speaker 3: I flew them all in America. I looked at their

969
01:00:04,600 --> 01:00:09,760
Speaker 3: version of Gap at cheaper prices. Two minutes I was

970
01:00:09,800 --> 01:00:13,800
Speaker 3: in store. I let feeling, wow, they're not going to

971
01:00:13,800 --> 01:00:17,800
Speaker 3: touch us. But I also said they were a company

972
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:21,560
Speaker 3: that does a lot of warranket research. My market research

973
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:24,800
Speaker 3: hours is yes, someone in the street as someone in store.

974
01:00:25,560 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 3: Wrong story short, very I gained I got back to

975
01:00:31,640 --> 01:00:36,360
Speaker 3: San Francisco, gave ten people in that demography two hundred

976
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:41,640
Speaker 3: dollars each. I assigned them a discount shop and a category.

977
01:00:41,840 --> 01:00:44,800
Speaker 3: So go to Walmart and buy these shirts. Go here.

978
01:00:45,320 --> 01:00:48,360
Speaker 3: And a week later they came back. I was so

979
01:00:48,560 --> 01:00:53,240
Speaker 3: happy to hear what they said. They want nice merchand bikes.

980
01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:57,280
Speaker 3: They don't care if the prices are eight ninety seven Walmart.

981
01:00:57,320 --> 01:01:01,640
Speaker 3: You stillways ending non prices. They don't want sale, they

982
01:01:01,680 --> 01:01:06,240
Speaker 3: want fair every day prices cling stores, and they like that.

983
01:01:07,600 --> 01:01:12,480
Speaker 3: After that meeting, I said to myself, Besidelude, I said,

984
01:01:12,640 --> 01:01:17,800
Speaker 3: we're doing this company. And we had Jeff started in Jenny,

985
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:21,720
Speaker 3: my old partners who ran the other businesses there, and

986
01:01:22,160 --> 01:01:24,040
Speaker 3: we worked on it and this is kind of an

987
01:01:24,120 --> 01:01:28,760
Speaker 3: interesting corporate story. Couldn't come up with Nate. And we

988
01:01:28,760 --> 01:01:33,240
Speaker 3: were ready to launch a month or two. And in Paris,

989
01:01:34,160 --> 01:01:39,480
Speaker 3: shopping shops or whatever, I'm on my way to the airport.

990
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:43,040
Speaker 3: I look out the window. Let me get Thank god,

991
01:01:43,040 --> 01:01:46,919
Speaker 3: I'm in the back seat on the left roussa, Germaine.

992
01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:52,360
Speaker 3: I see a neon light on a bar old Navy.

993
01:01:53,560 --> 01:01:59,480
Speaker 3: I said, that's the name that what happens in bureaucracies

994
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:04,800
Speaker 3: registered in New York. It wasn't taken Old Maybe. Then

995
01:02:05,000 --> 01:02:08,680
Speaker 3: the board didn't like the name dot dot da. We

996
01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:14,720
Speaker 3: hired two naming companies, consultants, whatever, and they came up

997
01:02:14,720 --> 01:02:18,960
Speaker 3: with horrible names. In today's dollars, is probably four million

998
01:02:19,040 --> 01:02:23,800
Speaker 3: dollars of cost. And the first store was called Gap

999
01:02:23,880 --> 01:02:27,520
Speaker 3: Old Maybe, and it's like putting pepsine and hope here. Anyway,

1000
01:02:27,560 --> 01:02:31,720
Speaker 3: long story short. The second store we called Old Navy,

1001
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:37,440
Speaker 3: and I loved that name. May Well nineteen thirty seven.

1002
01:02:38,040 --> 01:02:41,120
Speaker 3: Someone showed me the sign. And that's why when I

1003
01:02:41,320 --> 01:02:44,400
Speaker 3: say how much of what we all do is inside

1004
01:02:44,480 --> 01:02:48,800
Speaker 3: us or inside a partner you work with, we have confidence.

1005
01:02:49,160 --> 01:02:51,040
Speaker 2: So Mickey, you know we believe or that we've been

1006
01:02:51,080 --> 01:02:52,920
Speaker 2: out for an hour. I can't believe. This feels like

1007
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:56,600
Speaker 2: twenty minutes. But here's the question, so I know you're

1008
01:02:56,600 --> 01:02:59,000
Speaker 2: a creature of habit. Paul. This guy goes to soul

1009
01:02:59,120 --> 01:03:02,200
Speaker 2: cycle every day. He's in great shape, I mean really

1010
01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:06,120
Speaker 2: great shape, and he never never misses. But what do

1011
01:03:06,160 --> 01:03:08,440
Speaker 2: you worry about now at this stage of life. It

1012
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:09,960
Speaker 2: can't be money. You got all the money.

1013
01:03:10,200 --> 01:03:12,280
Speaker 1: I don't think he's a worrier. I don't think Mike

1014
01:03:12,360 --> 01:03:12,960
Speaker 1: he's a warrior.

1015
01:03:13,080 --> 01:03:14,439
Speaker 2: Oh no, you don't know him.

1016
01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:15,360
Speaker 3: Is he way?

1017
01:03:15,480 --> 01:03:16,000
Speaker 5: Way? Way?

1018
01:03:16,520 --> 01:03:17,000
Speaker 3: You don't know.

1019
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:19,000
Speaker 2: You don't know him. You don't know him.

1020
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:20,520
Speaker 1: I don't believe in worrying.

1021
01:03:21,880 --> 01:03:24,400
Speaker 3: Well, if you don't believe in it, give me the best, Senoran.

1022
01:03:24,520 --> 01:03:26,360
Speaker 1: Okay, I got it.

1023
01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:30,840
Speaker 3: I wish you'll help me on that.

1024
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:33,040
Speaker 1: That's a tough one, Okay, go ahead.

1025
01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:34,680
Speaker 3: All right? Well what are you worry.

1026
01:03:34,640 --> 01:03:36,960
Speaker 2: What keep you up? What makes you worry?

1027
01:03:37,120 --> 01:03:43,320
Speaker 3: I worry about well success. I worry about getting Alex

1028
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:49,160
Speaker 3: mill on the map and delivering for the next generation

1029
01:03:50,040 --> 01:03:55,000
Speaker 3: a great comedy. And that's what I worry about. You know.

1030
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:58,600
Speaker 3: I don't have to worry about the things everyone else. Look,

1031
01:03:58,680 --> 01:04:02,040
Speaker 3: I've been very lucky my life in that regard. But

1032
01:04:02,120 --> 01:04:05,040
Speaker 3: I I'm you know something I got to tell you for.

1033
01:04:05,520 --> 01:04:10,800
Speaker 3: It's the saying worries I've had for all these decades. Okay,

1034
01:04:11,440 --> 01:04:13,800
Speaker 3: every day it's a worry.

1035
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:16,400
Speaker 2: Isn't it. Tell me if this isn't the truth. I'm

1036
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:18,560
Speaker 2: sure that this is. But tell me if you don't

1037
01:04:18,560 --> 01:04:21,640
Speaker 2: think it is. You love to hire people who worry,

1038
01:04:21,680 --> 01:04:22,680
Speaker 2: You want worriers?

1039
01:04:23,040 --> 01:04:27,000
Speaker 3: All right, Well, it's you know, I love to hire

1040
01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:32,320
Speaker 3: people who who aren't self important, who have a history

1041
01:04:32,360 --> 01:04:36,280
Speaker 3: of working hard. I like to bolly with them on

1042
01:04:36,320 --> 01:04:40,160
Speaker 3: an interview, because when you're volleying, you meet someone in

1043
01:04:40,240 --> 01:04:45,520
Speaker 3: these unpreshing virns, you learn very quickly what they're like.

1044
01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:50,280
Speaker 3: I like people who walk fast. I do I watch

1045
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:53,720
Speaker 3: them come down the hallway now, I like. I always

1046
01:04:53,760 --> 01:04:58,640
Speaker 3: ask one of the big companies my assistance, I said,

1047
01:04:58,680 --> 01:05:01,440
Speaker 3: what do you think of the handy because they're shoosing

1048
01:05:01,920 --> 01:05:05,680
Speaker 3: and I hadn't always had offices or whatever. And I

1049
01:05:05,800 --> 01:05:10,480
Speaker 3: listened to them, because what do you think? Look, interviewing

1050
01:05:10,560 --> 01:05:14,480
Speaker 3: and all that is a matter of acting. Get the

1051
01:05:14,640 --> 01:05:20,560
Speaker 3: resume together, figure out what the person is going to

1052
01:05:20,800 --> 01:05:23,840
Speaker 3: ask you or me. And I always asked this to

1053
01:05:24,000 --> 01:05:27,360
Speaker 3: on part time jobs. I always say, like someone worked

1054
01:05:27,360 --> 01:05:30,360
Speaker 3: in Starbucks. I said, if you were the boss of

1055
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:35,120
Speaker 3: that store, what would you do differently? And he said

1056
01:05:35,200 --> 01:05:37,520
Speaker 3: to me, he thought it was all good. This is

1057
01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:41,160
Speaker 3: ten fifteen. I said, what about these counters that like

1058
01:05:41,200 --> 01:05:44,120
Speaker 3: a disgusting would want to stop on them? But I

1059
01:05:44,160 --> 01:05:47,520
Speaker 3: always asked, if they go to high school college, tell

1060
01:05:47,560 --> 01:05:51,000
Speaker 3: me what you would do if you were the head

1061
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:54,960
Speaker 3: of the college the high school. And I asked people

1062
01:05:54,960 --> 01:05:58,840
Speaker 3: on the woman who was a junior in high school Westchester,

1063
01:05:59,440 --> 01:06:03,080
Speaker 3: and I heard the name, I said, who is the

1064
01:06:03,200 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 3: name of the who was the high school named after?

1065
01:06:07,240 --> 01:06:09,840
Speaker 3: No idea, you go to a high school, you want

1066
01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:14,640
Speaker 3: to know whoever it is. This it's conversation. You know,

1067
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:18,600
Speaker 3: both of you pick it up and or your rehearse

1068
01:06:18,760 --> 01:06:23,640
Speaker 3: and I resumes tell me so much because you know that,

1069
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:29,200
Speaker 3: oh you're doing this volunteer work to impress us. Yeah,

1070
01:06:29,320 --> 01:06:32,960
Speaker 3: mostly can the ones who admit that I love I

1071
01:06:33,000 --> 01:06:35,240
Speaker 3: did it because you know whatever.

1072
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:38,280
Speaker 2: Another thing you have in common with Paul though, because

1073
01:06:38,280 --> 01:06:40,920
Speaker 2: you're always talking about team, Well, it's not me. It

1074
01:06:41,040 --> 01:06:43,040
Speaker 2: was the team. No, I didn't do that, it was

1075
01:06:43,080 --> 01:06:47,200
Speaker 2: the team. I've been watching Paul's concerts since the nineteen seventies.

1076
01:06:47,320 --> 01:06:49,919
Speaker 2: He's never done one show when he didn't introduce every

1077
01:06:49,960 --> 01:06:52,440
Speaker 2: member of the band or the orchestra that he's working with,

1078
01:06:52,880 --> 01:06:56,160
Speaker 2: and he gives them credit because that's that's And you're

1079
01:06:56,200 --> 01:06:59,000
Speaker 2: the same way, Mickey. You've always been a guy to

1080
01:06:59,040 --> 01:07:00,240
Speaker 2: share the credit with you people.

1081
01:07:00,480 --> 01:07:02,880
Speaker 1: Well success as many fathers as we know.

1082
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:06,880
Speaker 3: That's right. Look, you know, if I called my biggest

1083
01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:11,320
Speaker 3: compliment is I'm a mensh and I'm hanging the shock now.

1084
01:07:12,080 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 3: Trans you know, that's what people like today. This is

1085
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:18,960
Speaker 3: so many people so important.

1086
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:22,320
Speaker 2: Well, you just identified yourself because that's who you are,

1087
01:07:22,360 --> 01:07:24,040
Speaker 2: and we and we love you for doing this. This

1088
01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:26,440
Speaker 2: is for you to take the time of out of

1089
01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:28,680
Speaker 2: your day to do this with us where it's fun

1090
01:07:28,680 --> 01:07:29,320
Speaker 2: to talk to you.

1091
01:07:29,320 --> 01:07:32,760
Speaker 3: You know, I thought maybe Paul would teach me how

1092
01:07:32,800 --> 01:07:36,760
Speaker 3: to sing, because I always actual worse voice in the world.

1093
01:07:36,840 --> 01:07:37,360
Speaker 3: But it didn't.

1094
01:07:38,040 --> 01:07:41,920
Speaker 1: Next time, well, Nikky, I'll on that note, on that note,

1095
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:45,000
Speaker 1: and I'm going to drop a name. I did some

1096
01:07:45,200 --> 01:07:49,560
Speaker 1: work for Warren Buffett and it evolved into exactly what

1097
01:07:49,640 --> 01:07:54,600
Speaker 1: you said. And I have him recorded singing by way.

1098
01:07:54,680 --> 01:07:54,800
Speaker 5: Oh.

1099
01:07:56,160 --> 01:07:58,760
Speaker 1: I took him in a studio and he plays it

1100
01:07:58,800 --> 01:07:59,920
Speaker 1: every day in his office.

1101
01:08:00,120 --> 01:08:00,760
Speaker 3: I love it.

1102
01:08:00,840 --> 01:08:04,080
Speaker 1: So we're going to put the lean on you on

1103
01:08:04,160 --> 01:08:07,360
Speaker 1: our next one because we've had different guests who have sung.

1104
01:08:07,600 --> 01:08:12,439
Speaker 1: Oh my god, anybody can sing today, Mickey, and failing that,

1105
01:08:12,920 --> 01:08:14,720
Speaker 1: you let me know when your birthday is or a

1106
01:08:14,760 --> 01:08:15,520
Speaker 1: fiem in town.

1107
01:08:15,800 --> 01:08:18,040
Speaker 3: Okay, you got it, and I'll.

1108
01:08:17,840 --> 01:08:19,920
Speaker 1: Put something together for you and I to sing.

1109
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:20,320
Speaker 6: How's that?

1110
01:08:20,840 --> 01:08:25,160
Speaker 3: Paul and Skip love you guys. This suit's fun. Let's

1111
01:08:25,240 --> 01:08:28,320
Speaker 3: go on the road, take care of Thanks Again by

1112
01:08:28,360 --> 01:08:33,280
Speaker 3: Bye Bye.

1113
01:08:35,240 --> 01:08:38,040
Speaker 1: Our Way with Paul Anka and Skip Bronson is a

1114
01:08:38,080 --> 01:08:40,040
Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

1115
01:08:40,800 --> 01:08:45,840
Speaker 2: The show's executive producer is Jordan Runtogg, with supervising producer

1116
01:08:45,840 --> 01:08:47,559
Speaker 2: and editor Marcy Depina.

1117
01:08:48,000 --> 01:08:52,240
Speaker 1: It was engineered by Todd Carlin and Graham Gibson, mixed

1118
01:08:52,280 --> 01:08:54,920
Speaker 1: and mastered by a wonderful Mary Dude.

1119
01:08:55,800 --> 01:08:58,200
Speaker 2: If you like what you heard, please subscribe and leave

1120
01:08:58,280 --> 01:08:58,920
Speaker 2: us a review.

1121
01:08:59,160 --> 01:09:04,040
Speaker 1: For more podcast ass on iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1122
01:09:04,880 --> 01:09:09,879
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.