WEBVTT - Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend-January 9, 2021 0:00:01.080 --> 0:00:05.119 This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg 0:00:05.200 --> 0:00:09.080 Quick Takes. Tim Steinovic from Bloomberg Radio. Welcome to the 0:00:09.080 --> 0:00:11.760 weekend edition of Bloomberg Business Week. Tim. It was your 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:14.440 first full week with me as co host of Business Week, 0:00:14.560 --> 0:00:16.720 so great to have you here and listen. It was 0:00:16.760 --> 0:00:19.439 our first full week of the new year, week forty three, 0:00:19.680 --> 0:00:22.439 working from home. Still for so many we've been in 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:25.239 our New York studio together covering a time that will 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:28.320 be embedded in US history forever because of a mob 0:00:28.360 --> 0:00:32.280 of Trump supporters laying siege of the US capital on Wednesday. Carol, 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:34.479 you and I were covering this live with a lot 0:00:34.520 --> 0:00:37.080 of help from our reporters in Washington, and it was 0:00:37.120 --> 0:00:39.519 remarkable to see it play out play by play, and 0:00:39.600 --> 0:00:43.640 politics definitely front and center as COVID nineteen continues to 0:00:43.720 --> 0:00:45.960 rage on here in the US and around the world, 0:00:46.200 --> 0:00:48.960 causing more and more economic shutdowns. And with that as 0:00:48.960 --> 0:00:52.479 our backdrop, we'll hear from Chris lu former Deputy Secretary 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:55.920 of Labor under the Obama administration and executive director of 0:00:55.960 --> 0:00:59.160 Barack Obama's two thousand eight transition team. He's also a 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:03.120 member of Joe Biden's transition team, so great conversation looking 0:01:03.120 --> 0:01:06.520 forward to that. Also, we cannot let down our vigilance. 0:01:06.560 --> 0:01:08.760 We can't assume that a vaccine is going to be 0:01:08.800 --> 0:01:12.040 to panacea. The founder of Human Genome Sciences, Dr William 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:15.520 Hasltin on the virus is worrisome headlines and the chief 0:01:15.520 --> 0:01:19.120 information officer at B and Y Melon's pershing on pandemic 0:01:19.160 --> 0:01:21.440 tech trends that are taking off. All of that to 0:01:21.480 --> 0:01:24.399 come to him though, We begin with this week's cover story, 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:27.520 the trashing of American Democracy, a new law in American 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:31.000 politics and it's almost two hundred fifty year old democracy. 0:01:31.080 --> 0:01:34.280 We caught up with Bloomberg business Week national correspondent Josh 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:37.200 Green and Bloomberg business Week titor Joel Weber on this 0:01:37.319 --> 0:01:40.360 story that is told through pictures and a timeline, just 0:01:40.400 --> 0:01:43.080 to give you a sense of kind of what what 0:01:43.080 --> 0:01:45.240 what we go through a magazine is. You know, Wednesday, 0:01:45.240 --> 0:01:47.720 we we tend to we shipp the covers, shipped a 0:01:47.760 --> 0:01:50.040 lot of the magazine. On Wednesday, we were ready to 0:01:50.040 --> 0:01:53.440 go with a completely different cover, and I actually released 0:01:53.440 --> 0:01:56.040 that file and then immediately caught it back when we 0:01:56.040 --> 0:01:59.040 witnessed what was happening in DC, because it's like, how 0:01:59.080 --> 0:02:01.559 could you not talk about out what was happening in 0:02:01.640 --> 0:02:04.320 the nation's capital. And Um, Josh actually had nothing to 0:02:04.360 --> 0:02:06.440 do with what we ended up doing in the issue 0:02:06.440 --> 0:02:09.560 because everything unfolded so quickly and we are on such 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:13.120 a tight um timeline, and you know, the trashing of 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:16.679 American democracy seemed exactly like the right line to use. 0:02:17.639 --> 0:02:20.080 Main cover line was was new Low and and it 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:23.760 really felt that way and still feels that way way today. 0:02:23.800 --> 0:02:26.440 So I think we made the right call. And who 0:02:26.440 --> 0:02:29.080 knows that the world well ever see that other great idea. 0:02:29.480 --> 0:02:32.040 Hopefully they will. But the reason I wanted to bring 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:34.280 Josh on the program today is just because I think, 0:02:34.680 --> 0:02:37.880 you know, because of Devil's Bargain and he's sort of 0:02:38.000 --> 0:02:41.240 his knowledge of of Bannon gave us a really early 0:02:41.280 --> 0:02:45.560 sense of how how real the Trump effect was gonna be. 0:02:45.960 --> 0:02:48.240 And so and did the cover story hit a couple 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:50.760 of months ago on the coming out of the election 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:53.680 of Trump is um is here to stay? So so Josh, like, 0:02:53.880 --> 0:02:55.959 help me understand. Do you think Trump is um is 0:02:56.000 --> 0:02:59.640 still here to stay? Yeah? I certainly think it is 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:03.840 kind of an ugly reminder of its enduring power. With 0:03:03.960 --> 0:03:11.200 a not insubstantial group of hard right wing Republican voters. Um. 0:03:11.280 --> 0:03:14.920 You know, as as we see things here in Washington. 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:19.200 You know, a lot of times elected officials, Republican senators 0:03:19.200 --> 0:03:22.680 and House members go along with this, this sort of 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:26.600 thing and indulged Trump out of a sense of careerism 0:03:26.639 --> 0:03:30.960 and opportunity and uh, you know, a desire to advance 0:03:31.000 --> 0:03:35.120 within the party and a fear of their own Republican voters. 0:03:35.160 --> 0:03:38.360 And I think yesterday illustrated the danger in indulging this 0:03:38.480 --> 0:03:42.240 sort of thing and indulging Trump. Um. But you know, 0:03:42.320 --> 0:03:46.520 to me, one of the most horrifying things we witnessed 0:03:46.600 --> 0:03:49.440 was that after this violence that left four people dead, 0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:55.600 the capital overrun for the first time since eighteen twelve, 0:03:56.680 --> 0:04:00.480 was that a majority went ahead anyway after the words 0:04:00.520 --> 0:04:03.560 once Congress Reconnan in the middle of the night, uh 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:05.960 and objected to Joe Biden the victories. I think that 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:12.960 that shows you that even after this kind of mayhem, violence, death, terrorism, um, 0:04:12.960 --> 0:04:15.680 that Republicans are a certain segment of them are still 0:04:15.720 --> 0:04:18.119 going to march in line behind Donald Trump and whatever 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:20.360 it is that he wants to do. And I think 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:22.440 that's a good indication that there isn't going to be 0:04:22.520 --> 0:04:25.840 a clean break on January twentieth, and that that the 0:04:25.880 --> 0:04:28.360 country isn't going to be able to move beyond Trump, 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:32.120 certainly not the Republican Party. Josh we we how do 0:04:32.160 --> 0:04:35.840 you joining us live on the radio as this was 0:04:35.880 --> 0:04:39.120 taking place on the in the Capitol, Um for your 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:42.320 immediate reaction, for your immediate analysis. But I'm wondering to 0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:45.960 sort of think back on what happened, Um, what's the 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:50.120 damage that's been done? No, I don't think we can 0:04:50.440 --> 0:04:53.400 begin to really know the answer to that question. I mean, 0:04:53.800 --> 0:04:57.159 you know, part of the damage I think is is 0:04:57.400 --> 0:05:00.719 psychological and knowing that our country is acceptible of this 0:05:00.800 --> 0:05:04.160 sort of thing. I think part of the damage, um, 0:05:04.520 --> 0:05:07.440 comes to the reputation reputation of the United States in 0:05:07.480 --> 0:05:11.640 the world. I mean, it's certainly tarnished and diminished our 0:05:11.800 --> 0:05:15.120 standing even further. Uh, and the and the eyes of 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:18.520 allies and foreign countries. I mean one of the one 0:05:18.520 --> 0:05:23.360 of the things was the leaders of autocratic or dictorial 0:05:23.440 --> 0:05:28.000 countries essentially trolling the United States by releasing official statement, 0:05:28.480 --> 0:05:31.880 you know, expressing concern over the violence, death and mayhem 0:05:31.960 --> 0:05:36.400 in the US capital. Uh. It's it's just remarkable and 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:40.120 almost unthinkable that this could have happened here. And then 0:05:40.160 --> 0:05:42.160 we still have two weeks to go, and and you know, 0:05:42.160 --> 0:05:44.120 who knows. I mean, every day things seem to get 0:05:44.160 --> 0:05:46.839 worse in Washington. You don't think it can get worse, 0:05:47.240 --> 0:05:49.279 and then you turn on the news and see people 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:54.000 overrunning the capitol, uh, fighting being killed. Um, so you know, 0:05:54.720 --> 0:05:57.520 until Trump is out of office on January twenty, which 0:05:57.520 --> 0:06:00.440 I do think will happen eventually. UM. You know, we 0:06:00.839 --> 0:06:04.599 really don't have the kind of distances perspective that we 0:06:04.640 --> 0:06:08.760 need you to answer that question. How significant is it that, um, 0:06:09.120 --> 0:06:13.520 social media companies have intervened, at least some of them slightly, 0:06:13.600 --> 0:06:15.160 you know, in all serves. And I think that is 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:17.479 a really big deal. And I think it's commendable what 0:06:17.560 --> 0:06:21.680 Twitter did freezing Donald Trump's account and Facebook essentially kicking 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:24.919 him off the platform until he leaves office. That story 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:27.600 told in pictures, So definitely check it out at Bloomberg 0:06:27.680 --> 0:06:30.719 dot com or on the Bloomberg terminal. That was Bloomberg 0:06:30.720 --> 0:06:34.000 Business Week National correspondent Josh Green and Bloomberg Business Week 0:06:34.080 --> 0:06:37.159 editor Joel Weber coming up more on this week's top story. 0:06:37.240 --> 0:06:38.960 It's our cover story. We're going to check in with 0:06:39.040 --> 0:06:42.560 Chris Leu, former Deputy Secretary of Labor under the Obama administration, 0:06:42.839 --> 0:06:46.000 executive director Barack Obama's two thousand eight transition team. He's 0:06:46.120 --> 0:06:49.680 also part of Joe Biden's transition team. You're listening to 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:57.239 Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Business 0:06:57.279 --> 0:07:01.040 Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg. Quick to Tim Stinovin 0:07:01.400 --> 0:07:05.599 from Bloomberg Radio. So he's a voice that we've reached 0:07:05.600 --> 0:07:07.760 out too often to talk about the inner workings of 0:07:07.800 --> 0:07:11.080 an administration, what really goes on inside the White House. Tim, 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:13.920 we're talking about Chris Live. Yeah, that's right, Carol. Chris's 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:17.560 former Deputy Secretary of Labor under the Obama administration. He's 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:20.800 also a senior fellow at the University of Virginia Miller Center. 0:07:21.160 --> 0:07:24.560 Chris was also executive director of Barack Obama's two thousand 0:07:24.600 --> 0:07:27.120 eight transition team, and he's a member of the Biden 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:29.400 transition team. This is why we love to talk to him. 0:07:29.440 --> 0:07:31.440 We of course had to get his thoughts on this 0:07:31.520 --> 0:07:34.640 week's tests of democracy. Oh, it's somebody who's spent a 0:07:34.680 --> 0:07:37.840 dozen years on Capitol Hill. In both the Senate in 0:07:37.840 --> 0:07:40.840 the House. I mean, it was shocking, but that's even 0:07:40.880 --> 0:07:43.000 sort of an understatement. In the U. S. Capitol is 0:07:43.000 --> 0:07:46.920 one of the most secure facilities in the country. You know, 0:07:47.040 --> 0:07:51.840 it's it's protecting our highest selected leaders. It's what deliberations 0:07:51.880 --> 0:07:53.960 happen in the House and Senate. I mean, and to 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:57.480 see those people storming in as easily as they apparently did, 0:07:57.960 --> 0:08:02.200 causing the kind of havoc to seeing the proceedings, Um, 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:05.920 it's you know, we keep saying this is not who 0:08:06.000 --> 0:08:09.640 we are as Americans, but it clearly is. And I 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:11.600 think it's going to require a lot of soul searching 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:13.960 about how we got to this point, How does the 0:08:14.000 --> 0:08:15.960 country move on from this? Where do we go from here? 0:08:17.200 --> 0:08:20.360 You know, I think, um, the President elect, Joe Biden 0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:24.320 sent sent the right message. You know, he's continually talked 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:26.920 about healing, you know, really going back to the beginning 0:08:26.920 --> 0:08:29.360 of his campaign, that this was a battle for the 0:08:29.400 --> 0:08:32.040 soul of our nation. I think he is going to 0:08:32.080 --> 0:08:35.679 try to obviously take the temperature down on the rhetoric. Uh, 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:37.920 notwithstanding the fact that he's going to control both the 0:08:37.960 --> 0:08:40.880 House and Senate, He's gonna he has indicated he's going 0:08:40.880 --> 0:08:44.440 to continue to work for bipartisan solutions. Um. But I 0:08:44.480 --> 0:08:47.000 think we need to recognize that there is a very 0:08:47.000 --> 0:08:51.959 strong anti government under it's not just anti government, anti 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:56.080 all institutions undercurrent in our country right now, and that 0:08:56.200 --> 0:08:59.600 just continues to fester. And that's been a long term 0:08:59.640 --> 0:09:01.480 probably them in this country. You know, we just talked 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:04.240 Chris about the cover of Bloomberg business Week magazine this week, 0:09:04.280 --> 0:09:06.080 and this wasn't there a plan, but they had to 0:09:06.120 --> 0:09:07.880 do a quick change because there was no doubt about 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:10.520 it what the cover had to be. And in big 0:09:10.679 --> 0:09:13.240 letters it says new Low and underneath it it says 0:09:13.280 --> 0:09:16.920 the trashing of American democracy and it shows the capital. Uh, 0:09:16.960 --> 0:09:20.200 and the protesters just climbing the walls and all the 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:23.720 way up. You said something though that really resonated. You said, clearly, 0:09:23.880 --> 0:09:27.280 this is who we are as Americans, these protesters. You know, 0:09:27.480 --> 0:09:29.680 it does feel like half the country is this way. 0:09:30.160 --> 0:09:32.520 You know, a lot of people thought there was fraud 0:09:32.600 --> 0:09:35.800 in the election. Uh. There's division even within each of 0:09:35.800 --> 0:09:38.440 the parties in terms of some of the younger members, 0:09:38.440 --> 0:09:41.000 the older members, you know, the Republicans the same thing. 0:09:41.120 --> 0:09:44.280 And I do wonder how do we kind of bring 0:09:44.320 --> 0:09:46.400 it all together, so we go back to a time 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:50.080 where people did cross across the aisle or reach across 0:09:50.120 --> 0:09:54.160 the aisle and actually get things done that benefited more Americans, 0:09:54.200 --> 0:09:59.160 most Americans. You know, look, I watched the remarks both 0:09:59.240 --> 0:10:02.800 before and after the violence. I was struck by Senator 0:10:02.880 --> 0:10:06.720 McConnell's comments, where I think he really appropriately talked about 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.520 that there was no election fraud. This was not a 0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:12.320 particularly close election. You know, it is now the time 0:10:12.360 --> 0:10:15.560 to move on. And while I can applaud Senator McConnell 0:10:15.559 --> 0:10:18.559 and and other Republicans who gave statements, one wonders why 0:10:18.600 --> 0:10:21.200 those statements were not made two months ago. We've known 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:23.760 for two months who this election results are, and I 0:10:23.800 --> 0:10:25.280 think we do need to be careful. I mean, look, 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:28.040 I'm not I'm not being partisan, but this is not 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:31.200 a both sides are wrong. I mean, we have a president, 0:10:31.320 --> 0:10:35.600 sitting president who even before election day, has said if 0:10:35.600 --> 0:10:37.720 he does not win, it will be because of fraud, 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:41.560 and has continued to perpetuate this idea. And so it's 0:10:41.559 --> 0:10:44.520 not surprising that there is a significant percentage of people 0:10:44.559 --> 0:10:47.440 in this country that believe there's fraud notwithstanding the fact 0:10:47.520 --> 0:10:51.360 that the Department of Homeland Security, uh Mr Trump's own 0:10:51.440 --> 0:10:53.840 former attorney general have all said there's no fraud. This 0:10:53.880 --> 0:10:57.000 has now been litigated in over sixty court cases around 0:10:57.000 --> 0:10:59.959 the country. So you know, look, I mean, it's it's 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:03.559 it's there's an underlying distrust and government that is being 0:11:04.120 --> 0:11:08.600 um exploited by you know, elected officials. You've got a 0:11:08.640 --> 0:11:13.319 bifurcated not even bifurcated, You've got a diverse media atmosphere 0:11:13.320 --> 0:11:15.760 where people can watch whatever news they want. There's there's 0:11:15.760 --> 0:11:19.480 a lot going on here. I think Joe Biden can 0:11:19.520 --> 0:11:21.520 be part of the solution, but he won't be the 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:23.959 entire solution. Do you think part of the solution is 0:11:24.000 --> 0:11:27.640 invoking the twenty five Amendment for the president's remaining days 0:11:27.880 --> 0:11:33.560 or impeaching the president, as lawmakers have suggested. I guess 0:11:33.559 --> 0:11:36.200 I'd say this. Uh. I do think there needs to 0:11:36.240 --> 0:11:41.000 be a strong message sent that this is not acceptable conduct. Um. 0:11:41.040 --> 0:11:43.160 But we are only left with thirteen days left. That 0:11:43.320 --> 0:11:45.560 that being said, I mean, you know, we have seen, 0:11:45.640 --> 0:11:48.280 just over the course of twenty four hours what one 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:51.640 person's words can do. And I go back to you 0:11:51.679 --> 0:11:53.800 know what Joe Biden said in his remarks, he said, 0:11:53.840 --> 0:11:56.839 you know, the president's words matter. At their best, they 0:11:56.840 --> 0:11:59.760 can inspire and at the worst they can incite. And 0:11:59.800 --> 0:12:02.160 that what happened. And so I think we should all 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:06.240 brace ourselves, um, because I don't you know, I think 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:10.080 as fewer and fewer guard rails exist around this president, 0:12:10.240 --> 0:12:15.240 he remains a very unpredictable and potentially dangerous person right now. So, Chris, 0:12:15.280 --> 0:12:16.760 I do want to ask you about kind of the 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:20.199 role of all of us in being responsible citizens, responsible 0:12:20.240 --> 0:12:22.280 members of the media. I know we try to be 0:12:22.440 --> 0:12:25.040 very careful here, we are careful at Bloomberg, but I 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:28.599 do wonder there was so much coverage of everything and 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:32.880 anything that Donald Trump did and his team did, and 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:35.800 I think we also kind of struggled with it sometimes 0:12:35.800 --> 0:12:39.160 whether it was really news, uh, and whether or not 0:12:39.400 --> 0:12:42.880 you know, who are responsibility and kind of fueling some 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:45.559 of the fury. Yeah, you know, And I think this 0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:49.439 is a legitimate concern that people really need to examine. 0:12:49.480 --> 0:12:53.560 And it goes back to the presidential campaign, when you 0:12:53.640 --> 0:12:56.840 had network that would ron Trump's rallies, you know, from 0:12:56.840 --> 0:13:00.480 start to finish, giving him a disproportionate amount of airtime. 0:13:00.800 --> 0:13:02.720 But also at the same time airing a lot of 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:05.360 you know, the falsehoods that we have all gotten used 0:13:05.360 --> 0:13:07.679 to now, and the theories always well, you know it's news. 0:13:07.760 --> 0:13:11.480 Well just because it's news or might be newsworthy, doesn't 0:13:11.480 --> 0:13:13.760 mean it needs to be put out there. And how 0:13:13.800 --> 0:13:20.280 do you properly refute the false allegations? Um in that, 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:21.719 and how do you do that in real time? And 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:24.199 then it continues all the way to you know, whether 0:13:24.360 --> 0:13:27.360 it's you know, his press conference he did early in 0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:31.360 his administration or the COVID daily briefings that he did 0:13:31.440 --> 0:13:34.600 through last the spring and summer where he was just 0:13:34.679 --> 0:13:38.880 dispensing harmful misinformation. And then obviously what we've seen with 0:13:39.320 --> 0:13:42.760 you know, Facebook and Twitter both suspending him. Um, you 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:44.880 know what what what is what is the role of 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:48.080 social media as well? So uh, you know, we've never 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:52.280 had a president who has pushed the limits on disinformation 0:13:52.320 --> 0:13:55.040 as much. And you know, the theory had always been, 0:13:55.080 --> 0:13:57.520 you know, what the president says matters that needs to 0:13:57.520 --> 0:13:59.960 be covered, maybe that shouldn't be the rule going forward. 0:14:00.760 --> 0:14:03.360 That was former Deputy Secretary of Labor and senior fellow 0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:06.200 at the University of Virginia Miller Center Chris Leu, a 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:09.520 member of President Elected Joe Biden's transition team. Still ahead 0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:12.120 with our focus on politics this week. So easy at 0:14:12.160 --> 0:14:14.360 times to forget that we are yes in the midst 0:14:14.400 --> 0:14:17.600 of a raging health pandemic. We will get this under 0:14:17.600 --> 0:14:20.120 control in a way that lets our lives go on, 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:22.840 but it won't be easy. We've got to be vigilant. 0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:27.800 We've got to replace complacency with vigilant. Access Health International 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:31.440 President Dr William Hazeltine on a health epidemic out of control. 0:14:31.640 --> 0:14:34.720 Still to come on Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg. 0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:47.920 This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg 0:14:47.960 --> 0:14:51.800 Quick Takes Tim Stinovich from Bloomberg Radio. This week, the 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:54.880 US reported a record number of daily deaths from COVID nineteen, 0:14:54.960 --> 0:14:57.880 while confirmed cases globally climbed by an all time high. 0:14:57.960 --> 0:15:00.920 One trusted and informed voice for US on the coronavirus 0:15:01.000 --> 0:15:05.120 tim It's Access Health International Chairman and President, Dr William Hazeltine. Yeah. 0:15:05.200 --> 0:15:08.520 Dr Hazeltine has founded more than a dozen biotech companies, 0:15:08.560 --> 0:15:12.560 including Human Genome Sciences. He's also a founder of Harvard Medicals, 0:15:12.640 --> 0:15:15.600 Cancer and HIV AIDS research departments, and I gotta say 0:15:15.640 --> 0:15:17.880 some startling words from him. We started off to him 0:15:17.880 --> 0:15:20.400 talking about how he's making sense of the latest round 0:15:20.400 --> 0:15:23.840 of COVID headlines. With respect of the headlines, they're very 0:15:23.960 --> 0:15:28.920 upsetting because we see an epidemic out of control in 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:32.080 many countries, and when they try to control, at the 0:15:32.120 --> 0:15:36.720 moment they release it, the infections popping back up. Unless 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:39.280 you were able to control this infection early on, like 0:15:39.400 --> 0:15:42.240 China and a few other countries, did, you're really in 0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:44.880 the soup for a long time, And thank goodness, we 0:15:44.920 --> 0:15:48.800 have vaccines. Have you gotten On the other hand, yeah, 0:15:48.920 --> 0:15:50.840 have I gotten the vaccine? Not yet? No, I'm not 0:15:51.120 --> 0:15:54.760 not eligible yet. But we're all waiting for the vaccines. 0:15:54.840 --> 0:15:57.960 I can tell you. That's the first story. The second story, 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:02.600 of course, his virus very all of those who who 0:16:02.640 --> 0:16:06.560 worked with HIV this is like our old ghosts coming 0:16:06.600 --> 0:16:10.560 back to haunt us. And it's just a very serious 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:16.720 situation because the virus obviously is changing in response to 0:16:16.760 --> 0:16:20.920 immune pressure. Whether or not it's getting around the vaccines, 0:16:21.760 --> 0:16:24.680 I think it's only a matter of time. It may 0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:28.280 already have done so. And the optimism that people have 0:16:28.960 --> 0:16:32.000 that it's not gotten around the vaccines already is I 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:35.080 think misplaced. Let me tell you the reason I think 0:16:35.120 --> 0:16:39.000 that There was a patient in Great Britain who had 0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:43.200 a prolonged infection because the patient was immune suppressed. Twenty 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:46.160 three samples of virus were taken during the patient's treatment. 0:16:46.640 --> 0:16:50.480 The treatment with convalescent SARAH. That's people who successfully fought 0:16:50.480 --> 0:16:54.720 off the virus. That patient got three successive rounds and 0:16:54.880 --> 0:16:58.600 over time, because they were sampling frequently, you could see 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:03.840 variations arise and the virus became resistant to convalescents Sierra. 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:09.040 If it becomes resistance the convalescents SIRA, that means it 0:17:09.119 --> 0:17:12.440 can get around our natural immunity. And we can get 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.520 around our natural immunity. Is very likely it can get 0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:21.000 around our artificial immunity that we create with vaccine. What 0:17:21.000 --> 0:17:22.800 what are you talking about? This would this would be 0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:26.600 the case with MR and A vaccines and other ways 0:17:26.640 --> 0:17:30.720 that vaccines have and are being developed. Any vaccine I'm 0:17:30.720 --> 0:17:35.840 talking about any vaccine well, and the strains that the 0:17:36.040 --> 0:17:41.280 variants are they usually stronger, tougher to deal with, or 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:45.760 not necessarily then the idea that they're weaker is wrong. 0:17:45.960 --> 0:17:48.719 They are not necessarily weaker. In some cases that they're 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:54.200 more potent I be more transmissible, uh and grow higher tighters, 0:17:54.280 --> 0:17:57.480 higher concentrations and people who are effecting. So there's very 0:17:57.520 --> 0:18:01.400 worrying observations out there today. It felt pretty ominous here 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:03.320 and what you had to say about variants and kind 0:18:03.320 --> 0:18:05.800 of where we go from here when it comes to COVID. 0:18:06.280 --> 0:18:08.120 So it made me feel like we never get out 0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:10.720 of it. Help me set the record straight. Is that 0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:12.639 fair or is it just a case that it's going 0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:16.000 to take longer. How do you see it? I see 0:18:16.040 --> 0:18:18.840 this as a constant battle against this virus, likely fight 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:22.600 against US virus. I don't think it's going to paralyze 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:25.399 our economies and keep us in the house as it 0:18:25.440 --> 0:18:28.159 does now. I think we'll have effective measures, will have 0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:31.320 much faster diagnostics to know who's infected. We'll have a 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:33.920 whole series of drugs that we can take that can 0:18:33.960 --> 0:18:36.119 help us get over this and save us if we 0:18:36.160 --> 0:18:39.560 do get infected. And we'll have vaccines that will probably 0:18:39.640 --> 0:18:42.640 have to renew whether it's every year, every two years, 0:18:42.640 --> 0:18:44.600 every three years, we're gonna have to be renewing our 0:18:44.680 --> 0:18:47.520 vaccines to keep up with the virus changing. But we 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:50.640 will get this under control in a way that lets 0:18:50.640 --> 0:18:53.240 our lives go on. But it won't be easy. We've 0:18:53.280 --> 0:18:58.240 got to be vigilant. We've got to replace complacency with vigilance. 0:18:58.720 --> 0:19:01.920 What is the best historical precedence for this? If if 0:19:01.920 --> 0:19:07.359 we think about modern modern public health, when have we 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:10.639 gotten through something like this? Well, we've gotten through it 0:19:10.680 --> 0:19:13.439 in the nineteen eighteen flu, the nineteen fifty seven fifty 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:17.320 eight flu, and we've gotten through it for the HIV pandemic. 0:19:17.359 --> 0:19:20.480 I think most people forget that that virus has killed 0:19:20.840 --> 0:19:24.280 upwards of thirty five million people uh in the world, 0:19:24.359 --> 0:19:27.399 and that is uh much more than this is killed. 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:30.679 And yet we've got another control. So modern science is 0:19:30.720 --> 0:19:34.080 capable of doing this. People have to cooperate, which they're 0:19:34.080 --> 0:19:37.240 not doing particularly well, especially with the last Christmas. But 0:19:37.400 --> 0:19:41.120 this these are this is infectious diseases we can control, 0:19:41.600 --> 0:19:44.680 but we cannot let down our vigilance. We can't assume 0:19:44.960 --> 0:19:47.320 that a vaccine is going to be the panacea. We've 0:19:47.359 --> 0:19:51.240 got to combine that with good public health measures and 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:55.439 continued intensive research such as going on right now. That's right, 0:19:55.520 --> 0:19:58.560 we cannot get complacent. That was Access Health International Chairman 0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:02.280 and President Dr William hazel To, founder of Human Genome Scientists. 0:20:02.280 --> 0:20:04.920 His autobiography, by the way, came out this year. It's 0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:08.240 entitled My Lifelong Fight against Disease From Poleon Aids to 0:20:08.359 --> 0:20:12.199 COVID nineteen. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week coming up. 0:20:12.280 --> 0:20:15.160 Technology has been crucial in our fight against the virus. 0:20:15.320 --> 0:20:18.440 It certainly has, and in keeping us going during the pandemic. 0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:20.760 Upnecks the tech trends that will dominate this year. We'll 0:20:20.760 --> 0:20:22.760 get that from the chief information officer at B and 0:20:22.880 --> 0:20:35.479 Y Mellon's Pershing. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Business 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:39.359 Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovich 0:20:39.680 --> 0:20:42.240 from Bloomberg Radio. Well, whether it was the shift to 0:20:42.320 --> 0:20:44.960 remote work, the move to cloud computing software, the rise 0:20:45.000 --> 0:20:47.800 of video gaming, or the surgeon e commerce sales one 0:20:47.840 --> 0:20:50.800 of the big winners of Yeah, it was technology. Yeah, 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:53.119 I'm using my phone more. I'm watching more TV than 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:55.280 I think than ever before. I don't know whether or 0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:57.400 not that's a good thing. Carol. As we think about 0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:00.000 tech trends in the year ahead, you spoke with BNY 0:21:00.119 --> 0:21:04.080 Melon Pershing's chief information officer, rom Nagapan and like so 0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:06.480 many of our guests, he started off by talking about 0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:10.000 working from home. We're all working remotely and we're doing 0:21:10.080 --> 0:21:13.440 pretty good from how we are working, even though we're 0:21:13.480 --> 0:21:18.400 not really seeing face to face, but we are all operational. UM. 0:21:19.040 --> 0:21:21.520 On the technology point of view, I want to say 0:21:21.840 --> 0:21:25.399 technology as take in the center stage. Um. You know, 0:21:25.560 --> 0:21:29.680 it's it's moving from enabling the business to actually driving 0:21:29.720 --> 0:21:31.760 the business. What do you mean by that? What do 0:21:31.800 --> 0:21:35.520 you mean by that? Meaning before people used to use 0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:40.000 technology to enable the business. Now technology is the driving factor. 0:21:40.080 --> 0:21:44.520 For example, without technology, you even cannot do certain things. 0:21:45.040 --> 0:21:49.399 Since March, I would say, meaning, when we build technology, 0:21:49.480 --> 0:21:53.040 we always talk they built the technology for mobile first. 0:21:53.119 --> 0:21:56.320 You know, now we're all talking about building for remote 0:21:56.400 --> 0:21:59.800 first because people just went through a big lesson that 0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:04.280 they need to operate everything remotely and they need that capability. 0:22:04.359 --> 0:22:07.400 So technology is the one that is helping and actually 0:22:07.480 --> 0:22:10.040 driving to do those things. Well be and y Melon 0:22:10.200 --> 0:22:13.159 pershing you guys big financial company, and I do wonder. 0:22:13.520 --> 0:22:16.240 You know, there's a big debate about the working from 0:22:16.280 --> 0:22:20.119 home trend and we have yet to see how long 0:22:20.200 --> 0:22:24.160 it sticks, how much it sticks. But I've had conversations 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:26.119 with folks in the financial community who said, you know, 0:22:26.400 --> 0:22:28.680 we got rid of our offices in New York. We've 0:22:28.720 --> 0:22:31.600