Speaker 1: Warning. Today's episode contains spoilers for the first episode of
Speaker 1: Dune Prophecy on Max and HBO and the Wider Dune Cannon,
Speaker 1: so be warned.
Speaker 2: Wild Cannon guys, Wild Cannon.
Speaker 1: Hello, my name is Jason Concepsiode.
Speaker 2: And I am Mersey Nights of the Benny Jesuit.
Speaker 1: They're not called that yet and welcome back to ext
Speaker 1: revision of the podcast when we Dive dee Vinny your
Speaker 1: favorite shows, movies, comics and pop culture coming from my
Speaker 1: art podcast. We're bringing you three episodes a week every
Speaker 1: Tuesday Thursday, with an extra episode every Wednesday.
Speaker 2: In today's episode, we are joined by super producer and
Speaker 2: dune expert Aboo. How's it going.
Speaker 3: It's going super well.
Speaker 2: I love to hear it.
Speaker 3: I'm your local mentet. If you're our BENI Jess, that's right, and.
Speaker 2: Jason is obviously are chosen one. In the airlock. We
Speaker 2: will be deep diving into that recap of Doom Prophecy
Speaker 2: episode one, and boy does a lot of has stuff happened.
Speaker 2: I'm glad Aboo is here to help us through so much.
Speaker 2: Law the kids love law and HBO delivered with the
Speaker 2: Law in the omnibus Aboo's gonna take us through some
Speaker 2: of the Toms Easter Eggs references that you may have
Speaker 2: missed in this very dense, dense first episode of the
Speaker 2: Dune Prophecy Program.
Speaker 1: In the words of the Great British Breaking Show, it's
Speaker 1: quite stodgy this episode. Let's step out of the air
Speaker 1: lock and talk about it. We open with narration in
Speaker 1: the wake of the human victory over Ai and the
Speaker 1: great but Lerian Jihad, when the humans have overthrown the
Speaker 1: Thinking Machine.
Speaker 2: Pretty crazy to see that according.
Speaker 1: To legend or history. Why don't we have any history?
Speaker 1: Nobody wrote anything down. We're not here anyway. According to
Speaker 1: the propaganda that it exists, it was in a tradese
Speaker 1: who led human forces to victory in this wonderful grand
Speaker 1: victory over the Thinking Machines Akaai. The Harconans, who we
Speaker 1: have to admit are kind of scumbags and a lot
Speaker 1: of the stories that we know from the Dune universe,
Speaker 1: were somehow branded as cowards for their behavior during this
Speaker 1: war and were exiled to a planet that sucks. Valia
Speaker 1: harconin one of these spends these years in the wake
Speaker 1: of the war helping to build an organization of women
Speaker 1: who task themselves with guiding political events in the galaxy.
Speaker 1: They are trained as soothsayers. Basically, they're human light detectors,
Speaker 1: and through a marketing campaign, which we do not see,
Speaker 1: get themselves assigned.
Speaker 2: Let's see the marketing campaign, guy, we.
Speaker 1: Need to see the marketing campaign of their early benage,
Speaker 1: of their years of like, you got it. Have one
Speaker 1: of these soothsayers. Wow, I just got a soothsayer, and
Speaker 1: I know the truth you.
Speaker 2: Need in your house.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no one.
Speaker 2: Will ever trick you again. That will be a cool
Speaker 2: woman wearing a spooky uniform, and she will tell if
Speaker 2: everybody is telling them, we.
Speaker 1: Need that marketing cafe. Anyway. By the time that our
Speaker 1: story commences, these women are already being placed with various
Speaker 1: important houses throughout the galaxy. The word lands rat is
Speaker 1: not used, but I think we can assume that this
Speaker 1: collection of great houses probably exists. Yes, Mother Riquella is
Speaker 1: the first mother superior of this organization, and it is
Speaker 1: her mission. She creates the mission of this group to
Speaker 1: curate the genetics of the various royal houses so that
Speaker 1: they can put in force a kind of eugenics program.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Messiah, eugenics program to.
Speaker 1: Create future royal who are in obviously influential and powerful positions,
Speaker 1: but are also pliable in some way I guess, genetically suggestible,
Speaker 1: so that the Sisters can wield influence. Do I have
Speaker 1: it write aboo so far?
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a pretty good summary of it. I think
Speaker 3: the show itself really glosses over and rushes past a
Speaker 3: lot of this Mother Raquella stuff because this is from
Speaker 3: the book from Sisterhod of Dune, written by Brian Herbert
Speaker 3: Kevin J. Anderson. And the important point that the show
Speaker 3: doesn't hit on is that Mother Raquella is so important
Speaker 3: and her legacy overshadows the Sisterhood so much because she
Speaker 3: is the first ever Reverend Mother, as in, she has
Speaker 3: taken Spice, just like Jessica does in the movie right,
Speaker 3: and she has survived that ordeal, the Spice agony quote unquote,
Speaker 3: and has come out the other side with abilities, with
Speaker 3: access to her other memories, with all of those Reverend
Speaker 3: mother abilities that we know, and she's the first to
Speaker 3: ever achieve it. I the show never mentions that I wouldn't.
Speaker 2: Like to spend it an hour with her an opening
Speaker 2: episode about her and yeah and her journey.
Speaker 1: So Abu does she not have. So she has genetic
Speaker 1: memories from that extend beyond her own memories, but they're
Speaker 1: probably not that extensive because this hasn't been going on
Speaker 1: that long.
Speaker 3: Right, that's correct? Yeah, I mean she presumably has genetic
Speaker 3: memories down her female line, like every Reverend mother who
Speaker 3: has gone through the agony.
Speaker 1: Right, but not the collected memories.
Speaker 3: Not the collective Benny jesret right, So that is like
Speaker 3: Rickella is the start of that. She initiates that program
Speaker 3: and spends most of the book. The show doesn't address
Speaker 3: this at all and just assumes we're past it, but
Speaker 3: spends most of the book trying to figure out how
Speaker 3: the fuck do I make more Reverend Mothers because everyone
Speaker 3: I keep giving spice to keeps dying.
Speaker 1: Got to drink ato spice, right.
Speaker 3: And they keep dying. So they're trying to figure out
Speaker 3: the right formula and dosage. And I see, by the
Speaker 3: time we get to where this show picks up, Valia
Speaker 3: herself has been only the second to ever survive it.
Speaker 2: I think, Oh, and we haven't learned that yet. That
Speaker 2: might be a flashback.
Speaker 3: That might be a flashback.
Speaker 1: So Mother Raquella as she is dying calls for Valia,
Speaker 1: who appears to be her favorite of the sisters.
Speaker 2: Over her own door.
Speaker 1: That's right, yes, tough, look the sister. Valia shares Mother
Speaker 1: Superior's dedication to this genetic project. Raquella tells Valia that
Speaker 1: tyran erfl It's coming end quote, and then she has
Speaker 1: these various dying visions of like a huge sandworm swallowing
Speaker 1: the city and glowing eyes in space that speak in
Speaker 1: a kind of garbled language. She comes back to reality
Speaker 1: and grips Valia's hand and asks her to grow the
Speaker 1: sister its power and to protect it as it goes forward.
Speaker 1: Apparently tyran erfl is some kind of prophecy of holy judgment,
Speaker 1: a reckoning, and a tyrant who will rule the galaxy.
Speaker 2: Can I just interject him? Because I think this is
Speaker 2: one of the funniest things about making a show like this. Personally,
Speaker 2: I liked this episode a lot, and I felt like
Speaker 2: they do hold up the suspense, mostly due to density
Speaker 2: and confusion. But I do think it's really funny that
Speaker 2: they basically just tell you, like Pola Tredees is the
Speaker 2: bad thing that's coming, so early on in the show.
Speaker 2: It's like, we know where Dune is going, and if
Speaker 2: you've read the books, you know, so basically we're just
Speaker 2: going to be having the dramatic irony of watching them
Speaker 2: create their own downfall, which I think is like an
Speaker 2: interesting thing to lay out so early on.
Speaker 1: I agree with you, and I will say that part
Speaker 1: of my I think that there's a good show that
Speaker 1: will emerge here, and I think this first episode is
Speaker 1: a bit of a mess, but I did really enjoy
Speaker 1: the vibes.
Speaker 2: It's a good vibe show, and I think the.
Speaker 1: Vibes will grow. That said, I think there's a lot
Speaker 1: of suspense building by like dropping these little clues and
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, you can find out why this is
Speaker 1: such a big deal. Yeah, And I think that is,
Speaker 1: in my opinion, a mistake. I think they should have said,
Speaker 1: here's what the big thing they're worried about is, so
Speaker 1: you can share in that. Because there's a there's so
Speaker 1: much download that you're like, does that matter? Does that matter?
Speaker 1: What is that? There is a lot of vagary ching
Speaker 1: around to try and understand what's important, what's not, what
Speaker 1: are they freaking out about? And I think they needed
Speaker 1: to set that stage early. And then there's also the
Speaker 1: other thing of ladies. It's gonna be ten thousand years
Speaker 1: from now. Don't don't worry about it, stress that far,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like, let's trump the break somebody.
Speaker 2: Else in your order. She is gonna just take it
Speaker 2: upon ourself to do it anyway, So don't worry about it.
Speaker 3: Can you wait until tomorrow?
Speaker 1: Probably?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Probably?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I do think that's gonna be the most interesting thing
Speaker 2: is like how can they hook us into this world
Speaker 2: when we already know where we're going, And that's the
Speaker 2: cust of all prequels. I do think that the visual
Speaker 2: world building and as you put it, Jason, the vibes,
Speaker 2: which I think we are into a vibe show, and
Speaker 2: that side of it really did suck me in, like
Speaker 2: I want to spend time in this world, which I
Speaker 2: think is really important.
Speaker 1: It's a lot like foundation where yes, just looking at
Speaker 1: it great, I can just continue need to look at
Speaker 1: it because I want to continue to just even beyond
Speaker 1: the storytelling, like the visuals.
Speaker 2: Or another immense law show.
Speaker 1: Yes. Valia orders a small group of sister collaborators to
Speaker 1: begin a plot to raise an empress who will rule
Speaker 1: over the imperium. Apparently Sister Dorotea is on the outside
Speaker 1: of this plan. She's going to be a problem because
Speaker 1: she disagrees with a lot of stuff, including the genetic project.
Speaker 2: She's like, we're meant to be just humble witches, guys,
Speaker 2: we're not supposed to be becoming eugenesis doctors.
Speaker 1: She probably has why did you join this group? Then?
Speaker 1: Like this is kind of what the group project is Dorotea.
Speaker 2: I think her mom is Riquela. I don't know if
Speaker 2: she had a law of choice.
Speaker 1: Yes, So there's a lot of clues and hanging mysteries
Speaker 1: regarding her as well. At the funeral for Mother Raquela,
Speaker 1: Dorotea and her acolytes make it clear that hey, mother
Speaker 1: Superior's dying wishes, we're not down. We don't like that,
Speaker 1: We're not going to do it. Conflict clearly shaping up.
Speaker 1: Valia finds now Mother Dorotea, so she did she drink
Speaker 1: the spice or no, she just took the mantle on,
Speaker 1: but she hasn't done any of the stuff.
Speaker 2: Correct, which shows like her disrespect for the version of
Speaker 2: the sisterhood that was before. Now she's like, I'll just
Speaker 2: take it on, yeah and do something different.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And again there's potential for more flashback that flashes
Speaker 3: this out. But Dorotea is also the other Volley and
Speaker 3: Dorotea are the two next sisters to do the stuff
Speaker 3: and become the next reverend mothers in the books. In
Speaker 3: the books, and then there's a power struggle. There's a
Speaker 3: schism in the sisterhood and it's Dorotaea vers Valia.
Speaker 2: Interesting again, skimm Dova in the last ten minutes of
Speaker 2: this episode.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Dorotea is like, we should just be, in
Speaker 1: Rosie's words, humble witches who guide the imperium. We don't
Speaker 1: want to like ruling it from the shadows. That's overstepping.
Speaker 1: And so in service of my vision for this organization,
Speaker 1: I'm going to go into the genetic archive and I'm
Speaker 1: going to destroy it. And Valia is like, no, you're not.
Speaker 1: She used stops her from doing it.
Speaker 2: She's like, I don't know that.
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna get her that something she invented.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she invented the voice. She's the first person to
Speaker 1: ever use it live.
Speaker 2: Is that true to the Bookaboo?
Speaker 3: That is true to the book.
Speaker 1: Yes, Okay, so she's been developing the voice apparently, like
Speaker 1: doing R and D in secret she's so, this is
Speaker 1: the first live test of the voice and it's successful.
Speaker 2: I want to know how have she been practicing it?
Speaker 2: Because if she they get those prisoners from the imperium. Oh,
Speaker 2: that's true, she's just been making them do horrible stuff. Yah,
Speaker 2: she's a villain. They they if you felt like the
Speaker 2: Penguin on HBO Max, that was real villain centric show.
Speaker 2: I feel like this is following on in that in
Speaker 2: great terms.
Speaker 1: So Valia's like, well, listen, the voice pretty cool? Right,
Speaker 1: you were like this is pretty sick.
Speaker 3: Wouldn't you want to do this?
Speaker 1: Don't you want to learn how to do this? Right?
Speaker 1: I will teach you how to do it? If you
Speaker 1: just let us do the gen nick thing, can we
Speaker 1: do it? Dorte is like no, I will never agree
Speaker 1: to that. So Valias like ten stands us up of
Speaker 1: the neck and she's dead, and she does go on
Speaker 1: and the other sisters come running, not knowing Maybee the
Speaker 1: voice has been used. They don't even know about the voice,
Speaker 1: and they're just like, oh my god, dort kill herself.
Speaker 1: This is crazy.
Speaker 2: Guess we can just do our plan now. This is convenient.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm fast forward thirty years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my read of it is those three women that
Speaker 2: run along. I think they at least heard the voice,
Speaker 2: or they have some suspicion that Valuo was involved. But
Speaker 2: that plan is essentially like getting an empress to be
Speaker 2: in charge of the imperium is the most important thing.
Speaker 2: So we'll keep this between us, and like people in
Speaker 2: a slasher movie, in thirty years, someone's gonna come up
Speaker 2: and be like, bro, did you kill someone? And it's
Speaker 2: going to be a problem. And now it's that years later.
Speaker 2: That's a crazy time jump.
Speaker 1: So now it is thirty years later, one hundred and
Speaker 1: sixteen years after the end of the Butlery and Gie
Speaker 1: hot aka Machine War, and it's like ten thousand plus
Speaker 1: years before Paul and Tree's again, not that big of
Speaker 1: an emergency. Obviously, we don't want it to happen, but guys,
Speaker 1: we had ten grand And also.
Speaker 2: Guys, he was born early anyway, so it was supposed
Speaker 2: to be that next generation. So he's like even then,
Speaker 2: it's still a long time, guys, even though he came ali.
Speaker 1: So in the intervening years, Valya has taught the sisters
Speaker 1: how to use the voice, and the Order has only
Speaker 1: grown in power and influence. We now have sister soothsayers
Speaker 1: very much in demand across the galaxy.
Speaker 2: Everyone has on it.
Speaker 1: Everyone has one. You gotta get.
Speaker 2: It's like a tamagotchi. Everyone wants on you.
Speaker 1: Well, the Harkonans have not got one, and you think
Speaker 1: they're probably thinking, well, hold on, Valia, you're one of us.
Speaker 1: What the fuck can we get a soothsayer? And they've
Speaker 1: asked numerous times and Valua is like, for the fourth time, no, no,
Speaker 1: fuck yourself. Interesting interesting development. Yes, Imperial guards arrive, including
Speaker 1: the prince Lord Constantine, who is he's hung the half
Speaker 1: brother of the Princess Ynez who will soon be a
Speaker 1: student here at the not yet ben a Jesuit order,
Speaker 1: and he's here to just inspect the facilities and make
Speaker 1: sure everything's fine for the arrival of his sister. Lord
Speaker 1: Constantine is like, my sister's got to have her own quarters,
Speaker 1: she's got to have her own cell phone, she's got
Speaker 1: to have a prince, she's got to have.
Speaker 2: A she needs a special seat that's riped off so
Speaker 2: no one else can sit in all.
Speaker 1: Of that stuff. She needs a toilet seat that warms
Speaker 1: up and all that stuff. And Valuys like spa days
Speaker 1: and Volley's like, absolutely not. She's just gonna be a
Speaker 1: normal sister like everybody else. And Lord Constant's like, okay,
Speaker 1: well I tried.
Speaker 2: Yeah, He's like I had to try it.
Speaker 3: He wasn't that.
Speaker 1: He's very chill guy. He tried, and he's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I tried. Later to lahar Conen, Valia's sister is teaching
Speaker 1: the students how to strategically guide events in the Councils
Speaker 1: of the Powerful by lying and understanding the difference between
Speaker 1: lies and the truth, and understanding when to use each
Speaker 1: and how to shade truth with lies and how to
Speaker 1: shade lies with truth, et cetera. Her sister Valia comes
Speaker 1: down and says, hey, the Emperor deal, we got it sealed.
Speaker 1: Princesses common She's gonna be living here. It's gonna be great.
Speaker 2: Okay, bo, can I ask you a quick question. Ye
Speaker 2: are the women that we see in that sequence? Are
Speaker 2: all of those women actual characters from the books?
Speaker 3: No, there's a lot of original characters.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 2: It felt to me like this was kind of a
Speaker 2: adding kids to the Magic School section. It didn't necessarily
Speaker 2: feel like they were coming directly from the book, So
Speaker 2: thank you for that.
Speaker 1: We go to Seleusis Secundas, which apparently is the Emperor's
Speaker 1: throne world and will in the future, I believe, be
Speaker 1: the place where they make his imperial guards. Is that correct?
Speaker 3: That's correct. The planet mysteriously gets nuked to oblivion and
Speaker 3: becomes like the Healthscape prison planet.
Speaker 2: Fun.
Speaker 1: Okay, Swordmaster here into Tradees is sparring with Princess Ynez
Speaker 1: and let me tell you, Oh they're sparring. He's using
Speaker 1: more than just the sword.
Speaker 2: Is dead Pool Wolverine levels of we're having a fight,
Speaker 2: but really we're having sex.
Speaker 3: Focus on my body, he says, yeah.
Speaker 1: Focus on.
Speaker 2: The chemistry. Is that this is seems like she's having
Speaker 2: a good time.
Speaker 1: Constantine comes back and he's like, just came back from
Speaker 1: the school. Were elsewhere. The Emperor is having a meeting
Speaker 1: with the Duke of Riches.
Speaker 2: A space venus.
Speaker 1: Hey, yah, you're gonna love the matter. You're gonna love him.
Speaker 1: And if you are marrying princess to my charm, beautiful,
Speaker 1: I give you the ships.
Speaker 2: You need the sheep negotiation.
Speaker 1: You need my ballist, the ships and knows that the
Speaker 1: Cussi fall the iracas and you get the spies and
Speaker 1: the spies are gonna flow, So apparently the emperor is
Speaker 1: hard up for warships the emperor. So this is a
Speaker 1: good point where we can ask a question. I think
Speaker 1: because I think you hear emperor and you think unchecked power.
Speaker 1: But the emperor in the world of Dune is hamstrung
Speaker 1: by the power of his subordinates, the power of the
Speaker 1: great houses. Could you explain to us exactly why this
Speaker 1: emperor seems so weak and unable to provide his own armaments.
Speaker 2: And machinations with other houses.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, couple of reasons. One, Jason, You're correct, there's
Speaker 3: like this tenuous political tripod of this universe. You have
Speaker 3: the Emperor and his forces, which is currently hous Carino
Speaker 3: on one side. Then you have the lands Rod, which
Speaker 3: is the collection of great houses, the trades, the Harconins,
Speaker 3: there are jay Z's. And then you have a group
Speaker 3: we haven't seen in this show, but is very present
Speaker 3: in the books and we saw it in the Villna films,
Speaker 3: the Spacing Guild, who have a monopoly on all travel.
Speaker 3: And you have these three powers sort of precariously working
Speaker 3: with and against each other at all times. And so
Speaker 3: the Emperor isn't so powerful that he can just stomp
Speaker 3: over the Guild or the Lancerod any day he chooses,
Speaker 3: he has to work with them. His hands are tied.
Speaker 3: The second reason we're seeing sort of a weaker house
Speaker 3: Carino and a weaker Emperor at the moment is because
Speaker 3: we've just come off the tales of a machine war
Speaker 3: that SAPs the resources of all of humanity basically right, soldiers, money,
Speaker 3: everything we came from, back from essentially the brink of
Speaker 3: enslavement and destruction at the hands of machines and House
Speaker 3: Karno was pivotal in doing that, but very likely sacrifice
Speaker 3: the most in doing that as well. So they've obtained
Speaker 3: power but at great cost. And now they may control
Speaker 3: Aracus and Spice, but that doesn't mean they are objectively
Speaker 3: the most powerful people out there right now.
Speaker 1: So they need the ships they need there cheesy ships.
Speaker 1: While this is happening, we see that Kasha, the Emperor
Speaker 1: soothsayer and Duke with Chesy's soothsayer like finger signaling to
Speaker 1: each other and they're like, this fucking duke is a
Speaker 1: real asshole listening, and she's like, yeah.
Speaker 2: In case you didn't realize, the Duke of Richesi, you're
Speaker 2: selling his child, and.
Speaker 1: The Duke's in sooth series like, you don't even know
Speaker 1: the half of it. I work with this guy all
Speaker 1: the time. He's a piece of shit, and Kasha has
Speaker 1: to be like, well, listen, once the marriage is over
Speaker 1: and we're clear of that, we can take care of
Speaker 1: this guy. Whatever gom Jabar in the neck, we poison,
Speaker 1: whatever the case might be, we get rid of him.
Speaker 1: But we just got to get this wedding going. The
Speaker 1: Emperor then consults with Kasha over the ballistas and whether
Speaker 1: it's worth marrying his beloved daughter Ynez to the Duke
Speaker 1: of Richesi's son, and they confer and he goes over
Speaker 1: to the Duke of Riches. He's like, okay, let's do it,
Speaker 1: my daughter for the ships. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And it's very clear now that he is fully under
Speaker 2: the thrall of the Benajezra at this point, or at
Speaker 2: least takes them pre be prey the Sisterhood. Let's call
Speaker 2: him the Sisterhood.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't even say the thrall. I just think he is. Again,
Speaker 1: he's a weak emperor vying with powerful political forces that
Speaker 1: are ostensibly his subordinates but have agency on their own,
Speaker 1: and he just doesn't know where to turn. And I
Speaker 1: think Kasha has given him good advice to this point,
Speaker 1: and he's got to get the spice to flow.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and sort of living in the shoes of his predecessors,
Speaker 3: like he didn't win the machine war his the Karnos
Speaker 3: before him did, and he just inherited being emperor, so
Speaker 3: he didn't like get here on his own savvy or
Speaker 3: political and military might. He's just inherited it.
Speaker 1: Back on Wallack nine, where the Sisters live, we see
Speaker 1: that they are learning combat techniques and other subtle techniques
Speaker 1: in order to influence people. Sister Jen, during a session
Speaker 1: in which they take the Imperial prisoners and discover whether
Speaker 1: lying or not, thinks that all this soothsaying shit is
Speaker 1: too easy. It's way this way too easy. Come on,
Speaker 1: when are we going to ramp it up? Vol was like, okay,
Speaker 1: let's show us lie to us and tell us something.
Speaker 1: And she's like, oh yeah, well you know why I'm here.
Speaker 1: I'm here because I have fucking murdered my parents and
Speaker 1: I murdered my I walk into a McDonald's, I killed
Speaker 1: everybody blood and I put the blood in a super
Speaker 1: sized cup and I drank the blood out of that
Speaker 1: and I put ice it. And then I put the
Speaker 1: blood on my chicken nugget and I put ice cream
Speaker 1: on it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the bloody frosty.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And all the sisters are like, I don't know, I
Speaker 1: can't tell. I can't tell if that's true or not.
Speaker 1: And she's like it's a lie.
Speaker 2: Ah bitch, she's crazy.
Speaker 1: Later, Empress Natasha talks to the princess about the wedding.
Speaker 1: She's like, I hate all of this. I hate the wedding.
Speaker 1: I hate you going to the sisterhood school. This kid's nine.
Speaker 1: He's nine. The Chesy boy is nine.
Speaker 2: And he's got name threw it, ri Chesy. That's just
Speaker 2: a dumb es.
Speaker 1: Are you fucking kidding asking me your husband.
Speaker 2: She's like, I am here in the world of Dune,
Speaker 2: and guess what my name is, Natasha, just like Duncan. Yeah, Paul,
Speaker 2: I'm one of the people with a normal name. Your
Speaker 2: name's like kind of cool, Inns. It's not crazy, I
Speaker 2: know if you Andezza's in real life. But she's like
Speaker 2: through it, ri Chesy, like this is what you're doing.
Speaker 2: And also I think this is really interesting because the
Speaker 2: mom is basically like, you don't have to do this.
Speaker 2: You can just marry whoever you want your royalty, like,
Speaker 2: just live my life, don't live what your father wants.
Speaker 2: And I think that's interesting because that sets up that
Speaker 2: battle between the mom and then the influence of these witches.
Speaker 1: So the princess has a completely different point of view,
Speaker 1: which is she loves it. She wants to marry the boy.
Speaker 1: In fact, she wishes the boy was like three years
Speaker 1: old instead of nine, so she could have six extra
Speaker 1: years influencing him and molding him and.
Speaker 2: Being in the bensnany jesuit at school.
Speaker 1: Yeah, turning his heart and brains into servants for the Kreno.
Speaker 1: Cause she's like, this is fucking awesome. Mom's like fine,
Speaker 1: but also admit to me that you want to fuck
Speaker 1: You're a Tread's swordmasters, right, I could see it. You
Speaker 1: should do it. Yeah, I support it. And by the way,
Speaker 1: everybody could see it. Kuran, the swordmaster, walks in and
Speaker 1: he tells the Emperor that a guy just arrived from
Speaker 1: Oracus and it's Jason Momoa. No, it's not.
Speaker 2: Like, look at this man, isn't he Jason Momo? From behind? No,
Speaker 2: I knew it wasn't him.
Speaker 3: We have at home.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, that's right. This is Wish Jason Momo.
Speaker 1: This is t WU Jason Ravola. This is Houston Street
Speaker 1: Jason Ravola. He is Desmond Hart. He is a twelve
Speaker 1: tour veteran of the battlefields of Iracus, where he's been
Speaker 1: fighting Fremen and just recently his entire squadron was totally
Speaker 1: wiped out by a Fremen attack. And guess what, Desmond
Speaker 1: Hart the only guy who fucking survived. He's a little
Speaker 1: he's a little amped up, a little weird, but you're
Speaker 1: gonna like him. Hart has a meeting with the Emperor
Speaker 1: and he says, guess what, Emperor, it wasn't Fremen, it
Speaker 1: was your own allies. It was other forces from the
Speaker 1: great Houses who were secretly put on Iracus to undermine you.
Speaker 1: And the Emperor is like what. He goes over and
Speaker 1: talks to Kasha, is like, Kasha, is this true. She's like, well,
Speaker 1: he's telling the truth and what he thinks is the truth,
Speaker 1: so who knows? And she's like, why haven't I heard
Speaker 1: a thing about this? And she's like, well, maybe it's
Speaker 1: an isolated incident. Sounds is a weird.
Speaker 2: Thing, very suck.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't get that.
Speaker 2: I just want to say I love Mark Strong. He's
Speaker 2: one of my favorite actors. He's great in the Penguin.
Speaker 2: Love to see him here. Love that he's getting to
Speaker 2: plan an emper Good for him. But this emperor is dumb.
Speaker 2: If this man walked in and was like, hey, so
Speaker 2: everybody else who was a witness to this diede but
Speaker 2: here's my version of it that no one else can support.
Speaker 2: And then the Empress like, come to my wedding, Come
Speaker 2: to my door's wedding.
Speaker 1: I'm like, why is he invited? Don't I agree with you?
Speaker 1: So yeah, heart is like, hey, do you want your
Speaker 1: very own Jason Momoa in the palace? Give me a
Speaker 1: job here, And the Emperor is like sure.
Speaker 2: Sure, I'm too busy for this.
Speaker 1: And in fact, you don't just get a job, you
Speaker 1: get to show up to my fucking daughter's wedding to
Speaker 1: a nine year old. This is gonna be an awesome time,
Speaker 1: great food, great drink, incredible. Kasha has a dream that
Speaker 1: includes a lot of really ominous symbols, including fruit filled
Speaker 1: with worms and the princess being devoured by a sand worm,
Speaker 1: and then those glowing eyes with a strange voice in space.
Speaker 1: She goes to speak to the princesses like, I'm leaving
Speaker 1: because there's weird signs and dreams importance and I gotta
Speaker 1: go back. The vibes are off. I got to talk
Speaker 1: to the sisterhood about it. I'll be back, but listen,
Speaker 1: we hope you become empress. You're well on your way,
Speaker 1: and I'll be back shortly. Okay. The Emperor is really
Speaker 1: vexed that Kasha has left, but apparently she'll be back. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he just she leaves her like a message, like on
Speaker 1: a mini disc, and he's like, what this is fucked up,
Speaker 1: But apparently she's only going to miss the engagement party,
Speaker 1: not the actual wedding itself, so okay. The Emperor Empress.
Speaker 1: They argue about this wedding. The Emperor is for it
Speaker 1: because he needs the arichesy.
Speaker 2: Shit he needs and the galaxy the best.
Speaker 1: And a cheesy ship and go to bring a rackets
Speaker 1: to his knees uh, and the prisons against it because
Speaker 1: the groom is nine.
Speaker 2: He's like, come on, and she's like, this is just
Speaker 2: some dumb Betty jesureite plot. I'm not into this. She's like, well,
Speaker 2: if I don't always happy, and he's like, she wants
Speaker 2: to do it, We'll be happy with.
Speaker 1: Cheesy and again, we'll talk about the various storytelling decisions later.
Speaker 1: But I think part of the reason that particular conflict
Speaker 1: doesn't land too much is because your daughter wants to
Speaker 1: do it. Anyway, We go back to Wallack and Tula
Speaker 1: and Valier strategizing for the princess's arrival. Who do we
Speaker 1: pair her with? Who's your friend? Et cetera. You know this.
Speaker 1: The acolyte program is apparently a very important program. Emmeline, No,
Speaker 1: she's a bad influence. It's a bad apple. What about
Speaker 1: Sister Jen. Sister Jen is a little too independent, but
Speaker 1: obviously very very talented. What about Theodosia? Okay, hold on, now,
Speaker 1: she owes us for some reason which we will clearly
Speaker 1: find out about later. And she's apparently Vali's favorite, So
Speaker 1: guess what It's probably gonna be Theodosia, although Tula's favorite
Speaker 1: is Lila. Okay. Valia thinks that Lila is weak and afraid. Okay,
Speaker 1: so there's gonna be a difference of a pity there,
Speaker 1: and Tula says, well, she has a lot of promise,
Speaker 1: but she just needs time. I don't know that we've
Speaker 1: really landed on who the acolyte for the princess is
Speaker 1: gonna be, but clearly we're in a horse race between
Speaker 1: Lila and Theodosia. Rumbling then announces the arrival of the
Speaker 1: ship that shouldn't be here. It's Kasha. She's like, I
Speaker 1: had a really crazy dream. Let me tell you about it.
Speaker 1: She's clearly very afraid. Kasha is concerned that the reckoning,
Speaker 1: which is ten thousand years from now, if that's the
Speaker 1: thing they're talking about, might be closer if they do
Speaker 1: the thing that they're doing, which is putting an empress
Speaker 1: on the throne in the genetic machinations. They think that
Speaker 1: they're going to have a hard time getting the princess
Speaker 1: on the throne, which is why it's crucial apparently that
Speaker 1: the princess marry this nine year old that.
Speaker 2: Kasha is like, don't do it. She's like beginning to
Speaker 2: have her downs because of She's like, well, if a
Speaker 2: kid just has bad vibes.
Speaker 1: I had a crazy dream, and maybe we shouldn't do this.
Speaker 1: One thing that we should do is toss to an
Speaker 1: ad break. We're going to go to a word from
Speaker 1: our sponsors back in a second, and we're back, and
Speaker 1: the cheeses are back. The Chesy's a back, Baby Cheesy's arrive.
Speaker 1: It's the engagement party, a wonderful event. We get her.
Speaker 1: Look at Pruit, this young nine year old chesy boy.
Speaker 1: The princess is there, she looks great. The Empress the
Speaker 1: loving that dress, that red dress is about you're in
Speaker 1: a Tread's all there, Tula back on Wallach. Tula and
Speaker 1: Vala argue about the importance of Castia's dream. Tula is like,
Speaker 1: we got to take them more seriously, don't we. Let's
Speaker 1: pump the brakes and just really analyze what we're doing.
Speaker 1: He says, all gas, no breaks. We go forward. The
Speaker 1: princess is marrying that little boy, and she's the empress
Speaker 1: we need and we got to do it. Tula is like, okay,
Speaker 1: but can you just go and check the genetic archive
Speaker 1: to just make sure that we're right. Yeah, yeah, I'll
Speaker 1: go check here. The princess and Pruitt go through with
Speaker 1: the engagement ritual. It is super awkward. It involves like
Speaker 1: feeding pomegranate seaberries to each other something. Yeah. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: doesn't go smoothly. Preuit in particular does not seem keen
Speaker 1: to wed at this particular time, which I get it.
Speaker 1: He's nine, and it's very awkward, but there's lots of
Speaker 1: applause because obviously a lot of right is writing on us. Later,
Speaker 1: Constantine is playing the lute, and the ladies fucking love
Speaker 1: that shit. When he gets the.
Speaker 2: Loot out, Pruit sisters are really into it, and I think.
Speaker 1: He's a good looking kid. Lord he is.
Speaker 2: He's hunky and he's got a very strong jaw line.
Speaker 1: The Emperor is watching all of this closely. He's watching
Speaker 1: the richeses very suspiciously. The Princess, who is sitting on
Speaker 1: a little Dais couch with Pruet, notices that he's messing
Speaker 1: around with his little pouch on his belt, Like, what
Speaker 1: the fuck's that? I can tell that you're being untruthful
Speaker 1: right now and trying to hide whatever is in your
Speaker 1: little fucking belt pocket. And he's like, okay, it's this,
Speaker 1: and he pulls out a little robot lizard that runs
Speaker 1: around the room and runs around the floor. Mister Hart
Speaker 1: Desmond Heart Timu Jason Momoa stabs it with a knife
Speaker 1: and then shows it to everybody, and everybody is shocked
Speaker 1: because this is apparently forbidden robot shit, you know, coming
Speaker 1: off the Robot Wars, you're not supposed to have stuff.
Speaker 2: It's actually like scared in as when she saw it,
Speaker 2: She's like when the unfelt from the hand, she was
Speaker 2: like terrified.
Speaker 1: These are the things that tried to enslave us. How
Speaker 1: what the fuck? You can't have shit like this? And
Speaker 1: House Karno, obviously because of their role in guiding the
Speaker 1: galaxy to victory of the machines, takes this kind of
Speaker 1: stuff very seriously. The Empress is like, this is forbidden.
Speaker 1: This is forbidden. We're Chesy's we might have to throw
Speaker 1: you in the dungeon. The Emperor is like, oh who
Speaker 1: whoa wha who Let's talk about it after the marriage.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay to a child. Yeah, I'm married to this child.
Speaker 1: It's like, obviously it's a big deal. Yes, talk about
Speaker 1: it later, but he is clearly concerned. Heart gives the
Speaker 1: boy back his little robot. Here's a moment I didn't understand.
Speaker 1: Prude is like, thanks Eniz for what.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no no. She when the mom is
Speaker 2: like talking about it being forbidden technology and trying to
Speaker 2: set the gods on them, she puts him behind her
Speaker 2: back and like protects him, but then she turns around
Speaker 2: and says to him, if I see that thing again,
Speaker 2: I'll kill you myself murder. So that was a bit
Speaker 2: complex to me, But I think she's playing the political
Speaker 2: game where she was protecting per It because it's like,
Speaker 2: this is my guy that I'm gonna get married to,
Speaker 2: and we have to have some kind of loyalty. But
Speaker 2: also you're fucking with my ship, which is that I
Speaker 2: want to go to the Hearken.
Speaker 1: And I just found it weird because obviously Ynes blew
Speaker 1: up his spot. It's weird to thank her in that moment. Anyway.
Speaker 1: Valia is like, hey, just check the archive, and I
Speaker 1: just want you to know, like legit, like the princess
Speaker 1: is the right one. We're good.
Speaker 2: Oh and with zero evidence, like bay, yes please.
Speaker 1: Tula wants Kasha back at the Emperor's side, like we
Speaker 1: got to have her there. Valia says, yes, we'll obviously
Speaker 1: we're gonna put her back when he place her back
Speaker 1: with the Emperor, but we got to make sure that
Speaker 1: everything is okay with her upstairs because these dreams, I
Speaker 1: guess are a little concerning. Sister Emmeline and Jen are
Speaker 1: complaining about the princess looming arrival on campus. So we
Speaker 1: got to get the idea that this is a controversial
Speaker 1: thing that's going to happen here at the school. Constantin
Speaker 1: and Yinez head into town for a party. This is
Speaker 1: wild raving. Yes, spare fucking. They snort some imperial booger sugars. So,
Speaker 1: I guess what do we think this is? Like spice cocaine? Maybe, yeah, like.
Speaker 2: Some drugs caught with spice. Aboo is there anything like
Speaker 2: this in the books.
Speaker 3: There are a lot of drugs in the books. Yeah,
Speaker 3: Frank Kreber was not about drugs. This could be sumuta,
Speaker 3: this could be a laca blah blah blah. Like there's
Speaker 3: a lot of deep cut, lower drug things. But it
Speaker 3: just looks like, okay.
Speaker 1: Straight up, they're just doing good. So they go to
Speaker 1: a club. The club is banging. Meanwhile, the Emperor is
Speaker 1: like brooding by himself. He's so sad. He's like, Kash
Speaker 1: is not here, Who do I trust?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 1: What about Desmond Heart? Dosnet Heart comes in?
Speaker 2: What about your wife? Sah, how about you have a
Speaker 2: conversation with your wife?
Speaker 1: Well, he says, there's apparently, yeah, there's apparently a problem
Speaker 1: between those two. But Desmond Heart comes in and is like,
Speaker 1: I can tell you're afraid, which is like a weird
Speaker 1: thing to start with. The Emperor asks Heart, Okay, what
Speaker 1: do we do about this insurgency on Aracus that you
Speaker 1: say is not fremen. Heart doesn't answer, but he's like, well,
Speaker 1: that's not your only problem. Here's what your actual problem is.
Speaker 1: Your problem is that other great houses in the lands
Speaker 1: rad are grumbling because you made them get rid of
Speaker 1: their cell phones and their laptops and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: And they are like, we like that stuff. We want
Speaker 1: it back, we want all.
Speaker 2: That life is hard without.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I guess this is aboo. Is this pre
Speaker 1: the Mentat system?
Speaker 3: This is around the Mentats. Yeah, everything sort of crops
Speaker 3: up at once, the sisters, the Mentats that guild all
Speaker 3: of these things that replace technology.
Speaker 1: So at this point they're doing like space calculations, like
Speaker 1: on pad and paper, Like, how are they just like calculators?
Speaker 1: I mean they're doing it, Longhand at this point.
Speaker 3: No, the Mentat should exist. But we haven't seen any
Speaker 3: of the show. Okay, so I don't know what the
Speaker 3: creative choice is there.
Speaker 1: We may see them okay later, So whatever the case,
Speaker 1: there are various dissidents within the royal system who think
Speaker 1: that getting rid of Ai was a bad idea, and
Speaker 1: they think that the emperor having the monopoly on spice
Speaker 1: is also a bad idea, and the Emperor is like,
Speaker 1: I've never heard of this. This leads me to believe,
Speaker 1: along with the Glowing Eyes boo, that the major antagonist
Speaker 1: is going to be the Spacing Guild, like the Rise
Speaker 1: of Space.
Speaker 2: That's a good I like that.
Speaker 3: That would be fun for them to introduce that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, the Emperor is now like, you know what,
Speaker 1: Kasha is not here and I've completely changed my mind.
Speaker 1: I'm out on the wedding.
Speaker 2: Dude, this guy he has got like no fucking backbone,
Speaker 2: Like he doesn't know what is going on. He's like,
Speaker 2: Kasha has left me for five minutes and I'm sick
Speaker 2: of it. I'm done. Actually now, fake Jason Hama. You
Speaker 2: are now my new spiritual guide even though I've only
Speaker 2: known you for.
Speaker 1: You're my new guy, and I'm out on the wedding
Speaker 1: despite the fact that Kasha, who has never steered me wrong,
Speaker 1: is for it. But here's the issue.
Speaker 2: Needs those riches a ship the riches of ships.
Speaker 1: It's important. And here is like one of these moments
Speaker 1: where I felt a producer saying we need to restate
Speaker 1: the stakes because I don't understand what's at stake here.
Speaker 1: And so he says again, we need the riches ships
Speaker 1: because if I pull out of this marriage, we don't
Speaker 1: get the ships. And then we need the ships to
Speaker 1: secure ourragas and secure the spies. Because the Emperor can
Speaker 1: underlived the Spice. I'm a dead I'm a dead man.
Speaker 2: I'm a dead man. You'll come to me on the
Speaker 2: day of my daughter's engagement, but.
Speaker 1: I can't have the spice ad This is terrible. Desmond
Speaker 1: Hart says, Emperor. I'm gonna tell you some weird shit
Speaker 1: because I've been on a planet of spice for a
Speaker 1: long time and now I'm just gonna get crazy. Here's
Speaker 1: what's crazy. It's a miracle that I'm alive and then
Speaker 1: I'm with you right now because I was almost dead.
Speaker 1: I was reborn on Arakis. They almost killed me. I
Speaker 1: was there for twelve different tours and somehow I died
Speaker 1: a million times. And I'm back. He's back, and I
Speaker 1: feel that it's the will of the gods that I
Speaker 1: am here with you, Emperor Carino, and the Emperor says, well, listen,
Speaker 1: I'm not a religious man, but if the gods can
Speaker 1: get me out of this wedding to the a chesy child,
Speaker 1: oh I will be literally the biggest religion guy in
Speaker 1: the galaxy. Like I will be number one religion.
Speaker 2: My god, my, this fucking guy. This is like, this
Speaker 2: is like when you're a little kid and you're in
Speaker 2: trouble and you're like, oh please, I don't want anyone
Speaker 2: to find out I'm gonna be in trouble. Like then
Speaker 2: I will like be a good person. I'm like, how
Speaker 2: old are you?
Speaker 1: Brow?
Speaker 2: Are you like eight years old? You literally just gave
Speaker 2: this guy a free pause to do whatever he wants
Speaker 2: to stop the wedding, just so that you can be
Speaker 2: like really into religion. Like, Mark strong, Emperor, you're doing
Speaker 2: a bad job.
Speaker 1: Mark strong Emperor, you are you are not a great emperor.
Speaker 1: In the club where literally most of the people here
Speaker 1: are off fam they are Kieran is there. He clearly
Speaker 1: got the text from Yez is like going.
Speaker 2: To the club, I'm gad to see you there.
Speaker 1: And there's a vibe there is there is an extremely
Speaker 1: strong vibe between them. Kieran's girlfriend question Mark is like
Speaker 1: over his shoulder, being like, why are you flirting with
Speaker 1: the princess? Like do I need to explain this to you?
Speaker 1: So that was confusing because clearly the vibe I was hey,
Speaker 1: boyfriend girlfriend, but there was no explanation to who this
Speaker 1: woman behind Kieran was. Right, miss, I would say, it.
Speaker 2: Is quite interesting to me that this is a show,
Speaker 2: even after a couple of watches, where like they choose
Speaker 2: to do a lot of exposition about some stuff but
Speaker 2: be very vague about other stuff. And I guess that's
Speaker 2: every show, but it felt like in this when it
Speaker 2: was like we need the spice, the spice must flow,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, bro, everyone who's ever watched Dune or
Speaker 2: read even one bit of Dune knows the spice must flow,
Speaker 2: even if you only know the memes. But I would
Speaker 2: also like to like know some names, so like can
Speaker 2: the names be flowing?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Like who is this woman who looks upset? Anyway,
Speaker 1: Kieran if he is dating that woman, he's not particularly
Speaker 1: attached to her, because he immediately goes to a private
Speaker 1: room with Princess Ynez. He smokes some space crack and
Speaker 1: then they start having sex crazy. They seize the moment.
Speaker 1: She's like, I'm leaving forever probably in a days, go
Speaker 1: into the Benny not yet. The Benny Jes are at
Speaker 1: school and also marrying this nine year old, So if
Speaker 1: we want to get it in, we kind of have
Speaker 1: to get.
Speaker 2: It in right now.
Speaker 1: Let's do it now, and Kurtt is like, bet, let's go.
Speaker 1: We go to Wallach nine, where it's nighttime. We meet Lila.
Speaker 1: She can't sleep. Jen also up notices that Lila can't sleep.
Speaker 1: He's like, what's your deal. Lila says, that story that
Speaker 1: you told, which was a lie, there's a ring of
Speaker 1: truth to it and I could tell. And then Lila
Speaker 1: tells her story about how she got here. She doesn't
Speaker 1: know who her parents are. She thinks that the sisters
Speaker 1: know her family history but are keeping it from her.
Speaker 1: Jen says, don't worry because if it's important enough, the
Speaker 1: truth will find you, which is cold comfort. Valia is
Speaker 1: staring at mother Raquela's statue or mummy and just thinking
Speaker 1: about the future. Is it her mummy? Do we know?
Speaker 1: Like it seems like a very lifelike statue in a
Speaker 1: weird way. Yeah, I think it's just a statue, okay,
Speaker 1: but I like your spooky v that it's a mummy.
Speaker 1: The Emperor has a bad dream that involves a lot
Speaker 1: of the imagery which we have seen previously in the
Speaker 1: two previous bad dreams we've watched. He then goes wandering
Speaker 1: on the palace and he finds a video from Desmond
Speaker 1: Heart about how he survived on Oracus, and he watches
Speaker 1: the video taken like from a drone, I guess, and
Speaker 1: we see that there's a lot of dead bodies on
Speaker 1: the field. We don't see what happened, but Desmond Heart's
Speaker 1: walking around, he's the only guy. There's a spice loader
Speaker 1: in the background. And then there's like a huge worm
Speaker 1: that is clearly coming, and something happens. The worm seems
Speaker 1: to pause, but then also seems to attack, and then
Speaker 1: the video cuts out. Clearly Desmond is alive. So this
Speaker 1: raises a lot more questions than answer.
Speaker 2: Does this mean that he wrote to sand No, I
Speaker 2: think all of this is up in the air.
Speaker 3: It's intentionally one of those you'll find out later, Okay, yeah, thanks.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So elsewhere in the palace proven it is playing
Speaker 1: like in a hallway with his robot because apparently like
Speaker 1: he can't do it in his room because people will
Speaker 1: find out. So he's playing with his robot and Desmond
Speaker 1: Heart comes up. Prewe It is like, hey, Desmond Hart,
Speaker 1: I don't know you, but you're just like a weird,
Speaker 1: strange man in the palace. Let me tell you about
Speaker 1: my dad. Here's what's up. My dad thinks we should
Speaker 1: never have gotten rid of computers and cell phones and
Speaker 1: he wants them back.
Speaker 2: Thinks that great, he would thinks everyone should have a
Speaker 2: little airom.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that stuff's got to come back. Heart says, you know,
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I was a soldier on Oracus and prewe
Speaker 1: It is like, well, why are you here and he's like, well,
Speaker 1: because the palace is like a battleground also, and then
Speaker 1: he says, young boy, prew it. I have an important
Speaker 1: mission and sadly that mission requires you to be dead,
Speaker 1: and then he like fries the kid with his mind.
Speaker 1: It's really gross.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it goes on for a long time. They
Speaker 2: are like making you watch and this is not like
Speaker 2: a Jeoffrey who we know is evil. This is just
Speaker 2: like a funny, little rude nine year old with a toy.
Speaker 2: But alas he gets fried with The implication here to
Speaker 2: me is this is to start some kind of war
Speaker 2: or conflict or to stop the wedding, obviously, but also
Speaker 2: I feel like now you're going to have like, oh,
Speaker 2: there's someone in the palace who is a mole who
Speaker 2: is killing people. But obviously we know it's hot, but
Speaker 2: I don't think anyone else is going.
Speaker 3: To know that.
Speaker 1: I think that Desmond Hard is working on the orders
Speaker 1: of the Nascent Spacing guildh in order to make sure
Speaker 1: that the spice production remains chaotic and is up for grabs,
Speaker 1: so that they can get some access to this shit.
Speaker 1: That's what I think.
Speaker 2: I also wondered if it was like he's turned and
Speaker 2: now he's on the side of the Fremen, so he's
Speaker 2: actually there to stop spice being taken.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he doesn't look a Fremen vibe.
Speaker 2: He does look like he may have been doing some
Speaker 2: kissing with a Fremen. Yeah, kissing a Fremen, marrying a Fremen,
Speaker 2: killing children for a freemen. It could happen.
Speaker 1: This guy has smelled the water of life.
Speaker 2: Oh baby, he's spiced himself, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: Valiya wakes to screaming in the school. Tula is also
Speaker 1: awoken by this. They run up. They find Kasha wandering
Speaker 1: the halls in agony, and then she burns up just
Speaker 1: like Pruett died.
Speaker 2: You know, I like Kasha. I was a big Kasha man.
Speaker 1: The only Asian character dies in episode one. I can't
Speaker 1: do we've done it again anyway. Valyya then says, I
Speaker 1: see mother twice and clearly she realizes the importance of
Speaker 1: this event in a way that we don't understand yet,
Speaker 1: and that brings us to the end of our episode.
Speaker 1: We be right back after the word for our sponsors
Speaker 1: to discuss this episode. We're back. Okay, there's a lot.
Speaker 1: There's a lot here. Yeah, and while we discussed the episode,
Speaker 1: let's also discuss some of the lore that we saw
Speaker 1: so that we can all understand what we've seen. First
Speaker 1: of all, just reactions. Aboo, you're the super fan. You've
Speaker 1: been following this Yeah, guy for years, You've been following
Speaker 1: the production news of this show for years. Your thoughts
Speaker 1: Episode one, Dune Prophecy.
Speaker 3: I think I'm cautiously optimistic. I quite enjoyed this first episode,
Speaker 3: and I want to come into it with an open mind.
Speaker 3: Considering it is episode one. I'm trying to remember what
Speaker 3: it felt like to watch Game of Thrones episode one,
Speaker 3: and obviously.
Speaker 2: I think this is very Game of Thrones episode one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and so I want to give it time to
Speaker 3: tell its story and come into an open minded So
Speaker 3: I'm gonna let it do that before I come down
Speaker 3: too hard on it. Obviously I come in with a
Speaker 3: lot of preconceived notions, just being a Dune person and
Speaker 3: being a lifelong fan of the universe and the books.
Speaker 3: So there's a lot there. There's a lot of easter eggs.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of deep cuts for folks who do
Speaker 3: know you know, Like you mentioned Tiaran RFL earlier, Jason,
Speaker 3: that is a deep, deep cut from the fourth and
Speaker 3: fifth book that Frank Herbert wrote, of the six that
Speaker 3: Frank wrote, and so like most people aren't making it
Speaker 3: that far and aren't recognizing the word RFL, you know,
Speaker 3: And that to me inspires a little bit of confidence
Speaker 3: that the folks behind the show have done their own
Speaker 3: work and are throwing in those deep cuts for the
Speaker 3: super fans and doing their best to also make it accessible.
Speaker 3: I agree with many of the criticisms we've talked about,
Speaker 3: heavy on the exposition a bit of clunky storytelling, a
Speaker 3: lot of things that are like we'll tell you about
Speaker 3: this later, but just keep this in mind. Let's put
Speaker 3: a pin in it. There's a lot of putting pin
Speaker 3: in things for now. But again, episode one of a series,
Speaker 3: it's got to establish a lot of things before we
Speaker 3: get to the meat of it, so I'm willing to
Speaker 3: give it a bit of grace. TLDR. I liked it.
Speaker 3: I'm impressed by what I saw. It's very beautiful visually,
Speaker 3: very beautiful, and I look forward to seeing how the
Speaker 3: rest of it goes.
Speaker 1: Rosie your thoughts.
Speaker 2: I agree with the Boo. Also like Doune for me
Speaker 2: in general, whether it's the Lynch Dune or the Denny
Speaker 2: June or this or even the books when I'm brave
Speaker 2: enough to try and dive into them, it's a vibe
Speaker 2: property for me. I think it's all about the world
Speaker 2: building and the vibe of it and whether you want
Speaker 2: to spend time in that world. And I think Denny
Speaker 2: made me want to spend time in it a lot,
Speaker 2: so I got a lot more into done in the
Speaker 2: books and this first episode. It does a lot of
Speaker 2: things that I really enjoy. I love like a school story,
Speaker 2: in a genre space, So I think it's very interesting
Speaker 2: that we're getting this kind of Bena Jesuit training ground
Speaker 2: that's very ya, very divergent. I was very into that.
Speaker 2: I also thought that it looked great, very cool stuff
Speaker 2: to see, and also I like the weird lore of
Speaker 2: the Benny Jesre, so I'm interested to kind of see
Speaker 2: that happen. Also, I did think, even though you know,
Speaker 2: opening with a narration and a kind of flashback is
Speaker 2: often a shortcut for doing a deeper storytelling, it was
Speaker 2: interesting to see the visualization of what the Machine War
Speaker 2: looked like because I think often Doune feels very archaic
Speaker 2: and very star wars y and very like Sandy Planet's retrofuturism.
Speaker 2: So it's really interesting to get to see that high
Speaker 2: tech segment. So I would be interested to go back
Speaker 2: and look at that. And obviously the AI stuff feels
Speaker 2: very timely right now, Jason, what about you.
Speaker 1: Agree with everything that was said. I'm cautiously in In fact,
Speaker 1: I think very optimistic. I think that a really good
Speaker 1: show I think could emerge here, and could emerge I
Speaker 1: think pretty early on in this season, once we set
Speaker 1: a baseline of understanding of where we are in the world.
Speaker 1: I do think that there are I have small notes,
Speaker 1: like I think the exposition could have been handled better.
Speaker 1: I think that there was too much.
Speaker 2: A lot of characters introduced as well, Like a lot of.
Speaker 1: Characters, I think we could have narrowed the focus considerably,
Speaker 1: like who I couldn't tell you who the main character
Speaker 1: of this episode was, whereas in Game of Thrones episode one,
Speaker 1: it was very clear and Ned was going to be
Speaker 1: the main character of that story, and I think that
Speaker 1: that was a little bit of an issue. I do
Speaker 1: think that there was too much, Like with so much
Speaker 1: information coming at you, I disagree with, Hey, table this
Speaker 1: for later, but it's going to be important. We're going
Speaker 1: to come back to it. I think you need to
Speaker 1: explain more right away and set the stakes right away.
Speaker 2: Yeah, or do more, like more distinct hooks rather than
Speaker 2: put a pin in it. You want to feel hooked?
Speaker 2: Do you want to it?
Speaker 1: Like the wedding is a good example of like why
Speaker 1: is everybody so anxious about this? And then you find
Speaker 1: out it's a nine year old? Just tell us that,
Speaker 1: like off the back, just give us that off the jump.
Speaker 1: There are other weird things, like it was only when
Speaker 1: we started talking in our pre recording powow that I
Speaker 1: realized that it's very possible, if not likely, that Volia
Speaker 1: lies to her sister Tula, that she actually checked the Bai.
Speaker 1: The princess is the right person, because otherwise I was like,
Speaker 1: why does this scene exist? Why is there a scene
Speaker 1: in which Tula and Valia discuss whether or not to
Speaker 1: check the archives and then Folly's like, Okay, I'll check them,
Speaker 1: and then we get a scene later where she's leaving
Speaker 1: the archives, She's like, I checked it. That's really clunky
Speaker 1: to me, And the possibility that she's lying just kind
Speaker 1: of slips by because of all this information that you
Speaker 1: don't know of varying importance, and it's hard to understand,
Speaker 1: like what's important what's not. I think they could have
Speaker 1: set stuff up like that better by just letting you
Speaker 1: see that she didn't actually do it, and and there's
Speaker 1: like various things like that. Oh and one more, I
Speaker 1: think that the Sisterhood is too far along. I would
Speaker 1: have liked it if they were further back in their evolution,
Speaker 1: because yes, they're not the Benny Jesuit yet, right, and
Speaker 1: they've just only developed the voice, and they may not
Speaker 1: have other technologies like the Gomjabar and different.
Speaker 2: Already in these spaces.
Speaker 1: But they're already there are They already have someone with
Speaker 1: the emperor who's advising the emperor. They already have sisters
Speaker 1: who are placed with very great houses throughout the lands
Speaker 1: right including the Chess, and so they've already grown to
Speaker 1: this incredible extent where they're doing essentially the core functions
Speaker 1: of what the Benijeres are going to do ten thousand
Speaker 1: years now, and I think that's too similar. I would
Speaker 1: have liked to see them having to make the case
Speaker 1: about why it's important to have one of these sisters
Speaker 1: to in your hall of power, like why do you
Speaker 1: want someone like this next to a duke, next to
Speaker 1: the emperor, next to a various other lords? And that's
Speaker 1: my only one note that said. I do I think
Speaker 1: this is I think this is really promising. I think
Speaker 1: obviously it looks great, and I think that there is
Speaker 1: potential for a really really fun show. And I love
Speaker 1: the kind of political machinations that direction they've taken it,
Speaker 1: which is so core I think to the experience of
Speaker 1: reading Dune, and so I can't wait to see where
Speaker 1: this goes. Now that we've talked about our reactions. I
Speaker 1: think we're all on the same page. Let's mine the mind,
Speaker 1: yes of super producer Boo, to try and understand this
Speaker 1: world a little better and get some of that exposition
Speaker 1: that that show dumped on us to set in our
Speaker 1: minds a little bit more. Let's start. You mentioned RFL,
Speaker 1: the term we heard. Let's go further into some of
Speaker 1: those easter eggs. What are some of those deep cuts
Speaker 1: those easter eggs that the show dropped on us.
Speaker 3: Sure, so there's a couple of things that I found.
Speaker 3: And this is all super fun for me personally because
Speaker 3: I love world building. And again, I'm picking apart some
Speaker 3: of these because I think it shows us the confidence
Speaker 3: with which the creators are coming into this story. They've
Speaker 3: done their homework, and that inspires confidence in someone like me.
Speaker 3: I mentioned RFL, so we already talked about how in
Speaker 3: the show it's defined as this great yet vague sort
Speaker 3: of existential threat for the Sisterhood, some sort of reckoning,
Speaker 3: perhaps a tyrant. It's not very well defined what exactly
Speaker 3: this RFL threat is, but we know that Raquela has
Speaker 3: foreseen it and Vally is working toward preventing it. And
Speaker 3: what's funny is like in the fourth and fifth do
Speaker 3: in books. That's basically how it's used in the books
Speaker 3: as well, this vague existential threat that's very loosely defined
Speaker 3: that folks are foreseeing and worried about and trying to prevent.
Speaker 3: I did a little bit of history. What's fun is
Speaker 3: Frank is obviously borrowing a lot of his world building
Speaker 3: from real world religions and traditions and cultures. And so RFL,
Speaker 3: for folks who may not know, is actually the Hebrew
Speaker 3: word for fog. And within a religious context you see
Speaker 3: RFL come up in the Bible a lot. For example,
Speaker 3: it's usually used to refer to the apocalypse. So clearly
Speaker 3: there's a line here between the way Frank is using
Speaker 3: it and the real world use of that word. Something
Speaker 3: else I wanted to call out quickly was at Raquella's funeral,
Speaker 3: we hear Dorotea and some of the other sisters say
Speaker 3: the words the mind of man is holy. And that's
Speaker 3: important because that's sort of like the rallying cry of
Speaker 3: the but Larians, the Butleryan gihad. Is is this turning
Speaker 3: against the machines, right, this war against the machines. Here
Speaker 3: in the show, it's a literal war. I would argue,
Speaker 3: in Frank Herbert's original interpretation of it, it was more
Speaker 3: of a religious Zelot turning against technology as something that
Speaker 3: harms us as humans, takes away our humanity, and so
Speaker 3: we turned against it. In the show it's a literal war.
Speaker 3: But regardless, the mind of man is holy is sort
Speaker 3: of the rallying cry of that man is holy and
Speaker 3: relying too much on technology takes away from man's holiness.
Speaker 3: And Jason, before our recording, you had asked, like, where's
Speaker 3: the line? You know, what are we saying is a
Speaker 3: thinking machine and must be banned? And where are we
Speaker 3: saying it's okay? And I think the easiest way to
Speaker 3: think about it is a thinking machine is something that
Speaker 3: can compute on its own, and any sort of mechanical
Speaker 3: machine that requires human input and human control to operate
Speaker 3: is fine. Maybe it toes the line a little bit,
Speaker 3: and certainly many technologies in the books toe the line.
Speaker 3: A lot of cultures are pushing how far they can
Speaker 3: mess with the Butlerians, But I think it's that so
Speaker 3: like a computer that does, like advanced computations, not kosher,
Speaker 3: but like a I don't know, like a claw machine,
Speaker 3: a ship, a ship, something that moves because like people
Speaker 3: push buttons. That's okay, So that's interesting. Two super quick
Speaker 3: things I wanted to call out as well. We see
Speaker 3: the blue within blue eyes in this episode, which is
Speaker 3: fun because we've seen that Timothy Shallowy himself gets blue
Speaker 3: eyes in the movies. Here it's Kieran's girlfriend, question Mark friend.
Speaker 3: She has blue eyes, And if you've only seen the movies,
Speaker 3: you might think is that a Fremen because I've only
Speaker 3: ever seen Fremen with blue eyes. But the reality is
Speaker 3: these eyes, which are called the eyes of a bad
Speaker 3: are just the result of spice addiction. So we're getting
Speaker 3: some hints here that maybe a lot of this clobe ub,
Speaker 3: a lot of what's being consumed is spice or spice adjacent,
Speaker 3: and perhaps this person in particular is addicted and has
Speaker 3: the blue eyes.
Speaker 1: Question regarding spice addiction, because I think we've seen from
Speaker 1: Dune and from the later lore that continue to suspice
Speaker 1: you basically become immortal, but it also mutates you use
Speaker 1: of the fucking like a crazy huge cadpole. Much of
Speaker 1: the Space and Guild. That said, it seems to me
Speaker 1: like how expensive would like a crippling spice addiction be
Speaker 1: because this is like the rarest, the most hard to get,
Speaker 1: the most important substance in the universe, and it is
Speaker 1: a little crazy to me that it would even be
Speaker 1: possible to use it recreationally.
Speaker 3: Yes, you are correct. I think we are seeing a
Speaker 3: club for the one percenters. Hence the princess is going
Speaker 3: to this club in particular, and I think the patrons
Speaker 3: are also fellow one percenters. The economics, of course, like
Speaker 3: frankdon lay out the economics of spice, and if you
Speaker 3: try to pick apart the hints throughout the books and
Speaker 3: do the math, which I have tried to do, it
Speaker 3: makes absolutely no sense. So I think just the simple
Speaker 3: answer to that is like spice is available to the
Speaker 3: wealthy enough people and they are able to consume it
Speaker 3: in enough quantities, which is not a lot. You only
Speaker 3: need a little bit of spice to get addicted.
Speaker 1: You mentioned the earlier in our conversation, like the kind
Speaker 1: of like the three legged tripod the Emperor.
Speaker 2: That's why I was gonna say, yeah, yeah, tell us
Speaker 2: about how why is spice important in a post computer
Speaker 2: world and what does it allow humanity to do.
Speaker 3: That's a great question. First of all, it's economically important. Spice,
Speaker 3: very analogous to oil, is the oil of this universe.
Speaker 3: It operates a lot of things. So the Guild operates
Speaker 3: giant ships. But since it can't travel through space and
Speaker 3: through void space using advanced computers that do the computations
Speaker 3: for them, they use these tadpole fish people that you're
Speaker 3: alluding to, Jason, which we won't see until future books
Speaker 3: and movies. These navigators consume tons and tons of spice.
Speaker 3: They live in these giant vats of spice, and then
Speaker 3: they basically they trip balls and vision their way through
Speaker 3: safely navigating this ship. So spice is the engine that
Speaker 3: is powering transportation within the Empire. That's one value of it.
Speaker 3: The Sisterhood needs spice in order to create reverend Mothers,
Speaker 3: in order to create truth sayers, So there's another political
Speaker 3: and economic aspect of it. The Sisterhood needs it, so
Speaker 3: it's necessary for a lot of the groups that pop
Speaker 3: up host Machine War to fill in the gaps of technology.
Speaker 3: Spice powers a lot of these groups and their abilities
Speaker 3: and thus becomes this very essential commodity that many groups
Speaker 3: need for various reasons. And then are fighting over because
Speaker 3: of politics and power.
Speaker 1: Anything else that we should know that will help us
Speaker 1: understand the world of Doom Prophecy as we head into
Speaker 1: the rest of the season.
Speaker 3: The final thing, this is a deep, deep cut one
Speaker 3: last thing I wanted to kind of shout out for,
Speaker 3: in particular my Dune heads out there. The Empress has
Speaker 3: this very quick throwaway line about the traders of Harmon
Speaker 3: THEP when she's talking about her wedding dress with Yez,
Speaker 3: and that perked my ears up because Harmon THEP is
Speaker 3: a planet that shows up in many of the Brian
Speaker 3: Herbert Kevin J. Anderson prequel books. It's also in the
Speaker 3: Dune Encyclopedia, which is this expanded lore book that was
Speaker 3: created and then decanonized many years ago. But Harmit THEP
Speaker 3: is fun that it got a name drop because it's
Speaker 3: a planet that's located in the same Solar system as Kaladin.
Speaker 3: It has a pretty interesting history the precursors to the
Speaker 3: Fremen people known as the Zensuni Wanderers. It was one
Speaker 3: of the planets that they wandered to. These people were
Speaker 3: basically persecuted and forcibly migrated from planet to planet before
Speaker 3: settling on Oracus. Harmon Dep was one of those planets.
Speaker 3: What's fun is we are so far back in the
Speaker 3: history again, ten thousand years back in the.
Speaker 1: History that's twice recorded human history.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so we are so far before any of this.
Speaker 3: These Zansuni wanderers are not on Harmon Dep right now
Speaker 3: in the show. None of that matters really, Like Harma
Speaker 3: Dep gets blown up. It gets nuked and blown up
Speaker 3: six thousand years after this show takes place. But what's
Speaker 3: fun is, by the time we're in Paul's universe, Harmit
Speaker 3: Dep is like a rumor. It's a lost world. There's
Speaker 3: a lost language. Nobody knows what happened to Harmon thep
Speaker 3: And it's fun to get again these really deep cuts
Speaker 3: in a show that clearly knows that the super fans
Speaker 3: like me are going to be out here listening for
Speaker 3: that sort of thing. So I wanted to call that
Speaker 3: out too. I think that's fun that they're picking tiny,
Speaker 3: tiny details and like throwaway planets to include in the writ.
Speaker 2: That's the kind of stuff that makes us excited to
Speaker 2: watch these shows and kind of agree into them. And yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: this was really fun. I'm glad to be learning more
Speaker 2: about the wild world of Dune.
Speaker 3: Yeah, truly wild.
Speaker 1: On tomorrow's episode of X ray Vision, we're diving into
Speaker 1: our favorite films in the world of sword and Sandals,
Speaker 1: movies and television shows, and then our Friday we're sharing
Speaker 1: our reactions to Gladdie in a tube. That's it for
Speaker 1: the episode. Thanks for listening, Bye bye. X ray Vision
Speaker 1: is hosted by Jason Nsumsion and Rosie Knight and is
Speaker 1: a production of iHeart Podcasts. Our executive producers are Joelle
Speaker 1: Smith and Aaron Kaufman. Our supervising producer is a Boo Zafar.
Speaker 1: Our producers are Carmen Lawn and Mia Taylor. Our theme
Speaker 1: song is by Brian Basquez.
Speaker 2: Special thanks to Soul Rubin and Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman
Speaker 2: and Heidi a Discoord moderata