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Speaker 1: Yeah, we are back on normally the show with normalish

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Speaker 1: takes or when the news gets weird.

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Speaker 2: I am Mary Catherine Camp and.

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Speaker 3: I'm Carol Markowitz. Another relaxing weekend. Mary Catherine.

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Speaker 1: I was saying, like, I can't, I can't engage with this,

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Speaker 1: like when the whole cooj is fighting with each other

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Speaker 1: on Friday night. I'm like, nah, yeah, I'm checking out.

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Speaker 1: And I went and got my kids. They were with

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Speaker 1: the grandparents for a week, and I went on a

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Speaker 1: road trip with all four kids to pick them up

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Speaker 1: and bring them back. And it was one of those

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Speaker 1: days I'm sure you've had them where everything went haywire,

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Speaker 1: like we ate an epic storm where people are driving

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Speaker 1: with their flashers on just so they can be seen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I get the big kids.

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Speaker 1: Every single thing I had planned to do with the

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Speaker 1: four of them was either.

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Speaker 2: Happen right out. There was no power.

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Speaker 1: At the places we wanted to go because of the galleon,

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Speaker 1: and we ended up eating at waffle house and like

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Speaker 1: waiting in a creek.

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Speaker 2: So if you haven't wonder.

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Speaker 3: That sounds perfect.

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Speaker 1: Actually, like just just revert to redneck when disaster strikes.

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Speaker 2: That okay, Yeah, you.

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Speaker 3: Know, I have three kids, you have four kids.

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Speaker 4: I saw a mom on a plane yesterday with four kids,

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Speaker 4: and I always am like I wish I had a fourth,

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Speaker 4: Like I wish we had, you know, gotten for it.

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Speaker 3: That fourth kid. It's it really does add a lot

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Speaker 3: of kid.

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Speaker 1: Just the counting of heads, like when you're in a

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Speaker 1: public space becomes larger.

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Speaker 2: But we did have a wonderful time. It was a disastrous,

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Speaker 2: wonderful day.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, amazing.

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Speaker 4: All right, Well, we're not going to get into the

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Speaker 4: Epstein stuff today. We are going to see how it

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Speaker 4: shakes out in the next day or two. I know,

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Speaker 4: we get accused of like not covering some topics because

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Speaker 4: we are you know, we wait and see, but we've

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Speaker 4: not been wrong on the waiting and seeing yet.

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Speaker 1: It's a really good skill to have for a normous Yeah. Yeah, like,

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Speaker 1: is anyone going to quit? I would like to see

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Speaker 1: and then we'll discuss, Right.

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Speaker 3: We will watch it play out and then we'll talk

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Speaker 3: about it. But we probably will.

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Speaker 4: Get into it for Wednesday's episode, depending on how the

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Speaker 4: next day or two shake out. But we'll start today

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Speaker 4: with our last president, Joe Biden and his cooky administration.

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Speaker 1: Wow, what have they been up to. Well, here's the

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Speaker 1: first thing that's good. So the news story is that

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Speaker 1: the New York Times gets an interview with Joe Biden

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Speaker 1: in which he says, yeah, in these giant categories of

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Speaker 1: pardons that you've all been wondering about where people were

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Speaker 1: controversially let off the hook, and these giant tranches of pardons, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I theoretically said yes to those, but no, not I

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Speaker 1: did not sign all of them. The autopen was used

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Speaker 1: to a great degree in those large groupings.

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Speaker 3: Let me read you the quote.

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Speaker 4: Mister Biden did not individually approve each name for the

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Speaker 4: categorical pardons that applied to large numbers of people.

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Speaker 3: He and the AIDS confirmed.

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Speaker 4: Rather, after extensive discussion of different possible criteria, he signed

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Speaker 4: off on the standards he wanted to be used to

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Speaker 4: determine which convicts would qualify for a reduction in sentence.

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Speaker 4: Now people are comparing this to January sixth pardons by

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Speaker 4: Donald Trump. Whatever you think of those pardons, Donald Trump

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Speaker 4: signed those pardons on camera.

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Speaker 3: They were not signed by who knows who with an autopen.

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Speaker 4: Donald Trump might not be able to name every January

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Speaker 4: six six er. But that's irrelevant because we saw him

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Speaker 4: sign the pardons, and this is an entirely different story.

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Speaker 1: Well, and I just think all of it goes back

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Speaker 1: to the question is not whether it's okay for an

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Speaker 1: autopin to do things we have all agreed to some extent,

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Speaker 1: sure that that happens in a presidency.

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Speaker 2: The question is whether the person in charge.

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Speaker 1: Of saying that the autopen could sign things was of

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Speaker 1: a state of mind where he could actually agree to

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Speaker 1: those things. Yeah, exactly in Biden's case, especially with some

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Speaker 1: of these more controversial things, it's real unclear that's exactly

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Speaker 1: where he was, and it makes me uncomfortable. Although I

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Speaker 1: do think the pardon power is so clear and extensive

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Speaker 1: that there's probably not a lot to be done except

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Speaker 1: for to expose what happened, which is I sure there's consequences.

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Speaker 4: Which is a step forward, and again finding out who

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Speaker 4: was running the country during that time. I love this

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Speaker 4: part of the New York Times article. Mister Trump, asked

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Speaker 4: by a reporter last month whether he had uncovered evidence

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Speaker 4: that anything had been illegally signed without mister Biden's knowledge,

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Speaker 4: said no, but he cited his rival's debate performance in

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Speaker 4: June twenty twenty four, when mister Biden eighty one at

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Speaker 4: the time, delivered halting and meandering answers. Mister Biden withdrew

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Speaker 4: soon after his reelection bid quote, I've uncovered, you know,

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Speaker 4: the human mind. Mister Trump said, I was in the

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Speaker 4: debate with the human mind, and I didn't think he

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Speaker 4: knew what the hell he was doing.

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Speaker 2: End quote. Fair.

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Speaker 1: Fair. The other part of this reporting says, so he's

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Speaker 1: given the strictures or the he's talked, he signs off

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Speaker 1: on the guidelines for what a group of pardons should reflect.

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Speaker 1: But then it goes on to say even after mister

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Speaker 1: Biden made that decision, One former AID said, the Bureau

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Speaker 1: of Prisons kept providing additional information about specific inmates, resulting

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Speaker 1: in small changes to the list.

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Speaker 2: Rather than ask.

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Speaker 1: Mister Biden, who this is my parentthetical was probably napping or.

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Speaker 2: Comotos or what have you. Are given times right on

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Speaker 2: the beach.

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Speaker 1: Rather than asking mister Biden to keep signing revised versions,

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Speaker 1: his staff waited and then ran the final version through

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Speaker 1: the auto pen, which they saw as a routine procedure.

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Speaker 1: The AID said, that's an interesting sentence because it does

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Speaker 1: not include a check back, either over a phone or

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Speaker 1: in person yep or anything. No, there's no conferencing with

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Speaker 1: the president on Oh, we made a few changes.

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Speaker 3: Right, we added people.

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Speaker 4: I mean it has to be through the president, and

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Speaker 4: that goes unmentioned. I also liked that the New York

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Speaker 4: Times headline was, of course, a variation on the Republicans

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Speaker 4: pounced theme right right?

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Speaker 3: Donald Dr.

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Speaker 4: Trump and his allies had begun investigations to support their

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Speaker 4: claims that Joseph bar Biden Junior was incapacitated and his

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Speaker 4: staff conspired to take presidential actions in his name.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he was incapacitated, but his staff was empowered.

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Speaker 2: To take actions in his name. Like that's the problem.

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Speaker 4: Why are you pouncing, Mary Catherine?

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Speaker 1: Like, pouncing on the truth is pretty is a pretty

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Speaker 1: decent thing to do.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Do you think we find out who was running the

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Speaker 3: White House?

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Speaker 2: Probably not really.

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Speaker 4: I don't think kjp's book is an independent tells us anything.

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Speaker 2: No. No, I mean, look, I think that's.

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Speaker 3: The only way her book sells though.

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Speaker 2: So that's true.

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Speaker 1: But I think she's going to critique him from the left,

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Speaker 1: and she is not interested in exposing what actually went down,

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Speaker 1: like that would be interesting. I mean, she certainly had

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Speaker 1: a front row seat right, although like she's not a

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Speaker 1: person of discernment, so who knows what you would get.

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Speaker 1: But I just think this is one of those things

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Speaker 1: where because largely the presses to the left, they're all

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Speaker 1: going to be like, see, it's one of those things

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Speaker 1: where you can't talk about it while it's happening because

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Speaker 1: that's rude and conspiracy theorizing, and then you can't talk

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Speaker 1: about it after it happened because that's old news and

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Speaker 1: why would we talk about that? And I'm like, that's amazing,

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Speaker 1: it's very recent, and I feel like we should talk

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Speaker 1: about it. So I appreciate Republicans investigating it, and I

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Speaker 1: think that such that we get answers, that'll be the

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Speaker 1: only place because unless there's a follow up to all

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Speaker 1: these tellaws about the campaign that include what the hell

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Speaker 1: happened for four years, I don't think we're getting it right.

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Speaker 4: And I don't know that Senate and House Republicans can

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Speaker 4: get to the bottom of this either, although I would

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Speaker 4: like to see them continue to try.

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Speaker 3: This is important.

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Speaker 4: It's not nothing story imp This is like we elect

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Speaker 4: someone to run the country and that someone was really

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Speaker 4: unable to do that for those last four years and

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Speaker 4: somebody else was taking his place. Maybe it was multiple people,

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Speaker 4: maybe it was many people, But I'd like to know that.

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Speaker 4: And I want to know who covered it up and

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Speaker 4: how it all went down. And these kinds of asides

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Speaker 4: about him not really participating in the autopen signing of

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Speaker 4: these pardons. It's a step in the right direction of

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Speaker 4: telling that story.

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Speaker 2: Also, can we just note why is he giving interviews?

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Speaker 3: Why is he giving interviews? I don't know, Like.

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Speaker 1: Everyone who had a part in said scandal that we

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Speaker 1: have just explicated is like, please please stop talking, praise please?

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Speaker 1: Why are you talking to the New York Times? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because I think someone made this point on Twitter. I

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Speaker 1: forget who it was. But Trump has not had a

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Speaker 1: great price, even though he should because of the big,

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Speaker 1: beautiful bill.

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Speaker 2: And the NonStop wins.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, however, because of the Epstein stuff, which we're talking

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Speaker 1: about later in the week, he has had not a

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Speaker 1: great day and a half several days of coverage and

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Speaker 1: what does this do? This just you knights, all the

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Speaker 1: people of the right again to be like, look at

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Speaker 1: what we were enduring.

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Speaker 4: Yep and he you know, so many times during the

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Speaker 4: campaign Biden kept inserting himself into the conversations and making

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Speaker 4: himself the story even you know, even while he was

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Speaker 4: still running in a negative way.

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Speaker 3: And so this is just a continuation of that.

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Speaker 4: One of the other things they mentioned in the story

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Speaker 4: that we didn't actually get to last week, but Biden's

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Speaker 4: former doctor testified in front of lawmakers or answered questions

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Speaker 4: from lawmakers last week, and he pled the fifth when

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Speaker 4: he was asked whether the President Biden was.

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Speaker 3: Fit to serve.

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Speaker 4: That's a huge story in and of itself that his

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Speaker 4: doctor is pleading the fifth and not wanting to answer

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Speaker 4: questions about what he knew about his condition at the time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he just like kind of walked out of the

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Speaker 1: part of that gathering, which was I think closed press.

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Speaker 1: It was like a you know, under oath, but in

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Speaker 1: a in a closed setting situation.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I do think we're in a we're in a pickle

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Speaker 1: about how we deal with these issues in the future

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Speaker 1: because the press will only want to use a new

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Speaker 1: rubric with Donald Trump, like, oh, well, we really got

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Speaker 1: burned by that Biden guy, but we're going to use

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Speaker 1: this very strict standard now to Donald Trump, and Republicans

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Speaker 1: will not accept that. So it's kind of like looking forward,

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Speaker 1: I think the big hack might be just like someone

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Speaker 1: under seventy.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, good luck, that's my that's my governing hack everyone.

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Speaker 3: That would be nice.

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Speaker 4: I'm not sure we're going to be counting on that,

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Speaker 4: although I don't know.

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Speaker 3: The future field.

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Speaker 4: Does look more youthful, but I think they're going to

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Speaker 4: sneak in some eighty year olds, right and.

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Speaker 3: Next president, eighty five year old Bernie Sanders.

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Speaker 2: Love it, love it. We're heading there.

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Speaker 4: Ah, well, we're going to take a short break and

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Speaker 4: come right back with more normally.

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Speaker 3: We are back with normally. Thank you for sticking around.

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Speaker 4: Graduation rates are up, but SAT scores are down.

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Speaker 3: How does that work?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a little thing called social promotion.

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Speaker 3: Right, So apparently kids are doing worse than.

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Speaker 4: Ever on the SAT, but graduation rates continue to climb.

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Speaker 4: And Americans for School Oversight on x posted that teachers

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Speaker 4: are being told to give fifty percent even when students

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Speaker 4: skip tests or turn in nothing failure rate to suppress

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Speaker 4: to protect the system, not student learning.

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Speaker 3: This does not seem like a good idea.

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Speaker 4: This seems like letting a bunch of people who are

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Speaker 4: unprepared for a lot of things, for higher learning, for

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Speaker 4: life out into the world without the proper preparation.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a recipe for disaster. Lowering the bar is

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Speaker 1: not wise. One of the things that they discovered in

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Speaker 1: this literacy surge in places like Louisiana, Alabama, tennesse that

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Speaker 1: are doing better than in all demographics versus other states,

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Speaker 1: is it. One of the things they implemented in those

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Speaker 1: states was to say, if you have not learned the

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Speaker 1: basics of literacy, if you are not reading by third grade,

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Speaker 1: we have to hold you back. We will not be

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Speaker 1: letting you forward even though you have if you haven't.

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Speaker 3: Hit it's the way to go.

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Speaker 2: And in all.

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Speaker 1: Those states, everyone freaked out and was like, no, we'll

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Speaker 1: have to hold back so many students. And what happened

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Speaker 1: in reality was that it lit a fire under adults

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Speaker 1: because there wasn't actual consequences consequence. They were like, oh crap,

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Speaker 1: we have to spend these years actually teaching them to read,

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Speaker 1: all right, And students no doubt responded to the higher

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Speaker 1: bar as well, And you end up with not that

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Speaker 1: many holdbacks because people were accomplishing the skill. So if

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Speaker 1: you take away that part of the system, yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: no skills.

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Speaker 4: I really do think that people need like I mean,

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Speaker 4: I for sure need like deadlines or you know, accountability.

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Speaker 3: I need stuff like that.

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Speaker 4: In order to work, Like like I have a substack

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Speaker 4: and I write on it in frequently. I'm trying to

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Speaker 4: do better for people who follow and pay for my subjects.

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Speaker 2: Sorry about that, I feel you.

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Speaker 4: But if I don't have a deadline, if I don't

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Speaker 4: have a marker, it's very hard to do. And you know,

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Speaker 4: on the flip side of this, I have a friend

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Speaker 4: who has a son with special needs, and she wanted

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Speaker 4: him to repeat a grade because she felt he wasn't

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Speaker 4: prepared enough and they just wanted to keep promoting him,

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Speaker 4: and she wanted him to, you know, stay in the

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Speaker 4: same class, get a real handle on the information, be

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Speaker 4: able to proceed to the next grade really with confidence.

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Speaker 3: And she had to fight her school system in order

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Speaker 3: to make that happen. And he was clearly not prepared

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Speaker 3: for the next grade.

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Speaker 4: So you know, I'm sure there are parents who worry

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Speaker 4: about their kids not being promoted to the next grade.

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Speaker 3: But there's also the parents.

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Speaker 4: Who think, my kid could use another year of this

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Speaker 4: and they're not allowed to do that.

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Speaker 1: Well, and standardized test scores get a bad rap standardized

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Speaker 1: tests in general get a bad rap. I understand the concerns,

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Speaker 1: and some of them are very real. They also mean

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Speaker 1: something as a gauge they actually do, and all these

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Speaker 1: colleges that have tried to toss them out have come

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Speaker 1: up with pretty bad results as a result of that decision.

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Speaker 1: I want a note from There's a New York Times

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Speaker 1: up ed on standardized testing, which of course was only

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Speaker 1: written from a leftist perspective, to say, Linda McMahon is

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Speaker 1: going to ruin standardized testing, which they were never big

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Speaker 1: fans of before, but it makes this important point. Standardized

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Speaker 1: testing isn't perfect, and I'm sympathetic to the argument that

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Speaker 1: it can hamper teacher autonomy in the classroom, but there

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Speaker 1: is evidence that without standardized testing, parents have little awareness

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Speaker 1: of their children's deficits.

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Speaker 2: In part because of great inflation.

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Speaker 1: Over the past few decades, test scores have gone down

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Speaker 1: while grades have gone up. The issue, which predated the

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Speaker 1: pandemic is known as the honesty gap. I will add

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Speaker 1: that the honesty gap got larger after the pandemic. So

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Speaker 1: my district, because they shut down school for so long,

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Speaker 1: dispensed with their apples to Apple's stats comparison in a

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Speaker 1: lot of areas because they were like, ooh, that's going

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Speaker 1: to look bad for us. And so in a lot

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Speaker 1: of cases, the less standardized testing, the more they're trying

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Speaker 1: to cover up, and covering it up isn't helping anyone.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, you know.

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Speaker 4: I actually wrote against the Gifted and Talented Test in

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Speaker 4: New York City when my kids were little, because I

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Speaker 4: thought it was ridiculous to give a five year old

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Speaker 4: a standardized test. And even though my daughter like aced it,

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Speaker 4: I still thought it was ridiculous, and so I wrote

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Speaker 4: about it.

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Speaker 3: And I have completely changed my mind about it, in

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Speaker 3: part because they got rid of the test and they.

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Speaker 4: Started going by like teacher recommendations and that kind of thing,

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Speaker 4: which is so easily played. And the Gifted and Talented

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Speaker 4: schools are like in steep decline because they got rid

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Speaker 4: of that test. It just standardization makes it fairer. Everything

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Speaker 4: else can be gamed, can be played. You can, you know,

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Speaker 4: ask the teacher to give your kid the recommendation that

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Speaker 4: they need.

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Speaker 3: An interesting point.

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Speaker 4: About the results and the failure rates. Ex teacher Frank McCormick,

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Speaker 4: who tweets at cb heresy on X, posted the results

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Speaker 4: that we talk about, and noted that when he was

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Speaker 4: a teacher, despite being rated excellent, my principal told me

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Speaker 4: that my failure rate was too high and to fix

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Speaker 4: it if I wanted to come back next year. He

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Speaker 4: was reprimanded for holding students accountable and rewarded for fabricating grades.

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Speaker 4: He writes, I have never been more depressed and demoralized.

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Speaker 4: That's the other side of this is that teachers don't

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Speaker 4: want to be socially promoting these kids. They want them

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Speaker 4: to actually learn, and we're putting everybody in a tough

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Speaker 4: situation with this kind of behavior.

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Speaker 1: Can I note one quick stat also that as sort

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Speaker 1: of encouraging that was bouncing around the educational X of

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Speaker 1: areas this week, which is that, oh lo and behold

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Speaker 1: another one that makes levels a little uncomfortable. Family structure

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Speaker 1: matters to student achievements.

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Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: This is a University of Virginia study called Godfather's Flourishing Kids,

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Speaker 1: which came out just recently, and I'm glad it got

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Speaker 1: quite a bit of attention in those circles on X

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Speaker 1: and not just from right leading, right leading people for

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Speaker 1: this reason. This is in the seventy four the research

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Speaker 1: led by my AEI colleague Brad Wilcox, and co authored

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Speaker 1: by a diverse team that includes another AI colleague, finds

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Speaker 1: that children in Virginia with actively involved fathers are more

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Speaker 1: likely to earn good grades, less likely to have behavior

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Speaker 1: problems in school, and dramatically less likely to suffer from depression. Specifically,

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Speaker 1: children with disengaged fathers are sixty eight percent less likely

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Speaker 1: to get mostly good grades and nearly four times is

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Speaker 1: likely to be diagnosed with depression. These are not trivial effects,

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Speaker 1: and importantly, basically the entire achievement gap on race basis

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Speaker 1: is erased if you put black, white Hispanic students with

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Speaker 1: two engaged parents together in a co If you compare those,

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Speaker 1: the stability of the family overcomes a race issue every time.

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Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, there was a popular story, maybe like a

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Speaker 4: year and a half ago, two years ago. I covered

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Speaker 4: it a lot on the Carol Marko Wood Show, but

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Speaker 4: economist Melissa Kearney, who was.

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Speaker 3: A left leaning economist, found that, you.

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Speaker 4: Know, basically, children raised by married parents have better outcomes

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Speaker 4: across the board.

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Speaker 3: And it wasn't something that.

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Speaker 4: She wanted to find, and that's what she discovered in

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Speaker 4: her work and all of her the people she worked

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Speaker 4: with were like, you cannot say this, and once you

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Speaker 4: get to even if this helps children, you cannot admit

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Speaker 4: the truth.

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Speaker 3: It's a very dangerous place to be.

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Speaker 1: And that's where a lot of lefty academics get. Just

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Speaker 1: to make my somewhat muddled version of that clearer, this

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Speaker 1: writer writes, if a black or Hispanic student is raised

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Speaker 1: in a religious home with two biological parents, the achievement

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Speaker 1: gap totally disappears, even when adjusting for socioeconomic status. I mean,

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Speaker 1: this is powerful stuff because presumably we would all like

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Speaker 1: children to achieve and read and learn as that teacher does.

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Speaker 1: There are a lot of unions who might think different,

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Speaker 1: who are trying to cover all this up. Up next,

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Speaker 1: we have some reflections on July thirteenth, twenty twenty four

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Speaker 1: in the assassination attempt on Donald Trump, which weird the

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Speaker 1: media is not covering a ton.

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Speaker 2: I know we'll be back on normally, all.

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Speaker 1: Right, Carol, Well, it has been one year since a

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Speaker 1: seismic event in American politics. In American history, the one

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Speaker 1: year commemorations are not that common, but it is the

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Speaker 1: assassination attempt on one Donald J. Trump when he was

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Speaker 1: at a rally in Butler, Pennsylvania, July thirteenth, twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 1: And I just wanted to talk about it a little

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Speaker 1: bit because.

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Speaker 3: It's being undercovered, right.

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Speaker 4: It was like a giant story that barely gets any

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Speaker 4: kind of mention at all.

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Speaker 3: Where were you when you heard that?

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Speaker 1: Oh, I have a very interesting story about that. I

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Speaker 1: was on a plane full of journals, oh, on our

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Speaker 1: way to the RNC, and the plane did not have

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Speaker 1: Wi Fi. We happened to all be on a plane

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Speaker 1: without wife. So and it's like everyone's on this plane BBC, CNN,

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Speaker 1: like Tappers up there, Chuck Todd's over here, right.

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Speaker 2: I'm way in the back, probably have bought my ticket late,

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Speaker 2: like I do. I'm way in the back of the

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Speaker 2: plane and I did.

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Speaker 1: Sorry, TSA or whoever's in charge of this FA I

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Speaker 1: turned on my phone early to try to catch a

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Speaker 1: signal and see what it was. I didn't The plane

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Speaker 1: was fine, so I don't think it's a safety issue.

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Speaker 1: I turned it on, caught a signal, and I start

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Speaker 1: getting these texts from people I trust. So it wasn't

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Speaker 1: like a you know, like this is a made up

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Speaker 1: rumor thing. It was from like guy Benson, who was

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Speaker 1: following up from my husband, who's following up with very

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Speaker 1: specific things. And what happened is I think I was

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Speaker 1: the first person on the plane.

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Speaker 2: To know that this had happened.

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Speaker 3: Did you stand up and were like?

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Speaker 1: I actually thought about doing that, But much like the

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Speaker 1: fear you have when you're breaking something, I was like,

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Speaker 1: what if this turns out to be not what I

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Speaker 1: think it is? And I had no way to back

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Speaker 1: up my information aside from like the two and a

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Speaker 1: half texts I had received.

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Speaker 2: But yes, I was on that plane.

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Speaker 1: And then once we landed, of course everybody turns on

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Speaker 1: their phones and it goes like wildfire.

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Speaker 3: I knew.

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Speaker 1: I didn't tell the BBC gall next to me. I

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Speaker 1: was like, hey, you media. She's like yeah, and I

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Speaker 1: was like, I think President Trump was shot. She's like,

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Speaker 1: so it goes like wild through fire through the plane.

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Speaker 1: And I will say this for the journals. When we

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Speaker 1: exited that plane, it was silent because everyone was in

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Speaker 1: the throes of this is actually potentially extremely tragic.

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Speaker 2: And all very interesting. Yeah, I was.

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Speaker 1: I was a little bit proud of them, and in

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Speaker 1: that moment, obviously very quickly it turns into nonsense.

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Speaker 2: Again.

445
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:43,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, they didn't really cover themselves in Glory where all

446
00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:47,840
Speaker 4: some of the headlines were like Donald Trump falls on stage.

447
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:49,359
Speaker 1: In that moment, though, on that plane it was treated

448
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,119
Speaker 1: as very solemn and grave and very very very serious.

449
00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:53,719
Speaker 2: I was.

450
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:57,560
Speaker 4: I had just woken up in Singapore and I had

451
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,280
Speaker 4: gotten a text from our best friends and saying, hey,

452
00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:03,399
Speaker 4: I know you're away, but someone just took a shot

453
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:05,960
Speaker 4: at Donald Trump, and I like sat up in bed

454
00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:09,119
Speaker 4: just like, oh my god, you know, is he okay?

455
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:13,200
Speaker 4: Like just I feared the worst, obviously, like I guess

456
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:14,200
Speaker 4: a lot of people would.

457
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 2: And the fact.

458
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,400
Speaker 4: That it missed the bullet missed him by such a

459
00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:25,800
Speaker 4: tiny amount, by such a tiny, you know, measure, is

460
00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:30,480
Speaker 4: really miraculous. And I, you know, he seems like he

461
00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 4: has leaned on his faith a little bit since then,

462
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:37,159
Speaker 4: and I totally get why he talks about God in

463
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:38,160
Speaker 4: a way that he did.

464
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:39,320
Speaker 2: Not before that.

465
00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,959
Speaker 3: And I really do feel like I understand it.

466
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,600
Speaker 4: I had Selena Zito on the Carol Marco wid show

467
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:49,320
Speaker 4: a few months ago talking about her new book Butler.

468
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 3: I'm gonna play a little clip. She was there that day.

469
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:54,920
Speaker 4: She was right in front of Donald Trump, and this

470
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:56,640
Speaker 4: is her describing what happened.

471
00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 5: And you know, if you've never been to a rally,

472
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 5: you don't understand. But the relationship between him and the

473
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:08,719
Speaker 5: people that are attending it is very transactional. He feeds

474
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:12,240
Speaker 5: off of them, they feed off of him. And this

475
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,520
Speaker 5: isn't a positive way. This is a very sort of

476
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 5: aspirational way. People believe they are part of something bigger

477
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 5: than themselves, and Chump intuitively understands that he is as well.

478
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,600
Speaker 5: He's part of it, He's part of them. It's not

479
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:32,760
Speaker 5: just about him, it's about everybody there. So because of that,

480
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 5: he never looks away from the crop. He'll move his

481
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 5: he'll move his body and look at different size, like

482
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:41,680
Speaker 5: turn around and look at the crowds around.

483
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:43,400
Speaker 3: Rights has notes or anything.

484
00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:48,320
Speaker 5: Yeah, so two things happen simultaneously that never happened. He

485
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:49,440
Speaker 5: brings a chart down.

486
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:50,439
Speaker 2: I'm like, what is he?

487
00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 5: Ross Perot like, he never has a chart?

488
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:56,080
Speaker 2: Amazing.

489
00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:00,280
Speaker 5: And then he turns away from the crop and he

490
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:05,040
Speaker 5: never does that. And at that moment, I hear pop

491
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:09,120
Speaker 5: pop pop pop. The bullets fly right over. I watch

492
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:12,439
Speaker 5: him go down, but he takes himself down. I note that,

493
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 5: like it's really weird. You know how they always say

494
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:18,199
Speaker 5: things happen in slow motion. They absolutely do.

495
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:19,879
Speaker 2: Really, I can see him.

496
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 5: Go down, I can see him hold his ear. I

497
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 5: see the Secret Service go around him. You remember, I'm

498
00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:28,440
Speaker 5: like four feet away from him at this point.

499
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,520
Speaker 3: And is your daughter snapping pictures my dog?

500
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, we're We don't stop working until the second four

501
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:42,600
Speaker 5: bullets go by and Michelle takes us step the campaign

502
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:47,600
Speaker 5: press guy, he's amazing. He's my hero. He Michelle Licard.

503
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 5: I will love him forever. He was so protective of

504
00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 5: all of us. And I can I can hear the

505
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 5: whole conversation he is having with the Secret Service, and

506
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 5: you know, like about when to go up, and you

507
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,640
Speaker 5: know that the shooter is dead, and you can hear

508
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 5: them talking. You can hear the rain, I can hear

509
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,679
Speaker 5: the radios just because of how close you a and.

510
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 3: I can.

511
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 5: It was a little bit funny. It's funnier now. It

512
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 5: was a little bit funny.

513
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 2: In the moment.

514
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:24,320
Speaker 5: And hear him like they want him to get up

515
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,720
Speaker 5: and want me to be up, but he's like basically saying,

516
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 5: I need to put my damn shoes on right like

517
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:34,920
Speaker 5: his someone had knocked his shoes off and and I

518
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 5: hear one agent sigh like okay, all right, like okay,

519
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:43,119
Speaker 5: put your shoes on right.

520
00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:44,160
Speaker 3: And they get his shoes off.

521
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 2: That's so weird.

522
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 5: And then he comes off the stage. He goes right

523
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,400
Speaker 5: past me. There is an agent that holds a gun

524
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 5: right in our heads as he's going past, because they

525
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:58,679
Speaker 5: still don't know what. And so I did not go

526
00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 5: to Bedminster that day, no, obviously. But he calls me

527
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 5: the next morning, right nerling and before I could say hello, like,

528
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 5: I didn't even get my hello out.

529
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:13,199
Speaker 2: So are you okay? Is Shenon like okay?

530
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:15,919
Speaker 5: I'm like and I felt like saying, are you freaking

531
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:16,399
Speaker 5: kidding me?

532
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 2: You do? You've just been shot?

533
00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:22,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe focus on yourself.

534
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 2: Yeah.

535
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:24,359
Speaker 4: I know that clip was a little long, but I

536
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 4: felt like it was important to get the kind of

537
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 4: story of that day.

538
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 1: I just got the book and see how close they

539
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 1: were because this is her daughter's photo of before this happened. Yeah,

540
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:41,880
Speaker 1: just incredible stuff. And I think, you know, his reaction

541
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:46,639
Speaker 1: to that was just so genuinely brave and impressive.

542
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 2: It really was kind of astounding.

543
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 1: I think I had I had new different respect for

544
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 1: him after this happened. I also would like to add

545
00:27:56,720 --> 00:28:00,640
Speaker 1: that the comforatory family should stay in our prayers. You know,

546
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: his widow lost her husband a year ago this week,

547
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,880
Speaker 1: and he had daughters, and you know, very sad that

548
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,000
Speaker 1: that happened on that day. I think we were spared right,

549
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 1: a tremendous tragedy, although not all of it tragedy the

550
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 1: way the way this country would have spun out had

551
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 1: something they actually succeeded, had he had the shooter actually succeeded,

552
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: I just can't even comprehend.

553
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:28,919
Speaker 4: I don't know if we would have gotten over it,

554
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,440
Speaker 4: I really don't. I have to say that. You know,

555
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:35,919
Speaker 4: the right loves their conspiracies, but the left continues to

556
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 4: push the idea that this somehow was faked. Adam Parkomenko,

557
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:48,400
Speaker 4: who was a dnc Field director in twenty sixteen, tweeted,

558
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 4: if they could lie about the Epstein list, they would

559
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 4: lie about Butler too. Somebody, Telvin Griffin, who is in

560
00:28:56,760 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 4: Hollywood apparently got Academy Award nominated film whatever, has a

561
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 4: following on X. We're getting closer and closer to the

562
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 4: truth that the Butler assassination attempt was fake and stage

563
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:12,480
Speaker 4: here's the worst part of it all and innocent man died.

564
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:14,640
Speaker 4: They did this because the momentum of the election was

565
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 4: strongly in Kamala Harris's favor and they had no game

566
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:23,480
Speaker 4: plan for her. Kamala Harris wasn't running yet, so and

567
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 4: I don't remember the momentum ever being strongly in her favor.

568
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 2: No, it wasn't, That's just that true.

569
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:33,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, And they wanted to shift the momentum, so

570
00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:37,680
Speaker 4: they thought they'd take a shot at their own candidate, Like,

571
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 4: how does that make sense?

572
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 1: Who would be who would be barely missed in a

573
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:42,960
Speaker 1: headshot by hitting his ear?

574
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,040
Speaker 3: I was gonna say, now, now that I.

575
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:47,920
Speaker 4: Shoot guns, I can tell you with some certainty that

576
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 4: trying to shoot someone in the ear is not a thing.

577
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:52,959
Speaker 1: And that Trump would be like, sure, I'll sign up

578
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:56,200
Speaker 1: for that, Yeah, no problem.

579
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 4: Yeah.

580
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 1: The shooter, of course, killed on the scene, was Thomas

581
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 1: Matthew Crooks, a twenty year old, and I would I

582
00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 1: would like to know more about him and more about

583
00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 1: how we're preventing said things for the future. I appreciated

584
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,320
Speaker 1: the brief moment when everybody was left and right, we're

585
00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 1: together asking questions about the Secret Service and going.

586
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 2: Like what happened year? What happened.

587
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:18,440
Speaker 1: AOC actually had a couple of very good moments asking

588
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 1: those questions, and in general I would just like to

589
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: see more reflection.

590
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 4: On this, more normal after more normal behavior.

591
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, after the congressional baseball shooting too, where very few

592
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 1: people know the date of that shooting. It was June fourteenth,

593
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,920
Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, and the next first of all, it got

594
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 1: like forty eight hours of coverage maybe maybe not even that,

595
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: like wall to wall coverage an attempted mass murder of

596
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: congressional members. A year later, there was almost nothing in commemoration.

597
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 3: Crazy. Yeah, unbelievable.

598
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 2: These moments are important.

599
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 3: We should do better on that, We really should.

600
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 4: Well. Thanks for joining us on normally Normally airs Tuesdays

601
00:30:58,240 --> 00:30:59,400
Speaker 4: and Thursdays, and.

602
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 3: You could subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts.

603
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 4: Get in touch with us at normallythepod at gmail dot com.

604
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:09,960
Speaker 4: Thanks for listening, and when things get weird, act normally