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Speaker 1: Welcome to Fitness Disrupted, a production of My Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: I am Tom Holland and this is Fitness Disrupted Steroids

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Speaker 1: one oh one. Now. I have a copious list of

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Speaker 1: topics for this podcast. I keep it on my phone.

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Speaker 1: Whenever I think of something, or someone gives me an idea,

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Speaker 1: or I read something that I just think would make

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Speaker 1: for the perfect podcast, it goes into that list. And

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Speaker 1: that list is huge. It's huge. Even after I think

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Speaker 1: we're approaching almost two hundred episodes, that list is still long.

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Speaker 1: And what I like to do is wait until I

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Speaker 1: get inspired, and then I pulled from that list a

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Speaker 1: topic that I just read about where someone talked about

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Speaker 1: something that got me perturbed. You've heard these shows before

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Speaker 1: if you've listened to Fitness Disrupted, and I think those

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Speaker 1: make for better shows when I'm all amped up, when

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Speaker 1: there's something current, as there is for this topic. And

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Speaker 1: that is why I grabbed this from my list, because

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Speaker 1: there have been a handful of things in the last

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Speaker 1: week that just said it's time. It's time to do

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Speaker 1: this show. Now. It's a touchy subject, like just about

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Speaker 1: all these topics are in Fitness Disrupted, Health and Wellness.

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Speaker 1: One of the big problems is that people dance around

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Speaker 1: the truth. They'd answer around the truth. Oftentimes, as I've

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Speaker 1: said so many times before, they either don't have the knowledge,

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Speaker 1: or they sugarcoat the truth, or they just avoid it.

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Speaker 1: And steroids is a huge one, and I have a

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Speaker 1: lot of experience being around them. But I can tell you,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna say honestly, and I laughed because of the

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Speaker 1: number of people and I'll bring it. It goes to

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Speaker 1: my intro who lie about taking them. So yeah, you're

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Speaker 1: gonna have to believe me. I've never taken them now,

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Speaker 1: I don't look like I have. I don't think, although

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Speaker 1: you know when I was truly you know, pushing the

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Speaker 1: body building days, and I will talk about that again

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Speaker 1: occasionally I would get that, but I was never half

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Speaker 1: as big as these guys were, and I'll give you

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Speaker 1: those stories, but it was a compliment. But again, like

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Speaker 1: you're gonna have to take my word for it, because

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Speaker 1: so many people lie about them, and to someone who's

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Speaker 1: in the business, it is so egregiously offensive when they

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Speaker 1: do when they do, and I'll talk about that. So

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Speaker 1: a couple of things got me irked about this topic. First,

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Speaker 1: my youngest son is in a fantasy football league, and

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Speaker 1: he just brought up that one of the players has

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Speaker 1: been suspended for six games, so he's done for this

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Speaker 1: season and out for one game, I believe next season

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Speaker 1: for getting caught taking performance enhancing drugs. So that is

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Speaker 1: the overarching subject matter that I'm talking about here. Performance

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Speaker 1: enhancing drugs. Steroids are but one another term that is

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Speaker 1: often thrown out there. And I will parse this later,

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Speaker 1: but doping performance enhancing drugs rampant in sports, in body building,

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Speaker 1: and and many other aspects of the health and wellness industry.

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Speaker 1: And I'll tell you why. And I'm gonna end up

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Speaker 1: with four points about steroids that are just bogus, basically

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Speaker 1: myths and misconceptions that just again irk me as someone

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Speaker 1: who this is, this is what I do, this is

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Speaker 1: what I studied. I've been around it, so I have

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Speaker 1: so much anecdotal and I have a lot of studies

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Speaker 1: and a lot of reading and a lot of knowledge

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Speaker 1: about this, been around it, never taken it. And again

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Speaker 1: you're gonna have to take my word for it, but

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Speaker 1: you gotta take my word for everything, right, So but yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that got me thinking about steroids and then and

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna use names. I mean, obviously you can

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Speaker 1: figure some of this stuff out, but I'm gonna try

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Speaker 1: to keep it as vague as possible. Then I was

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Speaker 1: watching an interview with a very well known, hugely successful

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Speaker 1: movie star, and it could be so many that are huge,

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Speaker 1: and he did not. He was outright asked by the interviewer,

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Speaker 1: so you took steroids, You've taken stories? And he said no,

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Speaker 1: I was just a little kid. And he said it quickly.

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Speaker 1: I almost want to give him what, no, shouldn't he

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Speaker 1: said it quickly. No, I was just a small kid,

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Speaker 1: got bullied a lot and started lifting weights, absolutely ridiculously

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Speaker 1: offensive to someone who is in this industry and knows

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Speaker 1: that this person is on steroids. And you say, how

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Speaker 1: do you know? And again, you're gonna have to take

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Speaker 1: my word for it. And part of the reason is

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Speaker 1: you don't get that big, and you don't get that vascular,

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Speaker 1: and you don't look like that taking in a lot

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Speaker 1: of protein and lifting heavy. I don't care how disciplined

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Speaker 1: you are. And you know what, let's take a quick

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Speaker 1: break and want it come back. Listen. I give all

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Speaker 1: the credit in the world. I did it natural bodybuilding.

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Speaker 1: And when we come back for the break. I'll talk

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Speaker 1: about how it wasn't natural and rarely is, but I'm

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Speaker 1: not taking away. And this is where again the argument

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Speaker 1: gets cloudy where it shouldn't with bodybuilders, who gets so

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Speaker 1: defensive because they think that when they're accused of taking

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Speaker 1: steroids that it takes away from their discipline and their dedication.

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Speaker 1: Doesn't two completely separate issues. All right, quick break, we'll

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Speaker 1: be right back talking about steroids. And this is an overview.

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Speaker 1: I will do additional shows about specifics, specific people, specific

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Speaker 1: issues around doping and performance enhancing drugs, but this is

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Speaker 1: one oh one and the next show will be two

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Speaker 1: oh two, and there'll be more specific stuff. But I

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Speaker 1: wanted to do this first one just the basics. Just

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Speaker 1: the basics, and for most people that's all you care about.

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Speaker 1: But some people, and it's more specific, you'll be interested

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Speaker 1: in that as well. All right, So the third thing

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Speaker 1: and then I'll get back to the whole bodybuilding thing

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Speaker 1: and discipline. The third thing that actually got me all

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Speaker 1: riled up was another interview. Actually wasn't an interview with

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Speaker 1: social media to be specific. It was an Instagram post,

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Speaker 1: well known person again, and I'll leave it at that,

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Speaker 1: and they're talking about longevity, and it was all about longevity.

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Speaker 1: And this person is enormous thanks to performance enhancing drugs. Now,

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Speaker 1: as I will talk about during this show, because it's

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Speaker 1: a huge part of all this. There are enormous risks,

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Speaker 1: there are enormous side effects, and I have numerous examples

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Speaker 1: of people I have seen die okay in this industry.

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Speaker 1: And as I'll say, you can never one blame it

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Speaker 1: on the steroids or rarely, extremely rarely, that's not the

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Speaker 1: cause of death. Cause of death is not steroids. And

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Speaker 1: that is a huge problem because people gloss over it,

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Speaker 1: they look the other way, they avoid the topic. Okay,

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Speaker 1: but this, this person with a lot of followers, was

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Speaker 1: talking all about longevity and all these people were telling

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Speaker 1: him how greaty he looked and blah blah blah. And

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Speaker 1: trust me, what's going on inside is most likely not

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Speaker 1: how it looks on the outside. It's not about how

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Speaker 1: we look first and foremost, Yes, you want to look better,

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Speaker 1: feel better, live longer, but you can look better and

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Speaker 1: not live longer and not feel better. And that's one

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Speaker 1: of the dark secrets of the steroid and performance enhancing

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Speaker 1: drug world. And they're just far too many people who

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Speaker 1: have no idea what they're talking about, who talk about it,

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Speaker 1: and you know, that's why this has been on my

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Speaker 1: list for a while. And now I have to, you know,

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Speaker 1: do the first episode about it. So those three things

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Speaker 1: got me riled up enough that I said, let's go,

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Speaker 1: and I'm gonna throw one study in there just to

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Speaker 1: get us started. I'm just gonna read, you know, the

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Speaker 1: opening to this study because it's a great way to

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Speaker 1: just start the conversation. So this was in World Psychiatry

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Speaker 1: all the way back in two thousand seven June, and

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Speaker 1: the title is doping in Sports and it's spread to

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Speaker 1: at risk populations and international review. And here's the open.

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Speaker 1: Doping is now a global problem that follows international sporting

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Speaker 1: events worldwide. International sports federations, led by the International Olympic Committee,

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Speaker 1: have for the past half century attempted to stop the

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Speaker 1: spread of this problem with little effect. That was two

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Speaker 1: thousand seven. It is two thousand twenty, and I would

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Speaker 1: argue it's worse, and that is not the topic of today.

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Speaker 1: The money, huge part of it is money, of course,

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Speaker 1: the money in sports, and that's why there's so many

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Speaker 1: different shows to do from this. Just suffice it to

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Speaker 1: say it's a problem and it's pervasive. So when I

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Speaker 1: see these gargantuan movie stars athletes say they didn't take it,

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Speaker 1: it's a joke. And talking with someone else, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: There's a whole wrestling thing that came up recently. Hulk

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Speaker 1: Hogan used to say, just say your prayers and take

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Speaker 1: your vitamin's brother, Well, that's not gonna do it. And

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Speaker 1: when I first and I love, I love all these people. Oh,

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Speaker 1: by the way, let me get back to the dedication

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Speaker 1: and discipline. Bodybuilders have discipline unlike anyone else, along with

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Speaker 1: the steroid abuse. Okay, so yes, there are two things

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Speaker 1: in fa aolved. It is the steroids, and it is

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Speaker 1: the diet and the exercise. So three things the workout

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Speaker 1: and you can parse it out to cardio, but they

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Speaker 1: do very little cardio. Topic for another actually a fit

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Speaker 1: tip I've got coming up. But just because your discipline

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean you're not on drugs. And there are people,

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Speaker 1: by the way that I know that have taken the drugs.

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Speaker 1: Back when I was a trainer in New York City,

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Speaker 1: there are a couple of trainers who took steroids and

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Speaker 1: didn't diet at all. And didn't really work out, and

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Speaker 1: they didn't look anywhere near those guys of course and women,

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Speaker 1: but one does not dismiss the other. In other words, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're disciplined, but you're still taking something to get that

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Speaker 1: big You are not going then why take them? And

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Speaker 1: as I'm gonna bring up, and as I've experienced death

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Speaker 1: all around me from people who have taken them, you know,

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Speaker 1: when you're in the industry for thirty plus years there,

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Speaker 1: you know you gonna you're gonna see this stuff. So

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Speaker 1: I've seen it. And back to the body building. I

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Speaker 1: did natural body building for you know, I think it

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Speaker 1: was coming up on two years or total years many

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Speaker 1: years ago. It was a lie detector test. I think

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Speaker 1: I did I don't know, six eight shows and it

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Speaker 1: was a lie detector test for all of them, I

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Speaker 1: think except one lie detector and the people who would

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Speaker 1: come in work our gain and the people who weren't lost,

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Speaker 1: and I'm pretty sure that the people administering the light

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Speaker 1: detector test weren't trained. So even in natural body building,

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Speaker 1: people are taking drugs. And I'm gonna get to the

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Speaker 1: testing part that that's not lie detector that's supposedly more

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Speaker 1: accurate and again this goes to the problem, the huge problem.

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Speaker 1: So it was lie detectors. And another thing about steroids

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Speaker 1: that is not talked about, is not understood other than

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Speaker 1: people who have been around it and been in the

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Speaker 1: strength and conditioning world for many years, is that you

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Speaker 1: can also do steroids years prior and still reap the rewards. Now,

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Speaker 1: there's really not studies into this. How do you do

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Speaker 1: that study? What are you? What are you? What are

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Speaker 1: you looking at? I've had friends who have admitted took

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Speaker 1: them in college and when they start working out again,

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Speaker 1: they're they're a little different. So I would argue totally

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Speaker 1: anecdotal seeing it time and time again, though, you don't

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Speaker 1: have to do steroids a week prior or a year

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Speaker 1: prior to still see the results. So so many people

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Speaker 1: I know will say that they're natural because they haven't

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Speaker 1: done it in a while. That's my point. And what

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Speaker 1: that while is is the question in their mind is

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Speaker 1: it six months prior? Is that how you rationalize doing

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Speaker 1: a natural bodybuilding show or saying you're not on them anymore.

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Speaker 1: You're not on them, you're not taking them. And I

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Speaker 1: know from again experience in this world that that's the

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Speaker 1: case with a huge number of people who say they

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Speaker 1: are not taking them or didn't take them. What they're saying,

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Speaker 1: I didn't take them last month, were two months ago

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Speaker 1: or two weeks ago? All right. Now there's a huge

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Speaker 1: elephant in the room. And and this is where again

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Speaker 1: I don't want to necessarily have this conversation, but you

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Speaker 1: have to, and it's it's you know, facts don't have feelings,

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Speaker 1: They're just facts. So Arnold Schwarzenegger can't have this discussion

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Speaker 1: without talking about Arnold Swartzenegger once again, as someone who

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Speaker 1: you know, models my career as an entrepreneur in the

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Speaker 1: fitness world on people who have been successful. He's amazing,

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Speaker 1: has been successful in so many different fields. You can

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Speaker 1: never take that away from him. The only thing that

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Speaker 1: I have a problem with is that he represents fitness

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Speaker 1: that young kids are going to look up to that

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Speaker 1: and I was one of those young kids. I had

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Speaker 1: a book with Franco Colombo and Arnold Schwartzenegger. Now I

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Speaker 1: never really wanted to be that big. I wanted to

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Speaker 1: look good. I want to feel good. But when I

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Speaker 1: used to do lectures too high schoolers on strength and

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Speaker 1: conditioning back before COVID, I would often hold up a

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Speaker 1: copy of one of the popular magazines and those are

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Speaker 1: going away, but the cover and you would see this

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Speaker 1: enormous person. And inside that magazine are supplements and workouts

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Speaker 1: and dietary advice. And what I would say is you

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Speaker 1: will never look like this just based on what's in

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Speaker 1: these pages, because they're weaving out the most important part.

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Speaker 1: Now again you can have these body build of people

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Speaker 1: are screaming saying no, no, no, Tom, there's still yes,

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Speaker 1: you're dieting down, you're cutting carbs, your working your butt off.

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Speaker 1: But if don't need him, don't take them because you

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Speaker 1: have a really good chance of dying as the ultimate cost,

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Speaker 1: as I'll get to. All right, so why do well?

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Speaker 1: Let me finish up with Schwartzenegger, President's counsel on physical fitness,

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Speaker 1: and again huge. I talked about the five components of fitness.

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Speaker 1: Love Arnold Schwartzenegger. Again, you know what a a success story,

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Speaker 1: the American dream, all of it. Not taken away from that,

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Speaker 1: but you know, how's this flexibility? How is his cardiovascular fitness?

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Speaker 1: He's strong, it looks good, but admitted stairwoid user. And

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Speaker 1: now doctor's supervision and things like that. You know, topic

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Speaker 1: for another day. But when we're talking fitness, you gotta

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Speaker 1: have vile five components, and if you listen to my

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Speaker 1: episode on the six, you gotta have balance and you

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Speaker 1: know balance in there as well. All right, So why

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Speaker 1: do people take them? It's simple and it's not simple.

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Speaker 1: It is simple as someone like me who studies it,

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Speaker 1: but for many people it's confusing. So two main reasons

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Speaker 1: people take them, the vanity side and the performance side.

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Speaker 1: You're either trying to build muscle and lose that we

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Speaker 1: can throw in there because it does that as well

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Speaker 1: many of them, and to enhance athletic performance, so visual

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Speaker 1: and performance. You want to look better, you want to

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Speaker 1: perform better. Some people want to do both. Now when

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Speaker 1: it goes to performance, and this is where it gets

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Speaker 1: murky for so many people, especially in the endurance world.

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Speaker 1: On the performance end, you're gonna get stronger, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: get faster. It's going to improve your performance day of

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Speaker 1: But what people don't realize is it also enhances your practice.

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Speaker 1: What do I mean by that? You recover faster and

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Speaker 1: you can push harder. Let me say that again, you

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Speaker 1: recover faster and you push harder. In other words, simple

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Speaker 1: analogy as an endurance guy. I actually just signed up

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Speaker 1: for my next iron Man in Brazil. I can't believe it.

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Speaker 1: Pulled the trigger last night, cross fingers. It happens thanks

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Speaker 1: to COVID. I'm saying I will be there as far

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Speaker 1: as training goes. With an iron Man and endurance athletes

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Speaker 1: who take these drugs, they're doing it so that they

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Speaker 1: can bike a hundred miles on a Saturday and bike

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Speaker 1: another hundred miles on Sunday if they want, but so

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Speaker 1: they can do what they want, so they recover faster

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Speaker 1: and can push their bodies harder in practice. So so

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Speaker 1: many times here where we get to getting ahead of

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Speaker 1: myself a little bit. You look at someone I'm not

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Speaker 1: gonna name names, you know, well known endurance cyclists, runners,

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Speaker 1: and they'll say that guy is super brew skinny though,

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Speaker 1: or that woman both sexes abused these drugs, so they

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Speaker 1: can't possibly be on it. A that's not what their

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Speaker 1: goal is. So they're not lifting heavyweights, they're not taking

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Speaker 1: in lots of protein, and not not doing a myriad

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Speaker 1: of other things supplements to enhance their size. Their goal

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Speaker 1: is not hypertrophy. Their goal is to go as long

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Speaker 1: and as fast as possible, and so I can't tell

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Speaker 1: you how many people, and I know many of you

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Speaker 1: are listening and are confused as well. You go, well,

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Speaker 1: that person can't possibly, they're not huge. The other thing

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Speaker 1: that I will also get to is that the bodybuilders,

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Speaker 1: the enormous people, they're not just taking one. They're stacking them,

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Speaker 1: and they're taking a whole host of other things as

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Speaker 1: well quite often. Okay, so that endurance athlete is taking

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Speaker 1: one to three. There are tennis players, okay, numerous. I

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Speaker 1: could go through every single sport because it's money and

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Speaker 1: it's performance and you have a small window of time

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Speaker 1: to make as much money as possible. So I could

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Speaker 1: shock you with the number of tennis players who have

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Speaker 1: been caught taking this. And I could get more specific

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Speaker 1: with the specific type of steroids and drugs that they use,

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Speaker 1: but just suffice it to say performance and recovery. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let me give you the real quick definition. Okay. Anabolic

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Speaker 1: steroids are synthetic or human made variations of the male

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Speaker 1: sex hormone testosterone, simple, right. The proper term for these

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Speaker 1: compounds is anabolic androgenic steroids. Okay. Anabolic means muscle building

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Speaker 1: androgenic that refers to the increase in the male sex characteristics,

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Speaker 1: which is why when you see female bodybuilders oftentimes you

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Speaker 1: see that difference. You see the androgenic as well as

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Speaker 1: the anabolic effects. Okay, real simple, keeping a top level.

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Speaker 1: But steroids travel through the bloodstream to your tissue, your

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Speaker 1: muscle tissue, and they bind to an androgen receptor. Okay.

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Speaker 1: The drug can then interact with the cells DNA and

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Speaker 1: stimulate the protein synthesis process. Remember how many shows I've

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Speaker 1: talked about protein building block of muscle, and it stimulates

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Speaker 1: the protein synthesis process and that promotes cell growth, you

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Speaker 1: get bigger. Okay. Three ways to do steroids, now, three

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Speaker 1: basic ways, uh others, but these are the basics injection,

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Speaker 1: which is what most people think about, right and back

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Speaker 1: in the day, you had to inject, and so some

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Speaker 1: people who were scared of needles didn't do it. But

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Speaker 1: now and back when I was a trainer many years ago,

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Speaker 1: starting out, they started coming out with the oral steroids

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Speaker 1: and topical creams. You know, a bunch of professional athletes

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Speaker 1: caught you know, or blamed it on the topical creams

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Speaker 1: they took oral I mean I remember these names. When

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Speaker 1: I was doing research coming all back up. I haven't

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Speaker 1: been you know, in the training world as far as

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Speaker 1: the gyms in New York City in a long time.

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Speaker 1: But Anna Drawl, Anna var Danna Ball remember here and

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Speaker 1: all the bodybuilders talking about that stuff and trainers themselves.

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Speaker 1: So those are just a couple of the oral ones

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Speaker 1: that they would take. Decca and Trent. These are the

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Speaker 1: shortened versions. But there's there's so many, there's so many,

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Speaker 1: all right, quick history of steroids. Testosterone first synthesized in

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Speaker 1: Germany in nineteen thirty five, and it was used medically

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Speaker 1: at that time to treat depression. Okay, professional athletes then

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Speaker 1: started abusing them. They trace it back to the nineteen

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Speaker 1: fifty four Olympics. Russian weightlifters were using them. They were

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Speaker 1: given testosterone. Then in the nineteen eighties you had that

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Speaker 1: explosion an a bolic steroid abuse into the general population

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Speaker 1: young men, bodybuilders again to enhance athletic performance, but in

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Speaker 1: most cases to change their appearance to look better. Right,

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Speaker 1: Congress in past the anabolic Steroid Act to respond to this.

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Speaker 1: So it's a separate drug class and categorized in over

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Speaker 1: there's over two dozen drugs in this realm as controlled substances. Okay,

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Speaker 1: it's just you know, it's pervasive. And one thing I

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Speaker 1: do say about those action hero actors, I'm glad I'm

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Speaker 1: not in that world. They're being paid tens of millions

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Speaker 1: of dollars per movie. Why one reason, because they're not

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Speaker 1: like everyday people. So I get that from the professional athlete,

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Speaker 1: who again has to make as much money and as

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Speaker 1: shortest amount of time as possible while staying healthy and

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Speaker 1: and performance based. And other people are taking them too.

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Speaker 1: They're the topic for another day and one specific person

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Speaker 1: that you may be thinking of. But I'm so glad

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Speaker 1: I'm in the world I am in. And let me

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Speaker 1: also give you an example. When I was with Wilhelmina

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Speaker 1: as a fitness model, I would often go on auditions

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Speaker 1: that had some physical component to them, commercial videos, DV whatever,

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Speaker 1: and I would be not only competing against guys generally

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Speaker 1: speaking much younger than me because I signed it an

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Speaker 1: older age, but I knew that they were on performance

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Speaker 1: Nancy drugs, so they looked a heck of a lot

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Speaker 1: better and they could push it hard or not that

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Speaker 1: it mattered that much. In the workouts Soldo. A couple

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Speaker 1: actually booked funny story DVD program that you wouldn't know

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Speaker 1: about commercial way back. And these guys look good that

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Speaker 1: I was competing against in the audition that I was there,

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Speaker 1: you know with, but we got put through a pretty

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Speaker 1: rigorous workout and they didn't have the cardio. So just

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Speaker 1: more anecdotal about, you know, the looks versus the performance,

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Speaker 1: as far as that goes. But there are side effects.

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Speaker 1: There are side effects, the basic stuff that many of

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Speaker 1: you are already familiar with, acne, baldness, aggression, and something

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Speaker 1: the well, I'm not gonna give you the slang word

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Speaker 1: guy no komastia. It's always tough to pronounce, and I've

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Speaker 1: experienceding that. It's where guys grow breasts essentially because there's

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Speaker 1: a whole estrogen testosterone thing going on with steroids. All right,

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Speaker 1: you know what, one quick break and they we're gonna

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Speaker 1: put it all together, gonna give you the quick studies.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you the four myths and misconceptions, and

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Speaker 1: then you're gonna know, right, You're gonna know instead of wondering,

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Speaker 1: you know, listening to that person. And one of the

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Speaker 1: main reasons I'm doing this show, amongst many but as

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Speaker 1: kids I got kids. I I want my kids to

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Speaker 1: know to not feel bad about themselves because they can't

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Speaker 1: achieve something, and to focus on the health. When I

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Speaker 1: was competing against those guys and just the auditions, I

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Speaker 1: felt good about myself. I didn't care if I got

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Speaker 1: it or not based on what they had done. Michael

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Speaker 1: was to live long and to be healthy. And I

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Speaker 1: was gonna end the show with again the number of

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Speaker 1: people I know personally who have died, most likely from

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Speaker 1: steroid abuse because they were really young and they were

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Speaker 1: really big. That's that's what it's all about. All right,

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Speaker 1: the final break, We'll be right back and again. I

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Speaker 1: got really worked up about this show, and I think

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Speaker 1: what tipped the scales. I know what tip the scales

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Speaker 1: for me was that one actor talking about longevity, because

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Speaker 1: that drives me nuts. And I'm not naming names. There

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Speaker 1: is a super well known strength and conditioning coach who

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Speaker 1: suffices to say, push the limits. You've got to be

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Speaker 1: careful here. He died young. He died young, and you know,

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Speaker 1: Jack o'lane used to say he couldn't die because it

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Speaker 1: was bad for business, and I agree, you know, but

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Speaker 1: again the problem is that this person who died of

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Speaker 1: the most common one of the most common ways people

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Speaker 1: die suddenly, the side effects of steroid use. They didn't

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Speaker 1: attribute that most most outlets to his death. All right,

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Speaker 1: So according to the National Institute of Health, here's five

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Speaker 1: bad side effects you know that that don't go to

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Speaker 1: longevity if you take steroids. Kidney problems or failure, huge one.

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Speaker 1: Liver damage and tumors another huge one. And then here's

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Speaker 1: the real common stuff. Enlarged heart, high blood pressure, and

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Speaker 1: changes in blood color straw, all of which increase. Here

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Speaker 1: we go, the risk of stroke and heart attack even

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Speaker 1: in young people it increase. Increases your risk of blood

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Speaker 1: cloths again, that's tied in. And it also increases your

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Speaker 1: risk of numerous cancers, one being testicular. And that is

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Speaker 1: alluding to a show to come, another really tough topic.

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Speaker 1: But this is life or death, and this is about

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Speaker 1: health and wellness. And you know, just because that actor

427
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,440
Speaker 1: makes tens of millions and looks really good, it's kind

428
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,640
Speaker 1: of why I started this show, or in the intro

429
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: I used to do to this show. Do you listen

430
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 1: to someone who has years of experience and education, or

431
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 1: do you listen to someone who looks good? Well, when

432
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 1: you listen to someone who just looks good, that could

433
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,080
Speaker 1: be a problem, huge problem. All right, let's get right

434
00:27:56,119 --> 00:28:00,679
Speaker 1: to the myths. For top myths. One of them, it

435
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:02,600
Speaker 1: still surprises me to this day. There are people that

436
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 1: believe that steroids don't work. If they don't work, I

437
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 1: had a doctor friend years ago who who believed it

438
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,119
Speaker 1: didn't work. And one of the reasons, one of the

439
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,040
Speaker 1: reasons he didn't or the main reason he believes, and

440
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,199
Speaker 1: and the body is a really smart machine. And so

441
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:24,439
Speaker 1: his belief was because the body makes testosterone naturally that

442
00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: when you take it, it it balances out. Now he's right

443
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: to a certain degree. People who take steroids often cause

444
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:34,480
Speaker 1: their body to stop making it. And there's so so

445
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 1: there's issues. But to say it doesn't work is insane.

446
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 1: And I'll give you a couple of studies in just

447
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 1: a second. The show it does. But there are many

448
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:45,959
Speaker 1: people who say it doesn't work, doesn't increase performance, doesn't

449
00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 1: lead to you getting bigger. And by the way, there's

450
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,440
Speaker 1: the argument even with baseball players that well doesn't help

451
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 1: you hit a ball. Right, I'm gonna name those names.

452
00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 1: You know who I'm talking about. Many who got buzz

453
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,800
Speaker 1: always taking performance and ancwing drugs, and people said, well,

454
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: they still have to hit the ball. Guess what their

455
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 1: studies that are showing it helps with hand eye coordination

456
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:12,640
Speaker 1: and things like that. Okay, oh, but again people who

457
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: say it don't work. It's one of the top ones.

458
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 1: I read it online. I read it when people challenge

459
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: those people I'm talking about online and in other forums.

460
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 1: There will be people, not me because I don't care.

461
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 1: I'm not that's not my style, but who call out

462
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 1: those people and say, you know, and they will list

463
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:33,719
Speaker 1: the specific drugs. I mean, these are true bodybuilders. They

464
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: know exactly most likely what that person is taking. And

465
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 1: there's quite often numerous comments saying, what are you talking about?

466
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,280
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter aid they're not taking more b even

467
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 1: if they are, doesn't make a difference. Of course, it

468
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: does not taken away from the dedication to diet, the discipline,

469
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 1: all of that stuff, of course. And then number two

470
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 1: I already kind of covered it. If you're not big,

471
00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 1: you're not taking them. Absolute fallacy. And that's where people

472
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 1: don't understand the mechanisms of steroids. It is not only

473
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 1: for hypertrophe, and that is one use. And I understand

474
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 1: the confusion. I totally get it. How can this skinny

475
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,600
Speaker 1: triathlete marathon runner be taking them and not look like

476
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:22,640
Speaker 1: the bodybuilder? Well, many reasons, many reasons leave him at that,

477
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 1: all right, when it comes to recovery, I pulled a

478
00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:29,080
Speaker 1: line from a study I'm gonna bring up in a second.

479
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: Here's a quote from that study. It has been reported

480
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: that anabolic androgenic steroids can increase tolerance to exercise by

481
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 1: making the muscles more capable to overload, therefore shielding them

482
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:46,360
Speaker 1: from muscle fiber damage, and improving the level of protein

483
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:50,480
Speaker 1: synthesis during recovery. That is awesome. That is as deep

484
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 1: as I'm gonna get, and I'm gonna read it one

485
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: more time. Just pull it apart real quickly. So when

486
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 1: I talked about the ability to train longer and harder,

487
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 1: to get back out for that next workout, and this

488
00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: is why so many professional athletes take them. They want

489
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 1: to have a long career, as long as possible. Sometimes

490
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 1: it's two years, all right, can increase tolerance to exercise

491
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 1: by making the muscles more capable to overload pushing harder,

492
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 1: therefore shielding them from muscle fiber damage and improving the

493
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: level of protein synthesis during recovery, you're recovering faster, you're

494
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: pushing your body harder, and you're coming back. Okay, So yeah,

495
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,880
Speaker 1: that's That's just the simplest, clearest way I've seen in

496
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,840
Speaker 1: a long time talking about the benefits that most people

497
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 1: don't understand. Number three, Oh, this is a huge one.

498
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 1: This is a huge one. Debates I've had for years

499
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 1: and again topics for more podcasts to come. Testing works,

500
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: Testing doesn't work. My anecdotal I threw out there my

501
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:52,240
Speaker 1: experience with the stupid lie detectors. And by the way,

502
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 1: I also did one show where they did your analysis.

503
00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:57,840
Speaker 1: And trust me, from the look of the people that

504
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:02,120
Speaker 1: passed the test, I can tell you it doesn't work.

505
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:05,560
Speaker 1: And there's so many reasons why it doesn't. There are

506
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:11,880
Speaker 1: so many. Okay, and I'm gonna read you again. I

507
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,040
Speaker 1: pulled this quote early, but here you go from a

508
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 1: study I'm gonna bring up in a second. In fact, new,

509
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:21,480
Speaker 1: more powerful and undetectable doping techniques and substances are now

510
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 1: abused by professional athletes. While sophisticated network of distribution have developed,

511
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: they have to test for certain things. They also have

512
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 1: to test for certain levels. It's not just the presence

513
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 1: of something in your bloodstream. Okay, So they have to

514
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 1: have pretests. In other words, again they are not just

515
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,400
Speaker 1: trying to find something there. I don't want to get

516
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 1: too specific, but it's complicated. And so people go, well

517
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 1: they were tested. Uh, tests are so inaccurate at best,

518
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 1: and the professional athletes are one step ahead all the time.

519
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 1: How are they one step ahead? Well, first of all,

520
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,320
Speaker 1: if you just off the drugs, it's called cycling. So

521
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:04,920
Speaker 1: if you know when the test is, you can stop

522
00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 1: taking them weeks prior and they're not going to show up,

523
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 1: but you're still going to get the benefit. That is

524
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:15,600
Speaker 1: why they have to do out of competition testing. You know,

525
00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:18,000
Speaker 1: toward to France, guys, they have people knock on their

526
00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: doors during the off season and they have to show

527
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: up within minutes and give it your analysis, and there's

528
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: a whole show as we can do on that out

529
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: of so you can cycle, which most of them do.

530
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: So if you're not getting tested out of competition, it's

531
00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 1: basically worthless for the most part. And then they have

532
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 1: masking agents. You can take certain things, have certain techniques

533
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 1: that will mask it. And then finally they are taking

534
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 1: drugs that they will alter so they don't show up

535
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: on the tests, and that is one of the most

536
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:55,480
Speaker 1: common as well. So those are but three ways that

537
00:33:56,840 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: these tests don't work. Okay, there are designer steroids, new

538
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,760
Speaker 1: versions all the time, all the time. By the way,

539
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:08,360
Speaker 1: one final one, they do test positive and it's often

540
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 1: covered up, often covered up. Okay, And the final one

541
00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:16,640
Speaker 1: that I've been talking about the whole way through because

542
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:21,600
Speaker 1: the whole longevity thing really irked me that the risks

543
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:28,200
Speaker 1: of taking them are exaggerated. No, now, listen, I've said

544
00:34:28,200 --> 00:34:30,440
Speaker 1: it throughout this entire show. If you're a professional athlete,

545
00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 1: if you're an actor, action star, God bless you, you

546
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:39,960
Speaker 1: know you've gotta be bigger, faster, stronger for both careers

547
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,279
Speaker 1: and and there's other careers as well where you know

548
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:46,800
Speaker 1: this may come into play. That's tough. I still wouldn't

549
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 1: take them. I want to be around, but but I'm

550
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 1: not them. So that's the difference. I'm not passing judgment.

551
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,120
Speaker 1: I'm just giving you the facts on the health and

552
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 1: the studies, health risks. So there's the cost benefit that

553
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:04,240
Speaker 1: those people do, and and they've they've done the studies,

554
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:08,800
Speaker 1: they've you know, Olympic athletes are widely known. Study question

555
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: they asked a bunch of athletes years ago was if

556
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:15,440
Speaker 1: you could win a gold medal, but it would you know,

557
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 1: you'd have to give up years on your life. What

558
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 1: would you do? The vast majority said, of course I

559
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:22,399
Speaker 1: want that gold medal. And so that is the cost

560
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: benefit risk reward they are oftentimes doing with the steroids.

561
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 1: The people who are in the know, and then some

562
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:34,320
Speaker 1: take them. Many take them without knowing the true effects.

563
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: All right, Two quick studies the effect of oral antibolic

564
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: steroid on muscle strength and muscle growth in hemo dialysis patients.

565
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 1: This was Clinical Journal of the American Society of Nephrology February.

566
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:53,200
Speaker 1: So sarcopenia is really common in these patients hemodialysis. So

567
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:58,240
Speaker 1: this study looked at whether the antabolic steroid oxymetholone improved

568
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:02,320
Speaker 1: muscle mass and hand griped length and how real quickly.

569
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 1: Forty three patients basically broken down the middle twenty two

570
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:09,760
Speaker 1: some took it, some did not. What did they find

571
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:14,360
Speaker 1: in the hemo dialysis patients ingesting oxy meth alone was

572
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 1: associated with an increase in fat free mass. Okay, they

573
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:22,640
Speaker 1: built muscle hand grip strength and muscle m r n

574
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: A levels for several growth factors, and a decrease in

575
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,200
Speaker 1: fat mass. They gained muscle, they lost that they increased

576
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 1: their strength, but it also induced liver injury. Remember liver.

577
00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:36,759
Speaker 1: I think that was the second one I brought up.

578
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 1: Got you know, kidney issues, liver issues, that's really important.

579
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 1: And one really interesting thing about this study. I don't believe,

580
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 1: you know that they were doing any extra exercise so

581
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:52,680
Speaker 1: that hand grip strength. When people talk about you know,

582
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:54,399
Speaker 1: yes you have to work out, of course you do.

583
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:58,200
Speaker 1: But I couldn't find anywhere in that study where they

584
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 1: did some kind of exercise intervention, all right, So that

585
00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:07,280
Speaker 1: is interesting. And finally, one more study anabolic androgenic steroid

586
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 1: related deaths toptic, histopathological and toxicological findings always a mouthful,

587
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:21,879
Speaker 1: and this was in Current Neuropharmacology January two fifteen. This

588
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: was an interesting one review of literature. Basically, they identified

589
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 1: nineteen fatal cases between two thousand and twelve in which

590
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:34,640
Speaker 1: the autopsy excluded in all cases extra cardiac causes of death.

591
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:37,600
Speaker 1: Here's the findings, though, all you really need to know

592
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 1: the prolonged misuse and abuse of androgenic anabolic steroids can

593
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:46,280
Speaker 1: determine several adverse effects, some of which may be even fatal,

594
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 1: especially on the cardiovascular system because they may increase the

595
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 1: risk of sudden cardiac death, myocardial and farction. Blah blah blah. Yeah,

596
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 1: and the fact there was only nineteen, that's a problem.

597
00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 1: There's more, There's so many anymore, let's just wrap it up.

598
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: I feel like I feel like I got it out there.

599
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:10,840
Speaker 1: I feel like I started the discussion cost benefit. You know.

600
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:15,799
Speaker 1: I just want honesty, and I want honesty in all

601
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:18,840
Speaker 1: aspects of the health and wellness world. And when you

602
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:24,439
Speaker 1: have kids who, by the way, went through this whole show,

603
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 1: who are taking them to try to be like those

604
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 1: movie stars professional athletes, that's a problem. That's a problem.

605
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:39,800
Speaker 1: And the ones who are lying about it, that's a problem.

606
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:44,000
Speaker 1: So I'm just giving me the facts. Stories work stories

607
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 1: are dangerous. I have handfuls of people who I know

608
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,880
Speaker 1: died early and we're taking steroids, and that's all I

609
00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 1: can say. And it's such a touchy subject because they're deaths,

610
00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: their deaths, and you can't one say that that caused it.

611
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:10,000
Speaker 1: And that's a huge problem with health and wellness is

612
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,120
Speaker 1: the cause effect. You know, there's a friend of mine

613
00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: who had a trainer who was ginormous, and he used

614
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 1: to the friend who was working with the trainer used

615
00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 1: to make fun of me all the time. Just starting out.

616
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:26,759
Speaker 1: I was half the size if that not even half

617
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 1: the size of this guy. And he said, why aren't

618
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 1: you as big as my trainer? Why aren't you as

619
00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:35,080
Speaker 1: big as my trainer? Look at my trainer. That trainer,

620
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:39,400
Speaker 1: who was heavy into the bodybuilding world, died in his

621
00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:44,680
Speaker 1: forties early forties of one of the risk factors that

622
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 1: I just gave you. Now, I could give you ten

623
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: more examples of stories like that. Can I say absolutely

624
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:57,760
Speaker 1: that the steroids were the result. No, because, by the way,

625
00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:01,920
Speaker 1: bodybuilders often take things like feder in, growth hormone, insulin, diuretics,

626
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: so many other things, and that's that's part of the

627
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:09,680
Speaker 1: problem too. So my point is again, honesty, facts, and

628
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,040
Speaker 1: always look at the big picture whatever you're doing. That's

629
00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:15,839
Speaker 1: what I do, and I'm willing to be smaller. I'm

630
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 1: willing to lose a race or not perform as well

631
00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 1: compared to some other people who are are doing things

632
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:26,919
Speaker 1: that are illegal. Totally okay with that, because my goal

633
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 1: is longevity, true longevity, okay, and to give you the

634
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 1: facts to do the same as well. And there you

635
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 1: have it. I feel like I got a little thing

636
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:44,200
Speaker 1: off my chest. There's more to this, not today, all right, Tom,

637
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 1: I hope you learned something. If steroids have confused you,

638
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:49,600
Speaker 1: and if you're still confused, reach out to me Tom

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Speaker 1: h Fit, Instagram and Twitter. Tom h Fit. Go to

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Speaker 1: Fitness disrupted dot com. I'm redoing my website by the way.

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Speaker 1: It's a long time coming. I do my own websites

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Speaker 1: as part of the problem. But you can go there

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Speaker 1: as well Fitness just rupted dot com. Reach out, subscribe

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Speaker 1: to the show if you haven't, tell a friend and

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Speaker 1: rate the show. That is greatly appreciated as well. Again,

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Speaker 1: all I care about is helping you have the best

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Speaker 1: information possible to live the best life possible. Because we

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Speaker 1: control three things, how much we move, what we put

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Speaker 1: into our mouths, and our attitudes. And that's awesome. I

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Speaker 1: am Tom Holland this is Fitness Disrupted, Believe in yourself.

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Speaker 1: Fitness Disrupted is a production of I Heart Radio. For

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Speaker 1: more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the i heart

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Speaker 1: Radio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to your

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Speaker 1: favorite shows,