1 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, where we 2 00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:12,119 Speaker 1: discuss all things mental health, personal development, and all the 3 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 1: small decisions we can make to become the best possible 4 00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy Harden Bradford, 5 00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. To get more information 6 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: and resources, visit the website at Therapy for Black Girls 7 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: dot com. And while I hope you love listening to 8 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 1: and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to 9 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: be a substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental 10 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 1: health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for joining me 11 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: for session forty seven of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast. 12 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:54,320 Speaker 1: So this is the episode that you probably saw coming. 13 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 1: If you receive my newsletter, which you totally should, then 14 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 1: you know I've been absolutely the obsessed with Black Panther 15 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:05,360 Speaker 1: since it opened a few weeks ago. In today's episode, 16 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:09,039 Speaker 1: I'm joined by the biggest comic book loving therapist that 17 00:01:09,080 --> 00:01:13,560 Speaker 1: I knew, Mercedes Sommudio. For those of you who've been 18 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 1: around a while, you'll remember that Mercedes was our guests 19 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,080 Speaker 1: on session nine, where she talked all about her movement 20 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:25,240 Speaker 1: to in parents shaming. Mercedes is a licensed clinical social worker, 21 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 1: a parent coach, speaker, and bestselling author who helps parents 22 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: and children communicate with each other, manage emotional trauma, navigate 23 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 1: social media and technology together, and develop healthy parent child relationships. 24 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: Over the course of her career, she has worked with 25 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:49,880 Speaker 1: adoptive families, foster families, teen parents, parents navigating the child 26 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:55,320 Speaker 1: protective Services system, and children living with mental illness. Mercedes 27 00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 1: started the in parent shaming movement as well as coined 28 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: the term shameproof parenting, using both to bring awareness to 29 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:08,400 Speaker 1: ending parent shame. Mercedes is a leading parenting expert and 30 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:12,040 Speaker 1: has an amazing following on social media that allows her 31 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 1: to reach the hearts of thousands of parents who feel 32 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,679 Speaker 1: heard and seen on their parenting journey. She has been 33 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: featured on the Huffington's Posts, US News and Report, Woman's Day, 34 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:27,840 Speaker 1: l A Parent Magazine, CBS l A, and Kids in 35 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:31,919 Speaker 1: the House. Mercedes seeks to empower parents to believe that 36 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: they are already great guys for raising healthy and happy children. 37 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 1: You can read more about her and her parenting expertise 38 00:02:39,880 --> 00:02:44,799 Speaker 1: at shameproof parenting dot com. Mercedes and I did a 39 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:49,440 Speaker 1: deep dive into the psychology of black panther. We discuss 40 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: the importance of representation and how that impacts our mental health, 41 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:57,639 Speaker 1: the messages we received about black womanhood from the movie, 42 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: the strong attachment we all seem to have developed to 43 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 1: the characters, and why so many of us have had 44 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 1: to see it over and over again. I hope you'll 45 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:11,160 Speaker 1: enjoy listening as much as we enjoy chatting about it. 46 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:15,919 Speaker 1: Here's our conversation. So, thank you so much for joining 47 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 1: us today, Mercedes, Thank you so much for having me on. 48 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:21,679 Speaker 1: So I knew that there was no one else that 49 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 1: I could bring on the podcast to talk about Black 50 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 1: Panther besides you, so you are probably the biggest comic 51 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:35,600 Speaker 1: book fan that I know. It also has this clinical background, 52 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: so I felt like this could be a very good 53 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: conversation just about you know, like how it feels like 54 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 1: Black Panther has taken over our worlds at So let's 55 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: let us start by you sharing, um, how many times 56 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 1: have you seen Black Panther at this point exactly? So 57 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: I've still only seen it once. I still have not 58 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:01,119 Speaker 1: had it in my schedule to be able to see 59 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 1: it again, so I'm still going on one time. So 60 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: you probably can reenact some of these scenes much better. 61 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:11,640 Speaker 1: Than probably. So I do want to kind of just 62 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: start by talking because I think that you're not alone 63 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 1: in it, right, Like, um, you know, it feels like 64 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 1: multiple people, like people who probably wouldn't typically see movies 65 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 1: back to back like this, like watching the movie multiple 66 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 1: times are doing that. Like most people have probably seen 67 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 1: it at least twice. And so you know, I'm not 68 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 1: a comic book person, you know, like I typically will 69 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 1: see the movies, but you know, like I don't know 70 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 1: how all of the things work together. And the Marvel 71 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:43,280 Speaker 1: is the Marvel Cinematic universe, correct, Okay, so I'm not sure. 72 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 1: I know that they there is a tie together and 73 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 1: the characters kind of play off each other and they're like, 74 00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 1: you know, a storyline that kind of goes throughout. Um, 75 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 1: and it does feel like there is some level of 76 00:04:53,320 --> 00:04:56,559 Speaker 1: excitement like every time a Marvel movie drops, but something 77 00:04:56,640 --> 00:05:00,160 Speaker 1: about this feels very different. What do you think inc 78 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:04,200 Speaker 1: is happening? I think it's it's really this idea that 79 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: this is number one, the eighteenth Marvel movie. So we 80 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:12,720 Speaker 1: have had seventeen movies prior where there have been black actors. Right, 81 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:15,600 Speaker 1: So there's Don Cheeta who plays war Machine and Iron Patriot. 82 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:18,479 Speaker 1: There's Anthony Mackie who's the Falcon, but they're the sidekicks. 83 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:22,160 Speaker 1: They're not the main show. And they're black actors who 84 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:24,440 Speaker 1: are and there's a sorry Samuel Jackson as Nick Fury 85 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:26,920 Speaker 1: to uh he's in that. So there are these black 86 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 1: actors that are there. However, they are kind of the background. 87 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: They are the side kicks, they are not the main show, 88 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: and they're part of an ensemble white cast. So when 89 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,479 Speaker 1: you see this movie, it's not only that Black Panther 90 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:41,039 Speaker 1: is like just a black cast, but it's the fact 91 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:43,279 Speaker 1: that the black people in this movie they are the heroes, 92 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 1: they are the villains, they are everything. Uh. There's like 93 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 1: two main white actors in the movie, and they're kind 94 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: of auxiliary. Right for the first time, the white actors 95 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:54,480 Speaker 1: are the auxiliary and the black characters are the foreground. 96 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 1: And I think that it's just something that we talked 97 00:05:57,680 --> 00:05:59,600 Speaker 1: about it a little bit, but this idea of representation 98 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:02,640 Speaker 1: where it's like, finally, little kids don't have to do 99 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,719 Speaker 1: the black versions of this character. They are the version. 100 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: They are the initial version of this character. Yeah, and 101 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 1: I think there's something to be said about, like it's 102 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:14,720 Speaker 1: not just the main character right, Like, it feels like 103 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:18,120 Speaker 1: you see all of these supercute videos of kids being 104 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:21,279 Speaker 1: all of these different characters. So you know, they're dressed 105 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:23,840 Speaker 1: up like sure E, or they are a coyer and 106 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:27,680 Speaker 1: the door Malaja, they are um Umbaku. I mean, so 107 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,040 Speaker 1: you know, it's not even that. Like it feels like 108 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:33,240 Speaker 1: typically somebody might be like Captain America, but you don't 109 00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: really know all those other people that are kind of 110 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 1: in the background, whereas here it's an ensemble cast and 111 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 1: people it feels like, are identifying with different characters for 112 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: different reasons. Each of these characters has such a rich 113 00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:47,599 Speaker 1: kind of trajectory throughout the movie. I think that's something 114 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:50,600 Speaker 1: that Ryan Coogler did an amazing job writing and directing 115 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 1: and making sure that every character that shows up on 116 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,599 Speaker 1: Seen has something to do. They are not just there 117 00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 1: because it's cute. They all have such a regal presence 118 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:01,599 Speaker 1: about themselves. Even kill Monger being you know, the villain, 119 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 1: he has such a presence about himself. Works like you 120 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:06,920 Speaker 1: want to role play these people. You want to dig 121 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: into what that feels like to have on their clothes 122 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: and have on their style and to just embody them. 123 00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 1: They're so rich. Yeah, and and you know, again from 124 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:18,840 Speaker 1: my outside perspective as someone who has seen the past 125 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 1: some of the past movies, but you know, not as 126 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 1: in depth of a knowledge as you it doesn't feel 127 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: like other characters get the same level of like nuance 128 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: and complexity as they did in Black Panther. I agree 129 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:34,480 Speaker 1: with you. I mean, I think talk. I mean, I 130 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:37,040 Speaker 1: watched all these movies. I understand how intricate all of 131 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: these stories play out, and there are some characters that 132 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 1: have a little bit more um saliens than the main characters. 133 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: But I think, and again I have to I have 134 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:46,520 Speaker 1: to give Black Panther and I have to give the 135 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:48,920 Speaker 1: writers and the director of this movie a little bit 136 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: credit for this, a lot more credit for this. It 137 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:54,120 Speaker 1: was really intentional. I think, I think, if we're gonna 138 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: do something, and I'm just speculating on what Ryan Coogler 139 00:07:57,400 --> 00:08:00,440 Speaker 1: probably thought, if we're gonna do something like this as 140 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 1: black people, we don't get these opportunities all the time, 141 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 1: which is unfortunate to say in two as an eighteen, 142 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,280 Speaker 1: but we don't get on these opportunities for our black 143 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 1: directors to get a two hundred million dollar budget to 144 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 1: create this world, which is what he got for this movie. Um, 145 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 1: and so you imagine that he's sitting there thinking, I 146 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: have two hundred million dollars to show black excellence. Well, 147 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: damn it, I'm not gonna miss anything. I am going 148 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: to give every single person a rich identity, a rich 149 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,840 Speaker 1: cultural sense, a rich dialogue. I mean a rich I 150 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 1: mean if you just listen to him talk about it. 151 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 1: He even talks about how each person has their own style. 152 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:36,720 Speaker 1: Even the people in the Dormaalagy, they each have their 153 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 1: own style, and they took from each of the tribes 154 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:41,719 Speaker 1: and gave everybody at peace. You know, it was just 155 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,439 Speaker 1: so beautiful how he said, I'm going to make sure 156 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:46,679 Speaker 1: that I have this money to do this movie, and 157 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 1: we have this opportunity to be on this platform with 158 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: the Marvel Cinematic Universe. We're gonna do it up. We're 159 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 1: gonna go in. We're just gonna do this. And I 160 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 1: think with the other characters, the other movies where white 161 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:00,719 Speaker 1: actors always get a chance to step up, um and 162 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:03,680 Speaker 1: kind of do things, so there's not that sense of urgency. 163 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 1: I think there's not that sense of immediacy that the 164 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 1: white actors need to give everybody in the movie a 165 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 1: lot of space in presence, because they'll show up again. 166 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:14,679 Speaker 1: They'll come out again. All the actors, I feel like 167 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:17,880 Speaker 1: in all the other UM, Marvel Cinematic universities, they they 168 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 1: show up in other movies, they show up in other franchises. UM. 169 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:23,679 Speaker 1: Something that might be cool to talk about is that 170 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:26,559 Speaker 1: Chris Evans who plays Captain America, he was also the 171 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:29,320 Speaker 1: Human Torch. So he's been able to be a superhero twice, 172 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 1: you know, And so has Michael B. Jordan who plays 173 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:33,800 Speaker 1: kill Monger. He was also the Human Torch. But I 174 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,599 Speaker 1: feel like white actors always get another opportunity to do this. 175 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: They always get another opportunity to be the superhero or 176 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 1: be the lead. UM. And I feel like for our 177 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:45,120 Speaker 1: African American actors and characters, they don't always get those 178 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 1: opportunities to be a lead and to be the show. 179 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:51,640 Speaker 1: UM in this context. Right, So now is the human 180 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:56,320 Speaker 1: towards somebody in the Marvel Cinematic universe. Not yet. Marvel 181 00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 1: actually bought the rights to them. And I'm being complete 182 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 1: geek right now, but Marvel, right, I bought the rights 183 00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 1: to them, so they will eventually be but the Fantastic 184 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:05,559 Speaker 1: the Fantastic four. So human Torch is part of the 185 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:09,719 Speaker 1: Fantastic Four and they've had two movies, three movies that 186 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 1: have come out and they haven't done well, so you 187 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:16,079 Speaker 1: probably don't know who they are that okay, Okay, I 188 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:18,079 Speaker 1: was like, no, I don't know if I remember that 189 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: part of it. Get them right now? Totally fine, totally fine. 190 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 1: So you know, if we kind of play with this 191 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: idea of representation, because I do feel like that is 192 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: what everybody is really clinging to, right Like, I remember 193 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 1: distinctly when it was announced more than a year ago, 194 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 1: um that this was happening, and I think they shared 195 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 1: that Ryan Coogler was going to be the one um 196 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: doing it, and it felt like almost immediately people started 197 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 1: talking about, oh, this is what we're gonna be wearing 198 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 1: to the Black panther, um, you know. And I know 199 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 1: that typically these movies, like people will cosplay, right like, 200 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,280 Speaker 1: people typically will dress up as the characters, but it 201 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:04,079 Speaker 1: definitely felt like something different that um, you know, like 202 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,199 Speaker 1: that black people were saying like, Okay, we're gonna have 203 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 1: our finest garb to go and see this movie. Yes, 204 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: you know, I love that because yes, people do technically 205 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 1: costplay for these type of fandom stuff, so people would 206 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 1: costplay for Star Wars. People come to cost tumes for 207 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,839 Speaker 1: all the other Marvel Universe Cinematic Universe movies, but this one, 208 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 1: I think, and I have to kind of pull back 209 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 1: a little bit before I get to why we're costplaying 210 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 1: or why we're dressing up for it. It's the first time, 211 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:31,040 Speaker 1: I think and ever, and if I'm wrong, I don't 212 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:32,880 Speaker 1: mind being corrected. But I think it's the first time 213 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: since maybe coming to America or whatnot, where we've had 214 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 1: Africa being displayed in such regal beauty. And I think 215 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: that's something that people really clunk to where I think 216 00:11:42,040 --> 00:11:43,839 Speaker 1: most of the time Africa has seen as a third 217 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 1: World country, and that's part of the dialogue in the movie. 218 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:47,560 Speaker 1: All I thought, what kind of which is the third 219 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:49,839 Speaker 1: World country? I thought this was just you know, nothing 220 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 1: to be, you know, to worry about um. But when 221 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,920 Speaker 1: you look at the fact that we are finally getting 222 00:11:55,960 --> 00:12:02,920 Speaker 1: to see Africa as a technologically advanced community culture continent, 223 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:05,559 Speaker 1: like we don't get to see that. And I think 224 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:09,720 Speaker 1: when you see black people coming out in droves, dancing, 225 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 1: wearing beautiful garments, it's that it's that idea of we 226 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: get to showcase our beauty, not just on a small scale, 227 00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:19,559 Speaker 1: not in an independent movie, not on a direct to 228 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:23,680 Speaker 1: video movie, but a big movie, blockbuster, a tip pole 229 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 1: movie that honestly, when's the last time you saw all 230 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 1: black casts in a tip pole like summer blockbuster type movie, Like, 231 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:34,160 Speaker 1: we don't get that. And so I think it goes 232 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:35,839 Speaker 1: back to who we are as a culture. I think 233 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: we are just a very celebratory, communal culture. And so 234 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:40,719 Speaker 1: when we get to do it on this level, when 235 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 1: we get to celebrate it in this on this level, 236 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 1: we show out. We show up, and we show out, 237 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:47,319 Speaker 1: and I love it. I can't even I can't even 238 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: find the words to talk about how much I love 239 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:51,480 Speaker 1: that we get to show up and show out in 240 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:56,079 Speaker 1: such a beautifully dynamic way and it's not seen as 241 00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 1: you know how sometimes we are kind of portraying in 242 00:12:58,080 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 1: the media being raucous and rowdy. We're not doing that. 243 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,559 Speaker 1: We're just having a great time. Yeah, And I did 244 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 1: you know, pull a quote because I really wanted to understand, 245 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:09,599 Speaker 1: you know, like I think we hear this quote that 246 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:13,360 Speaker 1: representation matters, representation matters, um and I don't, and I 247 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:16,200 Speaker 1: don't know that we always know, like why that's important 248 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:19,040 Speaker 1: or like what that really means? Um? So I found 249 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:21,679 Speaker 1: a quote from Darnell Hunt, who is the director of 250 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: the Ralph J. Bunch Center for African American Studies at 251 00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 1: u c l A, and he said that we're pretty 252 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 1: confident that the more TV you watch, the more media 253 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:35,200 Speaker 1: you consume, the more likely it is that media, almost 254 00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 1: like radiation, builds up and the accumulated effect is to 255 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:42,480 Speaker 1: make you feel that what you're seeing is somewhat normal. 256 00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:46,760 Speaker 1: So this whole idea, like you mentioned that, Um, you 257 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:50,240 Speaker 1: know that Africa can be celebrated in its fullness and 258 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 1: that it's not this third world. You're not representing these 259 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 1: third world countries. Um. You know that that they're not 260 00:13:56,200 --> 00:14:00,560 Speaker 1: resources and lots of exciting things happening in this film. 261 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 1: We really do see this could be a normal. This 262 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 1: is people's normal. Yes, And you know you when you 263 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:10,679 Speaker 1: started talking about that, you made me think of something else. 264 00:14:10,760 --> 00:14:14,439 Speaker 1: I saw recently a young guy and I saw it 265 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:16,040 Speaker 1: on Twitter and I would try to send it to you, 266 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: so maybe you can share it too. But he actually 267 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 1: a couple of days ago kind of in London, started 268 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:25,800 Speaker 1: to do film posters where he replaced the white actors 269 00:14:25,880 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 1: on these film posters with black people, and the tagline, 270 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 1: if I can find it is if this is if 271 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: this is like confusing for you have seen this is 272 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 1: jarring for you? Um, that means we need to see 273 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:39,720 Speaker 1: more black people in these roles. And so he has 274 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 1: one for Harry Potter, he has one for Bridges Jones Diary, 275 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 1: and it's so cool because these are things that normally 276 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: he has one for Titanic. We're normally, we're used to 277 00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:50,520 Speaker 1: seeing white people on the forefront of these covers, right, 278 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:52,440 Speaker 1: We're used to seeing the white actor the leader, and 279 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 1: DiCaprio's the Kate Blanchet's the you know, the Kate Winslets, 280 00:14:56,840 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 1: and we're not used to seeing black people so regally, 281 00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:03,480 Speaker 1: PA trade in these really huge blockbuster movies. And I 282 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 1: think when you see the Black Panther posters, all black people, 283 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 1: you don't even see the white actors on there. Just 284 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 1: it's so beautiful to see Chadwick Boseman, Lupete and Jango 285 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 1: the Niagarrera like Michael B. Jordan's, just to see them 286 00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 1: on all of these posters all over the you know, 287 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:20,400 Speaker 1: I don't know, I know where you are in the South, 288 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:22,680 Speaker 1: but seeing it in l A, all these huge posters 289 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 1: in la It's like, yes, this is look at this, 290 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: and again, I love these movies, but it's so nice 291 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: to see someone who looks like me right being a 292 00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:34,320 Speaker 1: superhero something that I love. I love superheroes, and we 293 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: very rarely get to see it done this way. So 294 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 1: I have to say that I agree with that quote 295 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: that the more we see ourselves and media whatever that 296 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:45,920 Speaker 1: looks like our identities in the media, the more we 297 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 1: began to get comfortable with it. Um. The more I think, 298 00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 1: I'll even say it and bring it a little bit 299 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:54,520 Speaker 1: more um forward. I think the more we see ourselves 300 00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 1: in the media being portrayed on a continuum, on a spectrum, 301 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,680 Speaker 1: so not just the fast talking, smack talking people, but 302 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:03,600 Speaker 1: we see ourselves as kings and queens, we see ourselves 303 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 1: as superheroes, we see ourselves as villains. We see ourselves 304 00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:10,560 Speaker 1: and all of these stereotypically um reserve for white people roles. 305 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:13,360 Speaker 1: We see ourselves in all these roles. It begins to 306 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,400 Speaker 1: let people feel more comfortable, like, you're right, Black people 307 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: can be this diverse, right, They don't just have to 308 00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: be relegated to a certain type of film or a 309 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:24,400 Speaker 1: certain type of character portrayal. They can be anything. And 310 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 1: can you imagine the kids who watch this movie, who 311 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 1: see now I don't have to just audition for these 312 00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 1: type of roles and these type of characters. I can 313 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: audition for the superhero character. I can audition for the 314 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 1: lead and not be the black version of the lead 315 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:40,960 Speaker 1: and just be the lead. Yeah, I mean, and I'm 316 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: thinking about, you know, like the latest video that I've seen, 317 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: and I know you've seen it too, is this super 318 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 1: cute little boy who's re enacting the Emboco scene when 319 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:54,600 Speaker 1: he comes to challenge the Black Panther or the throne, right, 320 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: and so his timing is like on point, Like he 321 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 1: doesn't crack a smell, like he is clearly in character. 322 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 1: And so you know, I'm thinking about, like what is 323 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:07,399 Speaker 1: this child going to become? Like how is it you 324 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:10,639 Speaker 1: know that even just seeing this movie and like allowing 325 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:13,439 Speaker 1: himself to just be playful with it, you know, who 326 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:15,879 Speaker 1: knows what becomes of it? Right? Like you know, an 327 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:19,840 Speaker 1: imagination and play is so super important at that age, 328 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:22,639 Speaker 1: you know, So just the idea that even that hasn't 329 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:26,680 Speaker 1: been expanded for children, I think it's incredibly powerful and 330 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:28,960 Speaker 1: and it's what you just said where it's like play 331 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 1: and imagination is so important for children and how they 332 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 1: understand their world, how they process the world. And so 333 00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:40,119 Speaker 1: usually children are playing these characters who are white, right, 334 00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 1: So can you imagine that kind of those imprinted ideas 335 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,560 Speaker 1: that kids have where I can only be iron Man 336 00:17:45,680 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: if I'm white. I can only be Superman if I'm white. 337 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 1: So I have to pretend to be these characters. I 338 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: have to pretend or assimilate into this culture in order 339 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: to be these characters, whereas when I am Black Panther, 340 00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: I don't have to pretend and black panther and I 341 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:00,920 Speaker 1: love that chat with Bothman talks a lot about this 342 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:04,320 Speaker 1: in his interviews about how he fought for every African 343 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,040 Speaker 1: character to have African accent. They were not going to 344 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:10,080 Speaker 1: not speak cosa, they were not going to um speak 345 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:12,800 Speaker 1: in a British accent on an American accent like because again, 346 00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: when people, when kids, um and actors portrayed these characters, 347 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:20,880 Speaker 1: they get to speak in this African dialect. They don't 348 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:23,040 Speaker 1: have to pretend, they don't have to speak, you know, 349 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:26,680 Speaker 1: a certain dialect that makes them look more intelligent. Right, Um, 350 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 1: I'll even go into this idea of There was a 351 00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:32,119 Speaker 1: research study that talked about how people with accents are 352 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 1: characteristically deemed less intelligent, no matter what their degrees were 353 00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 1: or no matter what their profession is. And I think 354 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:41,560 Speaker 1: being able to see more people speak in their accents, 355 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 1: especially for African Americans, it allows us to stop being 356 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: so confused by accents. And it's linked to intelligence, where 357 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:53,359 Speaker 1: you've got this highly technologically advanced culture and everyone speaks cosa. 358 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 1: Everyone speaks with this beautiful accent and dialect, and they're 359 00:18:57,040 --> 00:19:00,680 Speaker 1: all brilliant and regal and amazing people. And I think 360 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 1: seeing more of that is what allows kids to say, 361 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:05,600 Speaker 1: I don't have to try to assimilate. I don't have 362 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,120 Speaker 1: to give up parts of my culture. Um to see 363 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,120 Speaker 1: all the women wearing natural hair and all the men 364 00:19:10,200 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 1: wearing natural hair. Okay, I don't have to straighten my 365 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:14,760 Speaker 1: hair to be a superhero. It's it's there's so many 366 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 1: little nuggets. They are where when you go back to 367 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:20,359 Speaker 1: pretend play and what kids have to assimilate into to 368 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 1: fit into these roles, they don't have to do that 369 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:26,040 Speaker 1: anymore when they play black parts, black panther characters, when 370 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 1: they role playing those characters. Yeah, and I do think. 371 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:33,119 Speaker 1: You know, we talked primarily about the representation piece for 372 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:35,880 Speaker 1: the kids, um, and I think that that is important. 373 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:38,840 Speaker 1: But I also think that there's something for adults too 374 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 1: in terms of the representation. What are your ideas about, like, 375 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:43,879 Speaker 1: you know, yeah, we know it needs a lot to 376 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:46,600 Speaker 1: the little kids, but what about for adults. Well, I'll 377 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:48,880 Speaker 1: speak from being a comic book fan. I'm gonna take 378 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:51,200 Speaker 1: a little turn in terms of my life and and 379 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 1: be really blunt about this. So I have always loved 380 00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 1: comic book stuff and magic because in my childhood it 381 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 1: allowed me to get away from what I was experiencing, 382 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:04,040 Speaker 1: um in my childhood, which wasn't great. And so I 383 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: dove into Harry Potter, I dove into Spider Man and 384 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: X Men and all those movies came out when I 385 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:11,200 Speaker 1: was in junior high in high school, and I love 386 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,880 Speaker 1: being immersed in these characters and learning about them and Batman. 387 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: To this day, my my wedding ring is actually Batman. Um. 388 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 1: Batman is always going to be for me like symbolic 389 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:24,440 Speaker 1: of how someone can go do such tragic pain and 390 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:27,359 Speaker 1: grow up to help and heal their community. And so 391 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:29,640 Speaker 1: these were always the characters that I felt so close 392 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:32,000 Speaker 1: to and so connected to, and I never worried that 393 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:33,640 Speaker 1: they were white. I never worried that I was black. 394 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,280 Speaker 1: But it really was like, well, I guess we'll just 395 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: never be that, you know, like I'll never be able 396 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:40,879 Speaker 1: to see a black person emote and be these ways 397 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:44,119 Speaker 1: and be these character portrayals. And so now, as a 398 00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:46,399 Speaker 1: thirty or two year old woman who loves these movies 399 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,680 Speaker 1: and who loves and understands the intricacies with which these 400 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 1: characters are portrayed, to be able to have that same 401 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 1: level of beauty and awesomeness and identification with black panther um, 402 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:02,920 Speaker 1: it's something that makes me really validated. It makes me 403 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:06,240 Speaker 1: feel like I matter. It makes me feel like, Okay, finally, 404 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 1: what I look like in the way that I wear 405 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:11,320 Speaker 1: my hair is just as beautiful as Pepper Pots, is 406 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 1: just as regal and cool as Captain America. Like, it's 407 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 1: just as amazing. And so I think I'm just speaking 408 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,120 Speaker 1: for me and whoever else resonates with this, I think 409 00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:24,000 Speaker 1: for us um as people of color who are geeks, 410 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:27,560 Speaker 1: we have finally got someone who looks like us, right, 411 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 1: we can geek out on a superhero who is just 412 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:34,760 Speaker 1: like me. I can geek out on the door, milaj 413 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 1: who are beautifully you know, diversely colored women, women of color. 414 00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:41,879 Speaker 1: I can I think, uh, Lupita and Yango is so 415 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:45,680 Speaker 1: beautiful and to see her be so strong and so amazing. 416 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,479 Speaker 1: And in the video that Jimmy Fallon had of Tywoo 417 00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:50,879 Speaker 1: Bose and meeting his fans, as one woman said it 418 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:53,360 Speaker 1: so articulately, she said, it was so beautiful to see 419 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:56,240 Speaker 1: black women who were in their strength and their power, 420 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:59,120 Speaker 1: and they weren't the stereotypical angry black women. They weren't 421 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,240 Speaker 1: the sassy, cookie lyon black women. They were just strong 422 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 1: and regal and and also empathetic and vulnerable all at once. 423 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:09,359 Speaker 1: And it's those moments for me, especially as a woman, 424 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:13,560 Speaker 1: where it's like, yes, we are strong, but we're also vulnerable. 425 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 1: We are you know, we can go out and kick, 426 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:17,679 Speaker 1: but but we can also you know, hold our man's 427 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 1: hand and tell him he could be whatever he needs 428 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:21,240 Speaker 1: to be. And it was all God, I can go 429 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 1: on and all, but it's there are so many pieces 430 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:25,879 Speaker 1: of that that as a woman who has loved this 431 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 1: stuff since I was a kid, it just felt so 432 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,399 Speaker 1: beautiful to be able to see people who look like 433 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 1: may be portrayed with that emotional continuum, that emotional spectrum. Yeah, 434 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:36,680 Speaker 1: and I do want to stay with that for a 435 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 1: little bit, Mercedes, because I do think you know, when 436 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:42,080 Speaker 1: we hear about this strong black woman, um, you know, 437 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: like I feel like a lot of times, um, it's 438 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,200 Speaker 1: not uh, you know, like the strength is kind of 439 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: put upon us in a way that like negates us 440 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: taking care of ourselves, whereas in Black Panther it was 441 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: a strength because their warriors, you know, and it was 442 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:00,879 Speaker 1: like you mentioned, like still aside that allowed them to 443 00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:04,040 Speaker 1: be vulnerable and to be in relationship and you know, 444 00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:07,320 Speaker 1: to not have their strength be that they weren't taking 445 00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:10,520 Speaker 1: care of themselves. Yes, and there were several scenes like that. 446 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 1: You know. I don't want to spoil this so you know, 447 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:13,440 Speaker 1: cover your years if you haven't seen the movie. But 448 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,640 Speaker 1: there's that wonderful, beautiful scene between a Koyer and Wakabi 449 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:18,480 Speaker 1: at the end when she he's like, are you gonna 450 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:21,879 Speaker 1: fight me? And she's like, yes, I will. But at 451 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:23,679 Speaker 1: the same time, we know from the way that they 452 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 1: developed those characters that they are in love. That he 453 00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 1: calls her my love and she does too, but she's like, 454 00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:30,480 Speaker 1: but also, this is my country, so if you don't 455 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:32,840 Speaker 1: take it down, we're gonna have to fight, brother. And 456 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:35,960 Speaker 1: I love love that scene because again I have to 457 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: command Ryan Coogler in the way that he wrote his characters, 458 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:41,760 Speaker 1: he developed their relationship very subtly but very powerfully. So 459 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,440 Speaker 1: that scene had so much more resonance um to it, 460 00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:46,200 Speaker 1: and I love it. I love the strength of her 461 00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:48,600 Speaker 1: at the same time, the vulnerability that she's like, you 462 00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:50,959 Speaker 1: are my love, but look, this is my country, these 463 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 1: are my people. We can't do this to each other, 464 00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:54,600 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I love that. I thought 465 00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 1: that was a beautiful scene. Yeah. And then with Nikia, 466 00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,920 Speaker 1: you know, you saw that she was someone who was 467 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 1: very self possessed, right, Like she had her own ideas 468 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,120 Speaker 1: about like what she wanted to do with her life, 469 00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:08,000 Speaker 1: and she even made the statement, you know, like I'd 470 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: be a great queen if I wanted that, you know. Yeah, 471 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,360 Speaker 1: so I mean but so even though she was very 472 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,760 Speaker 1: clear about like where she wanted to go with her life, 473 00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,719 Speaker 1: it does it did still feel like there was um 474 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 1: a level of compromise there when she decided to stay. 475 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,920 Speaker 1: Is at least it seems that way when he made 476 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:29,879 Speaker 1: space for her to kind of continue to do what 477 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 1: she needed to do as a part of the Kingdom 478 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,720 Speaker 1: of Yes. And I want to speak about that too, 479 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:39,200 Speaker 1: about how how T'Challa was kind of created too. And 480 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,040 Speaker 1: I think this when you go into representation, it's so 481 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 1: important for us to have, especially black men in the 482 00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,000 Speaker 1: culture that we have now, to see our black men 483 00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:50,800 Speaker 1: being okay being surrounded by black women and that even 484 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 1: if Niki is his girlfriend or not, that she's still 485 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:55,840 Speaker 1: able to be there for him that and the Koya 486 00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,080 Speaker 1: is not his girlfriend, she is not, you know, part 487 00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:00,880 Speaker 1: of his romantic kind of life, but she's still there 488 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 1: for him and supports him and at the same time 489 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: kind of pushes at him and says, are you sure 490 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:06,440 Speaker 1: that's what you're gonna do? Do you really need this? 491 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 1: And to watch that interplay between both the romantic kind 492 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 1: of talente that he got from the Kia, but as 493 00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: well as the camaraderie and the friendship and the respect 494 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 1: that he received from o Koa, and how he was 495 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: able to manage that and find a balance between both 496 00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: of those. I think it's such a great representation for 497 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:23,720 Speaker 1: a black man to see that you can be vulnerable, 498 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:25,959 Speaker 1: you can still stand your ground and say I am 499 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,200 Speaker 1: a king. Right, That's something that we definitely say about 500 00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 1: a black man. You are a king, right, and Shalla 501 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:33,320 Speaker 1: is a king. But he was able to be like, Okay, 502 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:36,000 Speaker 1: what are you both women who I highly respect? What 503 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 1: else are you saying? How can you help me to 504 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 1: reframe my ideas? So I'm still taking care of my 505 00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 1: country and I just love that vulnerability in him, right. 506 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 1: It did. It definitely did feel like there was a 507 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,040 Speaker 1: balance that it wasn't just the women who were being vulnerable, right, 508 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: which is nice, right. Yeah, it definitely felt like a 509 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 1: love letter, like it felt like the whole cast and 510 00:25:57,720 --> 00:25:59,760 Speaker 1: you know, kind of Live by Ryan Cludely, it felt 511 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,639 Speaker 1: very much like a love letter to black people, like 512 00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 1: just this kind of bomb that we need, um right now. 513 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 1: Which does bring me to like another thought and you know, 514 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 1: something that you mentioned as you were explaining like your 515 00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,399 Speaker 1: own history with like comic books and stuff, I feel like, 516 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,920 Speaker 1: you know, like we mentioned, most people have seen this, 517 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:21,240 Speaker 1: you know at least twice, Um, you've seen it five times. 518 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,240 Speaker 1: People have people have gone multiple times. And I think 519 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 1: at the core what this really is about is like escapism. 520 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,320 Speaker 1: So you know, in our real life, we have a 521 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: president who is just ridiculous, We have you know, oppression 522 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:41,520 Speaker 1: in many different forms, Like it just literally sometimes feels 523 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 1: like the world is on fire outside of you versus 524 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: we go to Wakanda and it's beautiful and there's this 525 00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:53,840 Speaker 1: rich culture and this advanced technology, and it definitely feels 526 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:56,400 Speaker 1: like I just want to be there. I just don't 527 00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:58,879 Speaker 1: want to be here. Um, So can you can you 528 00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,159 Speaker 1: talk more about like, you know, like if do you 529 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:03,680 Speaker 1: agree that you think that people are just you know, 530 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,040 Speaker 1: trying to escape what's going on in the real world 531 00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:09,960 Speaker 1: by these multiple visits to Wakinda so to speak. Yeah, 532 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:13,400 Speaker 1: you know, I think I think that's something that we deserve. 533 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:16,200 Speaker 1: Every other culture and and again I won't say every 534 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:18,000 Speaker 1: other culture, I'll stick with just kind of the mainstream 535 00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,919 Speaker 1: white culture has that level of escape misum it almost 536 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,680 Speaker 1: every genre. They have it in drama, they have it 537 00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 1: in action, they have it an indie Flix. They have 538 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 1: all of these different spaces where they can escape into 539 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,800 Speaker 1: a world that that they identify with, into a world 540 00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 1: that feels resonant with them. And so for uh, geeks 541 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,760 Speaker 1: of color, if you will, Um, we've always been able 542 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 1: to escape into these worlds too. And you know, I 543 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 1: talked to my husband a lot, a lot, a lot 544 00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:45,960 Speaker 1: about this. In the fantasy world there is kind of 545 00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,359 Speaker 1: racial commentary, with orcs and lesser kind of creatures being 546 00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:51,760 Speaker 1: kind of seen as a minority, oppressive race, and then 547 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: obviously all the elves and you know, all of the 548 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 1: hierarchy people are usually always white. And so he and 549 00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: I being he my husband's right, We've talked about how 550 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,080 Speaker 1: sometimes in the fantasy world there is racial commentary, there 551 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,480 Speaker 1: is cultural commentary. However, I think what Black Panther gives 552 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,800 Speaker 1: us is this level of escapism that African Americans don't 553 00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: always get in all of these different genres. Right, we 554 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:16,280 Speaker 1: don't get to be action heroes, we don't get to 555 00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:18,680 Speaker 1: be superheroes all the time. And so being able to 556 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:21,960 Speaker 1: escape into Wakonda is something that's such. I think we 557 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,160 Speaker 1: deserve that, right, We deserve to be able to see 558 00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 1: a world where we are not being oppressed, where we 559 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:29,240 Speaker 1: are on top, where we are the where we hold 560 00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,360 Speaker 1: all the power, all the money. Um, there's this hashtag 561 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:35,440 Speaker 1: on social media that says in Wakonda, right, So in Wakonda, 562 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,280 Speaker 1: Obama is still president. In Wakonda. Traylon Martin is still alive, 563 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 1: you know, and if you look it up hashtag in Wakonda, 564 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 1: you'll see like all of these beautiful kind of ideas 565 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:46,480 Speaker 1: of if we were able to bring that Wakandan kind 566 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 1: of um technology and life into our world, what would 567 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 1: we be as Black people? And I think being able 568 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 1: to have that escapism and being able to even kind 569 00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:57,960 Speaker 1: of have that imaginary play um as a culture makes 570 00:28:58,000 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: it kind of gives us a space to think, well 571 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 1: and we bring some of that here? Can we bring 572 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:04,719 Speaker 1: some of that voice, some of that fierceness into our 573 00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,760 Speaker 1: world where we know there's no such thing as Wakonda, 574 00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:10,880 Speaker 1: We know that there's no such thing as this vibranium. 575 00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 1: But what is it about these these concepts and these 576 00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: traits and these ideals that we can actually bring it 577 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:18,920 Speaker 1: to our real world? And I hope that with more 578 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 1: viewings and hopefully with the second and the third Black 579 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 1: Panther movies that are inevitable that are going to come out, 580 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 1: that we continue to do that. We continue to say, 581 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,719 Speaker 1: how can we bring these Wakonda ideas of strength, of power, 582 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 1: of togetherness, of vulnerability, How do we bring that into 583 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 1: our world to help build resilience around what's happening to 584 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 1: us as a culture in the world. Yeah, and I 585 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,760 Speaker 1: definitely feel like, you know, some of that has started. 586 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,000 Speaker 1: You know, like when people were talking about like some 587 00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,720 Speaker 1: of the blankets and things that we're in the movie, 588 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 1: people were then sharing links online like from authentic you 589 00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 1: know sellers where you could get this information from, so 590 00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 1: you know, kind of you know, as a way of 591 00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: kind of keeping money in the community and supporting the 592 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: people who you know, have given us like this very 593 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,240 Speaker 1: rich movie. Um and you know, a way to kind 594 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:09,120 Speaker 1: of you know, see ourselves differently. Yes, definitely, I think 595 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,160 Speaker 1: it's beautiful. Yeah, I mean, it just really is beautiful 596 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:13,840 Speaker 1: all around. And I mean and I think, you know, 597 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,920 Speaker 1: we do want to be careful, right because us escaping 598 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:20,800 Speaker 1: to Wakanda doesn't mean that we don't still have to 599 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,719 Speaker 1: deal with real life, right, Like it's not um our 600 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:28,400 Speaker 1: excitement about Black Panther is not necessarily like changing policies 601 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:30,960 Speaker 1: or you know that kind of thing. But I do think, 602 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 1: like you mentioned, we deserve that, right, Like, we deserve 603 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 1: to be able to participate in joyful things and to 604 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: being excited about things when you know, maybe so much 605 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:41,520 Speaker 1: of the rest of our life. It's been really trying 606 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 1: to kind of fight all of the oppression and you know, 607 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 1: to kind of do things in our community. We do 608 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 1: deserve to have joyful moments like this as well. And 609 00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:50,440 Speaker 1: you know, I would even say this, I'll bring up 610 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:52,760 Speaker 1: the topic of representation a little bit more and even 611 00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 1: that that idea of even though being kind of immersing 612 00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 1: ourselves in the fantasy of Wakanda doesn't change things. I 613 00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 1: think it's doesn't have to. I think it can just 614 00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:04,840 Speaker 1: be an immersion into this fantasy. And I think the 615 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 1: more people see that we deserve to have these fantasy 616 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:13,720 Speaker 1: worlds populated with black people, populated with people who look 617 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 1: like us, the more we don't have to latch on 618 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,160 Speaker 1: to one thing. We can have multiple Wakandas we can have, 619 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: you know, I mean think about Lord of the Rings 620 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 1: and Harry Potter and Hunger Games and all these different 621 00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,000 Speaker 1: worlds that white people get to have because they're populated 622 00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:28,840 Speaker 1: with white people. So you think about these fantasy worlds, 623 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 1: you know, where everyone gets to say all it can be. 624 00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: I can be I can go to Homewards, or I 625 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:34,680 Speaker 1: can join the Hunger Games, or I can go to 626 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,640 Speaker 1: Middle Earth. There's so many different places for white people 627 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:40,840 Speaker 1: to escape to. There's so many different places for us 628 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: as black people to kind of join in. We can 629 00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 1: go to, um, what's Western Roads, you know with Game 630 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:49,560 Speaker 1: of Thrones, there's so much because we're not used to 631 00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 1: seeing black people being populated in any of these areas. 632 00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:54,720 Speaker 1: So with all of these places that I just talked about, 633 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 1: you can't even think of how many black people you 634 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 1: saw in these places. How many black people are in 635 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,400 Speaker 1: Western Roast, how many black people are in Middle Earth, 636 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:03,520 Speaker 1: how many black people are in you know, the Hunger 637 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 1: Games are at Hogwarts, Like, we need to populate these 638 00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:09,360 Speaker 1: fantasy worlds with more black people, and not in the 639 00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:13,000 Speaker 1: auxiliary back of the frame, but in the foreground. And 640 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: I think, and then we don't have to hold onto 641 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:19,120 Speaker 1: Wakonda so tightly. We can start saying we're at Hogwarts too. 642 00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:21,640 Speaker 1: We can start saying we're also you know here, we're 643 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 1: also here. And I think that that's part of the 644 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:28,640 Speaker 1: dialogue about representation, that we are holding onto Waconda because 645 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:31,240 Speaker 1: it's the first fantasy world that we can go to 646 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:35,200 Speaker 1: and feel like we're populated here. Um Chadwick Boseman made 647 00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:36,720 Speaker 1: He's so brilliant. By the way, I'm going to tell 648 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,600 Speaker 1: everyone who's listening, look up Chadwick Boseman and watch his interviews. 649 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:42,080 Speaker 1: He's brilliant. But he was talking about the same thing 650 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:44,960 Speaker 1: that I just shared, which is, Um, every time we 651 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:48,000 Speaker 1: look at a futuristic world, it's almost like no black 652 00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:50,760 Speaker 1: people exist in the future anymore, like we just ceased 653 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:52,800 Speaker 1: to exist. That wherever we go in space or wherever 654 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 1: we go in the future, there's very few black people. 655 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:57,640 Speaker 1: And it's like, do we exist in the future, Well, 656 00:32:57,680 --> 00:32:59,840 Speaker 1: black panthers saying yes, we do, right, This is an 657 00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 1: feel futuristic culture where in the future Vibranium and Wakonda 658 00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 1: are still here and we're still and we're still powerful. 659 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:10,560 Speaker 1: And I just love that idea that with more representation, 660 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,320 Speaker 1: we can start populating these fantasy worlds with more black 661 00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:15,800 Speaker 1: people so we don't have to hold onto a conduct 662 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:18,480 Speaker 1: is the only place that we can escape to very 663 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:22,560 Speaker 1: good points. And I think, Um, you mentioned like the 664 00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: interviews that you have watched, your chat with Bozeman, and 665 00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 1: I know I know you and I that opening weekend, 666 00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:31,960 Speaker 1: we're like sharing all of these clips that we could 667 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,480 Speaker 1: find and and I want to dig into that a 668 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:38,040 Speaker 1: little bit right because to me, like Black Panther itself 669 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:41,520 Speaker 1: has been fascinating, but for me, the whole psychology behind 670 00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:45,120 Speaker 1: the attachment we're having to it is even more fascinating. 671 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,120 Speaker 1: And so you know, I know we were sharing articles 672 00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:52,720 Speaker 1: and it feels like, um, and probably part of this 673 00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:55,120 Speaker 1: was a part of the marketing plan, you know, where 674 00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:57,600 Speaker 1: they the whole cast did the press run and that 675 00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:01,320 Speaker 1: you always saw them together. Um and even now like 676 00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:04,760 Speaker 1: the movie opened, what two weeks ago, but like you know, 677 00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 1: even if the oscars this weekend, um, you know, you 678 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:11,480 Speaker 1: saw the cast posing in any time, like more than 679 00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,160 Speaker 1: one of them is together, like they're greeting them greeting 680 00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:16,960 Speaker 1: each other with the Wakanda hand signal. I mean, so 681 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,799 Speaker 1: it very much feels like you know, and I don't 682 00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:23,000 Speaker 1: I don't know what this is purposeful, um or if 683 00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:25,480 Speaker 1: you know, they just have become so enamored with these 684 00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 1: characters and the love that they're getting that it just 685 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,360 Speaker 1: kind of feels natural at this point. Um. But it 686 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: it very bunch feels like they are real. Like it 687 00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 1: feels like because you still see them together, like as 688 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 1: a collective or at least a couple of them. Um. 689 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,440 Speaker 1: That like it's a continuation of the movie. Yes, I 690 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,839 Speaker 1: agree with that actually, and I think, you know, again, 691 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,840 Speaker 1: going back to the interviews that I've seen, almost everybody 692 00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,359 Speaker 1: that has been on every party who goes on their shows, 693 00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:56,239 Speaker 1: especially on African American interviewers will greet Chadwick with the 694 00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:59,920 Speaker 1: Wakondan salute. Right. Um. Tiffany Hattish was on the Red 695 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 1: carpet and someone readed her with it and they did 696 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 1: it wrong and she corrected them to me, how it 697 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,600 Speaker 1: is not even in the movie. But she corrected them. 698 00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:08,439 Speaker 1: It was like, hey, it's right over left, not left 699 00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:11,120 Speaker 1: over right. And it's this moment of Again, I'll go 700 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:14,240 Speaker 1: back to my last point. This is why representation matters. 701 00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:18,280 Speaker 1: That when we have a world of fantasy world populated 702 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 1: with these types of people, we gravitate towards it, just 703 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:23,320 Speaker 1: like we do with all of these other fantasy worlds 704 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:26,319 Speaker 1: that we watch, and so we need I think people 705 00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,560 Speaker 1: need to look at again, going back to the psychology 706 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:31,800 Speaker 1: of it, that when we see a fantasy world, a 707 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,440 Speaker 1: place where we can escape that's populated with people that 708 00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:36,680 Speaker 1: look like you, that identify the same way as you, 709 00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,479 Speaker 1: you can't do anything but feel pride you can't feel 710 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:44,200 Speaker 1: anything but excitement and a swell um there's I've watched 711 00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:46,319 Speaker 1: this movie five times, and almost each time there are 712 00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,480 Speaker 1: different parts of the movie the movie where my heart 713 00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:51,320 Speaker 1: just swells with pride because of the beauty of it, 714 00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:53,520 Speaker 1: the regalness of it. And again not just because they're 715 00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:56,879 Speaker 1: kings and queens, but just because look at this, look 716 00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 1: at these people in this fantasy world who look like me. 717 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,320 Speaker 1: And I think seeing actors and interviewers and all of 718 00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:05,839 Speaker 1: the African American actors who are again, Will Smith did 719 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:09,400 Speaker 1: a beautiful um Instagram video congratulating the whole cast. You know, 720 00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,840 Speaker 1: I think seeing that is just a huge sign to 721 00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 1: Hollywood and two people who write these scripts and create 722 00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,720 Speaker 1: these worlds, that we would love to see these worlds 723 00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,480 Speaker 1: populated with black people. We would love to see these 724 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 1: worlds populated this way because look at like you just said, 725 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,799 Speaker 1: look at how we're resonated with these actors, these people 726 00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:31,239 Speaker 1: who have just portrayed a fictional world, fictional people. Look 727 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:33,800 Speaker 1: at how we're connecting to them. That is a huge 728 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:38,400 Speaker 1: sign that we deserve, need want thrive when we are 729 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:42,080 Speaker 1: represented in this way. Yeah, and in doing some research 730 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:44,960 Speaker 1: and it really did take a while to like research 731 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:46,800 Speaker 1: some of this stuff because I didn't even know what 732 00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:49,120 Speaker 1: to call it, right, Like, I was like, Okay, this 733 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,160 Speaker 1: kind of feels like when you don't want a good 734 00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:53,480 Speaker 1: storybook to end right, like you want to just kind 735 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,920 Speaker 1: of hang on. Um So, I think the technical term 736 00:36:57,040 --> 00:37:00,839 Speaker 1: is called character bonding. Uh So, see look at all 737 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:03,480 Speaker 1: this new stuff I learned. Um So, I found an 738 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:07,280 Speaker 1: article called the Psychology of Character bonding why we feel 739 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:11,400 Speaker 1: a real connection to actors, and it stated we'd have 740 00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:15,040 Speaker 1: no way of processing a character cognitively if we didn't 741 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,759 Speaker 1: have experiences with people outside of the fictional world. The 742 00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:22,520 Speaker 1: experiences with fictional characters resonate with us because of the 743 00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:26,600 Speaker 1: fact that we've had deep experiences with people throughout our lives, 744 00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 1: just as we do with real life friends and family. 745 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:34,440 Speaker 1: In our minds, we subconsciously filling the details of characters 746 00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:38,200 Speaker 1: lives that are missing. This includes ideas about what they're 747 00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:41,000 Speaker 1: thinking or what they were up to when we weren't around. 748 00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:44,279 Speaker 1: And so I think, you know, going back to that 749 00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,800 Speaker 1: scene that you mentioned at the end with what Kaby 750 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,719 Speaker 1: and okoy a, um, you know, like, I think that 751 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:54,000 Speaker 1: really highlights this sentiment because of course, then you saw 752 00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 1: a lot of conversation online about what the conversation between 753 00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:02,839 Speaker 1: what Kaby and Okoyer would be like afterwards, like does 754 00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:09,319 Speaker 1: on the couch now? Yeah? Yeah, Like what how how 755 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,239 Speaker 1: does that interaction continue? Right? So of course they don't 756 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 1: show us that in the movie, But because we have 757 00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 1: become so attached to these characters and feel like we 758 00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:19,239 Speaker 1: kind of know them and like they're part of our 759 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,640 Speaker 1: circle in some ways, then we are then playing out 760 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,439 Speaker 1: like what we think that interaction will be, like yeah, 761 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,040 Speaker 1: and you know, I'm gonna kind of kind of play 762 00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:29,840 Speaker 1: with us a little bit because going back to the 763 00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:33,959 Speaker 1: representation idea and how many times we get to bond 764 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,560 Speaker 1: with our characters right as black people, so we tend 765 00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:39,080 Speaker 1: to bond with Empire. So I look, I think about Empires. 766 00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:41,760 Speaker 1: One of those shows that a full black cast, the family. 767 00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,719 Speaker 1: It shows family dynamics. It shows something that we don't 768 00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,840 Speaker 1: always get to see on TV. You're like, you have Cookie, 769 00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:50,520 Speaker 1: you have Lucis, you have his sons, and you watch 770 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:52,759 Speaker 1: this character dynamics play out, and I think we bond 771 00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,439 Speaker 1: to those characters because we have a Cookie in our house. 772 00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:57,600 Speaker 1: We have a Lucius in our family, right, we have 773 00:38:57,800 --> 00:39:00,440 Speaker 1: you know, we have these characters, and so I think 774 00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:03,680 Speaker 1: about something like Black Panther, whereas I feel like Empire 775 00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:05,719 Speaker 1: is something that as black people were used to. We're 776 00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:08,640 Speaker 1: used to the snappy, fast talking black mama, you know, 777 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:11,080 Speaker 1: We're used to the very stern black dad who's gonna 778 00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:13,000 Speaker 1: set these rules. And I think we bond to those 779 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:16,120 Speaker 1: characters because, like you said in that definition, we see 780 00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:18,560 Speaker 1: these people in real life, and we can identify and 781 00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:22,080 Speaker 1: understand what's happening outside of these scripted scenes, and we 782 00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:24,399 Speaker 1: can bond to them. And so you get to something 783 00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:27,120 Speaker 1: like Black Panther where you say, well, as black people, 784 00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:29,440 Speaker 1: we don't always have superheroes. Are as black people, we 785 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:31,480 Speaker 1: don't always get to see the people flying through the 786 00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:34,640 Speaker 1: air and being cool action stars. But I would say 787 00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,880 Speaker 1: that we do. We see the people in our communities, 788 00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:39,920 Speaker 1: the people who we look up to. We see these 789 00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:43,520 Speaker 1: people every day, and even though they're not um and 790 00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,480 Speaker 1: and like they don't have the vibranium suits, we see 791 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,080 Speaker 1: people that look like kings and queens to us. We 792 00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:53,040 Speaker 1: see people in our lives that look like um. Strong 793 00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:55,560 Speaker 1: women are are that look like the dorm Laji, And 794 00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 1: I think we bond on that level two where it's 795 00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:01,439 Speaker 1: fantasy dorm laj is not real. But how many strong 796 00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:03,360 Speaker 1: women in your life do you know that are like 797 00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 1: that right that you can look at and say, Yep, 798 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:08,279 Speaker 1: that's my auntie, Yep, that's my big sister, Yep, that's 799 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,600 Speaker 1: my cousin. And I think, if if I'm staying with 800 00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,319 Speaker 1: that idea of character bonding, I think that even though 801 00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:15,560 Speaker 1: we as black people don't always get to see fantasy 802 00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:19,239 Speaker 1: world's populated with us, seeing something like this allows us 803 00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,920 Speaker 1: to bond with even the people in our lives who 804 00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:24,319 Speaker 1: aren't black panthers and aren't the keys are core. Yes, 805 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:26,040 Speaker 1: we get to see them in our real life and 806 00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 1: we get to see kind of this fantasy portrayal of 807 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,719 Speaker 1: what our auntie who's so strong and cool, would look 808 00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,719 Speaker 1: like if she was a dormalage, you know what I mean. 809 00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:38,319 Speaker 1: And I think that that's something that we deserve more of. Absolutely, Mercedes. Yeah, 810 00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:43,640 Speaker 1: So I mean we could probably talk forever, because you see, 811 00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:45,600 Speaker 1: I am everything you've give me. I just like go 812 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:50,120 Speaker 1: into like a ten minutes, you know what I think? Yeah, 813 00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:52,719 Speaker 1: And like I said, I have just been so fascinated 814 00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:55,520 Speaker 1: by the way that this has kind of become its 815 00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:59,239 Speaker 1: own thing UM, and completely agree with you that it did, 816 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:02,799 Speaker 1: doesn't It definitely feels like something we deserve right now 817 00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:07,440 Speaker 1: and that we really need it right now. Yeah. Yeah, Well, 818 00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:09,840 Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining me for this, Mercedes. 819 00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,799 Speaker 1: I definitely will make sure to include links to your 820 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:15,799 Speaker 1: UM private practice and everything in the show notes. Even 821 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: though we didn't talk very much about this, UM, You've 822 00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:20,719 Speaker 1: been on the podcast before to talk about your whole 823 00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:24,000 Speaker 1: movement around shameproof parenting UM, so I will link to 824 00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:26,680 Speaker 1: that episode that you were on earlier as well as 825 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:29,280 Speaker 1: well as UM all of the citations that I found 826 00:41:29,320 --> 00:41:32,480 Speaker 1: in doing my research for this episode. Because one other 827 00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:35,200 Speaker 1: thing that I found was a TED talk done by 828 00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:38,920 Speaker 1: a psychologist UM Dr Jennifer Bournes that talks about the 829 00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:43,879 Speaker 1: reality of our relationships with imaginary characters. So that gave 830 00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:45,960 Speaker 1: some great information too, So I will link to that 831 00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:47,839 Speaker 1: in the show notes as well, just because I think 832 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:49,600 Speaker 1: that could be a very cool thing for people to 833 00:41:49,719 --> 00:41:53,080 Speaker 1: check out. Awesome, thanks so much for having me. Thank you. 834 00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:59,040 Speaker 1: So you can see we had lots of feelings about 835 00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:01,960 Speaker 1: Black Panther, and I know many of you do too. 836 00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:04,840 Speaker 1: Make sure to share your thoughts with us about the 837 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:09,200 Speaker 1: episode on social media using the hashtag tb G in 838 00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:12,920 Speaker 1: session and make sure to tag our accounts. You can 839 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:16,200 Speaker 1: find us at Twitter at Therapy for the Number four 840 00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:18,880 Speaker 1: B Girls, and you can find us on Instagram and 841 00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:22,640 Speaker 1: Facebook at Therapy for Black Girls. Make sure to check 842 00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:25,200 Speaker 1: out the show notes at Therapy for Black Girls dot 843 00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:29,080 Speaker 1: com slash Session forty seven for links to the articles 844 00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:33,600 Speaker 1: I mentioned, as well as more information about Mercedes. If 845 00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:36,439 Speaker 1: you're looking for a therapist in your area, make sure 846 00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,360 Speaker 1: to check out the therapist directory, which can be found 847 00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:43,239 Speaker 1: at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash directory. And 848 00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,200 Speaker 1: if you want to have a place to talk more 849 00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:48,960 Speaker 1: about this episode, past episodes, or just to chat about 850 00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:51,600 Speaker 1: topics that are important to you, come on over and 851 00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:54,640 Speaker 1: join us in the Thrive Tribe, which is our Facebook community. 852 00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:57,960 Speaker 1: You can request to join at Therapy for Black Girls 853 00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:02,439 Speaker 1: dot com slash Tribe. Please continue to share your love 854 00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:05,480 Speaker 1: for the podcast by sharing it in your instant stories 855 00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:09,120 Speaker 1: on Twitter and by texting those who you think should 856 00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:12,520 Speaker 1: also check it out. If you listen on Apple Podcast, 857 00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:16,600 Speaker 1: please also consider leaving us a review. Thank you so 858 00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:19,800 Speaker 1: much again for joining me this week. I'm looking forward 859 00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:22,799 Speaker 1: to continue in this conversation with you all real soon 860 00:43:23,400 --> 00:44:08,880 Speaker 1: take good care, par Hotoral, p oftor