Speaker 1: So Susan and I were on a walk as you
Speaker 1: do every day every day, twice a day usually, but
Speaker 1: we might we might not be on the same walk
Speaker 1: twice a day because I walk the dog usually in
Speaker 1: the morning, and then we do the walk later at night.
Speaker 2: But as as we do, questions pop up. Okay, and
Speaker 2: so I got another walking with Sue and sammy question
Speaker 2: for you. Okay, I'll ask the question that I'll answer
Speaker 2: the question for myself to give you both time to
Speaker 2: come up with your answers. So we're walking down the
Speaker 2: street and I walk by a beautiful plant and it's
Speaker 2: one of my favorite smells in the world, which led
Speaker 2: to Top five Smells in Your Life.
Speaker 3: Hops five Smells. So here we go and Wilfredell's hand.
Speaker 2: Exactly so, in no particular order, the plant I walk
Speaker 2: by night jasmine, absolutely, Oh, I love it.
Speaker 3: I love it so much. My cologne bread, fresh bread
Speaker 3: being baked.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, that's a good one.
Speaker 2: Susan makes this amazing oatmeal that are granola that makes
Speaker 2: our entire house smell like oats and cinnamon and honey.
Speaker 2: It's incredible. And then good old fashioned gasoline.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah.
Speaker 2: Are some of my top five smells, so I throw
Speaker 2: it back to you people loves Gasol's not.
Speaker 3: Great for you, man, He's like, hang home. But I
Speaker 3: like smell.
Speaker 6: I literally insert this smell so we know to stay
Speaker 6: away from this stuff.
Speaker 3: So either one of you throwing it out there. What
Speaker 3: are some of your favorite smells? Books?
Speaker 6: Like a library, like you know, which I talked about
Speaker 6: on this is actually like there's a vanilla smell that
Speaker 6: comes out.
Speaker 3: Of old books from the glue they used to bind.
Speaker 3: So books.
Speaker 6: I have a campfire, and I have a I have
Speaker 6: a candle that's called a Knight in the woods. It's
Speaker 6: just like it's got a couple of different tree flavors
Speaker 6: in it, but it's mostly mostly just smells like campfire.
Speaker 3: It's so yeah, And I.
Speaker 6: Guess coffee, oh, just like knowing yeah. And then probably vanilla,
Speaker 6: which is a little up there with you know, kind
Speaker 6: of the same the same thing as books. But yeah,
Speaker 6: I like a nice distant vanilla, not like too strong,
Speaker 6: not like overdone, but like when you know that there's
Speaker 6: like a nice vanilla flavor in the air.
Speaker 3: Gosh, what a bread is a good one? Man, I've
Speaker 3: never thought about it, but bread is a smell.
Speaker 2: Bread like you walk into a place like a bakery
Speaker 2: where they're just baking bread.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I just want to wrap myself up in it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so good.
Speaker 5: Danielle cool water cologne Cool, I've never even heard of that.
Speaker 5: What is what from the nineties? It's it is boyfriend
Speaker 5: smell of every high school boy of the nineties, and
Speaker 5: it takes me right back to Michael Goldman.
Speaker 3: Like the same thing with old spice.
Speaker 4: That's so funny. Old spice will know.
Speaker 3: But it's date night, Pickles is coming out. Let's put
Speaker 3: on the old spice, old spy, She says, the same thing.
Speaker 3: It like smells like high.
Speaker 5: School, high school boyfriends, high school boyfriends. I love water
Speaker 5: clone similarly to the gasoline. When I was a kid,
Speaker 5: I really love the smell of gasoline. But now like
Speaker 5: the markers, like the smell of like a those like smell.
Speaker 3: Deeply and you wake up thirty seconds later.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that smell.
Speaker 5: I think like anything pine like Christmas, the smell of Christmas. Yes,
Speaker 5: something piney tree, Yeah, Christmas smell.
Speaker 3: I totally agree.
Speaker 5: Bread is really good, but also I'd like to throw
Speaker 5: it in the mix of the smell of bacon, bacon cooking.
Speaker 5: You know, like the smell of breakfast. There's there's something
Speaker 5: about the mix of coffee toast bacon that like, I
Speaker 5: just call it diner smell of diner diner.
Speaker 6: If there was a candle that was diner candle, that
Speaker 6: wouldn't be a bad call.
Speaker 5: It's a great idea. We could we could have a chubby,
Speaker 5: chubby candle if I could bottle the smell. The stinky
Speaker 5: smell of my children's feet right now, really pre peubescent, yeah,
Speaker 5: stinky kid feet.
Speaker 6: I'm telling you all that, like loving your kids smells,
Speaker 6: are not being bothered by your kid smells is gone by?
Speaker 5: I know by not actually I know.
Speaker 6: I was like suddenly I did not want Indy to
Speaker 6: be anywhere like yes, until then I was like no,
Speaker 6: it's fine. You get used to it and you deal
Speaker 6: with or you fall in love with it or whatever.
Speaker 6: But now it's like like, literally anytime he smells, I'm like, dude,
Speaker 6: figure this out, I know, because it's just what is
Speaker 6: it about the stinky feet?
Speaker 3: What does it even smell?
Speaker 4: Like?
Speaker 3: Can you relate it to anything?
Speaker 6: It's just human intimacy, man, It's just being close to
Speaker 6: somebody that you love so much that you're yeah, I
Speaker 6: don't know.
Speaker 5: I mean, honestly, Adler's farts when he was a baby,
Speaker 5: I was like, these are delicious, these are this is
Speaker 5: smell like India.
Speaker 3: The top of India's head was like one of my
Speaker 3: you know, because.
Speaker 6: It's just like these weird because it's you're never that
Speaker 6: close with another human and the pheromones it's your own.
Speaker 5: Like I could if they lined twenty kids up, I'd
Speaker 5: be able to pick out which one was Addler by
Speaker 5: the smell of his little feet, right.
Speaker 6: And you know, it's it's chemical and biological because like
Speaker 6: if I was ever around another kid like this is
Speaker 6: I'm going to vomit, Like I cannot be in this.
Speaker 6: But my kid, I was like totally, I never have
Speaker 6: a problem with any of it, Like it's totally.
Speaker 5: So yeah, that would have to be online. Just Aller
Speaker 5: and Keaton's stinky feet just.
Speaker 3: Dipping cool water.
Speaker 2: I'd like to give I'd like to give honorable mention
Speaker 2: to mushrooms, onions, and.
Speaker 3: Garlic cook Oh yeah, great comedy.
Speaker 6: Maybe the real question should remove all food considered.
Speaker 3: We're talking about food.
Speaker 6: It's like just exactly, yeah, you can never do so
Speaker 6: I feel like it maybe maybe an addendum should be
Speaker 6: that it's only non food, so then.
Speaker 2: If I have to take bread off the list, it
Speaker 2: would instantly be trumped by W D.
Speaker 6: Forty oh oh sawdust cut sawdust like.
Speaker 2: Hey yeah, freshly cut hay is another one that.
Speaker 4: I really like so much.
Speaker 5: Food. I don't like that. And you know what I
Speaker 5: don't like. A smell I don't like. I don't like
Speaker 5: that smell of rain on the asphalt that some people love,
Speaker 5: you know, people like disprocusting. You know what else I
Speaker 5: don't like the people like.
Speaker 6: I don't know the bottom five smells Top five cars
Speaker 6: like new car.
Speaker 5: Smell, Get it out of here, the wave that smell.
Speaker 3: Out, My god, I love new car smell.
Speaker 5: Replace it with my kid's stinky feet.
Speaker 3: This is stinky feet teenage boy car smell.
Speaker 5: And I did know teenage. I think by teenage i'll
Speaker 5: be over it. I will not like it. It's something
Speaker 5: about the fact.
Speaker 3: That they cool. He smells like starburst and cool water.
Speaker 6: You don't haven't smelled since the nineties c K one ladies,
Speaker 6: I still probably like that.
Speaker 5: Girls wore that all through the nineties, and the boys
Speaker 5: were all K one.
Speaker 4: You car.
Speaker 6: Like of all of the perfumes and colognes and stuff,
Speaker 6: shaving cream barbasol shaving cream. And I don't use it
Speaker 6: that much because I don't know now I should.
Speaker 3: But yeah, but I love that smell.
Speaker 4: Yeah that's a good one.
Speaker 3: Good Smeuth.
Speaker 5: Welcome to Bobby Turr. I'm Danielle Fishel, I'm right or Strong,
Speaker 5: and I'm Will Fordell was like, what are we supposed
Speaker 5: to do.
Speaker 4: The show?
Speaker 5: That's in our endless attempt to recreate every season's writer's room,
Speaker 5: we have been able to connect with so many men
Speaker 5: and women who helped craft the show right at its
Speaker 5: heart on every page of its script, whether they were
Speaker 5: there with us from the start, joined in the Michael
Speaker 5: exit or the Michael return, or maybe just contributed an
Speaker 5: episode from outside the staff. Some of our best podcasts
Speaker 5: have been with these incredible creatives, and this week is
Speaker 5: no different. He joined the show in season five, just
Speaker 5: barely sneaking in an episode at the end, the eventually
Speaker 5: prohibited tale of teen drinking if you can't be with
Speaker 5: the one you love quite and then then, after getting
Speaker 5: Corey and Sean blitzed, he wrote two in season six,
Speaker 5: including the recently recapped You're Married you're dead. So if
Speaker 5: you were wondering which writer liked messing with Corey and Tapanga,
Speaker 5: we found him. His middle initial H most likely stands
Speaker 5: for heartbreak. He'd write two in the final season, sticking
Speaker 5: around till the bitter end. But it was his prior
Speaker 5: work experience that is even more impressive, especially probably to
Speaker 5: Will Laverne and Shirley Bosom Buddies nine to five, Give
Speaker 5: me a Break, a different World, come Crash, Prince of
Speaker 5: bel Air, and Reba.
Speaker 1: Oh come on, and I'm talking about any of these
Speaker 1: in the day God.
Speaker 5: Also, he worked with a murderer, at least according to
Speaker 5: a civil suit. And so we are thrilled to welcome
Speaker 5: to Pod Meets World writer and producer Gary H. Miller. Yea,
Speaker 5: so good to see you.
Speaker 4: It's amazing to see you guys. So on the strike
Speaker 4: line and then yeah, I think it was twenty.
Speaker 5: Two years party.
Speaker 2: Actually no, Gary, you and I I don't know if
Speaker 2: you remember I ran to you at Target.
Speaker 4: You had a Target. We exchanged numbers, right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 4: we'll call each other.
Speaker 3: And that never never, that.
Speaker 4: Is saying that guy. But you know I would have
Speaker 4: loved to listen.
Speaker 5: So fun. Well we are so excited to talk to you.
Speaker 5: We know that you were an integral part of seasons
Speaker 5: five through seven, and we are excited to talk to
Speaker 5: you about that. But this is the first interview where
Speaker 5: we know, right off the bat we are nowhere near
Speaker 5: the most fascinating actors that you have worked with, because
Speaker 5: we know you worked on a show called First and
Speaker 5: Ten with O. J. Simpson. Oh my goodness, can you
Speaker 5: please tell us what that was like?
Speaker 4: You ready to rock the stats?
Speaker 5: Always you know us always always.
Speaker 4: Well, Okay, God, these are such long anecdotes, and I
Speaker 4: know we have limited time, and I certainly want to
Speaker 4: get to the drinking episode, but let's sit back and
Speaker 4: have a little drink and talk about mister Oja click
Speaker 4: backstory before I even mentioned it. Uh So, I used
Speaker 4: to be a school teacher in New York City. I
Speaker 4: taught school for eight years and I taught in the
Speaker 4: school in Queens and on my lunch hour I would jog,
Speaker 4: which included going across the Laguardi Airport was right near
Speaker 4: the school. And then one day I see him, O J. Simpson,
Speaker 4: who was like the biggest star you know from the
Speaker 4: Hurts com the America loved him and I saw him
Speaker 4: going to the terminal and you know, I'm a stupid
Speaker 4: person from Brooklyn Schoolowly School team tour and I said, oh,
Speaker 4: Jay oja, you know, like like a ten year old,
Speaker 4: and he looked at me. He gave me that OJ smile. Right.
Speaker 4: I ran back to school and into the teacher's room
Speaker 4: and I said, I just saw the juice, you know,
Speaker 4: And I was so excited. Yah. Well, now cut to
Speaker 4: some years later and I'm in now living out here
Speaker 4: with my youngest daughter who was born with the impairment.
Speaker 4: So we had taken it to a doctor in a
Speaker 4: building in Westwood, and we were waiting at the valet
Speaker 4: and there he was again, and like a ferrari pulls
Speaker 4: up and right before he gets in, he looks at
Speaker 4: me and says, is that your little girl? I said yeah.
Speaker 4: She says, she's so pretty, She's beautiful. I said thank you.
Speaker 4: I said, oh my god. Again O J. Simpson my
Speaker 4: second meeting. So then segue to I take over the
Speaker 4: show first and ten. It was kind of floundering, and
Speaker 4: I made it more realistic. I ate a big business, steroids,
Speaker 4: you know, real football stuff. I wrote O. J. Simpson
Speaker 4: into the show and we became kind of close. I
Speaker 4: used to watch Monday night football in his house. You
Speaker 4: watch it. The Heisman trophy is right over.
Speaker 5: There, and oh, my gosh, man.
Speaker 4: And we flew We spent the weekend in Kansas City together,
Speaker 4: the two of us. We went to see the Chiefs plane.
Speaker 4: The Chief played the Raiders, and we flew on the
Speaker 4: Raiders plane. And my god, We've got so many funny
Speaker 4: stories about that. How funny funny in hindsight. Right, I'll
Speaker 4: get there too. I'm talking real fash. We're in Kansas
Speaker 4: City and you know, everybody loves the guy. And we
Speaker 4: were in the marll one day and the father comes
Speaker 4: over his son, and the father's crying and he says,
Speaker 4: why is your boy crying? Why are you crying? Sir?
Speaker 4: He says, that's my boy. His name the boys he
Speaker 4: named Moji. This was America's. Yeah, we all know the story.
Speaker 4: And uh on a. On the flight back, I have
Speaker 4: hit the I was in the worst turbulence I had
Speaker 4: ever been into my And I'm talking. I'm on the
Speaker 4: plane with the Raiders, right, and they're getting their barf
Speaker 4: bigs right, two hundred and sixty pounds linemen and they're
Speaker 4: crossing themselves and it looks like we're going down because
Speaker 4: we're dropping like ten thousand feet. And I turned to
Speaker 4: look at OJ and he's just sitting there with a
Speaker 4: smile of this.
Speaker 6: Nothing's scary, the calm of a psychopathic.
Speaker 1: Exa.
Speaker 4: So here's a great you see, you got me started
Speaker 4: on this, So here's a great anecdote. So when first
Speaker 4: and ten they're negotiating, as you guys know about negotiations
Speaker 4: with actors, the producer comes to me. He says, look, Gary,
Speaker 4: we're having trouble OJ. We're not sure we can make
Speaker 4: this deal. Can you write him out of the show?
Speaker 4: I said, yes, I wrote him into the show. I
Speaker 4: guess I could write him out of the show, which
Speaker 4: wasn't I didn't like that idea. But then Oja comes
Speaker 4: to me by himself. He says, you think you could
Speaker 4: write a show like this for me, a different show?
Speaker 4: And I said, sure, so let me write gat. We'll
Speaker 4: make it. We'll make it a baseball show. And I
Speaker 4: went and I pitched it with him, and then we
Speaker 4: get a go on the pilot. It was easy to
Speaker 4: pitch over because I'm pitching and I don't even think
Speaker 4: the executive she's listening to me. She's just staring at OJ.
Speaker 4: And I'm thinking in my head, as you know, if
Speaker 4: you pitched. But he says, I'm going, well, I got
Speaker 4: to shift gears and got else and I finished, and
Speaker 4: I think this is awful. And she says, this is
Speaker 4: a project we must do. And so I get me
Speaker 4: elevator with OJ and I said, this is the easiest thing.
Speaker 4: I have a soul. I said, this is great. He says,
Speaker 4: that's good. A little while later, I get a call
Speaker 4: from his lawyer. His attorney skipped, and he says, listen
Speaker 4: to OJ. Would like co writing credit on the pilot. Oh,
Speaker 4: I said, oh really, I said, okay. I said, tell
Speaker 4: him he only has to work with me about two
Speaker 4: hours a day, and I'll do that. I'll do the
Speaker 4: brunt of it. I'll do most of it. He is no, no, no,
Speaker 4: you don't understand. He doesn't actually want to do He
Speaker 4: just wants co creating credit for the pilot. I said why.
Speaker 4: He said, because his mother would be very proud of
Speaker 4: him if he was in the writer's guild. I said,
Speaker 4: she'd be proud. He's in the Hall of Fame. Is
Speaker 4: proud enough of him?
Speaker 5: Is that not enough.
Speaker 4: The really so skip to the attorney says, look, you
Speaker 4: either agreed this, but this deal was done. It's going
Speaker 4: to blow up. I said, okay, I'll agree, but you
Speaker 4: tell this to Oj that I'll give him half writing
Speaker 4: credit on a script that I write. If he goes
Speaker 4: to the Canton Hall of Fame and tell them half
Speaker 4: that yard in his mind that I killed that deal.
Speaker 4: He then got a deal with NBC. They sent him
Speaker 4: to New York to be an on field reporter. I got.
Speaker 4: I got him a little going away gift. Was the
Speaker 4: last time I had talked to him. And then one
Speaker 4: day I was in Florida on vacation, playing golf, and
Speaker 4: I got the call from my friend saying, do you
Speaker 4: hear about Nicole Simpson? I said, I was on the
Speaker 4: golf course most of the day she was found dead.
Speaker 4: I said, oh no, this is before cell phones. I said,
Speaker 4: I don't have OJ's number. You got you gotta listen,
Speaker 4: you gotta get me OJ's number. I got to call
Speaker 4: call him and he said, no, you don't understand. They
Speaker 4: think he did it. And then it just got you know,
Speaker 4: as surreal as it could possibly be. Wow. Some time ago,
Speaker 4: I wrote an article for a mandatory magazine called OJ
Speaker 4: and Me, which is basically what I just told you,
Speaker 4: you know, in more terms. And uh, I mean I
Speaker 4: was subpoenaed for the the second trial also, so I
Speaker 4: wrote the article about this. What are telling you that?
Speaker 4: This woman in the comment says, how dare you associate
Speaker 4: with that murderer as a lady. This was before I
Speaker 4: knew he was a murderer. Yeah, exactly, yea murder And
Speaker 4: then anyway, there's my longer.
Speaker 3: Wow, we did not expect that.
Speaker 6: We were like, oh yeah, we talked on set a
Speaker 6: few times, and you know, that's incredible.
Speaker 4: And there's other stuff that I won't even go and
Speaker 4: it's got nothing to do about the horrific results of
Speaker 4: all that. But you know, just because when the lawyers
Speaker 4: were interviewing me as a witness, they wanted to know
Speaker 4: was the aggressive and all that? And I said, you
Speaker 4: know what, I was wrangling real football players. It was
Speaker 4: the least aggressive out of any of them. And I
Speaker 4: had John Tusak, who would break anything that came close
Speaker 4: to you. You know, I got it. John Tusack anecdotes too.
Speaker 4: But let's.
Speaker 5: Well, I want we want to talk to you about
Speaker 5: some of the other shows you worked on too, because
Speaker 5: you have truly written on some of TV's most iconic shows.
Speaker 5: I mean your first script being Laverne and Shirley, which
Speaker 5: is quite a debut. How did that become your first gig?
Speaker 4: We're going to need to make this a five part
Speaker 4: so at least I told you I was a school
Speaker 4: teacher in New York, hears in and not loving it,
Speaker 4: not loving the job, and not loving the pay, which
Speaker 4: is always low for teachers. Great, great contributors to our
Speaker 4: culture that they are. But so my wife said, hey,
Speaker 4: you're funny. Why don't you start writing scripts? What do
Speaker 4: I know about scripts? You know? But I went to
Speaker 4: the local library, took out a book, showed me the format,
Speaker 4: and I wrote a mass script. Right, I'll make a
Speaker 4: very long story shorter. I started writing spects for everything.
Speaker 4: I started sending letters. Remember no, no, no enginet, no
Speaker 4: way of contacting anybody. And if you guys, remember, if
Speaker 4: you're old enough to remember, you can't. You can't get
Speaker 4: into seeing anybody if you you know some kinds. Even
Speaker 4: if you are somebody, you can't get in. So I
Speaker 4: started writing letters, and I also started hanging out the
Speaker 4: improv in New York giving freak jokes to comics, and
Speaker 4: they let me know what producers were coming in from
Speaker 4: the West Coast. So it would be kind of like
Speaker 4: I wait outside the improv and when the producers are leaving,
Speaker 4: I'd run after them my script in my hand and
Speaker 4: like a BA time pass and a relay race get
Speaker 4: in their hands and they can't read this. You know,
Speaker 4: you got to sign a waiver. And one guy, Tom Patrick,
Speaker 4: he said, look, I'll send you a waives. Send me
Speaker 4: a script. I did. It was a mash. That was
Speaker 4: my first speck was a mash. He said, this is
Speaker 4: not bad. Get yourself an agent. So now I look
Speaker 4: up agent in the phone book, remember book, and I
Speaker 4: send her the script. She says, this is pretty good.
Speaker 4: I'm going to send it to the producer. So again
Speaker 4: I'm ignorant. I don't know anything about show business. I
Speaker 4: told my wife Karen, I said, I think we're going
Speaker 4: to Hollywood.
Speaker 3: Because sold our home.
Speaker 4: And yeah, by this time we were we had moved
Speaker 4: way away, out away from New York in western New Jersey.
Speaker 4: Were living in the woods and the mailboxes across the
Speaker 4: road and I go every day for the for the
Speaker 4: letter of saying you know, come come to Hollywood.
Speaker 3: Oh wait, I have to ask, do you remember what
Speaker 3: your mash was about? Do you remember the spec?
Speaker 4: The title was called Mistress Fever. Okay, it was about
Speaker 4: Frank's wife was coming for a visit and whether it's
Speaker 4: you know, and they didn't know what to do with
Speaker 4: what was the miss uh? What was? Yeah? And so
Speaker 4: they they concocted that she had some kind of illness
Speaker 4: and they try to keep her away from the wife.
Speaker 4: And I remember it. I was great, it's pretty mediocre.
Speaker 4: Uh so uh. I then got very frustrated. Uh. I
Speaker 4: start churning out spec scripts for threes Company, Welcome Back
Speaker 4: to uh, Barney Miller, all the shows of that day, Yeah,
Speaker 4: with no results in getting very disheartened, and I start
Speaker 4: writing letters Fred Silvan ABC. He said, we need new blood,
Speaker 4: we need new writer. I said, well, you need to writers.
Speaker 4: I'm the guy for you, right, send it out, Fred Silvan, Hollywood, California.
Speaker 4: And they must get ten thousand unsolicited scripts and letters.
Speaker 4: One day, God calls me from ABC. He said, I
Speaker 4: don't know why Fred wants me to do this, because
Speaker 4: he's not he's leaving, he's going to MBC. But he
Speaker 4: wants you to write a script for la Verna Surely
Speaker 4: or Happy Days. Those are our two big shows, and
Speaker 4: we'll see that the producers read it, says okay. So
Speaker 4: I write ola Verna Surely and send it in and
Speaker 4: then I start writing and I get nothing. Nothing six
Speaker 4: months ago. By now, I go to that mailbox and
Speaker 4: the mailbox says, leave me longer. Stop. So I start
Speaker 4: writing letters to Gary Marshall. I'm funny, and I start
Speaker 4: writing funny letters and okay, it's another deep dour. So
Speaker 4: I mentioned that my daughter was born with impairment, and
Speaker 4: I was very despondent. At this time. She was an infant.
Speaker 4: I was holding her in my arms and she had seizures.
Speaker 4: That was quite a problem. I'm holding her in my arms.
Speaker 4: Get this. You couldn't write it. I'm watching Laverne and Sheryold.
Speaker 4: It's a Tuesday night, right, she said, in my arms.
Speaker 4: She's having a seizure. We called the doctor and he says, look,
Speaker 4: if she has another seizure, you got to bring it
Speaker 4: into the hospital tomorrow. Okay. And I go off to
Speaker 4: work in New York, which is sixty miles away, and
Speaker 4: all day I'm expecting the call from my wife to
Speaker 4: say the baby had a seizure. You got to come
Speaker 4: to the hospital. So the assistant principal comes into the gym.
Speaker 4: I had a gin full of one hundred maniac kids
Speaker 4: running around, and she says, mister Miller, it's a call
Speaker 4: for you. I said, I know, I know, you know,
Speaker 4: and I you know, sombrely walked to get the phone,
Speaker 4: thickets my wife and it's Gary Marshall's office.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, telling.
Speaker 4: Me they want me to come be a writer. Wow.
Speaker 3: They called your school. Gary Marshall's office called your school.
Speaker 7: Well yeah, oh wow, wow, so did you did you
Speaker 7: then go to the set of Laverne and Shirley, which
Speaker 7: is arguably one of the most famous and contentious sets
Speaker 7: in the history of Hollywood.
Speaker 4: I didn't know what to do. I mean, I knew
Speaker 4: I had to go now, mind you, civil servant, eight
Speaker 4: years in the system, and I was known as crazy
Speaker 4: mister Miller because I was always be writing whenever I could,
Speaker 4: you know, and they say, what are you doing? I said, well,
Speaker 4: one day I'm gonna make it, you know that kind
Speaker 4: of stuff. And when it happened, it was, like, you know,
Speaker 4: pretty unbelievable and I remember one teacher, Charlie rebellion. He
Speaker 4: stops me in the whole. Now, mind you, this is
Speaker 4: back in the seventh These and kids didn't just pass
Speaker 4: from one cliss together. You took your life in your
Speaker 4: hands if you were in the hallway during Yeah, and
Speaker 4: and so Charlie grabs me. He says, Garry that eight
Speaker 4: years in the system, you can retire in nine more years.
Speaker 4: What are you doing, it, said Charlie, I'm going to
Speaker 4: be working on the number one show in all of television.
Speaker 5: Yeah right, Oh, oh my gosh, did your daughter have
Speaker 5: another seizure that day? Did Did she also end up
Speaker 5: at the hospital or no?
Speaker 4: No, no, oh thank god she's still to this day.
Speaker 4: I mean, my daughter is jack when you guys know.
Speaker 5: I know, I know, I just wanted it that day.
Speaker 5: I needed that story to wrap up. Are you expecting
Speaker 5: that phone call? You didn't get that phone call that day.
Speaker 4: So you're going to talk about ing and gang whatever
Speaker 4: it is. So it was tempered, you know, because there
Speaker 4: was still issue with our child, you know, which is
Speaker 4: always issue but a lot of us deal with, you know,
Speaker 4: personal issues. But that story and so you know, years
Speaker 4: later I said to one of the supervising producers at
Speaker 4: the time, who became a good friend of mine, of
Speaker 4: Phil Mischkin. I said, how did I get hired? All
Speaker 4: these writers in our city, Los Angeles, A vying to
Speaker 4: be the next writer on vern S Shirley? Why did
Speaker 4: he hire me? And Gary Marshall said, give me the
Speaker 4: school teacher who writes me to funny letters.
Speaker 5: Wow, didn't make a reference to the script, right, letters right?
Speaker 4: And every time I saw Gary, and I did see him,
Speaker 4: we didn't develop any kind of relationship, but I would
Speaker 4: see him from time to time in the town and
Speaker 4: every time I'd say to thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 4: And as I got later into my career, I would say,
Speaker 4: I think exactly.
Speaker 5: Another show we wanted to talk to you about was
Speaker 5: Bosom Buddies. It has come up before on this podcast
Speaker 5: in regards to just being one of the perfect Tom Hanks,
Speaker 5: perfect sitcom acting. Did you get to work with him
Speaker 5: directly at all when he was that green?
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, oh yeah to it. Look, let's not give
Speaker 4: Peter a short shrift. These two were great. These two
Speaker 4: were great together. It's not sad Peter went on to
Speaker 4: have a good career, but he kind of became a
Speaker 4: little bit of a joke because one guy's Tom Hanks,
Speaker 4: one Boot's buddies becomes Tom Hanks, and the other becomes
Speaker 4: Peter Scaur and I certainly have different types of careers,
Speaker 4: but they were great together. They were a lot of
Speaker 4: those you guys, when the stuff hit the stage, they
Speaker 4: made it better. This was really impressed me. You know,
Speaker 4: I would write something and we would write something as writers,
Speaker 4: and these guys just took it to another level. And
Speaker 4: it's a great feeling when that happens, because you know
Speaker 4: a lot of times it doesn't. A lot of times
Speaker 4: it goes the other way. And they were terrific. And
Speaker 4: you know, they they were new, they they were so fresh,
Speaker 4: they were so young, but he knew them. You know.
Speaker 4: Tom and I we had a Bruce Springsteen relationship and
Speaker 4: that we were both crazy fans. I mean Bruce Springsteen. Uh.
Speaker 4: And I used to have the old morel called cassette
Speaker 4: recorder and Tom would come into my office to listen
Speaker 4: to my Springsteen tapes. Right, And we used to have
Speaker 4: this thing where there's a song called Jungle In by
Speaker 4: Bruce Springsteen and there's a certain lyric and Tom and
Speaker 4: I used to see who could say this lyric the quickest,
Speaker 4: and the lyric is I'll probably budge it befoot girls
Speaker 4: sitting on the hood of the Dodge, drinking warm beer
Speaker 4: in summer night's rain, you know, and we try to
Speaker 4: say it faster than the other. So you know, lo
Speaker 4: and behold. He goes on to become one of Bruce
Speaker 4: Springsteen's best friends. I see him on a yacht with
Speaker 4: Bruce Springsteen and everybody else, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4: And I'm waiting online for ten hours to get on
Speaker 4: the book. But Tom, when ABC let them go, you know,
Speaker 4: we only let we were only offer to sea.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: That was one of the shows that was criminally canceled earlier.
Speaker 4: Yeah, canceled over today to have a tough time. I mean,
Speaker 4: guys dressing and drinking, Ye're gonna do that. But we
Speaker 4: knew we were funny, and we were hit funny. We
Speaker 4: were referenced funny, you know what I mean. We had
Speaker 4: a run where we wrentioned somebody in the script and
Speaker 4: they would die for some reason next week or something
Speaker 4: like that. But we really prided ourselves on being very hip,
Speaker 4: and to this day we still have a kind of
Speaker 4: a cult audience in one of them, and Peter, I mean,
Speaker 4: you know Peter. When I was consulting producer on Riba,
Speaker 4: there was a part for Peter, and I made sure
Speaker 4: that Peter got it. So Peter did a Riba and uh,
Speaker 4: he was in the same scene with my son Max,
Speaker 4: who had dialogue invent scene. So it was really a
Speaker 4: true for me.
Speaker 5: You also made stops over at nine to five, give
Speaker 5: me a Break and a different World, and then you
Speaker 5: jumped over to a sitcom starring an award winning rapper
Speaker 5: who had never acted on TV before, with the Fresh
Speaker 5: Prince of bel Air. Did you like was it obvious
Speaker 5: right from the beginning he was going to be a
Speaker 5: sitcom star?
Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, you could, Yes, you can just see it.
Speaker 4: Although we had a very interesting relationship of the two seasons.
Speaker 5: That I was Ewan will Smith.
Speaker 4: When I took over the show, he kind of had
Speaker 4: his own way all the time, and I said, look,
Speaker 4: I'm not like that, I said, so you know he said,
Speaker 4: and I think he respected that. And I told them
Speaker 4: things like, look, you're telegraphing your joke because you don't
Speaker 4: you don't have confidence, and so you're touching the actor
Speaker 4: and the scene with you, right before the joke. It's
Speaker 4: a thing you do. How do you do that? You know?
Speaker 4: I know the joke is coming next. You should you
Speaker 4: know stuff like that. You know that we discussed. I
Speaker 4: made him sit and watch. He hated this, the old
Speaker 4: Sogeant Bilko series. You'll never get rich with Phil Silvis,
Speaker 4: I said, watch this guy. Watch this guy driving episode,
Speaker 4: no matter how flimsy the storyline is. It's like a
Speaker 4: moving train and he takes everybody on the train with
Speaker 4: him and you get to the end. I said, that's
Speaker 4: the kind of energy we need in twenty two minutes,
Speaker 4: because slow time in a twenty two minute show is deadly.
Speaker 4: It really not to say you can't have your moments right,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean? You just need and you
Speaker 4: know when you edit the show too, that's what you
Speaker 4: look for. Again, we're in a twenty two minute play beginning, middle,
Speaker 4: and end. I mean that's why so many of your
Speaker 4: discussions and your listeners discussions about well, what happened to
Speaker 4: this and what happened to that? And how can they
Speaker 4: leave this happen? Like what's happen? But as you know,
Speaker 4: the process is hard and half hours. Well, I don't
Speaker 4: know why we call him half hours. The twenty two
Speaker 4: minutes are harder than hours. And if you think about it,
Speaker 4: the big, the big great sitcoms that did their finales
Speaker 4: is an hour. It kind of bombed.
Speaker 8: Yeah, well the Seinfeld hour wasn't good. I think the
Speaker 8: Cheers hour wasn't good. So what happens when I take
Speaker 8: over Fresh Prince? They told me we want you to
Speaker 8: write an hour opening season show.
Speaker 4: Wha man, right? What I did? And you know, it
Speaker 4: was pretty good and had the funniest scene I've ever
Speaker 4: written was in that. It was called the bungee jump scene,
Speaker 4: and that seemed to work. But yeah, I can tell
Speaker 4: you a lot about Fresh Prince about will I don't know,
Speaker 4: I might need an attorney.
Speaker 5: We don't want you to need an attorney, that's for sure.
Speaker 5: And then you enter the Boy Meets World universe in
Speaker 5: season five with I mean, which might is a little
Speaker 5: bit of a step down from everything else you had
Speaker 5: been working on. How did you end up in the
Speaker 5: Boy Meets World universe?
Speaker 4: Well? Odd, it was odd, I mean I did. I
Speaker 4: was showing the Fresh Prince of Bellia just I guess
Speaker 4: the same time you guys were on the air right
Speaker 4: ninety four, You're on the air, right, so we were
Speaker 4: on concurrently and you know, that's got its clout. And
Speaker 4: then I went from there. I had an overall deal
Speaker 4: at twentieth and and then I was contacted by an
Speaker 4: executive at Disney, David Himmelfarm.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you remember the name of sor and.
Speaker 4: I don't remember how a conversation went, but it was
Speaker 4: in the fifth season when there was a little bit
Speaker 4: of turmoil. There was a change in the guard that
Speaker 4: eventually happened, of course, as you know, and that's when
Speaker 4: they signed me in as a consulting producer. So I
Speaker 4: came aboard in the fifth season kind of just after
Speaker 4: the fifth season that started, and you know, Michael hadn't
Speaker 4: been there yet, and then he took over shortly after
Speaker 4: I got there, and then that adjustment had to be
Speaker 4: made in terms of dealing with Michael Jacobs. And I
Speaker 4: found the staff really nice, great friends. We were close knit.
Speaker 4: I met friends that I still have to this day.
Speaker 4: Jeff Minel is my closest friend. You know, what a
Speaker 4: wonderful guy he is. I became terrific friends with Bob Tishler,
Speaker 4: a great guy. We wound up writing together, but the
Speaker 4: last twenty years. We have a book on Amazon we
Speaker 4: wrote together, you Bo, Yeah, romantic comedy Cold Impossible. And
Speaker 4: when we lost him suddenly last springtime, it was devastating
Speaker 4: and I still feel his loss every day. He's such
Speaker 4: a great friend. But that's all boy meets world stuff,
Speaker 4: you know, Like I said, no things happen in life
Speaker 4: and you meet different people. And Alison Gibson she to
Speaker 4: work with ar on Riba, so you know, you know works.
Speaker 5: Yeah, those connections. You meet, meet with people and some
Speaker 5: of them are in your life forever.
Speaker 4: But it's interesting, Danielle that you mentioned, you know, it
Speaker 4: being a step down. It was different because most of
Speaker 4: the staff people in Bombie's world were you young, or
Speaker 4: they were kind of Michael disciples in a sense, you know.
Speaker 4: And so now suddenly Bob Tishla who was also a showrunner,
Speaker 4: and myself to show runners. Now we're on staff, you know,
Speaker 4: and possibly with different attitudes than mostly everybody else. Not
Speaker 4: that they we don't want to do good work, of course,
Speaker 4: that's always the goal, but you know, it was it
Speaker 4: was an interesting dynamic. Bob and I kind of had
Speaker 4: a little bit of spartico there how to deal with
Speaker 4: with things right. Wow. M hm.
Speaker 5: So had you seen Boy Meets World before you became
Speaker 5: a consulting producer on it? Had you did they give
Speaker 5: you VHS tapes to help you prep? Did they sell
Speaker 5: you VHS tapes of the show, because we got ours.
Speaker 4: They gave me drawings and I try.
Speaker 5: To okay a comic book aramatic perfect.
Speaker 4: Well, you know what, I don't remember what I usually
Speaker 4: do if I if I get hired on a show
Speaker 4: that I don't know about, or I from off for
Speaker 4: a show I don't know about it. You know, watch
Speaker 4: ten episodes, seven episodes of last season. I did that
Speaker 4: with a Different World too. I hadn't been watching a
Speaker 4: Different World and you kind of cram and you're watching
Speaker 4: and you get a feel for it. But yours is
Speaker 4: so different because you guys are growing up. You know,
Speaker 4: every year, it's different. You're different people that it's said to,
Speaker 4: different values, different objects of what you want to do,
Speaker 4: andationships change and all that. So it's a very interesting show.
Speaker 4: And I am very pleased with some of the episodes
Speaker 4: that I wrote for the show. Really, I think we
Speaker 4: can get to talk to it sometime later. Yeah, Chet
Speaker 4: Dying episode is one of my favorites.
Speaker 5: That we haven't gotten to that episode yet, so we
Speaker 5: have not seen it.
Speaker 3: Cast give rid of Blake, you can't, he's too good.
Speaker 5: So in your first season, season five, you write an
Speaker 5: episode late in the show order, the controversial and somewhat banned,
Speaker 5: if you can't be with the one you love? Do
Speaker 5: you remember the genesis of that very kind of adult theme?
Speaker 5: Was it your idea?
Speaker 4: Okay, here we go. First of all, I'm sorry we're
Speaker 4: all losing out on residuals on that episode. Right. Ironically,
Speaker 4: my first on air Laverne Shirley script that aired on
Speaker 4: television was called what Do You Do with a Drunken Salor?
Speaker 4: And it was about it was a kind of a
Speaker 4: serious Laverne and Shirley where her brother Bobby played by
Speaker 4: Ed Begley Jr. Comes home on leave and he's got
Speaker 4: a drinking problem. So it was in my pedigree through
Speaker 4: those kinds of stories. And I've also gravitated in my career.
Speaker 4: I've done some real what they call the special episode,
Speaker 4: some serious stuff, especially Different World. I did a racial
Speaker 4: violence episode will when I took over with Fresh Prince.
Speaker 4: I said, we joke about it him not having a father,
Speaker 4: let's bring his father back. We brought his.
Speaker 2: Father backs, like one of the most famous episodes.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Mareen, and so I kind of gravitate towards some
Speaker 4: serious themes. I figured that at Corey's age, young kid
Speaker 4: boy like that, being the feelings he had about the
Speaker 4: Panguin being you know, separated from her, would lead to
Speaker 4: some experimentation of the kind, especially since he was considered
Speaker 4: depressing and everybody was on his case and so on
Speaker 4: and so forth. So I can't exactly remember if it
Speaker 4: was my idea. It probably was because of my history
Speaker 4: with that, but I can tell you that this episode
Speaker 4: is a story of two acts acts acts. The first
Speaker 4: act it's pretty true to my draft. I have my draft.
Speaker 4: I love to send it to you. Second goes off
Speaker 4: into Michael Jacob's land. Let me give you an example. I
Speaker 4: listened to your your discussion. Will you're not in the
Speaker 4: episode now in my script, you're in three scenes and
Speaker 4: in both acts. And not only are you in both acts,
Speaker 4: you're in the climactic act with uh Sean and Jack
Speaker 4: and Corey in the apartment. Jack enlightens Sean about the predisposition,
Speaker 4: the genetical predisciplined Dad and how serious it is, and
Speaker 4: that he hit Jack's mother and that's what turns Sean.
Speaker 4: The girls aren't weren't even in that scene in my set.
Speaker 4: So the heat that I might take because Sean throws
Speaker 4: engines against the wall was never in my script. I
Speaker 4: wouldn't put it into my script, and I cringe every
Speaker 4: time I see it. You feel about it, but it
Speaker 4: upsets me because my name's on that script, you know.
Speaker 4: And there's a lot of shoving in that episode that
Speaker 4: wasn't in my draft, So I don't know where the
Speaker 4: pension for shoving people comes from. So that's one thing
Speaker 4: I certainly wanted to point out. The Other thing is
Speaker 4: that the family's more involved in promoting. There's a scene
Speaker 4: before Corey goes to the party where Alan basically says,
Speaker 4: you know you are depressing. Everybody does something about it,
Speaker 4: you know, like a phone, and that's that's when Corey
Speaker 4: goes and gets the alcohol and shows up. There's also
Speaker 4: another family scene after the cop car shows up, where
Speaker 4: Amy's worried they're out late and Alan says, don't don't
Speaker 4: worry that we told them to have finding's having fun.
Speaker 4: Let them be, and then they get the calls so,
Speaker 4: and then the second half goes from where it was.
Speaker 4: But also in the second halfter in my draft, I
Speaker 4: have Feeney being much more instrumental in helping Sean. Post
Speaker 4: to Sean, he gives him a card for doctor to
Speaker 4: call Doctor Kramer call him, he can help you with this,
Speaker 4: and then after Sean is enlightened by Jack, Sean eventually
Speaker 4: does go for help. And the last scene is I
Speaker 4: have it written. I look at the script some time later,
Speaker 4: not the next day. All those things about lock of this,
Speaker 4: why would he he's drunk one day. He's not drunk
Speaker 4: in that saying no, this is a passion. Yeah, it's
Speaker 4: real hard to show that, you know, if you could
Speaker 4: write it in the script right, unless you say sometime later. Yea.
Speaker 4: So those are some of the broad strokes about that episode.
Speaker 6: Wow, yeah, I remember our feeling was like this should
Speaker 6: have been a two parter, or you know, he's trying
Speaker 6: to cramp so much into it. Yeah, So it sounds
Speaker 6: like the Angela factor was like layered in after your
Speaker 6: draft and.
Speaker 3: Just just trying to do too much so much.
Speaker 4: Also, her reaction, I couldn't stand her reaction if I
Speaker 4: were writing that scene and you shoved, you would hear
Speaker 4: about it right there in the moment. She wouldn't, you know,
Speaker 4: slink away and and and cower and say late, I
Speaker 4: still love you. When you don't drink, she tells you
Speaker 4: often know, on certain terms is what she would do.
Speaker 4: So again, those are choices. I'm not blaming anybody. I'm
Speaker 4: just revealing the way what happened.
Speaker 2: Now, how much say in the room did you have
Speaker 2: if there was something that you know, from your original
Speaker 2: draft you felt very strongly about. Is that something that
Speaker 2: if you fought for it would stay in or was
Speaker 2: it kind of, hey, this is we're changing it, and
Speaker 2: that's just the way it is. I mean, we all
Speaker 2: know it's Michael Show at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: and he gets to do what he wants, and that's
Speaker 2: what one of the things you get when you're in
Speaker 2: the big chair is you just that's that's how it works.
Speaker 2: I mean, So, is it something that if you had
Speaker 2: gone in and really fought for it, it would have changed,
Speaker 2: or is it kind of like, no, this is this
Speaker 2: is where we're taking I don't remember.
Speaker 4: I certainly know the shoving scene really bothered me, and
Speaker 4: I don't recall if I expressed that or not I
Speaker 4: might have. I certainly never help myself back when I
Speaker 4: wanted to express myself. But as you said, it wasn't
Speaker 4: my show right at the show. I've been a show
Speaker 4: on it, so I know both sides of it. I
Speaker 4: know that side, I know this side, and I know
Speaker 4: the writer's side, and you know all the uh pressure
Speaker 4: you get from from executives and studios and all of
Speaker 4: that stuff. However, it bothered me, and obviously it didn't
Speaker 4: bother anybody else enough that because it stayed in and
Speaker 4: sometimes I wonder, I said, why wasn't there a network
Speaker 4: note about that? I mean, why why was that condoned? Right?
Speaker 4: Of course you couldn't. You'd have a hard time doing
Speaker 4: that scene today.
Speaker 5: Yeah, absolutely, I mean right right.
Speaker 4: How do you feel?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I remember.
Speaker 6: It all just felt too much like that that that
Speaker 6: that scene in particular, was like, oh, we're going to
Speaker 6: compress this revelation about his dad and you know, basically
Speaker 6: make Sean an angry, alcoholic, you know, abusive. I think
Speaker 6: the I guess for me, if you're going to do that,
Speaker 6: it just didn't never felt like the consequences were resolved
Speaker 6: in a way that empowered Angela. It was always like, oh,
Speaker 6: Angela getting hurt was a way for Sean to change
Speaker 6: and for him to come to a realization, as opposed
Speaker 6: for for it to be a moment of like, oh
Speaker 6: Sean needs you know, if you're going to hurt somebody,
Speaker 6: have her stand up for herself a little bit, or
Speaker 6: have her affect the change and Sean as opposed to
Speaker 6: just kind of being a prop.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 6: Unfortunately, Angela, especially at that point in the series, she
Speaker 6: didn't have much of a character.
Speaker 3: She didn't have much of a voice. I mean, now
Speaker 3: we're seeing in.
Speaker 6: The season six stuff there is you know, they've developed
Speaker 6: her and now Corey finally talks to her, for instance,
Speaker 6: But back then, you know, she was just kind of
Speaker 6: brought in. Her first couple episodes were great, but then
Speaker 6: I feel like the rest of season five she does
Speaker 6: not have enough of a presence. You know that it's
Speaker 6: not written to so yeah, so that bothers me, but I.
Speaker 4: Agree with you it should have been a more elaborate
Speaker 4: episode to you know, to two episodes, to say the least,
Speaker 4: because it kind of gives you know, I have an
Speaker 4: award Yere for the episode. So anytime you tackle something
Speaker 4: like that. Sometimes you'll get an award for it because
Speaker 4: there is some good stuff in that obviously, Yeah, but
Speaker 4: it gives it short shrift. It's just right, you know,
Speaker 4: and that's what's wrong. Sometimes its sitcom is one episode.
Speaker 4: Oh it wasn't as year cut off last week, and
Speaker 4: that was years back, right, right, Well, we got to
Speaker 4: carry these things through, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: Well, there was no streaming at the time, so weeks
Speaker 2: would go by, if not months would go by, you'd
Speaker 2: forget what happened.
Speaker 3: You know, hey, two seasons ago, Like.
Speaker 2: We always joke about mash where it's like, at one
Speaker 2: point everybody's wife was named Louise, and then there was
Speaker 2: change to Mildred, and Sean had sisters and a brother
Speaker 2: and this, and so when the idea of streaming didn't
Speaker 2: even exist, even the idea.
Speaker 3: Of we can watch these back to back to back
Speaker 3: to back to back, you're writing it and you kind
Speaker 3: of okay, well, I'm kind of forgetting some.
Speaker 2: Of the details of the stuff we did before, and
Speaker 2: you kind of move on with it for what you
Speaker 2: need that week. And now that we're streaming all the
Speaker 2: old shows, it's like.
Speaker 3: Wow, oh, okay, there's not a whole lot of consents and.
Speaker 5: Seeing some of these well, and when we interviewed when
Speaker 5: we had the bro Meats World guys on, and I
Speaker 5: remember being very feeling, very poignant when they pointed out
Speaker 5: that what it felt like to see the only woman
Speaker 5: of color on the show be the one treated in
Speaker 5: that way. Yeah, and how that comes across to the audience,
Speaker 5: and how that adds a layer to it that certainly
Speaker 5: I had never thought of, But hearing them say it
Speaker 5: was like, yeah, absolutely, what kind of a message does
Speaker 5: that send to the people watching? So I can see,
Speaker 5: of course why that would bother you. And it's very interesting.
Speaker 5: Thank you for providing that perspective for us too, because
Speaker 5: we have had you know, a lot of writers on
Speaker 5: and we've often talked about how the writer whose name
Speaker 5: is on the script, they are always almost like, oh, well,
Speaker 5: that really funny thing you're talking about, Oh that you
Speaker 5: don't give me all the credit for it. It was
Speaker 5: a group effort. But it also can happen in the
Speaker 5: reverse way, where your name is on a script and
Speaker 5: something is in there that you do not like, that
Speaker 5: you're not proud of, that you actually completely do not
Speaker 5: agree with, and yet people want to then give it
Speaker 5: to you and say, well, you're the one who wrote it,
Speaker 5: and we haven't really had that perspective on the show before.
Speaker 5: So thank you for one your honesty and telling us
Speaker 5: about that and you know, bringing that up for us
Speaker 5: because it's a perspective we have not experienced on the
Speaker 5: show before.
Speaker 4: Okay, thank you. Brubby's world Guy's name me. Yeah, and
Speaker 4: we had a really good time. And why what you're
Speaker 4: What they said about that moment with Angela really hits
Speaker 4: home with me again, Yeah, because part of what they
Speaker 4: said to me was, as two young black men, how
Speaker 4: a lot of the episodes I wrote, especially in a
Speaker 4: different world, really affected them and their families and their community.
Speaker 4: You know, thank me.
Speaker 5: Right in a positive way, Yeah, thank me for the
Speaker 5: messages in those episodes.
Speaker 4: And then you know, for them to think, what Gary,
Speaker 4: what is he doing to this platform? You know? So, yeah,
Speaker 4: you have no voice, and I guess this is kind
Speaker 4: of a voice, so a little bit of rebuttal right exactly.
Speaker 5: So then in season six, we just watched your episode,
Speaker 5: your script of that season, You're Married, You're Dead. I
Speaker 5: am assuming that that was maybe a script that had
Speaker 5: it been for anything other than for a Family show
Speaker 5: on Friday nights probably would have taken place in a
Speaker 5: strip club. Is that correct?
Speaker 4: That's exactly right, you know. And again I'm guilty, uh wrong,
Speaker 4: wrong arena for that show. But again, I mean, he's
Speaker 4: a college kid. I know these kids do, they go
Speaker 4: to strip club. So it was a strip club in
Speaker 4: my draft. It got changed. In fact, in my draft,
Speaker 4: I think it said the women are as scantily clad
Speaker 4: as network standards and practices will allow. Yeah, caviat I
Speaker 4: put in there, and you know, I got changed at
Speaker 4: club club odges and that by the end that girls
Speaker 4: were dressing like nuns. It wasn't It was.
Speaker 3: Like, who do is light right exactly?
Speaker 4: You talk about the change in an episode. Now, I'm
Speaker 4: not defending an episode, so not like I would defend
Speaker 4: the Drinking Show or anything else. I know, it's kind
Speaker 4: of fun. But the whole Eric Jack Rachel storyline was
Speaker 4: completely known my script. They were vying for her attention,
Speaker 4: and they hired a College of buff college guy to
Speaker 4: woo Rachel because their their theory was she's more susceptible
Speaker 4: on the rebound. So we get this cut of dumper
Speaker 4: and then one of us makes in that was that storyline,
Speaker 4: how they how they wound up in club. I don't remember.
Speaker 6: That's fine because I actually really like the idea of
Speaker 6: having the sort of male version of eye Candy coming
Speaker 6: in because then you have like a storyline, yeah you have,
Speaker 6: and how they would think that, that's how she would
Speaker 6: think by you know, we're just gonna.
Speaker 5: Here's a question. Did you create the tushy dance?
Speaker 4: You know, I watched the episode and I laughed, I said,
Speaker 4: this is a cute episode. You know. Sometimes we'll get
Speaker 4: you know, too analytical, too serious, and forget what we're
Speaker 4: doing here. You know. Yeah, and I and I listened
Speaker 4: to you guys enough to know there's a lot of
Speaker 4: times when the comedy is suspect in a sense, but
Speaker 4: you know it is common. You do need to do
Speaker 4: that otherwise you have dramas so bal it's always hard
Speaker 4: to do the balance. You know, you have a special episode.
Speaker 3: And again, yeah, we struggle with that same thing.
Speaker 2: We struggle with try to not sometimes we take it
Speaker 2: too seriously. We know we take it too seriously, but
Speaker 2: then you know, it's what we're doing, is we're analyzing
Speaker 2: a show. That's the point of kind of what we're doing.
Speaker 5: We also have said several times we do not reference
Speaker 5: enough how unbelievably difficult it is to churn out twenty
Speaker 5: two scripts or sometimes twenty four scripts at the breakneck
Speaker 5: speed that you guys are doing it, and receiving notes
Speaker 5: from network and standards and practices and your actors, who
Speaker 5: are you know, having opinions about things like you know,
Speaker 5: you're not going to please everybody, and not every one
Speaker 5: of them is going to be, oh wow, love this
Speaker 5: a plus. You know, sometimes you're just going to have
Speaker 5: an episode that exists and that is going to be
Speaker 5: what it is.
Speaker 2: Sometimes Henry Winkler is literally jumping the shark.
Speaker 4: Listen, and you don't know where the notes are coming from. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and again, I'll talk at the school. I got nothing
Speaker 4: to lose anymore. When we went on Rieba and by
Speaker 4: the way, a little history on Riva. Alison was writing
Speaker 4: that pilot.
Speaker 5: While she was on our show as Gibson.
Speaker 4: Alice Gibson. We became friends. She was in the office
Speaker 4: next to me and she was telling me about it,
Speaker 4: and then when she went to pilot on it, I
Speaker 4: did a little work with her on it. She made
Speaker 4: a little punch and stuff like that, so I worked
Speaker 4: with her, and then she eventually hired me on the show.
Speaker 4: And Reba McIntyre's husband at the time was Narvel Blackstock.
Speaker 4: If you want to create a villain's name, there is.
Speaker 3: Trying to steal the sun.
Speaker 4: He used to be I think the keyboard player in
Speaker 4: a band or the bass player, right, but no more.
Speaker 4: Now he's her husband, and he's the first guy to
Speaker 4: give notes after a table ry wow. And and me,
Speaker 4: as a veteran writer, been to all the wars since
Speaker 4: nineteen seventy nine. I said, we're taking notes from the
Speaker 4: keyboard time scripts. And then way at the end, when
Speaker 4: it got really ugly, they called me in for a
Speaker 4: meeting and Narvel black Socks said to me, you know
Speaker 4: that episode of football episode that we all hate something.
Speaker 4: I said yeah. He said, well, I can't believe you
Speaker 4: could go home and sleep at night and know my
Speaker 4: wife had to stay on stage and say that that stuff,
Speaker 4: that embarrassing stuff like that. And I said, Narvel, let
Speaker 4: me explain something to you. It wasn't a good episode.
Speaker 4: But sometimes we spend more time on a lousy episode
Speaker 4: than we do in a good episode because we can't
Speaker 4: find it, you know. So it's painstaking and it doesn't
Speaker 4: work that well. But getting back to what you mentioned about,
Speaker 4: when you're doing twenty two a season, you're going to
Speaker 4: have some clunkers. Everybody's got to understand that, and that's
Speaker 4: part of the deal. That's part of the experience.
Speaker 3: And that's for every show in the history of Hollywood.
Speaker 2: There's no sense like it's like finding a boxer who's
Speaker 2: fought for twelve years and never lost.
Speaker 3: It doesn't exist.
Speaker 2: You have good episodes and bad episodes, and your favorite
Speaker 2: show in the history of the world, whatever it is,
Speaker 2: has had bad episodes too, So it's just the way
Speaker 2: it works.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So no spoilers. We already heard a spoiler about
Speaker 5: Chet dying because well might it.
Speaker 4: That was on TV.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but we just.
Speaker 5: Haven't watched it since it was on It's a spoiler
Speaker 5: for us because we have not seen it since the nineties.
Speaker 5: Writers never watched it, so this it will be writers
Speaker 5: first time seeing it. It'll be Will and I only
Speaker 5: are second time seeing it ever.
Speaker 4: Give I can give you a little tease for it.
Speaker 5: Okay, Okay, it's called Will have a Good Time then, right, Okay.
Speaker 4: A lot of a lot of my scripts, I'll use
Speaker 4: song lyrics. That's from the.
Speaker 5: Best song Big.
Speaker 4: Harry Chapman fan and have a lot of her lyrics. Actually,
Speaker 4: the alcohol shows was from Crosby Stow's Nash and Young
Speaker 4: loved the one You're with. Yeah, so I told this
Speaker 4: to you right on the strike line. Maybe you don't recall.
Speaker 4: We'll remember at the table read for the for the
Speaker 4: check dying show writer wasn't there. He couldn't make it.
Speaker 4: He was sick for some reason. He wasn't at the table,
Speaker 4: and Matt Nelson read write his part. And I love
Speaker 4: Matt Nelson, great guy, rest in peace, but not right
Speaker 4: or strong? And and and the script tanked at the table.
Speaker 4: It did, And I knew this is a damn good script,
Speaker 4: you know, and said I was experienced enough to know
Speaker 4: that it was still a good script. And I didn't
Speaker 4: need ABC executives to tell me whether it's good or not.
Speaker 4: I know. And I said, it's it's not a good
Speaker 4: experience where you don't have the lead guy in the show.
Speaker 4: Not right exactly script. And so I'll leave it at
Speaker 4: that because I will save what Michael Jacobs said right
Speaker 4: after the read and in the room with everybody there.
Speaker 3: How's that for a TOI, Oh, yeah.
Speaker 4: He held up the script and said, I know what's
Speaker 4: wrong with this, and I can fix I was sitting
Speaker 4: right next to him and instead of saying, you know right,
Speaker 4: it couldn't be here today, So you know, so that's
Speaker 4: the kind of stuff that you know comes with the
Speaker 4: territory and write into your credit when we went up
Speaker 4: and started making changes, and you said to Michael, I
Speaker 4: really liked what was here before back. Yeah, and and
Speaker 4: again that's I think I wrote five episodes for the show,
Speaker 4: but that's by far my favorite. I think Rachel has
Speaker 4: a much more significant role as a person in that script,
Speaker 4: and she normally has, although she is still a sex object.
Speaker 4: That's that's the mantle that that we bear. But but anyway,
Speaker 4: that's what we can talk about that when we talk about.
Speaker 5: You mentioned that you you knew you have kind of
Speaker 5: reputation for writing these very kind of poignant, heavier Yeah.
Speaker 5: Did you recognize it, yeah, very special episodes. Did you
Speaker 5: recognize it at the time? And where do you think
Speaker 5: that comes from with you?
Speaker 4: I don't know because I really pride myself and this
Speaker 4: may sound egotistical and somewhat cocky, but I've always felt
Speaker 4: like I'm the funniest guy in any room I'm in
Speaker 4: uh huh, and I write real funny stuff. But at
Speaker 4: the same time I've been able to, you know, go
Speaker 4: into those areas again with the parameters of a sitcom
Speaker 4: and deal with really, really hard issues. A racial violence
Speaker 4: episode I wrote for Different World couldn't even air today
Speaker 4: because of what the content is, the things that are
Speaker 4: said that we don't say anymore, you know, And it
Speaker 4: was as controversial as an episode could be. I'm very
Speaker 4: proud of it. And there used to be a I
Speaker 4: think he was a doctor professor at Harvard or or Yale,
Speaker 4: doctor Alvin Grussan, and he basically was the spokesperson for
Speaker 4: the black community for want of a better description. And
Speaker 4: one script I wrote about, which is about a restricted
Speaker 4: country club, again a Different World, one of our characters
Speaker 4: was asked to join a white club and his son
Speaker 4: had a problem with it, and it was about tokenism
Speaker 4: and all that stuff, right, and he said, this is
Speaker 4: one of the hardest hitting episodes on race I've ever read.
Speaker 4: I hope it's well accepted. So that's the kind of
Speaker 4: thing that you know, I liked, But at the same time,
Speaker 4: I go work right, want of those accolades, but you know,
Speaker 4: they're good to be good, and they're satisfying, and sometimes
Speaker 4: they're more meaningful than writing a great joke. Yeah, well,
Speaker 4: a great joke, a great joe.
Speaker 5: What do you think, speak of jokes? What do you
Speaker 5: think gives you more satisfaction getting a laugh from the
Speaker 5: audience or getting a laugh from the writer's room.
Speaker 4: Oh, the audience were too beat up in the writer's room.
Speaker 4: There's nothing coming out of the writer's room that you
Speaker 4: can really apply to anything else. It's we're all worn out.
Speaker 4: I think you know. There's there's other stuff going on
Speaker 4: in the writer's room. There's this competition. There's joke anger,
Speaker 4: but a great joke when you write a great line.
Speaker 4: I love great lines. I thought I had written down
Speaker 4: something that Eric said in the episode that he's not in.
Speaker 5: From your script, that he wasn't But.
Speaker 4: You know, I don't seem to have it.
Speaker 3: I can't wait to read that draft though.
Speaker 4: You can see what I'm talking about. We can rename
Speaker 4: it a Tale of two Acts, because.
Speaker 5: We would love that.
Speaker 4: It certainly is so.
Speaker 2: I have I have a question for you, then, with
Speaker 2: all the work you've done, is there and not saying
Speaker 2: to take anything away from any room you've been in.
Speaker 2: But when you look back, what do you think was
Speaker 2: the funniest writer's room you've ever been involved in.
Speaker 4: I love the Boy Meets World people I work with,
Speaker 4: I really do, not saying that because it's your show,
Speaker 4: but I think Bliz and Buddies writers room was so tough.
Speaker 4: Guys would get up and cry. I mean we were
Speaker 4: so brutal with each other. But there was just ah
Speaker 4: with some magical comedy coming at it. Yeah, and I
Speaker 4: had to do. Chris Thompson created it and Chris has
Speaker 4: gone too. He was a dear friend of mine and uh,
Speaker 4: you know he sets the tone for what the show
Speaker 4: show should be. Uh, but Boy Meets World is close.
Speaker 4: I had a good room on a fresh print, a
Speaker 4: different world was a little bit more serious. Give me
Speaker 4: a break. So so that stuff. So I'd say Bus
Speaker 4: and Buddies and then then.
Speaker 5: You guys, Wow, that's a good company to be in.
Speaker 4: I think you guys are been blessed by some really
Speaker 4: good writing and yeah, at a time some not so.
Speaker 5: You mentioned your dear friendship with Bob Tishler, and you
Speaker 5: mentioned the book. You guys wrote a book called Impossible
Speaker 5: and unfortunately, as you also mentioned, we lost Bob last year,
Speaker 5: so we will not have the opportunity to have him
Speaker 5: on our podcast. So we wanted to ask you, as
Speaker 5: a dear friend of his, what would you like people
Speaker 5: to know about Bob?
Speaker 4: Well, I wish I was prepared for this. You know,
Speaker 4: you guys have been on a while with this podcast,
Speaker 4: and Bob and I were always planning to come on together,
Speaker 4: and you know, because we had some great stories, and
Speaker 4: we probably had more courage together to tell some of
Speaker 4: those stories because you know, certain people aren't gonna like
Speaker 4: those stories. But anyway, but Bob, Bob was a wonderful
Speaker 4: human being. He was giving, he was caring. I'll give
Speaker 4: you one example that Bob Tisher did on Board this World. Okay,
Speaker 4: there was a pilot written by two of our young writers.
Speaker 4: He stuck up for these two riders whose pilot was
Speaker 4: being co opted by another source. And I was standing
Speaker 4: there and saw him do this, and it was in
Speaker 4: that moment my respect for Bob's sword. I said, this
Speaker 4: is this is a guy, you know, because he's just
Speaker 4: a decent human being and a great writer. You know, Bob.
Speaker 4: Bob produced Saurday Night Live. He was a writer. He's
Speaker 4: got a great pedigree at and you know, I guess
Speaker 4: we were. We were joined at the hip hop world
Speaker 4: because we were two of the older guys. We were
Speaker 4: two former showrunners, and now we're thrust into this this
Speaker 4: very particular set of circumstances in terms of the creative
Speaker 4: aspects of the show. And uh, you know, we we bonded.
Speaker 4: And then of course, in harder times as we got older,
Speaker 4: and you know, there's ages in the industry, we wrote out.
Speaker 4: We wrote scripts and screenplays and pilots and pitched here
Speaker 4: and there, you know, and then eventually we wrote our
Speaker 4: book and it didn't make any money. But he was
Speaker 4: a great guy. And when I got really sick, he
Speaker 4: was there for me. And when he got really sick,
Speaker 4: I tried to be there as best I could for him.
Speaker 4: But you know, lost a great friend.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm sorry for your loss.
Speaker 2: Well, we we often talk about one of our biggest
Speaker 2: regrets is not realizing are being able to to see
Speaker 2: the talent that we had writing for us at the time,
Speaker 2: and to be able to sit down and talk to
Speaker 2: you all about I mean again, Danielle will come on
Speaker 2: and you know, reading your resume and I'm just sitting
Speaker 2: there going, I can't believe I didn't get I would
Speaker 2: sit there and would have peppered you with questions about
Speaker 2: Laverne and Shirley and all stuff. And we just didn't know.
Speaker 2: We were young and wrapped up in ourselves.
Speaker 5: And IMDb didn't exist. We didn't we didn't know to
Speaker 5: ask for your CV.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm so sorry that we didn't have more respect
Speaker 2: for the men and women that were actually putting the
Speaker 2: words in our mouth, because what a staff we had,
Speaker 2: and we just we didn't know.
Speaker 4: Everybody has their own story, you know, mine, as I said,
Speaker 4: it's kind of like kind of cinderellaish and the sends
Speaker 4: and Kermit Defer goes to Hollywood. You know, I grew
Speaker 4: up a working class kid in Brooklyn and the last
Speaker 4: thing ever in my mind was that I would one
Speaker 4: day be doing this, you know. Yeah that so that
Speaker 4: that's you know, that's the nature of it all. And
Speaker 4: same thing goes with it for you guys. You know,
Speaker 4: you all have individual stories and and things happen and
Speaker 4: things that life takes many turns. I mean, I'm going
Speaker 4: to be seventy seven on Saturday.
Speaker 5: Wow, Happy birth Happy birthday.
Speaker 4: So I guess I'm one of those guys who said
Speaker 4: I've seen it all and yet I haven't seen anything.
Speaker 5: Well, here we are, thirty years later, still talking about
Speaker 5: That's World.
Speaker 4: That's the most amazing book. I know it's thirty year
Speaker 4: because the last season in February. Last season, my youngest child, Alexander's,
Speaker 4: and she just turned twenty five. Yeah, there's a good barometer.
Speaker 3: For how Man.
Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly. What do you think is the reason why
Speaker 5: Boy Meets World still resonates with all these generations.
Speaker 4: I've got to give Michael this props there for keeping
Speaker 4: that show live for all those seasons. You know, that's
Speaker 4: no small feet, and of course the creative talents that
Speaker 4: were involved in working the storylines and the episodes and
Speaker 4: the arts, but it's mostly you, guys. You cannot substitute talent.
Speaker 4: You can't substitute for talent and likability. And I'm really
Speaker 4: stressing likability. Are all likable characters. People loved you, People
Speaker 4: are rooted for you, People became invested in you. And
Speaker 4: that's good because that's good because it allows the audience
Speaker 4: to escape and to feel something else and feel and
Speaker 4: I think that's the magic of it. And you know,
Speaker 4: you know, writing is great. You know, it's hard, and
Speaker 4: good writing is wonderful. God, look at the stuff that's
Speaker 4: on today in terms of what's wonderful writing, but great casting. Boy,
Speaker 4: you just can't you can't beat it. And that's what
Speaker 4: happened on this show. And Danielle, you know, I listened
Speaker 4: to the first podcast and what you went through. But
Speaker 4: thank goodness that the negative part of it didn't happen.
Speaker 4: And look what happened to you and.
Speaker 5: You became an icon so exactly, I know.
Speaker 4: And the other side of it is it could have
Speaker 4: gone south. It could have gone the other way.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, I very easily could have been let go. And
Speaker 5: I that show changed my life. And I've you know,
Speaker 5: I certainly every single week I was there up until
Speaker 5: about season midway through season six, every single week I
Speaker 5: was there, it was like, this is the greatest thing
Speaker 5: that's ever Like, Okay, how much this.
Speaker 4: There's another interesting dynamic to what you're doing now is
Speaker 4: you're now adults with your own grown up lives, and
Speaker 4: back then you were kids and and and so I
Speaker 4: think probably while your podcast is so popular, aside from
Speaker 4: the show itself, is you you you three? And and
Speaker 4: how you've changed and what your lives are like. And
Speaker 4: you know, it's almost looking at your own kids and saying, well, yeah,
Speaker 4: and they's succeptful doing things, and so on and so forth.
Speaker 4: So there's there's added elements to to all this. So
Speaker 4: I don't think Boys World could be a pigeonholed as
Speaker 4: a show. I think it's more of a of a thing,
Speaker 4: of a lifestyle in and of itself going on.
Speaker 5: It's its own You're right, it's its own organism.
Speaker 3: It's a cultural phenom of some it definitely goes beyond Yeah,
Speaker 3: I like that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I got that.
Speaker 5: Gary. Thank you so much for being here with us,
Speaker 5: for joining us. You're we could listen to your stories forever.
Speaker 5: We appreciate your perspective, We appreciate you coming on and
Speaker 5: spending your time with us, and I appreciate you for
Speaker 5: sharing all that stuff about Bob too. And not being
Speaker 5: able to have him on is going to be really
Speaker 5: high up on our list of regrets of this show
Speaker 5: that we didn't have him on sooner and then we
Speaker 5: missed the opportunity. So thank you for sharing with us
Speaker 5: a little bit about him, and your book Impossible that
Speaker 5: you wrote with him is available. I think you can
Speaker 5: get it on Amazon, So if anybody's interested in reading that,
Speaker 5: you can you can find that.
Speaker 4: Thank you, Gary, it's problems. I guess I'll speak to
Speaker 4: you guys soon about.
Speaker 5: About the Chat episode.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Chat, Yeah, we got to know what's going on.
Speaker 5: I know we haven't seen that episode yet, so it's
Speaker 5: hard for us to talk about it before. But we
Speaker 5: can have you back on when that episode comes around
Speaker 5: so that we can we can get the behind the
Speaker 5: scenes scoop on that episode as well.
Speaker 4: Boiler Alert is a hospital?
Speaker 5: Oh god, is mister Turner still there?
Speaker 3: One character after another sharing rooms?
Speaker 4: Nice?
Speaker 5: Well, thank you Gary. We'll have you back to talk
Speaker 5: about that. To see you by.
Speaker 3: Oh man, we gotta have another lunch. We gotta have
Speaker 3: a lunch.
Speaker 5: A lunch with Gary.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I had that.
Speaker 6: Experience meeting him on the on the strike line. It
Speaker 6: was really revelatory, just because I'd never talked to Gary
Speaker 6: when we were back back on the show and there
Speaker 6: was really kind of if anything there was. I thought
Speaker 6: he was like, not not really a writer. I thought
Speaker 6: he was more like a I got somehow the story
Speaker 6: got down to me that like Gary had to be
Speaker 6: there and that you know, so to find out that
Speaker 6: he was as much of a pro as he was.
Speaker 6: He clearly has, but he was just so you know,
Speaker 6: he took a back seat on our show.
Speaker 4: He took a back seat.
Speaker 3: I had no idea.
Speaker 6: And so when I went we saw him on the
Speaker 6: strike line, we started talking. I was like, oh, you
Speaker 6: you are very aware of what's going on. You are
Speaker 6: very clearly a creative force to be reckoned with. And
Speaker 6: I just had no idea and and yeah, and he
Speaker 6: shared with me then.
Speaker 3: Basically what he shared now.
Speaker 6: Is that he just had so much respect for us
Speaker 6: as actors and was so happy to be writing for us,
Speaker 6: which at the time I had, you know, he just
Speaker 6: took it for granted.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, Well, don't you remember the joke was
Speaker 2: that we we even put in our movie that we
Speaker 2: thought he was a mob boss because.
Speaker 6: It was worse sunglasses quiet and he was quiet and Jersey.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, so that we made a joke out of that.
Speaker 3: But yeah, we didn't.
Speaker 2: We just didn't know the caliber of the people that
Speaker 2: we had. I mean, had I known that this guy
Speaker 2: had written for Bosom Buddies and Laverne, surely, I mean,
Speaker 2: he's just some of the greatest sitcoms in history. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I was one of one of the things you hindsight
Speaker 2: being what it is you wish you could go back
Speaker 2: and just talk to everybody about what's going on.
Speaker 5: And I really do think it's just so interesting that
Speaker 5: this is the first time it's been brought up that
Speaker 5: there could be something you really don't like about a
Speaker 5: script that has your name on it. Normally it's come
Speaker 5: up or we're like, oh my gosh, there's something so
Speaker 5: funny in this, and they're like, hold on, don't give
Speaker 5: me credit, Like we we haven't had somebody come on
Speaker 5: and go, my name's on that script and I don't
Speaker 5: like this, Like that's kind of that's one of the
Speaker 5: first times we've had that perspective.
Speaker 3: So do they Alan Smithy in sitcom too?
Speaker 4: I don't think so.
Speaker 3: I don't know if that's even a thing, do what.
Speaker 2: So if a writer doesn't like their start director or director,
Speaker 2: but it's also a writer, they'll be where it'll say
Speaker 2: written by or directed by Alan Smithy, which is just
Speaker 2: somebody has taken.
Speaker 3: Their name on the Hollywood Hollywood name. So anytime you
Speaker 3: see this, please hold yeah.
Speaker 5: Thank you all for joining us for this episode of
Speaker 5: pod meets World as always. You can follow us on
Speaker 5: Instagram pod Meets World Show. You can send us your
Speaker 5: emails pod Meets World Show at gmail dot com. And
Speaker 5: we've got merch.
Speaker 3: Apparently chet dies merch.
Speaker 5: Pod Meetsworldshow dot com will send us out.
Speaker 3: We love you all, pod dismissed.
Speaker 2: Podmeets World isnheart podcast producer and hosted by Danielle Fischel,
Speaker 2: Wilfredell and Write or Strong. Executive producers Jensen Karp and
Speaker 2: Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Roma, producer
Speaker 2: and editor, Tara sudbachsch producer, Maddy Moore, engineer and Boy
Speaker 2: Meets World super fan Easton Allen. Our theme song is
Speaker 2: by Kyle Morton of Typhoon and you can follow us
Speaker 2: on Instagram at Podmets World Show or email us at
Speaker 2: Podmets Worldshow at gmail dot com