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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: It's Friday night, and it's time for a Friday Night special.

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Speaker 1: And boy is this special?

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Speaker 2: Did Kentucky cheerleader Laken Snelling actually take selfies while she

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Speaker 2: is in labor while giving birth?

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Speaker 1: Leave the baby to die?

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Speaker 2: Who, by the way, we now learn what's whimpering translation

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Speaker 2: was alive, leave the baby wrapped up in a blanket

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Speaker 2: and a trash bag in her closet, either dead or dying,

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Speaker 2: and then pop out for McDonald's rot Roe. I'm Nancy Grace,

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Speaker 2: this is Crime Stories. I'm gonna thank you for being

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Speaker 2: with us. We are learning from court documents that the

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Speaker 2: Kentucky stunt girl, cheerleader beauty queen Lake and Snelling took

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Speaker 2: selfies while she's giving birth just before she secretly delivers

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Speaker 2: her baby, then allegedly leaving it wrapped up in blankets,

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Speaker 2: towels in a trash bag in her closet, and then

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Speaker 2: dashes out to get McDonald's.

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to this.

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Speaker 3: According to an affidavit, Snelling reportedly gave birth to a

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Speaker 3: baby boy around four am on August twenty seven, with

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Speaker 3: the infant falling onto the floor of her bedroom. She

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Speaker 3: says she heard the baby make a noise. She stated

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Speaker 3: to investigators that she remained conscious for about thirty minutes

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Speaker 3: before losing consciousness. Upon waking, she noticed the baby was

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Speaker 3: turning blue and purple, which led her to believe he

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Speaker 3: was no longer alive. In a moment of distress, she

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Speaker 3: says she wrapped the baby in a towel and placed

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Speaker 3: him on the floor beside her for coming. Snelling subsequently

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Speaker 3: fell asleep and woke again around seven thirty am when

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Speaker 3: her alarm went off. Following this, she allegedly placed the

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Speaker 3: baby and the placenta in a black trash bag and

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Speaker 3: hid it in her closet. Roommates reported hearing a loud

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Speaker 3: noise around four am, more than four hours later. Snelling

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Speaker 3: informed them that she had fainted, which caused the commotion

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Speaker 3: and the loud noise. After the incident, she reportedly left

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Speaker 3: her apartment, skipped her nine thirty am class, and ordered

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Speaker 3: food from McDonald's on her app and then picked it up.

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Speaker 3: Although she visited the student clinic, she said she did

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Speaker 3: not enter the facility during Snelling's absence. Her roommates entered

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Speaker 3: the room and discovered a blood soaked towel on the

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Speaker 3: floor and a plastic bag containing evidence of a childbirth.

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Speaker 3: An incident report noted that the baby was quote cold

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Speaker 3: to the touch. Snelling returned to her apartment around ten

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Speaker 3: thirty am, where she was met with law enforcement. She

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Speaker 3: was subsequently taken by local police and later transported to

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Speaker 3: a local hospital for medical evaluation after requesting to be

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Speaker 3: checked out.

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Speaker 2: Okay, according to what we are learning right now, Snelling's

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Speaker 2: phone was full of images of her during labor, photos

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Speaker 2: of her doing things ordinary pregnant women should not be doing. Now,

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Speaker 2: that's according to court documents.

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Speaker 1: Then she.

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Speaker 2: Deletes tries to delete the photos in an apparent attempt

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Speaker 2: to hide the birth of the baby. These affidavits are

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Speaker 2: chalk full of evidence. Okay, wait a minute, let's back

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Speaker 2: it up. After giving birth, the Beauty Queen cheerleader reportedly

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Speaker 2: stuffs the baby boy in a trash bag, then heads

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Speaker 2: to McDonald's for a tiny bite. Okay, we still don't

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Speaker 2: know a cod be cause of death on the baby,

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Speaker 2: but we do know that roommates sneak into her room

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Speaker 2: to find a blood soaked towel on the floor and

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Speaker 2: a plastic bag quote containing evidence of child birth.

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to.

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Speaker 4: This lake, and Snelling's case is on its way to

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Speaker 4: a grand jury. The anonymous panel is expected to hear

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Speaker 4: evidence in late January. Since Snelling waived her right to

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Speaker 4: a preliminary hearing during his September twenty sixth court appearance,

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Speaker 4: the grand jury will likely be asked to indict Snelling

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Speaker 4: on three charges she initially pleaded not guilty to you.

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Speaker 4: There's the possibility also of account of murder or manslaughter

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Speaker 4: depending on the newborn's autopsy results.

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Speaker 1: How did we get here?

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Speaker 2: If another person, an adult was found dead wrapped in

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Speaker 2: a blanket, body in a trash bag hidden away, the

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Speaker 2: alleged purp would not be walking free right now with

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Speaker 2: a bedazzled ankle monitor.

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Speaker 1: But that is what has just happened. Let's start at

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Speaker 1: the beginning. Listen to this good.

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Speaker 5: Riversity Jefferson County Bear. I am lady, say how in

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Speaker 5: is Nancy University of Kentucky? As she's twenty years of age?

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Speaker 6: Her heart Centeriam jeff Selling of Morrison may needs list

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Speaker 6: while also being a student adeleade do one anelete on

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Speaker 6: the stunty at a University of Kentucky one hundred plus

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Speaker 6: community service.

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Speaker 1: Hours in the past year honors to be.

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Speaker 6: Aground the Jeffersony County Bear Student Bear and begun to

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Speaker 6: represent her house.

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Speaker 2: That is from the Jefferson County Fairest of the Fair

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Speaker 2: Beauty paget that she won. But can we get to

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Speaker 2: right now and what leads up to the discovery of

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Speaker 2: a dead infant baby boy in her closet?

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Speaker 4: Listen Lincoln Snelling is entering her senior year on the

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Speaker 4: cheer stunt team at the University of Kentucky. Snelling grew

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Speaker 4: up in the small town of White Pine, Tennessee, where

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Speaker 4: she was a Jefferson County High School varsity cheerleader and

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Speaker 4: crowned Jefferson County's Fairest of the Fair. Snelling is a

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Speaker 4: self proclaimed real life Barbie with an all pink apartment,

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Speaker 4: Barbie jeep, and fabulous clothes and paget gowns to match.

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Speaker 4: Snelling has an entire Instagram profile dedicated to selling her

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Speaker 4: old wardrobe. Snelling reveals that she is dating another student

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Speaker 4: athlete with an impressive basketball career. Snelling brings her bow

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Speaker 4: home for Easter and over this summer post professional photos

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Speaker 4: with him.

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Speaker 1: Why do I care about the boy?

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Speaker 2: And I'm trying to figure out who is the biological

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Speaker 2: father of this dead infant. And I'm completely intrigued, curious

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Speaker 2: about why so many dead babies are first wrapped in

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Speaker 2: a blanket, a baby blanket very often, remember top mom

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Speaker 2: Casey Anthony wrapped, according to the state, baby Kelly in

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Speaker 2: her favorite blanket before putting her in a trash bag

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Speaker 2: and throwing into a trashy.

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Speaker 1: Litter ridden swamp area about ten houses down.

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Speaker 2: From the Anthony home. Ge I wonder who did that?

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Speaker 2: And I see it over and over and over. The

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Speaker 2: infant is wrapped in a baby blanket and left to

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Speaker 2: die or killed and put in a trash bag. There's

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Speaker 2: gotten to be some sort of psychopathy to that. But

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Speaker 2: you know, I'm also very curious. Straight out to doctor

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Speaker 2: Bethany Marshall, joining US high profile psycho analyst, author of

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Speaker 2: deal Breaker on Amazon. You can see her now on

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Speaker 2: Peacock and find her at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany, I'm also intrigued, what does it mean, if anything,

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Speaker 2: that you are a self proclaimed real life Barbie.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking about the Barbie doll.

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Speaker 7: This woman's life, this young woman's life, is wrapped in

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Speaker 7: fantasy not reality. The fantasy of having a baby seems

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Speaker 7: a lot more compelling to her than the reality of

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Speaker 7: a baby. The fantasy of being Barbie is a lot

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Speaker 7: more compelling to her than the reality of who she

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Speaker 7: is as a mother and out in the world.

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Speaker 2: Okay, doctor Bethany, you got me drinking for the fire

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Speaker 2: hids right here. You gave me so much I've got

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Speaker 2: to parse it. Number one, can we state with Barbie?

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Speaker 2: You said I was writing as fast as I could.

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Speaker 2: The fantasy of being Barbie to her was being better,

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Speaker 2: was better than being leg and Snellings. Okay, now wait

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Speaker 2: a minute, it mean to be Barbie. It's a plastic

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Speaker 2: doll with fake breasts.

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Speaker 1: Why do you want to be that?

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Speaker 7: Because Barbie is beautiful, Barbie is desirable, Barbie is sexually

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Speaker 7: attractive in the world, and the idea that she would

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Speaker 7: be that person, it's like she's wrapping herself in an image,

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Speaker 7: an external image, rather than really focusing on who she is.

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Speaker 7: Does she attend to trust.

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Speaker 1: But blah blah blah?

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Speaker 2: Wait wait wait where can I see that video again

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Speaker 2: of her in the Foe? I guess that's no the

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Speaker 2: foe that that that was?

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Speaker 1: That's very similar to a Barbie outfit my sister had.

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Speaker 1: That's right, Okay.

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Speaker 2: I was trying to dissect the Barbie dolls and I

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Speaker 2: dissected all well, dismembered all of my sister's Barbie dolls.

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Speaker 2: That was a dark day, that said, I remember that outfit.

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Speaker 2: Barbie had an outfit like that with you know, so

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Speaker 2: love in spots. Okay, just wanted to point that out

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Speaker 2: d to Bethy. I don't know what your Barbie lore is,

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Speaker 2: but I distinctly recall an outfit like that with the

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Speaker 2: matching stilettos.

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Speaker 1: And this is when I was a little girl. The

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Speaker 1: stilettos were in then as well, at least for Barbie. Now,

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Back to who wants to be Barbie?

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Speaker 7: Who wants to be Barbie as somebody who's more living

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Speaker 7: in fantasy than reality. Hey, Nancy, that sound you just played.

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Speaker 1: The inside of.

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Speaker 7: Her apartment was pink. She lived in a Barbie place.

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Speaker 7: This is a woman who lives in a fantasy world,

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Speaker 7: not a reality world. Okay, Barbie is just that it's adult.

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Speaker 7: It's not a real person. She does not live her

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Speaker 7: life like a real person. She's living she's like it's

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Speaker 7: like cosplay of being Barbie. I'm wondering, would she go

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Speaker 7: to a church, does she have friends, is she kind

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Speaker 7: to people? Does she like children in real life?

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Speaker 2: Or was the.

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Speaker 7: Fantasy of being pregnant and the fantasy being a mom

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Speaker 7: much more compelling than the reality of changing diapers holding

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Speaker 7: a baby. Babies have needs, you know.

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Speaker 2: And I want to clear one thing up, doctor Bethany Marshall,

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Speaker 2: you can be anything and have played with Barbies as

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Speaker 2: a little girl. My sister that had the Barbies, she's

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Speaker 2: a brainiac.

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Speaker 8: You know.

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Speaker 1: I tried to read something she published.

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Speaker 2: It was just a bunch of formulas with you know,

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Speaker 2: like elements, and I'm like, okay, that was great. So

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Speaker 2: I'm not saying there's anything wrong with playing with barbiees

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Speaker 2: when you're a child. I mean, it can be fun.

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Speaker 2: But this is a grown woman that says she's a

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Speaker 2: real life Barbie. Okay, you know what, I've gone down

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Speaker 2: the Barbie trail way too long. That's not going to

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Speaker 2: help anybody a trial. I want to get to the

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Speaker 2: facts and what we know. Take a listen to this.

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Speaker 7: Ten thirty a m.

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Speaker 4: Wednesday morning, Lexington PD responds to a call about an

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Speaker 4: unresponsive infant found in a student department in one of

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Speaker 4: the tenant's closets inside a trash bag wrapped in towels.

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Speaker 4: The baby was deceased at the time officers received the report.

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Speaker 4: Snelling returns to her apartment to find police swarming the unit.

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Speaker 4: Snelling says she cleaned up after delivering the baby to

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Speaker 4: conceal that she had given birth and put all of

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Speaker 4: the cleaning materials in the trash bag with the baby.

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Speaker 2: What I'm saying here to Josh Colsrude. He is a

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Speaker 2: high profile criminal defense attorney, former felony prosecutor, founder of

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Speaker 2: Colsrude Law Offices. Josh, Now, this is anecdotal. I don't

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Speaker 2: have a statistic on this, but I noticed it over

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Speaker 2: and over and over in the over a decade that

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Speaker 2: I prosecuted felonies when the victim is a baby, very

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Speaker 2: often you see that case pled down like, oh, you know,

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Speaker 2: they were tired of the baby screaming and they bashed

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Speaker 2: its head on the dresser, or they got tired of

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Speaker 2: taking care of the baby, where they forgot to feed

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Speaker 2: the baby and it died, and it's often pled down

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Speaker 2: to vololunteer involuntary manslaughter.

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Speaker 1: Now, I don't know if you're going to admit to

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Speaker 1: that on the air. But it's true.

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Speaker 2: When the victim is a baby, somehow it's treated as

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Speaker 2: less important in our justice system.

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Speaker 1: Well, you know, these cases are tough, Nancy.

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Speaker 9: You know there's a very similar case that happened in

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Speaker 9: twenty seventeen Skyler Richard, high profile case in Ohio. It

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Speaker 9: was a cheerleader and in that case she was charged

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Speaker 9: with murder with second degree murder and they went to

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Speaker 9: trial and the prosecution lost. They lost because neo nanticide,

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Speaker 9: which is the intentional killing of a baby within twenty

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Speaker 9: four hours, is extremely difficult to prove because the scientific

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Speaker 9: tests generally cannot say with any certainty that murder was

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Speaker 9: the result. And so here we just don't have enough

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Speaker 9: information yet. The coroner has stated that, you know that

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Speaker 9: it's inconclusive right now, they are doing additional tests. But

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Speaker 9: I looked into this and the additional tests are all

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Speaker 9: going to have innocent explanations.

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Speaker 1: Number one, I think that the prosecutionw you go on

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Speaker 1: and on.

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Speaker 2: Thinking you were going to come back circle back to

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Speaker 2: the question, which you did not while you stay that

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Speaker 2: Brooks Schuyler Richardson was found not guilty isn't it true

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Speaker 2: that she was convicted of abuse of a corpse?

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Speaker 1: She was not let go, she was actually found guilty.

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Speaker 1: Isn't that correct? Yes?

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Speaker 2: It is okay, you know, I'm sorry I had to

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Speaker 2: put your feet to the fire on that. But you

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Speaker 2: were suggesting that she walked away scott free. What you

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Speaker 2: did say that I find pertinent is that the forensics

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Speaker 2: couldn't prove murder because very often, as you rightly pointed out,

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Speaker 2: Josh Colsrude, it's very difficult to get a cod cause

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Speaker 2: of death in a case like this. But isn't Skyler

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Speaker 2: Richardson the one that buried the baby in the backyard

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Speaker 2: after she tried to burn the baby's body.

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Speaker 9: Yes, and she also admitted that the baby was alive.

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Speaker 9: She told the police that she heard gurgle and that

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Speaker 9: it was briefly alive. She said this to actually her parents,

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Speaker 9: who were in the interrogation room when they didn't believe

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Speaker 9: that the recording was still going on.

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Speaker 1: Josh, do you even remember the question I asked you?

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Speaker 1: What you just said?

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Speaker 2: May scottle look even worse, Scyttle Richardson because the baby

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Speaker 2: was alive. She said it was gurgling and alive when

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Speaker 2: she gave birth. Now it's up to a jury to

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Speaker 2: determine how the baby was born alive and ended.

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Speaker 1: Up burned and buried in the backyard. That said, my

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Speaker 1: question was to you, you.

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Speaker 2: Know what, I'm gonna go to Chris Byers, Chris Byer's

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Speaker 2: private investigator, owner of Buyer's Investigative Services for my purposes.

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Speaker 2: He is the former police chief of John's Creek. Five

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Speaker 2: years in LA law enforcement.

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Speaker 1: Buyers.

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Speaker 2: Isn't it true that you guys work the case of

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Speaker 2: the dead baby, but when it gets to court somehow,

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Speaker 2: when the victim is a baby, an infant, it gets

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Speaker 2: pled down to it voluntary or voluntary.

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't get it.

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Speaker 10: In my experience with any of the cases that I've

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Speaker 10: had like that, they have been pled down. And yeah,

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Speaker 10: I can't explain it from the law enforcement side, that's

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Speaker 10: for sure.

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Speaker 2: Guys, how did the baby end up wrapped in a

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Speaker 2: blanket in her closet? Do you think it wrapped itself

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Speaker 2: up and went in the closet and died?

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Speaker 1: Joining me?

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Speaker 2: Now, Hermonia Rodriguez, chief US reporter, Dailymail dot Com. Hermonia,

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Speaker 2: do we know if Snellings had roommates, because I'm trying

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Speaker 2: to figure out who would call nine.

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Speaker 11: One one, right, That's one of the questions that remains

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Speaker 11: unanswered in this case. Police have refused to say whether

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Speaker 11: Snelling had any roommates and who called the police that morning,

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Speaker 11: so that remains open ended. However, there's a lot of

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Speaker 11: online speculation that says it was a roommate that called

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Speaker 11: the police that morning.

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Speaker 2: Guys, you were seeing shots beauty queen cheerleader Laken Snellings.

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Speaker 2: We already know that systematically, cases involving victims that are

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Speaker 2: infants or children, but especially infants, are typically pled down

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Speaker 2: and treated as less important than adult victims. I don't

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Speaker 2: get it, you know, I'm just thinking about who called

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Speaker 2: nine to one one? How did she keep the baby

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Speaker 2: a secret? Isn't it true, Harmonia Rodriguez that she was,

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Speaker 2: you know, a fantastic athlete. She was a stunt person

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Speaker 2: on the college cheerleading team, and you can see that

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Speaker 2: she's pregnant during her stunts.

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Speaker 1: Let's take a look at video of Lake and Snellings.

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Speaker 1: There you go, that is a baby right there. The baby,

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Speaker 1: the baby is in there.

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Speaker 10: I'm not a.

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Speaker 2: Medical doctor, but I can see that much she was

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Speaker 2: still performing stunts as a cheerleader while pregnant.

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Speaker 1: What you know what, doctor Bethany Marshall denial and I

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Speaker 1: ain't just a river in Egypt. Come on, what is this?

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Speaker 7: Bethany helped me out, Nancy. Not only is she in denial,

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Speaker 7: the whole team is denial.

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Speaker 3: It's in denial.

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Speaker 7: I mean, who's gonna pull a stunt like that when

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Speaker 7: you have a baby in your tommy? Nancy? What this

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Speaker 7: tells me is she was already disconnecting from the baby

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Speaker 7: as she was pregnant. A mother who wants a baby,

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Speaker 7: or who has a wanted baby and her tommy is

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Speaker 7: not going to pull a stunt like that, because the

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Speaker 7: maternal instinct is to protect your child. Nancy, did you

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Speaker 7: hear what the reporter just said. When she put that

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Speaker 7: baby in the plastic bag, she threw the cleaning material

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Speaker 7: on top of it. She threw trash on her baby.

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Speaker 7: It's so disturbing.

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Speaker 12: A member of the University of Kentucky's stunt team, Laken Snelling,

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Speaker 12: is driven, admired, and hiding a secret that will crack

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Speaker 12: her dreams.

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Speaker 2: And right now she is accused of a major felony

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Speaker 2: after her dead infant baby boy is found wrapped in

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Speaker 2: towels in a trash bag in her closet, straight out

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Speaker 2: to Harmonia Rodriguez joining us from Deally mail Harmonia.

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Speaker 1: There are two lines of.

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Speaker 2: Inquiry right now as to who call nine one one,

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Speaker 2: And this is important. Okay, you may think who cares

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Speaker 2: to call nine one one they found a dead baby

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Speaker 2: in the closet, But does the person that call nine

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Speaker 2: one one and have other facts and evidence that would

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Speaker 2: be probative.

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Speaker 1: So these are the two lines of inquiry.

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Speaker 2: One report is that roommates became suspicious after Lincoln Snelling

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Speaker 2: came back to school at the end of the summer.

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Speaker 2: She didn't look the same as she did when spring

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Speaker 2: semester ended. She looked pregnant. Then on that Wednesday morning,

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Speaker 2: the pregnancy bump was gone. So when she went to

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Speaker 2: class that day, they the roommates, decided to go into

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Speaker 2: her room and take a look. There are also reports

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Speaker 2: that one of the roommates had a dog that was

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Speaker 2: going berserk outside Lincoln Snelling's room and outside of her closet,

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Speaker 2: and because of that they looked in the closet. Both

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Speaker 2: reports indicate one of the roommates called nine to one one.

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Speaker 2: Do you know anything about either of those two reports, Harmonia,

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Speaker 2: I have.

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Speaker 1: Seen those reports.

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Speaker 11: One is from a local and the other one really

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Speaker 11: comes from this Facebook page that is about the case. However,

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Speaker 11: we have gone to police to ask about the circumstances

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Speaker 11: of who called nine one one, and they still are

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Speaker 11: not ready to release that information.

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Speaker 2: Guys, you're seeing video lake and snailings and it's kind

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Speaker 2: of amazing how someone that seemingly has the world at

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Speaker 2: their fate. You know, there's no question she's beautiful, she's vivacious,

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Speaker 2: she's healthy, she's smart, and now she's charged with a felony.

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Speaker 1: I think a lot will ride on the cause of death, but.

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Speaker 2: Right now, that cood remains undetermined. Joining me right now,

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Speaker 2: renowned medical examiner, the chief Medical Examiner of Terran County,

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Speaker 2: that's Fort Worth, Texas, esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School

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Speaker 2: of Medicine at TCU, and star of a hit new podcast,

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Speaker 2: Mayhem in the Morgue, Doctor Kendall Crowns, joining us.

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Speaker 1: What does that tell me? They don't have a cood yet?

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Speaker 1: Cause of death?

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Speaker 2: Let me read between the lines that tells me there

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Speaker 2: was no visible cood like you can just look at

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Speaker 2: the baby and say, oh, the baby was bludgeon dead,

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Speaker 2: or the baby was shot, or the baby was stabbed,

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Speaker 2: or ligature strangulation or manual strangulation. Maybe even you might

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Speaker 2: need a microscopic exam to determine if there were a

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Speaker 2: particiar hemorrhage.

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Speaker 1: To the eyes.

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Speaker 2: But that tells me that the cod was none of

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Speaker 2: those things. What's happening, doctor Kendall Crowns.

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Speaker 8: So typically with the babies that are found in trash bags,

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Speaker 8: you first have to determine if they were born alive.

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Speaker 8: There's certain things you can look for. One of them

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Speaker 8: is gestational age. If they're under twenty two weeks, they

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Speaker 8: probably couldn't have survived being born. If they have this

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Speaker 8: thing called maceration, which is an overall kind of reddish

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Speaker 8: decoloration sloughing of the skin of the baby, you know

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Speaker 8: they died in utero. And then finally, do they have

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Speaker 8: any major burst effects like they have no brain or

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Speaker 8: something of that nature. Then you go from there and

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Speaker 8: you have to figure out if they If you determine

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Speaker 8: that they could have been born alive, then you have

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Speaker 8: to determine if they actually took a breath, and that

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Speaker 8: can be a number of tests that are actually not

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Speaker 8: all that accurate. There's the float test with the lung,

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Speaker 8: but that can be disrupted by decomposition.

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Speaker 1: Crime stores with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: In the last Days a woman charge in a baby's death,

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Speaker 2: please not guilty. Affidavits reveal claims by police said the

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Speaker 2: Kentucky cheerleader like in Snelling, giving birth then brazenly goes

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Speaker 2: to eat McDonald's while the baby is in her closet.

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Speaker 1: I don't know by that time was it dead, was

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Speaker 1: it alive?

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Speaker 2: We know that. She also says the baby was whimpering.

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Speaker 2: She heard whimpering sounds, which means the baby was alive.

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Speaker 1: Listen.

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Speaker 4: A new subpoena filed last month in December, ordering the

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Speaker 4: University of the Kentucky Medical Center to provide Snelling's medical

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Speaker 4: records from August twenty twenty four to present. The hospital

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Speaker 4: has until January twentieth to comply. That is the facility

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Speaker 4: which treated Snelling hours after she allegedly gave birth to

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Speaker 4: a baby, which she says fell into the floor of

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Speaker 4: her bedroom. That statement about the birth was allegedly made

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Speaker 4: at the school's medical facility during one of Snelling's interview

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Speaker 4: with members of the Lexington Police Department.

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Speaker 1: Back to the case.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Kendall Crown's joining us. Could you please dummy down man?

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Speaker 2: You said, oh, would let's say, did a floatation test?

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Speaker 9: What not?

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Speaker 2: Everybody works in the morgue. Not everybody knows what you're

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Speaker 2: talking about. You just rattled off about fifteen medical phrases.

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Speaker 2: I'm surprised you didn't throw Latin at me. Could you

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Speaker 2: just start over and speak regular people talk? Please, if

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Speaker 2: not for the listener, for me, please start over if

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Speaker 2: you don't mind.

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Speaker 8: So the main thing, like I was talking about, is

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Speaker 8: they're going to be looking for any signs that the

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Speaker 8: child was living when it was born. So did it

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Speaker 8: take a breath? And if it took a breath, the

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Speaker 8: lungs will fill up with air and they could potentially

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Speaker 8: float if you put them in water, So you could say, oh,

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Speaker 8: that they breathe if the lungs float in water. The

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Speaker 8: problem with the flotation.

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Speaker 1: Test, Doctor Kendall Crown's right there, right there.

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Speaker 2: You have to explain what that means, because that reminds

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Speaker 2: me of when we were first told the Idaho for

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Speaker 2: students that were murdered by Brian Coberger died in their sleep.

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Speaker 1: So I was like they drifted off to a lullaby

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Speaker 1: and they woke up in heaven. That's not what happened.

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Speaker 1: They fought for their lives.

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Speaker 7: It was horrible.

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Speaker 2: You're saying the lungs are tested. What I believe you

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Speaker 2: mean is this infant is cut open, its lungs are removed,

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Speaker 2: and they're put in water to.

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Speaker 1: See if they float. Is that what that means?

441
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:28,879
Speaker 8: That's correct.

442
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:31,359
Speaker 2: You just rattled off the tip of your tongue like

443
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:34,960
Speaker 2: it's nothing. This is a baby got to Kendall crowns

444
00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:38,959
Speaker 2: that now has to be cut open and its lungs

445
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 2: removed from its little body. How big are baby lungs?

446
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 2: How big are they and the inn dunked in water?

447
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 2: How big is an infant's lungs?

448
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:50,080
Speaker 8: Well, it depends on how old the baby is gestationally,

449
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:53,440
Speaker 8: if they are newborn. If they are a newborn, their

450
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 8: lungs are about a couple inches.

451
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:57,960
Speaker 1: Maybe have you done a water test on a baby?

452
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:00,640
Speaker 2: Yes, I mean what went through your min when you're

453
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:02,440
Speaker 2: cutting out a baby's lungs.

454
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 1: That are this big?

455
00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:07,880
Speaker 2: About the size of a good cup, a kitchen measuring cup.

456
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,359
Speaker 2: I mean, do you look at it in your hands

457
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 2: and think, my stars, what happened.

458
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,240
Speaker 8: So when I'm doing an autopsy and a baby, it's

459
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:18,879
Speaker 8: no different than doing an autopsy and adults. I have

460
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 8: to determine the cause and manner of death.

461
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:22,359
Speaker 1: It's just it is what it is.

462
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 8: I have to figure out what happened to this child

463
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 8: or happen to the adults. And that's the purpose of

464
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 8: my employment.

465
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,520
Speaker 2: Okay, I understand that you have to remain detached while

466
00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 2: you're performing all of this, but you know, when you

467
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 2: just rattle off, I'm not saying you're wrong. I know

468
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,840
Speaker 2: for a fact that you're right, But when you say

469
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,159
Speaker 2: it so methodically, I mean, I got to think this

470
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 2: through dtor Kendall Crowns. You're saying, one of the first

471
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 2: things you do to determine COEOD if it's not immediately

472
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 2: visible with the naked eye, is you do a float

473
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,840
Speaker 2: test on the lungs. What that means is the baby

474
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,560
Speaker 2: is sliced open, its lungs, they're removed, and they're dunked

475
00:27:58,600 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 2: in water.

476
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,000
Speaker 1: What kind of water? What is that in a pan?

477
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 1: A sink?

478
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 9: What?

479
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,920
Speaker 8: It's tap water? And it's basically a big cup.

480
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 2: You know, we are talking on and on and on

481
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 2: doctor Kendl Crowns about Blake and Snellings. And she's a

482
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,920
Speaker 2: real life Barbie and she's a stunk person, and she's

483
00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 2: a cheerleader, and she's gorgeous, and she's Miss Fairest of

484
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:25,400
Speaker 2: the Fair. Nobody is talking about the baby boy that's

485
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:29,560
Speaker 2: lying on a more table getting its chest sliced open,

486
00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:30,680
Speaker 2: it's lungs.

487
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 1: Removed and put in water. Why does it have to

488
00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:35,240
Speaker 1: be all about her?

489
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:39,720
Speaker 2: That's that's why White Cases and Josh Colsrude would not

490
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 2: answer earlier, former federal prosecutor. I mean, okay, back to you,

491
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 2: doctor Kendall Crowns. So you do a lung test, and

492
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 2: if the lungs float, that means they had air in them.

493
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,800
Speaker 2: That means that baby was born alive. Is that where

494
00:28:58,800 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 2: you're going with that?

495
00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 8: That's correct. I mean, if they've taken a breath, the

496
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:04,959
Speaker 8: lungs will float, But it could also mean they were

497
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:09,480
Speaker 8: given CPR. It could also mean there's decompositional gas formation.

498
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 8: So one of the other things you'll do with the

499
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 8: floatation test is take the liver. Take a section of

500
00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 8: the liver and place it in the water as well

501
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:19,959
Speaker 8: to see if it will float to show that there

502
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 8: is or is not decomposition.

503
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 2: Okay, wait a minute, White a minute, Wait a minute.

504
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 2: I've never heard this before. A float test on the

505
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 2: baby's liver. So now the abdomen is cut out as well.

506
00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 1: Okay, why would you do a float test on a liver.

507
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 1: Why would there be air in a liver.

508
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 8: There would be no air in the liver. So if

509
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:41,160
Speaker 8: the liver doesn't float, you know that there is no decomposition.

510
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 8: But if it does float, then it puts into question

511
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 8: of whether the lungs are floating because of decomposition or

512
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 8: because there's air in them. So then you have to

513
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 8: go to microscopic analysis.

514
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 2: Okay, So you compare the float test of the liver

515
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 2: to the float test of the lungs, and if the

516
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:03,320
Speaker 2: liver goes down and the lungs go up, that indicates

517
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 2: the lungs are floating because the baby breathe, not because

518
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 2: of decompositional gases.

519
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 1: Is that right correct?

520
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:10,440
Speaker 8: Yes?

521
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 1: Okay, so that's what's happening to the baby.

522
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,800
Speaker 2: What else will be examined to determine the cod of

523
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 2: this baby, because this all hinges.

524
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 1: On the COEOD. If the baby was dead when it

525
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 1: was born, was still born.

526
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:28,040
Speaker 2: If then there's not going to be a murder prosecution.

527
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: As Josh Cole's.

528
00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:33,520
Speaker 2: Really pointed out, a lot is riding on the cause

529
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 2: of death. What else will be done, doctor Kendall Crowns.

530
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 8: So what else will be done is microscopic analysis or

531
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 8: looking at sections of the tissue under a microscope, looking

532
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:46,280
Speaker 8: for any disease processes. Also, you'll be looking at the

533
00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 8: lungs there as well, looking to see if the air

534
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 8: sacks or the alveoli and the lungs have filled up

535
00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:54,960
Speaker 8: with air. The other thing you'll be looking at is

536
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 8: the placenta, if it's available. Looking at the placenta looking

537
00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:04,360
Speaker 8: for any evidence of hemorrhage or loss of oxygen, or

538
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 8: infarction or infection of the membranes. You'll be looking at

539
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:11,239
Speaker 8: the umbilical cord to see if it's normally formed, if

540
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 8: it was wrapped around the child's neck, or if it

541
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:17,640
Speaker 8: has inflammation as well. And then you'll also be looking

542
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,200
Speaker 8: for any evidence of trauma birth trauma where like the

543
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 8: shoulder got stuck and they had to pull the child

544
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 8: very hard, fracturing the shoulder or separating the neck. You'll

545
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 8: also be looking for inflicted trauma like crushing of the ribs,

546
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 8: breaking of the extremities or the long bones of the extremities,

547
00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 8: or crushing of the skull.

548
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:40,880
Speaker 2: Harmonia Rodriguez dailymail dot com thinking about and analyzing what

549
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,400
Speaker 2: doctor Kimil Krause just said regarding was the baby shoulder

550
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 2: broken or prolapsed when it was delivered, other injuries to

551
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:55,760
Speaker 2: the baby during delivery. It's my understanding that she had

552
00:31:55,880 --> 00:32:00,239
Speaker 2: the pregnancy bomb one day and the next day when's day,

553
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:04,040
Speaker 2: it was gone and she went to class, So obviously

554
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 2: she did not have any injuries.

555
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:06,160
Speaker 1: That's right.

556
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 11: And while we have not been able to confirm that

557
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 11: she told anyone about this pregnancy, as we saw the

558
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 11: images show that she has a visible bump that she

559
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 11: then did not have after given birth.

560
00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:19,960
Speaker 1: However, so I think it's safe to say she was.

561
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 11: Probably not injured, and the autopsy report did say that

562
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 11: the baby did not have any obvious injuries either.

563
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:32,480
Speaker 5: Good diversity, Joerson, County Bear.

564
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 4: I am late in nine.

565
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 1: Com in his.

566
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:45,880
Speaker 6: Nancy University of Kentucky, and she's twenty years of age.

567
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 6: Her criterium is just selling the worse Meggs list while also.

568
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:53,560
Speaker 2: Being a student.

569
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 6: Adelte du One, anlete the stunty at a University of

570
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 6: techy one hundred.

571
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,080
Speaker 1: Plus community service hours.

572
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 6: Some cast you honor to day ground and Jerry City

573
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 6: Bear's student there and be able to represent her.

574
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 2: Now, I want to be very clear at this juncture,

575
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:19,360
Speaker 2: Lake and Snellings is not charged with murder. We are

576
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 2: waiting on a full and complete autopsy report.

577
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:27,880
Speaker 12: A roommate's dog leads to a horrific discovery inside Lincoln

578
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 12: Snelling's closet, inside a black trash bag the remains of

579
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 12: a baby boy, along with the evidence used to hide

580
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 12: the birth.

581
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 2: Lincoln Snelling's caught on video stating how grateful she is

582
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 2: for quote family. I don't know if that includes the

583
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 2: baby boy found wrapped in towels in a trash bag

584
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 2: in her closet, but I want you.

585
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: To see some texts that we've uncovered.

586
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 2: Here is lac And Snellings, and if you see her goals,

587
00:33:56,520 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 2: let's see a close up of her goals motherhood. Well,

588
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 2: then that baby's getting fed a bottle by a loving

589
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,240
Speaker 2: mom with blonde hair like Lake and Snellings. That is

590
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,920
Speaker 2: not what happened to this baby. And also circled as

591
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 2: her goal is a family with two children engagement, ring,

592
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:15,760
Speaker 2: money and a house?

593
00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:17,800
Speaker 1: What more have we learned?

594
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:20,840
Speaker 2: Being twenty is so weird, Like I'm an adult, but

595
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,719
Speaker 2: I still can't really really do anything. But people my

596
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 2: age have kids, Well, I think she knows the answer

597
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 2: to that. I actually start tweaking at the fact I

598
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:34,480
Speaker 2: may only birth boys and never get a girl.

599
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:38,840
Speaker 1: That would be a little small, miniature me.

600
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:44,560
Speaker 2: My parents had a whole child at my age, and

601
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:47,120
Speaker 2: I don't even know how to drive on to the.

602
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,239
Speaker 1: Tracks of a car wash.

603
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:55,879
Speaker 2: Okay, this and watching the kids play in the yard.

604
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 2: She seems like she'd be a great mom. How I

605
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,319
Speaker 2: sleep at night knowing I'm dating the person I'm going

606
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:05,600
Speaker 2: to marry, maryge just Gary. What if he doesn't want

607
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:10,960
Speaker 2: to put our daughter in cheer the second she can walk? Okay,

608
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:15,319
Speaker 2: I need a shrink, and I need a shrink right now,

609
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:20,560
Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, the well, they all are significant. Okay, Yes,

610
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,240
Speaker 2: none of this will likely ever come before a jury

611
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 2: because they will be deemed not probative. In other words,

612
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 2: they're incendiary and they don't really prove anything. Right, But

613
00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:33,560
Speaker 2: what about the part about I want to have a

614
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 2: mini me? What if I only birth boys? Which this

615
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,040
Speaker 2: was a baby boy, and I don't have a girl.

616
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:43,760
Speaker 2: I don't have a minime. That means something, Doctor Bethany.

617
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,880
Speaker 7: What it tells me that she's preoccupied with having an

618
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:49,839
Speaker 7: idealized life with a little girl who's just like her.

619
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,520
Speaker 7: That she's very self centered, Nancy. She's wrapped up in

620
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 7: her own little world. These texts are not to another person.

621
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:02,160
Speaker 7: These texts are to herself. She is preoccupied with herself. Now,

622
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:06,759
Speaker 7: women who commit and fanticide usually are not attached to

623
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 7: the baby when they are pregnant. The baby is like

624
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,800
Speaker 7: an it, a thing. It does not have a personality. Nancy,

625
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,719
Speaker 7: when you were first pregnant, I remember you told me

626
00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 7: were on the set of port TV. You were so excited.

627
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 7: You were attached to your babies. It's called maternal preoccupation

628
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,320
Speaker 7: when you're attached. She likely was not attached to the baby.

629
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:31,120
Speaker 7: She was attached to herself, and she was attached to

630
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 7: the idea of an idealized life. There's the ring, then

631
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:40,279
Speaker 7: there's the baby, Then there's the cash, then there's the house. Oh,

632
00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 7: there's the family. So this baby probably was getting in

633
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:49,640
Speaker 7: the way of some scheme or plan that she already had.

634
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:52,680
Speaker 7: Maybe she was getting ready for a prom. Maybe she

635
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 7: wanted to wear a wedding dress. Maybe she wanted to

636
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 7: find a really rich guy, or she wanted the perfect wedding,

637
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:02,839
Speaker 7: and this baby was inconvenient because the little baby didn't

638
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,520
Speaker 7: come around at the right time in her whatever her

639
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:07,800
Speaker 7: plan was for her life.

640
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 2: And Doctor Bethany, here's something I don't understand. And I'm

641
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 2: not saying pro or con abortion. I'm not arguing about

642
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 2: abortion tonight.

643
00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 1: That's a whole other can of worms.

644
00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 2: But if you don't want the baby, why wait nine

645
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:29,399
Speaker 2: months and give birth and then murder the baby? Why

646
00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 2: do that as opposed to terminating the pregnancy in the

647
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:34,680
Speaker 2: first three months.

648
00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 7: Nancy, In order to plan for an abortion, you have

649
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:41,320
Speaker 7: to be tethered to reality. Reality is that there is

650
00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,560
Speaker 7: a baby inside of you. That baby is growing. That

651
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 7: baby will be a person in the real world with

652
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,919
Speaker 7: real needs, a need for food, a need for love,

653
00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:53,799
Speaker 7: a need for care. I would doubt that she would

654
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:57,359
Speaker 7: even be attached enough to this baby to plan any

655
00:37:57,440 --> 00:37:59,800
Speaker 7: kind of medical procedure. I doubt she even went to

656
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 7: a doctor and got her vitamins or her being able

657
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 7: care or anything like that. That's one of the more

658
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:09,840
Speaker 7: fascinating parts of this story was did anybody recognize she

659
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 7: was pregnant? Did her own mother recognize? What about the

660
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,799
Speaker 7: other people on the cheer team? Or was this sort

661
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:18,800
Speaker 7: of a pipe dream about having a baby at some

662
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:22,360
Speaker 7: point in her life. But at that point she didn't

663
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,880
Speaker 7: imagine herself to be pregnant. She was just dissociated from

664
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:26,880
Speaker 7: the reality of it all.

665
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 2: And again, I'm not going down the pro life or

666
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:34,479
Speaker 2: pro abortion rabbit hole, but I want to get back

667
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:35,320
Speaker 2: to the facts.

668
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 1: Listen to this.

669
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:39,800
Speaker 4: Lincoln Snelling leads not guilty to all three charges levied

670
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:43,400
Speaker 4: against her and posted her one hundred thousand dollars vond.

671
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:46,880
Speaker 4: Snelling has been placed on house arrest at her parents

672
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 4: Jefferson City home. She will not be required to wear

673
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 4: an ankle monitor. Her next scheduled appearance in a Fayette

674
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,160
Speaker 4: County court is September twenty sixth.

675
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 8: Her fugeneral relations arm that from.

676
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:05,360
Speaker 2: Our friends at w KYT And you heard the judge

677
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 2: there at the end, Judge John Tackett, Wait a minute, Harmonia,

678
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:15,040
Speaker 2: she not only has walked free, but she doesn't.

679
00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 1: Even have to wear an ankle monitor. That's right, Nancy.

680
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 1: The judge order her to await trial at her.

681
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 11: Parents' home in Tennessee, and specified that she would not

682
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 11: have to wear an ankle monitor while she awaits her trial.

683
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:32,919
Speaker 2: Why, Josh Coles rude, you're the former federal prosecutor.

684
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 1: Why not even wear an ankle monitor? Forget the ankle

685
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 1: monitor to.

686
00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 2: Hay with that?

687
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 3: Why is she out on bond?

688
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 8: Well?

689
00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 9: Typically, judges have to look at two different prongs when

690
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,800
Speaker 9: evaluating whether or not to give somebody a bond, and

691
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:52,080
Speaker 9: if so, how much. The first is is the person

692
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 9: a substantial danger to the community? And the second is

693
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:02,080
Speaker 9: are they substantial flight risk? And here you're dealing with

694
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:04,440
Speaker 9: somebody who doesn't have any in.

695
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:11,120
Speaker 1: Me that she's young and pretty and rich and white.

696
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:15,760
Speaker 1: What about that? Does that factor into that bond decision?

697
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 1: Because I think it does. Is she too pretty for jail?

698
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:23,720
Speaker 1: Because that worked with debril Faye? Is that what happens

699
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 1: just too cute?

700
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:28,800
Speaker 9: Well, in this case, respectfully, she has not been accused

701
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:33,439
Speaker 9: of murdering anybody yet. The only charges in this case

702
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:38,840
Speaker 9: so far are abuse a corpse and some lower and

703
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:42,399
Speaker 9: some lesser included charges as well. So until the time

704
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:47,280
Speaker 9: that the state actually accuses her of murdering an infant child.

705
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 9: She's going to be treated as a low level offender.

706
00:40:57,239 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: Crime stores with Nancy Grace.

707
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 2: Cheerleaderlac and Snelling originally tells cops the baby fell to

708
00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 2: the floor fell on the floor after she gave birth,

709
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:15,400
Speaker 2: but she didn't think the baby was breathing or alive.

710
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 2: According to the affidavit that we have obtained, she says

711
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,520
Speaker 2: that she thought the baby was dead and wrapped it

712
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 2: like a quote burrito and laid next to it on

713
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:32,120
Speaker 2: the floor because it gave her a little comfort. What

714
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:36,720
Speaker 2: about the baby, She says, she woke up seven thirty am,

715
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:38,279
Speaker 2: put the baby in a trash bag.

716
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:39,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's normal.

717
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:43,400
Speaker 2: Then shower, cleaned up blood, placed placenta in a ziplock

718
00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 2: bag before skipping morning classes and going for McDonald's. That's

719
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,760
Speaker 2: what we are learning. But here is the critical moment.

720
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:01,120
Speaker 2: Here is the critical statement. She admitted to medical staff

721
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,440
Speaker 2: the baby had shown quote a little bit of fetal

722
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:10,719
Speaker 2: movement and made a whimper after he was born. Then

723
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:15,880
Speaker 2: she deletes the photo she took while she was giving birth.

724
00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:22,200
Speaker 2: Investigators believe there could be more images removed from her

725
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:25,920
Speaker 2: phone before her arrest. They will have to get that forensically.

726
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:28,560
Speaker 2: After a search warrant is obtained for her phone.

727
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,279
Speaker 1: What more do we know? Yay, I'm going to need

728
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 1: to send a deputy over here. At one twenty five Lakeside,

729
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 1: we got.

730
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 2: A newborn baby's fund started.

731
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:42,719
Speaker 8: Okay, any too, yep, thanks.

732
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 4: Miss Kingham University Delta Gamma Theta sisters find a suspicious

733
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 4: trash bag just outside the front door. Tearing it open,

734
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 4: they make a gruesome discovery. Next to an instant macincheese

735
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:59,160
Speaker 4: box lies a dead baby girl. Emily Weaver admits she

736
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 4: birthed the baby in the downstairs bathroom of the Theta house.

737
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 2: Okay, in that case, Sorry's sisters find a dead infant

738
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:12,239
Speaker 2: and a trash bag right outside their front door, and

739
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:17,920
Speaker 2: they immediately suspect and Emil Weaver listen, I just want

740
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:18,880
Speaker 2: to be able to tell.

741
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:25,839
Speaker 13: Yeah, the cause of death from the child. And did

742
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,319
Speaker 13: you do anything physically too?

743
00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:34,719
Speaker 2: No, it's physically I really obviously didn't much at all.

744
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 8: It was more concerned would be.

745
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 12: Guy was intentionally get a billet.

746
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 1: I mean, I would have like not put its head.

747
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:47,560
Speaker 10: Up when you just want to drop you know what

748
00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:47,839
Speaker 10: I mean?

749
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:52,480
Speaker 8: That's it was potentially inflicted.

750
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 2: You did.

751
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 4: Did you try and keep her alive?

752
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:09,560
Speaker 2: And then you add on Emily Weaver's texts that she

753
00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 2: had been arguing with the BF boyfriend for about a

754
00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:17,759
Speaker 2: month about the quote situation and then after just a

755
00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:20,560
Speaker 2: few hours after giving births as a text, no more

756
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:27,000
Speaker 2: baby taken care of. The baby was asphyxiated, suffocated dead.

757
00:44:27,480 --> 00:44:31,640
Speaker 2: Prosecutors argue she intentionally killed the baby by putting the

758
00:44:31,719 --> 00:44:35,200
Speaker 2: baby in the trash where it suffocated, and she was

759
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:36,520
Speaker 2: sentenced to life.

760
00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 1: That's what happened there. So I'm just.

761
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:45,360
Speaker 2: Thinking through the having the baby and doing nothing to

762
00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:51,120
Speaker 2: keep the baby alive, not just that putting the baby

763
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 2: in a trash bag wrapped in a towel.

764
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:56,360
Speaker 1: As in this case.

765
00:44:57,000 --> 00:45:01,480
Speaker 2: Could that have been the cause of asphixitionation in the

766
00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:05,320
Speaker 2: case in chief? Now, that case was about Emily Weaver.

767
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:08,239
Speaker 2: But then there's Alexei Chiviso.

768
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:11,120
Speaker 14: We had the lady come to clean the bathroom. She

769
00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 14: put the baby in the trash can and then she

770
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:18,719
Speaker 14: put another clean winer hoover the top of it, so

771
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:20,719
Speaker 14: they looked when they looked in there, it looked there

772
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:22,799
Speaker 14: was no trash in that, but it's underneath the clean

773
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:26,919
Speaker 14: bag the baby's dead. Okay, we have them in Toronto too.

774
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:29,000
Speaker 1: But she killed a kid?

775
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 6: Yeah, how to be?

776
00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:32,239
Speaker 14: I don't know, it's full time.

777
00:45:33,320 --> 00:45:33,840
Speaker 13: She just had it.

778
00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:35,960
Speaker 14: She had it in the bathroom, was what happened. And

779
00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:38,080
Speaker 14: then she whatever she did. I don't know if she's

780
00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 14: gonna lie. She wouldn't tell us she's pregnant. She's been

781
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:41,399
Speaker 14: lying the whole time.

782
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:44,560
Speaker 2: So she goes in the bathroom pregnant and then selling

783
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:48,080
Speaker 2: the baby's gone and it's underneath the clean bag near.

784
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:51,640
Speaker 1: The trash can. There's more.

785
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:52,840
Speaker 7: We just started a.

786
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:54,120
Speaker 6: Dead baby in the bathroom.

787
00:45:54,719 --> 00:46:01,320
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, so sorry I told you about this.

788
00:46:02,920 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 1: I just asked you babies, tell me the.

789
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,480
Speaker 2: Truths not.

790
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 1: And nothing was crying.

791
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:17,759
Speaker 8: Can do you guys have I'm the charge nurser. Do

792
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:19,080
Speaker 8: you guys have any questions for me?

793
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 1: What nine months something was?

794
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,400
Speaker 6: Let's see, have you watched the news of the girls

795
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:33,120
Speaker 6: and what they do to their babies and when they go.

796
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:42,759
Speaker 1: To jail, Doctor Anthony Marshall, what's with that mom?

797
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:45,400
Speaker 7: The mom seems more concerned about her daughter than her

798
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:48,120
Speaker 7: grand baby. It's it's really concerning. And you know, this

799
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,479
Speaker 7: is what we call Nancy a soft kill. When women

800
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:56,240
Speaker 7: kill their babies, usually it's suffocating them poisoning them, whereas

801
00:46:56,239 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 7: with men it sends to be some more of overt

802
00:46:58,560 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 7: physical violence. So this is just a soft kill. And

803
00:47:02,080 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 7: the mother never says, oh my god, my grandbaby. Those

804
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,200
Speaker 7: words do not come out of the mother's mouth.

805
00:47:08,400 --> 00:47:14,040
Speaker 1: I don't like anything you just said. Soft kill. Those

806
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:15,760
Speaker 1: words don't go together.

807
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:19,800
Speaker 2: Imagine how awful it would be to be murdered my

808
00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:21,279
Speaker 2: Let's just say asphyxiation.

809
00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:23,760
Speaker 1: Then, imagine if you're a baby.

810
00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 2: You can't speak, you can't move, you can't run away,

811
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:29,160
Speaker 2: you can't fight back. You have to just lay there

812
00:47:29,800 --> 00:47:33,879
Speaker 2: and die with something held down over your nose and mouth.

813
00:47:34,040 --> 00:47:35,960
Speaker 2: And to doctor Kendall Crown's.

814
00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:37,160
Speaker 1: Soft kill, my rear end.

815
00:47:37,960 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 2: Could this baby have died by asphyxiation simply by the

816
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 2: baby putting being wrapped in towels and put in a

817
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:45,799
Speaker 2: trash bag?

818
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 1: Could that have asphyxiated suffocated the baby.

819
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 8: Yes, we see that occasionally with full term infronts or

820
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,440
Speaker 8: babies that are beyond the twenty three week gestation. The

821
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:58,840
Speaker 8: mother places it in the trash bag and seals the

822
00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:01,799
Speaker 8: trash bag, throwing it in the trash There's not enough

823
00:48:01,880 --> 00:48:04,239
Speaker 8: oxygen in there for the child to survive, and so

824
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:07,839
Speaker 8: they eventually will suffocate by being an a plastic bag,

825
00:48:08,080 --> 00:48:10,359
Speaker 8: just as if you put a plastic bag over your head,

826
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:11,880
Speaker 8: it would suffocate you.

827
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:17,360
Speaker 2: And then to Chris Buyer's private investigator at Buyer's Investigative Services,

828
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:19,279
Speaker 2: I want you to hear this case.

829
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:22,399
Speaker 1: Similar and it's one brought up by Josh Cole Road

830
00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:23,800
Speaker 1: Skyler Richardson.

831
00:48:24,080 --> 00:48:26,800
Speaker 13: Is your bedroom mouthstairs or bathroom moufstairs? Okay, so you

832
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:32,600
Speaker 13: had to walk downstairs? Are you carrying her? Did you

833
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 13: go into the garage or do you have an outdoor shed.

834
00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:35,800
Speaker 8: Like where you have a shovel?

835
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:38,759
Speaker 7: Okay? When what did you find her?

836
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 13: What did you use?

837
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:42,399
Speaker 1: Put a little old my god?

838
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:45,719
Speaker 13: Okay, Anderson, what did you do?

839
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:48,160
Speaker 7: Did you have it and you didn't have any help? Right?

840
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:49,280
Speaker 13: Okay?

841
00:48:49,840 --> 00:48:52,040
Speaker 1: What did you do with her while you were digging

842
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:52,439
Speaker 1: the hole?

843
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:59,680
Speaker 2: And Chris Buyers in that particular case, Skylar Richardson, Dad

844
00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 2: ask tell us what's going on and she says, I

845
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:10,719
Speaker 2: tried to cremate the baby just a little. She tried

846
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:12,480
Speaker 2: to burn the baby.

847
00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:13,840
Speaker 1: Chris, Yeah, that.

848
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:15,440
Speaker 10: Is absolutely mind blowing.

849
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:16,720
Speaker 8: That level of evil.

850
00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:19,920
Speaker 10: I just can't even imagine just just all of these cases.

851
00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:23,840
Speaker 10: We see just the level of selfishness and self absorbedness

852
00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 10: in these in these girls, and just treating these babies

853
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:30,719
Speaker 10: just like garbage just absolutely blows my mind.

854
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:35,360
Speaker 2: Like garbage in every way putting it, putting babies in trash, throwing.

855
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:37,799
Speaker 1: Them in dumpsters. I want you to hear it from

856
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:39,279
Speaker 1: the horse's mouth, Chris.

857
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:43,200
Speaker 2: Here's Skylar Richardson stating that she tried to cremate the

858
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 2: baby just a little.

859
00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 13: Kind tells that you have to tell you to hear that.

860
00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:54,440
Speaker 4: A little.

861
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:01,760
Speaker 1: I want to be very clear.

862
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:08,720
Speaker 2: At this juncture, Lincoln Snelling is not charged with murder.

863
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:13,719
Speaker 2: We are also learning that her roommates could hear her

864
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:18,000
Speaker 2: giving birth and then snuck in when she left to

865
00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:22,239
Speaker 2: go to McDonald's to find the baby stuffed in her

866
00:50:22,360 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 2: closet hours later. Snelling reportedly tells the roommates the noise

867
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:31,719
Speaker 2: they heard was when she quote fell over passing out

868
00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:36,440
Speaker 2: from a routine illness. When the roommates find the baby

869
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 2: in the closet, they till the dispatcher at nine one one.

870
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:45,560
Speaker 2: The infant was quote cold to the touch. After her arrest,

871
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:49,239
Speaker 2: Snelling withdraws from school and is no longer a member

872
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:52,640
Speaker 2: of the stunt team. Hey, she's got bigger problems than

873
00:50:52,680 --> 00:50:58,440
Speaker 2: that Leaving the stunt Team. Lincoln Snelling needs to.

874
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:01,440
Speaker 1: Consider life behind bars and what that will be like.

875
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:07,439
Speaker 1: We wait as just as suppose. Goodbye friend,