1
00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:09,239
Speaker 1: Welcome back to Sheep Pivots. I'm Sally Christisen. Welcome back

2
00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:13,280
Speaker 1: to Sheep Pivots. I'm your host, Emily Tish Sussman. When

3
00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:15,320
Speaker 1: I was planning this season, I wanted to make sure

4
00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,840
Speaker 1: she pivots was a means for building connections. I said

5
00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:21,759
Speaker 1: during our season launch party that we're the generation of

6
00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:24,720
Speaker 1: women who build bridges and don't tear each other down.

7
00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:27,520
Speaker 2: And she pivots as a way to empower women to.

8
00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:30,600
Speaker 1: Look inward, to find success for themselves and not buy

9
00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:31,840
Speaker 1: society standards.

10
00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:33,280
Speaker 2: And it's working.

11
00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:36,880
Speaker 1: We're seeing a substantial change in the way women think

12
00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,280
Speaker 1: about and talk about their lives and their careers. I'm

13
00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:43,080
Speaker 1: so excited to dig deeper into these pivotal moments through

14
00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:45,920
Speaker 1: these shorter, more conversational.

15
00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:47,800
Speaker 2: Candid conbos this season. Let's jump right in.

16
00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:55,000
Speaker 1: If you know me, you know I love an argent

17
00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:58,480
Speaker 1: suit and I'm so excited to have these. Sally Christison

18
00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:01,800
Speaker 1: on the show today to talk about how she's transforming

19
00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:06,039
Speaker 1: the businesswear industry for women. Her famous hot pink suit

20
00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:10,200
Speaker 1: has been worn by Kerrie Washington, Ashley Graham, Governor Gretchen Whitmar,

21
00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:14,759
Speaker 1: or Big Gretch, and so many more. She's truly defined

22
00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:17,480
Speaker 1: how women think about work wear, and she doesn't seem

23
00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:21,160
Speaker 1: to be slowing down. Stay tuned for another inspiring and

24
00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:22,319
Speaker 1: cantid conversation.

25
00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:28,400
Speaker 3: My name is Sally Christensen. I'm the founder and CEO

26
00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:29,160
Speaker 3: of Argent.

27
00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:32,280
Speaker 1: Okay, so we'll do we'll just do like a little

28
00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:35,400
Speaker 1: like just a quick background here. Where did you grow up?

29
00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:37,520
Speaker 1: What did you see yourself doing when you grew up?

30
00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:40,360
Speaker 1: Were you dancing around in suits?

31
00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:41,800
Speaker 2: Not at all.

32
00:01:41,959 --> 00:01:44,440
Speaker 3: I grew up in Hardyville, South Carolina, on a farm.

33
00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:48,760
Speaker 3: I spent my summers in Turkey. So my dad's Turkish

34
00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:52,120
Speaker 3: and my mom is very Southern, and that combination shaped

35
00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:55,520
Speaker 3: a lot of who I am. Entrepreneurial, That's what I am.

36
00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:59,760
Speaker 3: With that said, I think that my upbringing shaped a

37
00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:02,640
Speaker 3: lot of what I'm doing now because I grew up

38
00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:05,120
Speaker 3: in a place that I didn't feel like I had

39
00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:08,200
Speaker 3: a lot of modeling or options in terms of what

40
00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:10,000
Speaker 3: career could look like because I was in the Southeast,

41
00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:13,560
Speaker 3: which is really banking, law and healthcare.

42
00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,280
Speaker 1: Well, when you say that that your your dad being

43
00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:20,160
Speaker 1: Turkish and your mom being very Southern shaped you like,

44
00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:21,840
Speaker 1: what traits of theirs?

45
00:02:22,040 --> 00:02:23,919
Speaker 2: Was it their relationship. Was it each of their own

46
00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:25,200
Speaker 2: traits that shaped.

47
00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:28,480
Speaker 3: You well, I think having the perspective that I did,

48
00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:32,720
Speaker 3: like from traveling to Turkey quite frequently. I just it's

49
00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:37,760
Speaker 3: a completely different culture. It's much more familial. My dad's

50
00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:42,160
Speaker 3: one of ten siblings. I have one bajillion cousins. And

51
00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:45,519
Speaker 3: we would spend our summers in Kumba and we'd all

52
00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,239
Speaker 3: stay in this one apartment building. Kumba is a small

53
00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:51,880
Speaker 3: beach town outside of Istanbul, and we would spend our

54
00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:54,560
Speaker 3: days going from one floor to the other to the

55
00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:57,560
Speaker 3: other and seeing different aunts and uncles, seeing my grandmother,

56
00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:02,079
Speaker 3: seeing like our great aunt, and it was just so special,

57
00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:07,160
Speaker 3: and it gave me such an appreciation for Islam, for

58
00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:10,119
Speaker 3: the Middle East, just for you know, all of these

59
00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,160
Speaker 3: things that I grew up, you know, that was half

60
00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:15,480
Speaker 3: of who I am. And I also grew up speaking Turkish,

61
00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:17,800
Speaker 3: so it just really is a huge part of me.

62
00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:22,240
Speaker 3: And then the South is the South. I'm really grateful

63
00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,680
Speaker 3: to have had that because I think it gives me

64
00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,080
Speaker 3: a deep understanding of what's happening in our country right now.

65
00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:30,760
Speaker 3: But it was a really special place. Like I spent

66
00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:33,480
Speaker 3: most of my days outdoors. I would go jump on

67
00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:36,360
Speaker 3: a horse and ride bareback, like been doing very dangerous things,

68
00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:40,640
Speaker 3: very adventurous things, but as a really spirited child. But

69
00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:42,960
Speaker 3: I think that like a lot of people don't really

70
00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:46,440
Speaker 3: get out of South Carolina. So the fact that I

71
00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:48,840
Speaker 3: got the option to do that with these trips to

72
00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:50,400
Speaker 3: Turkey really gave me perspective.

73
00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, a spirited child, I have one of those. I

74
00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:56,440
Speaker 2: know that two of those. I know how that goes.

75
00:03:57,200 --> 00:03:59,760
Speaker 1: That's so interesting. First of all, one of ten siblings

76
00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:03,440
Speaker 1: my mind. But I mean Argent is about the work woman,

77
00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:06,600
Speaker 1: which is so interesting. What I loved that broadsheet, Like,

78
00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:08,560
Speaker 1: I love the way the broadsheet was framed by the

79
00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:10,120
Speaker 1: way like you are honing in on that, and I'm

80
00:04:10,120 --> 00:04:11,240
Speaker 1: going to get back to that later.

81
00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:14,080
Speaker 2: Was your mom a professional? Did she wear suits?

82
00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:18,360
Speaker 3: No? My mom was, and this was pretty consistent with

83
00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:21,640
Speaker 3: all of my friends. She was a mom and she

84
00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:25,760
Speaker 3: was the best, and she very much shaped who I am.

85
00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:29,120
Speaker 3: She's she right now works the farm, like that's her

86
00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:32,000
Speaker 3: dream as to drive a tractor and to be on

87
00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:35,320
Speaker 3: her own. And she's very tough, and I think that

88
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:38,240
Speaker 3: she inspired a lot of who I am. But no,

89
00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:40,599
Speaker 3: I think that the modeling that I saw from a

90
00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:47,240
Speaker 3: work perspective came more from television, my dad, my parents

91
00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:52,840
Speaker 3: raising me without really putting gender norms on me, and

92
00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:56,279
Speaker 3: so I used to my dad's a he's an entrepreneur.

93
00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:58,359
Speaker 3: He had a rug shop that he which is pretty

94
00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:02,240
Speaker 3: typical that he ran out of our house when I

95
00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:05,160
Speaker 3: was really young and then had a shop in Hilton Head,

96
00:05:05,200 --> 00:05:07,720
Speaker 3: South Carolina, and I used to go with him, and

97
00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:09,640
Speaker 3: it was there that I remember being like, all I

98
00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:11,599
Speaker 3: want is like a stapler and a desk, like the

99
00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:13,760
Speaker 3: Internet didn't even exist, but I was like, I just

100
00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,159
Speaker 3: want to work, like this is this speaks to me.

101
00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:19,920
Speaker 1: Do you remember who it was on TV that modeled

102
00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,640
Speaker 1: for you, Like I feel like maybe Murphy Brown, Katie Kuric,

103
00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:23,599
Speaker 1: Katie Kuric.

104
00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:28,400
Speaker 3: But I also watched like the NBA is as you know,

105
00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:30,360
Speaker 3: it's like one of my favorite things on the planet.

106
00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,680
Speaker 3: But also watching Men and Women. I think I think

107
00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:36,479
Speaker 3: both were modeling for me. But I've grew up, you know,

108
00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,000
Speaker 3: at the age of five watching Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen,

109
00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:43,719
Speaker 3: et Cetera, Rosio O'Donnell. But I was really just consuming

110
00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:46,039
Speaker 3: a lot of magazines, reading a lot of books, all

111
00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:49,520
Speaker 3: kinds of things. There's no one person that really jumps out.

112
00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:51,720
Speaker 3: But it was really like men and women that I

113
00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,440
Speaker 3: was you know, it's pretty typical of kids our age.

114
00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:56,560
Speaker 1: I feel, yeah, okay, I was thinking a lot about

115
00:05:56,560 --> 00:05:59,880
Speaker 1: this in preparing for this conversation with you. You all

116
00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:04,680
Speaker 1: please describe your father as an entrepreneur, which like when

117
00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:06,520
Speaker 1: does someone get the title of entrepreneur?

118
00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:08,919
Speaker 2: Like what about it? Did you give him the title?

119
00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,919
Speaker 1: Like what makes someone an entrepreneur versus a small business

120
00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:15,520
Speaker 1: owner versus like opening a lot of business or one business?

121
00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:18,320
Speaker 3: Like why do you describe him that way? So I

122
00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:20,440
Speaker 3: actually think my mom will hate this. But my dad

123
00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:25,080
Speaker 3: grew up with no running water. They would share clothes

124
00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,960
Speaker 3: to be able to go to school, and he started

125
00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,400
Speaker 3: selling water in the Turkish bazaars at the age of five,

126
00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:36,000
Speaker 3: and he was constantly having to hustle to make money

127
00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:38,240
Speaker 3: for his family in order for them to put food

128
00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:42,120
Speaker 3: on the table. And through doing that, he learned so

129
00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:46,040
Speaker 3: many languages. I mean, he is such a lovely, special

130
00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:49,360
Speaker 3: human being, and he learned so much about people and

131
00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,919
Speaker 3: different cultures. And I was just such an ambitious person

132
00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:58,280
Speaker 3: by necessity, to be honest, But he is the third

133
00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:03,159
Speaker 3: in the family, and there's a lot of pressure on men,

134
00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:08,160
Speaker 3: especially you know, antiquated, outdated gender and expectations. But there

135
00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:10,600
Speaker 3: was a lot of pressure on him to provide for

136
00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:14,560
Speaker 3: the family. And so then, you know, he worked his

137
00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:17,600
Speaker 3: entire life and then he worked in the bazaars and

138
00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:21,600
Speaker 3: Turkey selling rugs eventually, and that's where he met my

139
00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:23,800
Speaker 3: mom and they I mean.

140
00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:25,840
Speaker 2: That's the whole story in and of itself. It's fantastic.

141
00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:29,360
Speaker 3: But then he moved back with her eventually and opened

142
00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,320
Speaker 3: his own rugshop. But I mean, just the sheer nature

143
00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:36,120
Speaker 3: of what he's always done is like, define whatever it

144
00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:38,800
Speaker 3: is that he's going to be selling, and he owns

145
00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:41,240
Speaker 3: the entire experience and process of that and the good

146
00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:42,280
Speaker 3: and the bad that comes with that.

147
00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:44,200
Speaker 2: Okay, but now I want to hear about how your

148
00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:44,680
Speaker 2: parent's met.

149
00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:50,920
Speaker 3: So my mom she comes from a more privileged background,

150
00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:54,440
Speaker 3: so I'll say that, so their backgrounds are very, very.

151
00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:56,119
Speaker 2: Different, which is also shaped who I am.

152
00:07:56,360 --> 00:07:58,880
Speaker 3: She went abroad after graduating from college with a group

153
00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:03,800
Speaker 3: of friends and they did this six month trek through Europe.

154
00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:06,200
Speaker 3: They went into Russia and they were in Turkey for

155
00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:09,840
Speaker 3: a short stint and while they were there, their tour guide,

156
00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:14,120
Speaker 3: who was Turkish, was bringing them through Istanbul, and my

157
00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:16,600
Speaker 3: dad saw my mom at a post office and asked

158
00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:19,360
Speaker 3: her to go out with him, and she politely declined.

159
00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:23,080
Speaker 3: And then later that day they were in the bazaar

160
00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:25,000
Speaker 3: and he saw her again and asked her out, and

161
00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:29,440
Speaker 3: she'd declined again, and then he convinced the tour guide

162
00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:31,880
Speaker 3: to ask her best friend so they could do a

163
00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:35,640
Speaker 3: double date to make her more comfortable. They went out

164
00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:39,600
Speaker 3: that night. He took her rowing his big grower, and

165
00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:44,679
Speaker 3: then they finished. My mom and her group finished their

166
00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:47,480
Speaker 3: trip and she ended up moving back to Turkey in

167
00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:49,199
Speaker 3: with my dad, which she used to be the story

168
00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:51,640
Speaker 3: I told us if it's normal, and now that I'm

169
00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:56,440
Speaker 3: an adult, I'm like, oh, that's wild. Wild, I'm like, yeah, totally.

170
00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:58,600
Speaker 3: Then she just moved in with him and stayed there

171
00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:01,360
Speaker 3: for a year to the wait where my very traditional

172
00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:04,440
Speaker 3: grandfather was writing letters to Turkey threatening my dad to

173
00:09:04,480 --> 00:09:07,320
Speaker 3: like send his daughter home, and then they ended up

174
00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:10,839
Speaker 3: moving back to Asheville, North Carolina, which is where my parents.

175
00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:16,200
Speaker 3: My grandparents were in retirement and eventually got married. But

176
00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:18,880
Speaker 3: they're still married forty something plus years.

177
00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:20,600
Speaker 2: I could do the Math forty eight.

178
00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:23,360
Speaker 3: But the best part of the story is actually that

179
00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,760
Speaker 3: the other couple is also married living in Ashville, North Carolina.

180
00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:30,400
Speaker 2: No, that is wild. Yeah.

181
00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:34,800
Speaker 1: Wow, the matches that happen in a Turkish bazaar are

182
00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:38,040
Speaker 1: like better than mumble, Like, this is unbelievable.

183
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:39,040
Speaker 2: Yeah.

184
00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:41,520
Speaker 3: So that's really what I hope to take away of

185
00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:43,840
Speaker 3: this episode to be is for everyone to rush to

186
00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:46,800
Speaker 3: Turkey to the bazaar that's looking for a relationship.

187
00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:48,120
Speaker 2: It's there.

188
00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:51,400
Speaker 1: Do you think that that's sort of like pick up

189
00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:56,160
Speaker 1: and move, like pick up and go story, really, like

190
00:09:56,200 --> 00:09:58,480
Speaker 1: you really internalize that, like as a normal thing to do,

191
00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:01,480
Speaker 1: because when you graduated college, you just picked up and

192
00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,000
Speaker 1: moved to Chicago like you didn't know anyone, you didn't

193
00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:04,680
Speaker 1: have a job.

194
00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:09,200
Speaker 3: Yes, I'm probably inspired by my parents for sure. I

195
00:10:09,240 --> 00:10:12,800
Speaker 3: think that they did a really great job raising me.

196
00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:14,560
Speaker 2: I just I love them very much.

197
00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:17,720
Speaker 3: I have an older brother, and they gave me the

198
00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,320
Speaker 3: confidence to just pursue whatever felt right.

199
00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:23,640
Speaker 2: And I think my entire upbringing.

200
00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:25,640
Speaker 3: As much as I appreciate and loved being raised in

201
00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:27,640
Speaker 3: the Southeast, it was obviously that's not really where I

202
00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:30,360
Speaker 3: was meant to be. Long Like in my adulthood, and

203
00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:34,120
Speaker 3: so after college, I knew I wanted a big city,

204
00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:36,679
Speaker 3: and everyone kept saying New York was way too big,

205
00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:38,520
Speaker 3: which I would have loved New York, you know, but

206
00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:41,280
Speaker 3: I was like, Okay, what's like the next next option?

207
00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,720
Speaker 2: So I just chose Chicago and moved there sight unseen.

208
00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:48,560
Speaker 2: Were you prepared for the wind? Yes, you knew it

209
00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:51,920
Speaker 2: was coming. Nope, I was prepared for whatever was going

210
00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:54,960
Speaker 2: to come my way. I figured it out. How did

211
00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:56,880
Speaker 2: you figure it? Like? Did you get off the plane

212
00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:01,000
Speaker 2: and went where I'd scout? Did so.

213
00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:07,200
Speaker 3: Through I studied abroad my senior year in college, and

214
00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:10,280
Speaker 3: I met kids from all over the country, and when

215
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,680
Speaker 3: we came back, we would do these reunions. And one

216
00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:16,600
Speaker 3: of those reunions took place in the University of Oregon

217
00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:19,920
Speaker 3: and one of my best friends from studying abroad was

218
00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:23,280
Speaker 3: his best friend from growing up is now my husband.

219
00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:26,040
Speaker 3: But I met him during one of those trips. Was

220
00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:29,800
Speaker 3: the last week of college, Dave. Dave moved to Chicago.

221
00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,800
Speaker 3: So Dave, who I met one time, was in Chicago

222
00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:35,800
Speaker 3: and I was like, can I come check out apartments?

223
00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:38,800
Speaker 3: And like, will you just show me around? He was

224
00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:40,679
Speaker 3: definitely not interested. In a relationship at that point and

225
00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,040
Speaker 3: had a lot of growth in front of him. But

226
00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:46,240
Speaker 3: that was like my only real connection to the city.

227
00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:49,719
Speaker 3: And I found an apartment, went home, packed up my car,

228
00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:52,960
Speaker 3: drove to the city, and then just started networking.

229
00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:55,160
Speaker 2: Wait, okay, this is a new element of this.

230
00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:01,240
Speaker 1: Was there an underlying there that you were like, well,

231
00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:02,760
Speaker 1: let me just see what happens if I'm in the

232
00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:04,640
Speaker 1: same city as Dave or not, even like it was

233
00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:05,520
Speaker 1: totally platonic.

234
00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:07,160
Speaker 2: I think it was more.

235
00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:10,520
Speaker 3: I think I was more focused on my career at

236
00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:14,200
Speaker 3: that point, and that the happy coincidence of where things

237
00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,400
Speaker 3: have gone with Dave is, you know, just the upside

238
00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:18,320
Speaker 3: of that choice.

239
00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:21,440
Speaker 1: So did it take a while before you guys started years?

240
00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:23,559
Speaker 2: Years before? Did you say friends the whole time? Are

241
00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:25,680
Speaker 2: you just again at a Turkish bazaar to run?

242
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:30,280
Speaker 3: We both went to Turkey, but we we a lot

243
00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:34,440
Speaker 3: of my friend group was formed through Dave's friend group

244
00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,800
Speaker 3: as well, So like a friend of theirs growing up

245
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:38,640
Speaker 3: had gone to Northwestern, so we became friends with a

246
00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:39,880
Speaker 3: lot of kids from Northwestern.

247
00:12:40,679 --> 00:12:42,040
Speaker 2: I was just really social at.

248
00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:43,920
Speaker 3: That stage, and we didn't have phones, we didn't use

249
00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:45,560
Speaker 3: technology in the same way, so we were really like

250
00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:49,400
Speaker 3: forced to get out and just be social. Yeah, and

251
00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:51,360
Speaker 3: those were some of the best years of my life

252
00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:54,880
Speaker 3: because you're not close enough to family, so your friends

253
00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:58,679
Speaker 3: become your family and you have to really I mean,

254
00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:02,800
Speaker 3: there's so much learning your early twenties. And I actually

255
00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:05,480
Speaker 3: sat around after college for a long time waiting for

256
00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:07,760
Speaker 3: someone who would live with me, and I was so

257
00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:10,280
Speaker 3: annoyed because everyone would like fake commit and then just

258
00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,280
Speaker 3: not really not really like do it. And so I

259
00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:15,280
Speaker 3: finally just did it on my own because I was

260
00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,000
Speaker 3: so annoyed by that. I have a very real bias

261
00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:20,439
Speaker 3: for action. And it was the best decision I ever made.

262
00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:21,760
Speaker 3: Its firt of set me on the past that I

263
00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,200
Speaker 3: this journey and we've moved a lot though since then,

264
00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:26,199
Speaker 3: but it just sort of gave me the confidence, I think,

265
00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:29,680
Speaker 3: to just take big risks and put myself out there and.

266
00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:30,559
Speaker 2: It all works out.

267
00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:32,559
Speaker 1: I feel like you just put language to something that

268
00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:34,480
Speaker 1: I felt my entire life and never known how to

269
00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:37,960
Speaker 1: articulate a bias for action. Oh yeah, did you come

270
00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:39,800
Speaker 1: up with that term yourself? I really feel that.

271
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:40,600
Speaker 2: I sure didn't.

272
00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:45,200
Speaker 3: There was my manager at Cisco used that to describe

273
00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:46,880
Speaker 3: me once and I was like, what does it mean?

274
00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:53,719
Speaker 3: So so then I figured out what it meant and

275
00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:55,240
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, yeah that's me.

276
00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:59,200
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's incredible. I love that came from a manager.

277
00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,760
Speaker 1: I feel like I got like the negative version of

278
00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:08,040
Speaker 1: that in performance reviews. That was like you're always jumping

279
00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:11,560
Speaker 1: ahead of everyone, Like why don't you let the process

280
00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:12,120
Speaker 1: play out?

281
00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:13,000
Speaker 2: Isn't that?

282
00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,760
Speaker 3: So like female specific though, I feel like we get

283
00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:20,760
Speaker 3: the worst professional like guidance sometimes stay in your lane,

284
00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:25,560
Speaker 3: do less, you know, just be perfect cool, great.

285
00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:29,280
Speaker 1: Totally, so okay, so you got you were always thinking

286
00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:31,440
Speaker 1: about yourself, like you wanted the stapler, the desk, you

287
00:14:31,480 --> 00:14:34,800
Speaker 1: wanted the job, like I love thinking about Like young Sally,

288
00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:37,040
Speaker 1: You're like, I'm here to network and I'm also here

289
00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:38,960
Speaker 1: to be a corporate boss.

290
00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:40,120
Speaker 2: You know what's funny.

291
00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:42,080
Speaker 3: I was actually in Chicago to have a good time.

292
00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:46,600
Speaker 3: So undergrad, I was the worst student on the planet.

293
00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:50,960
Speaker 3: I've really just banked on my like I'm smart enough.

294
00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:52,960
Speaker 3: I like didn't apply myself. So I was like i'll

295
00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:54,880
Speaker 3: get I'll be fine, I'll get like b's and c's

296
00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:55,760
Speaker 3: and we'll call it a day.

297
00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,320
Speaker 2: But I was very social, and I.

298
00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:00,760
Speaker 3: Actually think that that was is one of the best

299
00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:03,800
Speaker 3: decisions I have made. Granted, I'll think, oh, I wish

300
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,440
Speaker 3: I'd spent more time in the library, because that's not

301
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,200
Speaker 3: what I love. Like, I love learning. I'm a total introvert,

302
00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:11,840
Speaker 3: you know. I've really accepted who I am more. But

303
00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:15,360
Speaker 3: in those days, it was a great exercise of like

304
00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,160
Speaker 3: human learning, and that I think is like sixty percent

305
00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,160
Speaker 3: of success, if not more, is understanding people and how

306
00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:27,440
Speaker 3: people operate, and like understanding like your self and how

307
00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:30,520
Speaker 3: to interact with different people and just sort of navigating

308
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:33,680
Speaker 3: and like the networking aspect of things and the life

309
00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:36,600
Speaker 3: aspect of things, and understanding people's motivations, et cetera. So

310
00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:40,680
Speaker 3: I actually think that was really a huge takeaway from undergrad,

311
00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,000
Speaker 3: which I then applied to Chicago because my plan was

312
00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:44,480
Speaker 3: to go back to grad school and I knew that,

313
00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:47,440
Speaker 3: so I just wanted a job that I was learning

314
00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:50,920
Speaker 3: from because I am always wanting to just be learning.

315
00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:54,000
Speaker 3: That's like a that's a trend that you'll see throughout

316
00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:57,000
Speaker 3: all my career choices. But in Chicago, I spent more

317
00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:59,960
Speaker 3: time being social as well. And then once I got

318
00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:02,480
Speaker 3: back into grad school, top of the class, I feel like.

319
00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:06,240
Speaker 1: I am learning so much about myself in this conversation.

320
00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:08,400
Speaker 3: I have like.

321
00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:11,560
Speaker 2: These ways that you are illuminating.

322
00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:14,320
Speaker 1: And reframing choices that I made, like are making me

323
00:16:14,440 --> 00:16:15,160
Speaker 1: reflect on this.

324
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:18,200
Speaker 2: Like. Similarly, I did not do like I was terrible

325
00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:18,680
Speaker 2: in college.

326
00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:23,080
Speaker 1: I was just partying and I but I've never looked

327
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:25,800
Speaker 1: upon that favorably, like I don't tend to look back

328
00:16:25,840 --> 00:16:27,600
Speaker 1: on my own choices with a lot of regret. Like

329
00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:29,400
Speaker 1: I think that regret is sort of like a wasted

330
00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:32,720
Speaker 1: agree a wasted feeling, because I think you learn something

331
00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:34,760
Speaker 1: out of all of it. The one thing I do

332
00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:38,080
Speaker 1: kind of regret is really how little I applied myself

333
00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:38,600
Speaker 1: in college.

334
00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:41,400
Speaker 2: I really missed a lot of opportunity.

335
00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:43,600
Speaker 1: I don't think I was doing any like particularly sophisticated

336
00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:45,840
Speaker 1: thinking about navigating interpersonal relationships.

337
00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:47,640
Speaker 2: I think I was just partying all of the time.

338
00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,160
Speaker 1: But then similarly, I went to law school and I

339
00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,760
Speaker 1: was like a different person, Like it turned on for me.

340
00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:56,400
Speaker 1: I was applied in the first time and similarly graduated

341
00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:57,600
Speaker 1: in the top of my class because I was a

342
00:16:57,680 --> 00:16:58,280
Speaker 1: different person.

343
00:16:58,680 --> 00:16:58,920
Speaker 2: Yep.

344
00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:01,400
Speaker 1: But I didn't know I was going to go to

345
00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:03,560
Speaker 1: grad school. I thought I wasn't smart because I had

346
00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:06,800
Speaker 1: done so badly in college. So what about you gave

347
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:09,280
Speaker 1: you that confidence to think like, oh, I'll just turn

348
00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:10,159
Speaker 1: it on to grad school.

349
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:12,439
Speaker 3: I don't know if it was intentional, like, yeah, I'm

350
00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:16,440
Speaker 3: benefiting from hindsight and these stories. But I have always

351
00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,640
Speaker 3: my parents will say, I've always been confident. And it's

352
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:21,840
Speaker 3: similar to what you said about regret, Like I think

353
00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:25,920
Speaker 3: there's certain things where we own these emotions and we

354
00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:28,960
Speaker 3: deserve to be like kind to ourselves. We deserve to

355
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:32,159
Speaker 3: be confident, and it's a learned trait for some people,

356
00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,919
Speaker 3: you know, but we waste we waste a lot of

357
00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:41,160
Speaker 3: energy on guilt, on shame, on all sorts of things.

358
00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:44,199
Speaker 3: And so it's I don't know, probably like I have

359
00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:47,880
Speaker 3: a natural tendency toward like to be confident, but it's

360
00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:51,359
Speaker 3: something that I wish for everyone because it does shape

361
00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:53,600
Speaker 3: kind of your life experience, you know, But I don't.

362
00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:55,560
Speaker 2: I just have had it. I don't know. I don't

363
00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:55,960
Speaker 2: know why.

364
00:17:56,560 --> 00:17:59,159
Speaker 1: Okay, so you didn't just go to graduate school. You

365
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:03,280
Speaker 1: went to get your MBA. That's really serious. That's a

366
00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:04,560
Speaker 1: really serious question.

367
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:08,600
Speaker 2: In law school's not Yeah, but I thought I was

368
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:09,439
Speaker 2: going to be a lawyer.

369
00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:11,320
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, And I thought I had to go to

370
00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:13,639
Speaker 1: law school because I was going to be a lawyer. Sure,

371
00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:15,440
Speaker 1: Like NBA is just like, well, I think I'm good

372
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:18,080
Speaker 1: at business, and I want to be really good at business.

373
00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:19,199
Speaker 2: You know what it is for me.

374
00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:22,560
Speaker 3: So the way that I operate is I really need context.

375
00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:24,199
Speaker 3: So if you just come at me with like a

376
00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:27,199
Speaker 3: story and it's a piece of something, I struggle a

377
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,639
Speaker 3: little bit if I don't have like full context. So

378
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:34,919
Speaker 3: knowing that about myself, I wanted to get some experience

379
00:18:35,040 --> 00:18:37,480
Speaker 3: after undergrad and I studied business and undergrad as well,

380
00:18:37,880 --> 00:18:40,240
Speaker 3: I wanted some applied experience and I wanted to take

381
00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:41,760
Speaker 3: that back into getting an.

382
00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:44,000
Speaker 2: MBA because I needed a better.

383
00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:47,679
Speaker 3: Understanding of like the major functions of business and in

384
00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:49,560
Speaker 3: your twenties, you know nothing like I think back to

385
00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:51,840
Speaker 3: some of the questions I asked in interviews as if

386
00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:53,600
Speaker 3: I was smart, and I'm like, oh, I sounded just

387
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,879
Speaker 3: so young, you know. And so then I had that

388
00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:59,680
Speaker 3: experience and as part of that, I lived abroad in

389
00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:01,840
Speaker 3: German for a year, which was the draw to this

390
00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:04,679
Speaker 3: particular program. It's the International MBA Program at the University

391
00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:07,160
Speaker 3: of South Carolina, and so I got to live in Germany,

392
00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:09,360
Speaker 3: and then I worked at Daimler as part of that

393
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,120
Speaker 3: and came back got hired at Cisco Systems and they

394
00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:16,919
Speaker 3: have a leadership rotational program. And again it was like

395
00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:20,720
Speaker 3: me wanting to have applied experience on the heels of

396
00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:25,040
Speaker 3: academic experience. All of these choices were intentional to try

397
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:28,080
Speaker 3: and de risk starting my own company, and so I

398
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:30,679
Speaker 3: spent about ten years just trying to understand business as

399
00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:33,359
Speaker 3: best I could and then took the lead.

400
00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:36,200
Speaker 1: So you were always thinking there would be a company

401
00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:37,960
Speaker 1: that you had found. In the end, it wasn't like

402
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:39,320
Speaker 1: I think some people come to this with like a

403
00:19:39,359 --> 00:19:42,240
Speaker 1: specific product in mind or specific function in mind. You

404
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:46,000
Speaker 1: were thinking about skill building. Were you also looking to

405
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,679
Speaker 1: find what that company was going to be or you

406
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:49,880
Speaker 1: just felt like it would come to you.

407
00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:52,600
Speaker 2: This was skill building. I love that articulation.

408
00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:55,439
Speaker 3: That is certainly like it was in the back of

409
00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:57,159
Speaker 3: my mind that I wanted to start a company.

410
00:19:57,280 --> 00:19:57,680
Speaker 2: Period.

411
00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:01,719
Speaker 3: I was passively there. I was not actively thinking what

412
00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:03,840
Speaker 3: company should it be. I just assumed that it would

413
00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,159
Speaker 3: present itself and the timing would present itself. And I

414
00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:10,440
Speaker 3: actually actively tried to not start the company I ended

415
00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:13,119
Speaker 3: up starting because I was like, I really like apparel

416
00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:16,520
Speaker 3: seems tough, you know, and this is not what I do,

417
00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:19,359
Speaker 3: et cetera, et cetera. But it was just sort of

418
00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:22,040
Speaker 3: like undeniably slapping me on the face that this was

419
00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:22,560
Speaker 3: my calling.

420
00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,200
Speaker 1: So here we are, Okay, we're gonna get there, and

421
00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:27,480
Speaker 1: what's get to the founding? But what skills do you

422
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:29,560
Speaker 1: think that you did get? You know, whether it was

423
00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:32,359
Speaker 1: to the international MBA like let's foreshadow a little bit,

424
00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:34,040
Speaker 1: or whether it's like, I mean, ten years at Cisco

425
00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:34,400
Speaker 1: is nothing.

426
00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,360
Speaker 2: It slapped it like that's a serious.

427
00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:38,320
Speaker 1: Not at Cisco, ten years across all of these oh,

428
00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:39,960
Speaker 1: ten years across all of them, but like that's real

429
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:42,280
Speaker 1: time you put in there, Like what you know, if

430
00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:44,359
Speaker 1: the premise of the show is like everything builds us

431
00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:47,160
Speaker 1: to the next thing, Like what skills do you look

432
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:49,320
Speaker 1: back on now? And you were like, thank goodness, I

433
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:54,280
Speaker 1: did international what's it called like import export or you

434
00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:55,399
Speaker 1: know whatever the thing was.

435
00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean there's so many examples of it.

436
00:20:58,080 --> 00:20:59,879
Speaker 3: I think we already touched on the piece about just

437
00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:01,000
Speaker 3: interpersonal skills.

438
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:01,480
Speaker 2: All of that.

439
00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:05,000
Speaker 3: I ended up in client facing roles generally and across

440
00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:08,800
Speaker 3: all of my experiences, and I think that was sort

441
00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:11,639
Speaker 3: of an obvious thing for me with a background like

442
00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:15,080
Speaker 3: waiting tables, et cetera, you know, in my childhood and

443
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:17,879
Speaker 3: so in Chicago, I think there was a lot of

444
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:21,400
Speaker 3: personal development that needed to happen and growth. And then

445
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:25,520
Speaker 3: going into my MBA, I was an adult at twenty four.

446
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:27,639
Speaker 3: You know, we all were just I feel like we

447
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:29,880
Speaker 3: all reached that stage where we're like, I know everything.

448
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:33,159
Speaker 3: But then it was the grad school that I was

449
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:37,080
Speaker 3: forced into different groups and different projects, you know, carrying

450
00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:40,199
Speaker 3: some weight of the team sometimes you know, like mixed

451
00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:43,560
Speaker 3: caliber of partners, but they're like forcing you. And that's

452
00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 3: what all you do in grad school is just work

453
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,119
Speaker 3: together on projects, and so you're like carrying the load

454
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:49,160
Speaker 3: or the weight of the team sometimes and other times

455
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:50,520
Speaker 3: you've got like shared load.

456
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 2: Well let's hope they listen to this podcast and feel

457
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,920
Speaker 2: called out. I just want to name, I'd just like

458
00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:00,600
Speaker 2: to call out I want some accountability for you groups

459
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:01,320
Speaker 2: in this podcast.

460
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:03,320
Speaker 3: I've actually been building up to this moment where I

461
00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:05,520
Speaker 3: can call out the people that forced me to do

462
00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 3: the projects.

463
00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:09,879
Speaker 2: Company, the stores, the l profile. It was all building

464
00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 2: to this moment to call out your people.

465
00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:15,240
Speaker 3: I mean, I just learned so much. Where I learned

466
00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:18,960
Speaker 3: the most though, was definitely Cisco. So Cisco was I

467
00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:22,960
Speaker 3: chose a program. It's Leadership Development rotational program for NBA students.

468
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:25,760
Speaker 3: They put four people in this program every year and

469
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:28,159
Speaker 3: you do six months and all the major functions of

470
00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,840
Speaker 3: supply chain and Cisco as a top ten gartner supply chain.

471
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 3: So in addition to that, because there's like an executive

472
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:37,800
Speaker 3: course that goes along with that where you're getting exposure

473
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 3: to all the like top management at Cisco, which incorporate environments.

474
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:42,400
Speaker 3: I don't know if you've had experience with this, those

475
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:47,280
Speaker 3: are like celebrities, you know, like it's like the weirdest dynamic.

476
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:51,160
Speaker 3: But it was so good because executives in tech at

477
00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:54,760
Speaker 3: that level are excellent at what they do, Like they're

478
00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:58,680
Speaker 3: so smart. They pushed me so much, and I cultivated

479
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 3: these relationships with individuals that really helped me grow personally

480
00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:07,240
Speaker 3: and professionally. I also really like honed my skills, my

481
00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:11,080
Speaker 3: skills set around communication. My favorite saying is, if I'd

482
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 3: had more time, I would have written you a shorter email.

483
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,719
Speaker 3: So good, so good, because it's like you have to

484
00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 3: take into consideration like who you're communicating with and how

485
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,239
Speaker 3: you and what you communicate and how much detail they

486
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:25,360
Speaker 3: need or how you distill it to like one sentence,

487
00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:29,160
Speaker 3: because it's the CEO who is receiving a billion emails,

488
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:32,240
Speaker 3: you know. Yeah, so that consideration is probably what came

489
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:32,840
Speaker 3: from Cisco.

490
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 2: Yeah.

491
00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,480
Speaker 3: The last one is that at Cisco, I made the

492
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:41,119
Speaker 3: intentional choice to join the Cloud Group as which was

493
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:45,639
Speaker 3: a new initiative. They invested two billion dollars into Cloud

494
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:47,760
Speaker 3: they relate to the game, and I was the seventh

495
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:49,320
Speaker 3: person on a team that grew to two fifty in

496
00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:49,760
Speaker 3: a year.

497
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,000
Speaker 2: And that was entrepreneurship. It was you know, I.

498
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:59,200
Speaker 3: Had the luxury of like you know, endless cash essentially

499
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:01,919
Speaker 3: and being able to learn on Cisco's dime. But I

500
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,720
Speaker 3: got to build a team, to find a team, grow

501
00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,120
Speaker 3: a team, manage people for the first time, which is

502
00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:09,919
Speaker 3: really you know, you learn a ton from doing that.

503
00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:13,600
Speaker 3: And then I gained some confidence in myself through doing

504
00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 3: that and felt like, okay, this is the point, Like

505
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 3: I'm ready.

506
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:21,240
Speaker 1: Like I've essentially launched a business without my own risk

507
00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 1: in it.

508
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like I feel like I understand all that I

509
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 3: needed to to go start something.

510
00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:30,479
Speaker 1: I feel like what I'm hearing from you is when

511
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,359
Speaker 1: you say you know you love the context for something.

512
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:35,920
Speaker 1: I also think you give yourself context because if you're

513
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 1: moving through all of these like this rotational program, in

514
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:41,520
Speaker 1: these different positions, where you go into it with the

515
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,080
Speaker 1: mindset of learning, that takes away some of the sting

516
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:48,200
Speaker 1: of like putting our own egos in it, of being like, oh,

517
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 1: I got feedback and I didn't do it right, and

518
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:53,040
Speaker 1: I'm trying or you know, like or maybe I'm trying

519
00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:54,600
Speaker 1: to stay in the same position because i know that

520
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:55,920
Speaker 1: I'm doing it really well and I'm too scared to

521
00:24:55,960 --> 00:25:00,240
Speaker 1: try something else. We're going to take a short break

522
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 1: for some ads. Now back to the show. But like,

523
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,800
Speaker 1: I hear your mindset going into it as a learning mindset,

524
00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: and then I think you were able to get so

525
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:13,479
Speaker 1: much more from it.

526
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:14,919
Speaker 2: I love that observation.

527
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:18,359
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that we give up too much power

528
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:23,000
Speaker 3: sometimes to our jobs and to our employers and it

529
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 3: should be a mutually beneficial relationship. And for me, and

530
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:29,919
Speaker 3: we've touched on the fact that I'm a confident person,

531
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 3: but I do walk in with confidence that if it's

532
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:35,480
Speaker 3: not working out, and let's say I do lose my job,

533
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 3: then I can find another job, no harm, no foul.

534
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 3: But if I'm not my like authentic self and speaking

535
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 3: my mind and going after problems and trying to learn

536
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:48,240
Speaker 3: and doing all these things, like, that's not fulfilling to me.

537
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 3: And on the flip side, to walk in scared that

538
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:53,159
Speaker 3: I'm going to lose my job is just not a

539
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 3: great dynamic. And so I think my approach to employment

540
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,119
Speaker 3: has always been how many jobs in the world are they? Like?

541
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:03,159
Speaker 3: Can I just get a like this is going to

542
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:05,919
Speaker 3: be a good experience, and I'm going to learn from it,

543
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 3: And I always want to make sure that I'm in

544
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 3: a position where I'm learning.

545
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:08,920
Speaker 2: Well.

546
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:11,399
Speaker 1: Starting your own company is definitely being in a position

547
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:16,399
Speaker 1: of constantly learning, but you do become very attached to it,

548
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:19,639
Speaker 1: like it is your vision. So you went through this,

549
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:23,560
Speaker 1: you felt prepared for it. How did the specific product

550
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 1: lane come to you in that moment?

551
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 2: You mean, how did I land on Argent? Yeah? Like,

552
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 2: how did you land on Argent?

553
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:33,280
Speaker 3: I have always been frustrated by the fact that nobody

554
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:38,119
Speaker 3: is catering to the professional woman from a war droming perspective.

555
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:40,119
Speaker 3: My mom will tell you, like we went to a

556
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:43,399
Speaker 3: number of places for my first job interview to just

557
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,440
Speaker 3: find a suit, and how much I would complain about

558
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:47,840
Speaker 3: it because there was just it was such an afterthought

559
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 3: for these legacy brands, and you know, I was just

560
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:54,280
Speaker 3: always sort of sour about it, and I think about

561
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,879
Speaker 3: what I wore across all my experiences, and I was

562
00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 3: never deriving confidence from it. It was always such a

563
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:03,240
Speaker 3: time suck to find anything, let alone something I felt

564
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 3: decent in. And I worked across different industries that all

565
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:08,440
Speaker 3: call for different dress codes, like it was a whole thing,

566
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 3: you know. And then when I was at Cisco, I

567
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 3: read a study that showed that women are judge based

568
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 3: on appearance, and I quantified the impact of what you

569
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 3: wear on your bottom.

570
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:19,040
Speaker 2: Line of your lifetime and that was all it took.

571
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 3: I was like, Okay, you know what, I have thought

572
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 3: about this long enough. In a decade, no one has

573
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:28,360
Speaker 3: innovated the category from a product perspective, and I see

574
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 3: an opportunity to do that. I'm at the forefront of

575
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 3: the casualization of the workforce. Women in tech are really

576
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,000
Speaker 3: being left to their own devices because there is no

577
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:39,879
Speaker 3: model of dress in tech. No one's setting the dress

578
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,639
Speaker 3: code outside of a few men. I just saw a

579
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 3: real opportunity to create a work where authority that was

580
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:54,280
Speaker 3: a resource to these powerhouse women across you know, every industry,

581
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,200
Speaker 3: every city, and really it's a time constrained, ambitious woman

582
00:27:58,240 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 3: that doesn't really want to be thinking about it, but

583
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 3: she does want to wear something.

584
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 2: She goes grat in.

585
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,200
Speaker 3: Everyone does because we derive confidence from what we wear.

586
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:08,119
Speaker 3: So I think I saw an opportunity from a product perspective,

587
00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 3: and then I'm sure as obvious now on the mission side,

588
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 3: I had a front receipt to a lot of misogyny

589
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:25,440
Speaker 3: throughout my childhood into my career, and I'm very, very

590
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,879
Speaker 3: much I mean, someone who just loves women and feels

591
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:34,159
Speaker 3: that they deserve equal opportunities. And I saw how that

592
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,439
Speaker 3: conversation was being handled and how everyone was sort of

593
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 3: checking boxes, but it didn't feel like anything was really

594
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:45,719
Speaker 3: changing the narrative and impacting in a meaningful way. And

595
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 3: this was in twenty fifteen, and it almost got to

596
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 3: the point where we were talking about it so much

597
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 3: that people assumed that change had happened, but it wasn't happening.

598
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,440
Speaker 3: And I'd like remember talking to people about this idea

599
00:28:57,560 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 3: for Argent in twenty fifteen, and they're like, Oh, We're

600
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 3: about to have our first female president. How could you

601
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 3: say that so many people, But to me, the conversation

602
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 3: just wasn't nuanced in any capacity. And I saw an

603
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:12,480
Speaker 3: opportunity to do that through a brand, because I think

604
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 3: that brands are the most powerful thing in the world

605
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 3: and can have very real impact with their platforms.

606
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 2: And the gap that I touched on.

607
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 3: Earlier that I saw was that no one was catering

608
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 3: to the professional woman from a product perspective, but also

609
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:32,720
Speaker 3: no one was capturing those women through their visuals. No

610
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:35,239
Speaker 3: one was celebrating the women that I was seeing at

611
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 3: Cisco day and day out, and like telling their story

612
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 3: in a way that encourages women to just pursue whatever

613
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,480
Speaker 3: it is that they want to and gave them representation

614
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 3: and allowed them to see themselves in all walks of life.

615
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 3: And so I wanted to do that through the brand

616
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 3: and really serve as a resource.

617
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 1: As you're again, you're making me think about, like reflecting

618
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,400
Speaker 1: so much in my own life, like the choices that

619
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:58,960
Speaker 1: I've made. I always wanted to be a costume designer.

620
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 1: What I almost went to art school.

621
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 2: Oh, I love that.

622
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:06,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel very strongly about how that you put

623
00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:09,240
Speaker 1: on your armor, like you are reflecting the way you

624
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: want to feel, the confidence you want to bring into

625
00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 1: a room. And so I've always I kind of fluctuated

626
00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 1: in the way that I've dressed, like either like very

627
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: wild or then I was like, now I'm a law student,

628
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 1: this is corporate me.

629
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 2: And so I don't think I ever told this.

630
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:23,480
Speaker 1: You know how people like notoriously take the bar in

631
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 1: their pajamas, like people like that, Oh, this is like

632
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 1: a thing. They're like, oh god, I've been like studying

633
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:31,280
Speaker 1: so hard I can't even get dressed. Yeah, well, I

634
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 1: did the exact opposite that. I had to look like

635
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,479
Speaker 1: a lawyer, and so I took my only suit and

636
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 1: I wore it to every single exam I took in

637
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:40,560
Speaker 1: law school, and I wore it to every single day

638
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 1: of the bar.

639
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:42,240
Speaker 2: Head to toe.

640
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:44,959
Speaker 1: I wore a suit, I wore a shirt, I wore heels,

641
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 1: I wore jewelry that I would have to take off

642
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:48,880
Speaker 1: so we didn't bang on the desk when I wrote

643
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 1: in because I had to dress like it. And then

644
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 1: you know, I moved to Washington and I worked in

645
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:54,360
Speaker 1: military policy and so I had like an all black

646
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: suit look for that, probably a lot of Ann Taylor.

647
00:30:58,000 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 1: I feel like that's just generally people who were wearing

648
00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: a Washington. And then as soon as I left the

649
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 1: military policy job, I was like, well, now I'll dress

650
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,160
Speaker 1: the way I want, although not really so Washington, but

651
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:08,720
Speaker 1: there was no middle ground for me.

652
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,440
Speaker 3: Yeah. Oh that's so fascinating. Also, let's not write off

653
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,480
Speaker 3: costume designing. Thank you so much. Yeah, just saying I

654
00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 3: still kind of dress.

655
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 2: Like I'm in costume.

656
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,960
Speaker 3: I think that though, is like when I talk about

657
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 3: the study and like awareness of the fact that you're

658
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 3: being judge based on appearance. I think that it's good

659
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 3: to be aware that there is very much gender inequity

660
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 3: in our society. But I also think we've tried to

661
00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 3: flip that to focusing on giving women confidence and what

662
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:41,920
Speaker 3: they're wearing and giving them options that make them feel

663
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 3: like their best self. Yeah, and like their authentic self.

664
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 3: And it also serves as armor. So it's like, you know,

665
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 3: when you step into and this was me at Cisco,

666
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 3: a room full of men and you're the only woman.

667
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 3: You want to feel the part you want to look,

668
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:58,479
Speaker 3: the part you want to feel. Your best, you know,

669
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 3: and I can dissect also of you know, things that

670
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,800
Speaker 3: happen and why it matters around that. But I think

671
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 3: that it is so important that we find clothes that

672
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 3: make us feel our best into and we can use

673
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 3: that to our advantage, especially in like a corporate setting.

674
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:14,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you want to feel your best.

675
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:18,000
Speaker 1: But I think the era of the black suit, you know,

676
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:20,400
Speaker 1: when I was doing it, when I had to as

677
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:23,200
Speaker 1: a lobbyist and a military policy, I didn't feel like

678
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: I could bring any of myself into it. Yeah, and

679
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 1: so I think I was downplaying my own perspective and experiences,

680
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:34,800
Speaker 1: like I was only there as a vessel to.

681
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 2: Communicate on behalf of our clients.

682
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 1: I think if I had had something where I could

683
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 1: feel like I was dressing more aligned with myself, then

684
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 1: maybe I would have had more confidence to bring my

685
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 1: own perspective into it as well.

686
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 3: Yes.

687
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:48,280
Speaker 1: And by the way, my kids wear uniforms and Fridays

688
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 1: are dressed down days, and my four year old was

689
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,960
Speaker 1: a costume every single Friday.

690
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 2: Is that your spirited one? She's my spirited Yeah?

691
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 3: Are okay? Our daughter is daughters? Yeah, it would be

692
00:32:58,840 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 3: of course. Yeah, best mines on four two, and she

693
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 3: is a lot of costumes, a lot of costumes.

694
00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:05,880
Speaker 1: Love.

695
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 2: I encourage. I think it's great.

696
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 1: Like, if this is how you feel you want to

697
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 1: express yourself today, it's Unicorn day, it's mermaid. I actually

698
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 1: today she went to school in a wolf costume.

699
00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 2: That's great.

700
00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:18,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's perfect. Okay, So you entered a new category

701
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:20,959
Speaker 1: of apparel. This is not I mean, even though you

702
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:25,320
Speaker 1: had sort of entrepreneurship, a lot of tactical experience, leadership experience,

703
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 1: apparel was new. And I feel like, maybe I'm maybe

704
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 1: generalizing here, but I feel like most people that go

705
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: into a pail actually don't come from a business background.

706
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 2: They come from like a design background. That's right.

707
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:38,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, So how do you think you had unique challenges?

708
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:40,720
Speaker 1: And then how could you have solved them with your background?

709
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:41,680
Speaker 1: How did you solve them?

710
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:42,040
Speaker 2: Yeah?

711
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 3: So I think that business is sometimes like underappreciated or undervalued,

712
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 3: and it's important in every business, business and business. But uh,

713
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:57,600
Speaker 3: but I do think that my skill set could be

714
00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 3: applied to a lot of different categories. Like that's just

715
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 3: the sheer nature of business and that excites me. That's

716
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 3: why I was drawn to it. When it comes to apparel,

717
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 3: it is a very challenging category. And I had seen

718
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 3: a lot of people actually start businesses focused on women's work,

719
00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 3: were they all looked the same. No one was innovating,

720
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 3: and it felt as if oftentimes the consumer was then

721
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 3: designing the product, so it would be the equivalent of

722
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:30,000
Speaker 3: me then designing the product, which is I would not

723
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:33,000
Speaker 3: be here if I had done it that way, because nobody's.

724
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 2: Going to want to wear what I'm designing.

725
00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 3: Similar to our careers and like you know how we've

726
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 3: taken a not so linear path, but like everything's built

727
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 3: up to this point, there are so many talented men

728
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:48,240
Speaker 3: and women who are pursuing creative careers focused on product design,

729
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:52,640
Speaker 3: and you know, they are creative aspects of any business

730
00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 3: that go hand in hand with that skill set. And

731
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:56,759
Speaker 3: so I knew out of the gates that I was

732
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 3: going to need to find creative counterpart, and that's always

733
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 3: been represented with an argent Our creative director now she

734
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 3: joined us three years ago, is unbelievably talented. I mean,

735
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:13,040
Speaker 3: she's twenty plus years in design, She's worked across a

736
00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:17,920
Speaker 3: number of incredible companies, and she's designing the product. She's

737
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:20,640
Speaker 3: picking the color palette, et cetera. And I'm the consumer

738
00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:24,839
Speaker 3: and it's very much collaborative, but I'm pretty hands off,

739
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,319
Speaker 3: like she's the expert. And I think you have to

740
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 3: recognize what you know and what your blind spots are.

741
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 3: And I was very aware that that was pretty critical

742
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:37,920
Speaker 3: to building a product led company. Can you talk us through?

743
00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 1: I mean, what every entrepreneur says is that the things

744
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 1: they don't know once they start end up kind of

745
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 1: defining the first couple of years.

746
00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:51,759
Speaker 2: Okay, let me set up. Yeah, yeah, yeah, come here.

747
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:55,400
Speaker 1: Can you talk us through a couple of those Like,

748
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 1: you know, you decided to produce in the US, which

749
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,200
Speaker 1: was not happening a ton there. You had to change

750
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 1: creative directors at different points, like can you talk us

751
00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 1: through some of those pieces where you thought, Okay, I

752
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 1: might be.

753
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:07,319
Speaker 2: Out of my death here.

754
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:13,320
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think that it's incredibly important to be able

755
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 3: to have micro failures. And that's true of any career.

756
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:22,360
Speaker 3: It's especially true when you're building something because there's no

757
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 3: way that you're going to come out perfectly in every

758
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:28,720
Speaker 3: you know, like in every aspect of what you're building.

759
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 3: And there's a lot of personal growth and development that

760
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:34,759
Speaker 3: comes along with this. You have to when you make

761
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 3: the decision to take the leap and start a company,

762
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 3: you have to have conviction and vision in terms of

763
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 3: what the end goal is. And I tell people, if

764
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:43,880
Speaker 3: you have that, then you will make it. That's the

765
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 3: only way you'll make it. If you do not have that,

766
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:50,400
Speaker 3: do not start. Because how naive I felt going into

767
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 3: this journey was pretty startling. You just there are so

768
00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 3: many things that you have to figure out and get

769
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:03,000
Speaker 3: through and it takes very thick skin. And with that said,

770
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,880
Speaker 3: back to the failure piece, like, it's just part of

771
00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 3: the journey that you make mistakes and that are correcting

772
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 3: from those.

773
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 1: Were you able to have that perspective when you were

774
00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,840
Speaker 1: in it, similar to the way you went into learning

775
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:17,120
Speaker 1: experiences like it's okay, I'm learning, Like were you able

776
00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:19,799
Speaker 1: to say, okay, this has been a microom mistake where

777
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:20,919
Speaker 1: you're like, oh my god, it's over.

778
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:23,440
Speaker 3: I never thought it was over, and I'll never think

779
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:25,960
Speaker 3: it's I think that's what makes me a good entrepreneur.

780
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 3: There's a learning that's baked into that which we can

781
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 3: come back to as well. But for me, Argent will

782
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 3: succeed because I believe that women deserve it, So I

783
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 3: will do everything in my power to make that a reality,

784
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:42,080
Speaker 3: and I have overcome things like COVID. Right, that was

785
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 3: an intentional choice of survival because the opposite was the

786
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:48,319
Speaker 3: more obvious choice, which would be to just shutter the

787
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,720
Speaker 3: company because we went to zero dollar days overnight.

788
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 2: I want to go back to COVID.

789
00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 1: Can you because I have more questions about COVID, can

790
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:56,800
Speaker 1: you give us more examples of like sort of micro failures.

791
00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:00,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, so some of mine. I think that starting thing

792
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 3: is really lonely, and it's become way less lonely for me.

793
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:06,480
Speaker 3: I mean, I've been doing this for nine years, but

794
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 3: because it is lonely, you are a bit vulnerable.

795
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:14,239
Speaker 2: And when you're hiring, and this.

796
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,480
Speaker 3: Was mine, but you're I would project my enthusiasm and

797
00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:19,640
Speaker 3: my passion onto people that I was interviewing to the

798
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:21,520
Speaker 3: point that I would convince myself that they were perfect

799
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:23,680
Speaker 3: for the role, and they I wasn't letting them convince

800
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 3: me of that, And I allowed people into the company

801
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:30,759
Speaker 3: or agencies into the company that were not the right fit.

802
00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 2: But it was because I was so desperate.

803
00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:36,240
Speaker 3: For you know, rounding out a skill like the skills

804
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:38,040
Speaker 3: that I did not have, because I was aware of,

805
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 3: like some of the things that I didn't know or

806
00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:41,960
Speaker 3: that I needed, So I think that was one for me.

807
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:45,439
Speaker 3: It was rushing hiring decisions, and now we've gotten much

808
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:49,440
Speaker 3: better at that higher slow fire fast fire fast is

809
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 3: probably another one that I have had to learn over time.

810
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 3: I used to give people the benefit of the doubt

811
00:38:56,120 --> 00:38:59,839
Speaker 3: or try and justify X y Z. But I've really

812
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:02,759
Speaker 3: that muscle to recognize when someone's not working out, and

813
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 3: if they're not working out, you've just got to follow

814
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 3: your gut and do it quickly.

815
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 1: That's a topic we actually have not gotten into on

816
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:11,719
Speaker 1: this show, so I'm really curious to talk a little

817
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:15,400
Speaker 1: bit more about it. How long do you give them now?

818
00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 1: What do the conversations look like.

819
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:20,600
Speaker 3: It's really challenging and has been one of the hardest

820
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 3: parts of business, the personal piece, especially as a woman.

821
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 3: What I've noticed is that the second you give negative

822
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,319
Speaker 3: feedback to an agency, or you fire an agency, or

823
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:33,240
Speaker 3: you fire a person, it pivots from professional to personal.

824
00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 3: And it's not a personal conversation. Anyone that we hire.

825
00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:42,200
Speaker 3: We have a business need for hiring that person, and

826
00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:45,640
Speaker 3: I want them to succeed If it doesn't work out.

827
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:48,719
Speaker 3: I think two things are true. One, we should be

828
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:50,759
Speaker 3: able to give very I should be able to give

829
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:56,480
Speaker 3: very direct feedback and criticism on work or whatever and

830
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:58,480
Speaker 3: not be judged personally for it.

831
00:39:58,920 --> 00:39:59,520
Speaker 2: That's more true.

832
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 3: On the age of side. I've had a lot of

833
00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:05,680
Speaker 3: experiences where you know, older men will become very I

834
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:07,759
Speaker 3: don't even know what word to you. They're too emotionally

835
00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 3: to lead. Men are too emotional to lead.

836
00:40:09,719 --> 00:40:13,040
Speaker 2: Unprofessional. Yeah, too emotional to lead. It's wild.

837
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 3: It is actually very true. So I've dealt with that,

838
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 3: and you just develop thick skin. Like I just said,

839
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 3: now see it for what it is. And then in

840
00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:23,880
Speaker 3: terms of firing fast, Argent is an extension of me,

841
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:28,800
Speaker 3: and I'm the most tuned in on the cultural piece.

842
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:31,719
Speaker 3: So we are very much trying to hire people that

843
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:33,880
Speaker 3: are a fit for our culture. We are collaborative, we

844
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 3: are supportive, there's no room for politics. And just as

845
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 3: a sound bite, like they're the first ten hires at

846
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:44,040
Speaker 3: any startup, shape your culture.

847
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:47,440
Speaker 2: It is so important to what you're building. It is everything.

848
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:52,080
Speaker 2: And then once someone starts, I'll start seeing things I

849
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:55,399
Speaker 2: think I'm you know, it's either they're over delivering or

850
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:58,760
Speaker 2: there might be some flags. It comes in at different points.

851
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 2: But the second I mean the second you realize that

852
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:03,600
Speaker 2: it's not right, like you have the second you have

853
00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 2: that thought, it's not going to change. It's only reinforced.

854
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:10,880
Speaker 2: And so that's what I'm saying, Like from early days,

855
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:14,360
Speaker 2: I would see those flags for years and not do

856
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 2: anything about it. And now I'll see I'll see a

857
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:20,879
Speaker 2: flag and it's done the next day. Because the thing

858
00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 2: that happens is that it sits with you, and time

859
00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:29,280
Speaker 2: is your most valuable resource. And I need to ensure

860
00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 2: that not only for myself, but for the entire team,

861
00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 2: that we're not distracted by someone that's not a fit,

862
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,000
Speaker 2: and that we're not having to carry that load and

863
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 2: we're not getting caught up in the stresses that come

864
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:44,279
Speaker 2: along with that. And so we'll make those decisions and

865
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:45,880
Speaker 2: have those conversations very quickly.

866
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:49,680
Speaker 3: It's not something I'm an expert at. I would say

867
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 3: I think that we've done both ways. We've tried to

868
00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:55,839
Speaker 3: coach people, you know, and get them to a place

869
00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:57,920
Speaker 3: where it could work. We've never had success with that,

870
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:01,880
Speaker 3: and so I think think that we have had people

871
00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 3: come in that have areas of opportunity that work out

872
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:06,520
Speaker 3: long term. But I don't think we've ever had the

873
00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 3: sense of, oh, it's not the right fit. I think

874
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,160
Speaker 3: it's just that, oh, there's some development that can happen here,

875
00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:13,800
Speaker 3: and there's some learning thing can happen here. When it's

876
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,640
Speaker 3: not the right fit. It's a pretty cut and dry conversation,

877
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:18,919
Speaker 3: and that's where it can really go off the deep

878
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 3: end personally, and I've experienced that a number of times.

879
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so interesting. It's really interesting to hear you

880
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 1: talk through this. You know, the majority of my professional

881
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: career has been working in politics, and there's this sense

882
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:35,960
Speaker 1: that I think because we are brought to the work

883
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:39,839
Speaker 1: emotionally or not emotionally, but values based, it's a sort

884
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:41,680
Speaker 1: of an extension. We're working on an extension of what

885
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:45,799
Speaker 1: we believe in that it's so personal that there's also

886
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,960
Speaker 1: the sense that you can't fire anybody. And I actually

887
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,960
Speaker 1: think a big part of the dysfunction of politics is

888
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:56,720
Speaker 1: that you can't fire people because it would be perceived

889
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 1: as rejecting them personally. And so I actually have like

890
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: no insight into how to run a corporate environment. And

891
00:43:04,719 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 1: my sister and I were sort of like coming up

892
00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 1: at the same time, like She was very corporate and

893
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,160
Speaker 1: I was working in politics, and she'd be like, Oh,

894
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 1: I had to fire someone again today, And I.

895
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:12,280
Speaker 2: Was like, you can't.

896
00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:18,400
Speaker 4: Did they steal? Like did they murder your first board?

897
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:21,920
Speaker 4: Like I thought that was the bar of firing somebody.

898
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 4: I just I had no sense of it. So I

899
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 4: see how it can actually be much healthier.

900
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:31,799
Speaker 3: It's necessary, and the best leaders, your sister is one

901
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:34,919
Speaker 3: of them. The best leaders can do it, and they'll

902
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:39,280
Speaker 3: do it quickly, and they'll do it unemotionally. It's pretty

903
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 3: cut and dry, and we just have to shield ourselves

904
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,799
Speaker 3: as much as possible emotionally because I can recognize when

905
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:51,480
Speaker 3: it's coming from someone's own baggage and it's not about me.

906
00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 3: They're just sort of projecting onto me. But it's such

907
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 3: a bummer because you know, it's disappointing. Like I said,

908
00:43:56,719 --> 00:43:59,040
Speaker 3: we're hiring people that I like personally, and I've had

909
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,440
Speaker 3: to let people go that I like a lot personally

910
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:04,080
Speaker 3: but aren't the right fit for what we're building. And ultimately,

911
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 3: I'm a steward of Argent, and like, I have to

912
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:09,440
Speaker 3: protect the company. That's my job and people have to

913
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:11,800
Speaker 3: recognize that as well. And I have to protect the

914
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:14,600
Speaker 3: people on the team that are delivering. I want to

915
00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:17,800
Speaker 3: also mention I think that it works out for both parties.

916
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:21,360
Speaker 3: So I've seen people that do react really negatively, but

917
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:23,560
Speaker 3: then they land on their feet elsewhere and somewhere that

918
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:25,920
Speaker 3: is the right fit. So I don't think we are

919
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 3: for everyone. Like I don't think we're perfect either, and

920
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:31,640
Speaker 3: I have learned from every instance where it hasn't worked

921
00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:34,560
Speaker 3: out because I'm definitely not perfect. I think we hold

922
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,680
Speaker 3: women to such an impossibly high standard. With all of

923
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:42,800
Speaker 3: that said, you just can't hold something like keep someone

924
00:44:43,200 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 3: that's not working, and you want to make sure that

925
00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:50,920
Speaker 3: you have perspective that where they land afterwards is going

926
00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:52,040
Speaker 3: to be a better fit for them.

927
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,560
Speaker 2: You know, it always works out. It totally okay.

928
00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:58,479
Speaker 1: Well, this leads me into the team that you've built

929
00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:01,520
Speaker 1: as a whole, because that now also includes it's your husband.

930
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:03,560
Speaker 2: Have you considered firing him? Never?

931
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, I'm like, please never leave us. I

932
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 3: was actually complimenting him this morning. We are opposites. We

933
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 3: took a personality test. This was something we took at

934
00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:15,839
Speaker 3: Cisco that I loved so much that we now do

935
00:45:15,840 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 3: it at Argent every year. And it's so good for

936
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 3: team building because we learned how we all like tick

937
00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:23,520
Speaker 3: and operate and communicate. And he and I took it

938
00:45:23,560 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 3: and we're like exact opposites, which I think I knew,

939
00:45:27,640 --> 00:45:30,239
Speaker 3: but to see it in black and white like that,

940
00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:33,440
Speaker 3: it was like pretty fun. But the beauty of it

941
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:36,320
Speaker 3: is that I trust him completely and in our personal lives,

942
00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:39,600
Speaker 3: like he I know that he's going to take care

943
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:41,239
Speaker 3: of things and do things and I don't even have

944
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:43,359
Speaker 3: to think about it, and he doesn't stress about things

945
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,000
Speaker 3: that I stress about, and vice versa. So like we're

946
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 3: just a really good balance. And for him to step

947
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:54,160
Speaker 3: in professionally, that didn't happen until twenty nineteen. I launched

948
00:45:54,280 --> 00:45:56,800
Speaker 3: Argent in twenty sixteen. I started working at twenty fifteen.

949
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:01,160
Speaker 3: I was looking for a mark. I was looking for

950
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 3: someone that has that CMO skill set, and I was

951
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 3: living with that person, but I was I was not

952
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:11,120
Speaker 3: using Dave on the business because I needed an outlet,

953
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:13,759
Speaker 3: and he was my outlet those first few years. And

954
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:16,320
Speaker 3: so we got to this point where I'd been looking

955
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:19,680
Speaker 3: for this role for a long time. I think it's

956
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:23,160
Speaker 3: actually one of the hardest roles to fill, and he

957
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:27,040
Speaker 3: slowly started taking you just slowly started like dipping his

958
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:28,640
Speaker 3: toe and doing some of the work, and it was

959
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:29,880
Speaker 3: obvious that he was the perfect fit.

960
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:31,360
Speaker 2: I mean, he has the perfect background.

961
00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 3: He has worked across electronic arts, Apple, Adidas, you know,

962
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:38,319
Speaker 3: just McDonald's. He gets such a cool resume, such a

963
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:41,840
Speaker 3: cool skill set, and yeah, he started in twenty nineteen

964
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:44,840
Speaker 3: and it's been a wild ride because two kids have

965
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:46,840
Speaker 3: also come, you know, along with that.

966
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:48,360
Speaker 2: But it's it's perfect.

967
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:52,200
Speaker 1: Do you guys have boundaries for keeping the professional and personal?

968
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,319
Speaker 1: No boundaries perfect right now?

969
00:46:54,640 --> 00:46:58,759
Speaker 3: If you need to know anything about mindfulness and like

970
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:01,959
Speaker 3: taking care of yourself and boundaries, I'm not your gal.

971
00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 2: Okay, great, well I'm not either. I would even not

972
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,760
Speaker 2: questions to ask. I think, I do think and people

973
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:09,239
Speaker 2: talk about this.

974
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:11,879
Speaker 3: It becomes really fluid when you start something because it

975
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:15,240
Speaker 3: is fun. Like what I'm doing is really fun. So stressful,

976
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:18,160
Speaker 3: there's so many times we're like, oh, like you know,

977
00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:21,600
Speaker 3: you think about quitting, like that's just the name of

978
00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 3: the game. But at the end of the day, like

979
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:26,759
Speaker 3: I'm always thinking about urgent and that's the beautiful thing

980
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:28,360
Speaker 3: about it. But I have flexibility that I can go

981
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:30,360
Speaker 3: pick my kids up at four thirty or even I

982
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:33,520
Speaker 3: can go, you know, do something random on a Friday.

983
00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:36,440
Speaker 3: So it's it works for us. It's all very blended.

984
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:41,800
Speaker 1: We're going to take a short break for some ads.

985
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,600
Speaker 1: Now back to the show. When I looked at you know,

986
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:53,040
Speaker 1: I look at your product of like suiting, work where office,

987
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:55,880
Speaker 1: and I look at the timeline of starting in twenty sixteen,

988
00:47:56,360 --> 00:47:58,440
Speaker 1: I think I intellectually knew there must have been like

989
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 1: kind of a dip around COVID. But then I went

990
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 1: back to listen to interviews that you've done, and you

991
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 1: did a big podcast in twenty twenty, right before the

992
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:10,960
Speaker 1: pandemic hit, and the punchline, like the kind of launching

993
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:14,759
Speaker 1: pad of that podcast was we've never really you look

994
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:18,319
Speaker 1: so uncomfortable right now. You've never really marketed, and we're

995
00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:20,960
Speaker 1: about to do a big marketing push.

996
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:23,239
Speaker 2: And I felt it.

997
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:28,840
Speaker 1: I was like, if she only knows what's coming, Oh yeah, okay,

998
00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:29,960
Speaker 1: so talk us through this.

999
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,719
Speaker 3: So I am a slow and methodical person, and I

1000
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:38,400
Speaker 3: think building a company in apparel takes about seven years

1001
00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:40,880
Speaker 3: to strike it all right. So it's like you're iterating

1002
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 3: on product, photography, visuals, team, all the things and we

1003
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:49,279
Speaker 3: were on a more accelerated path, but I was always

1004
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 3: a little bit slower to market. We got to twenty

1005
00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:55,560
Speaker 3: twenty and it was like it was a time where

1006
00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:57,799
Speaker 3: everyone was like gang bust. I don't know if you

1007
00:48:57,840 --> 00:49:00,480
Speaker 3: remember this, but early twenty twenty and he was doing

1008
00:49:00,520 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 3: great the economy of striving like it was a good time.

1009
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,560
Speaker 2: Honestly. I had a third baby in February of twenty twenty.

1010
00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:06,480
Speaker 2: I don't remember much.

1011
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:10,840
Speaker 3: Oh, okay, May twenty twenty, but anyway, we were just

1012
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:13,120
Speaker 3: all of our metrics they were excellent, like we were

1013
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:15,600
Speaker 3: ready and we were going. And then eight and a

1014
00:49:15,600 --> 00:49:19,560
Speaker 3: half months pregnant, March thirteenth, and the world shuts down

1015
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:23,440
Speaker 3: and everyone was writing emails like in two weeks we'll reopen,

1016
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 3: and Dave and I had to have some really hard

1017
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:27,760
Speaker 3: conversations because I was thinking I was going on maternity

1018
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:29,319
Speaker 3: when I'm going to have like a proper break because

1019
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:31,840
Speaker 3: we had a nice team in place, and instead it

1020
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:35,160
Speaker 3: was like what's about to happen and how aggressive do

1021
00:49:35,200 --> 00:49:36,399
Speaker 3: we want to be with it?

1022
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:38,799
Speaker 2: And it ranged from.

1023
00:49:39,000 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 3: Do we quit to do we furlough the team, layoff

1024
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,120
Speaker 3: some team members, get out of all of our leases,

1025
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:49,200
Speaker 3: we had four stores at the time in an office,

1026
00:49:50,040 --> 00:49:53,080
Speaker 3: and we went with that option, with the choice of

1027
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:57,920
Speaker 3: trying to survive and just gut it out, and it

1028
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:02,399
Speaker 3: ended up really working on our favor because we made

1029
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,680
Speaker 3: that choice when no one else saw what was coming,

1030
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 3: and so it gave us a two week head start

1031
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:09,520
Speaker 3: and we got out of our leases, which allowed us

1032
00:50:09,560 --> 00:50:13,400
Speaker 3: to survive. Then had a baby, which was actually a

1033
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,520
Speaker 3: nice escape because I had had like I had a

1034
00:50:15,560 --> 00:50:18,799
Speaker 3: proper leave, but I mean a lot to unpack there

1035
00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:20,080
Speaker 3: as well, because it was just the two of us

1036
00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:21,920
Speaker 3: and two kids and just no help.

1037
00:50:22,040 --> 00:50:23,960
Speaker 1: I'm also feeling super stressed out for you that a

1038
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:27,759
Speaker 1: newborn baby felt like a nice stressless release for you,

1039
00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:29,640
Speaker 1: Like I'm concerned for your mental health care.

1040
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:32,279
Speaker 2: That's the right take a look.

1041
00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:35,319
Speaker 3: But it gave me, like some joy at a time

1042
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 3: that was so tough and brutal. And I got a

1043
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:41,680
Speaker 3: text from an investor I'll never forget there's an article

1044
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:44,799
Speaker 3: from CNN that said work where is dead forever and

1045
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:48,920
Speaker 3: she said we should talk. And I just didn't throw

1046
00:50:48,920 --> 00:50:50,880
Speaker 3: on my phone, but I certainly could have. I was

1047
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:54,640
Speaker 3: so angry because it was so inconsiderate, like it lacked

1048
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,359
Speaker 3: such empathy for something that I've been building for such

1049
00:50:57,360 --> 00:50:59,080
Speaker 3: a long time that I'd put my blood, sweat and

1050
00:50:59,080 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 3: tears into Fast forward to now that person's like my

1051
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:05,680
Speaker 3: best friend and reposting and sharing and anyway love her.

1052
00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:07,839
Speaker 3: But it was stuff like that where it was like,

1053
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:12,960
Speaker 3: I'm so focused and locked in right now on surviving

1054
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,040
Speaker 3: and how we're going to get there. We ended up

1055
00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:19,600
Speaker 3: running a campaign in October of twenty twenty that made

1056
00:51:19,640 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 3: our year in one day, the super Majority campaign, the

1057
00:51:22,840 --> 00:51:26,560
Speaker 3: Hot Pigsuits. It went viral, billions of impressions. At the

1058
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:28,680
Speaker 3: height of the pandemic, we sold out of a hot pigsuit.

1059
00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 3: It was bananas. And behind the scenes, I'm walking around

1060
00:51:33,200 --> 00:51:36,080
Speaker 3: with like a sleeping baby, you know, on my front,

1061
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:38,279
Speaker 3: and Dave's playing with a toddler somewhere, and it's like

1062
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,880
Speaker 3: the two of us really running this like massive campaign,

1063
00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:44,200
Speaker 3: and that gave us, I think, some pep in our step,

1064
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,160
Speaker 3: and you know, fast forward to twenty twenty one. We

1065
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:51,799
Speaker 3: started seeing the return to certain industries, so we kind

1066
00:51:51,800 --> 00:51:54,360
Speaker 3: of dressed women that were working at the White House throughout.

1067
00:51:54,840 --> 00:51:58,880
Speaker 3: We then see, you know, some lawyers around that start

1068
00:51:58,920 --> 00:52:00,960
Speaker 3: to return, and we just started seeing parts of the

1069
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:05,520
Speaker 3: country start to return. And so the beauty of COVID

1070
00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:09,640
Speaker 3: is it it allowed us to step back and really

1071
00:52:09,719 --> 00:52:13,040
Speaker 3: really restrategize on everything, and take all of our key

1072
00:52:13,160 --> 00:52:17,120
Speaker 3: early learnings and apply them all at the same time

1073
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:19,319
Speaker 3: and just come out swinging. So in the fall of

1074
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 3: twenty twenty two, I bet the farm on the return

1075
00:52:22,640 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 3: to the category delayed consumerism. Women are going back to

1076
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,919
Speaker 3: the office. They haven't shopped for this in a long time.

1077
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:31,080
Speaker 3: Bodies have changed. The list is long, and that proved

1078
00:52:31,080 --> 00:52:34,840
Speaker 3: to be true. And on the heels of that, I've then,

1079
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:40,000
Speaker 3: you know, raised some money and the rest is really

1080
00:52:40,080 --> 00:52:41,800
Speaker 3: I mean, now we're just scaling and we've been trying

1081
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:43,440
Speaker 3: to catch up with demand and we're finally in a

1082
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:45,520
Speaker 3: position where I feel like we're slightly ahead of it.

1083
00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:48,680
Speaker 3: And it's been so fun and it's been the opposite

1084
00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:51,520
Speaker 3: experience of what COVID has and we're executing in a

1085
00:52:51,520 --> 00:52:55,160
Speaker 3: different place and the competitive landscapes wiped out. There's a

1086
00:52:55,200 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 3: lot of upside in COVID for us, but I'm sure

1087
00:52:57,520 --> 00:52:59,040
Speaker 3: there's still a lot of trauma for me to unpackage.

1088
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:01,560
Speaker 2: I'n't dealt with, you know, someday will.

1089
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:06,120
Speaker 1: All of us that time at home with the kids. Yes, really,

1090
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:07,680
Speaker 1: so where do you think you're going?

1091
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:12,799
Speaker 3: So the vision of Argent is to provide tools and

1092
00:53:12,840 --> 00:53:16,480
Speaker 3: resources to women to allow them to optimally navigate their career,

1093
00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:21,839
Speaker 3: to remove barriers for women. And I think that for us,

1094
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:24,840
Speaker 3: our goal is to be the work where authority but

1095
00:53:25,000 --> 00:53:28,960
Speaker 3: also to really own the office because nobody does. And

1096
00:53:28,960 --> 00:53:31,120
Speaker 3: it's the thing that excites me the most in the

1097
00:53:31,120 --> 00:53:35,759
Speaker 3: world learning women's stories, connecting them, bringing men into the

1098
00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:39,480
Speaker 3: conversation in a meaningful and significant way. And so I

1099
00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:42,160
Speaker 3: think for me, I want Argent to be synonymous with

1100
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:46,560
Speaker 3: working women, I mean just incredible women and reframing how

1101
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:49,439
Speaker 3: we think about what society looks like and having women

1102
00:53:49,520 --> 00:53:54,160
Speaker 3: represented at all levels, and also reshaping how we talk

1103
00:53:54,200 --> 00:53:56,760
Speaker 3: about moms because that's the hardest job in the world,

1104
00:53:57,400 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 3: and so how do we establish some form of flexility

1105
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:03,680
Speaker 3: that supports them in those dark early days you know

1106
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:06,960
Speaker 3: that can be really demanding, and then also allows them

1107
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:08,640
Speaker 3: to put mom on their resume and then go back

1108
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:10,520
Speaker 3: into the workforce and speak with authority to the skill

1109
00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:12,560
Speaker 3: set that they've taken from being a mom.

1110
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:14,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel very strongly about that.

1111
00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:17,239
Speaker 1: What is one thing that you look back and at

1112
00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:19,560
Speaker 1: the time you thought, oh my god, this is the

1113
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:21,200
Speaker 1: worst thing that's ever happened to me. I'm not going

1114
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:23,239
Speaker 1: to make it out of this, and now in retrospect,

1115
00:54:23,360 --> 00:54:25,439
Speaker 1: you see it as having really positioned you to where

1116
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:25,919
Speaker 1: you are now.

1117
00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:27,560
Speaker 2: I mean, COVID.

1118
00:54:27,640 --> 00:54:29,520
Speaker 3: I hate to answer with COVID since we just talked

1119
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:33,080
Speaker 3: about it, but in what scenario was I thinking, Oh wow?

1120
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:35,120
Speaker 3: And then there'll be that day where nobody goes to

1121
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:39,040
Speaker 3: an office, So you're like constantly assessing risk and you've

1122
00:54:39,080 --> 00:54:42,160
Speaker 3: got your risk mitigation plan, whether it's formal or informal.

1123
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:45,960
Speaker 3: But my job is to ensure that no decision is fatal,

1124
00:54:46,719 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 3: and so I'm always like hedging our bets. And so

1125
00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:52,759
Speaker 3: I think the second it was obvious that women weren't

1126
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:54,719
Speaker 3: going to be going back into offices and who knew

1127
00:54:54,719 --> 00:54:56,359
Speaker 3: when they'd be returning was a.

1128
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:57,600
Speaker 2: Pretty like a fuck moment.

1129
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:01,200
Speaker 3: And then getting past that, I mean, just the entire

1130
00:55:01,560 --> 00:55:04,280
Speaker 3: that's a very stark example that does not happen for everyone,

1131
00:55:04,320 --> 00:55:07,640
Speaker 3: but that exists in everyone's journey. There are moments where

1132
00:55:07,640 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 3: you're like I just need to go watch Netflix, or

1133
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:11,680
Speaker 3: like I just don't want to fight through this. This

1134
00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:16,440
Speaker 3: is so it's such a hard it's such a hard thing.

1135
00:55:16,560 --> 00:55:17,880
Speaker 2: It's impossible to articulate.

1136
00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:19,560
Speaker 3: And there are just those days or those weeks where

1137
00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,840
Speaker 3: everything seems to be no everything like you just everything's

1138
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:25,799
Speaker 3: going against you, and you kind of learn how to

1139
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 3: like navigate that over time and just allow it to

1140
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:31,680
Speaker 3: happen and just sort of take a back seat when

1141
00:55:31,719 --> 00:55:33,759
Speaker 3: you need to, and then when things are going your

1142
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:35,800
Speaker 3: way to lean in all you know completely.

1143
00:55:36,560 --> 00:55:37,359
Speaker 2: But it really all.

1144
00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:40,200
Speaker 3: Goes back to the fact that Argent has to exist, period,

1145
00:55:40,239 --> 00:55:42,200
Speaker 3: and I'll do anything to make that happen. And because

1146
00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:44,759
Speaker 3: I feel that way, there's really like nothing that I'll

1147
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:46,640
Speaker 3: allow to take us out of the game.

1148
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,640
Speaker 2: I believe it. I believe it. Well, thank you, Sally,

1149
00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:53,000
Speaker 2: thanks for having me. This is so fun, so fun.

1150
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:59,279
Speaker 1: Sally is still building her Powersuit empire and lives in

1151
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:02,359
Speaker 1: New York with her family. Be sure to shop all

1152
00:56:02,400 --> 00:56:06,960
Speaker 1: the amazing Argent suits at argentwork dot com. Thanks for

1153
00:56:07,040 --> 00:56:10,759
Speaker 1: listening to this candid convo episode of she Pivots. Check

1154
00:56:10,880 --> 00:56:14,880
Speaker 1: back in weekly for more conversations with inspiring women. To

1155
00:56:15,040 --> 00:56:17,919
Speaker 1: learn more about our guests, follow us on Instagram at

1156
00:56:17,960 --> 00:56:21,080
Speaker 1: she Pivots. The podcast. Leave us a rating and comment

1157
00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:23,600
Speaker 1: if you enjoyed this episode to help others learn about it.

1158
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:27,600
Speaker 1: Talk to you next week, Hey listeners, Before we close

1159
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:29,560
Speaker 1: out this episode, I just wanted to pop in and

1160
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:31,480
Speaker 1: let you know that, on top of having the pleasure

1161
00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:35,240
Speaker 1: of interviewing Sally, I'm also a proud investor in Argent.

1162
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:37,680
Speaker 2: As I interview and meet people through.

1163
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:39,560
Speaker 5: She Pivots, I've been lucky enough to get involved with

1164
00:56:39,600 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 5: a few of our guests and their brands, and Sally

1165
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:44,440
Speaker 5: and Argent being one of them. I'm so proud that

1166
00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:46,880
Speaker 5: I'm able to invest in these incredible women own brands,

1167
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:49,600
Speaker 5: and I'm excited to continue to do my small part

1168
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:52,560
Speaker 5: in helping these women embrace their pivots. It's all for now,

1169
00:56:52,719 --> 00:56:56,319
Speaker 5: Talk to you next week. Special thanks to the She

1170
00:56:56,520 --> 00:57:01,600
Speaker 5: Pivots team, Executive producer Emily Edaveelosi, Associate producer and social

1171
00:57:01,680 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 5: media connoisseur Hannah Cousins, Research director Christine Dickinson, Events and

1172
00:57:06,680 --> 00:57:11,520
Speaker 5: logistics coordinator Madeline Sonovic, and audio editor and mixer Nina Pollock.

1173
00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:14,480
Speaker 1: I endorse Cheap Presents