1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,639 Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's Robert and Joe here. Today we're bringing 2 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,199 Speaker 1: you a new episode of Smart Talks with IBM. 3 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,920 Speaker 2: This season, Malcolm Gladwell talks to leaders using AI and 4 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 2: emerging technology to change the game in their industries. 5 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: From Heineken using AI to become the world's best connected 6 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: brewer to UFC using data to turn chaos into clarity 7 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: for fans and commentators. 8 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:25,600 Speaker 2: Two Cleveland Clinic using AI and quantum computing to accelerate 9 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:27,480 Speaker 2: discovery in biomedical research. 10 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: Smart Talks with IBM explores how organizations are applying technology 11 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 1: in unexpected and transformative ways. 12 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 2: New episodes drop every month wherever you get your podcasts. 13 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 2: Learn more at IBM dot com slash smart Talks. 14 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 1: This is a paid advertisement for IBM. 15 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:49,159 Speaker 3: Hi Malcolm Glawell, and you're listening to Smart Talks with IBM. 16 00:00:50,080 --> 00:00:53,120 Speaker 3: Imagine your business depends on a system you didn't build 17 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 3: and don't fully control. For years, it works perfectly, it's fast, reliable, 18 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 3: affordable time. More and more of your operations rely on it. 19 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 3: Then one day the terms change. What once felt flexible 20 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,800 Speaker 3: now feels difficult to leave, moving to another provider or 21 00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 3: bringing those capabilities back under your own control. Could take years, 22 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 3: cost millions, and disrupt the business in the process. That's 23 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 3: the challenge of digital sovereignty. Businesses today rely on all 24 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 3: sorts of third party systems, cloud platforms, data pipelines, AI models, 25 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:36,759 Speaker 3: software tools. Most days, these systems operate quietly in the background, 26 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 3: but when something changes, like costs go up or rules shift, 27 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 3: organizations are forced to confront how much control and flexibility 28 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 3: they actually have. This is why digital sovereignty has shifted 29 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:55,840 Speaker 3: from policy concept to board level priority. So to understand 30 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 3: the challenge up close, I traveled to Paris to attend Vivtec, 31 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:04,080 Speaker 3: Europe's largest technology conference, to speak with two people who 32 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:07,680 Speaker 3: think about these questions every day. On Apaula A. Cis, 33 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:11,919 Speaker 3: IBM's senior Vice president and chair for IBM e M 34 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 3: EA and APAC, and Giovanni Daniello, group chief Information Officer 35 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:26,000 Speaker 3: at AKSA. Hello, everyone, welcome to a live taping of 36 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:29,519 Speaker 3: the podcast Smart Talks with IBM. I was downstairs in 37 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:32,240 Speaker 3: the IBM booths chatting with the people who were doing 38 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:36,640 Speaker 3: the data Sovereignty presentation, and they were discussing the and 39 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:40,359 Speaker 3: I said, oh, it sounds like you're solving a headache. 40 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 3: And the guy I was trying to said, that's all 41 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,600 Speaker 3: we do at IBM. We solve headaches and cure headaches, 42 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 3: and I want to start out with the two of you. 43 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 3: What is the headache in this instance. 44 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:57,080 Speaker 4: So the topic of sovereignty gained a lot of traction 45 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 4: over the past few years, and even though I would 46 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:04,119 Speaker 4: said it really became a buzzword this year, I think 47 00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 4: that this actually started during COVID, when all the supply 48 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:14,760 Speaker 4: chains became extremely stressed and companies and governments started to 49 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 4: understand that there were a lot of choke points in 50 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 4: the world, right, so how can I do more on 51 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 4: ear shore in how can I guarantee that I have 52 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 4: autonomy of key elements of my supply chain? I think 53 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:29,080 Speaker 4: was really the wake up call. And then we entered 54 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:33,880 Speaker 4: in a period of unfortunately many wars happening constraining for example, 55 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 4: energy security. So all these disruptions in the world led 56 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 4: companies and governments to think, what is really that I 57 00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:45,120 Speaker 4: need to consider as critical for me, and how do 58 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,880 Speaker 4: I have better control of those capabilities? And now technology 59 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 4: being at the core of the operations, I think that 60 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 4: actually increased the need for companies to focus on sovereignty. 61 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 4: So that is the headache given that there are so 62 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:01,880 Speaker 4: many dependencies, given that we're living in a world that 63 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 4: is so interconnected, how do you get autonomy, how do 64 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 4: you get back control making sure that you continue to 65 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 4: operate in a collaborative ecosystem. 66 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:16,359 Speaker 5: It's a difficulty equilibrium in reality because we have to 67 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 5: take all those dimensions into consideration, making sure that at 68 00:04:20,400 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 5: the same time we can continue to access innovation and 69 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:29,279 Speaker 5: and and that's where the paradigm is is really very, very. 70 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:30,119 Speaker 6: Complicated to solve. 71 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,599 Speaker 5: So the headache we have in AXA and then probably 72 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 5: many large organizations in the in the world is exactly 73 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:41,040 Speaker 5: the topic in Europe at least it's it's about sovereignty 74 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 5: exactly in the terms you are talking about, and that's 75 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 5: becoming a topic that is very that is, there's a 76 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 5: lot of visibility, very in the agenda at very top 77 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 5: executive level since probably Yeah, it started with COVIY, I agree, 78 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,320 Speaker 5: but the last two years there's been an acceleration clearly. 79 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I you have a few data points. Today 80 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:08,040 Speaker 4: we announced a study through our IBM Institute of Business 81 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:13,279 Speaker 4: Value where basically we asked companies around the world, so 82 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 4: do you have visibility of your dependencies, right, do you 83 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 4: know exactly where are your exposures? And only nine percent 84 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 4: of the companies said that they have that level of visibility, 85 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 4: and seventy one percent of the company said that if 86 00:05:30,160 --> 00:05:33,359 Speaker 4: they needed to switch a provider today, it would be 87 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:36,279 Speaker 4: very difficult to do so. So I think the headache. 88 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 4: This actually shows in numbers the size of the headache. 89 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:47,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, you're in the insurance business. Speak to the specifics 90 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 3: of your own business. Why would this be an issue that? 91 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:53,799 Speaker 3: Am I right in thinking that this is an issue 92 00:05:53,800 --> 00:06:00,120 Speaker 3: that is a specific and special concern to an insurance I. 93 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:00,560 Speaker 6: Don't think so. 94 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 5: No, you know, no, I don't think so, because in reality, 95 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 5: it's an issue for organizations using technology, data and AI 96 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:12,840 Speaker 5: as an important driver within the activities they manage. 97 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 6: Insurance. 98 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 5: Of course, insurance is about data, it's about people, it's 99 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 5: about technology, of course, So it's very very central. 100 00:06:20,279 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 6: But it's absolutely not limited to insurance. 101 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 5: Because at the end, if we want to talk a 102 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:28,799 Speaker 5: little bit more into details, what is sovereignty Because everybody 103 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:32,039 Speaker 5: talks about sovereignty, but what is it about? And very 104 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 5: often people believe that once you know where your data 105 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 5: are located and if you are your open company. If 106 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:41,599 Speaker 5: you have the certainty that data are located in Europe, 107 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 5: many people believe I'm safe, I'm sobeer incompatible. Well it's 108 00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:51,480 Speaker 5: absolutely not enough. So there are models that not only 109 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 5: we are using an accept that are also very very 110 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 5: public on the market. Very often will refer to four dimensions. 111 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 5: Of course, data location is number one. If you don't 112 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 5: know where your data are, I mean you don't know anything. 113 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:08,200 Speaker 5: But it's not only that, I mean how do you operate? 114 00:07:08,720 --> 00:07:12,040 Speaker 5: Who is operating the system, who is patching, who is 115 00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 5: creating new versions of whatever the feature that becomes available. 116 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 5: That's the second one. The third one is contracts, legal terms. 117 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 5: Who is in charge legally speaking of the activities we 118 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 5: talk about, and and and the last one is the 119 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 5: technicality itself. Who is really mastering the technical details the 120 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:41,000 Speaker 5: underlying stach. Is it something that is European, US, China? 121 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 6: You know? And I mean it's it's known by everybody. 122 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 5: Most of the large European companies and US companies are 123 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:54,760 Speaker 5: using US technologies. So the difficulty in soeranties to scan 124 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:58,520 Speaker 5: on a permanent basis the four dimensions. Making sure that 125 00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 5: because you were saying another that you know exactly what 126 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 5: is exactly the situation on your business on those four dimensions. 127 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 3: Give me an example of how a specific example of 128 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 3: what difference it would make where your data was being held. 129 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:17,520 Speaker 3: In other words, in what sense our regulatory requirements for example, 130 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 3: different from one country to another, or from the EU 131 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:24,200 Speaker 3: to North America Or is there a practical way to 132 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 3: kind of express those differences. 133 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, there are very clear regulations in many of the 134 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:35,360 Speaker 4: countries regarding what type of data needs to reside inside 135 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:41,600 Speaker 4: the country, right, so particularly financial data, health data, those 136 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 4: are really really controlled and they have to follow those 137 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 4: regulatory requirements. So the way that we approach that in 138 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:55,959 Speaker 4: our architecture, in our platform is to enforce those regulatory 139 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 4: requirements within the platform so that this is not just 140 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 4: relied from a contract low standpoint, but that you ensure 141 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:07,640 Speaker 4: with governance tools and with capabilities that the platform is 142 00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:13,640 Speaker 4: securing that data in compliance with those regulatory aspects. And 143 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 4: when you think about sovereignty, it has to go beyond 144 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:21,320 Speaker 4: just the regulatory and compliance requirements. It's really understanding your 145 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 4: business requirements. What are the applications that are truly mission 146 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:28,400 Speaker 4: critical and that you need to ensure that have that 147 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:34,199 Speaker 4: level of control. Because also controlling everything is not necessarily viable, 148 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:37,679 Speaker 4: not from a technical standpoint and not from a business 149 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 4: case standpoint, right, So that is the I think that 150 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 4: is the challenge that many companies are going right now, 151 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:48,200 Speaker 4: is to have the visibility of their application mistake, how 152 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:51,959 Speaker 4: that matches the business strategy, and then making the decisions 153 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 4: on what is the level of sovereignty that I need 154 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:55,439 Speaker 4: to apply. 155 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,559 Speaker 3: Let's say I'm a naive company, I don't pay any 156 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 3: attention to this, I have operations in any different countries. 157 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:07,480 Speaker 3: What's the worst case scenario, what's the down What's what 158 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 3: happens if you don't act kind of prudently around data sovereignty. 159 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 4: So, I think the first aspect is if something happens 160 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 4: to your infrastructure that is sitting somewhere that you don't 161 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:25,719 Speaker 4: have visibility, goes out for some reason, a war and 162 00:10:25,960 --> 00:10:31,600 Speaker 4: energy blackout, any other cyber attack in your environment, if 163 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:33,920 Speaker 4: you don't have a fallback plan, if you don't have 164 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:37,560 Speaker 4: a way to move that application to operate from another 165 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 4: place that has the backups the real time data that 166 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 4: you are accessing to your pretty much go out of 167 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 4: out of operations, right. So it's a that's a very 168 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 4: important question. Because I think it brings the sovereignty aspect 169 00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:55,160 Speaker 4: to what I believe is the strategic role that it plays. 170 00:10:55,320 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 4: It's about resiliency, it's not about necessarily just meeting regulary requirements. 171 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 4: And I think you need to do that from a 172 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:07,360 Speaker 4: risk management standpoint, and I think an insurance company is 173 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:12,439 Speaker 4: the best position to do that. But it's not just regulations, 174 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 4: it's really making sure that you have continuous operation twenty 175 00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 4: four by seven, which is pretty much what businesses need 176 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 4: to come to achieve currrectly. 177 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:28,560 Speaker 5: In some countries for insurance, for example, but not only 178 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:33,959 Speaker 5: for insurance. In some countries there are obligations locally, for example, 179 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:38,200 Speaker 5: to store data in the country. So back to your question, 180 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 5: there's a limit to how naive you can be if 181 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 5: you want to develop a business, because that's at the 182 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:47,520 Speaker 5: heart of getting the authorization to operate and to run 183 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 5: your business in the countries where you would like to. 184 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 5: But then once you are over the kind of MVP 185 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 5: of requirements that are mandatory for you to open and operate, 186 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 5: then of course, I mean that's atort thing that an 187 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 5: What you said is completely completely relevant. 188 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 3: How does how does one anticipate these issues changing over time. 189 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:13,160 Speaker 3: In other words, you said that people are going to 190 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:15,959 Speaker 3: wake up to the importance of data sovereignty during COVID. 191 00:12:16,880 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 3: I'm just curious if we fast forward five years, do 192 00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:23,320 Speaker 3: we imagine that the kind of landscape in which companies 193 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:25,240 Speaker 3: like you as you want are operating is going to 194 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 3: get more complex or less complex? What's the what's the 195 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 3: movement in this? 196 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 4: I think it's going to become more complex because AI 197 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:37,079 Speaker 4: is really accelerating all the trends. 198 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 3: Why I want you to can you explain? I want 199 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,160 Speaker 3: you to kind of do a little deep dive on Yes, 200 00:12:43,240 --> 00:12:46,680 Speaker 3: what specifically is it about AI that's complicating this? 201 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 4: That's a very good question. AI now moves from you know, 202 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,760 Speaker 4: actions just being taken from you know, somebody operating a 203 00:12:56,840 --> 00:13:01,960 Speaker 4: system to the technology actually making this right. So you 204 00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 4: have to have a much better visibility of what systems 205 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:11,760 Speaker 4: AI is touching, what data it is accessing, and where right. 206 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 4: So you have to have that mapping much more clear 207 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 4: because the stakes are higher now on how technology is 208 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:22,440 Speaker 4: actually operating your business right. So I do think that 209 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:26,440 Speaker 4: there is an acceleration because of that. The second element, 210 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:30,600 Speaker 4: AI is going to increase the amount of vulnerabilities that 211 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 4: are going to be either identified or created. 212 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 6: So you have to have. 213 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 4: An ability to continuously monitor and scan what is happening 214 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 4: in the cybersecurity landscape so that you can prevent and 215 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:47,559 Speaker 4: react in a much faster way. So there are more 216 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:52,040 Speaker 4: elements of disruption that are coming up as a result 217 00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:53,679 Speaker 4: of the acceleration of technology. 218 00:13:55,160 --> 00:14:00,520 Speaker 5: I can give you a concrete example. So the wapplications 219 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 5: work today is pretty much deterministic. You have rules, you 220 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,559 Speaker 5: have data, you have processes. Very often embed it into 221 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 5: the the code, into the business logic. So these are 222 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:15,439 Speaker 5: executed and very often if you have the same inputs, 223 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:18,720 Speaker 5: you have the same output. And so you have I 224 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:21,760 Speaker 5: mean application with modules, you have APIs, you have data, 225 00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:24,600 Speaker 5: you have you know beautiful. 226 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 6: Mobile first front ends. You know all these fancy things 227 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 6: that we that we run on the cloud or on 228 00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 6: premium whatever. 229 00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 5: So let's project yourself into a couple of years from 230 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 5: now where the architecture is going to be agentic native. 231 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 6: With concepts such as had less applications. 232 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:45,120 Speaker 5: So you will interact with kind of prompt interface and 233 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:48,080 Speaker 5: you will start asking as a customer or as an 234 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 5: employee or as a partner, you will ask interacting and 235 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 5: asking a certain number of problems to be solved, and 236 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:57,280 Speaker 5: this is going to be given through tokens and all 237 00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 5: these all these technologies into a ecosystem of digital agents 238 00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 5: orchestrated and orchestrating activities looking at what is in the 239 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 5: in the rug in terms of what is the process 240 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 5: telling me about how do I have to manage that? 241 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:15,600 Speaker 5: What kind of data do I have in my repository? 242 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 5: And you enter into something which is going to become 243 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,760 Speaker 5: much more probabilistic, and you have llms there in the 244 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 5: meantime in the middle trying to get answers smart answers 245 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 5: to queries that will come from specialized digital agents. So 246 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:36,480 Speaker 5: there's nothing to do with the way applications run today. 247 00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 5: And if you look at the flow of data today 248 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:44,440 Speaker 5: that we know, we know where the data located. That 249 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:46,640 Speaker 5: was saying, you know a lot of things we know 250 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 5: and how the data is going to flow in all 251 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 5: the directions in this Argentic native architecture. You understand that, 252 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 5: as you said, this is going to accelerate significantly and 253 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 5: the need to understand the underlying tech and architecture in 254 00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 5: the sovereign the ecosystem is going to be crucial. You know, 255 00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:11,120 Speaker 5: data can suddenly become public in the way they can 256 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:13,960 Speaker 5: be used to train models and a little bit of 257 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:16,120 Speaker 5: your IP step by instead of going to go into 258 00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:19,640 Speaker 5: those those models if they learn. If you are not careful, 259 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:21,520 Speaker 5: that's what it's going to happen. Of course, there are 260 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 5: ways to prevent that, but if you're not careful, you 261 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 5: can suddenly see the word around you becoming more intelligent 262 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 5: than you on your own business. 263 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 3: It seems like there's a this is a very crude 264 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 3: way of putting it, but there's a race going on 265 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 3: with the technology on running one race and then the 266 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:43,000 Speaker 3: other race. Is our ability to kind of make sense 267 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 3: of it, have visibility and it integrate the technology into 268 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:49,000 Speaker 3: the way we do our who's winning that race right now? 269 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 3: Is it? Is it hard to keep up with the technology. 270 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:55,760 Speaker 4: That's why I think you need the technology to govern 271 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:58,560 Speaker 4: the technology right and and and to me, that is 272 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,960 Speaker 4: what our proposition with this platform that we launched a 273 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 4: few weeks ago called Sovereign Core, is to provide that 274 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 4: those that tool in and those capabilities to help organizations 275 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:14,760 Speaker 4: create those capabilities. Because what we learned already is that, 276 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:19,640 Speaker 4: as Jovanny explained very well, the technology is going to 277 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:25,359 Speaker 4: accelerate exponentially. How do you map that with that same 278 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 4: level of speed only another technology that is going to 279 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:34,040 Speaker 4: you know, operate at the same level of acceleration. And 280 00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 4: that is exactly the proposition that we have in supporting 281 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 4: our clients. So that's the headache that you're trying to solve. 282 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:44,480 Speaker 3: Givani, do you I'm assuming you've been in this field 283 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 3: of technology. 284 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 6: For how many years or thirty years? Yeah? 285 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 3: Is it any I'm curious to compare the moment we're 286 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,639 Speaker 3: into any previous moments. So you've now lived through several 287 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:01,840 Speaker 3: technological upheavals. Is this one compared to the ones earlier 288 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 3: in your career? 289 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:06,280 Speaker 5: For me, this one is very clearly the one that 290 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:13,480 Speaker 5: has the highest potential and in terms of speed, there's 291 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:17,360 Speaker 5: no precedent everything we've done in the past where we've 292 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:21,280 Speaker 5: been trying to modernize. Let's take a complete, complete exam 293 00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:24,919 Speaker 5: modernizing business applications. We had this discussion a couple of 294 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:28,359 Speaker 5: months ago. So like all the companies in the world, 295 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 5: we have legacy applications. All the companies have legacy applications 296 00:18:31,840 --> 00:18:35,440 Speaker 5: that have been written I don't know, thirty fifty years ago, 297 00:18:36,040 --> 00:18:40,520 Speaker 5: and the journey to modernize those applications. Has been the 298 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:44,400 Speaker 5: last let's say, the last fifteen years, something like very 299 00:18:44,440 --> 00:18:47,359 Speaker 5: often a five years ticket every time you wanted to 300 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 5: work to modernize something, including migration and decommissioning. And every 301 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 5: time we even a year ago, every time we were 302 00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:59,280 Speaker 5: thinking about how there's technology out there we can go much, much, 303 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:03,439 Speaker 5: much faster, we've always been blocked, and then we always 304 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:09,080 Speaker 5: came back to that unit of performance of the five years. 305 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:15,240 Speaker 5: And since this year, things are become potentially feasible because 306 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:19,360 Speaker 5: that's the agentic revolution, because then you can specialize agents 307 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:23,560 Speaker 5: like people in a team, to split the process into 308 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:26,399 Speaker 5: subtask and everybody is going to be very smart and 309 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,199 Speaker 5: intelligent in solving a part of the problem. And then 310 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:32,480 Speaker 5: if you are good enough to orchestrate that towards an outcome, 311 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:37,679 Speaker 5: which could be an application, modernization, ABC, whatsoever. Potentially I'm 312 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:40,720 Speaker 5: saying potentially, but this is now technologically we see that. 313 00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:41,399 Speaker 6: It can work. 314 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 5: You can do that, not any more than five years, 315 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:45,440 Speaker 5: but maybe I don't know, a year and a half, 316 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:48,520 Speaker 5: two years, maybe a little bit less. Why not, I 317 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:51,440 Speaker 5: don't know, but you see, the difference is simply huge. 318 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:52,720 Speaker 5: I've never seen that before. 319 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:54,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I agree with that. 320 00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 4: I think the compression that you're seeing in project delivery, 321 00:19:58,840 --> 00:20:03,639 Speaker 4: in new products at we are releasing updating versions of products, 322 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,879 Speaker 4: it's something that is absolutely unprecedented. So the base of 323 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,879 Speaker 4: innovation is happening very fast. And if we think that 324 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:16,239 Speaker 4: AI has already created a tremendous impact, let's wait for quantum, right, 325 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,400 Speaker 4: which is going to even take this. 326 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:23,160 Speaker 6: To another level. And the mix, the combination, prombination of both. 327 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:27,679 Speaker 3: Yes, it's a very interesting contradiction at the core of 328 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 3: all this, which is that intuitively, we know that innovation 329 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 3: thrives on openness into connectedness, you know, no border or whatever. 330 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:43,879 Speaker 3: But so DATUS already makes us think very specifically and often, 331 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:47,719 Speaker 3: I would imagine, painfully about the reality of orders. How 332 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:49,639 Speaker 3: do you manage that contradiction? 333 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:53,480 Speaker 4: I think that is really the challenge that we are 334 00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:56,160 Speaker 4: all facing right now, right I don't think we have 335 00:20:56,920 --> 00:21:01,879 Speaker 4: one hundred percent clear answer yet. There are certain elements 336 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 4: of this tack that clearly, I mean, trying to reinvent 337 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 4: is actually going to be a reinvention of the wheel, 338 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,880 Speaker 4: Like I mean, I'm not going to develop chips from 339 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:18,520 Speaker 4: the scratch from scratch, for example, infrastructure from scratch, But 340 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:20,640 Speaker 4: there are other elements of the stack that I can 341 00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:21,920 Speaker 4: get much better control. 342 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:22,440 Speaker 1: Right. 343 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,040 Speaker 4: So for example, to the point that you'ovanni made before, 344 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 4: where my data is sitting, what is the orchestration layer 345 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,600 Speaker 4: that I can implement so that I can bring the 346 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 4: right player at the right time. So look at the 347 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:39,159 Speaker 4: stack of technology that you're implementing and see what are 348 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 4: the elements where number one, it's feasible to achieve control 349 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 4: and number two, I know that it's something that I 350 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 4: actually have to do to make my business resilient. And 351 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 4: focus on those, right, because if you try to address 352 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:57,000 Speaker 4: the entire stack, or if you try to create a 353 00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:02,679 Speaker 4: model that basically build a fortres, that's not going to 354 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 4: be even feasible for you to achieve. 355 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:05,760 Speaker 6: Right. 356 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:08,800 Speaker 4: I normally say that sovereignty is not about building walls, 357 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:12,200 Speaker 4: it's about building bridges, right, It's how you really create 358 00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:13,200 Speaker 4: those connections. 359 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 6: I like. I like the way you phrase it. 360 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 5: That's exactly that, because at the end, if you put 361 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 5: sovereignty as an architecture requirement when you do design, I 362 00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:31,679 Speaker 5: don't say it's the it's it's it's the key to 363 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:35,400 Speaker 5: this very difficult you know, parading. But at least, it's 364 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:41,600 Speaker 5: making choices easier. So, for example, if you if you 365 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 5: don't put sovereignty as a business requirement, and you want 366 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 5: to develop your business in the cloud, what you are 367 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,280 Speaker 5: going to do is probably look at the available features 368 00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 5: that ive features from the cloud provider. You're going to 369 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 5: use those features full speed to go as fast as possible, 370 00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 5: as efficient as possible, and get access to all the 371 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,439 Speaker 5: stack you know and everything else. And the day you 372 00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 5: have a problem, you cannot switch, or it will take 373 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:09,439 Speaker 5: you five years and five hundred million to switch. 374 00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:11,520 Speaker 6: If you take the. 375 00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 5: Sovereignty as a requirement by design, when you want to 376 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 5: start the configuration of your stack, you ask yourself, what 377 00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:27,200 Speaker 5: do I have to concretely put here as a configuration item? 378 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 5: If I want to be, for example, multi cloud compatible 379 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,600 Speaker 5: or multi cloud and on prem compatible, what kind of 380 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 5: additional technologies maybe I have to use in order to 381 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 5: be able to I mean, do some portability of some 382 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:44,520 Speaker 5: workload from one platform to another. 383 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:46,680 Speaker 6: Not because I want to do that every day, because 384 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:47,359 Speaker 6: it makes no sense. 385 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 5: But if tomorrow I have a problem, I want to 386 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 5: be sure that by design I can I know what 387 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:54,719 Speaker 5: the process I'm going to use, what's the process is 388 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 5: going to use to do that portability. So these are 389 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:02,040 Speaker 5: elements that again, if you don't design your architecture using 390 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,959 Speaker 5: those those elements, you wake up in the morning you 391 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,639 Speaker 5: have a problem and you have no solution except spending 392 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 5: alpha billion euro. So that's that's that's the first point 393 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 5: I wanted to make. Now the second point is if 394 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 5: you want to turn technology into a business outcome, at 395 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 5: the end, you need to be very precisely activating a technology. 396 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:30,920 Speaker 5: So at the end you have to make a choice, 397 00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 5: yes I activate this feature you know, and yes I 398 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:36,960 Speaker 5: use this tech provider this solution. 399 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:38,679 Speaker 6: At the end, you don't escape. 400 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,800 Speaker 5: And what it also allows to do is making sure 401 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 5: that in this architecture based design you also make explicit 402 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:54,679 Speaker 5: what you buy from a tech provider and what you 403 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:59,400 Speaker 5: do yourself, and also what you do yourself for how 404 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:02,040 Speaker 5: long because you can try a certain number of things 405 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:05,080 Speaker 5: because you are not convinced that a certain number of 406 00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:12,520 Speaker 5: technology providers out there are sufficiently cross cross cloud platforms, 407 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,920 Speaker 5: and and you don't want to end up into a 408 00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 5: locking situation. So you can say I don't feel that 409 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,400 Speaker 5: it's mature enough, so I start doing it. But it's 410 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 5: not because you start doing it yourself, that you have 411 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,520 Speaker 5: to be stuck in that strategy of doing it yourself 412 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:28,439 Speaker 5: for fifteen years. 413 00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:30,760 Speaker 6: Again, even if you start doing it. 414 00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,440 Speaker 5: Yourself, in the design of the way you do it yourself, 415 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:37,920 Speaker 5: you plan an exit door to be able to move 416 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 5: into a solution from a tech provider when the strategy 417 00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:44,600 Speaker 5: is mature enough. So that's the difficulty, and that this 418 00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:49,880 Speaker 5: is every day discussions with discipline. What I always recommend 419 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 5: the teams is make the things explicit. There's no right 420 00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:58,359 Speaker 5: or wrong answer in a limited timeframe. There is something 421 00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,760 Speaker 5: that is best today for the company and may not 422 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 5: be the case tomorrow. 423 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:03,560 Speaker 6: So let's make it. 424 00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 5: Explicit and don't miss that that that I mean that 425 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:09,680 Speaker 5: extra work because it's extra work. This is not something 426 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,560 Speaker 5: that is coming really not falling from the sky. This 427 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 5: is extra work. But it's worse doing this this job. 428 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,439 Speaker 5: To be sure that at least we are always in 429 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:25,120 Speaker 5: this equilibri difficult equilibrium between accessing technologies and being sovereign 430 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:26,479 Speaker 5: compatible by design. 431 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 4: Just to stress you saw that Jovan used the word 432 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,120 Speaker 4: by design all the time, right, because I think that 433 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 4: intentionality is probably what's different from what we saw in 434 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,879 Speaker 4: the past on how companies were adopting innovation. It was 435 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 4: very much driven by convenience and speed, and now you 436 00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:50,880 Speaker 4: have to have convenience, speed and intentionality and understand that 437 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,680 Speaker 4: you know, you have to have visibility on the decisions 438 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,119 Speaker 4: you're making, and you have to keep your choices more open. 439 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 3: It was curious when you describe kind of challenges that 440 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,640 Speaker 3: come along with data sovereignty. This is also the way 441 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 3: that two of you work together. So I can I 442 00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:14,080 Speaker 3: mean companies insurers have been working with IBM. I imagine 443 00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:16,520 Speaker 3: for as long as they've been insurance and as long 444 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,760 Speaker 3: as they've been IBM. But I mean, in this particular iteration, 445 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 3: are we altering the nature the relationship. 446 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:27,800 Speaker 4: Before I go specifically to the partnership with as, I'm 447 00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:29,760 Speaker 4: going to give an example of what you're doing with 448 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:35,800 Speaker 4: another company, which I think illustrates very well the intention, 449 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:37,400 Speaker 4: the objective and the challenge. 450 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:37,680 Speaker 6: Right. 451 00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:41,400 Speaker 4: So we have a partnership with Locale as well, right, 452 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,000 Speaker 4: which is the cosmetics company. And they were like, okay, 453 00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 4: foundational models, large language models. 454 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:48,120 Speaker 6: Are super powerful. 455 00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,840 Speaker 4: Right, But I invested one hundred years in my company 456 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:56,000 Speaker 4: to build knowledge about building formula for cosmetics. 457 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:56,440 Speaker 6: Right. 458 00:27:56,800 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 4: I don't want to give that expertise that knowledge away, 459 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:05,359 Speaker 4: so I want to train my own my own foundational model. 460 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,879 Speaker 4: They are not going to do the entire stack of 461 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:13,160 Speaker 4: training by themselves, so they partner with us. We provide research, 462 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 4: We provide tooling that allows them to bring their data 463 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,840 Speaker 4: and create their own model based on an open source 464 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 4: pre trained a model. So these are the types of 465 00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:27,159 Speaker 4: you know, challenges that companies are facing. And to my 466 00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,320 Speaker 4: point prior, what is really critical to the point that 467 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 4: you don't want, you know, a third party to have 468 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 4: visibility or access to And when it comes to the 469 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 4: to the relationship with ACTS and many other of our clients, 470 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 4: I think number one is transparency. Right, they totally understand 471 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:51,400 Speaker 4: how our technology operates. What are the you know, what 472 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:54,920 Speaker 4: are the elements that are part of our architecture that 473 00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:58,880 Speaker 4: are going to connect with their systems and trust becomes 474 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:02,680 Speaker 4: really a fundamental element. Jovanni said. There are things that 475 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:04,520 Speaker 4: I'm going to build, there are things that I'm going 476 00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:07,240 Speaker 4: to buy, So who am I going to buy from? 477 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 4: Does this company really understand sovereignty by design? It's part 478 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 4: of the way that the architecture their solutions. I think 479 00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:17,720 Speaker 4: those are the elements and I think That's why this 480 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 4: discussion is so important right now because it also levels 481 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,960 Speaker 4: the playing field for us. Right at IBM, we have 482 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:28,880 Speaker 4: always been a company focused on technologies for the corporate 483 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 4: world to really implement mission critical workloads. So I think 484 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,040 Speaker 4: now people understand why we approach things the way we 485 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 4: approach and why hybrid cloud, you know, giving companies the 486 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:45,480 Speaker 4: ability to access multiple providers either on prem or in 487 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 4: the public domain. Why we have approached our technologies in 488 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:54,000 Speaker 4: that characterization is because we are starting to see the 489 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 4: challenges of not having a multi cloud hybrid cloud strategy 490 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 4: can actually imply to your business. So I think that 491 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 4: this is really what changes for us now we have 492 00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,239 Speaker 4: we we are much more conscious on the risks and 493 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:11,760 Speaker 4: those have to be considered when you're making technical decisions. 494 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 6: Yeah, I think in contact remre with with what you said. 495 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 5: That's that's that's at the heart of the relationship between 496 00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:23,760 Speaker 5: company like accesle and and and. 497 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 6: A strategic partner technology partner. 498 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:31,520 Speaker 5: If if that understanding is not there, there is no 499 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 5: way we are going to rely on that strategic partner 500 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 5: to build whatever future strategical orientation and and and it's 501 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,840 Speaker 5: true that today we have a large variety of technologies 502 00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:49,560 Speaker 5: running in production. As an insurance company, like banks, we 503 00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 5: have mainframes running a lot of a lot of business. 504 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 5: But at the same time we are full speeding the 505 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:02,080 Speaker 5: AI transformation. We have finished the clab migration and being 506 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:05,880 Speaker 5: able to understand the full stuck again, that's what is 507 00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 5: absolutely critical. 508 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:12,440 Speaker 3: I had asked you earlier about was there anything particular 509 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:16,440 Speaker 3: about the insurance business when it came to this question. 510 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:18,880 Speaker 3: I want to come back to that a little bit, 511 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 3: because you know, you've both of you have talked about 512 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:29,160 Speaker 3: trust and transparency. Our trust and transparency pretty core considerations 513 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,040 Speaker 3: for insure, I mean, much more so than someone that's 514 00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 3: yeah making you know, handkerchiefs. Talk a little bit about 515 00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:38,400 Speaker 3: Can you revisit that question. 516 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:40,240 Speaker 5: Yeah, of course, I think you have a very good 517 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 5: point if I look at the notion of trust. As 518 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:47,800 Speaker 5: you said, insurance is about trust the noble purpose of 519 00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 5: an insurance company. 520 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:50,880 Speaker 6: That's what I repeat every time I have the opportunity. 521 00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 5: You know, I'm so happy every morning when I wake 522 00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 5: up because I know what I'm waking up. EXCI is 523 00:31:56,840 --> 00:32:05,520 Speaker 5: there to help families, companies, individuals when they face real difficulties. 524 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:07,400 Speaker 6: You know why you wake up every morning. 525 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:11,520 Speaker 5: You know what is why it's difficult, and this implies, 526 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:14,640 Speaker 5: as you said, the notion of trust. So of course 527 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:18,000 Speaker 5: for us what it means, it means one, we need 528 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,520 Speaker 5: to make sure you were talking about data healthcare data and. 529 00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:22,720 Speaker 6: Your initial intervention. 530 00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:26,680 Speaker 5: We need to make sure indeed we know perfectly exactly 531 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:31,080 Speaker 5: where our data are stored and what kind of data 532 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,479 Speaker 5: we talk about, where is it sensitive data health data, 533 00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 5: because we need to overprotect that in order to make 534 00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:41,360 Speaker 5: sure that data that we have for our customers are 535 00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:44,040 Speaker 5: not going to be made public. That's our duty to 536 00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:47,720 Speaker 5: do that. It's again a notion of trust. Our customers 537 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 5: trust that we do that. Insurance companies are long term companies, 538 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 5: and if you don't have trust anymore, I mean we're 539 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:55,760 Speaker 5: simply out of business. 540 00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 6: So data is an important topic. 541 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:02,400 Speaker 5: But at the same time we talked about cyber You know, 542 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:08,400 Speaker 5: we have a very very strong cyber team and cyber 543 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:13,360 Speaker 5: security practice that we use both of course to protect 544 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 5: AXA like many organisms. I mean we all do that, 545 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:21,040 Speaker 5: of course, but also to help our customers protect themselves. 546 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,240 Speaker 6: And we have also used our. 547 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:29,320 Speaker 5: Skills to develop insurance products for companies to protect them 548 00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 5: against cyber risks. So that's also our duty to say 549 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 5: not only we develop those skills, but we also give 550 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 5: that skill back via an insurance product to our customers 551 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 5: because we want to help them. And then, of course, 552 00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 5: back to the notion of trust itself, if those elements 553 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 5: are there at the end, what we believe as an 554 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:51,479 Speaker 5: insurance company, and I agree with you this is valid 555 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:56,600 Speaker 5: for the insurance sector in general, is that if we 556 00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 5: continue to demonstrate that we do that very serio, our 557 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,080 Speaker 5: customers continue to have a lot of trust in us, 558 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:11,040 Speaker 5: and probably with the A revolution, the ones who will 559 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:14,239 Speaker 5: be able to be better, if I can use that word, 560 00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:16,680 Speaker 5: will be the ones who will be able to continuously 561 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 5: demonstrate that they can they always deserve the trust that 562 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 5: they received from from from their customers. So yes, of 563 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,279 Speaker 5: course this is specific. I mean the specific to the 564 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:31,719 Speaker 5: insurance sector probably thinks also such a know, pharmaceutical companies, 565 00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:36,319 Speaker 5: you know things activities where it's very very sensitive. 566 00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:38,439 Speaker 6: Yeah, that's that's clear. 567 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:41,120 Speaker 3: Let me ask a question the other way and maybe 568 00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:46,840 Speaker 3: Honor you can jump in here. These considerations might differ 569 00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:49,719 Speaker 3: from industry to industry, but can you what about from 570 00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:53,600 Speaker 3: big too small? Are is this a more pressing issue 571 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:57,080 Speaker 3: for a multinational than it is for a startup. 572 00:34:59,160 --> 00:34:59,839 Speaker 6: I think that this. 573 00:34:59,880 --> 00:35:02,759 Speaker 4: Is this this applies to all all the companies, right, 574 00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,000 Speaker 4: especially because they startups from today are not like the 575 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:07,160 Speaker 4: startups from the past. 576 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:07,520 Speaker 6: Right. 577 00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 4: Everybody is scaling so fast. Right, You're seeing companies going 578 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,080 Speaker 4: from zero to billion in like months in the current 579 00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:19,120 Speaker 4: in the current world. All these startup startups in general, 580 00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:23,719 Speaker 4: they operate in a global in a global footprint. So 581 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 4: if I am a startup going into the let's say 582 00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:31,480 Speaker 4: the healthcare, right industry, I'll need to follow the regulations, 583 00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:33,960 Speaker 4: even if I'm a very small startup, right. So I 584 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,839 Speaker 4: do think that probably what is happening now is that 585 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:44,440 Speaker 4: this applies to different sizes, different industries, probably some more 586 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:47,319 Speaker 4: regulated than others. And going back to the point of 587 00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:50,920 Speaker 4: Giovanni on insurance, I think insurance is probably the industry 588 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:56,080 Speaker 4: where this is much more visible, because insurance is about 589 00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,360 Speaker 4: pricing risk, right, and how do you price risk based 590 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,919 Speaker 4: on knowledge, based on probabilities, And that's all data, right, 591 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:07,600 Speaker 4: So data is their product, I would say. But every 592 00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:10,800 Speaker 4: company now will have to be watching those aspects because 593 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,000 Speaker 4: as they scale, even if they are small, they'll need 594 00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:16,880 Speaker 4: to be meeting those requirements. 595 00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:19,920 Speaker 3: If you were to chat with a founder who's just 596 00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:23,719 Speaker 3: starting out, came to you and said, what should I 597 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 3: be doing about data? 598 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:25,200 Speaker 6: Sovereignty? 599 00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,640 Speaker 3: Should what should I get right on day one? What 600 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 3: would your advice be? 601 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,760 Speaker 4: I think now it's much easier because when you're starting 602 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:35,839 Speaker 4: from scratch, you can really design your solutions and your 603 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:40,560 Speaker 4: applications already with all that in your mind. Right, So 604 00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:43,879 Speaker 4: all the points that Jovanni made before. By design, this 605 00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:47,200 Speaker 4: is how you're going to design up front. Understand what 606 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:51,360 Speaker 4: industry are operating in. Understand what are the implications of 607 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,799 Speaker 4: the data that you're manipulating, Map the risk and the 608 00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:59,480 Speaker 4: critical mission applications that you're going to develop. Make sure 609 00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:03,759 Speaker 4: that those are really like sovereign to the core, and 610 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:05,880 Speaker 4: you know, start the execution. 611 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:08,719 Speaker 5: We have not been talking a lot about that, but 612 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 5: if I look at Europe now, for example, encryption is 613 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:18,200 Speaker 5: very critical. When you talk sovereignty, everything you said is 614 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,359 Speaker 5: absolutely correct, but encrypt. That's an advice I would give 615 00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:25,640 Speaker 5: is make sure, for example that the management of the 616 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:29,799 Speaker 5: keys is yours is yours, you know, and do that 617 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,600 Speaker 5: from day one. Don't do that because when you do 618 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:37,239 Speaker 5: encryption very often That's what I was saying earlier. So 619 00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:41,440 Speaker 5: you have native services, for example, coming from the cloud providers, 620 00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:46,319 Speaker 5: and you can encrypt using the native services and dis 621 00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:48,200 Speaker 5: toward the keys of course that they have been used 622 00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:53,120 Speaker 5: to do this encryption, and it's very comfortable. You can 623 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 5: go very you can be very fast, but you lose 624 00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:01,680 Speaker 5: control mm hm. And so that's that's a very simple 625 00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:05,840 Speaker 5: trick that in the design very often now comes on 626 00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:08,960 Speaker 5: a regular business to pay attention. Of course, you can 627 00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:12,799 Speaker 5: use the services, but again storing the keys, the keys 628 00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:18,760 Speaker 5: are yours, so then nobody can access your data. 629 00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:22,040 Speaker 3: This is a really interesting theme that I'd love to 630 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 3: sort of end on, which is it seemed like there 631 00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:28,319 Speaker 3: was a moment in the evolution of technology where the 632 00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,200 Speaker 3: trend was in the other direction that I was you 633 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,160 Speaker 3: want to do outsources as much as you could and 634 00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,120 Speaker 3: just focus on a few things. But now you're talking 635 00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:39,680 Speaker 3: about the importance of taking back control. Is that? Am 636 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:42,120 Speaker 3: I right? Is this a shift across a number of 637 00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:44,839 Speaker 3: different dimensions when it comes to technology right now? 638 00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:49,359 Speaker 4: Yeah? I think technology now is so core to the business, 639 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:54,000 Speaker 4: is so central to the strategy that you really have 640 00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,640 Speaker 4: to take it like any other major component of your 641 00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:01,319 Speaker 4: supply chain and to me, that's the reason why we 642 00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:05,400 Speaker 4: have this wake up moment where people understand that I 643 00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:07,600 Speaker 4: need to put much more control, I need to have 644 00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 4: much more visibility. 645 00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:15,120 Speaker 5: The regulation itself is also creating, in a way the 646 00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:20,960 Speaker 5: obligation for us for certain activities to have those activities. 647 00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 6: Back under our control. 648 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:26,440 Speaker 5: For example, if I look at DORA regulation, what is 649 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:31,839 Speaker 5: DORA regulation telling you understand your key business processes, Map 650 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,839 Speaker 5: those key business processes to your underlying technology. 651 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:38,360 Speaker 6: Check where you have concentration risks. 652 00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:43,560 Speaker 5: Mapping again, starting from your very critical business processes. And 653 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:48,919 Speaker 5: once you've identified the areas where you have concentration, which 654 00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:58,760 Speaker 5: is normal, plan strategies, right strategies, test strategies on reversibility 655 00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:00,439 Speaker 5: and so this. 656 00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:02,960 Speaker 6: A couple of years ago. 657 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:09,880 Speaker 5: We were doing that, I would say, just when we 658 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:12,360 Speaker 5: were feeling that something in a specific area of the 659 00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:15,040 Speaker 5: architecture was a little bit strange. 660 00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:16,600 Speaker 6: Then we were doing a deep dive. 661 00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:19,960 Speaker 5: And we were very often arriving at the conclusion that 662 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:24,759 Speaker 5: probably there we need to change something. Let's change the technology, 663 00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:29,440 Speaker 5: create more portability, and bring the thing under control. But 664 00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:32,799 Speaker 5: it was really sporadic, you know, it was not systematic. 665 00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 5: With the regulation. Now it's mandatory we are as an 666 00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:41,520 Speaker 5: insurance company, we have to demonstrate every year we do 667 00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:45,040 Speaker 5: the job. So you see, I think you are totally 668 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:47,640 Speaker 5: right in saying that we need to make sure we 669 00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:50,720 Speaker 5: have a certain number of activities back under our control. 670 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:55,040 Speaker 5: But it's not only us deciding that. I think it's 671 00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 5: also regulations forcing us. And from that perspective at to say, 672 00:40:58,160 --> 00:40:59,480 Speaker 5: this was a very good initiative. 673 00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:01,000 Speaker 6: So just. 674 00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:08,160 Speaker 3: When you started, Giovanni and you're in this field, you 675 00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:11,760 Speaker 3: were probably either down the hall or on another floor, 676 00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:12,800 Speaker 3: and now. 677 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:13,239 Speaker 6: You have to be. 678 00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:17,600 Speaker 3: Directly in the C suite. I mean, these are It's 679 00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,359 Speaker 3: over the course of your career you've probably gone from 680 00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:24,480 Speaker 3: being marginal to being essential, which is very fascinating. I'm 681 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:28,920 Speaker 3: wondering did you Did you anticipate that transformation. 682 00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:31,799 Speaker 5: A little bit, yes, because I've always been convinced that 683 00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:37,560 Speaker 5: in reality, the more the world was going to modernize 684 00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:42,240 Speaker 5: and digitize, the more the technology was going to be inevitable. 685 00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:47,799 Speaker 5: But again I was I've not anticipated the speed of 686 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:51,000 Speaker 5: the current description that I've not anticipated. You know, I 687 00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:54,120 Speaker 5: was thinking about some of the statements that I was 688 00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:58,920 Speaker 5: making five years ago, announcing that a certain number of 689 00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:02,640 Speaker 5: elements we're going to upen probably you know, five two 690 00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:06,360 Speaker 5: time years time frame. In the meantime it's over. We 691 00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:10,440 Speaker 5: have already another disruption, you know. And I'm not talking 692 00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,120 Speaker 5: fifty years ago. I'm just talking five years or ten 693 00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:13,760 Speaker 5: years ago. 694 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:15,919 Speaker 6: So yeah, I. 695 00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:17,920 Speaker 5: Always had that feeling that technology was going to be 696 00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:21,960 Speaker 5: really critical, but I have to be honest and not honest, 697 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,320 Speaker 5: not that the level it is today. 698 00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:24,000 Speaker 6: Yeah. 699 00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,160 Speaker 3: The irony of this conversation is that I over the 700 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:29,920 Speaker 3: I've been a journalist for several decades and I realized 701 00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:34,040 Speaker 3: a few months ago that my data, in which case 702 00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:37,680 Speaker 3: is just interviews, you know, interview tape and transport, was 703 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,640 Speaker 3: scattered across a million different places. So I did my 704 00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:42,520 Speaker 3: own version of this, and I hired a twenty one 705 00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:45,480 Speaker 3: year old to sit on my hopice physically goes through 706 00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:48,360 Speaker 3: all my old archives. I'm doing my own version of 707 00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:51,359 Speaker 3: Malcolm Data Sovereignty is going on this summer a lot 708 00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:52,480 Speaker 3: less elaterate. 709 00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:54,840 Speaker 6: Good practice, good practice. 710 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:55,719 Speaker 1: Yeah that's good. 711 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,640 Speaker 3: But thank you very much for joining us on smart 712 00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:04,120 Speaker 3: talks I and good luck, and thank you all out 713 00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:05,880 Speaker 3: there for coming and listening. 714 00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:07,160 Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you. 715 00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:14,600 Speaker 3: Smart Talks with IBM is produced by Matt Ramano, Amy Gains, McQuaid, 716 00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:19,120 Speaker 3: Trina Menino, and Jake Harper. Engineering by Nina Bird Lawrence 717 00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:24,640 Speaker 3: Mastering by Sarah Braguera, music by Gramoscope, Strategy by Cassidy Meyer. 718 00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:28,719 Speaker 3: Smart Talks with IBM is a production of Pushkin Industries 719 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:33,400 Speaker 3: and Ruby's studio at iHeartMedia. To find more Pushkin podcasts, 720 00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:38,200 Speaker 3: listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 721 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:42,200 Speaker 3: listen to podcasts. I'm Malcolm Gladwell. This is a paid 722 00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:47,120 Speaker 3: advertisement from IBM. The conversations on this podcast don't necessarily 723 00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:57,719 Speaker 3: represent IBM's positions, strategies, or opinions.