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Speaker 1: Is that.

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Speaker 2: Okay, do you have enough friends?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Okay, me too, but you.

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Speaker 3: Can move back four more interesting.

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Speaker 5: Beth Carris and I are in Gaithersburg, Maryland, stuffing ourselves

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Speaker 5: into this car and about to go on a ride

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Speaker 5: along of sorts. We've asked Troy to help us recreate

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Speaker 5: what must have been one of the most frightening, chaotic,

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Speaker 5: and terrifying days of his life.

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Speaker 6: So I went up into here and then came back

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Speaker 6: down this way.

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Speaker 5: Beth is in the back, and I'm upfront with Troy,

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Speaker 5: who's driving. He's our tour guide today and has agreed

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Speaker 5: to bring us back to September eighth, twenty fourteen, the

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Speaker 5: day everything changed.

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Speaker 1: Probably the first place we could hit would be where

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Speaker 1: Jacob went missing from on the way back, and then

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Speaker 1: from there we'll go to Clarksburg and start from there.

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Speaker 5: I'm Sarah Trelevin and this is Unrestorable, an original podcast

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Speaker 5: from Anonymous content and iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Where are we?

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Speaker 1: We are entering what they call Darnstown or North Potomac,

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Speaker 1: which is actually still Gaithersburg.

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Speaker 5: We just drove through what looks like a pretty nice neighborhood.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this is Lakeland's here, and then We're going to

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Speaker 1: come out on twenty eight up here, and that'll take

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Speaker 1: us right out to where Lindsay used to live.

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Speaker 5: It's been about nine years since Troy has seen or

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Speaker 5: heard from his two youngest kids, Sarah three and Jacob two.

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Speaker 5: They were last seen with their mother, Catherine Hogle, and

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Speaker 5: despite her insistence that no harm has ever come to them,

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Speaker 5: police charged her with the children's murders, but she has

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Speaker 5: yet to face those charges in court. Years of mental

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Speaker 5: health problems led to Catherine being deemed incompetent, in other words,

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Speaker 5: unable to assist in her own defense. So for the

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Speaker 5: past nine years, Catherine has called the Clifton T. Perkins

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Speaker 5: Hospital Center, a psychiatric institution home. At the time that

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Speaker 5: his kids went missing, Troy and Catherine were still together

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Speaker 5: trying to raise their three kids, but Catherine's mental health

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Speaker 5: had been deteriorating and she'd been in and out of

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Speaker 5: mental health facilities. Her parents, especially her mother Lindsay, had

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Speaker 5: been helping with the kids, but even with his mother

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Speaker 5: in law's help, Troy was basically a single parent. He

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Speaker 5: was the one who did all the cooking and cleaning.

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Speaker 5: He made sure that the kids got to school and

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Speaker 5: gave them baths when they got home.

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Speaker 6: Two o'clock is when I picked her up from the

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Speaker 6: day program.

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Speaker 5: Troy spent the night of September seventh, twenty fourteen, at

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Speaker 5: work and the next day, September eighth, running errants that

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Speaker 5: included picking Catherine up from the psychiatric hospital, where she

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Speaker 5: attended a day program from morning through early afternoon.

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Speaker 6: I fell up, she's not out there.

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Speaker 1: Finally she comes walking out a little bit after two thirty,

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Speaker 1: so I'm like, what the heck is going on? You know,

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Speaker 1: She's like, oh, I got, you know, hung up talking

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Speaker 1: with this counselor and this and whatever all eyes Later on,

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Speaker 1: I find out because when I look at her phone records,

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Speaker 1: she actually was trying to call CAPS.

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Speaker 5: Troy was irritated because he didn't want to be late

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Speaker 5: to pick up his oldest son, who would soon be

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Speaker 5: dropped off by the school bus. But Catherine was normal,

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Speaker 5: fine to Troy. She was acting like it was any

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Speaker 5: other day.

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Speaker 6: I said, my little man can't be waiting.

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Speaker 5: The plan was to pick up their oldest son and

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Speaker 5: then get Sarah and Jacob from daycare.

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Speaker 2: And where did she tell you?

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Speaker 6: Like?

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Speaker 5: Was she like, oh, they're in this neighborhood. They're near

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Speaker 5: this complex much as they.

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Speaker 1: Were in daycare, So there was nothing really said at

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Speaker 1: this point because I thought I knew which one we

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Speaker 1: were going to.

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Speaker 5: Troy and Catherine had been discussing sending the two youngest

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Speaker 5: kids to daycare. They had talked about different options, but

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Speaker 5: that morning, when Troy woke up after working a late shift,

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Speaker 5: the kids weren't there. Catherine had made a decision to

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Speaker 5: take them to daycare, she told him. Not being consulted

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Speaker 5: about that decision definitely bothered Troy. But also Catherine wasn't

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Speaker 5: supposed to be driving because of the medication she was on,

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Speaker 5: and apparently she had driven both kids that morning. And

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Speaker 5: at this point, are you thinking anything's wrong other than like,

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Speaker 5: maybe this is a bit annoying.

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Speaker 1: No, I'm thinking I'm going to go get my kids

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Speaker 1: from the daycare and I'll determine, you know, if I

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Speaker 1: want them to go back to that daycare. But I'm thinking,

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Speaker 1: also what I need to do to make sure that

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Speaker 1: she's not even awake when I'm not around them, if

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Speaker 1: I need to have her not there at all, because

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Speaker 1: she's gonna, you know, full of craft like this.

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Speaker 5: Over the past few months, it had become clear to

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Speaker 5: Troy that Catherine could not be trusted to be alone

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Speaker 5: with her kids. The family questioned her ability to make

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Speaker 5: decisions and worried about the impact of the medication she

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Speaker 5: was taking. Lindsay says that Catherine would sometimes be so

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Speaker 5: drugged that she would fall into a deep sleep, impossible

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Speaker 5: to wake. Other times, Catherine seemed paranoid or confused or angry,

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Speaker 5: making the other adults around her uncomfortable and worried about

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Speaker 5: the children's safety. So as a family, they had decided

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Speaker 5: that Catherine could not be alone with the children. Troy

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Speaker 5: or her mother Lindsay or her father Randy had to

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Speaker 5: be around. Troy's life for the year leading up to

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Speaker 5: this event had been characterized by hypervigilants, the fear that

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Speaker 5: Catherine might in some way endanger the kids, even if

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Speaker 5: she didn't mean to hurt them. A unilateral move like this,

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Speaker 5: the loss of control to someone with a history of

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Speaker 5: making irrational decisions, was exactly what Troy had been afraid of.

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Speaker 2: But up until this day.

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Speaker 5: This car ride, no one imagined that Catherine would actively

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Speaker 5: hurt the kids. The day of September eighth begins with

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Speaker 5: Troy being woken up by his oldest son before the

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Speaker 5: alarm clock even goes off. Troy needs to start their day,

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Speaker 5: make breakfast for all three kids, and it's so early

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Speaker 5: that Troy just assumes that his two youngest kids, Sarah

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Speaker 5: and Jacob, are still asleep.

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Speaker 1: I notice Jacob is not in his crib, which is

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Speaker 1: actually in my room still, but it was normal for

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Speaker 1: him to climb out and go to my oldest bed.

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Speaker 5: Looking back, Troy now sees that there were hints that

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Speaker 5: things were off, but things have been off for so

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Speaker 5: long that the unusual had begun to feel somewhat normal.

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Speaker 1: What was also not as normal, but fairly normals for

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Speaker 1: all three of them to be in the same bed

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Speaker 1: by the morning.

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Speaker 6: So I look at in Sarah's She's not there. Something.

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Speaker 5: Next, Troy goes into his eldest son's bedroom, expecting to

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Speaker 5: see the youngest kids asleep together.

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Speaker 2: Instead, the room is empty.

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Speaker 6: So then I'm like, you know, okay, so they're not here.

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Speaker 5: Troy looks out the window and sees that his car

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Speaker 5: is gone too. When he calls Catherine's cell phone, he

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Speaker 5: sees it vibrating on the coffee table. He calls Lindsay

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Speaker 5: Catherine's mother, but she has no idea where Catherine, Sarah

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Speaker 5: or Jacob are.

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Speaker 1: I said, okay, and I get my oldest ready, get

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Speaker 1: him on the bus.

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Speaker 6: I didn't want to free came out. It seems. I

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Speaker 6: got him on a bus. I called nine one one.

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Speaker 5: That might seem extreme, I know, but things had become

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Speaker 5: so chaotic that Troy didn't want to take any chances.

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Speaker 5: But just as Troy's connecting with a nine to one

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Speaker 5: to one dispatcher, Troy sees Catherine pull up in their car.

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Speaker 6: I go to the car, What the hell is going

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Speaker 6: on based you know?

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Speaker 1: And she's like, oh, well, I took them to daycare.

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Speaker 4: I said, hold on, I said, you're not, and where

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Speaker 4: are we heading now?

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Speaker 6: So right now we're heading to Clarksburg.

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Speaker 4: And what's in Clarksburg.

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Speaker 6: That's the apartment we lived in with.

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Speaker 5: Troy believing his two youngest kids are in daycare and

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Speaker 5: his oldest safely at school. His day is relatively stress free,

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Speaker 5: but that irritated feeling he gets around Catherine settles in

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Speaker 5: as soon as he picks her up from her day

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Speaker 5: program at the hospital. She's running late, and Troy is

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Speaker 5: worried they will be late. Picking up their eldest son.

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Speaker 6: I was like, yeah, so let's go.

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Speaker 2: They make it on time to meet the school bus.

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Speaker 5: Next it's off to get the two babies off to

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Speaker 5: a daycare that Troy has never been to but thinks

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Speaker 5: he knows.

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Speaker 1: I got ready to turn, but she said go, you know, continue,

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Speaker 1: She was like, no, not that one. She was like,

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Speaker 1: it's down farther. I said, oh, I thought. She was like, no,

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Speaker 1: there's the one right behind me. So I keep going right.

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Speaker 1: So if we're driving here and I'm going, okay, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, there's no daycares right over here? Is there?

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Speaker 6: And she was like, not that I know of.

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Speaker 5: Catherine tells Troy to keep driving, but things are getting

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Speaker 5: very confusing, and.

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Speaker 1: I was like, so you're positive it's in Germantown and

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Speaker 1: she said yeah. I said, well, we're in Gaithersburg now,

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Speaker 1: so I need to make a U turn.

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Speaker 5: And the farther they go, the more it's clear that

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Speaker 5: Catherine is fuzzy on where she left their two youngest kids.

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Speaker 5: And Catherine is just sort of almost treating this like

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Speaker 5: you're having kind of a trivial argument, like it's not

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Speaker 5: a big deal. What are you getting So upset about

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Speaker 5: right exactly.

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Speaker 6: Her tone is kind of like, I don't understand why

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Speaker 6: you're so.

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Speaker 2: Angry For Troy.

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Speaker 5: It was infuriating Catherine, seeming nonchalance about picking up Sarah

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Speaker 5: and Jacob.

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Speaker 6: I said, so, what's the play is called? I don't know? Okay,

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Speaker 6: Well what road is it on?

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Speaker 1: I don't remember the name of the street, Troy, I said,

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Speaker 1: you don't remember what's called.

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Speaker 6: No, well, give me their phone number. I'll call them

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Speaker 6: right now.

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Speaker 1: I'm literally in this lane in this conversation sapen And

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Speaker 1: that's when she said, I don't have their phone though.

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Speaker 1: And then I looked at her. This light was red.

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Speaker 1: I stopped and I looked at her. I said, let

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Speaker 1: me get this straight. You took my kids and dropped

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Speaker 1: them off at a daycare. You don't know the name

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Speaker 1: of it, you don't have an address, you don't know

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Speaker 1: what street it's on, you have no idea where it is,

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Speaker 1: and you don't have a phone number. And she looked

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Speaker 1: at me, and that's when she said, well, they have

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Speaker 1: my number. And that's whenever I felt like I was

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Speaker 1: going to explode.

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Speaker 5: But out of the corner of his eye, Troy sees

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Speaker 5: his son, his eldest who's there in the backseat and

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Speaker 5: he's hearing.

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Speaker 6: All of this, and I said, okay, I can't do that.

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Speaker 5: Before Troy can go any further, he needs someone to

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Speaker 5: take his eldest son. So Troy calls Catherine's mother, Lindsey.

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Speaker 1: I said, I want you to take my son. And

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Speaker 1: Catherine was like, what are you doing? And I said,

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Speaker 1: what do you mean? What am I doing? I'm having

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Speaker 1: your mom meet us. He's going to go with her

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Speaker 1: and she was like, he's not going with her. I said, yes,

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Speaker 1: see it, And so she's going we'll go pick up

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Speaker 1: you know, Sarah and Jacob. And I said, I said, no,

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Speaker 1: we're going to go pick him up. I said, but first,

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Speaker 1: we're going to meet your mom here.

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Speaker 5: Troy pulls over to the side of the road to

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Speaker 5: wait for Lindsay, who shows up ten minutes later, but

222
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Speaker 5: Catherine is shaken out of complacency when Lindsay shows up

223
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Speaker 5: and separates Catherine from her eldest son. She was adamant

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Speaker 5: that Lindsay not take him. It seemed to trigger something

225
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Speaker 5: desperate furious in Catherine.

226
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Speaker 1: She starts going, well, he's not going through I'm like, yes, yes, yes,

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00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:34,360
Speaker 1: and She's.

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00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:36,360
Speaker 6: Telling her mom, Mom, just leave, just leaving. Let's going now.

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Speaker 1: I'm not leaving without him at this point, and Troy

230
00:11:39,800 --> 00:11:40,839
Speaker 1: wants me to take him.

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Speaker 2: You know, all of this behavior is clearly troubling.

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Speaker 5: Catherine had been struggling for years, but today this is

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Speaker 5: all new. In the months leading up to this, Catherine

234
00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,720
Speaker 5: was fine with her mother's involvement in their lives. Lindsay

235
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Speaker 5: had been a safe harbor for the family. She'd picked

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Speaker 5: up huge amounts of slack as a mother and grandmother.

237
00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:03,920
Speaker 5: But here and now, Catherine seems determined not to be

238
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Speaker 5: separated from her oldest son. Troy ignores her and picks

239
00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:10,200
Speaker 5: up their son, putting him in the back of Lindsay's car,

240
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Speaker 5: and I tell.

241
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Speaker 6: Her go she pulls off.

242
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Speaker 1: Catherine starts banging on the back of her car while

243
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Speaker 1: she's pulling off and springing obscenities at her. I said,

244
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Speaker 1: what the hell's wrong with you? She said, I don't

245
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Speaker 1: trust her with him. I said that's not true. She's

246
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Speaker 1: watched him a million times. So I said, so, where

247
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Speaker 1: are we going to get him? And she goes, well,

248
00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,000
Speaker 1: they're up here. She said, fine, let's go get him

249
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Speaker 1: because I want to go get him as soon as

250
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Speaker 1: possible from her.

251
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Speaker 5: At this point, Troy is wondering if this is some

252
00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:46,160
Speaker 5: kind of game, a control thing, maybe punishment for the

253
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Speaker 5: last year, for the rules, the hospitalizations, for telling Catherine

254
00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,480
Speaker 5: how she could be a mom. Maybe Catherine feels like

255
00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:56,720
Speaker 5: she's in trouble again, yet again letting down her family.

256
00:12:57,520 --> 00:12:59,960
Speaker 1: At this point, I'm not really scared because I can

257
00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:01,480
Speaker 1: my kids are in the daycare and we're going to

258
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Speaker 1: pick them up.

259
00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:03,040
Speaker 6: But I'm fearing.

260
00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:12,800
Speaker 5: Right before the kids went missing, Catherine had been getting

261
00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:17,199
Speaker 5: regular treatment. She was being medicated. Troy wondered if maybe

262
00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:22,080
Speaker 5: they could start enjoying life's mundane moments again. But now

263
00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:25,120
Speaker 5: Troy is wondering if maybe he'd been in denial that

264
00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:28,880
Speaker 5: in reality they could never really be a family, And

265
00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:32,360
Speaker 5: maybe he has no idea what Catherine is actually capable of.

266
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Speaker 6: We drive up here.

267
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Speaker 1: And I'm asking her, you know where there are things

268
00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:44,760
Speaker 1: like that, and she says, well, you know where it is?

269
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Speaker 2: This right here here was the daycare.

270
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Speaker 5: He knew it was close to the one where his

271
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Speaker 5: oldest had gone before he started school.

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Speaker 1: So are you telling me that they're at the daycare

273
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Speaker 1: where we put the oldest, and she said no. I said,

274
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Speaker 1: so some one right behind it. That's what you're telling me.

275
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Speaker 1: We're gonna go there and pick him up now. And

276
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:05,440
Speaker 1: she said, well, no, not that one. I said, well,

277
00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:07,560
Speaker 1: it was the only two over here. So at that

278
00:14:07,559 --> 00:14:09,400
Speaker 1: point I got the car. I opened up that door

279
00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:11,480
Speaker 1: and I'm saying above her, I'm gonna where are my kids?

280
00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,280
Speaker 5: And say sorry, you get out, walk around and open

281
00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:16,880
Speaker 5: her door.

282
00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:19,800
Speaker 1: Right and I'm gonna where are my kids? And she goes,

283
00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:24,680
Speaker 1: they're in daycare, Troy, you know? And I said, tell

284
00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:28,800
Speaker 1: me where my kids are? And whatever it is inside

285
00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:30,280
Speaker 1: of me, I can't put my hands on woman. I

286
00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:32,280
Speaker 1: wanted to yank her out and grab her and like

287
00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:34,680
Speaker 1: force her to talk, but I just can't put my

288
00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:36,600
Speaker 1: hands on a woman out of anger, and I didn't.

289
00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:40,000
Speaker 1: It may sound terrible, say I wish I could at

290
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:41,480
Speaker 1: this point. I wish I was one of those dudes

291
00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:44,400
Speaker 1: like it in that moment only, but just not. I

292
00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:48,480
Speaker 1: couldn't do it. So there's all kinds of things going

293
00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,080
Speaker 1: in my mind. I could make her talk, but nothing's happening.

294
00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,520
Speaker 5: Troy is losing control, but he knows he needs to

295
00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:59,080
Speaker 5: stay calm. He's picturing Sarah and Jacobs sitting at some

296
00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:03,400
Speaker 5: daycare god knows where, feeling forgotten, the only kids whose

297
00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:06,040
Speaker 5: parents haven't come to pick them up. But he's also

298
00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:08,840
Speaker 5: desperately hanging onto the hope that he'll see their faces

299
00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:12,640
Speaker 5: looking up at him when he finally gets there. Are

300
00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:15,360
Speaker 5: you thinking at this point that maybe she doesn't know

301
00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:17,680
Speaker 5: where the kids are, or maybe she's forgotten or anything.

302
00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:19,600
Speaker 2: No, she's nothing with it.

303
00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:24,480
Speaker 1: Or even since showing any signs of having this psychotic

304
00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:27,880
Speaker 1: break with no memory or any nothing like that. She's

305
00:15:27,920 --> 00:15:31,960
Speaker 1: not even acting like in terms of what I've seen

306
00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:35,000
Speaker 1: is in her mental illness when it's acting up or

307
00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:36,240
Speaker 1: bad or whatever you want to call it.

308
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:39,720
Speaker 5: Are the two of you talking about anything as this

309
00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:40,240
Speaker 5: goes on.

310
00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:41,720
Speaker 6: I have nothing to say to her.

311
00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:44,880
Speaker 1: I just want to get my kids, get them home,

312
00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:46,720
Speaker 1: get them in bed, and then put her ass out.

313
00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:49,040
Speaker 6: That's all I'm thinking. At this point.

314
00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:52,160
Speaker 5: She's thinking like I'm sending her to her parents or whatever,

315
00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:53,280
Speaker 5: or the street.

316
00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:55,040
Speaker 6: I don't care. At this point. She's a danger to

317
00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:56,440
Speaker 6: my kids, So I'm just done.

318
00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:05,000
Speaker 5: Driving from place to place. Troy's desperation grows. It's now

319
00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,280
Speaker 5: after six pm. The traffic is thinning as other people

320
00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:10,440
Speaker 5: make at home to spend the evening with their families

321
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:13,880
Speaker 5: to make dinner for their kids. When they pull up

322
00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:16,720
Speaker 5: to a church that Catherine has directed Troy to, he

323
00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:18,600
Speaker 5: feels a slight pang of relief when he sees a

324
00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:23,000
Speaker 5: playground and some toys. At this point, any sign of

325
00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:24,080
Speaker 5: children is a good thing.

326
00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:25,440
Speaker 6: So we go there.

327
00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:28,280
Speaker 1: There's a young lady there who runs the daycare, but

328
00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:30,000
Speaker 1: all the kids are gone.

329
00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:32,760
Speaker 5: The woman who runs the daycare confirms that Sarah and

330
00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:35,880
Speaker 5: Jacob were never there, that she's never seen Catherine before.

331
00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:39,240
Speaker 5: Catherine asked to use the bathroom, then comes back out

332
00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:40,560
Speaker 5: and joins Troy in the car.

333
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:43,000
Speaker 6: So what she did inside What turns out is she

334
00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:43,800
Speaker 6: asked to use phone.

335
00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:47,960
Speaker 1: She called her mom repeatedly and tried to get her

336
00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:49,080
Speaker 1: to bring the oldest back.

337
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:50,880
Speaker 6: Well, it turns out her mom.

338
00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:52,520
Speaker 1: Told her was that you know, as soon as you

339
00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:54,080
Speaker 1: produced the other two, then you'll see him.

340
00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,600
Speaker 5: Troy knows this is serious, but what are his options.

341
00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:00,480
Speaker 5: Catherine is the only one who knows where Sarah and

342
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,360
Speaker 5: Jacob are, and if he doesn't play her game or

343
00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:06,480
Speaker 5: whatever this is, then maybe she'll just decide not to

344
00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:09,560
Speaker 5: tell him. They start driving again.

345
00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:11,320
Speaker 1: I was like, is it this one? She was like, nah,

346
00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:13,959
Speaker 1: not that one. I pointed out, like pretty much every

347
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:14,920
Speaker 1: church on was it this one?

348
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:17,280
Speaker 6: Is it? This one? Is this one? The whole way

349
00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:17,720
Speaker 6: up there?

350
00:17:17,840 --> 00:17:20,119
Speaker 3: You know, at this point Catherine was not supposed to

351
00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:22,600
Speaker 3: be alone, unsupervised with the children.

352
00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:25,160
Speaker 5: Just a reminder that Beth Carris is in the car

353
00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:25,880
Speaker 5: with us as well.

354
00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:28,399
Speaker 3: I mean, maybe you didn't want to go there in

355
00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:30,800
Speaker 3: your mind that she had done something with the children,

356
00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:32,520
Speaker 3: but there was a reason why she wasn't supposed to

357
00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:33,240
Speaker 3: be alone.

358
00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:36,760
Speaker 1: With them, right right, And it wasn't that anyone actually

359
00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:40,080
Speaker 1: at that point believed that she would physically purposely hurt them.

360
00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:42,080
Speaker 6: It was more of the decision making stuff.

361
00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:56,439
Speaker 5: But it's at this point, close to seven pm, the

362
00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:59,400
Speaker 5: sun starting to dip, that the worst case scenario must

363
00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:07,600
Speaker 5: be starting to creep into Troy's mind. Troy and Catherine

364
00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:09,760
Speaker 5: had been in the car for more than four hours

365
00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:12,880
Speaker 5: when they arrived at one more daycare, and this one

366
00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:18,199
Speaker 5: is still open. Troy is sure that this is the

367
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,879
Speaker 5: one that he's going to walk through those doors and

368
00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:25,440
Speaker 5: see his children. As he pulls up, he can feel

369
00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:27,000
Speaker 5: his heart pounding in his chest.

370
00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:33,840
Speaker 1: I pulled into it was actually this middle spot here.

371
00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:39,000
Speaker 1: There was nothing here. There was like one car parked

372
00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:42,320
Speaker 1: in the back there. So I'm going, so this is way,

373
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:46,159
Speaker 1: she says, yes. So I get out, walk quickly to

374
00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:49,840
Speaker 1: the door. Here, go inside, and I'm so sorry I'm late.

375
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:51,960
Speaker 1: You know, I came to get my kids and the

376
00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:55,280
Speaker 1: ladies looking at me, going, ain't no kids here. I'm going, uh,

377
00:18:56,760 --> 00:18:58,680
Speaker 1: you know, I give their names, like Sarah and Jacob.

378
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,040
Speaker 1: She was like, no, bought my phone. I showed her

379
00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:04,920
Speaker 1: a picture on like these two and she's like they

380
00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:14,280
Speaker 1: were never here. She was like, we've never seen them.

381
00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:17,280
Speaker 2: Troy changes his mind.

382
00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:22,119
Speaker 5: At this moment, whatever Catherine is doing, whatever game she's playing,

383
00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:23,879
Speaker 5: he's done.

384
00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:28,440
Speaker 1: I'm thinking I'm going to the police station to basically

385
00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:30,640
Speaker 1: have them do whatever they need to do to find

386
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:34,199
Speaker 1: out where my kids are. And I'm thinking that I

387
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:36,720
Speaker 1: need to get there before I lose control over my emotions.

388
00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:40,560
Speaker 1: At this point, you know, this is it's just too much.

389
00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:43,119
Speaker 1: At this point, I'm like this, it's crazy.

390
00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:47,200
Speaker 2: So you're like really feeling on the edge here, Yes.

391
00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,320
Speaker 1: And it's at this point I still don't think in

392
00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:50,800
Speaker 1: my mind.

393
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:52,080
Speaker 6: She physically hurt my kids.

394
00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:54,080
Speaker 1: But I'm thinking she has left my kids somewhere where

395
00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:57,239
Speaker 1: no one is except maybe one person sitting there, you know,

396
00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:00,359
Speaker 1: because there's two kids stuck there, who's probably gonna call

397
00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:05,880
Speaker 1: the police or CPS, thinking that they've been abandoned. She owes,

398
00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:08,080
Speaker 1: why are we pulling down here? And I said to

399
00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:10,240
Speaker 1: the police station is here? We're going to the police station.

400
00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:12,840
Speaker 1: When I said that to her about right here, and

401
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:14,640
Speaker 1: she was like, we don't need to involve, We don't

402
00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:17,000
Speaker 1: need to do that. I said, yes we do. I said,

403
00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:19,320
Speaker 1: my kids aren't here. I don't know where you put them,

404
00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:21,760
Speaker 1: so I need to have the police help me find them, apparently,

405
00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:25,880
Speaker 1: and then she owes they're on beatheta church road.

406
00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,560
Speaker 5: Catherine plays this like she's folding, giving up the game,

407
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:39,000
Speaker 5: like Troy has won and now she is going to

408
00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:42,440
Speaker 5: really actually tell him where he can find Sarah and Jacob.

409
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:47,400
Speaker 5: Or maybe she's bargaining against something that terrifies her. Lindsey

410
00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:50,199
Speaker 5: told me that when Catherine was involuntarily committed, she was

411
00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:53,440
Speaker 5: handcuffed by police and taken away in front of her children,

412
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,760
Speaker 5: and that she'd had a paralyzing fear of police. There

413
00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:58,920
Speaker 5: are red and blue lights and the loud sirens in

414
00:20:58,960 --> 00:20:59,439
Speaker 5: the distance.

415
00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:03,120
Speaker 1: Since I was like, what are you talking about? She said,

416
00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:05,840
Speaker 1: there's a daycom Beth's Church Road. That's where I put them.

417
00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:07,960
Speaker 1: And I said, so, why wouldn't you have just said

418
00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:09,399
Speaker 1: that before so we could have went and picked up

419
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:11,920
Speaker 1: She said, because they actually have extended to stay there

420
00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:12,840
Speaker 1: till like eight o'clock.

421
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:15,280
Speaker 6: And I was like, no one does that, that's not real.

422
00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:17,320
Speaker 1: She was like, well, she's like out there, they do,

423
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:19,800
Speaker 1: she said, because parents get home much later because traffic

424
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:20,560
Speaker 1: is farther out.

425
00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:25,960
Speaker 5: Now. At this point, it's near dark and Troy is done,

426
00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 5: done with Catherine, done with the wild goose chase. Plus

427
00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,120
Speaker 5: he can't dismiss his creeping sense of alarm. He feels

428
00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:36,640
Speaker 5: a tug towards the police station. But he also can't

429
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:38,200
Speaker 5: let go of the hope that the kids will be

430
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:41,600
Speaker 5: at the next daycare, that after a long and frustrating day,

431
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:44,800
Speaker 5: his life will return to what looks like normal. So

432
00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:48,439
Speaker 5: he agrees to drive to Bethesda Church Road, but first

433
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:51,199
Speaker 5: Catherine pleads with him to stop for a soda. Her

434
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:55,120
Speaker 5: medication is kicking in, she says, and she's feeling tired, all.

435
00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:58,120
Speaker 6: Right, I said, we'll go right here. Hit it up.

436
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:01,040
Speaker 5: Troy and Catherine pull in the parking lot of a

437
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,159
Speaker 5: fast food chicken sandwich place. There's a drive through, but

438
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:05,240
Speaker 5: Troy parks the car.

439
00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:10,040
Speaker 1: I park right here, literally right here, in this spot,

440
00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:12,879
Speaker 1: and we got out, walked in.

441
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:16,600
Speaker 5: Catherine gets a soda, and the two of them head

442
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:19,440
Speaker 5: back to the car. Troy is hopeful that the next

443
00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:22,600
Speaker 5: daycare is the right one, that Sarah and Jacob will

444
00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,160
Speaker 5: be back in his arms as soon as he can

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00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:28,240
Speaker 5: get there. But Catherine stops. She says her cup is

446
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 5: already empty. She wants to get a refill, so she's

447
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 5: nice and alert when they go pick.

448
00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 2: Up the kids.

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00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,400
Speaker 1: So I said, well, hurry up, I said, I want

450
00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:37,280
Speaker 1: to go get my babies.

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00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 2: Troy gets in the car.

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00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:41,399
Speaker 5: He's antsy and he starts it up in anticipation of

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00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,639
Speaker 5: Catherine returning any second.

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00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,960
Speaker 1: Then approximately three minutes past, and that's when it hit me.

455
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:53,800
Speaker 6: You don't stand in line for refills here.

456
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 2: Desperate, Troy runs back into the store.

457
00:22:58,640 --> 00:22:59,879
Speaker 6: So don't see her anywhere.

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00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:03,440
Speaker 1: So she's not in line, she's not off to the

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00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,639
Speaker 1: side getting a refill, she's nowhere inside. Walk into the

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00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,160
Speaker 1: men's bathroom, walking into the women's bathroom.

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Speaker 6: Nothing, she's just.

462
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:16,040
Speaker 2: Gone, and now it's going through your mind.

463
00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:20,200
Speaker 6: What's going through my mind now? Is just panic.

464
00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:24,440
Speaker 5: Troy and knows where his next stop has to be.

465
00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:28,240
Speaker 5: The police station is right across the street. He parks

466
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:30,920
Speaker 5: in front and runs inside, so like, I.

467
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:32,639
Speaker 1: Go in, there's like the window where you tell them

468
00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:33,880
Speaker 1: you know why you're there or whatever.

469
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:38,720
Speaker 5: Troy frantically calls Lindsay, his own mother, Catherine's dad, Randy.

470
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:41,919
Speaker 5: Full panic has set in as he tells the cops

471
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:42,639
Speaker 5: what he's been.

472
00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,440
Speaker 1: Through that day, Like, go do whatever you gotta do.

473
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:47,520
Speaker 1: I'm sure you have to question me. Let's get that

474
00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:48,040
Speaker 1: out of the way.

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00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:48,280
Speaker 6: You know.

476
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:50,040
Speaker 1: It was like whatever you got to do to get

477
00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:51,639
Speaker 1: to actually finding my kids, just do it.

478
00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:53,600
Speaker 2: Lindsay arrives at the police station.

479
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:57,520
Speaker 1: So Lindsay goes, I've been searching daycare for nowhere any

480
00:23:57,560 --> 00:23:58,440
Speaker 1: of them in Germantown.

481
00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:01,000
Speaker 6: I've driven to all with like what, like how long

482
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 6: have you been doing it? And what is going on here?

483
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,359
Speaker 1: And she said, I've been worried kind of you know,

484
00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:08,919
Speaker 1: says she didn't come back with Jacob last night. And

485
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:13,720
Speaker 1: I said what, and she goes, yeah, she came back

486
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:15,000
Speaker 1: without Jacob last night.

487
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:22,159
Speaker 5: Catherine had come home without Jacob the night before.

488
00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:24,399
Speaker 1: I said, what the hell are you talking about, Lindsay,

489
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:26,720
Speaker 1: she goes, you didn't know Jacob wasn't there last night?

490
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 6: I said no, I said no. One told me that.

491
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:42,640
Speaker 4: With this.

492
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 5: It all comes crashing down that morning when Troy came

493
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 5: home from working the night shift and he couldn't find

494
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 5: his two youngest kids when Catherine was gone, and so

495
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:55,160
Speaker 5: was the car. Remember, Troy had started to call nine

496
00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 5: one one, but Catherine came home then and told him

497
00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:01,679
Speaker 5: she'd taken the kids to daycare. It never occurred to

498
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,760
Speaker 5: Troy that she'd been lying. It never occurred to him

499
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 5: that the kids hadn't spent the night in their beds,

500
00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:10,479
Speaker 5: that the kids had been missing since the night before.

501
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,680
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, you know, like what's going on? Like this

502
00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:17,359
Speaker 1: is insane, like where are my kids? And that's kind

503
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 1: of all I'm real I think it's just where are

504
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 1: my kids? What's going on here? Like I have to find.

505
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 2: Them next time? On Unrestorable.

506
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 1: The next morning, I get a call and they're asking

507
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 1: myself and Randy to come in and saying, look, she

508
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:37,879
Speaker 1: won't tell us where the kids are. Maybe she'll tell you, guys,

509
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:39,600
Speaker 1: come ask her.

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Speaker 5: Unrestorable is executive produced and hosted by Me, Sarah Trulevin,

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00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 5: and Beth Carris. Our story editor is Kathleen Goldhar. Mixing

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00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:56,959
Speaker 5: and sound designed by Reza Dyah for anonymous content. Jessica

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00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 5: Grimshaw is our executive producer, Jennifer Sears is our executive

514
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 5: in charge of production, and Nick Yanas is our legal council.

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00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:08,320
Speaker 5: For iHeart executive producer Christina Everett and supervising producer Abu

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Speaker 5: Zafar