WEBVTT - Sarah Wayne Callies 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:03.240 When I came to the Mainland for college. I went 0:00:03.279 --> 0:00:05.480 to school in New Hampshire, which is about as different 0:00:05.559 --> 0:00:06.640 as you can get. 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:07.240 Yeah. 0:00:07.600 --> 0:00:09.400 No, I actually didn't have any idea what I was 0:00:09.400 --> 0:00:11.000 in for. I brought like a pair of sneakers and 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:13.520 a cotton hoodie and I was like ready for winter, 0:00:13.880 --> 0:00:16.120 Like two comes up. I talked to this day. I 0:00:16.120 --> 0:00:19.120 don't know why my parents didn't like buy me wool 0:00:19.239 --> 0:00:21.840 or boots. I think they just I'm sure that I 0:00:21.880 --> 0:00:23.320 was just sort of an arrogant little shit of a 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:24.720 kid who was like, I kN know what I'm doing, 0:00:24.720 --> 0:00:26.040 and they were like, all right, you can learn the 0:00:26.079 --> 0:00:34.680 hard way. Hi. My name is Sarah Wayne Kelly's. And 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:39.760 in the following podcast, I almost make Brian spittake, which 0:00:40.000 --> 0:00:40.920 I am very proud of. 0:00:48.800 --> 0:00:53.000 Hey, everybody, we're back. It's another episode of Off the 0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:57.600 Beat here and I am your host, Brian Baumgartner. What 0:00:57.680 --> 0:00:59.400 I want you all to do for a second is 0:00:59.480 --> 0:01:04.959 think about things that give you nightmares. Maybe tornadoes, zombies 0:01:05.040 --> 0:01:08.720 for sure, zombies give people nightmares, maybe aliens, I don't know. 0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:11.200 Think about the things that give you nightmares, and then 0:01:11.520 --> 0:01:15.559 whatever you're thinking about. My guest today has probably been 0:01:15.840 --> 0:01:20.200 in a movie or a show about it. However, she 0:01:20.360 --> 0:01:24.039 herself is a dream my guest today, as you just 0:01:24.120 --> 0:01:28.880 heard Sarah Wayne Calli's You may know her from her 0:01:29.000 --> 0:01:33.280 death Row drama prison Break, maybe the zombie thriller The 0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:39.560 Walking Dead, the dystopian sci fi Colony, or from films 0:01:39.640 --> 0:01:42.840 like Into the Storm, Black November, and Pay the Ghost. 0:01:42.959 --> 0:01:49.480 She's also a writer, director, producer, former historian, and hula dancer, 0:01:49.760 --> 0:01:53.360 as you will soon hear about. I did not know 0:01:53.440 --> 0:01:56.280 Sarah before today, but let me just say this now 0:01:56.320 --> 0:02:00.160 that I do. She's awesome. Yeah, and you're gonna think 0:02:00.200 --> 0:02:04.480 so too. She's also just recently written, produced, directed, and 0:02:04.800 --> 0:02:10.720 voice starred in a fantastic post apocalyptic episodic story a 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:15.920 podcast called after Shock, which she just premiered its second season. 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:20.919 It's kind of an adventure thriller about the world after 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:25.960 a big earthquake levels Los Angeles, which I don't like 0:02:26.000 --> 0:02:29.720 to think about. Whoever, the story is fascinating. It's such 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:32.160 a cool project. You gotta check it out. But don't 0:02:32.160 --> 0:02:34.880 take my word for it. Take her. She's better at 0:02:34.919 --> 0:02:41.480 words anyway. The multi talented and very funny Sarah Wayne 0:02:41.680 --> 0:02:51.200 Kelly's Bubble and squeak, I love it, bubble and squeakna 0:02:53.440 --> 0:02:54.400 bubble and squeak. 0:02:54.440 --> 0:02:56.000 I cook it every mo. 0:02:56.480 --> 0:03:10.560 Lift over from the ninety before. Thanks Hi, Sarah, uh hi, 0:03:10.720 --> 0:03:13.680 how are you. I'm so good. How are you doing. 0:03:14.200 --> 0:03:15.960 I'm good. It's nice to see you. 0:03:16.480 --> 0:03:19.519 It's very nice to see you. Thank you so much 0:03:19.560 --> 0:03:20.720 for joining me today. 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:23.720 Oh my god, it's absolutely my pleasure. You gave me 0:03:23.800 --> 0:03:28.440 all the cool points with the kids. They're enormous office fans, 0:03:29.160 --> 0:03:30.880 and I think of everything I've done in the last 0:03:30.919 --> 0:03:32.840 maybe like eighteen months, this is the. 0:03:32.800 --> 0:03:35.640 One that like, this is this is the cool one. 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:37.240 Actually matters to them. So thank you. 0:03:38.440 --> 0:03:39.320 How old are they? 0:03:40.040 --> 0:03:41.120 Sixteen and ten? 0:03:41.640 --> 0:03:42.760 Yeah, that's about right. 0:03:42.960 --> 0:03:46.880 Well, and they just finished okay, it was on Netflix 0:03:46.880 --> 0:03:51.160 here in Canada, and so like they just finished two 0:03:51.360 --> 0:03:54.760 back to back binges of the whole thing for the 0:03:54.800 --> 0:03:57.200 first time. It was very sweet. They came up to 0:03:57.200 --> 0:03:58.640 me and they were like, have you ever seen the office? 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:01.200 It's great? And I was like, really, that's amazing. I'll 0:04:01.200 --> 0:04:03.280 tell everyone I know. Thank you. 0:04:04.560 --> 0:04:04.720 Yah. 0:04:04.760 --> 0:04:06.360 They got to the party late, but they're here. 0:04:06.760 --> 0:04:09.640 You've never heard of it? Where are you in Canada? 0:04:09.720 --> 0:04:11.680 I'm on my way you are. 0:04:11.760 --> 0:04:12.720 Where are you coming to. 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:15.960 I'm coming to Toronto. 0:04:16.680 --> 0:04:18.640 Oh, I'm on the other side. I'm in BC. 0:04:19.160 --> 0:04:21.000 Oh okay, yeah. 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:23.280 I'm on the warm side. How long are you going 0:04:23.360 --> 0:04:24.600 to be there? 0:04:24.640 --> 0:04:27.440 The war? Not that long. I think it's still I 0:04:27.440 --> 0:04:29.520 think it's still I think it's still hot there. But 0:04:29.600 --> 0:04:32.560 I've never been. I'm very excited. I've only been to 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:36.560 the the your side before. I've never I've never been 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:39.719 to Toronto. I'm excited. I'm excited to do it. 0:04:39.720 --> 0:04:40.320 Great city. 0:04:40.800 --> 0:04:44.559 I'm going to see Niagara Falls for the first time. 0:04:45.279 --> 0:04:49.599 That is wonderful. I have good I've got good kind 0:04:49.600 --> 0:04:52.360 of memories of that area. My husband's from quite near Rochester, 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:56.719 so you know, the falls were nearby. And when we 0:04:56.720 --> 0:04:59.240 we just became dual citizens with the US and Canada 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:02.599 last year. Okay, I first landed. You have to land 0:05:02.640 --> 0:05:06.640 as an immigrant, and we were staying with my husband's parents, 0:05:07.080 --> 0:05:08.960 and so we just went up to Saint Catherine's, which 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:10.840 is really close. It's this teeny little town on the 0:05:10.880 --> 0:05:13.480 border and you just cross the border and they stamped 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:15.239 the thing and you have to spend a night there. 0:05:15.640 --> 0:05:19.240 But it's like it has a nice, warm, fuzzy oh 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:21.920 spot in my house. And I gotta tell you, Toronto 0:05:22.000 --> 0:05:25.960 has some of my favorite food in the country. There's 0:05:26.200 --> 0:05:28.360 just wonderful restaurants. 0:05:28.440 --> 0:05:29.960 Okay, I'm very excited. Now. 0:05:30.040 --> 0:05:31.480 Yeah, I was just there for a conference. 0:05:31.480 --> 0:05:34.800 I'll send you a list, Okay, yeah, send me a list. 0:05:35.320 --> 0:05:38.480 All right, Well you're in Canada. Now, you started out 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:41.960 you were born in Illinois, but you went to Hawaii 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:47.320 like immediately. So first off, how are you feeling about 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:50.200 what's going on in Hawaii right now? It's I mean, 0:05:50.240 --> 0:05:54.520 it's it's devastating. What's what's happening over there in Hawaii? 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:56.280 You were on in a Wahu? Is that right? 0:05:56.480 --> 0:05:58.240 I grew up on o Wahoo. Yeah, so you know, 0:05:58.279 --> 0:06:02.520 I was born in Illinois. My parents both applied for 0:06:02.720 --> 0:06:06.120 jobs as professors at universities all around the country. And 0:06:06.120 --> 0:06:08.560 the only university that took them both. I don't know 0:06:08.560 --> 0:06:11.880 why university was so hard to say just then, the 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:16.039 only place of higher education that took them both was 0:06:16.040 --> 0:06:19.360 the University of Hawaii. So just a huge shout out 0:06:19.360 --> 0:06:23.320 of gratitude to the board of regents there for bringing 0:06:23.400 --> 0:06:27.480 me to Oahu where I grew up. As for what's 0:06:27.520 --> 0:06:30.120 happening on Maui. I don't honestly know that I have 0:06:30.279 --> 0:06:35.520 words yet. It's you know, Lahina was the capital of 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:41.280 the Kingdom of Hawaii before it was illegally overthrown as 0:06:41.279 --> 0:06:47.640 a sovereign monarchy. It's such a deeply important place to 0:06:47.720 --> 0:06:52.120 Hawaii's history before you even scratch the surface of just 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:57.000 the scale of the human loss. Yeah, you know, I 0:06:57.040 --> 0:07:01.040 was just reading something today that of the plus bodies 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:04.919 that they have discovered, they can only identify five because 0:07:04.960 --> 0:07:08.599 there's only enough left. And you just a friend of 0:07:08.600 --> 0:07:11.240 mine has a brother who's this wonderful T shirt designer, 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:13.560 So you know, he's designed a T shirt and I'm 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:15.120 going to put a bunch of stuff out about like 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:18.640 all profits to whatever. But I don't think there's a way. 0:07:20.800 --> 0:07:23.320 I don't know what you do. You can't rebuild. You 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:27.640 have to kind of re envision and recreate, and whatever 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:32.400 you build will still hold the kind of ghost of 0:07:32.440 --> 0:07:37.240 what you've lost. But I will say that, like I 0:07:37.280 --> 0:07:41.800 wonder if people in Hawaii don't have an extra set 0:07:42.560 --> 0:07:46.440 of tools in their toolbox. It is a place where 0:07:46.560 --> 0:07:50.280 I think most of us just were kind of raised 0:07:50.880 --> 0:07:55.760 with a connection to community, a connection to the land, 0:07:55.760 --> 0:08:01.560 itself to the stories about the land that will, I think, 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:05.320 create a kind of resilience and a kind of spirit 0:08:05.520 --> 0:08:09.480 of I don't even know what like resurrection of whatever 0:08:09.560 --> 0:08:10.640 comes next. 0:08:10.840 --> 0:08:14.920 Right now, I get it. I mean, clearly it's a 0:08:15.040 --> 0:08:20.400 very important place for you. I will say sadly, I've 0:08:20.560 --> 0:08:24.360 never been to MAUI obviously heard so much about it. 0:08:25.000 --> 0:08:27.360 What was it like for you growing up there with 0:08:27.520 --> 0:08:30.440 that kind of a community. You feel like it's a 0:08:30.520 --> 0:08:35.760 specifically different place that breeds a different kind of community 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:36.600 than anywhere else. 0:08:37.400 --> 0:08:40.920 Super I mean when I came to the Mainland for college, 0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:43.480 I went to school in New Hampshire, which is about 0:08:43.520 --> 0:08:46.440 as different as you can get. Yeah, I know, I 0:08:46.520 --> 0:08:48.200 actually didn't have any idea what I was in for. 0:08:48.280 --> 0:08:50.000 I brought like a pair of sneakers and a cotton 0:08:50.000 --> 0:08:52.840 hoodie and I was like ready for winter, like two 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:55.080 comes up. I don'd to this day. I don't know 0:08:55.120 --> 0:08:58.280 why my parents didn't like buy me wool or boots. 0:08:58.280 --> 0:09:00.520 I think they just I'm sure sure that I was 0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:02.120 just sort of an arrogant little shit of a kid 0:09:02.120 --> 0:09:03.480 who was like I knew what I'm doing, and they 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:05.000 were like, all right, you can learn the hard way. 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:09.560 I mean I felt culture shock. Okay, Like, first of all, 0:09:09.800 --> 0:09:17.360 the native Hawaiian presence in Hawaii is vast and permeates everything, right, 0:09:17.480 --> 0:09:23.559 Like I had Hawaiian friends, teachers, governors, legislators, police officers, 0:09:23.600 --> 0:09:26.280 like there were just there were Hawaiian people everywhere, and 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:29.040 there was language everywhere, right like half the street signs. 0:09:30.120 --> 0:09:33.720 There's a Hawaiian music radio station, a couple of them 0:09:33.800 --> 0:09:38.200 that play like both modern and contemporary and traditional Hawaiian music, 0:09:38.760 --> 0:09:41.240 most of it in Hawaiian. I took Hawaiian language in 0:09:41.320 --> 0:09:45.000 high school. Like that just felt very normal and pretty 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:47.280 fair because I was like their land, you know, like 0:09:47.360 --> 0:09:50.720 feels like we should be learning about the people and 0:09:50.760 --> 0:09:53.960 how to say right, please and thank you, and you know, 0:09:54.040 --> 0:09:57.320 what are the stories of the land. And then I 0:09:57.320 --> 0:10:00.120 got to the mainland and I was like, oh, no, 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:05.880 nobody knows who's land there on. No, there's like there 0:10:06.000 --> 0:10:12.840 was this deafening silence around those kinds of things, you know. 0:10:12.880 --> 0:10:14.800 And I mean I'd asked all these people and I 0:10:14.880 --> 0:10:17.000 was like, whose land are we on? They're like Darmouth College. 0:10:17.040 --> 0:10:20.600 I was like, sure, but go back a little bit. 0:10:20.760 --> 0:10:23.240 And partly you have to go back, so much farther 0:10:23.960 --> 0:10:25.679 on the East coast than you do in Hawaii. But 0:10:26.360 --> 0:10:28.720 it was really interesting. A part of the podcast actually, 0:10:28.760 --> 0:10:31.600 and like writing some of these Native Hawaiian characters in 0:10:31.960 --> 0:10:33.359 was just visibility. 0:10:33.679 --> 0:10:33.880 You know. 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:36.640 It's like before you can even get to the place 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:40.640 of equal rights and remedying certain things and you know, 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:45.320 issues of land and water, just like visibility, like, hey, 0:10:45.760 --> 0:10:48.840 there are people here, maybe we should give a listen 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:53.520 to what's going on, right because you know, and like 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:56.040 not to get too nuts about this stuff, but you know, 0:10:56.120 --> 0:10:59.080 I've been reading a lot of stuff lately about Maui 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:03.520 and it's tricky, right because the whole state relies on tourism. 0:11:04.120 --> 0:11:09.520 We've vectored our economy exclusively towards tourism, and yet part 0:11:09.520 --> 0:11:12.200 of why Maui was so dry was because all the 0:11:12.280 --> 0:11:15.719 water was going to the hotels and golf courses and 0:11:15.800 --> 0:11:19.400 not to like the rest of the island, which is 0:11:20.160 --> 0:11:21.839 you know, they're like there have been a bunch of 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:26.640 native communities for a while being like, hey, this is 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:28.560 not going to work long term. 0:11:29.720 --> 0:11:31.800 Has been discussion, that's been a discussion. 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:34.480 Yeah, yeah, there, I mean, you know, and it's not 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:36.800 getting a whole lot of coverage. But you know, for 0:11:36.840 --> 0:11:38.800 those of us who like are kind of you know, 0:11:38.880 --> 0:11:41.359 like there's a bunch of like protect Mono Kaa and Aamamana, 0:11:41.360 --> 0:11:43.600 and like there's a bunch of different folks on social 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:47.240 media that you know, have been speaking from the Native 0:11:47.240 --> 0:11:51.080 Hawaiian communities. Yeah, there are folks who are, like we've 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:53.480 been saying for a really long time that this this 0:11:53.559 --> 0:11:57.760 sort of tourism first approach to land and water and 0:11:57.800 --> 0:12:03.439 resources it is creating not only is it like vastly 0:12:03.520 --> 0:12:06.040 unfair to the people whose land it is and all 0:12:06.080 --> 0:12:11.920 of that, but right also creates this massive imbalance in 0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:16.200 the land's resilience to things like fire. 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:21.440 Oh yeah, yeah, it's that's it's a very I mean, 0:12:21.679 --> 0:12:23.600 I don't even know how you go back and begin 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:27.800 to un tangle and unwind those things. I mean, I 0:12:27.840 --> 0:12:30.920 guess to your point, it's going to have to be 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:33.360 re envisioned. It's going to have to be rebuilt in 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:37.640 a new way. But that that catch twenty two that 0:12:37.720 --> 0:12:41.440 you mentioned of we rely on the tourism yet we're 0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:48.880 neglecting our ancestors, our history, our native peoples. It's very complicated. 0:12:49.840 --> 0:12:52.680 It requires a lot of revisioning and I think I 0:12:52.760 --> 0:12:55.040 have no answers, and so I take what I am 0:12:55.080 --> 0:13:01.280 going to call a politically responsible cop out just to 0:13:01.400 --> 0:13:04.120 say it's not for me to come up with answers. 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:05.800 I just want to listen, you know what I mean, 0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:08.240 like sort of turn the mic over to like some 0:13:08.320 --> 0:13:10.880 of the some of the organizers and the leaders and 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:13.120 the elders in those communities and be like, Okay, if 0:13:13.240 --> 0:13:17.200 hypothetically I had no ideas, what are your ideas? What 0:13:17.240 --> 0:13:17.880 do you need for me? 0:13:18.520 --> 0:13:22.400 Right? I mean there's so much, as you said, music 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:26.600 and culture and performance. Were you did you begin performing 0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:32.360 in like Native Hawaiian spectacle or no? 0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:35.320 I mean, you know, I took the sort of you 0:13:35.360 --> 0:13:38.160 know how like little girls on the mainland take ballet. 0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:40.640 You turn four and they put you in a tutu 0:13:40.800 --> 0:13:43.040 Like it's just it's like a thing that happens. 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:43.760 It's required. 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:46.920 Yes, yeah, and if you're like super alternative, it might 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:50.640 be like gymnastics and baseball, but like that's about as 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:54.720 far outside about as we get. So I actually did 0:13:54.720 --> 0:13:56.440 take it year of ballet, and I think I think 0:13:56.480 --> 0:13:58.920 the ballet teacher took my parents aside and was like, 0:13:58.920 --> 0:14:04.000 I'm sure she's good at something it's not this. So 0:14:04.080 --> 0:14:06.400 I ended up in you know, hula lessons, which is 0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:08.319 what I think a lot of the like four or 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:11.160 five six year olds, you know, and I never got 0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:16.880 any good but enjoyed it. I think what what I 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:20.360 really kind of came away with is a sense of 0:14:21.200 --> 0:14:23.200 storytelling as really important. 0:14:23.720 --> 0:14:26.160 Okay, you know, because you. 0:14:26.080 --> 0:14:29.000 Grow up with like the stories in Hawaii, right, the 0:14:29.000 --> 0:14:31.880 stories of Pelle of the volcano goddess and of where 0:14:31.880 --> 0:14:34.800 the name for your valley comes from, or you know, 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:41.320 Cohala Opuna and the owls, and like those stories were everywhere, 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:45.920 and I was fascinated by them, and you know, everything 0:14:45.920 --> 0:14:48.680 from picture books to like you know, certain teachers or 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:51.440 your Hawaiian studies teachers sharing things. And I think at 0:14:51.480 --> 0:14:54.280 a certain point I started to realize how different those 0:14:54.320 --> 0:14:57.560 stories were from the stories that I was like hearing 0:14:57.600 --> 0:15:01.600 in church, right, especially when it came to women, you 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:04.200 know what I mean, Like lots of very powerful female 0:15:04.280 --> 0:15:08.520 figures in Hawaiian storytelling. The Bible seems to be all 0:15:08.560 --> 0:15:12.080 about like please don't have sex, but then do have 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:13.720 a baby. But that you know what I mean, Like 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:17.120 it's super complicated, very complicated, like Sarah in the Bible 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:19.240 is ninety nine and God tells her she's going to 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:22.360 have a kid, And in my imagination, her first response 0:15:22.720 --> 0:15:26.640 was just like, you really don't know how this works. 0:15:26.960 --> 0:15:28.960 I don't think you've thought this all the way through. Also, 0:15:29.160 --> 0:15:32.360 who wants kids at ninety nine? I'm in my forties 0:15:32.360 --> 0:15:35.280 and I don't want to stay awake that late. Yeah, no, 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:39.400 So so anyway, the point is that the storytelling, I think, 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:42.720 is what kind of hooked me into what we do. 0:15:43.800 --> 0:15:46.320 What about you? I know that I'm supposed to be 0:15:46.320 --> 0:15:47.800 interviewing me, but like, where did you know? 0:15:48.040 --> 0:15:51.000 It's it's interesting. So I grew up in the South, 0:15:51.720 --> 0:16:00.200 and I think similarly that tradition of storytelling, of history 0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:03.640 of who owns the land, which again that becomes a 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:08.760 very complicated issue at its depth, but I think there 0:16:09.480 --> 0:16:12.600 that was more important than I think it is say 0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:18.040 in New Hampshire or Iowa or whatever like. There is 0:16:18.280 --> 0:16:22.080 that sort of identity. Again, not all of it positive, 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:26.600 but the history in the South is is a part 0:16:26.640 --> 0:16:30.040 of it. And my grandfather, I mean we two three 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:33.720 four years old, I mean me and my sister at night, 0:16:34.160 --> 0:16:37.360 he would just tell stories. So yeah, I mean there 0:16:37.440 --> 0:16:41.280 is I'm not equating it at all to be exactly 0:16:41.320 --> 0:16:43.440 the same, but I think that there is some sort 0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:45.400 of similarity there. You. 0:16:45.840 --> 0:16:46.880 Yeah, that never. 0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:49.840 Really even quite occurred to me in that same way 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:52.480 in terms of my personal history until hearing you talk, 0:16:52.520 --> 0:16:56.000 because that really, that really was, that storytelling really was 0:16:56.120 --> 0:16:59.040 a part of my early childhood. 0:16:58.800 --> 0:17:01.960 Well and even the in the South. Yeah, I mean 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:03.880 I was what was I'm never going to remember this 0:17:03.960 --> 0:17:06.440 exactly right, And I apologize to all the Kenny fans 0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:09.200 out there, but there's that Kenny Rogers song the Coward 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:12.640 of Something County. Yes, I was listening to it came 0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:14.920 on the other day, and I thought, this is this 0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:17.359 is a movie in three minutes, do you know what 0:17:17.400 --> 0:17:20.760 I mean about? Like a man whose dad tells him 0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:23.240 don't get into fights and don't do what I did, 0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:24.679 and then he falls in love with this woman and 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:27.560 then she's ps gang raped like literally that's in the song, 0:17:27.560 --> 0:17:30.439 which is nice, and then he turns around and like 0:17:30.480 --> 0:17:34.800 it's it's a story, and it's it's a like Steven 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:39.240 Spielberg worthy giant story. And if I think about a 0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:44.280 lot of country music, that's you know, even bluegrass, right, 0:17:44.359 --> 0:17:46.200 Like I don't know what part of the South you're from. 0:17:45.960 --> 0:17:50.280 But no, Georgia. I mean as as deep as it goes. 0:17:50.520 --> 0:17:53.040 Yeah, wait where in Georgia? I lived there for five 0:17:53.119 --> 0:17:54.280 years Atlanta. 0:17:54.760 --> 0:17:59.160 Okay, yeah, so I think you're exactly right. It's why 0:17:59.280 --> 0:18:02.719 I you know, people say what's what's your favorite kind 0:18:02.720 --> 0:18:08.000 of music, and I'll say old country, like like Willie 0:18:08.000 --> 0:18:12.320 Nelson and yeah, Nylon Jennings and they're telling stories. My 0:18:12.440 --> 0:18:15.120 least favorite is new country because I feel like it's 0:18:15.240 --> 0:18:20.440 just bebop but he beep beepop I was drinking. Yeah, exactly, 0:18:20.840 --> 0:18:24.320 and it's not as complex as story. Actually, his stories 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:25.240 are way simpler. 0:18:25.640 --> 0:18:28.280 No, although I will say there are some do you 0:18:28.359 --> 0:18:32.080 know what I mean? Like blown Away, there's there's definitely 0:18:32.080 --> 0:18:34.840 some people still like Brad Paisley can still write some lyrics. 0:18:34.840 --> 0:18:38.000 Man, that's but that's old country. So if it's if 0:18:38.000 --> 0:18:40.120 it's in the old style that. 0:18:40.000 --> 0:19:00.560 Counts, then that then that that counts. 0:19:01.680 --> 0:19:08.639 So when you started becoming really involved in performing, I 0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:12.479 understand you started acting in school plays and stuff. Was 0:19:12.520 --> 0:19:16.240 this like a passion of yours? Was this an activity 0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:19.720 like ballet when you were four or did you feel 0:19:19.720 --> 0:19:22.199 like this was something that that that really moved you 0:19:22.280 --> 0:19:25.040 that you wanted to do later on, and if not, 0:19:25.640 --> 0:19:27.080 when did that moment occur? 0:19:28.119 --> 0:19:31.080 Good question. I mean plays. Acting was the first thing 0:19:31.080 --> 0:19:33.840 that I put myself in, you know, like your parents 0:19:33.840 --> 0:19:36.760 put you into dancing whatever, blah blah blah. I joined 0:19:36.760 --> 0:19:38.760 the track and field team because I thought that would 0:19:38.760 --> 0:19:41.680 be useful. Blew my knee out in the very first practice. 0:19:42.280 --> 0:19:45.440 There's I like anything that involves physical coordination. Basically, the 0:19:45.480 --> 0:19:48.040 people in charge are like, again, I'm sure you're good 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:49.639 at something, go find it. 0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:53.080 Wait a second track though, I mean running. 0:19:53.200 --> 0:19:55.400 I know, I know that's not. 0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:58.159 A ton of physical coordination this. 0:19:58.080 --> 0:20:01.919 Is, but it's more than I have, and I have. 0:20:02.680 --> 0:20:04.840 I will say I will now at this point in 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:06.920 my life, only run if someone's behind me with a firearm, 0:20:07.000 --> 0:20:10.439 which weirdly describes like half of my career on camera. 0:20:10.560 --> 0:20:15.240 So I do a bit of running, but only if 0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:20.159 there's like the Apocalypse is behind me. I basically flogged 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:23.600 out a track, which was amazing, And there were auditions 0:20:23.600 --> 0:20:25.840 for the play the next day. So and it was 0:20:25.880 --> 0:20:28.600 as you like it, and it was Shakespeare, and I 0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:31.879 loved that and the chewiness of the words and the 0:20:31.960 --> 0:20:36.119 language and the challenge of the language. It felt like 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:40.080 a puzzle. But I never thought I would do it professionally, 0:20:40.440 --> 0:20:43.119 you know, because I mean I didn't come from a 0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:46.400 family that like could support me, you know, so it 0:20:46.480 --> 0:20:48.800 was like, you get your degree and you are on 0:20:48.880 --> 0:20:52.680 your own right, which also, by the way, seemed completely fair. 0:20:53.320 --> 0:20:56.040 Sure, no, they put up with you for long enough, 0:20:56.440 --> 0:21:00.240 exactly an uncoordinated daughter. I mean, you can't expect get 0:21:00.280 --> 0:21:06.959 into things came going. But now you went when you 0:21:07.080 --> 0:21:09.600 left to go to New Hampshire, which is, by the way, 0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:13.480 it's just hilarious, but you go to New Hampshire. You 0:21:13.520 --> 0:21:15.320 but you went to study drama. 0:21:15.359 --> 0:21:17.800 Right like I know, I went to study history. 0:21:18.040 --> 0:21:19.840 You went to study I went to study history with. 0:21:19.800 --> 0:21:23.400 An eye toward being a diplomat, which is hilarious because 0:21:23.400 --> 0:21:25.119 people who know me, I mean you've known me now 0:21:25.160 --> 0:21:27.240 for what eight minutes, You're like, this is the least 0:21:27.240 --> 0:21:30.639 diplomatic person in the face of the earth. I can't 0:21:30.720 --> 0:21:33.840 not say something that floats through my head. You know, 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:36.600 it's funny. This is this is becoming the podcast about 0:21:36.640 --> 0:21:39.480 Sarah's failures, which I'm totally fine with. After my first 0:21:39.520 --> 0:21:40.240 semester in the. 0:21:40.200 --> 0:21:44.040 History that was not the attention, but go ahead, no. 0:21:43.480 --> 0:21:46.600 But it's truly like the head of the teacher that 0:21:46.640 --> 0:21:48.760 I had that taught me my first history seminar, she 0:21:48.800 --> 0:21:51.000 said to me, and I quote, you are too creative 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:53.360 to be a historian. The drama department is that way. 0:21:53.400 --> 0:21:56.760 And I was like, all right, really yeah, which, by 0:21:56.800 --> 0:21:59.040 the way, might be part of the problem of the 0:21:59.080 --> 0:22:01.960 way history was taught at the time, But at any 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:05.440 point I was out. I still never thought. I took 0:22:05.480 --> 0:22:07.359 a bunch of drama classes, I did a bunch of plays. 0:22:07.400 --> 0:22:09.280 I still never thought like, you can't make a living. 0:22:10.000 --> 0:22:11.439 And so you know, I was going to get a 0:22:11.440 --> 0:22:13.320 degree in something else and get a PhD and be 0:22:13.400 --> 0:22:17.520 a professor like my parents. And right before I graduated 0:22:18.400 --> 0:22:22.520 from university, I realized that I would have to fail 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:26.119 at acting before I could settle for anything else. I 0:22:26.160 --> 0:22:28.480 had to try. I just had to give it a shot. 0:22:28.640 --> 0:22:30.679 And you know, the thing is about it to me 0:22:33.160 --> 0:22:34.920 and growing up actually in such a big family. I 0:22:34.920 --> 0:22:37.240 wonder if this kind of lands with you too. I 0:22:37.359 --> 0:22:42.440 love how collaborative it is. I love that, like whether 0:22:42.480 --> 0:22:44.720