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Speaker 1: Previously on Hello John Doe.

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Speaker 2: I would like to know who my dad is. I

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Speaker 2: found out I potentially had another sister through the Brandenburg side,

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Speaker 2: but they were all connected to the Brandenburg except me.

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Speaker 3: Philip, Steedhm and Patterson. You should have had your butt

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Speaker 3: here because your sisters love you. He wants those answers.

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Speaker 3: We're going to do everything we can and as a

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Speaker 3: family to help him get those answers.

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Speaker 2: At this point, Steve still hadn't met Sandy, his biological mom,

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Speaker 2: and he had no plans to, but he had met

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Speaker 2: plenty of people related to Sandy. In our last chapter,

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Speaker 2: the Brandenburg sisters wanted to accept him into their fold,

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Speaker 2: even though DNA test showed they didn't share the same father.

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Speaker 2: Now that Brandyburger's ruled out, Steve really wanted an answer

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Speaker 2: to what man helped make him him. You want to

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Speaker 2: find your father, right, or at least I know who

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Speaker 2: he is, know who he is, at least find out. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that's one of my biggest things. I needed to ask

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Speaker 2: an expert, So I call Carol Silecki, who's been with

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Speaker 2: the Dough Network for years. She got involved after her

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Speaker 2: ex husband disappeared in nineteen eighty nine. He was missing

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Speaker 2: almost twenty years before he matched with a John Doe

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Speaker 2: who had drowned what's snorkeling in Florida. Carol has always

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Speaker 2: loved genealogy and ancestry, but she also had a stepfather

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Speaker 2: who was adopted as a baby and a.

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Speaker 4: Child, I was more interested in learning about his biological

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Speaker 4: family than he was.

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Speaker 2: For the last few decades, she's helped adoptees find their

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Speaker 2: biological families.

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Speaker 4: I work in retail jewelry sales. I make my money

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Speaker 4: and then I come home and this is my hobby.

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Speaker 2: I asked Carol to help me build out Stay's family

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Speaker 2: tree on ancestry dot Com.

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Speaker 4: So like the strength of the DNA matches, if you

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Speaker 4: have close matches and you're able to identify who these

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Speaker 4: people are and to build out their family trees, you

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Speaker 4: could solve this pretty quickly. What I mean by the

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Speaker 4: strength of the DNA matches, the amount of DNA that

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Speaker 4: two people share is measured in a unit called centim organs.

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Speaker 2: In general, the higher the cine morgan count, the closer

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Speaker 2: the genetic link. This step can get real complicated, but

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Speaker 2: basically you want to find where those numbers are The highest.

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Speaker 2: So in Stave's case, Carol found a woman who shared

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Speaker 2: five hundred fifty six cinem organs of DNA with him.

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Speaker 4: So the next thing I do is look at the

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Speaker 4: matches and luis color five fifty six. We look at

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Speaker 4: the matches that Stephen in five fifty six have in common,

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Speaker 4: and I try to look for matches that have good

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Speaker 4: sized public family trees that you can look at and analyze,

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Speaker 4: and I try to see how people are interconnected. And

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Speaker 4: what you want to do is find their most recent

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Speaker 4: common ancestor. We want to try to find maybe a

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Speaker 4: grandparent or great grandparent.

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Speaker 2: Then Carroll built private, unsearchable trees, plotting out DNA matches

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Speaker 2: to see how people connect. Basically, that's how she pinpointed

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Speaker 2: their most recent common ancestor, and I was.

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Speaker 4: Able to determine that five point fifty six is his

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Speaker 4: first cousin once removed, so she is Stephen's father's first cousin.

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Speaker 4: So she and Stephen's birth father share a set of grandparents.

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Speaker 4: Now we need to figure out who the other set

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Speaker 4: of grandparents is.

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Speaker 2: Based on this meticulous matching process, Carol identified State's paternal grandparents.

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Speaker 2: They settle in Nevada, and they had one son.

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Speaker 4: In a nutshell, we have the only son of a

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Speaker 4: married couple who come from two different areas of the country,

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Speaker 4: and we have close and clear DNA connects to both

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Speaker 4: sides of this couple's families. So that's what leads me

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Speaker 4: to believe that Daniel is his birth father.

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Speaker 2: After her exhaustive search, Carol had a name, Daniel Polk.

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Speaker 2: It felt like we'd found him, but I wanted to

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Speaker 2: run His name passed Sandy, so I called her up

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Speaker 2: and asked, did the name Polk sound familiar? And she

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Speaker 2: confirmed that yes, she did remember a Dan Polk who

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Speaker 2: she knew in Charlotte. She told me Dan was a

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Speaker 2: car salesman, a very slick person. Steve would have been

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Speaker 2: conceived around the summer of nineteen seventy three. Sandy tell

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Speaker 2: me she didn't date him per se, but she did

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Speaker 2: remember him. So he did a bit more digging on

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Speaker 2: Daniel Polk. He served in the Navy in Vietnam and

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Speaker 2: then he drilled water wells. He also volunteered with the

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Speaker 2: fire department in Lubock, Texas. I also found out that

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Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy nine he married a woman named Ronalda

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Speaker 2: about five years after Steve was born, and there was

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Speaker 2: something else he died.

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Speaker 4: I had in nineteen eighty Daniel would have been a

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Speaker 4: newly win pretty much bring tumors or what it looks like, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: bring tumor.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, very sad.

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Speaker 2: He was just thirty three and living in Texas when

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Speaker 2: he died. He was buried at a cemetery in New Mexico.

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Speaker 2: After all this time, I'd be able to tell Stavis

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Speaker 2: father's name, but he'd never be able to ask him

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Speaker 2: the questions he had, or to visit with him or

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Speaker 2: see if they both sit in the same way or

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Speaker 2: talk similarly. This isn't the first time Carol's digging help

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Speaker 2: someone find the parent they were looking for, only to

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Speaker 2: find that they were gone. It was too late.

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Speaker 4: I know firsthand what it's like to live without answers

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Speaker 4: for many, many years, And you know, it's just important

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Speaker 4: for people to know their origins.

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Speaker 5: You know, it just.

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Speaker 4: Gives people peace of mind, regardless of what the answers are.

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Speaker 4: Just to have the answers and to know the truth

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Speaker 4: is what gives people peace of mind.

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Speaker 2: After Carol filled me in, I needed to tell Steve.

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Speaker 2: I called Stephen Janette in June of twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 2: we have been into ancestry and we have you know,

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Speaker 2: I did find Polk. Polk was a name.

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Speaker 6: The closest relative to you that I found in ancerstory

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Speaker 6: was a Polk. Got a hold of Handy and I said,

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Speaker 6: do you remember any Pokes?

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Speaker 2: And she did. I do believe it. Daniel James Polk.

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Speaker 2: Where is he from?

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Speaker 4: Was he from North Carolina?

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Speaker 6: Yes, in the same area. She said that pretty Charlotte

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Speaker 6: is in Charlotte and he.

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Speaker 2: Has passed away. He passed away in nineteen eighty. Oh wow.

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Speaker 6: Now, as of right now, unless something changes my mind,

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Speaker 6: I believe that your last name would be Polk. And

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Speaker 6: you have family there that we were stolen from too.

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Speaker 6: They probably don't even know you exist.

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Speaker 2: Steve didn't say much on the phone that day. I

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Speaker 2: can see why I told him his father was Daniel

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Speaker 2: Polk at the end of a long phone call. The

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Speaker 2: name of his father could only do so much in

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Speaker 2: that moment. It didn't make him feel any more wanting.

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Speaker 2: I've thought about this interactional lot. Like I said before,

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Speaker 2: I'd been running ahead of Steve opening doors for him

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Speaker 2: that he wasn't ready for. I wanted so desperately to

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Speaker 2: help him move forward. I'd been pushing and maybe I'd

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Speaker 2: gone too far this time. My name is Todd Matthews,

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Speaker 2: and this is hello John Doe, A sleuth, a family,

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Speaker 2: and a serial killer. The story of a family torn

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Speaker 2: apart by tragedy and my quest to bring them back together.

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Speaker 2: Chapter ten, The Reunion. Okay, I am recording now. We

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Speaker 2: are about how far out, sixty four miles out from

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Speaker 2: our hotel, and we won't see Steve until later tonight

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Speaker 2: after he gets off work. A few weeks earlier, in

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Speaker 2: August of twenty twenty three, the Brandenburg sisters had all

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Speaker 2: gotten together for their own reunion at Andrew's place in Tennessee.

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Speaker 2: You remember Andrea the Firecracker didn't know her birth family

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Speaker 2: till her fifties. She had invited her sister, Michelle, the

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Speaker 2: dog killer owner from Michigan, and her other sister, Amy,

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Speaker 2: the Virginia school bus driver, and that invited Steve.

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Speaker 5: They was supposed to be a mini family reunion, but

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Speaker 5: he didn't come.

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Speaker 2: Steve was a no show, but all of them were

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Speaker 2: so excited to welcome him into their circle, so the

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Speaker 2: three of.

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Speaker 5: Us decided racing in there at her tables at Andrea's

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Speaker 5: house that we were going to go to him.

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Speaker 2: It could be a little road trip, and they invited

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Speaker 2: me to come along again. This second reunion came together

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Speaker 2: real fast, late summer. In a matter of days, Andrew

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Speaker 2: and I were talking about driving there in the same

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Speaker 2: car from Tennessee to Steve's hometown, Cherville, North Carolina. Amy

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Speaker 2: and her husband Mike were going to meet us there.

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Speaker 2: They didn't want to give Steve a chance to back

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Speaker 2: out or make an excuse, so they forged ahead.

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Speaker 5: He didn't know we were coming. We knew if we

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Speaker 5: told him, he probably would have said he had to

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Speaker 5: work or something. We kind of just sprung in on him.

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Speaker 2: I get where Amy's coming from. She and her brother

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Speaker 2: had an amazing connection when they first met, but after

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Speaker 2: that he seemed distant. Amy wanted to continue spending time

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Speaker 2: with her new found family, but it's hard to contain

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Speaker 2: surprises at this scale. Mary, Steve's adoptive mom, soon found

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Speaker 2: out that the sisters were coming to Cherryville to see Steve,

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Speaker 2: and she didn't think he'd appreciate them just dropping in,

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Speaker 2: so she told him. That's the first time things got tense.

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Speaker 2: She started texting me tell them not to come. He

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Speaker 2: is very upset, but when I texted Steve he said

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Speaker 2: he was cool with it as long as we met

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Speaker 2: at the hotel, not at his place. He would be

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Speaker 2: the first of many contradictions that weekend. That summer afternoon,

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Speaker 2: Steve met us at the Quality Inn. It was an

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Speaker 2: enthusiastic reunion. He seemed genuinely happy to see his sisters

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Speaker 2: and vice versa. They couldn't wait to tell him about

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Speaker 2: their plan. Here's Andrew the hisstory was adopted to well,

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Speaker 2: we're good.

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Speaker 3: To Our original plan was Toy was gonna message you

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Speaker 3: and say, hey, I just came in to Charlotte. I'm

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Speaker 3: gonna be in you know, he's Mountain or Shelby. You know,

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Speaker 3: I want to see you. Can you come over to

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Speaker 3: the hotel and hang out here?

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Speaker 7: And then we were surprised and that was our original plan.

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Speaker 5: It's just been over two years.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, that's one thing my mong little teaching secret for me.

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Speaker 8: I promise you that I can't.

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Speaker 4: There were nothing.

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Speaker 2: She asked me if I was working sad and I

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Speaker 2: said no.

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Speaker 4: I said what you need?

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Speaker 9: She said, I mean stuff done around the house?

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Speaker 10: What you done?

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Speaker 1: Right?

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Speaker 7: She said, I can't.

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Speaker 10: Down.

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Speaker 8: The next text said was five minutes later. She said,

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Speaker 8: you know I keep everybody.

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Speaker 2: I'm kind and glad. She told us it wouldn't be

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Speaker 2: too much of the shop. We wanted to surprise you,

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Speaker 2: but we didn't want it to blindside you, but it

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Speaker 2: would be another surprise that we'd end up unrappling some

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Speaker 2: of the goodwill between Steve's new sisters and his mom

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Speaker 2: and girlfriend. Steve, his sisters, and I gathered at the

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Speaker 2: hotel not too far from his house. The hotel wasn't fancy.

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Speaker 2: It was the kind where each room opens up into

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Speaker 2: the parking lot. We all got separate rooms, but we

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Speaker 2: treated andreas like homebase. So that's where we were catching

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Speaker 2: up and getting settled. Everyone seemed to ease. It felt

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Speaker 2: like whatever tension had happened before we got there was resolved.

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Speaker 2: About an hour after we all gathered, his sisters told

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Speaker 2: Steve there was more. It's a little hard to hear,

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Speaker 2: but here's Andrea.

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Speaker 3: Okay, you have another surprise.

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Speaker 5: It's your choice.

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Speaker 7: Sanity came with you.

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Speaker 8: She's in the race.

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Speaker 3: If you don't want to see her, that's fine with

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Speaker 3: all of us.

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00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:09,880
Speaker 2: Steve's mother, who gave him up for adoption fifty years ago,

223
00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:13,520
Speaker 2: who had only messaged on Facebook, was suddenly a room away.

224
00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:18,080
Speaker 2: Sandy had tagged along an Amy in MIT's car. Now

225
00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,080
Speaker 2: she was sitting in her own hotel room at the

226
00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:25,080
Speaker 2: same quality inn. I couldn't believe we had arrived at

227
00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:28,720
Speaker 2: this point. A mother and son torn apart by Floyd

228
00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:33,679
Speaker 2: might be reunited today if Steve would agree to see her.

229
00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:35,520
Speaker 2: We're here with you, Stephen.

230
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Speaker 8: I think you will open your cart. Both of you need.

231
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Speaker 2: We didn't want Jerry Springery, but both of you need

232
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Speaker 2: because you weren't going to.

233
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Speaker 8: Go and there's no hold of faults. If you want

234
00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:49,960
Speaker 8: to yell out of yell, yell.

235
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Speaker 2: At her, he said, I ain't gonna yell at her.

236
00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:56,520
Speaker 8: We're just saying, you do what you want.

237
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Speaker 3: If this last three years been through fucking rough on it,

238
00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:03,079
Speaker 3: so don't feel like you're strained. You can't ask or anything,

239
00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:06,280
Speaker 3: because everything is open right now for all of us,

240
00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:08,840
Speaker 3: and you don't have to worry about it.

241
00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:09,640
Speaker 11: We got you.

242
00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:13,000
Speaker 2: Are you okay with that?

243
00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:15,080
Speaker 3: If you're not, tell us.

244
00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:20,360
Speaker 2: Be honest with us, he said, it's fine. Steve seemed

245
00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:23,559
Speaker 2: really laid back in this moment. He was sitting having

246
00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:25,760
Speaker 2: a drink, seemingly going along with the flow.

247
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Speaker 3: I'm not serious. I want to help you so you

248
00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:31,439
Speaker 3: could process this whole thing.

249
00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:38,280
Speaker 5: She understood before we went that if he didn't want

250
00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:40,199
Speaker 5: to see her, we weren't going to force her on him,

251
00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:44,120
Speaker 5: you know, So she came prepared to stay in the

252
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Speaker 5: hotel room by herself, without seeing him.

253
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,640
Speaker 2: Steve got to choose, you can hear us ask him,

254
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:53,720
Speaker 2: But his choice is made in the matter of a

255
00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:57,559
Speaker 2: few minutes, with Sandy sitting in the other room. If

256
00:13:57,600 --> 00:13:59,760
Speaker 2: he had known this was the weekend he'd meet Sandy,

257
00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:02,560
Speaker 2: his girlfriend or his mom would have been by his sight,

258
00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:05,559
Speaker 2: but that day he didn't have either of them to

259
00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:09,000
Speaker 2: lean up. I'll let Amy tell you what happened next.

260
00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:11,959
Speaker 5: Before we brought her in, we asked Steven if he

261
00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:15,760
Speaker 5: wanted to see her, and he said yes. So we

262
00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:19,760
Speaker 5: took Sandy and she was in the hotel room, and

263
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,840
Speaker 5: then we asked and he said, sure, bring her over.

264
00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:25,840
Speaker 11: I said, just rip the band it.

265
00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:31,600
Speaker 5: Off and brought her in the room. And some people

266
00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:33,360
Speaker 5: were mad at me because I did it that way.

267
00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:37,480
Speaker 2: The thinking was that Sandy wouldn't live forever. She was

268
00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:41,000
Speaker 2: already in her seventies, and that Steve had real questions

269
00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:43,640
Speaker 2: about his background that only she might be able to answer.

270
00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:46,960
Speaker 2: I figured if we all got behind him and supported him,

271
00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:54,320
Speaker 2: maybe this was the right time to meet Sandy. They

272
00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,760
Speaker 2: willed Sandy into Andrea's room, where we were all gathered.

273
00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:00,560
Speaker 2: She looked a little nervous and a little tired, like

274
00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:02,240
Speaker 2: she had been traveling all day and it had been

275
00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:04,520
Speaker 2: hard on her. There were a lot of us in

276
00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:07,240
Speaker 2: that hotel room and only a few chairs and two

277
00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:11,320
Speaker 2: big beds. I watched the two. I was delighted to

278
00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,600
Speaker 2: reunite mother and son. I'd been the go between for

279
00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,560
Speaker 2: so long, and here they were finally face to face

280
00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:21,920
Speaker 2: after all this time. They didn't look too much alike,

281
00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:25,640
Speaker 2: but they did share the same temperament, A little reserved,

282
00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:27,080
Speaker 2: but polite.

283
00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:32,360
Speaker 5: They just said hello. There wasn't no big, happy like

284
00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:34,600
Speaker 5: happy reunion hung each other.

285
00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:38,120
Speaker 2: Based on all the time that I'd spent with both

286
00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:41,720
Speaker 2: Steve and Sandy separately, I knew Steve had hesitations about

287
00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:44,200
Speaker 2: meeting her, and I knew Sandy was reluctant to push

288
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:49,160
Speaker 2: too much. For the rest of the afternoon, we all

289
00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:52,400
Speaker 2: sat in the hotel room together. Steve said, with Sandy

290
00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,320
Speaker 2: knee to knee, him in a hotel chair, and her

291
00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:58,120
Speaker 2: and her wheelchair. The rest of us hung around the room.

292
00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:01,720
Speaker 2: Some went in and out to smoke cigarettes, some poor drinks.

293
00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:05,160
Speaker 2: Everyone cracked jokes and exchanged stories about the car ride there.

294
00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:08,080
Speaker 2: I don't know all of what Sandy and Steve talked

295
00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:10,960
Speaker 2: about in that corner. We tried to give him some space,

296
00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:14,680
Speaker 2: to be fair, though there wasn't much space in that room,

297
00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:18,760
Speaker 2: no real quiet for a private conversation. But every time

298
00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:21,000
Speaker 2: I glanced over, it felt like they were getting along.

299
00:16:22,040 --> 00:16:24,360
Speaker 2: I saw Steve show Sandy photos of his kids, and

300
00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:28,480
Speaker 2: she reciprocated. At first, they didn't talk about anything too deep,

301
00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:32,040
Speaker 2: but as the afternoon went on, Steve dug a bit deeper.

302
00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:37,760
Speaker 2: You can hear Steve here. He's pretty faint.

303
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,160
Speaker 8: Were you scared of him?

304
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:43,840
Speaker 2: Steve asked if she was scared of Floyd, the man

305
00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:45,680
Speaker 2: who tore them apart.

306
00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:49,440
Speaker 7: Terrafied, who had a knife with him all the time,

307
00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:54,680
Speaker 7: a knife under the pillow, knife and guns. One time,

308
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,000
Speaker 7: the girls a lot in the thing and he was

309
00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:01,320
Speaker 7: in the kitchen. He caught us for us somewhere When

310
00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:02,880
Speaker 7: you said, if any of you ever tried to believe

311
00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:05,040
Speaker 7: I'm gonna skin you just like this squirrel.

312
00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:08,440
Speaker 2: We've heard this story before, how Floyd threatened to skin

313
00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:12,040
Speaker 2: Sandy and her girls like squirrels. But this was the

314
00:17:12,080 --> 00:17:14,960
Speaker 2: first time that Steve had hurt. It was he starting

315
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:16,800
Speaker 2: to say that Sandy was a victim too.

316
00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,360
Speaker 7: I was arrested for raining at dollars seventy eight check

317
00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:23,720
Speaker 7: at seven eleven for diapers for eighty. I mean, the

318
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:27,359
Speaker 7: biggest part of it was after the tornado and after

319
00:17:27,440 --> 00:17:30,720
Speaker 7: you were born. Fema put us back in a trailer

320
00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:36,359
Speaker 7: in church and I had no car, no way to

321
00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:39,840
Speaker 7: get out, and every time the storm came. Annie was two,

322
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:45,639
Speaker 7: she would freak out. I would freak out, and I

323
00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,760
Speaker 7: guess and now they call it chu ksd And there

324
00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:51,400
Speaker 7: was no help. I asked the mask and asked for help,

325
00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:51,800
Speaker 7: and ever.

326
00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:56,639
Speaker 9: Because you'd say the system failed her, yes, one.

327
00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:58,120
Speaker 2: Yes, How does that make you feel?

328
00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:05,040
Speaker 9: Don't I would be happy.

329
00:18:06,119 --> 00:18:09,080
Speaker 2: I think everyone wanted to make him feel validated, But

330
00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:11,359
Speaker 2: in hindsight, we didn't give him a whole lot of

331
00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:12,800
Speaker 2: space to just sit with this.

332
00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:16,360
Speaker 8: It's a lot to process. I'm not gonna lie when

333
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:20,119
Speaker 8: I found out about it, you know, I still have

334
00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:27,119
Speaker 8: the messages. I said, they tell me your up. I

335
00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:31,280
Speaker 8: was like, is that true? And he was like, yeah,

336
00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:36,160
Speaker 8: I think I am sobby. It's a lot to process,

337
00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:37,720
Speaker 8: a lot, it is.

338
00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:44,479
Speaker 2: Throughout the story, I'd learned something from say Sandy, and

339
00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:47,360
Speaker 2: then relay it back to Steve, and Steve would say

340
00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:50,840
Speaker 2: something and I'd tell Sandy I was the carrier pigeon.

341
00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:54,160
Speaker 2: I'd been a buffer for both of them, but now

342
00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,920
Speaker 2: I needed to step away and give them a chance

343
00:18:56,920 --> 00:19:00,440
Speaker 2: to talk to each other. If Steve had questions, this

344
00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:04,040
Speaker 2: was his chance to ask Sandy directly. Every time I

345
00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:06,600
Speaker 2: looked over to see Sandy talking to Steve, I thought

346
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:10,879
Speaker 2: to myself. Fifty years ago, Franklin Floyd told Sandy should

347
00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:15,400
Speaker 2: never see her son again. Today we were undoing that promise.

348
00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:24,560
Speaker 2: While all of this was going down in the hotel room,

349
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:28,360
Speaker 2: Mary who lives pretty close to Steve, checked in on him.

350
00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:32,040
Speaker 11: I take to Steve, I said you okay, He said, Mama,

351
00:19:32,119 --> 00:19:32,720
Speaker 11: get down here.

352
00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:35,760
Speaker 2: Mary had no idea that Sandy was at the hotel.

353
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,080
Speaker 2: She thought, just as sisters had come. She was already

354
00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:42,160
Speaker 2: on the fence about that. So when she realized Sandy

355
00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:46,120
Speaker 2: herself was face to face with Steve. Well, Mary was angry.

356
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:49,920
Speaker 11: Steve was ambushed with this, and it's not very nice

357
00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:52,800
Speaker 11: for them to do that. Why I went down there,

358
00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:55,440
Speaker 11: and the first thing he said when I went into

359
00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:59,160
Speaker 11: the room was this is my mama, and I love her.

360
00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:03,400
Speaker 2: Steve was proudly introducing her, but I think something else

361
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:05,879
Speaker 2: was going on. He wanted the whole room to know

362
00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:07,560
Speaker 2: that Mary was the one who had been there for

363
00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:11,639
Speaker 2: him his whole life. Or maybe after Mary arrived he

364
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:15,120
Speaker 2: felt guilty after unexpectedly spending the whole day with Sandy.

365
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 2: I wasn't sure Amy noticed a ship too.

366
00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:23,080
Speaker 5: His whole attitude changed because before Mary got there, he

367
00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:26,199
Speaker 5: was talking to Sandy and asking her questions and she

368
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:30,159
Speaker 5: was answering for him, and he seemed to be a

369
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,280
Speaker 5: little more relaxed. But then when Mary got there, they

370
00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:34,320
Speaker 5: say he just Withdrew.

371
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,240
Speaker 2: Jeanette came to the hotel after work too. She seemed

372
00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:42,399
Speaker 2: a little quiet, but I figured she was just in shock.

373
00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 2: We tried to light in the move by going out

374
00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:49,360
Speaker 2: to eat together. We all went, the sisters plus Sandy,

375
00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:52,320
Speaker 2: Jeanette and Steve. We all sat at a big long

376
00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,040
Speaker 2: table at a Mexican joint in town.

377
00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:56,560
Speaker 5: When we went to dinner, it was comical as hell.

378
00:20:56,920 --> 00:21:01,400
Speaker 5: We all would just laughed so much, all being silly.

379
00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:04,400
Speaker 5: Oh we had a blah.

380
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:08,000
Speaker 2: But by this point something was a miss. Mary would

381
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:10,240
Speaker 2: later say that she was upset Sandy had come without

382
00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:14,080
Speaker 2: telling Steve first. I had a hard time seeing it clearly.

383
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:17,439
Speaker 2: Just then that day, I was only thinking about the

384
00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,080
Speaker 2: potential positives of having Steve been able to sit down

385
00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:23,920
Speaker 2: with Sandy, not the blowback it might have. I'd grown

386
00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:27,000
Speaker 2: tired of Steve not wanting to move forward on his journey,

387
00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:29,440
Speaker 2: not walking through the doors I'd helped open for him.

388
00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,520
Speaker 2: Mary and Jeanette aren't exactly the kind of people to

389
00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,679
Speaker 2: scream or get visibly angry, but it was clear they

390
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:39,000
Speaker 2: weren't happy with this situation. Jeanette said as much to me,

391
00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:46,199
Speaker 2: I wish this hadn't have happened. By Saturday morning, the

392
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,280
Speaker 2: tension began to come into focus for the sisters. At

393
00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:52,880
Speaker 2: the Mexican restaurant the night before, Jeanette apparently told Andrew

394
00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,240
Speaker 2: she felt this had been sprung on Steve without his consent.

395
00:21:56,119 --> 00:21:58,080
Speaker 2: Here's Andrea, and you know.

396
00:21:58,080 --> 00:21:59,320
Speaker 3: She's like, you know, I'll have to pick up the

397
00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:02,119
Speaker 3: pieces stand that, but we're your tea, you know. We

398
00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:04,760
Speaker 3: We've got his bag, we'll help. We're a phone call away,

399
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:06,080
Speaker 3: we're a text message away.

400
00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:07,080
Speaker 8: We'll talk to you.

401
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:09,840
Speaker 3: Because if he did have any more questions, she is

402
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:12,879
Speaker 3: the only person that could answer them.

403
00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 2: That Saturday, Steve had to run a few errands, so

404
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,320
Speaker 2: we knew we wouldn't be seeing him until later. That

405
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,919
Speaker 2: mostly left Sandy, Amy and Andrew alone with me, so

406
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:26,560
Speaker 2: we went out to lunch. How did you be last night?

407
00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:30,640
Speaker 7: We went talking pretty good for a while, help wonderful,

408
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:35,520
Speaker 7: and he called me Mama last night. I told him

409
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:38,560
Speaker 7: I looked for him in every way that I knew

410
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:42,359
Speaker 7: how at the time, and found nothing.

411
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:45,880
Speaker 11: And he said, oh.

412
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,920
Speaker 7: And then then Mary said that they had done away

413
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:52,320
Speaker 7: with the birth certificate when she adopted him. And then

414
00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:55,320
Speaker 7: he said, oh, I see. And that was the end

415
00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:57,080
Speaker 7: of that, and then everybody else came back in. We

416
00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 7: stopped talking like that. I think it answered a question

417
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,240
Speaker 7: for it, but I think in the back of his mind,

418
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,359
Speaker 7: and I guess if I were in his position, i'd

419
00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:07,120
Speaker 7: feel the same way that I didn't.

420
00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:07,880
Speaker 8: Look hard enough.

421
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:11,080
Speaker 2: After fifty years.

422
00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:14,160
Speaker 7: Strange, but good.

423
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,600
Speaker 2: Of all the people in the room with Steve that weekend.

424
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:20,000
Speaker 2: It seemed like Sandy could empathize with Steve the most.

425
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:25,440
Speaker 7: He's more fragile than I am, so I need to

426
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,560
Speaker 7: let him do it in his time, in his way.

427
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:32,120
Speaker 2: Sandy remained clear headed about the whole thing. She knew

428
00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:35,000
Speaker 2: this might be hard on him. She didn't always want

429
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:37,960
Speaker 2: to surprise Steven Cherville or think it was the right

430
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:41,719
Speaker 2: thing to do. Amy encouraged her to go. Sandy had

431
00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,679
Speaker 2: already lost one kid. Amy wanted her to have the

432
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:46,320
Speaker 2: opportunity to know her son.

433
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 7: I told her at first, I said, no, I'm not going,

434
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 7: and she said, if I should drag you out of

435
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:53,360
Speaker 7: the house, you're going.

436
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:55,520
Speaker 2: Go too.

437
00:23:56,720 --> 00:24:01,200
Speaker 7: Because I told her that I didn't feel like she.

438
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:03,760
Speaker 8: Observed to see him.

439
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 7: I think you did, though I think I do now,

440
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,560
Speaker 7: but I'm sort of like Steven that I don't like

441
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:11,280
Speaker 7: to intrude.

442
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:14,920
Speaker 2: Sandy had already processed Steve coming back in her life

443
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:17,680
Speaker 2: before she even showed up this weekend, but Steve was

444
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 2: still processing. She knew she didn't have a right to

445
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 2: know him if he didn't want her. She recognized that boundary,

446
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,720
Speaker 2: but Steve's sister Amy wanted peace in the family. She

447
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,600
Speaker 2: thought bringing everyone together would help them move through things.

448
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 2: Amy was trying to get Steve to see for himself

449
00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:39,240
Speaker 2: that he wasn't abandoned or discarded. What happened was for

450
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 2: the best. I think Amy, who had already gone through

451
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,359
Speaker 2: so much in her life, wanted Stephen Sandy to feel

452
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:48,359
Speaker 2: the peace that she'd found. She knew Janette would be

453
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,159
Speaker 2: left to care for Steve in the aftermath, that maybe

454
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:55,439
Speaker 2: Steve wasn't ready, that there would be consequences, but she

455
00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 2: barreled ahead, leaving Steve's girlfriend in the dark.

456
00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,399
Speaker 8: And I understand why she's mad, because she is the

457
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 8: one that has to deal with him after everybody's gone.

458
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 8: But I wish she would take a minute to realize

459
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:16,120
Speaker 8: all of this needed to hack. We need to close

460
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 8: the story. We need the story to have an Endie,

461
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 8: and I expect him to not talk to me for

462
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 8: a long time.

463
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 2: This is kind of a remarkable bit of insight. Amy

464
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:35,199
Speaker 2: knews surprising her brother with her Mom had pushed her

465
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 2: brother away, but still hoped he had come back on

466
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:42,119
Speaker 2: his own sometime in the future. Sandy I also recognized

467
00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 2: this might be the only time she ever sees Steve.

468
00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 7: He's not at peace and it's not going to be

469
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:52,320
Speaker 7: closure until he's at peace. So I would love to

470
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 7: have a relationship with him, but if that's not what

471
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 7: he wants, I'm not going to push it on. To

472
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:03,639
Speaker 7: know that he's alive and that we found him and

473
00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 7: that I've seen him, and if that's.

474
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:07,200
Speaker 11: All, I've got this all like that.

475
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:12,440
Speaker 2: After that weekend, it took a long time to get

476
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:15,040
Speaker 2: married to call me back. She ended up talking to

477
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 2: my producer, Kate.

478
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:22,960
Speaker 11: Well. I was told who his sister was coming, and

479
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,000
Speaker 11: that was his and a friend from up Tennessee.

480
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:30,120
Speaker 2: Mary, for her part, said Steve felt blindsiding and maybe

481
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 2: ganged up on.

482
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 11: They could have been honest, but they want they will

483
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 11: awful whip him. And if it had told me his

484
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 11: mama was coming, then it might have been different.

485
00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:46,399
Speaker 2: To this day, Mary Sam Sandy wants something from Steve.

486
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:50,240
Speaker 11: She's trying to play Steve on a pity card, but

487
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 11: he's smarter than that.

488
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,720
Speaker 2: Look, it could be that Steve has just been polite

489
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:57,439
Speaker 2: that day in the hotel, showing Sandy pictures and talking

490
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,400
Speaker 2: to her. Maybe you didn't want to offend her, so

491
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:02,520
Speaker 2: he stayed put to hear her out. Even if he

492
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 2: had lost faith in her, But it could be that

493
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:07,840
Speaker 2: Mary was the one having a hard time dealing with

494
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:17,320
Speaker 2: Sandy coming back into the picture. Amy thinks Steve's deferential

495
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:19,880
Speaker 2: to Mary that he felt he didn't want to disappoint

496
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 2: her by knowing Sandy. There's a lot of complicated dynamics.

497
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:27,280
Speaker 5: Sarah, I think he was afraid to let Mary know

498
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,360
Speaker 5: that he wanted Enginette to know that he wanted to meet,

499
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 5: or like there was something wrong with that. It's almost

500
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 5: like he doesn't doesn't want to hurt her feelings. I

501
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 5: don't know. I can't get a read on it. Steven

502
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 5: needed to know and Sandy needed to know that even

503
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 5: though it was a shitty decision that she made to

504
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 5: give him to Mary, it saved his life.

505
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,440
Speaker 2: The circumstances of Steve's life, even the one no one remembers,

506
00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 2: ensured he survived.

507
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:04,480
Speaker 5: Now. He hugged her both days. Friday before when we

508
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 5: were leaving, he hugged her, and Saturday before he left,

509
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,960
Speaker 5: he hugged her and he called her mom. Andy, you

510
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:15,720
Speaker 5: teared up and said that he called me mom. That's

511
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,840
Speaker 5: when I knew what I had done was right.

512
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 2: But there's something I keep coming back to if there

513
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:27,040
Speaker 2: is a part of this family story that is black

514
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 2: and white. It's this Franklin Floyd did a world of

515
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:34,680
Speaker 2: damage that persists to this day. He took away a.

516
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 8: Lot, and we're finding what he didn't get his hands on,

517
00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,680
Speaker 8: and we're trying to put it back together. And that's

518
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 8: all that matters.

519
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 2: Every single person this story is experiencing the ripple effects

520
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 2: of their family being torn apart and dealing with their

521
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 2: own struggles. It's like that saying hurt people, hurt people

522
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:00,760
Speaker 2: and bringing a family together is sim not enough to

523
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 2: bring closure to tragedy. Franklin Floyd robbed this family of

524
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 2: a lot. He took Susie from them, and then he

525
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 2: took Michael. He forcing into a situation in which she

526
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 2: felt she had to give up her son.

527
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:20,640
Speaker 8: You know, we will survived, We have survived, and we'll

528
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 8: just keep growing from here, she hoped so.

529
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 2: And I do too. After that weekend, my conversations with

530
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 2: Steve and Jeanette Dwindle, I don't think Steve was necessarily

531
00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:38,360
Speaker 2: cutting me out. I just figured he retreated from everyone.

532
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 2: Then several months later, my producer Kate tried Mary one

533
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 2: last time, and she picked up I was glad she

534
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 2: picked up. I was worried about how the reunion hit Steve,

535
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:51,920
Speaker 2: and I was anxious to hear how he was faring.

536
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:56,040
Speaker 2: Mary said. The months after the reunion had been tough.

537
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 11: He has not been the same and he's not happy.

538
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 11: He did not want to meet her and it was

539
00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 11: forced on him.

540
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 9: What does us say about all this?

541
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:13,920
Speaker 11: He won't talk about it. He didn't want no more

542
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 11: said about it. We're trying to let it die, just

543
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 11: let it die down, and he's trying to avoid Tod

544
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:27,640
Speaker 11: to real. Yeah, he he'll answer him shortly, but he

545
00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 11: wants He won't call you on a conversations to God.

546
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 9: Todd cares about him.

547
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 11: I know that. But you know, the more you stir

548
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 11: my parents talk, made more you stir shit the worsest thinks.

549
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 11: And he doesn't tell me, he said mom, And she

550
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,920
Speaker 11: might give life to me, but she won't answer tell

551
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 11: me the truth on questions. It's like one time you

552
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 11: lie to me, shame on you. Second time's shame on me.

553
00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 11: They won't be a third time.

554
00:30:58,360 --> 00:30:59,360
Speaker 9: What is she worried about?

555
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,239
Speaker 11: You know, she didn't know who he did he was,

556
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 11: and she didn't remember all lis She remembers all Lias,

557
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:09,120
Speaker 11: it's just a pedetoria.

558
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 9: Has he talked about therapy aal like with that help.

559
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 11: He wouldn't he thought my husband he wouldn't go to they.

560
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 9: The reasoning I wanted to ask you, So I just

561
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,920
Speaker 9: I just want to run this by you. Sandy to me,

562
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:27,440
Speaker 9: seems pretty unrecognizable. She seems like she watches out for

563
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:31,240
Speaker 9: her grandkids, and she cares for her kids, and that

564
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 9: she's she's a better mom than she used to be.

565
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,080
Speaker 9: And I wonder if you believe that she's changed.

566
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 11: I don't know. I'm not a random A lot on that.

567
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 9: She got settled down, she married for thirty years, had

568
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 9: more kids, and now has you know, grandkids and his

569
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 9: great grandkids, and they say that she's.

570
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 11: Changed, Well, it's about the bomb.

571
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 9: Do you think people can change?

572
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 11: Ye talked they walk so God, Bob, if you're willing.

573
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 9: Do you think you regrets starting on all this knowing

574
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 9: that his real name and knowing about Tindy and knowing

575
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:15,200
Speaker 9: of us, so we ain't unhappy about that.

576
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 11: I don't think I think he will calm down eventually,

577
00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:24,000
Speaker 11: maybe ten fifteen years from now he might reach out

578
00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 11: to him, but I doubt it.

579
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 2: Three years ago Steve asked me to find out more

580
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:34,320
Speaker 2: about his origin story. We ended up on the journey together,

581
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 2: but neither of us knew just what we were getting into.

582
00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:40,920
Speaker 2: Kate asked Steve's sister Amy about my role here.

583
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:46,040
Speaker 5: It's like he's been digging in and searching, and he

584
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 5: brought Steve to the rest of us. You know, he's

585
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 5: the one that's been fighting as you'd have thought, he

586
00:32:55,640 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 5: was the parent that lost their traps time ago. You

587
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 5: just thought he was Sandy. Surely he's family.

588
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 2: Knowing what I know now, should I have done this?

589
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:12,000
Speaker 2: I think the answer is yes, if you ask me,

590
00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:14,840
Speaker 2: I think the reunion is the only thing to do.

591
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 2: But I wish i'd realized center that Steve needed more

592
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 2: time to process. Not the months I gave him, but years.

593
00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:25,640
Speaker 2: And like I've said, I have my own journey to

594
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 2: Steve's story. I first heard about him twenty years ago,

595
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 2: long before I knew Amy or Sandy or even Steve himself.

596
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 2: I said this in the beginning. This case chose me.

597
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 2: The way I see it, Steve and I are still

598
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 2: early in our relationship. Once you've been in this situation

599
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 2: like this, one have been lost and found the people

600
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,000
Speaker 2: you embark with on that journey. Stay with you even

601
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,280
Speaker 2: if we don't talk for a while. I think we

602
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 2: can pick up right where we left off when Steve's ready.

603
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 2: I guess I know why I'm so invested in this one.

604
00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 2: You ever wish for something you can't have. I wish

605
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 2: I have what Steve has, the opportunity to know his siblings.

606
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,839
Speaker 2: I wasn't afforded that, And when I opened the door

607
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 2: for room, he decided he didn't want to walk through.

608
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 2: It's left me jealous. I guess what I do to

609
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:25,520
Speaker 2: trade places with him, just for a day. You always

610
00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:29,279
Speaker 2: want what you can't have. I'm used to dealing with

611
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,720
Speaker 2: the dead. It's easier to hand someone to bot some bones.

612
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,279
Speaker 2: There's a homecoming and a finality of knowing your loved

613
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:41,600
Speaker 2: one's not missing anymore through at peace. It's so much

614
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:44,480
Speaker 2: harder to work with the living. We're complicated and messy

615
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 2: as humans, people who love and hurt each other. Today,

616
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 2: Steve has more people to love him and ready to

617
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:53,560
Speaker 2: support him when the time is right for him to

618
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:55,879
Speaker 2: reach out. I hope you'll be glad to have those

619
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 2: people in his life, and I'll hope you'll forgive me

620
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 2: for the mistakes he might alone the way I've opened

621
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:06,439
Speaker 2: the door, and hopefully sometime in the future stable choose

622
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:07,000
Speaker 2: to walk through.

623
00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:30,400
Speaker 1: Remember how I told you at the end of the

624
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 1: story we'd see things in a different light. Just as

625
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: we'd finished this episode, Todd Matthews died suddenly. He's now

626
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 1: on the other side of the veil between life and death.

627
00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 1: He spent so much of his life thinking about the

628
00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:46,680
Speaker 1: dead and hoping one day to reunite with the siblings

629
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:50,440
Speaker 1: he lost, But his sudden passing has left us. All morning,

630
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:53,480
Speaker 1: I keep thinking about all the things he said during

631
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:55,960
Speaker 1: this journey that now have deeper meanings since he's gone.

632
00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:58,879
Speaker 1: So we felt like it was only fitting to spend

633
00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 1: time with his story for our first bonus episode. We're

634
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:05,240
Speaker 1: going to dig into the life of an original, our host,

635
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 1: Todd Matthews, so on the other.

636
00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:12,959
Speaker 10: Side now, and who's to say that he might leave

637
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:17,879
Speaker 10: a little tidbit of information here, little clues you don't

638
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 10: know that you know. Do I believe in God? Yes

639
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 10: I do. Do I believe in Todd?

640
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:37,240
Speaker 2: Yes I do. Hello. John Doe is an original productions

641
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:41,160
Speaker 2: by Revelations Entertainment in association with First and Last productions

642
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:45,359
Speaker 2: from Revelations. Our executive producers are Morgan Freeman and James

643
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:49,760
Speaker 2: Younger from first to last. Lindsey Moreno is the executive producer.

644
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,800
Speaker 2: Our producing partner is Neo on Hume Media. It was

645
00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 2: written and produced by Kate Michigan. Our editor is Catherine

646
00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:59,320
Speaker 2: Saint Louis. She is also ne on Home Media's executive editor.

647
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:04,120
Speaker 2: Executive producer is Sherah Morris. Our development producer is Ian Lindsay.

648
00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:09,320
Speaker 2: Our associate producer is Rufaro Faith Masarua. Sound design and

649
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,719
Speaker 2: mixing by Scott sun Reveal Demon Original music composed by

650
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,359
Speaker 2: Jesse Pearlsting. Additional music came from Epidemic Sound and Blue

651
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 2: Dot Sessions. Vendall Faulton is our fact checker. Our production

652
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,760
Speaker 2: manager is Samantha Allison from my Heart Media. Dylan Fagan

653
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:27,279
Speaker 2: is our executive producer. Special thanks to Adelia Ruben at

654
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 2: Nion Him and Carrie Lieberman and Will Pearson at iHeartMedia.

655
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:34,200
Speaker 2: I'm Todd Matthews. You can learn more about name us

656
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:36,840
Speaker 2: at nam us dot com. The number for the National

657
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:39,880
Speaker 2: Center for Missing Exploited Children's Call Center is one eight hundred.

658
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:43,759
Speaker 2: The loss that's one eight hundred eight four three five

659
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Speaker 2: six seven. Eighth. The National Sexual assaul Hotline from the Rate,

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Speaker 2: Abuse and Incest National Network is one eight hundred sixty

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Speaker 2: five six four six seven three. Okay, guys, this is

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Speaker 2: the end of the show. If you didn't like it,

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00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:00,360
Speaker 2: don't do anything. But if you did like, get you

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00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:02,560
Speaker 2: make sure that you rate and review the show. It

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00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:05,000
Speaker 2: helps more people to find it and hear this wonderful story.

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Speaker 2: Thanks again for listening.