Speaker 1: Hey guys, welcome to I've never said this before with
Speaker 1: me Tammy di Dario. Today's guest is the brilliant Emmy
Speaker 1: nominated actress and singer songwriter McKenna Grace. You may know
Speaker 1: McKenna from playing a younger version of Brie Larsen's Carol
Speaker 1: Danvers in Captain Marvel, or maybe you saw her playing
Speaker 1: the preteen version of Kieran and Shipka's Sabrina in Netflix's
Speaker 1: Chilling Adventures of Sabrina. Or maybe even as a young
Speaker 1: Tanya Harding in Itanya, which is personally one of my
Speaker 1: favorite movies. So good, but get this. In twenty twenty one,
Speaker 1: McKenna became one of the youngest ever actors in history
Speaker 1: to receive an Emmy nomination recognizing her work as a
Speaker 1: rebellious child bride in The Handmaid's Tale. And all of
Speaker 1: this was accomplished before she turned seventeen. Yeah, she is
Speaker 1: a total rock star. All right, Get your cozy sweaters,
Speaker 1: your scarves, a big cup of hot tea light, your
Speaker 1: pumpkins ice candle or okay, maybe twenty of them like me.
Speaker 1: Because her brand new five song EP called Autumn Leaves
Speaker 1: is out now and we are diving in. McKenna is
Speaker 1: vulnerable and open and really raw with her lyrics, and
Speaker 1: we get to see a different side to her aside
Speaker 1: that I, for one, I just I found so very relatable.
Speaker 1: She writes from her heart and it is on full display,
Speaker 1: and she leaves you wanting more, like twenty songs more
Speaker 1: because it is that good. So let's see if today
Speaker 1: we can get McKenna to say something that she's never
Speaker 1: said before. McKenna, Grace, it is so nice to see you.
Speaker 1: How are you today? O great? How are you? I
Speaker 1: am so good. I'm really good because you put me
Speaker 1: in all the fall vibes with your new ep, Thank You.
Speaker 2: I'm trying.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it is so good. It's such a
Speaker 1: perfect time of year for you to come out with this.
Speaker 1: Of course, it's called Autumn Leaves. It's a five song
Speaker 1: EP for everybody listening out now. It's ethereal yet it's powerful.
Speaker 1: It's stripped down yet it's cinematic. The instrumentals are just incredible.
Speaker 1: So describe the overall feeling and vibe of Autumn Leaves
Speaker 1: for me?
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know. I just really wanted to make it.
Speaker 2: Thank you. That's such like a nice description. I don't know.
Speaker 3: I just really wanted it to feel very I feel
Speaker 3: like I'm moving into it.
Speaker 2: Well, I don't feel like I know.
Speaker 3: I am moving into a different space with my music
Speaker 3: versus kind of the pop punk EP that I first
Speaker 3: came out with. And I think that I'm just wanting
Speaker 3: to kind of represent not anymore because I did write
Speaker 3: this a little bit of time ago, but where I
Speaker 3: was as a person at the time, and I want
Speaker 3: to move into feeling cinematic and floey and my producer
Speaker 3: Cody will always get live strings on it, and I
Speaker 3: think that it's so beautiful and and just I want
Speaker 3: everything to feel really cinematic and like a story and
Speaker 3: like something that you know. I want it to make
Speaker 3: sense from start to finish, the EP, the story and
Speaker 3: all the words and lyrics that I'm singing.
Speaker 2: So I don't know, I wanted it to feel really
Speaker 2: fall and heartbreak.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well it certainly does. So how would you describe
Speaker 1: what you were going through in your life personally when
Speaker 1: you wrote these songs, because it is a very very
Speaker 1: personal look into who you are and what you've gone through.
Speaker 2: It definitely is.
Speaker 3: I mean, I wrote this about my first like actual heartbreak.
Speaker 3: You know. It was the first time I ever felt
Speaker 3: like I was in love, and now looking back, I'm like,
Speaker 3: oh gosh, it was. It was pretty silly, And I
Speaker 3: don't know. I'm the kind of person that holds onto
Speaker 3: things for a long time. And I think that I
Speaker 3: wrote this and a lot of other music I have
Speaker 3: hopefully coming out at some point just kind of in
Speaker 3: a place where I didn't get closure on the situation,
Speaker 3: and I just felt like so sad and alone and
Speaker 3: heartbroken for way too long, and so I don't know,
Speaker 3: I just happened to channel it all into music.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, I mean, heartbreak is definitely the major theme
Speaker 1: throughout these these songs, but I would actually argue you
Speaker 1: walk away with a positive message after listening. Is that
Speaker 1: something that you think as well?
Speaker 2: A little bit.
Speaker 3: My main thing was I feel like I got all
Speaker 3: of my like little AnGR or biting songs out of
Speaker 3: my system whenever I released my last EP, and I
Speaker 3: just felt really sad and I felt like I didn't
Speaker 3: have really not that I ever want to say anything
Speaker 3: bad about anyone, but anything like bad.
Speaker 2: To say about this person.
Speaker 3: I was just like, I'm just sad and I can't
Speaker 3: say anything to you because you aren't responding. So I
Speaker 3: just feel like I should put everything I feel into.
Speaker 2: This music, you know.
Speaker 3: And it's not it's negative emotions, but not negative exactly
Speaker 3: towards you. It's just like, here's what you'll never say,
Speaker 3: Here's how I'm feeling, and I know I have to
Speaker 3: let go it. And it took me a while after
Speaker 3: writing all of these songs to get that last song
Speaker 3: of like I know that I have to let go.
Speaker 3: All of this happened last fall and only kind of
Speaker 3: later into the summer did I finally feel like, Okay,
Speaker 3: I like really have got to.
Speaker 2: Let go of this.
Speaker 3: It's silly and I've just far and so I finally did.
Speaker 3: And it's just like it's nice to have that on there.
Speaker 3: As you know, I might not have closure on everything,
Speaker 3: but I can give myself my own like peace of
Speaker 3: mind and closure and like you know what life goes on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and giving yourself your own peace of mind, I
Speaker 1: think is the greatest gift. We've all been through experiences
Speaker 1: where we want that closure and we don't necessarily always
Speaker 1: get it, So to give it to yourself, I think
Speaker 1: is one of the biggest gifts we can give right.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, though I would love a little bit
Speaker 2: of closure.
Speaker 1: You're like, well, I think it quite enough.
Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, it was nice to finally be able
Speaker 2: to write that.
Speaker 1: Is there a song on this EP that was more
Speaker 1: difficult than the rest for you to write?
Speaker 3: I don't know, probably midnight in London because that was
Speaker 3: kind of like because I was writing it and I
Speaker 3: was like, well, guys, I'm not over it, so I
Speaker 3: don't want to say this, and They're like, yeah.
Speaker 2: But you have to be.
Speaker 3: And I'm like, okay, fine, God, I'll write this and
Speaker 3: I'll say it and I know I have to let go,
Speaker 3: but I don't want.
Speaker 2: To, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's not easy to do. Is your
Speaker 1: songwriting process super for anetic? Is it peaceful? Is it random?
Speaker 1: Do you wake up at four? I am like, oh,
Speaker 1: I have a thought. I mean, how do you put
Speaker 1: together a body of work?
Speaker 3: I mean, it definitely depends. It really really depends. I
Speaker 3: mean the other night, my dad and I just took
Speaker 3: a trip and we went to rock slash Metal festival
Speaker 3: over the weekend and we had gotten back and both
Speaker 3: of us were so tired. But I was just laying
Speaker 3: up like in bed in this hotel, like just writing
Speaker 3: and writing, and my dad was like, can you go
Speaker 3: to bed? We have to get up in the morning
Speaker 3: and drive home. And I was like, no, I have
Speaker 3: so many thoughts.
Speaker 2: Like I can't go to bed.
Speaker 3: And I ended up getting to bed by like three,
Speaker 3: And I have this really scrambled, big gold like paragraph
Speaker 3: in my notes app at this point. But then other
Speaker 3: times I like to write on paper and I use
Speaker 3: a lot of pinterest. I think it really depends on
Speaker 3: what it is that I'm writing about.
Speaker 1: And you're someone who likes to write about what you're going.
Speaker 3: Through completely, I feel like I feel like it's I
Speaker 3: can't write about something if it isn't how I'm feeling.
Speaker 3: Because in my last ep, you know, I wrote about
Speaker 3: heartbreak and breakups, but it was more just a way
Speaker 3: because it was all entirely true to me, but saying
Speaker 3: that it was a breakup of a relationship was easier
Speaker 3: to convey in the music. But it was more of
Speaker 3: like a breakup of a friendship, or maybe it was
Speaker 3: a about a family member, maybe it was about this.
Speaker 2: But everything that.
Speaker 3: I'm feeling, I feel like I get annoying and songwriting
Speaker 3: sessions sometimes because someone will suggest something and I'll be like,
Speaker 3: I love that, and it's like such a good lyric,
Speaker 3: but I feel like I can't sing that because that
Speaker 3: didn't happen to me. And I don't want to be
Speaker 3: lying about this situation that nobody will ever know who
Speaker 3: this person is, nobody will ever know what this situation is.
Speaker 3: But I feel like I'm like, I don't know. I
Speaker 3: don't want to lie about them or about this, even
Speaker 3: though it's not a lie, it's a lyric.
Speaker 2: It's like I don't know.
Speaker 3: It just doesn't feel right to me, and I feel
Speaker 3: like I have to be as truthful as possible.
Speaker 2: But it is different.
Speaker 3: Sometimes I write songs through a character's perspective or for
Speaker 3: a film about the film or things like that, But
Speaker 3: whenever I'm writing for my own personal stories, I always
Speaker 3: get really specific in things that I reference or mention,
Speaker 3: and it's just kind of things that only like I
Speaker 3: would know, or only other people in that situation would know,
Speaker 3: and it's just like, I don't know.
Speaker 2: It just makes it extra like special listening back to it.
Speaker 1: Well, I think that's the magic of your work is
Speaker 1: it's so visual. And you know you mentioned Midnight in
Speaker 1: London and I love that. I loved that song for
Speaker 1: so many reasons, but I could really see every single
Speaker 1: frame of that song like playing out like a movie,
Speaker 1: and I thought it's I thought the message was incredible
Speaker 1: as well, just about having to let go and the
Speaker 1: importance of having to let go? Is that something throughout
Speaker 1: your life that was a hard lesson for you to learn?
Speaker 2: I don't even think that I've learned that lesson.
Speaker 3: Still like I wrote that song, but I still like
Speaker 3: I'm the type of person it's I feel like I
Speaker 3: really touched on it in my song November.
Speaker 2: I'm just the person I don't let go of things.
Speaker 3: I don't know I have like I'm looking at this
Speaker 3: little trinket shelf in front of me. That is another
Speaker 3: example that it's just like I see things and I
Speaker 3: create emotional attachments to them, and then it's just like, oh, well,
Speaker 3: now I can't watch this movie without thinking of a person,
Speaker 3: and it's like, what can I do?
Speaker 2: You know, It's just like, I don't know, I just
Speaker 2: hold on to things for way too long.
Speaker 3: I'm not great at letting things go, but I'm definitely
Speaker 3: I'm trying.
Speaker 1: But you know what, I don't know if it's a
Speaker 1: bad thing to be able to let certain things go.
Speaker 1: I'm the same way. I attach such emotional meaning to
Speaker 1: so many things, like stupid things. I'll have something on
Speaker 1: a shelf for like ten years, and my husband will
Speaker 1: be like, do you really need that? And I'm like, yes,
Speaker 1: because in nineteen ninety eight and one day I had
Speaker 1: lunch with somebody who gave it to me. Like it's
Speaker 1: so crazy the things I attach meaning to, But I
Speaker 1: don't know if it's always a bad thing.
Speaker 3: I think that it's important to let go of things
Speaker 3: that are not healthy to you anymore. But to me,
Speaker 3: everything that I've experienced with a person or just in
Speaker 3: my life is important and it carries some sort of
Speaker 3: meaning or value. And I've like, even if I don't
Speaker 3: talk to a person anymore, or even if they like
Speaker 3: really hurt me or I don't like them, or even
Speaker 3: if everything ended happily, but I can't let go of it.
Speaker 3: I still think that it's important to not have regrets
Speaker 3: about things that hurt you, because it's just like it
Speaker 3: happened and you.
Speaker 2: Learned a lesson and it made me who I am.
Speaker 3: Like there's so many things in my life that I
Speaker 3: feel like I would regret if I wasn't a songwriter
Speaker 3: and I did not see how it changed the way
Speaker 3: I write, or how it changed the way that I think,
Speaker 3: or how it changed the way that I like interact
Speaker 3: with the world around me. I just think that it's
Speaker 3: important to hold on to little things at least.
Speaker 1: When you brought up November earlier, there was a line
Speaker 1: in that song that I was just heartbroken hearing because
Speaker 1: I feel like, again, it's so relatable, and that line
Speaker 1: was I'm so tired of being patient, always waiting for
Speaker 1: something that never lasts. What were you going through when
Speaker 1: you wrote that?
Speaker 2: I mean, that's just me.
Speaker 3: I'm very, very very much a hopeless romantic, but like
Speaker 3: everything anything, everything romantically is very important to me. Like
Speaker 3: I don't take it lightly, even as silly as going
Speaker 3: on a day or kissing someone, Like to me, it's
Speaker 3: still like a big deal. It's like, oh my god,
Speaker 3: that's like massive to me.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: It's just like I love love so so much, and
Speaker 3: I so badly want to be in love, but I
Speaker 3: also never want to rush it. But I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: but when am I gonna fall in love? But I
Speaker 3: need to wait. But if something comes along, like I
Speaker 3: wouldn't be opposed to it, but also it might not
Speaker 3: be you know, like I'm just.
Speaker 2: Always all over the place.
Speaker 3: I'm always like I can't wait to fall in love someday,
Speaker 3: but then it feels like I don't know, it's like
Speaker 3: it never lasts and I'm just so sad. And then
Speaker 3: I feel like the line either before or after that
Speaker 3: is like telling myself, this too shall pass. And that's
Speaker 3: what my mom always says to me. That's like, that's
Speaker 3: my mom thing, is that my mom's always like.
Speaker 2: This too shall pass, like you'll makeet through this and
Speaker 2: X y Z and so it's just like a little
Speaker 2: personal motto.
Speaker 1: So you were totally a hopeless romantic.
Speaker 2: Completely.
Speaker 3: It's so bad that, like completely, and it ties into
Speaker 3: me like always holding on the little like silly things
Speaker 3: I I don't I love love.
Speaker 2: I love love.
Speaker 1: Listen, there are worse things to love. So I'm a
Speaker 1: hopeless romantic too. I love it. I'm the guy that's
Speaker 1: like watching a cheesy rom com crying his eyes out
Speaker 1: because it's so beautiful.
Speaker 3: I never thought of myself as somebody who like cried
Speaker 3: in movies or anything like that until I just recently
Speaker 3: started watching a bunch of rom coms and I'm like, wow,
Speaker 3: I'm a baby.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm the same way. Do you have a favorite
Speaker 1: rom com? Hmm?
Speaker 3: I just watched How to Lose a Guy in ten
Speaker 3: Days Classics.
Speaker 2: I just watched that. That was really that was really funny.
Speaker 2: I thought that it was sweet.
Speaker 1: Have you watched The Holiday Holiday as Kate.
Speaker 2: Winslet No, no, no, I haven't.
Speaker 1: Okay, one of my all time favorites for everyone listening
Speaker 1: pop in the Holiday? It will make you cry and
Speaker 1: feel all the feels.
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, I'll put it on my watch list.
Speaker 1: Yeah you must so you know. Yes, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of heartbreaking your songs. But I imagine that you have
Speaker 1: to stay optimistic to be able to keep the hope alive,
Speaker 1: to be able to want that love one day, to
Speaker 1: still believe in it. Right, So how do you stay
Speaker 1: optimistic when you do experience such heartbreak?
Speaker 2: I don't know. This is too shall pass. I just like.
Speaker 3: I have a firm belief that all that is meant
Speaker 3: to be like what happened, I am putting it in
Speaker 3: God and.
Speaker 2: The Universe's hands. You know, I.
Speaker 3: Know that there's someone out there for me romantically, keeping
Speaker 3: hope alive. I just know that someday, I don't know
Speaker 3: how I know, but I'm just like, someday, I know
Speaker 3: that it'll happen. I don't know when it'll be who
Speaker 3: it'll be, and I hate having to sit around and wait,
Speaker 3: but like, I don't know, there's some sort of plan
Speaker 3: out there in the universe for something, and I feel
Speaker 3: like I don't know. My fate is just like in
Speaker 3: the universes and in God's hands, so there's nothing I
Speaker 3: can do about it. I just have to wait and
Speaker 3: see what happens, and until then I can write all
Speaker 3: of my silly, little sad songs.
Speaker 1: Yes, and having that belief is so important. I think
Speaker 1: that listen, life is a crazy, messy, windy ride and
Speaker 1: we never know what's going to happen. And I think
Speaker 1: that as long as you go through it knowing what
Speaker 1: you want, knowing what you don't want, what you're willing
Speaker 1: to not sacrifice on right and waiting for the right
Speaker 1: thing is so important. And we have to go through
Speaker 1: our heartbreaks and our messes to get to the crown jewels.
Speaker 3: I like to say, yeah, it makes you who you are,
Speaker 3: and I mean without all of the heartbreak, and all
Speaker 3: of the messy things in life, you know, like how
Speaker 3: are you ever going to learn what you want or
Speaker 3: who you are or you know what you don't like
Speaker 3: like or what you do like or all the things.
Speaker 2: I mean everything.
Speaker 3: It's like I said earlier, everything is just like a
Speaker 3: learning experience and I don't know everything's important.
Speaker 1: And it's just like, yeah, and you just nailed it.
Speaker 1: Was I was in something in my young twenties that
Speaker 1: was so wrong for me for a million reasons. Thank
Speaker 1: god I went through that because now I know what
Speaker 1: it is that works for me and that I wanted
Speaker 1: and you know, I'm happily married and all the things.
Speaker 1: So yes, you have to go through your journey, and
Speaker 1: it's all, it's all a part of it. I So
Speaker 1: I felt so many different inspirations through your music through listening,
Speaker 1: and I'm curious to hear from you. Who are your
Speaker 1: biggest musical inspirations right now?
Speaker 3: Lana Delray, I have like on my wall over here,
Speaker 3: I have like a bunch of pictures of her.
Speaker 2: I love Lana Delray. I don't know. I think that
Speaker 2: she's so brilliant in the way that.
Speaker 3: She like is so old Hollywood and cool, but it's
Speaker 3: like in a weird, darker modern way, which I think
Speaker 3: is so rad because I don't know, Like I said,
Speaker 3: I want to stay cinematic and very like old Hollywood
Speaker 3: is my favorite type of vibe, and so I don't
Speaker 3: know that's right now.
Speaker 2: But at the time of writing this EP, because.
Speaker 3: It always jumps all over the place, it went from
Speaker 3: like Letigra and Green Day and Nirvana.
Speaker 2: To uh at the time, it was honestly just so
Speaker 2: many heartbreak songs.
Speaker 3: I have like a whole, whole long long playlist here
Speaker 3: it is, okay. I was listening to a lot of Miski,
Speaker 3: I was listening to a lot of Mac DeMarco and
Speaker 3: Taylor Swift and Lord, a lot of all of your
Speaker 3: ego of course, and surprising I love the Lala Lamb soundtrack.
Speaker 1: Oh it's beautiful.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I think that that really like ties into wanting to
Speaker 3: feel cinematic in your music.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. And it's funny you brought up
Speaker 1: Lana because she came into mind right away, and and
Speaker 1: Taylor came to mind too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So thank you.
Speaker 1: Yeah for real, I just I And I'm such a
Speaker 1: fan of our work. I think you are part of
Speaker 1: that that tribe now and releasing such moving and beautiful
Speaker 1: and you keep saying the word cinematic, and I know
Speaker 1: that's so important to you, and I truly feel like
Speaker 1: that's what you came out with. So it's really cool, Like,
Speaker 1: I are we gonna get some some music videos possibly?
Speaker 2: I mean, that's nice.
Speaker 3: I have a lot of them written and I may
Speaker 3: or may not be doing something this week, but who knows.
Speaker 2: Who knows?
Speaker 1: Fantastic because I mean, we've got to see this come
Speaker 1: to life. It's it's made for a music video, so
Speaker 1: we will eagerly await that may or may not happening.
Speaker 1: We'll see what will happen. But it's evident you love music,
Speaker 1: right and you also love acting. I know there's over
Speaker 1: seventy credits to your name, but songwriting and music is
Speaker 1: such a different thing, I imagine for you. So what
Speaker 1: is it about music that fulfills you in a different
Speaker 1: way than acting?
Speaker 2: Acting?
Speaker 3: To me is such it's really fulfilling, like playing a
Speaker 3: deep character or getting to film emotional scenes or doing
Speaker 3: something deep like that, or just playing any characters really fulfilling,
Speaker 3: like as an actress, and I love acting so much,
Speaker 3: But then music is fulfilling in like a deeper personal way.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: Music's music is my very public therapy, you know. It's
Speaker 3: just like I sit and I write, and I write,
Speaker 3: and I write all of the time now, and I
Speaker 3: can't stop because it's just my way to get all
Speaker 3: of my emotions out and whether I put it out
Speaker 3: there or not, you know, Like there's dozens of songs
Speaker 3: that I've written just because it like benefited my own
Speaker 3: mental health to just like write those things down and
Speaker 3: say them out loud in the form of song, I suppose.
Speaker 2: So it's just it's fulfilling in a different way.
Speaker 3: And it's nice to be able to share my own
Speaker 3: stories as much as I love telling everybody else's and
Speaker 3: getting to dive into different people.
Speaker 2: It's I don't know.
Speaker 3: I've been acting. I'm seven, and then I've been acting
Speaker 3: for twelve years, so that's like a lot of my life.
Speaker 3: And so I've been pretending to be other people and
Speaker 3: learning how to like be younger versions of someone, or
Speaker 3: how to play a different character, or like spending all
Speaker 3: night trying to figure out how to play a real
Speaker 3: life person. And now I'm like figuring out who I
Speaker 3: am and so my songs, I feel like the mood
Speaker 3: of the music is always all over the place, but
Speaker 3: it's because I am too.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I'm finally just like growing into myself and figuring out like, Okay,
Speaker 3: I have my own personality. I'm my own person like
Speaker 3: who is that? And so I've been really figuring it
Speaker 3: out and music has really.
Speaker 2: Been helping that.
Speaker 1: Is being a singer songwriter easier or harder than playing
Speaker 1: a character?
Speaker 3: I'd say it's it's probably easier because I'm a really
Speaker 3: emotional person. And I probably get that because I have
Speaker 3: to be so open with my emotions and acting.
Speaker 2: But I'm just a.
Speaker 3: Very deeply emotional person and so it's very easy for
Speaker 3: me to just like spill my guts all the time
Speaker 3: whenever songwriting. But I'd say like whenever it comes to performing,
Speaker 3: doing a live performance is way scarier because you only
Speaker 3: have one shot.
Speaker 1: Oh interesting, interesting, Even scarier than a camera like in
Speaker 1: your face.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because at least with like the camera in my face,
Speaker 3: I have like thirty takes to do it. But I mean,
Speaker 3: I don't know, there's just something about being on stage
Speaker 3: and whenever you're acting, you know, of course there's a
Speaker 3: crew around you and whatnot. But there's just something different
Speaker 3: about looking out at everybody and they're watching you, like
Speaker 3: in that moment, and they're watching what you're doing, and
Speaker 3: you have like one chance to do it, and you're like, well,
Speaker 3: pure goes nothing, and it's just so scary, but it's
Speaker 3: really fun.
Speaker 1: Well that makes total sense. It's amazing that you can
Speaker 1: do it all in all different avenues of creativity. Going
Speaker 1: back to the EP for a minute. Autumn. Why Autumn? Autumn?
Speaker 2: Oh? I love fall, Like I'm feeling so fall right now.
Speaker 3: I have like my best cup of tea, I have
Speaker 3: my little like brown sweater on, I have like last
Speaker 3: night I had like two different fall candles.
Speaker 2: Going and two different corners of my room. I love fall.
Speaker 2: It's my favorite season. I don't even know what else
Speaker 2: to say. It's just perfect whenever it starts getting just
Speaker 2: a little bit chilly and all the leaves turn, and.
Speaker 3: Then you can start wearing sweaters without feeling like ashamed
Speaker 3: of yourself because I just love sweaters so much, and
Speaker 3: I'll wear them during the summer, but then.
Speaker 2: It's too hot and I'm dying. But I'm like, God,
Speaker 2: but this is my favorite sweater.
Speaker 3: And it looks so good and so like I don't know,
Speaker 3: breaking out the tea, Halloween, scary movies all month, and
Speaker 3: then it's just it's also such a nice time for
Speaker 3: anything romantic, and I don't know, there's always the worst
Speaker 3: heartbreaking fall too.
Speaker 1: I find I'm with you, and I don't want to
Speaker 1: make this about me, but I did happen to wear
Speaker 1: my burgundy in your honor today in my Fall theme
Speaker 1: for you, so I love it.
Speaker 2: I'm in my Fall theme for.
Speaker 1: You or Fall Twins. I love that. I'm a New
Speaker 1: York City boy. I'm in New York right now. I'm
Speaker 1: from the East Coast, so we really get fall.
Speaker 2: I love New York.
Speaker 3: I write about it all the time in my EP
Speaker 3: and album I Love New York.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a special city. Something else that came to
Speaker 1: mind when I was listening to this, You know, you're
Speaker 1: writing about people essentially or somebody. Do you ever worry
Speaker 1: about putting out your personal life and how that person
Speaker 1: is going to view what you're saying? Like is there
Speaker 1: a line you won't cross? Are you cognizant to change
Speaker 1: certain things? Like? How is that process when there is
Speaker 1: somebody else involved? As a songwriter.
Speaker 3: It's terrifying because I get so specific and I'm saying
Speaker 3: things that you know, like only I and this other
Speaker 3: person will know. It's scary because I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 3: everybody's going to know who I wrote this about. Everybody's
Speaker 3: going to know this, but it's like nobody's going to know.
Speaker 3: It's just like it's nobody's gonna no except for us.
Speaker 3: And so I was. I was frustrated in my last EP,
Speaker 3: and I wrote a lot of things that weren't the nicest.
Speaker 2: And so I did have some phone calls.
Speaker 3: Uh. You know, I just feel like, man, I still
Speaker 3: have a phone call to make in regards to this EP,
Speaker 3: and I'm not looking forward to it. But I feel
Speaker 3: like it's important. Even though I feel like I'm not
Speaker 3: saying anything wrong or bad, I'm just saying how I
Speaker 3: felt and putting my emotions out there. I feel like
Speaker 3: it's only fair just to be like, hey, by the way,
Speaker 3: I wrote a lot of music, but it's also because
Speaker 3: you broke my heart.
Speaker 2: But I wrote a lot of music and I'm putting
Speaker 2: it out there.
Speaker 3: And luckily, like from my last EP, you know, those
Speaker 3: phone calls actually came a lot of good and now
Speaker 3: this person that I was so upset with for so
Speaker 3: long and who like I was like, felt like really
Speaker 3: hurt me or rogby you know, now we're like tight
Speaker 3: and friends again and it's just like amazing, and I'm
Speaker 3: like great, well, and now they make jokes all the
Speaker 3: time about remember whenever you wrote that song about me,
Speaker 3: and I'm like, yeah, if you like are mean again,
Speaker 3: then I'll write more. But actually a really funny story
Speaker 3: is that while I was recording what You'll Never Say,
Speaker 3: like singing myself the apology that I never received, I
Speaker 3: got my first phone call from this person in over
Speaker 3: like eight months, and I actually like have the take
Speaker 3: of me like like a cold, dirty out of nowhere.
Speaker 2: And so I was, I was singing this song and
Speaker 2: I have the take of me going, oh my god,
Speaker 2: so and so is calling me.
Speaker 3: And then like my producer, who like has been there
Speaker 3: through everything through whenever I was writing this Autumn Leaves
Speaker 3: Love song to now finishing this heartbreak.
Speaker 2: Epee uh you know, and we freaked out.
Speaker 3: And then I kind of got the apology like semi
Speaker 3: that semi that I never received, and it was like
Speaker 3: crazy and I was like, that's such an insane story
Speaker 3: to have now is that I'm singing myself the apology
Speaker 3: I never received, and then all of a sudden I kind.
Speaker 2: Of got it.
Speaker 3: And so it was just like so strange, and it
Speaker 3: just like goes to show the universe works so weird,
Speaker 3: Like I as soon as I finished this project, now
Speaker 3: it's like, I don't know. Everything's kind of like nice again,
Speaker 3: and it's just like, I don't know, it's strange to
Speaker 3: see how everything works.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and my heart break out of my system well.
Speaker 1: Right, and music's healing. I mean, that's why I think
Speaker 1: it's such an important art form that we all need
Speaker 1: to have. And I'm such an avid music listener and
Speaker 1: I don't know what I would do without music, And
Speaker 1: that's why it's one of the most important things in
Speaker 1: the world. To you. What makes music so important?
Speaker 3: I just connect so deeply, like emotionally with music, and it,
Speaker 3: whether I'm writing it or listening to it, helps me
Speaker 3: process my emotion and it can even whenever I'm acting,
Speaker 3: you know, it can really transport me to a place
Speaker 3: of very deep like emotions or sadness or anything. Like
Speaker 3: I listen to music constantly whenever I'm playing a character
Speaker 3: to get me into that headspace or that world, especially.
Speaker 2: With emotional scenes.
Speaker 3: But I don't know, finding a song that's like that
Speaker 3: is exactly how I feel. I'll listen to it until
Speaker 3: I can't anymore, you know, I don't know. I just
Speaker 3: think that there's something also so special about music and
Speaker 3: getting to see it live is so cool. Like I said,
Speaker 3: over the weekend, I was with my dad at this
Speaker 3: rock festival, which is so different than anything in regards
Speaker 3: to this EP, but like just getting to see everybody
Speaker 3: like jump around together and like feel that emotion and
Speaker 3: that vibe and everybody's so excited and hyped together.
Speaker 2: Like, I don't know, it's.
Speaker 3: So cool that just some people on stage with these
Speaker 3: silly little like stringed instruments can make people feel that
Speaker 3: and connect people in a way that they never would
Speaker 3: have connected before.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it creates that sense of community, which I think
Speaker 1: we all need more than ever, which is again one
Speaker 1: of the brilliant things about music. When I look at
Speaker 1: you right now, you seem so light, you seem so excited,
Speaker 1: You seem like you did go through a lot of
Speaker 1: tough things that you wrote about, but you came out
Speaker 1: on the other side. So McKenna I'm curious to know
Speaker 1: if you could fill in this blank what you would say.
Speaker 1: I am at a point in my life.
Speaker 2: Where I'm at a point in my life where I'm
Speaker 2: you know what.
Speaker 3: I'm at a point in my life where I'm starting
Speaker 3: to like like myself, which is nice.
Speaker 2: It's a really nice feeling.
Speaker 3: I for so long, like I don't know, not to
Speaker 3: get all like sad or deever weird.
Speaker 1: Oh please, so long, I just like, I don't.
Speaker 3: Know, I didn't like myself for so long, like I
Speaker 3: felt like there was something so like deeply wrong with me.
Speaker 2: And now I'm like sitting here and I'm like, WHOA.
Speaker 3: I think I was just like a really like sad
Speaker 3: teenager for a little bit, and now I'm like, I
Speaker 3: turned seventeen, and I've been really working on improving myself
Speaker 3: and my body and my mental health.
Speaker 2: And then I just like cleaned up my room and
Speaker 2: made it really.
Speaker 3: Like light and cleaner and less clottered, and I'm just
Speaker 3: trying to, like, I don't know, breathe, and I'm just like,
Speaker 3: I don't know, I'm starting to get to like a
Speaker 3: positive place with myself, which I think is really nice
Speaker 3: because I'm like, oh, hey, I'm like, I'm feeling myself
Speaker 3: lately and it's really nice.
Speaker 2: I'm just like, oh, I don't know, it's nice.
Speaker 1: Good for you, Good for you. That self work is
Speaker 1: something that I think we should never stop striving for.
Speaker 1: And I love that you're at a place at seventeen
Speaker 1: where you're starting to realize the importance of that and
Speaker 1: taking time to allow yourself to grow in all those
Speaker 1: different ways that you just talked about. I think that's
Speaker 1: a really honest and cool answer. I usually wrap up
Speaker 1: my show by asking all of my guests, what is
Speaker 1: one thing that they've never said before? But I feel
Speaker 1: like that maybe is something you really haven't talked about before.
Speaker 1: Is that right?
Speaker 2: I think so.
Speaker 3: I think a lot of right now, like this entire
Speaker 3: interview and just kind of with this EP in general,
Speaker 3: I'm talking about, you know, things I've never talked about
Speaker 3: it publicly, Like I don't know. As much as I
Speaker 3: write about it, I don't I don't really talk about
Speaker 3: my breakups or break up I'm singular, I don't really
Speaker 3: talk about like I don't know, I could feel so weird,
Speaker 3: like talking about my personal life or like my emotions
Speaker 3: or like I don't know, but yeah, especially that, because
Speaker 3: I feel like it's just been such a thing for
Speaker 3: me for such a long time. And you know, I
Speaker 3: have like a few songs out there about feeling into
Speaker 3: here in myself, but I always, I always felt so
Speaker 3: strange releasing something like that because I felt like I
Speaker 3: didn't have like a moral of the story, or I
Speaker 3: wasn't on the other side of it, and so I
Speaker 3: felt like it wasn't fair for me to put something
Speaker 3: out there that's like negative about myself but not know
Speaker 3: like how to resolve that or how to fix it.
Speaker 3: I go through things in life, but that's not who
Speaker 3: I am, you know. And now I'm starting to finally
Speaker 3: realize that, because it's easy to say, like I'm just
Speaker 3: a sad person and that's who I am, and I
Speaker 3: just don't like myself or.
Speaker 2: I'm just this. But it's like I'm always, throughout my
Speaker 2: life going to go through moments where where.
Speaker 3: I probably hate myself or where I probably hate this,
Speaker 3: or where I hate this or that, or where I'm
Speaker 3: deeply sad or depressed.
Speaker 2: But that's not gonna last forever. That's not who I am.
Speaker 3: It's not something that will actively take over my life,
Speaker 3: like it's just bumps and phases along the road, and
Speaker 3: then the rest of life is going to be life,
Speaker 3: and whatever happens happens, and I'm gonna have so many
Speaker 3: more adventures and I'm gonna.
Speaker 2: Have ups and downs, but it just like it comes
Speaker 2: and goes.
Speaker 3: And I think that it's nice to like I'm in
Speaker 3: like a more positive area of that ride right now
Speaker 3: and I'm happy about it. Well.
Speaker 1: And that's what I loved about this conversation today and
Speaker 1: about your EP is You're normalizing feeling all the emotions,
Speaker 1: and I think that's so important. You know, one of
Speaker 1: the most irritating questions to me that I get asked
Speaker 1: or someone else might get asked, is, oh, you seem
Speaker 1: really sad today. It's so unlike you Are you okay?
Speaker 1: It's like, I'm allowed to be sad. I do have
Speaker 1: a sad side as well, like I'm not always going
Speaker 1: to be happy. And I think that you talking about
Speaker 1: this and showing people that it's okay to feel what
Speaker 1: you feel and then pull out of it and carry
Speaker 1: on and not let it define you is such an
Speaker 1: important message. And I hope you realize that through being
Speaker 1: your honest self and through writing your truth you are
Speaker 1: helping a lot of people feel seen.
Speaker 2: I hope so.
Speaker 3: And I mean I'm saying this right now as if
Speaker 3: I wasn't like crying in the shower last night to
Speaker 3: Phoebe Bridgers, like I was so sad yesterday.
Speaker 2: But now I'm just like, oh, I'm feeling good right now.
Speaker 3: So it's like it's all over the place all the time,
Speaker 3: and I think that it's healthy and normal to feel that.
Speaker 2: But thank you. I try.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's a great message to put out there.
Speaker 1: Autumn Leaves is out now. How can people stream download
Speaker 1: all the things?
Speaker 3: All the things I don't know McKenna grace on like Spotify,
Speaker 3: rable music, ramas on music or any of the things.
Speaker 3: I have music videos on YouTube that I write myself
Speaker 3: then I co direct them.
Speaker 1: So all the things, all the things. Well, congratulations on
Speaker 1: this amazing ep. You heard it from Mechenna. Grab your fuzziest,
Speaker 1: coziest blanket and a cup of tea and light some
Speaker 1: pumpkin candles and I don't know, throw leaves around your
Speaker 1: room and listen.
Speaker 3: To this right absolutely yeah, the leaf throwing bit is
Speaker 3: really important.
Speaker 1: Just bring a vacuum, crucial, absolutely crucial. Thank you so much. Congratulations.
Speaker 1: I look forward to hearing more from you when the
Speaker 1: next round of inspiration hits.
Speaker 2: Thank you, it's already coming. There's too much good.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you, thank you, thank you, and happy fall. Congratulations,
Speaker 1: thank you, Happy ball. I've never said this before. It
Speaker 1: is hosted by me, Tommy de Dario. This podcast is
Speaker 1: executive produced by Andrew Puglisi at iHeartRadio and by me, Tommy,
Speaker 1: I've Never Said this before. It's part of the Elvis
Speaker 1: de Ram podcast network on iHeart Podcasts. For more, rate
Speaker 1: review and subscribe to our show and if you liked
Speaker 1: the episode, tell your friends until next time. I'm Tommy
Speaker 1: de Dario and I hope this show encourages you to
Speaker 1: say something that you've never said before.