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Speaker 1: Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln Radio Studio, the George

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Speaker 1: Washington Broadcast Center, Jack Armstrong, Joe Getty arm Strong and

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Speaker 1: Jetty and now he Armstrong and Yetty.

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Speaker 2: Christmas so close, two weeks from normal field, the walls

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Speaker 2: closing in on me. I haven't finished my Christmas shopping yet.

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Speaker 2: One of the things I am doing at the end

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Speaker 2: of the years I always do every single years, I

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Speaker 2: look at your end of the year book lists top

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Speaker 2: ten books of the year and see if there's any

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Speaker 2: stuff I missed that I want to read. One of

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Speaker 2: the books I started the new book about Araq, which

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Speaker 2: I'll talk about later, which fits in with Siria and

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Speaker 2: I find it quite compelling. But one of the books

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Speaker 2: it's outs, the Jonathan Hite book. I forget what the

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Speaker 2: name of it is, but it's all about how we've

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Speaker 2: ruined our kids with social media and smartphones and all

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Speaker 2: that sort of stuff.

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Speaker 1: We've talked about that book a lot started it. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I might want to read the something or other generation. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's it's horrifying. But it went from uh, nobody

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Speaker 1: did this to everybody did this in a couple of years.

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Speaker 1: In the around two thousand and eight, where everybody stares

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Speaker 1: at their phones all the time and we just have

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Speaker 1: all gotten used to it. I think the next thing

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Speaker 1: we're all going to get used to is gazillions of

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Speaker 1: things flying around in the sky all the time over

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Speaker 1: our heads and we have no idea what they are.

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Speaker 1: I think that's just going to be life in developed countries,

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Speaker 1: I suppose, So, yeah, there's a reason to be flying

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Speaker 1: them around. Well.

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Speaker 2: Whether to lead us into that discussion, what are those

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Speaker 2: drones flying around New Jersey?

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Speaker 1: Here's a news report on that authorities and Toms River,

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Speaker 1: New Jersey, were launching their own drone offensive. For a

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Speaker 1: closer look right now, we just want identify what it is.

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Speaker 3: The way it was explained, they're two feet bigger than

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Speaker 3: our drones.

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Speaker 1: Or two times aside rather so they're about four feet

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Speaker 1: and it looks like it's a fixed wing type craft.

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Speaker 3: What concerns us mostly is that at this point, nobody's

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Speaker 3: seen any of these units taking off or landing. This

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Speaker 3: is a significant threat to US national security.

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Speaker 1: Retired for Star General Barry McCaffrey tells NBC News there's

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Speaker 1: good reason why local and federal agencies are treading carefully.

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Speaker 3: When you see something of this capacity, you wonder why

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Speaker 3: it would be needed. What are they doing? It implies

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Speaker 3: a heavy payload, and a heavy payload would be either

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Speaker 3: something dangerous a bomb, but in this case, surveillance of

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Speaker 3: some sort.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So how do we have really large drones flying

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Speaker 1: around major urban areas now? For is it full week

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Speaker 1: or longer? At least? Yeah? And can't nail down? Are

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Speaker 1: they Chinese? Are they Amazon? Are they? Who are they?

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Speaker 1: Here's the governor of New Jersey yesterday.

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Speaker 4: These are apparently very as I understand it, very sophisticated.

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Speaker 4: The minute you get eyes on them, they go dark.

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Speaker 4: And you know, we're obviously most concerned about sensitive targets

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Speaker 4: and sensitive critical infrastructure. So we've got military assets, we've

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Speaker 4: got utility assets, we've got the president and Alex one

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Speaker 4: of his homes here. This is something we're taking deadly seriously.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So the governor says, you're taking it deadly seriously.

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Speaker 1: A four star general in one of the cable news

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Speaker 1: channels says, this is a major threat. Here's a cyber

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Speaker 1: guy on Fox talking about it today.

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Speaker 5: Big mystery here, but it's about to get solved. I

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Speaker 5: have a feeling, but here's what we can do. We

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Speaker 5: can rule out consumer drones, the little ones you and

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Speaker 5: I can buy online and then get soaring above people's houses.

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Speaker 5: Probably not that kind, because reports say that these are

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Speaker 5: a lot larger. So what could that then narrow it

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Speaker 5: down to? Is it surveillance? Is it a foreign and

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Speaker 5: trying to surveil parts of the US. Or could it

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Speaker 5: be one of these consumer related drones from say a

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Speaker 5: company that wants to deliver packages or deliver food to

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Speaker 5: somebody's house and they're testing them out. Why the lights

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Speaker 5: go out is unusual though?

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Speaker 1: No, thanks Cyberguy, good theory. Yeah, if I'm Amazon, I say, hey,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna be trusted to testing some drones. Boy, I

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Speaker 1: got to the bottom of that one quickly. Who is

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Speaker 1: this guy and why was he on TV? Here's something

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Speaker 1: that's not freaking stupid. Somebody pointed out that there are

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Speaker 1: a handful of restricted airspace areas in the Greater Zone

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Speaker 1: where these drones have been flying, and they've been avoiding

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Speaker 1: them like they know not to go there. Interesting if

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Speaker 1: I'm some dipstick just flying drones around because I got

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Speaker 1: a new drone for an early Christmas present, I don't

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Speaker 1: know that so that would speak to perhaps some level

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Speaker 1: of sophistication. But again, if it's a legitimate source of

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Speaker 1: these flights, they would have said something wow.

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Speaker 2: So I've heard conflicting reports about the legality of this.

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Speaker 2: I heard somebody say you need to have approval from

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Speaker 2: the FAA to fly drones in urban areas of this

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Speaker 2: size or something like that, and then I've heard of

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Speaker 2: other people say there.

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Speaker 1: Are no restrictions on this, So it could be anyone.

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Speaker 1: I don't know which is true. You know, I don't

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Speaker 1: think our FAA rules are hilariously antiquated, because you know,

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Speaker 1: whether it was the Chinese spy balloon or there have

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Speaker 1: been a couple of drone related stories, the authorities just say, well,

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Speaker 1: the regulations say we can't shoot down a drone in

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Speaker 1: an urban area that somebody might get hurt, if you know,

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Speaker 1: and so we can't do anything. No, we didn't make

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Speaker 1: it the other way. We'll shoot down your drone if

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Speaker 1: we're the least bit suspicious of what's going on. A

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Speaker 1: couple of kids Christmas presents will get blown out of

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Speaker 1: the sky. They'll have learned something jack about just something.

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Speaker 1: But isn't it kind of odd that the governor of

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Speaker 1: the state. We're taking this very seriously. It's a serious concern,

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Speaker 1: and it just keeps happening. That just seems I feel

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Speaker 1: like this is going to be the way security changed

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Speaker 1: at airports my whole life. If you're old and love

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Speaker 1: you remember this your whole life. You could just go

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Speaker 1: through security with your uh, you know, your friend and

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Speaker 1: walk up to the gate and you'd hang out and

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Speaker 1: talk to them. So they got on the plane, walked off.

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Speaker 1: Then we had nine to eleven and everything never again.

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Speaker 1: That was clearly a terrible idea. We can't do that.

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Speaker 1: There's something's gonna happen with a bad a terrorist or

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Speaker 1: China or something with a drone, and then all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden, all of the rules about drones are gonna

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Speaker 1: change drastically and for the rest of our lives. But

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Speaker 1: why can't we anticipate this a little bit? I don't know,

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Speaker 1: you know, as Churchill said, you have to get attacked

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Speaker 1: then everything changes. Yeah. The other as I'm theorizing about this,

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Speaker 1: the other angle is that if I were up to

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Speaker 1: something nefarious, I would probably lie low for a while.

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Speaker 1: Now lay low, lie low because there's so much attention

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Speaker 1: on it. But what did the governor say, as soon

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Speaker 1: as you get up close to it, it turns its

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Speaker 1: lights off. I mean, yeah, the hell is that? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: No kidding? Is it a test by some evil doers

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Speaker 1: to test our reaction to drones compiling us the US

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Speaker 1: like the government? Or yeah? Yeah, is it DARPA or

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Speaker 1: something inside the Pentagon they're trying to test out to

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Speaker 1: see how. I have no idea, and they just don't

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Speaker 1: bother telling the dopey governor of New Jersey.

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Speaker 2: God dangn So the speculation that it's Amazon testing out

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Speaker 2: their package delivery systems or whatever.

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Speaker 1: I don't see how that, ever, happens to.

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Speaker 2: Where we have FedEx or Amazon delivering packages with drones

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Speaker 2: big enough to carry them around all over the sky.

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Speaker 1: I can't even imagine how that would work. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: I don't know if the math works either. Honestly, perhaps

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Speaker 1: it does. But you've got a dude in a van

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Speaker 1: delivering one hundred and seventy five packages to you know,

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Speaker 1: my neighborhood alone. That seems fairly efficient, right. And then

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Speaker 1: I've heard multiple times these are the size of cars,

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Speaker 1: then these drones, and then then I heard I think

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Speaker 1: it was a little Ainslee on Fox and Friends this morning,

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Speaker 1: said that the size of the of the front of

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Speaker 1: a car, well that's a weird measuring stick. The size

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Speaker 1: of the front of a car, well, yeah, maybe a

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Speaker 1: clown car or those little smart cars that I see

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Speaker 1: people on the interstate in those things. I think, do

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Speaker 1: you want to die just throlling yourself off a cliff

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Speaker 1: driving that little toy? But so, how big are these drones?

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Speaker 1: Are four feet across? That's pretty big something like that.

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Speaker 1: Ye Oh yeah, it's a good size drunk. But the

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Speaker 1: size of it appears to be the size of a car.

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Speaker 1: But that's the media. I mean, you got somebody down

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Speaker 1: there in their their backyard with their iPhone taking videos,

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Speaker 1: and then the news media asked them. How big did

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Speaker 1: they seem to be? Tre's the size of a car

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Speaker 1: at least? I don't know. I thought it was the

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Speaker 1: size of a bear, at least bears. You can't tell

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Speaker 1: it's night, it's up in the sky. Well, it's funny

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Speaker 1: you brought up the Chinese spy balloon because I just

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Speaker 1: went through that part of the Bob Woodward book a

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Speaker 1: while a couple of weeks ago, and man, we had

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Speaker 1: we're at all kinds of horrible, horrible reactions to that.

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Speaker 1: It disconnects between people who knew exactly what it was,

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Speaker 1: and then a whole bunch of high level officials like

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Speaker 1: governors that weren't told anything.

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Speaker 2: So I had no idea, and so we could have

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Speaker 2: that going on right now. The Pentagon might know, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: we know exactly what it is. That's why we're not

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Speaker 2: worried about it. But you don't tell the governor. I

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Speaker 2: don't know if that's fine highly classifying. Well, what's your guess,

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Speaker 2: and then we'll move on from this. What do you

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Speaker 2: think it is?

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Speaker 1: I think it will end up being very mundane whatever

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Speaker 1: the explanation is. Wow, I hope I'm right. I don't

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Speaker 1: have high level of certainty on my theory. Hmm. Maybe

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Speaker 1: it depends on your definition of mundane. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if it can be mundane to have drones of size

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Speaker 1: flying all over the place. It's either something that we're

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Speaker 1: going to be okay with or decide is absolutely illegal

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Speaker 1: and they got to be shot out of the sky

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Speaker 1: because you can't. You can't have if China did have

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Speaker 1: a four foot drone flying over an urban area, you

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Speaker 1: can't just wait and see what happens. No, you shoot

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Speaker 1: it down immediately. Yes, Michael, you don't think this is

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Speaker 1: a promotion for a new movie of some sort, Oh

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Speaker 1: my god. Or it could just be the Garden State

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Speaker 1: Drone Club and they just don't watch a lot of

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Speaker 1: TVs so they don't understand the angst that they're causing.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. You're right, Michael, Tom Cruise in Drone Wars.

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you this, though, I'm going to put a

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Speaker 1: heavy end to this lighthearted discussion. You remember post nine

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Speaker 1: to eleven that there was a great deal of talk

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Speaker 1: about failing to connect the dots. And the dots were many,

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Speaker 1: and they were unmistakable, and it was more or less

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Speaker 1: astounding that any adults, much less those in positions of

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Speaker 1: importance an authority, could miss the clues. But they did.

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Speaker 1: When the day when the Eggfu Young hits the fan

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Speaker 1: and China unleashes some serious evil doing on the homeland,

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Speaker 1: the dots are going to be just everywhere, all the time,

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Speaker 1: every drone, you know, sighting, every you know power plant

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Speaker 1: that went down, mysterious hacking into our phone system, all

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Speaker 1: the hacks, all the spies on all the college campus.

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Speaker 1: In retrospect, it's going to be it. How stupid are we?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 1: Very very is the answer.

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Speaker 2: They surveilled these with drones for four years, turns out,

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Speaker 2: and you know that sort of thing.

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Speaker 1: You're right, You're probably right. Tell you what, some Chinese

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Speaker 1: national gets busted for spying, and anybody says anything about

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Speaker 1: racism or anti Chinese bias. Put that person in the

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Speaker 1: cell next to them, because they are at the very

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Speaker 1: least a comm simp as we used to call him

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Speaker 1: back in the Cold War days, a communist sympathizer, Pinko

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Speaker 1: A fellow traveler, did I tell you what again again?

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Speaker 1: When the egg flu young hits the fan, there's gonna

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Speaker 1: be no more playing. I love it when Joe Getty

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Speaker 1: goes Joe McCarthy. I love that. I love your comm

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Speaker 1: simp talk. I would never impugne anybody innocent though, no,

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Speaker 1: of course not. That's good stuff. There have a little

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Speaker 1: ran grab that one, Hans and I might want to

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Speaker 1: listen to that one on the way on sick. So

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Speaker 1: the over educated, rich progressive guy who tried, who murdered

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Speaker 1: that healthcare executive, everything's out about him and he is.

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Speaker 1: He's Ted Kazinski Junior is the unibommer junior.

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Speaker 2: Well, yeah, he actually spent a lot of time reading

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Speaker 2: the Ted Kaczinski Manifesto and even commented on it online

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Speaker 2: and liking it as a book.

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Speaker 1: A lot of stuff on the way. Stay here in Russia.

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Speaker 1: You know what that means. Nobody's home at the palace.

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Speaker 6: It's open house people the estate sail begins. Crowds are

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Speaker 6: pillaging the palace. They are sitting in his chairs, they

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Speaker 6: are taking pictures and his ship there. They're stealing more chairs.

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Speaker 6: He was there some kind of terrible seating.

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Speaker 1: Problem in this country.

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Speaker 6: But people are rushing the palace and they're just taking

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Speaker 6: the chairs. People are coming out like, don't bother going in.

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Speaker 6: The good chairs are gone. All that's left is money,

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Speaker 6: jewelry and antiquities.

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Speaker 1: The lighters say in the side of the Fall of

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Speaker 1: the Assad regime. We got more on that later, the

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Speaker 1: funny stuff and the serious stuff for you and the

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Speaker 1: United Healthcare CEO. Shooter Scumbag came from the incubator of

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Speaker 1: so many bad young ideas, America's elite college system. More

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Speaker 1: on his background, Stay with us.

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Speaker 2: Say this is about Trump from the Wall Street Journal,

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Speaker 2: And if you're Trump fan, you're gonna like it. If

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Speaker 2: you're Trump hater, I think you should listen to it,

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Speaker 2: because I think it's pretty interesting, analysis Gerald Baker in

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Speaker 2: his Wall Street Journal column Today, In record time, Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump has assembled the most diverse team to help him

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Speaker 2: execute the prietaries of the administration any president elect has

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Speaker 2: chosen in modern history. By diverse, I don't mean according

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Speaker 2: to the mandates of DEI commissars, whose brief weird tyranny

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Speaker 2: is thankfully coming to an end. Though even by these standards,

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Speaker 2: mister Trump is quite the progressive, having picked, among others,

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Speaker 2: by my count, three Hindus, that'd be Tulsi Gabbard, Cashptel

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Speaker 2: and Vivic Vivike Ramaswami, a pair of a Sponics, Hispanics

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Speaker 2: Marco Rubio and Laurie Chebez de Rummer, the first female who.

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Speaker 1: Waits to go immediately put back to you.

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Speaker 2: The first female White House Chief of Staff Susie Wilds,

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Speaker 2: and the highest ranking openly gay man in the official

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Speaker 2: Order of Presidential succession, Scott best Best It.

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Speaker 1: I didn't notice, so that is fairly diverse, as if

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Speaker 1: anyone who cares. I don't.

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Speaker 2: By diversity, I mean, writes the Wall Street Journal that

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Speaker 2: the most valuable sort of diversity of ideology and belief,

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Speaker 2: Trump too, will encompass, if all goes according to denomination plans,

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Speaker 2: a compound of contemporary political denominations traditional conservatives, national populists, libertarians, Democrats,

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Speaker 2: foreign policy hawks and doves, and many others. If you're

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Speaker 2: an optimist, you will see in this a ministry of

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Speaker 2: all the talents, the convening of a broad church that

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Speaker 2: reflects the dynamic pluralism America, pluralism of America. If you're

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Speaker 2: a pessimist, you might worry that it will turn out

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Speaker 2: to have all the efficiency and unity of purpose of

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Speaker 2: a first grade field trip.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. He hints that maybe, uh, you get appointed if

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Speaker 1: you kiss Donald Trump's butt, no matter what your ideology is,

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Speaker 1: and that it may be a government by whim. But

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Speaker 1: at the same time, group think is no good. And

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Speaker 1: if Trump up against like this labor secretary gal, she

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Speaker 1: has got to go right away the Senate, I hope

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Speaker 1: will punt her halfway to Pennsylvania. But you know, if

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Speaker 1: you don't execute Trump's, you know, his vision for the country,

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Speaker 1: he'll get rid of you. Oh right, It's not like

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Speaker 1: you're gonna tell him what to do. He does whatever

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Speaker 1: he wants to do. Yeah, so, yeah, there's some odd

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Speaker 1: choices there, but yeah, that's one take diversity of opinion.

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Speaker 1: I like it.

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Speaker 2: But if you're a Democrat and you come up with

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Speaker 2: a cabinet like that of advisors, you're doing the whole

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Speaker 2: Lincoln Team of Rivals thing. If you're Trump and you

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Speaker 2: do it, you're just a whack job. If you're a

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Speaker 2: Democrat and you appoint somebody who's Indian American, it's the

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Speaker 2: first Indian American person that's ever been the first whatever,

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Speaker 2: blah blah blah. If you're Trump, it's just you pick

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Speaker 2: out what's wrong with this person and forget the fact

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Speaker 2: that they're Indian.

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Speaker 1: He's an idiot who shouldn't be in the job, right,

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Speaker 1: Sure you need to know about that person. Yeah, they're

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Speaker 1: utterly dishonest, which is why they're dying once again.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so turn out, yet another overly educated rich kid

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Speaker 2: does something heinous and in this case, shot the CEO

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Speaker 2: of United Healthcare.

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Speaker 1: They caught the guy yesterday. His background really interesting in

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Speaker 1: revealing stay with us Armstrong and Getty.

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Speaker 7: It starts off basically with an apology saying, you know,

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Speaker 7: I do apologize for any strife or trauma, but it

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Speaker 7: had to be done. It talks about these parasites had

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Speaker 7: it coming. And within the document before kind of the

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Speaker 7: latter part of the document where he rails against the

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Speaker 7: healthcare industry, he talks about he acted alone and was

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Speaker 7: self financed. Now there's a question why does this document exist?

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Speaker 7: You know, people say, well, maybe he wanted to be caught.

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Speaker 7: He had the gun, he had the document. There is

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Speaker 7: another point of view, which is that he was planning

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Speaker 7: to strike again, maybe at some other executive or target,

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Speaker 7: and that the manifesto was either going to be left

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Speaker 7: or sent to police or sent to the media.

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Speaker 1: Or both are true. That's John Miller on CNN.

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Speaker 2: I'm talking about the nutjob killer that got apprehended at

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Speaker 2: the McDonald's in Altoona, Pennsylvania yesterday. He killed that poor

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Speaker 2: CEO of United Healthcare. So this job kid was reading

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Speaker 2: the unibomber's manifesto online, actually reviewing it on a couple

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Speaker 2: of different websites and liking it, which would lead me

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Speaker 2: to believe absolutely he was planning on striking it. He

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Speaker 2: thought he was going to be I assume like a

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Speaker 2: unibomber guy that everybody wondered where he was for years

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Speaker 2: as he got to go around the country being a

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Speaker 2: evil Robin Hood.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 1: There were several aspects of the whole thing, is it

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Speaker 1: unfolded that made me think either he wanted to be

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Speaker 1: caught or he because I'm going to refer to him

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Speaker 1: as a self important twit because that's what he is.

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Speaker 1: Who thought he was he was the guy who knew

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Speaker 1: so much and understood so much and was so righteous

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Speaker 1: a purpose he gets to kill people to change the world.

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Speaker 1: Just incredible hubris. But yeah, he wants to be known

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Speaker 1: as the hero he sees himself to be for all

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Speaker 1: of his back problems and you know, he had probably

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Speaker 1: problems with the insurance companies or was on pills. I

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Speaker 1: don't even know all this stuff, but I just think

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Speaker 1: it's as Noah Rothman of the National Review put it.

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Speaker 1: Who could have imagined that the alleged murderer whose violence

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Speaker 1: was being celebrated by a lot of two online over

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Speaker 1: educated white leftists would turn out to be a too online,

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Speaker 1: over educated white leftist. Sure he was the Carl Marxian

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Speaker 1: rich kid who fancied themselves as the savior of something

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Speaker 1: or other, became radicalized, and once you become radicalized. We

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Speaker 1: were talking about this early in the show. It's it's

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Speaker 1: almost like falling love or being really really angry. Your

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Speaker 1: capacity to make rational decisions just goes away. And that's

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Speaker 1: why you know, people who are very smart do and

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Speaker 1: say idiot things. They're blinded by their their activism. If

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Speaker 1: he was planning on.

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Speaker 2: Making this a career, at least for a little while,

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Speaker 2: you would think you wouldn't have gone into a Starbucks

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Speaker 2: the day before, and I've been unaware of the fact

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Speaker 2: that you're on camera everywhere you go, and then gone

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Speaker 2: into a McDonald's after the murderer.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I would not be going into McDonald's and sitting

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Speaker 1: there maskless and munching on my egg McMuffin, right if

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Speaker 1: I wanted to elude capture. I don't know anyway. In

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Speaker 1: reviewing the Unibomber's screed, he said, quote, ye had the

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Speaker 1: balls to recognize that peaceful protest has gotten us absolutely nowhere,

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Speaker 1: and at the end of the day, he's probably right.

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Speaker 1: When all other forms of communication fail, violence is necessary

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Speaker 1: to survive. You may not like his methods, but to

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Speaker 1: see things from his perspective, it's not terrorism, it's war

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Speaker 1: and revolution. That's interesting.

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Speaker 2: I live in the town where the unibomber struck and

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Speaker 2: killed and hurt people. Actually, the university and the un

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Speaker 2: obomber accomplished nothing. Dude, you don't know You've got that

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Speaker 2: out by watching he accomplish nothing.

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Speaker 1: Right, so insurance companies to engage in some abuses. Therefore,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to blow a bunch of people's fingers off,

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Speaker 1: like the unibomber killed a couple, right, or like this

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Speaker 1: guy going to shoot down a guy. What do you

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Speaker 1: think You're notited? Healthcare is going to go away now?

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Speaker 1: Or are they going to hire another CEO is going

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Speaker 1: to do roughly the same things, you stupid, self important moron.

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Speaker 1: I hate to say this because I don't like it

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Speaker 1: to be true at all, but I've heard a lot

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Speaker 1: of conversations about healthcare costs, insurance, what's fair, what's not fair? Etc.

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Speaker 1: Since the shooting. Well, it's like we've said many times

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Speaker 1: about the school shooters, who their grievances. The networks deal

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Speaker 1: with them is I tell you what you can buy

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Speaker 1: our attention with blood. You've got to give me a

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Speaker 1: lot of victims, you got to give me a lot

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Speaker 1: of horror. And if you do I will read your

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Speaker 1: complaint to America and this is the same thing, and I,

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't want to participate in it. But

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Speaker 1: so this guy went to Williams College, which well, he

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Speaker 1: went to a forty thousand dollars year prep school for

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Speaker 1: like half a dozen years, came from real money. And

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Speaker 1: then he goes to Williams College, which is a very

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Speaker 1: very exclusive, very well thought of quote unquote Ivy League

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Speaker 1: college where I actually know a guy who's a graduate

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Speaker 1: of it. But he's very sane too. Of course he's

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Speaker 1: not this generation. But one of my favorite online Twitter

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Speaker 1: accounts was quoted an account by a Williams College student

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Speaker 1: of his time at the country's top ranked liberal arts college,

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Speaker 1: and it was just it was actually pre George Floyd.

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Speaker 1: It was after Trayvon Martin and everything. Kid says, I

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Speaker 1: went to Williams for a year before transferring because it

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Speaker 1: was so bad. I became severely depressed. It's worse than

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Speaker 1: you can imagine. Literally every single class I took, everyone

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Speaker 1: had an anti white, anti Christian professor and agenda. Apart

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Speaker 1: from the anti white agenda in the entire curriculum, it

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Speaker 1: seeped through the general discourse. An atmosphere on campus as well.

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Speaker 1: There was a gigantic mural of Trayvon Martin hung in

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Speaker 1: the student center. Despite the school bending over backwards to

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Speaker 1: accommodate every single brown person's desire, they still felt oppressed

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Speaker 1: and launched a police brutality campaign against our campus security officers,

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Speaker 1: claiming they were being harassed and abused by these half asleep,

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Speaker 1: fat seventy year olds. And then it goes into just

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Speaker 1: the student activism, which was completely over the top. They

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Speaker 1: were in like the most woke place on earth. But

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Speaker 1: they formed this Coalition against Racism that published a list

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Speaker 1: of demands that our president immediately in act lest she

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Speaker 1: be branded as a racist. It was beyond parody. Everything

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Speaker 1: I'm about to list is one hundred percent true. And

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Speaker 1: this is where this guy went to college. They wanted this,

432
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:58,600
Speaker 1: their Coalition against Racism wanted their own self segregated living

433
00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:01,919
Speaker 1: space on campus, demand too, the school to pay for

434
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:07,640
Speaker 1: it and do their laundry for them. Three free transportation

435
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 1: in New York or Boston every weekend to escape the

436
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 1: pervasive culture of whiteness on campus. Oh my god. Again,

437
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 1: this is not parody. O my god. A special division

438
00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 1: of the school's counseling center comprised only of minority counselors

439
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:23,080
Speaker 1: who could better understand their troubles. I would like to

440
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:28,040
Speaker 1: I would like to revisit the laundry one who doesn't

441
00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:32,239
Speaker 1: want that light starts please, like I'd like to not

442
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,120
Speaker 1: have to do menial tasks. It is my right as

443
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:39,879
Speaker 1: a progressive right. And finally they demanded all minority faculty

444
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 1: receiver rays. This petition received hundreds of signatures from both

445
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:49,680
Speaker 1: students and faculty, and then he went He talks about

446
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:54,240
Speaker 1: trying to join a Republican club and how it was

447
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 1: just so ugly. Incident after incident, protest after protest again

448
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 1: in the most woke place on Earth. It goes on

449
00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 1: and on and on. They had to take a difference,

450
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,359
Speaker 1: Power and Equity course, which was a end to end

451
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,679
Speaker 1: f you at all the white people on campus. So

452
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,080
Speaker 1: in conclusion, I want to say this, our elite colleges

453
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:16,159
Speaker 1: are totally irreparably ft. This is a school that is

454
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: ranked number one of the country and is on par

455
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: with Princeton Harvard, and I'm sure much of the same

456
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:23,119
Speaker 1: as occurring. The anti white propaganda is totally all consuming,

457
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,560
Speaker 1: and so you get the kids like this the shooter

458
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:30,200
Speaker 1: who is a white guy, and I'm not going to

459
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 1: blame you know, his college or the university for turning

460
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:35,399
Speaker 1: him into what he was and what he did. But

461
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 1: if you look at all these these idiot screeching women

462
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,600
Speaker 1: on the quad, wearing their cafeas and demonstrating in favor

463
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 1: of Islamis terrorists who would murder them in an instant

464
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: for opening their mouths about anything, or stepping out without

465
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:57,360
Speaker 1: a male relative or whatever, you realize this college insanity

466
00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:59,920
Speaker 1: is having effect. So you got this white kid who

467
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 1: he goes through four years of this and he becomes

468
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,919
Speaker 1: completely convinced he's got to be a brave revolutionary in

469
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,919
Speaker 1: the name of progressivism to wash himself of his whiteness

470
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 1: or something like that.

471
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 2: Right, Just nuts different aspect of the manhunt and murder

472
00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 2: the gun. First of all, several things that the police

473
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 2: released as facts about the gun turned out to not

474
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 2: be true. So just let's all remind yourselves once again,

475
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,160
Speaker 2: everything you hear in the first couple of days after

476
00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 2: a big shooting or.

477
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:37,040
Speaker 1: Whatever, it's a coin flip here, it's accurate.

478
00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 2: I'm not even sure there's any point in paying attention

479
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:40,720
Speaker 2: to these stories in the first couple of days. There's

480
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 2: so many things flying around that aren't true. But it

481
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,440
Speaker 2: was one of those guns he assemble with parts that's

482
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:48,480
Speaker 2: got no serial number, not registered anywhere.

483
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:51,160
Speaker 1: I don't I'm a pro gun guy. I'm a Second

484
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,399
Speaker 1: Amendment guy. But I've got a buddy who's a he

485
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 1: calls himself a gun nut. I mean, he's got lots

486
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:59,840
Speaker 1: of different kinds of very crazy weapons. I don't know

487
00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:02,640
Speaker 1: what he's preparing for, but he's always telling me about how, yeah,

488
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:04,840
Speaker 1: you can order that even in California. You can order

489
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,000
Speaker 1: all these different parts and put together all kinds of

490
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 1: guns that uh, not a chance you could buy them

491
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:15,159
Speaker 1: assembled in California or most places. What is it with

492
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,679
Speaker 1: our laws on that is? What is that all about?

493
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 1: You can buy it's just an effort and it's slow

494
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:22,120
Speaker 1: you down. And it's not like they're hard to put together.

495
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:23,480
Speaker 1: It's not like you have to be some sort of

496
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 1: blacksmith or something. They screw together. You put this in,

497
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:27,440
Speaker 1: you put a screw, and all of a sudden you've

498
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:32,960
Speaker 1: got a crazy, deadly weapon that we've decided as a

499
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 1: society should be illegal.

500
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:36,560
Speaker 2: But if you buy the part separately and put it together.

501
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:39,119
Speaker 2: You can have it unregistered, nobody knows you have it,

502
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:39,800
Speaker 2: there's no way.

503
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:41,240
Speaker 1: To trace it. Mm hmm.

504
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 2: Now I'm not I don't know where I stand on that,

505
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:45,199
Speaker 2: but I just think it's an interesting aspect of the

506
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:45,800
Speaker 2: whole gum thing.

507
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:49,879
Speaker 1: Yeah again, I think they just want to put up

508
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: a hurdle or two to discourage people from doing it. Yeah, well,

509
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:58,560
Speaker 1: the people that want that kind of thing, you've figured

510
00:27:58,560 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 1: it out.

511
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, but this kid had a plastic gun, no serial

512
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:05,560
Speaker 2: number whatsoever, no way to know that he had it

513
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 2: and and used it to murder this dude.

514
00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:13,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, and a suppressor. But you know, again, there's something

515
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 1: and this is typical of this sort of would be

516
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 1: self aggrandizing, anti hero type guy. You would, if you

517
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 1: were sane, you would get rid of everything connected to

518
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: the crime, certainly the gun. If you can three D

519
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,480
Speaker 1: print a gun, then get the hell rid of it

520
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:34,159
Speaker 1: and make another one later down the road. You've got

521
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 1: all of the accessory or what's the You've got all

522
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 1: of the evidence of your crime with you atting in

523
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,360
Speaker 1: public at a McDonald's right. The fact that you didn't

524
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 1: get rid of the gun immediately after the murder.

525
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 2: Have you seen the godfather, you drop it, you walk out.

526
00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:51,000
Speaker 2: The fact that he didn't get rid of the gun

527
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 2: after the murder. You didn't even spash it somewhere while

528
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 2: you go in the McDonald's. You didn't, like, I'll hide

529
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,479
Speaker 2: it over here behind the bush and going the you

530
00:28:58,520 --> 00:28:59,240
Speaker 2: just have it with you.

531
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:03,000
Speaker 1: That's interesting. Yeah, yeah, that's one word. He's some level

532
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 1: of pretty unhinged. Yeah. Yeah, again, whether ideologically or like

533
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: has psychosis or something. I think it's probably just ideology.

534
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: He's valedictorian of his super fancy school, got any master's

535
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 1: degree in computer science and that sort of thing mathematics.

536
00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 1: So not a dumb guy. Oh no, no, not at all.

537
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 1: The relationship between intelligence and wisdom is random. Seems to be, yes,

538
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 1: seems to be, at least in some cases. But again,

539
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:42,920
Speaker 1: ideology is it's like falling in love. The rational faculties

540
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,320
Speaker 1: get shut down for a while. They're overwhelmed.

541
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 2: Learned something about Syria yesterday, I didn't know. I'll have

542
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 2: to get to that at some point. That continues to

543
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 2: be a hell of an interesting story. We have nine

544
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:58,440
Speaker 2: hundred troops there and got to figure that out. Bunch

545
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:00,000
Speaker 2: of stuff on the way. I hope you can stay here,

546
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:03,160
Speaker 2: Armstrong and Getty.

547
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:06,720
Speaker 8: All these kids. They love the nineties, big nineties trends.

548
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 8: You love the nineties so much. Go away for the bus.

549
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,720
Speaker 8: Go away for the bus and no cell phone. Look

550
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:14,000
Speaker 8: at your feet for ten minutes and look up at

551
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 8: the tree. Yeah, your boy, go look at your feet again.

552
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 8: What else are you gonna do? You're gonna take a rock,

553
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:21,800
Speaker 8: throw at a stop sign for twenty five minutes.

554
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:23,960
Speaker 1: You love the nineties so much, You got.

555
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 8: You then go wait, go sit after soccer practice and

556
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 8: your mom is like when the coach took all the balls.

557
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:31,040
Speaker 1: Sit there, just kind of look at your fet a

558
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 1: little bit.

559
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 8: Look back at the goalposts that's the un occur maybe,

560
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 8: and look up at the fence.

561
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: He loved the ninety so much. Yeah, he precently liked

562
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 1: to talk about that more. Yeah. He presents it as

563
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: kind of like it's awful. It's good. It was good

564
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:47,720
Speaker 1: for all of us, it was good for everybody. Stare

565
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 1: at your feet for a couple of minutes while you

566
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:51,920
Speaker 1: wait for the bus. Yeah, I'll give you a very

567
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 1: short version of my my manifesto. Human beings are designed

568
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 1: for that. You take in a certain amount of input

569
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:03,000
Speaker 1: and you spend the rest of your time filing it,

570
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 1: comparing it to other things you've learned, memorizing it, coming

571
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: up with jokes about it. Not constant input. That is

572
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 1: a recipe to make you insane, speak of insane. I impugned, Well,

573
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 1: not really. This guy, the shooter did not go to Williams.

574
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 1: He went to Penn. And the point of the article is,

575
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 1: this is the Ivy League atmosphere. For instance, this student

576
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 1: from Williams who talked about it, but Penn very similar.

577
00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 1: So anyway, I impugned Williams in a way even as

578
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 1: I was impugning them intentionally.

579
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 2: So we're talking about the big drones that are flying

580
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,040
Speaker 2: over New Jersey and nobody knows what they are, and

581
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 2: the Governor's worried and everything, and just what the hell's

582
00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 2: going on there? We got this text I thought was

583
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,200
Speaker 2: kind of interesting all the way around. On it read

584
00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 2: the drones. I work in the security industry. I won't

585
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 2: get into the specifics, but the FAA requires all drones.

586
00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 1: All drones to be registered in the operator must have

587
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 1: a certificate to operate the drone anywhere in the United States. Well,

588
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: there's got to be a size limit, because we've all

589
00:31:56,840 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 1: had bought our children little tiny drones for Christmas or whatever.

590
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 1: And I sign no certificate and registered with no one,

591
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,640
Speaker 1: So there must be some size requirement. I hope the

592
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: FBI visits your house later today. At work, we have

593
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: radar that is able to get you, like your mar

594
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 1: Lagosa going. How many of you knew this. We have

595
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 1: radar that is able to detect drones all over They

596
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:22,280
Speaker 1: mentioned the county we live. We're in broadcasting from right now.

597
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 2: All commercial drones broadcast a distinct serial number that is

598
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 2: registered with the FAA, much like a tail number for

599
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 2: an airplane. If a drone flies over any of the

600
00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 2: infrastructure we monitor, we can see the flight paths, serial number,

601
00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 2: and registered owner of the drone immediately. I guarantee that

602
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 2: if the drones flying over the sensitive infrastructure are commercial,

603
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,080
Speaker 2: the government and the authorities already know who owns them.

604
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 2: If the drones are not registered, or they are being

605
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 2: operated by a foreign entity, and yes, that is a

606
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:50,640
Speaker 2: serious threat. So it sounds like it's one of the other.

607
00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 2: It's either, well, obs, we know who this is, and

608
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 2: here's why we're not worried about it. But that's the

609
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 2: governor doesn't know why wouldn't they tell the governor.

610
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 1: I would think there is given the level of concern that,

611
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: like the governor expressed, they would find a way to

612
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 1: track one of the drones to its landing place. But

613
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 1: that hasn't happened yet. This is odd. I hope it's

614
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,479
Speaker 1: all because it's DARPA and we're trying something out and

615
00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:21,240
Speaker 1: it's not because it's like the Chinese balloon thing. They

616
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:25,600
Speaker 1: freaking sent a spy balloon across the country. That's absolutely

617
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:28,840
Speaker 1: one percent what they were doing. Yeah, and we just like,

618
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 1: I don't know what to do. For a long long time,

619
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: A long time Trump, for all his faults, would have

620
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 1: known what to do. I hope we're not doing that

621
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,120
Speaker 1: right now. Which depart which agency should be dealing with this?

622
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. You think we ought to shoot it down? Well,

623
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 1: if somebody gets hurt.

624
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 2: And all the while China just continues to test our

625
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:47,880
Speaker 2: systems or.

626
00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,480
Speaker 1: Spy or whatever she's in paying saying, can you but

627
00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,160
Speaker 1: believe how stupid these people aren't they just do anything?

628
00:33:56,040 --> 00:34:00,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I want to talk a little bit about Syria.

629
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 2: This book, it was one of the top books of

630
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,440
Speaker 2: the year according to everybody who does that sort of

631
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:06,960
Speaker 2: thing about Araq.

632
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 1: It's called the Achilles trap. Satim was saying the ci

633
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,239
Speaker 1: and the origins of America's invasion of Iraq, and I thought,

634
00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:13,839
Speaker 1: do I want to get you know, re get into

635
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,720
Speaker 1: a rack. But it's all, it's all, it's all the same,

636
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:19,359
Speaker 1: you know, a Raq, Syria, Afghanistan. So many of these

637
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 1: countries are the same sort of thing. And our involvement

638
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,279
Speaker 1: was the same sort of thing with the same sort

639
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 1: of results. So there's a lot of sameness to it.

640
00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 1: But and these evil regimes all have exactly the same playbook,

641
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:38,799
Speaker 1: exactly the way they treat prisoners and demand loyalty and

642
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:41,560
Speaker 1: stuff like that. All it's it's like, well, it's like

643
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 1: there's a dictator's handbook. Yeah, yeah, there is more or.

644
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 2: Less, and it's gruesome at the very bottom of it.

645
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:52,879
Speaker 2: Also a little bit on the new guy, the new

646
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:57,600
Speaker 2: rebel leader. Can we believe what he's saying about pluralism or.

647
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 1: Is he uh just fooling us? All for the time being,

648
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Speaker 1: wait and see provide incentives and disincentives to whatever extent

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Speaker 1: we can and hope for the best. But I get

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Speaker 1: involved involved, No, No, you don't want to. The United

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Speaker 1: States involved only. Like I described, provide incentives and disincentives

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Speaker 1: as is appropriate. Yeah. Interesting, We got a lot more

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Speaker 1: on that if you missed now I get the podcast

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Speaker 1: Armstrong and Getty on demand Armstrong and Getty