WEBVTT - What are blue laws? 0:00:01.480 --> 0:00:04.280 Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of I 0:00:04.360 --> 0:00:13.119 Heart Radio. Hey you, and welcome to the podcast. I'm 0:00:13.200 --> 0:00:16.120 Josh Clark, and there's Charles W Chuck Bryant, and of 0:00:16.160 --> 0:00:20.840 course the Greatest the Goat Jerry is with us as well. 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:25.280 It's just a quietly lurking in the background, the Greatest Goat, HM, 0:00:26.280 --> 0:00:32.800 the Greatest. How you doing, I'm doing good, Chuck, I'm 0:00:32.920 --> 0:00:35.199 I'm a little This was one of your picks, but 0:00:35.240 --> 0:00:38.160 I think I might be a little more enthusiastic about 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:41.280 this one than you. Why do you say that? Because 0:00:41.320 --> 0:00:44.080 I said this is boring, they fully recorded a little 0:00:44.120 --> 0:00:45.920 bit that may have something to do with it, and 0:00:45.960 --> 0:00:48.400 then me saying, oh, no, I think it's pretty interesting. 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:51.080 Oh I don't think it's really that boring. And it 0:00:51.159 --> 0:00:54.840 was my pick, um, Yeah, what made you choose that? Well, 0:00:54.880 --> 0:00:57.880 I mean we're talking about blue laws, and just very quickly, 0:00:57.920 --> 0:01:02.160 blue laws are our laws from ancient times that have 0:01:02.240 --> 0:01:05.840 carried over still in some places to modern day America 0:01:06.080 --> 0:01:09.440 and other countries as well. I guess that restrict certain 0:01:09.480 --> 0:01:12.839 activities on certain days. But generally in the United States, 0:01:12.840 --> 0:01:15.440 we think of blue laws are things that you can't 0:01:15.440 --> 0:01:19.560 do on Sundays a lot of time. Their vices like 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:22.240 you can't drink or buy alcohol until sometimes at all, 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:27.000 or until certain times, or maybe restrict working or gambling 0:01:27.200 --> 0:01:30.640 or you know, just various things. But uh, we had 0:01:30.680 --> 0:01:33.720 our own blue law, one blue law at least on 0:01:33.760 --> 0:01:35.720 the books in Georgia until just a few years ago, 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:40.240 you could not buy alcohol on Sunday at all. Yeah. 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:43.480 I think Georgia was the last state to repeal a 0:01:43.560 --> 0:01:48.040 full Sunday prohibition on buying alcohol full prohibition. But then 0:01:49.080 --> 0:01:52.840 I mean it passed by a ridiculous measure, something like 0:01:55.360 --> 0:01:58.040 but you still can't buy booze before I think noon 0:01:58.240 --> 0:02:02.040 on Sunday. And that's weird. And it seems like if 0:02:02.080 --> 0:02:04.840 you step back, if you were an alien, let's say, right, 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:08.799 and you came down and you're like, that's a great way. 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:11.799 So let's say you're work from work, right, Okay, that's 0:02:11.800 --> 0:02:14.720 what you just reminded me of. And you show up 0:02:14.720 --> 0:02:18.160 with your super cool block color puffy vest and you say, 0:02:18.200 --> 0:02:21.239 I want to familiarize myself with laws. This would makes sense. 0:02:21.320 --> 0:02:24.880 This makes sense. What you can't buy alcohol before noon 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:27.840 on Sunday, So that doesn't make any sense. That was 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:33.080 my impression of mark Um. If he dug a little deeper, 0:02:33.120 --> 0:02:35.480 it would become obvious that it makes a ton of 0:02:35.480 --> 0:02:38.080 sense if you're coming at it from the vantage point 0:02:38.160 --> 0:02:43.799 of a Christian in the Western hemisphere who observes Sunday 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:49.560 as the day of um worship and rest. Right outside 0:02:49.560 --> 0:02:51.760 of that context, it doesn't make sense. And there in 0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:54.960 lies the rub. There's the big push and pull between 0:02:55.040 --> 0:02:58.720 people who are like America is founded essentially on the 0:02:58.760 --> 0:03:02.160 idea and promise the separation of church and state. We're 0:03:02.160 --> 0:03:04.200 supposed to keep those two separate, So we shouldn't have 0:03:04.240 --> 0:03:08.600 the state making laws that enthusiastically support one of the 0:03:08.639 --> 0:03:13.640 tenets of this one particular church Christianity, which is you 0:03:13.639 --> 0:03:15.440 should not be doing a whole lot of stuff on 0:03:15.480 --> 0:03:19.040 Sunday and you should probably be going to church. And 0:03:19.080 --> 0:03:21.000 other people who say no, no, that's it's actually a 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:22.960 really really good thing to do. This even if you 0:03:23.000 --> 0:03:25.360 don't believe in religion, even if you don't go to church, 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:30.240 blue laws actually still help us out right. There have 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:32.880 been arguments, including as we will learn, all the way 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:36.640 up to the Supreme Court, that say, well, it may 0:03:36.680 --> 0:03:41.680 have started religious, but there are many secular benefits two, um, 0:03:41.720 --> 0:03:45.160 sort of forcing families to all be off work on 0:03:45.200 --> 0:03:50.360 the same day at gunpoint, go play together, right, take 0:03:50.400 --> 0:03:53.560 a walk. So I propose we talked about the history 0:03:53.560 --> 0:03:55.920 of blue laws first and then kind of get into 0:03:55.960 --> 0:03:58.720 some of the wackier ones and then talk about legality 0:03:58.920 --> 0:04:01.120 and so on, and so you could call what I'm 0:04:01.160 --> 0:04:03.520 doing now the table of contents? Do you agree to 0:04:03.560 --> 0:04:06.680 this table of contents? Uh? So? Are you saying you 0:04:06.680 --> 0:04:09.920 want to skip ahead to the where did blue laws 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:13.280 come from? That is my proposal. Okay, I love you 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:18.159 springing this stuff on me. I am flexible, though I 0:04:18.240 --> 0:04:22.400 know nimble, I know crazy. All I have to do 0:04:22.520 --> 0:04:26.719 is shuffle some paper. Okay, you're eighteen. I mean it 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:29.839 makes sense because, yeah, if you are an outside observer, 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:32.560 even if you're an inside observer, you might not realize 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:37.160 how ancient that the Blue laws are and that they actually, um, 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:44.440 conceivably they don't necessarily predate Christianity, but they weren't necessarily Um, 0:04:44.560 --> 0:04:48.080 they're pretty old. How about that? Well? Yeah, I mean, 0:04:48.160 --> 0:04:50.120 anyone who grew up going to church knows about the 0:04:50.160 --> 0:04:53.600 ten Commandments and knows that that fourth commandment says, remember 0:04:53.640 --> 0:04:56.600 the Sabbath day to keep it holy or and keep 0:04:56.640 --> 0:05:00.159 it holy. And depending on what religion you are, that 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:04.600 could be a different day. Judaism Saturday. If your Seventh 0:05:04.640 --> 0:05:08.760 day Adventist, that's Saturday. But Christianity at a certain point 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:12.320 between the second and fifth centuries were like, yeah, you know, 0:05:12.480 --> 0:05:16.280 let's distance ourselves from Judaism and let's move our day 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:20.800 to Sunday. Uh that way we can have our own day. 0:05:20.920 --> 0:05:25.160 We can tell everybody they're observing the wrong day, and 0:05:25.279 --> 0:05:29.680 it's a win win. Yeah. There's also, um the knock 0:05:29.720 --> 0:05:33.760 on effect of taking over Sunday from the Pagans who 0:05:34.040 --> 0:05:40.599 um observed Sunday as the day to worship the Sun Sunday. 0:05:40.680 --> 0:05:44.279 So it was basically total and complete encroachment and actually 0:05:44.320 --> 0:05:47.880 moving the day, the Sabbath day to Sunday. That that 0:05:47.960 --> 0:05:51.320 caused that. It's pretty pretty interesting. I hadn't known that before, 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.599 and it's it's so, let's so now we have like 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:58.080 the Christians saying, okay, everybody change the plans like that 0:05:58.120 --> 0:06:02.040 guy on the Fidelity commercial change plants. I haven't seen that. 0:06:02.080 --> 0:06:04.479 Oh man, it sounds like a Bond villain. It's crazy. 0:06:05.040 --> 0:06:10.400 Uh So, So the point was that the Christians said okay, everybody, 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:13.200 the Sabbath is now on Sunday. And then they followed 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:19.160 that up with really enforcing that that originally Jewish um tenant, 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:22.839 which was like basically, observe a day of rest and 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:26.680 worship on the Sabbath and don't do anything else. Right, 0:06:27.000 --> 0:06:30.560 And um, we don't know exactly when the first laws 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:33.320 were enacted, but it could have been. And this is 0:06:33.360 --> 0:06:35.760 the grabster that helped put this one together for us. 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:39.240 So thanks to add for that. But uh, possibly in 0:06:39.279 --> 0:06:44.760 three sixty three, a d at the Council of uh 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:48.560 Ladocia does see you. I would say, Leo to see you, 0:06:49.400 --> 0:06:52.320 Leo to see you. That's my I thought that a 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:55.560 might be silent. But weren't you raised Baptists. You don't 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:58.039 know about the council of Leo to see you. I 0:06:58.040 --> 0:07:00.240 had never heard of it, truly, you are Joe King. 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:03.159 I am Joey al right, Because that was a meeting 0:07:03.240 --> 0:07:06.200 of of leaders in the Christian religion who said we 0:07:06.200 --> 0:07:07.960 need to get some laws on the books. I'm surprised 0:07:08.000 --> 0:07:11.200 I hadn't heard of it, but I hadn't or possibly 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:15.240 the first laws were from ancient Rome, uh, and I 0:07:15.280 --> 0:07:19.080 saw various Roman emperors who could have been responsible for these. 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:22.800 I saw Constantine in three twenty one. Yeah, I think 0:07:23.360 --> 0:07:25.200 I saw one of the other dudes. But I got 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:32.040 that from the Valdosta Times. Take that or leave it, 0:07:33.720 --> 0:07:36.800 that's right. So so you had a bunch of Christian rulers, 0:07:36.880 --> 0:07:38.800 essentially is the upshot of all this that kind of 0:07:38.800 --> 0:07:42.920 took over and started issuing these proclamations and new crees 0:07:42.960 --> 0:07:46.560 and stuff about observing the Sabbath. Right. Yeah, for like 0:07:46.680 --> 0:07:50.760 hundreds of years this happened in various ways, various loss thing. 0:07:50.840 --> 0:07:54.000 You can do this, you can't do that. Uh, it 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:57.960 was I think the Protestants were a little less into it, 0:07:58.920 --> 0:08:01.400 but not real I mean, they were still into it. 0:08:02.160 --> 0:08:04.480 I think it would be disingenuous to say the Protestants 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:07.600 were just fine with it, well supposedly with doing whatever 0:08:07.600 --> 0:08:11.080 on Sunday, supposedly, right. I think it wasn't that they 0:08:11.120 --> 0:08:13.840 weren't They weren't cool with just not having a day, 0:08:13.880 --> 0:08:16.720 a Sabbath day of some sort. It was Martin Luther 0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:19.360 wasn't big in following the old time rules, and he 0:08:19.440 --> 0:08:22.120 was saying, it doesn't have to be Sunday, don't be ridiculous, 0:08:22.160 --> 0:08:25.160 just but do a day a week. Um. But the 0:08:25.200 --> 0:08:27.800 irony of the whole thing is that Protestants would come 0:08:27.840 --> 0:08:32.160 to be like some of the biggest enforcers and writers 0:08:32.200 --> 0:08:36.520 of blue laws in America, especially as Sunday being the 0:08:36.600 --> 0:08:41.280 Sabbath day, like defending Sunday in particular, right, and so 0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:45.000 you know, these get enacted there. Obviously, when the colonies 0:08:45.040 --> 0:08:48.200 are being formed, they make their way over there. The 0:08:48.240 --> 0:08:53.320 Puritans were like, oh, great, this is perfect. We're all 0:08:53.320 --> 0:08:57.040 about restricting people whenever Sunday. That's fine, we'll restrict people 0:08:57.040 --> 0:09:00.360 on Sunday. And by the time the colonies roll around, 0:09:00.400 --> 0:09:04.520 they were pretty well ensconced, such that there's even a story. 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:07.440 I think you can really do much of anything on 0:09:07.480 --> 0:09:10.679 Sunday's in the colonial times. But there's a story from 0:09:10.720 --> 0:09:17.360 Sight nine where supposedly George Washington himself was was tracked 0:09:17.400 --> 0:09:20.440 down or at least stopped by a sheriff for going 0:09:20.880 --> 0:09:22.920 for traveling on a Sunday, even though he was traveling 0:09:22.920 --> 0:09:28.240 to church. Yeah, because the premise was that um, saddling 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:31.839 up your horse or connecting a team of horses to 0:09:31.960 --> 0:09:35.240 a carriage or whatever that constituted labor, and you weren't 0:09:35.320 --> 0:09:38.480 doing any kind of labor on Sunday. And and speaking 0:09:38.480 --> 0:09:41.319 of the colonies, chock I turned up something about James 0:09:41.360 --> 0:09:45.400 Town's Blue Laws. Um, they had their first blue law 0:09:45.480 --> 0:09:48.360 enacted in sixteen ten, like right out of the gate. 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:50.120 One of the first things they said was, here's some 0:09:50.160 --> 0:09:54.040 blue laws. Everybody gather around. So basically you couldn't do 0:09:54.320 --> 0:10:00.000 like you were saying, anything on a Sunday. And uh, 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:03.760 tendency at church was mandatory on Sunday. So the blue 0:10:03.840 --> 0:10:06.640 laws actually made a lot more sense in that context, right, Like, 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:10.840 but I'm guessing there was that there's probably some sort 0:10:10.840 --> 0:10:13.520 of like social you know, people snitching on one another 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:16.280 kind of thing, like you notice who's not here, right, right, 0:10:16.600 --> 0:10:18.840 But in that context, the blue law makes more sense 0:10:18.840 --> 0:10:20.839 because it's like, you were supposed to be in church 0:10:20.920 --> 0:10:22.800 and if you do anything other than church, here are 0:10:22.800 --> 0:10:27.040 your punishments. Right, But the punishments were really severe, Like 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:30.960 the first time you were caught doing anything but going 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:35.040 to church on a Sunday, you would go a week 0:10:35.080 --> 0:10:38.640 without food. Like they you got your food from like 0:10:38.720 --> 0:10:42.120 the village. The village all gathered and shared food. It 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:44.800 was super socialist, right, and you weren't you were disinvited 0:10:44.800 --> 0:10:47.280 from that party until the next Sabbath. You did not 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:50.640 get food, and that usually was enough to straighten anybody out. 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:54.960 The second time you would lose your allowance for a week, 0:10:55.440 --> 0:10:57.800 and then you would also be whipped at the stake. 0:10:58.800 --> 0:11:01.440 The third time, they just told you. The third time 0:11:01.440 --> 0:11:03.840 they caught you doing something other than going to church 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:06.400 on the Sabbath, even say after you'd been to church 0:11:06.480 --> 0:11:09.600 that day, you they would kill you. That was the 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:12.760 punishment for So they were quite serious about that kind 0:11:12.760 --> 0:11:15.840 of thing. Um. But over time that kind of fell 0:11:15.880 --> 0:11:19.959 away fell to the wayside, especially as America took up 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:24.240 this project UM that was led by people like Thomas 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:31.040 Jefferson called um disestablishmentarianism, right, yeah, and that's from the 0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:35.880 original word disestablishment. And then of course the very famous 0:11:35.920 --> 0:11:40.319 longer word that every elementary school student knows and can 0:11:40.360 --> 0:11:44.320 spell is the longest weird Is it still the longest word? 0:11:44.440 --> 0:11:50.080 I don't know, anti disestablishmentarianism, yes, which I always thought 0:11:50.120 --> 0:11:52.600 was just like what does that even mean? Like is 0:11:52.600 --> 0:11:54.400 that a real word? But it's a real word, And 0:11:54.440 --> 0:11:56.520 now that we know what all this means, it makes 0:11:56.520 --> 0:12:01.920 perfect sense. Yeah, because disestablishmentarianism was that movement that basically said, look, 0:12:02.040 --> 0:12:04.280 we need to get the government out of the business 0:12:04.360 --> 0:12:08.319 of supporting churches because there's a lot more churches than 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:10.800 there used to be when we when we were colonies, 0:12:11.240 --> 0:12:15.320 a lot of different Christian sects, and the government shouldn't 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:17.959 really throw its lawt into one against the other. That's 0:12:17.960 --> 0:12:21.120 a really English thing to do, because the I think 0:12:21.320 --> 0:12:23.560 even in the nineties, there was a movement or there's 0:12:23.559 --> 0:12:26.440 still a movement of foot in the UK to basically 0:12:26.520 --> 0:12:29.760 be like, okay, state, stop supporting the Anglican Church. It's 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:33.079 not you know, there should be a separation. The Americans 0:12:33.080 --> 0:12:36.040 picked up on that very early on, and so that 0:12:36.160 --> 0:12:38.240 led to this um like a bunch of laws and 0:12:38.280 --> 0:12:42.320 stuff that basically said, we're we're supporting religious freedom, not 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:45.960 casting our lot with one particular sect or religion or another. 0:12:46.000 --> 0:12:48.600 So here in America you can practice whatever religion you 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:52.440 want and the go you can you can expect the 0:12:52.480 --> 0:12:56.200 government not to promote some other rival religion, somebody else's 0:12:56.200 --> 0:13:00.200 team over yours, because that's not fair. All right, you 0:13:00.200 --> 0:13:03.959 know what, that's a great cliffhanger. Uh, we'll take a 0:13:04.000 --> 0:13:07.520 little break here and we'll talk about what that resulted in, right, 0:13:07.559 --> 0:13:38.559 after this, all right, So here's where we are. Uh, 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:44.240 the United States gets hit into disestablishment, which basically was, hey, 0:13:44.760 --> 0:13:48.560 we can't throw all of our eggs in one denominational basket, 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:52.040 because there are a lot of different denominations here and 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:56.280 we respect them all long as they're Christian. Basically that's 0:13:56.280 --> 0:14:01.120 a parenthetical to that song title. And uh, you know what, 0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:05.080 what kind of happened was the I guess there's no 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:09.240 other way to say it other than Evangelicals Protestant evangelical said, 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:11.800 you know what, this is a great opportunity for us 0:14:12.360 --> 0:14:16.800 to really sort of grab the reins of power and 0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:21.720 to put our our morals and our values on everybody 0:14:21.760 --> 0:14:26.560 else through law. Yeah, because you know they're every single 0:14:26.640 --> 0:14:29.680 average American wasn't like, yeah, government, get out of the 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:33.400 business of supporting churches and get into just freedom of religion. 0:14:33.400 --> 0:14:35.280 There are plenty of people and this is the late 0:14:35.280 --> 0:14:39.520 eighteenth century and early nineteenth century, first half and nineteenth century, Um, 0:14:39.560 --> 0:14:41.520 there are plenty of people who are like, no, I 0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:44.680 I you guys have supported my church forever. Let's just 0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:48.360 keep doing that. And so in that kind of sense 0:14:48.400 --> 0:14:53.000 of probably a certain sense of betrayal or loss of trust. 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:57.400 A lot of religious leaders became political and and stepped 0:14:57.480 --> 0:15:02.920 up that that that amazing word anti disestablishmentarianism, which is 0:15:02.960 --> 0:15:07.680 fighting against that idea and basically saying, no America supports 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:13.600 um Protestant churches. Basically America is waspy, is what they 0:15:13.600 --> 0:15:16.440 were trying to say. Yeah, and it's funny, like if 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:20.120 you think that this sort of thing started happening in 0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:24.520 the nineteen eighties, that was just a re establishment, like 0:15:24.960 --> 0:15:28.320 it started happening in the seventeen eighties. Really, yeah, that 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:35.080 was the anti disestablishmentarianism revival, that's right. Uh they printed 0:15:35.080 --> 0:15:40.520 t shirts for uh, for Christian universities, and they they 0:15:40.520 --> 0:15:44.000 sold like hotcakes, I think. But uh so, all right, 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:46.160 here's what they're doing. They're trying to establish power. But 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:50.400 there's a problem and that as America grew, the economy 0:15:50.440 --> 0:15:55.080 grew and businesses grew, and it didn't necessarily jibe with 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:58.200 this shut everything down one day of the weak mentality. 0:15:58.200 --> 0:16:00.320 They were like, hey, there's there's money to be made 0:16:00.360 --> 0:16:03.200 on these days, and there are things to do on 0:16:03.280 --> 0:16:06.200 these days off that you're sort of making a stake. 0:16:06.480 --> 0:16:08.640 So there was sort of conflict even way back then 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:13.240 between I guess the secular and the religious. Yeah, and 0:16:13.280 --> 0:16:16.680 I mean I think that's ultimately the thing that that 0:16:16.880 --> 0:16:18.960 is the greatest tension at the heart of this, at 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.760 least in America, this idea like, no, the whole the 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:26.280 whole purpose of government, the whole reason for everyone living 0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:29.400 is to make a lot of money for certain select 0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:31.400 group of people. Serverybody, get back to work. What are 0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:34.760 you talking about taking a the day off on Sunday. 0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:37.200 That's a full day. You could be making us profit. 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:42.480 And so that that um became diametrically opposed to the 0:16:42.520 --> 0:16:46.560 idea of blue laws. And you had two really powerful institutions, 0:16:46.800 --> 0:16:50.760 the church or all of the churches that celebrated the 0:16:50.800 --> 0:16:55.560 sabboth On on Sunday, versus the captains of industry who 0:16:55.560 --> 0:16:59.200 were just now starting to really make on godly amounts 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:03.240 of money during the Second Industrial Revolution in the United States, 0:17:03.680 --> 0:17:06.800 that's right, as well as Jewish people and Seventh day 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:12.639 Adventists and just regular secular people who were just like, uh, no, 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:14.919 we shouldn't be doing stuff like this at all. Like 0:17:15.000 --> 0:17:17.560 what is separation of church and state all about? If 0:17:17.560 --> 0:17:19.440 we're still going to do stuff like this. I'm really 0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:21.520 glad you said that too. Because one thing that blue 0:17:21.560 --> 0:17:25.280 laws do is make really strange bedfellows. So in league 0:17:25.359 --> 0:17:29.240 with the churchy types, you had labor unions and you 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:32.359 still do. Actually, labor unions still typically tend to support 0:17:32.359 --> 0:17:36.160 blue laws because religious or not, their workers are still 0:17:36.200 --> 0:17:39.800 getting the day off on Sunday with their families. And 0:17:39.840 --> 0:17:42.440 on the other side, like you said, it's captains of industry, 0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:45.479 along with Seventh day Adventists and Jewish people, along with 0:17:45.840 --> 0:17:48.719 secular types. I mean, like those are those are not 0:17:48.800 --> 0:17:52.080 groups that you would normally put together on the kickball 0:17:52.119 --> 0:17:56.680 field or something, you know, that's right. And they had 0:17:56.680 --> 0:17:59.920 a couple of names. The Sabbatarians were the Evangelicals, the 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:03.879 Protestant Evangelicals, Uh, and like you said, labor unions and 0:18:03.880 --> 0:18:06.919 groups like that. And then the Anti Sabbatarians were the others. 0:18:07.760 --> 0:18:09.679 And you know, they kind of battled it out for 0:18:09.680 --> 0:18:12.400 a little while, and in the end, it turns out, 0:18:12.440 --> 0:18:14.960 and this should come as no surprise, Uh, there were 0:18:15.000 --> 0:18:19.359 more anti Sabbatarians who were like, no, we should not 0:18:19.480 --> 0:18:21.920 have these days often, we should separate church and state. 0:18:22.400 --> 0:18:27.480 But the Sabbatarians were louder, and they were more um, 0:18:27.520 --> 0:18:29.680 they were more fired up basically, and they got people 0:18:29.680 --> 0:18:31.680 out to vote more, and they've got people to sign 0:18:31.760 --> 0:18:34.960 petitions more and to put more pressure on officials who 0:18:34.960 --> 0:18:38.520 decided these things. And so in the end what they 0:18:38.560 --> 0:18:40.119 did it was I mean, I don't know if it 0:18:40.160 --> 0:18:43.320 was a win win or a lose lose. The blue 0:18:43.359 --> 0:18:46.359 laws kind of stayed pretty firmly entrenched on the books, 0:18:46.560 --> 0:18:50.640 but the anti Sabbatarians were able to carve out certain 0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:54.119 exceptions basically like hey, we should be able to do 0:18:54.160 --> 0:18:56.879 this in this and maybe stores can be open. But 0:18:57.000 --> 0:19:00.399 then the Sabbatarians are like, yeah, but no alcohol what soever. 0:19:00.960 --> 0:19:02.920 So it kind of played out like this. I don't 0:19:02.920 --> 0:19:06.760 know calling in a negotiation is the right term, but 0:19:07.480 --> 0:19:11.200 a long drawn out battle, let's call it a compromise. Sure. 0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:15.239 So the the effect of all of this is that 0:19:15.359 --> 0:19:18.480 over time in the you know, it seemed like in 0:19:18.480 --> 0:19:22.480 the twentieth century, it really started to get to a road. Um, 0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:25.439 these little these exceptions got like bigger and bigger and 0:19:25.520 --> 0:19:28.040 carved out more and more of these blanket blue laws 0:19:28.080 --> 0:19:30.800 that remember originally started out is basically like you cannot 0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:35.040 do anything on Sunday, And then it was like except 0:19:35.920 --> 0:19:39.639 you can go and buy ice cream at the beach, 0:19:40.359 --> 0:19:42.359 or you can buy milk, but you're not allowed to 0:19:42.400 --> 0:19:45.840 buy anything to put milk in. Um, just all sorts 0:19:45.840 --> 0:19:50.320 of weird stuff that made the whole thing seem really arbitrary. 0:19:50.359 --> 0:19:53.840 And there's this idea like um like, Okay, if you 0:19:53.880 --> 0:19:56.200 were if you're going to the beach, you can buy 0:19:56.240 --> 0:20:00.399 ice cream at the beach, but if you went into town, 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:02.920 you would not be able to illegally buy ice cream. 0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:06.119 How does that make any sense? Well, it does in 0:20:06.200 --> 0:20:08.720 a certain way depending on how you look at the 0:20:08.840 --> 0:20:13.760 role of government. And in this case, it is arbitrary. 0:20:13.840 --> 0:20:18.960 It is it does impact one group in town storekeepers 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:23.200 in favor of another group beach side ice cream vendors. Right, 0:20:24.080 --> 0:20:26.879 But if you believe that the role of government is 0:20:26.960 --> 0:20:30.720 in part not just to support the economic activity of 0:20:30.840 --> 0:20:35.120 the citizens of the United States, but instead to support 0:20:35.160 --> 0:20:38.960 their well being as well, then it does make sense 0:20:39.080 --> 0:20:42.000 because what they're basically saying is, Okay, we want to 0:20:42.080 --> 0:20:44.159 encourage people to take that trip to the beach with 0:20:44.200 --> 0:20:47.440 their family on Sunday. And what makes a beach trip 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:50.800 that much more enjoyable ice cream. I don't think I've 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:53.160 ever had ice cream on the beach I haven't either, 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:55.800 but apparently it was like all the rage during the 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:58.480 thirties and forties and fifties. I get it. I mean 0:20:58.640 --> 0:21:02.080 it's I bet it's nice. I love ice cream and 0:21:02.080 --> 0:21:04.520 I love beaches. We gotta try it sometime. We have 0:21:04.600 --> 0:21:06.520 to go to a beach and eat some ice cream 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:10.040 very soon, chunk. Yeah, sure, so it makes sense in 0:21:10.080 --> 0:21:12.600 that in that respect. But yes, if you're if you're 0:21:12.600 --> 0:21:14.879 one of those people who are like, no, these laws 0:21:14.920 --> 0:21:17.320 all need to make sense, they need to follow all 0:21:17.320 --> 0:21:20.280 the rules, then you probably have a pretty big problem 0:21:20.280 --> 0:21:24.280 with blue laws. Yes, should we talk about a few 0:21:24.680 --> 0:21:28.040 of these blue laws still in the books? I think so. 0:21:28.040 --> 0:21:30.679 So we mentioned Georgia, Like I said, up until just 0:21:30.720 --> 0:21:33.280 a few years ago, it was on the ballot to 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:36.960 be allowed to buy alcohol on the Sundays. But still 0:21:37.080 --> 0:21:39.280 if you go to Sunday brunch, and this was the 0:21:39.320 --> 0:21:41.600 same in believe it or not in New York until 0:21:43.240 --> 0:21:45.040 if you go to brunch on a Sunday you couldn't 0:21:45.040 --> 0:21:48.639 buy booze at a bar or restaurant until noon. I 0:21:48.680 --> 0:21:51.679 think in New York they changed it to ten. But 0:21:51.880 --> 0:21:54.639 I think in Georgia, I don't really do brunch much anymore. 0:21:54.680 --> 0:21:57.879 But I think it's still noon. As far as I know, 0:21:57.960 --> 0:22:00.280 it's still noon. But yeah, I haven't done brunch a 0:22:00.280 --> 0:22:03.240 couple of years now. So if you if you get 0:22:03.240 --> 0:22:05.880 the jump on things and you're like, oh, we gotta 0:22:05.880 --> 0:22:08.439 beat those brunch crowds and get there at eleven, you know, 0:22:08.480 --> 0:22:10.960 there's a reason the brunch crowds come later. And it 0:22:11.000 --> 0:22:14.960 ain't church, no, but that is. But church is the 0:22:15.000 --> 0:22:17.920 reason why they set that time on Sundays to start 0:22:17.960 --> 0:22:21.080 around noon, because it's like, okay, everybody has a reasonable 0:22:21.200 --> 0:22:23.760 chance to go to the morning services and then they 0:22:23.800 --> 0:22:27.800 can get drunk. Everyone wins. Basically. It's funny. I remember 0:22:28.800 --> 0:22:32.000 growing up in the Baptist Church. There were it was 0:22:32.080 --> 0:22:37.600 just sort of this implied agreement between the congregation, most 0:22:37.640 --> 0:22:40.640 of the congregation, and the preacher that like you wrap 0:22:40.680 --> 0:22:46.320 it up by noon because of lunch and football basically, 0:22:46.800 --> 0:22:49.320 And it was you know, there were some Sundays where like, 0:22:49.400 --> 0:22:52.760 you know, the spirit was was raging within the church 0:22:53.280 --> 0:22:55.919 and things would start to you know, he'd be feeling 0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:58.240 it and things would start to go a little long, 0:22:59.800 --> 0:23:02.879 and uh, you you would really sense the shifting of 0:23:02.960 --> 0:23:06.840 bodies and the looking at watches and the unease among 0:23:07.119 --> 0:23:10.600 the congregation, usually like the dads that are like all right, 0:23:10.920 --> 0:23:14.480 like I'm glad everyone's feeling it and everything, but the 0:23:14.520 --> 0:23:18.360 Falcons kick off soon. We need to get out of here. Uh. 0:23:18.359 --> 0:23:20.560 And I remember being a kid, like being like twelve 0:23:20.600 --> 0:23:23.200 years old and sensing that and being on the side 0:23:23.240 --> 0:23:26.800 of football. Yeah, that's funny. I have the opposite experience 0:23:26.840 --> 0:23:30.679 where I'm I'm like, I always dread somebody tying it 0:23:30.760 --> 0:23:35.200 up and going into overtime and preempting sixty minutes on Sunday. 0:23:36.280 --> 0:23:38.960 It happened this past Sunday as recently, is that I 0:23:38.960 --> 0:23:41.119 could tell at the beginning of the fourth quarter that 0:23:41.160 --> 0:23:42.920 the Cowboys and the Patriots were going to tie it 0:23:43.000 --> 0:23:45.040 up and go over time, and I have course right 0:23:45.640 --> 0:23:48.280 to wait like an extra hour for sixty minutes. Do 0:23:48.320 --> 0:23:50.239 you still watch sixty minutes? Yeah? I watched them more 0:23:50.280 --> 0:23:52.840 than ever now. It's really great. I used to watch 0:23:52.920 --> 0:23:54.320 it as I believe it or not, as like a 0:23:54.359 --> 0:23:58.600 high school student. I was really into it, and maybe 0:23:58.600 --> 0:24:00.520