1 00:00:01,639 --> 00:00:06,560 Speaker 1: Hey, folks, it is Wednesday, October first, and on this day, 2 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 1: twelve years ago, Amy Robot stepped onto a van, pulled 3 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: out her breast, and life changed forever. Welcome to this 4 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:20,600 Speaker 1: episode of Amy and TJ. This is an anniversary robes 5 00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: of your life starting in a different direction. You look 6 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:32,879 Speaker 1: at it as what reflective, happy anniversary, said anniversary what? 7 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:36,599 Speaker 2: It's not sad because this was the day that changed 8 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 2: my life. This is the day that actually made today 9 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:45,200 Speaker 2: possible and the reason why I actually celebrate it and 10 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 2: don't mind and actually appreciate talking about it because this day, 11 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 2: October first, is the first day of Breast Cancer Awareness Month, 12 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 2: and because of that, I was asked on assignment to 13 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 2: have my first mammogram in a Mamma van in the 14 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:04,040 Speaker 2: middle of Times Square on live national television. And I 15 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 2: didn't want to do it, and I actually said no 16 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:10,760 Speaker 2: multiple times before eventually saying yes. Because I had no 17 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:15,320 Speaker 2: family history of breast cancer. I truly believed that it 18 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:18,679 Speaker 2: couldn't happen to me, and so I didn't feel like 19 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:21,600 Speaker 2: I needed to get a mammogram At the time. The 20 00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 2: recommendations were that if you had no family history, you 21 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 2: could wait until you were fifty, So at forty, why 22 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 2: would I walk into a Mamma van and have a mammogram. 23 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 2: I didn't want to do it, but thankfully I did 24 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:37,800 Speaker 2: because that was the day that led to my diagnosis 25 00:01:37,840 --> 00:01:39,959 Speaker 2: at the end of this month where I was ultimately 26 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,080 Speaker 2: diagnosed with stage two invasive bast CAN. 27 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:43,880 Speaker 1: But again go back to October first. You look at 28 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: it as what I know, people talk about cancer versors, 29 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: they talk about other stuff. October first, for. 30 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:51,960 Speaker 2: You is what it was a liberation day because I 31 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 2: was finally by going ahead and going through with this mammogram, 32 00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 2: I got information that I needed to then set out 33 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:05,120 Speaker 2: on a path where I could save my own life. Literally, 34 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 2: the power was mine to have only if I knew 35 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 2: what I was dealing with. And I think a lot 36 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 2: of women don't make their appointments. They don't go in 37 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 2: for their mammograms because number one, they don't think it 38 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 2: can happen to them, and number two, they're afraid of 39 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 2: what they might find out. They don't want to know. 40 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 2: Ignorance is bliss, right. 41 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:26,680 Speaker 1: When was your next mammogram? 42 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:30,519 Speaker 2: Well, I had been given a prescription at the age 43 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,040 Speaker 2: of thirty nine by my obgyn and said you know what, 44 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 2: maybe you should think about doing this. You're coming up 45 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 2: on the age where look, it's disputed as to when 46 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:40,240 Speaker 2: you should go in, but you're around that age. And 47 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,679 Speaker 2: I thought, okay, I took that I had a prescription. 48 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:45,799 Speaker 2: I threw it in my purse and it it went 49 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:48,040 Speaker 2: around in there for about, I don't know a few months. 50 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 2: I eventually threw it away and forgot about it. So 51 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 2: I wasn't going to get a mammogram for ten years, Like, 52 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:56,960 Speaker 2: I was not planning on having a test that I 53 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:00,520 Speaker 2: didn't technically need to have, at least according to what 54 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:03,720 Speaker 2: I was hearing recommendations. So why would I get something 55 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:07,680 Speaker 2: that could be painful and definitely would seem annoying if 56 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 2: I didn't have to. 57 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 1: What decisions have you made in your life after that 58 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 1: diagnosis that you think would have been different had you 59 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 1: never been diagnosed with cancer? 60 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, I don't think i'd be sitting here 61 00:03:19,919 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 2: with you. 62 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 3: I don't. 63 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 2: I know that I wouldn't have run a marathon. I 64 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:27,160 Speaker 2: wouldn't have climbed the mountains I've climbed. 65 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 3: I wouldn't have. 66 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:34,560 Speaker 2: So many things, just how I've reacted to things, friends, 67 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:35,640 Speaker 2: I've chosen to. 68 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 3: Actually let go, and. 69 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 2: Decisions I've made about my time and who I spend 70 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 2: it with. All of that has been significantly impacted by 71 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 2: my cancer Diagnosis's. 72 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:53,840 Speaker 1: Friend's decisions factor into that, has a decision about who's 73 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 1: around you factor into you walking into a van twelve 74 00:03:58,440 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: years ago. 75 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 2: Today, cus I think so often we all take for 76 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 2: granted that we have tomorrow. We don't think about time 77 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 2: as our most precious gift and as a commodity that 78 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:12,880 Speaker 2: we should actually value and really take. 79 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 3: Seriously. 80 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 2: So I think a lot of times I would say 81 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:21,120 Speaker 2: yes to things, yes to people, yes to events, yes 82 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 2: to time spent with folks. So I didn't really enjoy 83 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:29,480 Speaker 2: being around And a lot of it was duty driven 84 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 2: or obligations. 85 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 3: Or I made decisions out of guilt. 86 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:38,120 Speaker 2: But I didn't value my time and I do now 87 00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:41,280 Speaker 2: and who, most importantly, who I spend it with, and 88 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:43,960 Speaker 2: how I spend it that and just even just my 89 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:49,160 Speaker 2: overall attitude about the small stuff that can weigh us 90 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:49,480 Speaker 2: all down. 91 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 1: You remember the first time you laughed about something after 92 00:04:56,600 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 1: your diagnosis. It took a while, you know, the first 93 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 1: time you genuinely laughed about something. 94 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 2: I don't know what time when I genuinely laughed. But 95 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:11,280 Speaker 2: I can tell you when I genuinely felt some joy, 96 00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:14,360 Speaker 2: and you're gonna laugh when I tell you what it was. 97 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 2: I think you'll get it. I think you'll understand. So 98 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:22,839 Speaker 2: when I came finally was released from the hospital after 99 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 2: my double mastectomy, this was in mid November or something 100 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 2: like that, my brother surprised me by showing up at 101 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 2: my apartment when I got back from the hospital, and 102 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 2: it just so happened that when he got there, And 103 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,200 Speaker 2: this is one of the few things we share in 104 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 2: terms of our likes. The Conjuring. I had not seen 105 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 2: it came to streaming services, and so I remember all 106 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 2: bandaged up, in significant pain and definitely still on a 107 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:53,200 Speaker 2: little bit of drugs. Eric and I watched the Conjuring together, 108 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 2: and I could get emotional thinking about it because I 109 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 2: remember feeling I laughed, I jumped, I screamed, I forgot, 110 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:03,680 Speaker 2: and for those I don't know, that hour and a half, 111 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 2: however long it runs, I forgot. I didn't think about 112 00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 2: what I had just been through and what I was 113 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:12,800 Speaker 2: still facing because chemo was obviously looming ahead of me, 114 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 2: and all sorts of other uncertainties and unknowns. But in 115 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:20,919 Speaker 2: that moment, I was able to just exist and enjoy 116 00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 2: the fact that someone else was having a tougher day 117 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 2: than me. They were possessed by demons and I was 118 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 2: just dealing with a medical issue. 119 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 1: Oh no, I mean, if you gave me a choice, 120 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:34,160 Speaker 1: which one demonic possession. 121 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 3: Or breast cancer. 122 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:39,280 Speaker 1: I mean. I have seen them exercise people before the 123 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 1: demon was gone forever. 124 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:43,840 Speaker 2: Oftentimes they don't go well though. It was just it 125 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 2: was a moment where I got to It sounds crazy, 126 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 2: but I in that you know, fear and jump scares 127 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:51,479 Speaker 2: and all of that, and not knowing what's going to happen. 128 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:57,280 Speaker 2: I was taken out of my own horrific reality and 129 00:06:57,480 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 2: able to actually enjoy another one that was complete. 130 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 3: Make believe you know what. 131 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 1: I would have been looking into doing some science on 132 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: horror movies. Okay, just hit on something in particular where 133 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 1: people like to now direct whatever their fear and anxiety 134 00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: is about life in one direction that's right in front 135 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:16,960 Speaker 1: of them. Whatever that horror movie is, it's all directed there, 136 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:20,160 Speaker 1: and then when it's over there's some sense of relief. Actually, 137 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 1: there's actually folks that argue you can feel better because 138 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:26,880 Speaker 1: you go up, up, up, anxiety and you know it's 139 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 1: going to end. 140 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 3: That ends in your more relaxed and you feel a 141 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:31,200 Speaker 3: little bit of euphoria. 142 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 2: So that was actually the first time I felt joy 143 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 2: since my diagnosis was the day I came home and 144 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 2: I watched the Conjuring. So the Conjuring I love regardless, 145 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 2: but it has a special place in my heart in 146 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 2: my breast cancer journey, if that makes any sense. 147 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 1: What are you going to tell your daughters about when 148 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:49,840 Speaker 1: they should be screened? 149 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,640 Speaker 2: So my oncologist told me that whenever I was diagnosed, 150 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 2: which for me was at the age of forty, although 151 00:07:56,680 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 2: they do they did say for sure because mine was 152 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 2: a slower growing cancer that I had had it for 153 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 2: a couple of years. But on average, you should have 154 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 2: your daughters be screened ten years before the date of 155 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:10,680 Speaker 2: your diagnosis. So my daughters will have their baseline mammogram 156 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:11,679 Speaker 2: at the age of thirty. 157 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 1: What do they think of what they said to you 158 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 1: about it. 159 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 2: They are on board with that, and actually we're asking 160 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 2: if they could get it sooner. I think there's a 161 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 2: huge level of fear obviously knowing that their mother had 162 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 2: premenopausal breast cancer with no family history, and I did 163 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:35,520 Speaker 2: not test positive for the Brakawan and bracket two genes, 164 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 2: which is a good thing. But they've been tested as 165 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,680 Speaker 2: well and they don't have the gene either, so that's 166 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 2: a little bit of relief, But still there's concern. And clearly, 167 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:46,079 Speaker 2: if you have someone as close as your mother or 168 00:08:46,120 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 2: your sister or your sibling have breast cancer, you certainly 169 00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 2: are at higher risk. 170 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:50,480 Speaker 3: Period. 171 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 2: So they are all on board with being preventative, and 172 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 2: I know that they're taking their health more seriously, at 173 00:08:56,679 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 2: least as they get older. 174 00:08:57,440 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 3: Ava's almost twenty three now. 175 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 2: She's sending me pictures of her running every day and 176 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:05,360 Speaker 2: she's keto like we are now, so you know, I 177 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:09,320 Speaker 2: think she's starting to realize just the power she has 178 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:12,679 Speaker 2: in terms of her level of exercise, her nutrition, all 179 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 2: of that. And I think analyse will come around eventually. 180 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 2: She's working out, she likes her hot yoga. But I 181 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:21,959 Speaker 2: do think that it's absolutely impacted their decisions, and it 182 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:24,719 Speaker 2: will more so the older they get, the more they're 183 00:09:24,760 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 2: able to understand what we do know and what we 184 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 2: don't know, and what we can do to prevent something 185 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:30,920 Speaker 2: like this. 186 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:35,440 Speaker 1: Make the connection between walking onto a van twelve years 187 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 1: ago to where you sit now. 188 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:45,120 Speaker 2: Well, I am a completely different person, and I would 189 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:47,160 Speaker 2: even go so far as to say I was arrogant 190 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:50,839 Speaker 2: about my health. I had at that time all my 191 00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 2: grandparents still alive, which is fairly remarkable. 192 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:55,400 Speaker 3: My mom is one of nine, my dad is one 193 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 3: of six. 194 00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 2: And to have looked at all of my family members 195 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,199 Speaker 2: at that point, and I don't even know how many 196 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 2: first cousins I have, but it's in the dozens and dozens. Yeah, 197 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:08,959 Speaker 2: you've got these German Catholic families who were trying to 198 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 2: follow the Pope's example at least a few generations ago, 199 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:16,640 Speaker 2: a few generations ago. Yes, that's what happens when you 200 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 2: aren't on birth control. So I have a lot of 201 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 2: family members to compare my situation to, and I just 202 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 2: felt I felt like I couldn't actually have cancer because 203 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:29,719 Speaker 2: I didn't know anyone at that time who did in 204 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 2: my family. And that was an arrogance that I obviously 205 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 2: no longer carry with me, and I think we all 206 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 2: have that. You know, when you're young, you feel invincible. 207 00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:42,760 Speaker 2: I felt like I was a runner, and I relatively 208 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 2: took good care of myself. I just felt invincible, and 209 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:50,559 Speaker 2: I certainly don't know, I absolutely understand. I have a 210 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:55,679 Speaker 2: humility about myself. I'm vulnerable in ways that I think 211 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,599 Speaker 2: are healthy, because when you recognize that there is no 212 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 2: such thing as security, you act and behave differently. 213 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 1: No question, again, how did I get you to today? 214 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: What twists and turns? And how is your life different? 215 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:16,320 Speaker 1: That's what I was asking and making a connection between 216 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 1: walking onto a van today and where your life has 217 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: landed you. 218 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 2: I think all of the decisions, and especially maybe the 219 00:11:25,520 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 2: little ones fall through the cracks, but the bigger decisions 220 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:32,839 Speaker 2: in my life all now go through the lens of 221 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 2: humility and vulnerability and the fact that I am so 222 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 2: significantly aware that none of us are guaranteed tomorrow. I 223 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:45,679 Speaker 2: will tell you this is something that a lot of 224 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:48,319 Speaker 2: folks don't realize. There are certain kinds of cancers, and 225 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,520 Speaker 2: breast cancer is certainly among them. Where you live under 226 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:53,920 Speaker 2: a constant threat of recurrence. When you have a tumor 227 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 2: based cancer, especially a hormonally charged cancer, you recognize that 228 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:03,319 Speaker 2: it could come back. And I received mine. It's called 229 00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:05,719 Speaker 2: an ANCA score, and it's your They give you a 230 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 2: number literally that gives you your chance of recurrence low, 231 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:13,439 Speaker 2: medium or high, and mine came in in the higher 232 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 2: echelons of medium, and I remember that day I was 233 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 2: actually at Good Morning America. That was the second most 234 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 2: devastating piece of news. I got past the fact that 235 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:25,720 Speaker 2: I had breast cancer because when I got that ANCA score, 236 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:28,880 Speaker 2: chemo was guaranteed, I knew I had to have six 237 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 2: rounds of it. 238 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:32,440 Speaker 3: And then now I have to live under this cloud, 239 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 3: this dark cloud. 240 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:36,600 Speaker 2: That is I actually I know it's figurative, but sometimes 241 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:38,959 Speaker 2: I actually feel like I can see it hanging over 242 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 2: my head, knowing that my cancer could come back. And 243 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:44,480 Speaker 2: so every time you go back for your diagnostics, whether 244 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 2: it's a blood test or just being checked out your 245 00:12:47,320 --> 00:12:50,240 Speaker 2: lymph nodes, etc. By your oncologists, you live with this fear, 246 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 2: in this threat that maybe this is the time where 247 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 2: I get the news that I am metastatic. And around 248 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:01,120 Speaker 2: thirty percent of all early stage breast cancer patients become metastatic, 249 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:02,000 Speaker 2: and they can't. 250 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:03,640 Speaker 3: Necessarily know who is going to be. 251 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:05,959 Speaker 2: They can tell you or at a higher risk, but 252 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:09,040 Speaker 2: ultimately they can't tell you it's gonna come back or 253 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:10,680 Speaker 2: it's not going to It can come back in five years, 254 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:12,240 Speaker 2: ten years, twenty years, thirty years. 255 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:13,680 Speaker 3: Look at Olivia Newton John. 256 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 2: So every time you hear these stories of these women 257 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:19,560 Speaker 2: who have survived, and then fifteen years later it's back, 258 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 2: twenty years later, it's back. And so that fear was 259 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 2: initially absolutely paralyzing, but then eventually it became motivating. 260 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:33,160 Speaker 3: And I chose a lot of things, but I chose 261 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 3: us through that lens. 262 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:39,960 Speaker 2: I ask myself sometimes, if I knew my cancer was back, 263 00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 2: if I knew I had X amount of years left, 264 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:45,560 Speaker 2: what would I decide then? And if it's different than 265 00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:47,559 Speaker 2: what I think I want to do, But when I 266 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:50,319 Speaker 2: look it through that lens, if I have a different answer, 267 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,719 Speaker 2: that's the right answer. Because life is short. We're not 268 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 2: here to please other people or to make other people 269 00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 2: feel good about our decisions. We're here to love, to learn, 270 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:10,079 Speaker 2: and to value first of our relationship with ourselves and 271 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 2: then with the people who we choose to be around. 272 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:14,720 Speaker 2: I just I don't think I didn't have my priorities straight. 273 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 1: You gotta know. 274 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 2: More so than I did before. And I'm always I'm 275 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 2: a work in progress. Always, I think that's the big thing. 276 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 2: I'm always trying to do. 277 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 3: Better and be better. 278 00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,080 Speaker 2: And I recognize in how many ways I still have 279 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 2: to grow. But that's I think that humility I'm I'm 280 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 2: still working through and working with. But it came to 281 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:38,760 Speaker 2: me it was a gift that I received from cancer 282 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 2: without a doubt. 283 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: All right. Well, the question I certainly have, and I'm 284 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:46,040 Speaker 1: gonna ask when we come back, is there ever ever 285 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: such thing as a good cancer joke? All right, folks, 286 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: A lot of a lot laughs in this episode, But 287 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,360 Speaker 1: there is a such thing I have seen I've heard before, 288 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:12,440 Speaker 1: cancer humor. Yes, as we continue here on this twelve 289 00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: year anniversary of robots stepping onto that Mamma Van and 290 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:18,720 Speaker 1: getting that mammogram that led to her diagnosis and really 291 00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 1: a change in her life, in the direction of her life, 292 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 1: but robes along the way. I mean you, obviously you 293 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 1: have to laugh to keep them crying. Yes, And obviously 294 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: folks who've been diagnosed and their families aren't all walking 295 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:34,000 Speaker 1: around in terrible moods all the time. You find places 296 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 1: for humor. But is there a such thing, first of all, 297 00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:39,440 Speaker 1: as cancer humor? 298 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 2: Yes, and I highly suggest it. Here's the deal, here's 299 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 2: the caveat. Only the person who actually has had the 300 00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:52,960 Speaker 2: cancer can make the joke. No one else should make 301 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 2: a joke. If you haven't walked to that road, if 302 00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:57,120 Speaker 2: you haven't walked on that path, if you are not 303 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 2: a cancer survivor, slash Thriver, please don't attempt cancer humor. 304 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 1: Now close we are Nope, you leave it, Nope, leave 305 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: it to us. Okay, now the next part of that, 306 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:11,720 Speaker 1: if we leave it to you, then how do we 307 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 1: know how much or even if we can laugh? 308 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:17,120 Speaker 2: You can totally let Actually, you know what, this is 309 00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 2: so funny. I'm hoping maybe in the next month or 310 00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:23,120 Speaker 2: two to bring on someone who I was able to meet. 311 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 2: Her name is Rachel and she's a stand up comedian 312 00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 2: and she became a stand up comedian while dealing with 313 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 2: metastatic cancer. And she gets up on a stage like 314 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 2: once a week and makes cancer jokes. And she said, 315 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:36,760 Speaker 2: it's true, people don't know if they can laugh. And 316 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 2: she makes it very clear, Please I need you to laugh. 317 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 2: Laugh with me, not at me. But if I'm making 318 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 2: the jokes, it's okay to laugh. I mean you and 319 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 2: I not that this is exactly similar, but you and 320 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:51,520 Speaker 2: I went to that movie American History, Oh yeah, and 321 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 2: there were a lot of jokes that were being made 322 00:16:56,280 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 2: in jest around Rachel shoes. Yeah, we we were in 323 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:05,119 Speaker 2: the movie theater. You were the only black person a 324 00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:08,080 Speaker 2: lot of white folks, and people weren't laughing because they 325 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 2: were afraid to laugh. But I remember thinking, well, I 326 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 2: can laugh because you aren't gonna judge me because it 327 00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:17,159 Speaker 2: is funny. But it's one of those things like I 328 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:19,240 Speaker 2: had to look at you, like can I laugh, and 329 00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:20,360 Speaker 2: that people around us. 330 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:22,280 Speaker 3: Couldn't laugh because they didn't know you well enough to 331 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 3: look at you. Can we laugh? 332 00:17:24,600 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 2: It's similar, Yes, yes, and so yes, it is intentional, 333 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:31,280 Speaker 2: and I do think that's an important part of healing. 334 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 2: They say laughter is the best medicine, and I do 335 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,000 Speaker 2: think that we have to be able to laugh. We 336 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 2: have to be able to poke fun at some of 337 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:42,159 Speaker 2: the shit that's handed our way. I mean, we do 338 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 2: that about so many things in life. It's just you know, 339 00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:47,120 Speaker 2: you can say you can't say anything about my mother, 340 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:48,840 Speaker 2: but I can't. You know, it's the same, It's the 341 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 2: same rule applies. And I do think that it's helpful 342 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,879 Speaker 2: if we can get some perspective and have moments of 343 00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:59,879 Speaker 2: levity in the face of really awful moment. 344 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:02,320 Speaker 1: I can't think of what would be a good cancer joke. Like, 345 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 1: I can't see what what what do you poke fun of? 346 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 1: I don't know if you've heard some I'm not putting 347 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:09,080 Speaker 1: you on the spot to remember, but I don't know. 348 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 1: It seems so awkward to think of anything surrounding cancer 349 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 1: to be funny. I know folks can find. 350 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:21,399 Speaker 2: I mean, I think it's I think it's those moments 351 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:23,280 Speaker 2: where like, Okay, my hair is gone, but you know, 352 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 2: you're making a joke about your hair loss, or you're 353 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:27,000 Speaker 2: you know, the fact that you don't have you know, 354 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 2: all of it, like or sorry, excuse me while I 355 00:18:29,320 --> 00:18:32,200 Speaker 2: go puke right now, you know, or you know, chemo 356 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:34,359 Speaker 2: brain like you know, Actually it was great because I 357 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 2: would blame stuff on my chemo brain, which actually was legit. 358 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:40,720 Speaker 2: But at a certain point I remember telling the girls, 359 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 2: like telling them to stop fighting, like I'm in the 360 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 2: middle of it and you're gonna actually and they would say, Mom, 361 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 2: how long are you going to pull the cancer card? 362 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 3: And I was like forever? And then we'd all laugh, like, you. 363 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:54,920 Speaker 2: Know, you just have moments of levity where you're trying 364 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:58,000 Speaker 2: to just acknowledge that this shit is hard, but can 365 00:18:58,040 --> 00:19:01,159 Speaker 2: we at least laugh at the absurdity of whatever it 366 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 2: is we were all dealing with or having to work through, 367 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 2: and I think it's actually extremely helpful to. 368 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:08,680 Speaker 3: Be able to do so. 369 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:10,160 Speaker 1: You still use a cancer card. 370 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:11,280 Speaker 3: Why wouldn't I? 371 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 1: I mean it's a hell of a house here. You 372 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 1: got the cancer card, I got the black card. We 373 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 1: just smacking each other the cards all day long. 374 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,399 Speaker 3: Oh really, well I got one for you. Yes, we 375 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 3: can one off each other. The suffering Olympics. 376 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:32,160 Speaker 1: Well, blank anniversary, I don't know, happy anniversary, but reflective anniversary, 377 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:37,320 Speaker 1: but valuable anniversary and always worth noting. I ever want 378 00:19:37,320 --> 00:19:39,320 Speaker 1: to skip over into these moments. 379 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 3: It's worth noting. 380 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:44,560 Speaker 2: I've always been a big believer in acknowledging anniversaries, even 381 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 2: tough ones, even hard ones, because you can look and 382 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 2: see how far you've come. You can take a moment 383 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,359 Speaker 2: to look back at, even if it's something that's devastating 384 00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 2: or difficult, the lessons you learned, I mean, those are 385 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 2: all so valuable. There's no point in going through pain 386 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:01,680 Speaker 2: if you can't come out on the other side with wisdom. 387 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 2: And I do think that we look this is so true. 388 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 2: I know you might not know a lot of cancer survivors, 389 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:13,159 Speaker 2: but you know a couple of them. Are they not 390 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 2: some of the most joyful, grateful people you've ever met. 391 00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:18,400 Speaker 1: As soon as you said I was trying to think 392 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: of a I didn't have to think of the ones. 393 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:20,159 Speaker 2: I know. 394 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:22,040 Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of an outlier. I'm trying to 395 00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:23,040 Speaker 1: think of somebody. 396 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:27,400 Speaker 3: Who's there's always an outlier. 397 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, but predominantly, I would say ninety five percent of 398 00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 2: anyone who any of you know listening who has been 399 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:39,439 Speaker 2: through cancer is going through cancer. Yes, of course there 400 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 2: are dark moments. Yes, of course there are tough times, 401 00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 2: but I would argue most of those men and women 402 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:48,480 Speaker 2: have big smiles on their faces, are taking those vacations, 403 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,680 Speaker 2: are living out loud. I live my life like a 404 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 2: country music song. I live like I'm dying. We are 405 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:57,720 Speaker 2: all dying. We are all one day closer to our deaths. 406 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:00,400 Speaker 2: So to say I'll do that in a year, I'll 407 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 2: do that in five years. 408 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:04,040 Speaker 3: You know what, if you can do it now. And 409 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:05,159 Speaker 3: this goes back to some of. 410 00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:06,920 Speaker 2: The quotes of the day that we pick out during 411 00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 2: morning run, where it's the advice is to pop that champagne, 412 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:15,000 Speaker 2: pour the expensive wine, burn the candle. You know where 413 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:20,920 Speaker 2: the dress you bought enjoy your life and don't think 414 00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:24,200 Speaker 2: or save something for tomorrow or for the next day. 415 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 2: I just the more we live, the older I get, 416 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 2: whether I had had cancer or not. It's funny, I 417 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 2: thought I had this perspective being the journalist that I was, 418 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:36,280 Speaker 2: and that we have covered, you know, death and destruction 419 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:41,080 Speaker 2: like we have, those reminders pounded in on us when 420 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:43,840 Speaker 2: we cover stories and events, like you think, but when 421 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:47,400 Speaker 2: it happens to you, it is a completely different experience 422 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:49,880 Speaker 2: all of a sudden, intellectually what you thought you knew 423 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 2: just to in the depths of your bones, you feel 424 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 2: and you know in a way you couldn't have before. 425 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 2: And so it just it's it's a game changer, you know. 426 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:04,520 Speaker 2: Perspective is is something that is earned, something. 427 00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:06,879 Speaker 3: That is it's not just given. 428 00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 2: You have to go through something to actually really know 429 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:10,359 Speaker 2: what it's like. 430 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:15,120 Speaker 1: Well, happy anniversary anyway, babe. 431 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 2: Thank you. I'm happy to be here, grateful to be 432 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:19,760 Speaker 2: here twelve years later, and 433 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:22,920 Speaker 3: I'll be grateful for every day after that.