WEBVTT - Mandatory D.E.I. Training: Dr. Owen Anderson Talks to A&G

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<v Speaker 1>It's a pleasure to talk to doctor Owen Anderson, a

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<v Speaker 1>longtime professor at Arizona State University who is joining with

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<v Speaker 1>the Goldwater Institute to sue Arizona State for a number

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<v Speaker 1>of different reasons. And I don't want to steal us thunder,

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<v Speaker 1>but it has to do with being forced to submit

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<v Speaker 1>to DEI training and in violation not only of conscience

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<v Speaker 1>and beliefs about race, but in violation of state law.

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<v Speaker 1>Doctor Owen Anderson joins us. Maybe we call you Owen sir, Yes.

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<v Speaker 2>Please do, and thank you so much for having me on.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh, it's beyond our pleasure. This is at the top

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<v Speaker 1>of our list of jihadds. But so, what did Arizona

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<v Speaker 1>State to tell you you had to do and why

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<v Speaker 1>do you object?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I've been actually been teaching at ASU for over

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<v Speaker 2>twenty one years, so I've been in quite a while,

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<v Speaker 2>and i've always you know, I've gotten good, good reviews

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<v Speaker 2>for my teaching and my work as a professor, I

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<v Speaker 2>published widely in my field. But then about it's about

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<v Speaker 2>two years ago, November twenty twenty two, I got a

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<v Speaker 2>notification that I required DEI training is called Inclusive Communities,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think everybody who works at a state university

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<v Speaker 2>is in favor of inclusion, and you know everybody should

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<v Speaker 2>go to go to state university without any exception. So

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<v Speaker 2>it sounds good inclusive communities. But when you look into

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<v Speaker 2>the content, I mean, I think it's startling. One thing

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<v Speaker 2>the Goldwater Institute has done is they've made the content

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<v Speaker 2>known publicly, and anyone who reads it is kind of startled, like, wow,

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<v Speaker 2>that's that's actually racism. What it does is it divides

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<v Speaker 2>people up into races, and then it treats them differently

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<v Speaker 2>based on their race, based on their skin color, which

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<v Speaker 2>is the very definition of racism. And so I said,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to take that because it violates my conscience.

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<v Speaker 2>I believe racism is wrong in any setting. And so

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to able to earpreicipate so that it

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<v Speaker 2>stays on my file saying as is required and I'm overdue.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm supposed to take it once every two years. Time

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<v Speaker 2>is coming up soon here where I won't have taken

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<v Speaker 2>it in two years, and so I've always had this

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<v Speaker 2>kind of threat hanging over me then that I may

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<v Speaker 2>be disciplined for not meeting the requirement of this DEI train.

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<v Speaker 1>You said something there owen that went by quickly, but

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<v Speaker 1>I think it is pretty significant. And because we've observed this,

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<v Speaker 1>observed this over and over again, people don't many people

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<v Speaker 1>don't know what's in these so called training courses, and

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<v Speaker 1>as soon as they're exposed to the truth, they're shocked

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<v Speaker 1>by it. And it's it's odd, to say the least,

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<v Speaker 1>that Arizona State has training programs that when people see

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<v Speaker 1>their content are horrified by them. That shouldn't be going

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<v Speaker 1>There should be much more transparency than that.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, that's exactly right, and I think that's part of

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<v Speaker 2>what's going to happen is that this is a state

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<v Speaker 2>agency and I'm a state employee, and so anything that

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<v Speaker 2>goes on needs to be known to the public. The

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<v Speaker 2>taxpayers need to know this is the kind of thing

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<v Speaker 2>going on. Is one thing to teach a about DEI

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<v Speaker 2>for those who are interested. It's quite an honest thing

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<v Speaker 2>to require it. And it goes beyond simply requiring you

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<v Speaker 2>watch a video. There's a quiz you have to take,

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<v Speaker 2>and so the quiz, the way the answers are set up,

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<v Speaker 2>compels you to agree with the content. So, for example,

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<v Speaker 2>there might be a true false question, and it says,

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<v Speaker 2>you know something like white people don't know about their privilege,

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<v Speaker 2>and you're supposed to say true, which means you agree

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<v Speaker 2>with it. I can reef you like I can read.

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<v Speaker 2>I've got some of them here, go ahead, please. Some

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<v Speaker 2>of the content from the slides include one of the

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<v Speaker 2>main topics is white supremacy and how the whole United

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<v Speaker 2>States system is structurally racist. And so they'll have topics

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<v Speaker 2>like explaining white privilege to a broke white person. So

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<v Speaker 2>even though this person's broke, they're white, and so just

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<v Speaker 2>in version of that, they're privileged. White fragility. There's a

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<v Speaker 2>whole video about white fragility and how white people don't

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<v Speaker 2>act up their responsibility for all the past evils, and

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<v Speaker 2>that's that's one of the main things that goes on

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<v Speaker 2>in these is that all of history leading up to

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<v Speaker 2>the present is blamed on people for their race. Because

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<v Speaker 2>of your race, because of your skin color, you're responsible

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<v Speaker 2>for things that happened in the past.

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<v Speaker 1>And then there's right and you are just assumed, well

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<v Speaker 1>not assumed, but it's aggressively taught that you have a

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<v Speaker 1>certain set of characteristics because of your skin color, which

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<v Speaker 1>is the definition of racism.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, so you decided not to take the training. Do

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<v Speaker 3>you have any idea if you did take the training,

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<v Speaker 3>but you said false to the true false question, how

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<v Speaker 3>does that work?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a great question. Because what I did was

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<v Speaker 2>I started going through it and I said this is wrong,

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<v Speaker 2>and I looked at the quiz and I said, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not going to do these and so I never finished it.

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<v Speaker 2>So I don't know what would have happened if I

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<v Speaker 2>simply disagreed with the answers. But what I did was

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<v Speaker 2>I started a substack doctor Owen Anderson on substack, and

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<v Speaker 2>I just started talking about this stuff because I said,

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<v Speaker 2>the public needs to know about this. This is this

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<v Speaker 2>is not right people. I mean, the idea of a

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<v Speaker 2>state university is a very good idea. We should have

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<v Speaker 2>universities that people that are that are affordable for the

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<v Speaker 2>people of the state, and you can send your children

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<v Speaker 2>there you can afford, you know, hopefully, I mean it's

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<v Speaker 2>gone up a lot in price, and hope you can afford.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a good education. But then what's happened is these

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<v Speaker 2>state universities are actively teaching a very partisan ideology and

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<v Speaker 2>it alienates conservatives Christians. I mean We had Dennis Preger

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<v Speaker 2>out to ASU last year, and the vast majority of

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<v Speaker 2>our Honors college wrote a letter about how he's a

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<v Speaker 2>white nationalist. Dennis Preger beautiful.

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<v Speaker 1>We're talking at doctor Owan Anderson of Arizona State University.

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<v Speaker 1>He and Goldwater Institute are suing Arizona State University for

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<v Speaker 1>mandatory DEI training, and all of this is absolutely right,

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<v Speaker 1>and I believe it fervently from a moral point of view.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's also correct me if I'm wrong. It's just

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<v Speaker 1>literally illegal in Arizona to have this sort of mandatory

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<v Speaker 1>training that teaches essentially discrimination based on race.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, that's right. We have a law that prohibits state

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<v Speaker 2>agencies from using state money to teach any kind of

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<v Speaker 2>race blame or judgment based on race, and that should

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<v Speaker 2>just be common sense. I mean, the idea is you

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<v Speaker 2>blame a people group based on their skin color for

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<v Speaker 2>something that you say, all those people are wrong. That's

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<v Speaker 2>just what racism is. That's what we're opposed to. That's

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<v Speaker 2>what Martin Luther King Junior taught us to avoid judging

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<v Speaker 2>people based on their skin color instead of their character.

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<v Speaker 2>So it should be obvious. But what's happened is most

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<v Speaker 2>of this is done secretly, behind the scenes, and people

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<v Speaker 2>don't know about it. So one thing that was interesting

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<v Speaker 2>to me as I started my sub sac is I

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<v Speaker 2>would get emails from parents who said I had no idea.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I always assumed in a university's liberal, but

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<v Speaker 2>I had no idea how bad it was.

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<v Speaker 4>So let me hear what was that true false question?

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<v Speaker 2>Again, the true false question. Let me give an example.

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<v Speaker 2>Here's another one. I have it in front of me.

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<v Speaker 2>Which of the following areas of the university should address

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<v Speaker 2>DEIB so diversity, equity, inclusion belonging. There's multiple choice, but

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<v Speaker 2>the correct answer is d DEIB should be part of

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<v Speaker 2>every facet of the university. Right to get that question right,

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<v Speaker 2>you have to agree that DEIV should be part of

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<v Speaker 2>every single facet of the university. And of course I

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<v Speaker 2>don't agree about that at all.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, and then leaving microbiology, good luck with that, right, and.

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<v Speaker 2>Then right, there's a big push for that in the sciences. Yep,

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<v Speaker 2>how do you.

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<v Speaker 4>Work that into physics? You have any idea?

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<v Speaker 1>They try, Yeah, I've seen examples of it, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>just it's laughable and idiotic. Now, doctor Anderson, I happen

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<v Speaker 1>to know, you teach philosophy and religious studies, and this

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<v Speaker 1>is kind of ani but it's got to make you

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<v Speaker 1>insane that you have this, you know, the ebramex canny

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<v Speaker 1>point of view that you're a racist. And you have

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<v Speaker 1>two choices either say no, I'm not a racist, which

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<v Speaker 1>proves you're a racist, or say yes, I'm a racist,

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<v Speaker 1>which proves you're a racist. As a guy who's devoted

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<v Speaker 1>your life to these subtleties of knowledge and human understanding,

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<v Speaker 1>the fact that people would fall for a scheme that's

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<v Speaker 1>stupid has got to make you insane.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, one of my classes I love teaching is introductional logic, right,

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<v Speaker 2>and so you're right. What stuns me is I'm teaching

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<v Speaker 2>my freshman symbol logical fallacies to avoid, and then I'm

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<v Speaker 2>seeing them by people who are advanced degrees, and so

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<v Speaker 2>it is stunning to me. The one you just gave

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<v Speaker 2>from IBRAMX Kennedy is a great example where where you're

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<v Speaker 2>simply assumed that you are a racist is begs the question,

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<v Speaker 2>and you can't say anything back or else. That just

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<v Speaker 2>simply proves the point as well. So yeah, that's you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's one thing That is a mark. I

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<v Speaker 2>love universe. See, I love studying philosophy, I love studying

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<v Speaker 2>all subjects. But this is a real mark against an

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<v Speaker 2>argument that says, hey, everyone should go to college. But

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<v Speaker 2>wait a minute. Your most advanced professors can't avoid simple

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<v Speaker 2>logical fallacies.

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<v Speaker 3>So us talking to an education us talking to a

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<v Speaker 3>philosophy major the other day got their graduate degree in

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<v Speaker 3>philosophy from Berkeley, and I brought up Nietzsche, and they said,

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<v Speaker 3>Nietzsche's a bunch of crap.

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<v Speaker 4>You got to read Kant or Hume. Would you agree

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<v Speaker 4>or not it with that? Niets you a bunch of

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<v Speaker 4>crap you want to give you out.

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<v Speaker 2>I think he is overrated. He appeals to people who

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<v Speaker 2>think I want to do what I want to do.

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<v Speaker 2>There you go, So the power of your bill a

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<v Speaker 2>bunch of crap.

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<v Speaker 4>There you go.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, there you go summarized an entire class there in

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<v Speaker 1>thirty seconds.

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<v Speaker 3>You're a gifted jack. You're a gift to see me

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<v Speaker 3>a lot of time there so on. So a whole

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<v Speaker 3>bunch of people like, so would your take me that?

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<v Speaker 3>Like practically everybody there at the university did take that

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<v Speaker 3>test and answered to a question like to or false.

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<v Speaker 3>White people aren't understanding their white privilege like most people

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<v Speaker 3>took it and said true.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean I don't have access to them. I

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<v Speaker 2>would have to assume that's true. I have a few

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<v Speaker 2>people who reach out to me and they said they

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<v Speaker 2>didn't take it either, and so I do know there's

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<v Speaker 2>a couple of us, But I think the vastman I

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<v Speaker 2>think the people who agree with me at ASU mostly

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<v Speaker 2>are silent because they know if I speak up, there's

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<v Speaker 2>all kinds of subtle ways they can harass you. And

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<v Speaker 2>I mean I've sat to faculty meetings where we're supposed

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<v Speaker 2>to be talking about the business of our school, classes, enrollment,

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<v Speaker 2>things like that, and we will touch on those and

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<v Speaker 2>then we get right into left wing politics and how

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<v Speaker 2>bad Conservatives and Christians are, and so there's all kinds

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<v Speaker 2>of ways that you can you can be made to

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<v Speaker 2>feel uncomfortable at work, which if it was done to

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<v Speaker 2>anyone else, they would say, hey, that's illegal.

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<v Speaker 1>Unless you drop to your knees and pledge fealty to

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<v Speaker 1>their religion. Yeah, exactly. Uh, doctor owan Anderson.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry, Well, you just said is important. It's a religion.

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<v Speaker 2>It has all the same marks of religion. And I

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<v Speaker 2>don't say that as a put down because I'm I'm

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<v Speaker 2>a Christian. I'm not actually also a Christian pastor. But

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<v Speaker 2>it has the marks of a religion in terms of

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<v Speaker 2>having assumptions that you're not allowed to question, and then

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<v Speaker 2>having this kind of missionary zeal where they want to

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<v Speaker 2>convert all the young people to their religion.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, and like some religions or even the phases of

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<v Speaker 1>Christianity of the past, they want to hurt anyone who

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<v Speaker 1>refuses to come around. But we're about out of time,

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<v Speaker 1>you know. We ought to have doctor Anderson back again sometime,

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<v Speaker 1>whether orm the air or to do a podcast. I

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<v Speaker 1>would love to do a podcast on logical fallacies. That's

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<v Speaker 1>one of my favorite things. Yeah, but hey, hey, stay

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<v Speaker 1>in touch on this. We're one hundred percent on your side,

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<v Speaker 1>rooting for you, and it's been great to talk.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks, thank you so much.

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<v Speaker 4>And as you learn, Nietzsche's a bunch of crap.

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<v Speaker 1>So just to summarize, yeah

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<v Speaker 2>Armstrong and Getty