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Speaker 1: Lots of phellows, ladies. Okay, I'm in Williamsburg, Virginia, touring

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Speaker 1: the old gallows, where eighteenth century criminals were publicly executed.

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Speaker 1: It has been the site of the final breaths for

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Speaker 1: countless thieves, grifters, and murderers. In the summer of seventeen

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Speaker 1: fifty two, a convicted killer named John Sparks escaped the

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Speaker 1: nearby jail by sawing the iron bars and bashing the

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Speaker 1: guard over the head with a bottle. He was captured

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Speaker 1: the next day and then quickly executed. The public jail

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Speaker 1: in Williamsburg, like all jails, has a troubled history.

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Speaker 2: That's what it would have looked.

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Speaker 1: Like right here, this structure right over there. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: this is where they would hang people. What was the method?

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Speaker 3: Was it and weight?

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Speaker 1: In the eighteen hundreds, it was like the weight down.

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Speaker 1: I think it was the weight, but I would double

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Speaker 1: check with Cash on that one.

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Speaker 2: It's a terrible way to die.

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Speaker 1: It's so much better to be dropped.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it's it's brutal.

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Speaker 1: That's historian and interpreter Nicole Brown. She and site supervisor

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Speaker 1: Cash ear Hart are giving me a tour of where

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Speaker 1: so many people were hanged in this town's history. Cash

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Speaker 1: gives us a little summary of how convicted criminals in

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Speaker 1: the seventeen hundreds met their fate, and it's terrible. Well,

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Speaker 1: there were two different methods predominantly in the eighteen hundreds.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, do you know what method of hanging they would use?

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Speaker 3: The gallows Here, you would be stood up in the

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Speaker 3: back of the cart or the wagon with the noose

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Speaker 3: attached around your neck and suspended from the beam of

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Speaker 3: the gallows, and the slack would be removed from the rope,

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Speaker 3: so the cart would be pulled out and the condemned

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Speaker 3: would be left there. Who dangle under their own weight?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I asked Cash if a person's size mattered, and

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Speaker 1: it does, so.

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Speaker 3: A lighter person, somebody who doesn't weigh a whole lot,

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Speaker 3: it would likely take them much longer to expire than

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Speaker 3: someone who was heavier. There's more weight pulling down on them.

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Speaker 3: They would suffocate, possibly even break their neck in a

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Speaker 3: shorter amount of time.

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Speaker 4: But regardless, I mean to have to think about that,

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Speaker 4: think about your demise of like, am I heavy enough?

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Speaker 2: Am I too light? Like that?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: It was probably traumatic.

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Speaker 1: Trauma is the right word for this season. There are

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Speaker 1: three controversial deaths in the story, and each of them

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Speaker 1: contributed to a larger narrative why the American Revolutionary War

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Speaker 1: even began. You've likely never heard of any of these

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Speaker 1: men the ones who died. One died of natural causes,

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Speaker 1: but his secrets shook the colonies and the crown. The

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Speaker 1: second man died by a sword, and his murder triggered

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Speaker 1: protests that frightened the upper class. And the third man

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Speaker 1: died in a very mysterious way. This is a story

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Speaker 1: about justice lost and then perhaps regained by some measure.

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Speaker 1: It's the most interesting true crime case that you've never

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Speaker 1: heard of that is extraordinarily well documented for.

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Speaker 2: What it is. It's a tragic story, very tragic, as

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Speaker 2: you say, the ripple effects of how many people. It

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Speaker 2: just sort of goes out how many people were caught

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Speaker 2: and this murder.

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Speaker 1: It's about the upstairs and the downstairs residents of Virginia,

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Speaker 1: including those enslaved in the manor houses and the tobacco fields.

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Speaker 1: And it's about the people who were determined to march

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Speaker 1: toward war despite the very poor odds of winning.

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Speaker 2: I think this is a very human story. Just as

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Speaker 2: people today feel pressure, people in the eighteenth century, worry

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Speaker 2: about their families may actually take some desperate measures to

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Speaker 2: protect their family, protect their reputations.

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Speaker 1: I'm Kate Winkler Dawson, a crime historian and the author

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Speaker 1: of All That Is Wicked and American Sherlock. And this

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Speaker 1: is our new season of tenfold More Wicked. This is

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Speaker 1: our oldest story yet. For this season, we're in seventeen

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Speaker 1: sixty six Williamsburg, Virginia, where the money is plentiful for

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Speaker 1: a select few. Most of my work is in the

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Speaker 1: nineteenth century, but this really is my favorite time period.

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Speaker 1: America is not America yet. The Revolutionary War is brewing,

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Speaker 1: the swords are drawn, but justice might be elusive because

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Speaker 1: the killer is privileged. We called this season entitled. And

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Speaker 1: when we're talking about entitlement in a court of law,

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Speaker 1: it means the same thing now that it did in

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Speaker 1: the seventeen hundreds. Can your status in life help you

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Speaker 1: avoid a legal punishment? Yes, of course it can, and

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Speaker 1: it did in this case. First, let's start with a

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Speaker 1: history lesson, and we'll also clarify some terms. We're less

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Speaker 1: than a decade before the seventeen seventy five start of

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Speaker 1: the American Revolutionary War between what were called the British

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Speaker 1: Colonies and Great Britain. Later they would be called the

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Speaker 1: United Colonies, but they weren't united in the years that

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Speaker 1: we're talking about. They were still very separate. At this

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Speaker 1: point there were thirteen colonies. My daughter just learned about

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Speaker 1: them in school, so I had to quizzer for a test.

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Speaker 1: The original colonies were Georgia, South Carolina, North Carolina, Virginia, Maryland, Delaware,

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Speaker 1: New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, Massachusetts, and

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Speaker 1: New Hampshire. In sixteen oh seven, more than a century

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Speaker 1: and a half before our story starts, the colony of

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Speaker 1: Virginia was the first to receive its charter from King

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Speaker 1: James the First. This gave it a special designation the

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Speaker 1: Crown's first child in America. Robert Weathers is an actor

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Speaker 1: and storyteller with the Colonial Williamsburg Foundation. He says that

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Speaker 1: in the mid eighteenth century, Virginia was the brightest jewel

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Speaker 1: in England's crown.

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Speaker 4: Charles the Second refers to Virginia as his loyal old dominion,

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Speaker 4: and that loyalty is rooted in a general understanding that

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Speaker 4: those who are in charge are supposed to be in.

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Speaker 1: Charge, and they were in charge. The top one to

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Speaker 1: two percent of the most prosperous people ran Virginia, the

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Speaker 1: Crown's most powerful colony. Virginia served as the King's prototype

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Speaker 1: for how each of the other twelve colonies should evolve,

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Speaker 1: with tax collectors who could accumulate wealth for England and

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Speaker 1: control for the King. England's expansion was a priority for

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Speaker 1: the Crown.

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Speaker 4: So Virginia. It is the largest, the wealthiest, the most

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Speaker 4: populous of all the colonies, and I think a lot

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Speaker 4: of Virginians would consider themselves to be the most British

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Speaker 4: of all of the thirteen colonies in North America.

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Speaker 1: In seventeen sixty six America, there were loyalists, people who

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Speaker 1: were loyal to England, and there were rebels sometimes called patriots,

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Speaker 1: the people who increasingly wanted independence from England. And then

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Speaker 1: there was the crown, the King of England. There was

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Speaker 1: tension between the three groups, the loyalists the rebels in

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Speaker 1: the Crown. There always had been. Cash Earhart is a

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Speaker 1: supervisor in the Department of Historical Interpretation of Colonial Williamsburg.

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Speaker 1: He and Nicole Brown worked together. I asked Cash about

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Speaker 1: the difference between a patriot and a loyalist. He said

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Speaker 1: that he avoids specifically using patriots and loyalists when he

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Speaker 1: talks about the eighteenth century because they were subjective terms.

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Speaker 1: Someone who was loyal to their country was a loyalist,

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Speaker 1: but the patriots felt the same way they were loyal

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Speaker 1: sounds a bit like today, who is loyal and who

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Speaker 1: is patriotic? So I'll just stick with rebels. Back to

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Speaker 1: seventeen sixty six, there had already been skirmishes between loyalists

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Speaker 1: and rebels in New York, and very soon they would

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Speaker 1: collide and there would be so much bloodshed. But this

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Speaker 1: story isn't about the war or even the fighting that

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Speaker 1: led up to the war. Three men in Virginia would

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Speaker 1: die tragically, painfully before the war even began, all over entitlement.

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Speaker 1: Two were members of the gentry class. One was a

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Speaker 1: humble merchant with a huge group of loyal friends. Each

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Speaker 1: death in some ways changed history. My kids and I

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Speaker 1: are on a wagon drawn by two large horses as

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Speaker 1: we travel across Old Williamsburg, Virginia, during an impromptu tour.

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Speaker 1: The Colonial Williamsburg Foundation has done an outstanding job reconstructing

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Speaker 1: the town from the eighteenth century sites are still being

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Speaker 1: excavated to resurrect history, and we're here close to the

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Speaker 1: fourth of July, so there are people everywhere still seeing

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Speaker 1: the town recreated like this is really fascinating, and by

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Speaker 1: the time we finish, I've got more questions that need answers.

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Speaker 1: Julie Richter is a lecturer in early American history at

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Speaker 1: the College of William and Mary in Williamsburg. I asked

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Speaker 1: her about the socioeconomic makeup of Williamsburg in seventeen sixty six,

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Speaker 1: because remember, Virginia had been the richest of the American colonies.

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Speaker 2: Let me start with like the social levels first, that

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Speaker 2: Williamsburg and the Colony of Virginia was home to some

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Speaker 2: very prosperous, very comfortably rich, economically comfortable, socially dominant, and

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Speaker 2: politically dominant families, often called the gentry, sort of the

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Speaker 2: top four to five percent of the colony's population.

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Speaker 1: That's another important term from this period that we've already mentioned, gentry.

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Speaker 2: And then there's really even range within that group of

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Speaker 2: people that there are some who are amazingly powerful, amazingly prosperous,

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Speaker 2: at least on paper they look solid, and some people

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Speaker 2: call them the super gentry.

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Speaker 1: We'll talk a lot about the super gentry in this story,

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Speaker 1: the richest of the rich in the richest colony in America.

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Speaker 1: We'll visit the gentry's palatial homes. We'll talk about their

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Speaker 1: seemingly perfect lives, and we'll discuss their tragic deaths.

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Speaker 2: Virginia on the eve of the Revolution is the largest

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Speaker 2: and most populous and most powerful of the thirteen colonies

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Speaker 2: that decide to declare their independence, and the wealth contained

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Speaker 2: in Virginia is immense.

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Speaker 1: In the colonial period, the declaration of independence would be

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Speaker 1: signed in seventeen seventy six, when America was born, but

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Speaker 1: in seventeen sixty six, a decade earlier. The gentry were

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Speaker 1: generally loyalists to the crown through and through. Kelly Brennan

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Speaker 1: is a historian with the Old Williamsburg Foundation. She says

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Speaker 1: that the town's elite often deferred to the king rather

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Speaker 1: than try to forge their own identity because they were

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Speaker 1: English after all.

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Speaker 5: They spent a lot of time, especially the established elete,

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Speaker 5: mimicking and trying to base their entire existence on the

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Speaker 5: English power structure.

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Speaker 1: Robert Weathers says that the crown was in financial trouble

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Speaker 1: after a major war.

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Speaker 4: What happens is with the conclusion of the French and

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Speaker 4: Indian War in seventeen sixty three, the British government racks

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Speaker 4: up a debt of over one hundred and forty million pounds,

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Speaker 4: which we might giggle at today, but it is a

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Speaker 4: wild sum.

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Speaker 1: That was an incredible amount of debt, more than thirty

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Speaker 1: trillion dollars today and during the following years, the debt

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Speaker 1: in England created an economic depression in the United Colonies.

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Speaker 1: Historian Julie Richter says that to decrease the debt and

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Speaker 1: mitigate the economic uncertainty, England did what most countries would do.

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Speaker 1: It increased taxes on the colonies by a lot.

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Speaker 2: The Sugar Act, the Stampback, the Townshend Acts, the Declaratory Act,

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Speaker 2: this whole series of pieces of legislation. None of the

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Speaker 2: colonists like this. And it wasn't just the taxes. Virginians

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Speaker 2: deeply believed that they had the right to impose any

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Speaker 2: tax on themselves.

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Speaker 1: They believed that only they had that right, not the Crown,

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Speaker 1: and any taxes they levied should stay in Virginia, not

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Speaker 1: go to England. Future founding father Patrick Henry began to

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Speaker 1: push back publicly against the Crown in speeches, but he

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Speaker 1: was in the minority.

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Speaker 2: They were the more moderate, maybe even conservative, members of

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Speaker 2: the gentry who didn't want to push When you start

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Speaker 2: questioning Parliament and questioning the King, you're questioning the whole

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Speaker 2: social order. Sure, and that's a big deal. Declaring independence

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Speaker 2: is a complete rejection of your social hierarchy with the

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Speaker 2: king at the top of it.

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Speaker 1: Just to be clear, these taxes were imposed against the

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Speaker 1: United colum colonies only, not the people in England. Cash

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Speaker 1: Earhart says that this really upset the colonies, especially the rebels.

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Speaker 3: There's a lot of instability that is starting to show

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Speaker 3: the fact that the American people are becoming a distinct

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Speaker 3: people from their English brethren. But it's a very diverse group.

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Speaker 3: You know, South Carolinians and New Englanders are as foreign

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Speaker 3: to Virginia as France and Spain. In some ways, we

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Speaker 3: do more trade with France and Spain and their colonies

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Speaker 3: than we have with Boston or New York or South Carolina.

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Speaker 1: The Crown had given the colonies some rights from Afar.

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Speaker 1: They had set up their own governments and elected their

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Speaker 1: own officials, but they were still ruled by the King,

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Speaker 1: they paid higher taxes, and the Crown forced colonists to

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Speaker 1: host British soldiers in their home, providing them with a

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Speaker 1: place to sleep and with food. Some colonists had trouble

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Speaker 1: even feeding themselves, let alone soldiers. And now the Crown

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Speaker 1: was threatening to tighten its rule on the colonies and

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Speaker 1: taking away rights that had already been granted is almost

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Speaker 1: never a good idea.

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Speaker 3: And when they see Parliament and the Crown begin to

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Speaker 3: erode those rights that they have exercised here in America

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Speaker 3: in the case of Virginia for over one hundred and

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Speaker 3: fifty years since they established their first colony and settlement

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Speaker 3: at Jamestown, they see that as a threat. This is

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Speaker 3: a foreign people, the King, Parliament. They don't come to America.

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Speaker 3: They aren't familiar with us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that might sound odd to call the English foreign people,

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Speaker 1: but remember that it had been more than one hundred

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Speaker 1: and fifty years since the colonies were established. Most people

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Speaker 1: in England had no idea what the colonies over were

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Speaker 1: even like. In seventeen sixty four, Parliament passed the Sugar Tax,

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Speaker 1: which taxed sugar, molasses and other products imported into the

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Speaker 1: American colonies. From areas in the Caribbean not controlled by

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Speaker 1: the King. In seventeen sixty seven, Parliament passed the Townsend Acts,

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Speaker 1: which tax the colonies on glass, lead, paint, and tea,

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Speaker 1: among other things. But the tax that seemed to upset

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Speaker 1: people the most was the stamp tax in seventeen sixty five,

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Speaker 1: two years earlier. Robert Weathers offers a lesson on why

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Speaker 1: the Stamp Act was so difficult for the colonists. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't really about stamps.

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Speaker 4: The stamp tax is not a tax on stamps per se.

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Speaker 4: It is a tax on paper goods. So anything paper

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Speaker 4: more or less requires a stamp. So you can think

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Speaker 4: about things like pamphlets, newspapers, books, degrees from the college.

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Speaker 4: Even things, as we point out a lot here at

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Speaker 4: Colonial Williamsburg like dice become wrapped in paper and and

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Speaker 4: playing cards require the stamp.

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Speaker 1: So the Stamp Act affected everyone in the colonies, rich

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Speaker 1: and poor. Of course, the poor were the most affected.

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Speaker 4: It's really obvious to people here in North America that

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Speaker 4: this act is pinned by the wealthiest men and the

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Speaker 4: wealthiest part of the Empire, who have no idea what

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Speaker 4: Virginia's actually can afford.

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Speaker 1: This increase in taxes made life difficult for the average

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Speaker 1: white citizen in Williamsburg. We'll talk more about the experiences

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Speaker 1: of black people in Williamsburg later on, because clearly they

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Speaker 1: had a different experience than even the white servants had.

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Speaker 2: There's actually a range of experiences in Williamsburg and anywhere

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Speaker 2: in Virginia. In the seventeen sixties. There has been some

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Speaker 2: economic depression after the end of the French and Indian War.

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Speaker 2: There's great concern about the various pieces of legislation Parliament

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Speaker 2: is approving to raise money to pay for the French

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Speaker 2: and Indian War.

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Speaker 1: The Stamp Act was passed by Parliament in London in

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Speaker 1: seventeen sixty five, a year before the deaths in this

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Speaker 1: story would take place. The Act was so unpopular that

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Speaker 1: it didn't even last a year, but Parliament and the

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Speaker 1: King still wanted to tighten England's grip on the colonies.

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Speaker 1: The day that the Crown repealed the Stamp Act, it

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Speaker 1: also passed the Declaratory Act. It was a declaration that

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Speaker 1: Parliament had total power to tax the colonies, just like

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Speaker 1: it did in Great Britain. By seventeen sixty six, everyone

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Speaker 1: in Virginia was concerned about the increased taxes and the

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Speaker 1: increased financial burden on their lives, and the lack of

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Speaker 1: political power even the gentry.

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Speaker 2: So while the gentry are comfortable, they're worried about an

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Speaker 2: increased tax burden. The economic depression is hitting the middling

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Speaker 2: and lower folks harder because they have less in reserve.

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Speaker 1: Some of the colonists protested loudly. Others did so in

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Speaker 1: other ways.

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Speaker 2: If you don't treat us the way we feel we

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Speaker 2: should be treated, we'll stop buying this long list of

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Speaker 2: goods from you, and you'll realize it's you actually you

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Speaker 2: need us.

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Speaker 1: Some of the colonists refused to buy goods that were

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Speaker 1: coming in from England. They hoped that would send a

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Speaker 1: strong message to the king, but it really didn't.

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Speaker 2: That was successful a few times, but it was hard

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Speaker 2: for Virginians to hold to this agreement. They are supposed

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Speaker 2: to buy all of their goods from English merchants. So

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Speaker 2: if you pledge not to buy material, you have little

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Speaker 2: material to make new clothes.

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Speaker 1: The colonists were furious because they were being taxed by England,

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Speaker 1: but at the same time they had no representation in

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Speaker 1: the English government. The crown could pass virtually any tax

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Speaker 1: it wanted on the colony because there was no one

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Speaker 1: fighting for their rights. It's true that they were represented

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Speaker 1: in their own colonies, but not in England, not with

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Speaker 1: a seat in Parliament. And as seventeen sixty six approached,

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Speaker 1: the colonists who weren't from the upper echelons of society

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Speaker 1: were fed up with the gentry, both back in England

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Speaker 1: and here in the colonies.

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Speaker 3: The colonists the establishment in Virginia. We haven't changed it's parliament.

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Speaker 3: They're changing the rules on us. They're infringing upon our

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Speaker 3: royal charters from the Crown that say we get to

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Speaker 3: have these rights as British subjects, we get to elect

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Speaker 3: our representatives to the legislature. This is parliament that is

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Speaker 3: trying to usurp our rights and change things.

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Speaker 1: It's strange to think that the Revolutionary War didn't begin

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Speaker 1: with ideas that were actually revolutionary. Most of the colonists

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Speaker 1: didn't want more rights, They just wanted their old rights back.

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Speaker 3: In one sense, the revolution is a very radical idea

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Speaker 3: creating an independent nation, But what they were trying to

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Speaker 3: preserve are very conservative ideas. They want to keep things

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Speaker 3: the same as they had been for decades previously, and

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Speaker 3: then they start to evolve. You see the expansion of

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Speaker 3: voting rights, You see the disestablishment of the official church

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Speaker 3: in Virginia.

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Speaker 1: By seventeen sixty six, rebels had begun plotting against the crown,

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Speaker 1: laying the groundwork for a war. So called commoners in

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Speaker 1: the colonies had already eyed the members of the gentry

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Speaker 1: class with jealousy and suspicion. The gentry could do whatever

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Speaker 1: they pleased with impunity, it seemed. But now the question

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Speaker 1: is would that be true in this story. Before we

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Speaker 1: get to those controversies, the sudden death of a powerful

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Speaker 1: figure would stun England's most important colony. Williamsburg in the

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Speaker 1: eighteenth century was exciting. A city and a colony with

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Speaker 1: lots of money.

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Speaker 2: Williamsburg is a bustling city. In the seventeen sixties, close

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Speaker 2: to two thousand permanent residents. Approximately half of the city's

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Speaker 2: permanent population are people of color, both enslaved and free blacks.

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Speaker 2: You would have heard multiple languages being spoken if you

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Speaker 2: visited Williamsburg. It's a busy I know some people laugh

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Speaker 2: when I say this cosmopolitan place.

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Speaker 1: One of Williamsburg's most prominent residents was Colonel John Chas.

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Speaker 1: He was born in seventeen ten in Hanover County, Virginia,

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Speaker 1: an area now known as Scotch Town. His father, Charles,

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Speaker 1: was an immigrant from Scotland, but he was not a

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Speaker 1: typical Scottish merchant. Charles Chisel was a land spectator and

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Speaker 1: a plantation owner. He cultivated tobacco on his family's land,

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Speaker 1: and he was a local politician. When Charles died, he

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Speaker 1: left his only child, John, more than fifty thousand acres.

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Speaker 1: Over the years, John acquired more and more assets and

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Speaker 1: his political influence grew. Eventually, he also invested in mine operations,

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Speaker 1: which could be very lucrative. The Chisel name really meant

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Speaker 1: something in Scotchtown and Williamsburg. In fact, his large manor

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Speaker 1: house still sits in Williamsburg, a sprawling testament to his

358
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Speaker 1: standing in seventeen hundred society. Now the politics, Chisel was

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Speaker 1: a staunch loyalist. He was committed to the Crown. He

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Speaker 1: also was a politician. Chisel had been a member of

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Speaker 1: the House of Burgesses. Another quick history lesson. The House

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Speaker 1: of Burgesses was the first legislative body in the United

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Speaker 1: Colonies that was democratically elected. It held its first meeting

364
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Speaker 1: in Jamestown, Virginia, in sixteen nineteen. Some of the most

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Speaker 1: important men in the colonies served in the House founding

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Speaker 1: fathers like George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and Patrick Henry. John

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Speaker 1: Chisel was a burgess from seventeen fifty six until seventeen

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Speaker 1: fifty eight, when he was in his forties. Chisel was articulate, affluent,

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Speaker 1: and gifted at business, it seemed, but in many ways,

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Speaker 1: Colonel Chisel's life was gilded. Historians Julie Richter and Kelly

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Speaker 1: Brennan explained that he wasn't technically a colonel. It was

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Speaker 1: more of an honorary title.

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Speaker 2: Each county had its own militia, and the titles were

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Speaker 2: often honorific. Colonel Chisel tells us that, yeah, he was

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Speaker 2: active in his local militia. They would have drilled near

376
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Speaker 2: their courthouse several times a year, but you know, active

377
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Speaker 2: fighting most likely not. You know, during the French and

378
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Speaker 2: Indian War, Peyton Randolph gathered a group of men and

379
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Speaker 2: he was going to lead them to western Pennsylvania and

380
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Speaker 2: they never left the colony of Virginia. I don't know

381
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Speaker 2: if Chisel was in that group or not, but most

382
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Speaker 2: of the elite. Anybody like a colonel is not did

383
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Speaker 2: not see active fighting.

384
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Speaker 5: And usually it's going to be our lieutenant governor is

385
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Speaker 5: handing out titles basically, you know how like there's yes,

386
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Speaker 5: it's like they're exactly it's exactly like that. It's that

387
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Speaker 5: they can't actually build their own aristocracy. So what they

388
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Speaker 5: do is the gives out like these really kind of

389
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Speaker 5: stupid and it's usually colonel and it's not and they're

390
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Speaker 5: technically made colonel of something. I don't remember what it

391
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Speaker 5: is for him.

392
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Speaker 1: In seventeen thirty six, John Chisel married a woman named

393
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Speaker 1: Elizabeth Randolph, who was five years younger. Elizabeth hailed from

394
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Speaker 1: one of the most famous families in the colonies. A

395
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Speaker 1: French traveler once wrote, no family in colonial Virginia was

396
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Speaker 1: more prominent or more powerful than the Randolphs. They were

397
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Speaker 1: one of the wealthiest dynasties in what would become America

398
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Speaker 1: as we know it today. When writing Moby Dick in

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Speaker 1: eighteen fifty one, Herman Melville cited the Randolphs as the

400
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Speaker 1: quintessential old established family in the land. In the seventeen hundreds,

401
00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: many of the landed gentry and upper classes of Virginia

402
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 1: were connected, and now John Chisel was connected to the

403
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:43,880
Speaker 1: Randolphs through marriage. Janice Kennedy is an interpreter and site

404
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,360
Speaker 1: supervisor with the Colonial Williamsburg Foundation.

405
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Speaker 6: What you have to understand is in this town, you

406
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 6: know the gentry. The Randolphs represent the gentry. Some say

407
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,159
Speaker 6: two percent, some books say five percent, but a very

408
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Speaker 6: small percentage of the town's population who are the very,

409
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Speaker 6: very wealthy. They owned a large home, the large tracts

410
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 6: of land, and they sit in the government offices. And

411
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Speaker 6: Randols have always been involved in government. They are making

412
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Speaker 6: the rules and laws for everyone.

413
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Speaker 1: Elizabeth and John started their lives in Scotch Town and

414
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Speaker 1: his family's sprawling eight room house. For several years, Elizabeth

415
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 1: wasn't the lady of the house because Chisel's mother remained

416
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Speaker 1: alive until seventeen fifty. Between seventeen thirty seven and seventeen

417
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Speaker 1: fifty two, John and Elizabeth Chisel had four children, all girls, Susannah, Mary, Lucy,

418
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Speaker 1: and Elizabeth. No boys, which was a problem for the

419
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,200
Speaker 1: longevity of the Chisel's name. It certainly made it harder

420
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Speaker 1: on me to find relatives today. The family eventually moved

421
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,879
Speaker 1: to Williamsburg, probably because of John Chisel's business dealings. He

422
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 1: partially owned a tavern in town, and by then he

423
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Speaker 1: was a member of the House of Burgesses. Chisel was

424
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Speaker 1: described as arrogant and quick tempered, while his wife was

425
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:57,159
Speaker 1: considered kind. She had taken in her sister's two sons

426
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,400
Speaker 1: when their parents died. She was also very real religious.

427
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Speaker 1: An acquaintance described her as a most amiable lady. From

428
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Speaker 1: her door, the needy were never sent empty away. Elizabeth

429
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 1: seemed to tolerate her husband's fits, as many eighteenth century

430
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:18,479
Speaker 1: wives would. Now, let's talk about John Chisel's inner circle.

431
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Speaker 1: The most important ally he had was a man named

432
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Speaker 1: John Robinson. He will be a key to this case.

433
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Speaker 7: So my surname is Robinson, and I suppose I was

434
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 7: in my late teens when my grandfather gave me a

435
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:40,920
Speaker 7: book all about the Robinson's and their one hundred and

436
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:45,720
Speaker 7: fifty years they spent in the Americas, particularly in Virginia

437
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 7: and New York.

438
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 1: Simon Robinson knows a lot about this story because he

439
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 1: is one of John Robinson's descendants.

440
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:59,760
Speaker 7: I was aware of my four greats grandfather called Beverly Robinson,

441
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:05,520
Speaker 7: and he had an older brother called John Robinson, who

442
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 7: was the speaker and treasurer of the Virginia House of Burgesses.

443
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:13,520
Speaker 1: Simon says that John Robinson was a loyalist.

444
00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:18,280
Speaker 7: Of course, clearly, the Robinsons were very much of the

445
00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:23,800
Speaker 7: loyalist persuasion. Even though there had not been residents in

446
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:28,240
Speaker 7: England for over one hundred years, there was regular travel

447
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 7: and education that took place in England, and you know,

448
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:36,840
Speaker 7: their bread was buttered on the loyalist side, keeping in

449
00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 7: with the crown.

450
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 1: But John Robinson was so much more than a politician.

451
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 7: I mean, it's difficult for us to imagine how that

452
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 7: sort of new style aristocracy worked in Virginia. And you

453
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:56,040
Speaker 7: had John Robinson, who was the son of Well his

454
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 7: father had been President of the Council of Virginia, and

455
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 7: his grandfather had been the immigrant to Virginia in the

456
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 7: mid seventeenth century. So they'd created a long line at

457
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 7: that stage of landowners, highly respected, seen as pillars of

458
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 7: the community.

459
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 1: The Robinsons were part of the upper echelons of society

460
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 1: in Virginia, and John Robinson had been speaker and treasurer

461
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 1: for more than twenty years, so.

462
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 7: This was a really significant person in the Colony. Whilst

463
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 7: he was Speaker, he lavished praise on George Washington for

464
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 7: his role in the French Indian Wars. You know, all

465
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:43,720
Speaker 7: of these families knew each other very intimately.

466
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,560
Speaker 1: But John Robinson didn't agree with George Washington's later ideas

467
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:51,160
Speaker 1: on politics, and he was also very critical of another

468
00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:53,880
Speaker 1: young member of the House of Burgesses.

469
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 5: Patrick Henry, who ends up being showing up in a

470
00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 5: few spots. He's one of these firebrands and he's coming

471
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 5: from further out. He does have gentry ties and he

472
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 5: actually has a tie to a sort of a tie

473
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:09,720
Speaker 5: at Chisel. So he's the guy who when it comes

474
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 5: to the Stamp Act, he he's pushing politically these kind

475
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 5: of radical ideas about basically telling the King and Parliament

476
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 5: we're not doing this, we are not doing this.

477
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 1: Patrick Henry's most famous speech is when he proclaims, give

478
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:27,280
Speaker 1: me liberty or give me death. But this one was

479
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 1: delivered ten years earlier. It was seventeen sixty five and

480
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 1: Patrick Henry was sitting in a session in the House

481
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 1: of Burgesses in Richmond. He eyed Speaker John Robinson. Henry

482
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 1: rose and began his attack on the Stamp Act and

483
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:45,800
Speaker 1: the British Parliament's right to tax the colonies.

484
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 5: And he gives this speech that I think is better

485
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 5: than liberty or death. I think it is actually one

486
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:52,800
Speaker 5: of the best quotes at the very end of it

487
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:55,959
Speaker 5: of the Revolutionary period, like full stop. It's known as

488
00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 5: the Caesar Brutish Speech. So this one takes place here

489
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 5: in Williamsburg seventeen sixty five, and the most sort of

490
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:07,400
Speaker 5: famous part of it is Caesar had his brutus Charles

491
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 5: the first, his Cromwell, and George the third.

492
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 1: Patrick Henry was insinuating that the King of England could

493
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 1: be assassinated for his decisions, just like Caesar.

494
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 5: And everybody jumps up in the House of Burgesses and

495
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 5: starts screaming, and they're yelling it's treason, it's treason, it's treason,

496
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,680
Speaker 5: exactly I was gonna say. And John Robinson's yelling the loudest.

497
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 1: John Robinson was furious, while Patrick Henry seemed pleased. He

498
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 1: spoke again and declared something that seemed to be pretty threatening.

499
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 5: If this be treason, make the most of it. And

500
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 5: that's a big message to be sending to these guys,

501
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 5: especially when you're looking at somebody like Robinson.

502
00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 1: Some rebels believed that the Stamp Act was their last

503
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 1: stand and they wanted to pressure the Crown to reverse it.

504
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:03,120
Speaker 1: It seemed like war was coming. I asked Robert Weathers

505
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: about the impact the Stamp Act had. Is the Stamp

506
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 1: Act the first major volley?

507
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I think so. What kicks off the War

508
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 4: for Independence generally is regarded as the signing of the

509
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 4: Treaty of Paris and the debt wrecked up from the war,

510
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 4: and the stamp Tax is the first friction, you know,

511
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:26,240
Speaker 4: the real friction between North America and Great Britain.

512
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 1: This friction would continue to build, but we're still a

513
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: decade before the war. Because many of the powerful, including

514
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: John Chisel, didn't want things to change at all. It

515
00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 1: had taken generations to build their status in society, and

516
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 1: they were determined to maintain it for the next generation.

517
00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 3: Chisel is part of the elite, the old guard, the

518
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 3: very top of establishment society. Hit one of his homes.

519
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 3: Of his several houses, one is here in the capital

520
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 3: in Williamsburg. All of his daughters, they make very excellent matches.

521
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:11,040
Speaker 3: They stay in that strata of society.

522
00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:14,800
Speaker 1: Remember how the members of the gentry continued to stay

523
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:19,720
Speaker 1: powerful for generations. They married each other. John Chisel married

524
00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 1: a Randolph, and now he needed one of his daughters, Susannah,

525
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 1: to marry someone just as powerful.

526
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 5: For Chisel, it is really important that his daughter had married.

527
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,839
Speaker 5: Doesn't matter what the difference was. It didn't matter if

528
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 5: you know he had crawled out of the dismal swamp,

529
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:38,279
Speaker 5: as long as the guy was gentry and powerful. I mean,

530
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 5: we know that he was ridiculously powerful.

531
00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 1: She's talking about John Robinson. John Chisel either convinced or

532
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,239
Speaker 1: commanded his young daughter to marry a man who was

533
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:50,040
Speaker 1: older than her own father.

534
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 7: I'd say with Chisel and John Robinson. For him to

535
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 7: marry off his nineteen year old daughter to a fifty

536
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 7: four year old man who's exceedingly powerful and one has

537
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:07,320
Speaker 7: already has business relationships, I personally questioned how much free

538
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:12,160
Speaker 7: will was in existence for the bride.

539
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd agree. I doubt that nineteen year old Susannah

540
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:19,680
Speaker 1: had any choice. In seventeen fifty nine, she would become

541
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:23,719
Speaker 1: John Robinson's third wife, and now John Chisel was the

542
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:27,759
Speaker 1: father in law of the most powerful and most dangerous

543
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 1: man in Virginia. Robinson and Chisel were now grafted together

544
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:35,320
Speaker 1: by marriage.

545
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:40,960
Speaker 7: So there was a relationship by marriage between the brother

546
00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:46,120
Speaker 7: of my full greats grandfather and Chisel, and they were

547
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:51,439
Speaker 7: also in business together. John Robinson and John Chisel had

548
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 7: invested in various schemes, including a mining operation, and so

549
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:58,560
Speaker 7: they were very much intertwined.

550
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:01,760
Speaker 1: If you've listened to Pass Seasons of Tenfold, you'll likely

551
00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:06,640
Speaker 1: remember that sometimes powerful families becoming intertwined doesn't work out

552
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 1: so well. We told you another story set in Virginia

553
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 1: about a family feud between the Witchers and the Clements.

554
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:16,560
Speaker 1: And along the way I learned that reputation was everything

555
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:21,399
Speaker 1: to people in Virginia. Everything I asked Janis Kennedy about

556
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: the joining of families in Virginia through marriage.

557
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:25,840
Speaker 3: It's very important.

558
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:31,280
Speaker 6: It's part of that picture of success and permanence and family,

559
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:34,719
Speaker 6: and it helps us to create a societal picture about you.

560
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 6: That status, and it's a thing that's not going to

561
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:41,799
Speaker 6: be looked at lightly. Even if there's difficulty there, and

562
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,799
Speaker 6: we know their difficulty in those situations, they find a

563
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:47,080
Speaker 6: way to deal with it, but they don't ever. They

564
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:50,200
Speaker 6: might separate and go different spaces, different places, but the

565
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,600
Speaker 6: legal aspects of it there's so much tied into that.

566
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:57,920
Speaker 6: Your value, your inheritance, your power is all tied into that.

567
00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: By seventeen sixty six, Robinson's and the Chisels were certainly intertwined,

568
00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 1: but no one had any idea how intertwined they'd become

569
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 1: until it was too late.

570
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:14,240
Speaker 7: In this book that my grandfather gave me, I learnt

571
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 7: about what was called the Robinson scandal, the Robinson affair

572
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:22,960
Speaker 7: where in his role as speaker and treasurer, he had

573
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:27,080
Speaker 7: a love of power, he had access to money, and

574
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:31,000
Speaker 7: there had been an economic shock.

575
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:36,279
Speaker 1: The Robinson scandal was just the beginning. Sometimes we don't

576
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 1: find out what our loved ones were really doing with

577
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:43,360
Speaker 1: their lives, both good or bad, until after they are dead.

578
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 1: On May tenth, seventeen sixty six, John Robinson lay in

579
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:53,280
Speaker 1: his bed, crying out in agony and clutching his ribs.

580
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 1: The pain radiated throughout his body. His wife, Susannah was

581
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:02,359
Speaker 1: by his bedside. One Robinson seemed to be dying at

582
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 1: the age of sixty one. John Chisel fretted about his

583
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: son in law, and not just because he respected him

584
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: as a relative and a powerful politician. Robinson was key

585
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:16,640
Speaker 1: to Chisel's reputation in Virginia, and as Robinson lay in

586
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 1: his bed, clinging to life, the Speaker of the House

587
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:24,319
Speaker 1: of Burgesses kept a dark secret. It could ruin the

588
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:29,320
Speaker 1: Crown's most important, most prosperous colony. It was a secret

589
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:34,440
Speaker 1: that could also ruin John Robinson's family if anyone found out.

590
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:37,160
Speaker 1: And no one could have predicted how the story would end.

591
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 1: Three deaths and many more secrets. Did someone get away

592
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:47,279
Speaker 1: with a crime just because they were wealthy? And I

593
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: think that's a question, isn't it. Do you think the

594
00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:52,160
Speaker 1: law applies to you or do you think you're above it?

595
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,480
Speaker 1: On this season of tenfold war wicked on exactly right?

596
00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:01,799
Speaker 2: Are we starting to call it a divided nation?

597
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,759
Speaker 3: Well? Yeah, I mean, if you've ever seen the cartoon

598
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 3: that Benjamin Franklin drew of a snake chopped into pieces

599
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 3: and underneath it says unite or die. There is no

600
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:14,520
Speaker 3: common American identity.

601
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 2: The elite of Virginia deeply needed to display who they were.

602
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 2: You were honorable, if you had money, you were honorable.

603
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 2: If you could be a bountiful host.

604
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:32,279
Speaker 7: I mean, just having that key relationship fall away with

605
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:35,680
Speaker 7: the death of Robinson, that was all immediately a shock,

606
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:40,960
Speaker 7: then the unfolding financial scandal that tank would have been

607
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 7: on Chisel.

608
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:44,279
Speaker 8: They're all in there, they're all got their fingers in

609
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:46,680
Speaker 8: the by. It's like, all of a sudden, you know,

610
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:50,840
Speaker 8: the flashball went off and everybody's caught back and it

611
00:39:51,440 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 8: doesn't make the gentry look good.

612
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:05,879
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617
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Speaker 1: American Sherlock and All That Is Wicked. This has been

619
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Speaker 1: an exactly right tenfold More media production producer Jason Whaling,

620
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Speaker 1: Senior producer Alexis and Morosi. Consulting producer Kyle Ryan, researcher

621
00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:44,680
Speaker 1: Nicole Brown, sound designer Eric Friend, composer Curtis Heath, artwork

622
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 1: Nick Toga. Executive producers Georgia Hartstark, Karen Kilgarriff and Danielle Kramer.

623
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:54,760
Speaker 1: Follow us on Instagram and Facebook at tenfold More Wicked

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625
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Speaker 6: No No, No,