1 00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:06,680 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff 2 00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 3 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:16,800 Speaker 1: My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Douglas. And 4 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: today's episode is a bit of a special treat. Uh. 5 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:26,439 Speaker 1: We just sit down yesterday and we interviewed Neil Degrass Hyson, who, 6 00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: in addition to being an accomplished astrophysicist, is pretty much 7 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:35,520 Speaker 1: a science superstar. Yeah, he's everywhere and I'm sure people 8 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 1: have probably seen him on Colbert or Jon Stewart recently 9 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: on Bill Maher. Um, he's been a nova like all 10 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: the time. Yeah, yeah, he's he will Basically he is 11 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 1: the least camera shy scientist I've ever heard of. Like, 12 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:54,720 Speaker 1: he's just a huge extrovert and he's amazing doing a 13 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:57,440 Speaker 1: great advocate for science, and it's a real talent for 14 00:00:57,440 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 1: for taking this stuff down and just in talking about science, 15 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: uh in a way that his intended audience can really 16 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:06,039 Speaker 1: understand it. Be that intended audience, Um, you know, the 17 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 1: average Joe, the the listener, you know what, viewer of 18 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:12,800 Speaker 1: the Daily Show, or politician looking to pass some sort 19 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,000 Speaker 1: of bills. So yeah, we were very excited to be 20 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 1: able to get on the phone with him and ask 21 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:19,840 Speaker 1: him some questions about what he's been up to and 22 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 1: his thoughts on science and where does the state of 23 00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 1: it so to speak, all right, so let's uh let's 24 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:27,880 Speaker 1: go ahead and jump into it here. The first question 25 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: we had for Dr Tyson had to do with the 26 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 1: fact that there is a new Cosmos television show coming 27 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,960 Speaker 1: in so it's gonna be a little little ways off. 28 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:40,120 Speaker 1: But Cosmos is, of course the classic Carl Sagan show 29 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:43,280 Speaker 1: that just continues to uh to to have a big 30 00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 1: influence on people like people who grew up watching the show. 31 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 1: We're just really inspired about science and about the universe 32 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: and cosmology and just a just a really beautiful show. 33 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 1: And so they're they're bringing it back. Tyson is the 34 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:56,920 Speaker 1: new host, and so we had to ask him about 35 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: stepping in and filling Carl Sagan's shoes. It's a twenty 36 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 1: first century version of Cosmos, conceived as though it was 37 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 1: the first time it would it would be aired. However 38 00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 1: we already know. But what I mean by that is 39 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 1: there's a lot of issues and science frontiers and cultural 40 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:22,320 Speaker 1: social um dimensions to the relationship of science to society 41 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: that mattered today more or differently than they mattered years ago. Okay, 42 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 1: so we couldn't help it, but we had to ask, 43 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: you'd probably have to wear a turtle neck then in 44 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:38,080 Speaker 1: the new Consince. You know, if I do, it would 45 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: be some sort of back to our homage to Carl. 46 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:44,639 Speaker 1: But there are other ways we we can think of 47 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: honoring him without the turtle n I was a big 48 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:51,800 Speaker 1: turtle netwear in my day, but right, these are other 49 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: days that we're talking about, and so, uh so we'll 50 00:02:56,080 --> 00:02:58,560 Speaker 1: and my my wardrobe was not yet determined. Actually, we 51 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,400 Speaker 1: have to consult people who think deeply about this sort 52 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:02,800 Speaker 1: of thing. So he got a big kick out of that. 53 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:05,079 Speaker 1: Come to ask him about the sweater, I wanted to 54 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:07,400 Speaker 1: ask him. It was very intimidating talking to I wanted 55 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:09,679 Speaker 1: to ask him whether he would have his own spaceship 56 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 1: in the show, like like Sagan had. But um, you know, 57 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 1: like you said, they're still not even sure exactly what 58 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:17,160 Speaker 1: he's going to be wearing this, so perhaps those decisions, 59 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:20,000 Speaker 1: that's right, that's right. The best minds are on it, though, 60 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 1: So we also wanted to ask him some some more 61 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: hard core science questions here. We were particularly interested what 62 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 1: Tyson's take on this question would be, if he had 63 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:32,799 Speaker 1: had unlimited funding in his disposal, what two large scale 64 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:36,600 Speaker 1: astrophysics projects would he like to see realized and why. 65 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 1: He had a pretty awesome answer, And here's what his 66 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 1: answer was. We still don't know enough about the structural 67 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 1: integrity of asteroids too too to claim that we have 68 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 1: any clue about how to deflect them, or to destroy them, 69 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 1: or to mitigate what would otherwise be an extinction level 70 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 1: catastrophe on Earth, something that's happened before. So I would 71 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 1: do all the above. So so you know what NASA 72 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 1: would be. NASA would be like a space depot and 73 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 1: you go there and say, okay, I need to go 74 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:14,960 Speaker 1: to an asteroid that's orbiting beyond Mars, and you would 75 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: assemble the rocket propulsion elements to to your to your 76 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:25,039 Speaker 1: spacecraft necessary to reach that goal. Right, So it's like 77 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:27,039 Speaker 1: choosing what kind of fuel tank and what kind of 78 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: supplies and you pack it up and then you go. 79 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 1: And so it's not let's only go to this one 80 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:34,160 Speaker 1: destination and that would be what we that that will 81 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:36,480 Speaker 1: be the mission. No, all of space should be the mission. 82 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: Otherwise it's it's a one they're all one off you know, 83 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: if expansion of human presence, we're all one off, we 84 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 1: would all explore and then go back into the cave. 85 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:49,839 Speaker 1: It's okay, we did that. Um, let's think of something 86 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:52,160 Speaker 1: different to do. But of course, the history of our 87 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: species is one where we explore, we pitch tent, and 88 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:59,480 Speaker 1: then we explore from there and find ways to survive. 89 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:04,480 Speaker 1: And and our species has thrived because of this fact. 90 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 1: And space is simply another frontier where I had full 91 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 1: expectations that we continue the way we have. So I 92 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:17,359 Speaker 1: thought that was very thoughtful in talking about space is 93 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 1: more of a cohesive mission exploring space, and that we 94 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:23,919 Speaker 1: shouldn't necessarily have these one offs. And I really like 95 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: this this idea that we we don't just stop, you know, 96 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: we just don't go back to our caves and stop 97 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: thinking about these things and stop exploring. Yeah, And and 98 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:36,720 Speaker 1: that NASA should be like a you know, a home 99 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,479 Speaker 1: depot for space travel that I thought was pretty great. 100 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: And I could see like the little orange uh pests 101 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:46,600 Speaker 1: or whatever they wear, um, and how cool would that 102 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:49,279 Speaker 1: be to go and get your space parts there? But 103 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:51,279 Speaker 1: you know, this is sort of big The question or 104 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 1: or made us think a little bit more about funding 105 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 1: and how we are hamstrung by that currently in our 106 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:01,520 Speaker 1: environment we don't necessarily have all the funding out our disposals. 107 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 1: So we wanted to ask him about, uh, the sort 108 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: of unfortunate state of funding for space exploration. And we 109 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: had wondered if he thought it was just a current 110 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:14,440 Speaker 1: political zeitgeast, or if we're just not doing good enough 111 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 1: job of explaining why space exploration is important. And this 112 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: is what he had to say about it. Space exploration 113 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: should be funded, not for any normal reason. That's given 114 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: the fact to have a book coming out in February, 115 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:31,279 Speaker 1: which was originally titled Failure to Launch The Dreams and 116 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 1: Delusions of Space Enthusiasts, but the publisher felt the title 117 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:37,360 Speaker 1: was too depressing, so we came up with a less 118 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:41,280 Speaker 1: depressing title and what it will appear in the form 119 00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 1: of a book titled Space Chronicles. It's every thought I've 120 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 1: ever had about our past, present, and future in space, 121 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:53,840 Speaker 1: and out of that comes certain realizations that we've never 122 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:57,159 Speaker 1: gone into space because it's a frontier, or because it's 123 00:06:57,279 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 1: to explore, or because there's scientific to goveries to be had. 124 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 1: We've never gone into space with the Man program for 125 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: that reason. The man program is the lion's share of 126 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 1: the cost of space exploration. So and in fact, we've 127 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 1: never gone into space without humans above a certain cost level, 128 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 1: because there's a radar level below which you can fund 129 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 1: almost any science you want, and that's a function of 130 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 1: how wealthy the nation is that's conducting the activity. The 131 00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:31,760 Speaker 1: Hubble telescope, for example, that's essentially just at the limit, 132 00:07:31,800 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 1: a little bit below the funding radar. You can get 133 00:07:34,840 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: multibillion dollar projects funded over the years, but when you're 134 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 1: up around ten billion, thirty billion, that's where discovery and 135 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 1: it's our mission, it's in our DNA. None of that works. 136 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: None of it, or at least the history of the 137 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:57,640 Speaker 1: funding of expensive projects of our species and all cultures 138 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 1: and all civilizations, there is no evidence that we have 139 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 1: ever responded positively to those kinds of drivers. The only 140 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 1: drivers that really stimulate people to spend money is war 141 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:17,800 Speaker 1: and economics, and a third one which is less common today, 142 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:22,120 Speaker 1: the praise of royalty or deity. There was a day 143 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,040 Speaker 1: when you could use you can invoke one or both 144 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 1: of those and you can get anything done. That's how 145 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: you get the Pyramids and all the church building in Europe. 146 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 1: The Cathedrals of England, this sort of thing. You could 147 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:36,320 Speaker 1: do that if there's a power above you that you 148 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:41,559 Speaker 1: fear or that you want to praise too for your protection. 149 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 1: So but that doesn't happen much anymore. That leaves war 150 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,200 Speaker 1: and economics. We went to the Moon because we were 151 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: at war. We choose not to remember it that way, 152 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: but that was the driver. And but we remember it 153 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 1: as though was where Americans. Of course we're going to explore. 154 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 1: Without the war driver would have never had. And and 155 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:04,199 Speaker 1: so that's the blunt realization of it. So to say, 156 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:07,439 Speaker 1: let's become a space faring nation if it is, if 157 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: it is, if the arguments are absent these other drivers, 158 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:14,880 Speaker 1: then you would have to assert that we are a 159 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:18,800 Speaker 1: fundamentally different kind of civilization from all civilizations that have 160 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 1: ever preceded us. So I found that really fascinating. Um, 161 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 1: you know, the idea that that that for modern society, 162 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,720 Speaker 1: the big driver of this kind of advancement and what 163 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 1: we would need for like really hardcore investment in space 164 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 1: exploration is you know, the economic incentive or the war 165 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 1: incentative incentive. So on one level, I could not but 166 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 1: think what we need to do is fake an interplanetary war, 167 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 1: like we need to roll out the war the World's 168 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:46,760 Speaker 1: hoax for real, and then people will be like, oh 169 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:50,200 Speaker 1: my goodness, there's an alien race that wants to destroy us. Yes, 170 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 1: let's invest in space because there's a lot at stake here. 171 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:55,679 Speaker 1: This is war, this is serious, this is what humans 172 00:09:55,679 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 1: are all about. Um, you know, let's let's work on 173 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 1: those battle crisis. Yeah. But then of a sudden you're 174 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: rolling out study and their space lawyers. Right, it's gets 175 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,040 Speaker 1: a little bit more complicated. Space lawyers always complicate things. Um. 176 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 1: The other thing that did really fascinating. We've we've talked 177 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 1: before about the topic of religion and space, and I've 178 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:17,120 Speaker 1: I've blogged about it, and I actually got an accompanying 179 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: blog post for this podcast for Discovery Space where I 180 00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:21,960 Speaker 1: talked about this a little. But the idea like what 181 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 1: if you had to create a religion for space now, 182 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 1: And for some people, that's completely ridiculous because because science, 183 00:10:28,480 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: science is king and space exploration, there's no room for religion. Right, 184 00:10:31,960 --> 00:10:35,240 Speaker 1: That's that's certainly that's a valid argument. But the other 185 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 1: side of the argument that I'm not I'm not necessarily 186 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 1: saying like this is what we need to do. But 187 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:41,200 Speaker 1: it's interesting sort of thought process is what if we 188 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:44,720 Speaker 1: created a religion to make to make space, to support 189 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,439 Speaker 1: space exploration. Like I was talking to a friend of mine, 190 00:10:47,480 --> 00:10:50,440 Speaker 1: this guy Andy, who's a game designer and he works 191 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,560 Speaker 1: with space themes sort of space opera projects, and so 192 00:10:53,679 --> 00:10:55,960 Speaker 1: he was arguing that, like, all right, in space exploration, 193 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:59,240 Speaker 1: space travel, you know, the details are important. Everything's gonna 194 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:01,199 Speaker 1: be ironed and you've gotta be disciplined. So you need 195 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 1: some sort of like really dogmatic religion that's going to 196 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 1: inspire that you know, you have to this is your duty, 197 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 1: this is you know, you've got to play another Yeah. Well, 198 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:14,199 Speaker 1: I mean I think on a certain level, any kind 199 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 1: of space expression is gonna be fear based, because if 200 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:18,640 Speaker 1: you messed up, you're gonna die. But he was talking 201 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:20,800 Speaker 1: about like just you know, really regimented kind of like 202 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 1: uber you know, Catholic kind of a space religion or 203 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: something very heavily ritualized. Right, And we've talked and we've 204 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 1: talked about in the past. You know, people who have 205 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: been inspired by, say, um, the Church of Jeice Christ, 206 00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:37,439 Speaker 1: the Latter day Saints, and that is the fact that 207 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 1: that faith has space already factored into it, and therefore 208 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:43,319 Speaker 1: for some individuals that has been a driving force for them. So, 209 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:46,439 Speaker 1: but what Dr Tyson said made me think about, all right, well, 210 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: what if what if you created this religion to where 211 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:53,559 Speaker 1: where another huge part of it is by exploring outer 212 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:57,720 Speaker 1: space you are pleasing some some deity or even just 213 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 1: some sort of divine king, and maybe you're everlasting soul 214 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: is somehow tied up in the bargain. I know it's 215 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:05,839 Speaker 1: it's probably a little bit disenterying. I just get I 216 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 1: like to get a little bit more simplistic with it, 217 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: and I just say, let's just just call it second 218 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:11,560 Speaker 1: is um and we all wear the turtle. Yeah, we 219 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:15,720 Speaker 1: all wear turtlenecks, and we all support space exploration. Yeah 220 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,680 Speaker 1: and uh, and we can ritualize it as much as possible, 221 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:21,320 Speaker 1: you know, and to to make it feel like, hey, 222 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:23,959 Speaker 1: this is let's do it for for Carl. Second, so 223 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:25,600 Speaker 1: like the pretest sets down with you and says, look, 224 00:12:25,880 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 1: you want to make your heavenly sake and happy, don't you? Well, 225 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:32,720 Speaker 1: exactly really need to apply yourself more in space exploration 226 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 1: and get a new turtleneck because that one is a 227 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 1: little dingy. Yeah. Um, So I don't know, it is 228 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 1: it is. Uh. What I thought was interesting about what 229 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:43,160 Speaker 1: Tyson had to say is that he really is stripping 230 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:46,719 Speaker 1: away the reasons underneath why we do what we do, right, Yeah, 231 00:12:46,760 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: I mean that's the really the driving point here in 232 00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: the argument is that the reason we built the pyramids 233 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:55,040 Speaker 1: these other great acts because the thing is, like humans, 234 00:12:55,120 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 1: we know what humans can do, but we got to 235 00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 1: have some sort of motivation to do them. Yeah, and 236 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 1: you know us like build a pyramid, Well, what are 237 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: you gonna do to make me do it? Or you 238 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:04,839 Speaker 1: can you know, maybe you're gonna crack a whip or 239 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:07,120 Speaker 1: tell me about um, you know, the afterlife or some 240 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 1: of the divine being that have to be other motivators there, 241 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 1: And he's saying that the only ones left to us 242 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,480 Speaker 1: for the most part are war in economics because gods 243 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:18,040 Speaker 1: and god kings are not really as as much of 244 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:21,199 Speaker 1: a driving force and technological advancement these days. Well, and 245 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 1: I just thought it was very refreshing that he said 246 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:25,320 Speaker 1: that to say, you know, okay, it is part of 247 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:28,160 Speaker 1: space exploration as part of our national identity, but let's 248 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: just be real about it. This was driven by war, 249 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:34,960 Speaker 1: Its driven by economics. Um. And this is following what 250 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:38,319 Speaker 1: he said about frontiers and like the basic adventure, you know, 251 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:40,120 Speaker 1: spirit of man. So he's not denying that, but he's 252 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 1: saying saying that that's this is all well and good, 253 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,240 Speaker 1: but you have to face the realities of actually seeing 254 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:48,679 Speaker 1: these big projects take off, you know, past that threshold, right, 255 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: and I that's the rub, right, because we can't help 256 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 1: but to create as a species. And yet we have 257 00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:57,560 Speaker 1: these drivers that, um, that that are behind why we 258 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:00,840 Speaker 1: do what we do. Yeah, So my plan end is 259 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:04,959 Speaker 1: we convince everyone that the devil lives on another planet 260 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 1: and it's going to invade Earth unless we team up 261 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:12,000 Speaker 1: with a space god and start getting serious about exploring 262 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:15,719 Speaker 1: the cosmos. You have got some elaborate plans. Might we 263 00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:18,720 Speaker 1: gotta we we gotta push that throughout Congress. Um. But 264 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 1: before we continue with the interview, we need to take 265 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: a quick break, so we'll be right back right after this. 266 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,479 Speaker 1: This podcast is brought to you by Intel, the sponsors 267 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 1: of Tomorrow and the Discovery Channel. At Intel, we believe 268 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:36,960 Speaker 1: curiosity is the spark which drives innovation. Join us at 269 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:40,840 Speaker 1: curiosity dot com and explore the answers to life's questions 270 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 1: and we're back. Let's get back to the interview. Um, 271 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 1: what was it? What was the next question that we 272 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 1: had for Dr Tyson. Well, it was a sort of 273 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:55,360 Speaker 1: a m an idea about neuroscience and how uh this 274 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:57,760 Speaker 1: this question about whether or not it's stolen any thunder 275 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:01,320 Speaker 1: from space exploration. In this sense, the people are so 276 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: sort of taken with exploring the universe of their minds 277 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 1: that perhaps they have moved away from space exploration. And 278 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 1: in case in point, our podcast stuff to blow your mind. 279 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:12,560 Speaker 1: But I haven't done account but I have a feeling 280 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 1: we've done more uh episodes about the mind than we 281 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 1: have about space. Yeah, and certainly, I mean there's a 282 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 1: lot of stuff in the media in neurosciences as a 283 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: field that is just completely exploding. So this was the 284 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:27,200 Speaker 1: question that we pose to Dr Tyson. And there's no 285 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: comparison with regard to the funding that goes to space 286 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: exploration versus the funding that goes to neuroscience. In other words, 287 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 1: whatever thunder one might imagine, it has taken away the 288 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 1: relative funding, which is the most that's the clearest measure 289 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: of of of thundered one might have. Uh, it's small. 290 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: Neuroscience is pennies compared with space exploration. And by the way, 291 00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: if you look at the total space budget of the world, 292 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 1: all money spent on space related products and services, the 293 00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: NASA budget is a tiny fraction of that total money. 294 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:12,359 Speaker 1: If you add up all the total value of GPS 295 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 1: and weather satellites and communications satellite, direct TV, satellite radio, 296 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 1: add it all up, what we actually spend on NASA 297 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 1: is small. So so as an enterprise, space is huge, 298 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:29,440 Speaker 1: and it's sort of permanently huge because it's worked its 299 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 1: way into our daily lives in ways that some people 300 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:36,560 Speaker 1: today take for granted. People who are saying, we don't 301 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 1: need the space exploration. But you know, it's as it's 302 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: has been stereotyped. The person first person to say we 303 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 1: don't need space exploration, and what do I need that for. 304 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 1: I've got the weather channel, you know, and of course 305 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 1: were it gets all its images of the hurricane en 306 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:56,320 Speaker 1: route to your town, you know. So so there's a 307 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:58,920 Speaker 1: lot that we all take for granted, and on some 308 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 1: level that's a good thing. It means it's a fundamental 309 00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:05,240 Speaker 1: part of our culture. But the funding to extend it 310 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 1: and to promote it then need the case needs to 311 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 1: be made because people haven't thought about why they do it. 312 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 1: They just do it. The human brain seems to only 313 00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 1: go from A to B. Doesn't know how to go 314 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,199 Speaker 1: from A to B then to see and then you 315 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 1: get to D, and the D is the goal that 316 00:17:20,600 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 1: you want those extra steps to fund a space program 317 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 1: to have that be a carrot for the smartest kids 318 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:33,000 Speaker 1: and the educational pipeline who then want to become biologists 319 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 1: and chemists and aerospace engineers and astrophysicists and geologists. Because 320 00:17:39,119 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: if you're a geologists, I say, well, you can study 321 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 1: this rock face on Earth, where this rock face on Mars. 322 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:47,320 Speaker 1: I'm gonna get the best geologists because they're gonna want 323 00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:49,399 Speaker 1: to do it on Mars. I can say you can 324 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:51,840 Speaker 1: study this slime mold here on Earth where you can 325 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 1: look for life that's never been found before in the 326 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,680 Speaker 1: aquifers of Mars. I'm going to get the best biologists. 327 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:01,840 Speaker 1: Space has a way of attracting the best people because 328 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 1: the best people want to work on the best problems, 329 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:07,800 Speaker 1: with the hardest problems, with the most interesting problems. And 330 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:10,720 Speaker 1: once that happens, you care. Then you create the culture 331 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,199 Speaker 1: of science as something that a nation is engaged in 332 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:18,200 Speaker 1: that gets the respect of politicians because they're the ones 333 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:21,080 Speaker 1: voting to fund it, and then it works its way 334 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 1: into the moods and attitudes of teachers, of students, of parents, 335 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: and science is no longer something to fear and something 336 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:32,920 Speaker 1: to embrace. Once you embrace this, then the culture creates 337 00:18:33,640 --> 00:18:39,479 Speaker 1: stem field people who in their creativity, invent tomorrow, and 338 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:44,480 Speaker 1: that creativity births entire new economies for the twenty one century, 339 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:47,879 Speaker 1: and that's what will keep a nation at the forefront. 340 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:51,680 Speaker 1: This whole job's package that they're trying to promote now 341 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 1: it's it's it shouldn't be about jobs. It should be 342 00:18:55,080 --> 00:19:00,959 Speaker 1: about frontier industries so that America can lead the world 343 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:03,480 Speaker 1: as it once did. Oh, by the way, those industries 344 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:07,280 Speaker 1: need jobs. It's not Let's get you back to work 345 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:09,600 Speaker 1: and then all will be fine. We can get you 346 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:11,600 Speaker 1: back and we can have a country of a hundred 347 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 1: percent working people, but we'll be dancing to the tune 348 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:18,879 Speaker 1: of everyone else who's actually innovating. And the innovators are 349 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 1: the people who are the engineers, the scientists, the technologists 350 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:29,159 Speaker 1: who see what is to come combined with what they know, 351 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 1: and they invent something new to make tomorrow. Come. Once 352 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: this happens, then the country's economy will boom. And this 353 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:44,040 Speaker 1: connection between space exploration and a booming economy, like I said, 354 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 1: takes longer than an elevator ride. And it's not a 355 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 1: direct connection, it's indirect. And I think therein is the challenge. 356 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,920 Speaker 1: So again from Dr Tyson, there's another sobering look at 357 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:59,640 Speaker 1: what it takes to push science through the political system. Yea, 358 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:03,119 Speaker 1: And I believe that um Dr Tyson was at the 359 00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:08,000 Speaker 1: World Science Festivals Stephen weinberg keynote address. Yeah you were there, Yeah, 360 00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:09,439 Speaker 1: I was there, and I'm pretty sure he was in 361 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:13,520 Speaker 1: the audience, And so we asked him about what Weinberg 362 00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:17,080 Speaker 1: argued that we need a new particle accelerator because it's 363 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:20,680 Speaker 1: necessary for society to better understand the laws of nature. 364 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: That's that's what Weinberg says, in particular dark matter, because 365 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:26,199 Speaker 1: you know five six of the universe is made up 366 00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:28,479 Speaker 1: of it, and why not know more about that? Right? Right? 367 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:30,800 Speaker 1: And and just to clarify, because we haven't really talked 368 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:33,919 Speaker 1: as much about particle colliders in this podcast, but this 369 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 1: is where you take particles and you speed them around 370 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,280 Speaker 1: this giant facility, smashed them into each other. They and 371 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,959 Speaker 1: when they break apart, you can learn about what composes 372 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 1: them and therefore learn about the about what's happening with 373 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:50,520 Speaker 1: matter at its smallest and briefest uh points right. And 374 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:52,680 Speaker 1: what Weinberg said is we we really need something that 375 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,600 Speaker 1: is the more beefed up superconductor than than what we 376 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:59,200 Speaker 1: have right now and certain so, um so it led 377 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 1: us just to wonder about dark matter and how how 378 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:06,320 Speaker 1: we can get the general public interested in that, How 379 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:08,879 Speaker 1: could we relate to the general public that this is 380 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 1: actually important to look into. How can we make it 381 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,159 Speaker 1: more personal? And um this is what Dr Tesson had 382 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 1: to say. It won't trigger the funding, so I won't 383 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:20,240 Speaker 1: even I don't even go there. That's the delusion. The 384 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:23,160 Speaker 1: delusion is you just have to make the science case 385 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:28,000 Speaker 1: and everyone will want to do it. I the history 386 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 1: of human behavior does not bear that out. And so 387 00:21:31,800 --> 00:21:35,159 Speaker 1: the reason why particle physics was funded for a hundred 388 00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:38,479 Speaker 1: years in America was because the physicists who were engaged 389 00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:42,520 Speaker 1: in that activity built bombs. It was the physics of 390 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:46,680 Speaker 1: our nuclear arsenal in the Cold War. So the illusion 391 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 1: was that America was interested in physics research because we 392 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:56,080 Speaker 1: wanted to be on the frontier of discovery. The actual 393 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 1: reason was that these are the people who won the 394 00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: Second World War for us and are creating the power 395 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:07,560 Speaker 1: that the geopolitics needed throughout the Cold War. So there 396 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:11,120 Speaker 1: is no there is no argument. That's my point. There's 397 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 1: no argument unless you can say, or at the other 398 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:15,880 Speaker 1: end of this, we've got a new weapon and we're 399 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,240 Speaker 1: at war with somebody against whom we can use this weapon, 400 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: we get funded overnight. The original super collider was canceled. 401 00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:25,879 Speaker 1: It was proposed in the mid eighties, work began in 402 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:29,320 Speaker 1: the late eighties. It was canceled in the early nineties 403 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,320 Speaker 1: because a couple of years earlier peace broke out in Europe. 404 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: That's not what they'll tell you. They'll tell you, Oh, 405 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:38,840 Speaker 1: because there's cost overruns and we just couldn't afford it 406 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 1: in this climate. Okay, that's what they'll tell you. But 407 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 1: there was no talk of cost overruns in the Manhattan project. 408 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:49,760 Speaker 1: There's no talk of cost over runs in the Apollo program. 409 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 1: Those are war projects, and when you're at war, money 410 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:58,320 Speaker 1: flows like rivers period, and the sooner we understand this, 411 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 1: the more relevant is any conversation we have about what's 412 00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:08,719 Speaker 1: possible and what's not in a funding environment. So if 413 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,720 Speaker 1: you want to make the case with a SuperCollider, you 414 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:12,600 Speaker 1: make the case that you're gonna be on the frontier 415 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:18,640 Speaker 1: with your technologies, and those technologies will influence a culture 416 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: of other technologies that will stoke our economy. The economy 417 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 1: has to be in there somewhere the pure scientific discovery. 418 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: And Steve Weinberg is in that sense. You gotta love 419 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,520 Speaker 1: him because he's like a pure academic and he thinks 420 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:35,960 Speaker 1: academically and the world shows appears to him through his 421 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:40,560 Speaker 1: academic filter. But at some point a congressman has to vote, 422 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:45,360 Speaker 1: and why they vote is completely linked to what they 423 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,800 Speaker 1: think is in the interest of the wealth of the 424 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:50,680 Speaker 1: nation or the health of the nation, health as in 425 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:55,240 Speaker 1: national security. They and they can say whatever they want 426 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: about discovery, but the actual drivers are not that at 427 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:02,280 Speaker 1: which they which I was, it wasn't true. This is 428 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 1: these are my findings in my study of six thousand 429 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 1: years of human culture, and that analysis is in this 430 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:10,680 Speaker 1: book coming out in February. Okay, So that's why it's 431 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 1: important to write your congresswoman or you're a congressman, right, Yeah, 432 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 1: Though also I think there's a little more rationale for 433 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:18,959 Speaker 1: the fake devil planet. I was thinking about that as 434 00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:21,640 Speaker 1: but but now, but beyond beyond that. Yeah, he really 435 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:24,400 Speaker 1: makes a solid case for just how we end up 436 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:28,200 Speaker 1: achieving these these different scientific programs and what is really 437 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,040 Speaker 1: the motivator there. And again that's what's one of the 438 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:33,360 Speaker 1: brilliant things about Tyson these not blind to these economic 439 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,080 Speaker 1: and political realities when talking about the future of science, 440 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,520 Speaker 1: because I mean, we would all like for the you know, 441 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 1: it just to be like, yes, ra ra science raa 442 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 1: discovery because in our heart, I feel like we all 443 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: feel that way. Certainly if you're listening to to this podcast, 444 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:48,199 Speaker 1: you have at least a little of that in you. 445 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:50,160 Speaker 1: But you know, thus is the world, and we let's 446 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: move through the world. That's right. And pure science is 447 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:55,760 Speaker 1: like sitting down to a blink page, right and just 448 00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: creating just for free creativity's sake, whereas applied science, you know, 449 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:01,400 Speaker 1: you sit down that blank page and you know who 450 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: your sponsors are and what's going to come of it. 451 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:05,719 Speaker 1: So it's a little bit disheartening to think of it 452 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:09,440 Speaker 1: that way, but it is a really pragmatic way to 453 00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 1: understand why civilizations further their cultures, right, Yeah, what Dr 454 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:15,159 Speaker 1: Tyson has say. Remind you. I can't help but be 455 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 1: reminded of the documentary on origami between the photos, because 456 00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: that's a situation where you have mathematicians who were just 457 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:25,200 Speaker 1: really into origami, not just like oh I made a swan, 458 00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,439 Speaker 1: but like really complex oregonamy problems that have to be 459 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:32,400 Speaker 1: tackled from a mathematical standpoint, And in that regard it's 460 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 1: purely academic, like like on one level, there is no 461 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:40,760 Speaker 1: application for the heavy mathematical study of origami. But these 462 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 1: guys reached the point where they figured that where where 463 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 1: their findings did have applications in the real world, such 464 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 1: as in uh, how we fold a parachute or solar 465 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,919 Speaker 1: sales and satellites. But like Hyson says, it's there's an 466 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 1: indirect link, and for the most part, people were blind 467 00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:01,760 Speaker 1: to indirect links, certainly in politics. Yeah, there you go. 468 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 1: So we had just one final question that we had 469 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,919 Speaker 1: to ask Dr Dyson, and here here it is Julie. 470 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,160 Speaker 1: Here's Julie asking it and us getting an answer. Burning question, 471 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: bring it back it alone, if you can bring it back, 472 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,840 Speaker 1: bring it back sure, Uh, I don't know that it 473 00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 1: would know how to survive here's the problem. You bring 474 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:27,320 Speaker 1: back a wooly mammoth just in time for global warming. 475 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,760 Speaker 1: You know that's cruel. Bring back something that likes hot wet, 476 00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 1: not the mammoth who thrived on the on the glacial 477 00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:40,200 Speaker 1: coverage of North America. So I think it's inevitable, whether 478 00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:42,160 Speaker 1: we want to do it or not, somebody's gonna do it. 479 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:47,720 Speaker 1: And uh sure so So in other words, I'm indifferent 480 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 1: to that. I don't have an opinion one way or another. 481 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: It's going to happen, and when it happens, I won't 482 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 1: even stand in judgment of it. I'll just okay, it 483 00:26:56,680 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 1: was inevitable, and uh, you know, they we should have 484 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:04,200 Speaker 1: some foresight about what it means to bring it back. 485 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,680 Speaker 1: Do you bring back a male and a female their mammals, 486 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 1: so I presume they made it sexually. Do you keep 487 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: it in a zoo? Do you sit it loose in 488 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:18,480 Speaker 1: the northern Northern Canada? Like what do you do? You know? 489 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,720 Speaker 1: Be nice? If we so thought that through. So there 490 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:22,639 Speaker 1: you go, bring it back? Yeah, yeah, there you go, 491 00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 1: according to Tyson and why not? Yeah, well but you're 492 00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 1: just caution. He's you know, no, no, you're right, He's 493 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:30,520 Speaker 1: not he's not saying just you know, wholesale, let's start 494 00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:35,320 Speaker 1: selling them at a pet smart Yeah, um, you know 495 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 1: not know, we have a miniature version that can They 496 00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: can live indoors and be potty trained for sure. So 497 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:42,360 Speaker 1: we'd like to thank Dr Tyson for taking the time 498 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,040 Speaker 1: to talk with us. Was a real honor and privilege 499 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:46,520 Speaker 1: to get to chat with him a little bit there. 500 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:49,919 Speaker 1: And if you would like to learn more from Dr Tyson, 501 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,720 Speaker 1: you should definitely check out his radio show, his podcast 502 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:54,680 Speaker 1: on which you can find on a star Talk Radio 503 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 1: dot net. That's star Talk Radio dot net. You can 504 00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 1: also check out his new book when it comes out 505 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:02,200 Speaker 1: in February again, that's gonna it called Space Chronicles, and 506 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,720 Speaker 1: you can also find him on Nova right and pretty 507 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:07,840 Speaker 1: much everyone. Yes, let's say, just turn on the TV 508 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,439 Speaker 1: you will find him. Um. But yeah, it was. It 509 00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:13,719 Speaker 1: was great to be able to interview him and we 510 00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:15,720 Speaker 1: appreciate it. We hope that you guys enjoyed it. Yeah, 511 00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:17,159 Speaker 1: let us know what you think. You can find us 512 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:19,159 Speaker 1: on Facebook and Twitter. We are blow the Mind on 513 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:21,159 Speaker 1: both of us and you can drop us an email 514 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:28,639 Speaker 1: at blow the Mind at how stuff Works dot com. 515 00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 1: Be sure to check out our new video podcast, Stuff 516 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:33,960 Speaker 1: from the Future. Join how Stuff Work staff as we 517 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,560 Speaker 1: explore the most promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow.