WEBVTT - Jason Isbell 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:03.840 This episode is also available as video on YouTube. You 0:00:03.880 --> 0:00:06.440 can visit Norah Jones channel and be sure to subscribe 0:00:06.440 --> 0:00:08.920 while you're there. Hey, I'm Norah Jones and today I'm 0:00:08.920 --> 0:00:17.959 playing along with Jason Isbel. I'm just playing lousy, I'm 0:00:18.239 --> 0:00:26.880 just playing in lone uzy. Hey, I'm Nora Jones with 0:00:26.920 --> 0:00:28.200 me as always a Sarah Oda. 0:00:28.400 --> 0:00:31.640 Hello, welcome to the show, Jinks. 0:00:33.640 --> 0:00:34.519 I like your jacket. 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:35.080 Thank you. 0:00:35.400 --> 0:00:39.000 It's fresh from Japan. It's lovely. We have an incredible 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:39.720 episode today. 0:00:39.800 --> 0:00:44.040 We're joined by Jason Isbel, the Grammy winning singer songwriter 0:00:44.080 --> 0:00:46.120 who you may know from his time with the Drive 0:00:46.159 --> 0:00:50.080 By Truckers or from Jason Isbel in the four hundred Unit. 0:00:50.960 --> 0:00:53.640 His latest album just came out this year. It's a 0:00:53.720 --> 0:00:57.120 new solo album called Foxes in the Snow, which is 0:00:57.240 --> 0:01:01.440 a stripped down acoustic album that really features his raw vocals. 0:01:01.440 --> 0:01:04.280 It's very intimate and heartfelt, very beautiful album. It's a 0:01:04.400 --> 0:01:07.520 very beautiful album. We had fun playing songs from it, 0:01:07.600 --> 0:01:10.760 and yeah, I just I just loved hanging with him 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:13.240 and playing music. We've met before, but we never got 0:01:13.240 --> 0:01:15.559 a chance to really interact much, so. 0:01:15.560 --> 0:01:17.400 It was very fun in this episode. 0:01:17.440 --> 0:01:20.720 You're going to hear about his on screen film debut, 0:01:21.640 --> 0:01:24.760 about navigating how to write a love song, and what 0:01:24.880 --> 0:01:26.280 kind of manicure he likes to get. 0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:27.720 Oh, I forgot about that. 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:30.840 Yeah, And as always, we have great music coming up, 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:33.880 including a really great surprise of a cover that you 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:36.880 do cover surprise, So stay tuned. 0:01:38.280 --> 0:01:43.040 Here she is our episode with Jason isbo Enjoy. Hey, 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:43.759 you want to play song? 0:01:43.880 --> 0:01:44.520 Let's do a song? 0:01:44.600 --> 0:01:44.759 Yeah? 0:01:44.840 --> 0:01:44.960 Let me? 0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:45.320 Yeah? 0:01:46.880 --> 0:01:58.880 You want to count it? To just start playing? Okay? 0:02:01.640 --> 0:02:04.200 Started out like it always start. 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:06.680 Try to hold the hunger bad. 0:02:08.040 --> 0:02:12.480 You don't anticipate a broken heart. I can't see nothing 0:02:12.600 --> 0:02:17.320 but to try a diamond earring in a bowery bead. 0:02:18.200 --> 0:02:20.480 You kicked your shoes across the floor. 0:02:21.800 --> 0:02:25.360 You regret the things that went on the set? Have 0:02:25.520 --> 0:02:26.600 you heard it all? 0:02:26.840 --> 0:02:37.079 For Ily? You should have seen this coming soon? Right 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:41.400 me to be along for all my. 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:50.519 Ily thought the truth was just a room that show. 0:02:55.960 --> 0:03:00.959 And it ended like it always ends, somebody crying the phone. 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:06.400 Tell each other you could still beet friends. You both 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:10.600 know you're all on your own. My own behavior was 0:03:10.600 --> 0:03:15.799 a shock to me. I never thought I'd have a nerd. 0:03:16.080 --> 0:03:18.400 I hope you're sleeping through the night alley. 0:03:19.560 --> 0:03:21.640 I hope they're grading all the curve. 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:29.720 Ily, you should have seen this coming soon? 0:03:31.400 --> 0:03:34.480 Why me me alone? 0:03:35.240 --> 0:03:42.120 For all mind Ily, you thought the truth. 0:03:42.040 --> 0:03:43.520 Was just a rumor. 0:03:44.120 --> 0:04:15.240 That's sure. Somebody broke my heart. Was I was useless 0:04:15.280 --> 0:04:16.760 for a week. 0:04:17.440 --> 0:04:21.040 I didn't leave my apartment, I. 0:04:20.920 --> 0:04:22.760 Didn't need I didn't sleep. 0:04:24.400 --> 0:04:29.080 Then I found the letter show against the wall behind 0:04:29.240 --> 0:04:34.840 the bed said forever as a dead man's show. That's 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:36.640 the only thing that said. 0:04:39.560 --> 0:04:45.080 I should have seen this come in simple. 0:04:46.440 --> 0:04:49.560 Right, me me alone? 0:04:50.160 --> 0:04:58.560 For all mydy I thought the truth was just a rumor. 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:19.840 That shore way, that's it sounded good. 0:05:20.000 --> 0:05:23.840 That was so pretty. It was really good. Yeah. It's 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:27.039 interesting because I you know your songs. I'm dying to 0:05:27.040 --> 0:05:30.359 sing harmony all over the place. But there's there's so 0:05:30.520 --> 0:05:34.840 intimate on this record. It's all solo, right, the whole thing. Yeah, 0:05:34.880 --> 0:05:37.600 and also I think there's something about certain lyrics that 0:05:37.720 --> 0:05:40.760 can be hard to have two people. 0:05:41.080 --> 0:05:41.480 That's true. 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:44.520 Sometimes it feels weird to have a second voice in there. 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:46.480 It does, But I just had to do it. 0:05:46.720 --> 0:05:48.440 How do you? Yeah, I want you to do it. 0:05:48.480 --> 0:05:49.160 I had to do it. 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:51.800 They heard the version that just has me on her, 0:05:51.880 --> 0:05:54.279 they can find it easily. Yeah, we're going to do something. 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:56.640 I had to do it. But yeah, it was like 0:05:56.760 --> 0:06:00.440 there's such a tender song and such a you know, 0:06:00.560 --> 0:06:04.160 seems like a lonesome lyric, you. 0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:07.080 Know, Yeah, I think so, it's where do you where 0:06:07.080 --> 0:06:09.599 do you put the line? Because it's tough for me 0:06:09.680 --> 0:06:12.159 to choose, Like, I want to put harmonies on everything. 0:06:12.279 --> 0:06:12.599 Me too. 0:06:12.720 --> 0:06:15.960 I grew up listening to harmony vocals and like studying 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:19.720 like David Crosby and Mike Mills and you know, Everley's 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:21.279 and all this stuff, and I want it. I want 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:23.440 to put it on everything. And then I hear it 0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:26.080 and I think that's way that's way too much harmony. 0:06:26.440 --> 0:06:29.720 That's like putting too much seasoning on a dish, too 0:06:29.760 --> 0:06:33.000 many ingredients, Yeah, exactly, Yeah, yeah, And I don't know, 0:06:33.120 --> 0:06:35.120 it's it's it's a tough line. 0:06:35.279 --> 0:06:37.880 I think you can usually tell after you do it, 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:41.360 if it's you know, overdubbed or you know, you rehearse it, 0:06:42.440 --> 0:06:45.200 you can tell where to leave it eventually, and then 0:06:45.240 --> 0:06:47.599 once you put it in, it's like the magic bloss. 0:06:47.320 --> 0:06:50.640 It's so perfect, right, Yeah, it's so perfect. I remember 0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:52.920 like for some reason. That was one of the things 0:06:52.960 --> 0:06:54.520 I think maybe when I was a kid, I just 0:06:54.560 --> 0:06:57.279 thought that I was going to sing harmony and play guitar. Really, 0:06:57.320 --> 0:06:59.400 I didn't realize I was going to be singing lead 0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:00.440 vocals on anything. 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:01.960 And so that's what I listened to. 0:07:01.960 --> 0:07:07.479 Super closely, and I remember certain moments like like on 0:07:08.400 --> 0:07:11.800 like time after time, that harmony vocal is one of 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:13.600 the best harmony. 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:15.080 Kind of angular it is. 0:07:15.400 --> 0:07:19.720 It sounds like Elvis Costello, but it sounds like you know. 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:23.520 But then it's like I remember also like you're so vain, 0:07:23.680 --> 0:07:26.840 like Mick On, You're so vain. It's basically just unison. 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:29.960 He's not even really singing harmony, but it's so perfect, 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:31.080 you know. 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:32.560 I remember trying to figure. 0:07:32.280 --> 0:07:35.640 Out why, what is it that makes one harmony part better? 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:38.960 Well, it's like the whole Gillian Welsh David Rawlings thing. 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:42.680 I'm always singing along a third part when I'm listening 0:07:42.680 --> 0:07:45.200 to them. But the truth is, it's much cooler when 0:07:45.200 --> 0:07:47.400 it's just two of them, It's true, and they find 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:51.200 these weird sevens and like they don't pick you know, 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:53.800 Dave doesn't always do a typical harmony. 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:55.360 No, he never does a typical harmony. 0:07:55.520 --> 0:07:57.160 He'll do like a weird line and then I'll go 0:07:57.280 --> 0:07:59.720 lower than her and then higher than her, and it's 0:07:59.760 --> 0:08:01.680 like it's just more special. 0:08:02.240 --> 0:08:03.240 Yeah it is. 0:08:03.440 --> 0:08:05.880 And it's like I feel like it's rewarding for those 0:08:05.920 --> 0:08:09.560 of us who you know, build music for a living 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:11.800 or take it that seit, but also for people who 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:14.480 don't and just listen. They think this is weird in 0:08:14.520 --> 0:08:15.120 a good way. 0:08:15.440 --> 0:08:17.680 Yeah, they don't. He told me a really cool story 0:08:17.720 --> 0:08:22.280 once about I think Time the Revelator. He said that 0:08:22.320 --> 0:08:25.240 somebody sent a comment online about how his guitar was 0:08:25.320 --> 0:08:27.680 out of tune because it was dissonant, and he was 0:08:27.720 --> 0:08:34.280 playing this weird like yeah, using that, and he just 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:35.640 got such a kick out of it. 0:08:35.960 --> 0:08:36.160 Yeah. 0:08:36.280 --> 0:08:40.120 They didn't understand that the difference was actually correct but 0:08:40.440 --> 0:08:42.400 supposed to be weird. They just thought it was out 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:42.800 of tune. 0:08:43.040 --> 0:08:46.360 Yeah yeah, and I mean it probably being that old Olympic, 0:08:46.480 --> 0:08:48.000 it probably was also out of tune. 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:52.040 Probably that's not what they were here. Yeah, yeah, he does. 0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:54.240 He came and sat in with me on some solo 0:08:54.320 --> 0:08:59.240 shows in Nashville. You know, I feel like sometimes like 0:08:59.320 --> 0:09:03.120 he's arts from a point of like this is not good. 0:09:03.280 --> 0:09:05.280 I don't want this to make perfect sense, and I'm 0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:07.480 going to figure out how to get back down the 0:09:07.559 --> 0:09:08.920 lamb into the tree. 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:11.920 Yeah, and it makes me so happy. Yeah, you're right. 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:12.800 I can kind of picture. 0:09:12.840 --> 0:09:15.160 It's like it's like I'm going back for the tree, 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:17.320 but you know, I'm not going to start from a 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:18.200 typical spot. 0:09:18.320 --> 0:09:18.560 Yeah. 0:09:18.960 --> 0:09:23.160 It's so nice because it never sounds superfluous that way. 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:25.800 It's it's always like, Okay, this is here for a reason, 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:28.400 and it doesn't always land, Like when I try to 0:09:28.440 --> 0:09:30.960 do that, it does not land half the time. 0:09:31.520 --> 0:09:33.040 But he's just really good at it. 0:09:33.120 --> 0:09:36.439 He's really good at doing like chromatic oh yeah, falls 0:09:36.480 --> 0:09:39.600 and walks and landing on that third or landing somewhere 0:09:39.640 --> 0:09:41.320 where it's like, oh now I'm comfortable. 0:09:41.480 --> 0:09:43.360 It's like a cat on the list exactly. 0:09:43.960 --> 0:09:44.199 It is. 0:09:44.520 --> 0:09:47.080 Yeah, Yeah, he's so good. 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:48.800 Tell me about your guitar. 0:09:49.200 --> 0:09:52.560 This guitar is is a Martin. When I was in 0:09:52.679 --> 0:09:58.800 Oklahoma filming Killers of the Flower Moon, very coolat either way, 0:09:59.000 --> 0:10:02.600 that was very thank you. That was really weird, like 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:05.680 I just don't do that. And we were in the 0:10:05.760 --> 0:10:09.760 pandemic and I was like, well, I can't tour, and 0:10:09.800 --> 0:10:11.400 so I asked my agent if I could get like 0:10:11.440 --> 0:10:12.800 auditions or something. 0:10:12.559 --> 0:10:14.880 Really Okay, Yeah, so you were proactive about it. 0:10:15.000 --> 0:10:17.160 Yeah. I wanted to, like if somebody's got a set 0:10:17.200 --> 0:10:19.839 where they're testing and filming a show where a movie, 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:23.000 now might be the time. And you know, I got 0:10:23.040 --> 0:10:25.319 an audition, I got called back, and I'm like in 0:10:25.360 --> 0:10:28.320 my house, you know, in the in the bedroom with 0:10:28.360 --> 0:10:33.760 my laptop, you know, just like with Marty and and DiCaprio, 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:36.520 like on the Zoom, and I'm terrified. 0:10:36.600 --> 0:10:37.319 It's hilarious. 0:10:37.559 --> 0:10:39.800 Yeah, And I finally wound up getting it and getting 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:42.200 out there and no clue what I was doing, just 0:10:42.480 --> 0:10:44.199 you know, but I just told everybody, I don't know 0:10:44.240 --> 0:10:46.320 how to do this, so tell me how to do it, 0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:48.920 and I will do my best. And they're like, oh, okay, 0:10:48.960 --> 0:10:49.800 that's refreshing. 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:51.600 You know. 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:54.360 Delayed proceeding some days, but most of the time it 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:59.440 was fine. But Martin experience, it was nuts. But Martin 0:10:59.480 --> 0:11:02.840 sent me this because I needed a little acoustic to 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:03.960 bang around on. 0:11:04.240 --> 0:11:04.960 Oh, because it's. 0:11:04.840 --> 0:11:08.440 Small and travelable, Okay, I see, Yeah, And I was 0:11:08.480 --> 0:11:12.199 having to go back and forth between Oklahoma and shows 0:11:12.800 --> 0:11:18.320 because they the scheduling was a massive event around that. 0:11:18.480 --> 0:11:20.240 Oh yeah, it's not your time. 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:21.800 No, not in any way. 0:11:22.000 --> 0:11:26.600 That's what's hard for me the few times have done things. Yeah, 0:11:26.640 --> 0:11:29.040 it's just I'm so used to being in control of 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:29.480 my time. 0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:30.280 Yeah, me too. 0:11:30.280 --> 0:11:32.120 And yeah it's not You're going to get dressed up 0:11:32.160 --> 0:11:34.000 and sit there for nine hours make up. 0:11:34.480 --> 0:11:37.319 It's an uncomfortable outfit, very uncomfortable. 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:41.400 And you know, we were outdoors in Oklahoma, and so 0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:45.240 it was like the weather brutal. Yeah, it was either 0:11:45.280 --> 0:11:50.360 really really hot or like de Niro hurd himself and 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:52.880 had to go get surgery. So it kind of pushed 0:11:52.920 --> 0:11:57.679 everything back a few weeks, and then we wound up 0:11:57.679 --> 0:11:59.920 in storm season. So I was just in the trailer, 0:12:00.520 --> 0:12:04.280 oh wow, waiting, you know, dressed up in suspenders and 0:12:04.760 --> 0:12:08.040 old riding boots and my hair slicked back and sitting 0:12:08.040 --> 0:12:11.600 there playing this guitar. But I did write most of 0:12:12.880 --> 0:12:16.880 an album that way, the new album, the one before Weatherbag. 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.440 I wrote almost that whole record. Yeah, I know. 0:12:20.880 --> 0:12:23.240 I just when I said that, realized that the weather 0:12:23.559 --> 0:12:27.400 was a big reason. Yeah, but yeah, I wrote most 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:29.880 of that record out there in that trailer, dressed up 0:12:29.920 --> 0:12:31.960 like a horse repair man. 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:37.240 It's amazing but this isn't what you used on the 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:37.760 new record. 0:12:37.920 --> 0:12:40.120 No, on the new record, I used an old guitar 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:44.720 that is currently in New York, that's been in New 0:12:44.760 --> 0:12:45.600 York since I got it. 0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:47.920 I got it at Retro here in Brooklyn. 0:12:47.960 --> 0:12:49.520 I just called sheer and I was like, I need 0:12:49.559 --> 0:12:53.840 a little tiny Martin for the apartment here, and uh, 0:12:54.120 --> 0:12:58.880 and I wound up writing and recording Foxes a new 0:12:58.920 --> 0:13:01.760 record all on that good, the whole thing. I just 0:13:01.800 --> 0:13:04.880 went into Electric Lady and. 0:13:04.840 --> 0:13:08.320 You did it here, yeah, and uh, just you and 0:13:08.320 --> 0:13:08.959 the guitar. 0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:13.160 And a guitar Gina Johnson who engineered and co produced 0:13:13.200 --> 0:13:17.520 it with me, and a bunch of microphones. And my 0:13:17.600 --> 0:13:21.079 best friend Will Welch Uh. He came in and filmed 0:13:21.120 --> 0:13:23.920 and hung out. And you know, there's a few people 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:27.000 that I can handle just having in the studio all 0:13:27.040 --> 0:13:27.400 the time. 0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:29.480 And he's definitely great for that. 0:13:30.040 --> 0:13:32.720 Yeah. You know, I've still never let this is weird 0:13:32.760 --> 0:13:34.080 for me having cameras. 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:37.760 Oh yeah yeah, but do you normally just have like 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:40.839 somebody hitting engineering. 0:13:40.240 --> 0:13:42.079 And oh I need an engineer for. 0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:44.800 Sure, engineer too. That makes me feel better doing that. 0:13:44.920 --> 0:13:47.840 But like the filming thing, now everybody wants to film everything, 0:13:47.920 --> 0:13:51.000 and I get it. I just yeah, to get a 0:13:51.040 --> 0:13:51.959 little stiff. 0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:57.800 Yeah, yeah, me too. Yeah, but that's cool. Yeah, it was, 0:13:57.880 --> 0:13:58.800 it was. It was great. 0:13:58.840 --> 0:14:00.800 And he was like, why are you doing this electric lady? 0:14:00.880 --> 0:14:02.920 Is it's like an acoustic. 0:14:02.480 --> 0:14:04.160 Yeah, you could do it in a barn somewhere. 0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:05.600 Yeah, But I was like, well, where are the rest 0:14:05.640 --> 0:14:08.680 of the studios in the village where you can make 0:14:08.720 --> 0:14:11.160 a good sounding record and everything works and you're not 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:12.319 waiting all day? 0:14:12.760 --> 0:14:14.439 I wanted to go into. 0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:16.360 A studio in the village with a guitar and a 0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:17.640 notebook and make a record. 0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:19.960 That was the point that was kind of romantic? Was 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:21.160 it like a romantic idea? 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.240 I think as I think, I think I put those 0:14:24.840 --> 0:14:27.840 That's about the only time I'll allow myself to go 0:14:27.880 --> 0:14:30.760 buy those rules, those sort of romanticized rules. 0:14:30.880 --> 0:14:31.600 I think that's good. 0:14:31.840 --> 0:14:34.480 I think that's the whole point of having studios because 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:36.520 if not, you know, I could just do it at 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.760 home or in somebody's basement or something. And to me, 0:14:39.800 --> 0:14:41.680 if I'm going to go into a studio, I want 0:14:41.720 --> 0:14:43.920 to feel the pressure of what's happening. 0:14:44.200 --> 0:14:46.880 Yeah, yeah, you do feel a little bit more heightened 0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:48.960 with the Yeah you're paying for. 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:50.440 It, yeah, which helps the budget. 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:53.440 It really, that's the only reason I put pressure on 0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:54.880 myself so the bank does. 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:58.840 Yeah, you know, but there is something to be said 0:14:58.920 --> 0:15:00.720 for having a deadline. I mean a lot of people 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:03.280 work better that way. It's almost like having a deadline 0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:04.320 going to the studio. 0:15:04.640 --> 0:15:07.440 That is kind of have to make your own you know. 0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:11.320 Luckily, I have to make my own restrictions, you know, 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:13.400 because I don't have a lay like I have my 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:15.960 own label. So I kind of say, Okay, I want 0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:18.240 to go make a record this month, and that's great, 0:15:18.360 --> 0:15:20.440 put it out that month and that kind of stuff. 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:21.280 That's great. 0:15:21.520 --> 0:15:25.320 Yeah, it's nice. It's really nice unless something goes wrong 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:28.920 and then I can't turn around and yell at anybody responsible. 0:15:29.120 --> 0:15:31.000 Yeah yeah, but I like it. 0:15:31.040 --> 0:15:35.160 I started it with Southeastern, which was like my first 0:15:35.480 --> 0:15:38.240 big sort of record, and so that all lined up 0:15:38.280 --> 0:15:39.200 really really nicely. 0:15:39.400 --> 0:15:42.280 That's very lucky, very lucky because the timing of it, 0:15:42.360 --> 0:15:42.600 you know. 0:15:43.000 --> 0:15:44.960 Yeah, yeah, it was very lucky. 0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:48.920 Big labels are not where you want to be anymore, no. 0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:53.600 And it's uh, yeah, I don't know. I don't even 0:15:53.600 --> 0:15:55.960 know what the formula is, what the plan is now. 0:15:56.240 --> 0:15:58.280 Yeah, I'm not sure. I mean, I'm still on a label. 0:15:58.320 --> 0:16:03.040 I love my label, but you know, sometimes I'm not 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:06.440 sure what the better way would be. Because I have 0:16:06.480 --> 0:16:09.960 an experienced going out on my own. I think for 0:16:10.040 --> 0:16:14.160 you and your level of how you operate, it's probably perfect. 0:16:14.240 --> 0:16:14.920 I think it's great. 0:16:15.080 --> 0:16:18.240 Yeah, it's great because I don't even like I'm not 0:16:18.280 --> 0:16:20.280 always looking to grow things. 0:16:20.840 --> 0:16:24.640 You know, I'm feeling pretty good. I'm fine. Yeah, like 0:16:24.680 --> 0:16:25.560 I'm fine. 0:16:25.960 --> 0:16:29.040 I like to be able to hear myself and have 0:16:29.120 --> 0:16:32.480 good gear and travel as comfortably as possible. And outside 0:16:32.480 --> 0:16:34.880 of that, it's like, you know, I don't I don't 0:16:34.920 --> 0:16:36.400 need more and more and more. I'm not going to 0:16:36.480 --> 0:16:38.680 retire and no stop. 0:16:38.760 --> 0:16:39.680 Do you imagine? 0:16:39.920 --> 0:16:41.840 Yeah, what would that be? What would that even mean? 0:16:41.880 --> 0:16:43.000 It would be really hard. 0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:45.520 It would be so I'd be worse than Elton, Like 0:16:45.560 --> 0:16:48.600 he's retired half a dozen times in the last two years, 0:16:49.360 --> 0:16:50.480 and I would be worse than that. 0:16:50.600 --> 0:16:54.640 I would just I'm back. Yeah, I'm it's all reunion tour. 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:59.920 I'm reuniting myself, my own molecules are reuniting for another tour. 0:17:00.160 --> 0:17:02.320 Well, I think that's the great part about this job 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:03.600 is you don't have to retire. 0:17:03.960 --> 0:17:04.960 Yeah, you don't have to. 0:17:04.840 --> 0:17:07.720 Tour anymore, but you can still play and record or 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:08.919 do local stuff. 0:17:09.080 --> 0:17:09.800 Yeah. 0:17:09.840 --> 0:17:13.159 And we were never silly rock stars, so it's not 0:17:13.200 --> 0:17:14.080 gonna look dumb. 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:21.040 Speak for yourself six yeah, No, I think we're good like. 0:17:21.080 --> 0:17:23.840 Yeah, I'm not talking about like like level like yeah, 0:17:24.200 --> 0:17:25.919 like we like you have a big deal. No, I 0:17:25.960 --> 0:17:27.520 was joking, but you didn't have your foot up on 0:17:27.560 --> 0:17:31.800 the monitor wearing like spandex and definitely not. 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:34.720 Yeah. And that means at some point you're gonna have. 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:39.800 To have hang upire yeah, yeah, or just yeah, or 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:42.760 just just just spain. 0:17:42.600 --> 0:17:44.920 Maybe a larger size. 0:17:45.600 --> 0:17:47.639 Yeah, it's either a just the size or you're just 0:17:47.680 --> 0:17:51.640 going to be adjusting the whole time your own steady. 0:17:51.760 --> 0:17:53.040 All right, what should we do nowt. 0:17:52.920 --> 0:17:54.439 You want to do Foxes in the Snow? 0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:56.359 Yeah, let's do that. Let's do that. 0:17:57.119 --> 0:17:58.760 This is the title song on the record. 0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:02.840 It is, Yeah, this is the title Track's a strange 0:18:02.840 --> 0:18:05.879 song from me because it is it's just different, you know, 0:18:06.000 --> 0:18:07.240 it's really different. 0:18:07.440 --> 0:18:08.280 I love it. 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:10.639 It's a little bouncy. 0:18:11.080 --> 0:18:14.320 Yeah. 0:18:14.359 --> 0:18:16.240 And also I kind of had to let go of. 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:24.399 The idea of just being metaphorical and songwriterly and just 0:18:24.560 --> 0:18:26.639 say things that I wanted to say and play the 0:18:26.680 --> 0:18:29.040 guitar and sing with them and think, let's take all 0:18:29.080 --> 0:18:31.840 the context out, Let's take the ego out, Let's take 0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:35.399 the preconceived idea of what I'm supposed to do as 0:18:35.480 --> 0:18:37.600 a songwriter and just make. 0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:38.320 A song happen. 0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:39.960 Is that not you? Is that hard for you to 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:40.919 let all that go? 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:43.760 I don't think it will be now because I've done 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:47.040 it in the past. But in the past, yeah, yeah, 0:18:47.040 --> 0:18:49.399 there was this kind of like, well, if I can't 0:18:49.440 --> 0:18:54.800 provide reachable insight with these lyrics, and I'm not doing 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.280 my job, and it may have been true at one. 0:18:57.200 --> 0:19:01.479 Point, Okay, can you explain reachable insight Like does that 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:04.800 mean like relatability or it's more the story you're telling 0:19:04.920 --> 0:19:05.480 is true. 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:10.080 Oh well, it reveals something okay in the lyric about 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:16.920 the process, and by reachable I mean not necessarily obvious, 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:21.600 but also able to be found by the average listener. 0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:24.119 You're not hitting them over the head with it, but 0:19:24.240 --> 0:19:26.040 it's pretty much all there. 0:19:25.840 --> 0:19:28.840 For the Yeah, yeah, there are the clue. The mystery 0:19:28.880 --> 0:19:31.240 can be solved with the information, and you're not. 0:19:31.160 --> 0:19:33.960 Being overly cryptic, right, and you're not like trying to 0:19:34.040 --> 0:19:36.520 hide every every detail, yes. 0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:39.000 Or being vague or like running from anything. 0:19:39.160 --> 0:19:41.240 That's something I had to learn because in the beginning, 0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:44.080 I I didn't know how to write songs at all. 0:19:44.160 --> 0:19:46.560 And then I started and I tried to take all 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:50.080 the eyes out of the song. I was tried to 0:19:50.080 --> 0:19:53.239 be very you know, vague, and then I was like, 0:19:53.320 --> 0:19:54.480 that's not very. 0:19:54.520 --> 0:19:58.320 Soulful, right, No, it's not, Yeah, it's not. Yeah. 0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:03.680 The soulful stuff to me is the like the details 0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:08.480 that are for whatever reason, you're reluctant to include them, 0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:12.160 either because they're too much or too revealing or makes 0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:14.800 you cringe, or because you think this is not going 0:20:14.880 --> 0:20:18.320 to apply to everybody. That's where I really hit something. 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:21.320 I think it doesn't matter if it applies to everybody. 0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:23.120 You have to let that go. Is that what you're 0:20:23.119 --> 0:20:23.600