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Speaker 1: Hi, guys, Nancy Grace here, welcome back to killers amongst us,

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Speaker 1: the production of iHeart media and crime online. Every day,

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Speaker 1: so many of us go through life with blinders on.

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Speaker 1: Were in a hurry to pick up the children from school,

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Speaker 1: to make dinner, to get to work on time, to

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Speaker 1: punch the clot to get off, to beat the traffic,

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Speaker 1: to this, to that. Do you ever look up and

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Speaker 1: wonder who are these people around you? At the checkout

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Speaker 1: line at the grocery store, or as you walk up

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Speaker 1: and down the aisles. Somebody talked to on the phone,

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Speaker 1: the receptionist that the person jogging alongside you, who are they?

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Speaker 1: Believe it or not, there are killers amongst us. I'm

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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, thanks for being with us. A beautiful girl,

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Speaker 1: beautiful on the inside and the outside. Allen Greenberg. It

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Speaker 1: had just been a short while when she sent the

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Speaker 1: save the date out for her wedding. The whole lives

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Speaker 1: for her and her fiance unfolding before her like a

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Speaker 1: long wonderful road to be walked. Joining me. What a

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Speaker 1: wonderful group, Sandy Greenberg. This is Ellen's mother, Josh, her

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Speaker 1: father former prosecutor turned defense attorney, Darryl Cohen. Defense attorney

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Speaker 1: at Cohen Cooper is Stepan Allen, doctor Angela Arnold, renowned psychiatrists,

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Speaker 1: joining me out of the Atlanta jurisdiction at Angela Arnold, MD,

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Speaker 1: dot com private investigator for the Greenberg family. Tom Brennan,

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Speaker 1: an Crime online dot com investigative reporter Tyler Hunt. You know,

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Speaker 1: when I look at the photos of Ellen, She's just

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Speaker 1: absolutely beautiful. Do you, Sandy Greenberg? Tell me about when

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Speaker 1: Ellen was born. Every day was exciting with her. She

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Speaker 1: was just so much fun to be around. She had

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Speaker 1: tremendous energy, big smile, deep laugh. She was a normal

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Speaker 1: She had a normal childhood. But you know, every little

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Speaker 1: girl dreams of, you know, getting married and walking down

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Speaker 1: the aisle, and I think she was really looking forward

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Speaker 1: to her future. I'm looking at a photo of her

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Speaker 1: right now. She goes beautiful long. You know, people pay

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Speaker 1: good money to have their hair colored this color. She

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Speaker 1: has got long, beautiful raven locks. She's very petite. She's

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Speaker 1: standing on rocks at an ocean and the waves are

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Speaker 1: crashing up. When she got engaged, waves are crashing up

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Speaker 1: behind her. She's got on this cute little short crop

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Speaker 1: denim jacket over shirt beautiful, Wow, beautiful, perfect smile, and

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Speaker 1: she is You're right. She's holding up her left hand

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Speaker 1: and on her ring finger is a huge diamond ring.

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Speaker 1: What do you remember the most about her birth? Well,

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Speaker 1: I had a cissarean, so her space and her skin

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Speaker 1: were just beautifully shaped and just the smell of a

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Speaker 1: new baby. It's just a beautiful thing. And we were very,

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Speaker 1: very blessed with her. Every day that we had with

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Speaker 1: her was just a blessing. Now that we look back

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Speaker 1: and see, oh, how long ago that was, Josh Greenberg,

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Speaker 1: you know, I missed my dad every minute of every day.

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Speaker 1: I have my mom living with me right now. We're

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Speaker 1: very very close. But my dad and I were soulmates.

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Speaker 1: We like the same things. We love to dance, we

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Speaker 1: love to laugh, we love a good party. My dad

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Speaker 1: was just quiet, such a quiet guy, a very tender

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Speaker 1: and sensitive, very tender hearted. But oh he loved a

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Speaker 1: good time. You know those people that they walk in

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Speaker 1: the room and everybody gravitates toward them, that's my dad.

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Speaker 1: And the relationship between a dad and his daughter. Tell

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Speaker 1: me about you and Ellen. Well, let's go back to

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Speaker 1: the birthing. Sandy went through a lot and all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden, this was the time when I was supposed

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Speaker 1: to go into the Ohs. I wanted to wash, but

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Speaker 1: it wasn't the thrill to me, so I didn't go

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Speaker 1: into the US. So they come out with this cart

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Speaker 1: with this metal tray, and then this metal tray is

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Speaker 1: my daughter, and I'm going, what am I supposed to

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Speaker 1: do with her? I watched the nurses. Molly came and

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Speaker 1: they took her and stuff. But Ellen got to be

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Speaker 1: more and more of a child. She became very clingy

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Speaker 1: to me. I was the one she threw up on repeatedly.

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Speaker 1: I was the one who learned how to eat my

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Speaker 1: meals double quick fast because I had to take care

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Speaker 1: of her. I was the one that when she wanted,

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Speaker 1: we wanted her to ghost of somebody, She reached out

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Speaker 1: her arms to grab me, in fact, so that my

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Speaker 1: mother in law could have some time with her. When

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Speaker 1: we would visit my mother in law, who lived in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania,

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Speaker 1: where we now live, but we lived in Tentifland, New Jersey,

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Speaker 1: I would go away so Ellen couldn't grab me and

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Speaker 1: she'd stay with my mother in law. I wanted her

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Speaker 1: at time, but Ellen, Ellen was special. I know there's

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Speaker 1: a characteristic because Ellen got older. I'm gonna skip around

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Speaker 1: a little bit here. Ellen and had the ability, a

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Speaker 1: very strange ability, very special ability to bring different people together.

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Speaker 1: Sandy can relate the story how Sandy asked her and

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Speaker 1: she said, Mommy, I just bring my friends together. Mom,

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Speaker 1: I's yeah, yeah. And I remember things that when we

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Speaker 1: moved into our house. We lived the first in the

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Speaker 1: department in Fort Lee, and then we moved into a

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Speaker 1: house in Tenta Fly, and I would go for walks

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Speaker 1: with her, and she was this is a couple of

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Speaker 1: years old already, and it was a softball field, And

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Speaker 1: for the life of me, I couldn't figure out why

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Speaker 1: she would drag me over there to watch the girls

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Speaker 1: play softball. I mean, this is a girl. She's not

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Speaker 1: supposed to be interested in softball or athletics or anything,

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Speaker 1: and she was. She gradually grew into an all star

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Speaker 1: softball player in New Jersey and tenafly. Then there were

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Speaker 1: the times that she was like a little bouncing ball.

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Speaker 1: I was a giant New York Giant football fan, and

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Speaker 1: I would go to the games with her at two

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Speaker 1: tickets and we'd be dressed to the hilp you know,

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Speaker 1: in poor degree weather, sitting there freezing in a crowd,

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Speaker 1: and she would be bouncing between the crowd and a

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Speaker 1: little ball. People were knocking her around. I remember one

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Speaker 1: game it was so cold. I said, Ellen, can't we

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Speaker 1: go home now? And she said, no, Daddy, I want

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Speaker 1: to watch the game. I said, Ellen, I'll buy you something.

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Speaker 1: I'll buy you a hot dog, I'll buy ice cream. No, Daddy,

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Speaker 1: I want to watch the game. And there were times

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Speaker 1: again a father and a daughter, it's not supposed to

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Speaker 1: be this way, where we got hockey tickets to the Devils,

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Speaker 1: and I would go with friends and their daughters and

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Speaker 1: they didn't know what to do. And I said, first period,

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Speaker 1: you give them something to eat, the second period, you

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Speaker 1: give them dessert, and the third period you're ready to

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Speaker 1: go home anyway, So it doesn't matter. Ellen would sit there.

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Speaker 1: There was a time I took it to an ice

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Speaker 1: capaid show and I'm not really good at heights, so

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Speaker 1: I got the first row in the upper deck, but

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize I'd have to walk down from the

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Speaker 1: exit down to the first roll in the upper deck. Daddy,

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Speaker 1: why are you sliding on your tusheet to go to

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Speaker 1: the seat because I was afraid, but she was not afraid.

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Speaker 1: I held on to her, let her get, you know, escape.

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Speaker 1: I've also had tickets to the Yankee Games, and I

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Speaker 1: had really good tickets. I had the front row behind

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Speaker 1: the visitors dugout and we had one birthday party where

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Speaker 1: I had to take her and two of her friends

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Speaker 1: and they were up on the scoreboard and the pictures

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Speaker 1: of them and we signed the autographs by the visiting team.

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Speaker 1: And when we went to the bathroom, you know, they

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Speaker 1: went to the girls room, so I couldn't go in.

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Speaker 1: But I made them all. I heard of them like

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Speaker 1: little sheep, all of them, to keep them all together,

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Speaker 1: figuring if I kept them all together, at least if

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Speaker 1: I lost one, I wouldn't lose more. Or they've skipped

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Speaker 1: together somehow. And every time a person came out, I

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Speaker 1: sort of frisked them and I bumped into them to

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Speaker 1: make sure they weren't carrying it's a little child underneath

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Speaker 1: the coats because this is the time when people would

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Speaker 1: cut the hair and change it. And I was nervous.

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Speaker 1: I was afraid, but we got through it. So the

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Speaker 1: free tickets quested me like seventy dollars in food and

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Speaker 1: this and that as a baseball game. But she loved

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Speaker 1: that's what you wanted. She wanted to go to those games.

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Speaker 1: On another note, remember they had these um chuck e

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Speaker 1: cheese and they had a clown and a monkey, and

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Speaker 1: Ellen would go, daddy and little light monkey. I had

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Speaker 1: a data around, so she got a phrase of the

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Speaker 1: clown of the monkey whatever it was. But then Ellen

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Speaker 1: grew and Ellen did some great things. She was a

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Speaker 1: a what's called a lionizer. She went to the Penn

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Speaker 1: State University. I hope I'm not skipping an eye too far,

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Speaker 1: but I'm loving every word. Keep going, it all gets better.

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Speaker 1: Then she was a lionizer. What they did until the

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Speaker 1: University of Colorado ruined it by having their females do

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Speaker 1: things they shouldn't do. Ellen would take the parents of

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Speaker 1: the football recruits around. And the first night came the

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Speaker 1: Penn State ever had was against the University of Nebraska University,

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Speaker 1: which is a red and white team. So unfortunately Sandy

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Speaker 1: was dressed in wet and whites. We had to go

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Speaker 1: back and change her into blue life. But I'm sitting

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Speaker 1: halfway up in some seats and on the field running around,

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Speaker 1: waving to me, is my daughter at a ten state

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Speaker 1: game with her a hundreds and somewhat thousand people screaming

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Speaker 1: and yelling. Then she's sitting there and she did and

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Speaker 1: she loved She didn't want to do it. She enjoyed Soriti,

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Speaker 1: but she somehow, I don't know. I think Sandy got

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Speaker 1: her to go to the lion Hiser for Jay Paterno's children.

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Speaker 1: That's what she ended up that Jay suggested to Ellen

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Speaker 1: that she come in for an interview, and she wasn't

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Speaker 1: really going to do it, and I said, you've got

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Speaker 1: nothing to lose, please go for the interview. Then you

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Speaker 1: can decide whether or not you want to accept or not.

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Speaker 1: And turned out to be fabulous. She really Oh, she

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Speaker 1: loved it. She yes, she wasn't asked it to the

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Speaker 1: football game. And I just can't tell you how much

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Speaker 1: I love these stories. You're making me think about my

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Speaker 1: dad and my mom. I remember when I did Dancing

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Speaker 1: with the Stars and my mom and dad came from

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Speaker 1: Georgia to live in the apartment next to me in

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Speaker 1: LA and helped me take care of the children because

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Speaker 1: I had never been away from my twins in the

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Speaker 1: middle of the day, because I had a night job,

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Speaker 1: and I remember the first. Of course, they put me

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Speaker 1: in Jeopardy every single week, and I deserved it, I'm sure.

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Speaker 1: But the first night I was in Jeopardy, I was

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Speaker 1: in with Metal World Peace, the NBA star. We were

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Speaker 1: both somebody was getting thrown off and it was either

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Speaker 1: me or him. We were looking at each other. I

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Speaker 1: looked down the audience and out of all those people,

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Speaker 1: I saw my dad and they had come all the

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Speaker 1: way and relocated to La to be with me, and

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Speaker 1: he was looking at me. I thought he was going

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Speaker 1: to cry. He had this look on and says that

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Speaker 1: he was so worried. I'd be upset if I was

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Speaker 1: thrown off the very first night with the stars, and

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Speaker 1: I saw his face. I hadn't been upset until I

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Speaker 1: saw his face. I'm like, Oh, dear Lord in heaven,

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Speaker 1: Oh dear Lord in Heaven, my father is going to

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Speaker 1: have a heart attack. I'm looking right at him. He

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Speaker 1: looks like he's gonna cry, and know he's worried about

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Speaker 1: me and how I feel. Please don't let me get

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Speaker 1: thrown off this one night. Let it be next week

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Speaker 1: for Pete's sake. Well, let me just tell you something

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Speaker 1: Sandy and Josh. I stayed on till the very, the

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Speaker 1: bitter end. Really, my feet would actually bleed from practicing.

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Speaker 1: And I'll say I made it till how far did

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Speaker 1: I make it, Jackie, till the very till there were

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Speaker 1: three three people left, and they were all fantastic dancers.

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Speaker 1: But what I my takeaway is looking out at my

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Speaker 1: dad sitting there, and when I would cheerlead or whatever

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Speaker 1: I was gonna do, my dad would take me to

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Speaker 1: the event, and he and my mom, if she was there,

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Speaker 1: would and I would find them in the crowd, and

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Speaker 1: that's kind of all that mattered, was that they were there.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Daryl Cohen, when you hear the stories that

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Speaker 1: Sandy and Josh are telling so often, you know, as

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Speaker 1: a former prosecutor now defense attorney, I didn't because I'm

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Speaker 1: a crime victim. But so often people don't realize the

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Speaker 1: impact that one moment in time has for the rest

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Speaker 1: of their lives. So true, it just never I look

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Speaker 1: back my three daughters, and there's certain things that have

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Speaker 1: impacted me that I could never forget ten years after

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Speaker 1: I was deceased. It's unbelievable that one special moment and

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Speaker 1: normally It's a special one. Whether it's in Costa Rica,

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Speaker 1: whether it's at home, you just it lives with you

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Speaker 1: forever and it will never go away. It will be

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Speaker 1: as if it happened seconds to go rather than days,

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Speaker 1: weeks or years. And doctor Angie Arnold, renowned psychiatrists joining

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Speaker 1: me out of Atlanta, Doctor Angie. As I was growing up,

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Speaker 1: my mother and father my whole world, and they stayed

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Speaker 1: that way must to the chagrin of anybody I ever

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Speaker 1: dated until I had the children. And now the children

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Speaker 1: and my mom are you know, that's who I have

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Speaker 1: to take care of every single day. But hearing Josh

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Speaker 1: and Sandy talk, I realize as what the twins are

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Speaker 1: to me. That's what Ellen has always been to Sandy

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Speaker 1: and Josh. I mean, when you have your heart the

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Speaker 1: center of your life. Not to suggest they don't have

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Speaker 1: a life of their own, but I mean, my twins there,

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Speaker 1: they're a whole world. They're the center of my life.

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Speaker 1: Will be life without them, they always will be. I

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Speaker 1: can't even imagine the pain that they must suffer on

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Speaker 1: a daily basis. Well, go ahead, go ahead, Josh. I

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Speaker 1: have a story that I really would like to get out,

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Speaker 1: and this shows what kind of a person Ellen was.

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Speaker 1: I think when we moved to Tenafly, they had a girls'

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Speaker 1: softball league and somebody on a team that was very

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Speaker 1: a good team that always won, and this guy wasn't

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Speaker 1: very much into winning. Asked me about Ellen's softball credentials,

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Speaker 1: and I said, she played first base, she played third base,

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Speaker 1: she was on the all star team. She batted fourth

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Speaker 1: and fifth. And he wanted us not to show up

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Speaker 1: to the tryouts too, so that nobody would pick Ellen,

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Speaker 1: because you're not going to pick up the girl that

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Speaker 1: you haven't seen Ellen. I walked away and I said, Ellen,

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Speaker 1: what do you want to do, No, daddy, We're going

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Speaker 1: to show up and go to tryouts. So instead of

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Speaker 1: being on the best team in the league, Ellen was

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Speaker 1: on the worst and they lost every game. She never

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Speaker 1: complained about that. She never picked on anybody. She never

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Speaker 1: blamed the coach or anybody for the losing. She felt

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Speaker 1: that she should do the right thing, and she did.

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Speaker 1: And she was a child even as a little girl.

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Speaker 1: I guess Freud was right that your personality who you

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Speaker 1: are formed by the time you're four. I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: who you are. I'm wondering about that sometimes guys, who

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Speaker 1: was Ellen Greenberg. I'm looking at her photo, I'm hearing

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Speaker 1: stories about her, and she's coming alive in my mind.

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friend Jackie Howard. Ellen Greenberg

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Speaker 1: is an only child, so it's probably not a surprise

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Speaker 1: that she went into a profession dealing with lots of children.

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Speaker 1: She was a school teacher with a master's degree in education.

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Speaker 1: Her specialty reading. She had a Reading Specialist certification that

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Speaker 1: meant she would help students who had difficulty with reading,

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Speaker 1: or help teachers learn how to instruct their students with

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Speaker 1: reading difficulties. She liked working with young children and was

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Speaker 1: working with first graders at Honiana on Huntingdon Park in Philadelphia.

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Speaker 1: In fact, she was one of the founding teachers that

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Speaker 1: had been there for four years. Wow, I taught a student,

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Speaker 1: taught while I was waiting to hopefully get into law school,

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Speaker 1: which I managed to eke in somehow. And I loved teaching.

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Speaker 1: Tell me about that. It's a real calling, Sandy to

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Speaker 1: be a teacher, and she was actually working with children

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Speaker 1: in reading. Yeah, the classroom looked like any other classroom

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Speaker 1: across the United States. It was full of you know,

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Speaker 1: colorful posters and you know, all kinds of learning tools,

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Speaker 1: and she just when I would go to the class

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Speaker 1: and watch her in action with the children she did.

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Speaker 1: It was so alive and they don't always like to

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Speaker 1: sit still, but she somehow was able to command a

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Speaker 1: good learning atmosphere. And I even realized in I think

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Speaker 1: I read somewhere online, some of her students, after they

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Speaker 1: found out that Ellen had passed, said some really beautiful

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Speaker 1: things about how they taught she Ellen had taught them

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Speaker 1: to read, and you know, one of their most favorite teachers,

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Speaker 1: and she was firm in the classroom, but then she

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Speaker 1: loved them up. You know, they knew, you know. And

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Speaker 1: you never know, Sandy, how much that affects people, because

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Speaker 1: people can ask me any time, who was your favorite teacher? Well,

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Speaker 1: I know that I don't even have to think about it.

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Speaker 1: It was Claria Bell Bryant, my second great teacher that

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Speaker 1: taught me how to read. And that was when I

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Speaker 1: read my first poem from Miss Claria belt round the Meadow.

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Speaker 1: And I remember her. What she looked like, her leaning

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Speaker 1: over my desk, you know, to show me something or

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Speaker 1: read something. What she smell like. I always smell like

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Speaker 1: some kind of talcum powder, just always so gentle and loving.

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Speaker 1: But oh my goodness, if you misbehaved, Oh that didn't

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Speaker 1: last long. But yet, the soft, sweet, wonderful side of her.

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Speaker 1: I'll never forget Miss Clara Belle, who's long, long been

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Speaker 1: in heaven, but I think about her often. What made

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Speaker 1: Ellen Greenberg so special? You know? Joining me as a

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Speaker 1: private investigator, very well known, who's been working with the

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Speaker 1: Greenberg family searching for answers as we are here, Tom Brennan, Tom,

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Speaker 1: all of this is just coming alive from me hearing

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Speaker 1: about Ellen. I lived in Philly for a while with

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Speaker 1: my sister. She's a professor at Wharton, and my husband,

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Speaker 1: my now husband, went to grad school there as well.

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Speaker 1: And I just love Philly. I can just see her

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Speaker 1: right now in her classroom with all of her students.

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Speaker 1: What have you learned about Ellen that has made her

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Speaker 1: so special? Tom Um. In the course of my review

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Speaker 1: of the case, one of the things that the investigator

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Speaker 1: were you a cop? Tom? Were you ever a copy?

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Speaker 1: Because that's just exactly what I would expect and invest

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Speaker 1: a detective to write and a supplemental report, And the

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Speaker 1: course of my review, I love the way. Okay, go ahead,

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Speaker 1: tell me what have you learned that about? Why is

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Speaker 1: she this girl so special? I took a look at

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Speaker 1: a list of telephone numbers, okay with a special code

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Speaker 1: player to going in dialing the number, and the police

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Speaker 1: put a lot of emphasis on that series of six

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Speaker 1: or seven, um well almost almost ten different telephone numbers,

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Speaker 1: and they said it was all you know, special code,

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Speaker 1: so that um they didn't know what she was dialing

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Speaker 1: or what who she was dialing. So I took the

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Speaker 1: time to call several of those numbers and they were

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Speaker 1: all parents of students. The morning um of Ellen's Ellen's death,

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Speaker 1: there was a huge snowstorm in Philadelphia and she was

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Speaker 1: calling parents notifying them that they were their children, there

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Speaker 1: was going to be an early dismissal and that they

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Speaker 1: to be sure that they were there to pick up

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Speaker 1: their children. So she was taking the time to call

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Speaker 1: all the parents as may as she could get hold

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Speaker 1: of to tell them about the snow. You know, we

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Speaker 1: just get and I'm glad to get it, not knocking it.

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Speaker 1: When we have a snow alert or any other issue,

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Speaker 1: we get a text and I'm happy to get it.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what I would do, what a fall

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Speaker 1: over if one of the teachers actually call me, said Nancy,

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Speaker 1: just so you know, I don't even know. Just that

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Speaker 1: doesn't happen anymore. But that is, says Volumes about Ellen Greenberg,

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Speaker 1: the only child of Sandy and Josh. They put all

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Speaker 1: their love into her, all their hopes, all their dreams,

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Speaker 1: all their money to help foster and really create the

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Speaker 1: woman this girl will become. And then the excitement. Take

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Speaker 1: a listen to this. Greenberg's personal life was going just

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Speaker 1: as well as her teaching career. Greenberg lived in an

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Speaker 1: apartment with her boyfriend, Samuel Goldberg. He was a television

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Speaker 1: producer for NBC. In fact, the pair were engaged and

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Speaker 1: planning a wedding. Save the date cards had just been

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Speaker 1: sent to guests. Friends tell Oxygen. Greenberg was all smiles.

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Speaker 1: We all received the save the date in the mail.

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Speaker 1: I remember calling her on the phone saying, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: they're so beautiful, and she was so excited. Oh my goodness.

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Speaker 1: I'm just imagining that moment, and I see that makes

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Speaker 1: me wish I'd had the whole formal wedding, Sandy, because

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Speaker 1: my husband and I we decided on Tuesday we were

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Speaker 1: going to get married. We got married on Saturday, and

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Speaker 1: we flew various relatives in Let's see what did we have?

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Speaker 1: We had shrimp, grits, tenderloin. What else did we have? Oh,

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Speaker 1: scrambled eggs of course, and oh gosh, anything you could

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Speaker 1: think of to eat or drink that we liked. And

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Speaker 1: I called a friends that can you make a cake?

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Speaker 1: And he did. We had a cake that morning. I

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Speaker 1: picked flowers. That was my bouquet and it was totally

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Speaker 1: thrown together. And when I hear about people that do

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Speaker 1: save the dates and have this beautiful, well planned wedding,

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Speaker 1: I mean I barely have any pictures to show my

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Speaker 1: twins for Pete's sake. And do you remember when Ellen

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Speaker 1: told you Mom, I'm getting married. Well, they got engaged

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Speaker 1: in California on that twelve miles I make sure that

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Speaker 1: you had seen anyway. So it was a phone conversation

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Speaker 1: of her announcing her engagement and we were just over

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Speaker 1: the moon with excitement. And you know then, of course

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Speaker 1: we were trying to get dates secured because I think

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Speaker 1: she was going to plan on doing it that summer

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Speaker 1: of two thousand and eleven in August, and just all

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Speaker 1: the little details and everybody putting together their lists of

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Speaker 1: who we were going to invite, and I tried to

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Speaker 1: do everything, you know, as fair as can be, so

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Speaker 1: that you know, everybody, we were starting off on the

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Speaker 1: right foot and everybody you know, had the same amount

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Speaker 1: of guests and the other details. Ellen was more interested

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Speaker 1: in than I was, But I of course had to

400
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Speaker 1: embrace it all because that's what she wanted, and you know,

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Speaker 1: I was hoping too, or we were hoping to, you know,

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Speaker 1: make it a very happy, joyous occasion. You know, I

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Speaker 1: will never forget when I married David. Of course I

404
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 1: had cold feet. Cold feet had nothing to do with David,

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Speaker 1: you know, he was a gift from heaven that fell

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Speaker 1: on me. But my fiancee had been murdered shortly before

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Speaker 1: our wedding, and I had never ever really even considered

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Speaker 1: seriously going through with another try at marriage. I just no.

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Speaker 1: And I remember I was almost two hours late to

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Speaker 1: my own wedding and I finally got there and my

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Speaker 1: dad came up and he handed me a hanky. He

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Speaker 1: always had a hank you with him. He handed it

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Speaker 1: to me. I stuck it in the Bible I have.

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Speaker 1: I looked down the aisle, I saw my mom and

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Speaker 1: held on to my dad and off we went down

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Speaker 1: the aisle together. And I'm just thinking, Josh, when you

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Speaker 1: learned your baby girl was getting married, what did you think? Well,

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Speaker 1: I was gonna be a father in one number one,

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Speaker 1: Number two, I wanted my daughter to be happy. But

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Speaker 1: this is the band, the boy she wanted to be

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Speaker 1: happy with. Fine, But number three it's like, I use

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Speaker 1: this and I know I'm a little flipping. It's like

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Speaker 1: the shot you hit off a t on the golf

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00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,480
Speaker 1: course that goes in the rough. That may not be

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00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: what you want, but you think you can work with it.

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Speaker 1: And that was what I was thinking. Well, as my

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Speaker 1: daughter was happy, that's what I wanted, But I wanted

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Speaker 1: certain things to be the way certain things are, as

429
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Speaker 1: a father in law. But who knows, never got the

430
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,160
Speaker 1: chance at a time in her life when the world

431
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 1: was enfolding in such a magical and wonderful way. For

432
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:47,439
Speaker 1: Ellen Greenberg? Why why what's her life cut so brutally short?

433
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:55,159
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace killers and lax Tess signing off good not

434
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 1: Friend