1
00:00:02,560 --> 00:00:06,800
Speaker 1: Happy Saturday. On October twelfth, nineteen forty five, or seventy

2
00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:10,319
Speaker 1: nine years ago today, Desmond T. Doss was awarded the

3
00:00:10,360 --> 00:00:14,240
Speaker 1: Medal of Honor, making him the first conscientious objector to

4
00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:15,640
Speaker 1: receive that award.

5
00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:19,040
Speaker 2: Our episode on Desmond T. Doss originally came out on

6
00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,760
Speaker 2: July twenty fifth, twenty sixteen, and it is Today's Saturday

7
00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:28,840
Speaker 2: Classic Enjoy Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class,

8
00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:39,440
Speaker 2: a production of iHeartRadio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast.

9
00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:41,840
Speaker 2: I'm Tracy B. Wilson. I'm Holly Fryme.

10
00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:45,879
Speaker 1: We pretty recently did two episodes on Byered Restin, and

11
00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:48,920
Speaker 1: in those episodes we talked a little bit about conscience

12
00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:52,800
Speaker 1: objection to military service. Byed Restin was a Quaker, and

13
00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:56,080
Speaker 1: because he was a pacifist, his conscience objection to war

14
00:00:56,240 --> 00:01:00,280
Speaker 1: also evolved to include an objection to conscripting people into

15
00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:03,520
Speaker 1: the military. So at one point he had actually registered

16
00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:06,000
Speaker 1: as a conscientious objector, which meant that if he had

17
00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:10,160
Speaker 1: been drafted, he could be assigned to alternate non combat service.

18
00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,000
Speaker 1: But after this evolution in his views, he instead rescinded

19
00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:18,440
Speaker 1: his registration and went to federal prison instead. Some of

20
00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:21,640
Speaker 1: the response that we got to that episode, moved today's

21
00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:25,399
Speaker 1: topic farther up ahead on my shortlist of subjects. My

22
00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:29,320
Speaker 1: shortlist is like fifty things long. Yeah, my shortlist has

23
00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:32,800
Speaker 1: a very similar number. It's fart with the air course.

24
00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:36,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's the whole year worth of podcasts.

25
00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:40,760
Speaker 2: Uh. So it moved this topic ahead in that in

26
00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:42,680
Speaker 2: that shortlist. A. Desmond T.

27
00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:46,760
Speaker 1: Doss was also a conscientious objector, but his choices relating

28
00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:50,600
Speaker 1: to this objection took a really different form from buyered restins.

29
00:01:51,160 --> 00:01:54,800
Speaker 1: Doss did serve in the military in a non combat role,

30
00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:58,240
Speaker 1: and he was the first conscientious objector to be awarded

31
00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:00,320
Speaker 1: the Medal of Honor. So today we're going to talk

32
00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:02,720
Speaker 1: about him, as well as a little bit about two

33
00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:07,000
Speaker 1: other conscientious objectors who have also been awarded the same honor.

34
00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:10,400
Speaker 2: Before we get into DOS's story, we're going to level

35
00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:12,200
Speaker 2: set a little bit with a look at some of

36
00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:16,359
Speaker 2: the history of conscience objection in the Western world. Das

37
00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:17,880
Speaker 2: and both of the other men that we're going to

38
00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:21,240
Speaker 2: talk about were from the United States, but conscience objection

39
00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:23,800
Speaker 2: in general is something that exists in a lot of

40
00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:27,840
Speaker 2: other nations as well. So although the basic idea is

41
00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,480
Speaker 2: a whole lot older. The term conscientious objector seems to

42
00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,800
Speaker 2: have been coined sometime in the early nineteenth century to

43
00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:38,440
Speaker 2: describe a person who refuses to comply with the requirement

44
00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:42,280
Speaker 2: because doing so would violate their conscience. So this term

45
00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,600
Speaker 2: has been applied to all kinds of requirements related to

46
00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:49,320
Speaker 2: lots of different services and fields and circumstances. This includes

47
00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,280
Speaker 2: medicine and law, but today we are really sticking to

48
00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:57,560
Speaker 2: the context of conscience and military service. Issues of conscience

49
00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:01,679
Speaker 2: objection typically only come up when military service is mandatory

50
00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:04,720
Speaker 2: in some way. This was true of the person typically

51
00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:09,600
Speaker 2: cited as history's first conscientious subjector. That was Maximilianus, who

52
00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:12,240
Speaker 2: was the son of a Roman army veteran. He was

53
00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:14,880
Speaker 2: required to join the military when he turned twenty one,

54
00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:17,239
Speaker 2: and this was back in the year two ninety five.

55
00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:22,960
Speaker 2: Maximilianus refused, citing his Christian beliefs as his reason for refusal,

56
00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:25,560
Speaker 2: and he was beheaded for doing so.

57
00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:32,040
Speaker 1: Historically, conscience objection to military service has usually not always

58
00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:35,440
Speaker 1: been connected to pacifist religions, and this meant that in

59
00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:39,080
Speaker 1: Europe conscience subjection became a lot more common following the

60
00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:44,000
Speaker 1: Protestant Reformation. After the Reformation, the number and focus of

61
00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,320
Speaker 1: religious denominations became a lot more diverse, and a lot

62
00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:51,200
Speaker 1: more people began to choose which faith to belong to

63
00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,800
Speaker 1: rather than following a state sponsored or nationally consistent religion.

64
00:03:56,200 --> 00:04:00,600
Speaker 1: So Mennonites, for example, were exempt from mandatory guard duties

65
00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:03,320
Speaker 1: because of their pacifist beliefs. During the Dutch Wars of

66
00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:05,320
Speaker 1: Independence in the sixteenth century.

67
00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:10,800
Speaker 2: Standards and rules about how to handle conscience objections also spread,

68
00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,760
Speaker 2: along with conscription into standing armies in Europe following the

69
00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:19,000
Speaker 2: French Revolution. Nations saw a need to establish and maintain

70
00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:21,800
Speaker 2: a standing army, but they also saw a need not

71
00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:25,279
Speaker 2: to force their citizens to violate their religious principles in

72
00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:30,560
Speaker 2: doing so. It was really the twentieth century before conscience

73
00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:35,040
Speaker 2: objection sort of coalesced into an anti war movement strategy.

74
00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:38,760
Speaker 2: That was when people really started to describe themselves as

75
00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:43,560
Speaker 2: conscientious objectors rather than describing conscription or military service or

76
00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:46,719
Speaker 2: a specific war as something that was against their religion.

77
00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:50,880
Speaker 2: And the idea that someone could have a conscious objection

78
00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:54,160
Speaker 2: to war personally without being without it being based in

79
00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:57,840
Speaker 2: a very specific organized religion started to become more common

80
00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,240
Speaker 2: around the First World War as well, and at the

81
00:05:01,279 --> 00:05:04,479
Speaker 2: start of World War One, many European nations and the

82
00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:09,560
Speaker 2: United States added specific conscience objection rules to their conscription policies,

83
00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:12,799
Speaker 2: in part because of advocacy on the part of pacifist

84
00:05:12,880 --> 00:05:16,480
Speaker 2: religious groups. When World War One ended, most but not

85
00:05:16,560 --> 00:05:21,799
Speaker 2: all European nations ended their conscription programs, which temporarily tabled

86
00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:27,119
Speaker 2: the issue of conscience objection. When conscriptions started up again.

87
00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:29,719
Speaker 2: Before and during World War II, a lot of nations

88
00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:34,159
Speaker 2: again offered alternative service to conscientious objectors, although people who

89
00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:37,159
Speaker 2: felt like their conscience wouldn't allow them to support the

90
00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:39,240
Speaker 2: war in any way, even if it were in a

91
00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:42,360
Speaker 2: non combat role, still usually wound up being sentenced to

92
00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:47,000
Speaker 2: time in prison. Today, many nations around the world view

93
00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,320
Speaker 2: conscience objection as a fundamental human right protected by international law.

94
00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:55,159
Speaker 2: The Universal Declaration of Human Rights was adopted by the

95
00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:59,159
Speaker 2: United Nations General Assembly on December tenth of nineteen forty

96
00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:02,640
Speaker 2: eight in the wake of World War II. Article eighteen

97
00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:06,240
Speaker 2: of that declaration reads quote, everyone has the right to

98
00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:10,719
Speaker 2: freedom of thought, conscience, and religion. This right includes freedom

99
00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:14,039
Speaker 2: to change his religion or belief, and freedom either alone

100
00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:16,840
Speaker 2: or in a community with others, and in public or

101
00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:21,880
Speaker 2: private to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship,

102
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:22,920
Speaker 2: and observance.

103
00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:28,599
Speaker 1: Article eighteen of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights,

104
00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:32,240
Speaker 1: which is adopted in nineteen sixty six, builds on this idea.

105
00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:37,200
Speaker 1: Further Part one of that article is really similar to

106
00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:40,240
Speaker 1: what Holly just read, and then it continues too. No

107
00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:43,599
Speaker 1: one shall be subject to coercion which would impair his

108
00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:47,159
Speaker 1: freedom to have or adopt a religion or belief.

109
00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:48,800
Speaker 2: Of his choice. Three.

110
00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:52,240
Speaker 1: Freedom to manifest one's religion or beliefs may be subject

111
00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:55,680
Speaker 1: only to such limitations as are prescribed by law and

112
00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:59,640
Speaker 1: are necessary to protect public safety, order, health, or morals,

113
00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:04,080
Speaker 1: or the fundamental right and freedoms of others. Although this

114
00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:10,000
Speaker 1: Declaration and Covenant don't specifically mention conscience objection, many nations

115
00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,280
Speaker 1: have interpreted conscience subjection as an aspect of the freedom

116
00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:17,640
Speaker 1: of thought, conscience, and religion. Also, the United Nations Commission

117
00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:20,200
Speaker 1: on Human Rights, which was replaced by the Human Rights

118
00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:23,080
Speaker 1: Council in two thousand and six, has issued a number

119
00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:27,760
Speaker 1: of other declarations that do specifically address conscience objection, although

120
00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:31,400
Speaker 1: these aren't legally binding among member states, they spell out

121
00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:34,440
Speaker 1: conscience objection as being part of the fundamental human right

122
00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:38,080
Speaker 1: to freedom of thought. The first of these was Resolution

123
00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:41,800
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty seven forty six, which was passed in nineteen

124
00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:44,840
Speaker 1: eighty seven with twenty six votes in favor, two against,

125
00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,800
Speaker 1: and fourteen abstentions. The following year, the Commission on Human

126
00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:52,560
Speaker 1: Rights issued Resolution nineteen eighty eight seventy seven, specifying that

127
00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,560
Speaker 1: everyone has the right to conscience objection and calling on

128
00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:59,760
Speaker 1: states that don't have conscience objection policies to develop them

129
00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:03,560
Speaker 1: in a non discriminatory way. A number of other resolutions

130
00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:06,640
Speaker 1: upholding the right the conscience objection have followed since then.

131
00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:10,640
Speaker 1: Not every United Nations member state has agreed with those

132
00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:14,960
Speaker 1: resolutions or with the interpretation that conscience objection is a

133
00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:19,040
Speaker 1: fundamental human right. For example, Singapore drafted a letter to

134
00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:21,080
Speaker 1: the Commission in two thousand and two that was co

135
00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:30,800
Speaker 1: signed by sixteen member states. Those include Bangladesh, Botswana, China, Egypt, Eritrea, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon,

136
00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:37,840
Speaker 1: me and mar Rwanda, Singapore, Sudan, Syria, Thailand, Tanzania, and Vietnam,

137
00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:42,359
Speaker 1: stating that they quote do not recognize the universal applicability

138
00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:46,560
Speaker 1: of conscientious objection to military service, and of course, not

139
00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:49,240
Speaker 1: every nation on earth is a member state of the

140
00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:53,520
Speaker 1: United Nations. There are so many nuances to all this,

141
00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:56,880
Speaker 1: and from an ethical and moral standpoint, the decision to

142
00:08:56,960 --> 00:08:59,920
Speaker 1: object or not to object is an incredibly personal line.

143
00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:03,560
Speaker 1: And if conscience objection is a fundamental human right, then

144
00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,479
Speaker 1: that means that people who do serve in the military

145
00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:09,920
Speaker 1: are fighting to protect the right not to, whether they

146
00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:12,720
Speaker 1: agree with the existence of that right or not. And

147
00:09:12,800 --> 00:09:15,160
Speaker 1: there have also been lots of times in history when

148
00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:19,239
Speaker 1: the idea of conscience objections has become just incredibly divisive,

149
00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:22,160
Speaker 1: and the most obvious is probably during the Vietnam War.

150
00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:25,240
Speaker 1: All of that is really outside the scope of our

151
00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,480
Speaker 1: show today, but we would be remiss.

152
00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:30,200
Speaker 2: If we did not at least acknowledge it. So for

153
00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:33,719
Speaker 2: Desmond T. Dos the decision not to fight was not

154
00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:37,480
Speaker 2: actually even something he thought of as a conscience objection.

155
00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:41,760
Speaker 2: He actually preferred to be called a conscientious cooperator. And

156
00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:44,160
Speaker 2: we're going to talk about him after a brief word

157
00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:55,240
Speaker 2: from one of our sponsors. Desmond T.

158
00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:59,400
Speaker 1: Doss was born in Lynchburg, Virginia, on February seventh, nineteen nineteen.

159
00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,320
Speaker 1: His mother worked in a shoe factory, and his father

160
00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:05,160
Speaker 1: was a carpenter, and their family were members of the

161
00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:08,800
Speaker 1: Seventh day Adventist Church. In their home, they had a

162
00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:12,600
Speaker 1: framed poster that displayed the illustrated ten Commandments in the

163
00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,120
Speaker 1: Lord's Prayer, and the illustration of the sixth commandment of

164
00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:19,480
Speaker 1: Thou shalt not kill was of Cain having just killed

165
00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:24,440
Speaker 1: his brother Abel from the Book of Genesis. This image

166
00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:28,040
Speaker 1: had an almost visceral impact on the young Desmond. He

167
00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:31,160
Speaker 1: was appalled at the idea that one brother could murder another,

168
00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:34,440
Speaker 1: and he also believed that bearing arms was a sin

169
00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:39,800
Speaker 1: against God. In April of nineteen forty two, Dawson listed

170
00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:42,679
Speaker 1: in the Army for World War Two. Although he was

171
00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:46,160
Speaker 1: designated as a conscientious objector, he didn't actually have an

172
00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:49,079
Speaker 1: objection to serving as long as he didn't have to

173
00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:52,000
Speaker 1: kill anyone or carry a weapon and could observe the

174
00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:56,560
Speaker 1: Sabbath each Saturday. To reconcile his service with his faith,

175
00:10:57,280 --> 00:11:00,000
Speaker 1: Dos became a medic. Being a medic would let him

176
00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:03,480
Speaker 1: help people rather than harm them, and he didn't have

177
00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:07,160
Speaker 1: an objection to doing actual medical work on Saturday, since

178
00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:11,520
Speaker 1: and his words quote Christ, healed on a Sabbath. Even so,

179
00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,200
Speaker 1: Das faced harassment and derision from his peers while they

180
00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:18,600
Speaker 1: were in training. In addition to his religious refusal to

181
00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:21,640
Speaker 1: carry a weapon or do non medical work like participating

182
00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:25,680
Speaker 1: in drills on Saturdays, he continued his practice of devotion

183
00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:29,920
Speaker 1: in prayers. He was also a vegetarian for religious reasons.

184
00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:33,199
Speaker 1: At one point, his commanding officer attempted to have him

185
00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:35,920
Speaker 1: discharged from the army on the grounds that he was

186
00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:40,760
Speaker 1: mentally ill. Doas's response quote, I'd be a very poor

187
00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:43,840
Speaker 1: Christian if I accepted a discharge implying that I was

188
00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:48,920
Speaker 1: mentally off because of my religion. In the end, though,

189
00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:51,760
Speaker 1: Das completed his training and was deployed with the three

190
00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:56,600
Speaker 1: hundred seventh Infantry seventy seventh Infantry Division. He left for

191
00:11:56,679 --> 00:11:59,240
Speaker 1: Guam in the summer of nineteen forty four, and he

192
00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:02,000
Speaker 1: served as a me both there and on the island

193
00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:05,160
Speaker 1: of Leati and the Philippines, earning the Bronze Star for

194
00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:09,520
Speaker 1: his heroism. In the spring of nineteen forty five, Dos

195
00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:12,120
Speaker 1: was part of the Battle of Okinawa, which stretched from

196
00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:15,120
Speaker 1: April first to June twenty second of nineteen forty five

197
00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:19,000
Speaker 1: and pitted the US and its allies against Japanese troops

198
00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:22,280
Speaker 1: that were deeply entrenched in caves, tunnels, and other cover

199
00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:25,520
Speaker 1: DOS's unit was on the four hundred foot tall ridge

200
00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:29,760
Speaker 1: at Maida Escarpment when a Japanese force staged a counter

201
00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:34,960
Speaker 1: attack on Saturday, May fifth of nineteen forty five. Dos

202
00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,800
Speaker 1: was the only medic with them on the escarpment, and

203
00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,480
Speaker 1: while some of the American force was able to retreat

204
00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,240
Speaker 1: back down, a lot of the men who were wounded

205
00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:46,280
Speaker 1: were stranded on top of this ridge and pinned down

206
00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:48,160
Speaker 1: under fire from the Japanese force.

207
00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:52,400
Speaker 2: Dos remained with the wounded men, and he rigged a

208
00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:55,560
Speaker 2: sling to evacuate them one at a time down the

209
00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:58,800
Speaker 2: face of a cliff, using knots and techniques that he

210
00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:02,000
Speaker 2: had learned as a youth when working in a flood rescue.

211
00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,000
Speaker 2: He used a tree stump to anchor his sling. He

212
00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:07,840
Speaker 2: loaded each wounded man into it, and he lowered them

213
00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:10,920
Speaker 2: thirty five feet to safety on a protected ledge below.

214
00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:14,440
Speaker 2: He did this over and over while under fire, until

215
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:18,240
Speaker 2: every man was down, and then he lowered himself. His

216
00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:20,920
Speaker 2: commanding officer wanted to credit him with saving one hundred

217
00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,800
Speaker 2: men's lives that day. He said it was only more

218
00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:28,560
Speaker 2: like fifty, and they eventually compromised at seventy five. His

219
00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:32,400
Speaker 2: heroic efforts to save people's lives did not stop there, though.

220
00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:36,480
Speaker 2: He basically continued to rescue men from under fire repeatedly,

221
00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:40,080
Speaker 2: including carrying people to safety while being fired upon for

222
00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:43,280
Speaker 2: pretty much the whole next week. On May twelfth, he

223
00:13:43,400 --> 00:13:46,680
Speaker 2: was injured by a grenade and had multiple shrapnel injuries

224
00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:50,560
Speaker 2: to his legs. Although another medic was nearby, Dos cared

225
00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:54,520
Speaker 2: for his injuries himself for five hours rather than having

226
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:58,200
Speaker 2: any other medic risk his own safety and come to help. Then,

227
00:13:58,400 --> 00:14:01,880
Speaker 2: when Dos was finally evacuated, he saw another soldier whose

228
00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:04,440
Speaker 2: need he thought was greater, so he got off the

229
00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:07,280
Speaker 2: litter he was being carried on and asked the medics

230
00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:11,600
Speaker 2: to take care of that other man instead. Then, while

231
00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:13,640
Speaker 2: he was waiting for them to come back for him,

232
00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:16,160
Speaker 2: he was struck in the arm by enemy fire and

233
00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:20,240
Speaker 2: sustained a compound fracture. Impossibly the only time in his

234
00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:22,600
Speaker 2: life that he ever handled a weapon, he made a

235
00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:25,400
Speaker 2: splint for himself out of a rifle stock and then

236
00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:29,200
Speaker 2: crawled to an aid station three hundred yards away with

237
00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:33,200
Speaker 2: one of his arms broken. And splinted. Just stand in

238
00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:38,120
Speaker 2: awe of all of this. I can't even grasp the

239
00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:41,520
Speaker 2: fortitude a person has to have, which is why he

240
00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:46,960
Speaker 2: earned the nickname the wonder Man of Okinawa. DESMONDI.

241
00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,120
Speaker 1: Das was one of the men awarded the Medal of

242
00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:52,560
Speaker 1: Honor by President Harry S. Truman on October twelfth, nineteen

243
00:14:52,680 --> 00:14:55,400
Speaker 1: forty five. Doss had been a private when he took

244
00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:58,200
Speaker 1: these actions that led to this recognition, and he was

245
00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:01,120
Speaker 1: a corporal when it was actually a war to him.

246
00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:04,720
Speaker 1: His injuries from the war, however, were extensive and he

247
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:09,240
Speaker 1: needed ongoing medical care, and he eventually lost along to tuberculosis.

248
00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:12,440
Speaker 1: He spent about six years in hospitals trying to recover,

249
00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,000
Speaker 1: and he had planned to go to a trade school

250
00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:17,880
Speaker 1: and become a florist, but the extent of his injuries

251
00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:21,480
Speaker 1: and illnesses made that impossible. He devoted most of his

252
00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:25,120
Speaker 1: life instead to religious work, and in nineteen seventy six

253
00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:30,200
Speaker 1: he suddenly lost his hearing. In nineteen ninety one, DOS's

254
00:15:30,280 --> 00:15:33,400
Speaker 1: first wife, Dorothy he had married in nineteen forty two

255
00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,360
Speaker 1: before leaving for the service, died in a car accident.

256
00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:40,400
Speaker 1: He remarried about three years later, and his second wife, Francis,

257
00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:43,120
Speaker 1: was still living when Dos died on March twenty third,

258
00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:45,200
Speaker 1: two thousand and six, at the age of eighty seven.

259
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:48,880
Speaker 1: In nineteen eighty seven, he said in an interview quote,

260
00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:51,520
Speaker 1: I wasn't trying to be a hero. I was thinking

261
00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:54,320
Speaker 1: about it from this standpoint. In a house on fire

262
00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:56,640
Speaker 1: and a mother has a child in that house, what

263
00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:58,880
Speaker 1: prompts her to go in and get that child?

264
00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:02,520
Speaker 2: Love? I loved my men, and they loved me. I

265
00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:06,080
Speaker 2: don't consider myself a hero. I just couldn't give them up,

266
00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:08,960
Speaker 2: just like that mother couldn't give up the child. For

267
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,600
Speaker 2: all of his life, he credited God with his survival

268
00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:15,920
Speaker 2: during the war. After another brief sponsor break, we will

269
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:19,520
Speaker 2: talk a little bit about two other conscientious objectors who

270
00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:31,240
Speaker 2: have also been awarded the Medal of Honor. We spoke

271
00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:34,400
Speaker 2: right before the break about two other conscientious objectors who

272
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:37,000
Speaker 2: have also been awarded the Medal of Honor, and both

273
00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:40,760
Speaker 2: of them received that honor for work as medics in Vietnam.

274
00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:45,040
Speaker 2: The first was Thomas W. Bennett of Morgantown, West Virginia.

275
00:16:45,520 --> 00:16:49,520
Speaker 2: His military records didn't list a denominational preference, but sources

276
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:54,320
Speaker 2: suggest that he was raised either Methodist or Southern Baptist. Regardless,

277
00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:57,760
Speaker 2: he attended the services of multiple denominations, and he came

278
00:16:57,800 --> 00:17:00,720
Speaker 2: to a sincerely held belief that all life was sacred.

279
00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:04,600
Speaker 2: He also vehemently objected to the United States involvement in

280
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:10,560
Speaker 2: the Vietnam War. Specifically, Bennett was drafted during that involvement

281
00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:14,160
Speaker 2: in Vietnam, and after he'd lost his student deferment due

282
00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:16,960
Speaker 2: to poor grades at West Virginia University, he wound up

283
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:20,119
Speaker 2: registering as a conscientious objector who was willing to serve

284
00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:23,159
Speaker 2: in a non combat role. He became a medic and

285
00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:27,159
Speaker 2: was eventually deployed to Vietnam. On February ninth of nineteen

286
00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:30,840
Speaker 2: sixty nine, his platoon there was ambushed. In the words

287
00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:34,159
Speaker 2: of his Medal of Honor citation quote, Corporal Bennett, with

288
00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:37,680
Speaker 2: complete disregard for his safety, ran through the heavy fire

289
00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:42,040
Speaker 2: to his fallen comrades, administered life saving first aid under fire,

290
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,280
Speaker 2: and then made repeated trips carrying the wounded men to

291
00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:48,280
Speaker 2: positions of relative safety from which they would be medically

292
00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:53,040
Speaker 2: evacuated from the battle position. Corporal Bennett repeatedly braved the

293
00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:57,080
Speaker 2: intense enemy fire, moving across open areas to give aid

294
00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:01,760
Speaker 2: and comfort to his wounded comrades. Valiantly exposed himself to

295
00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,560
Speaker 2: the heavy fire in order to retrieve the bodies of

296
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:06,040
Speaker 2: several fallen personnel.

297
00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:11,240
Speaker 1: Then, as the whole platoon was awaiting for helicopters to

298
00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:14,359
Speaker 1: rescue the injured men, he spent the night outside the

299
00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:17,000
Speaker 1: safety of any kind of shelter, tending to wounded people

300
00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:18,000
Speaker 1: who couldn't be moved.

301
00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:22,280
Speaker 2: On February eleventh, a similar event happened again when the

302
00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:25,640
Speaker 2: platoon came under sniper fire, and once again Bennett put

303
00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,800
Speaker 2: himself at risk repeatedly to try to aid the wounded,

304
00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:31,399
Speaker 2: including an attempt to save a fellow soldier who had

305
00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:35,000
Speaker 2: fallen ahead of the company's position. Even though he was

306
00:18:35,080 --> 00:18:37,720
Speaker 2: warned that the fallen soldier would be impossible to reach

307
00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:40,280
Speaker 2: given where he was in the amount of enemy fire,

308
00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,399
Speaker 2: Bennett tried anyway, and he was mortally wounded in the process.

309
00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:47,639
Speaker 2: He was posthumously awarded the Medal of Honor on April

310
00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:50,680
Speaker 2: seventh of nineteen seventy, which would have been his twenty

311
00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,600
Speaker 2: third birthday. The third conscientious objector to be awarded the

312
00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:57,879
Speaker 2: Medal of Honor was Specialist for Joseph G. Lapointe Junior,

313
00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:01,520
Speaker 2: and there's not as much biographical inform that's publicly available

314
00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:05,080
Speaker 2: on him. Army records, though identified him as a Baptist.

315
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,959
Speaker 2: On June second of nineteen sixty nine, the patrol he

316
00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:12,480
Speaker 2: was on fell under heavy enemy fire. He rendered aid

317
00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:15,439
Speaker 2: while under fire to two injured soldiers, and to do

318
00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:17,960
Speaker 2: so he had to crawl directly into the line of

319
00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:21,520
Speaker 2: sight of an enemy bunker. He resorted to shielding the

320
00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:24,000
Speaker 2: two fallen men with his own body, but all three

321
00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:27,960
Speaker 2: were killed by an enemy grenade. In addition to his

322
00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:32,000
Speaker 2: Medal of Honor, Lapointe was also posthumously awarded the Silver Star.

323
00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:34,680
Speaker 2: He was survived by his wife, Cindy, and his son,

324
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:38,680
Speaker 2: also named Joseph, who was unfortunately born after his father's death.

325
00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:49,760
Speaker 2: And that's a little bit about conscience objection and conscientious objectors.

326
00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:53,520
Speaker 2: Thanks so much for joining us on this Saturday. If

327
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:55,680
Speaker 2: you'd like to send us a note, our email addresses

328
00:19:55,840 --> 00:20:00,440
Speaker 2: History Podcast at iHeartRadio dot com, and you can subscribe

329
00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:03,560
Speaker 2: to the show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

330
00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:05,640
Speaker 2: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.