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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Netflix is the largest

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Speaker 1: paid streaming service in the world, but it's so much.

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Speaker 2: More when you think of the traditional film and television.

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Speaker 2: Netflix is the biggest TV network. It is the most

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Speaker 2: productive movie studio.

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Speaker 1: Lucas Shaw reports on the business of entertainment for Bloomberg,

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Speaker 1: and he's covered Netflix closely for years as the company

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Speaker 1: has grown from a DVD by mail service into a

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Speaker 1: streaming juggernaut.

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Speaker 2: It's been making original programming for about ten years, and

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Speaker 2: in that ten year span it has more from sort

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Speaker 2: of like this small, cuddly company into the most powerful

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Speaker 2: for us in Hollywood.

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Speaker 1: Today, Netflix is the envy of other paid subscription services,

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Speaker 1: along with many TV networks and movie studios. But back

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty two, there were a lot of questions

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Speaker 1: about Netflix's future coming out of the pandemic when streaming

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Speaker 1: use skyrocketed then plateaued. The company had the worst six

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Speaker 1: month stretch in its history, and it lost around two

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Speaker 1: hundred billion dollars in market value. But Netflix defied its

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Speaker 1: critics and engineer to turn around, and Lucas says there

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Speaker 1: is one person who's led the way through the company's rebound.

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Speaker 2: He's one of the most important and powerful people in

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Speaker 2: the media entertainment business and someone that I think nobody

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Speaker 2: knows anything about.

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Speaker 1: Greg Peters is Netflix's co CEO, an executive handpicked by

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Speaker 1: Reed Hastings. He's the company's billionaire co founder who stepped

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Speaker 1: aside last year. Well now Peters runs Netflix alongside Ted Sarandos,

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Speaker 1: and together they've put Netflix on track to generate ten

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Speaker 1: billion dollars in profit this year. On today's episode, who

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Speaker 1: is Greg Peters And what's his vision for Netflix? And

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Speaker 1: how we'll watch? Well everything, I'm David Gerret and this

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Speaker 1: is the big take from Bloomberg News. Bloomberg's Lucas Shaw

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Speaker 1: recently sat down with Greg Peters for his first print

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Speaker 1: profile since he became Netflix's co CEO last year. Can

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Speaker 1: you describe what it was like to meet him and

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Speaker 1: sort of how you thought about the scenes or the

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Speaker 1: situations in which you'd want to show him in this role.

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Speaker 2: Well, I only had so much control over that, right,

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Speaker 2: Netflix is a very controlling company. You know, Normally, if

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Speaker 2: you profile someone, you want to spend a lot of

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Speaker 2: time with them, you want to see them in multiple settings.

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Speaker 2: But you know, I knew I wanted something that was

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Speaker 2: sort of more of a corporate event to see him

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Speaker 2: interacting with peers, and so that ended up being going

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Speaker 2: to this thing they have called New Employee College, which

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Speaker 2: is like new higher orientation, and he gave sort of

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Speaker 2: a basically a pep talk to this room of people.

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Speaker 1: The orientation happened at an art deco theater in Hollywood,

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Speaker 1: and Peters started that pep talk by tracing Netflix's history,

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Speaker 1: a history he helped shape.

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Speaker 2: If you look at the biggest initiatives for the company

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Speaker 2: over the last few years, he has been the person

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Speaker 2: leading those.

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Speaker 1: Peters is not exactly your average tech guy. He's a

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Speaker 1: bit of a renaissance man. He speaks six languages and

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Speaker 1: plays the Digeri do. After college at Yale, where he

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Speaker 1: studied physics and astronomy, he got a job as an

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Speaker 1: engineer at an online wine reed sailor, where he developed

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Speaker 1: a taste for the finest barolos before the dot com

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Speaker 1: bubble burst in two thousand and one. Over the next

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Speaker 1: few years, Peters bounced around from tech company to tech company,

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Speaker 1: and in two thousand and eight he got a call

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Speaker 1: from Netflix.

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Speaker 2: They were looking for someone who could help get the

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Speaker 2: service distributed on a lot more devices because Netflix started

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Speaker 2: off only being available on your computer. You know, I

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Speaker 2: watched it on my laptop in college that year, and

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Speaker 2: Greg had a resume that was in many ways perfect

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Speaker 2: for that because he was navigating this relationship between representing

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Speaker 2: software and negotiating with consumer electronics companies.

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Speaker 1: Peters was part of the team that convinced the TV

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Speaker 1: manufacturer Visio to put a Netflix button on its remotes,

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Speaker 1: and that convinced Netflix co founder Read Hastings that Peters

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Speaker 1: had potential.

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Speaker 2: Read takes a liking to him. He sees someone with

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Speaker 2: broad interests. He sees someone who is sort of multifaceted

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Speaker 2: because he understands the technical side very well and can

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Speaker 2: do things that other people explain to me that I

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Speaker 2: would struggle in explaining, and so I think that became

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Speaker 2: attractive to someone like Read.

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Speaker 1: Hastings tapped Peters to oversee Netflix's expansion in Japan, and

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Speaker 1: then Peters became the company's chief product officer, and in

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Speaker 1: that role, Peters started looking into something that had become

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Speaker 1: a problem for the company, password sharing.

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Speaker 2: Netflix started to study it. They tried to examine there

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Speaker 2: are both ways to identify who was sharing and then

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Speaker 2: how you would stop them from doing soak.

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Speaker 1: There are a lot of ways people share Netflix, like

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Speaker 1: a family of four using the same account under one roof.

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Speaker 1: But then there's the twenty something who's moved away from

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Speaker 1: home and lets his two friends and his ex girlfriend

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Speaker 1: us his mom's account. Peters and his team studied all

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Speaker 1: those scenarios.

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Speaker 2: There's a lot of studying of building the algorithm to

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Speaker 2: determine who is sort of unfairly sharing, and then how

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Speaker 2: do you communicate that without pissing people off.

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Speaker 1: After rooting out the moochers, Netflix started to think about

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Speaker 1: how it could launch a broader crackdown in twenty twenty two,

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Speaker 1: but Lucas says there was this divide within the company

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Speaker 1: about how to proceed.

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Speaker 2: They have a big disagreement basically about what the best

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Speaker 2: approaches Read Hastings on one side, Greg Peters and most

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Speaker 2: of his most of the executive team on the other side.

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Speaker 1: Hastings, Netflix's co founder, thought Netflix should charge by physical location.

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Speaker 1: For example, if you are lucky enough to have two houses,

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Speaker 1: you would need two Netflix accounts. Well, Peters thought that

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Speaker 1: violated Netflix's core promise that if you paid for the service,

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Speaker 1: you should be able to take it with you. Peters

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Speaker 1: advocated for a model based on individual users. You could

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Speaker 1: access Netflix wherever you wanted, but you'd have to pay

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Speaker 1: to add new users to your account.

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Speaker 2: So they test both models in Latin America in sort

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Speaker 2: of two distinct tests, and Greg's instinct proves to be correct.

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Speaker 1: By this point, Hastings had been thinking for a while

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Speaker 1: about his next chapter. The fact that Peters's approach worked

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Speaker 1: that led to more sign ups, fewer cancelations, and less

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Speaker 1: online outrage was the last in a string of successes

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Speaker 1: that convinced Hastings Peters could lead Netflix.

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Speaker 2: He was, as Read Hastings described, like kind of the

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Speaker 2: battlefield generals. And so there's a reason that after they

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Speaker 2: had settled on how to crack down and password sharing,

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Speaker 2: read Hastings decides, now's my time. I can leave, and

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Speaker 2: I trust Greg to succeed me.

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Speaker 1: In January twenty twenty three, Netflix announced Hastings would transition

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Speaker 1: to a role as executive chairman. Peters became co CEO

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Speaker 1: alongside Ted sarandos.

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Speaker 2: Now you've got this structure where you've got Greg Peters

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Speaker 2: seen as sort of the tech Silicon valley guy in

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Speaker 2: many ways, the air to read Hastings working alongside Ted Sarandos,

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Speaker 2: who's the Hollywood guy running this massive company.

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Speaker 1: Netflix is now thriving. It's adding subscribers and advertisers even

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Speaker 1: as other streaming services struggle, which is something Lucas saw

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Speaker 1: Peters brag about when he was on stage at that

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Speaker 1: new employee orientation.

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Speaker 2: Greg is basically saying, you know, all these traditional media

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Speaker 2: companies with cable networks, they are screwed. Their cable networks

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Speaker 2: are shrinking and that's depriving them of resources, and their

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Speaker 2: streaming services don't make any money, and so these aren't

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Speaker 2: sort of real threats to us. And the companies that

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Speaker 2: have the money to compete with us, the Apples and

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Speaker 2: Amazons of the world, they don't really care about entertainment

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Speaker 2: like Amazon's been at it for almost as long as Netflix,

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Speaker 2: and Netflix has probably released more hit shows this year

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Speaker 2: than Amazon has released in its entirety. And I think

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Speaker 2: he wants to say it's ours to win, but he

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Speaker 2: feels that Netflix has always been more effective when it

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Speaker 2: has seen itself as the underdog, and so he sort

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Speaker 2: of ends this by saying it's ours to lose.

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Speaker 1: It's ours to lose. Uz coming up after the break

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Speaker 1: Greg Peters's strategy to win. Lucashaw oversees media and entertainment

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Speaker 1: coverage for Bloomberg and writes a weekly newsletter called screen

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Speaker 1: Time about the business of pop culture, which means he

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Speaker 1: knows a lot about the competitive landscape Netflix is in.

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Speaker 1: Lucas says, one part of co CEO Greg Peters's plan

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Speaker 1: for Netflix is pretty simple. It's to focus on what

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Speaker 1: the company is good at.

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Speaker 2: I think that they want to continue to be the

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Speaker 2: best and most popular streaming service in the world without

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Speaker 2: getting distracted by a lot of other potential initiatives. But

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Speaker 2: there's a recognition that they need to evolve the business

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Speaker 2: and have sort of multiple levers for growth.

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Speaker 1: Peters isn't pushing Netflix to expand into movie theaters or

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Speaker 1: build theme parks some other media companies, but Lucas says

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Speaker 1: Netflix is entering a new phase. One we're making more

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Speaker 1: money from its current model is as important as adding

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Speaker 1: new subscribers, and the company has identified three ways to

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Speaker 1: do that. To sell ads, to make video games, and

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Speaker 1: to raise prices. When it comes to the first one, advertising,

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Speaker 1: Netflix has a pretty straightforward strategy.

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Speaker 2: If you can get people to spend more time watching Netflix,

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Speaker 2: you can sell more ads and make more money.

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Speaker 1: And one way to get subscribers to spend more time

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Speaker 1: on Netflix is live programming. That company announced last week

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Speaker 1: it's acquired the rights to stream two NFL games on

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Speaker 1: Christmas Day, the Chiefs versus the Steelers and the Ravens

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Speaker 1: versus the Texans. Netflix also acquired the rights to air

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Speaker 1: professional wrestling, and there are plans in the works for

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Speaker 1: award shows and more comedy specials.

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Speaker 2: I would anticipate you'll see just more and more live

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Speaker 2: programming and get to the point where they have something

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Speaker 2: live almost every day.

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Speaker 1: Are there signs that that's strategy branching in live events

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Speaker 1: is working for them.

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Speaker 2: It's really too soon to tell, because their early live

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Speaker 2: programming didn't matter, didn't move the needle. The Chris Rock

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Speaker 2: Live Comedy Special it did fine, right, but it's still

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Speaker 2: a live comedy special. There's only so much you can

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Speaker 2: get from that. They had a Lover Is Blind reunion

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Speaker 2: that was a technical failure. They had like this Mark

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Speaker 2: Twain Prize, who cares. They had a celebrity golf match

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Speaker 2: with golfers and F one drivers, like sort of more

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Speaker 2: of a stunt test. These are all I think Netflix

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Speaker 2: trying to figure out what could work and not spend

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Speaker 2: too much money because live sports can be prohibitively expensive.

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Speaker 2: I see all of these as what works and how

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Speaker 2: should we do it.

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Speaker 1: Then there's Netflix's ambitions in the world of gaming.

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Speaker 2: They have a very nascent investment in video games, which

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Speaker 2: is also something that Greg is in charge of. They

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Speaker 2: don't make any money from it yet, and it's still

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Speaker 2: really unclear if that's working.

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Speaker 1: So there's advertising and gaming, and then everyone's favorite charging

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Speaker 1: more money. We've seen the price increases, and I wonder

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Speaker 1: are we at the end of that. No, how do

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Speaker 1: they think about how much more they can raise prices

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Speaker 1: and maintain audience or continue to build audience.

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Speaker 2: Well, their argument is always we feel comfortable raising prices

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Speaker 2: if we are giving you more that you like and

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Speaker 2: care about. Right, Because if you think about the start

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Speaker 2: of Netflix, and it was very affordable, and because they

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Speaker 2: had so many licensing deals with so many other studios,

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Speaker 2: it was in many ways a replacement for cable at

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Speaker 2: a fraction of the cost of cable. It's still a

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Speaker 2: fraction of the cost of cable. We can argue over

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Speaker 2: whether it has as much right they're not getting as

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Speaker 2: nearly as much licensed from others, but they make a ton.

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Speaker 2: If you really wanted to just watch Netflix, you wouldn't

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Speaker 2: get all the news and sports, but you could replace

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Speaker 2: all the entertainment programming anywhere on just Netflix. So I

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Speaker 2: think as they invest more, you know, they bring in wrestling,

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Speaker 2: they bring in football, they bring in gaming. As they

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Speaker 2: add more of these elements, they feel comfortable raising prices.

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Speaker 2: But it's a tricky balance.

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Speaker 1: So what are the odds that Greg Peters will succeed?

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Speaker 1: Lucas says that from everything he's heard about him and

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Speaker 1: what he saw as he reported on him, Peters is

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Speaker 1: not someone people tend to bet against.

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Speaker 2: There were stories of you know, a company off off

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Speaker 2: sites where they would play sort of fun and silly

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Speaker 2: like family feud type games, and he would take it

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Speaker 2: very seriously and you would know that if you were

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Speaker 2: on his side, you were going to win. Actually, like

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Speaker 2: I had one of these awkward moments you have when

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Speaker 2: you're profiling someone where I was like, you know, I

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Speaker 2: talked to someone who said that you would play family

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Speaker 2: feud and jeopardy in these games and that you would cheat,

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Speaker 2: and he both categorically denied ever cheating while saying, you know,

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Speaker 2: if you're going to do something, you might as well

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Speaker 2: do it to win, which I thought was very telling.

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Speaker 2: You know, I drew a comparison to how you might

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Speaker 2: sometimes like you don't want to spoil your kids by

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Speaker 2: making them think that they could always win and losing

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Speaker 2: on purpose, and he did verify that he has routinely

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Speaker 2: lost on purpose to with children, but I think when

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Speaker 2: facing other adults, Greg Peters does not like to lose.

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Speaker 1: You can sign up for Lucas's screen Time newsletter at

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot com. This is the Big Take from Bloomberg News.

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Speaker 1: I'm David Gera. This episode was produced by Thomas lou

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Speaker 1: It was edited by Aaron Edwards. It was mixed by

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Speaker 1: Blake Maples. It was fact checked by Adriana Tapia. Our

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Speaker 1: senior producers are Kim Giittleson and Naomi Shaven. Our senior

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Speaker 1: editor is Elizabeth Ponso. The cole Beemster Bor is our

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Speaker 1: executive producer. Sage Bauman is our head of podcasts. Thanks

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Speaker 1: for listening. Please follow and review The Big Take wherever

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Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. It helps new listeners find the show.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back tomorrow.