1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,720
Speaker 1: This episode is also available as video on YouTube. You

2
00:00:03,760 --> 00:00:06,320
Speaker 1: can visit Norah Jones channel and be sure to subscribe

3
00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:09,360
Speaker 1: while you're there. Hey, I'm Norah Jones and today I'm

4
00:00:09,360 --> 00:00:14,760
Speaker 1: playing along with Sam Smith. I'm just playing long Weuy,

5
00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:25,279
Speaker 1: I'm just playing in lone with you. Hey, I'm Nora.

6
00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:28,240
Speaker 1: Welcome to the show. And with me, it's always is

7
00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:30,240
Speaker 1: Sarah Oda. Welcome to our show.

8
00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:30,760
Speaker 2: Yay.

9
00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:35,200
Speaker 3: Our guest today is Grammy winning singer songwriter, beautiful human

10
00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:36,520
Speaker 3: with an incredible.

11
00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:38,080
Speaker 1: Voice, Sam Smith.

12
00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:41,440
Speaker 3: They broke out with Stay with Me and their record

13
00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,599
Speaker 3: called in the Lonely Hour in twenty fourteen, and you're

14
00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:48,160
Speaker 3: going to hear about how they've continued evolving since then. Currently,

15
00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:51,280
Speaker 3: they're doing a tour of intimate, stripped down residencies called.

16
00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:51,879
Speaker 1: To Be Free.

17
00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:55,520
Speaker 3: The New York run has extended dates through December thirteenth.

18
00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:57,760
Speaker 3: Keep an eye out to see if there's still tickets available,

19
00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:01,320
Speaker 3: but they've also announced more residency dates in San Francisco

20
00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:03,240
Speaker 3: for February of twenty twenty six.

21
00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:03,840
Speaker 4: Yeah.

22
00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:07,280
Speaker 3: This was a really special episode, really really heartwarming.

23
00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:12,280
Speaker 1: I'm a fan and I really just could I could

24
00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,800
Speaker 1: listen to Sam talk forever. Yeah, we sang some pretty

25
00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:17,560
Speaker 1: songs too beautiful.

26
00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:21,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're going to hear about evolving as an artist

27
00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:26,080
Speaker 3: and kind of how fans perceive those changes. Feeling happy

28
00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:29,039
Speaker 3: and confident in your own skin, and staying connected with

29
00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:32,080
Speaker 3: music from the past, which isn't always easy, and new

30
00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:33,600
Speaker 3: takes on songs you might know.

31
00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I hope you enjoy this episode with Sam Smith.

32
00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:40,440
Speaker 1: You're living in New York.

33
00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:42,000
Speaker 5: Yes, I'm living in New York.

34
00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:44,919
Speaker 1: And is it How does it feel?

35
00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:53,160
Speaker 5: It feels? It feels amazing. It's it feels like for me,

36
00:01:53,640 --> 00:02:00,880
Speaker 5: the first time I found a place to be where

37
00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,800
Speaker 5: I'm just enough and not. That's that's how it feels

38
00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:06,240
Speaker 5: like to me.

39
00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:06,919
Speaker 2: Wow.

40
00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's like I've just everywhere I've always been since

41
00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:12,919
Speaker 5: I was a kid, it's just always too much all

42
00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:19,840
Speaker 5: the time and too loud, too big, to queer, to opinionate,

43
00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:22,320
Speaker 5: all these things, and so it really it feels like

44
00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:27,040
Speaker 5: it's a city that can facilitate my nature. That is deep,

45
00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:28,280
Speaker 5: which is beautiful, That.

46
00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:30,400
Speaker 1: Is really beautiful. Well, welcome to New York.

47
00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:34,560
Speaker 5: Thank you, Yeah, thank you. You're hearing that from you

48
00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:35,239
Speaker 5: is amazing.

49
00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:39,359
Speaker 1: Wow, that's really quite a thing to to realize.

50
00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:39,919
Speaker 5: Yeah.

51
00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:44,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, I'm glad you're content here. This feels good

52
00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:49,560
Speaker 1: and you're doing like this crazy string of shows. Yeah,

53
00:02:49,919 --> 00:02:52,680
Speaker 1: just at the Warsaw, right, Yeah, the Warsaw How many

54
00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:53,320
Speaker 1: shows is it?

55
00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:55,440
Speaker 5: Twenty four shows in total, but.

56
00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:57,560
Speaker 1: With little breaks, right, Yeah, it's three.

57
00:02:57,400 --> 00:02:59,639
Speaker 5: Shows a week for three weeks, and then I get

58
00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:01,560
Speaker 5: two weeks break, which I'm on right now, and then

59
00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:02,520
Speaker 5: another three weeks.

60
00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:04,480
Speaker 1: Aren't But that sounds so fun.

61
00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:07,480
Speaker 5: It's so fun. And yeah, it's so fun, and I

62
00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:11,840
Speaker 5: it was quite confronting the first show, because you've got

63
00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:14,760
Speaker 5: to remember, You've got to remember I've been traveling since

64
00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,440
Speaker 5: I was twenty years old. My shows started to get

65
00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:21,760
Speaker 5: bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger, and I I

66
00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:25,600
Speaker 5: just became an arena artist and that's what I did

67
00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:33,000
Speaker 5: for my whole twenties. And the pressure of that and

68
00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:36,440
Speaker 5: the I love playing those rooms and nothing and the

69
00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:38,080
Speaker 5: buzz of it is so incredible.

70
00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:39,040
Speaker 1: It's a different thing.

71
00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:43,120
Speaker 5: It's a different thing, and for me, it's you know,

72
00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,760
Speaker 5: I've never really spoken about it too much in detail

73
00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:49,240
Speaker 5: because I because but I can now I think, But

74
00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:55,040
Speaker 5: I am so scared of performing live really, Yeah, I

75
00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:56,880
Speaker 5: find it really traumatic and petrifying.

76
00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,400
Speaker 1: Is it just your nature to be shy like that

77
00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:00,480
Speaker 1: or no?

78
00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:02,200
Speaker 5: I think. I think. Actually, now I'm going on and

79
00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:06,720
Speaker 5: realize I'm more of a what's it called introvert. I'm

80
00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:08,640
Speaker 5: more of an intro than I thought I was, because

81
00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:11,600
Speaker 5: I'm in, you know, in everyday life. I'm larger than life.

82
00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:13,960
Speaker 5: But it's just being in those rooms. It what it is.

83
00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:17,040
Speaker 5: It's the pressure. It's the pressure in those big arenas.

84
00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,960
Speaker 5: For me, it's the pressure on my voice to deliver.

85
00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:25,960
Speaker 5: I find that crippling. And because I've chosen to not

86
00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:29,840
Speaker 5: mime and not to lean on that if things go.

87
00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:32,120
Speaker 1: Wrong, which most arena artists do.

88
00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:34,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, a lot of a lot of them do, I think,

89
00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:38,680
Speaker 5: And and that is there's no judgment. Actually, and I

90
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:42,520
Speaker 5: actually tried it once. There's one show that I for

91
00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:44,720
Speaker 5: one song in one show, I was like, do you

92
00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:48,040
Speaker 5: know what? I can't be so opinionated about this unless

93
00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,200
Speaker 5: I try it myself. So there's one show one night

94
00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:53,039
Speaker 5: on my tour when my voice was totally fine, and

95
00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,080
Speaker 5: I just said, JO for one song, I'm gonna min

96
00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:59,840
Speaker 5: or just start to finish. I just had a live

97
00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:05,000
Speaker 5: vocal come over my voice. I I and I mind

98
00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:07,960
Speaker 5: for the first time ever in a room full of

99
00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:10,080
Speaker 5: twenty thousand people. But I still sang ninety percent of

100
00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,200
Speaker 5: that show, ninety nine percent of that show.

101
00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:13,600
Speaker 1: But you just wanted to see what it was like.

102
00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:15,240
Speaker 5: I would see what it was like for one song,

103
00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:20,719
Speaker 5: and it was it was great. You got a little break,

104
00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:24,320
Speaker 5: it was great, my voice got a break. But it

105
00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:33,880
Speaker 5: was just it wasn't it wasn't right for me. I

106
00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:35,880
Speaker 5: I think that I got into you know, I started

107
00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,400
Speaker 5: doing musical theater as a child, and then I decided

108
00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:40,520
Speaker 5: I wanted to stop doing musical theater when I was

109
00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,800
Speaker 5: about fifteen, from listening to records like yours and so

110
00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:46,600
Speaker 5: many records around me as a child, where I just

111
00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:48,880
Speaker 5: fell in love with the art of singer songwriters and

112
00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:54,520
Speaker 5: people telling their stories through their records. And my singing

113
00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,320
Speaker 5: teacher at the time is an amazing woman called Joanna Eden,

114
00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:01,760
Speaker 5: and she is a singer songwriter and she is incredible

115
00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:04,320
Speaker 5: and her albums used to inspire me so much when

116
00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:05,880
Speaker 5: I was a child, because I was like, Wow, I

117
00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,119
Speaker 5: could do that. I can actually tell my stories and

118
00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:11,680
Speaker 5: maybe even travel one day around the country or you know,

119
00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:13,600
Speaker 5: never really thought it would be the world, but and

120
00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:16,479
Speaker 5: be able to like just play small venues and enjoy

121
00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,839
Speaker 5: the art of singing and sharing stories. That's what I

122
00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:22,360
Speaker 5: fell in love with and from a young age I

123
00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:26,240
Speaker 5: kind of promised myself that. And one of the main

124
00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:28,080
Speaker 5: reasons why I love that art form is so much

125
00:06:28,240 --> 00:06:30,480
Speaker 5: is because of the warts and all, and from those

126
00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:33,719
Speaker 5: incredible recordings of you know, Jooni Mitchell and people like that,

127
00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,480
Speaker 5: where you hear the voice change and you hear the

128
00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,279
Speaker 5: imperfections in the voice change. And so I think that

129
00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:43,839
Speaker 5: through miming that one time in that one song, I

130
00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:48,160
Speaker 5: really it became clear to me what I wanted to do.

131
00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:52,240
Speaker 5: And so doing these shows at the Warsaw have been

132
00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:55,760
Speaker 5: an amazing way of me getting back to that and

133
00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:59,200
Speaker 5: getting back to the real love of what I do,

134
00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:03,200
Speaker 5: and that my love, because my ultimate love is studio writing.

135
00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:06,839
Speaker 5: Singing and performing was more more of a secondary thing

136
00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,400
Speaker 5: that comes with the territory.

137
00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:11,320
Speaker 1: Well being in a small room. I was just talking

138
00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:13,760
Speaker 1: to a friend this morning about that, because I went

139
00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:18,400
Speaker 1: to a few arena shows recently and it was so

140
00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:22,440
Speaker 1: different from from where I play in usually smaller theaters

141
00:07:22,680 --> 00:07:27,840
Speaker 1: and being backstage. Because I was backstage, I got to

142
00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:31,080
Speaker 1: be backstage and it was crazy, because what did you

143
00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:36,640
Speaker 1: say I saw? I saw John Legend last night and

144
00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:38,400
Speaker 1: I got to singing. It was incredible.

145
00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,280
Speaker 5: He's incredible. He's incredible, the greatest, one of the greatest

146
00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:42,640
Speaker 5: there is.

147
00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:47,480
Speaker 1: His voice is insane, so beautiful. But just the backstage

148
00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:49,480
Speaker 1: area and it was a very nice arena. You know,

149
00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:52,560
Speaker 1: it's beautiful, but I feel like if you were only

150
00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:58,120
Speaker 1: in those kinds of places, even just being backstage, it

151
00:07:58,200 --> 00:07:59,760
Speaker 1: feels kind of lonely.

152
00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:05,800
Speaker 5: It's very lonely. It's very lonely and isolating. And you know,

153
00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:08,880
Speaker 5: one of the things I love about doing shows is

154
00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:11,080
Speaker 5: I like being with my band. I like being close

155
00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:16,640
Speaker 5: to my band, especially my backing singers there they're my family,

156
00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:19,480
Speaker 5: and so I love to be close to people. And

157
00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:22,160
Speaker 5: because it really is as much as it's my name

158
00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:25,080
Speaker 5: of my songs, it's such a collaborative thing, you know,

159
00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:26,040
Speaker 5: being on stage, so.

160
00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:28,880
Speaker 1: Well, that's what when it is, that's when it's the best.

161
00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:32,719
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, but I my whole career became in my

162
00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:36,560
Speaker 5: last arena tour became very very isolated where for me

163
00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:39,400
Speaker 5: to fill some sort of control as well. I actually

164
00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:46,199
Speaker 5: I kind of lean into the theatrics really far on

165
00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:49,199
Speaker 5: my last arena tour with the costume changes, and I

166
00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:50,760
Speaker 5: was quite defined. I was like, look, if I'm going

167
00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:52,640
Speaker 5: to do this room in this way and sing pop

168
00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:54,960
Speaker 5: songs like this, then this is how it's going to be.

169
00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:58,280
Speaker 5: It's going to be loads of track and and I'm

170
00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:01,160
Speaker 5: going to do this pop star thing that I've always

171
00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,600
Speaker 5: the itch, I've always wanted to scratch.

172
00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:05,040
Speaker 1: So you did it so well.

173
00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:07,240
Speaker 5: It was fun. I was I was fat, and I

174
00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:09,840
Speaker 5: was shattered the whole way through it. I sprayed my

175
00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:14,000
Speaker 5: ankle three times because I was wearing People don't realize

176
00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:17,760
Speaker 5: I'm like, you know, the girls, the girls, the queens

177
00:09:17,960 --> 00:09:20,280
Speaker 5: of music, you know, they do this and they do

178
00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:23,160
Speaker 5: it so incredibly well. But I'm a six foot two,

179
00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:29,520
Speaker 5: seventeen stone queer person, you know, in eight inch massive hills.

180
00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:33,640
Speaker 5: That's nice running around, you know, like doing crazy things

181
00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:37,480
Speaker 5: and being new, like naked on stage every night for

182
00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:41,920
Speaker 5: that one song when I sang them Adonna song Express Yourself.

183
00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:44,440
Speaker 5: It was such a wild experience and it was really

184
00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,720
Speaker 5: was a dream come true and I got to tick

185
00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:50,720
Speaker 5: that box. But after I was like, I belong at

186
00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:53,560
Speaker 5: the Warsaw and Brooklyn right now. I need to go back.

187
00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:56,400
Speaker 5: I need to regather, and I need to connect to

188
00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,000
Speaker 5: my fan base again, because me and my fans we

189
00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:03,680
Speaker 5: we I think there's a little there's been a disconnect naturally,

190
00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:07,679
Speaker 5: because I've gone from being to them a gay, a

191
00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:11,360
Speaker 5: young gay man, to now being in a position where

192
00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,760
Speaker 5: I have my pronouns have changed and I'm a queer

193
00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:17,840
Speaker 5: person and I'm now a very different person, and so

194
00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:19,800
Speaker 5: I have to reconnect with my fans.

195
00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,000
Speaker 1: But I think they're all changing as well. I mean, everyone,

196
00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:26,920
Speaker 1: over time changes, and I think that's just part of life.

197
00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:29,840
Speaker 1: And I think people's favorite type of artists are ones

198
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:30,520
Speaker 1: who change.

199
00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:31,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think so.

200
00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:35,440
Speaker 1: I think going from being this pop star in the

201
00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,959
Speaker 1: arena to playing these intimate shows, it's just so special

202
00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:39,480
Speaker 1: for people.

203
00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:42,040
Speaker 5: But you must have experienced that right through your career,

204
00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:45,000
Speaker 5: like having to like do the things that you want

205
00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:47,120
Speaker 5: to do and maybe some people not coming along for

206
00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:47,560
Speaker 5: the ride.

207
00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:50,920
Speaker 1: Probably. I had a record label president tell me he

208
00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:54,319
Speaker 1: didn't love my record, and that was fine because he

209
00:10:54,360 --> 00:10:57,079
Speaker 1: was my friend and I trusted him. But I loved it,

210
00:10:57,120 --> 00:10:59,199
Speaker 1: and so he still was fine and he let me

211
00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:01,840
Speaker 1: put it out. Is a good thing, you know, that's good.

212
00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:04,560
Speaker 1: But yeah, I think I think changing once you realize

213
00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:08,439
Speaker 1: that you can't do this to please them. You want

214
00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:11,120
Speaker 1: to stay connected to them, but only that's only going

215
00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:14,839
Speaker 1: to keep happening if you're doing what just tickles you,

216
00:11:14,840 --> 00:11:16,560
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, what you love.

217
00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:17,839
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's so true.

218
00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:20,839
Speaker 1: Well, I wanted to see if you wanted to sing

219
00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:23,360
Speaker 1: one of your new songs that you've been doing at

220
00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,560
Speaker 1: the warsaw Yes, I would love to that to be

221
00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:28,439
Speaker 1: Free it's actually called the to Be Free.

222
00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:31,520
Speaker 5: It's called to it's called to Be Free tour, that

223
00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:36,200
Speaker 5: residency tour that if we've announced to the residen season.

224
00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:39,920
Speaker 5: This song is a song that I wrote with my

225
00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:44,160
Speaker 5: friend Simon Aldred and I wrote it at the very

226
00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:48,040
Speaker 5: the same week that I actually changed my pronouns and

227
00:11:48,600 --> 00:11:52,120
Speaker 5: went on this this this moment of self discovery for

228
00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:54,640
Speaker 5: me and realization, and I wrote this song with him

229
00:11:54,679 --> 00:11:59,240
Speaker 5: and it's just such an amazing moment. And I'll never

230
00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:01,320
Speaker 5: sing the song like I did in the recording because

231
00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:02,520
Speaker 5: it was five years ago.

232
00:12:02,520 --> 00:12:05,240
Speaker 1: And and you felt it every drop of it.

233
00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:08,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was like the whole the song that you

234
00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:12,040
Speaker 5: that's been released is the it's just me singing the

235
00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:14,960
Speaker 5: thing the whole way through me and him just performing

236
00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:18,560
Speaker 5: free in the room, no clicks beautiful. It was amazing,

237
00:12:18,679 --> 00:12:19,839
Speaker 5: So I you.

238
00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:22,360
Speaker 1: Know it sure goes along with the lyrics too, you

239
00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,760
Speaker 1: know everything and just do it.

240
00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:26,960
Speaker 5: That's beautiful.

241
00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:46,120
Speaker 1: I would love to okay.

242
00:12:50,080 --> 00:13:00,920
Speaker 6: Pray, be live, prave and free like bye.

243
00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:18,920
Speaker 2: Flowed, oh fare whole place down the lane to be free,

244
00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:40,640
Speaker 2: like the river, just be to be free, winds of feed.

245
00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:44,680
Speaker 5: Fly to.

246
00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:12,959
Speaker 7: Shake off you're burden, shame stol, friend of body lost,

247
00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:17,240
Speaker 7: my faith in perfect.

248
00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,440
Speaker 2: Will behold.

249
00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:37,240
Speaker 4: Entire to be free, thank the river, just to be.

250
00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:49,480
Speaker 2: To be free, winds of freedom.

251
00:14:51,280 --> 00:15:26,680
Speaker 8: Flyer flo ae fla to be free, and the river.

252
00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:30,400
Speaker 2: That is the speed.

253
00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:33,880
Speaker 4: To be free.

254
00:15:39,760 --> 00:16:11,480
Speaker 2: Wings are freedom. Fight tune me, fight me change.

255
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:24,160
Speaker 1: Oh that's so pretty.

256
00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:30,400
Speaker 5: Two days ago I was I was Julia Childs for Halloween.

257
00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:32,240
Speaker 1: Oh my god, so I was.

258
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:37,640
Speaker 5: So I was screaming like like screaming really laugh and

259
00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:38,560
Speaker 5: my voices.

260
00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:40,240
Speaker 1: On did you do the show on Halloween?

261
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:41,520
Speaker 5: I did?

262
00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:47,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, were you Julia Childs for the show? But after

263
00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:51,280
Speaker 1: the show, after the show, that's kind of a brilliant, fabulous.

264
00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,320
Speaker 1: That's like the best costume I think I've heard in one.

265
00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:56,840
Speaker 5: The theme of my Halloween part was Meryl streep, so

266
00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:58,920
Speaker 5: we and then last year the theme was Nicole Kidman.

267
00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:01,480
Speaker 1: Can I where do I get it? Invite to this

268
00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:02,400
Speaker 1: Friday right now?

269
00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:05,040
Speaker 5: You're invited next year. Come next year we're going to

270
00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:05,760
Speaker 5: do Sex and City.

271
00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:09,240
Speaker 1: I think, Oh my god, I'm a Halloween.

272
00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:12,159
Speaker 5: Lover since coming to New York. I now get it.

273
00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,280
Speaker 5: Like it's different here, isn't it. It's like, yeah, I.

274
00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:17,679
Speaker 1: Spent one Halloween in London and it was funny.

275
00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:18,920
Speaker 5: It's quite bleak.

276
00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:21,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, well it was fun, but yeah, nobody else was

277
00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:25,160
Speaker 1: dressed like me. I felt really ugly.

278
00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:27,800
Speaker 5: And it's all for children in the Halloween in the UK,

279
00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,160
Speaker 5: like THEE it's involved.

280
00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:35,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, Yeah, your songs are very piano friendly. Oh

281
00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:40,040
Speaker 1: there's so beautiful and fun to play. It's like a prayer.

282
00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:42,680
Speaker 5: Yeah, it feels like a prayer that song to me

283
00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:44,600
Speaker 5: when I sing it, and like even just then, like

284
00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:49,399
Speaker 5: my voice feels a bit tired today, but it still

285
00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:52,280
Speaker 5: feels right when I'm doing it. You can mumble it

286
00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:56,320
Speaker 5: and hopefully when I'm old and gray, I can croak

287
00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:56,720
Speaker 5: it out.

288
00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:01,040
Speaker 1: I think you will. It's so beautiful. You said you

289
00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:03,920
Speaker 1: wrote that at a time when you were really coming

290
00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:08,560
Speaker 1: into yourself a little more. It's been really interesting watching

291
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:14,960
Speaker 1: you over the years and feeling I've come to this

292
00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:18,680
Speaker 1: realization that you've become such an inspiration to so many people,

293
00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:23,920
Speaker 1: and it's really beautiful. And I was wondering if you

294
00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:28,159
Speaker 1: feel that you must know that you must feel it

295
00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:28,879
Speaker 1: from people.

296
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:32,199
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think I'm actually in the process right now

297
00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:38,040
Speaker 5: of starting to like now that I've now I feel

298
00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:42,240
Speaker 5: like I'm in my skin, which I always felt, to

299
00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:44,480
Speaker 5: be honest, but it was just now I feel like

300
00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:45,800
Speaker 5: everyone's caught up with me.

301
00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:49,720
Speaker 1: It's more how I feel that makes sense.

302
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:55,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, I feel I feel now ready to assume responsibility

303
00:18:56,119 --> 00:19:01,240
Speaker 5: in and feel good about that, not just for hopefully

304
00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:03,760
Speaker 5: queer people that may see themselves a little bit in

305
00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:10,760
Speaker 5: what I do or or feel soothed by it, but

306
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:17,080
Speaker 5: also for everyone, not just queer people, anyone who feels different.

307
00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:21,000
Speaker 1: You know, it's it's just most people, which is most people.

308
00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:23,200
Speaker 5: Yeah. I think the more we spoke about that, actually,

309
00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:25,000
Speaker 5: the more we'd realize we have so much more in

310
00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:29,440
Speaker 5: common than we think. Yeah, but it was, Yeah, it was.

311
00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:31,320
Speaker 5: It's been a strange experience to me because I was

312
00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:34,680
Speaker 5: so out and proud as a child, were you okay,

313
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,600
Speaker 5: very like it was not you know, there was no

314
00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:38,280
Speaker 5: containing me.

315
00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:38,600
Speaker 3: I was.

316
00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:41,080
Speaker 5: There was no closets. Honestly, when I came out, everyone

317
00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:44,320
Speaker 5: was like, yeah, like it was so and I came

318
00:19:44,359 --> 00:19:46,800
Speaker 5: out so young. I was like ten years old, and

319
00:19:46,920 --> 00:19:49,119
Speaker 5: so by the time that I was in school end

320
00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:53,000
Speaker 5: of school, I was wearing four I go to score

321
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,680
Speaker 5: every day in makeup and female clothing and everything, and

322
00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 5: I was very much how people have seen me over

323
00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:00,920
Speaker 5: the last three years expressed myself. I was doing that

324
00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:01,560
Speaker 5: at eighteen.

325
00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:04,720
Speaker 1: I felt like for the first for my first album,

326
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:06,360
Speaker 1: I kind of felt like I was in drag.

327
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:11,360
Speaker 5: By wearing suits, wearing my suits, and my queer file

328
00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:13,200
Speaker 5: was like, this is fab I feel like I feel,

329
00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:16,159
Speaker 5: I feel. I loved it. I felt very much in

330
00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,240
Speaker 5: my skin because I was exploring. It was only until

331
00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:23,159
Speaker 5: my second album when there was this pressure to remain

332
00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:24,040
Speaker 5: the same.

333
00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:26,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was going to ask if that came again

334
00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:28,080
Speaker 1: then from the industry.

335
00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:30,680
Speaker 5: It was from the industry, but it's also myself, like

336
00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:33,440
Speaker 5: I was, I'm a very ambitious person and so I

337
00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:37,119
Speaker 5: I would love like I looked at people around me

338
00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:40,359
Speaker 5: like I looked at Adele, and I looked at ed

339
00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:46,840
Speaker 5: sheeran even like Amy Winehouse and you know, so many

340
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:49,440
Speaker 5: of the greats. I looked at them and I just thought,

341
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:52,359
Speaker 5: I would love to be like that. I'd love to

342
00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:56,840
Speaker 5: just stick with that iconic look and that and that

343
00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:00,480
Speaker 5: thing and be able to stay there. And so I tried.

344
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:05,399
Speaker 5: I tried, and but there is a there is an

345
00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:10,920
Speaker 5: ocean inside of me that is constantly flowing. Wow, it's

346
00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:12,840
Speaker 5: a weird thing to balance because you're happy and you're

347
00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,800
Speaker 5: getting happier in your skin, but you're still very blessed

348
00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:18,840
Speaker 5: and lucky in your career in life, so there's nothing

349
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:19,520
Speaker 5: to moan about.

350
00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:23,240
Speaker 1: But when you see ambition starts to lessen, and when

351
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:27,160
Speaker 1: you see people leaving, you only see usually people mostly

352
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:30,680
Speaker 1: only see the negative sometimes, Oh for sure, easy to

353
00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:32,440
Speaker 1: ruminate on that for sure.

354
00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,840
Speaker 5: And thank god I had amazing positive people around me

355
00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,720
Speaker 5: that was you know, just like, look around you, this

356
00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:42,640
Speaker 5: is incredible. Like if there's nothing to worry about, it's beautiful.

357
00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:45,920
Speaker 5: But you know, I was trained from a young age

358
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,399
Speaker 5: to be ambitious and to and to break through the

359
00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:52,000
Speaker 5: ceilings above me, you know, And so I'm starting to

360
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,639
Speaker 5: realize now that I can do that still if I

361
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:58,800
Speaker 5: want to. But Yeah, it was. It was a transitional

362
00:21:59,080 --> 00:22:01,239
Speaker 5: thing that happened to me that I don't think has

363
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,879
Speaker 5: happened to a lot of Popeyes before.

364
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:06,680
Speaker 1: No, I don't think so at all. That's why I

365
00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:12,760
Speaker 1: feel like it's so it's amazing. Actually, you know, when

366
00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:15,800
Speaker 1: I was thinking about the last ten or so years

367
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:19,399
Speaker 1: and you preparing for this, I was thinking about all

368
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:25,119
Speaker 1: of the evolving that's happened you and how how was

369
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:29,159
Speaker 1: that on the inside, you know, how was that it was?

370
00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:31,879
Speaker 5: It was you know, it was it was hard, but

371
00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:34,560
Speaker 5: it was it was the more I became myself, the

372
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:38,080
Speaker 5: more happy off my skin. The hardest part for me

373
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:41,359
Speaker 5: was in on my second album, I did call a

374
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,440
Speaker 5: tal called the Thrill of It or World Tour, and

375
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:47,640
Speaker 5: it was one hundred and forty dates. That's a lot

376
00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 5: around the world, and my audience was huge, and it

377
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 5: was the pressure was insane. Yeah, and I got through

378
00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:00,399
Speaker 5: one hundred dates and did it. And I think I

379
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:02,520
Speaker 5: did those hundred dates without canceling anything.

380
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:03,919
Speaker 9: And then.

381
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,320
Speaker 5: Throughout the tour, I'd start to really start to realize

382
00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 5: that I'm not moving on stage the way that I

383
00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:14,200
Speaker 5: want to, the way that I'm dancing. I'm kind of

384
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:18,880
Speaker 5: I'm playing straight. I'm like, to me, what that ever

385
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:21,159
Speaker 5: meant to me? But like, I'm I'm kind of moving.

386
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:23,720
Speaker 5: I'm not moving in the way that I move when

387
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 5: I'm out of the club with my friends because I'm

388
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:30,480
Speaker 5: I'm quite a fem mover and dancer, and so I'm

389
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:32,639
Speaker 5: like trying to enjoy my shows and dance. But I

390
00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:34,840
Speaker 5: could have moved in the way that I wanted to.

391
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:38,520
Speaker 5: And so that that created this dialogue within me, like

392
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 5: what's what's happening here? And then I started to realize,

393
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 5: oh God, there's this there's a secret I have that

394
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:45,440
Speaker 5: I haven't shared with the world, I haven't shared with

395
00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:48,200
Speaker 5: my team, and that is that I'm fem that I'm

396
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:52,560
Speaker 5: a femme queer person. And so that became bigger. This

397
00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:55,760
Speaker 5: this pressure became bigger and bigger, bigger within yourself, within

398
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 5: myself to share it, to share it. And I knew

399
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:01,560
Speaker 5: that I had this secret I had to share, and

400
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 5: it all came to fruition. I was in South Africa

401
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 5: and I was I was I thought I was doing

402
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,919
Speaker 5: fine and getting through everything. But I was on stage

403
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,760
Speaker 5: and I had like three four songs in and I

404
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,520
Speaker 5: just like something in my brain switched and then I

405
00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 5: had a massive panic attack four songs in on stage.

406
00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:23,840
Speaker 5: Managed to hide it from the audience, but walked off stage.

407
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,160
Speaker 5: And I've never done this in my life. I'd walked

408
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,159
Speaker 5: off stage and just walked directly into my car and

409
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:32,840
Speaker 5: I said, I need to go, and I went to

410
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 5: the hotel and had to cancel thirty shows and I

411
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:42,600
Speaker 5: stopped performing for about a year and a half. I

412
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,200
Speaker 5: didn't talk about it publicly, and I'm happy I didn't

413
00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:49,240
Speaker 5: because at the time. At the time, yeah, because I'm

414
00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 5: happy I didn't talk about it because I was able

415
00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 5: to heal without the pressure of everyone knowing that, oh,

416
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:56,080
Speaker 5: I was having panic attacks, so.

417
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:57,160
Speaker 1: That would be the worst.

418
00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:57,680
Speaker 2: Yeah.

419
00:24:57,920 --> 00:24:58,879
Speaker 10: Yeah, So when I go.

420
00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:00,760
Speaker 5: Back on stage, I could act actually like have a

421
00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:04,359
Speaker 5: chance at dealing with it privately. But that was the

422
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,240
Speaker 5: hardest part for me because my body just went this

423
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 5: character that we're doing right now, it's done.

424
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 1: It rejected it, it rejected it. Isn't it weird? How

425
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,680
Speaker 1: the body? Will they say that that book The body

426
00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 1: keeps score? It really is.

427
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 5: Oh God, it's wild. It's actually and it's a lovely thing.

428
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:22,640
Speaker 1: It's like it's self protective.

429
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, your brain is only one part of your whole body.

430
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 5: Your whole body's moving it. Yeah, you know, you've got

431
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:30,720
Speaker 5: to listen to it. And so I stopped. And that's

432
00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 5: when I had lots of therapy. I realized that, you know,

433
00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 5: this is I'm showing facets of myself to the public

434
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,600
Speaker 5: through my music. And I'm very famous and successful because

435
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,879
Speaker 5: of this, but I am there's more. There's more to

436
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 5: me that needs to be shared. Yeah, you know, And

437
00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 5: and so I did, and I found the courage.

438
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:55,720
Speaker 1: That's beautiful. Did you feel like at that time was

439
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:58,800
Speaker 1: it all making its way into the music you were making?

440
00:25:59,320 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 5: Yeah for sure.

441
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 1: So so the music was telling all the sort of

442
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:06,080
Speaker 1: insides of you.

443
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think it was. And that's what I get

444
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:12,479
Speaker 5: so frustrated with with the way that my music has

445
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 5: taken sometimes because my my third and my fourth album

446
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 5: became more and more commercial and more pop. And I've mean,

447
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 5: I guess you can hear that money was in the room.

448
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 5: When when When when you listen to that music, because

449
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 5: there's there's their formulaic and their I think that some

450
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 5: people look at it as if I sold out sometimes,

451
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 5: but that's what think. No, but I spent years think

452
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:43,880
Speaker 5: about it and even now to this day, when I'm

453
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:47,120
Speaker 5: releasing new music now people are saying, you know, I've heard,

454
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:49,399
Speaker 5: I heard I now don't listen to anything, but I

455
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:54,920
Speaker 5: heard someone say recently, this new song so authentic. It's

456
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:57,479
Speaker 5: so nice for them to hear them doing what they

457
00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:00,200
Speaker 5: want to do. I suppose what the labelers forced to

458
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 5: do on the last few albums.

459
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 1: Which is not the case.

460
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 5: It's not the case because to understand my third and

461
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:09,399
Speaker 5: fourth record, you have to understand the context of what

462
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 5: it is to be queer and famous at twenty five

463
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 5: years old. Yeah, and so I was making music that

464
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,800
Speaker 5: I was being I wasn't like I've never been like

465
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,680
Speaker 5: a cool queer person where I like, for you won't

466
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 5: find me in like deep Brooklyn, like listening to like

467
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,680
Speaker 5: incredible like house music and stuff. I feel quite alienated

468
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,479
Speaker 5: from those rooms A lot of the time. I'm I'm

469
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 5: kind of more of like a radical, centrist queer person,

470
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:43,080
Speaker 5: like you'll find me in Stonewall, like you'll find me

471
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 5: in those parts of gay culture. I like to be

472
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,360
Speaker 5: in the center, and I always like to be kind

473
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 5: of around, yeah, just around the set the center of

474
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 5: queerness in that way, in the on those high streets

475
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 5: that have all that history around. I enjoy that. And

476
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,639
Speaker 5: so the music that I was exposed to and have

477
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 5: been from when I was finding myself in my twenties

478
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:09,320
Speaker 5: was like real, like down straight down the middle pop music,

479
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,040
Speaker 5: incredible pop music, an the anthems, and also the kind

480
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:16,080
Speaker 5: of like I don't I don't want to bad mouth

481
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:18,840
Speaker 5: the pop that I'm talking about when I'm saying this,

482
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:23,360
Speaker 5: but just like I don't know, like it's so weird.

483
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:25,880
Speaker 5: There's there's like some songs that I've loved from girl

484
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 5: groups that I've been obsessed with for a long time,

485
00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 5: and I've even met the writers behind it who have

486
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 5: kind of said, oh, we wrote that as a joke,

487
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:34,480
Speaker 5: and I'm like, well, it's not a joke to me,

488
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 5: Like I love that song, I like dance to it.

489
00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 5: It's my going out song. And so I'm very proud

490
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:44,040
Speaker 5: of those records. And within those records there's fantastic moments,

491
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:48,800
Speaker 5: but there's also moments that I've learned a lot from.

492
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 5: And so yeah, I get annoyed that people don't understand

493
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 5: the context of my music sometimes and they they compare

494
00:28:55,840 --> 00:29:01,560
Speaker 5: me to straight counterparts that the work where context is important.

495
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 2: You can't.

496
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, those opinions will hang you up. Yeah, and they

497
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 1: will mess you up.

498
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 2: You can't.

499
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, push them aside, I have to.

500
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's something I am just coming to great so

501
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:15,240
Speaker 5: with even now.

502
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:19,000
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, I learned that lesson after my first record. Yeah,

503
00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 1: I stopped reading anything because it just hurt my feelings. Yeah,

504
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 1: even though a lot of it was so good. All again,

505
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 1: all you see is the negative. It's really hard to

506
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:32,719
Speaker 1: see all the good sometimes you just focus on them

507
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 1: like one little negative thing.

508
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 5: See, I'm a sucker for Like I think it's probably

509
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 5: down to my my upbringing. I think a lot of

510
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 5: queer people as well are hard on themselves, so I think,

511
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:45,160
Speaker 5: of course.

512
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 1: I see it as like I thought it was positive

513
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,080
Speaker 1: to like whip myself like that, but it's not.

514
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 5: And I'm realizing that now.

515
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 1: No, No, I'm sure you know, the baggage we all

516
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:58,400
Speaker 1: carry is different. But I'm sure it's pretty deep. It

517
00:29:58,440 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: goes pretty deep for you.

518
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, it does. And it's just it's a learning and

519
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 5: it's a practice and I'm getting so much better at it.

520
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 5: But I just I do. I am just a big

521
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 5: kind of I'm a cheerleader for the music, for my music.

522
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, your music is beautiful, and I wanted to ask, also,

523
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:16,320
Speaker 1: it's a dance music and you go out and dance.

524
00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 5: Yes, a little bit. Not anymore. Actually before, before, when

525
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:22,719
Speaker 5: I was younger, I did, yeah, but it was more

526
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:25,200
Speaker 5: it was it wasn't necessary to dance. It was more

527
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 5: to pop, just pop stars, pop girls doing what they do.

528
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 5: I'm just I'm I'm. Everything that I'm inspy by is

529
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,040
Speaker 5: from women. That's the truth the whole way through. You know,

530
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,160
Speaker 5: it's only a few men I listened to and really, yeah,

531
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:45,360
Speaker 5: and I just love listening to stories from women. That's beautiful, greatest.

532
00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 1: Well, you want to try another song? Yeah, yeah, I

533
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,440
Speaker 1: love the song. I'm not the only one. I just

534
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:54,440
Speaker 1: love that piano part. I know that insane?

535
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, who played Jimmy names? He wrote that and he

536
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 5: played it and we actually wrote completely different song to

537
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:06,440
Speaker 5: those chords, which which wasn't great. And then like a

538
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 5: few weeks later, I was just like, we have to

539
00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 5: go back to those chords because there's something about those courts.

540
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 1: They're so good and just the way he plays them.

541
00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:16,720
Speaker 5: And then we redid it and took a second crack

542
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 5: at it, and then we wrote this which.

543
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:20,760
Speaker 1: Is okay, which is amazing. It's great. Is this on

544
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 1: your first song?

545
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 5: This is on my first album? Yeah, this is. It's

546
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:28,240
Speaker 5: a song about I was. I was very young, and

547
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 5: I was completely besotted and in love with a straight

548
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:36,400
Speaker 5: guy who didn't nothing physical happened between us, so it

549
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 5: wasn't a relationship. It was pure unrequited love. And he

550
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 5: was actually married and he was not faithful to his wife.

551
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:55,280
Speaker 5: And I would witness this sometimes without without him, like

552
00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 5: if we were out and about, I'd see him flirt

553
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 5: with people, and it would break my heart seeing it happen.

554
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:02,800
Speaker 5: And it's someone that I loved. But also I was

555
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 5: just so upset and angry that he was doing this

556
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 5: in his life.

557
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 1: And so this is a song that I wrote from

558
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 1: her perspective. Wow, Yeah, it's pretty heartbreaking.

559
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, you and me we made a fum pardo all

560
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 2: the fun mode and I can't believe you let me.

561
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 10: But the proofs in the way.

562
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 2: Her from mons. End of that, then Nevey.

563
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:27,280
Speaker 5: And I wish this will be over now, but I

564
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 5: know that I still meet tune.

565
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 11: He said, are grazed because you don't think you knowny.

566
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:54,120
Speaker 9: Daughters, But where you car me by me? And not

567
00:33:54,480 --> 00:34:04,880
Speaker 9: the Naty only world. You'vean sort of vada.

568
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:09,960
Speaker 2: No Sady, I know.

569
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 12: Your heart is unertainable, even though the knows you can,

570
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 12: he said, raise.

571
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:42,960
Speaker 8: Because you nohing I know you man where you love

572
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,919
Speaker 8: me by me and not the nah.

573
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 2: The only world he know I loved you for money.

574
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 11: They behind and do honey know he made me realizes

575
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 11: with the speeds.

576
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:24,040
Speaker 13: Who by like he's having side, He said, razy.

577
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:35,680
Speaker 8: Because you don't think a normal unger where you call

578
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:37,840
Speaker 8: me baby.

579
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:50,640
Speaker 11: A novel Naty only one, the Nomernahyly.

580
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 2: The love of.

581
00:35:53,200 --> 00:36:03,840
Speaker 8: Nady only one. No no no no no no no no.

582
00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 14: Noanyly, How did you want around?

583
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 2: I love it?

584
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:34,800
Speaker 5: After singing that song, I'm not the only one. I

585
00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 5: we have both had like an album that is that

586
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 5: was from my first album, and that album is kind

587
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,320
Speaker 5: of it's just so it's spread far and wide in

588
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:53,960
Speaker 5: such a beautiful way, does it. I've I've started to

589
00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:55,400
Speaker 5: get used to it now and I'm starting to be

590
00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:57,440
Speaker 5: okay with it. But as I'm getting older, it's like

591
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:02,080
Speaker 5: it's so it feels hot hot sometimes and hurt sometimes

592
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,400
Speaker 5: when you're bringing out music. I bring out music now

593
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 5: that I think is getting better and maturing and everything,

594
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:16,320
Speaker 5: but all people want to hear is missing that song.

595
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:20,759
Speaker 5: And I just like, you're one of very few people

596
00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 5: that I think can relate to me in terms of

597
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 5: like having like having an album spread far and wide

598
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:31,160
Speaker 5: like that. Do you ever feel that? Did you ever

599
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,239
Speaker 5: feel resentment?

600
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 1: I never felt resentment. But on my first album, I

601
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:40,600
Speaker 1: was still really new to songwriting, so I only wrote.

602
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:43,040
Speaker 1: There were only three songs on my first album that

603
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:46,319
Speaker 1: I wrote, so I think there was a little bit

604
00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 1: of a over the years. I still feel connected to

605
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:52,040
Speaker 1: the album, of course, but I feel more connected to

606
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,360
Speaker 1: the ones I wrote, but the bulk of the album

607
00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:56,920
Speaker 1: I really didn't write. My bass player wrote, and my

608
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 1: guitar player at the time wrote, and they're still really

609
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 1: close to me. But there is something different about singing

610
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 1: your own words. Yeah, it's really different. So on your

611
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:09,360
Speaker 1: first album, you wrote all the songs, I.

612
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,160
Speaker 5: Did, but they were also I was co writing for

613
00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,319
Speaker 5: the first time ever too, so which was the whole thing.

614
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 5: It's like, you know, I was still very much there

615
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:22,800
Speaker 5: and writing, but my writing has got more and more me,

616
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:24,320
Speaker 5: I guess as I've got older.

617
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:27,879
Speaker 1: So yeah, and you feel more yourself you're writing too.

618
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:30,720
Speaker 5: And I don't. I'm learning to not feel resemblement because

619
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:31,600
Speaker 5: it's a beautiful thing.

620
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:33,759
Speaker 1: No, it's a beautiful thing. I think it's easy to

621
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 1: feel resentment. I don't know if I ever felt like

622
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:39,600
Speaker 1: true resentment, but I definitely I have felt really lucky.

623
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 1: But I think you also create the path you're on.

624
00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:45,279
Speaker 1: Even though it's luck, it's also you're creating it as

625
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:49,200
Speaker 1: you go along. And I think there's something really special

626
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: about an artist who can get to ten years in.

627
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:54,920
Speaker 1: You're ten years in. I'm over twenty years in now

628
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,399
Speaker 1: from my first album, and I do feel like I'm

629
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:01,440
Speaker 1: still releasing music that I really believe in, and I

630
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:03,840
Speaker 1: feel like, even if it loses some of the audience,

631
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:06,360
Speaker 1: a lot of the audience does connect to it. And

632
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:08,480
Speaker 1: I feel like by going out and playing shows and

633
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: like being inspired, I'm very inspired. The last ten years,

634
00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 1: I've felt more inspired than ever, and especially in writing

635
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:21,239
Speaker 1: and playing live. And I think you're doing everything right.

636
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 1: You're surrounding yourself with a band you love, and you're

637
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:26,719
Speaker 1: playing these shows at the Warsaw and you're connecting with

638
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 1: people in a special way. And I think people once

639
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:33,399
Speaker 1: you get twenty years out, you'll see that whatever you're

640
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,320
Speaker 1: doing right now, put all that sort of work into

641
00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:40,040
Speaker 1: keeping people connected to what you're doing at the moment.

642
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:41,920
Speaker 5: It's just blocking out the noise.

643
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, don't think about that, because you win some,

644
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:48,800
Speaker 1: you lose some. I learned that with my first record.

645
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 1: Even my first record was a massive success, was it

646
00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:59,160
Speaker 1: was one of those like crazy things, you know, and

647
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:05,080
Speaker 1: even then people talk about, you know again seeing the negative,

648
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 1: and so I learned at that moment, I'm just going

649
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,320
Speaker 1: to do what makes me happy. I mean, the first album,

650
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:12,440
Speaker 1: I was doing what made me happy. That's how it

651
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,439
Speaker 1: came to be. But okay, I'm not going to worry

652
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 1: about this second album thing. I'm not going to try

653
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:19,239
Speaker 1: to recreate it. I'm just going to let it be

654
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 1: what it was. I probably won't sell as many records

655
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:25,719
Speaker 1: because that is crazy, and I'm okay with that, and

656
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:28,920
Speaker 1: I just want to stay inspired. Because there was a

657
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:32,440
Speaker 1: moment at the end of that whole year and a

658
00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:35,480
Speaker 1: half of the first record, I was on tour and

659
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, I wasn't happy and I'm like,

660
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:41,520
Speaker 1: what is happening? And it was because it was too much,

661
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:43,880
Speaker 1: and it was I think I was just doing too

662
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 1: much press, and I just I was like, we're pushing

663
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 1: this album. It's already crazy. Why are you making me

664
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 1: do all this stuff that I don't want to do?

665
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 1: You know, Let's just play music. That's what this is about.

666
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:58,239
Speaker 1: And so I took a step back and that's when

667
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:00,120
Speaker 1: I kind of realized that. So from then and I

668
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,839
Speaker 1: really just tried to keep it focused on the things

669
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 1: that bring me joy. Beautiful, you know, and that's a lucky,

670
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:08,120
Speaker 1: very lucky place to be.

671
00:41:08,600 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 5: And it sounds like you have an amazing compass within you,

672
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:15,839
Speaker 5: and yeah, it's I feel like I just jumped straight

673
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 5: into the monster's mouth. Yeah, but I think I think

674
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:23,520
Speaker 5: you and then you cal back out again. Well, you're out,

675
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:30,319
Speaker 5: the monster's my friend. Yeah, it's fine. Yeah, I think

676
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 5: we all find our ways eventually. And it's when when

677
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 5: people don't that it's really you know, yeah, I think

678
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 5: that's what people don't realize about this world of music

679
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:44,239
Speaker 5: and pop stardom. And and I think fame, you know,

680
00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:46,719
Speaker 5: fame is something that can kill you.

681
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 1: And it's yeah, it's not for everyone. It's not everyone

682
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:53,879
Speaker 1: can handle it. And you feel I feel lucky. Also,

683
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 1: I've had good people around me. Do you feel yeah,

684
00:41:57,160 --> 00:41:57,920
Speaker 1: it seems.

685
00:41:57,640 --> 00:41:59,319
Speaker 5: Like you have if I speak about it too much

686
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:03,359
Speaker 5: a Lolways, Yeah, there's just like I have the most

687
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:06,839
Speaker 5: amazing family, beautiful I do. And I have the most

688
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:14,320
Speaker 5: amazing team. Like my manager Jack is just an absolute anchor,

689
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:17,920
Speaker 5: and he's one of my best friends, and he has

690
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:23,560
Speaker 5: grown with me and learnt with me and moved and

691
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 5: learned learned how to flow with me in such a

692
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:31,600
Speaker 5: beautiful way. And everyone in my team, I've just I've

693
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,200
Speaker 5: I've and I'm very thankful actually to the artists that

694
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 5: came before me in the UK and something that I've

695
00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:45,160
Speaker 5: been learning about recently through do you know None. They're

696
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:50,360
Speaker 5: incredible and She's she's such an an amazing person human

697
00:42:50,520 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 5: artists and teacher and recently says guided me a little bit,

698
00:42:55,040 --> 00:43:00,120
Speaker 5: and it's just awakened me to just the people that

699
00:43:00,200 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 5: came before me, Boy George and them and George Michael

700
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:08,879
Speaker 5: and all these amazing queer artists that have come before

701
00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 5: me in my life and made it possible for me

702
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:16,400
Speaker 5: to have a chance at a healthy crack at this

703
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 5: world of music, you know. And so it's I'm very lucky.

704
00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:23,799
Speaker 5: I'm very very lucky, and I've been able to keep

705
00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:26,760
Speaker 5: my composure and also part of part of my queerness

706
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:29,440
Speaker 5: has allowed me to do that too. I never had

707
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:32,080
Speaker 5: like I never went I was became very well known

708
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:34,960
Speaker 5: if I knew I was, but I never had like

709
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 5: the screaming girls outside the house or the all of

710
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 5: that stuff. I'd walk into gay bars and everyone been

711
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:45,080
Speaker 5: like who the which was kind of is annoying at

712
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:48,080
Speaker 5: the time, but also just like very very humbling, very

713
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:50,719
Speaker 5: very humbling, because you know, a lot of queer bars

714
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:54,680
Speaker 5: and queer people they care more about straight girl.

715
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 1: That's very funny.

716
00:43:57,440 --> 00:43:59,959
Speaker 5: So it was. It's always been a beautiful safe space

717
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:03,680
Speaker 5: the land, you know that's good and grounding. Yeah, I'm

718
00:44:03,719 --> 00:44:06,080
Speaker 5: happy for you, thank you. I'm very proud of you.

719
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:12,760
Speaker 5: But yeah, it's been beautiful watching your whole whole journey.

720
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 1: And the music. Let's get back to the music. Did

721
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 1: you you grew up in church, because you seem to

722
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 1: love gospel music and the harmonies sort of lend itself

723
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:23,320
Speaker 1: to that.

724
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:27,440
Speaker 5: I grew up in church. Really the church, I mean,

725
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:30,640
Speaker 5: when I get down to it, I think that the

726
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:36,200
Speaker 5: music that my mum played at home and the songs

727
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:40,839
Speaker 5: that she would be drawn to from Aretha Franklin too,

728
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 5: Shaka car George Michael, Stevie Wonder, Whitney Houston. When I go,

729
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:55,439
Speaker 5: when I go back to those origins, when I first

730
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 5: started listening to music, and what I was surrounded by.

731
00:44:58,080 --> 00:45:00,960
Speaker 5: Luther Vandros was a huge one, actually, one of the biggest.

732
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:06,480
Speaker 5: It all came from the church, definitely, you know, and

733
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 5: all of my mum's favorite songs of theirs came from

734
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:12,400
Speaker 5: the church. And so that was my exposure. And then

735
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 5: I also went to church from a young age. I

736
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:18,920
Speaker 5: went to Catholic school until I was eighteen.

737
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 1: Did you sing in the choir?

738
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:23,880
Speaker 5: I sang in the choir the whole time, Latin hymns,

739
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:28,799
Speaker 5: Latin hymn ok. Yeah, which I found tough. But then

740
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:32,279
Speaker 5: there was some moments in my secondary school where I

741
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 5: had some amazing music teachers. They loved some gospel songs

742
00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 5: and they would have me and the choirs sing some

743
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:40,920
Speaker 5: of those songs in church too. So I got to

744
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:44,600
Speaker 5: experience that in church, and so it's a part of

745
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 5: my life. I wouldn't sound religious. I'm a spiritual person now,

746
00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:55,720
Speaker 5: but I would always feel connected and there's certain words

747
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:58,759
Speaker 5: that find their way into my music that come from

748
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,480
Speaker 5: the church and I think it's as there's certain feelings

749
00:46:01,520 --> 00:46:04,840
Speaker 5: that are so big, and I revert to those words

750
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:06,000
Speaker 5: to explain those feelings.

751
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:10,920
Speaker 1: Sometimes you know, they become universal in a in a

752
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:11,480
Speaker 1: deep way.

753
00:46:12,160 --> 00:46:16,399
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah for sure. So yeah. But I love gospel music,

754
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:18,120
Speaker 5: and as I've got older, it's just become more and

755
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:20,040
Speaker 5: more for passion and love.

756
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 1: How many singers do you have in your band?

757
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,480
Speaker 5: I only have three. I mean on all of the

758
00:46:25,640 --> 00:46:29,000
Speaker 5: songs that I that you hear choirs on on my music.

759
00:46:30,160 --> 00:46:34,759
Speaker 5: Before the music I'm working on now was me. There

760
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:36,520
Speaker 5: was just loads of me and.

761
00:46:36,560 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 1: I love doing this, which is so fun fun. Well,

762
00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 1: you said in the text message you don't sing harmony?

763
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 5: No, well I do sing how many when I'm layering

764
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:44,520
Speaker 5: like that?

765
00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:48,600
Speaker 1: But you don't think and dream and harmony? No, you

766
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:51,799
Speaker 1: don't like harmonize. I always go to the background singer

767
00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:55,040
Speaker 1: when I'm singing along. Well yeah, I always know.

768
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 5: I'm always obnoxiously like kind of dueting.

769
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 1: I always go to the back grounds or the harmonies,

770
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 1: and that's what I hee wow yeah beautiful.

771
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:09,400
Speaker 5: No, I'm yeah, I'm always I find I find music

772
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 5: like harmonizing and stuff like that. I find it quite

773
00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:15,680
Speaker 5: daunting sometimes because I don't have the brain for it.

774
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:18,319
Speaker 5: I'm more of a jazz singer, i'd say, and that's

775
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 5: more of my main influences have come from jazz as well. Really, yeah,

776
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 5: like Frank Sinatra in my house was a massive thing,

777
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:31,800
Speaker 5: and wine house was a huge thing in my house,

778
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:34,800
Speaker 5: and then that led me to Saravon.

779
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:36,760
Speaker 1: Savon's one of my favorites.

780
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 5: I think she's my favorite artist of all time.

781
00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:40,840
Speaker 1: You know that version of my Funny Valentine where she

782
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:48,560
Speaker 1: goes all over the place, her.

783
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 5: Singing misty, It's just my favorite thing.

784
00:47:51,719 --> 00:47:51,959
Speaker 4: Yeah.

785
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:55,719
Speaker 5: So yeah, I just I love music and I and

786
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,680
Speaker 5: I and I'm trying to honor those roots more and

787
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:01,880
Speaker 5: more in the music that I'm making now, which is amazing.

788
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 5: And I'm actually like, I've worked with incredible choir called

789
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:08,799
Speaker 5: the Two City Choir. They're from Philly and from all

790
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:11,040
Speaker 5: over actually, and they've come to New York a few

791
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:13,960
Speaker 5: times now. Wow, And they're on the song to Be

792
00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 5: Free and.

793
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:17,560
Speaker 1: Okay, that's who that is. That that's beautiful and they're

794
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:20,239
Speaker 1: insane and like, yeah, well it just feels so.

795
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:22,040
Speaker 2: Right.

796
00:48:22,760 --> 00:48:25,440
Speaker 5: Well I'm feeling from moving to New York, I'm finally

797
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:29,480
Speaker 5: feeling that I've actually got some exposure now to players

798
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:33,719
Speaker 5: and musicians that are actually fit more into what I've

799
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:34,479
Speaker 5: always been.

800
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:36,520
Speaker 1: Inspired by the music you came up with.

801
00:48:36,719 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, because I came up with American music. Yeah. I

802
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 5: love American music, and so it's you know, I sing

803
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 5: an American, you know, I don't sing in English in British,

804
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:51,480
Speaker 5: you know, So there's moments that you can hear it,

805
00:48:51,600 --> 00:48:56,480
Speaker 5: but I mainly sing an American. So I I it's

806
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:58,440
Speaker 5: been amazing to be in New York and actually like

807
00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:00,920
Speaker 5: to be close to some people where you're like, oh,

808
00:49:01,719 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 5: that would sound and made that bass player would sound

809
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 5: insane on this, and then you start it's amazing. But

810
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:10,120
Speaker 5: there's still incredible talent in the UK that that has

811
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:11,720
Speaker 5: pulled that together in the past.

812
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 3: Yeah.

813
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:14,239
Speaker 1: No, it's just a different scene and it's big. It's

814
00:49:14,239 --> 00:49:16,040
Speaker 1: maybe bigger here, it's bigger.

815
00:49:16,080 --> 00:49:18,879
Speaker 5: And you're also just like you're rooted to the earth

816
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:22,560
Speaker 5: and of what you're doing, of what you're doing just

817
00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:27,000
Speaker 5: listening to jazz music and walking around Manhattan, like that's

818
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:28,759
Speaker 5: what I do now. I listened to I put on

819
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:31,920
Speaker 5: my jazz music and I walk around Manhattan and do

820
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:38,320
Speaker 5: my do my errands, and it's amazing. There's something different

821
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 5: about this to jazz in New York. I don't know

822
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:41,400
Speaker 5: what it is.

823
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:44,279
Speaker 1: It feels different being here. Yeah, it feels more because

824
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:46,879
Speaker 1: some of it was recorded just down the street. Yeah, yeah,

825
00:49:47,120 --> 00:49:49,000
Speaker 1: I had that experience the other night. We were listening

826
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 1: to a live Bill Love's album from the Village Vanguard,

827
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:57,239
Speaker 1: and we're like, thinking that was recorded right over there. Yeah,

828
00:49:57,360 --> 00:49:57,799
Speaker 1: it's cool.

829
00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:00,680
Speaker 5: So the spirit of the and there's a romance to

830
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,200
Speaker 5: New York that suits me very well.

831
00:50:03,239 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 15: I love it.

832
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:04,200
Speaker 5: That's good.

833
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:06,239
Speaker 1: You're still in the honeymoon phase for sure.

834
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:08,560
Speaker 5: For sure. I mean I've had tough moments the last

835
00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 5: year where get me out of here. I'm still trying

836
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:15,239
Speaker 5: to find where that is. I think I'm going to

837
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 5: go to the jungle.

838
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:17,800
Speaker 1: That's where you want to live next?

839
00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:19,879
Speaker 5: No, I think I want to always live in New York.

840
00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:22,360
Speaker 5: But I think I want to jule if I am,

841
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:24,880
Speaker 5: if I'm lucky enough to be to afford somewhere to

842
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:28,279
Speaker 5: escape to, like a little shack. I think I just

843
00:50:28,360 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 5: want to go to the jungle because I feel like

844
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:33,120
Speaker 5: I live in the jungle now in New York. But

845
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 5: then so I think like I've been going to the

846
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:38,080
Speaker 5: jungle over the last few years ago. Yeah, Costa Rica

847
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:41,239
Speaker 5: and like going. I've also gone to the Caribbean a

848
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:43,080
Speaker 5: bit more because it's only three hours away from here,

849
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:45,880
Speaker 5: and I just like, I think I might be in

850
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:46,799
Speaker 5: my tropical era.

851
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 1: It's amazing. When I hear that, all I think about

852
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:54,120
Speaker 1: is mosquitoes. Oh my god, in a magnet.

853
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 2: Same, that's my only love me.

854
00:50:56,600 --> 00:50:59,759
Speaker 5: I'm like a cream puff. I mean, they love me.

855
00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 5: But you just got a spray. Just get in on

856
00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 5: the spray. And the more you live there, you acclimatize.

857
00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:08,479
Speaker 1: They stop liking the way you taste, I guess.

858
00:51:09,080 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 5: And also people just don't stay outside that much. I've

859
00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:15,200
Speaker 5: noticed people that live there like hours of the day

860
00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:17,680
Speaker 5: to stay in and out, whereas when we're there, we're

861
00:51:17,719 --> 00:51:19,160
Speaker 5: just like trying to soak up the song.

862
00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:24,080
Speaker 1: Well, I saw something that you posted the other day.

863
00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:26,160
Speaker 1: You did this beautiful Tom Putty cover.

864
00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:31,759
Speaker 5: Oh gosh ya. Yeah, I first heard that song in

865
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:33,600
Speaker 5: a film called Elizabethtown.

866
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:35,160
Speaker 1: Oh I didn't know the song.

867
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,520
Speaker 5: It's amazing. It's in a film called Elizabethtown with Kirston

868
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:43,279
Speaker 5: Dunce and which was beautiful film. But that song just

869
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:47,320
Speaker 5: knocked me Sideways when I watched that film, and so

870
00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:52,040
Speaker 5: I've loved that song for a while. And it's also

871
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 5: been like a little like when I have my big

872
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 5: first heartbreak. I turned to this song a lot, but

873
00:51:59,760 --> 00:52:01,359
Speaker 5: there it was just when I was putting this show

874
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 5: together for the Warsaw, there was just this I was

875
00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:06,880
Speaker 5: singing stay with Me, and I just really wanted to

876
00:52:06,960 --> 00:52:10,360
Speaker 5: start telling some real stories that the Warsaw about that

877
00:52:10,440 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 5: people have never heard. It's a real life. I went

878
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:18,319
Speaker 5: to a copyright issue with Tom Petty for the songs

879
00:52:18,320 --> 00:52:22,000
Speaker 5: stay with Me, and it just like, it was such

880
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:24,279
Speaker 5: a hard thing that was on your first album, So

881
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:28,120
Speaker 5: my first album, that must have felt so bad. It was.

882
00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:30,719
Speaker 5: It was so bad. I was so confused. So I

883
00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:34,440
Speaker 5: was just so confused, firstly because I was I come

884
00:52:34,520 --> 00:52:36,759
Speaker 5: from a hill in the middle of England. I didn't

885
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:39,960
Speaker 5: know who Tom Petty was. I'm gay, Like some gay

886
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:41,640
Speaker 5: people might have known who Tom Petty was when they

887
00:52:41,680 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 5: were like eleven years old, not me. I was just

888
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,840
Speaker 5: listening to women singing the whole time, and his beautiful

889
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:51,080
Speaker 5: music never made its way to my heart until later on.

890
00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:56,040
Speaker 5: So when that happened, it was I felt like I

891
00:52:56,160 --> 00:52:57,080
Speaker 5: was being robbed.

892
00:52:57,120 --> 00:52:59,920
Speaker 1: Well, it feels like a shaming sort of thing.

893
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:03,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it makes me Yeah. And because it was

894
00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 5: in the news everywhere, it was almost like everyone being like,

895
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:08,080
Speaker 5: you're not an original, you know, that's.

896
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:11,880
Speaker 1: Tripping you of your your whatever, your metals or something

897
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:13,759
Speaker 1: at the end of the like the Olympics are.

898
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:15,600
Speaker 5: And and then when it got to the Grammys though,

899
00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:18,160
Speaker 5: I think that there was probably people that wanted me,

900
00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:22,239
Speaker 5: you know, taken out of the Grammys and all of

901
00:53:22,320 --> 00:53:25,680
Speaker 5: that stuff because they didn't want me to because there

902
00:53:25,800 --> 00:53:28,400
Speaker 5: was a reason for me to not be, you know,

903
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:31,880
Speaker 5: awarded for that song. So it was, it was it

904
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:37,040
Speaker 5: was hard, It was confusing and frustrating. And he wrote

905
00:53:37,080 --> 00:53:41,160
Speaker 5: me a letter. The night before the Grammys, a letter

906
00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:42,759
Speaker 5: came to my door and he wrote me a letter,

907
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 5: and he was so sweet in the letter. He did

908
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,480
Speaker 5: say in the letter he said, I'm sorry this still happening.

909
00:53:49,800 --> 00:53:53,800
Speaker 5: I think you're amazing. And he said there's only so

910
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:58,399
Speaker 5: many notes on the piano in the letter, which, if

911
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:00,800
Speaker 5: I'm honest, at the time, made me annoyed because I

912
00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:04,279
Speaker 5: was like, if you know that, then why are we

913
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:04,640
Speaker 5: doing this?

914
00:54:04,920 --> 00:54:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, do you know?

915
00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:07,399
Speaker 5: I mean, like, why has this happened, if you're aware

916
00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:10,920
Speaker 5: of that. But it's what people don't know about this

917
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:14,200
Speaker 5: stuff is it's more than just the artists. It's everyone

918
00:54:14,280 --> 00:54:17,880
Speaker 5: around them and the whole infrastructure of things that come

919
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 5: into play. But when I got the note, I was

920
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 5: a little bit annoyed but also touched. And I at

921
00:54:25,040 --> 00:54:28,960
Speaker 5: the time, I was twenty two, and I went from

922
00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:32,719
Speaker 5: working in a bar to being known around the world

923
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:35,320
Speaker 5: and traveling around the world touring within two years. So

924
00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:39,279
Speaker 5: I had trauma that happened within those years to my

925
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:42,320
Speaker 5: body and my brain, and so I didn't get to

926
00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:45,040
Speaker 5: respond to him for a couple of years, and I'm

927
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:49,600
Speaker 5: so upset with myself that I never did right back.

928
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:53,120
Speaker 5: But I didn't write back, and he died, so he

929
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:54,839
Speaker 5: never got to and I never got to write back,

930
00:54:55,000 --> 00:55:00,640
Speaker 5: and I feel awful about it and still and that's

931
00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:03,120
Speaker 5: why there's a healing going on now for me. When

932
00:55:03,120 --> 00:55:05,360
Speaker 5: I I want to sing this song and I want to,

933
00:55:07,040 --> 00:55:08,719
Speaker 5: I think I actually want to sing more of his

934
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:10,920
Speaker 5: songs maybe and like every now and then put them

935
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:13,240
Speaker 5: into my set as just an ode to him, because

936
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:16,359
Speaker 5: I feel connected to him. We've connected to each other

937
00:55:16,560 --> 00:55:20,160
Speaker 5: some way, and so I did it and it felt

938
00:55:20,239 --> 00:55:21,120
Speaker 5: really really good.

939
00:55:21,040 --> 00:55:21,360
Speaker 9: To do it.

940
00:55:21,600 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I loved the way you posted about it as well.

941
00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:27,200
Speaker 1: It was really beautiful. But that story is insane.

942
00:55:27,719 --> 00:55:30,799
Speaker 5: Is insane, is insane, and it's like the worst part

943
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:33,080
Speaker 5: is I never actually listened to I went back down

944
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:36,560
Speaker 5: the song for years, and then like five years later

945
00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:39,759
Speaker 5: I listened to I was like, oh my god, like

946
00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:42,839
Speaker 5: it's the exact same you heard it. It's the exact same,

947
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:43,920
Speaker 5: but it's I mean, it's.

948
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:46,400
Speaker 1: But it's still but it's so different.

949
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:48,200
Speaker 5: That's it.

950
00:55:48,480 --> 00:55:52,359
Speaker 1: Such different songs, such different and there are only twelve

951
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:54,799
Speaker 1: notes on the piano, you.

952
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:58,160
Speaker 5: Know, and I did it differently, and he did it differently,

953
00:55:58,200 --> 00:56:01,520
Speaker 5: and there was probably someone before here, yes, most likely

954
00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:04,239
Speaker 5: did it differently too, you know. So it's it's an

955
00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:07,560
Speaker 5: interesting one, but it's definitely definitely changed my you know, Look,

956
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:10,360
Speaker 5: I don't know how i'd feel if someone actually ripped,

957
00:56:10,480 --> 00:56:13,760
Speaker 5: like if someone had released a song that sounded exactly

958
00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:16,600
Speaker 5: like to Be Free or or something like that. I

959
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:19,120
Speaker 5: don't know how I would feel in the moment. But

960
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:23,640
Speaker 5: what has happened to me will one hundred percent come

961
00:56:23,719 --> 00:56:26,120
Speaker 5: into play a little bit. Yeah, And I'm not sure

962
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,600
Speaker 5: if I would go forth vigorously.

963
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:33,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a really traumatic thing to happen. I feel

964
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:38,560
Speaker 1: like as a young person thrust into the world of music.

965
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:41,239
Speaker 5: Yeah, And the one thing I would definitely implore is

966
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:45,520
Speaker 5: when this does happen, talk to each other, artist to

967
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:49,240
Speaker 5: artist if that is possible. Yeah, you know, but lawyers

968
00:56:49,239 --> 00:56:51,960
Speaker 5: would be like, don't do that, it would I just

969
00:56:52,040 --> 00:56:54,359
Speaker 5: wish that, especially when there's two well known artists though

970
00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:57,480
Speaker 5: both like you know in pop music, and it's and

971
00:56:57,560 --> 00:56:59,880
Speaker 5: it's happened, like sit and talk to each other.

972
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:02,440
Speaker 1: But again, everybody's got so many people surrounding them that

973
00:57:02,560 --> 00:57:06,319
Speaker 1: are doing different things money well. I mean, I think

974
00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:08,399
Speaker 1: it's obvious when you hear something that is a real

975
00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:11,839
Speaker 1: rip off, Like you know, I hear all these songs

976
00:57:11,920 --> 00:57:14,960
Speaker 1: on the radio, and I'm like, that is the product.

977
00:57:15,000 --> 00:57:17,720
Speaker 1: It's more about the production. Usually, I feel like they're

978
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 1: just trying to get the exact vibe of the song

979
00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:23,240
Speaker 1: from thirty years ago or whatever it was.

980
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:26,880
Speaker 5: And that does happen. That happens, But it does happen,

981
00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:29,640
Speaker 5: And that actually happens subconsciously too. It does, and you've

982
00:57:29,640 --> 00:57:31,000
Speaker 5: got to be able to hold your hands up and

983
00:57:31,080 --> 00:57:34,000
Speaker 5: be like, that's happened. I do think that people can

984
00:57:34,160 --> 00:57:38,160
Speaker 5: also take into account when dealing with the procedures, what

985
00:57:38,400 --> 00:57:40,600
Speaker 5: that what the artists are going through. You know, if

986
00:57:40,640 --> 00:57:43,280
Speaker 5: you're if you're a very prolific artist that has has

987
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:46,680
Speaker 5: your career and has all this money behind you, then

988
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:49,000
Speaker 5: maybe you can be graceful.

989
00:57:48,800 --> 00:57:51,880
Speaker 1: A little graceful. Yeah, but I think it's really sweet.

990
00:57:51,960 --> 00:57:53,760
Speaker 5: And Tom was graceful by the way, Yeah he was.

991
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:57,360
Speaker 5: He was even in the what ended up happening with

992
00:57:57,920 --> 00:58:00,479
Speaker 5: that song. Legally he was graceful. Was lucky.

993
00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:03,760
Speaker 1: Well, I like that you're doing this song, and I

994
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:05,880
Speaker 1: like that it's your way of writing him back.

995
00:58:06,080 --> 00:58:06,280
Speaker 5: Yeah.

996
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:07,480
Speaker 1: I think it's very sweet.

997
00:58:07,960 --> 00:58:09,160
Speaker 5: What a song.

998
00:58:09,480 --> 00:58:12,200
Speaker 1: It's such well, he has so many great songs, but

999
00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:14,560
Speaker 1: this is one I had never heard, and I thought

1000
00:58:14,600 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 1: I'd finally heard them all what I have.

1001
00:58:16,600 --> 00:58:17,880
Speaker 5: It's just like I love it.

1002
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:19,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're beautiful.

1003
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:22,400
Speaker 5: I want to do it. I did it differently where

1004
00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:25,320
Speaker 5: there was more breaks in between each thing. But you'll

1005
00:58:25,360 --> 00:58:26,160
Speaker 5: hear it when we do it.

1006
00:58:26,840 --> 00:58:30,200
Speaker 1: Do you want to lead the the bits then? I

1007
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:32,000
Speaker 1: think so, Yeah, that way, I won't go to the

1008
00:58:32,080 --> 00:58:33,560
Speaker 1: court until you do the pick up.

1009
00:58:33,680 --> 00:58:34,080
Speaker 5: I think so.

1010
00:58:34,440 --> 00:58:35,200
Speaker 2: Is that cool? Yeah?

1011
00:58:35,280 --> 00:58:39,640
Speaker 1: Okay, that will help me. Yeah again, we'll see what happens.

1012
00:58:39,680 --> 00:58:40,640
Speaker 5: I can sit for this one.

1013
00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:41,479
Speaker 1: Okay, cool?

1014
00:58:52,880 --> 00:58:53,959
Speaker 8: You want fa.

1015
00:58:56,760 --> 00:59:09,080
Speaker 15: So eyes so blue, they looked like weather. When he

1016
00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:13,560
Speaker 15: need me, I wasn't around.

1017
00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:15,880
Speaker 4: That's the way it.

1018
00:59:16,080 --> 00:59:26,280
Speaker 2: Goes in along. There were times upon.

1019
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:32,480
Speaker 15: There were times two together. I was fleshed to him

1020
00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:43,840
Speaker 15: through so bitter when in mine and most I let

1021
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:49,480
Speaker 15: him down. That's the way it goes in along.

1022
00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:51,440
Speaker 2: Work goes.

1023
00:59:55,160 --> 00:59:57,200
Speaker 8: In work.

1024
00:59:58,440 --> 01:00:06,520
Speaker 2: He better round with him then with me?

1025
01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:39,920
Speaker 16: Mm hmm, here it all work out.

1026
01:00:40,680 --> 01:00:52,240
Speaker 15: Evly be around with him there with me. Now the

1027
01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:58,000
Speaker 15: wind is high and the rain is silly, and the

1028
01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:02,600
Speaker 15: world is around. Say leave me.

1029
01:01:06,840 --> 01:01:07,120
Speaker 4: Still.

1030
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:10,680
Speaker 2: I'm then come him when the sun.

1031
01:01:10,680 --> 01:01:18,120
Speaker 4: Goes down and never goes away. You know, said.

1032
01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:28,880
Speaker 15: Hiding that event should better love.

1033
01:01:29,160 --> 01:01:32,480
Speaker 4: With him than with me.

1034
01:01:33,720 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 15: Along again, event should had along with him, and he.

1035
01:01:43,720 --> 01:02:09,960
Speaker 10: With I try not to cry that whole time.

1036
01:02:10,560 --> 01:02:12,640
Speaker 1: That turned into such a sad heartbreak.

1037
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 5: It's terrible. The way you play is so beautiful.

1038
01:02:16,680 --> 01:02:17,000
Speaker 4: Thank you.

1039
01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:22,360
Speaker 1: The way you say it's so beautiful. It's funny because

1040
01:02:22,360 --> 01:02:25,000
Speaker 1: the tom version of the song is so like it's

1041
01:02:25,040 --> 01:02:25,720
Speaker 1: like Irish, I.

1042
01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:29,520
Speaker 5: Must It's like Irish with like a there's a it's

1043
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:34,640
Speaker 5: a it feels like an Asian instrument, right, Yeah, it's

1044
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:36,600
Speaker 5: like some Chinese instrument.

1045
01:02:36,840 --> 01:02:37,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so we came here.

1046
01:02:38,120 --> 01:02:39,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's amazing.

1047
01:02:39,520 --> 01:02:40,400
Speaker 1: Well that was beautiful.

1048
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:43,160
Speaker 5: That's beautiful. It's it's like singing it now is like

1049
01:02:44,320 --> 01:02:46,600
Speaker 5: it's an emotional song for me. But like with the

1050
01:02:46,640 --> 01:02:49,400
Speaker 5: story that I'm telling, it's also like the one of

1051
01:02:49,400 --> 01:02:53,400
Speaker 5: the lyrics is like when it mattened most, I let

1052
01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:55,480
Speaker 5: him down. That's the way it goes all. I'm just

1053
01:02:55,960 --> 01:02:59,240
Speaker 5: it feels like I feel it's I don't know. There's

1054
01:02:59,240 --> 01:03:01,760
Speaker 5: so many moments that I've had in my life, especially

1055
01:03:01,840 --> 01:03:03,600
Speaker 5: with artists. I look back at the beginning of my

1056
01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:07,520
Speaker 5: career and I'm like, that person wrote to me, that

1057
01:03:07,640 --> 01:03:10,040
Speaker 5: person said something to me, and I'm I didn't I

1058
01:03:10,160 --> 01:03:13,280
Speaker 5: didn't write back. I didn't write back. Keep the letters.

1059
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:15,120
Speaker 1: I have a few of those two and.

1060
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:18,600
Speaker 5: It's it's not it's just because I was running at

1061
01:03:18,680 --> 01:03:22,760
Speaker 5: such a high speed that I I didn't treasure those

1062
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:23,520
Speaker 5: moments enough.

1063
01:03:23,600 --> 01:03:26,920
Speaker 1: Sometimes you know, Yeah, I have those situations too. It's

1064
01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:30,640
Speaker 1: weird people. I have messages that I never called the

1065
01:03:30,680 --> 01:03:34,480
Speaker 1: person back, and I think it was part anxiety too.

1066
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:37,920
Speaker 1: It was part busyness, but part anxiety of not knowing how.

1067
01:03:37,840 --> 01:03:40,360
Speaker 5: To how to fully do it, how to do it.

1068
01:03:40,600 --> 01:03:43,200
Speaker 5: I remember the first time I met Beyonce, and I've

1069
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:45,400
Speaker 5: met her a few times now, but I'm always so

1070
01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:48,480
Speaker 5: ashamed of the first time I ever met her. She

1071
01:03:48,600 --> 01:03:51,760
Speaker 5: invited me into a dressing room and I'm such huge

1072
01:03:51,920 --> 01:03:55,480
Speaker 5: Beyonce fan. She was, and it is always my ultimate

1073
01:03:55,600 --> 01:04:02,440
Speaker 5: I think actually in today's times. And I went into

1074
01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:05,800
Speaker 5: her dressing room and she was there in a private space,

1075
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:09,240
Speaker 5: and I asked for a picture, and you felt bad

1076
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:11,440
Speaker 5: about that, awful And I still do to this day,

1077
01:04:11,480 --> 01:04:15,200
Speaker 5: because it's like it's just like now, I know how

1078
01:04:15,280 --> 01:04:18,080
Speaker 5: it feels, yea to have someone in your space, and

1079
01:04:18,200 --> 01:04:22,320
Speaker 5: like I was still very kind and sweet and thankful,

1080
01:04:22,360 --> 01:04:24,280
Speaker 5: and I'm sure she's used to that happening a lot.

1081
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:24,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure.

1082
01:04:25,040 --> 01:04:26,920
Speaker 5: I'm just like, damn it. I wish I was cooler.

1083
01:04:27,440 --> 01:04:30,000
Speaker 5: I wish I was cooler, And I just didn't do

1084
01:04:30,200 --> 01:04:32,760
Speaker 5: that because I didn't need it. I didn't need a picture. Yeah,

1085
01:04:32,760 --> 01:04:33,720
Speaker 5: I didn't need a picture.

1086
01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:37,640
Speaker 1: Don't beat yourself up. I beat myself up about stuff

1087
01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:42,040
Speaker 1: like that too, But I think it's okay. We're all human, Yeah, yeah,

1088
01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:47,640
Speaker 1: but yeah, well now you're present. And here's the thing though,

1089
01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:50,120
Speaker 1: people who reached out to us when we were little

1090
01:04:50,160 --> 01:04:53,960
Speaker 1: babies starting out, they were already past where we are now,

1091
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:57,439
Speaker 1: so they understood, they understood it's okay, yeah for sure.

1092
01:04:58,640 --> 01:05:02,360
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and we're older and maybe we'll reach out more.

1093
01:05:03,440 --> 01:05:06,240
Speaker 1: I'm not good at that. Do you reach out too?

1094
01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:07,240
Speaker 2: I used to?

1095
01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:10,840
Speaker 5: There was like I remember when like Billie Eilish came

1096
01:05:10,960 --> 01:05:13,720
Speaker 5: up and a few people, it was like I just

1097
01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:18,320
Speaker 5: survived my wave of stuff and I and I felt

1098
01:05:18,800 --> 01:05:21,600
Speaker 5: I wrote a few notes to people just saying like

1099
01:05:22,360 --> 01:05:25,400
Speaker 5: I'm always here, yeah, And then I just kind of

1100
01:05:25,600 --> 01:05:29,760
Speaker 5: realized that, like, that's very different what they're going through

1101
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:32,120
Speaker 5: to what I'm going through. This isn't some this isn't

1102
01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:33,240
Speaker 5: something that's the same.

1103
01:05:33,560 --> 01:05:36,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, and you're self conscious about the letter

1104
01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:37,960
Speaker 1: and yeah, of god, that's me.

1105
01:05:38,080 --> 01:05:39,840
Speaker 5: I'm just like all the time, Wait, so did you

1106
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:42,200
Speaker 5: send it? I did send that, and they replied and

1107
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:44,520
Speaker 5: they they and I saw them at their show in

1108
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:47,880
Speaker 5: London and they were wonderful to me and very sweet

1109
01:05:47,960 --> 01:05:51,439
Speaker 5: and was great. But I definitely realized in that moment

1110
01:05:51,520 --> 01:05:56,840
Speaker 5: that that's probably not my role in an industry. I

1111
01:05:56,960 --> 01:06:00,920
Speaker 5: think that I if anyone, you know, if anyone ever

1112
01:06:01,080 --> 01:06:03,040
Speaker 5: needs me or wants to talk to me, I'm there

1113
01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:04,200
Speaker 5: and I would love to.

1114
01:06:04,400 --> 01:06:05,920
Speaker 1: But you're not going to impose yourself.

1115
01:06:05,960 --> 01:06:08,800
Speaker 5: I'm not going to impose myself because we're just so different.

1116
01:06:08,920 --> 01:06:12,920
Speaker 5: This isn't like a race. It's not a race. It's

1117
01:06:13,240 --> 01:06:15,560
Speaker 5: it's a it's a music is so personal, and what

1118
01:06:15,720 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 5: you go through and what I go through is so different,

1119
01:06:19,160 --> 01:06:22,440
Speaker 5: like just my just being queer myself and and and

1120
01:06:22,720 --> 01:06:24,760
Speaker 5: like what I'm and what you've gone through in your life.

1121
01:06:24,760 --> 01:06:28,240
Speaker 5: It's just so it's so singular. I see all these

1122
01:06:28,280 --> 01:06:31,760
Speaker 5: amazing artists come out and like they really are just amazing.

1123
01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:35,920
Speaker 1: They're amazing, kind of crazy. Yeah it's beautiful. Yeah, well

1124
01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:38,080
Speaker 1: you're one of them. And thank you so much for

1125
01:06:38,240 --> 01:06:40,760
Speaker 1: doing this. This is kind of my way of doing

1126
01:06:40,840 --> 01:06:44,360
Speaker 1: that is getting to be with people and share things

1127
01:06:44,400 --> 01:06:44,720
Speaker 1: with them.

1128
01:06:44,920 --> 01:06:47,600
Speaker 5: And what an amazing thing to do. It's just it

1129
01:06:47,840 --> 01:06:50,080
Speaker 5: feels you made me feel very safe today.

1130
01:06:50,080 --> 01:06:50,680
Speaker 2: It's good.

1131
01:06:51,120 --> 01:06:54,560
Speaker 5: Thank you. Just singing hearing you play that song just there,

1132
01:06:54,600 --> 01:06:56,080
Speaker 5: it's just highlight for me.

1133
01:06:56,480 --> 01:06:58,040
Speaker 1: Well, I hope I can come to the worst song

1134
01:06:58,120 --> 01:07:04,680
Speaker 1: one night. I can't wait please Yeah, yay think ooh

1135
01:07:05,920 --> 01:07:10,440
Speaker 1: that made me happy. Oh that was incredible. I love

1136
01:07:10,520 --> 01:07:13,840
Speaker 1: all their stories, like I know, just what a human

1137
01:07:14,200 --> 01:07:15,000
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah.

1138
01:07:15,640 --> 01:07:18,000
Speaker 3: And that's something about the residencies I think is like

1139
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:21,120
Speaker 3: you can hear more of these stories, the stories behind

1140
01:07:21,160 --> 01:07:22,920
Speaker 3: the music, you know, which is really such a big

1141
01:07:23,000 --> 01:07:23,360
Speaker 3: part of it.

1142
01:07:23,760 --> 01:07:27,200
Speaker 1: I think these residencies are kind of I think they're

1143
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:30,360
Speaker 1: what a lot of artists want to do nowadays. I've

1144
01:07:30,400 --> 01:07:33,240
Speaker 1: talked about doing something like that too. It just feels

1145
01:07:34,080 --> 01:07:36,880
Speaker 1: like a really beautiful way to connect with people and

1146
01:07:37,040 --> 01:07:39,960
Speaker 1: to sort of also not be so hard on yourself.

1147
01:07:40,160 --> 01:07:42,720
Speaker 1: Touring can be a hard life, so it's kind of

1148
01:07:42,800 --> 01:07:46,440
Speaker 1: a nice way to plant yourself somewhere and just to

1149
01:07:46,560 --> 01:07:48,120
Speaker 1: be free, to be free do the thing.

1150
01:07:48,360 --> 01:07:48,520
Speaker 7: Yeah.

1151
01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:49,120
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1152
01:07:50,160 --> 01:07:52,120
Speaker 1: If you'd like to know what songs we played today,

1153
01:07:53,120 --> 01:07:56,400
Speaker 1: we did the song to Be Free that Sam just

1154
01:07:56,520 --> 01:07:59,880
Speaker 1: released in twenty twenty five. We also did I'm Not

1155
01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:02,960
Speaker 1: the Only One from in the Lonely Hour, which was

1156
01:08:03,040 --> 01:08:07,480
Speaker 1: released in twenty fourteen, and we did It'll All Work Out,

1157
01:08:07,560 --> 01:08:10,680
Speaker 1: the Tom Petty song from Let Me Up I've Had Enough,

1158
01:08:10,880 --> 01:08:15,320
Speaker 1: released in nineteen eighty seven. Special thanks to Sam Smith

1159
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:18,040
Speaker 1: for joining us today. We'll be back next week with

1160
01:08:18,240 --> 01:08:21,320
Speaker 1: Nate Smith. Visit Nora Jones channel and be sure to

1161
01:08:21,360 --> 01:08:24,240
Speaker 1: subscribe while you're there. Nora Jones Is Playing Along is

1162
01:08:24,320 --> 01:08:28,160
Speaker 1: a production of iHeart Podcast I'm Your Host Norah Jones.

1163
01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:32,320
Speaker 1: This episode was recorded by Matt Marinelli, mixed by Jamie Landry.

1164
01:08:32,600 --> 01:08:36,080
Speaker 1: Audio post production and mastering by Greg Tobler. Artwork by

1165
01:08:36,120 --> 01:08:40,320
Speaker 1: Eliza Frye, Photography by Shervin Linez. Produced by Nora Jones

1166
01:08:40,360 --> 01:08:44,400
Speaker 1: and Sarah Oda. Executive producers Aaron Wang Kaufman and Jordan

1167
01:08:44,520 --> 01:08:47,400
Speaker 1: Runtog Marketing Lead Queen and a Key