WEBVTT - Rerun: Machine Consciousness 0:00:04.600 --> 0:00:12.720 Welcome to tech Stuff, a production from iHeartRadio. Hey there, 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:16.480 and welcome to tech Stuff. I'm your host, Jonathan Strickland. 0:00:16.480 --> 0:00:20.079 I'm an executive producer with iHeartRadio, and I love all 0:00:20.160 --> 0:00:23.520 things tech and I owe you guys an apology. We're 0:00:23.520 --> 0:00:27.440 you're having a rerun episode today, So this is a 0:00:27.480 --> 0:00:33.240 rerun from twenty nineteen about machine consciousness, and it's again 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:37.400 one of those tricky concepts. Consciousness is a difficult thing 0:00:37.440 --> 0:00:41.320 to define, even for humans. So sit back and enjoy 0:00:41.400 --> 0:00:44.000 this rerun. I'll talk to you again at the end 0:00:44.040 --> 0:00:47.320 of the episode. There's a topic I have touched on 0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:51.280 on several occasions in past episodes, but I really wanted 0:00:51.320 --> 0:00:54.600 to dig down today into this topic because it's one 0:00:54.600 --> 0:00:58.480 of those that's fascinating and is an underpinning for tons 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:02.280 of speculative fiction and horror stories. And since we're now 0:01:02.360 --> 0:01:06.040 in October, I fig this would be kind of thematically 0:01:06.120 --> 0:01:09.959 linked to Halloween text style. It turns out that's pretty 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:13.600 hard to do Halloween technology stories. I've already covered stuff 0:01:13.680 --> 0:01:17.560 like haunted house technology. So today we're going to talk 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:21.280 about consciousness and whether or not it might be possible 0:01:21.400 --> 0:01:26.080 that machines could one day achieve consciousness. Now, I could 0:01:26.160 --> 0:01:29.440 start this off by talking about the Turing test, which 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:32.640 many people have used as the launch point for machine 0:01:32.640 --> 0:01:37.160 intelligence and machine consciousness debates. The way we understand that 0:01:37.240 --> 0:01:40.560 test today, which by the way, is slightly different from 0:01:40.600 --> 0:01:44.080 the test that Alan Turing first proposed, is that you 0:01:44.120 --> 0:01:48.480 have a human interviewer who, through a computer interface, asks 0:01:48.600 --> 0:01:52.400 questions of a subject, and the subject might be another human, 0:01:52.880 --> 0:01:56.320 or it might be a computer program posing as a human, 0:01:56.800 --> 0:01:59.840 and the interviewer just sees text on a screen. So 0:02:00.120 --> 0:02:03.400 if the interviewer is unable to pass a certain threshold 0:02:03.760 --> 0:02:05.960 of being able to tell the difference, to be able 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:08.320 to determine whether it was a machine or a person, 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:12.239 then the program or machine that's being tested is said 0:02:12.320 --> 0:02:15.560 to have passed the Turing test. It doesn't mean the 0:02:15.600 --> 0:02:19.839 program or machine is conscious or even intelligent, but rather 0:02:19.960 --> 0:02:24.919 says that to outward appearances, it seems to be intelligent 0:02:25.000 --> 0:02:29.720 and conscious. See, we humans can't be absolutely sure that 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:33.799 other humans are conscious and intelligent. We assume that they 0:02:33.840 --> 0:02:38.720 are because each of us knows of our own consciousness 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:42.440 and our own intelligence. We have a personal experience with 0:02:42.560 --> 0:02:47.520 that direct personal experience, and other people seem to display 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:51.679 behaviors that indicate they too possess those traits, and they 0:02:51.720 --> 0:02:56.160 too have a personal experience. But we cannot be those 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:59.400 other people, and so we have to grant them the 0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:03.160 consideration that they too are conscious and intelligent. And I 0:03:03.240 --> 0:03:07.240 agree that is very big of us. This is actually 0:03:07.320 --> 0:03:12.160 called the problem of other minds in the field of philosophy, 0:03:12.440 --> 0:03:15.560 and the problem is this, it is impossible for any 0:03:15.680 --> 0:03:19.040 one of us to step outside of ourselves and into 0:03:19.080 --> 0:03:23.640 any other person's consciousness. We cannot feel what other people 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:28.160 are feeling or experience their thoughts firsthand. We are aware 0:03:28.240 --> 0:03:31.520 of our own abilities, but we are only aware of 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:36.400 the appearance that other people share those abilities. So assuming 0:03:36.440 --> 0:03:40.360 that other people also experience consciousness rather than imitating it, 0:03:40.600 --> 0:03:44.120 really really, well, that's a step we all have to take. 0:03:45.280 --> 0:03:49.960 Turing's point is that if we do grant that consideration 0:03:50.040 --> 0:03:52.600 to other people, why would we not do it to 0:03:52.680 --> 0:03:57.080 machines as well. I mean, the machine appears to possess 0:03:57.280 --> 0:04:00.760 the same qualities as a human. This is a hypothetical machine, 0:04:01.200 --> 0:04:04.200 so we cannot experience what that machine is going through, 0:04:04.480 --> 0:04:07.760 just as we can't experience what another person is going through. 0:04:07.880 --> 0:04:12.360 At least not on the intrinsic personal level. So why 0:04:12.360 --> 0:04:16.080 would we not grant the machine the same consideration that 0:04:16.120 --> 0:04:19.360 we would grant to people? And Touring was being a 0:04:19.360 --> 0:04:22.200 little cheeky. But while I just gave kind of a 0:04:22.240 --> 0:04:25.880 super fast, high level description of the Turing test, that's 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:28.600 not actually where I want to start. I want to 0:04:28.640 --> 0:04:32.560 begin with the concept of consciousness itself. Now, the reason 0:04:32.600 --> 0:04:35.640 I want to do this isn't just to make a 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:38.840 longer podcast. It's because I think one of the most 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:44.479 fundamental problems with the discussion about AI intelligence, self awareness, 0:04:44.520 --> 0:04:47.720 and consciousness is that there tends to be a pretty 0:04:47.800 --> 0:04:51.920 large disconnect between the biologists and the doctors who specialize 0:04:51.960 --> 0:04:56.760 in neuroscience, particularly cognitive neuroscience, and thus have some understanding 0:04:56.960 --> 0:05:00.400 about the nature of consciousness and people. And then you 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:02.920 have computer scientists who have a deep understanding of how 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:07.440 computers process information. And while we frequently will compare brains 0:05:07.560 --> 0:05:11.400 to computers, that comparison is not one to one. It 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:15.360 is largely a comparison of convenience, and in some cases 0:05:15.400 --> 0:05:18.400 you could argue it's not terribly useful, it might actually 0:05:18.600 --> 0:05:21.880 be counterproductive. And so I think at least some of 0:05:21.920 --> 0:05:25.800 the speculation about machine consciousness is based on a lack 0:05:25.839 --> 0:05:30.040 of understanding of how complicated and mysterious this topic is 0:05:30.160 --> 0:05:34.000 in the first place, and this ends up being really tricky. 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:39.800 Consciousness isn't an easily defined quality or quantity. Some people 0:05:39.880 --> 0:05:42.880 like to say, we don't so much define consciousness by 0:05:42.920 --> 0:05:46.320 what it is, but rather what it isn't. And this 0:05:46.360 --> 0:05:48.679 will also will kind of bring us into the realm 0:05:48.839 --> 0:05:52.200 of philosophy. Now, I'm going to be honest with you, guys. 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:56.680 The realm of philosophy is not one I'm terribly comfortable in. 0:05:57.000 --> 0:05:59.760 I'm pretty pragmatic, and philosophy deals with a lot of 0:05:59.760 --> 0:06:04.680 stuff that is, at least for now, unknowable. Philosophy sometimes 0:06:04.680 --> 0:06:08.080 asks questions that we do not and cannot have the 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:11.760 answer to, and in many cases we may never be 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:15.520 able to answer those questions. And the pragmatist em says, well, 0:06:16.279 --> 0:06:19.320 why bother asking the question if you can never get 0:06:19.320 --> 0:06:22.040 the answer. Let's just focus on the stuff we actually 0:06:22.160 --> 0:06:26.479 can answer. Now, I realize this is a limitation on 0:06:26.640 --> 0:06:30.320 my part. I'm owning that I'm not out to upset 0:06:30.360 --> 0:06:34.640 the philosophical apple cart. I'm just of a different philosophical meant, 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:38.200 and I realize that just because we can't answer some 0:06:38.400 --> 0:06:42.440 questions right now, that doesn't necessarily mean they will all 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:45.880 go unanswered for all time. We might glean a way 0:06:45.920 --> 0:06:48.560 of answering at least some of them, though I suspect 0:06:48.560 --> 0:06:52.120 a few will be forever unanswered. If we go with 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:57.159 the Basic Dictionary definition of consciousness, it's quote the state 0:06:57.320 --> 0:07:02.440 of being awake and aware of one's end quote. But 0:07:02.520 --> 0:07:06.000 what this doesn't tell us is what's going on that 0:07:06.120 --> 0:07:09.159 lets us do that. It also doesn't talk about being 0:07:09.279 --> 0:07:14.240 aware of oneself, which we largely consider consciousness to be 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:17.400 part of. Is not just aware of your surroundings, but 0:07:17.480 --> 0:07:21.720 aware that you exist within those surroundings, your relationship to 0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:26.120 your surroundings, and things that are going on within you, yourself, 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:28.560 your feelings, and your thoughts. The fact that you can 0:07:28.600 --> 0:07:32.280 process all of this, you can reflect upon yourself. We 0:07:32.360 --> 0:07:36.400 tend to group that into consciousness as well. So how 0:07:36.480 --> 0:07:39.360 is it that we can feel things and be aware 0:07:39.480 --> 0:07:42.120 of those feelings? How is it that we can have 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:46.560 intentions and be aware of our intentions. We are more 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:51.000 complex than beings that simply react to sensory input. We 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:55.760 are more than beings that respond to stuff like hunger, fear, 0:07:56.040 --> 0:07:59.920 or the desire to procreate. We have motivations, sometimes really 0:08:00.280 --> 0:08:03.680 complex motivations, and we can reflect on those, we can 0:08:03.760 --> 0:08:06.880 examine them, we can question them, we can even change them. 0:08:06.920 --> 0:08:10.760 So how do we do this? Now? We know this 0:08:10.840 --> 0:08:13.400 is special because some of the things we can do 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:18.320 are shared among a very few species on Earth. For example, 0:08:18.680 --> 0:08:22.000 we humans can recognize our own reflections in a mirror. 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:26.360 Starting at around age two or so, we can see 0:08:26.360 --> 0:08:29.320 the mirror image and we recognize the mirrorage image is 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:33.400 of us. Now, there are only eight species that can 0:08:33.480 --> 0:08:37.319 do this that we know about anyway. Those species are 0:08:37.440 --> 0:08:42.360 the great apes. So you've got humans, gorillas orangutans, bonobos, 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:47.360 and chimpanzees, the magpie, the dolphin, and that's it. Oh 0:08:47.400 --> 0:08:51.440 and the magpies are birds, right, That's that's all of them. 0:08:51.720 --> 0:08:54.640 Recognizing one's own form in a mirror shows a sense 0:08:54.679 --> 0:09:00.080 of self awareness, literally, of awareness of one's self. There 0:09:00.120 --> 0:09:03.040 are a lot of great resources online and offline that 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:07.319 go into the theme of consciousness. Heck, there are numerous 0:09:07.559 --> 0:09:12.280 college level courses and graduate level courses dedicated to this topic. 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:14.560 So I'm not going to be able to go into 0:09:14.679 --> 0:09:19.360 all the different hypotheses, arguments, counter arguments, etc. In this episode, 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:24.400 but I can cover some basics. Also, I highly recommend 0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:28.120 you check out V. Sauce's video on YouTube that's titled 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:32.840 what is Consciousness? Because it's really good. And no, I 0:09:32.840 --> 0:09:35.439 don't know Michael. I have no connection to him. I've 0:09:35.480 --> 0:09:38.720 never met him. This is just an honest recommendation from me, 0:09:39.040 --> 0:09:42.240 and I have no connection whatsoever to that video series. 0:09:42.720 --> 0:09:45.480 The video includes a link to what V Sauce dubs 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:49.400 a lean back, which is a playlist of related videos 0:09:49.400 --> 0:09:52.520 on the subject at hand, in this case, consciousness. Those 0:09:52.520 --> 0:09:55.040 are also really fascinating. But I do want to point 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:57.599 out that, at least at the time of this recording, 0:09:57.960 --> 0:10:00.600 a couple of the videos in that playlist since been 0:10:00.679 --> 0:10:03.559 delisted from YouTube for whatever reason, So there are a 0:10:03.600 --> 0:10:06.760 couple of blank spots in there. But what those videos show, 0:10:07.120 --> 0:10:11.439 and what countless papers and courses and presentations also show, 0:10:11.920 --> 0:10:15.880 is that the brain is so incredibly complex and nuanced 0:10:16.400 --> 0:10:19.840 that we don't know what we don't know. We do 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:22.480 know that there are some pretty funky things going up 0:10:22.480 --> 0:10:24.720 in the gray matter up in our noggins, and we 0:10:24.800 --> 0:10:29.199 also know that many of the explanations given to describe 0:10:29.360 --> 0:10:33.480 consciousness rely upon some assumptions that we don't have any 0:10:33.520 --> 0:10:38.080 substantial evidence for. You can't really assert something to be 0:10:38.240 --> 0:10:41.760 true if it's based on a premise that you also 0:10:42.000 --> 0:10:45.400 don't know to be true. That's not how good science works. 0:10:45.640 --> 0:10:48.600 This is also why I reject the arguments around stuff 0:10:48.720 --> 0:10:52.520 like ghost hunting equipment. The use of that equipment is 0:10:52.600 --> 0:10:56.480 predicated on the argument that ghosts exist and they have 0:10:56.559 --> 0:11:00.200 certain influences on their environment. But we haven't proven that 0:11:00.280 --> 0:11:03.080 ghosts exist in the first place, let alone that they 0:11:03.080 --> 0:11:06.800 can affect the environment. So selling a meter that supposedly 0:11:06.840 --> 0:11:11.720 detects a ghostly presence from electromagnetic fluctuations makes no logical sense. 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:14.439 For us to know that to be true, we would 0:11:14.440 --> 0:11:18.360 already have to have established that one, ghosts are real, 0:11:18.960 --> 0:11:22.840 at two that they have these electromagnetic fluctuation effects, and 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:26.800 we haven't done that. It's like working science in reverse. 0:11:26.840 --> 0:11:29.000 That's not how it works anyway. There are a lot 0:11:29.000 --> 0:11:33.680 of arguments about consciousness that suggests perhaps there's some ineffable 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:37.240 force that informs it. You can call it the spirit 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:40.920 or the soul or whatever. So that argument suggests that 0:11:41.000 --> 0:11:44.319 this thing we've never proven to have existed, is what 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:48.960 gives consciousness its own and that's a problem. We can't 0:11:49.320 --> 0:11:51.920 really state that. I mean, you can't say the reason 0:11:51.960 --> 0:11:54.679 this thing exists is this other thing that we've never 0:11:54.760 --> 0:11:58.800 proven to exist makes it exist. Well, that you've just 0:11:58.840 --> 0:12:02.640 made it harder to even prove anything. And we have 0:12:02.720 --> 0:12:06.840 evidence that also shows that that whole idea doesn't hold water. 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:10.920 The evidence comes in the form of brain disorders, brain diseases, 0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:14.320 and brain damage. We have seen that disease and damage 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:19.880 to the brain affects consciousness, which suggests that consciousness manifests 0:12:20.240 --> 0:12:24.000 from the actual form and function of our brains, not 0:12:24.200 --> 0:12:29.240 from any mysterious force. Our ability to perceive, to process information, 0:12:29.320 --> 0:12:32.120 to have an understanding of the self, to have an 0:12:32.240 --> 0:12:36.319 accurate reflection of what's going on around us within our 0:12:36.360 --> 0:12:39.640 own conceptual reality, all of that appears to be predicated 0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:43.800 primarily upon the brain. Now, originally I was planning to 0:12:43.800 --> 0:12:47.800 give a rundown on some of the prevailing theories about consciousness. 0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:50.880 In other words, I want to summarize the various schools 0:12:50.880 --> 0:12:55.560 of thought about how consciousness actually arises. But as I 0:12:55.679 --> 0:13:00.120 dove down into the research, it became apparent really quickly 0:13:00.320 --> 0:13:03.840 that such a discussion would require so much groundwork and 0:13:04.120 --> 0:13:08.440 more importantly, a much deeper understanding on my part than 0:13:08.559 --> 0:13:12.040 would be practical for this podcast. So instead of talking 0:13:12.120 --> 0:13:15.720 about the higher order theory of consciousness versus the general 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:20.280 workspace theory versus integrated information theory, I'll take a step 0:13:20.320 --> 0:13:23.920 back and I'll say there's a lot of ongoing debate 0:13:24.280 --> 0:13:27.960 about the subject, and no one has conclusively proven that 0:13:28.040 --> 0:13:32.200 any particular theory or argument is most likely true. Each 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:36.160 theory has its strengths and its weaknesses, and complicating matters 0:13:36.160 --> 0:13:39.560 further is that we haven't refined our language around the 0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:44.960 concepts enough to differentiate various ideas. That means you can't 0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:49.160 talk about an organism being conscious of something and that 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:54.120 degree of consciousness is somehow inherently specific, it's not. That's 0:13:54.160 --> 0:13:57.120 the issue. So, for example, I could say a rat 0:13:57.160 --> 0:14:00.880 is conscious of a rat terrier type of that hunts 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.439 down rats, and so as a result of this consciousness 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:07.520 of the rat terrier, the rat attempts to remain hidden 0:14:07.720 --> 0:14:09.880 so as not to be killed. But does that mean 0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:13.400 the rat merely perceives the rat terrier and thus is 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:15.240 trying to stay out of its way, and that's as 0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:18.720 far as the consciousness goes. Or does it mean that 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:22.440 the rat actually has a deeper, more meaningful awareness of 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:25.600 the rat terrier? The language is in much help here, 0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:30.200 and moreover, there's debate about what degrees of consciousness there 0:14:30.240 --> 0:14:34.960 even are. Also, while I've been harping on consciousness, that's 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:38.520 not the only concept we have to consider. Another is intelligence, 0:14:38.880 --> 0:14:43.200 which is distinct from consciousness, and there are some similarities. 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:48.600 Like consciousness, intelligence is predicated upon brain functions. Again, a 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:52.760 long history of investigating brain disorders and brain damage indicates this, 0:14:53.240 --> 0:14:56.440 as it can affect not just consciousness but also intelligence. 0:14:57.000 --> 0:15:01.960 So what is intelligence? Well ready for this, but like consciousness, 0:15:02.200 --> 0:15:07.160 there's no single agreed upon definition or theory of intelligence. 0:15:07.440 --> 0:15:10.120 In general, we use the word intelligence to describe the 0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:14.120 ability to think, to learn, to absorb knowledge, and to 0:15:14.200 --> 0:15:17.880 make use of it to develop skills. Intelligence is what 0:15:17.960 --> 0:15:20.920 allowed humans to learn how to make basic tools, to 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:24.320 gain an understanding of how to cultivate plants and develop agriculture, 0:15:24.640 --> 0:15:28.680 to develop architecture, to understand mathematic principles and all sorts 0:15:28.680 --> 0:15:32.880 of stuff. So in humans, we tend to lump consciousness 0:15:32.920 --> 0:15:35.640 and intelligence together we tend to think in terms of 0:15:36.000 --> 0:15:39.800 being intelligent and being self aware, but the two need 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:43.080 not necessarily go hand in hand. There are many people 0:15:43.160 --> 0:15:45.480 who believe that it could be possible to construct an 0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:50.920 artificial intelligence or an artificial consciousness independently of one another. 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:54.280 When we come back, i'll explain more, but first let's 0:15:54.360 --> 0:16:05.480 take a quick break. So, in a very general sense, 0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:09.920 the group of hypotheses that fall into the integrated information 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:15.520 theory umbrella state that consciousness emerges through linking elements in 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:20.680 our brains. These would be neurons processing large amounts of information, 0:16:21.080 --> 0:16:24.720 and that it's the scale of this endeavor that then 0:16:24.880 --> 0:16:28.120 leads to consciousness. In other words, if you have enough 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:32.520 processors working on enough information and they're all interconnected with 0:16:32.600 --> 0:16:37.440 each other and it's very complicated, bang, you get consciousness. Now, 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:41.960 it is clear our brains process a lot of information. 0:16:42.400 --> 0:16:45.560 If you do a search in textbooks or online, you'll 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:49.320 frequently encounter the stat that their brains have around one 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:53.160 hundred billion neurons in them and ten times as many 0:16:53.240 --> 0:16:57.960 glial cells. Neurons are like the processors in a computer system, 0:16:57.960 --> 0:17:01.320 and glial cells would be the support systems and insulators 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:05.120 for those processors. Anyway, those numbers have since come under 0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:09.639 some dispute. As an associate professor at Vanderbilt University named 0:17:09.760 --> 0:17:15.640 Susanna Herculano Husel. She explained that the old way of 0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:19.720 estimating how many neurons the brain had appeared to be 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:23.240 based on taking slices of the brain, estimating the number 0:17:23.240 --> 0:17:26.320 of neurons in that slice, and then kind of extrapolating 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:29.320 that number to apply across the brain in general. But 0:17:29.440 --> 0:17:32.800 that ignores stuff like the density of cells and the 0:17:32.800 --> 0:17:35.960 distribution of the cells across the brain. So what she did, 0:17:36.640 --> 0:17:40.360 and this also falls into the category of Halloween horror stories, 0:17:40.880 --> 0:17:44.159 is she took a brain and she freaking dissolved it. 0:17:44.960 --> 0:17:48.280 She could then get account of the neuron nuclei that 0:17:48.440 --> 0:17:53.600 was in the soupy mix. By her accounting, the brain 0:17:53.680 --> 0:17:58.000 has closer to eighty six billion neurons and just as 0:17:58.000 --> 0:18:01.280 many glial cells. Still a lot of cells, mind you, 0:18:01.359 --> 0:18:02.720 But you got to admit it's a bit of a 0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:07.160 blow to lose fourteen billion neurons overnight. Still, we're talking 0:18:07.160 --> 0:18:12.480 about billions of neurons that interconnect through an incredibly complex 0:18:12.520 --> 0:18:15.880 system in our brains, with different regions of the brain 0:18:15.960 --> 0:18:19.360 handling different things, and so, yeah, we're processing a lot 0:18:19.359 --> 0:18:22.720 of information all the time, and we do happen to 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:26.439 be conscious. So could it be possible that with a 0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:30.280 sufficiently powerful computer system, perhaps made up of hundreds or 0:18:30.520 --> 0:18:34.720 thousands or tens of thousands of individual computers, each with 0:18:34.960 --> 0:18:38.280 hundreds of processors, that you could end up with an 0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:42.439 emergent consciousness, Or, as some people have proposed, could the 0:18:42.560 --> 0:18:46.240 Internet itself become conscious due to the fact that it 0:18:46.320 --> 0:18:50.040 is an enormous system of interconnected nodes that is pushing 0:18:50.040 --> 0:18:55.960 around incredible amounts of information. Well, maybe maybe it's possible. 0:18:56.480 --> 0:19:00.360 But here's the kicker. This theory doesn't actually explain the 0:19:00.400 --> 0:19:05.640 mechanism by which the consciousness emerges. See, it's one thing 0:19:05.720 --> 0:19:10.080 to process information, it's another thing to be aware of 0:19:10.119 --> 0:19:13.520 that experience. So when I perceive a color, I'm not 0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:18.600 just perceiving a color. I'm aware that I'm experiencing that color. 0:19:19.000 --> 0:19:21.080 Or to put it in another way, I can relate 0:19:21.200 --> 0:19:23.960 something to how it makes me feel, or some other 0:19:24.119 --> 0:19:28.400 subjective experience that is personal to me. So a machine 0:19:28.520 --> 0:19:32.320 might objectively be able to return data about stuff like 0:19:32.800 --> 0:19:35.080 what is a color of a piece of paper? It 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:38.040 analyzes the light that's being reflected off that piece of paper, 0:19:38.240 --> 0:19:40.879 it compares that light to a spectrum of colors. But 0:19:40.920 --> 0:19:43.280 that's still not the same thing as having the subjective 0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:47.159 experience of perceiving the color. And there may well be 0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:50.960 some connection between the complexity of the interconnected neurons in 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:53.960 our brains and the amount of information that we're processing 0:19:54.480 --> 0:19:58.800 and our sense of consciousness, but the theory doesn't actually 0:19:58.840 --> 0:20:02.840 explain what that connection is. It's more like saying, hey, 0:20:03.400 --> 0:20:07.840 maybe this thing we have, this consciousness experience, is also 0:20:07.960 --> 0:20:11.960 linked to this other thing, without actually making the link 0:20:12.000 --> 0:20:15.400 between the two. It appears to be correlative, but not 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:20.280 necessarily causal to relate that to our personal experience. Imagine 0:20:20.320 --> 0:20:24.119 that you've just poofed into existence. You have no prior 0:20:24.200 --> 0:20:27.679 knowledge of the world, or the physics in that world, 0:20:27.800 --> 0:20:31.280 or basic stuff like that, so you're drawing conclusions about 0:20:31.280 --> 0:20:35.360 the world around you based solely on your observations as 0:20:35.400 --> 0:20:38.320 you wander around and do stuff. And at one point 0:20:38.720 --> 0:20:42.199 you see an interesting looking rock on the path, so 0:20:42.240 --> 0:20:44.199 you bend over and you pick up the rock, and 0:20:44.280 --> 0:20:47.480 when you do, it starts to rain, and you think, well, 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:50.199 maybe I caused it to rain because I picked up 0:20:50.240 --> 0:20:53.240 this rock. And maybe it happens a few times where 0:20:53.280 --> 0:20:55.280 you pick up a rock and it starts to rain, 0:20:55.600 --> 0:20:58.600 which seems to support your thesis. But does that mean 0:20:58.680 --> 0:21:02.879 you're actually causing the effects that you are observing? If so, 0:21:03.440 --> 0:21:07.199 what is it about picking up the rock that's making 0:21:07.240 --> 0:21:11.000 it rain? Now, even in this absurd case that I'm making, 0:21:11.440 --> 0:21:14.320 you could argue that if there's never an instance in 0:21:14.359 --> 0:21:17.400 which picking up the rock wasn't immediately followed by rain, 0:21:17.880 --> 0:21:20.479 there's a lot of evidence to suggest the two are linked, 0:21:20.840 --> 0:21:24.040 but you still can't explain why they are linked, why 0:21:24.080 --> 0:21:27.639 does one cause the other? And that's a problem because 0:21:27.880 --> 0:21:31.840 without that piece, you're never really totally sure that you're 0:21:31.840 --> 0:21:34.960 on the right track. That's kind of where we are 0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:38.120 with consciousness. We've got a lot of ideas about what 0:21:38.200 --> 0:21:41.480 makes it happen, but those ideas are mostly missing key 0:21:41.520 --> 0:21:46.520 pieces that explain why it's happening. Now, it's possible that 0:21:46.600 --> 0:21:50.280 we cannot reduce consciousness any further than we already have, 0:21:50.840 --> 0:21:53.520 and maybe that means we never really get a handle 0:21:53.600 --> 0:21:56.320 on what makes it happen. It's also possible that we 0:21:56.359 --> 0:22:00.680 could facilitate the emergence of consciousness and machines without knowing 0:22:01.080 --> 0:22:04.800 how we did it. Essentially, that would be like stumbling 0:22:04.880 --> 0:22:08.399 upon the phenomenon by luck. We just happened to create 0:22:08.440 --> 0:22:12.080 the conditions necessary to allow some form of artificial consciousness 0:22:12.080 --> 0:22:15.439 to emerge. Now, I think this might be possible, but 0:22:15.480 --> 0:22:18.520 it strikes me as a long shot. I think of 0:22:18.560 --> 0:22:21.520 it like being locked in a dark warehouse filled with 0:22:21.680 --> 0:22:25.280 every mechanical part you can imagine, and you start trying 0:22:25.359 --> 0:22:28.159 to put things together in complete darkness, and then the 0:22:28.240 --> 0:22:30.480 lights come on and you see that you have created 0:22:30.520 --> 0:22:34.359 a perfect replica of an F fifteen fighter jet. Is 0:22:34.400 --> 0:22:38.879 that possible? Well, I mean, yeah, I guess, but it 0:22:38.920 --> 0:22:43.760 seems overwhelmingly unlikely. But again, this is based off ignorance. 0:22:44.000 --> 0:22:46.399 It's based off the fact that it hasn't happened yet, 0:22:46.720 --> 0:22:50.800 so I could be totally wrong here. Now, on the 0:22:50.800 --> 0:22:55.320 flip side of that, programmers, engineers, and scientists have created 0:22:55.400 --> 0:22:59.159 computer systems that can process information in intricate ways to 0:22:59.160 --> 0:23:02.040 come up with solutions to problems that seem, at least 0:23:02.080 --> 0:23:05.600 at first glance, to be similar to how we humans think. 0:23:05.960 --> 0:23:09.440 We even have names for systems that reflect biological systems, 0:23:09.480 --> 0:23:13.239 like artificial neural networks. Now, the name might make it 0:23:13.320 --> 0:23:18.040 sound like it's a robot brain, but it's not quite that. Instead, 0:23:18.320 --> 0:23:20.879 it's a model for computing in which components in the 0:23:20.920 --> 0:23:25.280 system act kind of like neurons. They're interconnected and each 0:23:25.359 --> 0:23:29.320 one does a specific process. The nodes in the computer 0:23:29.400 --> 0:23:33.159 system connect to other nodes. So you feed the system 0:23:33.240 --> 0:23:36.520 input whatever it is you want to process, and then 0:23:36.680 --> 0:23:40.320 the nodes that accept that input perform some form of 0:23:40.359 --> 0:23:44.840 operation on it and then send that resulting data the 0:23:45.600 --> 0:23:50.439 answer after they've processed this information onto other nodes in 0:23:50.480 --> 0:23:53.840 the network. It's a non linear approach to computing, and 0:23:53.880 --> 0:23:57.600 by adjusting the processes each node performs. This is also 0:23:58.119 --> 0:24:01.440 known as adjusting the weight of the nodes, you can 0:24:01.480 --> 0:24:04.840 tweak the outcomes. Now, this is incredibly useful. If you 0:24:04.960 --> 0:24:08.520 already know the outcome you want, you can tweak the 0:24:08.560 --> 0:24:12.199 system so that it learns or is trained to recognize 0:24:12.200 --> 0:24:16.760 something specific. For example, you could train a computer system 0:24:16.800 --> 0:24:20.159 to recognize faces, so you would feed it images. Some 0:24:20.200 --> 0:24:22.760 of the images would have faces in them, some would 0:24:22.760 --> 0:24:25.639 not have faces in them. Some might have something that 0:24:25.760 --> 0:24:27.680 could be a face, but it's hard to tell. Maybe 0:24:27.720 --> 0:24:30.919 it's a shape in a picture. That looks kind of 0:24:30.960 --> 0:24:33.960 like a face, but it's not actually someone's face. Anyway. 0:24:34.000 --> 0:24:36.879 You train the computer model to try and separate the 0:24:36.960 --> 0:24:40.600 faces from the non faces, and it might take many 0:24:40.680 --> 0:24:43.800 iterations to get the model trained up using your starting 0:24:43.880 --> 0:24:47.159 data your training data. Now, once you do have your 0:24:47.160 --> 0:24:49.600 computer model trained up, you've tweaked all the nodes so 0:24:49.680 --> 0:24:54.040 that it is reliably producing results that say, yes, this 0:24:54.160 --> 0:24:56.800 is a face or no, this isn't. You can now 0:24:56.920 --> 0:25:00.760 feed that same computer model brand new images that it 0:25:00.800 --> 0:25:04.480 has never seen before, and it can perform the same functions. 0:25:04.800 --> 0:25:08.520 You have taught the computer model how to do something. 0:25:08.880 --> 0:25:12.880 But this isn't like spontaneous intelligence, and it's not connected 0:25:12.920 --> 0:25:16.880 to consciousness. You couldn't really call it thinking so much 0:25:16.880 --> 0:25:21.880 as just being trained to recognize specific patterns pretty well. Now, 0:25:21.920 --> 0:25:25.119 that's just one example of putting an artificial neural network 0:25:25.160 --> 0:25:28.199 to use. There are lots of others, and there are 0:25:28.200 --> 0:25:33.480 also systems like IBM's Watson, which also appears at casual 0:25:33.520 --> 0:25:36.960 glance to think. This was helped in no small part 0:25:37.080 --> 0:25:40.720 by the very public display of Watson competing on special 0:25:40.800 --> 0:25:44.119