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Speaker 1: Welcome to Is this great game or what? And our

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Speaker 1: special guest today is Joe West, who umpired more games

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Speaker 1: than any umpire in the history of baseball. Joe, welcome

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Speaker 1: to the show. This is my son, jeff He used

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Speaker 1: to be an umpire.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I bet he was a good one too, because

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Speaker 2: if he knows the rules as well as you do,

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Speaker 2: he did the good.

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Speaker 1: Job, you know, Joe, I learned.

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Speaker 3: I learned the infield fly rule situations before I learned

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Speaker 3: my ABCS matter.

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Speaker 1: So, Joe, the first game that Jeffrey ever umpired, he's

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Speaker 1: like fifteen or so, and he's the base umpire and

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Speaker 1: there's a runner on first base and there's a pop

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Speaker 1: up to the second basement and the fans standing right

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Speaker 1: behind me screams out loud, it's an infield fly rule.

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Speaker 3: Ump you got the call wrong.

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Speaker 1: That's the field fly rule. So I turned around to

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Speaker 1: look it at him, and he looks at me, Joe,

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Speaker 1: and he recognizes me, and he goes, oh, oh, you're

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Speaker 1: the baseball guy. That's an infield fly rule. And I said, no,

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Speaker 1: it's not. And that's my son, and the guy like

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Speaker 1: slinked away. This this is standard in the umpiring business.

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Speaker 2: Correct, Joe, Well, yeah, I can remember. There was a

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Speaker 2: play in San Francisco one time and there was a

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Speaker 2: bunt in the air, and uh, they didn't they didn't

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Speaker 2: call it infield fly because it's not. And so when

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Speaker 2: they didn't catch the ball, they threw the ball to

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Speaker 2: third base to try to retire the runner, and of

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Speaker 2: course the third base is stretched out, you know, and

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Speaker 2: the guy's out right because it's not an infield fly, right, Okay.

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Speaker 2: So we had another play in San Diego years years

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Speaker 2: prior to this, and Ed Rungky was in the press

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Speaker 2: box the old retired on fire from the American League,

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Speaker 2: and it was a pop fly behind shortstop and Pat

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Speaker 2: Rocket went out and called the ball and it was

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Speaker 2: it wasn't infield fly, even though it was in the outfield,

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Speaker 2: and so I called the infield fly. When they threw

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Speaker 2: the ball to third base to Bob Horner, he again

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Speaker 2: stretched out to catch the ball, and when he caught

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Speaker 2: the ball, I called the guy safe because he didn't

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Speaker 2: tag him because the hitter was already retired. Now he

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Speaker 2: had to tag him right. Well, the Braids went crazy

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Speaker 2: until I explained it to him, and then they went

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Speaker 2: back in the day but ed Rungky had the time

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Speaker 2: of his life in the press box telling them the

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Speaker 2: rule about the infield fly because he was in the

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Speaker 2: press box at the time. So I made ed Rongky's

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Speaker 2: day there.

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Speaker 3: Joe, I worked for Single A, the Frederick Keys. I

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Speaker 3: was an intern for them, right, and I worked in

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Speaker 3: the press box. And these are professional baseball players. A

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Speaker 3: infield fly was dropped with the loaded and no outs,

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Speaker 3: so obviously in phil fly rule you call one out.

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Speaker 3: The runner on third since it was dropped, thinks, oh crap,

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Speaker 3: I have to go home. A triple play ends the

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Speaker 3: inning for the Keys. They're the ones on the bases.

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Speaker 3: Ryan minor Is, the manager, comes storming out, says, what

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Speaker 3: is going on? Why are my players running triple play

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Speaker 3: have the chance to score many runs in this inning?

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Speaker 3: And they brought me into the broadcast booth because even

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Speaker 3: the broadcasters were like a little bit lost the news

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Speaker 3: because nobody needed to run, but everybody started running. A

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Speaker 3: triple play ends the inning and they end up losing

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Speaker 3: the game by two runs. So these are the things

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Speaker 3: that even some of our players, and we don't need

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Speaker 3: to get into this, but some of our players don't

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Speaker 3: even know the Rules of the Game.

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Speaker 2: I was working with Ed Rabiano and San Francisco and

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Speaker 2: Joe Morgan and John Miller, I think used to do

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Speaker 2: that Sunday Night baseball, right, And there was a ground

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Speaker 2: ball hit to the third baseman and he looked at

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Speaker 2: second base to try to get the first out, and

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Speaker 2: he realized he couldn't get the guy because he was running,

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Speaker 2: so he turned immediately and through the first and when

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Speaker 2: he threw the ball away, the umpires awarded the runner

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Speaker 2: going in the second third base, and they awarded the

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Speaker 2: batter runner second, which is correct. Well, Sooshia came out

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Speaker 2: to argue because he was managing the a's at the time,

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Speaker 2: and he was arguing that his base runner had touched

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Speaker 2: second base before he threw the ball the first okay, right, Well,

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Speaker 2: had it been the second play by an infielder, that

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Speaker 2: would have been correct. But the first play by the

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Speaker 2: infielder is what governs this in this case. So Joe

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Speaker 2: Morgan is trying to explain this on the air and

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Speaker 2: he can't figure out. He says, you know, he was

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Speaker 2: on second base, but I know it's not right. He

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Speaker 2: doesn't get the right to score here. And he's trying

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Speaker 2: to explain to them it and ed ed Rappiano looks

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Speaker 2: up for him his fourk aposta and he says, it's

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Speaker 2: the first throw by infielder. How tough is it? So

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Speaker 2: they end up getting another out, And I called Joe

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Speaker 2: on his cell phone and he said, tell me what

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Speaker 2: I'm missing. I said, it's the first play by an infielder.

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Speaker 2: He says, I knew it. I knew it, but I

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Speaker 2: just couldn't remember how to explain it. He goes back

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Speaker 2: on the air when they come back from the commercial.

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Speaker 2: He explained, my good friend Joe West called and told

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Speaker 2: me what was wrong.

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Speaker 1: But Joe, Jeff is right. You constantly, as an umpire

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Speaker 1: all those years, had to explain to players and to

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Speaker 1: managers being critical, what the rules of the game are,

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Speaker 1: because they are difficult at times.

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Speaker 2: Greed absolutely, yeah, absolutely. I can remember when I first

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Speaker 2: started amateur umpiring, the guy would the picture would throw

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Speaker 2: the ball the first base and throw it away. But

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Speaker 2: when he threw the ball from the rubber, it was

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Speaker 2: only one base. And if he was off the rubber,

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Speaker 2: if he stepped off and threw it away, it's two bases.

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Speaker 2: Because that's the rules. Anyways. Just little things like that

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Speaker 2: they really don't understand, and they don't know. We had

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Speaker 2: to play in Dodger Stadium one time and Jeff Bagwell

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Speaker 2: was playing first base and Bizio is playing second, and

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Speaker 2: the runner on first was Mondescy. So they hit a

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Speaker 2: line drive past Bagwell, who's holding Monday on. But when

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Speaker 2: Mondessey took off to go to second base, the ball

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Speaker 2: hit him. But since he's passed Bagwell and Bigio is

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Speaker 2: going to cover second base, he's not out because there

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Speaker 2: has to be another field or behind him who could

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Speaker 2: have caught the ball. So Montessy goes into second base.

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Speaker 2: The second base some part, not thinking that it. Bagwell's

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Speaker 2: in front of Montsea calls mondess out. Montassy is going

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Speaker 2: to leave the field. I come over with Jim quick.

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Speaker 2: We correct it got good segment everybody. Of course, the

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Speaker 2: astros had to fit because they saw the ball hitting.

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Speaker 2: You know, Larry Dirker is still talking about this to

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Speaker 2: this day, and when I explained the rule, he said,

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Speaker 2: you know, I agree with the rule, but I don't

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Speaker 2: agree with what you call it. Well, that is the rule.

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Speaker 2: You know. Vince Scully murdered us because he didn't know

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Speaker 2: the rule. And the next day when we explained it

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Speaker 2: to him. He went on the air and apologized for

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Speaker 2: like five minutes. Tell him right, the umpires were right there.

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Speaker 2: But I mean little things like that people don't really understand.

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Speaker 2: And when you have a play that's as complicated as

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Speaker 2: that simple play was, the umpires don't have a chance

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Speaker 2: to really look around and see where everybody was, and

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Speaker 2: so more times than not they missed that play because

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Speaker 2: they didn't know where the fielders were.

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Speaker 1: Joe. A simple play is the difference between obstruction and interference,

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Speaker 1: and people get it wrong all the time. Jeffrey Kirchen

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Speaker 1: used to just still does calls me every once in

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Speaker 1: a while and said, they called it obstruction, it's interference,

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Speaker 1: it's not. Yes, So would you just for our listeners,

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Speaker 1: our viewers, would you just explain the difference between the

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Speaker 1: two in as simple terms as you already have.

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Speaker 2: Well, Obstruction, you have to realize the defense has to

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Speaker 2: obstruct the runner from going to the next space. Interference

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Speaker 2: is one the offensive player has caused the defensive player

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Speaker 2: to miss the ball or to make an error because

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Speaker 2: of his actions. So it's completely opposite. It determines us

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Speaker 2: who's on the offense, who's on the defense, whether it's

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Speaker 2: obstruction or interference. That's about as simple as you can

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Speaker 2: make it. But I mean there's a lot lot of

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Speaker 2: things that happened out there. I mean, one, you know,

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Speaker 2: I can remember stuff like box. You know, they the

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Speaker 2: National League when I was coming up, was big on

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Speaker 2: calling box because they had Kurt Flood, they had even

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Speaker 2: later in that, they had Willie McGee. They had all

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Speaker 2: these base dealers, and the American League wasn't as big

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Speaker 2: on calling box as the Nationally was. And I can

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Speaker 2: remember when when Vida Blue got traded to the Giants

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Speaker 2: and the first time he stepped to throw the first

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Speaker 2: base he stepped right toward home plate and four different

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Speaker 2: umpires called it a balk and he looked around like

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Speaker 2: like and hey, went okay, that was it because he'd

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Speaker 2: never had a bark called on him. And that's not

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Speaker 2: to pick on the one umpire staff for the other.

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Speaker 2: In fact, I think it's good that they put the

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Speaker 2: umpires all under the same umbrellas, so they were all

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Speaker 2: trying to do the same thing. But the point, the

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Speaker 2: point being is you have to be consistent and you

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Speaker 2: go back over things like okay, let's do the strike zone.

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Speaker 2: Well we had. I worked with Lee Wire and if

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Speaker 2: the ball was in the air and between the dugouts,

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Speaker 2: it was a strike. And I worked with Dutch Renter

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Speaker 2: and he had a posted stamp strike. So the players

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Speaker 2: knew what their strike zone was, so they adjusted accordingly.

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Speaker 2: But it wasn't until they brought in the zone evaluation

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Speaker 2: stuff that the umpires are trying to all call the

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Speaker 2: exact same strike zone. I mean, it was, and that's

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Speaker 2: that's the way it's been for years. I mean, they're

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Speaker 2: still complaining about Don Larson's last pitch in the World Series,

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Speaker 2: but I mean, and they'll be I remember Bruce Framing

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Speaker 2: had a game with Milk Pappas where a three to

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Speaker 2: two pitch he called ball four and Papas had a

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Speaker 2: fit because he had a perfect game. So after the

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Speaker 2: game that reporters come by Bruce's locker room. They said,

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Speaker 2: you know, if you'd call that a strike, you'd have

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Speaker 2: been like the thirteenth umpire. I have a perfect game.

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Speaker 2: And Bruce said, can you name another one? And they couldn't,

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Speaker 2: And so it was it was just those kind of

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Speaker 2: little things happen, and they follow you around, I mean,

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Speaker 2: and I told a story to your son just before

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Speaker 2: we got on the air about John Box who you

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Speaker 2: know and who your brother knew. I think your brother

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Speaker 2: played with him or played against him or something. And

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Speaker 2: he said something about me being controversial. I said, I'm

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Speaker 2: not controversial. I'm either right or I'm wrong. There's no

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Speaker 2: controversy in what we do. And I think Yogi Berra

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Speaker 2: said it best in his movie that they just put

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Speaker 2: out in the last year or so, there's no pressure

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Speaker 2: in baseball, Precious one. They're shooting at you on the

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Speaker 2: beach at Normandy, that's pressure. That there's really no pressure

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Speaker 2: in baseball. You go out and you do what you've

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Speaker 2: been taught all your life, right. And I think I've

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Speaker 2: always said this to any young umpire that comes up

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Speaker 2: to work with me or other umpires, I always tell

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Speaker 2: them you have three responsibilities. And your first responsibilities to

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Speaker 2: the game of baseball. But that doesn't mean the Commissioner's office.

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Speaker 2: That means the game of baseball itself. Your second responsibility

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Speaker 2: is to your profession, and that might not mean the Union,

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Speaker 2: it means the profession itself. And your third responsibilities do

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Speaker 2: what you know is morally honest and correct in your heart.

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Speaker 2: And if you do those three things in that order,

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Speaker 2: Nothing you do will be wrong. You'll be criticized for it,

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Speaker 2: because you've got to realize half the people don't like

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Speaker 2: what you called anyone. But if you do those three

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Speaker 2: things in that order, nothing you do will be.

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Speaker 1: Wrong, right, Jeff. When I did a story on Joe

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Speaker 1: several years ago for ESPN, Joe told me I have

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Speaker 1: never missed a call. That's what he said, and I

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Speaker 1: loved out loud. But Joe, explain what you meant by that?

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Speaker 2: Well, I was out there for all of them. The

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Speaker 2: first time I ever used that line was on Dick

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Speaker 2: Williams in Montreal. How long ago was that? He came

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Speaker 2: out and he said, he said, just tell me you

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Speaker 2: missed it and I'll go away. I said, I've been

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Speaker 2: here four years and I've never missed one. He said,

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Speaker 2: you can't be that arrogant. I said, that's not arrogant.

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Speaker 2: I've been I don't call them all right, but I've

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Speaker 2: been out here for all of us. I've never missed.

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Speaker 1: One that Joe, would you explain again? That explain the

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Speaker 1: circumstances where the Bass is not an island of safety.

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Speaker 1: Most people think the base is an island of safety.

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Speaker 1: Could you explain that for our listeners and our viewers.

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Speaker 2: Well, if you're forced to vacate it by the batter

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Speaker 2: becoming a runner, you're not safe, right, And the only

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Speaker 2: time you would be safe is if it's an infield

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Speaker 2: fly and you're doing everything you can to get out

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Speaker 2: of way to the fielders and it comes down and

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Speaker 2: hits you on the base. That would be the only

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Speaker 2: time it's a safe haven. The base is the base

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Speaker 2: is anybody's until you get to it when it's your

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Speaker 2: turn to get there. So I guess that's the best

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Speaker 2: way to explain. But when the batter becomes a runner,

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Speaker 2: then you have to vacate the base if you are

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Speaker 2: forced to leave the base.

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Speaker 3: Right, So, Joe, I have a question. So you called

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Speaker 3: numerous World Series games very I mean, I believe you

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Speaker 3: called a perfect game, right. I think you called a

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Speaker 3: no hitter for Nolan Ryan, if I'm not mistaken. So

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Speaker 3: You've been around for quite a bit and had some

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Speaker 3: incredible experiences, and I don't want this to be controversial.

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Speaker 3: This is not what the show is about. So I'm

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Speaker 3: going to go the other way around and say, was

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Speaker 3: there ever a manager? Because this happened to me in

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Speaker 3: Little league. Was there ever a manager that came to

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Speaker 3: you and said, Joe, throw me out. Oh he asked

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Speaker 3: to be thrown out? And is there a story that

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Speaker 3: you want to tell us about that?

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Speaker 2: Well, one of them was Terry Collins. He was in

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Speaker 2: a fight. They were breaking up a beanball instant. He

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Speaker 2: got cut really bad, and he said, I hate to

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Speaker 2: ask you to do this, but I need to get

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Speaker 2: kicked out of here, because first of all, I'm not

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Speaker 2: going to be able to continue like I am. And

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Speaker 2: second of all, It'll make it look like to my

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Speaker 2: players that I'm taking up for him. So we kicked

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Speaker 2: him out, you know, I mean Tony Gwinn the first

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Speaker 2: time he was ever kicked out. He said, if you

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Speaker 2: think that was a strike, you're going to have to

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Speaker 2: kick me out. I said, okay, goodbye.

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Speaker 1: And Aaron Boone. As you know, Joe got thrown out

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Speaker 1: in the first major league game that he ever played.

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Speaker 1: He was out he called out at the plate. I

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Speaker 1: think he was pinch running and he got called out

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Speaker 1: at the plate, threw his helmet down and got chunked.

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Speaker 1: After the game, I mean, that must to happen to you.

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Speaker 1: Somebody making a major league debut or somebody you didn't

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Speaker 1: even know, and you threw him out of the game. Agreed.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if it was their major league debut.

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Speaker 2: I mean I had some major league debuts that were

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Speaker 2: very interesting. One of them was Greg Maddox. They put

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Speaker 2: him in as a pinch rudder and then brought him

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Speaker 2: into pitch. Probably the most famous first game I ever

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Speaker 2: had was Dwight Gooden was he was borderlined with Frank

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Speaker 2: Cashing as the whether they were going to bring him

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Speaker 2: to the big leagues, and Davy Johnson said, if this

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Speaker 2: kid doesn't go with the big leagues, I'm not going either.

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Speaker 2: And he's the manager. So they don't start him in

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Speaker 2: New York at Chase stating for the opener. They wave

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Speaker 2: to that series over and they started him in Houston

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Speaker 2: against the Astros and Davy comes out, hands me the

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Speaker 2: lineup cards and I'm working on the plate and he says,

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Speaker 2: take care of my kid today. After his first game

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Speaker 2: at the big leagues. I don't think anything of it.

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Speaker 2: And this wiry, skinny kid goes out to the mountain.

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Speaker 2: I think somebody got a hit on him in the

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Speaker 2: first animent. The other three guys he just blew them away,

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Speaker 2: and normally, when you're the plate umpire, when the inning's over,

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Speaker 2: you walk up the baseline of the team that's coming

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Speaker 2: on the field. Well, after this exhibition of what Gooden did,

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Speaker 2: I didn't walk that way. I walked over to the

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Speaker 2: third base dug out to Davy Johnson. I said, this

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Speaker 2: kid don't need my help. So but yeah, I've seen

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Speaker 2: a lot of people come and go. You know, I

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Speaker 2: had when I was in the minor leagues. I had

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Speaker 2: an exhibition game with Carl you Strimsky, and now I

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Speaker 2: knew it was time to retire when his grandson's playing

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Speaker 2: for the Giants. So so uh the first base coach

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Speaker 2: for the Giants, the grandson's on first base, and the

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Speaker 2: first base coach looked at me and he says, who'd

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Speaker 2: you like better, Carler? I think his name's Mike, Yes, Mike,

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Speaker 2: who'd you like better, Carlo? Mike, I said, Well, Carl

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Speaker 2: was kind of grumpy. Mike turned around and said, he still

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Speaker 2: is that.

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Speaker 1: Joe, could you clear up for people who think there

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Speaker 1: is something in the rule book that a tie goes

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Speaker 1: to the runner. This is something we talked about when

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Speaker 1: we were five years old, and there are big leaguers

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Speaker 1: who still believe it, would you explain that.

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Speaker 2: The tie only goes to the guy that forgot to

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Speaker 2: wear one to a formal dinner. That's the best way

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Speaker 2: to explain it. That's where the tie goes. There's no

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Speaker 2: such thing as a tie in baseball.

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Speaker 1: Sorry, but Joe, people must.

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Speaker 2: The only time I've ever seen a tie was in

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Speaker 2: the the All Star Game in Milwaukee when they called

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Speaker 2: it all Both managers had run out of pictures, not

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Speaker 2: paying attention to what was going on.

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Speaker 1: But along the way, players managers must must have said

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Speaker 1: to you, at some point, ty goes to the runner.

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Speaker 1: Correct on the big league level.

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Speaker 2: No, not at the good No, No, I never heard

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Speaker 2: that of the big league level. But it's it's funny

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Speaker 2: because that's just a myth, you know. And the crazy

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Speaker 2: thing is you got to realize. I help negotiate the

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Speaker 2: replay system, and Baseball spent forty five million dollars proven

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Speaker 2: to the rest of the world that were ninety nine

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Speaker 2: points six percent right on the basis instead of putting

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Speaker 2: money in the umpire development program where you could afford

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Speaker 2: to keep kids for three four years till they learned

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Speaker 2: how to umpire. They don't pay them enough money to

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Speaker 2: develop umpires they can't afford to umpire down there for

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Speaker 2: four or five, sometimes ten years. I think this lady

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Speaker 2: umpire that just worked yesterday, over the weekend and over

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Speaker 2: the weekend, I think she was in the minor leagues

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Speaker 2: for ten years. And that's a hard road to hope

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Speaker 2: because you don't make any money. I think the highest

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Speaker 2: paid umpire down there is less than thirty thousand dollars.

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Speaker 2: You can't live on that.

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Speaker 1: So Joe Jen Powell apparently did a pretty good job

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Speaker 1: calling balls and strikes. I've said that the average fan

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Speaker 1: wouldn't last five pitches behind home plate before they say,

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Speaker 1: get me out of here. This is too difficult, this

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Speaker 1: is too scary, this is too dangerous. I found the

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Speaker 1: most impressive part about her, and I would about any umpire,

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Speaker 1: male or female, is the courage it takes to get

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Speaker 1: behind the plate when somebody's throwing one hundred miles an hour.

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Speaker 1: Am I overstating this or am I correct well.

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Speaker 2: From a novice standpoint, and I'm not calling you a

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Speaker 2: novice by any means. I would say that's correct. But

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Speaker 2: once you learn how to call balls and stripes, the

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Speaker 2: harder they throw it the easier it is. The fastball

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Speaker 2: levels out the tough pitches, the call of the breaking pitches,

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Speaker 2: the ones at the knees going to the corner. The knuckleball,

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Speaker 2: I mean, the knuckleball is so hard to call. The

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Speaker 2: machine that grades us can't call it. Really, I'm serious.

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Speaker 2: The machine that grades the umpires cannot call a knuckleball.

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Speaker 1: So, Joe, when you had Charlie Huff or Phil Nicro

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Speaker 1: or somebody did that, was was that your hardest day?

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Speaker 1: No matter what, no matter if a knuckleballer had a

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Speaker 1: great one that day.

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Speaker 2: My first game behind the plate in the big leagues,

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Speaker 2: I had walking and new harm and Phil Necro. Oh boy, yeah,

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Speaker 2: So I had a flamethrower on one side and the

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Speaker 2: guy throwing butterflies from the other side. And so years later,

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Speaker 2: of course Nicro said, you know, you worked the great

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Speaker 2: that game, your first game. That was a great game.

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Speaker 2: I don't think you missed but one pitch. I said, well,

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Speaker 2: that's very kind of you. And what was that? He said,

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Speaker 2: the knuckleball.

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Speaker 1: It's incredible, that's joy clever. That's pretty good.

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Speaker 3: So along obviously with the relationship with a pitcher, something

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Speaker 3: I always valued in my once again, tiny, tiny in

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Speaker 3: comparison to what you did as an umpire was the

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Speaker 3: relationship with a catcher. Now, I'm not asking who's your

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Speaker 3: favorite catcher to work with, because that is not the

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Speaker 3: right question to ask. But for you spending all these

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Speaker 3: years in the league, who was a catcher that was

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Speaker 3: nothing but respectful to umpires you felt safe behind, that

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Speaker 3: had the skill to you said, I'm gonna be I'm

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Speaker 3: gonna be very comfortable back here because I got whoever

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Speaker 3: it is in front of me.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's kind of kind of counterproductive to say who

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Speaker 2: is the best catcher, because probably the best catcher that

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Speaker 2: I worked was Bench. But Bench had broad shoulders, he

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Speaker 2: had a size of eight helmet, and if he didn't

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Speaker 2: hit right behind the plate, you couldn't see anything. And

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Speaker 2: at the same time, when I came up, the Dodgers

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Speaker 2: had just taken Jerry Grody away away from the Mets,

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Speaker 2: and Jerry Grody might have been the best defensive catcher

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Speaker 2: for showing the umpire the pitches. I mean, if he

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Speaker 2: moved inside, he was almost on the ground. With Benito Santiago,

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Speaker 2: he had the san Ghien with the Pirates. These kind

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Speaker 2: of catchers would let you see the pitches. Bench was

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Speaker 2: hard to umpire behind because and he actually created what

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Speaker 2: they call framing, holding the pitch out in front of him,

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Speaker 2: because he knew that if he caught like Yogi Berra did,

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Speaker 2: you'd never see anything. Because Joja used to catch the

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Speaker 2: ball inside like that, but Bench used like a glove

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Speaker 2: that was almost like a first base was mitt and

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Speaker 2: he held it out in front of him and catched

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Speaker 2: the ball. And so he's really the one that created

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Speaker 2: what they call today the framing of the pitches, and

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Speaker 2: it makes it it makes a big difference if you

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Speaker 2: don't let the umpire see the pitch, you know it's

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Speaker 2: it's It's a tough enough game as it is, but

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Speaker 2: I would say that Bench did more for catching than

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Speaker 2: anybody did. And the only reason Grody's not in his

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Speaker 2: categories because Grody certainly couldn't hit with you. They could

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Speaker 2: both get rid of the ball really quickly. In fact,

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Speaker 2: one day we're in Cincinnati and Phil Garner is on

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Speaker 2: first base for the Pirates and there's a ball in

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Speaker 2: the dirt and hits the Bench in the shoulder and

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Speaker 2: it gets away and Garner takes off for a second. Well,

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Speaker 2: Joe Morgan's covering the bag and tells Garner to stand up,

429
00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:00,640
Speaker 2: and Bench got to the ball and threw him ount

430
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:05,719
Speaker 2: and Morgan caught the ball but refused to tag him

431
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 2: because he told him to stand up. Now concept she

432
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:15,440
Speaker 2: own's yelling at him. Garner's yelling at him because he

433
00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:17,520
Speaker 2: told him to stand up. Bench is yelling at him.

434
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:20,719
Speaker 2: The picture's yelling at him. And Joe just looked at

435
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:25,399
Speaker 2: me and rolled his eyes. And I'm laughing because I

436
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 2: know what happened and they don't know what happened. Right,

437
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:32,159
Speaker 2: So a couple of years later I asked him about that,

438
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,200
Speaker 2: and he says, I should have just dropped the damn

439
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 2: ball because I told him to stand up. I wasn't

440
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:39,960
Speaker 2: going to tag him mount after I told him to

441
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 2: stand up. You may started that would be starting to

442
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 2: fight for no reason. But Bench diad he threw him out,

443
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:49,240
Speaker 2: and Morgan wouldn't tag him.

444
00:25:49,440 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 4: So so Joe, our good friend Eduardo Perez describe you

445
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:05,439
Speaker 4: as an umpire, as the biggest stickler on rules, and

446
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:07,440
Speaker 4: we're going to play by the rules here.

447
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,879
Speaker 1: And he said, Joe West is the judge that sends

448
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:15,159
Speaker 1: a good friend to prison for ten years because he

449
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,720
Speaker 1: broke the rules, and this is the sentence. But then

450
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:22,360
Speaker 1: Joe goes and picks the guy up at the prison

451
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: when the sentence has ended. Is that semi accurate from

452
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,120
Speaker 1: Eduardo about how you have done how you did your

453
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:35,119
Speaker 1: job for well over five thousand Major league games?

454
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:38,560
Speaker 2: Well, I think Edwardo's missing the point that if the

455
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,160
Speaker 2: guy went to jail for ten years, he didn't buy

456
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:45,120
Speaker 2: his share of rounds at the bar. So that's why

457
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 2: I would go pick him up. He's way behind Joe.

458
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:58,920
Speaker 1: You told me the story about Garth Brooks and Ed

459
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 1: Montague in a spring training game.

460
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:03,200
Speaker 2: Oh, that is hilarious.

461
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,480
Speaker 1: Just tell that story. As you know, Jeff, Joe is

462
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:11,360
Speaker 1: a great singer. He sang at the Grand Old Opry

463
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 1: in front of some pretty good people behind him. So

464
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:18,160
Speaker 1: he loves music. He knows music. But tell us when

465
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,640
Speaker 1: Garth Brooks will reach first base? What happened?

466
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 2: Well, Garth had been in spring training with the Padres

467
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 2: for years, not a lot of years, maybe three, and

468
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,720
Speaker 2: he'd never gotten in a game, and so Bochi finally

469
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,479
Speaker 2: put him in spring training game against the Cubs as

470
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:40,960
Speaker 2: a pinch runner. So he takes his lead off of

471
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 2: first base and left handed Pitcher picked him off and

472
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:48,120
Speaker 2: he's out from here the next week, and Montague called

473
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:53,479
Speaker 2: him safe. Of course, Mark Race, who taggedhim out, starts laughing.

474
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 2: Garth gets up and goes over and hugs Montague. The

475
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:03,960
Speaker 2: crowds going while everybody's laughing because everybody knew you that right.

476
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 2: So sure enough, after the game, the media goes down

477
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:11,440
Speaker 2: to talk to Ed Monague about calling Garth Brooks safe,

478
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,800
Speaker 2: and Money can say, Look, I can call out Mark Race,

479
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:18,400
Speaker 2: I can call out Barry Bonds. I can call out

480
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 2: any baseball player in the big leies. But if I

481
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:25,600
Speaker 2: call out Garth Brooks, I can't go home. So that

482
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:27,720
Speaker 2: was that was his comment.

483
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:31,119
Speaker 1: To the media because his wife loved Garth Brooks.

484
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 2: That's right.

485
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 1: Wow, it's so good. So Joe, tell us about the

486
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: story you umpires. You know, you go out to dinner

487
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 1: one night and it happens all the time, I'm sure.

488
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 1: Tell us about the steak dinner you ordered in Minneapolis

489
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: that night and you and the waiter and the other

490
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 1: people at the table.

491
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 2: Wow, that was I think that was when I worked

492
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 2: my five thousandth game and we go to dinner at

493
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:01,560
Speaker 2: this place called Manny's and there's a couple old friends

494
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 2: of mine that used to play football that were there.

495
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,560
Speaker 2: One of them was Paul Krause, who played for the Vikings,

496
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,440
Speaker 2: and one of them was Dave Gasper, who had moved

497
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:15,239
Speaker 2: up there sella's insurance stuff with Northwestern Mutual. And so

498
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 2: we all go to dinner at Manny's. And Manny's was

499
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 2: a big hangout for Marty Springstead, who was an old

500
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 2: umpire in American League and later become the supervisor for

501
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 2: the American League. And Marty had taken us all there

502
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 2: many times. And so we're sitting down for dinner and

503
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 2: they bring out these great, big, long menus, and the

504
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 2: menu they put in front of me had a spiral.

505
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 2: It was like a spiral ring notebook. And so I

506
00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 2: knew something was up, but I don't know. And I'm

507
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 2: looking around the room and I don't see anybody looking

508
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 2: at us. And so the waiter comes over and he's

509
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 2: gonna take everybody's order. And I opened my spiral ring

510
00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 2: notebook up and it's in Braille, so I didn't miss

511
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 2: a beat. I said, I'll have the I'm running my

512
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 2: finger across the thing. I said, I'll have the ribbon

513
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 2: meetium rare sweet potato baked, and so I did the

514
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 2: whole order. Just then they closed it up, and of

515
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,760
Speaker 2: course the entire weight staff is now watching and they

516
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 2: are laughing. But yeah, they bring the menus to me

517
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 2: and braille, And I tell you another funny story about braille.

518
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 2: My brother thought it was the funniest thing he ever saw.

519
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 2: That the sign in the locker room for the umpires

520
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,680
Speaker 2: at the ballpark at Camden Yards as a sign says

521
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 2: Umpire's locker room, and behind it it's written in braille.

522
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 2: He said, why would they do that? Joe?

523
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 1: Joe, I go past that room every time I go

524
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 1: to the ballpark, which is often. You're telling me I

525
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 1: need to look for a braille sign next to it.

526
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 2: Well, that's how how bad you are. You can't see

527
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 2: well enough to see the braille. That's really terrible that

528
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:09,960
Speaker 2: you can't see that. Well.

529
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:14,480
Speaker 1: Now I'm going to start to look for it. But Joe, seriously,

530
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,320
Speaker 1: this is the life of an umpire, right. No one

531
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 1: recognized you when you're any good. They only recognize when

532
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:24,160
Speaker 1: you get something wrong. How have you? How were you

533
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,200
Speaker 1: able to deal with that? For all the years that

534
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 1: you umpired that people didn't like you just because of

535
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:32,280
Speaker 1: who you are.

536
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 2: Well, I shouldn't say that.

537
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 1: They just don't like umpires and I don't understand.

538
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 2: That, you know, in the beginning, when I was coming

539
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 2: through the minor leagues and everything, that kind of irked

540
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 2: me that they didn't understand what I did. And like

541
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:51,719
Speaker 2: I said before, you have free responsibilities and you're you know,

542
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 2: none of those responsibilities to make people like you. And

543
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 2: I kind of played football in college and I noticed

544
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:03,560
Speaker 2: that the most disrespected people of the team were the

545
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:07,479
Speaker 2: offensive linemen. No one knew who they were until they

546
00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 2: missed the block. No one knew who they were until

547
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 2: they missed an assignment, and they didn't get credit for

548
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 2: the good things they did. So I was a quarterback

549
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 2: at Elon College and the first time they gave me

550
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 2: the player of the week, I gave it to the

551
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 2: offensive lineman. I said, this is your honor, this isn't mine.

552
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 2: I only did what I did because of you guys.

553
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 2: And they would die for me. They do. After I

554
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 2: gave them that honor. I could have done anything in

555
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 2: the world. They would die for me. They would. I mean,

556
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 2: they get in fights and somebody gave me a cheap shot,

557
00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 2: you know, so so I learned from past experiences, and

558
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 2: the big thing is is sometimes you don't get credit

559
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:53,560
Speaker 2: for doing things the right way. I can remember the

560
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:56,320
Speaker 2: play we had between the Red Sox and the Yankees

561
00:32:56,360 --> 00:33:01,400
Speaker 2: where Alex Rodriguez slapped at Arroya's glove and we fixed it.

562
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:07,280
Speaker 2: We fixed it, We got the play right. And what

563
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:09,480
Speaker 2: happened was there were so many people running at Randy

564
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:11,520
Speaker 2: Marsh he didn't see him use his hand to knock

565
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 2: the ballers. So when they came out to start to argue,

566
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:18,000
Speaker 2: I told Frankcone to get back. We'll have a little

567
00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 2: discussion here. And Jeff Kellogg came down from right field

568
00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 2: and I came up from home play and I said,

569
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 2: did you see him slap at the ball And he

570
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 2: says no. His eyes got real big, so I know

571
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 2: he didn't see it. But when he signaled safe, we

572
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 2: can't call this any kind of interference again, interference struct championship.

573
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,440
Speaker 2: So we have to let the play go until we

574
00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 2: can get together. Because he's made a call. It's his call.

575
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 2: So now we get together and we call all the

576
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,600
Speaker 2: other umpires in, and Kellogg, the right field umpire, and

577
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 2: myself were the only ones that saw it, so we

578
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 2: need to change this or we're going to you're making

579
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 2: the wrong call And I said, but it's your call

580
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 2: if you want me to call. He said, no, no,

581
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:11,839
Speaker 2: it's my call and I'll call it. So he called

582
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 2: him out and they threw everything at us. They threw

583
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 2: stuff from the stands. Somebody threw their car keys at

584
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 2: John Hirschbeck at third base and they were BMW car keys.

585
00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 2: I said, I told him we should go through the

586
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 2: parking lot's see if we could line it. And uh

587
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,239
Speaker 2: so I went over to security, which was in the

588
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 2: third base dugout where the police were because they if

589
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 2: the Yankees win, the series is over and they're going

590
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:40,719
Speaker 2: to have to line the field. I said, guys, we're

591
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 2: going to need to show a strength here and I

592
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,279
Speaker 2: need you to line the field right now to show

593
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:53,120
Speaker 2: everybody we're serious. And the guy in chart said, are

594
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:55,640
Speaker 2: you telling us or is major League Baseball? I said, well,

595
00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 2: let me put it this way. When I go back

596
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:00,120
Speaker 2: to home played, if you haven't lined the field, we're

597
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 2: going in. He said, yes, sir, and they lined the field.

598
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:09,279
Speaker 2: They arrested like sixteen or twenty people immediately, and we

599
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:12,400
Speaker 2: continued the game and the great thing about that was

600
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 2: the next day because the media took up for us

601
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:20,799
Speaker 2: making the right call. The Yankee fans actually applauded us

602
00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 2: when we walked on the field and they lost the game.

603
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 2: And that's the only time I can remember that we

604
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:32,040
Speaker 2: got an applause to come on the field. That's amazing.

605
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:36,239
Speaker 3: But I just remember I loved playing having games with

606
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 3: a base umpire or being a base umpire, because I

607
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:45,799
Speaker 3: would occasionally with pretty high level little league games, I

608
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 3: would call a meeting with my umpire and I would

609
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:50,759
Speaker 3: tell him I blew that. So I'm going to make

610
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 3: it look like I'm telling you're telling me that I

611
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 3: need to change the call. And you saw it differently, Okay, Okay, he.

612
00:35:58,120 --> 00:35:58,879
Speaker 1: Is out right.

613
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 3: I don't even ask him if he saw it. And

614
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:04,400
Speaker 3: I had done that a number of times, Hey did

615
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 3: you see it differently?

616
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 1: Know?

617
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,279
Speaker 3: Okay, we're going to stick with it. But at least

618
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:10,360
Speaker 3: two times I can remember, I said, Hey, I know

619
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 3: I blew this. I reacted in incorrectly. We're going to

620
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 3: change it. Just make it look like you're telling me

621
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 3: that you saw it differently.

622
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,200
Speaker 2: Well, you know what's really funny is the biggest selling

623
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:24,840
Speaker 2: point of the replay stuff was I had to convince

624
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 2: the umpires that replay wasn't taking their job. Replay was

625
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,759
Speaker 2: creating jobs because they had to hire eight people to

626
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:36,920
Speaker 2: man replay. You had thirty games, you can't I mean,

627
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 2: first thing Manfred said was I'll give you two umpires

628
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 2: for replay. I said, you'll give me eight, and he said, no,

629
00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 2: I'll give you two. I said, you'll give me eight,

630
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:48,799
Speaker 2: or you can do it yourself. And the funny thing

631
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 2: was the players were on our side because they didn't

632
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 2: want a techie making the calls in the replay, but

633
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:57,840
Speaker 2: they wanted a real umpire, so we had an advantage.

634
00:36:57,840 --> 00:37:00,359
Speaker 2: And Manford gave us the eight. Of course, he gave

635
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:02,960
Speaker 2: us two of them his minor league umpires, so they

636
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:06,680
Speaker 2: didn't get pension benefits. But after in the next contract

637
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 2: he gave us all eight. And now, I mean, we

638
00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 2: had guys that would say, I don't want to replay. Now,

639
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:15,279
Speaker 2: if you try to take replay away from these guys,

640
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 2: they get mad because they can take the They're going

641
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 2: to be in New York for a week for a replace,

642
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 2: so they take their families there and they shopping and

643
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:29,120
Speaker 2: sight see it and stuff. But it's it was an

644
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 2: interesting concept. And then I had to convince them that

645
00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 2: it's like having another umpire on the field with you

646
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 2: who's trying to help you get the play right, because

647
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,480
Speaker 2: you don't want to be the reason that somebody lost

648
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 2: the game or lost a no hitter or whatever. I

649
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 2: can remember when I went to Drew Coble's wife's funeral

650
00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:53,200
Speaker 2: and I get in the church a little bit late,

651
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:55,400
Speaker 2: and who's sitting in the back row but Don Dankinger,

652
00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:01,200
Speaker 2: who had that play in Saint Louis, and he knew

653
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 2: that I had negotiated the replay. He looked at me

654
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:06,200
Speaker 2: and he says, where the hell were you when I

655
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,239
Speaker 2: needed you?

656
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,520
Speaker 1: I mean, Joe, But you're right. And it's not funny

657
00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:15,320
Speaker 1: because we remember Don Dankeninger, who was a good umpire

658
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:18,040
Speaker 1: for one thing. I was there that night in Kansas City.

659
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: He missed the call, so replay could have saved him.

660
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:23,360
Speaker 2: Yeah.

661
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:27,439
Speaker 1: Correct, and ultimately no umpire wants to be wrong, Joe.

662
00:38:27,560 --> 00:38:29,440
Speaker 1: Now with the system in place, right.

663
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there's a I mean, this is a perfect example.

664
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:37,200
Speaker 2: He made a call at first base and the game

665
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:41,120
Speaker 2: wasn't over by any means, because they still had outs

666
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,600
Speaker 2: to get and runs to score and whatever. In fact

667
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:48,880
Speaker 2: that Cardinals made more errors than he did, but he's

668
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 2: he was crucified and the media murdered him. Jimmy Joyce

669
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 2: had to play at first base in the Detroit Tiger game.

670
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:01,160
Speaker 2: That costs the kid a perfect game, and he was

671
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:06,040
Speaker 2: glorified for admitting he was wrong. I mean, he got

672
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 2: an award from ESPN for sportsmanship, and there's no difference

673
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,720
Speaker 2: in the two plays, and both of them, with replay,

674
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:19,600
Speaker 2: could have been corrected. And that was what I had

675
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:21,800
Speaker 2: to try to instill people. You know, these are the

676
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,000
Speaker 2: kind of plays that you don't want on your record.

677
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:26,479
Speaker 2: And I was very lucky all that you talked about

678
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 2: all the World Series games I had, and I had

679
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:32,240
Speaker 2: playoff games. I had to play and right field without

680
00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:36,600
Speaker 2: Tuv hit a ball and Bets jumped up to try

681
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 2: to catch it for the Red Sox and the fan

682
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 2: closed his glove. So I called interference, spectator interference and

683
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:49,640
Speaker 2: replay said I was right. Well that saves you number

684
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 2: one because you went to replay and they agree with you.

685
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:55,280
Speaker 2: And I was very lucky all the all the World

686
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:59,840
Speaker 2: Series games, playoff games that I had, all the stuff

687
00:39:59,880 --> 00:40:03,759
Speaker 2: that you would call controversial, which I never did. I

688
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:07,760
Speaker 2: happened to get him right. You see what I'm saying. Yes,

689
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 2: And the point is, even if I got him wrong

690
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:14,640
Speaker 2: late in my career, we could have corrected him. Well,

691
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:17,320
Speaker 2: we couldn't correct that Kinger's call. We couldn't correct Jimmy

692
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 2: Joyce's call, and that we've evolved into a place where

693
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:25,200
Speaker 2: we're trying to get everything right. And the best part

694
00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:28,600
Speaker 2: of replay is it changed the attitude of the players

695
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:32,839
Speaker 2: with the umpires because now the players realize, hey, they

696
00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:34,719
Speaker 2: really are trying to get him right. He didn't call

697
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:37,239
Speaker 2: me out because he didn't like me. He didn't call

698
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:40,240
Speaker 2: me safe because he didn't like the other. They realized

699
00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:42,319
Speaker 2: that the umpires are trying to get the play right,

700
00:40:42,800 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 2: which is a good thing.

701
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:47,600
Speaker 1: Right, Joe, what about the ABS system? What is your

702
00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 1: thoughts on where it is and where it is going?

703
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:56,839
Speaker 2: Well, I think the owners and the people have been

704
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 2: on the Commissioner's office to implement it because they feel

705
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,120
Speaker 2: like it would take the plate umpire of the game.

706
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:07,360
Speaker 2: But that's that's not going to happen. The problem with

707
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 2: this new system is it misses more pitches than the

708
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:14,040
Speaker 2: umpires do. The last three years I worked, we didn't

709
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 2: have an umpire that missed seven percent of his pitches.

710
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 2: We didn't have a single umpire. I mean, the worst

711
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:24,800
Speaker 2: umpire didn't miss seven percent of his pitches. This machine

712
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 2: misses more than that. And the problem with the machine

713
00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:30,640
Speaker 2: is when it misses a pitch, it doesn't call anything.

714
00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,840
Speaker 2: It doesn't call ball or strying. It didn't call anything.

715
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:37,840
Speaker 2: So when the umpire misses the pitch, at least he

716
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 2: called something. You see what I'm saying. So you got

717
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,080
Speaker 2: a three two pitch in the ninth in it right,

718
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:48,719
Speaker 2: pitch comes in, the machine doesn't doesn't doesn't track it.

719
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:52,839
Speaker 2: What do you do now? You can't. You can't work

720
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:56,400
Speaker 2: that way. I mean the games. The game's not perfect,

721
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:59,360
Speaker 2: don't get me wrong, And all umpires are not perfect

722
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 2: by a long shot. We're not perfect, but you know what,

723
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 2: we're out there for every one of them, and we're

724
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:06,759
Speaker 2: doing our very best to get them all right.

725
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, twenty sixteen All Star Game, Nelson Cruz comes to

726
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:13,920
Speaker 1: the plate. Tell us what happened there?

727
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 2: Well, he came to the plate and he said something

728
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,399
Speaker 2: in Spanish to yachda your molina, And the next thing

729
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 2: I know, he hands him his phone and yacht. He

730
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:26,480
Speaker 2: turns around and Nelson puts his arm around me like

731
00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 2: he's posing for a picture. And that's what he was doing.

732
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:32,600
Speaker 2: He was posing for a picture. And all I could

733
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:34,319
Speaker 2: think it was, I can't even tell him to get

734
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:36,320
Speaker 2: the hell away from me because I got a microphone.

735
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:41,839
Speaker 2: So I look out of the corner of my eye

736
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 2: and the entire American League Dugout is roaring. They're banging

737
00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:49,840
Speaker 2: on the railing and everything, and it was. It was

738
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 2: a classic picture too. But that was that was in Miami.

739
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 3: I think, yeah, yes, Joe, that last question for me

740
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 3: here in it in Umpiring, I had some very difficult

741
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:07,800
Speaker 3: calls to make. I had a kid catch a ball

742
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:10,880
Speaker 3: in left field, thinking it was the last out of

743
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,560
Speaker 3: the game. He took his glove with the ball in

744
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:16,799
Speaker 3: it and threw it. He caught it and he threw

745
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:20,279
Speaker 3: it out of play, and I couldn't tell if it

746
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:22,799
Speaker 3: was in fair or foul territory. And my brain was

747
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 3: so cluttered because it was the fifth game I did

748
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 3: that day on a ninety degree one hundred percent humidity heat,

749
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:30,319
Speaker 3: I didn't know what the call was. My point of

750
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:33,840
Speaker 3: saying this is even at the professional major league level.

751
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:37,840
Speaker 3: There are some things that happen that are wildly obscure,

752
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:41,320
Speaker 3: that even make a veteran and a legend like yourself

753
00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:44,239
Speaker 3: maybe scratch your head. Do you recall a play that

754
00:43:44,280 --> 00:43:47,399
Speaker 3: you think, what in the world do I do here?

755
00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 3: I've never seen that before? How do I handle this?

756
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:55,760
Speaker 2: Well? Yeah, and there's stuff that happens that you probably

757
00:43:55,800 --> 00:44:00,719
Speaker 2: haven't seen before me. There are times, and I tell

758
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:04,799
Speaker 2: people all the time, there's three ways to missic Hall

759
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:12,640
Speaker 2: lack of concentration, lack of positioning, and lack of timing. Now,

760
00:44:12,680 --> 00:44:15,560
Speaker 2: when I say lack of concentration, that's paying attention to

761
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:18,960
Speaker 2: what you're doing out there. Lack of positioning could happen

762
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 2: any number of ways. Sometimes the players take you out

763
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:24,960
Speaker 2: of position. Like we were talking about how tough it

764
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:27,960
Speaker 2: is to call pictures behind Johnny bench. Sometimes he would

765
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:31,839
Speaker 2: take pictures away from his guy because you couldn't see him. Like.

766
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,880
Speaker 2: There be plays at third base, and third base, if

767
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:39,200
Speaker 2: you'll notice, is usually where the majority of screw ups

768
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:43,200
Speaker 2: are because the angles are completely different and they are

769
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:47,280
Speaker 2: usually always tag plates. Force plays aren't nearly as hard

770
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:50,320
Speaker 2: as tag plates, so you could be taken out of

771
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:54,880
Speaker 2: position any number of ways, and lack of timing is

772
00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:59,400
Speaker 2: the hardest thing to teach umpires because when they come up,

773
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 2: they want to be forceful and they want to look

774
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:04,040
Speaker 2: like they know exactly what they're doing, so they call

775
00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:07,239
Speaker 2: it before everything's done with. Well, that'd be like a

776
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 2: judge making a decision before he has the defense, before

777
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 2: they have their arguments, and that's that's one of the

778
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:19,040
Speaker 2: best things. If you have good timing, you can usually

779
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:21,920
Speaker 2: account for the fact that you were out of position.

780
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:25,759
Speaker 2: You can usually a judge what happened if you'll wait

781
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:28,719
Speaker 2: till everything's over and then piece it all together like

782
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:30,840
Speaker 2: a puss joe.

783
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:35,200
Speaker 1: You needed stem cell treatments in your knees in order

784
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:39,239
Speaker 1: to continue umpiring because of the beating you took, as

785
00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:44,040
Speaker 1: so many umpires do. How are you feeling now in retirement?

786
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:48,200
Speaker 1: How is your body feel after all those foul tips

787
00:45:48,239 --> 00:45:51,040
Speaker 1: you took, all those shots you took off your arm?

788
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:54,320
Speaker 1: How are you doing physically well?

789
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:58,200
Speaker 2: Before I retired, I had my left knee replaced. I

790
00:45:58,239 --> 00:46:01,359
Speaker 2: worked the last year with a knee replace. Wow, And

791
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:04,319
Speaker 2: then after I retired, I had the other knee done.

792
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:06,800
Speaker 2: And the reason I'm like this all the time is

793
00:46:06,840 --> 00:46:14,440
Speaker 2: all those foul balls. But yeah, the things they do today,

794
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:21,160
Speaker 2: it's crazy putting stuff together. I had knee surgery in

795
00:46:21,200 --> 00:46:24,719
Speaker 2: like two thousand and two, two thousand and one or

796
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:30,120
Speaker 2: two thousand and two for torn meniscus in the knee,

797
00:46:30,160 --> 00:46:33,080
Speaker 2: and I was back to work in three weeks. So

798
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:35,720
Speaker 2: I was very you know, I'm one of the luckiest

799
00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:39,080
Speaker 2: people were because I have a great threat pain threshold.

800
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:45,759
Speaker 2: So when doctor Canal, who's the orthopedic surgeon for the Dolphins,

801
00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:50,200
Speaker 2: did my knee surgery, he said, if you were a

802
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:52,000
Speaker 2: football player, i'd put you back to work. So I

803
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:56,560
Speaker 2: went back to work, you know. And if you remember,

804
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:59,399
Speaker 2: Steve Yeager had the same surgery and he was back

805
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:02,400
Speaker 2: in two or three weeks as a catcher, which is

806
00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:06,480
Speaker 2: harder on their legs than it is on umpire's legs.

807
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: Right, Joe, Last thing for me. If Jen Powell came

808
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,360
Speaker 1: to you and said, hey, I want to keep my

809
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,799
Speaker 1: umpiring career going. I want to be a regular major

810
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 1: league umpire. What what's the first piece of advice you

811
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 1: would give her in order to get to where she

812
00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:28,400
Speaker 1: wants to be in this exceptionally difficult job.

813
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 2: Well, she's got two things going against her. One is

814
00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:40,719
Speaker 2: the media scrutiny, which she's handled that very well so far.

815
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:44,279
Speaker 2: Because she's a female, she's going to get more media

816
00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:50,360
Speaker 2: scrutiny than anybody. And the other thing is they waited

817
00:47:50,440 --> 00:47:52,080
Speaker 2: till she's in her forties to bring her to the

818
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:53,759
Speaker 2: big league, so her career is not going to be

819
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,759
Speaker 2: as long as it might have been had they hired

820
00:47:56,800 --> 00:47:59,000
Speaker 2: her when she was in her late thirties, you know.

821
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:03,240
Speaker 2: But the big thing is, I think she's doing everything

822
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 2: the right way and I'm pulling for I think I

823
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:12,839
Speaker 2: think it's a good thing. She's uh, she's articulate when

824
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:16,759
Speaker 2: she speaks, she's she's smart. I think there's going to

825
00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:19,160
Speaker 2: be times where they're going to try to put her

826
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:21,920
Speaker 2: in a in a corner and question her about stuff

827
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:26,360
Speaker 2: that there's no reason to so. But they did the

828
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 2: same thing when Pam post Them was coming up. But this,

829
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:33,799
Speaker 2: this this lady is going to be just fine. I

830
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:36,440
Speaker 2: just hate the fact that they waited so long to

831
00:48:36,440 --> 00:48:38,399
Speaker 2: bring her up. But then again, they did the same

832
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 2: thing to em and Ashford when he was when he

833
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:45,839
Speaker 2: was brought up, they waited until he was almost at

834
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 2: retirement age to bring him up. And of course, the

835
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 2: American League had a retirement age back in those days,

836
00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:56,920
Speaker 2: which was fifty five, and Ashley never had that retirement

837
00:48:56,920 --> 00:49:00,200
Speaker 2: age because back then the umpires were assigned up one

838
00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:02,960
Speaker 2: league or the other. In fact, the National League wanted

839
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 2: the senior umpires. They wanted seniority on the field, and

840
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 2: the American League was not of that mindset at the time.

841
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:14,800
Speaker 1: So, Jeff, let me just finish with this. When I

842
00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 1: did this story with Joe, we walked out of the

843
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:20,279
Speaker 1: restaurant where we had lunch and there were a bunch

844
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:22,279
Speaker 1: of kids in the parking lot, and he goes into

845
00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:25,720
Speaker 1: the trunk of his car and pulls out like twenty

846
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 1: four baseballs, like a big package of baseballs, and just

847
00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:32,879
Speaker 1: gives them to these kids. Joe, you did that all

848
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:35,759
Speaker 1: the time. Don't be humble about this. You did that

849
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:38,480
Speaker 1: all the time. Greg. Why did you do that?

850
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:46,360
Speaker 2: Well, I didn't want to give them my World Series rings,

851
00:49:46,760 --> 00:49:50,520
Speaker 2: and I have an account with rawlings and they send

852
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: them to me. I don't think I get as good

853
00:49:53,080 --> 00:49:56,319
Speaker 2: a deal as the clubs do, but they do give

854
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:59,719
Speaker 2: me a break on the baseballs, so they're actual real

855
00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:03,640
Speaker 2: base that I give these kids. And you don't think

856
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:05,719
Speaker 2: they're made of gold. Give one to a little boy

857
00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:11,279
Speaker 2: or a little girl. They are they're special. So and

858
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:17,359
Speaker 2: if I remember you signed those baseballs for us, they

859
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:19,279
Speaker 2: knew who you were. They didn't know who I was.

860
00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:23,319
Speaker 1: World's worst signature, all right, Joe?

861
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:24,120
Speaker 2: Uh?

862
00:50:24,160 --> 00:50:27,160
Speaker 1: Does everyone still call you cowboy Joe in retirement?

863
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:27,839
Speaker 3: Or is that?

864
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:29,160
Speaker 1: Is that? It is?

865
00:50:29,280 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 2: Right?

866
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:30,480
Speaker 1: That's your name? Right?

867
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,120
Speaker 2: Yeah? Did you see my little logo here?

868
00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:34,839
Speaker 3: I love that.

869
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 1: It's beautiful. It's Jeff, explain what it is for the

870
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:40,040
Speaker 1: for our listeners.

871
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:43,480
Speaker 3: We've got if it's a baseball teed up on a

872
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:45,400
Speaker 3: on a bat, is that what we've got there with

873
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:48,200
Speaker 3: a cowboy hat? It's a golf on a golf dof

874
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:51,440
Speaker 3: tea with baseball on top of a golf team with

875
00:50:51,520 --> 00:50:54,560
Speaker 3: a cowboy hat on top of that? That is incredible?

876
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:55,160
Speaker 2: Right?

877
00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:58,319
Speaker 1: And Joe, you play golf how many times a week?

878
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:02,800
Speaker 2: Well? At least right? Sometimes more? You know? And the

879
00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:07,600
Speaker 2: club pro over here at Bellacalina where I'm remember, I said, Jay,

880
00:51:07,719 --> 00:51:11,200
Speaker 2: I about order me a case of golf balls from

881
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:14,239
Speaker 2: Tylus and tell him to put my little logo on it.

882
00:51:14,320 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 2: And he said, you know, have a look. I said,

883
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 2: just tell him so he calls tylist and he says,

884
00:51:20,440 --> 00:51:24,280
Speaker 2: I'd like to order a case of pro v ones.

885
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:28,040
Speaker 2: And this guy says, he's got a logo. You have

886
00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:30,720
Speaker 2: a you have a thing for Joe West a logo

887
00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:33,680
Speaker 2: for titlist. Goffo. Guy says, give me a minute, and

888
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:35,680
Speaker 2: he says, oh, yeah, we got it right here.

889
00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:43,719
Speaker 1: So sorry, Joe. One more question. You are a stickler

890
00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 1: on the rules. You have to get the rules right

891
00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:50,000
Speaker 1: if you're going to play baseball and be an umpire,

892
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:52,319
Speaker 1: what are you like on the golf course? Let's say

893
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:55,680
Speaker 1: you're in a tournament, like it really counts and I

894
00:51:55,760 --> 00:51:59,160
Speaker 1: incorrectly mark my ball, which I did once and like

895
00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:03,000
Speaker 1: the only turnament and the guy I'm playing against called

896
00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:05,960
Speaker 1: me on it, and he was right. What are you

897
00:52:06,840 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 1: who umpired more games than anyone in Major league history?

898
00:52:10,040 --> 00:52:13,239
Speaker 1: What are you like as far as the rules go

899
00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:14,800
Speaker 1: on the golf course.

900
00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:19,319
Speaker 2: Well, if you're in a tournament, it's your responsibility to

901
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:24,319
Speaker 2: enforce the rules, even if the playing participant didn't, and

902
00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:26,279
Speaker 2: you have to call him on it, and you have

903
00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:30,040
Speaker 2: to make sure that everybody's aware if it's something like

904
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:33,000
Speaker 2: you just said, like marking my ball illegally and it's

905
00:52:33,080 --> 00:52:36,960
Speaker 2: not a tournament thing. Then I'll say something like, you know,

906
00:52:37,000 --> 00:52:38,600
Speaker 2: if you're in a tournament, this is going to cost

907
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:40,839
Speaker 2: your penalty, and they'll go, well, what do you mean,

908
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 2: And then I'll explain the rule to them, and you know,

909
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,560
Speaker 2: they go from there. I saw something the other day

910
00:52:47,840 --> 00:52:51,399
Speaker 2: which is crazy person hit the ball in the sand

911
00:52:51,440 --> 00:52:56,279
Speaker 2: trap and it was up against the rake. Well, you

912
00:52:56,280 --> 00:52:58,439
Speaker 2: don't have to hit it if it's against the rake,

913
00:53:00,120 --> 00:53:01,959
Speaker 2: but what you have to do is remove the rake

914
00:53:03,160 --> 00:53:06,160
Speaker 2: without the ball moving. So if the ball's going to

915
00:53:06,239 --> 00:53:09,399
Speaker 2: move while you're in the trap, if you move the rake,

916
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:12,239
Speaker 2: then you need to market mark it with a t

917
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:14,200
Speaker 2: where the ball is and then move the rake. And

918
00:53:14,239 --> 00:53:15,799
Speaker 2: then if the ball moves, you have to put the

919
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:20,839
Speaker 2: ball back right. Most people would have no idea, that's

920
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:21,239
Speaker 2: the rule.

921
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:24,880
Speaker 3: No idea, Jeff, I thought the rule was if it

922
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:27,400
Speaker 3: hits the rake, you can just take a drop outside

923
00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:29,880
Speaker 3: of the trap. That's the way I've always played it.

924
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:31,480
Speaker 2: That's the friendly game.

925
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:34,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh yeah, as far as I can throw it,

926
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:35,319
Speaker 3: that's what I say.

927
00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:39,920
Speaker 2: The toughest rules. I used to play a lot of

928
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:42,880
Speaker 2: golf with Larry Ziegler down here was a PGA player

929
00:53:43,760 --> 00:53:46,759
Speaker 2: and he's hit the ball right down the middle, and

930
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:48,520
Speaker 2: I look up and he's going in the rough and

931
00:53:48,560 --> 00:53:50,960
Speaker 2: this real thick rough. And one of the guys playing

932
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 2: with us says, you know, he's going to get bit

933
00:53:53,320 --> 00:53:56,600
Speaker 2: by a snake. I said, snakes won't bite him. He said,

934
00:53:56,600 --> 00:53:58,480
Speaker 2: what do you mean, Is he got some kind of repellent.

935
00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:00,800
Speaker 2: I said, no, it's professional courtesy. They're not.

936
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:07,120
Speaker 1: It's an ankle bite. The rest of us, but not

937
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:10,839
Speaker 1: Verry Ziegler, Joe. We could ask you questions all day.

938
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:14,680
Speaker 1: We've taken an hour. Thank you so much for your generosity.

939
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:17,960
Speaker 1: Today a couple of little umpires here, me and Jeff

940
00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:21,719
Speaker 1: thoroughly enjoyed talking baseball and umpiring with you.

941
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:24,880
Speaker 3: Thank you so so much for joining, Thanks for having

942
00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:25,120
Speaker 3: me