1 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:06,800 Speaker 1: Hey there, and welcome to the short stuff. I'm Josh, 2 00:00:06,840 --> 00:00:08,959 Speaker 1: and there's Chuck and there's Jerry. Let's get to it. 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 1: Why do you lawyers were wigs in Britain? Go? You 4 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: know what's funny is when I was researching this, it's 5 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:21,239 Speaker 1: really funny to me to look at modern pictures of 6 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: these And I don't want to make fun of it, 7 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: but it is funny in two thousand nineteen to look 8 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: at photos of barristers and judges wearing powdered wigs. Just 9 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:37,199 Speaker 1: let me say that out loud before did you just 10 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 1: say that out loud? Like you see them outside? There's 11 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 1: pictures smoking a cigarette on their on their smartphone wearing 12 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:47,840 Speaker 1: these wigs, right playing. Um, before we get started, a Chuck, 13 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:52,880 Speaker 1: I want to differentiate between a barrister and a solicitor, 14 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: which I did not know until today actually in difference. Yeah, 15 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:00,400 Speaker 1: I thought maybe one was like a defensive ernie and 16 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 1: one was a prosecutor like we have here in the US. Um, 17 00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:07,760 Speaker 1: that's not the case. A solicitor is like the lawyer 18 00:01:07,880 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 1: that you go meet with outside of court, uh and 19 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: maybe advises you on family and children matters, or bankruptcy 20 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 1: or divorce or something like that, and then they might 21 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 1: negotiate contracts that kind of thing. But then when you're 22 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: in court, you're represented by a barrister, and the barrister 23 00:01:26,720 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: works with the solicitor to understand your case. But it's 24 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 1: the barrister who's petitioning the court on your behalf. So 25 00:01:33,120 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 1: they're both working like for the people, they're not prosecuting somebody. 26 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 1: But that's the difference. One of the other differences, at 27 00:01:40,840 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: least one of the most obvious and apparent differences between 28 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:45,839 Speaker 1: a barrister and a solicitor is that you don't see 29 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:50,560 Speaker 1: solicitors wearing wigs. You do see barristers wearing wigs. So 30 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:54,320 Speaker 1: that's a short stuff within a short stuff, the difference 31 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 1: between barristers and solicitors everybody. That's just an s s. 32 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: It's so short. So to the wigs, there are a 33 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 1: lot of reasons are called Peruke's um that over the years, 34 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 1: and we'll get to the whole fashion of the whigs 35 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:10,840 Speaker 1: in a minute too, but uh, there are several reasons 36 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 1: why they wore them to begin with him. While they 37 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 1: still might wear them in certain cases. Um one of 38 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:22,120 Speaker 1: the main reasons is to give it a more formal proceeding, um, 39 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 1: a more solemn proceeding. Another big reason is it's a 40 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:29,919 Speaker 1: safeguard almost like and that I've seen the word disguise used. 41 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 1: It's very bad disguise because it's just the wig. Oh yeah, 42 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 1: I hadn't noticed that. But in the in criminal court, 43 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 1: they it's supposedly lends to anonymity, these robes and wigs. 44 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: So where if this criminal sees their attorney on the 45 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 1: street six months later, they might be like, I don't 46 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: even recognize the guy. He looks familiar, but if only 47 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:51,880 Speaker 1: he had a powdered wig on, I might be able 48 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 1: to knife them in the tube. Can't quite place him. 49 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:58,640 Speaker 1: So uh, that is sort of what they represent. And um, 50 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:02,920 Speaker 1: they have been a part of the court system over there, 51 00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:08,120 Speaker 1: um not forever, but since what year? Uh, since six 52 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:11,799 Speaker 1: five at least. Yeah, previously that they didn't use these wigs, 53 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:14,480 Speaker 1: which is interesting. It is interesting because at the time 54 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:18,359 Speaker 1: wigs were already all the rage in Europe and had 55 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 1: been for a few years. But I guess the court 56 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 1: system was like, no, we're going to not take part 57 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 1: in this ridiculous fashion trend. And I guess just portraits 58 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 1: from the early sixteen eighties even um just showed like 59 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,360 Speaker 1: people without wigs on, and then all of a sudden, bam, 60 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 1: wigs start showing up in the portraits. And they've been 61 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 1: there ever since, even long after wiggs fell out of fashion. 62 00:03:43,760 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 1: I mean wiggs were only fashionable for less than a 63 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 1: hundred years, actually far less than a hundred years, No, 64 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 1: about a hundred years, let's say, And then and then 65 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: they were gone, and the British court system wherever it 66 00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 1: popped up around the world, um hung onto these wigs 67 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 1: for another like two hundred, three hundred years. Yeah, and 68 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:09,200 Speaker 1: there you know, as far as the whigs themselves, uh, 69 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 1: you can get a little bit of variety, but it's 70 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: not like you can walk in there with your rainbow 71 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 1: afro wig, um, John. They're generally similar barristers have you know, 72 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: it's a little little frizzed at the top. They have 73 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: the horizontal curls on the side and the back and 74 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:31,240 Speaker 1: then the very very back the mullet section. You have 75 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 1: these two long strips um below the hairline with a 76 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 1: little looped curl. The the judges themselves have the much 77 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:44,840 Speaker 1: more ornate wigs that's more full, um very long, yeah, 78 00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 1: super long. These are the one you know. That's how 79 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 1: you can tell the difference. When you see the the 80 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 1: dude with a big, huge, full long wig, that's a judge. 81 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 1: When you see the little little one sitting on top, 82 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 1: standing outside the court house with your smartphone and your cigarette, 83 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: that's a barrister and the judge. His wig looks very 84 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 1: very much like a seventies rocker hair. Do if you 85 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: step back and look at it? Yeah, like really, I'm 86 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:11,440 Speaker 1: trying to think of who, like maybe like a tour 87 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:15,279 Speaker 1: manager for led Zeppelin or something like that. All right, maybe, 88 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:18,119 Speaker 1: although he famously did not have long hair, but sure 89 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:20,839 Speaker 1: who Phil Graham? He was ball on top? Was that 90 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:25,839 Speaker 1: his name? He was the promoter? Okay? Phil Graham was alright, 91 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:28,479 Speaker 1: well man. He used to stick people up. He would say, like, 92 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:32,080 Speaker 1: if if you don't give us an extra hundred thousand dollars, uh, 93 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:34,640 Speaker 1: my boys aren't going on stage, like five minutes before 94 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 1: they were supposed to go on. He was pretty legendary 95 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: piece of work. So as far as the wigs, oh 96 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:42,239 Speaker 1: they're expensive. Um. Judges can throw down about three grand 97 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 1: on a wig. Um. The barristers may spend anywhere from 98 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 1: five hundred to a thousand. These are dollars, not pounds. Yeah, yeah, 99 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:54,160 Speaker 1: and uh, they're made of horsehair. UM. Traditionally have always 100 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 1: been made of horse hair if you can afford it. Um, 101 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 1: just because of tradition. It's not like horse hair is 102 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:02,599 Speaker 1: some super valuable thing, but some have been made through 103 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:05,799 Speaker 1: other things like goats hair or just cotton, or maybe 104 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 1: a dead human or or even a live human. Uh. 105 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:13,239 Speaker 1: At the time, back in the day, humans would donate 106 00:06:13,279 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 1: their long white hair kind of like locks of love. 107 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: But rather than you know, for people who have survived cancer, 108 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: it's for the courts. And rather than for love, it's 109 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 1: for money. So it doesn't really bear that much of 110 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: a resemblance although hair was involved. But the the horse hair, 111 00:06:33,920 --> 00:06:36,359 Speaker 1: it's like you said, it's not prize. It's this tradition. 112 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:38,360 Speaker 1: That's what they were made out of originally, and that's 113 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,039 Speaker 1: why they continue to be made out of. UM. But 114 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:43,480 Speaker 1: that's not to say they're just like thrown together. These 115 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: are UM remarkably well made where they're supposed to be. 116 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:51,799 Speaker 1: For for a very long time, they were very well made, 117 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: UM artisan crafted wigs. All right, let's take a break. 118 00:06:57,600 --> 00:06:59,280 Speaker 1: We're gonna come back and talk a little bit more 119 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,479 Speaker 1: about the history of these wigs, and while on Earth 120 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:11,600 Speaker 1: they're still wearing them right after this as why skol 121 00:07:15,600 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 1: definite should ski all right, So the history of wigs here. Uh, 122 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 1: it may surprise you to know that a big reason 123 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:40,920 Speaker 1: these wigs started to be worn is because syphilis was rampant. Yeah, 124 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 1: it seems like everybody had syphilis. Yeah. And one of 125 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 1: the things that could happen when you have syphilis, aside 126 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:52,040 Speaker 1: from blindness and rashes and dementia and open source as 127 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 1: you can lose your hair. So what it maybe unfairly 128 00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: because male pattern baldness is a thing anyway, if you 129 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:02,640 Speaker 1: lost your hair and you're a prominent person, but a 130 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: lot of people probably looked at you and said, well 131 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:07,960 Speaker 1: he got syphilis. Yeah. Plus, at the time, long hair 132 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:11,680 Speaker 1: on men was very much in fast and that does 133 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:14,560 Speaker 1: not go well with syphilis if you're if you're balding. 134 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: So wiggs came into play, and they might not have 135 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 1: come into play as strongly as they did had it 136 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 1: not been for Louis the fourteenth, the King of France, 137 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: the same king who um they believe had syphilis, and 138 00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:31,320 Speaker 1: he started wearing wigs himself. He reigned from sixteen forty 139 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 1: three to seventeen fifteen, and he was a huge trend setter. 140 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:39,079 Speaker 1: So when he started wearing these powdered wigs, everybody started 141 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,079 Speaker 1: wearing powdered wigs, and not just in France and not 142 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 1: just among his court, but in courts and the aristocracy 143 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 1: and the upper classes of all of Europe, including in England, 144 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: which was rained by Charles the Second at the time, 145 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 1: who was the cousin of Louis the fourteenth. And also 146 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:59,000 Speaker 1: maybe he had syphilis. Yeah, syphilis. Everywhere you get syphilis, 147 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:03,200 Speaker 1: you get syphilis, you agains hyphilis. Uh. And like you said, 148 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 1: it spread through all of aristocracy. Um, finally it fell 149 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: out of fashion over time. Um that like you said, well, yeah, 150 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:14,079 Speaker 1: didn't take that long for the whigs to fall out 151 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: of fashion, would you say, less than a hundred years. Yeah. 152 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 1: By by the time King George the Third, who was 153 00:09:19,679 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 1: presiding over England during the American Revolution, when he was 154 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 1: in charge, it was really just basically, um, Coachman, bishops, 155 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 1: and I believe the court and in the eighteen thirties 156 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:35,560 Speaker 1: the church or the Anglican Church that bishops don't need 157 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 1: to wear those anymore. I don't know when Coachman stopped 158 00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 1: wearing them, but then like we're with the bishops, right, 159 00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 1: then the courts are um. They just kept it up 160 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 1: from that point on. Yeah. So finally in two thousand 161 00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 1: seven there was a court challenge, UM, an actual like 162 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 1: suit brought forward to say can we not wear these 163 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: wigs anymore? And there was a ruling that said, uh 164 00:09:56,679 --> 00:10:00,680 Speaker 1: that that technically did away with barrister whigs, but entirely 165 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: because that was only in civil court um or appearing 166 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 1: before the Supreme Court. But in criminal cases they were like, 167 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 1: keep those wigs on everybody, and I believe they still do, right. Yeah, 168 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:16,520 Speaker 1: that's what I couldn't quite figure out. Like I read 169 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:19,960 Speaker 1: like in this article it says until two thousand eleven 170 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:22,880 Speaker 1: when the practice was discontinued, Well that was with judges. 171 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 1: Oh okay, alright, that makes more sense now, barristers in 172 00:10:26,320 --> 00:10:29,559 Speaker 1: two thousand seven, judges in two thousand and eleven. But 173 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 1: I believe that in criminal cases both barristers and judges 174 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:36,079 Speaker 1: are still required to wear wigs or else it's a 175 00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:38,520 Speaker 1: real affront to the decorum of the court. Yeah. Like 176 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: I was reading articles from last year that talked about 177 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:45,000 Speaker 1: the fact that they were still trying to get it 178 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 1: not mandatory for criminal cases, but I think they are 179 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 1: still wearing them and it had a sweeping effect, like 180 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,679 Speaker 1: everyone around the world that had that worked in the 181 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:58,559 Speaker 1: legal system of a country that was a former British colony, 182 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:02,840 Speaker 1: whether in Africa, whether also Astralia, whether Canada, or just waiting. 183 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: Actually I think Canada did away with him before, but 184 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 1: it's like they were just waiting to pull these wigs off. Um, 185 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 1: Jamaica got rid of their's in two thousand thirteen, Australia 186 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: got rid of their's finally in two thousand ten. So 187 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 1: whatever lawsuit that was in two thousand seven, that had sweet, 188 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:21,880 Speaker 1: like literally global effects. Yeah. I mean one of the 189 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 1: articles I read talked about in England the heat they're 190 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 1: in the summertime heat. Yeah, in the summertime, these rogues 191 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 1: and these wigs, they were like that, it's just like 192 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 1: it's a problem and they just should just file a 193 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 1: petition or whatever. That just says to whom it may concern, 194 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 1: Come on, this is ridiculous. It's two thousand nineteen the end. Yeah, 195 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: we look silly. Yeah, although in Hong Kong they they 196 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: are still with it from what I understand. So if 197 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: you want to go see your lawyers and your judges 198 00:11:56,440 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: wearing traditional wigs. Go to Hong Kong. I think it's 199 00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,160 Speaker 1: the upshode of the shorts. Yeah, go commit a crime 200 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 1: in Hong Kong. There you go. Um, thanks a lot 201 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:06,679 Speaker 1: for joining us. If you want to get in touch 202 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:08,680 Speaker 1: with the shoot us an email, why don't you send 203 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:10,920 Speaker 1: it off to Stuff Podcast at how stuff works dot 204 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 1: com