WEBVTT - Ep. 391: Border Patrol 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:12.760 This is me eat your podcast coming at you shirtless, 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:15.720 severely bug bitten, and in my case, underwear. Listening to 0:00:15.880 --> 0:00:21.960 Hunt E podcast, you can't predict anything presented by First Light, 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:26.680 creating proven versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to 0:00:26.760 --> 0:00:35.800 technical outerwear. For every hunt, first Light, go farther, stay longer. Alright, everybody, 0:00:35.840 --> 0:00:39.360 we got the room packed with Apparently it's packed with 0:00:40.920 --> 0:00:45.559 pistol pack and bagpipe players. I mean, I know you 0:00:45.560 --> 0:00:47.920 guys play bagpipes, but you guys, I'm assuming you packed 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:51.880 pistols at work. Yes, sir, pistol packing bags players. Okay, 0:00:52.000 --> 0:00:55.040 I want you to douce yourselves. My name is rich Fortunate. 0:00:55.160 --> 0:00:57.200 I'm the acting Chief Patrol Agent to have their sector 0:00:57.240 --> 0:01:00.560 Border Patrol Sector. Want to say that real slow? Richard 0:01:00.600 --> 0:01:04.440 Fortunado the acting Chief Patrol Agent of the Haver Sector 0:01:04.600 --> 0:01:09.039 Border Patrol Sector. So your patroling the northern border I'm patrolling. Actually, 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:12.360 the a O R for Haver Sector is is Montana, 0:01:12.800 --> 0:01:17.920 east of the Continental Divide, Idaho, east of the Continental Divide, Utah, Colorado, 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:21.240 and Wyoming. So we were looking. We do work throughout 0:01:21.240 --> 0:01:25.119 that entire area. Colorado. I hope you catch them before 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:31.680 they coming from the north, I imagine. Well, yeah, so 0:01:32.160 --> 0:01:33.920 the stuff that we try to do down in the states, 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:36.240 in Wyoming, in Colorado is is more of a task 0:01:36.280 --> 0:01:39.480 force working with other law enforcement partners and working on 0:01:39.600 --> 0:01:42.800 that type of traffic the borders. The border next to 0:01:42.880 --> 0:01:45.800 stuff is obviously in Montana. God, yeah, I got a 0:01:45.800 --> 0:01:49.240 bunch of questions about the northern border. I've been the 0:01:49.320 --> 0:01:51.840 Quiet it's the I don't know the Quiet border. Wow, 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:54.920 I wouldn't see it's quiet. I would say that it's uh, 0:01:54.960 --> 0:01:57.400 it's different, right, So it's it's the traffic that we 0:01:57.400 --> 0:01:59.720 have in the southern border is definitely different from the 0:01:59.720 --> 0:02:02.360 type traffic that we have on the northern border. So 0:02:02.520 --> 0:02:05.320 obviously the stuff that they see, uh down south is 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:09.720 Central American South American based and the stuff that we 0:02:09.760 --> 0:02:12.280 see on the northern border is more based in Eastern 0:02:12.320 --> 0:02:16.920 European Romanians. And yeah, okay, we'll get into that, Sir. 0:02:17.919 --> 0:02:21.399 Hi Charles trost Um, currently the Tusson Sector public Leans 0:02:21.440 --> 0:02:24.640 Leaders on Agent US Border Patrol, just finished up a 0:02:24.720 --> 0:02:27.240 three year detail as a National public Leans Leaders on 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:31.800 Agent program manager. Okay, so so get I get it, 0:02:31.840 --> 0:02:35.280 but but get approach it with a different set of words. 0:02:35.320 --> 0:02:39.480 So UM. Basically, UM I served as the first point 0:02:39.480 --> 0:02:44.120 of contact for our land management agency partners UM. You know, 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:47.400 being the border patrol. You know typically we're along the border, 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:51.720 that's we're working. UM. But we don't actually own any 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:54.959 property any land out there. So the areas that we're patrolling, 0:02:55.320 --> 0:02:58.959 it's other people's property, if you would, you know, UM SO, 0:02:59.080 --> 0:03:02.360 and that's typically along the border. That's Department of Interior, 0:03:02.440 --> 0:03:06.000 US Department of Agriculture being for a service land so 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:08.639 BLM land and for a service land well and not 0:03:08.720 --> 0:03:12.560 just BLM. You have fish and wildlife service refugees. You 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:16.200 have UM. You know, you have the national conservation areas 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:19.840 with with BLM. You also have National parks UM that 0:03:19.880 --> 0:03:22.840 are along the border areas and so you know that's 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:25.720 just part of it. And then you also have ben 0:03:26.120 --> 0:03:30.120 yeah Big Bend National huge one organ piped National Cactus 0:03:30.160 --> 0:03:33.880 Monument another big one UM Core not a national memorial. 0:03:33.960 --> 0:03:38.520 I mean there's a whole lot thecmement Wilderness UM in California. 0:03:38.760 --> 0:03:41.520 There's all kinds of areas and so UM. You know, 0:03:41.840 --> 0:03:45.680 those land management agencies when when we're patrolling, you know, 0:03:45.760 --> 0:03:48.640 if there's an issue I'm usually one of the first person, 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:50.960 either myself or within the sector there's a p l 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:53.800 l A that they would contact and they would work 0:03:53.800 --> 0:03:55.960 out that issue along with that. Though it's not just 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:59.680 issues like if we have UM technology deployments that we're 0:03:59.720 --> 0:04:01.840 working on, we would reach out to them and it's 0:04:01.920 --> 0:04:04.440 usually the p l A that's UM, you know, helping 0:04:04.480 --> 0:04:07.400 to initiate that conversation and work through that UH. And 0:04:07.440 --> 0:04:09.640 then we find, you know, different collaborative work to do 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:12.560 UM you know, cross agency training because a lot of 0:04:12.560 --> 0:04:17.200 people don't really know UM about the areas that they're 0:04:17.200 --> 0:04:20.720 working in. Most border patrol agents they don't typically come 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:23.400 from the area that they're assigned to you and so 0:04:23.600 --> 0:04:25.560 you're coming to this new land. So one of the 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:27.279 things that the p l A program helps to do 0:04:27.600 --> 0:04:31.279 is not only UM improve the the knowledge of the 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:33.640 border Patrol agent of the area that they're working in, 0:04:34.120 --> 0:04:36.920 but we also reach out to the public lands managers 0:04:37.160 --> 0:04:39.520 and we teach their new employees about what the border 0:04:39.520 --> 0:04:42.320 patrol is because they may not have any interaction with BP, 0:04:43.080 --> 0:04:45.440 and so we kind of try to teach them, hey, 0:04:45.480 --> 0:04:47.440 this is the work that we do, so they aren't 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:50.599 just thinking we're out there roaming across their property, you know, 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:54.480 infringing on their resource. Like there's there's a method behind 0:04:54.520 --> 0:04:57.719 the stuff that we're doing, and we try to broker 0:04:57.760 --> 0:05:00.360 that and and just kind of makes or that we're 0:05:00.360 --> 0:05:02.000 all on the same page that we're out there trying 0:05:02.040 --> 0:05:04.520 to protect the resource as a whole. We just have 0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:07.720 different approaches to doing it and the end result being 0:05:07.880 --> 0:05:10.520 that the area is safe and that people can enjoy 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:13.440 the resource for what it is. Uh, you are all 0:05:13.480 --> 0:05:16.719 you guys former military. Um, I think I'm the only 0:05:16.720 --> 0:05:24.920 one got it, Brody, former former trivia master. Look at 0:05:24.920 --> 0:05:29.800 that scoreboard, Brody Henderson, why board over there? And by 0:05:29.920 --> 0:05:35.400 day I was quite all be decided, all be decided. 0:05:36.760 --> 0:05:42.719 That's right, the playoffs are coming up. Are you ready? 0:05:41.839 --> 0:05:44.400 I was gonna want to keep doing my old man 0:05:44.440 --> 0:05:51.279 brody things. Crins here, Uh, Phil, And then uh, James, 0:05:51.279 --> 0:05:54.360 go ahead, Hey, James Searle. I'm an assistant chief assigned 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:57.560 to Board headquarters in Washington, d C. And Uh, my 0:05:57.680 --> 0:06:00.640 portfolio is worked for the Recruitment division up there. And 0:06:00.720 --> 0:06:05.240 my portfolio includes UM brand engagement, sponsorships, Canada developments, and 0:06:05.360 --> 0:06:08.200 virtual outreach for things just like this. To reach out 0:06:08.240 --> 0:06:12.440 to communities and find unique and different audiences to UM 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:15.680 communicate what the border Patrol does. UM, not just through 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:18.359 what people see uh on the lens of mainstream media, 0:06:18.400 --> 0:06:22.480 but actually you know, find uh, find more intimate settings 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:25.680 to communicate who borders all agents are UM and UH 0:06:25.720 --> 0:06:28.320 and engage with the public and you know, provide additional 0:06:28.320 --> 0:06:30.400 transparency and tell them all the other things that we 0:06:30.640 --> 0:06:32.560 you know, you're not going to see just by watching 0:06:32.720 --> 0:06:35.719 big news. UM. Tell you know what, what's what's in 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:38.960 the gravy that makes up border security. And like Charles explained, 0:06:38.960 --> 0:06:41.400 working with you know, three letter agencies to on on 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:44.200 various lands to to do our job and border security mission, 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.120 but also in further their missions as well. Uh. Was 0:06:47.160 --> 0:06:49.320 it was you that reached out with like a thing 0:06:49.480 --> 0:06:52.920 like you guys talk about stuff that is that has implications, 0:06:52.920 --> 0:06:57.440 has border implications. Absolutely, and you had a many many 0:06:57.839 --> 0:07:02.360 a very detailed email of many episodes where we bordered 0:07:02.360 --> 0:07:04.960 on the borders. Yeah. First first paper, first paper I 0:07:04.960 --> 0:07:06.400 wrote on reaching out to you guys was back in 0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:12.720 seventeen and uh and when uh, it's just different times, 0:07:12.800 --> 0:07:17.560 sir and uh, I wrote a paper internally to my 0:07:17.680 --> 0:07:21.640 organization on doing outreach with with me eaterback. I thought 0:07:21.640 --> 0:07:23.760 you meant that, Um, you tried to get ahold of 0:07:23.800 --> 0:07:27.040 us and called you back. That's happened two more recently. 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:31.760 But uh had a phone friend. I had a phone 0:07:31.800 --> 0:07:34.040 a friend. Uh, I believe that you're you're the team 0:07:34.040 --> 0:07:36.840 and haven't reached out back in early summer, I think, 0:07:36.840 --> 0:07:40.640 And but just through the like the regular website contact 0:07:40.720 --> 0:07:43.440 and uh, you never know who you're gonna get. Yeah, 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:45.960 probably wound up in a junk box. People need to 0:07:45.960 --> 0:07:48.320 get ahold of he can say it, but he got 0:07:48.360 --> 0:07:57.760 hold of Kran. You should put never mind. Uh, all right, 0:07:57.880 --> 0:07:59.880 we're gonna cover a bunch of this stuff. So let 0:07:59.880 --> 0:08:01.280 me of a couple of for instances though, and then 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:02.960 we're gonna we're gonna talk about a couple of things. 0:08:02.960 --> 0:08:07.160 Wait and Yannis here, Oh sorry, y good morning, Yanni. 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:11.080 Play your real quick play your daughter doing the um. 0:08:11.080 --> 0:08:13.600 This is great. Yanni's daughters learning how to gobble like 0:08:13.640 --> 0:08:15.640 a turkey. But he's got a video. And when he 0:08:15.680 --> 0:08:17.760 showed me the video, she's sort of dressed up real 0:08:17.880 --> 0:08:20.640 nice and facing the camera. I thought she's gonna sing 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:26.760 the Lavian national anthem. A turkey gobble, A couple of 0:08:26.800 --> 0:08:42.640 turkey gobles. You've never seen a cuter. How does she? 0:08:43.440 --> 0:08:48.199 She's eight. A few of the episodes that that we 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:51.000 talked about where we got into the we got into 0:08:51.040 --> 0:08:56.520 the landscape of what the Border Patrol does. We had 0:08:56.559 --> 0:09:02.079 episode one seventy nine, the weed warden Um. In James's words, 0:09:02.120 --> 0:09:05.559 this episode touches on cartel smuggling to support illegal marijuana 0:09:05.600 --> 0:09:09.319 grows on public lands. While this focus is on state 0:09:09.360 --> 0:09:13.000 conservation officer enforcement, US Border Patrols part of the largest 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:17.160 uniformed law enforcement agency in the nation that on an 0:09:17.200 --> 0:09:24.360 average day seizes four thousand, seven thirty two pounds of drugs, 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:28.440 much of which crosses through or seized on public lands. 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:31.160 Did you guys see that video Hefflefinger posted when he 0:09:31.200 --> 0:09:38.160 was hunting in Arazon recently, uniformed like uniformed smugglers in 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:42.520 matching carrying back. He thought he does a bunch of hunters. 0:09:42.559 --> 0:09:45.439 He realized, oh ship like they were like decked out 0:09:45.760 --> 0:09:49.400 like uniforms. It's fairly common. Yeah, he was, he was. 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:53.240 He was impressed by the professional you'd be. You'd be 0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:56.480 surprised on on the on the level of copycat with 0:09:56.480 --> 0:09:59.720 with not even just uniforms, but vehicles of of what 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:02.439 folks will try to do. We've seen more control, We've 0:10:02.480 --> 0:10:06.040 seen FedEx, We've seen ups, a whole number of different things, 0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:09.199 vehicles that that smuggles will try to use to get 0:10:09.200 --> 0:10:12.000 their their product. You guys almost bust me in Yannie 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:15.480 one time. Remember we're driving around and Douglas trying to 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:19.160 find a place to go. We're kind of lost in 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:21.719 Douglas and we're in a rental van and eventually we 0:10:21.760 --> 0:10:25.680 got pulled over by board as soon as they looked 0:10:25.679 --> 0:10:27.640 in the window and we're like, they're like, what do 0:10:27.640 --> 0:10:29.760 you guys? We said, they're just basically get out of here, 0:10:30.559 --> 0:10:34.079 but we're kind of lost, stopping and starting and well, yeah, 0:10:34.080 --> 0:10:36.960 because we had to, Uh, I forget we had maybe 0:10:37.880 --> 0:10:41.040 we're going to leave a gun that we didn't have 0:10:41.120 --> 0:10:44.160 the proper proper permit for. We're doing a firearms delivered. 0:10:44.960 --> 0:10:49.000 We yeah, stashed firearm for a week while we were 0:10:49.040 --> 0:10:50.880 while we were in Mexico and then come back and 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:53.240 get it on the way just at a buddy's mom's house, 0:10:53.280 --> 0:10:56.760 you know, and uh couldn't find her house, found it. 0:10:56.800 --> 0:10:59.520 I just quickly run to the house, drop off a gun, 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:04.040 come back, and yeah, that got us flagged. It makes 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:05.640 you wonder if they were falling into the whole time 0:11:07.440 --> 0:11:11.160 we got into. We did a wild horse episode and 0:11:11.200 --> 0:11:13.160 that touches you guys in a handful ways, which is internet. 0:11:13.200 --> 0:11:16.320 We're getting into that breaking wild horses used for border 0:11:16.320 --> 0:11:20.320 patrol stuff. Uh. The episode James words focus on impacts 0:11:20.320 --> 0:11:23.160 of wild horse overpopulation to public and tribal lands and 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:27.240 efforts of the BLM Wild Horse and Burrow Program, which 0:11:27.520 --> 0:11:32.240 US Border Patrol is a consumer of US Border Patrol 0:11:32.280 --> 0:11:38.080 employees wild mustangs for horse patrol operations in strategic locations 0:11:38.080 --> 0:11:43.520 on both the northern and southern borders. That's a trip, absolutely, absolutely, yeah, 0:11:43.559 --> 0:11:44.959 I guess can tell me again what you guys pay 0:11:45.000 --> 0:11:47.000 for one of those horses. I don't know the exact 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:50.400 dollar amount, but compared to like buying a bread quarter horse, 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:53.199 it's you know, pennies on the dollar from want to understand, 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:58.120 and a dog is eight nine thousand bucks. Yeah, trained, trained, trained, 0:11:58.480 --> 0:12:03.280 trained horses three or something five? Maybe yeah, Um, I 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:07.360 don't know what that says about dogs and horses. We 0:12:07.360 --> 0:12:10.880 we said we covered episode one oh two l Surprise, 0:12:10.960 --> 0:12:14.720 Oh the gray ghost touches on dangers acrossing the border 0:12:14.800 --> 0:12:19.280 hunting near the border in Cartel Country head on Chairman 0:12:19.360 --> 0:12:23.400 Rob Bishop former Chairman Rob Bishop, uh exploring the potential 0:12:23.440 --> 0:12:27.559 impacts of infrastructure on public lands. US Border Patrol owns 0:12:27.600 --> 0:12:31.160 the requirements that inform the development of barrier systems along 0:12:31.200 --> 0:12:35.840 the southwest border, often referred to as the Wall. Let 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:37.760 me ask you. Let me ask you a quickie if 0:12:37.800 --> 0:12:45.720 you guys had to rate, Okay, one being ten being 0:12:46.160 --> 0:12:51.160 laying in bed with your spouse at night, and how 0:12:51.200 --> 0:12:56.640 you might feel at liberty to talk about your opinions. Okay, 0:12:56.720 --> 0:13:02.520 that's ten. One being you're with the president tracking where 0:13:02.520 --> 0:13:04.880 do where do you sit in your liberty to express 0:13:05.120 --> 0:13:14.320 opinion right now? Um? I think it depends on the question. Okay, 0:13:14.559 --> 0:13:21.720 So so i'd say low. Again, I wouldn't say that. 0:13:21.760 --> 0:13:24.120 I mean, I think it just depends on the question, 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:27.679 right because obviously what we're a branch of the executive government, 0:13:27.720 --> 0:13:31.559 so we're bound by by the administration. But uh, um, 0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:35.920 my opinion, uh kind of falls along with with that direction. 0:13:36.000 --> 0:13:38.280 But it just depends on the question. Okay, Well we'll 0:13:38.280 --> 0:13:43.640 see maybe that beyond rate, how honestly felt the replies, Okay, 0:13:45.440 --> 0:13:46.760 but I feel like I don't know if you did 0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:49.560 a good job of setting the parameters, cause I feel 0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:52.120 like you have to be honest with both your spouse 0:13:52.200 --> 0:13:54.760 and the president. No, dude, if you if you let's 0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:56.880 say you're one of these fellows and you get invited 0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:58.120 to the White House, you're not gonna go in there 0:13:58.120 --> 0:14:00.360 and let me tell you what I think gonna go 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:02.280 in there and be like, you're gonna go there and 0:14:02.320 --> 0:14:06.280 be like, sir, take a picture and you're Okay. I'm 0:14:06.320 --> 0:14:07.439 not going to go in there and be like, Hey, 0:14:08.240 --> 0:14:14.520 from a personal opinion perspective, but at night with your wife, 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:18.880 just I'm the most fucked up thing iver, you know 0:14:18.920 --> 0:14:23.320 what I mean? Like, whatever, Charles, what would you say? Um, 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:25.480 I just finished my details, So I think I'd be 0:14:25.520 --> 0:14:28.160 more at liberty to just let you know, no. No. 0:14:28.360 --> 0:14:32.000 But now I think with with all of us within 0:14:32.200 --> 0:14:35.400 within the patrol um, you know, I feel comfortable saying that, 0:14:35.480 --> 0:14:39.120 you know, just like what she was just talking about, 0:14:39.160 --> 0:14:41.880 you know, I mean we do have that that executive branch. 0:14:41.960 --> 0:14:45.200 But along with along with that, I mean we all 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:47.720 overall we have the mindset of you know, we want 0:14:47.800 --> 0:14:50.960 what's best for the country. Overall, we want to do 0:14:51.040 --> 0:14:55.040 what's right not only you know, for our our fellow agents, 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:57.920 but also for you know, our fellow man and woman 0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:01.080 you know and child, for the country. We're all looking 0:15:01.160 --> 0:15:05.680 at what's best for creating a good um set up 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:09.720 for national security um although within the border patrol you 0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:12.520 have additional things that you need to be concerned about. 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:16.119 What's best for the technology deployment, what's best for recruiting 0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:19.920 and maintaining our caudre of agents. For for me, within 0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:22.600 public lands, not only what's best for national security, but 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:25.600 it's what what's best for the relationship we share with 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:29.200 our land management partners and our stakeholders. And so it's 0:15:29.240 --> 0:15:31.720 it's trying to find that that good balance and then 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:35.040 being able to deliver that balance, you know, in a 0:15:35.080 --> 0:15:38.680 way that's palatable to both sides, to to understand and 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:43.360 to um accept, collaborate on and move forward from. You're. 0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:46.160 The only area I'm gonna really care about the level 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:52.120 of honesty is when later I ask about based on experts, 0:15:52.160 --> 0:15:56.080 based on opinions of being around, when I ask about 0:15:56.080 --> 0:15:59.280 any insights you guys might have around the question of 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:06.240 wildlife migrations in the border wall. Yeah, So I'll be 0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:08.480 the only no, no, don't do it now. But I'll 0:16:08.520 --> 0:16:10.840 just say this. I would say that if I was 0:16:10.840 --> 0:16:13.000 asked to going to the president and provide my opinion 0:16:13.080 --> 0:16:16.960 on on X topic, I would provide my opinion and 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:19.320 whether he decided to take it or not would be 0:16:19.360 --> 0:16:22.920 completely up to him. So the thing is it really accurate? 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:25.400 Is it? And so I the question would be, is 0:16:25.400 --> 0:16:27.080 is if if you were to ask me a question 0:16:27.120 --> 0:16:31.160 of if if walls work, my statement to be yes, 0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:34.000 we have data that says they work. If you were 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:37.520 to ask me, um, in my opinion, do I support walls? 0:16:37.800 --> 0:16:40.400 I wouldn't answer that question because I'm in line with 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:43.440 what the administration wants to do and that my opinion 0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:46.280 as a leader walls work because the data says that 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:48.760 walls work. Whether or not I agree with walls or 0:16:48.800 --> 0:16:51.640 not is my own personal opinion, and I think it's 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:55.760 good business to keep my personal opinion out of professional 0:16:56.600 --> 0:17:00.240 So like you're interested, you're you're you're comfortable with an 0:17:00.280 --> 0:17:04.680 opinion around or not an opinion, You're comfortable with objective analysis, 0:17:04.720 --> 0:17:11.920 but not like subjective opinions. Absolutely, okay, Uh so what 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:13.200 I want to ask, But I don't want to spend 0:17:13.160 --> 0:17:14.640 a ton of time on this, but I think Karn 0:17:14.680 --> 0:17:18.320 spoke to you about my my desire to get a 0:17:18.359 --> 0:17:20.520 person to come in here to minister a lie detector 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:25.840 the mediator office fish highest mystery. Well, I got a 0:17:25.880 --> 0:17:33.080 new lead on last night, no good lead. It's no, no, no, 0:17:33.119 --> 0:17:35.960 not the crime. So now who stole my fish? I 0:17:36.000 --> 0:17:38.159 got a good lead on getting a detector person in. 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:42.080 How much how much exposed you guys have to in 0:17:42.160 --> 0:17:45.880 minister in lie detectors? Me personally, I mean I led 0:17:45.920 --> 0:17:49.280 the recruiting division before I left headquarters and James worked 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:52.679 for me over there. So I haven't a little bit 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:55.760 of information on on the CBP polygraph But I was 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:59.400 in law enforcement in Colorado and have taken many polygraphs. 0:17:59.440 --> 0:18:04.560 So do UM sure of having one of them polygraphs? 0:18:04.640 --> 0:18:06.920 What's the Do you guys have a hot tip from 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:09.040 from being an enforcement a hot tip about how to 0:18:09.080 --> 0:18:12.120 tell when someone's spinning your yarn? Well, I would say 0:18:12.160 --> 0:18:14.119 that the best way to be and and we'll talk 0:18:14.119 --> 0:18:16.720 a little bit about read techniques right when you're he 0:18:16.760 --> 0:18:19.760 asked somebody a baseline of questions, right, if I'm talking 0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:22.160 to honest second asked, hey, where were you born? And 0:18:22.200 --> 0:18:24.439 he would give me that response, and I'm I'd be 0:18:24.480 --> 0:18:27.280 watching what he's doing. So it's like whether or not 0:18:27.400 --> 0:18:29.760 he has a lie detector hooked up to right. Well, not, 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:31.719 you don't even need a lie detective hooking up to him. 0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:33.520 So if I was to ask Johnnie, what was the 0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:36.520 do it with? What was the greatest hunt that you 0:18:36.600 --> 0:18:39.879 ever had? Oh, that's when I went with Steve to 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:47.960 Kentucky and we killed squirrels. So and that would be 0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:50.480 based on on on the baseline questions right where I'd 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:54.720 ask and watching his eyes. So historically, when people access 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.399 a part of their brain that's truth, they'll look to 0:18:57.480 --> 0:18:59.800 that side of their brain. So when they go to 0:18:59.800 --> 0:19:02.719 tell a lie, they look to the other side because 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:08.639 now their eyes literally literally move. What's the true side? Well, 0:19:08.680 --> 0:19:10.760 you'll have to do That's why you asked the baseline questions, 0:19:11.000 --> 0:19:12.680 things that you know are true. What's your name, where 0:19:12.680 --> 0:19:14.840 were you born? You know how old are you? And 0:19:14.880 --> 0:19:17.159 you watched their eyes? Yeah, So a follow up to 0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:21.399 that would be uh to to determine truthfulness would be so, Yanni, 0:19:22.480 --> 0:19:24.480 you know, what would you say to someone else who 0:19:24.480 --> 0:19:26.680 wants to go on a hunt in Kentucky for squirrels 0:19:26.680 --> 0:19:34.240 with Steve. Would you recommend that? Did I asked the 0:19:34.320 --> 0:19:37.680 question about his st if you want, I asked my question. 0:19:38.760 --> 0:19:40.560 So I'll just give you I'm just part of a 0:19:40.600 --> 0:19:42.840 test here, bro what I asked him what his greatest 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:46.359 hunt was. His eyes actually flittered to my right or 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:49.240 his left. But when he asked him the other question 0:19:49.320 --> 0:19:51.480 we was going to make something up, they dotted to 0:19:51.680 --> 0:19:54.120 his right and my left. So that's how you can 0:19:54.119 --> 0:19:56.919 determine whether or not they're being honestly. Yeah. I use 0:19:57.000 --> 0:19:58.439 it with my kids all the time. They ate me. 0:19:59.480 --> 0:20:02.120 So Steve, if you give, you know, if we get 0:20:02.119 --> 0:20:05.359 a couple of more tips, maybe you could actually, you know, 0:20:05.640 --> 0:20:08.800 be the question er. But if you start wearing shades 0:20:08.840 --> 0:20:11.520 around here, you get a situation. Let's say you just 0:20:11.600 --> 0:20:13.560 encounter you en connor someone and you and you just 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:15.560 talk to him. We had a cop on the other day, 0:20:16.240 --> 0:20:17.800 but he wasn't here as a cop. He was here 0:20:17.800 --> 0:20:21.080 as a Walleye tournament person. But I said to him, man, 0:20:21.119 --> 0:20:24.760 you gotta spend half your time having people tell you 0:20:24.880 --> 0:20:27.800 telling you bullshit or whatever. And he said, yeah, but 0:20:27.880 --> 0:20:30.119 you probably spend half your time people telling you bullshit 0:20:30.359 --> 0:20:32.280 because it's just it's everywhere. It's not like it's just 0:20:32.359 --> 0:20:38.080 in my world, you know. But how do you, uh like, 0:20:38.760 --> 0:20:41.080 how quickly do you know someone's not being fourth right? 0:20:41.400 --> 0:20:42.920 So you just like I said, when you established that 0:20:42.960 --> 0:20:45.120 baseline of questions, you've got an idea where they're gonna look, 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:49.320 and then you start something you go to and then 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:51.280 when you start digging down to the questions, then it's 0:20:51.280 --> 0:20:54.000 the other non physical things they can control. They cover 0:20:54.080 --> 0:20:56.760 their arms because they're they're creating a barrier between you 0:20:56.800 --> 0:20:59.320 and them, or they push themselves back, they lean back, 0:20:59.359 --> 0:21:02.320 they put their feed up, They create barriers. So whenever 0:21:02.400 --> 0:21:06.000 somebody's lying to you there they don't sit comfortably. They 0:21:06.720 --> 0:21:10.240 physically can't control themselves, so they create barriers. So when 0:21:10.280 --> 0:21:12.280 you talk to people, you can see them starting to 0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:14.520 do those kind of things. You should be telling people 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:19.639 this dead straight on and I'm gonna lean toward the 0:21:19.640 --> 0:21:23.800 person unless there's an absolute sociopath work in the media. 0:21:24.680 --> 0:21:27.200 But isn't it like, isn't it if you are looking 0:21:27.240 --> 0:21:30.959 like dead straight that you're not able to hold that 0:21:31.040 --> 0:21:34.240 consistently And if like someone is being questioned and they're 0:21:34.280 --> 0:21:36.600 trying not to lie, they'll try to do the opposite 0:21:36.840 --> 0:21:39.560 of the thing that's anticipated of them. So if Steve 0:21:39.640 --> 0:21:42.480 is looking you, looking at you dead center too much, 0:21:42.560 --> 0:21:45.080 that might signal something and you're breaking the tension of 0:21:45.080 --> 0:21:46.960 a gaze would be a would be a you know, 0:21:46.960 --> 0:21:49.480 a nonverbal queue. Well what does that mean? Break? And 0:21:49.600 --> 0:21:51.080 I know what it means, But what does that tell you? 0:21:51.200 --> 0:21:53.200 If I mean, if they're locked on and they can't 0:21:53.720 --> 0:21:56.040 they can't look at you straight while actually telling something 0:21:56.600 --> 0:22:00.879 that's false. They can't physically take the tes of looking 0:22:00.920 --> 0:22:04.159 you directly in to tell you that. It's easier for 0:22:04.160 --> 0:22:08.159 people to hold the gaze telling the truth. It's easier 0:22:08.160 --> 0:22:11.520 to tell him, yes, yes, you're you're gonna be. Someone 0:22:11.560 --> 0:22:15.080 who's truthful is going to be actively engaged in the conversation, 0:22:16.000 --> 0:22:20.280 probably like remembering, pointing at things the cooler was here, 0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:24.119 uh this, And they're because they're recollecting things that actually happened, 0:22:24.119 --> 0:22:27.159 where someone who's lying is going to be searching and 0:22:27.240 --> 0:22:30.240 breaking that that tension. So there's actually a video out 0:22:30.240 --> 0:22:33.720 there Manuel Noriega back in the in the late nineties 0:22:33.720 --> 0:22:36.160 where that he was being interviewed by somebody on on 0:22:36.400 --> 0:22:38.199 the news and they were talking about a bunch of 0:22:38.200 --> 0:22:40.800 things and he had exactly where you're talking about, where 0:22:40.800 --> 0:22:43.359 he had this stet set gaze and they got to 0:22:43.400 --> 0:22:45.400 the question, well, how much money do you really make? 0:22:45.800 --> 0:22:48.440 And you can watch the video, his eyes go from here, 0:22:48.880 --> 0:22:50.800 this is how much I make. I can't tell him 0:22:50.840 --> 0:22:53.199 that all the way over here to this is what 0:22:53.240 --> 0:22:55.159 I'm going to tell him, And that that video is 0:22:55.160 --> 0:22:57.119 actually out there on YouTube. So if you go and 0:22:57.119 --> 0:22:58.800 find that, he'll give you a pretty good idea of 0:22:59.119 --> 0:23:01.360 to the video where he's locked in and they asked 0:23:01.440 --> 0:23:03.760 him a question and he looks in that you can 0:23:03.760 --> 0:23:07.080 see that whole eye movement back and forth. Nick Nixon 0:23:07.080 --> 0:23:10.840 in the in the White Waters, the famous videos, he 0:23:10.840 --> 0:23:14.119 has a tell he oh yeah, right, like before he says, 0:23:14.160 --> 0:23:16.400 you know, I didn't there was no misconduct. He says 0:23:16.440 --> 0:23:19.080 like three different things. To prepare the national audience too, 0:23:19.600 --> 0:23:21.240 you know, listen to me. I want you to hear 0:23:21.280 --> 0:23:25.280 me clearly. He's like, I'm preparing the nation to for 0:23:25.320 --> 0:23:26.600 what I'm about to lie to you about it. And 0:23:26.720 --> 0:23:28.880 he's trying to like re encourage everyone that what I'm 0:23:28.880 --> 0:23:31.399 about to say instead of just telling the truth. He 0:23:31.440 --> 0:23:34.119 prepares everybody for what he's about to lie about. Incidentally, 0:23:34.119 --> 0:23:35.879 Bill Clinton did the same thing on the whole Monica 0:23:35.960 --> 0:23:38.600 Lewinsky thing, come out and said, I want to tell 0:23:38.640 --> 0:23:41.520 the American people, can you talk about this this triangle 0:23:41.640 --> 0:23:45.080 signal templing when you're when you're when you're templing your 0:23:45.920 --> 0:23:49.399 you're it's like a make a show up dominance, Like 0:23:49.440 --> 0:23:53.000 I am, It's like, I'm over you. Can you describe 0:23:53.000 --> 0:23:55.560 what that is? Like your pointer describing to me over 0:23:55.560 --> 0:23:58.120 the phone. I thought it was Clinton's signature deal where 0:23:58.119 --> 0:24:01.920 he like, imagine you make a fist. So I'm just 0:24:01.920 --> 0:24:06.080 just to the audience. Imagine you make a fist that's 0:24:06.160 --> 0:24:09.159 sitting vertical, so your knuckles are lined up vertical. Clinton 0:24:09.200 --> 0:24:12.520 would then roll his thumb over the top so it 0:24:12.640 --> 0:24:17.080 left so his thumb would rest on the middle knuckle 0:24:17.160 --> 0:24:19.639 of his pointer finger. I think it was like, I 0:24:19.720 --> 0:24:21.840 think he must have had a pointing habit. I think 0:24:21.920 --> 0:24:23.920 he did that in that you know I did not 0:24:24.240 --> 0:24:27.040 and like driving the point fold yeah, and I think 0:24:27.040 --> 0:24:30.399 that someone said don't it's too aggressive, and so he 0:24:30.440 --> 0:24:32.360 started to go up in that. But he would then 0:24:32.560 --> 0:24:35.440 roll that pointer finger and he'd have that little thumb 0:24:35.440 --> 0:24:39.240 pointing out and it was widely parodied. So when criminals 0:24:39.240 --> 0:24:41.760 talking about Clinton's hands, I thought she was talking about that, 0:24:41.800 --> 0:24:44.399 But you're talking about him making up some and I 0:24:44.400 --> 0:24:46.960 guess him putting his fingers together, making a little church. 0:24:47.320 --> 0:24:49.800 It's like templing, is what I believe they call it. Yeah, 0:24:49.800 --> 0:24:52.000 it's a it's a show of dominance over who you're 0:24:52.000 --> 0:24:57.200 talking to. Apparently it's a subconscious thing. Yeah, I think 0:24:57.200 --> 0:25:00.199 I did bring my kids, but I associate it was 0:25:00.280 --> 0:25:04.960 trying to like calm myself down where I'm like, listen, 0:25:07.600 --> 0:25:15.760 look me in the eye. Yeah, I'm establishing dominance for sure. Yeah. Uh, 0:25:16.119 --> 0:25:19.919 gotta plug our trivia tournament. We're gonna crown a trivia 0:25:20.040 --> 0:25:25.600 champion three tournament episodes. So the way it's gonna go, 0:25:25.800 --> 0:25:27.760 it's gonna be like an elimination thing. I'm trying to 0:25:27.800 --> 0:25:31.120 think of a good sports analogy, but I can't help 0:25:31.160 --> 0:25:39.320 me out any playoff, playoff, any bracket ever start with 0:25:40.760 --> 0:25:46.400 you guys play along the mediator trivia. Ever, it's unfortunate 0:25:46.480 --> 0:25:48.840 we're not we're not having one today because we were 0:25:48.880 --> 0:25:54.240 all prepared. I came in thinking we probably were. Yeah, 0:25:54.359 --> 0:25:57.720 you're him in trouble. I continue to hear from Tommy Edson, 0:25:57.720 --> 0:26:00.920 the blue collar scholar who always sends me his scorecard 0:26:01.040 --> 0:26:03.399 on his steering wheel because he does it on a 0:26:03.480 --> 0:26:07.040 lunch break or something at work. And of course he 0:26:07.119 --> 0:26:09.400 said me the other day he had to not tell 0:26:09.480 --> 0:26:11.520 me Gus thinks he's be the randing champion. But then 0:26:11.560 --> 0:26:14.840 we had him here and he didn't win. I don't 0:26:14.840 --> 0:26:18.640 know what, I don't know. I gotta get him back here. 0:26:18.840 --> 0:26:23.000 He's always telling me he won this and one that. Um, 0:26:23.040 --> 0:26:25.119 we're gonna start with four teen players and weed him 0:26:25.119 --> 0:26:27.879 out as we go a lot of drama and surprises 0:26:27.920 --> 0:26:34.720 along the way. Well, Brody NDErs, Um, you know I'm 0:26:34.760 --> 0:26:37.560 not I'm not talk to hr about this age is 0:26:37.640 --> 0:26:41.000 and thing going on while you're doing it. You know 0:26:41.320 --> 0:26:43.199 I'm gonna go down there with you. Yeah, because you 0:26:43.200 --> 0:26:45.399 know what I learned His age is. Um. Did you 0:26:45.400 --> 0:26:49.800 know that you can't dog on someone for not knowing technology? 0:26:51.600 --> 0:26:56.359 M that's ages. Um, you can't say, oh, he's not 0:26:56.520 --> 0:26:59.680 tech savvy of a person of my age, and that's 0:26:59.720 --> 0:27:03.200 all anybody does. His goof on me. I get skinny shamed, 0:27:03.680 --> 0:27:07.760 I get tech shamed. YEP. So yeah, let me know 0:27:07.760 --> 0:27:11.320 what that age. We'll go down there and I'll be like, 0:27:11.640 --> 0:27:13.760 Brownie has some complaints about me, and I have some 0:27:13.760 --> 0:27:17.080 complaints about everybody else. Was it inappropriate for me to 0:27:17.080 --> 0:27:21.600 say Phil sounded twice his age? I don't know. Yeah, 0:27:21.720 --> 0:27:28.720 that's that's kind of complex. Come down business here. Now, 0:27:28.760 --> 0:27:31.560 I'd like to tell you complaint about these podcasts. Guess 0:27:31.600 --> 0:27:36.119 we had to get your take on something. Oh, this 0:27:36.160 --> 0:27:37.920 guy wrote it. Really See, I'm telling you I got 0:27:37.920 --> 0:27:40.000 two stories for you, guys, but they're they're appropriate because 0:27:40.000 --> 0:27:43.560 they both border on law enforcement and lawbreaking kind of. 0:27:44.400 --> 0:27:47.239 So a guy, a guy rode in. It takes a 0:27:47.240 --> 0:27:53.679 lot of um somethings like that takes a lot of 0:27:54.359 --> 0:27:59.639 I don't know, gumption. Let's say, yeah, we use a 0:27:59.680 --> 0:28:01.719 lot of you. Oh, I was wrong on a Yiddish 0:28:01.720 --> 0:28:06.480 word recently, making love is to stop. Oh, I didn't 0:28:06.480 --> 0:28:13.000 know that stuck. It's stuck stuck and uh someone wrote 0:28:13.000 --> 0:28:18.720 in to correct me. Will so check this out. Will 0:28:18.840 --> 0:28:25.560 from Omaha, Nebraska. This is an insane story. He's hunt 0:28:25.600 --> 0:28:28.040 a piece of land. So he's in Nebraska. He's hunt 0:28:28.080 --> 0:28:30.159 a piece of land accessible only by boat on the 0:28:30.200 --> 0:28:34.720 Missouri River. Okay, he had decided to take. So he's 0:28:34.720 --> 0:28:36.679 going out scout and he wants to take down his 0:28:36.720 --> 0:28:38.920 own dear stand because he's got a camera out and 0:28:38.920 --> 0:28:41.920 there's no action on the trail camera. He says he 0:28:41.960 --> 0:28:44.560 had noticed that there had been a stand that had 0:28:44.600 --> 0:28:46.720 been sitting in the same spot in the woods for 0:28:46.840 --> 0:28:52.240 three years, on the same piece of public land. In Nebraska, 0:28:52.600 --> 0:28:56.760 a stand becomes legally abandoned after February, Right, So if 0:28:56.800 --> 0:28:58.760 you put a stand in public land in Nebraska, you 0:28:58.840 --> 0:29:01.880 got till February take it down, at which point it's 0:29:01.920 --> 0:29:06.400 it becomes part of the public property. He decides to, 0:29:06.520 --> 0:29:10.160 as he put it, acquired that stand, and he froll 0:29:10.200 --> 0:29:13.480 sees to go down do some scouting, and that's I 0:29:13.480 --> 0:29:15.640 think that's like a good thing to do because he's 0:29:15.640 --> 0:29:17.880 not only acquiring his stand, but he's cleaning cleaning the 0:29:17.880 --> 0:29:20.200 woods up. Oh man, there's one I got my eye 0:29:20.200 --> 0:29:22.240 on on a chunk of state land. It's been there 0:29:22.240 --> 0:29:26.200 for three years. Well talk to this guy first. Where 0:29:26.240 --> 0:29:29.280 the story gets crazy. He also had set out a 0:29:29.320 --> 0:29:31.560 line for catfish, so he goes to check out his 0:29:31.640 --> 0:29:34.320 line for catfish. He's messing with his catfish line and 0:29:34.400 --> 0:29:39.440 another boat pulls up, asked him if he's seen anyone 0:29:39.520 --> 0:29:42.720 in the area because they just had a stand stolen. 0:29:44.520 --> 0:29:47.760 He says, cool. I messed up by panicking and not 0:29:47.880 --> 0:29:50.640 confessing that it was me and tried to play it 0:29:50.680 --> 0:29:54.520 off like I didn't know. He then he was looking 0:29:54.520 --> 0:29:58.000 to the right side of his brain, like I was shocked. 0:29:58.200 --> 0:30:02.520 This guys after this guy's writing in about this. He says, 0:30:02.560 --> 0:30:05.440 they then decided to check my boat and found their stand. 0:30:06.280 --> 0:30:09.040 They went into a fury, and when I tried to 0:30:09.080 --> 0:30:12.600 explain my reasoning, it made no difference to them. They demanded, 0:30:12.680 --> 0:30:15.440 under threat of violence, that I showed them my I 0:30:15.560 --> 0:30:18.840 d and then asked if I had taken a ship 0:30:18.920 --> 0:30:32.280 by their setup. I had, he says, they had. He 0:30:32.400 --> 0:30:35.840 says they had a whole illegal camp set up with 0:30:35.920 --> 0:30:38.520 two by fours nailed into trees to make a windbreak, 0:30:38.520 --> 0:30:41.080 and a picnic table and a fire pit. But he 0:30:41.200 --> 0:30:43.479 thought this stuff was from years past and it was 0:30:43.560 --> 0:30:45.760 obvious they had been there a long time, so nature 0:30:45.800 --> 0:30:49.440 called I took a dump there. They then demanded, once 0:30:49.480 --> 0:30:51.720 again under threats of kicking my ass, that I pick 0:30:51.840 --> 0:30:58.040 up my ship with my bare hands, and so I 0:30:58.080 --> 0:31:00.360 did what I had to do to not get eat up. 0:31:02.000 --> 0:31:04.280 Then left was told to not come back there again. 0:31:05.320 --> 0:31:07.480 I'm still gonna hunt there because I did see some 0:31:07.600 --> 0:31:13.920 nice scrapes. And that's man dedicated to the cause right there. 0:31:14.920 --> 0:31:17.680 He wanted to get our opinion on it. I don't 0:31:17.920 --> 0:31:22.400 have no opinions. I have one opinion. He's a service shitter. 0:31:22.680 --> 0:31:25.760 Oh that's bad. Oh yeah, that ainion. Yeah, but the 0:31:25.840 --> 0:31:30.360 other guys the wrong too. Right sorted out with the 0:31:30.400 --> 0:31:33.440 game Warden. Two wrongs don't make it. He should have 0:31:33.480 --> 0:31:36.480 buried his uh ship and then he wouldn't at least 0:31:36.480 --> 0:31:42.440 would have had half the problems that he had. He Um. 0:31:42.520 --> 0:31:45.000 He says, Also, I'd like to serve as an example 0:31:45.360 --> 0:31:47.320 of how even if you're not breaking the law, you 0:31:47.320 --> 0:31:49.800 can still find yourself in trouble, and once caught, just 0:31:49.840 --> 0:31:52.880 tell the truth because if you don't, nothing you say 0:31:52.960 --> 0:31:56.880 after that half will be believable. Also, don't ship in 0:31:56.920 --> 0:32:04.000 other people's camps. Um, here's what I want to bring up. 0:32:04.000 --> 0:32:05.720 But it's this is gonna this is gonna take some 0:32:05.760 --> 0:32:14.080 production skills. Yanni, do you remember long ago what episode 0:32:14.160 --> 0:32:19.600 number was that Double Digits Episode sixty. We recorded an 0:32:19.640 --> 0:32:26.280 episode in Guyana with a mkushi man named Roven Alvin. 0:32:26.640 --> 0:32:30.400 I do remember this. Do you remember what Roven told 0:32:30.520 --> 0:32:36.280 us was going on with the local white lipped peckery population. 0:32:38.040 --> 0:32:42.600 I remember something about that he told us. He told 0:32:42.680 --> 0:32:46.880 us that they were having a problem because there was 0:32:46.920 --> 0:32:50.720 a village down the river that was jealous of his 0:32:50.920 --> 0:32:58.040 village's prosperity, and they had a shaman who had locked 0:32:58.200 --> 0:33:03.160 all of their packery's in a mountain, And they had 0:33:03.200 --> 0:33:06.080 a young shaman in their village that they were hoping 0:33:07.000 --> 0:33:11.480 would get trained up and developed the necessary skills to 0:33:11.760 --> 0:33:17.600 unlock the packers from the mountain because they hunt white 0:33:17.640 --> 0:33:21.360 lipp packeries. The other day, I'm looking through my emails 0:33:21.400 --> 0:33:26.280 and there's, uh, I subscribe to a news list and 0:33:26.320 --> 0:33:29.480 there's a email there's an article, a study called the 0:33:29.520 --> 0:33:36.240 case of Latin America's mysterious disappearing and reappearing white lip packeries. 0:33:37.200 --> 0:33:40.120 And it gets into how so they look very similar 0:33:40.120 --> 0:33:42.200 to a ha alina, which is a collared packery, but 0:33:42.240 --> 0:33:46.320 they run in herds of two. I mean, there's there's 0:33:46.360 --> 0:33:48.280 a video attached to this article that just is like 0:33:48.320 --> 0:33:51.840 a cross, like a a trail along the river and 0:33:52.240 --> 0:33:54.640 it just goes on for seven eight minutes. My kids 0:33:54.680 --> 0:33:56.440 love it. It's just seven eight minutes of white lip 0:33:56.440 --> 0:34:01.600 peckeries just flooding through across this trail. Uh. And it 0:34:01.680 --> 0:34:06.320 goes on to talk about this research to document large 0:34:06.360 --> 0:34:11.120 scale white lipped peckery disappearances and wild population cycling across 0:34:11.160 --> 0:34:16.839 the range in Latin America, and it alludes to indigenous 0:34:16.880 --> 0:34:21.319 people's mythologies that were built up to explain how it 0:34:21.360 --> 0:34:27.120 could happen that one minute there's hundreds and you're living 0:34:27.120 --> 0:34:30.000 off them. In the next minute they're just gone. And 0:34:30.040 --> 0:34:37.120 the article talked about that very thing. Um. Other More, 0:34:37.560 --> 0:34:40.160 what would you used for it? Not a cult? That's 0:34:40.200 --> 0:34:43.040 not the right word spiritual X. I don't know is 0:34:43.040 --> 0:34:46.279 that the right word? Spiritual explanations? What would you say? 0:34:46.680 --> 0:34:51.520 Other worldly explanations? Maybe spiritual explanations for a phenomenon that 0:34:51.640 --> 0:34:54.080 researchers are just now trying to understand. It goes on 0:34:54.200 --> 0:34:56.920 and on, but I think we should revisit that story 0:34:58.120 --> 0:35:01.120 um from Rovin as much as much as as possible, 0:35:01.680 --> 0:35:04.759 and then think about that where this paper it goes 0:35:04.800 --> 0:35:08.520 on and on about these wild population migrations and fluctuations 0:35:08.960 --> 0:35:13.000 and talks about this being a long standing puzzle among 0:35:13.080 --> 0:35:19.160 indigenous people's roban. We talked about something privately, and if 0:35:19.200 --> 0:35:20.640 you don't want to talk about you don't have to. 0:35:21.160 --> 0:35:25.840 But would you mind talking to a public audience about 0:35:25.880 --> 0:35:29.640 what happened with the packeries or is that something you 0:35:29.680 --> 0:35:34.520 don't want to discuss, like why you're not seeing them 0:35:34.600 --> 0:35:45.279 right now? Well, um, we have sha men. They are 0:35:45.360 --> 0:35:50.480 like the I would say, they're like the doctor's northst 0:35:50.520 --> 0:35:52.759 Livory you would call in your country. But here we 0:35:52.840 --> 0:35:56.600 have like shamans. They are knowledgeable, they have the power 0:35:56.600 --> 0:36:01.839 of using we call it a Marian science. They can't 0:36:01.840 --> 0:36:06.759 do anything to a fish the river, to animals such 0:36:06.760 --> 0:36:15.600 as pickery is um twelve. Approximately twelve years ago, we 0:36:15.680 --> 0:36:19.720 used to have lots of peckeries coming close to the 0:36:19.840 --> 0:36:23.680 village feeding a white white lit packer. Would you come 0:36:23.760 --> 0:36:25.640 like a one hundred or two hundred of them at 0:36:25.680 --> 0:36:29.239 a time. Yeah, they're like a hog pig. Yeah, we 0:36:29.360 --> 0:36:32.320 call it white. We call havel. We have the collared packer, 0:36:32.400 --> 0:36:35.919 which is called Havilina. This is a bigger, louder, more 0:36:35.960 --> 0:36:41.839 gregarious Havilina species of colored white let packery. So this 0:36:41.840 --> 0:36:44.719 this hugs white hugs. Pickery is used to come and 0:36:44.760 --> 0:36:50.000 feeding in the end of the ponds. We didn't fruits 0:36:50.040 --> 0:36:54.040 not warm. And as you go trout up the river 0:36:54.280 --> 0:36:56.000 you can bump into them. You can head them up 0:36:56.000 --> 0:36:59.239 a destance. You can't even smell them. It's a fine. 0:36:59.480 --> 0:37:01.520 So we to have a lot of fun like shooting, 0:37:01.640 --> 0:37:04.319 and we have like meat. You can barbecue lots of 0:37:04.320 --> 0:37:13.520 barbecues fresh meat. Now in order I'm ranging villages. They 0:37:13.520 --> 0:37:17.440 have people that have very knowledge, like you said show men, 0:37:17.760 --> 0:37:24.080 and because of we um having a lot of food 0:37:25.000 --> 0:37:31.800 and where they don't. Now there's like jealousy if forever, 0:37:31.840 --> 0:37:36.400 if I'm jealous of Steve, Steve is accurately shooting, I 0:37:36.440 --> 0:37:38.680 would do my highest science on Steve and next time 0:37:38.680 --> 0:37:42.080 he would shoot accurate. Anything should is like miss keep 0:37:42.120 --> 0:37:46.880 missing a curse on them. Yeah, So because of my 0:37:47.040 --> 0:37:49.359 I use my high science on him. So people are 0:37:49.440 --> 0:37:52.400 like like that here. So what they do is like 0:37:52.480 --> 0:37:57.719 this top the pickeries, they lock them up somewhere well 0:37:57.760 --> 0:38:01.600 I don't were, but somewhere in the mountains. I have 0:38:01.680 --> 0:38:08.080 no idea using their highest science. Now to get the 0:38:08.120 --> 0:38:11.239 pickers to come out from there, we have to get 0:38:11.280 --> 0:38:16.799 another another shalman that could do the highest science to 0:38:16.960 --> 0:38:20.799 get the pickers out from there because they are lacked 0:38:20.800 --> 0:38:23.360 out there. Now, if we have one like that, we 0:38:23.360 --> 0:38:25.640 could get the speakers out now they will be all 0:38:25.680 --> 0:38:31.240 over again. But that's that's how the pickers had me stopped. 0:38:31.600 --> 0:38:35.600 How did they showman get that get to that level? Well, 0:38:36.320 --> 0:38:38.399 is there someone training or you know what I mean? 0:38:38.480 --> 0:38:41.120 They learn from their parents. Their parents like it was 0:38:41.200 --> 0:38:45.160 like a shaman and smoke, tobacco, trades, nose and you 0:38:45.200 --> 0:38:49.000 know that these a lot of things. They can bring 0:38:49.040 --> 0:38:53.840 them like a fish spirit by shaking the bush in 0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:56.640 the house and doing their things and stuff like that. 0:38:57.640 --> 0:39:01.360 And then they can bring them like a picker is 0:39:02.200 --> 0:39:08.439 h pickery is leader. I would call it that way. Now, hey, 0:39:08.480 --> 0:39:11.520 you know, gab with him, take shout of local drink, 0:39:11.560 --> 0:39:16.400 you know by spirit. And then if the shaman said, okay, 0:39:16.440 --> 0:39:18.840 what I want to luck you up here for a 0:39:18.840 --> 0:39:21.600 while to three years, four five years, how many years 0:39:22.360 --> 0:39:24.759 and be there, I don't come on, I want you 0:39:24.800 --> 0:39:28.520 to be there. I want you to stay there. That's 0:39:28.520 --> 0:39:32.560 how the shaman works. They have like a little power designs. 0:39:32.560 --> 0:39:35.520 They are working so they are like good and bad ones. 0:39:37.120 --> 0:39:41.560 So I don't know if you are here and you said, 0:39:41.560 --> 0:39:44.319 the picker is but we used to have a lot 0:39:44.360 --> 0:39:47.719 of pickers here. We have to have a lot of myths. 0:39:47.840 --> 0:39:50.480 We used to have a lot of fun. But now 0:39:51.040 --> 0:39:55.680 there's no white pickories. We just have the colored ones around. 0:39:56.040 --> 0:39:59.480 Did the did the shaman or the other village that 0:40:00.440 --> 0:40:03.160 use the high science to lock up the packers? Did 0:40:03.239 --> 0:40:06.600 they tell you that they were doing this or did 0:40:06.640 --> 0:40:10.399 the packers just disappear? And then you you you speculated 0:40:10.440 --> 0:40:13.640 that that's why they We we know, we know, we 0:40:13.719 --> 0:40:17.279 know because for a while we didn't any pickeries and 0:40:17.480 --> 0:40:22.840 then we have our shaman. And the village is not perfect, 0:40:22.920 --> 0:40:26.520 but at least you can get some experience. But he 0:40:26.560 --> 0:40:30.080 could already could tell you what is happening. He knows 0:40:30.120 --> 0:40:34.080 what happened. So he said, ah, there's somebody locked them 0:40:34.160 --> 0:40:38.920 up there, so they're there. That's what anymore. Even the 0:40:38.960 --> 0:40:43.839 fish like, if somebody like do something to the river, 0:40:44.600 --> 0:40:49.839 you will hardly get some fish, hardly get some turtles, otters, 0:40:50.120 --> 0:40:56.680 kinmons and so on. So that is how the shaman works. 0:40:56.920 --> 0:41:00.759 There are gooddons and bottons, you know, they could do 0:41:00.800 --> 0:41:06.560 any anything. I understand whoever, like I understand why someone 0:41:06.600 --> 0:41:11.759 would be jealous of rewild village because it's a beautiful 0:41:14.280 --> 0:41:17.160 village that's wonderful to visit. So I understand how someone 0:41:17.200 --> 0:41:20.239 that had a bad village that wasn't this way and 0:41:20.239 --> 0:41:24.000 this friendly and such great people. Um, I see how 0:41:24.000 --> 0:41:27.799 they would get jealous. Yeah, but I don't think that you. 0:41:28.280 --> 0:41:31.479 I don't think that that that that that I hope 0:41:31.480 --> 0:41:34.680 that your packery's come back. Yeah, I hope they come 0:41:34.680 --> 0:41:39.879 back soon. Some day I started to shan wanna being 0:41:39.880 --> 0:41:44.040 like briandad. I hope that I hope that they come back. 0:41:53.840 --> 0:41:55.960 Guy wrote in why I always say that pronghorns smell 0:41:56.000 --> 0:42:01.920 like freedom lay corn chips. It's a bacterial him. Dogs 0:42:01.960 --> 0:42:04.640 get him, Dogs can get him. It's not harmful, but 0:42:04.680 --> 0:42:06.680 that dogs need the same bacteria. It makes them smell 0:42:06.760 --> 0:42:11.840 like corn chips. If I wasn't lying, When you guys 0:42:11.920 --> 0:42:15.680 round up those prong horn, do you ever get a 0:42:15.680 --> 0:42:30.400 whiff of freedo smell? Um? Yeah? What does it smell like? 0:42:30.920 --> 0:42:34.520 It smells like the desert. Yeah, I can't say that 0:42:34.560 --> 0:42:39.520 I've ever smelled corn chips. Smells like not just corn chips, 0:42:39.840 --> 0:42:43.040 Freedo lake. Well, because I was I was thinking about 0:42:43.280 --> 0:42:45.360 a while back, I can't remember which guest it was 0:42:45.440 --> 0:42:49.560 that you had had um. He was talking about how 0:42:49.600 --> 0:42:53.120 like one of his favorite smells is like when your 0:42:53.200 --> 0:42:56.000 dog is sleeping and you know it's a really good 0:42:56.040 --> 0:42:58.239 sleep because your dog gets up and it smells like 0:42:58.280 --> 0:43:01.080 corn chips. And he said I was in my car 0:43:01.200 --> 0:43:03.080 listening to that, and I was like, oh my god, 0:43:03.120 --> 0:43:05.160 I'm not the only one that's ever smelled that, like 0:43:05.200 --> 0:43:07.400 I thought. I thought for sure I was the one 0:43:07.440 --> 0:43:09.680 that was crazy, like because I talked to my kids 0:43:09.680 --> 0:43:12.040 about it and they're like, I don't think I've ever 0:43:12.120 --> 0:43:14.719 smelled that from the dog's dad. And I'm like, I 0:43:14.760 --> 0:43:17.080 swear like sometimes when the dogs sleep, if it's a 0:43:17.120 --> 0:43:20.840 really good sleep, they and it smells like corn chips. 0:43:20.920 --> 0:43:22.920 And I just heard it somebody else, somebody else has 0:43:22.960 --> 0:43:25.920 a dog that does that, and I was super psyched that, Okay, 0:43:26.000 --> 0:43:29.359 I'm not crazy like this is. And now there's scientific 0:43:29.880 --> 0:43:33.240 information that backs up my dogs can smell like corn chips, 0:43:33.239 --> 0:43:35.640 and it's okay. I actually think that's on the it's 0:43:35.680 --> 0:43:39.279 on their paths at the feet's on the path. It's 0:43:39.320 --> 0:43:41.360 not harmful, but it can spin out of control. It 0:43:41.360 --> 0:43:44.279 talks about dogs control their body temperature by paintings, since 0:43:44.320 --> 0:43:46.640 they don't perspire. The only place dogs have to cool 0:43:46.680 --> 0:43:50.279 downs on the bottom of their feet. Chip sizes This 0:43:51.360 --> 0:43:55.480 veterinarian emphasizes that the friedo smell is completely normal and 0:43:55.520 --> 0:43:59.600 doesn't mean that your dog has a bacterial or fungal infection. However, 0:43:59.680 --> 0:44:01.600 he's a it goes on, he's older, they can get 0:44:01.600 --> 0:44:04.920 out of control and uh, your dog can get unhealthy 0:44:05.000 --> 0:44:08.759 feet bumps, redness, swelling, or changes in your dog's behavior, 0:44:09.760 --> 0:44:12.879 So watch out for that. All right, Do you guys 0:44:12.920 --> 0:44:15.000 want to start with the southern border of the Northern border? 0:44:15.360 --> 0:44:21.080 How are you supposed to do this? Mm hmmm, I 0:44:21.120 --> 0:44:26.839 guess like rock, paper scissors? Yeah, where's the wind blowing today? 0:44:26.840 --> 0:44:29.160 Is it coming from the north? STI I was gonna 0:44:29.160 --> 0:44:30.680 say north. I don't know why it's my decision, but 0:44:30.800 --> 0:44:36.960 something start. Let's start with the north. I feel like 0:44:37.120 --> 0:44:47.880 the south is the carrot. What patrol in the northern border? Um, 0:44:47.920 --> 0:44:50.719 I made a joke about it being sleepy, but what 0:44:50.760 --> 0:44:58.480 are the primary what are the primary things that were like, look, 0:44:58.520 --> 0:45:01.719 what are the primary elicit activities that happen along the 0:45:01.760 --> 0:45:05.560 northern border? So in reality, so just a quick one 0:45:05.560 --> 0:45:08.160 on one on on on border patrol. Border patrol is 0:45:08.200 --> 0:45:11.520 one component within Customs and Border Protection UM, and I 0:45:11.560 --> 0:45:13.960 want to make a clarification that there are there are 0:45:14.040 --> 0:45:18.520 three law enforcement components within side Customs and Border Protection 0:45:18.760 --> 0:45:21.400 or can you can you touch on Department Homeland Security 0:45:21.400 --> 0:45:24.080 comes into this department and Homeland Security is the mother agency. 0:45:24.239 --> 0:45:28.200 So uh CVP is basically an agency withinside the Department 0:45:28.200 --> 0:45:30.719 of Homeland Security, which is basically the don't do all 0:45:30.760 --> 0:45:34.879 the acronyms. Yeah yeah, So DHS or Department Homeland Security 0:45:34.920 --> 0:45:38.480 is the cabinet level and then UM the agency level 0:45:38.880 --> 0:45:42.640 is Customs and Border Protection. A better analogy would be 0:45:42.800 --> 0:45:46.840 Department of Justice and FBI. So FBI is a is 0:45:46.880 --> 0:45:50.359 an agency withinside the Department of Justice, and so that's 0:45:50.400 --> 0:45:53.960 where CBP falls in. UM. Border patrol is a component 0:45:54.840 --> 0:45:59.040 of CBP. There are three law enforcement entities of CBP. 0:45:59.520 --> 0:46:01.880 Aaron Bury Aaron Brens are the folks that fly all 0:46:01.880 --> 0:46:05.439 the helicopters and do all the deep water stuff right 0:46:05.760 --> 0:46:08.719 out in in in the Atlantic Oceans. I've never heard 0:46:08.760 --> 0:46:12.719 of that, well, probably because most people don't. Most people 0:46:13.000 --> 0:46:15.000 when they think about the border patrol, they think about 0:46:15.000 --> 0:46:17.359 the people that you encounter a crossing the border. It's 0:46:17.400 --> 0:46:20.600 called air and marine Aaron Marine, Yeah, Aaron Breene operations, 0:46:20.600 --> 0:46:22.680 and they are they are the component they fly all 0:46:22.719 --> 0:46:27.319 the not coastguard. Coastguard is an entity of DHS. So 0:46:27.400 --> 0:46:30.680 do they run like the edge of US waters and 0:46:30.800 --> 0:46:33.800 international waters? Like is that the extent of their range 0:46:33.960 --> 0:46:36.680 or they do along with border patrols. So the separation 0:46:36.719 --> 0:46:38.799 of what we call deep water and brown blue water 0:46:38.800 --> 0:46:41.239 and brown water. So me being a sailor, right, I'm 0:46:41.280 --> 0:46:44.080 a blue water sailor. Coastguards or brown water sailers because 0:46:44.080 --> 0:46:46.319 they hug the they never get out out of side 0:46:46.320 --> 0:46:49.399 of the shore. So are Aeron marine folks? Those guys 0:46:49.440 --> 0:46:51.440 go into the deep water because that they have the 0:46:51.480 --> 0:46:53.960 bigger boats and go out and interact, uh stuff like 0:46:54.000 --> 0:46:57.320 you'd see the Cuban refugees and things coming across in Miami. 0:46:57.640 --> 0:47:00.320 And then our border patrol agents still operate air and 0:47:00.400 --> 0:47:03.279 marine boats, but they operate in the coastal water raise 0:47:03.520 --> 0:47:05.560 the Great Lakes and things like that, and they operate 0:47:05.560 --> 0:47:08.200 within about three to five miles of the coastline. So 0:47:08.320 --> 0:47:15.160 can Aaron Marine operate in international waters? Um? I have 0:47:15.239 --> 0:47:18.480 to do? You remember back in your days. Uh, from 0:47:18.520 --> 0:47:21.960 the on the on the water now, I don't think so. 0:47:22.000 --> 0:47:23.479 I think they get out far enough in the water. 0:47:23.560 --> 0:47:27.800 But in the air, Uh, they have a lot more liberty, 0:47:28.160 --> 0:47:30.200 right for some of their operations they do, so I 0:47:30.200 --> 0:47:33.480 would say the historically they probably stay within federal federal 0:47:33.480 --> 0:47:36.799 waters right and if they are operating outside into into 0:47:36.920 --> 0:47:40.239 international waters, they're probably working in with the Coastguard because 0:47:40.280 --> 0:47:43.200 Coastguard has that ability to do that type of stuff. 0:47:43.560 --> 0:47:45.160 So Aeron Marine they handle like I said, they're all 0:47:45.160 --> 0:47:47.719 our pilots. There are UM and they handle all the 0:47:47.800 --> 0:47:51.680 all the deep water blue water UM activities. UM Office 0:47:51.680 --> 0:47:54.160 of Field Operations. Those are the blue uniforms. Those are 0:47:54.160 --> 0:47:56.239 the folks that you're going to encounter at the port 0:47:56.239 --> 0:47:58.680 of entry and trade and at the airport. So their 0:47:58.719 --> 0:48:04.560 responsibility is between the confines or within the fence line 0:48:04.600 --> 0:48:07.000 of the port of entry. That's what OLD does. So 0:48:07.160 --> 0:48:09.280 when you guys go to Mexico or go to Canada 0:48:09.719 --> 0:48:12.640 and come through a port of entry, you're interacting with 0:48:12.640 --> 0:48:16.880 with officers from field operations and then the Border Patrol 0:48:16.960 --> 0:48:19.480 is the entity. Those are green uniforms. We operate in 0:48:19.520 --> 0:48:22.279 between the ports of entry. So all that traffic that 0:48:22.320 --> 0:48:25.200 comes in of the legal entries is what the border 0:48:25.239 --> 0:48:28.759 patrol is encountering and working on. Got it? Okay, that's 0:48:28.760 --> 0:48:32.840 what you need. Okay, let's say you're crossing. I know, 0:48:32.920 --> 0:48:35.880 we're back to I just can't. I'm going to go 0:48:35.920 --> 0:48:38.719 to the southern border from it. You're crossing at the 0:48:39.000 --> 0:48:45.600 Argo creator Douglas Crossing. You're when you're in that customs process, 0:48:46.080 --> 0:48:48.560 you're not dealing with border. You're dealing with Field Office 0:48:48.560 --> 0:48:52.800 of Field Operations customs and different different color uniform, different 0:48:52.800 --> 0:48:55.439 components within If I go off, if I go east 0:48:55.520 --> 0:48:57.719 or west twenty miles and try to do the same thing. 0:48:58.560 --> 0:49:00.680 If you're hunting south in New Mexico, you find yourself 0:49:00.719 --> 0:49:02.680 up on the line because you're tracking something and you 0:49:02.680 --> 0:49:04.360 across the line, then you're gonna be dealing with the 0:49:04.360 --> 0:49:06.480 border patrol because you've just made an entry at a 0:49:06.520 --> 0:49:09.440 place in time not designated as a border ventrol. Do 0:49:09.520 --> 0:49:13.280 you know all that, honey? I do not. It makes sense? Okay. 0:49:14.320 --> 0:49:16.880 So that's how that's basically the one on one of 0:49:16.960 --> 0:49:19.640 border patrol, and we operate between the ports of entries, 0:49:19.680 --> 0:49:24.600 and somehow I've lost the question. So what um on 0:49:24.760 --> 0:49:30.120 that on that wide open, lonely border, the northern border 0:49:30.400 --> 0:49:33.600 between the US and Canada. What kind of dark, shady 0:49:33.640 --> 0:49:36.919 stuff goes on up there. Uh So the difference between 0:49:36.920 --> 0:49:38.719 the northern water and southern border on the northern border, 0:49:38.760 --> 0:49:43.040 because obviously we're dealing with weather and uh the geography 0:49:43.080 --> 0:49:45.320 is a little bit different along the northern border. Obviously 0:49:45.680 --> 0:49:48.040 that not that Arizona doesn't have mountains, but the mountains 0:49:48.080 --> 0:49:51.680 are bigger in in in Colorado and Montana or in 0:49:51.719 --> 0:49:55.480 Montana than there are in Arizona. See, the traffic is 0:49:55.480 --> 0:49:57.600 a little bit lower, but you deal with what we 0:49:57.719 --> 0:50:01.200 call a little bit more exciting things. So, um, this 0:50:01.320 --> 0:50:04.400 year recently, we had a a gentleman from from Canada 0:50:04.600 --> 0:50:08.680 kidnaped his his living girlfriend and their two children, and 0:50:08.760 --> 0:50:12.760 he was a sex trafficker and ended up coming south Eline. 0:50:12.840 --> 0:50:15.279 He came through a place not designated port of entry 0:50:15.560 --> 0:50:18.120 and we ended up with a task force. We apprehended them. 0:50:18.560 --> 0:50:21.200 I don't know why this guy went to to Sturgis, 0:50:21.239 --> 0:50:24.120 South Dakota at the time of Sturgist when they had 0:50:24.520 --> 0:50:26.400 every cop in the world there, but that's where he 0:50:26.480 --> 0:50:28.560 ended up going, and through a task force, we ended 0:50:28.640 --> 0:50:32.160 up apprehending this guy. This guy was his his girlfriend 0:50:32.160 --> 0:50:36.200 had some mental incapassibilities. Um, but his goal was to 0:50:36.239 --> 0:50:40.480 take the children to use for child pornography at Sturgist. 0:50:40.520 --> 0:50:42.799 For whatever reason he went to Sturgist. I don't have 0:50:42.840 --> 0:50:45.640 to struggle for reasons why he would have. Obviously he 0:50:45.920 --> 0:50:48.319 had no intelligence. That's the last place I would go 0:50:48.880 --> 0:50:52.319 during during bike because of the law enforcement coverage. But 0:50:52.600 --> 0:50:57.320 that's a handful. Yeah. So it's those type of cases 0:50:57.360 --> 0:51:00.000 that we run into and and uh, the other stuff 0:51:00.000 --> 0:51:02.880 that we get right now, guns are super super popular 0:51:02.920 --> 0:51:05.200 in Canada because of the gun laws and things in 0:51:05.239 --> 0:51:09.279 Canada Canada. So a a weapon, a polymer eighty right, 0:51:09.360 --> 0:51:13.080 those those glock clones that we buy here for what 0:51:13.120 --> 0:51:15.319 a couple of hundred bucks, there's someone for five and 0:51:15.360 --> 0:51:18.759 six thousand dollars a piece in Canada. So that's the 0:51:19.160 --> 0:51:21.120 stuff moving the other That stuff moving the other day. 0:51:21.320 --> 0:51:25.520 Is that your responsibility U pushing borders out the border troube. 0:51:25.560 --> 0:51:28.240 We want to be partners with with all law enforcements 0:51:28.239 --> 0:51:30.479 and and our focus is on and what I would 0:51:30.480 --> 0:51:34.040 call border security and more along homeland security and pushing 0:51:34.080 --> 0:51:37.120 those borders out and making the entire border safe, and 0:51:37.160 --> 0:51:39.080 we can only do that by working with our Canadian 0:51:39.120 --> 0:51:41.719 partners and our Mexican partners. So so yeah, I never 0:51:41.719 --> 0:51:45.879 thought that if you're at the border, you're also looking southward. Yeah, 0:51:45.920 --> 0:51:47.799 so that's the concept that we are like that we're 0:51:47.800 --> 0:51:50.040 working on in have Her. Like I had commented early, 0:51:50.080 --> 0:51:51.800 we go all the way down to Colorado and Utah. 0:51:52.120 --> 0:51:56.359 Our focus is on homeland security entities, right, those things 0:51:56.400 --> 0:51:59.640 that have an impact on on the entire homeland security. 0:51:59.719 --> 0:52:03.160 Try thinking of children trafficking and people smuggling weapons. And 0:52:03.200 --> 0:52:05.040 I don't need to talk about Fenton, al. All you 0:52:05.080 --> 0:52:07.120 gotta do is turn on the news and see what's 0:52:07.120 --> 0:52:10.160 happened in fentanyl. So, with the Border Patrol and our 0:52:10.239 --> 0:52:13.600 law enforcement capabilities with Title eight, Title nineteen, and Title 0:52:13.680 --> 0:52:16.960 twenty one, which is UH. Title nineteen is the Customs 0:52:16.960 --> 0:52:20.799 and Tariffs law, Title twenty one is the Narcotics law, 0:52:21.040 --> 0:52:24.160 and Title eight is the overall criminal statute for for 0:52:24.200 --> 0:52:26.960 the United States, we have authorities and all three of 0:52:27.000 --> 0:52:29.960 those titles, so that gives us the ability to interdict 0:52:30.400 --> 0:52:32.279 all that traffic. So that's what we're trying to do 0:52:32.280 --> 0:52:35.319 in the Border Patrol is go after those things that 0:52:35.400 --> 0:52:37.719 are that are dangerous to the country, Like, I mean 0:52:38.000 --> 0:52:42.400 everyone is child traffickers off off the streets, and we 0:52:42.400 --> 0:52:44.560 want to get fountainl off the streets. And that's the 0:52:44.600 --> 0:52:46.399 direction that we're trying to go with The Border troll 0:52:46.480 --> 0:52:48.840 is not so not be so much focused on the border. 0:52:48.840 --> 0:52:51.040 We're focused on the border, but we want to focus 0:52:51.080 --> 0:52:53.600 on those on those things that have an impact throughout home, 0:52:53.840 --> 0:52:57.320 homeland security or public safety. How do how do people 0:52:57.480 --> 0:53:00.960 move how do people move guns? Ac Like, if you're 0:53:00.960 --> 0:53:03.560 trying to move guns into Canada, how do you see 0:53:03.560 --> 0:53:05.719 it done? Do you see it done at you see 0:53:05.760 --> 0:53:07.960 it done at not at crossings? Oh, you actually see 0:53:07.960 --> 0:53:10.840 a mix right. So again, the like we talked about earlier, 0:53:10.880 --> 0:53:14.360 smugglers go through great, great stinch to try to hide 0:53:14.560 --> 0:53:17.640 whatever product they're trying to trying to smuggle. Um, we've 0:53:17.680 --> 0:53:20.960 seen we've seen narcotics on aptrack coming from Seattle going 0:53:21.000 --> 0:53:23.920 to New York or to Minneapolis, and then the cash 0:53:24.080 --> 0:53:27.960 that that's coming back. We see in most cases a 0:53:28.000 --> 0:53:30.680 lot of that stuff is probably happening between the ports 0:53:30.680 --> 0:53:32.839 of entries where they've go out, just like you would 0:53:32.880 --> 0:53:35.239 hunting to go out and scouting area to see where 0:53:35.280 --> 0:53:38.040 traffic is where they can actually get across, and they 0:53:38.080 --> 0:53:40.759 bring across through either smuggling through a port of entry. 0:53:40.960 --> 0:53:44.360 They use hidden compartments in vehicles, um for narcotics, to 0:53:44.400 --> 0:53:48.160 use body carriers, a whole gamut of things that they 0:53:48.200 --> 0:53:52.800 try to do. Do car tells ever move because it 0:53:53.520 --> 0:53:59.800 do drug traffickers in South in Columbia wherever South and 0:54:00.040 --> 0:54:05.160 droll America? Do they ever get stuff to Canada and 0:54:05.200 --> 0:54:07.920 then into the US from Canada or is that just 0:54:08.040 --> 0:54:11.399 add a lot of complexity? Um, Well, again, I think, 0:54:11.440 --> 0:54:13.200 like I said, it's this new paradigm, right, we're seeing 0:54:13.239 --> 0:54:17.040 We're seeing smugglers go through different stents to try to 0:54:17.040 --> 0:54:18.600 to try to make money. Right. I mean when we 0:54:18.640 --> 0:54:20.680 talk about when we talk about people trying to come 0:54:20.719 --> 0:54:22.759 to the United States, there's always somebody out there that's 0:54:22.760 --> 0:54:25.160 gonna prey on that person. Right, They're gonna they're gonna 0:54:25.400 --> 0:54:28.400 they're gonna drive him into his slavery. So they're gonna say, 0:54:28.440 --> 0:54:32.080 i'll smuggle you. It's gonna be twenty dollars per person. 0:54:32.360 --> 0:54:36.120 So this person brings him in there his five family members, 0:54:36.320 --> 0:54:39.480 so now he's he's in destitute to the smugglers. So 0:54:39.520 --> 0:54:41.200 he doesn't have that money, so they put him to 0:54:41.200 --> 0:54:43.959 work to work for them, and and so they're working 0:54:44.000 --> 0:54:46.480 for him, but they're also having to pay the smugglers rent, 0:54:46.680 --> 0:54:49.160 They have to pay the smugglers the electricity and all 0:54:49.200 --> 0:54:51.120 that stuff. So all the money that they make to 0:54:51.160 --> 0:54:54.400 try to pay back being smuggling, they never touch because 0:54:54.440 --> 0:54:59.040 they're they're hitting him on all these other factions of absolutely, 0:54:59.280 --> 0:55:01.440 so they're they're they're just destitute to do in that. 0:55:01.640 --> 0:55:03.800 So that's the type of stuff that they do. I 0:55:04.000 --> 0:55:07.359 think that um Nar cartels are gonna do whatever they 0:55:07.400 --> 0:55:09.120 can to make money, and if there's a way to 0:55:09.160 --> 0:55:12.680 make money to take a product to Canada and come south, 0:55:12.840 --> 0:55:16.080 they will. Um In fact, they think that I wouldn't 0:55:16.080 --> 0:55:19.600 be surprised to see it with with Mexican nationals. I mean, 0:55:19.680 --> 0:55:23.399 Canada has a very liberal visa waiver pro program. So 0:55:23.760 --> 0:55:26.719 the visa waivers, the countries on on on the visa 0:55:26.760 --> 0:55:30.799 waiver list for Canada are like three hundred or four 0:55:31.239 --> 0:55:33.040 countries are on there. All you have to do is 0:55:33.080 --> 0:55:35.640 be from that country. You come into Canada and you're 0:55:35.680 --> 0:55:40.440 given automatic status in Canada as a non immigrant, and 0:55:40.480 --> 0:55:43.640 they give them money to live and survive for approximately 0:55:43.680 --> 0:55:48.200 twelve months, So I wouldn't good first step. Good first 0:55:48.200 --> 0:55:51.120 step is to make it into Canada and then utilize 0:55:51.480 --> 0:55:55.040 those social work programs and then when that's done, then 0:55:55.120 --> 0:55:57.640 you can come south. Or if you can get Canadian citizenship, 0:55:58.000 --> 0:56:00.680 then it's a free broke right because we it's open 0:56:00.680 --> 0:56:02.759 borders for just as its open borders for us to 0:56:02.800 --> 0:56:05.520 go to Canada, it's open borders for Canadian citizens to 0:56:05.600 --> 0:56:09.880 come south. Canadian citizens, whether they're naturalized or born Canadians 0:56:10.040 --> 0:56:12.359 as they can come back and forth. So because that 0:56:12.480 --> 0:56:15.000 entities out there, the things that we look at is 0:56:15.280 --> 0:56:17.680 there's a possibility for somebody to come up, utilize the 0:56:17.840 --> 0:56:21.279 programs and then be smuggled back down south. A lot 0:56:21.280 --> 0:56:24.319 of the nine eleven hijackers flowed through Canada, all four 0:56:24.400 --> 0:56:26.799 of them. It was a whole lot more than four. 0:56:27.760 --> 0:56:29.960 All four crews, the four, the four on the planes 0:56:30.000 --> 0:56:33.640 all came through. Oh actually came through Swanton, Vermont and 0:56:34.920 --> 0:56:39.320 h who. Just the other day, I had a conversation 0:56:39.320 --> 0:56:42.000 with someone where they're telling me that they had gone 0:56:42.800 --> 0:56:46.799 black bear hunting in Canada. Okay, like many people do. 0:56:46.840 --> 0:56:49.400 There's places around like bear bait factories, in Canada and 0:56:49.440 --> 0:56:51.720 so many you know guys got to hunt bears in Canada. 0:56:52.560 --> 0:56:54.000 And he was telling me, and it's the thing I 0:56:54.040 --> 0:56:55.480 hear all the time. He was telling me that they 0:56:55.520 --> 0:56:59.080 told him you can't bring the meat home. No, that's 0:56:59.160 --> 0:57:02.760 that's not true. I know. There's so much confusion about 0:57:04.880 --> 0:57:07.480 if you ask ten guys, you're gonna get ten different 0:57:07.480 --> 0:57:09.799 answers about how it works with it. You can't bring 0:57:09.840 --> 0:57:13.400 your gun, you can't bring meat. You can't drive from Alaska, 0:57:13.680 --> 0:57:15.279 even though I know you can. You can't like take 0:57:15.280 --> 0:57:18.600 Alaska meat from Alaska into the Lower forty eight because 0:57:18.640 --> 0:57:25.480 of the who's um, who's bidding, like, who's setting those rules? 0:57:25.520 --> 0:57:29.160 So those rules are those are the the AGG specialists 0:57:29.160 --> 0:57:33.000 that actually worked for OFOS off Office of Bild Operations. 0:57:33.000 --> 0:57:35.040 The guys at the port of entry. So if you 0:57:35.120 --> 0:57:36.840 come into a port of entry and you see somebody 0:57:36.960 --> 0:57:40.000 at at the at the primary and they're wearing a weapon, 0:57:40.280 --> 0:57:42.680 that's a that's an officer. They also have folks that 0:57:42.720 --> 0:57:46.080 aren't on their non law enforcement types and their AGG specialists, 0:57:46.080 --> 0:57:49.160 they're the ones that set those responsibilities. So moose is 0:57:49.200 --> 0:57:51.520 a perfect example. You can go up and hunt moose 0:57:51.560 --> 0:57:54.360 in Canada. The only thing you can't bring south is 0:57:54.640 --> 0:57:57.600 any of the contents of the head because of the 0:57:58.640 --> 0:58:01.360 cw D. Yeah, so so with let's tell me it 0:58:01.400 --> 0:58:04.560 can come across without a problem. So tell me what 0:58:04.680 --> 0:58:08.280 someone would need to do. Uh, you go bear hunting 0:58:08.320 --> 0:58:11.840 in Canada, UM, and you want to drive up with 0:58:11.880 --> 0:58:14.840 a gun, and you want to come back with the 0:58:14.880 --> 0:58:17.480 bear meat and the bear hide and everything. So if 0:58:17.520 --> 0:58:19.720 you follow the proper stuff, there's no reason you can't 0:58:19.720 --> 0:58:22.120 do that. And and and and I just did it 0:58:22.160 --> 0:58:24.400 in my personal capacity to I went up to I 0:58:24.400 --> 0:58:26.080 went up to New Brunswick, shot of black bear and 0:58:26.080 --> 0:58:27.680 just did just as past September and went through that 0:58:27.840 --> 0:58:36.080 entire process. UH. Can't bring can't bring the baculum back. UM, 0:58:36.200 --> 0:58:41.360 can't bring ball bladder. UM. And and quite quite frankly, 0:58:41.360 --> 0:58:44.520 it's the it's the UH. I don't know they're what 0:58:44.560 --> 0:58:47.040 their official name is, but it's basically their version of 0:58:47.120 --> 0:58:50.280 us fashion wildlife, the Canadian Fishing wildlife for lack of 0:58:50.320 --> 0:58:52.280 a better term. They're the ones that actually did the 0:58:52.560 --> 0:58:54.440 rigors inspection on the way out of the country on 0:58:54.520 --> 0:58:58.400 their side, UM, to make sure you weren't bringing down 0:58:58.400 --> 0:59:00.640 stuff that has a black market and and extreme you 0:59:00.640 --> 0:59:02.920 fill out of survey, they do a deep dive into 0:59:03.400 --> 0:59:08.200 what outfitter you're used. They we were talking about investigative techniques. 0:59:08.280 --> 0:59:11.720 They investigated. They separated me and my best friend who 0:59:11.760 --> 0:59:14.160 was the driver, talked as just to see if we're 0:59:14.200 --> 0:59:17.480 telling the same story, but asking us about what altfreder 0:59:17.560 --> 0:59:20.560 we used. Uh, did the outfit ter got the animal 0:59:20.560 --> 0:59:23.040 in the field? Did the outfitter himself take anything back 0:59:23.040 --> 0:59:24.760 from the gut pile when he came back to camp? 0:59:24.960 --> 0:59:27.880 How many days we were there? Um? Huh. So that 0:59:28.000 --> 0:59:30.439 like that's and because they're trying because of the black 0:59:30.480 --> 0:59:32.840 market trade for all of the animal parts specific to 0:59:33.640 --> 0:59:37.040 UH controlled species in Canada, they want to make sure 0:59:37.080 --> 0:59:40.280 that those things aren't being transported illegally throughout their country 0:59:40.400 --> 0:59:43.240 or back into the United States. UM. As far as 0:59:43.280 --> 0:59:45.920 the process of just going over and coming back, it 0:59:46.040 --> 0:59:49.360 was at this time around, you know, you know, we 0:59:49.360 --> 0:59:51.440 were kind of nervous because of all the things post COVID, 0:59:51.920 --> 0:59:55.200 with the Canadian restrictions on ongoing there. There's a new 0:59:55.240 --> 0:59:57.760 app you gotta fill out to arrive can and whatnot. 0:59:57.960 --> 0:59:59.400 We thought it was gonna be pretty difficult, and it 0:59:59.440 --> 1:00:03.920 was actually really really seamless. Um, all things considered. Uh, 1:00:04.080 --> 1:00:06.280 the bringing in a gun you can bring up to believe, 1:00:06.320 --> 1:00:09.240 up to three guns per person. Um. It's a simple 1:00:09.320 --> 1:00:12.680 form they where you just identify what guns you're bringing up, 1:00:12.720 --> 1:00:16.200 serial numbers, and I believe you pay a permit fee 1:00:16.200 --> 1:00:17.560 and you just have to keep it on your person 1:00:18.040 --> 1:00:21.800 the entire time you're hunting and on the way back. Um, 1:00:21.840 --> 1:00:25.000 it's it's just an inspection by Canada on the way out, 1:00:25.840 --> 1:00:28.760 by their by their Efficient Game Agency to make sure 1:00:28.880 --> 1:00:31.360 of all those things we just talked about. But taking 1:00:31.360 --> 1:00:36.080 the meatback taking I had already I cleaned my skull 1:00:36.560 --> 1:00:39.959 and we boiled our skulls in Canada. So I don't 1:00:40.000 --> 1:00:42.680 know the restrictions on brain matter for bear, because I 1:00:42.680 --> 1:00:44.960 don't know if if their brain matter is a disease 1:00:45.000 --> 1:00:47.440 carrying but not that I know of. It might be 1:00:47.520 --> 1:00:50.240 that they don't. It might be that they don't. They 1:00:50.360 --> 1:00:53.920 create a whole bunch off. You're my experience, and what 1:00:53.920 --> 1:00:55.600 I kind of sense from them is if you're bringing 1:00:56.120 --> 1:01:00.480 like the entire the entire animal back absent into kernels, 1:01:01.040 --> 1:01:02.960 there's a lot less of an issue, whereas if you 1:01:03.080 --> 1:01:05.919 just like if you try to do things like pull 1:01:06.000 --> 1:01:07.720 the clause and just bring the clause back. They ding 1:01:07.800 --> 1:01:10.040 you on that. God, But if you're bringing back the 1:01:10.200 --> 1:01:13.560 entire the entire hide with the skull inside the hide 1:01:13.600 --> 1:01:15.680 and the claws still on everything, no issue. So long 1:01:15.720 --> 1:01:17.800 as you're not bringing back the restricted items like baculum 1:01:17.840 --> 1:01:20.640 and gall bladder. I didn't know there was a black 1:01:20.680 --> 1:01:23.120 market on vaculum. Did you know that? Prior to going 1:01:23.480 --> 1:01:27.200 you only knew about gall bladder. Yeah. You mentioned the 1:01:27.280 --> 1:01:29.760 US Fish and Wildlife Service. Do you guys work with 1:01:29.840 --> 1:01:33.440 them a lot for like illegal trafficking endangered species that 1:01:33.680 --> 1:01:38.880 like is that a big partnership. Yeah, that's that's one 1:01:38.920 --> 1:01:41.320 of the things that that that we do work with 1:01:41.400 --> 1:01:45.560 them on, um, you know, not so much on their 1:01:45.680 --> 1:01:49.480 investigative per the whole investigation side of it, but like 1:01:49.560 --> 1:01:52.600 some sometimes it's initiation of because of a lot of 1:01:52.600 --> 1:01:55.600 the training that that we do that that cross agency 1:01:55.600 --> 1:01:59.200 training and inter agency training. Like when there are um, 1:01:59.240 --> 1:02:02.280 you know, like certain times of the year when um, 1:02:02.320 --> 1:02:06.160 there's a lot of herpetology. Uh what's I can't remember 1:02:06.160 --> 1:02:09.320 what the we call like her thieves or poachers. Um, 1:02:09.400 --> 1:02:11.800 so they'll come out and like the fish and Wildlife 1:02:11.800 --> 1:02:13.960 Service will let us know, Hey, you know, it's springtime, 1:02:14.200 --> 1:02:16.880 we're gonna get a lot of her poachers out and 1:02:16.920 --> 1:02:19.160 so we'll we'll get together with them and we'll create 1:02:19.200 --> 1:02:23.320 like little campaigns within um, you know, within the patrol, 1:02:23.360 --> 1:02:26.680 within the sectors and stations, to like create little um 1:02:26.760 --> 1:02:31.120 kind of like posters and emailings out there. We'll talk 1:02:31.120 --> 1:02:32.880 about it our musters and say, hey, guys, you know, 1:02:33.120 --> 1:02:35.280 Fish and Wildlife. You know they're they're going to be 1:02:35.320 --> 1:02:36.800 out there, but these are some of the things to 1:02:36.840 --> 1:02:38.720 look out for. And if you happen to see that, 1:02:39.120 --> 1:02:41.480 you know from you know, while you're out there patrolling, 1:02:41.760 --> 1:02:47.480 here's the contact information. So they're interested in people smuggling 1:02:47.520 --> 1:02:51.560 across the border, not not even they're just interested in 1:02:51.560 --> 1:02:55.560 people out in the landscape stealing snakes and lizards. And yeah, 1:02:55.560 --> 1:02:59.320 I guess I guess I was asking more like, when 1:02:59.320 --> 1:03:03.200 you see a new article like man gets busted with 1:03:03.280 --> 1:03:07.880 forty seven whatever dangered endangered species in his suitcase or whatever, like, 1:03:08.000 --> 1:03:10.640 is that, like do you work with the US Fish 1:03:10.640 --> 1:03:14.560 and Wildlife Service on those kinds of things. So when 1:03:14.600 --> 1:03:17.440 it's something like that where it's like you said, you know, 1:03:17.680 --> 1:03:20.760 busted in a suitcase with you know, twenty five you know, 1:03:20.840 --> 1:03:24.080 endangered bats or sparrows or something. A lot of time. 1:03:24.120 --> 1:03:27.120 That's what like what Chief Fortunato was talking about, UM 1:03:27.280 --> 1:03:30.200 is when it's an agg specialist that's probably caught that 1:03:30.280 --> 1:03:32.040 at a port of entry, Like they were going through 1:03:32.040 --> 1:03:35.640 the port of entry and they were inspecting the contents 1:03:35.640 --> 1:03:37.800 of the bag and then they found that, you know, 1:03:37.920 --> 1:03:41.880 on the bag or on their person and stuff like that. UM. 1:03:41.920 --> 1:03:44.600 But again with border patrol, we're working in between the 1:03:44.640 --> 1:03:47.080 ports of entry. So like we'll do stuff with like 1:03:47.120 --> 1:03:49.760 the Land Management l e O for you know, the 1:03:50.520 --> 1:03:53.520 Wildlife Refuge or the park um you know, or even 1:03:53.640 --> 1:03:55.560 you know one of their biologists specialists and let us 1:03:55.600 --> 1:03:57.960 know about something. And I actually think it depends on 1:03:58.000 --> 1:04:00.200 the area too. So if you get down too, uh 1:04:00.280 --> 1:04:03.280 the real Grand Valley, there's there's Santana Refuge which is 1:04:03.400 --> 1:04:05.640 right on the Rio Grand River, which is a very 1:04:05.640 --> 1:04:09.680 big populated location for smuggling back and forth across. And 1:04:09.760 --> 1:04:11.439 I don't know if you guys have ever been down south, 1:04:11.480 --> 1:04:15.160 but in a very heavily trafficked area that the landing 1:04:15.200 --> 1:04:18.840 on the on the river side is is destroyed plastic bags, 1:04:18.880 --> 1:04:22.600 water bottles, these makeshift floatation devices and things like that, 1:04:22.880 --> 1:04:26.320 and that Santa Ana Refugees is known for a spot 1:04:26.360 --> 1:04:28.480 for them to come across in that area, and it 1:04:28.560 --> 1:04:31.960 just riddles the entire public land where people in Santa 1:04:32.000 --> 1:04:34.160 refuge is a hiking area and things like that where 1:04:34.200 --> 1:04:36.040 they have to go down and and see all that 1:04:36.080 --> 1:04:39.600 type of stuff. So when the when somebody comes across there, 1:04:39.600 --> 1:04:42.960 it's often a fishing wildlife person that might encounter them first, 1:04:43.240 --> 1:04:45.680 that would come up and we would encounter them and 1:04:45.680 --> 1:04:47.880 and and work that direction. So I think a lot 1:04:47.960 --> 1:04:50.840 depends on on on the area that is in proximity 1:04:50.880 --> 1:04:53.160 to the border and and things that go along Lada. 1:04:53.200 --> 1:04:55.800 I know also in in Rio Grand Valley with the 1:04:56.000 --> 1:04:58.880 with the river, fishing wildlife is on the river, so 1:04:58.920 --> 1:05:00.800 there's a lot of times where the they'll jump on 1:05:00.840 --> 1:05:03.480 a boat with borbatrol and then patrol, which then takes 1:05:03.520 --> 1:05:06.440 the scope of the scope and authority a little bit bigger. 1:05:06.600 --> 1:05:09.280 So now you just don't have the scope of authority 1:05:09.280 --> 1:05:11.520 of the BORBA relib of the scope authority of the 1:05:11.520 --> 1:05:14.240 fish and Wildlife officers, so that you can do more things. 1:05:14.280 --> 1:05:16.480 The same thing with Coastguard when we put a Coastguard 1:05:16.520 --> 1:05:18.960 person on our boat. We now have all the authorities 1:05:18.960 --> 1:05:21.959 of Coastguard, so we can do checks and things like that. 1:05:22.960 --> 1:05:26.320 I gotta here's nother question about the Northern border. What 1:05:26.480 --> 1:05:28.760 is if you imagine the most out of the most 1:05:28.760 --> 1:05:31.200 remote areas of the northern border, like say the Boundary 1:05:31.240 --> 1:05:35.360 waters or okay, I worked there for eleven years, how 1:05:35.400 --> 1:05:38.760 do you know? Do you know when you've crossed the border? So? 1:05:40.440 --> 1:05:43.960 So in reality? Right? So? Yes? And no, right, because 1:05:44.040 --> 1:05:46.840 we've GPS s and things like that. Um, Like in 1:05:46.880 --> 1:05:49.840 the boundary waters, right, it's a pristine there's no mechanized 1:05:50.040 --> 1:05:52.320 there's no but there's no there's no there's no cut line, 1:05:52.360 --> 1:05:54.439 there is no cut line. Right. So, and the thought 1:05:54.480 --> 1:05:56.520 process this comes on. And the same thing with the 1:05:56.560 --> 1:05:59.000 Rio Grand River when you're when you're working at our 1:05:59.040 --> 1:06:01.840 concept is you can't take water and split it in 1:06:01.880 --> 1:06:04.240 half and say this belongs to the United States and 1:06:04.280 --> 1:06:06.920 this belongs to Mexico, or this belongs to Canada, and 1:06:06.920 --> 1:06:09.320 this belongs to the United to the United States. They 1:06:09.360 --> 1:06:11.240 do it all the time, well, they try to. But 1:06:11.320 --> 1:06:14.240 the reality is, as long as and this is our 1:06:14.240 --> 1:06:17.600 thought process, as long as you don't make a meaningful entry. 1:06:17.600 --> 1:06:20.600 And a meaningful entry on water would be to stop 1:06:20.640 --> 1:06:23.680 and drop acre or drop a fishing line or something 1:06:23.720 --> 1:06:26.360 like that, and you're just cascading through. If you're on 1:06:26.400 --> 1:06:29.400 a canoe, and a canoe you're canoeing. As long as 1:06:29.440 --> 1:06:32.120 you don't make a meaningful entry stop and do something, 1:06:32.440 --> 1:06:34.520 then you just keep on going. That doesn't really matter. 1:06:34.720 --> 1:06:36.960 It's when you actually stop and drop a fishing line 1:06:37.240 --> 1:06:39.600 or stop me in Canada that means you're now and 1:06:39.680 --> 1:06:44.520 he made a meaningful entry. Really ye, So if I 1:06:44.600 --> 1:06:47.080 do just nudge my foot across the border, I've broken 1:06:47.120 --> 1:06:51.680 the law. Do you make a meaningful entry? So in Rey, 1:06:51.720 --> 1:06:53.680 in reality and and and James, you worked in in 1:06:53.760 --> 1:06:56.640 del Rio is probably the same way. We actually didn't 1:06:56.680 --> 1:06:59.200 consider folks coming across the river when I worked in 1:06:59.440 --> 1:07:02.720 mccallen's Exs. We didn't think. We didn't consider them making 1:07:02.760 --> 1:07:05.520 an entry till they made landfall. If they were standing 1:07:05.560 --> 1:07:08.880 on the U S side and still ankle deep in water, 1:07:09.280 --> 1:07:13.400 we didn't touch them because they haven't made a meanful entry. 1:07:13.480 --> 1:07:16.160 But the moment they come on land, they've made a 1:07:16.160 --> 1:07:19.800 meaningful entry. Now I'm not saying that people probably weren't grabbed, 1:07:20.240 --> 1:07:23.200 because that probably did happen. But the reality is, in 1:07:23.240 --> 1:07:25.960 most cases you could step and say until they actually 1:07:26.360 --> 1:07:28.280 leave the crest of the water, they haven't made a 1:07:28.320 --> 1:07:31.880 meaningful entry. So if you if you stepped out to 1:07:31.920 --> 1:07:34.800 go to the bathroom, then you made a meaning canoe 1:07:34.840 --> 1:07:37.360 and bound. Yeah, you they would say that you made 1:07:37.360 --> 1:07:45.960 a meaningful entry. Let's move whatever. Before we hear this 1:07:46.080 --> 1:07:50.920 threat in Montana of wild pigs coming down from Canada. 1:07:51.320 --> 1:07:58.240 Wild pigs supposedly feral pigs. Supposedly Saskatchewan has like a 1:07:58.280 --> 1:08:02.280 little population of wild hall game farm Yeah, like capes, 1:08:03.480 --> 1:08:06.000 maybe even in the rags. There's always like a little 1:08:06.000 --> 1:08:08.960 blip in there about like if you see, you know, 1:08:09.120 --> 1:08:11.840 feral pigs when you're hunting up you know in that 1:08:12.480 --> 1:08:14.760 have her area, you know, on the high line or 1:08:14.760 --> 1:08:18.439 whatever along the Canadian border, to immediately notify you know, 1:08:18.560 --> 1:08:22.680 the local warden. But no, no, no thoughts or I 1:08:22.720 --> 1:08:24.600 guess there's there must not be that big of a 1:08:24.640 --> 1:08:28.360 problem if you guys are no, no, no, no, it 1:08:28.400 --> 1:08:31.840 sounds like a lot of fun um. I would relate 1:08:31.840 --> 1:08:34.520 it to I don't know. I think that the similarities 1:08:34.520 --> 1:08:37.360 would be a livestock on the on the Mexican side. 1:08:37.560 --> 1:08:39.640 So we have we have tick riders down in in 1:08:39.880 --> 1:08:42.840 Texas and there's a lot of feral pigs, horses, and 1:08:42.880 --> 1:08:45.040 cattle that come across the river, and that would be 1:08:45.080 --> 1:08:47.360 tick riders that would go out and interdict that traffic 1:08:47.439 --> 1:08:51.000 because of the ticks and things down the tick riders 1:08:51.080 --> 1:08:54.280 do you remember, I think there are an interior, their 1:08:54.320 --> 1:08:58.360 deprimate interior. No, what's the US the international? Do they 1:08:58.360 --> 1:09:02.160 work boundary commis and all are I thought they were 1:09:02.200 --> 1:09:07.160 at agriculture there, Yeah, it's I don't think it's UM. 1:09:07.200 --> 1:09:10.040 I think they work for UM boundary water yea. So 1:09:10.280 --> 1:09:12.680 they are there. They're law enforcement official. Their sold job. 1:09:12.680 --> 1:09:14.920 They ride horses. They go out and they look for 1:09:15.040 --> 1:09:18.559 livestock or traffic or animal traffic that has come from 1:09:18.600 --> 1:09:23.040 Mexico to the United States to apprehend them, to take 1:09:23.080 --> 1:09:26.080 them and dip them because of the ticks in in Mexico. 1:09:26.280 --> 1:09:32.120 Just livestock. I haven't heard anything of live colleagues are 1:09:32.160 --> 1:09:35.479 real stickers about when you when someone wants to bring 1:09:35.479 --> 1:09:42.280 a deer cape deer in Mexico and you're looking at 1:09:42.320 --> 1:09:45.840 the US border. Okay, so you imagine a tick like 1:09:45.880 --> 1:09:53.439 an ambitious tick would just but but you want it, 1:09:53.479 --> 1:09:55.160 you're looking. You can kill a deer inside of the 1:09:55.240 --> 1:10:00.519 US border, and when you go through customs, you can't 1:10:00.560 --> 1:10:06.320 have a single tick on that cape. That's part of that. 1:10:06.320 --> 1:10:08.680 That's why we would not you know, I get it, 1:10:08.680 --> 1:10:09.880 like you don't know where it came from. Whatever. You 1:10:09.880 --> 1:10:12.160 gotta do your job. But I would laugh about, well, 1:10:12.160 --> 1:10:16.080 how many ticks right now are crossing that border on coyotes, 1:10:17.200 --> 1:10:22.200 I mean the animal on whatever the hell? Yeah, mule deer, 1:10:22.320 --> 1:10:25.280 cuse deer like ticks are back and forth. I had 1:10:25.320 --> 1:10:29.559 no idea that there's someone out actually, yeah, cruising for 1:10:29.920 --> 1:10:32.840 cruising for livestock to just because of the ticks? Do 1:10:32.880 --> 1:10:34.760 they got a bad just as ticks? They are They 1:10:34.800 --> 1:10:41.799 are a law enforcenate. I think the job I actually 1:10:41.800 --> 1:10:45.040 take their Department of Agriculture and and I'm not sure 1:10:45.160 --> 1:10:47.160 exactly what they work for, but they are. They are 1:10:47.200 --> 1:10:50.639 a law enforcement officer, federal officer that works, and that's 1:10:50.680 --> 1:10:54.599 their soul jobs. And it's mainly horses and cattle and 1:10:54.600 --> 1:11:00.439 and hugs. So yeah, wildlife to wildlife, wild just comes 1:11:00.439 --> 1:11:03.080 and goes. But if there's a if there's a Mexican 1:11:03.080 --> 1:11:04.920 cow that comes across and gets through the double tick 1:11:05.000 --> 1:11:08.200 fence and onto you know, some ranches they have to 1:11:09.000 --> 1:11:11.800 particularly in Texas is where I know it is, they 1:11:11.840 --> 1:11:15.680 have they have one basically barbed wire fence right on 1:11:15.720 --> 1:11:18.559 the water and then another one like like ten yards 1:11:18.600 --> 1:11:20.679 off of that, and it's to try if anything gets 1:11:20.680 --> 1:11:22.240 past the first one, a lease is contained in that 1:11:22.280 --> 1:11:25.599 one little barrier close to the rapairian zone right there. Um. 1:11:25.760 --> 1:11:27.600 But then if it gets through that second one, so 1:11:27.640 --> 1:11:29.519 they try and contain them in that little that little 1:11:29.560 --> 1:11:31.400 corridor right there, so they don't make you know, in 1:11:31.479 --> 1:11:35.000 further into whatever property they're on and they start mixing 1:11:35.040 --> 1:11:37.439 with if the if whatever they're carrying gets with the 1:11:37.680 --> 1:11:40.200 cattle that these ranchers are are running, it becomes a 1:11:40.200 --> 1:11:43.320 bad day. And we we've had situations where like a 1:11:43.320 --> 1:11:46.240 smuggler's horse gets through and then we have the season 1:11:46.280 --> 1:11:48.439 and it's it's a ton of paperwork when you're dealing 1:11:48.479 --> 1:11:51.200 with a with a with a horse from Mexico. It's 1:11:53.160 --> 1:11:55.920 absolutely What's even worse, is it if because you don't 1:11:55.920 --> 1:11:58.240 know where they came across. So if you're out patrolling 1:11:58.280 --> 1:12:00.880 you see this horse or something come on the drag road. 1:12:01.160 --> 1:12:02.599 You don't know where it came from. They know what's 1:12:02.600 --> 1:12:04.719 not supposed to be there. You call a tick rider, 1:12:05.040 --> 1:12:07.320 and if it happens to be just the local farmer 1:12:07.320 --> 1:12:09.400 whose horse got out, oh yeah, they get a little 1:12:09.400 --> 1:12:12.400 fired up. Man. I wish you guys had brought up 1:12:12.400 --> 1:12:15.720 this tick riding because I wish I knew that. I 1:12:15.800 --> 1:12:18.519 wish I was the only guy that knew, the only 1:12:18.600 --> 1:12:21.599 media person that knew about tick riders. To answer your question, 1:12:21.640 --> 1:12:24.640 I haven't heard anything about Farrell Hawgs coming south from 1:12:24.640 --> 1:12:28.320 from Canada. Oh yeah, I forgot about. So we're on 1:12:28.360 --> 1:12:30.559 the lookout. If you look at where I used to 1:12:30.560 --> 1:12:33.520 think that hogs would buy sort of like by definition 1:12:33.600 --> 1:12:37.920 have to be would be confined to the American South. Um, 1:12:37.960 --> 1:12:40.400 but that's not true now. If you look at like 1:12:40.800 --> 1:12:43.760 maps of where where hoggs could feasibly you know, without 1:12:43.800 --> 1:12:46.599 any sort of human persecution, where hoggs con feasibly live, 1:12:46.760 --> 1:12:51.919 it's the Lord. Did you guys just do a question ridiculous? 1:12:52.040 --> 1:12:55.519 Number four states have confirmed that's absolutely incredible, and there's 1:12:55.520 --> 1:13:00.360 no reason that they. I mean, I guess you could 1:13:00.800 --> 1:13:04.439 in the northern Great Plains, you could feasibly have like 1:13:04.520 --> 1:13:07.920 the the landscape would support them. Probably, I would, because 1:13:07.920 --> 1:13:09.040 you need to be like, well, I thought it'd be 1:13:09.040 --> 1:13:10.519 too cold, but then you think about where they're at 1:13:10.560 --> 1:13:13.559 in Siberia. Well, Yannis is up in Latvia. How high 1:13:13.600 --> 1:13:18.080 is Latvia. It's not that it's like the same latitude 1:13:18.080 --> 1:13:21.920 as Juno, but it's got pigs. Yeah, oh yeah, that 1:13:22.160 --> 1:13:25.680 sounds pretty cold. It's got native well I guess, yeah. 1:13:25.760 --> 1:13:29.080 And the because I think of Juno is within the 1:13:29.120 --> 1:13:32.280 context of Alaska, and like the southeast of Alaska is 1:13:32.320 --> 1:13:38.320 just not nowhere near the extreme temps Buttarctic circle. Yeah, 1:13:38.400 --> 1:13:41.240 latitude wise, no, they got they could have a trement, 1:13:41.280 --> 1:13:42.960 they could, they could be there. I think it just 1:13:43.000 --> 1:13:47.320 be easier to obviously, eradicating hogs on the northern plains 1:13:47.560 --> 1:13:50.800 would be like a much easier job than out of 1:13:50.960 --> 1:13:54.519 heavily Georgia than out of swampy jungly show. I mean, 1:13:54.800 --> 1:13:57.720 even though even though it's mostly private land, Texas is 1:13:57.760 --> 1:14:05.800 pretty open and uh yeah they so, oh yeah, I'm 1:14:05.800 --> 1:14:08.320 real skeptical. We covered this recently. We had a guy 1:14:08.840 --> 1:14:12.160 we just did an episode in Hawaii and we're on 1:14:12.200 --> 1:14:15.680 a coffee plantation and you know, all the pigs, you know, 1:14:15.720 --> 1:14:17.559 they don't. All the pigs cause so much damage. And 1:14:17.560 --> 1:14:20.800 I asked my body who loves to hunt them? I said, 1:14:20.800 --> 1:14:28.200 do you really want them gone? No? Exactly yea. In 1:14:28.240 --> 1:14:31.200 my personal opinion, I'd say, uh, you mon kind of boys, 1:14:31.200 --> 1:14:36.120 better start shooting them pigs before they post rigs. Uh. 1:14:36.280 --> 1:14:38.200 I was saying, if you really hated the pigs. I 1:14:38.240 --> 1:14:40.200 was telling my friend Danny, who's been on the podcast 1:14:40.240 --> 1:14:41.920 for I said, if you really hated pigs, you put 1:14:42.000 --> 1:14:45.080 up a big sign that said please come hunt my land. 1:14:45.439 --> 1:14:47.800 I said, your pigs be gone. He said, but can 1:14:47.800 --> 1:14:49.800 you imagine what kinds of people would show up in 1:14:49.840 --> 1:15:02.800 my Buddy Callahan said, barbecuers. All right, let's talk about 1:15:02.800 --> 1:15:04.439 the Southern Boarder. We kind we're already kind of talking 1:15:04.439 --> 1:15:06.120 about the Southern Boarder with the tick riders. How many 1:15:06.120 --> 1:15:09.439 tick riders are there? I think they're mainly based in Texas. Handful, 1:15:09.479 --> 1:15:11.920 It's not it's not a big agency. This article. I 1:15:11.960 --> 1:15:14.560 was just reading, Uh, they are under the U. S 1:15:14.640 --> 1:15:19.960 d A. There was eighty six of them sick riders. 1:15:19.960 --> 1:15:22.559 Not very big, I feel that, but I don't know 1:15:27.680 --> 1:15:29.760 bad Larry McMurtry's that's still not around it right, like 1:15:29.800 --> 1:15:35.240 a thousand page novel. Titilated to the extreme. Oh, you 1:15:35.240 --> 1:15:37.680 know the double you're talking about, the double fence. I 1:15:37.760 --> 1:15:40.519 was on a friends ranch not long ago and one 1:15:40.520 --> 1:15:44.280 of his line fences was a double fence yep. And 1:15:44.360 --> 1:15:47.360 I asked him why he has why one of the 1:15:47.400 --> 1:15:50.600 line fences a double fence. And I thought that it 1:15:50.680 --> 1:15:53.120 must have been some dispute, you know whatever, Like we 1:15:53.200 --> 1:15:55.960 would go through the trouble putting fences like five ft apart, 1:15:56.040 --> 1:15:58.960 six ft apart. So I said, what's going on with that? 1:15:59.080 --> 1:16:02.719 And it's to keep um, it's from keeping the cattle 1:16:02.760 --> 1:16:09.880 from stopping through the fence. Look at that stopping with 1:16:09.920 --> 1:16:13.040 the neighbors cattle, keeping breeding populations away from one another, 1:16:13.760 --> 1:16:19.880 they'll stoop through the fence. Wow, surprised me. Nature is 1:16:19.920 --> 1:16:24.000 always going to happen, right, Uh, how long have you 1:16:24.040 --> 1:16:27.200 guys been? How different is working on the southern border 1:16:27.240 --> 1:16:33.559 now than it was you know ten years ago, twenty 1:16:33.640 --> 1:16:36.040 years ago, thirty years ago. It's not even the same 1:16:36.439 --> 1:16:38.479 now as it was three years ago, right, I mean, 1:16:38.520 --> 1:16:42.720 it's just it's just what they're dealing with in in 1:16:42.800 --> 1:16:48.320 sheer numbers is the human numbers, human numbers. Yeah, they're 1:16:48.360 --> 1:16:50.559 just the numbers that they're dealing with. Give me a ballpark, 1:16:50.640 --> 1:16:55.200 like how many people are on a daily basis, how 1:16:55.200 --> 1:16:57.640 many people are in some way or another flirting with 1:16:57.680 --> 1:17:00.840 the border? Um? Yeah, and I remember the numbers from 1:17:00.880 --> 1:17:03.040 last year. I think James is looking. I think we 1:17:03.040 --> 1:17:07.599 were for one point border patrol encounters. Fiscal year twenty 1:17:07.600 --> 1:17:11.200 two is two million, two thousand, six hundred and fifty two, 1:17:12.400 --> 1:17:15.160 and then I think was one point five one point 1:17:15.200 --> 1:17:18.320 six point six. Yeah, so in just one year, you know, 1:17:18.479 --> 1:17:22.320 half a million people. If you had so many border 1:17:22.320 --> 1:17:24.759 patrol agents that you guys can stand along the border 1:17:24.800 --> 1:17:34.000 shoulder to shoulder, would that completely stop illegal movement across 1:17:34.040 --> 1:17:37.080 the border. And so this is gonna be my opinion. 1:17:37.200 --> 1:17:39.920 All right, So probably you're shaking your head. No, no, 1:17:40.040 --> 1:17:43.599 I I if there's money to be made, a smuggler 1:17:43.680 --> 1:17:46.040 is going to do something. He's gonna try to smuggle something. 1:17:46.360 --> 1:17:49.040 So that I don't think that we will ever stop 1:17:50.720 --> 1:17:53.160 of traffic coming back and forth across the borders. It's 1:17:53.200 --> 1:17:58.599 just not feasible. You got something you well, that's I mean, 1:17:58.680 --> 1:18:01.000 you could put you could put peoples shoulders the shoulder 1:18:01.040 --> 1:18:02.960 and they're gonna go to the air or they're gonna 1:18:03.000 --> 1:18:05.280 go more to they're going to go to concealment rate 1:18:05.400 --> 1:18:08.400 you know, through the through the ports of entry. UM. 1:18:08.479 --> 1:18:11.000 And so it's you know, how how far are we 1:18:11.080 --> 1:18:14.800 going to dig into you know, inspections more so than 1:18:14.840 --> 1:18:17.280 we already do at the international borders, you know, try 1:18:17.280 --> 1:18:20.920 and facilitate legitimate trade and travel UM takes a you 1:18:20.960 --> 1:18:26.600 know a unique balance of of enforcement and UM and 1:18:26.680 --> 1:18:30.400 throughput in order to maintain our economy. UM. So you 1:18:30.400 --> 1:18:33.040 know what is the answer, I don't know, UM, but 1:18:33.560 --> 1:18:37.320 putting forth the best the best known practices of of 1:18:37.320 --> 1:18:42.960 of intelligence, surveillance capabilities UM in order to get you 1:18:42.960 --> 1:18:45.519 know that that traffic through at the ports of entry, 1:18:45.880 --> 1:18:47.800 but also block off what's in between the ports the 1:18:47.800 --> 1:18:49.840 ports of venture like we do is it's it's a 1:18:49.840 --> 1:18:52.400 delicate dance. So everything we do, right, I mean, their 1:18:52.439 --> 1:18:55.880 counterintelligence smugglers, counter counter of tongues just as good as ours. 1:18:55.880 --> 1:18:58.439 They're gonna see how we're reacting to certain traffick in 1:18:58.439 --> 1:19:01.439 an area, and they're gonna change their tactics and it's 1:19:01.479 --> 1:19:03.519 up to us to figure out how they've changed their 1:19:03.520 --> 1:19:05.880 tactics and react to it. So, like you said, we 1:19:05.920 --> 1:19:10.000 can put you know, shoulder to shoulder and they're either 1:19:10.000 --> 1:19:12.320 gonna fly over because if there's money to be made, 1:19:12.640 --> 1:19:14.639 they're gonna they're gonna do it, or they're gonna tunnel. 1:19:14.680 --> 1:19:17.440 You guys have probably we've had a rash of tunnels 1:19:17.479 --> 1:19:20.440 along the southwest border. They'll dig a tunnel and come underneath, 1:19:21.240 --> 1:19:24.559 or um they'll they'll expand on their on their their 1:19:24.560 --> 1:19:27.880 concealment methods, like the tractor trailer down on Larrado. They'll 1:19:27.880 --> 1:19:30.439 do different things to try to get them across. If 1:19:30.439 --> 1:19:32.760 there's money to be made, smuggles are gonna are gonna 1:19:32.800 --> 1:19:34.880 smuggle it. Is there a part of the agency or 1:19:34.880 --> 1:19:37.519 a different agency that you guys work with that looks 1:19:37.560 --> 1:19:40.439 at it on a bigger scale, like a social scale, 1:19:40.439 --> 1:19:43.000 like what could we do so that there wouldn't be 1:19:43.040 --> 1:19:45.599 this money to be made or wouldn't be this demand 1:19:45.680 --> 1:19:48.320 for these things that cause these issues? Or is there 1:19:48.360 --> 1:19:52.560 somebody working on it from that angle that questions that 1:19:52.760 --> 1:19:57.240 endle will be a consequence, right, So actions have consequences, right, 1:19:57.240 --> 1:20:00.360 and if it's a negative consequence, you probably he won't 1:20:00.360 --> 1:20:04.960 do that action again. So the the best method of 1:20:05.720 --> 1:20:09.920 stopping somebody from doing something is having negative consequence on 1:20:09.960 --> 1:20:14.160 their action, right, um. And and that's the delicate dance. 1:20:14.280 --> 1:20:17.160 Right to operate within as a chief patrol age. And 1:20:17.160 --> 1:20:19.680 I'm given I'm given the left and right boundaries from 1:20:19.680 --> 1:20:22.559 the administration, and it's up to me to figure out 1:20:22.560 --> 1:20:24.920 how to get from A to B within those left 1:20:24.920 --> 1:20:27.639 and right boundaries to deliver that consequence. I think, well, yeah, 1:20:27.680 --> 1:20:30.360 what yeah, An, what you're I think what you're more 1:20:30.400 --> 1:20:33.479 referring to, UM, I would say it does happen if 1:20:33.520 --> 1:20:37.160 you look at the way that the federal government might 1:20:37.160 --> 1:20:41.280 try to go down and engage with governments in Venezuela, 1:20:41.680 --> 1:20:47.200 governments in Columbia about how to improve conditions adjustments that 1:20:47.240 --> 1:20:50.599 they might make where they're not creating an inhospitable environment 1:20:50.640 --> 1:20:52.280 for people that then we have to deal with at 1:20:52.280 --> 1:20:54.000 our borders. So like, take some of that money and 1:20:54.000 --> 1:20:56.840 try to go to the root, cause that's going to 1:20:56.880 --> 1:20:59.400 be more Department of State type activities in order to 1:20:59.439 --> 1:21:02.760 eliminate push factors from these from these countries. And we 1:21:02.800 --> 1:21:06.959 have our International Affairs UH division over in in operational services, 1:21:07.240 --> 1:21:11.240 another component within customs and Border protection where they work 1:21:11.280 --> 1:21:13.519 with our foreign partners and try to figure out ways 1:21:13.560 --> 1:21:17.639 to deliver consequences and and and also to to get 1:21:17.680 --> 1:21:20.280 other countries to step up and and assist us in 1:21:20.320 --> 1:21:24.280 these in these actions. How how is your working working 1:21:24.360 --> 1:21:30.240 relationship with like Mexican government and authorities? Like is it 1:21:30.360 --> 1:21:33.000 something you guys work with? It's like, are they helping 1:21:33.040 --> 1:21:38.479 you prevent people from crossing the border? Is that not? Well? 1:21:39.120 --> 1:21:41.880 So we work both with with with Canadian and and 1:21:42.080 --> 1:21:46.320 yeah and South So I think really the relationship is 1:21:46.360 --> 1:21:47.760 pretty good. But the other thing is too. You have 1:21:47.800 --> 1:21:50.160 to remember now we're getting into the politics, right, The 1:21:50.160 --> 1:21:53.040 politics of of Mexico and the politics the United States 1:21:53.040 --> 1:21:55.880 are two very very different things. So it's and and 1:21:55.880 --> 1:21:57.960 those agencies that we work with down there, whether it's 1:21:57.960 --> 1:22:01.679 Sadeta or any of those other countries, are those UH 1:22:01.840 --> 1:22:05.519 agencies within the Mexican government. They have the same left 1:22:05.560 --> 1:22:09.519 and right boundaries that we do. So there between between 1:22:09.520 --> 1:22:11.280 the two of us were trying to find the best 1:22:11.320 --> 1:22:16.440 way to deliver a consequence or help um UH in 1:22:17.160 --> 1:22:22.080 impede UH traffic coming through right because obviously I think 1:22:22.080 --> 1:22:24.000 that the country of Mexico wants to do what they 1:22:24.000 --> 1:22:27.120 can because the impact from South American people coming through 1:22:27.200 --> 1:22:30.960 Mexico has the same impact on the citizens of Mexico 1:22:31.240 --> 1:22:33.040 that it does on the citizens in United States. So 1:22:33.400 --> 1:22:37.160 they have a vested um benefit in trying to work 1:22:37.200 --> 1:22:39.160 with us. So it's not like you guys would get 1:22:39.200 --> 1:22:42.240 a call and be like, hey, well we have we 1:22:42.320 --> 1:22:44.519 have a group coming, we have folks in heeded, we 1:22:44.560 --> 1:22:47.760 have folks embedded in in in countries through the International 1:22:47.800 --> 1:22:51.639 Affairs Program, so that that then intelligent to sell shared 1:22:51.680 --> 1:22:55.840 back and forth. I was hunting to Havelina in Arizona, 1:22:56.520 --> 1:22:58.840 UM last February for a couple of days, just messing 1:22:58.880 --> 1:23:02.200 around a couple of friends of mine, and we had 1:23:02.240 --> 1:23:05.759 found a big They were showing me just a big trail, 1:23:05.840 --> 1:23:07.800 like kind of an unexpected location. It's like a big 1:23:07.800 --> 1:23:11.320 crossing trail, and there were areas that had We went 1:23:11.320 --> 1:23:14.280 to this one area they showed me where it had 1:23:14.920 --> 1:23:19.559 stashes that had been depleted, clothing stashes and water stashes 1:23:19.560 --> 1:23:23.120 and people would change clothes and an empty water jugs 1:23:23.479 --> 1:23:25.200 and they're like, oh yeah, they'll have people come ahead 1:23:25.240 --> 1:23:27.040 and scout and set all that stuff. Then the people 1:23:27.200 --> 1:23:28.680 come over and they know where it's at. It was. 1:23:28.720 --> 1:23:31.320 I took a T shirt that I found, brought it home, 1:23:31.560 --> 1:23:33.040 gave it to my kid and said, that's a drug 1:23:33.120 --> 1:23:35.880 runner's T shirt. He got all excited about it. My 1:23:35.920 --> 1:23:37.600 wife then took it away from him because she's like, 1:23:37.640 --> 1:23:40.120 he's gonna go to school, he's gonna tell everybody to 1:23:40.200 --> 1:23:42.880 drug Like, what do you you know? She's like, why 1:23:43.000 --> 1:23:45.400 do you have to tell him that it's in my 1:23:45.520 --> 1:23:47.760 rag bin in my garage now? But she's like, you 1:23:47.800 --> 1:23:49.720 can't give him like half a story like that and 1:23:49.760 --> 1:23:52.760 then expect him to probably probably the best place for 1:23:52.800 --> 1:23:54.280 her to know what to say, you know, this is 1:23:54.320 --> 1:23:58.040 a drugging shirt. The question I wanted to ask about 1:23:58.040 --> 1:24:02.479 it is, so we're in the same place for a 1:24:02.479 --> 1:24:07.200 couple of days, creeping all around the woods, and um, 1:24:07.320 --> 1:24:09.280 no one talks to us, like, no one comes and 1:24:09.360 --> 1:24:11.200 checks on us and my buddies like they know what 1:24:11.240 --> 1:24:18.680 you're doing. They border patrol. So again, I I'm just 1:24:18.680 --> 1:24:21.840 gonna speak for myself and and that I think I 1:24:21.840 --> 1:24:25.080 can tell the difference between somebody laying in and hunting 1:24:25.400 --> 1:24:29.040 and somebody laying in and do something else. Right, Um, 1:24:29.120 --> 1:24:31.040 just like just like if I'm working at a port 1:24:31.080 --> 1:24:33.519 of entry, and James is coming back and he's got 1:24:33.520 --> 1:24:34.720 a weapon, and I said, well, why do you have 1:24:34.760 --> 1:24:36.680 a weapon while I went hunting? And I'm gonna go 1:24:36.680 --> 1:24:38.360 through his car and I'm gonna see that. Oh wait, 1:24:38.400 --> 1:24:41.240 he's got some meat. He's also got this guy's been hunting. 1:24:41.280 --> 1:24:44.479 There's some validity to that story compared to somebody coming 1:24:44.479 --> 1:24:46.920 and saying, oh, I went bear hunting in Canada and 1:24:46.960 --> 1:24:49.479 all they have is a bunch of rifles and they 1:24:49.520 --> 1:24:51.840 didn't look like they've been hunting at all. So I 1:24:52.160 --> 1:24:55.840 think in most cases, most portant, most ports religions have 1:24:55.880 --> 1:24:57.960 a pretty good idea of their of the area that 1:24:58.000 --> 1:25:00.840 they're working in, and and they also have a pretty 1:25:00.840 --> 1:25:03.640 good idea of what areas are are high trafficked in 1:25:03.760 --> 1:25:06.840 hunters and and then are high traffic and other things. 1:25:07.160 --> 1:25:10.960 Not only that, um, you know, hunters, Borber religions are 1:25:11.040 --> 1:25:13.040 very pretty good at sign cutting. All of us are are. 1:25:13.320 --> 1:25:15.320 It's just that's the one thing they say about a 1:25:15.320 --> 1:25:17.519 border tril agent is if you need somebody to help track, 1:25:17.920 --> 1:25:21.200 call a Borber trilogy because they're good trackers, and you 1:25:22.840 --> 1:25:26.479 alien smugglers or or narcotic smugglers, they go to great 1:25:26.560 --> 1:25:30.880 lengths to try to brush outside where hunters don't necessarily 1:25:31.160 --> 1:25:33.920 worry about that, right because the sign you're following is 1:25:33.920 --> 1:25:37.800 obviously something else. They'll they'll brush, absolutely, they'll brush out 1:25:37.800 --> 1:25:40.720 the tracks that well. They will wear carpet on their 1:25:40.760 --> 1:25:43.920 shoes to try to hide their tracks. They'll they'll walk 1:25:43.960 --> 1:25:47.160 backwards to make it look like they're going the other direction. 1:25:48.360 --> 1:25:51.920 They carry a leaf blower, carry leaf blowers, any any 1:25:52.000 --> 1:25:54.800 number of things. I've even seen them take coves from 1:25:54.920 --> 1:25:57.599 from cattle and strap them to their feet to make 1:25:57.640 --> 1:26:02.000 it look like cattle traffic and not human traffic. Yeah, 1:26:02.040 --> 1:26:04.000 you know the weed warden we had talked about that 1:26:05.080 --> 1:26:07.479 area where they had an illegal grow and you just 1:26:07.520 --> 1:26:11.840 thought it was all cattle making little shoes, making little 1:26:11.840 --> 1:26:15.679 shoes like that and they're strapping them to their feet. Oh. So, 1:26:16.000 --> 1:26:18.880 we have a podcast on our network that's by a 1:26:18.880 --> 1:26:21.920 guy named Clay Newcome called the Bear Grease Podcast. He 1:26:21.960 --> 1:26:23.880 had a guy on there telling a story recently where 1:26:23.880 --> 1:26:28.960 he had killed buck and cut the tarso glands off 1:26:29.040 --> 1:26:32.439 it and tied the car tarsal glands to his shoes 1:26:34.360 --> 1:26:39.680 and he bout got attacked by a buck. Believe it. 1:26:40.479 --> 1:26:42.519 He said this buck. He could hear. He kept hearing 1:26:42.520 --> 1:26:45.160 something behind him, and this buck was coming snorting at him. 1:26:45.439 --> 1:26:49.040 He killed it, but he said he doesn't do that anymore. Not, 1:26:51.439 --> 1:26:53.320 no I did. He said it scared him bad when 1:26:53.320 --> 1:26:56.840 he turned around there, it was coming for him. You know. Uh, 1:26:57.000 --> 1:27:01.400 let's talk about those big ass blimps. Oh, aerostats. Yeah, 1:27:01.439 --> 1:27:03.439 Now here's where you can't. Here's where you're not gonna 1:27:03.439 --> 1:27:07.400 be able to tell me anything. What's up with those 1:27:07.400 --> 1:27:17.720 big gas blimps? Okay, weather balloons. No, we make a 1:27:17.720 --> 1:27:19.800 real habit of staring at those blimps when we're hunting 1:27:19.800 --> 1:27:22.639 down there, and we're like that dude he could tell 1:27:22.640 --> 1:27:24.559 when you're picking his nose and when you're picking your nose. 1:27:26.280 --> 1:27:27.880 I don't know about that, and I haven't seen the 1:27:28.320 --> 1:27:29.960 So the aerostats are just let you guys know, in 1:27:29.960 --> 1:27:31.760 the south west part, they have a great deal of 1:27:31.760 --> 1:27:35.439 technology between the cameras and the lights and all that 1:27:35.479 --> 1:27:37.640 stuff that's gone out there. You guys have probably been 1:27:37.640 --> 1:27:39.719 down the You've probably seen the scope trucks or the 1:27:39.800 --> 1:27:43.160 or the trailers that are those kind of things are 1:27:43.160 --> 1:27:46.320 always up on the good glass. Yeah, they're causing problems, right, 1:27:46.360 --> 1:27:48.720 So they're actually gone up and leaned against those the 1:27:48.760 --> 1:27:51.640 fences around that stuff glass and yeah, so the aerostat 1:27:51.720 --> 1:27:54.160 is just another instead of having a helo or a 1:27:54.200 --> 1:27:56.439 plane flying, we can put up an arrow stat and 1:27:56.520 --> 1:27:58.920 use the erostat like a camera to look at an 1:27:58.920 --> 1:28:01.680 area to see where traffic is coming or traffic is 1:28:01.680 --> 1:28:04.280 coming across. Has a way to identify what the traffic 1:28:04.400 --> 1:28:06.200 is and then give us an idea of how to 1:28:06.240 --> 1:28:09.120 interdict it. So one one question that I had for 1:28:09.240 --> 1:28:12.280 James when we first spoke was all of the hardware 1:28:12.880 --> 1:28:16.759 and video cameras and such along the border. That's picking 1:28:16.880 --> 1:28:21.040 up everything that the camera I will pick up. But 1:28:21.240 --> 1:28:26.960 how is that being used to in your uh feel Charles, 1:28:27.080 --> 1:28:30.600 like looking at animals crossing you know how that's monitoring 1:28:30.640 --> 1:28:34.400 wildlife as well. Yeah, that's a that's a great question, 1:28:34.960 --> 1:28:41.360 really like cool. Yeah, yeah, exactly exactly. Actually it is 1:28:41.439 --> 1:28:44.360 exactly like that. We've we have actually had, um, there 1:28:44.400 --> 1:28:46.760 have been a few cases in the past where we've 1:28:47.040 --> 1:28:50.160 where we have you know, seen big cats um from 1:28:50.160 --> 1:28:57.599 those things, not not from the aerostat um, but from yeah, 1:28:57.680 --> 1:28:59.760 through some of our other technology. Yeah, we get some 1:29:00.320 --> 1:29:03.360 pretty over the years, um that that I've been lucky 1:29:03.439 --> 1:29:06.120 enough to to be in this position. I've been privy 1:29:06.640 --> 1:29:09.040 and able to share it with with our land management 1:29:09.040 --> 1:29:13.080 partners on some pretty unique situations have happened with wildlife 1:29:13.120 --> 1:29:16.439 and the border. Oh yeah, I posted I post a 1:29:16.439 --> 1:29:18.920 picture every month on on the Instagram page for the 1:29:18.960 --> 1:29:22.120 have Her Sector Chiefs of stuff that we've seen mountain 1:29:22.160 --> 1:29:24.160 lions and things like that on some of our game camera. 1:29:24.320 --> 1:29:28.240 So you've picked up uh, you guys have picked up jaguars. 1:29:28.520 --> 1:29:32.599 We well, I mean we haven't, but yeah, we've had 1:29:32.640 --> 1:29:35.760 pictures on like on some of our surveillance where we've 1:29:35.800 --> 1:29:39.280 had jaguars. And do you notify wildlife folks about that? Yeah? 1:29:39.280 --> 1:29:41.439 And well, you know we have to go through there 1:29:41.520 --> 1:29:44.320 there are some you know, security things that we have 1:29:44.360 --> 1:29:47.519 to go through internally. Um, but we do you know, 1:29:48.200 --> 1:29:51.040 relay that information out to Fish and Wildlife Service for 1:29:51.080 --> 1:29:54.120 their and for you know, so they can keep track also. Um. 1:29:54.200 --> 1:29:56.759 And then you know, occasionally we have some fun stuff 1:29:56.800 --> 1:29:59.240 that happens, like there was um, I think it was 1:29:59.280 --> 1:30:00.880 maybe a couple of year is back, we had a 1:30:00.920 --> 1:30:04.080 bear that climbed the border wall and then would climb 1:30:04.280 --> 1:30:08.040 climb one of the light towers. Um that's along the 1:30:08.040 --> 1:30:11.160 borderer or tried to climb the light tower anyways. Um. 1:30:11.200 --> 1:30:14.680 And then we had um uh a mountain lion that 1:30:14.800 --> 1:30:16.600 actually got on top of the border wall and was 1:30:16.680 --> 1:30:21.160 like walking across the top of the border wall. Oh yeah, 1:30:21.360 --> 1:30:26.280 what did he end up doing? I end up going south? Yeah, 1:30:26.439 --> 1:30:28.439 he came. He came from the north, speaking of like 1:30:28.439 --> 1:30:30.160 what you're going across the north to the south. He 1:30:30.200 --> 1:30:32.960 went north to the south south, Yeah, and right over 1:30:33.000 --> 1:30:35.320 the right over the fence group. Like, I feel like 1:30:35.360 --> 1:30:38.360 there's just gotta be so much visual information of like 1:30:38.560 --> 1:30:42.200 interesting critter stories that all of that. I mean, I 1:30:42.040 --> 1:30:45.679 imagine there's a ship ton of cameras, so just everything 1:30:45.720 --> 1:30:48.679 that you pick up. Yeah, I mean we pick up, Yeah, 1:30:48.720 --> 1:30:50.519 we pick up a lot of stuff. And it's just 1:30:50.600 --> 1:30:54.400 the more interesting stuff that you know, and and and 1:30:54.840 --> 1:30:57.919 more unique stuff that will that will share because otherwise, 1:30:57.920 --> 1:31:01.280 like we would inundate fishing Wildlife Service service with like hey, 1:31:01.320 --> 1:31:03.639 here's a here's another picture of a bear on this trail, 1:31:03.720 --> 1:31:06.240 you know, and and follow the bear through the trail 1:31:06.600 --> 1:31:08.920 that um, you know that they're going on or you 1:31:08.920 --> 1:31:11.559 know whatever, you know, whatever significant wildlife So it's just 1:31:11.600 --> 1:31:14.200 like the more interesting things like our guys know, like 1:31:14.200 --> 1:31:16.640 if they see a big cat you know, um, you 1:31:16.680 --> 1:31:20.120 know jaguar specifically, um or you know, a mountain lion 1:31:20.200 --> 1:31:23.280 in in something a unique case that that gets relate 1:31:23.320 --> 1:31:24.920 to me, so then we can relay it to our 1:31:25.000 --> 1:31:30.200 land management partners. Yeah. Let's say an agent has a 1:31:30.320 --> 1:31:35.600 buddy who's a hunter, great bund and he sees like 1:31:35.640 --> 1:31:39.840 a a camera. Is there anything wrong with him being like, hey, 1:31:39.920 --> 1:31:43.120 you know down kind of in that little zone of 1:31:43.840 --> 1:31:46.840 this creek there. I can tell you they're tight lip 1:31:46.880 --> 1:31:49.840 because me and Eddie when we were hunting Haviline and 1:31:49.880 --> 1:31:51.800 we tried to hit up some Border patrol dudes and 1:31:51.840 --> 1:31:57.360 they were like, you like, no intel, these guys don't 1:31:57.360 --> 1:31:59.920 know what's going on. Well here's the thing that hunter 1:32:01.960 --> 1:32:05.840 that's exactly like one of the things that you don't 1:32:05.880 --> 1:32:09.439 know where any but one of the things that I 1:32:09.439 --> 1:32:14.080 think a lot of people, um, you know don't maybe 1:32:14.200 --> 1:32:15.960 I don't know. I don't want to say they don't realize, 1:32:15.960 --> 1:32:18.840 but but sometimes you've got to remember is like our 1:32:18.960 --> 1:32:22.920 job as a border patrol agent is a pretty I'm 1:32:22.920 --> 1:32:25.599 gonna say it, sorry, Chief, I'm gonna say this, it's crazy. 1:32:25.760 --> 1:32:29.639 You're given okay, you're you're hired and you're given you're 1:32:29.680 --> 1:32:32.400 given training, how to sign cut, how to do this 1:32:32.479 --> 1:32:36.439 job out and you know, in God's country right, all 1:32:36.479 --> 1:32:40.599 across the southern, southern and northern border. Right, you're sometimes 1:32:40.640 --> 1:32:42.559 you're alone, sometimes you're you have you know, you have 1:32:42.640 --> 1:32:45.800 a partner to to work with you out there, and 1:32:45.920 --> 1:32:49.160 you come back and you do it again every day. Right. 1:32:49.920 --> 1:32:51.680 You gotta be a little crazy to do that kind 1:32:51.680 --> 1:32:54.080 of job, you know. And at the same time, you 1:32:54.240 --> 1:32:58.400 also have to be an avid outdoorsman or outdoors woman. 1:32:58.439 --> 1:33:00.639 You have to love the environment, have some kind of 1:33:00.680 --> 1:33:04.160 love and affinity towards working outdoors to do the job 1:33:04.200 --> 1:33:07.400 that we do, which back to your question about hey, 1:33:07.439 --> 1:33:09.759 where's this big you know, where's this coups or where's 1:33:09.800 --> 1:33:12.720 this you know heard at? Well, most of us are 1:33:12.840 --> 1:33:15.080 hunters too, and so we don't want to give up, 1:33:16.360 --> 1:33:22.599 but we may know as a good spot more these 1:33:22.600 --> 1:33:26.000 guys played dumb about the havelin. I'm like, so best, 1:33:26.040 --> 1:33:29.080 I can tell you've been out here some number of days. 1:33:30.600 --> 1:33:32.840 I'll tell you a good thing about bobar T religion 1:33:32.800 --> 1:33:35.160 and and it's it doesn't matter whether it's because there's 1:33:35.160 --> 1:33:36.840 a lot of times a lot of ortlins when they're 1:33:36.840 --> 1:33:39.200 working a load of dope, they'll go down and burn 1:33:39.240 --> 1:33:41.320 it just so the other bobard t religian doesn't catch it. 1:33:41.600 --> 1:33:43.839 So it's the same thing when it comes to hunters, 1:33:43.960 --> 1:33:46.719 right and hunting boblis won't tell you a thing because 1:33:46.720 --> 1:33:49.080 they'd rather fail and not get it than see you 1:33:49.160 --> 1:33:57.040 be successful. Well, now I'll be like seeing any havelina first, 1:33:57.040 --> 1:33:58.759 I'm gonna be like, so you work for the Border Patrol, 1:33:58.760 --> 1:34:00.920 and I'll see in his eyes, dude and asked him 1:34:00.920 --> 1:34:05.599 about the halina. If you let's let's talk about more 1:34:05.640 --> 1:34:08.360 about wildlife in the in the border. It's still real 1:34:08.400 --> 1:34:12.400 quick just to interject that the biggest balloons those are 1:34:12.479 --> 1:34:15.080 those are called the acronym for those tars, it's tethered 1:34:15.120 --> 1:34:20.400 aerostat Radar systems UM. Those are actually primarily for UM 1:34:20.840 --> 1:34:25.400 sensing the low air domain, So for aircraft aircraft sensor. 1:34:25.520 --> 1:34:28.599 They're not watching you pick your nose in at. There's 1:34:28.640 --> 1:34:31.519 other stuff quote unquote on their way with other other 1:34:31.640 --> 1:34:35.679 sensing equipment on those UM, but the primary their primary 1:34:36.400 --> 1:34:40.720 role is for is basically low low aircraft systems. You know, 1:34:42.240 --> 1:34:45.200 spent time in ultra lights, helicopters one that's going on 1:34:45.360 --> 1:34:49.400 low space and the and then individual uh su ad 1:34:49.439 --> 1:34:52.280 the smaller V I had a friend of mine in 1:34:52.280 --> 1:34:55.080 the military. I can't hear if you talk about Iraq Afghanistan, 1:34:55.560 --> 1:34:57.519 he said they used a lot of those for that purpose. 1:34:57.800 --> 1:35:03.880 Absolutely the exact same capability tracking aircraft and drones and stuff. Okay, Um, 1:35:05.400 --> 1:35:07.120 I've brought a bunch of times over the years to 1:35:07.360 --> 1:35:09.640 listeners the idea, especially when the idea of the of 1:35:09.720 --> 1:35:14.479 an impenetrable wall right became an issue, I would bring up. 1:35:15.080 --> 1:35:19.240 I would bring up when considering all of the factors, 1:35:20.200 --> 1:35:26.560 a thing to consider is wildlife movement. Okay, not in 1:35:26.960 --> 1:35:28.640 in people get riled up and they get piste to 1:35:28.680 --> 1:35:31.840 even mentioned it because how dare you question the legitimacy 1:35:31.880 --> 1:35:34.040 of it of the wall. I'm like, I'm not. I'm 1:35:34.080 --> 1:35:37.760 just saying it's a thing to consider. But the more 1:35:37.800 --> 1:35:40.840 I think about it, too, I'd have to imagine that 1:35:41.000 --> 1:35:45.280 there are with just the amount of human traffic, human 1:35:45.360 --> 1:35:51.200 activity in terms of people crossing illegally, people trying to 1:35:51.320 --> 1:35:56.879 catch the people crossing illegally. Um, all the vehicular traffic. 1:35:58.040 --> 1:35:59.800 Then you add in the wall. It has to have 1:36:00.120 --> 1:36:06.840 big implications for wildlife. Um, I'm gonna answer this little 1:36:06.840 --> 1:36:08.439 bit in Charles. You can correct me when I'm wrong, 1:36:08.439 --> 1:36:11.200 because I'm pretty sure i'll be wrong. I'll just talk 1:36:11.240 --> 1:36:14.280 about this section in human Arizona. So one of one 1:36:14.320 --> 1:36:15.920 of the problems you have in Arizona is what's the 1:36:16.040 --> 1:36:19.280 lizard that's down there that do you have to avoid? Well, 1:36:19.320 --> 1:36:21.920 I mean there's the the HeLa monster, and yeah, there's 1:36:21.960 --> 1:36:25.000 there's they have these lizards at all over and we're warrnted, 1:36:25.040 --> 1:36:26.559 you know when you see him stop the run over 1:36:26.720 --> 1:36:29.200 things like that. So the wall that that's built in 1:36:29.520 --> 1:36:32.760 Numa doesn't impede that animal's ability to go back and 1:36:32.840 --> 1:36:37.040 forth or or or or in any direction. Lizard a lizard, right, well, 1:36:37.040 --> 1:36:39.560 I think it or more thinking about large like like 1:36:41.280 --> 1:36:45.639 it certainly does it affect the the ability for them. So, UM, 1:36:48.560 --> 1:36:50.840 I don't know. I'm gonna let you answer they because 1:36:51.240 --> 1:36:53.880 I think I'm going to get into trouble. That's okay, 1:36:54.000 --> 1:36:57.800 I'm yeah, Um, yes, there's I mean, is there some 1:36:57.960 --> 1:37:00.920 kind of impedence, Yes, that's I mean, it's a wall, 1:37:01.240 --> 1:37:04.439 you know. Um, it's a border wall system though. Two. 1:37:04.560 --> 1:37:06.880 That's that's the thing I think a lot of people don't, 1:37:07.520 --> 1:37:10.760 um don't take into account for, is that, like it's 1:37:11.000 --> 1:37:14.519 where we aren't DHS isn't trying to put up just 1:37:14.760 --> 1:37:16.760 a border wall. We're trying to put up a border 1:37:16.800 --> 1:37:23.400 wall system. UM. And that does so when when you say, oh, well, 1:37:23.439 --> 1:37:26.720 it's just you know, it's that wall, it's that wall, Well, yeah, 1:37:26.880 --> 1:37:30.520 it's just we're talking about specifically just that one component 1:37:31.360 --> 1:37:34.400 of what should be a system, which is the wall. 1:37:34.880 --> 1:37:38.200 There is an enforcement zone or you know, some some 1:37:38.360 --> 1:37:42.040 way for for an agent to traverse that area, along 1:37:42.120 --> 1:37:47.280 with technology, so all three of those things working together, okay, 1:37:47.400 --> 1:37:51.320 to to help maintain the safety of the border. It's 1:37:51.520 --> 1:37:55.680 essentially of the nation. Um. And and so when you 1:37:55.800 --> 1:37:59.760 look at just the wall as the impedance, yes, there 1:37:59.840 --> 1:38:05.120 is that impedance, but Border Patrol, DHS, CBP, UM we 1:38:05.240 --> 1:38:08.560 are working with the land management agencies to address and 1:38:08.720 --> 1:38:12.440 mitigate some of that impedance on the environment and the wildlife. 1:38:12.920 --> 1:38:16.920 For example, UM, you know in low water crossings, we 1:38:17.040 --> 1:38:20.560 have you know, gates there so we can allow for 1:38:20.640 --> 1:38:23.160 the for the sheet flow of the water during rainy 1:38:23.200 --> 1:38:26.320 seasons or outside of rainy seasons, if there's an event, 1:38:26.520 --> 1:38:29.320 we can you know, open up those open up those 1:38:29.360 --> 1:38:32.320 gates to allow for UM for the water to flow, 1:38:32.640 --> 1:38:37.320 which you know also allows for for wildlife to cross through. UM. 1:38:37.520 --> 1:38:40.599 Along with that, there's also I just got back UM 1:38:42.080 --> 1:38:45.160 about two weeks ago, UM maybe a week ago out. 1:38:45.240 --> 1:38:47.479 My dates are running and running together. It's been busy, 1:38:47.800 --> 1:38:51.519 but we just got back from actually ground truthing UM 1:38:51.800 --> 1:38:55.640 what are called small wildlife patch passages UM. So it's 1:38:55.760 --> 1:38:59.280 like what Chief Fortunato was talking about in Yuma. It's 1:38:59.280 --> 1:39:01.360 one of the places where this originated from. As they 1:39:01.400 --> 1:39:04.040 were putting a putting in. Their border wall system is 1:39:04.120 --> 1:39:07.600 along the border UM. Even though they're they're ballard's on 1:39:07.680 --> 1:39:11.639 the border that are you know about every four four 1:39:11.680 --> 1:39:16.080 inches UM there's a a circular ballard and so you 1:39:16.160 --> 1:39:18.400 have a four inch gap essentially that lets the border 1:39:18.400 --> 1:39:20.840 patrol see what's going on south. So it provides some 1:39:21.120 --> 1:39:24.000 visual security for us of what's going on south. But 1:39:24.080 --> 1:39:26.640 it's just a four inch gap UMUS sector started at 1:39:26.680 --> 1:39:31.400 the bottom putting in UM larger gaps. I think there's 1:39:31.439 --> 1:39:33.920 like it's like a six inch by two inch gaps 1:39:33.960 --> 1:39:37.120 so they notch out a portion every I don't know 1:39:37.160 --> 1:39:41.000 how many feet of that um uh of the ballard 1:39:41.160 --> 1:39:44.360 to allow for that lizard to freely go through it 1:39:44.400 --> 1:39:47.920 wouldn't be impeded in Tucson sector. And they're they're doing 1:39:47.960 --> 1:39:50.679 it in the in the newer UM border wall system 1:39:50.800 --> 1:39:53.240 that that they started putting in UM that there was 1:39:53.439 --> 1:39:56.360 it was placed in on pause on the January twenty 1:39:56.439 --> 1:39:59.719 but within the system UM we started putting in small 1:39:59.760 --> 1:40:03.160 wall life passages. So we in order to even put 1:40:03.240 --> 1:40:06.960 those in, we got with Department of Interior and Department 1:40:07.280 --> 1:40:11.599 of Agriculture, you know, being for service essentially, UM Fish 1:40:11.640 --> 1:40:14.920 and Wildlife Service, Bureau of Land Management, National Park Service, 1:40:15.320 --> 1:40:17.280 all the land managers that were along the border. We 1:40:17.400 --> 1:40:20.880 got with those land managers and we talked with them about, hey, 1:40:20.960 --> 1:40:23.680 we want to put in these small wildlife passages on 1:40:23.760 --> 1:40:27.080 the border wall system to allow for to to better 1:40:27.160 --> 1:40:31.040 allow for wildlife to migrate through the border wall system. 1:40:31.640 --> 1:40:34.479 And what we did was we let them pick the 1:40:34.600 --> 1:40:37.479 locations of where they think it would be adequate to 1:40:37.600 --> 1:40:41.320 put these UM small wildlife passages in. But then we 1:40:41.439 --> 1:40:43.840 also got with them physically went out to the border 1:40:44.280 --> 1:40:46.479 and said Okay, this is a GPS location that you 1:40:46.600 --> 1:40:49.280 said you would like to see this passage because they 1:40:49.360 --> 1:40:54.000 had the information on where wildlife would reverse and if 1:40:54.400 --> 1:40:56.240 you know, there were some places where where they looked 1:40:56.280 --> 1:40:58.080 and it was already in a wash, there was already 1:40:58.120 --> 1:41:01.880 a you know, a gate we were putting in there. 1:41:02.080 --> 1:41:03.800 So we would say, hey, you know what if we 1:41:03.920 --> 1:41:06.960 move this up into a little bit higher ground. That way, 1:41:07.000 --> 1:41:09.720 it's going to be in a place where wildlife can 1:41:09.920 --> 1:41:12.320 can pass through, and it's not a wasted location because 1:41:12.360 --> 1:41:14.920 there's you know, there's already a gate at the bottom 1:41:14.920 --> 1:41:17.080 of this washlests maybe put a little bit higher. When 1:41:17.160 --> 1:41:21.320 you say small wildlife passage, like what sized animal are 1:41:21.400 --> 1:41:24.240 we are like a deer could pass through this or 1:41:24.479 --> 1:41:30.240 not a deer is I wouldn't consider a deer small wildlife. Um, 1:41:30.560 --> 1:41:34.719 I'm talking the size of the hole wildlife as small 1:41:34.760 --> 1:41:40.719 as yeah, the kind of wildlife. So like it's essentially 1:41:40.800 --> 1:41:42.240 the gap is going to be about eight and a 1:41:42.320 --> 1:41:46.240 half by eleven um. So you know, and really when 1:41:46.280 --> 1:41:48.360 you're when you're thinking about it or when you look 1:41:48.400 --> 1:41:50.880 at that, that's a pretty significant amount of space because, 1:41:51.200 --> 1:41:53.719 like I said, the original gap is only four inches 1:41:53.800 --> 1:41:58.439 approximately four inches, UM, And so I just don't want 1:41:58.439 --> 1:42:00.439 anybody to go down there and go, oh that trust 1:42:00.479 --> 1:42:02.920 guy said, it's you know, four inches, and this gap 1:42:03.080 --> 1:42:05.160 is three point seven five you know, or it's four 1:42:05.280 --> 1:42:08.920 point two whatever, but it's approximately four inches, right, UM. 1:42:09.080 --> 1:42:12.200 So we're essentially making that gap almost doubling the size 1:42:12.320 --> 1:42:14.960 the width, and then we're increasing it, you know, eleven 1:42:15.200 --> 1:42:19.120 eleven inches up. Um. So we came to that. It 1:42:19.280 --> 1:42:23.479 was years back, UM when they actually came to the 1:42:23.560 --> 1:42:27.240 reasoning why. I'm not exactly sure what the reason why. Essentially, 1:42:27.320 --> 1:42:30.840 it's that the reality is the reality is that most 1:42:31.120 --> 1:42:33.800 normal human beings that are going to be coming through 1:42:34.320 --> 1:42:36.120 the international border, they are going to be able to 1:42:36.160 --> 1:42:40.000 fit that. But the amount of wildlife that you can 1:42:40.320 --> 1:42:44.000 that can fit through that is you know, greatly increased 1:42:44.439 --> 1:42:47.920 because just from from putting that kind of of um 1:42:48.720 --> 1:42:52.200 passage allowable for the wildlife to go through. Imagine a 1:42:52.360 --> 1:42:59.880 chart that has two lines on it. One is UM. Okay, 1:43:00.040 --> 1:43:04.200 let's say one line is spending spending at the spending 1:43:04.280 --> 1:43:07.120 on border security, US spending on border security in the 1:43:07.160 --> 1:43:13.200 southern border, and the other line is um traffic across 1:43:13.280 --> 1:43:21.680 said border. They rise in tandem or don't they We're 1:43:21.680 --> 1:43:23.519 spending more and more and more, but more and more 1:43:23.560 --> 1:43:27.960 people are coming across. If you like, let's say you 1:43:28.280 --> 1:43:33.599 drop the spending line with the other line increase even more. 1:43:34.200 --> 1:43:36.160 The gap would the gap would just increase? It be 1:43:36.280 --> 1:43:42.600 like like if there was no no obstruction whatsoever you 1:43:42.680 --> 1:43:45.360 feel it would be like I'm I asking an obvious question, 1:43:46.720 --> 1:43:52.120 no obstruction at all would be more than whatever million people? Yes, 1:43:54.560 --> 1:43:57.280 I hop, I mean I have to think so again. 1:43:57.320 --> 1:43:59.320 It goes back to that, like I talked about the consequence, 1:43:59.400 --> 1:44:02.880 right that you have to have the border wall system 1:44:02.920 --> 1:44:05.960 and and and tied with the consequent system and the 1:44:06.040 --> 1:44:08.960 criminal and and and being able to charge them criminally. 1:44:09.200 --> 1:44:12.040 All that is what's going to help bring those numbers down. 1:44:12.400 --> 1:44:14.840 Without it, it's just going to continue to fly because 1:44:14.840 --> 1:44:17.800 there has to be a consequence, and that consequence has 1:44:17.840 --> 1:44:19.799 to be greater than the amount of money that smugglers 1:44:19.880 --> 1:44:24.920 can make. M that's the reality. Where do you you see? 1:44:25.000 --> 1:44:26.360 I don't even want to ask because you won't be 1:44:26.360 --> 1:44:29.800 able to answer it, but I think I was gonna 1:44:29.800 --> 1:44:35.599 ask you where we sit right now? On consequence? Um, 1:44:36.960 --> 1:44:39.000 I'm doing the best job I can within the Haver 1:44:39.080 --> 1:44:43.040 sector a R to deliver the highest consequence possible to 1:44:43.160 --> 1:44:46.160 all those that break the laws that I'm authorized and 1:44:46.280 --> 1:44:50.000 forced and Title eight, Title nineteen and Title so we 1:44:50.240 --> 1:44:52.960 we levy Title twenty nine UH fees. If you come 1:44:52.960 --> 1:44:56.160 across you and you illegal, you come across the border, 1:44:56.160 --> 1:44:58.439 if you're Canadian, you come across the border through POE, 1:44:58.600 --> 1:45:01.280 we apprehend you. We're gonna deliver your consequence either through 1:45:01.360 --> 1:45:04.120 Title forty two or title to Title eight. So Title 1:45:04.160 --> 1:45:07.120 forty two expel them back, or Title eight charged them 1:45:07.200 --> 1:45:09.720 with illegal entry in the United States, and I'm also 1:45:09.800 --> 1:45:12.160 gonna hit you with a five thousand dollar fine for 1:45:12.720 --> 1:45:16.200 evading inspection at the port of entry. So we're doing 1:45:16.280 --> 1:45:20.320 everything we can to deliver the highest possible consequence that 1:45:20.439 --> 1:45:22.960 I can, knowing that the U. S. Attorney in the 1:45:23.000 --> 1:45:26.240 State of Montana is going to charge. They have they 1:45:26.320 --> 1:45:30.360 have their responsibilities, and they have their prosecution guidelines. I 1:45:30.479 --> 1:45:32.960 have those prosecution guidelines, and I do everything I can 1:45:33.360 --> 1:45:37.479 to prosecute and deliver consequence to anybody that enters or 1:45:37.520 --> 1:45:40.040 any crime that's committed within my a O R within 1:45:40.120 --> 1:45:43.080 those prosecution guidelines. Do you get more in trouble do 1:45:43.080 --> 1:45:46.240 you getting more trouble from crossing the northern border than 1:45:46.280 --> 1:45:51.760 you do the southern border because it more illegal? No, 1:45:51.960 --> 1:45:54.240 I mean a board or whether you cross, whether you 1:45:54.320 --> 1:45:57.120 cross in Mexico or whether you cross in Canada, or 1:45:57.120 --> 1:45:59.040 whether you for whatever reason, if you can do it, 1:45:59.439 --> 1:46:03.360 you can aid going through customs that you know, the 1:46:03.439 --> 1:46:06.439 international airport. It's it's all the same that the laws 1:46:06.479 --> 1:46:07.880 of the same. You're gonna get treated the same way. 1:46:07.880 --> 1:46:13.360 You can get treated the same way. Really really, yes, 1:46:14.400 --> 1:46:17.240 why are you so skeptical? I just feel like some dude, 1:46:17.760 --> 1:46:22.519 like with neferry, like some do with nefarious intentions, snuck 1:46:22.560 --> 1:46:26.400 across the northern border and gets picked up. I just 1:46:26.520 --> 1:46:28.839 feel like it's gonna be he's gonna have a different 1:46:28.920 --> 1:46:31.080 outcome than someone that did the same thing on the 1:46:31.120 --> 1:46:34.720 southern border. Well I wor yeah, I would have to think, 1:46:34.720 --> 1:46:37.400 because it's just gonna be Like I just feel like 1:46:37.439 --> 1:46:40.400 it's gonna be worse. No. So again that goes down 1:46:40.439 --> 1:46:42.439 to the problems you'll be given a trial date and 1:46:42.479 --> 1:46:45.760 turned loose. Um. I guess it depends on on the 1:46:45.920 --> 1:46:48.439 on on the parameters of the case. Right. So in 1:46:48.560 --> 1:46:50.760 some of those things, right, So as as the chief 1:46:50.800 --> 1:46:53.680 of the Border Patrol. The only thing that I can 1:46:53.800 --> 1:46:57.320 do is interdict and charge and and build the best 1:46:57.400 --> 1:47:00.160 case that I possibly can for that person to be 1:47:00.200 --> 1:47:03.640 actually be held in custody. That responsibility falls to the 1:47:03.720 --> 1:47:08.800 Director of Immigration UH Customs Enforcement. So the Director of 1:47:09.120 --> 1:47:13.000 of Immigration Customers Enforcement is housed in Salt Lake City. 1:47:13.439 --> 1:47:17.520 It's his responsibility to find space for whoever I apprehend. 1:47:18.240 --> 1:47:21.439 If he doesn't have the space, he has the authority 1:47:21.600 --> 1:47:24.560 to release that person into the into the country with 1:47:24.680 --> 1:47:27.920 a with a court date. So I have no control 1:47:28.000 --> 1:47:30.840 over that. I can utilize whatever network I have and 1:47:30.920 --> 1:47:33.880 whatever arm twisting I can, or whatever pleading I can, 1:47:34.320 --> 1:47:37.360 whatever relationship I have with them. Hey, this is the 1:47:37.439 --> 1:47:39.639 one guy I think I need, that you really need 1:47:39.720 --> 1:47:42.800 to hold. But ultimately it's his decision on whether or 1:47:42.800 --> 1:47:44.680 not he holds him. And then the same thing when 1:47:44.720 --> 1:47:48.040 it comes to the actual consequence. I have no control 1:47:48.120 --> 1:47:51.960 whether the Assistant U S Attorney in in in Missoula, 1:47:52.040 --> 1:47:56.719 Montana prosecutes that person that we have that we apprehend 1:47:56.760 --> 1:47:58.479 it in charge. All I can do, and this is 1:47:58.520 --> 1:48:01.160 what I tell my agents all the time. Our responsibility 1:48:01.360 --> 1:48:04.439 is to to protect the home land. And if somebody 1:48:04.600 --> 1:48:07.840 violates that protection and violates a law. Our job is 1:48:07.920 --> 1:48:12.479 to apprehend them and charge them. Once we're done with that, 1:48:13.000 --> 1:48:16.439 our bullets downrange. Everything else that happens after that, we 1:48:16.560 --> 1:48:19.280 have zero control over They whether they get held is 1:48:19.360 --> 1:48:22.040 up to somebody else's responsibility. And whether or not they 1:48:22.080 --> 1:48:24.800 get charged, or whether that that charge is dismissed or 1:48:24.840 --> 1:48:27.320 whether that charge is plead out. Is that the responsibility 1:48:27.360 --> 1:48:32.800 of somebody else. I hear from friends of mine and 1:48:32.880 --> 1:48:38.120 law enforcement that sometimes people will develop, like people in 1:48:38.200 --> 1:48:41.799 the field will develop a little bit of fatigue about 1:48:43.080 --> 1:48:46.120 doing their job and not seeing not being happy with 1:48:46.320 --> 1:48:50.439 you mentioned the down the downrange bullet. Yeah, what happens 1:48:50.479 --> 1:48:52.840 to it wants it gets downrange that it leads to 1:48:52.920 --> 1:48:55.640 fatigue and a little bit of ambivalence. Well, it's and 1:48:55.920 --> 1:48:58.880 I'm just gonna speak for for the agents that I 1:48:58.960 --> 1:49:02.799 supervise and and and have her and and it's probably 1:49:03.360 --> 1:49:06.040 typical of most border choices. Is probably even the four 1:49:06.080 --> 1:49:08.760 of us sitting in this room as a border of 1:49:08.800 --> 1:49:12.280 tal agent. It's just not good enough to apprehend them 1:49:12.280 --> 1:49:14.840 the charge and we want to see, we want to 1:49:14.880 --> 1:49:17.759 see something happen to them. And because we're all type 1:49:17.800 --> 1:49:21.919 a personalities, and and because we believe in protecting the homeland, 1:49:22.320 --> 1:49:24.559 and and we believe that that as part of doing 1:49:24.640 --> 1:49:28.240 that job is is bringing a consequence to somebody that 1:49:28.400 --> 1:49:31.760 breaks the law. And and yes, that the fatigue does 1:49:31.880 --> 1:49:35.360 come in because all in all, and you guys correct 1:49:35.400 --> 1:49:37.960 me if I'm wrong, an agent gets sick and tired 1:49:38.000 --> 1:49:40.400 of doing the best job that they possibly can to 1:49:40.560 --> 1:49:44.320 see them just walk away with so uh and and 1:49:44.439 --> 1:49:46.840 and it's not just the border of trolles like you said, 1:49:46.880 --> 1:49:50.360 it's it's happens all the way across law enforcement agencies. 1:49:50.720 --> 1:49:52.719 It even happened when I was a police officer in Colorado. 1:49:52.960 --> 1:49:56.040 You would charge things, and you know often the attorneys 1:49:56.120 --> 1:49:59.439 that that decide how things go besides the the ultimate 1:49:59.760 --> 1:50:01.760 they that happens with that case. So I know that 1:50:01.960 --> 1:50:04.719 that is one of the big challenges that were facing 1:50:04.720 --> 1:50:06.720 in the Border trol is that our Borbatrol agents are 1:50:06.760 --> 1:50:09.600 working hard every single day. And and they voiced to 1:50:09.680 --> 1:50:12.880 me that there they're sick and tired of working hard 1:50:13.280 --> 1:50:16.479 and and not seeing a consequence delivered. And that's my 1:50:16.600 --> 1:50:18.440 job is to try to make sure that those consequences 1:50:18.479 --> 1:50:21.640 are delivered. I gotta I know where this happened. I 1:50:21.640 --> 1:50:23.000 don't wanna get too many details, but I got a 1:50:23.080 --> 1:50:26.400 friend who, uh his body owns some retail space and 1:50:26.520 --> 1:50:29.799 he had a woman leave. Uh. He rents his retail 1:50:29.840 --> 1:50:37.320 space to a major um drug store. Okay, he watched 1:50:37.560 --> 1:50:41.120 a customer of his leave the store and get mugged 1:50:41.160 --> 1:50:45.080 and have her bags and purse stolen. And he couldn't 1:50:45.120 --> 1:50:49.120 get the cops that were there interested, and that this 1:50:49.320 --> 1:50:51.360 is there is nothing to do with your department. He 1:50:51.400 --> 1:50:54.360 couldn't get the cops interested, and the cops said to him, oh, 1:50:54.720 --> 1:50:59.599 what would you like me to do? Apprehend him? Well, 1:51:01.040 --> 1:51:04.120 I can tell you the apathy, right yeah, And I 1:51:04.160 --> 1:51:06.160 get that that's that's a police officer he's haven't talking 1:51:06.240 --> 1:51:09.080 to I can. I can honestly say that if that 1:51:09.240 --> 1:51:11.320 of a board of Chile Agion was standing there, I 1:51:11.439 --> 1:51:14.559 guarantee that person would have been apprehended, whether they were 1:51:14.600 --> 1:51:17.439 on dude or not, right James, Right, Charles, they would 1:51:17.479 --> 1:51:19.679 have jumped in and they would have that guy would 1:51:19.720 --> 1:51:33.160 have been apprehended. Steve on your on your what you 1:51:33.240 --> 1:51:36.560 described as far as like budget investment versus you know, 1:51:36.760 --> 1:51:40.320 the the increasing flow like they're like they kind of 1:51:40.920 --> 1:51:43.160 go hand in hand with one another. I don't think 1:51:43.200 --> 1:51:46.360 it's there. And and anyone could look up the CBPS 1:51:46.400 --> 1:51:49.880 as custom board protraction statistics for every fiscal year. Um, 1:51:50.080 --> 1:51:54.519 you know budgets. Uh, I'm just just speaking plainly. I'm sure. 1:51:54.640 --> 1:51:57.439 I'm sure government budgets for all matter of departments go 1:51:57.600 --> 1:51:59.600 up year after year. That's just seems to be the 1:51:59.640 --> 1:52:01.920 way I think the federal government. But you know the 1:52:02.000 --> 1:52:07.000 apprehensions and encounters that we see um in the war 1:52:07.080 --> 1:52:11.280 patrol and CPP wide, it's it's very much is related 1:52:11.360 --> 1:52:15.800 to the push factors from where people are leaving from, 1:52:16.320 --> 1:52:21.280 whether it's socio economic, environmental Uh. You know a lot 1:52:21.360 --> 1:52:25.680 of you know, communism, issues of communism Venezuela right now, 1:52:26.120 --> 1:52:28.760 an earthquake in Haiti, when any one of any one 1:52:28.800 --> 1:52:31.839 of a combination these factors can push a large population 1:52:31.920 --> 1:52:36.360 in people out to find refuge someplace else. Um. Combined 1:52:36.439 --> 1:52:42.000 with how whatever political parties in power in the United 1:52:42.040 --> 1:52:46.160 States any one time, how their priorities are loaded against 1:52:46.360 --> 1:52:48.560 the laws that are on the books, which typically do 1:52:48.720 --> 1:52:51.760 not change. It's just the priorities that they put in 1:52:51.880 --> 1:52:55.360 place on how those laws are enforced. It is what 1:52:55.520 --> 1:52:57.960 becomes the poll fit. That's an interesting point. Yeah, this 1:52:58.040 --> 1:53:00.559 interesting point that the laws don't change, it's just how 1:53:00.640 --> 1:53:06.559 you how you prioritize them changes. Well. So while while 1:53:06.600 --> 1:53:10.080 budget probably increases year after year, I would say, at 1:53:10.160 --> 1:53:13.320 least for homeland security because of of what it means 1:53:14.040 --> 1:53:19.240 um the the the the encounters will vary upon the 1:53:19.360 --> 1:53:21.519 combination of those push and pull factors. So it's not 1:53:21.680 --> 1:53:25.880 necessarily a correlation between budget goes up apprehensions encounters are 1:53:25.920 --> 1:53:27.640 going to go up. That's not necessarily the case. It 1:53:27.640 --> 1:53:31.240 will flow depending on those factors. Do agents that you 1:53:31.360 --> 1:53:33.559 guys know, do people start to feel a little bit 1:53:33.560 --> 1:53:39.080 of whiplash about changing priorities year to year? Is it? 1:53:40.240 --> 1:53:41.439 You know what I mean? Is it? Is it a 1:53:41.560 --> 1:53:45.600 cause of I've been in just about twenty five years now. 1:53:45.600 --> 1:53:47.439 I think I'm used to it. I've I've kind of 1:53:47.600 --> 1:53:51.479 chameleoned to what what we're doing. It's nothing, I guess 1:53:51.520 --> 1:53:54.240 I'm just used to it. And and and it's you know, 1:53:54.400 --> 1:53:55.800 that's that's just the way a government. We're not the 1:53:55.840 --> 1:53:58.519 only people impacted by this. It's every single agency. Uh, 1:53:58.640 --> 1:54:01.439 I know, you guys have had a myriad of of 1:54:01.800 --> 1:54:05.000 of land management experts on on the show over the years, 1:54:05.040 --> 1:54:07.160 and I'm sure they have. Uh you know, how long 1:54:07.200 --> 1:54:10.040 has it been since since for service or BLM has 1:54:10.080 --> 1:54:12.120 had like a budget to sustain roads and whatnot? I 1:54:12.160 --> 1:54:14.800 mean like the Department of waiting decades just because things 1:54:14.880 --> 1:54:18.280 like homeland security and and international terrorism when I probably 1:54:18.280 --> 1:54:20.200 got in the way of those budgets being fulfilled and 1:54:20.720 --> 1:54:23.479 who knows how long. So it's it's just not it's 1:54:23.520 --> 1:54:27.400 just not us. So every every every every department and agency, 1:54:27.400 --> 1:54:29.600 even the federal government has has has to evolve to 1:54:29.680 --> 1:54:32.200 whatever the priorities are. Yeah, and I think it does. 1:54:32.440 --> 1:54:35.120 It just comes down to the length of time and service. Again, 1:54:35.160 --> 1:54:37.640 I've been in almost twenty six years and in twenty 1:54:37.680 --> 1:54:40.960 six years, I've seen what five presidents, So that change 1:54:41.000 --> 1:54:44.680 of response of of has happened that many times as 1:54:45.000 --> 1:54:46.920 as compared to somebody has only been in the agency 1:54:47.040 --> 1:54:49.400 maybe three or four years that come into it. This 1:54:49.600 --> 1:54:52.520 is all they know. They just don't have that concept 1:54:52.640 --> 1:54:55.040 of of it's an ebbs and flows kind of thing. 1:54:55.120 --> 1:54:58.640 It's it's uh, the reality is is that uh, you know, 1:54:58.840 --> 1:55:02.200 how we how we can deliver, how we work comes 1:55:02.280 --> 1:55:05.080 in in line with what the agents with the administration 1:55:05.160 --> 1:55:07.160 wants us to do. So a lot of that does 1:55:07.240 --> 1:55:09.840 come into link the service. Those guys that are younger 1:55:09.880 --> 1:55:12.000 are those agents that have been a little bit less 1:55:12.000 --> 1:55:14.160 amount of time struggle with a little bit more than 1:55:14.240 --> 1:55:16.560 folks that have what they perceive as a real change 1:55:16.600 --> 1:55:19.760 in direction. Right, do you have a hard time finding agents? 1:55:19.840 --> 1:55:24.640 Is a tough recruitment. Um, So recruitment has has has 1:55:24.680 --> 1:55:26.440 been a struggle, not just for the border troll but 1:55:26.480 --> 1:55:30.680 I think law enforcement, uh nationwide. Right, it's uh the 1:55:30.680 --> 1:55:33.760 border of trolling particular, Like Charles said, you have to 1:55:33.880 --> 1:55:35.560 be a borda tal agent. You have to be willing 1:55:36.120 --> 1:55:38.440 to go out and work in the outdoors and be 1:55:38.560 --> 1:55:41.440 outdoors and not be not being next to bathrooms and 1:55:41.960 --> 1:55:44.600 and be willing to to lay in with ticks and 1:55:44.840 --> 1:55:48.520 scorpions and spiders and god forbid snakes and all those 1:55:48.560 --> 1:55:51.360 other things that come along. And it takes a certain 1:55:51.800 --> 1:55:54.880 kind of a person to want to do that. And Um, 1:55:55.800 --> 1:55:57.560 the other thing that we're running into is this is 1:55:57.600 --> 1:56:00.640 this is a generation issue right now, right, Um, the 1:56:00.760 --> 1:56:04.000 generation of folks sitting around this table have a concept 1:56:04.040 --> 1:56:06.200 of hard work and true grit, and they're willing to 1:56:06.240 --> 1:56:08.600 go out and do that type of work. The generation 1:56:08.680 --> 1:56:10.640 nowadays is not that they don't want to work hard. 1:56:11.080 --> 1:56:13.960 They just want to work as hard as they can 1:56:14.120 --> 1:56:17.760 for as little hours as possible and get as much 1:56:17.800 --> 1:56:22.400 money as right, so that they can go do that 1:56:22.960 --> 1:56:25.480 so they can go enjoy life. Right. They don't want 1:56:25.480 --> 1:56:26.960 to they don't want to live to work. They want 1:56:26.960 --> 1:56:29.200 to work as little as possible and make as much 1:56:29.560 --> 1:56:31.760 money as they possibly can so they can go fish 1:56:31.840 --> 1:56:35.080 and go kayaking, go hiking, world travel, do those kind 1:56:35.120 --> 1:56:38.120 of things. So trying to find people that want to 1:56:38.200 --> 1:56:41.880 do both of those things is becoming difficult. Speaking of 1:56:41.960 --> 1:56:45.360 that is there is there places around the country that 1:56:45.480 --> 1:56:49.680 are like choice posts for border patrol agents or just 1:56:50.000 --> 1:56:54.520 employees in general. Places. Yeah, like places like that's the place, 1:56:55.000 --> 1:56:58.440 So I guess it depends on the person. Right. There's 1:56:58.440 --> 1:57:00.720 a lot of folks that are here in Montana. Part 1:57:00.760 --> 1:57:03.000 of the reason why they wanted to come to Montana 1:57:03.080 --> 1:57:05.480 is because of the of the ability to do that 1:57:05.600 --> 1:57:08.080 kind of things. Um, I think a lot of folks 1:57:08.160 --> 1:57:10.760 live in Arizona so that they can have those kind 1:57:10.800 --> 1:57:12.400 of concept. There's a lot of folks that want to 1:57:12.440 --> 1:57:16.240 go to the Rio Grand Valley because their fishermen they 1:57:16.280 --> 1:57:18.840 want to go do the offshore fishing and things like that. 1:57:19.240 --> 1:57:21.720 Um um, so yeah, there's a lot of folks that 1:57:21.760 --> 1:57:24.000 want to do that. The problem with the border, which 1:57:24.000 --> 1:57:26.520 told that most law enforcement agents don't have, is we're 1:57:26.640 --> 1:57:29.120 constrained by geography and that when you come into the 1:57:29.200 --> 1:57:31.720 United States Border Patrol and you get hired, you're going 1:57:31.800 --> 1:57:34.440 to one of the nine Southwest border sectors for your 1:57:34.480 --> 1:57:39.120 first assignment. So yeah, you're not don't You don't start now. 1:57:39.200 --> 1:57:41.360 And in fact, in fact I went north to to 1:57:41.520 --> 1:57:44.000 Graham Array, Minnesota in two thousand one. It took me 1:57:44.040 --> 1:57:47.080 six years to get there. They said, they send you 1:57:47.120 --> 1:57:48.920 to the south. They yeah, you go to the south. 1:57:49.000 --> 1:57:52.360 So when you come on and the difference between now 1:57:52.480 --> 1:57:54.440 and and when we all came in, I didn't get 1:57:54.440 --> 1:57:57.160 a choice. I got a fed X men saity, congratulations, 1:57:57.320 --> 1:57:58.800 you're hired by the U. S. Bard Patrol. You're going 1:57:58.840 --> 1:58:00.920 to McCallan, Texas. And I had to look on the 1:58:01.000 --> 1:58:03.520 map and said, where the hell is McAllen, Texas? On 1:58:03.600 --> 1:58:05.520 an atlas, on an atlas, not on my phone. I 1:58:05.600 --> 1:58:07.600 had to look on an atlas to see where McAllen, 1:58:07.640 --> 1:58:11.600 Texas was um, but nowadays they get a chance to 1:58:11.640 --> 1:58:13.760 pick so as they go through the process, and of 1:58:13.840 --> 1:58:17.040 course they have the technology at the tips of their fingers, 1:58:17.080 --> 1:58:18.840 they can look on and see while you know, I 1:58:18.880 --> 1:58:20.600 don't want to go to Presidio, Texas because all you 1:58:20.640 --> 1:58:22.919 gotta do is look on the map and see where Presidio, 1:58:23.000 --> 1:58:27.000 Texas is and realize it's eight hours from anywhere, right, 1:58:27.080 --> 1:58:30.160 So well, I'd rather be in San Diego, California, right. 1:58:30.240 --> 1:58:32.520 And so that comes down to the mentality too, because 1:58:32.560 --> 1:58:34.880 we're going out and and cabin these kind of people, 1:58:35.400 --> 1:58:38.680 and and and we've got folks and it happens today 1:58:38.960 --> 1:58:40.800 that are from New York that don't even have a 1:58:40.880 --> 1:58:43.280 driver's license. They get a driver's license to get a 1:58:43.360 --> 1:58:45.840 job as a board troll agent. So they've never driven 1:58:45.880 --> 1:58:48.919 a car until they go to the board troll Academy 1:58:49.160 --> 1:58:52.240 and we teach them defensive driving and high speed tactics. 1:58:54.200 --> 1:58:57.640 When when I showed when I showed up in Dorio 1:58:57.720 --> 1:59:00.400 from the Bronx New York, the everyone and del Rey 1:59:00.440 --> 1:59:02.600 always asking me, you know you drive, and I'm like, 1:59:03.240 --> 1:59:05.280 I'm driving to some sixteen what are you talking about? 1:59:09.120 --> 1:59:11.360 In the opposite side too. I'm from I'm from Colorado, 1:59:11.440 --> 1:59:12.920 grew up and it was born in Reason, Colorado, and 1:59:12.960 --> 1:59:15.240 I went to becoming Texas and one of my classmates 1:59:15.280 --> 1:59:17.280 sitting on the plane with he's freaking out. It was 1:59:17.360 --> 1:59:19.440 the first time he's he's twenty eight years or first 1:59:19.520 --> 1:59:21.800 time in twenty eight years he's ever been on a 1:59:21.840 --> 1:59:25.720 plane and left the state of Texas. Huh, never been 1:59:25.720 --> 1:59:27.840 out of state of Texas in twenty eight years until 1:59:27.920 --> 1:59:29.560 he got on a plane to fly to Charleston, South 1:59:29.600 --> 1:59:32.720 Carolina to go be a bordual agent. I read that 1:59:33.120 --> 1:59:36.680 he's true, man, that someone from like a citizen of 1:59:36.800 --> 1:59:42.320 Texas is more likely to leave the state than the 1:59:42.400 --> 1:59:45.360 citizen of any other state or some ship like that. 1:59:46.120 --> 1:59:47.760 But didn't make sense. I thought about what about people 1:59:47.800 --> 1:59:49.440 Rhode Island who can't go get a cup of coffee 1:59:49.440 --> 1:59:55.600 without leaving the state. Yeah, I shouldn't need harung it up. Yeah. 1:59:55.640 --> 1:59:57.800 So the recruitment, I have a high likelihood of going 1:59:57.800 --> 1:59:59.920 on vacation or something I do. So recruitment is tough 2:00:00.000 --> 2:00:01.879 because we're trying to we're trying to have that dynamic 2:00:01.960 --> 2:00:03.680 of folks that want to go out and work in 2:00:03.680 --> 2:00:07.480 the outdoors, and and and and and encountered large groups 2:00:07.520 --> 2:00:10.000 of people. Right as as a police officer in Colorado, 2:00:10.160 --> 2:00:12.800 you know, the largest apprehension arrest I have ever made 2:00:12.880 --> 2:00:15.400 was maybe two people at a time. And after going 2:00:15.480 --> 2:00:19.040 down to McCallen, Texas, when I first apprehend hundred and 2:00:19.040 --> 2:00:21.240 fifty people. So how do you go from and you're 2:00:21.320 --> 2:00:23.360 the only one, right, So how do you go from 2:00:24.480 --> 2:00:27.000 maintaining control of a hundred fifty people? Because let's be honest, 2:00:27.320 --> 2:00:34.440 if they want you, they're gonna take you. So it 2:00:34.560 --> 2:00:36.240 was kind of funny. You can do things like So 2:00:36.640 --> 2:00:38.760 what I did with them is the first thing I 2:00:38.800 --> 2:00:42.080 want to do is identify whether from Mexico from another country. 2:00:42.360 --> 2:00:44.520 So a hundred and fifty people walking out singing the 2:00:44.600 --> 2:00:47.800 Mexican national anthem just to keep them occupied, because it's 2:00:47.800 --> 2:00:50.200 the only way I can control a hundred and fifty people. 2:00:50.200 --> 2:00:53.320 I had two sets of handcuffs. Who am I gonna pick? Right? 2:00:53.400 --> 2:00:55.560 You just get them all singing the national anthem as 2:00:55.600 --> 2:00:58.240 you're walking out out of the trail too for the 2:00:58.320 --> 2:01:01.040 bus to come pick them up. So it's it's you 2:01:01.120 --> 2:01:04.000 gotta It's an interesting dynamic to find people that really 2:01:04.080 --> 2:01:05.680 want to go out and step in and do that 2:01:05.840 --> 2:01:08.400 type of law enforcement work, especially when they can go 2:01:08.560 --> 2:01:12.800 work for Bozeman p D and patrol here in Bozeman, 2:01:12.920 --> 2:01:17.000 or even working in Denver, Colorado, or Kansas City, Missouri 2:01:17.120 --> 2:01:21.720 and and just patrol and have backup thirty seconds away 2:01:22.000 --> 2:01:26.200 for us, backups in in a lot of cases minutes, ten, 2:01:26.320 --> 2:01:29.080 fifteen minutes away. So how many agents do you guys 2:01:29.160 --> 2:01:31.120 lose on like every year in the line of duty, 2:01:31.600 --> 2:01:36.080 the ebbs and flows, we lost almost fifty two CBP wide. Uh, 2:01:36.280 --> 2:01:39.040 probably because of COVID in the last couple of years. Um, 2:01:39.120 --> 2:01:42.240 I think we're at two or one. I think we're 2:01:42.240 --> 2:01:44.800 at one or two so far for for this year. 2:01:45.040 --> 2:01:47.840 So it's it's it's up and down, right, It's up 2:01:47.880 --> 2:01:49.600 and down. There's there's no way for us to depict that. 2:01:50.440 --> 2:01:54.720 What's uh, what's the pathway into that line of work 2:01:55.240 --> 2:01:57.160 to board patrol? You know, like how do people how 2:01:57.200 --> 2:02:01.720 do people flow? Right? Um? So Uh, you wake up 2:02:01.760 --> 2:02:02.840 one day and he'd be like, man, I want to 2:02:03.000 --> 2:02:04.960 I want to join the U. S. Border Patrol. There's 2:02:04.960 --> 2:02:07.400 a variety of ways that people people get involved into it. 2:02:07.480 --> 2:02:09.320 Mean myself, I mean I grew up in a in 2:02:09.440 --> 2:02:12.840 a you know, in a neighborhood in in New York 2:02:12.880 --> 2:02:15.000 City where I mean most of the guys that I 2:02:15.080 --> 2:02:17.320 knew you grew up became a cop, fireman or or 2:02:17.600 --> 2:02:21.920 construction And I was going after the police route and 2:02:22.080 --> 2:02:24.680 taking police exams all up and down the East coast, 2:02:24.720 --> 2:02:27.840 the North Atlantic coast, and uh and Boordahl just happened 2:02:27.840 --> 2:02:30.600 to be the first one to to send me a 2:02:30.720 --> 2:02:33.000 letter of acceptance. So I jumped in blind and it 2:02:33.040 --> 2:02:35.400 was the best thing I ever did. UM. But I 2:02:35.480 --> 2:02:39.400 mean there's there's there's you know, there's uh c J 2:02:39.560 --> 2:02:42.560 programs across the country that that you know, try to 2:02:42.680 --> 2:02:48.520 try to place their students into different different law enforcement paths. Um. 2:02:48.720 --> 2:02:51.000 And then for us, I mean, the third of our 2:02:51.040 --> 2:02:55.000 workforce or or our veterans, so it's a natural about 2:02:55.040 --> 2:02:57.960 third of our war of the cbp A workforces is veterans, 2:02:58.000 --> 2:03:00.840 and so it's a natural transition. Plus they carry over 2:03:00.840 --> 2:03:02.880 a lot of their benefits whatnot. So if they're mindful 2:03:02.920 --> 2:03:05.480 of that, they're able to bring over their federal benefits 2:03:05.520 --> 2:03:08.400 and time and service from the from their armed services 2:03:08.440 --> 2:03:11.920 to the board. You need to add that to your retirement, Yes, oh, no, kid. Yeah, 2:03:12.240 --> 2:03:13.640 and we we had a lot of folks that want 2:03:13.680 --> 2:03:16.640 to jump from state or or or local law enforcement 2:03:17.240 --> 2:03:19.480 the federal. So the pay is a little bit better 2:03:19.560 --> 2:03:21.640 on the fideral side it is in the state. But 2:03:21.680 --> 2:03:23.720 to your point about recruiting, it's a it's it's a 2:03:24.320 --> 2:03:26.920 like all I think was a referendum on on law 2:03:26.960 --> 2:03:29.400 enforcement goes without saying, you know, nationwide, it was it 2:03:29.520 --> 2:03:31.440 was a you know, it forced agencies to take a 2:03:31.480 --> 2:03:34.440 look at what law you know, policing in general meant 2:03:34.480 --> 2:03:38.040 were no exception um, and you know, uh and and 2:03:38.120 --> 2:03:42.360 and focusing on how to bring in uh. You guys 2:03:42.520 --> 2:03:45.240 look at reactivating hunters. You know, it's one of your 2:03:45.280 --> 2:03:47.440 tenants that you guys, we were very much in the 2:03:47.520 --> 2:03:50.200 same situation. Actually, I think all industry is looking to 2:03:50.240 --> 2:03:51.680 trying to get people out of back to work in 2:03:51.760 --> 2:03:54.080 some form or fashion. But we're no, we're because of 2:03:54.120 --> 2:03:57.760 how scrutinized law enforcement as a whole was from now. Um, 2:03:57.880 --> 2:04:00.480 it's made it tough and and whiles you know, as 2:04:00.520 --> 2:04:03.640 they say that the economy is kind of difficult right now. Um, 2:04:04.200 --> 2:04:07.960 the you know, my daughter, you know, good better and different, 2:04:08.000 --> 2:04:11.160 had the choice of of uh you know, going to school, 2:04:11.920 --> 2:04:14.839 uh go finding a blue college job, going to college, 2:04:15.120 --> 2:04:17.440 or trying to get on YouTube and make a million 2:04:17.480 --> 2:04:19.400 dollars a year or or something like that. Like that, 2:04:19.480 --> 2:04:22.040 that's an actual viable option, which blows my mind nowadays. 2:04:22.640 --> 2:04:27.120 Um so uh not only competing about the changing sentiment 2:04:27.160 --> 2:04:30.680 towards law enforcement and enticing people um to go in 2:04:30.760 --> 2:04:34.680 that career field, but also uh making it a viable 2:04:34.720 --> 2:04:36.520 option to all these other things that are that are 2:04:36.720 --> 2:04:39.000 you know, we've never would have perceived we're at their 2:04:39.000 --> 2:04:42.560 disposable to make money uh thirty years ago or something 2:04:42.640 --> 2:04:46.680 like that. So uh but but I think anyone who 2:04:46.800 --> 2:04:50.280 has that sense uh for us a particularly speaking bores, 2:04:50.320 --> 2:04:54.800 anyone has that sense of adventure um uh or or 2:04:55.040 --> 2:04:57.200 wants to you know, all the all the areas that 2:04:57.240 --> 2:04:59.240 we talked about. Charles mentioned God's Country. If you want 2:04:59.280 --> 2:05:00.920 to make that you're offer since this is a natural 2:05:01.680 --> 2:05:03.960 way to a natural way to live in that in 2:05:04.040 --> 2:05:06.160 that kind of office environment every day where you get 2:05:06.200 --> 2:05:09.640 to experience these the great outdoors and protect it, even 2:05:09.680 --> 2:05:11.920 though maybe maybe that's not your primary mission is to 2:05:11.920 --> 2:05:14.520 protect the actual land, but just by this, just by 2:05:14.560 --> 2:05:16.800 your actual presence on the landscape, you're protecting it and 2:05:17.240 --> 2:05:19.280 and it takes the rights type of person to do that. 2:05:19.360 --> 2:05:20.920 And there's still a lot of those folks out there 2:05:20.960 --> 2:05:23.320 that have that, that are wired towards that that career field. 2:05:23.720 --> 2:05:25.839 So if you wanted to get a job riding horseback 2:05:26.000 --> 2:05:29.720 through uh Big Ben National Park, there's a way to 2:05:29.760 --> 2:05:34.760 do that. And they get the camp out actually spoken 2:05:34.880 --> 2:05:37.600 does a lot of a lot of details where that 2:05:37.680 --> 2:05:40.680 where they go remote with horse patrol for weeks at 2:05:40.720 --> 2:05:43.000 a time. If you want, if you're gonna go camp 2:05:43.080 --> 2:05:46.520 out in in in the Glacier National Park here in Montana, 2:05:46.960 --> 2:05:48.680 we got details you can do that. If you want 2:05:48.720 --> 2:05:51.600 to spend time in the b w C, the Botder 2:05:51.640 --> 2:05:54.600 Water Canoe Area in Minnesota, there's an eight you can 2:05:54.600 --> 2:05:57.160 go out there and spend I've spent ten days because 2:05:58.360 --> 2:06:01.280 I spent I spent ten days odds leading through the 2:06:01.440 --> 2:06:05.200 boundary waters. Really yeah, as an agent, as an agent 2:06:06.080 --> 2:06:08.520 because it's not because it's non motorized, because non motorized, 2:06:08.560 --> 2:06:11.160 no mechanized. And what was you what's the craziest thing 2:06:11.240 --> 2:06:13.800 in those ten years that you spent up there that 2:06:13.880 --> 2:06:16.840 you encountered as far as something crossing the border that 2:06:16.960 --> 2:06:21.720 you had to interdict. Um, the craziest thing would have 2:06:21.760 --> 2:06:25.920 been body carries with diamonds in the boundary waters. In 2:06:25.960 --> 2:06:29.800 the boundary waters. Yeah, what did you call me again? 2:06:29.960 --> 2:06:35.840 Body carries? Body carriers carrying diamonds. So trying to dodge terror? 2:06:35.920 --> 2:06:38.160 Are they well? Because they could They were getting head 2:06:38.160 --> 2:06:40.400 at the port of entry, so they were taking them 2:06:40.440 --> 2:06:43.080 to the one section and on the Canadian side where 2:06:43.080 --> 2:06:45.840 they can actually get vehicles to and then they were 2:06:45.880 --> 2:06:49.240 bringing them across in in canoes. But it's not illegal 2:06:49.280 --> 2:06:52.560 to have a diamond. They're trying to avoid what the customs, 2:06:52.640 --> 2:06:56.920 the taxes? No kid? Yeah, were they in canoes. They 2:06:56.960 --> 2:07:00.680 were in canoes. Econom in canoes. They're in canoes. Did 2:07:00.720 --> 2:07:02.920 they seem they knew? They seem why they knew what 2:07:02.960 --> 2:07:06.000 they were doing? Uh? Could you pick them out from 2:07:06.040 --> 2:07:09.120 a mile away? You're like those guys I'm sticking out. 2:07:09.400 --> 2:07:13.040 I believe they beat us nine times before we caught them. 2:07:13.400 --> 2:07:18.560 Really back to that, Yeah, yeah, I have no clue, 2:07:18.760 --> 2:07:21.360 but they I believe when we caught them they were 2:07:21.400 --> 2:07:24.280 shocked to see us. So they had been successful on 2:07:24.440 --> 2:07:29.760 multiple occasions. M Yeah, I want another like a couple 2:07:29.800 --> 2:07:33.760 of highlights or like craziest events of my career on 2:07:33.880 --> 2:07:35.720 the border was in Texas, so a lot of those 2:07:36.040 --> 2:07:38.640 high fence, high fence ranches down there with all sorts 2:07:38.680 --> 2:07:42.400 of animals small over the planet, and so getting attecked 2:07:42.400 --> 2:07:47.280 by EMUs was one of my early and finding out 2:07:47.320 --> 2:07:51.120 they like to pull your buttons off your shirt. Yeah, 2:07:51.640 --> 2:07:53.480 it's a strange thing if you ever never seen one 2:07:53.520 --> 2:07:56.440 before you're all the wild. But as you can imagine, 2:07:56.480 --> 2:07:58.920 all the you know, the manner of things that that 2:07:59.040 --> 2:08:00.640 they put on those ranches is out there that we 2:08:00.720 --> 2:08:03.200 have to patrol on and you know, seeing a zebra 2:08:03.360 --> 2:08:05.440 or or a you know, a kudu for the first 2:08:05.480 --> 2:08:09.800 time driving around, it kind of blows your mind. M hmm, yeah, 2:08:09.800 --> 2:08:12.920 I think. Um when actually when, when Sammy and I 2:08:13.000 --> 2:08:15.680 were back in Laredo working together, there was one night 2:08:16.000 --> 2:08:19.200 and it wasn't me that um that made the apprehension, 2:08:19.320 --> 2:08:20.880 but but we were working one night and we got 2:08:20.960 --> 2:08:23.840 a call and because they didn't the guys in the 2:08:23.920 --> 2:08:27.400 field didn't know who to call um, and we didn't 2:08:27.440 --> 2:08:29.720 know either. We got a call from from an agent 2:08:29.800 --> 2:08:31.280 and and they're like, hey, we're we're out here with 2:08:31.400 --> 2:08:33.680 a group Okay, what's the big deal. You know, you 2:08:33.760 --> 2:08:36.800 guys got thirty and whatever. And then they're like, yeah, 2:08:36.840 --> 2:08:40.320 we have this group, but we have a tiger, remember that. 2:08:40.600 --> 2:08:44.080 And and we're like, what you have a tiger? And yeah, 2:08:44.240 --> 2:08:46.480 we have a group of thirty and one of these 2:08:46.520 --> 2:08:51.000 guys has a tiger. I real, yes, it was a 2:08:51.120 --> 2:08:54.640 baby cub tiger. He was bringing it across because I 2:08:55.080 --> 2:08:57.360 apparently the black market trade and stuff. He was going 2:08:57.440 --> 2:09:00.320 to sell this tiger to Somebody's happen a bunch of times. Parents. 2:09:00.400 --> 2:09:03.240 Parents are real popular in southern part of the parents 2:09:03.240 --> 2:09:09.480 to cans, monkeys, foot traffic, yeah yeah, foot foot and 2:09:09.640 --> 2:09:11.720 and at the bridge trying to the bridges, but but 2:09:11.880 --> 2:09:14.280 also through just carrying in a duffle bag across the 2:09:14.320 --> 2:09:20.200 border for sure. Huh. Kind of monkeys, those those little 2:09:20.880 --> 2:09:23.640 I don't even know what they're called. But the friends 2:09:23.720 --> 2:09:27.600 ones that the confus like a little like a little 2:09:27.680 --> 2:09:29.760 like like I don't know, it's kind of longy that 2:09:29.800 --> 2:09:31.760 you can jump on your shoulders. Yeah, yeah, not like 2:09:31.880 --> 2:09:37.240 a not like a little many tiny you know, you know, 2:09:37.360 --> 2:09:39.640 monkeys from Africa and things like that they were trying 2:09:39.680 --> 2:09:43.400 to bring in. Really, yeah, how could be enough money 2:09:43.440 --> 2:09:47.040 and that to make that worthwhile. If there's money to 2:09:47.120 --> 2:09:50.280 be made, there's trying to sell it. Unfortunately, you know, 2:09:50.920 --> 2:09:53.600 just just and I don't know, we're probably getting off topic. 2:09:53.640 --> 2:09:56.680 In South Texas use clothings and big things. You see 2:09:57.920 --> 2:10:01.280 palletts of of us clothing, so clothing we would throw away, 2:10:01.320 --> 2:10:03.160 they put in and bind in a pallet and they 2:10:03.200 --> 2:10:05.640 smuggled at south to Mexico. The same thing with chicken 2:10:05.960 --> 2:10:09.000 raw chicken raw, chicken go south because in Mexico they 2:10:09.120 --> 2:10:12.880 charge attacks. They never charge attacks on chicken trying to 2:10:12.880 --> 2:10:15.360 get out of the tax. So they're smuggling chicken south 2:10:15.760 --> 2:10:18.200 into into Mexico. And then we call it rope saw 2:10:18.240 --> 2:10:21.280 to use clothing going south into Mexico for people to buy. 2:10:21.800 --> 2:10:27.080 Use clothing. And funny story in in McAllen Um, we 2:10:27.240 --> 2:10:29.440 had clothing going and we were tired of him, right 2:10:29.480 --> 2:10:32.000 so we said, oh we're gonna, we're gonna bust your palates. 2:10:32.040 --> 2:10:35.200 We we cracked the palletts hundred thousand dollars cash wrapped 2:10:35.240 --> 2:10:37.320 up inside one of the bundles, which was a mistake 2:10:37.360 --> 2:10:39.720 because then every bundle going south was getting cracked open 2:10:40.000 --> 2:10:42.600 by bordal chodes and there was used clothing all over 2:10:42.680 --> 2:10:44.920 the border just turned out to be a nightmare. But yeah, 2:10:44.960 --> 2:10:47.160 that's the kind of stuff that happens. So whenever something's 2:10:47.160 --> 2:10:51.720 going north, cash is going south. M hmm. When you 2:10:51.760 --> 2:10:53.800 guys found all that money, you probably party that night. 2:10:59.360 --> 2:11:02.720 Avocado is also a big thing, Avocados coming north. People 2:11:02.720 --> 2:11:06.040 smuggling avocados to avoid to avoid tax well to avoid 2:11:06.120 --> 2:11:09.080 taxes and then alvas. The avocados in Mexico are actually 2:11:09.160 --> 2:11:12.120 quite a bit bigger than than you can the California avocados. 2:11:12.440 --> 2:11:15.520 So in Texas avocados are are are pretty big. People 2:11:15.560 --> 2:11:17.920 smuggling avocados cross so if you go you can go 2:11:18.000 --> 2:11:19.760 to Mexico and buy an avocado, but they take out 2:11:19.800 --> 2:11:22.240 the bone. It has to do with the bone. There's 2:11:22.280 --> 2:11:24.760 some sort of agriculture or some disease that's in the 2:11:24.840 --> 2:11:27.960 seed or so they does that by smuggling north because 2:11:28.160 --> 2:11:29.960 they can get more money. And obviously if you hold 2:11:30.000 --> 2:11:33.720 the Mexican avocado next to a California Texan avocados like 2:11:33.760 --> 2:11:37.280 a softball to a baseball. It's so avocados are really popular. 2:11:38.200 --> 2:11:40.680 Cigarettes on the northern border now, cigarettes on the northern ord, 2:11:40.800 --> 2:11:44.640 especially over in in California in New York going north 2:11:44.760 --> 2:11:49.360 or coming south? Uh, both both. They call them two nis. 2:11:49.440 --> 2:11:52.160 You can you go into the Agnosasi territories and buy 2:11:52.560 --> 2:11:54.720 It's really kind of crazy. It's it's the equivalent of 2:11:54.800 --> 2:11:57.280 a of a cart and cigarettes, but they're they're just 2:11:57.360 --> 2:12:01.440 thrown in a bag because they're nondescript. No, my buddy 2:12:01.640 --> 2:12:03.960 had a girlfriend in Canada who had she only had 2:12:04.000 --> 2:12:07.160 one leg, and she would put all kinds of cigarettes 2:12:07.200 --> 2:12:10.040 in her fake leg every time she went across she 2:12:10.160 --> 2:12:11.960 was she'd come, she'd come over to the US and 2:12:12.000 --> 2:12:13.720 then fill her fake leg with a cigarettes to go 2:12:13.800 --> 2:12:19.320 back to Canada. No buddy mind fellow named Kurt. So 2:12:19.560 --> 2:12:21.640 there's if there's money to be made in smuggling it, 2:12:21.680 --> 2:12:24.640 they're gonna do it. We all thought it was funny. 2:12:24.640 --> 2:12:30.440 I never thought the report her. I've just semi harmless. 2:12:31.920 --> 2:12:34.080 And then we start talking about Western boots and things 2:12:34.160 --> 2:12:36.200 like that. Of course, reptile styles and things like that. 2:12:36.560 --> 2:12:38.320 A lot of those things are restricted from coming. And 2:12:38.440 --> 2:12:42.839 you'll see loads of boots coming across, and reptile belts 2:12:42.880 --> 2:12:48.280 and things like that, like wildlife trade. Huh do you 2:12:48.320 --> 2:12:51.400 ever see um when we're down there? Across and they 2:12:51.480 --> 2:12:54.880 have a thing about all the cats like awes lots 2:12:55.880 --> 2:12:59.040 you know what else they got their turtle shells. You 2:12:59.200 --> 2:13:01.320 a big poster, I know the post you're talking about. 2:13:01.320 --> 2:13:03.400 I can't remember all the there's a bunch of birds 2:13:03.480 --> 2:13:06.640 on it. It's just like the wildlife trafficking business. The 2:13:07.040 --> 2:13:09.880 stuff that we the stuff that our counterparts, the office 2:13:09.920 --> 2:13:13.480 field operations, ladies and gents at the bridges that that 2:13:13.600 --> 2:13:16.560 come across the agg specialists that have to go through 2:13:17.320 --> 2:13:19.800 people bringing in fruit and all that stuff. And usually there, 2:13:19.840 --> 2:13:21.280 you know, most of the stuff their time. They're looking 2:13:21.320 --> 2:13:23.920 for pests, you know, anything that any kind of you know, 2:13:24.080 --> 2:13:26.360 beetle or larva or something that's in with like a 2:13:26.440 --> 2:13:29.520 dozen roses or some kind of whatever fruit you're bringing over. 2:13:29.960 --> 2:13:31.720 But they're the ones that run into like the really 2:13:31.800 --> 2:13:34.600 really wacky stuff from like and like stuff that just 2:13:34.720 --> 2:13:37.040 shows up that that these people bring because it's a 2:13:37.160 --> 2:13:39.680 it's a totem or something like that, and it who 2:13:39.760 --> 2:13:42.120 knows where they got some kind of crazy dried up 2:13:42.160 --> 2:13:44.880 and endangered frog from down in Chioppa's, Mexico and then 2:13:45.080 --> 2:13:47.960 bringing up and uh, it's common for for these things 2:13:48.040 --> 2:13:51.040 to just be um part of part of their kid 2:13:51.120 --> 2:13:58.040 that they're bringing with them. Oh well you got no, 2:13:58.200 --> 2:14:05.040 that's better. What do you guys, what do you guys have? 2:14:05.160 --> 2:14:10.160 Do you want to add that we didn't get into, Uh, Charles, 2:14:10.200 --> 2:14:13.080 I think a little bit about um, the efforts on 2:14:13.120 --> 2:14:16.400 the organ pipe pretty yeah, I think. UM. I mean 2:14:16.520 --> 2:14:18.480 one of the cool things like we talked about, you know, 2:14:19.520 --> 2:14:21.680 we you guys, you're you know, you guys talk a 2:14:21.720 --> 2:14:24.680 lot about conservation and and the use of public lands 2:14:24.760 --> 2:14:28.760 and and how you know, UM, you know, how hunting 2:14:29.120 --> 2:14:34.040 and you know, in general, the general population impacts the environment. UM. 2:14:34.560 --> 2:14:36.680 You know, one of the things that within border patrol, 2:14:36.680 --> 2:14:38.440 I mean, there's no doubt about it. Like the job 2:14:38.520 --> 2:14:41.360 that we do, UM, you know, there is an impact 2:14:41.520 --> 2:14:44.960 on it. UM and over the years like an organ 2:14:45.040 --> 2:14:47.880 pipe UM organ pipe Cactus National Monument for those of 2:14:48.600 --> 2:14:51.280 y'all that don't know, it's it's a huge national monument 2:14:51.600 --> 2:14:54.840 on the southern border of Arizona. UM. You know, the 2:14:54.920 --> 2:14:58.640 majority of it, the whole southern border butts the international 2:14:58.760 --> 2:15:04.040 boundary UM with Mexico, and UM. You know, there's a 2:15:04.080 --> 2:15:06.000 lot of stuff that had happened over the years, UM 2:15:06.440 --> 2:15:11.320 on that property. UM. One of which was the unfortunate 2:15:11.440 --> 2:15:15.920 death of of UM Chris Sedgley UM and UH and 2:15:16.120 --> 2:15:19.400 and that came about through UM drug trafficking. I didn't 2:15:19.440 --> 2:15:22.120 know that was on the that that was on the monument. 2:15:22.640 --> 2:15:26.280 It was it occurred on the monument UM I believe 2:15:26.320 --> 2:15:31.120 in in two thousand three. I believe. I apologize if 2:15:31.160 --> 2:15:33.160 I don't UM, if I'm getting a date wrong. But 2:15:33.960 --> 2:15:37.120 because of what had happened UM, it actually Department of 2:15:37.200 --> 2:15:41.400 Interior actually put up UM a a border fence on 2:15:41.480 --> 2:15:45.720 their property. So they they installed a vehicle barrier UM 2:15:45.800 --> 2:15:48.880 on there because UM Chris was killed from from cross 2:15:48.920 --> 2:15:52.920 border traffic UM that included a vehicle driving over the 2:15:53.280 --> 2:15:56.440 or driving through the international boundary UM onto the park 2:15:57.240 --> 2:16:00.360 and UM and so again Park Service put up that 2:16:00.960 --> 2:16:05.760 put up that that fence UM and that was just that. 2:16:06.080 --> 2:16:09.560 Unfortunately that that was one of the biggest events. But 2:16:09.760 --> 2:16:12.560 it was a common occurrence that people would drive through 2:16:13.080 --> 2:16:16.120 UM Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument. And so there were 2:16:16.680 --> 2:16:21.680 hundreds of UM what what they consider UM what Park 2:16:21.760 --> 2:16:26.640 Service considers you know, UM wildcat roads or unauthorized vehicle 2:16:27.000 --> 2:16:32.240 roads UM. And the majority of of of organ Pipe 2:16:32.360 --> 2:16:36.080 it's designated wilderness so there really shouldn't be too many 2:16:36.240 --> 2:16:40.320 roads unless it's been stipulated within the wilderness designation United 2:16:40.400 --> 2:16:46.880 Nations Protected Site or one of those UM that I'm 2:16:47.040 --> 2:16:50.200 not sure of UM for certain, but I know it's 2:16:50.280 --> 2:16:54.360 it's designated wilderness. And and there was over the years 2:16:54.440 --> 2:16:57.360 because of cross border traffic, hundreds of miles of these 2:16:57.520 --> 2:17:01.600 illegal roads UM. And you know, yeah, did border patrol 2:17:01.680 --> 2:17:03.520 use them? Did the public use them? Yes? Because they 2:17:03.600 --> 2:17:07.440 looked like roads from people just you know, driving across UM. 2:17:09.280 --> 2:17:13.120 We got some funding UM from some from I believe 2:17:13.200 --> 2:17:17.000 it was the UM Secure Fence Act. UM. We got 2:17:17.080 --> 2:17:20.440 some funding to work with Department of Interior UH to 2:17:20.600 --> 2:17:23.000 do some remediation work along the border. One of the 2:17:23.080 --> 2:17:26.840 projects that we chose to UM that we chose we 2:17:26.959 --> 2:17:30.240 jointly worked with Department of Interior National Park Service UM 2:17:30.400 --> 2:17:35.280 on was to UM do some road remediation on organ pipe. UM. 2:17:35.440 --> 2:17:37.760 So what that what that basically entailed is we took 2:17:38.120 --> 2:17:42.640 UH aerial aerial photography of the park. We looked at 2:17:42.680 --> 2:17:45.720 all these roads. We looked at where UM border patrol 2:17:45.840 --> 2:17:49.800 had infrastructure, where the park had infrastructure. UM. What roads 2:17:49.920 --> 2:17:54.520 were the traffic patterns for migration? For illegal migration or 2:17:54.520 --> 2:17:58.720 illegal crossings, um. And we overlaid all those. We got 2:17:58.800 --> 2:18:01.120 together with with Parks are Us and we were like, hey, 2:18:01.200 --> 2:18:03.240 you know, we got there's all these roads here. We 2:18:03.360 --> 2:18:05.720 have some money to do some remediation. Let's start closing 2:18:05.800 --> 2:18:08.200 some of these roads. And so we spent a lot 2:18:08.280 --> 2:18:11.600 of money on taking these roads where you know, hundreds 2:18:11.640 --> 2:18:13.800 of miles of roads. And we would see that these 2:18:13.879 --> 2:18:15.879 roads were going you know, four or five roads going 2:18:15.920 --> 2:18:18.800 to the same place. Well, you know, really, what's the 2:18:18.879 --> 2:18:20.960 need for that. Let's start closing some of these roads. 2:18:21.000 --> 2:18:23.920 So we use that money to do things like, um, 2:18:25.560 --> 2:18:29.720 what's called I learned the term vertical mulch um where 2:18:29.800 --> 2:18:34.400 you you put you put up stuff on a roadway, UM, 2:18:34.720 --> 2:18:37.360 or you put stuff you you put um, you know, 2:18:37.560 --> 2:18:42.200 foliage and um landscaping on a roadway, so you make 2:18:42.280 --> 2:18:44.360 it look like it's no longer a road and you 2:18:44.480 --> 2:18:46.240 just go as far as like the I can see 2:18:46.320 --> 2:18:49.280 or so like you know, and then you can put 2:18:49.320 --> 2:18:54.039 a sauce. It's it's vertical mulch yeah and so yeah, 2:18:54.120 --> 2:18:56.320 and I was just like, oh, that's that's interesting. Um. 2:18:56.440 --> 2:18:59.520 So so we did that on on a whole bunch 2:18:59.560 --> 2:19:01.920 of roads. It ended up being like two over two 2:19:02.000 --> 2:19:05.560 hundred miles of roads UM on organ pipe that we 2:19:05.680 --> 2:19:08.720 were able to um uh you know, to close off 2:19:09.000 --> 2:19:15.280 and that you know, defragments the landscape. So now the wilderness, 2:19:15.360 --> 2:19:17.440 you know, the wildlife has more of an area to room. 2:19:17.480 --> 2:19:20.520 They don't they aren't like running into road every a 2:19:20.560 --> 2:19:22.600 couple hundred yards or something like that. There's there's more 2:19:22.640 --> 2:19:26.080 area for for for wildlife to thrive and the visitors 2:19:26.200 --> 2:19:28.680 to actually visit and not feel like, you know, they 2:19:28.800 --> 2:19:31.280 feel that, you know, one of the one of the 2:19:31.360 --> 2:19:34.840 characteristics of willderness. They feel that solitude, you know, because 2:19:35.440 --> 2:19:37.040 you are you know, you run into a road when 2:19:37.080 --> 2:19:38.800 you're in the middle of wilderness, you don't really feel 2:19:38.840 --> 2:19:41.600 alone at that point. Sure, right, even you know, even 2:19:41.640 --> 2:19:43.440 though you may not see somebody on that road, you 2:19:44.200 --> 2:19:47.280 you know that that moment is kind of if you 2:19:47.520 --> 2:19:51.400 you know, if you will UM. But yeah, we overall 2:19:51.480 --> 2:19:54.160 we restored like two over two hundred miles of road 2:19:54.720 --> 2:19:58.920 UM that year. UM was for me, fairly significant I 2:19:59.000 --> 2:20:02.640 think for really for for border patrol UM, you know, 2:20:02.959 --> 2:20:05.480 I I hope it was. It was pretty significant because 2:20:05.560 --> 2:20:10.080 that year the border patrol was actually UM given along 2:20:10.160 --> 2:20:13.760 with National Park Service UM and BLM. We were given 2:20:13.879 --> 2:20:16.840 the d O I. West Henry Award, which is an 2:20:16.879 --> 2:20:21.160 award that's typically UM has been given internally UM within 2:20:21.280 --> 2:20:26.280 Department of Interior for environmental stewardship. Yeah, and so it's 2:20:26.360 --> 2:20:28.600 it was the first time that they've ever chosen to 2:20:28.640 --> 2:20:31.720 give it to to an outside agency. UM. It was 2:20:31.720 --> 2:20:33.360 because of that project, and it was yeah, and that 2:20:33.480 --> 2:20:35.480 was part of that was the major reason, because of 2:20:35.520 --> 2:20:39.200 that project, because of the restoration UM benefits from that project. 2:20:40.040 --> 2:20:41.840 That ties into what I was asking about just the 2:20:41.879 --> 2:20:47.800 amount of UM activity in these very remote areas and 2:20:47.920 --> 2:20:50.879 what the implications are for well I brought up wildlife, 2:20:50.920 --> 2:20:54.280 but wildlife, solitude whatever, right, just it makes it like 2:20:54.400 --> 2:20:57.200 a buzz with activity. Yeah. Yeah, and that's and that's 2:20:57.240 --> 2:20:59.879 what that border wall system helps to do real lis 2:21:00.000 --> 2:21:03.240 stically for both sides. It's going to help. It does 2:21:03.360 --> 2:21:08.240 help to, you know, increase that solitude aspect and the 2:21:08.879 --> 2:21:12.040 the the I think that the enjoyment of the resource 2:21:12.560 --> 2:21:16.160 UM when when you have you know, a visitor out there, 2:21:16.560 --> 2:21:19.640 because now it's a little bit more safer, they can 2:21:19.680 --> 2:21:22.440 be a little bit more comfortable. Going back to what 2:21:22.560 --> 2:21:25.000 I was talking about with that road restoration and the 2:21:25.120 --> 2:21:28.640 unfortunate incident with with Chris Egley. You know, because of that, 2:21:29.240 --> 2:21:32.760 the Park Service actually closed like sixty of their park 2:21:33.000 --> 2:21:37.119 because of that. Yeah, because of the restoration aary efforts 2:21:37.200 --> 2:21:41.600 that Border Patrol worked with with Park Service, the park reopen. Now, 2:21:42.640 --> 2:21:44.400 you know, so this area that had been closed for 2:21:44.720 --> 2:21:48.520 at that point, you know, fifteen years. Um, you know, 2:21:48.600 --> 2:21:51.000 we were able to reopen that the end and now 2:21:51.120 --> 2:21:53.960 not only can the visitors go out there, but Park 2:21:54.040 --> 2:21:57.120 Service their researchers and biologists can go back out there 2:21:57.400 --> 2:22:00.640 and do their research, you know, and do what they 2:22:00.680 --> 2:22:04.160 need to do to help them, you know, catalog you know, 2:22:04.320 --> 2:22:08.640 the cultural and the environmental significance of that area. That's great. 2:22:09.560 --> 2:22:12.880 Did closing those roads those roads limit the illegal traffic 2:22:13.000 --> 2:22:15.800 or do the illegal traffic just change its method? But 2:22:16.360 --> 2:22:22.440 it's you know yes, really yes, yes, yes to both. Um. 2:22:22.800 --> 2:22:27.240 You know, closing it was again just part of the 2:22:27.680 --> 2:22:30.800 whole system because we have the infrastructure on the southern 2:22:30.879 --> 2:22:34.600 border that helped prevent the um you know, the vehicle 2:22:34.680 --> 2:22:38.120 traffic to go over, and then you have agents, you know, 2:22:38.280 --> 2:22:41.120 we it wasn't just like we we we put up 2:22:41.480 --> 2:22:44.640 vertical mulch and you know, walked away. It was a 2:22:44.720 --> 2:22:47.400 joint effort between us. We put up the vertical mulch, 2:22:47.840 --> 2:22:51.320 We went to we had park service come to our musters, 2:22:51.440 --> 2:22:54.360 talk with the agents, tell them about, you know, the 2:22:54.440 --> 2:22:57.480 significance for the area, why we need to use certain roads. 2:22:57.520 --> 2:23:01.080 We kept our agents accountable by making um, you know, 2:23:01.200 --> 2:23:03.879 making them call call in and they call in when 2:23:03.920 --> 2:23:07.360 they go on um these off road um you know, 2:23:07.520 --> 2:23:11.640 unauthorized roads. Essentially we now they're now called temporary tactical 2:23:11.680 --> 2:23:15.280 infrastructure and they call in when they're going off off 2:23:15.320 --> 2:23:17.560 that road, so we can keep account of, Okay, are 2:23:17.640 --> 2:23:20.240 they you know, are they using them? How often? And 2:23:20.320 --> 2:23:23.040 if we need to adjust um those and we we 2:23:23.200 --> 2:23:25.160 still go through every few years, we go through what 2:23:25.360 --> 2:23:27.800 what is currently there, and we'll close off roads that 2:23:28.160 --> 2:23:29.920 you don't need to be closed off if we if 2:23:29.959 --> 2:23:32.760 we need to to you know, create you know, or 2:23:32.920 --> 2:23:36.439 utilize a new path that's been that that's been utilized. 2:23:36.760 --> 2:23:38.600 We work with the land managers to see how we 2:23:38.640 --> 2:23:41.720 can affect that, you know, so you know, sometimes it's 2:23:41.760 --> 2:23:44.199 not necessarily a one for one, but sometimes it works, 2:23:44.280 --> 2:23:46.520 you know, more in part part service favor sometimes it 2:23:46.600 --> 2:23:50.000 works more VP favor if you will, but there's still 2:23:50.040 --> 2:23:54.160 that dialogue that we share with with the land manager. Ye. 2:23:59.320 --> 2:24:03.320 I want to talk about the prong horn rescue okay 2:24:03.720 --> 2:24:07.480 um because I didn't know that the Border Patrol did 2:24:07.560 --> 2:24:10.600 this until I actually got into this program. But it 2:24:10.800 --> 2:24:13.120 is one of the funniest times that I have and 2:24:13.480 --> 2:24:16.120 thankfully I get to have it there almost every year. UM. 2:24:16.840 --> 2:24:18.959 So the Border Patrol works with Fish and Wildlife Service 2:24:19.080 --> 2:24:21.960 the Sonoran pronghorn um out there in southern Arizona on 2:24:22.000 --> 2:24:26.080 the Cabeza Pritta National Wildlife Refuge. So UM we meet 2:24:26.160 --> 2:24:29.039 throughout the year, but their big thing is that um 2:24:29.800 --> 2:24:33.119 uh there's it's called the prong horn round up UM 2:24:33.400 --> 2:24:39.000 in December. UM, before December some sometime we set up 2:24:39.040 --> 2:24:41.480 I think it's around September October we'll set up boma's 2:24:41.840 --> 2:24:44.680 and they'll capture some of the pronghorn that are on 2:24:44.760 --> 2:24:48.840 Cabeza Prietta UM and then in December UM Fish and 2:24:48.840 --> 2:24:52.200 wild Lifestyle, what does the boma trap? A boma is like, Yeah, 2:24:52.240 --> 2:24:55.760 it's it's almost like like a trap. There like three 2:24:55.920 --> 2:25:01.480 semicircle um enclosures like a yeah, like a corral. So 2:25:01.560 --> 2:25:05.039 they'll they'll they'll get as many prong horn as they 2:25:05.080 --> 2:25:08.480 can into this area and then in December we get 2:25:08.520 --> 2:25:11.880 together we being Fish and Wildlife Service, Bureau of Land Management, 2:25:11.920 --> 2:25:15.800 Park Service, UM, Arizona Game and Fish UM. They have 2:25:16.240 --> 2:25:21.440 UM contracts with various veterinarians to come out and will 2:25:21.840 --> 2:25:25.680 go in and there's various steps to the process, but 2:25:25.800 --> 2:25:27.760 we we take out the prong horn one by one, 2:25:27.840 --> 2:25:31.080 we carry them out, they get UM vet checks, UM 2:25:31.520 --> 2:25:34.440 you know, new radio callers if they need callers UM, 2:25:34.560 --> 2:25:39.120 and then will will redistribute the herd depending on where 2:25:39.200 --> 2:25:42.280 they where they need to go. Because again going back 2:25:42.320 --> 2:25:46.080 to that Secure Fence Act funding in early two thousand's UM, 2:25:46.120 --> 2:25:50.720 the snow and pronghorn was another research UM UH research 2:25:50.760 --> 2:25:54.199 funding string that we utilize. They're about fifty prong horn 2:25:54.560 --> 2:25:58.440 um on Cabeza preod at the time UM currently currently, 2:25:58.480 --> 2:26:00.560 I want to stay somewhere around like four in fifty. 2:26:00.640 --> 2:26:02.440 A few years back, it was like a little over 2:26:02.520 --> 2:26:05.160 five dred but there's been droughts, there's been some other issues. 2:26:05.720 --> 2:26:08.480 Is it a hunted population It is not. It's not. 2:26:08.640 --> 2:26:12.120 It's an endangered species UM and so they've been working 2:26:12.240 --> 2:26:16.600 to re establish in on the Cabezi Prietta. So it's 2:26:16.640 --> 2:26:22.400 like a restoration. It's a restoration, yeah yeah, and um yeah, 2:26:22.480 --> 2:26:26.000 it's it is. It is crazy sometimes of the things 2:26:26.080 --> 2:26:29.120 that that happened, just even just trying to get um 2:26:29.200 --> 2:26:30.840 these prong horn out because you've got to go in. 2:26:31.000 --> 2:26:34.680 There's i'd say maybe anywhere from seven to twelve of 2:26:34.800 --> 2:26:38.720 us on essentially a tennis net, and you gotta they'll 2:26:38.800 --> 2:26:41.800 put they try to they try to to take you know, 2:26:41.840 --> 2:26:44.360 there's eighty in the first boma and then they will 2:26:44.440 --> 2:26:46.840 let down, so they will let down into the second 2:26:46.920 --> 2:26:49.760 and then the final. In the final boma there they 2:26:49.840 --> 2:26:52.560 try to have like two to three prong horn, so 2:26:52.680 --> 2:26:55.440 you have two or three pronghorn running around. You get 2:26:55.560 --> 2:26:58.160 this net and you have to go in and you're 2:26:58.200 --> 2:27:00.880 trying to to net them, but they're very fragile. They're 2:27:00.879 --> 2:27:03.440 also super quick and they jumped super high, so a 2:27:03.560 --> 2:27:08.280 three ft net sometimes not even close to enough. Um. Unfortunately, 2:27:08.400 --> 2:27:11.600 one time this we were going in and the person 2:27:11.720 --> 2:27:14.440 that was the lead, the lead netter, he had a 2:27:14.920 --> 2:27:17.640 catcher's mask on and it was one of my first 2:27:17.800 --> 2:27:19.840 years doing this, and I was like, why is that 2:27:19.879 --> 2:27:21.920 guy wearing a catcher's mask, like I got I'm holding 2:27:22.000 --> 2:27:24.280 this net and I got you know, I got gloves 2:27:24.360 --> 2:27:26.480 on and a hat, and I'm thinking, why is this 2:27:26.600 --> 2:27:32.400 guy wearing a catcher's mask? Where's Yeah? I'm like, what 2:27:32.640 --> 2:27:35.040 what did I sign up to do here? Right? So 2:27:35.200 --> 2:27:37.560 then I just I hear that the gate open, and 2:27:37.640 --> 2:27:39.320 then you've got to be really quiet because you don't 2:27:39.320 --> 2:27:40.560 want to scare him. And I just hear go co 2:27:40.720 --> 2:27:43.360 co co co. And so we're starting to we're starting 2:27:43.400 --> 2:27:45.800 to run run to the door, and the guy slams 2:27:45.879 --> 2:27:47.720 the door shut, and I'm like, oh my gosh, what happened? 2:27:47.760 --> 2:27:49.960 Like now we're we all kind of sandwich at the door. 2:27:50.440 --> 2:27:52.600 And then they're like, hey, come here, come here. They're 2:27:52.640 --> 2:27:55.040 calling another vet, you know, a medic, and they go 2:27:55.200 --> 2:27:58.920 in there and then here some rustling. A minute later, 2:27:59.080 --> 2:28:01.720 the guy with the catcher's mask comes out. The mask 2:28:01.879 --> 2:28:04.600 is like on the side of his face, his nose 2:28:04.720 --> 2:28:07.400 is bleeding, his shirts all caught up, and I'm just 2:28:07.480 --> 2:28:12.120 standing like I'm supposed to be next, Like what is 2:28:12.360 --> 2:28:15.040 like I looked at what a prong horn was Is 2:28:15.120 --> 2:28:17.160 there really a prong horn in this thing? Or like 2:28:17.320 --> 2:28:19.720 is this some kind of weird, like you know, interagency 2:28:19.800 --> 2:28:23.160 joke and oh my gosh, but it turns out it 2:28:23.320 --> 2:28:25.840 was just prong horn. But they are so fast and 2:28:25.920 --> 2:28:29.600 so feisty. Um. But it's a you know, it's a 2:28:29.680 --> 2:28:32.360 great time. And I never thought when I got into 2:28:32.400 --> 2:28:34.880 the Border Patrol, I never thought that this would be 2:28:34.920 --> 2:28:38.000 an opportunity that I would have like pronghorn Yeah well 2:28:38.120 --> 2:28:41.200 not even yeah, pronghorn wrestling when you when you boil 2:28:41.280 --> 2:28:43.280 it down, but the fact that like I get to 2:28:43.360 --> 2:28:45.080 come to work and one of my jobs is to 2:28:45.280 --> 2:28:49.280 interact with an endangered species and be part of be 2:28:49.440 --> 2:28:53.320 part of a project that hopefully rehabilitates, you know, and 2:28:53.440 --> 2:28:57.600 re establishes an endangered species you know, on on Earth, 2:28:57.879 --> 2:29:00.960 you know, and in the country, like for some kid 2:29:01.160 --> 2:29:04.440 from Oak Carbor who went to you know, Washington State 2:29:04.560 --> 2:29:08.520 University and ends up, you know, helping to re establish 2:29:08.600 --> 2:29:11.840 an endangered species. Like that's I never thought that that 2:29:12.000 --> 2:29:17.519 my life would lead to something like that, ye unexpected 2:29:17.600 --> 2:29:20.560 turns man. Oh yeah, yeah. And that's the great thing 2:29:20.640 --> 2:29:23.320 I think that with the Border Patrol, um, is that 2:29:23.560 --> 2:29:27.920 I think people don't often see just how diverse the 2:29:28.280 --> 2:29:31.080 job can be, you know. Um, they think, oh, you're 2:29:31.120 --> 2:29:33.520 just going to be out along the border, you know. Well, 2:29:33.840 --> 2:29:35.880 yeah you may, you know, for a little bit. But 2:29:35.959 --> 2:29:37.920 then look, you could be working with these you know, 2:29:38.000 --> 2:29:41.640 these aerostats. You could be you know, playing bagpipes. You 2:29:41.720 --> 2:29:44.600 could be you know, you could be you could be 2:29:44.720 --> 2:29:47.480 working with pronghorn. There's so much when I could see 2:29:47.480 --> 2:29:51.120 where people would have I don't have it, but I 2:29:51.160 --> 2:29:53.320 could see where people would have a limited view of 2:29:53.400 --> 2:29:55.640 the job. But I guess I've just spent enough time 2:29:55.760 --> 2:30:00.280 down in border country where I recognized the complexity of 2:30:00.400 --> 2:30:04.400 the role and all the different you know, I guess 2:30:04.440 --> 2:30:06.320 if you're down there and you're observant, you just see, 2:30:07.280 --> 2:30:11.640 um how wide reaching and complex it is. But I 2:30:11.720 --> 2:30:14.600 think that you could come from a certain very narrow 2:30:14.920 --> 2:30:18.920 view and and just get an idea of what people 2:30:18.920 --> 2:30:22.360 are up to. That's a little bit reductive mm of 2:30:22.680 --> 2:30:25.280 what's going on. I haven't personally felt that way though, 2:30:25.560 --> 2:30:27.640 you know, I look at them like that. That's like 2:30:27.800 --> 2:30:32.240 a lot, there's a lot happening with a lot of ramifications. Man, 2:30:32.680 --> 2:30:35.480 I'll say this, if you're looking to get into a 2:30:35.520 --> 2:30:38.600 federal job and make a difference the the the United 2:30:38.640 --> 2:30:40.720 States border controls, one place where you can do that 2:30:41.200 --> 2:30:44.240 just because of the the great deal of things that 2:30:44.320 --> 2:30:46.240 we do. You can go and you can patrol on boat, 2:30:46.240 --> 2:30:48.880 you control on a TV, you can patrol on horseback, 2:30:48.959 --> 2:30:51.480 you control my vehicle, UM, and we have all these 2:30:51.520 --> 2:30:53.800 other programs that you grow that you can go into 2:30:53.879 --> 2:30:56.240 and do that you can actually make a difference if 2:30:56.320 --> 2:30:58.840 something is important to you. So if if the environment 2:30:58.959 --> 2:31:01.160 is important to you, we have an we have an 2:31:01.200 --> 2:31:03.800 avenue for that in the Border Patrol. If if wildlife 2:31:03.920 --> 2:31:05.560 is important to you, we have an avenue for that 2:31:06.040 --> 2:31:09.280 in the Border Patrol. And fighting narcotics is important to you, 2:31:09.360 --> 2:31:11.840 we have an avenue for that in the Border Patrol. 2:31:11.920 --> 2:31:14.280 So that's one thing the Border Patrol gives it. Most 2:31:14.720 --> 2:31:17.920 law enforcement agencies don't have is they're sort of they're 2:31:17.920 --> 2:31:20.320 sort of focused on on one thing where we're trying 2:31:20.320 --> 2:31:22.760 to focus on, but we have to focus on so 2:31:22.920 --> 2:31:25.800 many other things just just just because of the virtue 2:31:25.840 --> 2:31:27.680 of the way we do our jobs. I'll tell you 2:31:27.760 --> 2:31:32.320 one area you guys aren't focused. UM have Lena Intel 2:31:32.400 --> 2:31:36.400 for me and we listen. We might be down in 2:31:36.480 --> 2:31:38.920 that spot in mid February. I expect it to be 2:31:38.920 --> 2:31:41.560 a little different when I run into this year. Now 2:31:41.600 --> 2:31:43.200 that you made that public, and keep an eye in 2:31:43.200 --> 2:31:48.800 your inbox. Probably I want those guys be ready to 2:31:48.840 --> 2:31:51.120 air drop way points because like, don't play dumb with me. 2:31:51.400 --> 2:31:53.039 I want to make sure one more thing we covered 2:31:53.080 --> 2:31:56.800 before we go. Since we've given you some tools. Going 2:31:56.840 --> 2:31:59.520 back to your your fish gate thing, here, I'm gonna 2:31:59.600 --> 2:32:03.800 depute eyes you as a junior board. Here's your This 2:32:04.040 --> 2:32:08.720 gives you no authority whatsoever. Wear it with pride, and 2:32:09.200 --> 2:32:12.240 I hope you find a solution to the fish gate. 2:32:12.400 --> 2:32:15.640 Oh when I'm doing my fish don't, I want you 2:32:15.720 --> 2:32:18.280 to be able to display say that for when you 2:32:18.360 --> 2:32:21.840 get your polygraph, when you hook them up to the 2:32:21.920 --> 2:32:24.800 machine and you start watching them, they will give you 2:32:24.920 --> 2:32:30.840 that get Their eyes are gonna be twitching just seeing that. Well, 2:32:30.840 --> 2:32:34.320 I appreciate you guys coming down, man um. I've always 2:32:34.320 --> 2:32:37.280 been real fascinated by it. Again, just like time spent, 2:32:37.400 --> 2:32:42.440 and like Southern Texas, a lot of time we're spending, 2:32:42.600 --> 2:32:46.960 uh the Sonora Arizona. You know, just be like, what 2:32:47.080 --> 2:32:50.400 are those guys up to? Well, we appreciate the opportunity 2:32:50.400 --> 2:32:52.840 to come on. It's a great opportunity for us to 2:32:52.920 --> 2:32:55.039 come and show the work that we're doing in the board, 2:32:55.080 --> 2:32:57.920 which to give give your listeners and everybody else out 2:32:57.959 --> 2:32:59.200 there and the idea of the things that we do, 2:32:59.680 --> 2:33:01.240 and give than them a better idea of the things 2:33:01.240 --> 2:33:03.040 that we do. So we appreciate the opportunity to come on. 2:33:03.160 --> 2:33:06.520 It's great, man, it's been educational. Stay safe, guys. Thank you, 2:33:06.760 --> 2:33:08.600 thank you, thanks for having us, Thanks for having us. 2:33:08.600 --> 2:33:10.720 Really appreciate it, man, it's excellent. Thanks a lot