WEBVTT - A Conversation With Brooke Shields About Living a Public Life 0:00:04.800 --> 0:00:08.000 Hi everyone, I'm Kitty Kuric, and this is next question. 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:15.440 Brookshields is an American icon. I don't know about you, 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:18.840 but I remember her face being on the box of 0:00:18.960 --> 0:00:22.520 Ivory Snow because she was such a pretty baby. She 0:00:22.720 --> 0:00:26.360 later starred, of course, in Pretty Baby, and then froliced 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:29.160 in the Blue Lagoon. When I was in my twenties, 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:31.880 I learned that nothing came between her and her Calvin's. 0:00:32.479 --> 0:00:34.560 I have been a fan of hers for a very 0:00:34.600 --> 0:00:37.800 long time. I think she's so smart and funny and 0:00:38.000 --> 0:00:44.000 miraculously survived enormous fame from a very early age. In fact, 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:47.199 there's a whole documentary about her life called Pretty Baby 0:00:47.680 --> 0:00:50.519 Now on Hulu. When Brook invited me to be on 0:00:50.520 --> 0:00:55.320 her podcast, now What, I thought, why not? Although I'm 0:00:55.440 --> 0:00:58.320 a bit older than she is, we're both interested in 0:00:58.400 --> 0:01:02.160 making sure we're living and loving life as more and 0:01:02.240 --> 0:01:06.000 more candles appear on our birthday cakes. We ended up 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:08.840 having a great conversation, so I thought this might be 0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:12.080 a really nice way to kick off twenty twenty four. 0:01:12.640 --> 0:01:14.560 So I hope you all enjoy. 0:01:17.560 --> 0:01:17.760 Well. 0:01:17.800 --> 0:01:19.479 Thank you so much for doing this. 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:22.480 Oh my god, of course, I'm thrilled to talk to 0:01:22.520 --> 0:01:24.760 you because you know, I'm such a big fan, and 0:01:25.080 --> 0:01:27.560 I think I'm glad that people are kind of, you know, 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:31.000 getting to know you and your personality because you're so funny. 0:01:31.600 --> 0:01:34.720 And I don't think people I think, like when obviously 0:01:34.840 --> 0:01:37.960 suddenly Susan and you've had other roles, but I don't 0:01:37.959 --> 0:01:41.520 think everyone appreciates your sense of humor or the fact 0:01:41.560 --> 0:01:43.360 that you have such a good sense of humor. 0:01:43.680 --> 0:01:45.760 Well, thank you for that. I think, you know, I 0:01:45.840 --> 0:01:48.400 think it's anyway, it's odd. I think it's because if 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:51.160 you've been sort of positioned a certain way for a 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:54.000 good portion of your life, that is just what people 0:01:54.040 --> 0:01:56.920 imprint on and you know you can't I guess you 0:01:56.960 --> 0:02:00.600 can't be labeled pretty and funny, although I mean Lucio 0:02:00.680 --> 0:02:04.280 Ball was like a beauty queen when she started. 0:02:05.000 --> 0:02:07.480 I don't know why people have to put people in 0:02:07.600 --> 0:02:12.400 boxes and don't appreciate that, As Walt Whitman said, we 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:14.680 contain multitudes, right, right. 0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:18.280 I mean, I think it's easier for people because also 0:02:18.400 --> 0:02:23.000 if you really, if you really take in all that 0:02:23.040 --> 0:02:24.440 we're all capable of. 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:26.120 It's a lot of pressure for people. 0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:29.359 And yeah, I'm really kind of I have to say 0:02:29.400 --> 0:02:31.639 I was a bit intimidating, not a bit a lot 0:02:31.680 --> 0:02:36.200 intimidated when I really heard, only because not as a friend, 0:02:36.240 --> 0:02:38.560 because as a friend and like a girlfriend, I know 0:02:38.639 --> 0:02:41.560 I can call you and we can be girls, and 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:45.360 we've talked about a multitude of private things together. But 0:02:46.000 --> 0:02:48.800 it just, you know, you set the tone, and you're 0:02:48.960 --> 0:02:52.799 the front runner for so many women. And the fact 0:02:52.840 --> 0:02:55.359 that I got intimidated by the fact that I thought 0:02:55.400 --> 0:02:57.080 you were going to be that I knew you were 0:02:57.080 --> 0:02:59.480 going to be on the show, it struck me. I thought, 0:02:59.480 --> 0:03:03.359 I wonder if she ever gets intimidated by interviews that 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:06.560 she has to give. Has there been anybody that's been 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:08.080 intimidating to you? 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:12.720 I think when I have to tackle topics that I 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:15.320 don't know a great deal about that I feel like 0:03:15.400 --> 0:03:19.040 the learning curve is really steep. You know, if it's 0:03:19.080 --> 0:03:22.840 somebody on a specific aspect of foreign policy that I 0:03:22.919 --> 0:03:27.320 might not be uber knowledgeable about, or a medical thing 0:03:27.480 --> 0:03:30.960 that I don't know a lot about. Sometimes I do 0:03:31.000 --> 0:03:34.520 get intimidated, but I think at this point you just 0:03:34.639 --> 0:03:38.600 let your natural curiosity take over. You have a conversation, 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:42.360 and I think the goal is to really make things 0:03:42.080 --> 0:03:47.080 accessible and understandable to people. So I remember Tom Friedman 0:03:47.200 --> 0:03:52.440 said to explain things simply, you have to understand them deeply. 0:03:53.040 --> 0:03:57.640 So I try to strike that balance of understanding something 0:03:57.720 --> 0:04:00.120 and then synthesizing it and distill. 0:04:00.840 --> 0:04:05.640 That's a that's a tall order, but the research involved, 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:10.240 I think is daunting, and I'm sure you know, to 0:04:10.280 --> 0:04:12.880 make it accessible for other people is really. 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:16.280 Is really the gift of being a journalist. 0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:20.320 You wanted to be a journalist from the time you 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:24.000 were a little kid. I mean, you're the You're the 0:04:24.040 --> 0:04:27.720 youngest of four, correct, you grew up in Virginia and 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:30.360 you said you wanted to be a journalist from a 0:04:30.440 --> 0:04:33.040 young age. What how did you know that that's what 0:04:33.080 --> 0:04:36.919 you wanted. What was it about journalism that intrigued you. 0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:39.680 I think I wanted to do something that had to 0:04:39.720 --> 0:04:43.480 do with language and writing, and I think it was 0:04:43.520 --> 0:04:47.440 the process of elimination. Honestly, I wasn't very strong in 0:04:47.480 --> 0:04:50.240 math and science. I hate to say that because that's 0:04:50.279 --> 0:04:56.080 such a stereotypical thing, but I really gravitated towards words 0:04:56.120 --> 0:05:00.880 and language and writing and more creative pursuit. So I 0:05:00.960 --> 0:05:04.719 knew I wanted to do something that involved some form 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:08.839 of communication, whether it was writing or radio or talking. 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:13.240 And I think because my dad was a print journalist 0:05:13.560 --> 0:05:17.479 early in his career, and he saw that I wrote well, 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:21.200 and I wrote quickly because I was such a procrastinator 0:05:21.240 --> 0:05:23.159 as a kid, I'd wait till the last minute to 0:05:23.200 --> 0:05:26.400 do my homework, but I was able to write things 0:05:26.640 --> 0:05:30.400 under pressure. And I think he thought, wow, journalism might 0:05:30.440 --> 0:05:32.560 be a really great career for you. I mean, he 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:35.880 didn't say that, but we sort of went in that direction. 0:05:36.040 --> 0:05:39.480 And I got internships when I was in college, and 0:05:39.560 --> 0:05:42.280 I worked at three different radio stations, and I wrote 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:44.919 for my school newspaper and at Uva, I wrote for 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:46.040 the Cavalier Daily. 0:05:46.240 --> 0:05:48.320 So I really enjoyed it. 0:05:48.360 --> 0:05:52.159 And you know, I think when you are lucky enough 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:56.360 to find a job you'd love, that is such a gift. 0:05:56.839 --> 0:05:59.640 Do you remember the first time that you fell in 0:05:59.680 --> 0:06:03.279 love with the idea of news, like the news moment 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:06.480 that made you just fall in love with that medium. 0:06:06.560 --> 0:06:09.520 I don't remember if there was one particular moment. I 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:15.680 just loved every aspect of jumping into a local news van, 0:06:16.400 --> 0:06:19.800 not knowing what you were going to find when you 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:25.560 stopped to cover a story, having to jump out get 0:06:25.560 --> 0:06:29.200 your bearings, figure out what was going on, find people 0:06:29.240 --> 0:06:32.960 to talk to, start painting a picture of the story 0:06:33.000 --> 0:06:36.240 in your mind, listening to the sound bites on your 0:06:36.240 --> 0:06:40.280 little mini tape recorder on the way home, writing the script, 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:43.800 figuring out what you're maybe if you're going live from 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:47.240 the location, what your you know your live intro is 0:06:47.279 --> 0:06:49.360 going to be, what your outro is going to be, 0:06:49.600 --> 0:06:53.920 and doing it? Thank you much pressure. Oh yeah, it's 0:06:54.040 --> 0:06:59.960 so fun. It's such an adrenaline rush and it's just excite. 0:07:00.400 --> 0:07:05.400 And then you've got this thing that you've produced and 0:07:05.440 --> 0:07:09.440 it's done and it's over and you can go home 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:10.880 and leave it behind. 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:12.480 It's awesome. 0:07:12.760 --> 0:07:13.720 It's amazing. 0:07:13.760 --> 0:07:15.840 And also just the thinking on your feet and that 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:19.320 being able to adapt. I mean, it's our version as 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:22.840 an actor of improv. You know, you just it's yes, 0:07:22.960 --> 0:07:26.160 and you know, you never shut anything down. It's always 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:29.000 what's the next thing. But it's interesting though I don't 0:07:29.000 --> 0:07:33.960 think you know, my daughter, I always things happen and 0:07:34.000 --> 0:07:36.040 things don't happen for them, and I try to tell 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:38.800 them all the time that you know, rejection is just 0:07:38.920 --> 0:07:43.840 part of growth, and especially in this medium. What you're 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:48.160 what you I mean there must have been so much rejection. 0:07:48.360 --> 0:07:50.520 And part of what I wanted to do with this 0:07:50.600 --> 0:07:55.200 show is to normalize rejection, you know, to show people 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:58.160 that you can recover from it, that it happens to 0:07:58.200 --> 0:08:00.880 all of us, and it's how you're gone and how 0:08:00.920 --> 0:08:03.520 you continue that really reveals who you are. 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:06.360 That's so true. That's so true. 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:08.480 And I mean from the get go, I had people 0:08:09.360 --> 0:08:11.840 telling me, you know, oh, you're never going to make 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:14.600 it in the business. The president of CNN when I 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:20.120 did a really bad report, like I was too young 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:25.520 and really bad, and he called the assignment desk at 0:08:25.520 --> 0:08:28.320 CNN in Washington said he never wanted to see me 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:32.920 on the air again. Talk about like deflating. And you know, 0:08:33.240 --> 0:08:37.840 I had a really challenging time when I went to CBS, 0:08:37.920 --> 0:08:42.360 both internally with the politics there and externally with people 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:46.520 I think wanting to tear me down and not picking 0:08:46.600 --> 0:08:49.320 up what I was putting down in terms of trying 0:08:49.360 --> 0:08:54.760 to retool an evening news broadcast. And it's hard, and 0:08:55.360 --> 0:09:00.600 you're right, everybody deals with rejection or disappointment or hopes 0:09:00.640 --> 0:09:03.679 at some point in their lives and it's no fun, 0:09:04.000 --> 0:09:05.400 but it's just part of life. 0:09:05.559 --> 0:09:07.120 How did you move on from it, though, what do 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:07.360 you do? 0:09:07.840 --> 0:09:08.679 What was I mean? 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:12.800 I think I had different reactions that differed two different disappointments, 0:09:12.840 --> 0:09:15.680 Like when the president of CNN said he never wanted 0:09:15.720 --> 0:09:18.160 to see me on the air again. I was just 0:09:18.320 --> 0:09:22.319 like devastated. But I also thought, maybe he's right. Maybe 0:09:22.360 --> 0:09:26.400 I need more experience. Maybe I'm not ready, and I 0:09:26.559 --> 0:09:29.160 just need to do it more. And that's when I 0:09:29.200 --> 0:09:32.480 moved to Atlanta and became a producer and started doing 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:35.240 on air stuff little by little and found a mentor. 0:09:35.440 --> 0:09:37.760 That's when I went to Miami and became a local 0:09:37.840 --> 0:09:41.000 news and just churned out story after story. And you know, 0:09:41.080 --> 0:09:43.880 I agree with Malcolm Gladwell, it takes about ten thousand 0:09:43.880 --> 0:09:46.720 hours to get good at anything. And I just thought, 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:49.920 you know, I'm just I need more practice, I need 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:53.800 more experience. So I took it personally, and yet I 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:57.079 didn't take it personally, and I tried to figure out, well, 0:09:57.120 --> 0:09:59.880 how could I change the circumstances I found myself in. 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:10.520 When we come back, Brooke and I debunked the morning 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:14.040 show stigma and discuss one of the central tenets of 0:10:14.120 --> 0:10:22.559 journalism objectivity. That's right after this. If you want to 0:10:22.559 --> 0:10:25.280 get smarter every morning with a breakdown of the news 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:28.760 and fascinating takes on health and wellness and pop culture. 0:10:29.320 --> 0:10:32.200 Sign up for our daily newsletter, Wake Upcall by going 0:10:32.200 --> 0:10:37.720 to Katiecouric dot com. 0:10:37.760 --> 0:10:40.920 You were interviewed by people after you left CBS and 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:45.440 you said you didn't think that people really internally, ever 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:48.360 really accepted you. And you said, I thought we were 0:10:48.440 --> 0:10:53.160 much further along when it came to sexism. What prompted 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:55.400 that observation. 0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:58.640 Well, I think if you had sort of been in 0:10:58.720 --> 0:11:02.560 my shoes during those five years. And I think a 0:11:02.600 --> 0:11:07.320 lot has changed. I think that sexism is still one 0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:10.600 of the most acceptable isms, less so than it used 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:14.520 to be. But I think that I got criticized for 0:11:14.640 --> 0:11:17.560 what I wore my first night on the evening news. 0:11:18.240 --> 0:11:21.239 I got criticized for the way I held my hands, 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:25.640 these really dopey things that a mail anchor would just 0:11:25.760 --> 0:11:28.079 never be subjected to. I mean, let's face it, it's 0:11:28.120 --> 0:11:32.840 more interesting, I think, to look at women on television 0:11:32.880 --> 0:11:37.520 because there's more variety. You know, men just look generally 0:11:37.559 --> 0:11:40.480 a certain way, where a certain suit and a tie, 0:11:40.640 --> 0:11:45.000 and I think that not everyone. And by the way, 0:11:45.040 --> 0:11:47.680 I had a lot of friends within CBS, but a 0:11:47.720 --> 0:11:51.520 lot of people I think sort of didn't like outsiders. 0:11:52.440 --> 0:11:55.800 It's a pretty insular place. People go there and they 0:11:55.880 --> 0:11:59.520 kind of spend their entire careers there. So I had 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:03.440 the out status, I had the first woman's status. I 0:12:03.600 --> 0:12:08.600 had the morning show albatross around my neck, that somehow 0:12:08.640 --> 0:12:12.079 I lacked rabatas, which I always say is Latin for testicles, 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:17.599 and you know, and that and that somehow I wasn't 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:21.319 enough of a you know, a serious journalist to handle 0:12:21.640 --> 0:12:26.080 the CBS evening news, which was just honestly boloney. So 0:12:26.240 --> 0:12:28.320 I think there were a lot of and not just 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:32.719 I think there were a lot of biases that honestly 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:38.240 infected or affected the way people saw me in that role. 0:12:39.360 --> 0:12:43.239 What just explained to me what the morning show stigma? 0:12:44.160 --> 0:12:48.360 Oh well, I think that people, you know, even though 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:51.320 Tom Brokaw did the Today Show, for example, and even 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:56.800 John Chancellor did the Today Show, I think there is 0:12:57.200 --> 0:13:01.360 a feeling that the morning shows are very fluffy and 0:13:01.559 --> 0:13:05.480 that they don't deal with serious news, and they're not. 0:13:06.360 --> 0:13:09.920 They're not done or anchored by serious people. I think 0:13:09.960 --> 0:13:14.480 that's an unfair characterization because I did so many serious 0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:17.200 interviews during my fifteen years at the Today Show, and 0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:20.960 I did many dateline specials. I interviewed Supreme Court justices 0:13:21.120 --> 0:13:26.360 and presidents and world leaders. But I think that it 0:13:26.600 --> 0:13:31.480 just has this kind of unfair sort of impromoder as 0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:34.920 kind of a you know, a light fluffy show. 0:13:35.040 --> 0:13:36.679 It's entertainment, not news. 0:13:36.760 --> 0:13:37.120 Yeah. 0:13:37.280 --> 0:13:41.280 Yeah, But I was really really proud of working on 0:13:41.320 --> 0:13:44.480 The Today Show and really proud of a lot of 0:13:44.520 --> 0:13:47.480 the work we did in the stories and the serious 0:13:47.520 --> 0:13:51.240 stories I covered, from Oklahoma City bombing to nine to eleven, 0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:56.199 to presidential elections to all kinds of really important stories. 0:13:56.520 --> 0:13:59.160 I mean, you've covered so much, and I'm curious about. 0:13:58.960 --> 0:14:03.400 How you cover some of the more divisive issues without 0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:04.959 inserting your personal opinion. 0:14:05.320 --> 0:14:09.120 I honestly try to understand what the person is saying, 0:14:09.400 --> 0:14:13.520 and I try to learn from that and ask questions 0:14:13.520 --> 0:14:16.520 that I think other people would ask. I do try to, 0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:19.520 you know, have a vulcan mind meld with people who 0:14:19.640 --> 0:14:23.600 might be watching, and I try to be objective, but 0:14:24.400 --> 0:14:26.200 you know, I have at this point in my life, 0:14:26.280 --> 0:14:29.360 I'm sixty six years old. There are certain things that 0:14:30.440 --> 0:14:34.760 I really believe in it, and it is hard to sometimes, 0:14:34.880 --> 0:14:38.920 like interview somebody who is against abortion. You know, I'm 0:14:39.040 --> 0:14:43.640 for reproductive rights. I am for stricter gun laws. Have 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:47.320 I think, at this point in my career, been able 0:14:47.440 --> 0:14:51.120 to say there's some things that I really deeply believe in, 0:14:52.400 --> 0:14:56.640 and so I think I do have biases when it 0:14:56.680 --> 0:15:00.320 comes to those topics. But in other instances is I 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:06.440 just try to listen and challenge when necessary and in 0:15:06.480 --> 0:15:10.800 a respectful way, you know, have a conversation with people. 0:15:11.200 --> 0:15:15.560 But you know, as I think, there's no such thing 0:15:15.600 --> 0:15:20.080 as true objectivity. You know, unless you're doing the very 0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:23.200 strict to what when we're why, if you're trying to 0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:29.040 put any context or any kind of explanation behind an event, 0:15:29.640 --> 0:15:33.520 it's inevitable that your perspective is going to be influenced 0:15:33.600 --> 0:15:35.720 by your point of view in some way. 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:38.920 And do you feel like you are now there's areas 0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:43.360 of your personality that you can more freely and unapologetically 0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:46.200 share now that you might not have in your early days. 0:15:46.240 --> 0:15:48.920 And news, yeah, they were like, you know, there were 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:53.400 third rails, like you couldn't talk about gun violence. And 0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:56.960 I did a whole documentary about why gun violence was 0:15:57.000 --> 0:16:00.360 out of control in this country. You know, I couldn't 0:16:00.360 --> 0:16:02.840 have done that anchoring the Today Show, I could not 0:16:03.040 --> 0:16:05.640 have had a strong opinion. 0:16:05.840 --> 0:16:07.080 With your media company. 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:09.720 Now you can, yeah, put out the messaging that you 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:12.680 believe in and you know, well, you know. 0:16:12.760 --> 0:16:17.080 Brooke, I was able to shape the broadcast slightly differently 0:16:17.120 --> 0:16:19.520 when I was at CBS. I could focus more on 0:16:19.560 --> 0:16:22.800 women's stories. You know, we did something on dating violence, 0:16:22.840 --> 0:16:26.560 we did something on you know, sexual assault in the military. 0:16:26.920 --> 0:16:30.320 I did, you know, stories that I think a male 0:16:30.440 --> 0:16:35.480 anchor would not have necessarily thought about. And so I 0:16:35.680 --> 0:16:40.440 was able to make my mark in some ways when 0:16:40.440 --> 0:16:44.000 it came to story selection. So I feel like I 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:49.320 wasn't totally you know, hamstrung by being in a more 0:16:49.360 --> 0:16:50.720 traditional media environment. 0:16:51.560 --> 0:16:56.440 Well, I'm relieved and glad to hear that. I think 0:16:56.520 --> 0:17:01.240 you're a very strong business woman in so far as 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:06.120 the way you handled this fascination with your personal life 0:17:06.680 --> 0:17:10.600 in a way that made it not get stolen from you. 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:13.040 You know. I mean, I've felt that my whole life. 0:17:13.040 --> 0:17:15.800 But I'm right, I'm not in new I'm not in news, 0:17:15.880 --> 0:17:21.040 you know, but that that that piece is usually not 0:17:21.320 --> 0:17:25.439 something that gets it's usually that that personality and then 0:17:25.440 --> 0:17:27.640 the private life is the private life. But You've done 0:17:27.680 --> 0:17:32.600 such a sort of beautiful job of taking trials and tribulations, 0:17:32.640 --> 0:17:35.800 and you've been open about so much that you went 0:17:35.840 --> 0:17:40.840 through personally in your life, but also making them teaching 0:17:40.880 --> 0:17:46.200 moments and sharing them for other people's benefit. And I'm 0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:49.840 curious as to how you were able to reconcile that. 0:17:50.920 --> 0:17:54.840 Yeah, well, you know, I think that morning television is 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:59.119 such a different animal. You develop, you know, these parasocial 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:02.640 relationships with the anchors. You do get to know them. 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:02.879 You know. 0:18:02.920 --> 0:18:05.040 People would say to me, I feel like I know you, 0:18:05.080 --> 0:18:07.800 and I said, I'd always say, in many ways, I 0:18:07.840 --> 0:18:10.880 think you do. Because they'd see you in serious moments, 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:14.720 they'd see you having fun, they'd see you having casual 0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:19.920 chit chat with your colleagues. And I think maybe there 0:18:20.119 --> 0:18:23.880 was a lot of interest in my personal life because 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:29.080 I was very authentic to who I was on television 0:18:29.160 --> 0:18:32.879 that who I was off camera was really There was 0:18:32.920 --> 0:18:35.200 no difference really to how I mean. 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:37.280 There were some limitations of. 0:18:37.240 --> 0:18:39.399 Things I would do on television that I wouldn't do 0:18:39.480 --> 0:18:42.840 off camera, but I was very much the same person 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:47.119 with the same persona. And I think when people saw 0:18:47.160 --> 0:18:51.240 me pregnant, they were with me when I had both 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:54.840 of my girls. They were with me when my husband 0:18:55.000 --> 0:18:55.920 Jay got sick. 0:18:56.880 --> 0:18:57.080 You know. 0:18:57.320 --> 0:19:00.360 There I was a forty one year old widow with 0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:06.600 two children, six and two, and I think people felt 0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:11.359 terrible for me in the most loving way. I mean, obviously, 0:19:11.400 --> 0:19:13.800 how can you say that about millions of people, But 0:19:13.880 --> 0:19:19.480 I did feel this support coming to me from from 0:19:19.520 --> 0:19:23.480 the Today Show viewers and the audience that you know 0:19:23.640 --> 0:19:26.199 does welcome you and your home and their home like 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:32.320 your kind of family. And having seen that terrible thing 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:38.040 happen to Jay, and then to see me try to 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:42.560 be resilient and move forward, then I think people became 0:19:42.640 --> 0:19:46.240 interested in my love life. Like you know, it made 0:19:46.280 --> 0:19:50.119 for good tabloid fodder, and you know, it was just 0:19:50.280 --> 0:19:53.919 part of being I think at the time where morning 0:19:54.000 --> 0:19:57.359 shows had a real place in the culture, more so 0:19:57.440 --> 0:20:00.520 than I think they do today because of the friendgmentation 0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:05.760 of media, and I think people just were interested in 0:20:06.600 --> 0:20:08.560 that how I was going to move forward. 0:20:08.680 --> 0:20:12.840 I mean, I mean sometimes it felt sometimes. 0:20:12.400 --> 0:20:17.200 It felt invasive, but during the trauma of losing Jay, 0:20:18.359 --> 0:20:21.359 it was so helpful. It was so comforting. I felt 0:20:22.440 --> 0:20:27.080 so cared about by complete strangers who sent me mass 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:32.560 cards and sympathy notes and stories about loss that they 0:20:32.600 --> 0:20:36.639 had experienced. It was actually really beautiful and I still 0:20:36.880 --> 0:20:41.159 have many of those letters in big tupperware bins in 0:20:41.200 --> 0:20:44.960 my basement. And you know, I at Jay's funeral, I 0:20:45.040 --> 0:20:48.679 asked everyone who came to write letters to ellieen Carey 0:20:49.440 --> 0:20:52.479 because I knew that they were not going to have 0:20:52.680 --> 0:20:57.119 the privilege of really getting to know their father, and 0:20:57.359 --> 0:21:01.880 so to be able to have those that people wrote 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:08.400 such beautiful, thoughtful notes and letters and multi page letters 0:21:08.480 --> 0:21:15.560 to the girls. That is really love. That's compassion, that's empathy. 0:21:16.000 --> 0:21:21.680 And I felt it so strongly, and you know, a loss, 0:21:21.920 --> 0:21:27.000 it was a terrible loss, but it did help and 0:21:27.040 --> 0:21:31.359 it was comforting to know that people were out there 0:21:31.720 --> 0:21:43.480 holding me in their hearts. After this quick break, Brooke 0:21:43.520 --> 0:21:46.480 and I reflect on the burden and privilege of having 0:21:46.480 --> 0:21:50.480 a platform and how we both try to use ours 0:21:50.720 --> 0:21:55.639 in a positive way. 0:21:58.480 --> 0:22:02.040 You know, when I had very severe postpartum and wrote 0:22:02.119 --> 0:22:03.480 and I wrote about it, I. 0:22:03.560 --> 0:22:05.840 Stay right, you came on the Today Show. 0:22:05.880 --> 0:22:10.359 I did. But to this day, people come with women 0:22:10.480 --> 0:22:12.640 come up to me and tears in their eyes and 0:22:12.680 --> 0:22:15.239 they and they cry and they say thank you, and 0:22:15.800 --> 0:22:17.800 you know, and it's that there's something to be. 0:22:17.920 --> 0:22:21.680 Said for shared loss or shared. 0:22:21.359 --> 0:22:24.679 Experience, or that you know you're not alone, and that 0:22:25.480 --> 0:22:29.359 you know to be willing to be open to that 0:22:29.480 --> 0:22:32.880 I think is obviously a sign of who you are 0:22:33.240 --> 0:22:34.000 as a person. 0:22:34.359 --> 0:22:34.520 Well. 0:22:34.560 --> 0:22:37.120 I think especially you know, when it comes to taboo 0:22:37.200 --> 0:22:42.159 topics like postpartum depression that people are so terrified of 0:22:42.480 --> 0:22:47.160 and so frightened by, and to break the stigma and 0:22:47.240 --> 0:22:50.399 to let people share and know it's okay and that 0:22:50.480 --> 0:22:54.240 there's help. I mean, you did a tremendous public service, 0:22:54.480 --> 0:22:56.880 and I hope that I did the same with colon cancer. 0:22:56.960 --> 0:23:00.960 You know, nobody talked about colon cancer when CHA got 0:23:01.040 --> 0:23:05.200 sick and died, and nobody really talked about the fact 0:23:05.200 --> 0:23:09.359 that it's highly preventable if you get screened. And you know, 0:23:09.520 --> 0:23:13.440 I think when you're a public figure, you have a platform, 0:23:13.720 --> 0:23:17.480 and with that platform comes to responsibility and if you 0:23:17.560 --> 0:23:22.240 can educate people and arm them with information that will 0:23:22.280 --> 0:23:26.600 help them, that could even save their lives. I hate 0:23:26.640 --> 0:23:30.480 to say it, but I think it's really selfish not share, 0:23:30.640 --> 0:23:32.959 not to share your experience. 0:23:32.760 --> 0:23:35.080 And I you know, I call this show now What 0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:39.959 because it's really about those pivotal times in our lives 0:23:40.000 --> 0:23:44.640 when something very massive happens and we we really are 0:23:44.359 --> 0:23:47.480 are the rug is pulled out from underneath us, and 0:23:47.520 --> 0:23:48.720 we are thinking, oh shit. 0:23:48.600 --> 0:23:49.320 What do I you know? 0:23:49.800 --> 0:23:50.000 Now? 0:23:50.000 --> 0:23:50.640 What do I do? 0:23:51.240 --> 0:23:55.359 And I imagine you've had many now what moments? Was 0:23:55.359 --> 0:23:58.240 that one of your biggest? Now what moments? How did 0:23:58.280 --> 0:23:59.720 you move forward from that? 0:24:00.200 --> 0:24:02.840 I think when you have children, you really have no 0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:07.160 option but to put one foot ahead of the other. 0:24:07.440 --> 0:24:10.520 You know, when something like that happens, you don't have 0:24:10.920 --> 0:24:14.200 the luxury of staying in bed and pulling the covers 0:24:14.240 --> 0:24:17.720 over your head. You have to be there for your kids. 0:24:17.760 --> 0:24:22.480 You have a responsibility. You have to parent. And so 0:24:23.160 --> 0:24:26.280 that's what I did. And I also, you know, I 0:24:26.400 --> 0:24:29.359 was a single parent. I had to keep working. I 0:24:29.440 --> 0:24:33.239 wanted to keep working. I loved my job. And I 0:24:33.280 --> 0:24:36.879