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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 2: my name is Nol.

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Speaker 3: They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our

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Speaker 3: super producer Dylan the Tennessee pal Fagan. Most importantly, you

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Speaker 3: are you. You are here. That makes this the stuff

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Speaker 3: they don't want you to know. If you are listening

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Speaker 3: to this the evening it comes out, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome

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Speaker 3: to November fourth. You have survived Halloween. So happy Halloween

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Speaker 3: to all those who celebrate.

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Speaker 4: And in a burst of I guess calendar asynchronous nests

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Speaker 4: both of my stories or Halloween really today, So sorry,

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Speaker 4: it's still kind of spooky season.

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Speaker 3: It's always Halloween in America and in our hearts. Is

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Speaker 3: a way I like to explain. We're going to get

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Speaker 3: into so much stuff. We are going to talk about,

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Speaker 3: not just Halloween, but some occultish stuff, some recent discoveries.

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Speaker 3: We're going to talk about a little bit of AI

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Speaker 3: and some heist and recoveries as well. Before we do

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Speaker 3: any of that, guys, I gotta tell you I read

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Speaker 3: the dumbest story. I've been on this last meals thing

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Speaker 3: for a minute now, But did you guys hear about

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Speaker 3: a prisoner on death row who asked for a cigarette

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Speaker 3: instead of a last meal?

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Speaker 4: Was it the Icelandic breakfast? Have you seen this? Or

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Speaker 4: it's like a cigarette finished breakfast. It's like a cigarette,

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Speaker 4: a shot of espresso and vodka. But what was the deal? Ben?

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Speaker 4: He asked for a cigarette, asked for a cigarette?

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Speaker 3: They were the prison authorities refused because it was quote

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Speaker 3: harmful to his health. He was electrocuted a few hours later.

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Speaker 4: Weren't they going to give it to him if he

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Speaker 4: would like do a p s A again smoking things?

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Speaker 4: Maybe I misread that would have been hilarious though, Well.

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Speaker 3: We've got we've got a lot of weird stuff.

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Speaker 2: Don't definitely not kill me.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, if you smoke, you will go to the death row.

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Speaker 3: We we also, uh, it's the time for gallows humor.

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Speaker 3: Let's make this our cold open.

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Speaker 4: Oh please, And we have returned.

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Speaker 3: Based on the kind words of many conspiracy realists, we

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Speaker 3: like to start with a scattershot approach to a lot

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Speaker 3: of strange news that hasn't maybe gotten the do it deserves.

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Speaker 3: Let's say it this way. We'll start with good news.

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Speaker 3: Another lost city has been discovered in modern day Mexico,

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Speaker 3: and it's a huge one. Did you guys hear about this.

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Speaker 3: I know we're all light our nerds.

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Speaker 4: Found was a satellite imagery. Yeah, that's right, and that's

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Speaker 4: the part that I saw. I saw like a map

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Speaker 4: of some sort.

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Speaker 2: It's incredible.

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Speaker 5: It's what we've talked about on some of those Hidden

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Speaker 5: Cities episodes we did. I think it was a two

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Speaker 5: parter we did a long time ago. It is the

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Speaker 5: exact thing that I think Ben. We just were excited

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Speaker 5: about it one day happening and now it's.

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Speaker 3: Here, and we argued that this would inevitably lead to

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Speaker 3: more discovery. So we proudly present to you the formerly

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Speaker 3: hidden complex which has been named Valeriana. Nobody knows its

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Speaker 3: real name. It was discovered using laser survey or light

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Speaker 3: our technology. This is not just a big deal historically,

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Speaker 3: it's a big deal geographically. So we want to give

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Speaker 3: a shout out to Luke Ald Thomas, who's a PhD

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Speaker 3: student at Tulane University down south here in the US,

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Speaker 3: who had the greatest explanation for how they discuss this quote.

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Speaker 3: I was on something like page sixteen of Google search

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Speaker 3: and found a laser survey done by a Mexican organization

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Speaker 3: for environmental monitoring. And our pal, the PhD student Old Thomas,

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Speaker 3: found a light our survey and this got him thinking,

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Speaker 3: and so we processed the data using methodology of previous archaeologists,

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Speaker 3: and he saw that this ancient city, which had been

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Speaker 3: eaten by the jungle, was at one time home to

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Speaker 3: thirty to fifty thousand people, somewhere between seven hundred and

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Speaker 3: fifty to eight hundred and fifty eight, which is really

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Speaker 3: not that long ago if you think about.

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Speaker 4: It, Ben, did these people have magical powers?

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Speaker 3: Well, we're going to need a different kind of technology

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Speaker 3: to figure that one out. No, okay, but I hope.

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Speaker 3: So I choose to think this was the original home

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Speaker 3: of wearbats, perhaps because I've been playing too many strange games.

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Speaker 4: Well I'm being a dork, but like, isn't it sort

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Speaker 4: of part of the whole, you know, thinking behind some

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Speaker 4: of these hidden civilizations, that they were more advanced, or

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Speaker 4: that they possessed some kind of like uncanny abilities like

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Speaker 4: atlantis and stuff like that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's it's gonna be red meat, of course,

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Speaker 3: for the ancient aliens folks, for the hidden history folks.

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Speaker 3: We can say at least the latter is true. This

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Speaker 3: is hidden history. If you want to learn more, please

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Speaker 3: check out a fantastic article PhD student finds lost city

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Speaker 3: in Mexico jungle by accident from our pals the BBC,

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Speaker 3: specifically journalist and science reporter Georgina Renard.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, we just had dinner with her the other night.

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Speaker 4: That's not true, figurative information.

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Speaker 3: Pals, Dinner of the mind exactly.

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Speaker 5: Can we just say, really quickly, it's amazing how fast

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Speaker 5: the jungle really does overtake these places. Like you were saying, Ben,

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Speaker 5: I've been contemplating since you mentioned it, just how not

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Speaker 5: long ago this city existed and there were you know,

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Speaker 5: tens of thousands of humans probably living in it.

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Speaker 2: That's insane mm hmm.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. And it is something that we I don't even

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Speaker 3: want to call it a prediction, but it was statistically

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Speaker 3: inevitable that more stuff would be discovered as this technology

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Speaker 3: met economy of scale and could be more easily rolled

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Speaker 3: out and afforded by various Boffen initiatives. Often autanistic initiatives. Whatever,

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Speaker 3: we'll keep it boff initiatives off initiatives. There we go,

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Speaker 3: well done, and so we want to move on. Speaking

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Speaker 3: of rediscovering stuff, you guys, the Vatican, that's right, the

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Speaker 3: seat of the Catholic Church is rediscovering their relevance to

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Speaker 3: the newer generations, and not in the creepy way they've

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Speaker 3: been associated with in the past.

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Speaker 4: They're now doing all of their services in brain rot speak, right,

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Speaker 4: is that what it is?

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Speaker 3: Close? Well, I wouldn't even see like. Okay, So Luce,

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Speaker 3: which will all hopefully meet soon, means light in Italian.

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Speaker 3: Pardon my pronunciation. This is a mascot unveiled by Archbishop

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Speaker 3: Reno Fisicella in a press conference just a few days

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Speaker 3: ago on October twenty eighth. As we record this is

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna share a picture with you guys, and please,

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Speaker 3: as you're playing along with us at home, please check

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Speaker 3: it out at your leisure. Lucie is an anime inspired

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Speaker 3: mascot for the Vatican to connect with the kids. I'm

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Speaker 3: just gonna show you guys a quick image search here. Again,

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Speaker 3: please play along at home. This is Luce.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, it kind of looks like the Morton Salt Girl,

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Speaker 4: but like a little more anime. Yeah, it's pretty funny.

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Speaker 4: The yellow rainslicker. What's that about. It's like she's a

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Speaker 4: door of the explorer for the Catholic Church going on

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Speaker 4: an adventure into the scriptures.

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Speaker 3: Note also the rosary warren as a necklace which some

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Speaker 3: people got in trouble for in Catholic school. So question

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Speaker 3: is that right? Yeah, like wearing it in that fashion

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Speaker 3: was not okay. Some kids got in trouble for it.

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Speaker 3: You know that your mileage may vary. Before we move

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Speaker 3: on to our next story, have to ask do you

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Speaker 3: guys think this anime character will work? Do you think

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Speaker 3: kids will say, oh, the Pope school.

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Speaker 4: Droves droves of gen Z kids are going to start

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Speaker 4: flocking to the church. No, I don't know about that.

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Speaker 5: I like the idea that it's a pilgrim, right, that

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Speaker 5: it's a depiction of a typical traveler, So it's not

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Speaker 5: really a raincoat. It's a coat that I don't know,

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Speaker 5: a depiction of a I don't know what they're trying

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Speaker 5: to go for really there, but I like the idea

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Speaker 5: that this is somebody who was supposed to be bringing

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Speaker 5: a light, maybe the light of Christ throughout the world

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Speaker 5: as they travel around it. That's a that's a cool concept.

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Speaker 5: That's one of the major positive things that exists in religion.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 3: It's the yellow hooded coat is a reference to the

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Speaker 3: Vatican flag. The staff is a pilgrim's staff traditionally. If

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Speaker 3: you want to learn more, one article we like for

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Speaker 3: this is The Straits Times st R A T. S.

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Speaker 3: By Ian Chang, where the idea is that, as mentioned earlier,

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Speaker 3: the idea is that this is somehow the Holy See

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Speaker 3: won't like me say it this way, but is somehow

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Speaker 3: Promethean right bringing the light of Christ to other people.

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Speaker 3: This was unveiled during the or in planning for their

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Speaker 3: big jubilee. And I don't know, you know, I don't

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Speaker 3: see anything inherently sinister about this. If there's a conspiracy afoot,

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Speaker 3: it's conspiring to bring more people to the light of

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Speaker 3: Jesus Christ.

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Speaker 5: Right, Sure, Yeah, that's all I'm saying. I think it's

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Speaker 5: theoretically hopefully good.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I mean, you know, the results may vary about how

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Speaker 4: religion works for you or where in your life it

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Speaker 4: plays a role. I definitely kind of a little weird

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Speaker 4: weirded out by the idea of recruiting young people to

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Speaker 4: the church all. I've never particularly loved the idea of

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Speaker 4: baptism before. You know, a kid has the agency to decide,

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Speaker 4: and so there's something about that that's a little odd

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Speaker 4: to me, especially given the scandals and all of the abuses.

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Speaker 4: I don't know, I get what they're trying to do.

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Speaker 4: It feels a little ham fisted to me, though.

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Speaker 3: Speaking of we'll move to a next story, which is

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Speaker 3: which is that'll be funny later, folks promise, which is

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Speaker 3: this As anybody who has lived in Japan or visited

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Speaker 3: Japan knows, a huge portion of the population resides in cities,

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Speaker 3: so much so that a lot of rural areas are

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Speaker 3: becoming depopulated. They're experiencing brain dream at a level that

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Speaker 3: is simply unsustainable, sadly for a lot of these towns,

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Speaker 3: and you can see it if you're American, you can

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Speaker 3: see it in other rural parts of the United States.

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Speaker 3: More than one Japanese town has attempted a solution to

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Speaker 3: your earlier point, Noel, about the idea of you can

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Speaker 3: see the intent, but we don't know about the execution

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Speaker 3: of the results. Let's go to a story you find

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Speaker 3: decided everywhere. Sky News has a great write up on it.

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Speaker 3: Japanese villages are replacing young people with mannequins as the

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Speaker 3: population plummets.

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Speaker 4: I'm sorry, like those like those body pillow things like

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Speaker 4: what are we talking about you?

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Speaker 3: Here's a picture sharing this the mannequins that are being

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Speaker 3: put around town in public spaces. Would we like to

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Speaker 3: describe them nightmare fuel?

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Speaker 2: Hmm, Matt, how does this hit you? Brother?

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Speaker 4: This is terrifying to me.

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Speaker 2: Ah, I don't know. The scarecrow, but less.

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Speaker 3: Useful, definitely not human looking. They're definitely wrought in humanoid

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Speaker 3: in like humanoid form, but they're clearly not real children.

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Speaker 3: They've done this such that now this small village in particular,

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Speaker 3: I pulled this picture from a town called Ichi No No,

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Speaker 3: and this town is now quote outnumbered by puppets. There

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Speaker 3: are fewer than sixty people who live in the southern village,

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Speaker 3: and most of them are older, which happens a lot

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Speaker 3: in places with you know, declining earth rates and brain

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Speaker 3: train And I gotta tell you, it seems like a

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Speaker 3: good hearted conspiracy, well intentioned, but if it is meant

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Speaker 3: to heal feelings of loneliness. Would it not just accelerate

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Speaker 3: those feelings? This is a villager initiative, by the way

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Speaker 3: they used found materials, clothing, fabric, a mannequins.

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Speaker 4: God forbid, you're some hapless passerby who isn't aware of

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Speaker 4: the initiative. Can you imagine just what is going on

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Speaker 4: in this town? This is It's like a Stephen King

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Speaker 4: short story.

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Speaker 5: What if your eyesight's going pretty hard and you don't

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Speaker 5: ever get really close to these mannequins, and if you're

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Speaker 5: walking down the street, you're, oh, there's a cute family

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Speaker 5: over there on the swing set.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's just to be clear. The picture that Ben

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Speaker 4: showed us is of one of these horrors on a

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Speaker 4: swing set.

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Speaker 2: Mm hmm my good. Yeah, look at that.

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Speaker 3: And this is for perspective on how rural this is.

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Speaker 3: It's about three and a half hours from Osaka, which

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Speaker 3: would probably be the closest big town most Westerners are

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Speaker 3: familiar with. I also hope it works out. I hope

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Speaker 3: none of us listening this evening are driving through a

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Speaker 3: small town in what is sometimes called flyover country here

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Speaker 3: in the US and runs into a mannequin place that

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Speaker 3: feels like some real get out fuel.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's that turned into poppets.

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Speaker 3: The town that turned into poppets.

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Speaker 2: Think about how good of listeners they are though.

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Speaker 5: You could tell them all about your day until they

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Speaker 5: eat your soul.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and this is something that is perhaps part of

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Speaker 3: a larger trend, which we'll discuss maybe in a future episode.

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Speaker 4: You know, it's funny. It's a different country, but I

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Speaker 4: did see a story about how the Chinese government is

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Speaker 4: actually dealing with the similar issues and actively calling women

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Speaker 4: to convince them that it's a good idea to get pregnant.

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Speaker 3: That's a true story. Yeah, it is the It is

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Speaker 3: the Chinese government that recently made Western news doing that.

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Speaker 3: We don't know exactly how the like, how the vibe

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Speaker 3: is for those folks who got called. We don't know.

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Speaker 3: I can only guess that a lot of people, whether

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Speaker 3: or not they're carrying a child, did not react.

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Speaker 4: Well. Is it like a pitch like? I mean, excuse me,

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Speaker 4: Can I have a moment of your time please? You

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Speaker 4: are you familiar with breeding?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it seems like an unrealistic idea, similar to the

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Speaker 3: idea that Russia wants Google and Google will come up

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Speaker 3: later in tonight's strange news segment. Russia wants Google to

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Speaker 3: pay a fine. We all read about this right because

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Speaker 3: this has made the rounds. Russia wants Google to pay

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Speaker 3: a fine like as a state organization. And it is

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Speaker 3: a number higher than any amount of currency that exists

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Speaker 3: on Earth.

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Speaker 4: Oh, a gajillion billion zillion something like that in US right, Yes,

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Speaker 4: of course, what you yeah, which would make it even

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Speaker 4: a larger number if I'm not mistake.

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Speaker 3: Right, twenty point five descilion deecill io n and this

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Speaker 3: is more than the entire GDP of the planet. A

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Speaker 3: Russian court, not a private entity, has ordered Google to

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Speaker 3: pay this fine, with additionally a one million dollar US

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Speaker 3: in this one US dollar penalty for every day they

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Speaker 3: don't pay.

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Speaker 4: I'm sure Google will get right on that, so.

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Speaker 3: I'm sure they will. The way you would write this

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Speaker 3: out would be a decillion is twenty followed by thirty

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Speaker 3: three zeros. Google is valued at two trillion dollars, which

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Speaker 3: is already honestly not real money.

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Speaker 4: And isn't the word Google a bizarro giant number about

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Speaker 4: like a certain like a crazy amount of zeros?

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Speaker 3: Yes, it is a purposeful misspelling of a Google. The

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Speaker 3: number ten to the hundredth power.

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Speaker 4: Got it?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so there they've always been dreaming big. I got

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Speaker 3: to tell you, this story has been making the rounds

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Speaker 3: pretty often, but I don't know if it now far

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Speaker 3: be it for us to portray ourselves as experts in

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Speaker 3: the world of economics. But guys, I don't think they're

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Speaker 3: going to pay it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, thinking you're probably right there, But I mean I

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Speaker 4: gotta say though, the fact the way you had to

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Speaker 4: describe this number, and then me immediately being like, oh,

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Speaker 4: isn't that kind of what a Google is as well?

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Speaker 4: Do you think it's a symbolic like middle finger kind

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Speaker 4: of thing, almost like a little bit of a wink wink,

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Speaker 4: like the reference to the name of the company. I

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Speaker 4: know it's not the same as a Google, but it

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Speaker 4: is a similarly absurd number.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think that's I think that's a good

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Speaker 3: point because we also have to consider the larger context.

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Speaker 3: Google has accumulated a lot of fines in Russia. They've

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Speaker 3: already before this happened, they already were in trouble, right,

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Speaker 3: And their largest find aside from this is a four

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Speaker 3: point seven billion US dollars find issued by the EU

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Speaker 3: in twenty eighteen for some anti trust stuff and that

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Speaker 3: like that translates to four point three four billion euro

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Speaker 3: which is still minuscule, tiny in comparison to what Russia

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Speaker 3: is demanding. What they really want is for Google to

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Speaker 3: restore YouTube accounts of state run propaganda, which is again

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Speaker 3: I don't think they're going to do either of those, right, Like,

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Speaker 3: why would you?

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Speaker 4: I mean, I don't know. It doesn't seem like the

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Speaker 4: smartest bet to play ball with the government. That's that

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Speaker 4: outwardly corrupt.

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Speaker 5: Well, I mean, Google can decide that anyone has violated

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Speaker 5: whatever terms of service, right and then just say no,

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Speaker 5: you don't have access anymore.

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Speaker 4: Is there a private private company you owe it to

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Speaker 4: the Russian government to give them back their account?

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Speaker 3: Oh wait, wait wait, sorry they're a private entity shout

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Speaker 3: out alphabet. But uh but yeah, I'm curious about this

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Speaker 3: when I think a lot of us are. We know

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Speaker 3: that Google is no stranger to different pretty ambitious accusations.

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Speaker 3: Just to give you a sense of how unrealistic this

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Speaker 3: Russian fine judgment is. So we talked for about how

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Speaker 3: a billion is much larger than a million. We talked

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Speaker 3: before about a trillion is much larger than a billion.

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Speaker 3: To reach a dacillion from a trillion, you have to

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Speaker 3: multiply that trillion, buy one million, take what you've multiplied,

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Speaker 3: multiply that by another million, and then take that and

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Speaker 3: multiply that by another million.

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Speaker 4: You lost me at math ben Sorry.

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Speaker 5: One website said it was two trillion billion dollars. Your

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Speaker 5: brain goes, huh millions.

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Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, so good luck Google. We've all gotten in situations.

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Speaker 3: You're probably going to get away with this when obviously

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Speaker 3: it started with the invasion of Ukraine.

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Speaker 4: I just hope Google is going to be okay, that's yeah.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, what do we say? Thoughts and prayers, right.

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Speaker 2: And two undecillion rubles to you.

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Speaker 3: We're going to start a GoFundMe for Google, you know

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Speaker 3: what I I mean, just to make sure they're in

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Speaker 3: a good spot. We've got a bunch of other stuff

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Speaker 3: we're not going to get to. There was a great

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Speaker 3: cheese heist, not just a good cheese we've.

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Speaker 4: Spoken of cheeseist. Yeah, this is a big one. There

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Speaker 4: was some artisanal cheeses valued it in the hundreds of

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Speaker 4: thousands of pounds. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so we've got we have a story about the

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Speaker 3: great cheese spiracy. There's a very special episode on that

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Speaker 3: coming out on another show. These con artists made out

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Speaker 3: with five hundred and forty thousand dollars worth of cheddar.

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Speaker 4: That's a lot of cheddar.

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Speaker 3: That's a lot of cheddar. That's a lot of pony bones.

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Speaker 3: And maybe, just maybe, by the time you're hearing this,

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Speaker 3: elephants in Colorado will have the right to sue for

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Speaker 3: release from a zoo. What are we talking about. We'll

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Speaker 3: have to tell you later. For now, we're going to

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Speaker 3: take a moment for a word from our sponsors, and

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Speaker 3: we will return with more strange news.

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Speaker 4: And we're back with some more strange news. As I

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Speaker 4: teased at the top of the show, I come to

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Speaker 4: you bearing two Halloween themed stories, even though we are

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Speaker 4: into November already. But that's okay, it's the thought that counts.

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Speaker 4: I did not know this. We have talked about the

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Speaker 4: concept of Beggars Night. If you can actually refer back

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Speaker 4: to the stuff that, I'll want you a new episode

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Speaker 4: on the history of Halloween and Sawn and all of

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Speaker 4: that good stuff. Beggar's Night is certainly a part of

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Speaker 4: that history and that culture. The night before all hollows Eve.

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Speaker 4: What I did not know is that since nineteen thirty eight,

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Speaker 4: children in des Moines, Iowa have been celebrating that particular

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Speaker 4: night instead of proper Halloween. Nineteen thirty eight a long,

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Speaker 4: long time ago. And the reason for this is that

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Speaker 4: apparently if you talked about this in the episode too,

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Speaker 4: and I feel like we also did something about it

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Speaker 4: on Ridiculous History, But there was a lot of crime

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Speaker 4: and mischief associated with Halloween, and these I guess the

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Speaker 4: powers that be in Des Moines said the no, no, no,

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Speaker 4: We're putting a stop to these shenanigans and we're going

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Speaker 4: to have a very tightly regimented night before Halloween experienced

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Speaker 4: for children. They still can dress up in costumes, they

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Speaker 4: still can go door to door. But this idea of

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Speaker 4: the trick or the treat, you know, this exchange all

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Speaker 4: right out as the bridge devils Night, No Devil's Night. Instead,

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Speaker 4: you can when you knock on the door, you don't

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Speaker 4: even say trick or treat. You just tell a joke

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Speaker 4: or a riddle of some kind.

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Speaker 3: Okay, I love it.

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Speaker 4: It's charming, it's just absolutely delightful.

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Speaker 3: I'm sorry to interrupt. We have an example.

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Speaker 4: Uh no, I do not, but I mean any I

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Speaker 4: mean got since the nineteen thirties here, so I'm sure

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Speaker 4: the evolution of the jokes told have be a thing

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Speaker 4: to behold in and of itself. You know, yeah, what

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Speaker 4: what is it? Uh? You want to tip never leave

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Speaker 4: wax lips on the counter on a sunny day or

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Speaker 4: something like That's.

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Speaker 3: There are probably a few that didn't age as well as.

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Speaker 4: Money June's jokes. Guys, the apple guess been that is

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Speaker 4: a thing in and of itself. But then, Matt, all

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Speaker 4: of this is changing because this year, it's been a

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Speaker 4: couple of days now, the children of Fair des Moines

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Speaker 4: are getting their first trick or treat experience proper trick

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Speaker 4: or treat on the night on October the thirty first,

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Speaker 4: largely because of weather prediction that yeah, weather a bad

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Speaker 4: You'd think it would have happened by now in that

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Speaker 4: many years, you know, close to one hundred years, you know,

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Speaker 4: at least in the late eight eighty years plus since

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Speaker 4: they started this tradition, that they would have had a

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Speaker 4: rain out on Devil's Nights. I don't quite understand how

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Speaker 4: this is like such a remarkable thing that it caused

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Speaker 4: them to rethink the whole plan. But Assistant city manager

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Speaker 4: Jen Schultz said, to my knowledge, has never been moved

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Speaker 4: or canceled since it was established after Halloween in nineteen

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Speaker 4: thirty eight, which presume was a hell on Earth or

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Speaker 4: just chouldren and smashing. It was like crystal knocked, you know,

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Speaker 4: children smashing shop windows and you know, burning things or whatever.

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Speaker 4: However she goes on, the safety of our residence, families

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Speaker 4: and children is always our top priority and led to

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Speaker 4: the change in this year's scheduled Beggars Night. So, yeah,

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Speaker 4: a couple other options for your door to door interactions.

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Speaker 4: We'd be singing a song, reciting a poem, or maybe

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Speaker 4: doing a little dance some of them some other little

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Speaker 4: make a little note, we don't make any love. We'd

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Speaker 4: make no love dance, Yes, get a little tree? Yeah? Extra?

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Speaker 4: Can they do all three? The egots Beggars Night? You know,

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Speaker 4: really talented kids over there in Des Moines. So I

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Speaker 4: don't know. I just I thought that was a charming,

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Speaker 4: little halloweeny story. So moving on to the segue, which

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Speaker 4: is a little bit kind of a beefier story. And Ben,

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Speaker 4: we were talking off Mike, I think this might be

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Speaker 4: something to weave into a larger exploration. But in the

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Speaker 4: United Kingdom, in the eastern county of Lincolnshire, a Tudor

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Speaker 4: manor like the I guess that's a style also probably

435
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 4: referring to its historical provenance, you know, from the Tutor era.

436
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 4: It's not just like a style of home. This is

437
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 4: actually a home from that period in British history, was

438
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:27,400
Speaker 4: found to have many many witches marx, very large numbers

439
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:32,160
Speaker 4: of what are referred to as witch's marx. A staggering array,

440
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:36,200
Speaker 4: in fact, is what CNN reported in an article published

441
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,600
Speaker 4: by CNN's staff. The term is actually, I don't know

442
00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 4: if you're familiar with this, Ben Matt, apotropaic Marx or magic. Yeah, sure, indeed, yes,

443
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:49,360
Speaker 4: I'm sorry.

444
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:52,639
Speaker 3: I thought you were also known as magic, you know,

445
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,119
Speaker 3: but yeah, your protective magic basic one hundred percent.

446
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:57,879
Speaker 4: That's exactly right, Ben. And that's the thing that I

447
00:25:57,880 --> 00:25:59,679
Speaker 4: think is so interesting about the story is because I

448
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 4: think it's an easy go to and we think about

449
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 4: witches historically speaking, that they're like in league with Satan

450
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 4: or in league with infernal forces, and I think that

451
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:15,879
Speaker 4: is largely, you know, almost entirely a misnomer. You know,

452
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:19,439
Speaker 4: practitioners of Wicca and all that they are pagan, you know,

453
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:23,400
Speaker 4: practicing of witchcraft, not that at all. So I think

454
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,360
Speaker 4: when somebody maybe who isn't as into this stuff as

455
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:28,199
Speaker 4: maybe we are, would see this, they would say, oh,

456
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:29,840
Speaker 4: it's going to be like all kinds of six six

457
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:32,879
Speaker 4: sixes and you know, devils of horns and you know

458
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 4: bapha met type things. Not the case. It's really fascinating

459
00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:42,639
Speaker 4: the kinds of things that were found. The English Heritage Society,

460
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 4: I guess, released a statement on this, referring to around

461
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:51,360
Speaker 4: twenty carvings discovered by Rick Berry, an English Heritage volunteer

462
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,719
Speaker 4: who spent two years at this property mapping all of

463
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:59,400
Speaker 4: these designs, and they include lots of different things. One

464
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,760
Speaker 4: particular design is known as a hexafoil, which is a

465
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 4: circular kind of design that is meant to have a

466
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 4: six pedal kind of flower array in the middle. However,

467
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 4: it appears that this particular design wasn't like finished, and

468
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:19,360
Speaker 4: the one theory is that they it may have been

469
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 4: beyond the skill of the carver. From that means because

470
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:27,399
Speaker 4: these are etched into you know, very stone surfaces another symbol.

471
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:29,760
Speaker 4: I think this was really interesting to all of us

472
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:32,400
Speaker 4: when we were talking about it. Off Mike, was this

473
00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 4: array of overlapping these known as Mary and Marx, which

474
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 4: are believed to be a call for protection from the

475
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 4: Virgin Mary, as well as a pentangle which I think

476
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 4: many folks would would be more familiar with, which is

477
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 4: design to protect against evil or intended to protect against evil.

478
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 4: But guys, it kind of blew my mind a little bit.

479
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:57,679
Speaker 4: The idea of this intersection of something like Catholicism or

480
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:03,119
Speaker 4: Protestantism or whatever into these clearly more like pagan type practices.

481
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,400
Speaker 3: Is this religious syncreties that's right? Yeah, and also protection

482
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 3: of the Virgin Mary from by yeah, like.

483
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 4: Protection from against her. It is calling on her to

484
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 4: protect them, so asking her for her protection, but.

485
00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:19,639
Speaker 3: For an intercession.

486
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 4: When you say religious sncretism, then what do you mean.

487
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,639
Speaker 3: Oh, this is something that's I think quite fascinating to

488
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 3: all of us, and we've explored this in previous evenings.

489
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 3: Religion as technology. We don't mean that in offensive way.

490
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,679
Speaker 3: We mean that in a very academic way. So let's

491
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 3: say you are a missionary back in the fourteen hundreds

492
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 3: or the fifteen hundreds. You roll into a brand new

493
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 3: land and you see they already have their own rich

494
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 3: ancient millennia old tradition of spiritual beliefs. You don't tell

495
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 3: them they're wrong. You tell them they have been doing

496
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 3: what you told them about earlier. It's just using different names.

497
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 4: I'm familiar with the concept of religious secretism, I didn't

498
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 4: quite understand how it applied here. I totally get it now.

499
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 4: This virgin Mary stuff may well have been a product

500
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:12,040
Speaker 4: of whatever this individual was exposed to that maybe converged

501
00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 4: their pagan beliefs with something more resembling Christianity.

502
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:18,280
Speaker 3: Right, one hundred percent nailed it.

503
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 4: Another thing that I found super fascinating came from Kevin Booth,

504
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 4: the head of Collections at English Heritage, who said, in

505
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:26,960
Speaker 4: the statement quote it is astonishing that centuries on the

506
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 4: amazing old buildings in our care still have secrets way

507
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 4: to be discovered. So English Heritage is a foundation that

508
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:36,080
Speaker 4: deals with like protects and preserves, maybe even restores some

509
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 4: of these old buildings and homes and manors or whatever,

510
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 4: of which England is absolutely lousy with. Egos on the

511
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,080
Speaker 4: Old Hall as it's referred to, has undoubtedly had a

512
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:49,000
Speaker 4: tumultuous pass, not least under the ownership of the apparently

513
00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 4: unpopular William Hickman. But why it's the scene of quite

514
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,960
Speaker 4: such a high concentration of protective carvings remains a mystery.

515
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 4: That William Hickman that he's referring to appears to have

516
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 4: been curt by one of these marks. This is the

517
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 4: one sort of more infernal, though maybe the guy had

518
00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 4: it coming, it would seem so kind of markings of

519
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 4: the bunch. He owned the property from fifteen ninety six.

520
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 4: His name was found written upside down, and in the

521
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 4: release they mentioned that these types of marks were likely

522
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 4: made to curse an individual. The idea of defacing someone's

523
00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 4: name widely believed as a means of cursing, though this

524
00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 4: practice was much more common with Roman and Anglo Saxons

525
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 4: rather than the era that the English heritage property sort

526
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 4: of encompass. And I guess that makes sense if anyone's

527
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:42,600
Speaker 4: seen Rome the HBO series, there are some instances of

528
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:47,320
Speaker 4: cursing where like they will scrawl over somebody's name very

529
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 4: violently or whatever kind of shred their name, which is

530
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:53,560
Speaker 4: like almost the kind of thing you associate with a

531
00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 4: voodoo doll or one of the puppets, you know, one

532
00:30:56,640 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 4: of those kind of stand in you know, effigies that

533
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 4: you're hurting the individual that it's associated with.

534
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is and I love that you. I love

535
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 3: that you open at the front with apotropaic magic because

536
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,960
Speaker 3: this dates back so far, you know, and the religious

537
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 3: syncretism is fascinating. I almost said awesome, but I love

538
00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:22,239
Speaker 3: that you're pointing out too. When the folks discovered this

539
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:27,040
Speaker 3: at Gainsborough Old Hole, they they literally did find this

540
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 3: guy's name written upside down, which was a really bad

541
00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:32,200
Speaker 3: thing to do to people.

542
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:34,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, I never said, I just I do think again,

543
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 4: with the religious syncretism stuff like this was something that

544
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:42,160
Speaker 4: was more prevalent in Roman traditions. So there's that kind

545
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 4: of crossing the streams, I guess, for lack of a

546
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,480
Speaker 4: better way of describing it, kind of situation here. You know,

547
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 4: these types of marks have been found, you know, over

548
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 4: the years all over England. In fact, in twenty nineteen

549
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,040
Speaker 4: the article points out as well, I think we also

550
00:31:57,080 --> 00:32:00,680
Speaker 4: discussed this in a cave system in the East Midlands

551
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 4: of central England. Hundreds of these apotropaic marks were found

552
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,240
Speaker 4: and they continue to be found in houses built between

553
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 4: fifteen fifty and seventeen fifty and as well as in

554
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:15,880
Speaker 4: churches and homes, cave systems, like we said, you know,

555
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:19,520
Speaker 4: all kinds of different places in the UK to ward

556
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 4: off sickness, death or things like poor harvests.

557
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 3: So he's fascinating.

558
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:26,040
Speaker 4: It's really cool. Yeah, I thought I thought it was.

559
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 3: That's fascinating because that also the time frame you correct

560
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:31,640
Speaker 3: me if I'm off base here. The time frame you're

561
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:36,240
Speaker 3: describing there goes past the Tudor period. That's definitely know

562
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 3: what precedes it. But I think the Tutor period was

563
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:41,880
Speaker 3: fourteen eighty five to sixteen hundred.

564
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 4: I'll take your word for it. Beat sure, you're right. Yeah,

565
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:46,960
Speaker 4: I don't no, No, that does seem to be correct

566
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,920
Speaker 4: in terms of like the how there was a little

567
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 4: bit of a disconnect between those periods.

568
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 3: So we got to get some witch marks. Go in here.

569
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,160
Speaker 3: What if we go to the office, because we're heading

570
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,560
Speaker 3: to the office later in a few weeks, what if

571
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 3: we start putting down some witch marks, you guys, just

572
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:05,360
Speaker 3: to be safe, right, the original alarm system.

573
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 4: Come on, Matt, you got this. You be the leader

574
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:09,440
Speaker 4: of the witch mark initiative.

575
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,320
Speaker 5: I mean, yeah, I'm down. I'm down for spiritual protection

576
00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 5: like that. Yeah, let's do it. Just who knows what

577
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 5: you're protecting against. Maybe it's the thing that brings in

578
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 5: the money. I'm just saying why, Like, it makes me wonder,

579
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:27,800
Speaker 5: this is a praise. This is a hugeous state, right yes, hall,

580
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,080
Speaker 5: there's a lot of money that flowed in and out

581
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 5: of this thing. There are some powerful people that resided

582
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 5: within it, and a lot of people who worked for

583
00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 5: let's let's put that in quotations, worked for the people

584
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:41,720
Speaker 5: that were there that were powerful. It does make me

585
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:46,640
Speaker 5: wonder if there is specific protection against you know, the

586
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 5: owners of this place with a guy's name written on

587
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:51,480
Speaker 5: there and everything. It does make you wonder if you

588
00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 5: know they're they're in need of spiritual protection against somebody

589
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:57,280
Speaker 5: for some specific spiritual reason.

590
00:33:57,760 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 4: Well, and it gets even more kind of like present

591
00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:02,200
Speaker 4: in a fun way when little detail I left out

592
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 4: is they also found around one hundred small burn marks,

593
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:08,360
Speaker 4: which were thought to be another type of protection against

594
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:12,319
Speaker 4: fire like property damage. So this place seemed to be

595
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,799
Speaker 4: have all its bases covered in terms of like spiritual

596
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 4: uh you know, protection.

597
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:20,799
Speaker 3: Sympathetic magic right like calls to like, well that would

598
00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:23,479
Speaker 3: make sense because then burning something, well, all right, we're

599
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:24,640
Speaker 3: not the magician.

600
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 4: No, no, no, we are about the Dreamership Dreams.

601
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 5: The infinite money glitch that we discussed with the boys

602
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 5: over there for my mama told me, well, it's begun.

603
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 5: JP Morgan Chase is officially suing everybody.

604
00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:44,840
Speaker 2: That attempted this glitch.

605
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:46,879
Speaker 3: No way.

606
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:50,879
Speaker 5: Yeah, I know it's crazy, but you know, as as

607
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 5: cynical as a lot of the story is, it's just

608
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:56,520
Speaker 5: it's what's happening now. There were several people that attempted

609
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:58,560
Speaker 5: to get a lot more money than others via this

610
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:02,200
Speaker 5: you know, check fraud lash infinite money glitch. One case

611
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 5: in Houston involved a person who deposited a counterfeit check

612
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,400
Speaker 5: for three hundred and thirty five thousand dollars and then

613
00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 5: immediately the person who owned the bank account that false

614
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:15,239
Speaker 5: check was inserted into via the ATM went inside and

615
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 5: got out two hundred and ninety thousand dollars.

616
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 4: And uh, just a plan, I mean, yeah, yeah, what

617
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:22,520
Speaker 4: could go wrong?

618
00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:27,640
Speaker 3: You know, this guy should write crime novels on it, right, right.

619
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:30,120
Speaker 4: I mean, are a real evil genius type figure.

620
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,000
Speaker 5: Well, gay, it's what we talked about on the show,

621
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,319
Speaker 5: And go listen to the episode we did with those

622
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:39,400
Speaker 5: guys from my mom and told me. But some people

623
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,799
Speaker 5: got out eighty thousand dollars, another person got out one

624
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:45,360
Speaker 5: hundred and forty one thousand dollars. Several people only took out,

625
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,759
Speaker 5: you know, a couple thousand, couple ten thousand, maybe not

626
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 5: that much, but it doesn't matter to JP Morgan Chase.

627
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 5: They've got everybody's accounts that you know, committed check fraud.

628
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,360
Speaker 5: They know who these people are. In order to have

629
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 5: an account, you have to submit all your info. So

630
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:04,080
Speaker 5: they're coming after everybody. And they're not just asking for

631
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 5: the amount of money that was stolen from the bank

632
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:11,440
Speaker 5: via check fraud. They're asking for damages, lawyers fees, interest,

633
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:13,959
Speaker 5: overdraft fees, all kinds.

634
00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,680
Speaker 4: You imagine the overdraft fees if they calculated like what

635
00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:18,960
Speaker 4: your actual ballance should have been versus how much you

636
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 4: quote unquote took out, you know, overdrafted.

637
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:24,600
Speaker 3: Those are already a grip. And now now the blood's

638
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 3: in the water, so the sharks come to swim.

639
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:28,360
Speaker 2: Right yep, yep, yep.

640
00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:32,080
Speaker 5: And just one little note here from CNBC, you can

641
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 5: go check out this article written by Hugh Soon on

642
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 5: October twenty eighth, twenty twenty four, title JP Morgan begins

643
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,360
Speaker 5: suing customers who allegedly stole thousands of dollars in infinite

644
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:45,120
Speaker 5: money glitch, according to Hugh, who wrote it. He says

645
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:48,280
Speaker 5: despite the waning use of paper checks as digital forms

646
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:52,040
Speaker 5: of payment gained popularity, there's still a major avenue for fraud,

647
00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:55,799
Speaker 5: resulting in I couldn't believe this, you guys, twenty six

648
00:36:55,840 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 5: point six billion dollars in losses globally last year, twenty

649
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:04,200
Speaker 5: six point six billion dollars in check fraud. I just

650
00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:06,319
Speaker 5: I can't believe that's still that much of a thing.

651
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 4: What are they not considered breakage you know in the

652
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:12,359
Speaker 4: industry or shrinkage and what I just mean in terms of,

653
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:14,279
Speaker 4: like it's the cost of doing it. If that's the

654
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:17,040
Speaker 4: cost of doing business, and it wasn't enough for them

655
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 4: to completely overhaul the check system, can you imagine the

656
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 4: amount of money we're talking about be a bigger picture,

657
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 4: you know, like how much money is moving around in

658
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:27,000
Speaker 4: these institutions originals?

659
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,120
Speaker 5: I know, especially if you think back to the TD

660
00:37:30,239 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 5: Bank thing we just talked about, with some banks just

661
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:35,839
Speaker 5: having to at some point or deciding to, let's say,

662
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 5: throw in the towel when it comes to checking out

663
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 5: what their you know, customers are doing and what they're

664
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:42,279
Speaker 5: doing with their money.

665
00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:43,760
Speaker 2: I don't know, weird stuff.

666
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 5: Just to stay on the money tip, guys, let's go

667
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:50,800
Speaker 5: to a report that comes out of Australia that I

668
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,360
Speaker 5: don't know, I think we find particularly charming. We've discussed

669
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 5: it before on the show here, guys, but Bluey the

670
00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 5: show Blueye, I think might be one of my favorite

671
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:01,440
Speaker 5: ourtoons that's ever been created.

672
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 2: Have you guys? Did we talk about that before?

673
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 4: I haven't seen a moment of it. I know it's

674
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:06,240
Speaker 4: much beloved though.

675
00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 2: Oh okay you mentioned it.

676
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:09,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we've mentioned in the past.

677
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 5: Yeah, okay, well it's it's just fantastic.

678
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:13,640
Speaker 2: I don't care who you are.

679
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 5: Anytime you can make a show that my son, you know,

680
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:20,759
Speaker 5: who isn't even ten yet loves and will make me

681
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,840
Speaker 5: tear up during the episode, you're doing something right. So

682
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:26,520
Speaker 5: here's the story coming to us via BBC News and

683
00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:27,759
Speaker 5: Simon Atkinson.

684
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:29,000
Speaker 2: You can look it up.

685
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:33,919
Speaker 5: It's titled Police recover more than forty thousand stolen Bluey Coins.

686
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 2: What what it's like?

687
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 4: A crypto scam? What are we talking to you?

688
00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 5: Okay, right, that's what it sounds like on the surface

689
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:42,400
Speaker 5: is what I thought too, But no, we're talking actual

690
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 5: coins that were produced by the Australian Mint. It was

691
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:49,319
Speaker 5: reported back in July that sixty three thousand coins had

692
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:51,919
Speaker 5: been stolen from a warehouse where they were hanging out

693
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:55,359
Speaker 5: in western Sydney. They were about to enter circulation when

694
00:38:55,360 --> 00:39:00,400
Speaker 5: they were stolen. But now authorities recovered over forty thousand

695
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:03,440
Speaker 5: of these individual coins after a raid on a property

696
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:06,840
Speaker 5: that was, like, guys, like six miles ten kilometers from

697
00:39:06,920 --> 00:39:10,239
Speaker 5: where these coins were stored at that warehouse. When they

698
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:11,799
Speaker 5: picked them up, they found that.

699
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 2: There are three people.

700
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:15,959
Speaker 5: The person that this report is talking about is somebody

701
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:19,400
Speaker 5: who was allegedly the getaway driver for a three person team,

702
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:22,280
Speaker 5: somebody who worked inside at the warehouse, somebody who assisted,

703
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 5: and then this new person who was the getaway driver.

704
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:28,120
Speaker 5: But either way they had these coins. It's only it

705
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 5: was only like five or six bags of coins, right,

706
00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:31,800
Speaker 5: it's not that many.

707
00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:34,320
Speaker 3: Do we know the denomination of the coins?

708
00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:36,480
Speaker 5: I don't know the denomination. I know that they are

709
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,240
Speaker 5: valued at around one Australian dollar, which is about point

710
00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:43,759
Speaker 5: sixty five US dollars, right about fifty pence.

711
00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 3: So they're kind of like a dollar.

712
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:50,040
Speaker 5: Yes, coin, but they're being sold online for like ten

713
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 5: times that, so like ten Australian dollars right per one coin.

714
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 3: So that establishes profit.

715
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:59,080
Speaker 5: There is value to them if you could turn them around,

716
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:01,640
Speaker 5: but it appears that these folks at least were unable

717
00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 5: to turn around many. Right they there were sixty three

718
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 5: thousand stolen in all, there were still forty thousand coins around.

719
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:12,520
Speaker 2: I guess when they were found. I don't know.

720
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 5: I think it's super cute. They're gold colored coins known

721
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 5: as Bluey dollar bucks because that is the currency that

722
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 5: that's how currency is referred to in the world of Bluey,

723
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:23,040
Speaker 5: and it's adorable.

724
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 4: This is like a commemorative thing because Bluey's so beloved

725
00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:30,200
Speaker 4: in Australia that they just decided to like do these

726
00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:32,920
Speaker 4: special edition coins and actually put them in circulation.

727
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 2: Yes, like the old.

728
00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 3: Made for TV commercials where you get the branded stuff

729
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:38,879
Speaker 3: from the US Federal Mint.

730
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:41,040
Speaker 4: That's right. But who got a whole had? Was this

731
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 4: a mint worker?

732
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 3: Like?

733
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:43,399
Speaker 4: How? Yeah?

734
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 5: It was somebody who was somebody who was on in

735
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 5: the inside I who found out where they were being

736
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:50,839
Speaker 5: stored and got access to them and then got them

737
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 5: to another person who then like basically took them to

738
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 5: a getaway car and they escaped, at least according to

739
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,799
Speaker 5: this BBC News article. But the reason why they even

740
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:03,040
Speaker 5: meant at these coins, Guys, when we're thinking about the

741
00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 5: number of people you need to either go to the

742
00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 5: theaters to watch a movie, to turn on Netflix and

743
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 5: stream a movie, to download a podcast, to watch a

744
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,480
Speaker 5: YouTube video, the threshold you need to reach for something

745
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 5: to be considered a hit has changed so much, right.

746
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:26,440
Speaker 3: As a successful piece of show or content, not as

747
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 3: in a successful hit defined as a crime.

748
00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:31,960
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, a successful hit. Different thing.

749
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 5: The bar is lower though, right, The bar is so

750
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:39,319
Speaker 5: much lower than it ever has been because there are

751
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:40,879
Speaker 5: so many places to watch things.

752
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:42,520
Speaker 2: There's so many things to watch.

753
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:44,880
Speaker 5: Now you've just got to get a tiny little slice

754
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 5: of the pie. And you know, advertisers and you know

755
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 5: moneybackers say.

756
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:51,440
Speaker 2: Well, dang, great job, you did it.

757
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 3: Well.

758
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:54,520
Speaker 5: Just listen to these numbers from the VBC about Bluey.

759
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:58,600
Speaker 5: It was streamed for more than twenty billion minutes on

760
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 5: Disney Plus in I just the United States last year.

761
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 3: Well on their way to a dacilion.

762
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 2: There you go.

763
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,560
Speaker 5: But yeah, it's incredible. What are the top ten streaming

764
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 5: programs like in the United States, if you're measuring by

765
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 5: minutes fewed and it's just I don't know, I'm excited

766
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:18,239
Speaker 5: about that. I'm sad the coins got stolen. I'm glad

767
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:22,800
Speaker 5: they're now returned. Those Bandit Bucks, blue Eye dollar Bucks. Okay,

768
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:27,680
Speaker 5: last story for me, guys. Google is developing something that

769
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 5: they're calling a Computer using Agent. Now, we have talked

770
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:36,480
Speaker 5: a lot about language learning models, about very specific uses

771
00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:40,520
Speaker 5: of what is again, as we always say, called AI,

772
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:43,600
Speaker 5: but isn't necessarily AI, isn't exactly AI, but it is

773
00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:47,759
Speaker 5: using language learning models computer learning technology to where you

774
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:53,280
Speaker 5: can basically have a program that can somewhat think.

775
00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:55,120
Speaker 2: For itself, work on in its own way.

776
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,880
Speaker 5: You pose it a question, you give it parameters, and

777
00:42:57,920 --> 00:43:01,239
Speaker 5: it can spit back out answers that are extremely complicated

778
00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:02,360
Speaker 5: analyzing a ton.

779
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 2: Of different data.

780
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 5: This new thing that Google is rolling out, a Computer

781
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:11,279
Speaker 5: using Agent, is very different. It is specifically a thing

782
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:15,279
Speaker 5: that can actually exist on your computer as an application

783
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:19,320
Speaker 5: and then go on Chrome or you know, Safari, whatever

784
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 5: you're using, and use the browser and basically perform research

785
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:29,560
Speaker 5: from that browser. Can do things like enter text in

786
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 5: the browser. It can analyze the buttons, the clickable buttons

787
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:36,759
Speaker 5: that exist inside a frame, inside an entire website, that

788
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:39,480
Speaker 5: it would be scrollable if like, if you were using it,

789
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:41,319
Speaker 5: you would have to scroll up and down. But this

790
00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 5: thing just analyzes everything that's on the website.

791
00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:44,480
Speaker 2: It can just.

792
00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 5: Look at the screen and analyze everything that's on the screen,

793
00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 5: including all the windows you have open. It's got some

794
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:56,200
Speaker 5: incredible potential right to where you could instead of saying hey,

795
00:43:56,840 --> 00:44:02,759
Speaker 5: chat GPT or whatever, find me the top twelve examples

796
00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:08,279
Speaker 5: of times X said X or whatever, you can say, hey,

797
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:11,919
Speaker 5: but get me some tickets for this concert I really want.

798
00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 5: When I think you'd say, like tickets come out tomorrow

799
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:17,799
Speaker 5: at ten am or something like that.

800
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:20,480
Speaker 4: So it could compete with the scalp robots. Then that

801
00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:21,600
Speaker 4: could be a positive thing.

802
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:23,160
Speaker 3: That's a potential application.

803
00:44:23,239 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 2: That's one.

804
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 5: That's one tiny application, right, I mean there's so many

805
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 5: different things. Imagine a thing that you could perform on

806
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,319
Speaker 5: your computer via a browser, and you could ask this

807
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 5: new thing to do that, and you know there would

808
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:37,440
Speaker 5: be varying results on whether or not it works right

809
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:39,719
Speaker 5: or how well it worked at least for a long time.

810
00:44:39,800 --> 00:44:42,720
Speaker 5: As something like this is first unveiled and then gets

811
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:47,360
Speaker 5: refined over you know, thousands, if not millions of uses.

812
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 2: It's very very strange.

813
00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 5: By the way, Google's not the only people doing it,

814
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 5: and we haven't even said what it is yet. Google's

815
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:56,839
Speaker 5: calling this project Jarvis. That's at least the code name.

816
00:44:56,880 --> 00:44:58,480
Speaker 5: It'll be something else when.

817
00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:01,759
Speaker 4: It's a pay fail that trade, isn't that IP? Isn't

818
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:04,720
Speaker 4: that Marvel? Is the name of like giron Man's computer.

819
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:07,640
Speaker 3: You can't you can't copyright a name that's that's but

820
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 3: it is it is. I would argue the idea of

821
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:17,279
Speaker 3: referencing a typical Butler name does conjure shadows of its predecessor,

822
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 3: ask Jeeves.

823
00:45:18,920 --> 00:45:21,040
Speaker 2: Yes, there you go, There you go.

824
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 5: And there are other things like this that are already

825
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:29,200
Speaker 5: coming out but aren't necessarily out yet in functioning word

826
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:31,880
Speaker 5: the way they're supposed to. There's this thing you can find.

827
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:36,359
Speaker 5: It's a company called Rabbit and you can find this.

828
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:39,439
Speaker 5: I found it on tech Crunch. But they've got a

829
00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:43,400
Speaker 5: web based quote large action model that just came out

830
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:46,360
Speaker 5: in October this year, twenty twenty four, and it is

831
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:49,399
Speaker 5: an actual piece of hardware that you connect up, then

832
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:53,600
Speaker 5: goes through and uses web browsers theoretically to do things

833
00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:57,080
Speaker 5: like analyze what it sees on a screen, including the buttons,

834
00:45:57,080 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 5: the fields, images, and it doesn't matter where they are,

835
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,840
Speaker 5: and then it can interact with whatever elements it needs

836
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:06,359
Speaker 5: to to perform whatever task it's been given. But it's

837
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:09,759
Speaker 5: not really functioning the way it said on the tin

838
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 5: I guess originally.

839
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:15,160
Speaker 3: And to interject it to that earlier point about more

840
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 3: players being in the game, didn't a company called Anthropic

841
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:23,319
Speaker 3: YEP do something? Yeah, can you tell us about that?

842
00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:27,000
Speaker 5: I think that's Claude At least that was something that

843
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:28,800
Speaker 5: came out a while back. It was in a beta

844
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:33,080
Speaker 5: form and it wasn't wasn't really again, like these things

845
00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:35,080
Speaker 5: have a ton of errors in them because they're just

846
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:37,280
Speaker 5: being introduced and they have to be tested and tested

847
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 5: and tested and tested and basically run through a gambit

848
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 5: before they learn, you know, and get updated like how

849
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:44,520
Speaker 5: to better do things.

850
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:47,040
Speaker 4: Well, that's all emergent stuff. I mean, it's not going

851
00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:48,919
Speaker 4: to get it like perfect on the first go round,

852
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 4: but I did. There was a comment on the Verge

853
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:54,600
Speaker 4: piece from a user Frederick at VDZ. He said, how

854
00:46:54,640 --> 00:46:56,759
Speaker 4: about spending all that time and effort to make a

855
00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:59,799
Speaker 4: computer more user friendly, instead of spending a climate alter

856
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:02,360
Speaker 4: amount of energy and the GDP of a medium sized

857
00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 4: country to make a half assed automating protocol that will

858
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:09,120
Speaker 4: only kind of do a task correctly. Sometimes, yeah, I.

859
00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:11,479
Speaker 2: Mean it would stink if you were banking on this thing.

860
00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 2: I don't know.

861
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:17,919
Speaker 5: Let's say oasis tickets, see well, or developing. Let's say

862
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:21,799
Speaker 5: a schedule for you when you're gonna go visit Scotland

863
00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:24,200
Speaker 5: or something, right, and it's like, find me the coolest

864
00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:26,520
Speaker 5: stuff to do in Scotland and build an itinerary for

865
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:29,600
Speaker 5: me or something like that. That could be a huge help,

866
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:32,560
Speaker 5: a huge time saver, and it might discover things that

867
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:35,400
Speaker 5: you would never find on your own. But what if

868
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 5: it's just terrible?

869
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 3: Another example, what if you are a PhD candidate and

870
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:47,719
Speaker 3: you take a jin shortcut or attempt to when conducting

871
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:51,880
Speaker 3: some very serious research, and then you get referred to

872
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:57,359
Speaker 3: things that do not exist or are misinterpreted. I mean

873
00:47:57,400 --> 00:48:02,439
Speaker 3: there are real world consequence to this, and we also see,

874
00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:06,759
Speaker 3: I mean, we see again the inherent flaws of these

875
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:11,080
Speaker 3: large language models or excuse me, large action models. Excellent

876
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:12,480
Speaker 3: marketing there, guys.

877
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:15,839
Speaker 4: You're right, Ben, they talk about it like it's a thing,

878
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 4: but it's they made it up. That's it is rebranding.

879
00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:22,880
Speaker 3: They manifested it right, and so we we see the

880
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:28,359
Speaker 3: supernatural increasingly becoming real. But I had heard that. I'd

881
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:33,680
Speaker 3: heard that originally, Google itself refused to comment on Jarvis

882
00:48:33,760 --> 00:48:36,560
Speaker 3: for a while. It was an internal thing, and someone

883
00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:40,319
Speaker 3: and correct me if I'm wrong here. Someone asked Googles

884
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:46,239
Speaker 3: god it the phrase ai Google's Gemini assistant about Jarvis,

885
00:48:47,040 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 3: and then Gemini made.

886
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:52,800
Speaker 4: A statement, Wow, well, I prefer his work with pulp.

887
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:56,839
Speaker 4: I didn't like his solo stuff so much music nerd joke.

888
00:48:57,400 --> 00:49:00,000
Speaker 3: It's like when you ask chat GPT how to come

889
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:02,319
Speaker 3: made a crime by phrasing it as though you're in

890
00:49:02,360 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 3: a Dungeons and Dragons sary.

891
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:05,799
Speaker 4: What a great work around that was. That was a

892
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:06,800
Speaker 4: fun story, dude.

893
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 5: Well, so this all gives me to the final story

894
00:49:09,080 --> 00:49:10,560
Speaker 5: I wanted to talk to you guys about because it's

895
00:49:10,560 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 5: related directly to this.

896
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 2: Somebody came out in the AP News.

897
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:19,800
Speaker 5: About how AI powered transcription services that are being rolled

898
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:23,920
Speaker 5: out in hospitals and emergency care facilities across the planet

899
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:25,600
Speaker 5: are malfunctioning.

900
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:28,320
Speaker 3: Yes, those conditions do not exist.

901
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:31,200
Speaker 5: Well, yeah, so let's just get into the positive. Theoretically,

902
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:34,040
Speaker 5: Let's say you're sitting there talking with your doctor, rather

903
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:36,200
Speaker 5: than your doctor having to scribble down notes as quickly

904
00:49:36,239 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 5: as possible just to understand exactly what you're going through

905
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:43,120
Speaker 5: in ways that you can be helped. This language learning thing,

906
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:47,160
Speaker 5: this AI powered transcription tool is listening and it's taken

907
00:49:47,239 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 5: notes and getting specifics. It can even prout well, I

908
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 5: don't know exactly, but I imagine you could easily have

909
00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 5: like recommendations, right, based off of previous diagnoses, based off

910
00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:01,880
Speaker 5: of previous medicine that were prescribed, based off of previous

911
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:04,520
Speaker 5: preventive things that could be prescribed. It could give you

912
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:07,040
Speaker 5: all that stuff based on what is recording. But what

913
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 5: it's doing not all the time, but sometimes this transcription

914
00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:15,719
Speaker 5: tool is inventing stuff that nobody discussed in the room

915
00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:17,960
Speaker 5: or during that hospital visit, during.

916
00:50:17,800 --> 00:50:19,760
Speaker 4: That hallucination, right, isn't that AI?

917
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:25,200
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's pumping out hallucinations and fabricating things that they

918
00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:28,399
Speaker 5: could be really bad espec Like, imagine if you're going

919
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:30,879
Speaker 5: in for a consultation that involves a surgery or something

920
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:34,120
Speaker 5: where you're gonna you know, be cut open or put

921
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:37,239
Speaker 5: under for and it hallucinates something that then just gets

922
00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:40,600
Speaker 5: put into the record, and as the medical team is

923
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:43,480
Speaker 5: going through and attempting to analyze everything and understand what's

924
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,399
Speaker 5: happening in the next couple of weeks, there's this new

925
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:50,759
Speaker 5: thing that's there that ends up getting your pancreas messed with,

926
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:52,080
Speaker 5: and it shouldn't have been touched.

927
00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:55,200
Speaker 4: I don't know, remember some of those those Google AI

928
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 4: search results that were so embarrassing, like it's okay to

929
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:03,840
Speaker 4: eat eight rocks, or like a good alternative for gluten

930
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:06,600
Speaker 4: is Elmer's glue, you know, like things like that. That's

931
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:08,239
Speaker 4: the kind of stuff we're talking about here.

932
00:51:08,320 --> 00:51:12,960
Speaker 3: It's wild. Yeah, we said the name of this transcription tool.

933
00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:15,960
Speaker 5: Yet, well it's it's from open ai. It's called Whisper

934
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:18,279
Speaker 5: whisp e er whisper.

935
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:21,359
Speaker 3: And since these things don't occur in a vacuum, it's

936
00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:25,280
Speaker 3: also interesting I would pause it to see how many

937
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:30,319
Speaker 3: people have left open ai due to internal conflicts that

938
00:51:30,360 --> 00:51:35,040
Speaker 3: are still largely black boxed from the public. Mm hmmm,

939
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:40,640
Speaker 3: due to NDAs. Because legislation, NDAs do not apply if

940
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:44,759
Speaker 3: they concern the commission of a crime. However, the legislation

941
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:51,280
Speaker 3: has not codified what could count as LM crime here.

942
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 3: You know, it'll be very interesting to see who is

943
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:57,520
Speaker 3: left holding the bag of badgers when someone dies as

944
00:51:57,520 --> 00:52:00,960
Speaker 3: a result of these hallucinations in the metal field. At

945
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:01,919
Speaker 3: least that's my take.

946
00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:04,319
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's super dangerous. If you go to the AP

947
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:08,239
Speaker 5: article titled Researchers say an AI power transcription tool used

948
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:11,120
Speaker 5: in hospitals invents things no one ever said, you will

949
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:16,200
Speaker 5: read that several people who are working with this, Several engineers.

950
00:52:17,040 --> 00:52:18,719
Speaker 2: Discovered some things. Here you go.

951
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:22,040
Speaker 5: A University of Michigan researcher conducting a study of public meetings,

952
00:52:22,080 --> 00:52:25,200
Speaker 5: for example, set he found hallucinations in eight out of

953
00:52:25,239 --> 00:52:29,120
Speaker 5: every ten transcriptions he inspected. Then he tried to improve

954
00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:32,080
Speaker 5: the model. A machine learning engineer said he initially discovered

955
00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:35,240
Speaker 5: hallucinations in about half of the over one hundred hours

956
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:39,000
Speaker 5: of Whisper transcriptions he analyzed, and a third developer said

957
00:52:39,040 --> 00:52:42,360
Speaker 5: he found hallucinations in nearly every one of the twenty

958
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:45,240
Speaker 5: six thousand transcripts he created with Whisper.

959
00:52:45,600 --> 00:52:48,840
Speaker 4: Isn't it fascinating that these hallucinations just seemed to be

960
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:54,359
Speaker 4: kind of an organic byproduct of this technology, Like I

961
00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:57,040
Speaker 4: don't fully understand it, do you guys? Like, is it

962
00:52:57,120 --> 00:52:59,880
Speaker 4: just it's a failing clearly, But it also seems to

963
00:52:59,880 --> 00:53:04,359
Speaker 4: have happened across various versions of these llms, Like what

964
00:53:04,520 --> 00:53:06,160
Speaker 4: is the deal? Why are they doing this?

965
00:53:06,239 --> 00:53:09,040
Speaker 3: Two mirrors facing each other, They're just quoting each other.

966
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:12,040
Speaker 3: There's not a lot of original analysis.

967
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:14,920
Speaker 4: But wouldn't a hallucination kind of be original? But yeah,

968
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:16,640
Speaker 4: completely inappropriate.

969
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:20,560
Speaker 3: Maybe hallucination. Maybe we're hanging too much on that word.

970
00:53:21,040 --> 00:53:22,640
Speaker 3: Maybe a better way to put it. And this is

971
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:24,600
Speaker 3: just my opinion. I'm not an expert. Is to say

972
00:53:25,000 --> 00:53:28,320
Speaker 3: not caep be short, but to say hallucination is better

973
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:34,120
Speaker 3: defined as putting a thing in the wrong spot. So

974
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:38,640
Speaker 3: this hallucination, no one's saying, you know, this patient all

975
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:42,480
Speaker 3: of a sudden became a dragon. What they're like out

976
00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:45,760
Speaker 3: a whole cloth. They're reading or pulling from some other source,

977
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:49,000
Speaker 3: and something about the commonality between the sources they're cripping

978
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:52,239
Speaker 3: made them think the other thing was applicable in this

979
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 3: context when it was not.

980
00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:57,319
Speaker 4: I think that's a great description that makes sense to me.

981
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:01,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, it reminds me a lot of the predictive text

982
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 5: thing that has arrived you know, on everybody's cell phones

983
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:09,759
Speaker 5: on and gotten everybody's it has gotten better, and sometimes

984
00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:14,400
Speaker 5: it's really good about predicting what your next entire sentence

985
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:16,560
Speaker 5: is going to be, or re least thought right or

986
00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:18,640
Speaker 5: phrase as you're beginning to type something.

987
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:23,080
Speaker 2: I think it's applying that and attempting.

988
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:26,080
Speaker 5: To basically not see the future of what's being said,

989
00:54:26,080 --> 00:54:28,279
Speaker 5: but just get ahead of it, to stay far enough

990
00:54:28,320 --> 00:54:29,839
Speaker 5: ahead on the scroll of.

991
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:32,400
Speaker 2: What's being said that it's not missing anything.

992
00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:35,360
Speaker 4: But if it makes a wrong assumption and then moves

993
00:54:35,400 --> 00:54:38,640
Speaker 4: forward from that point on, everything else is based on

994
00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:41,960
Speaker 4: this wrong assumption, right, Maybe I don't know, that's just

995
00:54:41,960 --> 00:54:44,239
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I'm trying to describe it in Layman's terms.

996
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:45,960
Speaker 4: That makes sense to me. I think I think I

997
00:54:45,960 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 4: can wrap my head around that.

998
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:51,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, weird stuff, weird weird stuff. But that's all

999
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:52,000
Speaker 2: for me, guys.

1000
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:56,520
Speaker 3: And we will be returning later this week. Find us

1001
00:54:56,560 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 3: at an evening or a pair of headphones near you. Folks,

1002
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:03,560
Speaker 3: thanks so much for joining us in tonight's strange news program.

1003
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:06,360
Speaker 3: We can't wait for you to join the show. And

1004
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:09,120
Speaker 3: as they say in Hell Raisers or Hell Razor, we

1005
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:13,040
Speaker 3: have such wonders to show you. Tune in for future

1006
00:55:13,080 --> 00:55:16,439
Speaker 3: episodes on the Plane of Jars and Laos. Check out

1007
00:55:16,520 --> 00:55:22,320
Speaker 3: our our terrifying examination of ongoing abuse in the Amish

1008
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:26,719
Speaker 3: community and learn what an info hazard is. Tell us

1009
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:28,799
Speaker 3: your thoughts. We try to be easy to find in

1010
00:55:28,840 --> 00:55:33,160
Speaker 3: so many ways, email, telephone, and guess what online.

1011
00:55:33,280 --> 00:55:36,080
Speaker 4: Careful with those info hazards, y'all, that's true. You can

1012
00:55:36,160 --> 00:55:38,120
Speaker 4: in fact find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff where

1013
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:40,560
Speaker 4: we exist. On Facebook with our Facebook group Here's where

1014
00:55:40,560 --> 00:55:44,480
Speaker 4: it gets crazy, on YouTube with our video content galore

1015
00:55:44,560 --> 00:55:49,000
Speaker 4: for YouTube peruse, and on x fka, Twitter, on Instagram

1016
00:55:49,000 --> 00:55:51,600
Speaker 4: and TikTok. However, we are Conspiracy Stuff Show.

1017
00:55:52,200 --> 00:55:53,759
Speaker 5: I'm going to give you a quick example of one

1018
00:55:53,760 --> 00:55:56,520
Speaker 5: of these hallucinations that just found before I give you

1019
00:55:56,560 --> 00:55:57,200
Speaker 5: the phone number.

1020
00:55:57,840 --> 00:55:58,440
Speaker 2: Here we go.

1021
00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:02,640
Speaker 5: In one example, a speaker said, quote, he the boy

1022
00:56:02,960 --> 00:56:06,000
Speaker 5: was going to I'm not sure exactly take the umbrella,

1023
00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:09,960
Speaker 5: but the transcription software added quote, he took a big

1024
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:13,040
Speaker 5: piece of a cross, a teeny small piece. I'm sure

1025
00:56:13,040 --> 00:56:15,000
Speaker 5: he didn't have a terror knife, so he killed a

1026
00:56:15,080 --> 00:56:15,760
Speaker 5: number of people.

1027
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:18,480
Speaker 2: Okay, sure, sure.

1028
00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:21,319
Speaker 4: That's poetry. It's like shadow predictive text poetry. I love

1029
00:56:21,320 --> 00:56:22,160
Speaker 4: writing that stuff.

1030
00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 2: That's it. That's it all right.

1031
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:25,359
Speaker 5: If you want to call us and tell us you're

1032
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:29,319
Speaker 5: weird hallucinations or ones that you've encountered on some kind

1033
00:56:29,320 --> 00:56:32,840
Speaker 5: of language learning model, call one eight three three std

1034
00:56:33,080 --> 00:56:36,160
Speaker 5: WYTK when you call in, give yourself a cool nickname

1035
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:37,919
Speaker 5: and let us know if we can use that name

1036
00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:40,319
Speaker 5: and your message on the air. If you've got more

1037
00:56:40,360 --> 00:56:42,800
Speaker 5: to say than can fit in a three minute voicemail,

1038
00:56:42,880 --> 00:56:45,240
Speaker 5: why not instead send us a good old fashioned email.

1039
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:48,800
Speaker 3: We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence

1040
00:56:48,840 --> 00:56:52,400
Speaker 3: we receive. Be well aware, yet unafraid. Sometimes the void

1041
00:56:52,520 --> 00:56:55,560
Speaker 3: writes back. I'd like to give a big, big shout

1042
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:59,760
Speaker 3: out to our pal Logan, who gave us a hookup

1043
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:02,760
Speaker 3: to go get on the ground with some UAP stuff.

1044
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:07,680
Speaker 3: You're massively appreciated, Logan. Also big shout out and apologies

1045
00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:12,520
Speaker 3: to co host for GP who mentioned corvid intelligence. Promise

1046
00:57:12,600 --> 00:57:16,320
Speaker 3: not to try to squeeze that into future shows. Please please,

1047
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:18,840
Speaker 3: please send us whatever's on your mind. Give us the links,

1048
00:57:18,880 --> 00:57:20,480
Speaker 3: give us the photos, take us to the edge of

1049
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:22,640
Speaker 3: the rabbit hole. We will do the rest. So join

1050
00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:46,000
Speaker 3: us out here in the dark. Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1051
00:57:46,160 --> 00:57:48,240
Speaker 5: Stuff They Don't Want You to Know is a production

1052
00:57:48,320 --> 00:57:52,880
Speaker 5: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1053
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:56,000
Speaker 5: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.