WEBVTT - Short Stuff: Toronto Clown Riot

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, welcome to the short Stuff. I'm Josh. There's Chuck.

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<v Speaker 1>Jerry's here too. She's just sound mute and she's sitting

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<v Speaker 1>in for Dave, who's not here. And this is short stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right about the Toronto clown riot.

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<v Speaker 1>That was dead on Toronto, that was.

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<v Speaker 3>Supposed to be a clown horn. It sounded like a

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<v Speaker 3>sick mule in my head. It was kind of come

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<v Speaker 3>out better and I thought about doing a second take,

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<v Speaker 3>but who cares, Let's leave it in there.

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<v Speaker 2>It's fun.

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<v Speaker 1>It was a sick mule doing the disco call wow.

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<v Speaker 1>And we also called a lot of information from the

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<v Speaker 1>Toronto Star, Spacing magazine, specifically Adam Bunch on Spacing magazine,

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<v Speaker 1>and the Circus Diaries.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right, the sexiest mini series.

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<v Speaker 1>The Red Shoe Circus Diaries.

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<v Speaker 3>But we are talking about one of our towns that

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<v Speaker 3>we love a lot, Toronto, and we are coming back

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<v Speaker 3>there to Massey Hall, by the way, as part of

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<v Speaker 3>our Nadian tour. We always love Massy Holl in particular

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<v Speaker 3>and playing to our friends there. I think that I

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<v Speaker 3>think our very first live show ever was in Toronto, right.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it was actually, yeah, our Bars episode good

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<v Speaker 1>Call Chuck, that was our first one.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right. That's what gave us the taste.

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<v Speaker 1>Everybody h the taste of Toronto.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right.

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<v Speaker 1>And also i've spoken to Chuck everybody. He's promised to

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<v Speaker 1>do like ninety percent less. Gordon Lightfoot chokes this time.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right.

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<v Speaker 3>But we need to hop in the way back machine

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<v Speaker 3>for this one, because we're going back to eighteen fifty

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<v Speaker 3>five when Toronto was a different place. It's not the

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<v Speaker 3>it wasn't the metropolitan kind of refined big city that

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<v Speaker 3>it is now.

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<v Speaker 2>It was. It was tough.

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<v Speaker 3>It had like three hundred and fifty two drinking establishments

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<v Speaker 3>for the forty thousand people. There had a lot of brothels,

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<v Speaker 3>and they were people that liked to to mix it up.

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<v Speaker 3>It seems like back in the day.

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<v Speaker 1>For sure, not just the people at Tronto, but the

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<v Speaker 1>people who were in circuses too like to mix it up.

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<v Speaker 1>And specifically, in July eighteen fifty five, when our event

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<v Speaker 1>takes place, the SB House Star Troop in Menagerie and

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<v Speaker 1>circus was in town, and that circus was from New

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<v Speaker 1>York State and they showed up in Toronto. They set

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<v Speaker 1>up their tents and said, hey, everybody come see. And

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<v Speaker 1>of course since there's a circus, even in eighteen fifty

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<v Speaker 1>five circus, there were a bunch of clowns there. Chuck

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<v Speaker 1>and these clowns. They had a long day of performing

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<v Speaker 1>and they said, let's go to a local brothel. And

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<v Speaker 1>they did as a group.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right.

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<v Speaker 3>They said, let's go get drunk and doing other things

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<v Speaker 3>you can do with brothels. And they went to Mariann

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<v Speaker 3>Armstrong's brothel. It's a corner of King and John Streets,

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<v Speaker 3>and this happened to be a brothel where that was

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<v Speaker 3>kind of the main hangout of the Hook and Ladder

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<v Speaker 3>fire brigade. So we need to explain a couple of

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<v Speaker 3>things about these two groups. The clowns at the time

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<v Speaker 3>are not the lovable psychopaths that we have now in

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<v Speaker 3>our circuses. They were, you know, they were kind of

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<v Speaker 3>the road crew as well as clowns. So they had

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<v Speaker 3>to put up these big tents, break everything down, get

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<v Speaker 3>all the gear in place. So they were they were brawny,

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<v Speaker 3>like big dudes and the firefighters of the day in

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<v Speaker 3>Toronto at least, and I bet they were like this

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<v Speaker 3>in a.

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<v Speaker 2>Lot of places.

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<v Speaker 3>It was before the city government had, you know, was

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<v Speaker 3>in charge of that kind of thing. So you had

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<v Speaker 3>private fire departments and private companies that you know, build

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<v Speaker 3>for their services, like we'll put out your fire for

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<v Speaker 3>this amount of money. So you have fire private fire

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<v Speaker 3>companies like racing to fires to get there first. And

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<v Speaker 3>there were several instances of them arriving at the same

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<v Speaker 3>time and like fighting one another to put out the

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<v Speaker 3>fire while the fire's burning.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, several instances. One as recent as just a couple

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<v Speaker 1>of weeks before that Hook and Land Company who called

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<v Speaker 1>Marianne Armstrong's house they'll repute their hangout. They showed up

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<v Speaker 1>to one and there was already another company there and

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<v Speaker 1>they got into a fight and a riot broke out, right,

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<v Speaker 1>So there was a firefighter riot at a burning house.

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<v Speaker 1>The firefighters all decided instead of putting the house out,

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<v Speaker 1>they let it burn and looted the houses around it.

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<v Speaker 1>It was that kind of riot. These are the firefighters

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<v Speaker 1>in Toronto at the time, right, So by the time

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<v Speaker 1>this Toronto clown riot happens, the Hook and Ladder Company

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<v Speaker 1>has already been in one riot within the last few weeks,

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<v Speaker 1>and I guess they were itching for another one or something.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So they were there and they were hanging out

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<v Speaker 3>and they were drinking, and the clowns show up and

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<v Speaker 3>they're ready to do their thing. And pretty much everyone's

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<v Speaker 3>account is the same is that the clown started it.

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't see anything that said that the firefighters did.

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<v Speaker 3>So it was either like clowns cutting in line or

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<v Speaker 3>there was a clown that knocked. This all sounds very funny,

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<v Speaker 3>by the way, even as it's coming out of my mouth,

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<v Speaker 3>or a clown knocked the firefighters had off and are

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<v Speaker 3>and all of a sudden, a big brawl breaks out,

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<v Speaker 3>and maybe we should take a break there and tell

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<v Speaker 3>everybody who won right after.

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<v Speaker 4>This, okay, and things.

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<v Speaker 1>Like jumping job, I'll tell you who won, Chuck. The

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<v Speaker 1>clowns won, you know it. I don't think anybody disputes that.

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<v Speaker 1>Because one firefighter was seriously injured and so he was

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<v Speaker 1>kind of removed from the brothel, and as his fellow

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<v Speaker 1>firefighters were dragging him off, they all retreated as well.

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<v Speaker 1>So the clowns were like, okay, great, well we're here now,

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<v Speaker 1>so they just joy the rest of the night there, right,

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<v Speaker 1>that's right. The problem was is that the city of

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<v Speaker 1>Toronto at the time was run and was for like

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<v Speaker 1>one hundred plus years by an Irish Protestant group called

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<v Speaker 1>the Orange Order. It was kind of like a fraternal order,

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<v Speaker 1>and if you wanted to be an elected official, a cop,

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<v Speaker 1>a firefighter, if you wanted a government job, you basically

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<v Speaker 1>had to be an Orange Man a member of the Order.

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<v Speaker 1>And the Hook and latter Company were all Orangemen, which

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<v Speaker 1>meant they were deeply connected to a lot of other

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<v Speaker 1>people they called brothers in town. And the clowns had

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<v Speaker 1>just stepped in a big time.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, this has got to be from Syracuse University's Orangemen.

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<v Speaker 2>It's got to be related, right.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know.

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<v Speaker 3>I meant to look that up, but as soon as

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<v Speaker 3>I saw Orangemen, I was like, wait a minute, Syracuse,

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<v Speaker 3>So I imagine that came from the same Irish Protestant order.

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<v Speaker 2>That would be a weird coincidence. How many Orangemen are there?

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<v Speaker 2>After all?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, they grow a lot of oranges in Syracuse, so

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<v Speaker 1>maybe that's.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's probably it.

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<v Speaker 3>Gentle Winter's there, good for the fruit. So word spreads

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<v Speaker 3>about what happens at this fight, and the next day

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<v Speaker 3>a bunch of mad Orange Men show up and they're like,

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<v Speaker 3>we're gonna we're gonna kick the fun out of these clowns.

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<v Speaker 3>They started attacking the circus basically, and it got really

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<v Speaker 3>out of hand.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it did get out of hand. They were throwing rocks,

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<v Speaker 1>they were beating up the clowns, and the crowd just

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<v Speaker 1>kept growing and growing. And so this not just the clowns,

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<v Speaker 1>but the entire circus was overwhelmed. Then the Hook and

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<v Speaker 1>Ladder Company, who had been in the fight the day

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<v Speaker 1>before with the clowns, they showed up and rather than

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<v Speaker 1>put out any fires, they actually started fires. They started

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<v Speaker 1>burning down the tents. They had fire axes which they

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<v Speaker 1>used to break up the property of the circus. They

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<v Speaker 1>like everybody kind of dragged the circus performers wagons down

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<v Speaker 1>to this lakeside and tipped them over. Yeah, it was

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<v Speaker 1>a bad jam for sure.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so the circus is in big trouble at this point.

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<v Speaker 3>So they're like, you know, thank god, the police. The

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<v Speaker 3>police show up, but they were also corrupt because they

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<v Speaker 3>were also orange men, orange people, or at least the

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<v Speaker 3>chief was, and I bet a lot of the cops were.

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<v Speaker 3>Mayor Quimby finally steps in and calms everything down. He

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<v Speaker 3>arrives on the scene, and this is I love this

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<v Speaker 3>because this is totally made up lore, but I've got

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<v Speaker 3>to read it anyway. He said to have grabbed the

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<v Speaker 3>axe out of the hand of a rioter midswing as

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<v Speaker 3>he was about to bring.

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<v Speaker 2>It down upon a clown.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>The mayor's office put that out the next day.

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<v Speaker 1>For sure. He was shirtless too when he did it.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>The police chief, who, like you said, was an orangeman

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<v Speaker 1>and was very corrupt. He is supposedly credited with saving

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<v Speaker 1>the animals, or keeping the rioters from harming the animals,

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<v Speaker 1>which yeah, really the elephants. It's a big mark in favor. Frankly, no,

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<v Speaker 1>for sure. Aside from that though, the police just sat

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<v Speaker 1>on their hands. They purposefully did not intervene. Right. Eventually

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<v Speaker 1>this riot what became known as the Toronto clown Riot

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<v Speaker 1>or the Toronto circus Riot. I prefer clown riot, what

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<v Speaker 1>about you.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that sounds that's the better band name, so that's

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<v Speaker 2>what I'll go with.

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<v Speaker 1>Sure, it eventually settled down. The mob dispersed and the

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<v Speaker 1>circus people came back and grabbed their things and they

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<v Speaker 1>high tailed it out of town. They were like, we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to Ottawa. This place is way too hot for us.

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<v Speaker 2>You know what.

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<v Speaker 3>Now, I'm thinking, though, you can't use Toronto Clown Riot

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<v Speaker 3>as a band name because once insane clown Posse did

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<v Speaker 3>that that. You just can't even come close to touching

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<v Speaker 3>that word. Could you get a band name, I don't think.

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<v Speaker 1>Could you use it as like an album date?

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<v Speaker 3>Maybe, but I don't know who wants to be associated

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<v Speaker 3>with the Juggalos.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, I know some Jugglos or former Juggalos. They're

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<v Speaker 1>good people. Oh yeah, all right, I'm going to stand

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<v Speaker 1>up for him. Sure, look at.

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<v Speaker 2>You going to beat for the Juggalos.

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<v Speaker 1>Sure.

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<v Speaker 2>I feel like Aaron Cooper has done.

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<v Speaker 3>We talked about Juggles before, and I believe there are

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<v Speaker 3>pictures of us as Juggalos if I'm not mistaken.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, for sure, I think from our Magnets episode. Maybe.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that sounds right, So Chuck.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, Obviously the whole thing settles down, everybody gets level

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<v Speaker 1>headed again, and justice prevails.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, we'll see, We'll let the audience decide. Seventeen

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<v Speaker 3>people were charged with rioting. It was basically because of

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<v Speaker 3>the corruption that there wasn't a big widespread dragnet over

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<v Speaker 3>this whole thing, but the one you know, it took

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<v Speaker 3>a while, but the one good thing that came out

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<v Speaker 3>of this was it was kind of the last straw

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<v Speaker 3>for the people of Toronto with like these corrupt Orangemen

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<v Speaker 3>kind of running everything. It was kind of like the

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<v Speaker 3>you know New York City's Tammany, right, Yeah, And they

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<v Speaker 3>were like, we're we're not going to handle this anymore.

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<v Speaker 2>We can't be like New York.

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<v Speaker 3>And so the Reform Party comes into power and the

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<v Speaker 3>idea of reform is top of mind. It took about

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<v Speaker 3>one hundred and years to kind of get the Orange

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<v Speaker 3>men completely out of the picture.

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<v Speaker 2>That's kind of the weird part.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Adam Bunch In that Spacing magazine article, he says,

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<v Speaker 1>though the he points to the clown riot as like

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<v Speaker 1>the turning point that eventually became the foundation for the

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<v Speaker 1>modern less corrupt and less orange I guess police force

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<v Speaker 1>and turn I'm going.

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<v Speaker 3>To look and see when I'm there, when I'm walking around,

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<v Speaker 3>which is I'd love to do that one in there.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm going to see if I see any like orangeman

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<v Speaker 3>stuff anywhere.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you want, you know, how you find out somebody's

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<v Speaker 1>an orangeman? You should walk up to a cop and

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<v Speaker 1>what you do is you hold out your hand like

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<v Speaker 1>you're gonna shake it. And then the orange man handshake

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<v Speaker 1>is when the cop goes to grab your hand to

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<v Speaker 1>shake it, you take it away and smooth the side

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<v Speaker 1>of your hair, and he or she will do the

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<v Speaker 1>same thing. Just watch.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh okay, I thought you would go up to them

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<v Speaker 3>and squeeze their skin like you were popping a zet

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<v Speaker 3>to see if any orange essential oil comes out.

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<v Speaker 1>That works too, Yeah, all right, okay, I think short

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<v Speaker 1>stuff is.

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<v Speaker 2>That Stuff you should know is a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>For more podcasts my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

0:12:13.040 --> 0:12:15.920
<v Speaker 2>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.