Speaker 1: Let's talk about it.
Speaker 2: Let's talk about the Maro.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about it.
Speaker 4: Let's talk about the Man Hero. Welcome to the Man,
Speaker 4: Welcome back to the mail room. Jordan Runt with me as.
Speaker 2: Always, Hello everybody, So good to see you, always good
Speaker 2: to see you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm gonna ask you a question before I introduce
Speaker 4: our guest. What's that When you were in high school
Speaker 4: and you were thinking.
Speaker 3: About what you want to do with your life.
Speaker 4: Was there ever a part of you that said, one
Speaker 4: day I might be co hosting your show and producing
Speaker 4: your show. We're gonna be talking about tech enabled cock rings.
Speaker 4: Did that ever come up?
Speaker 3: Well?
Speaker 2: I wasn't really ever thinking about what I want to
Speaker 2: do with my life in that era at all, but oh,
Speaker 2: I got it. If I considered it, that probably would
Speaker 2: have been on my top ten maybe.
Speaker 4: Really Okay, No, So that was interesting because I was
Speaker 4: very rock and roll. Yeah, when I did that Myers
Speaker 4: Briggs thing, I think I was either supposed to be
Speaker 4: a police officer or a minister, you know. And so
Speaker 4: so I'm preaching the gospel of good men's health, and
Speaker 4: I'm preaching and I'm making sure people are staying in line,
Speaker 4: you know, when they are coming into my clinic and
Speaker 4: their nutrition is good, then I'm the nutrition cop, I guess.
Speaker 2: But yeah, never preaching to the perverted, that's right exactly.
Speaker 4: So with that in mind, I would ask doctor Justin
Speaker 4: the same question, like you know, when he was at
Speaker 4: high school and he was in medical school. I want
Speaker 4: to know the career pathways he took. Because doctor Justin
Speaker 4: is a CEO and founder at firm Tech, which is
Speaker 4: the first sex tech company dedicated to improving men's of
Speaker 4: rectile fitness, and he has a background in emergency medicine,
Speaker 4: and as you know, a lot of what we talk
Speaker 4: about in men's health is wrecked out. His function is
Speaker 4: sort of the first sign of some more serious health conditions,
Speaker 4: and it's also usually an association in otherwise guys don't
Speaker 4: just get ed without something else going on. And so
Speaker 4: I'm going to really unpack that with him today, based
Speaker 4: on the fact that he has a cardiovascular band to
Speaker 4: what he does, since that's a lot of guys go
Speaker 4: to the AR with not erect out dysfunction, but with
Speaker 4: substernal crushing chest pains. So we're gonna get into that
Speaker 4: with him. And he's a serial healthcare entrepreneur. He's founded
Speaker 4: and sold Pegasus Emergency Group and Swift MD, and provided
Speaker 4: guidance to various services tell himedicine and tech startups. Interestingly enough,
Speaker 4: we have some common ground as well. So doctor Justin
Speaker 4: was a Slavic studies major at Harvard and I was,
Speaker 4: as you know, a Russian literature major in UCLA.
Speaker 3: And so here we are. So we might do the
Speaker 3: whole episode Paruski.
Speaker 4: The lucha Paruski will vidiums. But anyway, we'll have some
Speaker 4: people translate to talk about what I just said there.
Speaker 3: But this is really cool.
Speaker 4: He's been married for thirty five years, so he's got
Speaker 4: me beat by exactly three to his wife. And they
Speaker 4: live in Montana, God's Country, riding horses and managing chickens.
Speaker 4: I imagine, are you I'm gonna just go into this,
Speaker 4: but I mean, my my pressing question is how do
Speaker 4: you keep the wolves away from your chickens in Montana?
Speaker 3: Doctor Justin?
Speaker 1: Well, last year our chickens rejoined the circle of life.
Speaker 3: Oh boy, so so the edges, you don't.
Speaker 1: Well, actually they stopped laying eggs. We had a whole flock.
Speaker 1: And I'm not particularly sentimental about chickens the way I'm
Speaker 1: about my dog and my horses. So I we just
Speaker 1: decided that, you know, let's just leave the coop door
Speaker 1: open over the winter and.
Speaker 2: Let the chicks fall where they may.
Speaker 1: I love that, yea. So anyway, thanks for joying the
Speaker 1: circle of life with Elvis. The roofs to being the
Speaker 1: last one to go down, and I think there was
Speaker 1: you know, a combination of mostly pie coyotes, you know them.
Speaker 3: Elvis has left the coop. That is uh, we joined
Speaker 3: the circle of life.
Speaker 1: Is beautiful?
Speaker 2: Really, Yeah, that's an incredible way to break bad news
Speaker 2: about pants.
Speaker 4: Yes, I think we really need a moment to mourn
Speaker 4: the chickens. Yeah, we had a similar thing. I lived
Speaker 4: on my parents had this property in Missouri, and when
Speaker 4: I was in grad school, my wife and I moved
Speaker 4: in with them. And we had My parents both born
Speaker 4: and raised in farms, and my dad very unsemental because
Speaker 4: he did all the farm work as a kid, and
Speaker 4: he and my mom convinced him to get a flock
Speaker 4: of guineas and we had guinea hns same way, and
Speaker 4: they had a great Pyrenees which protected the guineas from
Speaker 4: all kinds of wild animals. In the Missouri wilderness and
Speaker 4: they did pretty well until the guineas. Unfortunately, the Pyrenees
Speaker 4: had to go into boarding while my parents were out
Speaker 4: of town, and not a guinea survived when the Pyrenees
Speaker 4: came back. And I think he was professionally devastated by it,
Speaker 4: like he let this whole flock down, because never once
Speaker 4: did we have any infiltrators, but we had bald eagles
Speaker 4: and hawks and coyotes and all kinds of stuff. So
Speaker 4: I don't know how we got on this, but we
Speaker 4: are going to actually talk about something totally different but
Speaker 4: also health related today, and that is the idea of
Speaker 4: how do we get tech into our healthcare because we
Speaker 4: have all kinds of devices from cgms or continuous glucose monitors,
Speaker 4: which I see a lot of people in my gym
Speaker 4: wearing even though they don't have diabetes. But I think
Speaker 4: it kind of helps them decide whether they can have
Speaker 4: a blueberry muffin or a handful of blueberries, because obviously,
Speaker 4: you know, they need a CGM to tell them that
Speaker 4: instead of knowing that you should probably always have the
Speaker 4: blueberry muffin because life is short. But now we're talking
Speaker 4: about sex in the bedroom and sex wearables and devices
Speaker 4: in the bedroom.
Speaker 3: And that's what we're bringing doctor Justin on.
Speaker 4: Because he has helped develop this device with some of
Speaker 4: my colleagues who actually know very well to start this
Speaker 4: company called Firm Tech. So let's just we love creation stories,
Speaker 4: doctor Justin, So talk to me about where this all started,
Speaker 4: what was the great idea where you said, and then
Speaker 4: also just explain what your device does it specifically at
Speaker 4: least your wearable penile ring, and just you know, kind
Speaker 4: of give us a little history one on one on
Speaker 4: where this came from.
Speaker 1: Well four years ago, if you told me, doufor Justin,
Speaker 1: you'll be talking about direction rings the rest of your life.
Speaker 1: I would have said, like most of been, no fucking way,
Speaker 1: I don't need it. I'm good. And I realized it's
Speaker 1: not about being good, it's about being great. It's not
Speaker 1: about needing something, it's about wanting something. So all men
Speaker 1: I spend with you, David, all men can optimize usher performers,
Speaker 1: not just with data but with the Russian rings. But
Speaker 1: going way back, I think I'm the only doctor I
Speaker 1: know whose mother took them to see urologists twice from
Speaker 1: their teenager because she thought their masturbation happens would prevent
Speaker 1: them from getting into college. Was that okay, were you
Speaker 1: were you? Were you one of those guys?
Speaker 4: No, no, no, yeah, I can't say that that that
Speaker 4: ever made it up in the Mill's household.
Speaker 3: So very strange. But we were good Quakers, you know.
Speaker 1: Here I are, mom and so. Uh. And actually their
Speaker 1: last last business kind of amused me because it was
Speaker 1: like the end of the junior year. Uh. And the
Speaker 1: doctor chastised me in front of my mother for saying,
Speaker 1: you know, several times a day, man, that's that's excessive.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: And then he called back into the office after she
Speaker 1: left this and said, oh, by the way, Elliott, a
Speaker 1: year from now you'll be in college and they'll have
Speaker 1: to put up with her again. So uh, then skipping
Speaker 1: your head to medical school. My first day medical school,
Speaker 1: I looked around, thought, these are not my people. You
Speaker 1: look like you're little bit young than me. But there
Speaker 1: used be this thing called Index Medicus was endian of
Speaker 1: all the articles there, you know, that research oficles throughout
Speaker 1: medicine from the year before, before there was computers, these
Speaker 1: large volumes. So I looked around the classroom and looked
Speaker 1: around the auditorium and went to the medical library and
Speaker 1: went to the A volume after dc X, I had
Speaker 1: to read about it. I want to know if the
Speaker 1: doctors are keeping something from us.
Speaker 3: Right, where's that Spanish fly that's right?
Speaker 1: And THEO himbe and all the other Anyway, I kind
Speaker 1: of worked through this list. It's got a lot of
Speaker 1: the same stuff it's around today, because when it comes
Speaker 1: to retel dysfunction or reptile health, you know where the hopes,
Speaker 1: they're dopes and guys will walk on broken glass to
Speaker 1: you know, optimize or improve the performance. So sorry, from
Speaker 1: the Spanish flying and hymbe, there was a large neil
Speaker 1: citralan macar u Honi gogried all the same things that
Speaker 1: are in the Celtnes today, and I'll share with you
Speaker 1: that we have tested a lot of them and we
Speaker 1: have not found anything to improve octurnal blood float to
Speaker 1: projective marker, skipping ahead other than Montana. I ride horses.
Speaker 1: My wife says I ride like a fifteen year old.
Speaker 1: Let's say I ride with least the maturity, but twenty
Speaker 1: five year old. But I sometimes had this illusion down
Speaker 1: in my centaur. Then I'm one with my horse. I
Speaker 1: don't know if you guys ride horses, but this is
Speaker 1: it's like think you're like you're like one with your motorcycle.
Speaker 1: So in the valley over from where we live, by
Speaker 1: the way, it's called Paradise Valley, I was riding a
Speaker 1: Paris valley and some do good or had cut a
Speaker 1: tree that had fallen over a trail so you could
Speaker 1: walk underneath it, but you couldn't ride a horse underneath it,
Speaker 1: especially if you're going along fecklessly, full out about thirty
Speaker 1: five miles per hour, having a lot of fun. So
Speaker 1: I came around this curve and here was this tree, limb,
Speaker 1: trunk really and I shattered that at the pieces. I'm
Speaker 1: certain there's still the tree is still talking about me
Speaker 1: in that forest. But he also broke six ribs and
Speaker 1: six vertebrae, and I was always lying there on the ground.
Speaker 1: I thought it was my spinacle damaged. Do you know
Speaker 1: about the cock up sign?
Speaker 3: Yeah, tell me yes, Yeah, it has two three four.
Speaker 1: Assume me a breathing and you're not bleeding out. It's
Speaker 1: important for everyone who's concerned about spinakle injuries know that
Speaker 1: if you can cock your big toe back, you can
Speaker 1: defecate your nite. The Big three. So my wife came
Speaker 1: riding up behind me god of a horse and said,
Speaker 1: you're gonna die, And I said, no, I'm not gonna die,
Speaker 1: but I'm in. It's gonna be really bad. It's gonna
Speaker 1: be like very nineteenth century experience. So I had to
Speaker 1: walk out for about I don't know, six seven miles
Speaker 1: to a clearing or to get helicoptered out. Anyway, as
Speaker 1: I was making this very slow walk, I thought, she
Speaker 1: what's been done to real bility sexual function in men
Speaker 1: and women who have had a spawnal cood injury or
Speaker 1: spina core disease. So there were six papers in the
Speaker 1: medical literature, certainly after COVID. We all should laugh about
Speaker 1: that phrase medical literature, because the literature is largely fiction,
Speaker 1: and most medical research is probably logic fiction as well too,
Speaker 1: not reproducible at least to give them the benefit the doubt.
Speaker 1: So there were six papers per reviewed of course, saying
Speaker 1: that they were able to neuromodulate human sexual response. So
Speaker 1: neuromodulation like client paste makings and planting electrode and producing
Speaker 1: a neurological response, we can make the heart beat after death.
Speaker 1: Imagine if we could, well, I don't want to talk
Speaker 1: about getting the carrons after death, but imagine if we
Speaker 1: could actually use no modulation to restore or maintain sex
Speaker 1: sexual function, especially in Asian population. So this interested me.
Speaker 1: I tried out on two rams two male sheep at
Speaker 1: a lap here in California, and we identified the podental
Speaker 1: and cabinist nerves, everyone's two favorite nerves that no one's
Speaker 1: ever heard about. The nerves are responsible for arousal and
Speaker 1: climax and men and women, and we got direction and
Speaker 1: ejaculation in the two rams, but we also got defecation urination,
Speaker 1: so it wasn't quite bedroom friendly unless you're it's certain
Speaker 1: neighborhoods in La San Francisco, maybe sit near London.
Speaker 4: That's right, or disgraced wrap in pop stars, but yes.
Speaker 1: Exactly exactly. I thought, Gee, it's too opten to here.
Speaker 1: I can either go out and go to the Valley
Speaker 1: or Ballet or New York and raise fifteen twenty five
Speaker 1: million dollars and go down to Nigeria or Brazil and
Speaker 1: find twenty five guys VT and put electrodes in them.
Speaker 1: Or I could try it out myself. So I had
Speaker 1: a friend of mine, Errolic, just went to a surge
Speaker 1: of center outside of San Jose. By the way, there
Speaker 1: was no consent form for this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was going to say, this is yeah, is Carlors.
Speaker 4: You get a little tight here at iHeart radio, But yeah,
Speaker 4: keep going and we.
Speaker 1: Implant to electro implanted to electrode by my potental in
Speaker 1: cabinets news and we tried all different amplitudes, frequencies, voltages,
Speaker 1: and I felt nothing of tatally from electricity. I actually
Speaker 1: don't think we understand the neurophysiology of human sexuality. There are
Speaker 1: you know, claims literature about Paris Sympic nervouses and blah
Speaker 1: blah blah. So I called a project oh for obvious reasons.
Speaker 1: I tried to get it published unsuccessfully. You know, you
Speaker 1: know negative studies almost never get published, especially negative study
Speaker 1: is done by an emergency meta position without a consent
Speaker 1: form and a surch of center in San Jose.
Speaker 3: When I reb yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: One so years passed. Four years ago. A Urolagship professor
Speaker 1: at the University of Utah, doctor Chancel Talent. He's not
Speaker 1: my chief medical officer. He heard about this tale from
Speaker 1: shul friend and he said, gee, I want to work
Speaker 1: with him. Jim had been trying to develop device to
Speaker 1: measure nocturnal erections for eight or nine years and unable
Speaker 1: to complete that development, and he wanted me to take this,
Speaker 1: you know forward. So he told me the number of
Speaker 1: nocturnal directions and a man are leading indicator of his
Speaker 1: cardiovascar health. That the penis is the canarian the coal
Speaker 1: mine of cardiofasquar disease. And just parenthetically, in the course
Speaker 1: of my career, I had developed expertise as a consultant
Speaker 1: the area of sense of technologies and ropati management technology,
Speaker 1: so it wasn't just some random thing here. And he said,
Speaker 1: noaturnal directions are lead indicator. That really took me back
Speaker 1: when I was ignorant about it. And two, in medicine,
Speaker 1: we don't have a lot of lead indicators. In medicine.
Speaker 1: We treat associations, and we treat associations as if they
Speaker 1: are lead the indicators. So lead indicators are things are
Speaker 1: actually predictive. So we treat high blood pressures associated with stroke,
Speaker 1: for example, but it's only predictive when it's really extreme.
Speaker 1: I mean, my blood pressure goes from you know, forty,
Speaker 1: it's I'm not telling me not to stroke my brush.
Speaker 1: Redical was one twenty to two forty. That's a problem.
Speaker 3: You're in trouble.
Speaker 1: And the same thing. We look proteins, and we often
Speaker 1: overtreat these these things because we treat these these minor
Speaker 1: signals being really significant. Doctor Hotelling told me and showed
Speaker 1: me research in the medical literature, quote literature indicating that
Speaker 1: the number of nocturnal directions of man has come down
Speaker 1: by fifty percent. The man has a quotes to fifty
Speaker 1: percent chance of having a Caldivascar event heart attack in
Speaker 1: China in the next two or three years, and that
Speaker 1: that's a powerful number. Especially as leading indicator rithology, I
Speaker 1: wanted to get involved in this. So that's the backstory.
Speaker 4: We talk a lot about the concept of the really
Speaker 4: the foundation of men's health as a discipline started in
Speaker 4: nineteen ninety eight with the advent of the little Blue pill.
Speaker 4: And we realized all those data that came out of
Speaker 4: Olmsted County, which is the Mayo Clinic data in Framingham,
Speaker 4: which is your alma mater at Harvard, looking at these
Speaker 4: cardiovascular indicators, and right, you know, any guy that had
Speaker 4: any degree of wrecked out his function in his forties
Speaker 4: has a two to threefold higher incident of a major
Speaker 4: associated cardiac event within those ensuing five to even ten years,
Speaker 4: and so right that we've always looked at that, and
Speaker 4: the way to a man's heart is probably not through
Speaker 4: his stomach but to his penis, honestly, and both from
Speaker 4: an incentive standpoint as well as from a cardiovascular arist
Speaker 4: ratification standpoint.
Speaker 3: So anything we can do to get.
Speaker 4: In early on this is really interesting, interesting advice. And
Speaker 4: we just got done with Men's Health Month, and you know,
Speaker 4: I always like to say that genital health is general health,
Speaker 4: and so you have something that is genital health that
Speaker 4: very much correlates to general health. So talk to me
Speaker 4: about why I'm gonna I'm going to set up a
Speaker 4: sales pitch for you and then and then I'll probably
Speaker 4: pull back because I'm skeptical and don't like selling things.
Speaker 4: But tell me why every guy you should have this
Speaker 4: device and explain what it does. Explain this to the technology,
Speaker 4: and explain the data that we get if we're wearing
Speaker 4: one of these pnile rings.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's first just go back to biograph, just if
Speaker 1: I could for just one moment. Of course, so Vader
Speaker 1: was validated with subjective data. There's a scoring scheme as
Speaker 1: you know, called the ie F YEP. That's a bunch
Speaker 1: of questions about your sexual health. Well, it's subjective. For example,
Speaker 1: how is your sexual health over the last thirty days. Well,
Speaker 1: you know, if I'm putting a prison room with you,
Speaker 1: my secial health is going to be really bad over
Speaker 1: the next thirty days. Other hand, put me in a
Speaker 1: room with some some fashion, some model, it's going to
Speaker 1: be great. So when we start taking care of people
Speaker 1: on a base of subjective scoring systems, we make mistakes situational.
Speaker 1: So as I recall with fives were applying for viacara.
Speaker 1: There there was seven papers, two of which showed no
Speaker 1: more benefit of the placebo, and then one of them
Speaker 1: was the largest loge number of subjects in it. There's
Speaker 1: one paper that was just you know, had men with
Speaker 1: prostate disease that had the most response. I think we're
Speaker 1: seventy percent improvement on the ief. Well, most men that
Speaker 1: don't have prostate cans haven't had surgery in the prostate.
Speaker 1: And the other four papers show nor more benefit than
Speaker 1: the thirty five to forty percent range. Well placebos thirty percent,
Speaker 1: So we're not talking about a powerful boner pill here
Speaker 1: the way you know, the way the way you know,
Speaker 1: And we really have fallen into the trap of of
Speaker 1: succumbing to I think bad data, subjective data, and form
Speaker 1: of marketing when it comes to taking the pills for everyone.
Speaker 1: So what is our what do we do well? Minor
Speaker 1: harackers want to hack health, but you can't hack health
Speaker 1: unless you can track it. You can't really fix things,
Speaker 1: in my opinion, unless you can actually measure them and
Speaker 1: measure them objectively. So our device we embedded sensors into
Speaker 1: an erection ray. I don't like calling it a cock
Speaker 1: ring because that puts it in the context of a
Speaker 1: sex toward toward novelty. I suppose something that that is
Speaker 1: variable with valuable data, but also is a form that's
Speaker 1: going to optimize some sexual performance. So in better senses,
Speaker 1: into an direction ring. One overnight, we count the number
Speaker 1: optional directions, measure the duration and firmness. One during sexy
Speaker 1: measure duration and firmness. And with this information we give
Speaker 1: we provide people what we call an erect out fitness score.
Speaker 1: Where fitness oriented culture. We all of us, including both
Speaker 1: you young guys on this call, are on the road
Speaker 1: from erect out fitness to rect ale this function. And
Speaker 1: we don't know where we are on the road, and
Speaker 1: we drive a car, we have a dashboard. If you
Speaker 1: don't have a dashboard, we're likely to break down, crash
Speaker 1: around a gas you don't have problems. So we're giving
Speaker 1: men and the healthcare providers data that tells them where
Speaker 1: you are on that road, in addition to which we're
Speaker 1: also optimizing their performance. Because an effective erection ring is
Speaker 1: not one of these o rings that you see in
Speaker 1: sex toy stores that essentially like a gasket for your dick.
Speaker 1: You know you have to have you have to have
Speaker 1: an direction for it to work. You slide it down
Speaker 1: your penis. It chokes off your penis. It's like a
Speaker 1: relation of your penis. It's coming off teria of blood flow. Uh.
Speaker 1: And you know they're considered to be dangerous. They're wret
Speaker 1: for more than twenty to thirty minutes. It's probably more
Speaker 1: like an hour. But if people have diabetes, hypertension, compromised circulation,
Speaker 1: they can be quite problematic.
Speaker 4: Boy, do I have stories that involve dremal saws and
Speaker 4: late nights in the emergency room, bolt cutters, jaws of life.
Speaker 3: You're absolutely right. I'm sure you've seen it too as
Speaker 3: an er doctor.
Speaker 1: So we've documented a quarter million, two undred thousand directions
Speaker 1: lest time booked on four thousand men. We have the
Speaker 1: world's largest database, and researchers of mine that data to say, well,
Speaker 1: what really works, what doesn't work? And when comes to
Speaker 1: men's sexual health, a lot of the things that have
Speaker 1: been recommended have been either untested. Frank quite a few
Speaker 1: that don't work. And in addition to which you know,
Speaker 1: there are several papers underway right now correlating nocturnal erection
Speaker 1: parameters with CT calcium scores for cardiacal highbassue risk and
Speaker 1: the blood and the markets appob and other markets of
Speaker 1: cardiabasket health, and those papers will look them out. One
Speaker 1: will be presented this fall, the other ones will come
Speaker 1: out next year. As you know, the academic wheels of
Speaker 1: research turn slowly. But I can tell you what the
Speaker 1: research shows because the research the biggest. The big research
Speaker 1: shows but men and doctors think this leading cause of
Speaker 1: rattles function is actually the second leading cause. Do you
Speaker 1: want to know?
Speaker 4: Yeah, tell me what your thoughts are, because I definitely
Speaker 4: have thoughts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have you know, you probably know some of
Speaker 1: the people that we're working with, doctor John Mahall more,
Speaker 1: some Cattering Mote Kera from Baylor who's on the home
Speaker 1: on our board, Javio Tero, Mero Spain, different Chapman. We
Speaker 1: have some of the world's leaders and men's sexual medicine
Speaker 1: are on our advisory board or doing research for the device.
Speaker 1: So the expectation the incience of rattles function.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: And by the way, I got to talk about the
Speaker 1: definition moment because the definition is flawed. But the instance
Speaker 1: of Reteld's function goes up ten percent per decade after
Speaker 1: age thirty. I'm seventy three years old. By my age
Speaker 1: seventy percent, so it goes up ten percent per decade.
Speaker 1: So the expectation of the demics was as the instance
Speaker 1: of reftorld disfunction goes up, the number nocturnal erections will
Speaker 1: come down, the firm's nocturnal directions will come down, and
Speaker 1: the firm's of sex direction will come down. It didn't happen.
Speaker 1: So I remember looking at the data when we had
Speaker 1: like forty thousand erections. I got seventh sixth of what
Speaker 1: we had. Right now, I'm thinking the data is trying
Speaker 1: to tell me something. It's going to be really simple.
Speaker 1: Why we had Why are we reporting more rethtle dysfunction?
Speaker 1: But men's erections are staying just as hard in the
Speaker 1: sixties as men's erections in the thirties. Men haven't just
Speaker 1: made nocturnal erections in the sixties as a matter of
Speaker 1: having in the thirties. What's going on here? So twelve
Speaker 1: to thirteen percent of men, they do deteriorate, and these
Speaker 1: are men with significant cardiovascid disease. These are men with diabetes,
Speaker 1: high pertension, usually pull out controlled. But that's not the
Speaker 1: vast majority of men. The vast majority of men are
Speaker 1: reporting retort of dysfunction, but they're staying just as hard.
Speaker 1: So what's going on? So the flaw is in the
Speaker 1: definition in my mind, so definition of reptild dysfunction called
Speaker 1: International side for section most and has three clauses. The
Speaker 1: first clause inability to get an erection or difficulty getting erection.
Speaker 1: I don't mean because you're drunk, I mean in some
Speaker 1: sorts just sustained basis. Well, those are the men with
Speaker 1: bad cardiovasket will we doctors called left side heart failure.
Speaker 1: They've got narrowly their arteries due to diabetes or hypertension.
Speaker 1: They got well, they have that heart attack or John
Speaker 1: just a heart failure or mircodie. Some a heart stop
Speaker 1: pumping up blood the penis, the arteries and narrow. They're
Speaker 1: struggling to get an erection because they have some cardiovasket problem.
Speaker 1: The second part of the definition is difficulty maintaining erection.
Speaker 1: That's all men, that's all of us. As we get older,
Speaker 1: with all of us, as we get older, those sustain
Speaker 1: erections the way we did we were younger. It's multi factorial.
Speaker 1: I'll pick on you. I'm guessing look at you that
Speaker 1: when you were twelve years old, if a girl put
Speaker 1: a tongue in her mouth for ten seconds, you get
Speaker 1: a hard on for an hour and a half. What
Speaker 1: was the last time that happened to you?
Speaker 3: You're looking right at the camera of both of us.
Speaker 4: Yes, and I would say that, yeah, you know, well
Speaker 4: the answer is not that long ago, because I've been
Speaker 4: happily married as well.
Speaker 1: But but no, no, But but you know the point talking.
Speaker 4: I know because I actually I will tell you this.
Speaker 4: I mean I talk about with my patients all all
Speaker 4: the time. I call it the NRB or they're no
Speaker 4: reason boner, and it's you know, for me, it's a
Speaker 4: question is you know when I was sitting in algebra
Speaker 4: class in ninth or tenth grade and all of a
Speaker 4: sudden something happened. You know, under my textbook, those are
Speaker 4: the things that are very tough as we get older
Speaker 4: to get the NRBS. Yeah, I mean direct stimulation. Boy,
Speaker 4: I'm you know, I'm good to go. Not to TMI
Speaker 4: with my audience.
Speaker 1: Well, of course I'm not talking about the rest simulation.
Speaker 1: I'm talking about Yeah, I'm talking. So I think we've
Speaker 1: what we've done is pathologize the aging process for sure.
Speaker 1: You know, I'll put on both of you guys again
Speaker 1: on myself. Hey, I'm seventy three. Do I run as
Speaker 1: fast I did when I was twenty? No, of course not.
Speaker 1: I must have r D run as function, and I
Speaker 1: need to see a running as function specialist, and I
Speaker 1: need special series of exercises, any pills, any sufflements in
Speaker 1: order to cure my RD. And that's what we've done
Speaker 1: with e D. The pejorative men get up and then
Speaker 1: lose it fast than they did when they were younger.
Speaker 1: Now this could be multi factorial. Obviously there's a confidence
Speaker 1: issue there's a baby crying next room, you're worried about
Speaker 1: paying the mortgage, there are business issues, you and your
Speaker 1: wife had to fight, someone's cheating on someone else, or
Speaker 1: you've had too much to drink. And then the pills
Speaker 1: that we doctors prescribe that make it harder for people
Speaker 1: to stay in directions. There's certain Antihypotensis, the entire class
Speaker 1: SSRI interpressants. But if you're getting blood in, these guys
Speaker 1: are getting blood in then losing it. The primary goal
Speaker 1: of therapy should be not immedia therapy, not the root cause.
Speaker 1: The prime cours of therapy should be keep blood in.
Speaker 1: But the pills that farmer has pop so popularized the
Speaker 1: p five pills by aggress alas being the big ones.
Speaker 1: They put more blood in, but they don't keep it there.
Speaker 1: And if you the problem is you're getting hard taking
Speaker 1: them more blood, you have to keep the tap open.
Speaker 1: That's great, but how are you going to keep blood
Speaker 1: in there? And the answer is mechanical solution. For most men,
Speaker 1: the answer is a ring. There are three papers, one
Speaker 1: we did internally in two that will be published comparing
Speaker 1: our rings to ten milligrams to dallaphil so like Alison
Speaker 1: most commonly prescribed direction pill in the East, the United States,
Speaker 1: maybe with the world, and in one of the papers
Speaker 1: the equivalent and two of the papers are ring superior.
Speaker 1: And why is that Because the problem is for most men,
Speaker 1: it's not getting blood in, it's keeping it there. So
Speaker 1: here's how the studies worked. When one of them, we
Speaker 1: looked at the research around it looked at D two
Speaker 1: messons the time it takes for an erection to go
Speaker 1: down after climax, So with nothing it was twenty five
Speaker 1: to thirty five seconds. With to dallaphill it was around
Speaker 1: two minutes. With the ring was close to three minutes,
Speaker 1: and both together it was close to four minutes. Well,
Speaker 1: it takeaway for all men should be if you want
Speaker 1: optimish your performance, take a pill and put a ring
Speaker 1: on it. It is a doctor Yoshi Sato. He did
Speaker 1: a paper looking at men with an erected hardness scores
Speaker 1: of two and three. You're familar with EHS, aren't you.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, not validated but yes, kind of validated but true.
Speaker 1: So the HS so an HS to two this force
Speaker 1: point scale, and this is how urologists think about often
Speaker 1: grade erections. Just for your audience, a four is normal.
Speaker 1: A one is a dead penis, A two is you
Speaker 1: can get hard, but you can't penetrate. The three is
Speaker 1: you can get hard enough to penetrate, but you can't
Speaker 1: sustain an erection for satisfactory intercourse. So with the HS
Speaker 1: three being probably the most common statistically, the large number
Speaker 1: of men, and these are men. All these men were
Speaker 1: taking a PD five medication, and half of them were
Speaker 1: injecting trimex, which.
Speaker 4: Is an injection drug to induce an erection. For those
Speaker 4: of us that right, I don't know that, yes, it's
Speaker 4: it's before we had viagara, we had the injectibles, which
Speaker 4: has caused overwhelming blood flow into the penis to get
Speaker 4: an erection, whether you were sexually stimulated or not.
Speaker 3: Yeah, go on.
Speaker 1: Percent of the men of the HS two group, we're able
Speaker 1: to have satisfactoris of course for ten minutes and stay
Speaker 1: hard for an average eight minutes just by using a ring.
Speaker 1: One percent of them men pant the small number and
Speaker 1: a twenty in the group. One hundred percent of the
Speaker 1: men in the HS three category, men who with a
Speaker 1: pill and an injection, when I able to have satisfaction,
Speaker 1: its course, we're able to have a satisfactory intercourse and
Speaker 1: stay hard for close to ten minutes on average afterwards.
Speaker 1: So the power of rings, to my mind is clear.
Speaker 1: But we doctored the focus on things that we can
Speaker 1: write perscriptions for. Uh. And if you talk again, if
Speaker 1: you told me four years ago, doctor Justin, you're gonna
Speaker 1: be talking about rings the rest of your life, I
Speaker 1: would have said, no way. And now I understand that
Speaker 1: we all can benefit from rings. And I don't have
Speaker 1: sex without a ring. My wife's idea of four play
Speaker 1: is to put on red lipstick and you know, toss
Speaker 1: the ring to mate. I'm a guy, I'm easy, you know.
Speaker 4: So so talk to me about what did so get
Speaker 4: the I mean the rings are they essentially? I mean,
Speaker 4: just to backup, we had discussions about this before in
Speaker 4: the podcast. Our listeners are pretty familiar. The idea of
Speaker 4: the institution of interaction and the achieving phases and arterial
Speaker 4: mediate to event as you talked about, and the maintenance
Speaker 4: phase is if venus mediated event where essentially what happens
Speaker 4: the erection is a giant ball of smooth muscle, and
Speaker 4: as we get older, that smooth muscle goes through high
Speaker 4: onization or atrophy and it doesn't trap the blood flow
Speaker 4: in those veins as much. And so you have something
Speaker 4: that is a ring is basically allowing ourterial inflow in
Speaker 4: because the arterial pressure is a lot higher venus outflow
Speaker 4: keeps it in the penis because venus outflow pressure is
Speaker 4: much lower, like physiological should be less than about five
Speaker 4: centimeters a second, whereas ourterial inflow is upwards of thirty
Speaker 4: six to forty to sixty plus centimeters a second. So
Speaker 4: your ring is essentially trying to keep the arterial flow
Speaker 4: in maintenance, to maintain the erection as well as to
Speaker 4: do the exclusive band. So that's kind of the physiology,
Speaker 4: makes perfect sense.
Speaker 3: Love it.
Speaker 4: I recommend rings all the time. Tell me about the
Speaker 4: data added? So what do you get as a consumer?
Speaker 4: Because yeah, sure, rings are great for having sex, and
Speaker 4: people have known about this since the times of the
Speaker 4: ancient Egyptians and beyond.
Speaker 3: But talk to us, talk to.
Speaker 4: Just about what kind of data you get out of
Speaker 4: a guy when he's wearing a tech ring or a
Speaker 4: wearable tech device.
Speaker 1: Sure well, the question that men need to ask themselves
Speaker 1: is am I having three to five not turn directions
Speaker 1: per night? Because that's what you should be having all
Speaker 1: those directions lasting forty to forty five minutes on average,
Speaker 1: because that's what you should be having. And are they
Speaker 1: at least a six on a one to ten firmness scale,
Speaker 1: because that's one of the we have two data points
Speaker 1: and we turn that into a further of scale one
Speaker 1: to ten. So when a man buys our device, he's
Speaker 1: comparing himself to now close to five thousand men. Well,
Speaker 1: that's a really powerful data set. And you can and
Speaker 1: utilize the app when the Google and Apple stores and
Speaker 1: utilizing one of the screens on the app, you can
Speaker 1: compare yourself to men within five years older than you
Speaker 1: and five years young young than you, So you'll know
Speaker 1: whether you're below average, average, above average in terms of
Speaker 1: these parameters, and of course we all want to be
Speaker 1: above average, right, So then that should get you thinking about, well, gee,
Speaker 1: if I'm below average, what's wrong? Why am I below
Speaker 1: average or from above average? What can I do to
Speaker 1: maintain it? And that's that's the power of data. So
Speaker 1: with this data you can say how bad is my
Speaker 1: diabetes or hypotension? So there are some men who even
Speaker 1: ignorant about these things. We've had six men that were
Speaker 1: aware of get krdiac cathorizations. Why because in all these
Speaker 1: cases their wives bought Why is the girlfriends bought them device.
Speaker 1: I've only had emailed substant email communications with four of
Speaker 1: these people, but I'll relate the anadotes just a moment.
Speaker 1: Why is and girlfriends both device for their men. The
Speaker 1: men were blaming their erectile dysfunction on their female partner
Speaker 1: because their technique was lousy, or they were overweight or
Speaker 1: whatever the weather. The reasons were, and it turned out
Speaker 1: that all these guys had significant kardiovascal problems. They had
Speaker 1: one guy had no nocturnal erections and the other guys
Speaker 1: had weak one to two nocturnal erections and weak confirmness,
Speaker 1: and they got kardiac cathorizations. And three of those relationships
Speaker 1: resulted in divorce or breakup because the women fed up
Speaker 1: with the guys. At the other extreme, we've had five
Speaker 1: men not get penal implants. Why because their noaturnal erection
Speaker 1: data was good. The problem was in their head or
Speaker 1: in their relationship. We're alcohol those are great, love it
Speaker 1: and those are extremes. Yeah, how is the data benefited
Speaker 1: in me personally? So? Probably because I'm involved in the
Speaker 1: startup my own personal money. My blood pressure, I thought,
Speaker 1: you know, like two years ago, my blood pressure went up,
Speaker 1: not disasterlete went up, and my internets recommend that I
Speaker 1: take lessonerprol and my erections went from h they lost
Speaker 1: thirty fifteen percent in firmness. And that's not enough. Fifty
Speaker 1: percent is not enough to be you know, noticeable. But
Speaker 1: why would I take a medication that's decreasing blood flow
Speaker 1: to my penis because it's problem is decreasing blood flow
Speaker 1: of other vital against a matter of fact. So you know,
Speaker 1: so I switched. I switched medications. I also realized that
Speaker 1: I would sometimes take zolpidin for sleep ambient uh, and
Speaker 1: why not my nocturnal erections? So I stopped taking it.
Speaker 3: That's right.
Speaker 1: Data is really powerful.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love that, Elliott. I think.
Speaker 4: Actually, yeah, so I'll you know, throw in a little
Speaker 4: bit of what's happening to you just for the audience.
Speaker 4: Is that that you know, blood pressure medicines in general,
Speaker 4: except for the ARBs, which probably is what they switched
Speaker 4: you over to, but a lot of these, especially better blockers,
Speaker 4: even in calcium channel blockers, they can you know, they
Speaker 4: essentially the idea is to shut blood away from less
Speaker 4: vital organs like our penis, so that you know your
Speaker 4: heart's protected. A very very poor man's description of what's happening.
Speaker 4: And so a lot of times guys with hypertension have
Speaker 4: erect out dysfunction. Then they, in some degree however we
Speaker 4: define it, they go to the doctor, they say you
Speaker 4: need to be on this pill for bloodressure, and then
Speaker 4: it gets worse, and then they come to the Eurologi's
Speaker 4: office to say what happened. And so your your device
Speaker 4: told you that that you were starting to have a
Speaker 4: little creep and then all of a sudden it got
Speaker 4: really bad on.
Speaker 3: So that's huge. But I think one of the other.
Speaker 4: Things that you reminded me of a story that I
Speaker 4: think is very indicative of where the power of your data.
Speaker 3: Set can be.
Speaker 4: And there was an old and I can't remember joining
Speaker 4: if we brought this up or not on the podcast,
Speaker 4: but but there's a classic quote from a Mayo cardiologist
Speaker 4: from years ago. I can't remember the guy's name either,
Speaker 4: but I bring it up all the time. But he said,
Speaker 4: essentially that men can hide angine or chest pain from
Speaker 4: their partners, but they can't hide erect out as function,
Speaker 4: which is kind of what you were saying, is that
Speaker 4: you actually have a device where the partners are like, no,
Speaker 4: you need to wear this, and then all of a sudden,
Speaker 4: the guy needs a cat.
Speaker 3: I just had a guy in my office the other day.
Speaker 4: Which is even more important to what you brought up earlier,
Speaker 4: in the whole idea of patching men's health together by
Speaker 4: going online and getting boner pills, right, which I've kind
Speaker 4: of rallied a career against.
Speaker 3: I published against it.
Speaker 4: I've got in trouble for not trouble, but I've gotten
Speaker 4: you know, people tried to sort of take down some
Speaker 4: of the literature I have that show that you can
Speaker 4: actually miss really critical health issues by just going online.
Speaker 3: To get a prescription for an ed pill.
Speaker 4: And I had a guy in my office the other
Speaker 4: day that was so indicative that he was forty five
Speaker 4: years old and he was surreptitiously buying pills online, and
Speaker 4: he ended up hiding his erect out as function from
Speaker 4: his partner because the pills worked for a while until
Speaker 4: he had a heart attack. Because he had no diagnostic
Speaker 4: work up, he was just buying boner pills without any
Speaker 4: medical supervision other than just an online, you know, five
Speaker 4: minute visit in a brown bag envelope in your mail.
Speaker 4: This guy was able to mess the system up even
Speaker 4: more because he actually hid ed from his partner, who
Speaker 4: was probably willing to help. If he had a device
Speaker 4: that was telling him, dude, you're in trouble and it's
Speaker 4: something that a pill is probably not going to save
Speaker 4: your life. He would have not had to have, you know,
Speaker 4: three vessel standing and almost die at forty five.
Speaker 1: You know, doctor Mohit karen No, so I am on the
Speaker 1: most five most famous andrologists or alogists in the world,
Speaker 1: he said a couple months ago on the podcast Flag
Speaker 1: was viking, what do you mean by that? He meant
Speaker 1: that for twelve to fifty percent of men who have
Speaker 1: have a cart vascer root clause for the poor sexual performance,
Speaker 1: guys take vital like he just said, they could just
Speaker 1: they could be masking a problem. One of my goals
Speaker 1: with what we're doing is to get the measurement of
Speaker 1: sexual health parameters embedded in clinical preventive medicine. And I'm
Speaker 1: confident with you know, we have several research papers, they're
Speaker 1: more underway. It's hard to change metical practice. It takes
Speaker 1: a long time. It took twenty years for electric choiogram
Speaker 1: to become a standard of care. Sure, so I mean
Speaker 1: it took pulse ox symmetry on a finger over a
Speaker 1: decade to become a standard of care. But I'm confident
Speaker 1: of what we're doing in time and by time. In
Speaker 1: like three to five years, if a man is forty
Speaker 1: forty five years of age and go see a doctor
Speaker 1: for preventive healthcare visit, they will want to know his
Speaker 1: baseline and rept off fitness score in his nocturnal parameters,
Speaker 1: because you're gonna want it's a piece of data like
Speaker 1: live proteins or blood pressure that you're going to want
Speaker 1: to follow over time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and again, and I think we have we have
Speaker 4: the literature show that it does precede by an appreciable
Speaker 4: amount of interventional time, whether it's one year or two years,
Speaker 4: five years, that you can tease that out. And then
Speaker 4: also it is good, it's a good way of sussing
Speaker 4: out how much of this is what we call psychological,
Speaker 4: but it is. I think there's a little bit of
Speaker 4: this parasympathetic sympathetic drive that you know, if you're nervous,
Speaker 4: if you're not motivated sexually then you may have d
Speaker 4: during spontaneous attempts in intercourse, but when you're sleeping, that's
Speaker 4: all down right. That is pure physiology and also involves
Speaker 4: sleep medicine. Like at the other point I was going
Speaker 4: to bring up for the lead reader or the listeners,
Speaker 4: because we talked about this with the Sleep Talk a
Speaker 4: few episodes ago, that that you know, the medications that
Speaker 4: are ostensibly for sleep, they actually don't really let you
Speaker 4: get into that deep, deep delta sleep, with that aram sleep,
Speaker 4: which is where our nocturnal erections have to happen. And
Speaker 4: so that's a really good good indicator. What you just
Speaker 4: said is that you notice that taking a sleep drug
Speaker 4: actually was a counterproductive to erections because you weren't really
Speaker 4: getting as deep asleep as you needed.
Speaker 1: I think our device is a sleep modern device as
Speaker 1: well too, although research on it so and I'll still
Speaker 1: you know, look, we all come out with an advanced
Speaker 1: version two point zero later on this year that will
Speaker 1: allow us the heart rate variability night as well too.
Speaker 1: But our engineers a couple of years ago, no engineers,
Speaker 1: guys who have you know, they got an Apple watch,
Speaker 1: they got whooped, they got or they got you know,
Speaker 1: they're there their data people, and they noticed that they
Speaker 1: were getting slightly more erection time utilizing our device measurement
Speaker 1: nocturnal erection time than they were getting on the on
Speaker 1: their or which makes sense that our device would be
Speaker 1: more accurate because every episode of quality sleep is accompanied
Speaker 1: by an erection. Assuming that a man is not in
Speaker 1: a or some medicases block that's blocking it. Then there's a.
Speaker 5: Paper right now, Uh, doctor Carra's shop and Baylor has
Speaker 5: a paper comparing looking at WHOOP consumers Lucos Monitoring, and
Speaker 5: our device just just attracted the parameters.
Speaker 1: In man at night and our device correlates with I
Speaker 1: mean with what the WHOOP device is showing. So people
Speaker 1: can monitor not only in them there cardiovascar and secial health,
Speaker 1: but also their sleep using our device.
Speaker 4: So yeah, it's a lot more discreet at the gym,
Speaker 4: or at least the gyms I go to. But yeah,
Speaker 4: I think that's important. Can you imagine if the if
Speaker 4: the teenage doctor justin had an or a ring and
Speaker 4: a firt intake device, you may have been kept out
Speaker 4: of the doctor's office and you could have just showed
Speaker 4: showed your mom your data and say look at healthyre
Speaker 4: you have Mom, just keep shaving my problems and getting
Speaker 4: on with my life. I think that's uh, that's powerful.
Speaker 4: H Tell me some new dances. Tell me, tell me
Speaker 4: what the next chapter is here in uh, in your evolution.
Speaker 1: I just wanted to Ed's maybe one of the point,
Speaker 1: because you know, I got into this for the data.
Speaker 1: I didn't realize I was also going to be solving
Speaker 1: the cock ring problem. The cocking problem is, uh that
Speaker 1: these these hard plastic rings you're buying online or self
Speaker 1: us store for you know, forty ninety five, they pinched.
Speaker 1: They are uncomfortable, they're not safe. So in order to
Speaker 1: get count them not turnal directions over night, we have
Speaker 1: to reinvent the material. You know, ours are our rings
Speaker 1: made out of self the lastomer. It's not matter heart silicone.
Speaker 1: Our rings don't block the out flow flow and the
Speaker 1: only constrain the veens return. Uh. And then I realized,
Speaker 1: wait a second, how can I improve a man's pleasure?
Speaker 1: Women have vibrators and then have shit. They've got this.
Speaker 1: We all we have these stupid strokers that get like
Speaker 1: it beats someone.
Speaker 3: To death with I think that's where the term comes from.
Speaker 1: Actually happy, if we can put the right amount of
Speaker 1: pressure over the rethroat to pull on the jackatory phase,
Speaker 1: we can produce some more powerful locasim for men. So
Speaker 1: the typical response of of a male, heterosexual, male urologist
Speaker 1: to to cockering is, I don't need it. Maybe some
Speaker 1: of my patients might need it, like you. I recommend
Speaker 1: to people all the time, but I bet you don't
Speaker 1: use them all the time. Maybe I recommend. I don't
Speaker 1: need it. It's almost like the reaction Superman to Kryptonite. No,
Speaker 1: not to me, you know, it's like So my thought
Speaker 1: is if we can produce a more intense orgasm, everyone
Speaker 1: should should want them. So we designed our massive performance
Speaker 1: ranked but the right amount of pressure. We tested on
Speaker 1: twenty eight men age twenty eight to seventy as oldest
Speaker 1: person test group. Our goal is to increase the e
Speaker 1: jackatory phase and a man by fifty percent with the
Speaker 1: right amount of grip, if you will, from the last
Speaker 1: roe on the Earth throw. So with this device, jackatoory
Speaker 1: phase goes from four seconds to seven seconds. And that's
Speaker 1: an incredible orgasm because obviously orgasm lasts the sensational orgas
Speaker 1: lest longly just you know, seven to seven seconds. This
Speaker 1: is something men need to think about it. It's not
Speaker 1: about do I need this? I got a problem? Do
Speaker 1: I need it? It's about do I want to have
Speaker 1: more pleasure? Women have vibrators and men have nothing. And
Speaker 1: now the data shows that this our device and other
Speaker 1: rings partly too, but our device can safely produce the
Speaker 1: more intense orgasm. Do you want to have more tests orgasm?
Speaker 3: Who doesn't?
Speaker 1: Who doesn't?
Speaker 3: I mean seriously, who doesn't put a ring on it?
Speaker 1: Hours? Of course?
Speaker 4: Exactly right? So what do you think is happening there?
Speaker 4: Is it? Is it perineal stimulation? Is it pushed to stimulation?
Speaker 1: No? I think it's simply drawing up the jack of
Speaker 1: toy face, the long jacktalk phase last, the longer, the
Speaker 1: parasympathetical glow glow if you will. But you asked about
Speaker 1: the future, well, SidD only the fact that that I'm again,
Speaker 1: I think the all mentioneds rings. Here's what's going, here's
Speaker 1: what we're doing in the future. So we're coming. We're
Speaker 1: working right now on the critique the world's first monitor
Speaker 1: of the health of clarists.
Speaker 3: Nice and I.
Speaker 1: Think that this will be just the way I think.
Speaker 1: So this will take gynecology and sexology of women. It's
Speaker 1: the twenty first century of objective, personalized care. You have
Speaker 1: all the same problems that men do with diabetes, hypertension, athlescrossis,
Speaker 1: ob st poor physical condition. But they also do two
Speaker 1: things that men don't don't deal with well, we actually
Speaker 1: do with one of them. One is premenopausal women take
Speaker 1: hormones that have a negative impact upon their sexual health performance,
Speaker 1: and they also take sor actepressants, depending upon the study,
Speaker 1: fourth to ten times as much as men do. We
Speaker 1: don't know what the right doses are with these things,
Speaker 1: because you know unlick and blood, you know blood pressure
Speaker 1: or karak rhythma. We actually measure the impact of our
Speaker 1: therapy when it comes to men's sexual health to t
Speaker 1: with PD five medications, we don't know what the right
Speaker 1: doses are without data. When it comes to women's sexual health,
Speaker 1: what's the right dose of a hormone, what's the right
Speaker 1: dose and antipressant that will have the least effect upon
Speaker 1: the clearest we don't know without data. So we're going
Speaker 1: to come out with that device something by December this year,
Speaker 1: and then we're also working on a more advanced version
Speaker 1: of the male device because we want to make it
Speaker 1: more sensitive and specific. We want to eliminate what I
Speaker 1: call data fuzziness. So I'll pick up my own device.
Speaker 1: My ACTIL directions are seven most seven six. It wasn't
Speaker 1: really innate because it's just you know, the same time
Speaker 1: the blood pressure tough on your desk, or pulselo symmetry
Speaker 1: or your will bring there's a certain data fudd you
Speaker 1: acceptable maybe ten percent data data fuzziness. I want to
Speaker 1: eliminate that. I also want to adding the ability to
Speaker 1: measure the pulse so we can really nail down the
Speaker 1: quality of sleep. And then we're also going to actually
Speaker 1: be able to tell you the delta, the change in
Speaker 1: the volume of blood and your penis between the flash
Speaker 1: of state and the rest and the erect state, how
Speaker 1: much blood is your penis holding, and then measure the
Speaker 1: impact of medications, diseases, et cetera upon that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 4: I mean I see a lot of you know, one
Speaker 4: of the things I do a lot of research in
Speaker 4: and treat a lot of guys for Perrone's disease. And
Speaker 4: you know, we have static ways of looking at pen
Speaker 4: out blood flow, doing ultrasounds in the office, but the
Speaker 4: number of guys that at Peroni's and have what I
Speaker 4: call a fixed external obstruction. In other words, this art
Speaker 4: tissue itself can can cause this extrinsic obstruction of blood flow.
Speaker 3: We don't have a great way of monitoring it.
Speaker 4: You know, basically talk to guys and they talk about
Speaker 4: this concept, and we've we've had a whole series in
Speaker 4: factory kind of finishing up in real time, the big
Speaker 4: series of done upronties. But they talk about what we
Speaker 4: call distal flcidity, where you get interaction, the plaque is
Speaker 4: externally compressing like a thumb over a garden hose, and
Speaker 4: then you get sort of this poor blood flow post
Speaker 4: But again we're doing that by history and then duplex ultrascenography,
Speaker 4: which is cumbersome and has to be done in the office,
Speaker 4: et cetera, et cetera. So yeah, there may be you know,
Speaker 4: we should talk offline about looking at some of the
Speaker 4: ways that we improve Perrone's disease through incremented medical dosing
Speaker 4: or interlegional therapy. And yeah, it'd be a really interesting study, honestly, Elliott,
Speaker 4: to look at that, because after work. Yeah, that's is
Speaker 4: one of the things that guys complain about, is that
Speaker 4: not only as my penis bent and I'm not getting
Speaker 4: the same rigidity, but because of the bent and difficulty
Speaker 4: dependent treading, I'm also losing that stability what we call
Speaker 4: axial stability.
Speaker 3: So okay, yeah, that's good. See.
Speaker 4: I love I love having thought provoking guests, people that
Speaker 4: are really trying to figure out problems that have never
Speaker 4: had a really organic solution. And I think this is
Speaker 4: what you're doing, is you're looking at at a device
Speaker 4: that diagnoses without treating, but then coming up with unique
Speaker 4: and specific treatment patterns based on the data you're providing,
Speaker 4: as well as potentially you know, helping cardiovascularness using this
Speaker 4: erectile function.
Speaker 1: Well, it's just the gap here. Yeah, you know, you know,
Speaker 1: if you AREFC patients who have problems with their kidneys,
Speaker 1: their bowels, their lungs, their heart, we can get imaging tests,
Speaker 1: we get blood tests that will help make that problem objective,
Speaker 1: and then we can measure the impact objectively of any
Speaker 1: interventions that we that we undertake with without patients. But
Speaker 1: when it comes to mend's sexual health, much a nothing,
Speaker 1: you know, an off astop of this is pretty much nothing,
Speaker 1: and we rely upon the subjective questionnaires. I frankly think
Speaker 1: the if is embarrassing. Embarrassing because this is the year
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six, This is not the year nineteen ten,
Speaker 1: and we should not be relying upon subjective questionnaire is
Speaker 1: when it comes up. Look, I regular love making it subjective.
Speaker 1: I'm not, you know, there's this obfoice of a profound
Speaker 1: subjective component to it to our social response. We are
Speaker 1: supposed to be scientific, We're supposed to be objective in
Speaker 1: our approach, and we need data for that.
Speaker 3: That's right.
Speaker 4: It's still mostly heteronormative, as we say as well, so
Speaker 4: you're missing same sex couples, and so it really does
Speaker 4: become very limited to what we define sexual function as
Speaker 4: hard enough to penetrate the vagina and long enough to
Speaker 4: maintain that penetration.
Speaker 1: So let's get that for a moment, because the whole
Speaker 1: the subjective questionnaires are focused on pound pennant. By the way,
Speaker 1: Petra sex we couldn't go in intercourse wasn't good enough?
Speaker 1: I mean, why do we reinvent these words all the time.
Speaker 1: By the way, I can penetrate it with my tongue,
Speaker 1: with my fingers too, So really haven't made this definition
Speaker 1: any better. But the definitions are focused, and the outcomes
Speaker 1: they're looking for is satisfactory. That's that's the third phrase,
Speaker 1: the definition of I felt this function satisfactory intercourse.
Speaker 3: Well is it good for you?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Well, yeah exactly. And also if you speak to men,
Speaker 1: older men, and I'm the older and old, old than
Speaker 1: forty forty five years of age, intercourse is not the
Speaker 1: end all be all because of friction. They're not getting that.
Speaker 1: They don't they're not getting to the friction they do
Speaker 1: from a hand, hand or a mouth. Uh. And method
Speaker 1: of preference, and a real study should should get should
Speaker 1: be asking those questions because I've got I've got patience. Uh,
Speaker 1: you probably have many more. I'm not eurologists who tell
Speaker 1: me that, you know, I don't enjoy intercourse, but I
Speaker 1: certainly enjoy other ways you know of Uh, I get
Speaker 1: just I get hard other ways. And and but yet
Speaker 1: they are diagnosed having a D.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, it's true.
Speaker 4: I mean it's a very narrow definition that gets into
Speaker 4: our science and and then we make huge outcomes studies
Speaker 4: based on very poorly your data.
Speaker 3: So now I applaud this, I applot what you're looking at. Well,
Speaker 3: talk to me about this. We always like to do
Speaker 3: what you're going to be okay?
Speaker 4: Section where I take a health expert and I say,
Speaker 4: here's a scenario.
Speaker 3: Is this guy going to be okay?
Speaker 4: And I think your your ring You may have already
Speaker 4: kind of alluded to this, but I'm going to give
Speaker 4: you a patient scenario. I'm going to see how would
Speaker 4: you work this guy up based on your medical knowledge
Speaker 4: as well as your technologe and so so, a guy
Speaker 4: goes online, he buys your firm tech device, he starts
Speaker 4: wearing it, and he starts seeing when he's forty six
Speaker 4: that he still has all of the scores top of
Speaker 4: the charts. He's doing great. And then insidiously he starts
Speaker 4: to see month after month to the point where he's
Speaker 4: forty eight years old, that he's seeing this decline in
Speaker 4: rigidity and decline and frequency of erections.
Speaker 3: He has data. How is this guy going to be okay?
Speaker 4: What are you going to do to reverse this guy's
Speaker 4: ed that you diagnose based on your device that maybe
Speaker 4: his partner hasn't noticed yet, maybe he's noticed, but it's
Speaker 4: too ashamed to go to his doctor with. And also
Speaker 4: he knows if he goes the doctor, the guy is
Speaker 4: going to be like dude, you're still having sex?
Speaker 3: What do you want from me? So, how is this
Speaker 3: guy going to be okay?
Speaker 1: Are you well, you're you're You're getting don a real
Speaker 1: problem here because if he goes to his doctor's doctor
Speaker 1: Appli said, hey, you know, take a pill. And now
Speaker 1: back in the world that that doctor Cara wanted about,
Speaker 1: Bager is blacking in because you'll describe someone's having to
Speaker 1: decreased rigidity in the nocturnal parameters. To my mind, has
Speaker 1: a cardiovascar primary carve asker problem until proven otherwise, not pterological,
Speaker 1: but more likely to be primary callebasque problem till proven otherwise.
Speaker 1: And he's called of asked the work up, and most
Speaker 1: doctors are not taking that way. Now the guy could
Speaker 1: Let's assume this patient have have a strong free T.
Speaker 1: Is free T great than twenty?
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's say it is just for fun to make
Speaker 4: it easy. Yeah, so optimize his tea.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's one will work up is normal. He's got
Speaker 1: a cardive askue problem till proven otherwise. I want to
Speaker 1: be certain that he sees He probably an interventional radiology
Speaker 1: study and you and I both know that's not common.
Speaker 1: I just got contact today by a guy who a
Speaker 1: guy in South Africa, very sophisticated. A man South Africa
Speaker 1: who bought our tech ring. He was five fifty years
Speaker 1: old and was describing. But you know, his doctor recommended,
Speaker 1: you know, a P five medication. He's taken twenty solis
Speaker 1: now no, you know, and he's still unable to perform
Speaker 1: what he did. You know two years ago. He is
Speaker 1: cut out drinking completely. He finally got a reeology study
Speaker 1: which showed a blockage of his penal lottery. Yeah, in
Speaker 1: my experience in yours is greater than mine. In this area,
Speaker 1: an interventional radiology study is not common when it comes
Speaker 1: to the workup of ED and that's unfortunate.
Speaker 3: Right it is.
Speaker 4: I mean we usually in fact, that's one of the
Speaker 4: reasons I do a lot of duplex ultra scenography because
Speaker 4: I can pick those things up and then refer appropriately.
Speaker 4: And we start to incorporate preventive cardiology into the men's
Speaker 4: clinic at UCLA for that reason. But you're right, not common,
Speaker 4: not standard of care. And again it's sort of here's
Speaker 4: a pill and hope for the best, and we're trying
Speaker 4: to do better. And I think that you're at the
Speaker 4: forefront of looking at this in an early way. So, Jordan,
Speaker 4: what do you got for our good doctor and entrepreneur here?
Speaker 3: What thoughts have come up? Are you?
Speaker 4: Are you already getting online to buy a firm tech
Speaker 4: Tell me what your thoughts are?
Speaker 2: Well, I have a few other questions, but now, just
Speaker 2: based on what you just said, I'm curious, why is
Speaker 2: radiology not standard of care?
Speaker 3: Well? Yeah, I have my thoughts.
Speaker 4: But first of all, it's probably cost prohibitive for a
Speaker 4: little bit. Diagnostic sensitivity is not that great. But certainly
Speaker 4: I think if you appropriately screen, and if you had
Speaker 4: a screening device, which is essentially what a penile duplex ultrasound,
Speaker 4: or an even cheaper and much more easily accessed like
Speaker 4: a firmtech ring, could help screen who would actually benefit
Speaker 4: most from a radiologic intervention.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let me speak up for a second. So there's
Speaker 1: a paper the University of Utah. It's going to be
Speaker 1: present into this fall uh SSM and a by doctor
Speaker 1: Kelly Gross. I don't really know where, but she's comparing
Speaker 1: our device to and to uh, you know, an office doppler,
Speaker 1: and our device is I'll share with you, is accurate
Speaker 1: as an in office toppler and actually superior because from
Speaker 1: my perspective this of course I did invent this thing,
Speaker 1: but why is it superior? Because we provide more data
Speaker 1: points and an office doppler is just one data point,
Speaker 1: whereas our device provides multiple data points. And therefore I
Speaker 1: think our device in time will demonstrated to be superior.
Speaker 1: But the neurologists have been trained and the and the
Speaker 1: building system drives them to the in office doppler. There's
Speaker 1: no box. I don't think the neurologists are thinking about
Speaker 1: intiventual radiology, and they probablyhould think about it more.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, for sure, I think that's it, Jordan.
Speaker 4: I think the other problem in general in medicines we
Speaker 4: talk about a lot is is there has become a
Speaker 4: siloing of our specialties and the fact that as a
Speaker 4: you know, as a board certified urologist and especially trained
Speaker 4: microsurgeon that actually trained with you know, Mo and I
Speaker 4: go back back years Elliott.
Speaker 3: We both trained with Lipshoalz years ago.
Speaker 4: And yeah, here I am spending a lot of my
Speaker 4: life talking about cardiovascular preventive strategies. Not common, you know,
Speaker 4: but most of the time we're very siloed in our
Speaker 4: specialty and I have a surgical practice, so my entire
Speaker 4: existence and the reason that I trained so hard was
Speaker 4: to build to operate on people and have great surgical outcomes.
Speaker 4: But you know, there is a holistic lack in a
Speaker 4: lot of medicine these days, of looking at symptoms and
Speaker 4: treating just the symptom without looking at the genome. And
Speaker 4: that's what we're trying to do a little bit at
Speaker 4: a time through better individualized screening and so a lot
Speaker 4: of the I think the future of wearables is very interesting.
Speaker 4: And I didn't really mean to dig that hard on
Speaker 4: the continuous glucose monitors at the beginning, because you actually
Speaker 4: will find people diagnosing diabetes they didn't know they had
Speaker 4: it just by starting their cgms. But I do think
Speaker 4: there's a huge ability for especially as to become cheaper
Speaker 4: and cheaper. And this, I mean, what is your device
Speaker 4: retail for now? I'm going to give you a sales
Speaker 4: pitch justin but these are not devices.
Speaker 1: It reach also two seventy five yeah, about the same
Speaker 1: price is two good balls of one?
Speaker 4: Where do you going? And in office doppel or ultrasound?
Speaker 4: You know, I think even medicare allowable somewhere around eight
Speaker 4: or nine hundred bucks, and so you have one device
Speaker 4: that you know they can give multiple data points. And
Speaker 4: if we look at that over same thing, cgms are
Speaker 4: like thirty bucks now, I mean they're all of these
Speaker 4: things at home blood pressure cups for goodness sakes, you
Speaker 4: can get for thirty forty dollars to get all this
Speaker 4: information before you get to your doctor's office. And I
Speaker 4: think that's the hope, is that we're able to really
Speaker 4: tailor our medicine towards these So, yeah, what else you
Speaker 4: got for him?
Speaker 3: Jordan?
Speaker 2: I mean, I am a warrior by nature.
Speaker 1: Some men are warriors. I'm a warrior.
Speaker 2: Sexual health data it's among the most private information that
Speaker 2: a device can collect. What data does firm tech store?
Speaker 1: Who can access it?
Speaker 2: And could it ever be shared with advertisers, insurers or
Speaker 2: outside companies?
Speaker 1: Sure? Well, I appreciate the fact that you're a warrior.
Speaker 1: I don't like winers. Our data is started Amazon Web
Speaker 1: Services as a healthcare along with thousands and thousands and
Speaker 1: thousands of doctors and hospitals. We have a hippoc appliance.
Speaker 1: There are two people have signed Hippo contract in the company.
Speaker 1: I'm one of them. Our head of technology is the other.
Speaker 1: All the data is anonymatized ghost the cloud is given
Speaker 1: a code so we can use research purposes anonymously. We
Speaker 1: can't attribute anything to anyone in particular, I personally have
Speaker 1: never you know, if someone wants to consult with me
Speaker 1: or having to look at their data, they have to
Speaker 1: give me permission, and permission is a two step process
Speaker 1: so that they I mean, could it be hacked? What
Speaker 1: can't be hacked? Someone really wants to get at it.
Speaker 1: But it's as secure as we can possibly make it.
Speaker 1: And we are, you know, using usual and customary for
Speaker 1: a hospital, physician offices. Security protections great.
Speaker 3: So before I let you go, I also have a question.
Speaker 4: I ask everybody that is a men's health specialist, or
Speaker 4: actually just anybody honestly that comes on the show, is
Speaker 4: what is it that makes you you that's non negotiable
Speaker 4: on a daily basis.
Speaker 3: I have an idea based on what we just.
Speaker 4: Talked about, But tell me, you know, before you get
Speaker 4: your day started, you know, what do you have to
Speaker 4: do to know that you're going to have a good
Speaker 4: day and you're gonna be able to take great care
Speaker 4: of your patients, great care of your company and stewardship
Speaker 4: of what you're doing now, So what is the non
Speaker 4: negotiable that makes doctor justin doctor justin?
Speaker 1: I think that secks every day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think.
Speaker 1: Okay, you know, we talked about how, you know, like
Speaker 1: mother would say, apple dack is doctor a way because
Speaker 1: you want to eat fruit and fruits certainly healthy. I
Speaker 1: think it ALLGA has some day keeps the doctor away,
Speaker 1: and that's something that everyone should just buy it too.
Speaker 3: There you go.
Speaker 1: How do I start my day to be in a
Speaker 1: good mood? I look, I'm blessed. I live in Montana.
Speaker 1: I get up with Dawn. I'm now married thirty eight years.
Speaker 1: I make my wife coffee. We spend about the first
Speaker 1: half hour our day and bed together. I can say
Speaker 1: we make love in the morning. We were kind of
Speaker 1: night time people, but starting that day with intimacy with
Speaker 1: love every day makes my life rich. I wake up, Look,
Speaker 1: this is most fun we've had in my life. I've
Speaker 1: started seven companies, this one to talk about sex and
Speaker 1: health every day, to be involved with research and wear.
Speaker 1: Both are taking men's health in the twenty first century
Speaker 1: objective personalized care. I'm having a lot of fun and
Speaker 1: it's the latest.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's great. I mean, I love this. This is
Speaker 3: why we do.
Speaker 4: This is why we talk about what we talk about
Speaker 4: on the show. And also those are some actionable items.
Speaker 4: I think that what we learned today is that for
Speaker 4: the right guy, which maybe in your case is every
Speaker 4: guy should have some better control not only of his metrics,
Speaker 4: but what this could be an indicator of as well
Speaker 4: as it actually works as a functional improvement to enhance
Speaker 4: sexual experience.
Speaker 3: And so so.
Speaker 4: Doctor Justin you delivered on the mailroom and I'm so
Speaker 4: happy you came and that we had a good objective talk.
Speaker 4: We talked about science, we talked about how not all
Speaker 4: science has created equal and.
Speaker 3: And where where can guys find you?
Speaker 1: Now?
Speaker 4: I will give you your your plug in terms of how
Speaker 4: is this device accessible?
Speaker 3: Where can people learn more about it?
Speaker 1: Sure you can find us at my firm tech M
Speaker 1: Y F I R M T H myfirmtech dot com.
Speaker 1: You can reach me personally at Elliott L. L IoT
Speaker 1: at myfirmtech dot com. And it was great being here.
Speaker 1: Thanks for the opportunity so much.
Speaker 3: Well, I look forward. We'll talk offline.
Speaker 4: As I know all the guys that you mentioned, we
Speaker 4: all hang in the same circles, so I think there
Speaker 4: could be some interesting research we could do in Perni's
Speaker 4: as well.
Speaker 3: So so yes, I'm sure we'll.
Speaker 4: Be in touch and and hope to have you back
Speaker 4: with some more interesting device, especially as you look in
Speaker 4: the world of female sexual dysfunction, which I think is
Speaker 4: very understudied, as you know, so so I applaud you
Speaker 4: for exploring that at as well to to you know,
Speaker 4: level the playing field, level the bedroom. So I appreciate it.
Speaker 4: Thanks so much, everybody, have a great rest of your day.
Speaker 3: Thanks so much. Take us out, Jordan long Transit.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about it.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about the maro.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about it.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about it.
Speaker 1: A maro. Let's talk about it. Let's talk about it.
Speaker 2: An The mail Room with Doctor Jesse Mills was a
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Speaker 2: It was edited, mixed, and mastered by Behead Fraser, and
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Speaker 2: not represent the official positions of UCLA or UCLA Health