1 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:03,320 Speaker 1: Calls media. 2 00:00:06,040 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 2: Hey, so look, contractually I'm allowed one more rerun. So 3 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:17,880 Speaker 2: the one I want to run though, is something from 4 00:00:17,920 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 2: the It Can Happen Here series of shows that my 5 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:31,159 Speaker 2: man James did on the Darien Pass down at the 6 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 2: Mexico border outside of San Diego. I got to go 7 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:39,239 Speaker 2: down there with him and meet up with some of 8 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:44,200 Speaker 2: those folks out there doing mutual aid and meeting people 9 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:48,800 Speaker 2: at the border, providing these vast buckets of like beans 10 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 2: and rice and like wasted charge their phones and warm clothes. 11 00:00:53,000 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 2: It's it's the realist. It's like simultaneously the most beautifl 12 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:04,760 Speaker 2: full and tragic thing you'll see. I mean, every language 13 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 2: was spoken there. 14 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:07,160 Speaker 3: They're just. 15 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:12,199 Speaker 2: It ain't it's just a whole in defense and people 16 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 2: just walked in. There's no this no man's land of 17 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 2: asylum seeking and James, James lived down there, and James 18 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 2: pulls up on him people and is really about that life. 19 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 2: It was so inspiring to me. It reminded me of 20 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 2: this story. It's all just intro. When I was in Cameroon, 21 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 2: performed at this maximum security prison. Believe it or not, 22 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 2: but maximum security prison for you know, developing country Africa 23 00:01:54,160 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 2: means there is no security. It's just overwhelmed with the inmates. 24 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:03,680 Speaker 2: I mean it's just people sitting in the office just 25 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 2: like on the floor and I'm like, yo, are these 26 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 2: people just sitting there or they're prisoners. There's just no 27 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 2: space for them. Some of them but ass naked, And 28 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 2: part of it was you'll learn why later. And then 29 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 2: the people that was escorting me and the homies to 30 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 2: the stage to perform, then no uniforms and nothing. It 31 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:29,919 Speaker 2: was like it is volunteers. So we performed. It was great, 32 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 2: the most amazing experience. And then after it was over, 33 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 2: just like commotion started happening. And I mean, like, I 34 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,120 Speaker 2: don't know if you ever how terrifying it is to 35 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 2: like have a crowd press on you. But that crowd 36 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 2: ain't even speaking your language. And our prisoners and how 37 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 2: the people were we had to get rushed out. How 38 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:58,960 Speaker 2: the people were rushing us out. They just had like 39 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:02,359 Speaker 2: tire shreds and coaxo cables and we're whipping dudes back 40 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,800 Speaker 2: to like get get back for us to get out. 41 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:10,000 Speaker 2: We won't even know why they doing this, right, So 42 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 2: the guy tells us why they're doing this. He was like, well, y'all, 43 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 2: didn't bring no like food or clothes. They was like, 44 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 2: we can't eat these songs. I was like, yo, we're 45 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 2: supposed to. You ain't tell us we were supposed to 46 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:28,959 Speaker 2: bring food and why didn't we bring food and clothes? 47 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:37,440 Speaker 2: I I don't understand why. They was like, so they 48 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 2: thought you just came to perform, but you didn't bring 49 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 2: no food. They was like, yeah, the the prison system 50 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 2: in Cameroon, they don't provide anything the families provided. They 51 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 2: don't provide clothes, they don't provide food, and don't provide 52 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 2: none of that. So if your family don't bring nothing, 53 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 2: you don't get nothing. So us as as a community, 54 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 2: you know, it was a church community, a hip hop community, whatever, 55 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,320 Speaker 2: we're the ones that like bring the stuff. And I 56 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,960 Speaker 2: was like, dang, man, that's crazy, as it's riot ever 57 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 2: happened before. He was like, yeah, man, it happened last week. 58 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 2: I was like, Waitchall was here last week. He was like, 59 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 2: we come every week. I thought we were special. I 60 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 2: thought coming in here and performing this thing was my duty. 61 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 2: That I could pat myself on the back for the 62 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 2: rest of my life and say that I did. They 63 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 2: come every week. They usually bring food and clothes, but 64 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 2: they come every week. So that moment down there where 65 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,680 Speaker 2: I was really feeling myself about doing something great for 66 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:43,159 Speaker 2: the border crisis was like, oh, we get up and 67 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 2: do this tomorrow. Here's episode one of that series. 68 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 4: The most difficult part of the journey is when you 69 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:08,280 Speaker 4: are taking and you'll meet dead bodies on the road. 70 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 4: It makes you weep, it makes you cry, but there's 71 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:21,720 Speaker 4: only one focus in the forest ahead. You'll have to 72 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 4: keep going. You'll see mothers, children, They are crying just 73 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 4: to have a sip of water. It is not easy. 74 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,920 Speaker 5: A few weeks ago, I found myself sitting beside the 75 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:48,600 Speaker 5: Tuquesa River on a warm afternoon in late September, making 76 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:50,840 Speaker 5: silly faces at the two minths old baby as we 77 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:55,359 Speaker 5: both marveled at the cloud yellow butterflies. Anywhere else on earth, 78 00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:58,240 Speaker 5: it could be in a delict summer day, but in 79 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 5: these final steps of the journey across the da it's 80 00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 5: hard to open up your mind to experience joy. I'd 81 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:07,480 Speaker 5: only been in the tiny Emberra village of Bajo Jiquito 82 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 5: a couple of days, and I had already seen the 83 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 5: lifeless body of a little girl. And so the migrants 84 00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:15,479 Speaker 5: carried her into town. The river I was sleeping around 85 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,359 Speaker 5: him with this group of migrants resting here in the 86 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:20,520 Speaker 5: shade had swept sleeping children to their deaths earlier this year. 87 00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 5: An up tostream of me, there were at least three 88 00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:27,279 Speaker 5: people's remains here. It was shin deep. The crossing up 89 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 5: stream where it's above head height and rages down out 90 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 5: of the mountains in steep ravines was the migrants I 91 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 5: walked back to town with told me the stuff of nightmares. 92 00:06:36,760 --> 00:06:38,960 Speaker 5: The voice you just heard was a migrant from Cameroon 93 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 5: who called himself James. That's not his real name, and 94 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 5: astute listeners would have noticed that it is my real name, 95 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 5: but for the protection of James and his family, it's 96 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 5: a name we'll be using. When I met James. We're 97 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 5: in a migrant reception center called Las Blancas, to the 98 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:55,200 Speaker 5: north of. 99 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 6: The Dayan Gap. 100 00:06:56,920 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 5: To get there, one has to take a dugout canoe 101 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:03,320 Speaker 5: called a pira were from Bajo Jiquito. The voyage takes 102 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 5: five hours, and for that five hours, migrants are packed 103 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 5: fifteen to a boat wearing bright orange life jackets. They 104 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 5: share the boat with Nembra Piraguero, who sits at the 105 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 5: back driving the boat with a tooth stroke motor, and 106 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:17,360 Speaker 5: a guide who sits on the front, using a pole 107 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 5: when necessary to push the boat through shallow sections. The 108 00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 5: Umbrada people are indigenous to the area that's commonly known 109 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 5: as a Dalian Gap, or at least to this part 110 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:28,560 Speaker 5: of it, and a tiny Embrea village of Bajo Jiquito. 111 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 5: It's a first settlement migrants encounter is they emerge from 112 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 5: the perilous crossing of the jungle that divides Central America 113 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 5: from South America and thousands of people from a better future. 114 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 5: There's a morale patch that the Panamanian Border patrol and 115 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 5: military wear on their uniforms. There reflects a slogan in 116 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 5: a government messaging campaign, d esna Jungla. It says the 117 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:54,600 Speaker 5: campaign was launched in August, and it translates to the 118 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:56,680 Speaker 5: Darien isn't a route or maybe a road to a 119 00:07:56,720 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 5: better translation, it's a jungle. Obviously it's actually both, but 120 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 5: this is like no route. Most of us will be 121 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:07,600 Speaker 5: familiar with. The dark and foreboding jungle I saw in 122 00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 5: Bahajiguito is one of the most impenetrable on Earth, and 123 00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:13,600 Speaker 5: the crossing of it is among the most dangerous land 124 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 5: migration routes. In the nineteen seventies, the British Army set 125 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 5: its most experienced explorers to find a way through the gap. 126 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 7: Their commander called the gap a. 127 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:23,679 Speaker 6: Gold forsaken place. 128 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 5: Today, migrants have their own names for it, Ruta del 129 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 5: morte or sometimes the green Hell. Here's a group from 130 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,679 Speaker 5: Cameroon explaining why they didn't see a future there and 131 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 5: they decided to take this dangerous route. 132 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 8: We are coming from Cameroon. My name is Powers. There's 133 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 8: a lot of crisis in our country. That's the civil 134 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 8: war going on in Cameroon right now because of our president. 135 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 8: President Pombia has been in power over forty two years. 136 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:52,559 Speaker 8: So all the anglophone we set a revolting for him 137 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 8: to step down because he doesn't develop the Southern American Sorry, 138 00:08:56,840 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 8: the English section of Cameroon angler. Yeah, the anglophone revert 139 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 8: ins that you was set in the military and what's 140 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:08,480 Speaker 8: killing the citizens of our country. There's a lot of harseship, 141 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 8: a lot of dead eye For one, I've lost everybody. 142 00:09:11,160 --> 00:09:13,079 Speaker 8: I lost four of my family, my mom, my dad, 143 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 8: my two brothers, and I'm the only one left. So 144 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 8: thanks no, there's no job. I've completed a school, but 145 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 8: there's nothing for me to do, so that's why it 146 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:22,319 Speaker 8: decided to migrate. 147 00:09:23,720 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 5: To get to baho Jiquito from Columbia with James and 148 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:29,679 Speaker 5: other migrants did. There's no road you can take. You 149 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 5: can't even take a boat or a train. Instead, you 150 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:37,080 Speaker 5: have to walk the Dairying Gap, an area of rainforested mountains, 151 00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 5: so it's one of the most dangerous migration routes in 152 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 5: the world. For anywhere between two and fifteen days, migrants 153 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 5: trek through waste time, mud and rivers deeper than they 154 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:51,520 Speaker 5: are tall. They must climb giant boulders, cross perilous ravines, 155 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:55,720 Speaker 5: and traverse sheer cliff faces, all of this with barely 156 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 5: any water than what they can carry, little to no food, 157 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 5: inadequate clothing, a terrible footwear, and no medical attention. They 158 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 5: must walk past dead bodies and past people who might 159 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 5: soon become dead bodies. As they beg for help. They 160 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 5: carry their children, their dreams, and sometimes each other, across 161 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 5: mountains and rivers, and in bou Jiqito they take what 162 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:20,240 Speaker 5: for many of them will be the final steps of 163 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:23,839 Speaker 5: this part of their journey. It's a journey that few 164 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 5: of us can imagine, and they were lucky to be 165 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:29,480 Speaker 5: able to avoid. My own migration to the US sixteen 166 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:33,319 Speaker 5: years ago was much simpler and safer. But for migrants 167 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 5: like James, the journey's worth it because what they're leaving 168 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 5: behind is worse. Here's James describing the situation in the 169 00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 5: stative Cameroon. 170 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 7: The situation in Cameroon is, how can I put it, 171 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 7: very very. 172 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 4: Very very difficult, especially in the anglophone part of the country. Yeah, 173 00:10:56,840 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 4: because for about five to six years there's a world 174 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 4: the ongoing war in the angry phone crisis. We also 175 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 4: have been there has been fighting, has been shooting, killings. 176 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:22,679 Speaker 4: I'm myself speaking to you. Yeah, I've been targeted. My 177 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:31,160 Speaker 4: cousin was shot and with his husband were shot together. 178 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:37,080 Speaker 7: Both of them were Nessis and they were shot by 179 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 7: the army that were. 180 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 4: There to protect the people. So the situation back at home, 181 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:50,800 Speaker 4: it's very very tense. Yeah, it's very very tense. When 182 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:55,520 Speaker 4: you see most of Camaronians traveling taking the Rik's part 183 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:59,840 Speaker 4: from Columbia brazy right up to where I am. 184 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 7: It is not because they like it. It is because 185 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:04,840 Speaker 7: of the situation back. 186 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 4: At home and most of it, and most of the 187 00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 4: time it is the anglophone population that is suffering most 188 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 4: of them. They choose this part because they will not 189 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 4: have a direct result to America. 190 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 6: Yeah, it's very hard to get one. 191 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 4: Yes, it's very very difficult, so they have to use 192 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 4: the hard way, which is the only way. 193 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:27,120 Speaker 5: The truth is dead bodies, terrible stories and families celebrating 194 00:12:27,160 --> 00:12:29,640 Speaker 5: the end of their work is nothing out of the ordinary. 195 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 5: And Bahajiqito, the Enbarra town with the population of just 196 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 5: five hundred and ninety's a place I've been trying to 197 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 5: come to for almost as long as I've been writing 198 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 5: about migration. There are a few stories in my time 199 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:42,760 Speaker 5: as a journalist that I've been pitching for close to 200 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:45,840 Speaker 5: a decade. Most of the time I give up if 201 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:48,559 Speaker 5: there are no bites after a few months. And that's 202 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:50,360 Speaker 5: why you won't see me write about the people who 203 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 5: try to hire mercenaries to intimidate voters in twenty twenty, 204 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 5: or the Burmese rebels w if I did their revolution 205 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:58,439 Speaker 5: with co op produced tea, or a surfing team in 206 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,320 Speaker 5: the Gaza strip and on reflect and you probably won't 207 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 5: hear about that last one anywhere now the media cycle 208 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:07,720 Speaker 5: has a way of coming around to these stories eventually, sure, 209 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 5: but I not really want to go back to what 210 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 5: it is you didn't give a shit about people before 211 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 5: and only care about their stories now because they get 212 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 5: more traffic. But there's one story I've never given up on. 213 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,199 Speaker 5: That's the story of the Daddy En Gap and the 214 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:22,520 Speaker 5: people who risk their lives crossing it for a shot 215 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:25,520 Speaker 5: at the American dream. And at this point I do 216 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 5: want to ignolige. I'm incredibly grateful to the people I 217 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 5: work with for trusting me when I asked them to 218 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 5: pay for me to disappear in a dugout canoe into 219 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,199 Speaker 5: the jungle and come back two weeks later with a 220 00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:38,240 Speaker 5: story the Daddy and looms in the stories of migrants 221 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 5: I meet in the US border as a sort of 222 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 5: heart of darkness on what is a very difficult and 223 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 5: dangerous journey. It's worse than the freight trains they hop 224 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:50,320 Speaker 5: on in Mexico, worse than the crowded buses, worse even 225 00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:53,760 Speaker 5: than the months of waiting for an asylum appointment. I 226 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:57,439 Speaker 5: firly believe that you can't really understand and write about 227 00:13:57,559 --> 00:14:01,440 Speaker 5: things you haven't seen, smelt, and heard. So for years 228 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 5: I've been asking, yet it is to send me to 229 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:05,839 Speaker 5: the tiny ember our community on the banks of the river, 230 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 5: so that I could share the final steps of this 231 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:11,079 Speaker 5: horrific journey with the people who see little option but 232 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 5: to risk their lives for a better future for their children. 233 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 5: Because the US refuses to create more legal pathways, people 234 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 5: instead take the sudden pathway straight up and down the 235 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 5: mountains to the Darian rainforest. The journey will take them 236 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 5: past the corpse into people who never left. The terrain 237 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 5: is too fierce for anyone to carry their remains out, 238 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 5: so they must simply rut there as a reminder to migrants, 239 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 5: so they must keep going. It's a sort of deterrent 240 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 5: through death that has been the unofficial and official US 241 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:40,480 Speaker 5: border policy for decades. 242 00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:42,000 Speaker 6: To turn or not. 243 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 5: Once you're in the Daryan, there's no turning back, and 244 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:47,480 Speaker 5: the lack of escape routes has made the gap popular 245 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:51,680 Speaker 5: among criminals, who commit untold numbers of sexual assaults, murders, 246 00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:55,400 Speaker 5: and armed robberies every year in the jungle. Despite this, 247 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 5: more than half a million migrants made a perilous journey 248 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:00,400 Speaker 5: last year, and if many you have not, more will 249 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:00,640 Speaker 5: do so. 250 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 6: This year. 251 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:04,320 Speaker 5: Do you understand that, Daddy, And you have to first 252 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 5: understand US immigration policy, which is something I talk about 253 00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 5: a lot on this podcast. I want to include here 254 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 5: a clip from Amos am I going from North Africa 255 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 5: who met my friends and helped them build shelters in 256 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 5: the Cumba last year, explaining his journey to the United States. 257 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 3: So another route right now, which is a difficult route, 258 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:27,400 Speaker 3: is through Brazil because Brazil has a I don't know 259 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 3: if you guys know, and I think they do that 260 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 3: for Americans too. Yeah, so Brazil has sort of I 261 00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 3: don't know the word, but the equivalent to them is 262 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 3: if you impose a visa on Brazil, Brazilians will imposed 263 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:44,720 Speaker 3: his own news. They do that to Americans too, So 264 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 3: so you know where I'm from, they don't have a 265 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 3: visa to as far as for Brazilians, so we don't. 266 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 3: So a lot of Africans can go to Brazil and 267 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 3: from Brazil take the route all the way. 268 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 5: They Camos James couldn't fly here directly that he was 269 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 5: able to get a little bit closer to the US 270 00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:07,480 Speaker 5: by flying to Columbia. I'll let him explain how he 271 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 5: pulled that off. 272 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 4: For me, to have a pass to Colombia. It was 273 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 4: not easy, so we have we had to There was 274 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:22,840 Speaker 4: a female female on that twenty World Cup that was 275 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:28,240 Speaker 4: that was taking place in Colombia, so we had to 276 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:32,600 Speaker 4: go to Columbia as football fans. That's why they had 277 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:36,640 Speaker 4: They had to give us our bizare yes all right? 278 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:40,800 Speaker 4: From Colombia, we'll find our way out of the airport to. 279 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 6: Where we are. 280 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 5: Today, both from a continental America. We'll have to travel 281 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 5: to Brazil. Just like Amos he's won a cap. I'll 282 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 5: let the speakers introduce himselves. 283 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 9: My name is Tomayer, I'm from i Don. 284 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:02,000 Speaker 10: My name is Mohad for my name is Ali, and 285 00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 10: I'm Promiraan. 286 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:06,280 Speaker 5: They told me why they left around, but I'm sure 287 00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:07,760 Speaker 5: manage you could wear that went out of yourself, so 288 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 5: we won't included here. How did you come from Iran 289 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 5: to here? 290 00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:12,480 Speaker 7: You go for a Turkey? 291 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 10: It was so difficult, and we came from Iran, Tehran 292 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:25,120 Speaker 10: to Dubai, after that south all of Brazil and after 293 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:31,640 Speaker 10: that believe Peru, Ecuador, Colombia and Akokley and Jungle Panama 294 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 10: here Panama, and it was so difficult for us because 295 00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:43,359 Speaker 10: we're young. We just leave our family, my sister, my mother, father. 296 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 10: It was so emotional and it was so hard for us. 297 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:50,680 Speaker 10: But because of the freedom, because we can't speak in 298 00:17:50,760 --> 00:17:54,119 Speaker 10: our country. You know, if you speak in your in 299 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 10: the street, something like it, they will arrest you. Yeah, ja, 300 00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:03,679 Speaker 10: when you are not Muslim, when you really like something 301 00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:07,800 Speaker 10: like a Christian or something else, they verity, yes it. 302 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 10: It was so so, so, so difficult living in Iran, 303 00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 10: but it's a wonderful country, but not government. 304 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:19,640 Speaker 5: When I talk to migrants, I always want to offer 305 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 5: them the chance to share their stories in ways that 306 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:25,080 Speaker 5: they want to share them. And I asked them what 307 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:27,400 Speaker 5: they would want to say if they could talk directly 308 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:30,240 Speaker 5: to Americans. It's a question I ask a lot, because 309 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:32,439 Speaker 5: in all the coverage of migration I've seen in this country, 310 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:36,679 Speaker 5: I rarely see migrants' voices. I'm very familiar with being 311 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 5: the only journalist in a place, and I'd be lying 312 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:40,720 Speaker 5: if I said I didn't prefer it that way. But 313 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 5: I do always feel obliged to use the platform I 314 00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:46,280 Speaker 5: have here to give people a chance to share their stories, 315 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:49,680 Speaker 5: their voices, and their struggles. So here's their message to you. 316 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 10: We love you, hope too, you love is it's hard 317 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:54,320 Speaker 10: to share. 318 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,640 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I think that's very good. 319 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,920 Speaker 11: All right, be our next home and we should be 320 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:06,119 Speaker 11: proud of that, We should be bored for that. We 321 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 11: should be be a real American for the concert. 322 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:16,920 Speaker 9: Yeah, they know women are very bad situations, have a 323 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:24,359 Speaker 9: bad situation in Iran. Yeah, for all people, that is saying, 324 00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 9: but for women is very very, very hard. I think 325 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 9: American people know about Massa Amini. Yeah, and they really 326 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:41,359 Speaker 9: they chill us, really, they chill women for simple things. 327 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:46,160 Speaker 5: I heard hundreds of stories like this in my time 328 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:49,080 Speaker 5: in Bajo Jiquito and the last Blancast migrant reception center 329 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 5: that migrants travel to after they arrive in Baja Chiquito. 330 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:56,480 Speaker 5: People left horrific things behind them and saw horrific things 331 00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,639 Speaker 5: on their journey, but they all remained hopeful for a 332 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 5: better future in America. These journeys, in some cases. 333 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:11,280 Speaker 6: Can take a year or more. 334 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:14,960 Speaker 5: One napoorly Man I met in Bajojuquito, I'd spent thirty 335 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 5: months just to get that far, and among his group, 336 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:22,199 Speaker 5: his journey had been the fastest. As long as these 337 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,320 Speaker 5: journeys are that Darien often stems out as the hardest 338 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:28,959 Speaker 5: part do understand why I want to take you back 339 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 5: to that shady spot by the river, just a few 340 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:34,760 Speaker 5: minutes south of Bajo Juquito. So what I'm doing right now, 341 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 5: you can hear from my foot depths, is I'm doing 342 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:39,120 Speaker 5: what it told me not to do. I'm walking along 343 00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:44,200 Speaker 5: the migrant trail. Lots of like vines and creepers and 344 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:50,440 Speaker 5: oh fucking hell, that's me ely eating shit. There's little 345 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 5: bits of tape marking a trail. I think they just 346 00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:57,159 Speaker 5: come down the river here, and some local guys are 347 00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:59,640 Speaker 5: pushing out wheelbarrows on the trail to dump trash. There's 348 00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 5: trash everywhere to fucking mess. Uh the little wood arrows 349 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,320 Speaker 5: that they've carved just outside town to direct people into town, 350 00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:10,680 Speaker 5: and if I heard, I can see migrants making what's 351 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:15,240 Speaker 5: probably hopefully their final crossing of the river here. One 352 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 5: thing I noticed was that as soon as I got 353 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 5: out of sight in near shot of the town, the 354 00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 5: jungle seemed a lot more intimidating. I'm somebod who spends 355 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:24,680 Speaker 5: a lot of time in the mountains, and I grew 356 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,760 Speaker 5: up playing in the woods. I'm comfortable outdoors, and I 357 00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:29,880 Speaker 5: frequently camp and hike for days on my own. 358 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,640 Speaker 6: I like it better that way, and I might. 359 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 5: See more comfortable forty feet under the sea free diving, 360 00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:36,879 Speaker 5: or three hours from the nearest road. Then I'm in 361 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,359 Speaker 5: a busy city sometimes, but in the jungle, after all 362 00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 5: the stories I'd heard that week. 363 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:46,240 Speaker 6: I was afraid. I get scary. I don't know why. 364 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:51,639 Speaker 6: I mean, everything's new to me. I'm, you know, relatively 365 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:53,000 Speaker 6: comfortable in the outdoors. 366 00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:58,320 Speaker 5: But fucking there's new animals, there's new plants. I don't 367 00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:01,639 Speaker 5: know what's poisonous, what's going to kill me, and who's 368 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 5: going to try and hurt me? 369 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,399 Speaker 6: Got another fucking horse, Jesus wept. I'm jumping out my skin. Everything. 370 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 6: Now it's funny. 371 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:19,239 Speaker 5: I'm in a place that's beautiful, you know, like these 372 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:23,840 Speaker 5: better paradise plants are just just growing. Here's gorgeousness. Horses 373 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:29,800 Speaker 5: along to people of the black community. I suppose it's 374 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:35,159 Speaker 5: having snacks, you know, eating jungle horse food. And here 375 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:35,840 Speaker 5: here I'm at the river. 376 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 6: It's wide. 377 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:40,119 Speaker 5: Here, it's sort of shallow, and it's been dammed up 378 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:42,280 Speaker 5: a little bit with rubbish, just like flocks and and 379 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:43,320 Speaker 5: jets some kind of stuff. 380 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 12: And then. 381 00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:47,959 Speaker 5: This is where people cross because of that little dam, 382 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:49,920 Speaker 5: but it's still got some force to it, like you 383 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:53,119 Speaker 5: wouldn't want to fall and crack your head or you know, 384 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:53,760 Speaker 5: a lot of these folks. 385 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,800 Speaker 6: You can't swim even without the fear. 386 00:22:56,840 --> 00:23:00,040 Speaker 5: It's hard going because you've only hiked on trails, so 387 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 5: I have don't realize how much work goes into making 388 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:05,600 Speaker 5: that surface possible. There are no trail crews in the Darien, 389 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 5: and as a result, every step has the potential to 390 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 5: results in a sprained ankle or another injury, which might 391 00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,199 Speaker 5: sound trivial but can be faithal in such a remote 392 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 5: and challenging place. Trail is all rocks, like maybe rocks 393 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:22,200 Speaker 5: the side of a fist by that way now, and 394 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:24,800 Speaker 5: then there are sort of in this area we only 395 00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,640 Speaker 5: have the lower canopy, so we have ferns, we have reeds, 396 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 5: bamboo plants growing really tall and straight, that's what they 397 00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 5: use for the poles that the pit I was, and then. 398 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:37,600 Speaker 6: Sort of low grassy kind of plants. 399 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker 5: And then where the migrant to walk is just this 400 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:41,880 Speaker 5: muddy trail that every time it range just turns into 401 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 5: like ankle to. 402 00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 6: Knee deep mud. 403 00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:47,440 Speaker 5: And I could see them making pretty slow progress along 404 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,320 Speaker 5: the trail towards me. At the end of the day, 405 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 5: as I took a piaguard back to Madagante, where I 406 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 5: would be staying the night, I reflected again on this 407 00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 5: and the incredible tenacity it took for people with little 408 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:01,919 Speaker 5: outdoor experience some terrible equipment to pass through the jungle. 409 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 5: You know, I'm a fit person. I run ultramarathons. I 410 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 5: used to be exercised for a living. And it's fucking hard. 411 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 5: It's wet, everything's wet all the time. If you're wet 412 00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:18,359 Speaker 5: from the rain, then you're wet. If you're wet from 413 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,520 Speaker 5: the sweat and you're wet. If you cross rivers, you 414 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:24,240 Speaker 5: get wet. You just can't stay dry. And everyone's feet 415 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:26,359 Speaker 5: are just fucked when they get into town, like the 416 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:30,640 Speaker 5: size of the blisters I've seen, And like one lady 417 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,600 Speaker 5: had a cramp today where like it just locked up 418 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:35,240 Speaker 5: a whole that she like I grabbed her or she 419 00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,399 Speaker 5: was falling down and I was able to hold her up. 420 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 5: But people are really pushing themselves physically as well as psychologically. 421 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 5: That river crossing south of Bachigito was as far south 422 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 5: as I was going to be able to get without 423 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:52,480 Speaker 5: being forced tobly abjected from Panama, and my request to 424 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,239 Speaker 5: take a boat or walk further south was denied by 425 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,600 Speaker 5: the Panamanian Ministry of Security. So the only part of 426 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:00,800 Speaker 5: the migrants journey I would share with them with their 427 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 5: last kilometer or so of their walk. Even then, I 428 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,040 Speaker 5: wasn't really supposed to be leaving town at all, So 429 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:10,399 Speaker 5: several times over the days I spent in Bajajiquito, I 430 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 5: would look over my shoulder, hop down the river bank, 431 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:16,120 Speaker 5: jump across the stream, and lightly jog out of town. 432 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 5: Once on the trail, I'd started to walk slowly and 433 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,160 Speaker 5: try and waive a groups of outcoming migrants. I didn't 434 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 5: want to scare them. 435 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:24,679 Speaker 6: I offered to. 436 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 5: Carry their bags and gant any help I could, supporting 437 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:30,160 Speaker 5: them as they walked towards their first meal and clean 438 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:52,119 Speaker 5: drink of water. In up to a week, just getting 439 00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:54,200 Speaker 5: to bajaji Gito was a journey in itself for me. 440 00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:58,200 Speaker 5: I took two flights a five hour drive, which was 441 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,520 Speaker 5: equally split between paved roads, roads that aspired to pavement, 442 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 5: and dirt roads. At the end of our road journey, 443 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 5: the Pan American Highway, the links Alaska to Argentina, seems 444 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,280 Speaker 5: to give up on fighting the jungle and Peter's out. 445 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:15,480 Speaker 5: Asphalt turned to worse asphalt, which turned to dirt, which 446 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:19,639 Speaker 5: turned to mud, which led us to a river. A driver, however, 447 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 5: was prepared for this. 448 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:24,919 Speaker 6: The drive here was mad, like that road was fucked. 449 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:26,360 Speaker 6: We're in this tiny little card. 450 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 5: The driver took off his shoes and socks to conduct 451 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:32,280 Speaker 5: the more technical section of the drive, which I thought 452 00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:36,399 Speaker 5: was quite amusing. And yeah, really steep, lots of holes, 453 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 5: lots of potholes, you know, just really rutted out a 454 00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 5: kind of dirt road. 455 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,919 Speaker 6: And then we got here and took. 456 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:46,960 Speaker 5: Some guys, negotiated a price and told them where we 457 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,560 Speaker 5: wanted to go, and they said, yeah, sure, buy some water, 458 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,760 Speaker 5: you know, snow water on the way about three hours 459 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:56,520 Speaker 5: and so we bought some water right there, and yeah, 460 00:26:56,560 --> 00:27:00,639 Speaker 5: here we are on the boat now, as you can hear. 461 00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,119 Speaker 5: I recorded this on a piragua. It's a kind of 462 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:05,800 Speaker 5: dugout canoe with the hole made out of a single 463 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:08,360 Speaker 5: tree and a tooth stroke motor bolted on the back. 464 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:11,119 Speaker 5: It's the only way to travel here other than on 465 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:14,479 Speaker 5: your feet, and it's the only way the Embarra can 466 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,760 Speaker 5: get the produced cigaret to market. The skill of the Piragueros, 467 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:22,360 Speaker 5: the people who drive the piraguas, is incredible. They navigate 468 00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 5: parts of the river so shallow that they have to 469 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,719 Speaker 5: pull up the tooth stroke motor, and I noticed all 470 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 5: the motors have propellers that are covered in chips and 471 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,520 Speaker 5: bashes from smacking into the rocks at the bottom. In 472 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:34,480 Speaker 5: the bow of the boat, I sat on top of 473 00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 5: my giant rucksack, marveling at the birds, insects, and foliage 474 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 5: of the jungle, and occasionally I jumped up to make 475 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:46,040 Speaker 5: fairly useless contributions with the boat's bamboo pole under the 476 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 5: close supervision of Marcellino, our driver, and a soon to 477 00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:51,560 Speaker 5: be host for mostly just laughed at me as I 478 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 5: leaned my whole way into the pole, which nosably slipped, 479 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:56,480 Speaker 5: and I tried to avoid falling face first into the 480 00:27:56,560 --> 00:28:00,960 Speaker 5: chocolate brown water. On the way to Baajiki, we passed 481 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:04,520 Speaker 5: several small lumber our villages. Little children waved at us 482 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:06,239 Speaker 5: from the banks or from the shallows of the river 483 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 5: where they washed and played. Adults looked on and doubtless 484 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,200 Speaker 5: why there One nurse's Exct. Three white dude was going 485 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 5: the wrong way on the river for a migrant but 486 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 5: they smiled and waved back anyway. After an overnight flight, 487 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:21,359 Speaker 5: a five hour drive, and three hours in a dugout canoe, 488 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:24,880 Speaker 5: we rounded a corner in the river. Bao Jigito came 489 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 5: into view. Over the last few years, it three oorientated 490 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,919 Speaker 5: itself from a tiny indigenous village to an unofficial reception 491 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 5: center for migrants. On my hopelessly outdated topo map, the 492 00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 5: area has nothing but contours and green shading, no roads, 493 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 5: no trails, no markets of human existence at all, And 494 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 5: perhaps that's how the state sees this place. The Daddy 495 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 5: n is as real to most Panamanians a Sesame street 496 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,959 Speaker 5: or Jurassic park, But for them this has been their 497 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,800 Speaker 5: home since long before Panama and Columbia and even maps existed. 498 00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:01,240 Speaker 5: A few dozen houses in the village, mostly built on 499 00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 5: stilts to avoid the seasonal floods, now, offer up their 500 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 5: rooms as hostels for the migrants. Some of them have 501 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:11,760 Speaker 5: enclosed at bottom floor using plywood or cinder blocks. Others 502 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:15,200 Speaker 5: have strung hammocks from their support posts. For four or 503 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 5: five bugs, migrants can get their first good night's sleep 504 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 5: since they left Neck or Clee in Columbia as much 505 00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:23,680 Speaker 5: as a week before. Along the main street, which is 506 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,240 Speaker 5: really just to raise concrete footpath about a meter across, 507 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 5: you can buy a meal any of half a dozen 508 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,560 Speaker 5: places for five bucks. You can get an hour of 509 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:33,600 Speaker 5: Wi Fi for a dollar, or charge your phone for 510 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,600 Speaker 5: at the same price. Cold drinks for a dollar as well. 511 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:38,680 Speaker 5: Are one of the many front rooms that have turned 512 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 5: into small kiosks. And that's where the migrants I have 513 00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:43,440 Speaker 5: been sitting down with at the river went. When they're 514 00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 5: arrived into town, I let them be for a while 515 00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,720 Speaker 5: I went off to interview more migrants. About a thousand 516 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 5: of them arrive in this village every day. Each year 517 00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 5: since a pandemic has seen record numbers arrived, and the 518 00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 5: little village on the side of a hill, surrounded by 519 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 5: palm trees and full of smiling children in their traditional 520 00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:05,360 Speaker 5: brightly colored pollumers chasing chickens and dogs, has welcomed every 521 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 5: single one of them. About a thousand of them arrive 522 00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 5: in this town every day. 523 00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 7: To get here. 524 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 5: They also take a boat from necko'clee across the golf 525 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,120 Speaker 5: of the Dabienne. They crossed on small motor boats to 526 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,640 Speaker 5: Kapolgana or Kandel. Those are both towns on the western 527 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:22,280 Speaker 5: side of the Gulf of the Darienne. From there they 528 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:25,680 Speaker 5: begin their walk. Even though they're now north of the Dolf, 529 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,800 Speaker 5: they're still in Colombia and on the Colombian. 530 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:29,160 Speaker 6: Side of the border. 531 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:32,000 Speaker 5: They're guided by guides, to whom they pay several hundred 532 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:35,640 Speaker 5: dollars and in return received protection and a wristband that 533 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 5: ensures they can walk without being robbed. Nobody I spoke 534 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 5: to had made it this far without paying a guide. 535 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 5: The area is largely under the control of the Golf Cartel, 536 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,000 Speaker 5: several members of which were sanctioned by the USA. 537 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:49,080 Speaker 6: While I was in the jungle. 538 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:51,640 Speaker 5: The markers I spoke to didn't really have much bad 539 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,560 Speaker 5: to say about this part of their experience, but universally 540 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,280 Speaker 5: acknowledged that the next part was where they really confronted 541 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,480 Speaker 5: their fears and nightmares about the Daddy inne Here's one 542 00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:02,720 Speaker 5: Venezuelan migrant sharing his experience. 543 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 13: That's nothing compared to what comes from the border. To hear, Yes, 544 00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:10,720 Speaker 13: the road is better, and I say that the danger 545 00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:13,120 Speaker 13: is less too, and they have everything you need there. 546 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 13: You come prepared, you have, you come with water, and 547 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,719 Speaker 13: there are also many ravines where you can drink water well. 548 00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,120 Speaker 13: There are springs that come from the mountain, but from 549 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 13: the border on it's pretty ugly. 550 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 5: It's a stretch from the Colombian Panamanian border at a 551 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,600 Speaker 5: place that they call Las Banderas, which means to flags, 552 00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 5: to Bajo Chiquito, where migrants suffer the most. There they 553 00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:39,520 Speaker 5: can't drink from the river because a human waste and 554 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:42,920 Speaker 5: human remains that constantly fill it like the water deadly. 555 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:47,040 Speaker 5: They must walk on unmaintained trails. It often turns in 556 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 5: deep mud. They only have the supplies they carry, which 557 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 5: often run out, or they jettison to stave weight on 558 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 5: the incredibly steep mountain path. They climb and descend those 559 00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 5: mountains across rivers, often without eating or drinking for days 560 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,600 Speaker 5: at a time. On the trail, they passed by the 561 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:07,120 Speaker 5: bodies of their fellow travelers as a constant reminder of 562 00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 5: the risk they're taking. If you ask people in Panama City, 563 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,240 Speaker 5: they'll tell you that Dalian is closed now. Your president, 564 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:17,520 Speaker 5: Nose Raoul Molino was elected on a promise to shut 565 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:21,920 Speaker 5: down the gap, end the humanitarian crisis, and deport more 566 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,680 Speaker 5: migrants with US funding, and that funding has certainly arrived, 567 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:28,120 Speaker 5: with more than six million already spent since he took 568 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,640 Speaker 5: office in July. Since then, Panama has deported more than 569 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:35,840 Speaker 5: eleven hundred people to Venezuela, Cuba, Colombia. 570 00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 6: And India. 571 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:40,880 Speaker 5: Each of these has been funded by US taxpayers. Obviously, 572 00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:43,840 Speaker 5: the jungle isn't closed, and it can't really be closed, 573 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 5: but in an interview before he was elected, Molino said 574 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 5: that the border of the United States, instead of being 575 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 5: in Texas, has moved to Panama, and that is something 576 00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 5: he can do with US support. I spoke to us 577 00:32:57,840 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 5: in venezuel And ladies to help them carry their bags. 578 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:01,440 Speaker 5: It's a steep hill, and they were saying that no 579 00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 5: one had seen any barriers. I don't know when to 580 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,080 Speaker 5: think about any barriers or any fences in a Darian 581 00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,720 Speaker 5: and that like they hadn't heard it was closed. Evidently 582 00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:10,520 Speaker 5: it's not. I'm standing in front of one hundred people 583 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,280 Speaker 5: who just got off a boat from. 584 00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:14,040 Speaker 6: The Darienn. 585 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 5: Hubris Aside, the rhetoric of closing the Dadi m signals 586 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 5: are turn not just in Panamanian politics, but in the 587 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 5: way the world sees and handles migration. The US has 588 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:30,120 Speaker 5: always sought to externalize its borders from US train border 589 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 5: patrol officers and Dominican Republic along the border is Haiti 590 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:37,640 Speaker 5: to DHS agents deploying to Iraq and Afghanistan. As migration 591 00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:40,760 Speaker 5: has become more politicized, the US has sought to move 592 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,280 Speaker 5: its enforcement away from prying eyes and from compassion, and 593 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,200 Speaker 5: instead brought more trauma to a place that is already 594 00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:50,760 Speaker 5: so hard. I've spent much of the last decade of 595 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:52,960 Speaker 5: my life watching the state try to bring the mountains 596 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,080 Speaker 5: and desert close to where I live under its control. 597 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:59,800 Speaker 5: I've stood with Kumia people as the government dynamited their graveyards. 598 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,200 Speaker 5: I found border wal contractors lost deep in the mountains. 599 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 5: I've driven the impossibly steep concrete roads that they built, 600 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,719 Speaker 5: worried about my truck turning end on end. I've seen 601 00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:13,279 Speaker 5: billions of dollars thrown at these mountains, and I've seen 602 00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,200 Speaker 5: people with twenty dollars angle grinders or ladders made of 603 00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:19,920 Speaker 5: old palettes defeat the wall in moments. Trying to close 604 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,239 Speaker 5: borders doesn't work at home, and it won't work in 605 00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 5: the Daddy and Gap either. Just building the roads to 606 00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:27,799 Speaker 5: get the construction equipment into the gap is a gargantuan 607 00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,840 Speaker 5: task in any attempt to create a barrier across the 608 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 5: sixty kilometer wide wilderness area, or simply push migrants onto 609 00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:38,680 Speaker 5: other more dangerous routes, into places where you can't build 610 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:41,400 Speaker 5: and the places where nobody can rescue you if you 611 00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,719 Speaker 5: fall down or break your leg. That doesn't mean there's 612 00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 5: nothing the US can do. I saw first hand the 613 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:51,120 Speaker 5: impact of Americans spending here as migrants had a reception 614 00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,799 Speaker 5: center called Lajas Blancas, had their families torn apart, and men, 615 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,839 Speaker 5: women and children cried as their parents and partners were 616 00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:00,840 Speaker 5: taken away for a flight back to columb be A, Cuba, 617 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:04,480 Speaker 5: or Venezuela that my taxes helped to pay for. I 618 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:07,360 Speaker 5: consoled the children with toys and stickers and something to 619 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,799 Speaker 5: eat as their dads were loaded into a flatbed truck. 620 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 5: A government didn't send money to feed these children, but 621 00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,480 Speaker 5: it seemed to have the funds to fund their parents' deportation. 622 00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,920 Speaker 5: By deporting people from Panama, the US effectively deprives them 623 00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,240 Speaker 5: of much of the due process they should, in theory, 624 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,000 Speaker 5: have the right to in the United States, and the 625 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:28,200 Speaker 5: US can easily deport them back to places like Cuba 626 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:32,239 Speaker 5: and Venezuela, which he considers to be dictatorial regimes. The 627 00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:36,400 Speaker 5: US does not and cannot stop migration. People have always moved, 628 00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:39,880 Speaker 5: and people will always want a better future for their children. 629 00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,120 Speaker 5: What it can do is make it as painful and 630 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,480 Speaker 5: dangerous as possible. But the rais of word barriers in 631 00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:48,920 Speaker 5: the Daddy and Gap which I've seen person on social 632 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,840 Speaker 5: media didn't exist for the hundreds of migrants I spoke to. 633 00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:55,920 Speaker 5: No one I asked had even seen them, but what 634 00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:57,880 Speaker 5: they had seen was far worse. 635 00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 1: There are many rivers that you're forced into all the time. 636 00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:06,239 Speaker 1: You're putting your life and everything else on the line there. 637 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,080 Speaker 1: I was worried that the indigenous people would come out 638 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,120 Speaker 1: and do something to us. In the nights. I was 639 00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:15,160 Speaker 1: worried that any of the children, god forbid, would have 640 00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,399 Speaker 1: an accident. The same for me. It's horrible to think 641 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 1: about it now. 642 00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 5: This mother hood cross with a five, six, and sixteen 643 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:27,640 Speaker 5: year old child, the baby of six months. They'd all 644 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:30,040 Speaker 5: made it in one piece, but the journey clearly had 645 00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:31,160 Speaker 5: its impact on the children. 646 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 1: There are many people who are left out there without 647 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:37,720 Speaker 1: food and do not have anything to give to their children. 648 00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:41,840 Speaker 1: We had food until last night, nothing left now, and 649 00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:44,719 Speaker 1: we had to each one had to just eat a 650 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,160 Speaker 1: little bit because we had nothing else to give them. 651 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:50,440 Speaker 1: You can't find anything there. It's in the middle of nowhere. 652 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,360 Speaker 1: People died right now along with those who came with 653 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,600 Speaker 1: us yesterday. How many died yesterday? 654 00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 6: Three? 655 00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:00,640 Speaker 1: I think three died yesterday. One drowned in the river. Yeah, 656 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:01,879 Speaker 1: it's really tough. 657 00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:02,279 Speaker 14: This. 658 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:07,279 Speaker 1: No, no, nobody should do this. Nobody. We do this 659 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:10,200 Speaker 1: out of pure physical necessity to look for a better 660 00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 1: future for our kids. We can't stay in our country. 661 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:14,719 Speaker 1: We couldn't stay any longer. 662 00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:14,960 Speaker 6: There. 663 00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:17,960 Speaker 5: Here are a couple of the kids I spoke to, 664 00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:20,520 Speaker 5: or in some cases the kids who took my regorda 665 00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:22,239 Speaker 5: and conducted interviews with each other. 666 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:28,400 Speaker 1: The mountains, I was so tired and I couldn't climb anymore, 667 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:31,680 Speaker 1: And when I fell on the river, I was really scared. 668 00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:33,680 Speaker 12: Anymore. 669 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:39,359 Speaker 5: Apparently the whole thing was like an adventure she'd seen 670 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:42,360 Speaker 5: Pepper Pig having, which at once made me giggle and 671 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:44,440 Speaker 5: also one reflection, It's one of the saddest things I've 672 00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,120 Speaker 5: ever had to record. I'm sure her mum told her 673 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:49,160 Speaker 5: that to make it easier for her to pass through 674 00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:51,960 Speaker 5: a terrible place. They're really sure to be at home 675 00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:55,240 Speaker 5: washing Pepper pig and playing with her friends. No walking 676 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,080 Speaker 5: past three dead bodies which are currently decomposing on the trail. 677 00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:02,120 Speaker 5: She seemed remarkably resilly. She said the long bust ride 678 00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:04,360 Speaker 5: she'd taken to get there one boring because she enjoyed 679 00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:06,600 Speaker 5: looking out the window and the whole journey was. 680 00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:10,520 Speaker 6: Well, I'll let her say, Mamma, I'm not buying. 681 00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 14: Her. 682 00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:13,480 Speaker 6: Mum gave us a different account. 683 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:15,720 Speaker 14: Raho. 684 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:19,880 Speaker 15: I didn't want to cry because I didn't want her 685 00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:23,120 Speaker 15: to see me crying. But sometimes I would explode because 686 00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:25,759 Speaker 15: it's hard for your child to ask you for water, 687 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:27,799 Speaker 15: to ask you for food, and you don't have any 688 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:30,359 Speaker 15: to be in a place where you walk. You walk 689 00:38:30,400 --> 00:38:33,080 Speaker 15: from five in the morning, it's five in the afternoon. 690 00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:35,879 Speaker 15: You're walking, you don't know what to do, going through 691 00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:38,080 Speaker 15: more than one hundred rivers and asking God not to 692 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 15: rain and not wanting it to get worse. It rained, 693 00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 15: and the girl got a fever. 694 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:44,320 Speaker 6: She got a fever. 695 00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:48,120 Speaker 15: But well, God is good that we pray a lot. 696 00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:50,840 Speaker 15: I say that we don't know God so much in 697 00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:53,880 Speaker 15: the church from the process and the process that we 698 00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,480 Speaker 15: are in, and we don't know we can be so 699 00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,160 Speaker 15: strong until we go through that storm and we see 700 00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,280 Speaker 15: that he protect us. He knows that he was always 701 00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:04,000 Speaker 15: there watching over us, taking care of us at all times. 702 00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:08,719 Speaker 5: Parents being amazed at their children and drawing shrink from 703 00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:11,759 Speaker 5: them and their faith was a common message I heard 704 00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,640 Speaker 5: from migrants. He's a migrant from Zimbabwe telling me how 705 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:18,000 Speaker 5: her daughter inspired her to keep going, but she felt 706 00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:19,240 Speaker 5: like she couldn't walk anymore. 707 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,880 Speaker 14: My daughter, she was strong, she was strong, but she 708 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,120 Speaker 14: was crying also, but she has got wound all over 709 00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,080 Speaker 14: the body. Even me, I was crying myself. I was like, 710 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:32,440 Speaker 14: I want to just put myself in the water, then 711 00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:36,120 Speaker 14: I can just go both. The gene was tough, really 712 00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:40,120 Speaker 14: really tough. The mountain, the stones, the river. It's not 713 00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:45,120 Speaker 14: easy at all. It's not very I don't even recommended 714 00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:48,200 Speaker 14: someone to say you use daddy and gave no. And 715 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 14: even myself, I did know about it. I was regretting myself. 716 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:53,400 Speaker 10: I was crying. 717 00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:57,200 Speaker 14: I was like, God, I don't know my family and 718 00:39:57,360 --> 00:39:59,759 Speaker 14: my family they don't know where I am right now. 719 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:04,320 Speaker 5: But like so many other migrants, when the government of 720 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,000 Speaker 5: the world abandoned her, she found strength in the strangers 721 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:08,839 Speaker 5: along the road, who wouldn't abandon her. 722 00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 14: We didn't even eat anything. We just asked and people, 723 00:40:12,719 --> 00:40:14,320 Speaker 14: can I have a piece of biscuit? 724 00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 10: They just help us. 725 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:16,239 Speaker 7: That's nice. 726 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:17,400 Speaker 6: The other migrants helped you. 727 00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:18,600 Speaker 14: Yeah, the others. 728 00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:19,239 Speaker 5: Yeah. 729 00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:22,120 Speaker 6: Do you think that they treat African people differently? 730 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:27,520 Speaker 14: Very nice, especially these Spanish people, they are very nice. 731 00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:30,359 Speaker 14: I don't want to lie because if you need help, 732 00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:33,000 Speaker 14: you for call them for your The other ones they 733 00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:36,279 Speaker 14: might run away, but the other ones they just come 734 00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:40,359 Speaker 14: for help. They even give us tablets on the road, 735 00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:45,040 Speaker 14: give us energy drinks, give my daughter a sweets for energe. 736 00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:48,400 Speaker 14: They push us like, let's go, guys, let's call, let's go. 737 00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:52,040 Speaker 14: You make it, and we really make it. 738 00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:20,120 Speaker 5: The journey over the mountains to Banama has become more 739 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,800 Speaker 5: and more popular in recent years as other routes have 740 00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:26,360 Speaker 5: become more dangerous or closed themselves off to migrants entirely. 741 00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:30,200 Speaker 5: It's a route the Embira tell me that started with 742 00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:33,920 Speaker 5: people leaving India and then Haiti. It grew as conditions 743 00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:37,319 Speaker 5: in Venezuela became more unsustainable and people found themselves too 744 00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:40,040 Speaker 5: poor to stay home and too poor to travel north 745 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:43,120 Speaker 5: by any other means, and so they chose a deadly 746 00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:45,359 Speaker 5: jungle over a future in a country where their votes 747 00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:49,560 Speaker 5: don't matter. Last year, as many as half a million 748 00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:52,640 Speaker 5: people cross the jungle. This year we might see more 749 00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:56,200 Speaker 5: migrants arriving about Jiguito spend the day in the village 750 00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:58,640 Speaker 5: before taking off in a piagua of their own up 751 00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:01,640 Speaker 5: to Lahas Blancas the micro reception center I mentioned earlier. 752 00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:05,520 Speaker 5: They register with Panamanian Board Patrol known by the acronym 753 00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:08,760 Speaker 5: Cena Front, and they call their families to say they survived. 754 00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:12,680 Speaker 5: Then they dry out their blistered feet, enjoy the cooking 755 00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:14,760 Speaker 5: of several of the families who have turned their homes 756 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:18,720 Speaker 5: into sort of ersad's restaurants. They sleep on the floors 757 00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:21,800 Speaker 5: of the houses or underneath them, wardge their phones for 758 00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:25,160 Speaker 5: a dollar a time. Certainly, migration has changed this town, 759 00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:28,120 Speaker 5: and I want to talk about that more in tomorrow's episode. 760 00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:31,560 Speaker 5: But despite more than a million people passing through this route, 761 00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:36,760 Speaker 5: you don't find anti migrant sentiment here right now, Despite 762 00:42:36,760 --> 00:42:39,280 Speaker 5: the gap being a deadly de terrent, numbers are expected 763 00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:43,040 Speaker 5: to reach a record again this year, maybe seven hundred 764 00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:46,040 Speaker 5: thousand people will walk the gap. But despite these numbers, 765 00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:49,479 Speaker 5: which may seem high for a small country. I didn't 766 00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,160 Speaker 5: really find much anti migrant sentiment in Panama as a whole. 767 00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:55,440 Speaker 5: There's plenty of it in the US, though, And as 768 00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:58,040 Speaker 5: the United States winds down its war and terror, it 769 00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:01,240 Speaker 5: needs a new nebulous enemy to fight its military spending 770 00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,160 Speaker 5: and to keep the security into veillance companies donat into 771 00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:08,440 Speaker 5: politicians in their millions. In part, it is found that 772 00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:12,440 Speaker 5: by simply opening a floodgate of weapons and funding, they 773 00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:16,160 Speaker 5: can spew forth genocide and death in Palestine and keep 774 00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:17,440 Speaker 5: some of its income streams. 775 00:43:18,040 --> 00:43:20,160 Speaker 6: But it needs a more long term solution. 776 00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:23,319 Speaker 5: There are only so many Palestinian babies that can bomb, 777 00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:25,440 Speaker 5: and we'll run out of Palestinians long before we run 778 00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:29,200 Speaker 5: out of bombs. The USA is new enemy when it 779 00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:31,600 Speaker 5: must seek out all over the world. It's a migrant. 780 00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:35,080 Speaker 5: It's a woman I met carrying her child across the mountains. 781 00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:39,120 Speaker 5: The little Venezuelan girl throwing bottle caps into a cinderblock 782 00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:41,239 Speaker 5: with me to pass the time as she asked me 783 00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:44,640 Speaker 5: questions about America. It's a twenty one year old man 784 00:43:44,760 --> 00:43:46,920 Speaker 5: whose remains my friends found in the border on a 785 00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:50,399 Speaker 5: hot day this September. The US will stop at nothing 786 00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:53,080 Speaker 5: and fining and destroying the migrant, and just as it 787 00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:55,560 Speaker 5: did in the War on Terror, it will find fast 788 00:43:55,640 --> 00:43:58,400 Speaker 5: friends in states desperate to avail themselves to a seemingly 789 00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:02,520 Speaker 5: unlimited flow of resources. US dedicates to keeping its conflicts 790 00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,160 Speaker 5: out of the sights and the minds of its citizens. 791 00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,759 Speaker 5: The USA's open hostility to migrants isn't something that's unknown here. 792 00:44:19,680 --> 00:44:22,359 Speaker 5: Everyone I met knew about it. Several of them had 793 00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:25,440 Speaker 5: watched with horror as Kamala Harris and Donald Trump argued 794 00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:28,319 Speaker 5: not about how to treat migrants but about who could 795 00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:30,640 Speaker 5: turn more of them away. In a recent presidential debate, 796 00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,920 Speaker 5: Every migrant I met had questioned about CBP one, about 797 00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:37,960 Speaker 5: US asylum policy, and about how they could get to 798 00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:42,080 Speaker 5: the US before a second Trump administration. Despite this, they 799 00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:44,960 Speaker 5: all clung to their versions of the American dream. They 800 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:47,560 Speaker 5: wanted to work and be paid a fair wage, to 801 00:44:47,640 --> 00:44:50,080 Speaker 5: send their kids to school and maybe to college, to 802 00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,239 Speaker 5: feel safe in their homes, and to be able to 803 00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:56,160 Speaker 5: speak and dress as they wished without fearing consequences. All 804 00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:58,880 Speaker 5: of those things are imperiling this country too, and they 805 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:01,680 Speaker 5: know that, but they still feel their dreams are worth 806 00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:06,120 Speaker 5: the journey. For Noemi, little girl who took the daddy 807 00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:09,560 Speaker 5: in a astride, The American dream was pretty simple. She 808 00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:13,000 Speaker 5: wanted two things, to see Minnie Mouse and to see 809 00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:13,400 Speaker 5: her around. 810 00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:20,399 Speaker 12: Why am I miss a studio app? 811 00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:22,480 Speaker 2: Not yet? 812 00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:36,839 Speaker 12: An amimia a dia amida, It could happen. 813 00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:38,720 Speaker 1: Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 814 00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,960 Speaker 15: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 815 00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:44,600 Speaker 15: cool Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the 816 00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:48,520 Speaker 15: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.