1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: Hey, Betrayal fans, I have exciting news to share. Season 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:06,920 Speaker 1: three of Betrayal is now a docu series on Hulu. 3 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: It's the gripping story of Stacy Tyler and the doctor 4 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:13,320 Speaker 1: who betrayed them. See the voices you've come to know 5 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 1: in Betrayal Under His Eye, streaming now on Hulu. Before 6 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,600 Speaker 1: we start this episode, I want to let you know 7 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:24,599 Speaker 1: that this episode discusses suicide and its effects. Please take 8 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:25,479 Speaker 1: care while listening. 9 00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 2: He was just constantly chasing, chasing the next thing. No 10 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 2: car he bought was fast enough, no house we bought. 11 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 3: Was big enough. 12 00:00:37,200 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 2: The more money and more success that he had that 13 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:42,000 Speaker 2: almost turned him into this monster. 14 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 1: I'm Andrea Gunning, and this is Betrayal, a show about 15 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 1: the people we trust the most and the deceptions that 16 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 1: change everything. Today we're telling Kimberly's story. She grew up 17 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: in rural Pennsylvania where her parents owned their own hair salon. 18 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 1: They didn't have a lot of money, but they were 19 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:18,760 Speaker 1: determined to show Kimberly the world. 20 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 2: My parents would save up money and take us to 21 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 2: New York and go see Phanom of the Opera and 22 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:28,720 Speaker 2: Glamo's rob So we'd backpack through Europe and we went 23 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:32,080 Speaker 2: to like every single national park in the United States. 24 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 1: Kimberly's parents taught her that no dream was too big. 25 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 2: I wanted to be a teacher. I wanted to be 26 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 2: a journalist, I wanted to write a book. I wanted 27 00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 2: to be a veterinarian. And I remember my father used 28 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 2: to say, I don't ever worry about you. 29 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 3: I just know that. 30 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 2: You're going to always succeed and always land on your feet, 31 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 2: because you just have that determination. 32 00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:56,800 Speaker 1: Nobody in her family had gone to college, but Kimberly 33 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 1: decided she wanted to be the first in a small 34 00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 1: liberal arts school for women. 35 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 2: I was prepared academically, but I was not prepared to 36 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,160 Speaker 2: be moved into this group of very. 37 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 3: Affluent young women. 38 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 2: Many of them come from boarding schools, and they brought 39 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:18,679 Speaker 2: their own horses to campus. I would go to classes 40 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 2: and some of my classmates would be wearing pearls. 41 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 1: That was our first exposure to the world of wealth 42 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: and connections. Kimberly realized that if she wanted to make 43 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 1: it as far as her classmates, she'd have to make 44 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 1: her own way. She graduated with an English degree, and 45 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 1: she got hired at a publishing house in Washington, d C. 46 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:41,640 Speaker 2: I loved my job in publishing. I was always getting 47 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 2: to read and read all these manuscripts and see everybody's articles. 48 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: It was the nineties. DC was an exciting place for 49 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:54,240 Speaker 1: Kimberly to explore. A few months after she moved to 50 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 1: the city. 51 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 2: My friend was throwing a Halloween party and I was 52 00:02:58,360 --> 00:03:03,520 Speaker 2: actually dressed up as Carme and Miranda. I had a 53 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:05,520 Speaker 2: fruit basket on my head and a parrot. 54 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 1: There was a guy across the room who kept making 55 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 1: eye contact with her. 56 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:16,360 Speaker 2: He was cute, and he came over and he was like, 57 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:21,000 Speaker 2: I like your fruit basket, and it was just endearing. 58 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,720 Speaker 1: It was quite the icebreaker. His name was Tim. 59 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 3: He was blondes, blue eyes. Just something about him. 60 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 2: I just was like, Oh, he's really, really cute. 61 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 1: They started chatting. He'd also just graduated college and moved 62 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 1: to DC. 63 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 2: He was an only child from a small rural town 64 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 2: in Georgia. 65 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: They had mutual friends. Kimberly's roommate knew Tim. 66 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 2: My roommate was like, he's a great guy. Everyone knows him. 67 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 2: He's really wonderful. He asked for my number and I 68 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:58,760 Speaker 2: gave it to him. He called me shortly after that 69 00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:01,119 Speaker 2: and said, I'd would like to see you again. Would 70 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 2: you have any interest in going on a date? 71 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:07,280 Speaker 1: She said yes. He had two tickets to a black 72 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:10,200 Speaker 1: tie event for the opening of the Russian Embassy. 73 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:13,880 Speaker 2: The Russian Embassy was just fantastic. I was like, oh 74 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 2: my gosh, this is amazing. You know, free drinks and 75 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:18,799 Speaker 2: free food, and everyone's beautiful and dressed up in gowns 76 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 2: and textedos. I remember everything being like kind of dark 77 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 2: that lit up in like Lauder Crystal, and they had 78 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 2: shots of vodka, like tables and tables of vodka. I 79 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:34,840 Speaker 2: had this handsome young man in front of me, and 80 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:40,400 Speaker 2: I was really impressed. It was such a far cry 81 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:41,559 Speaker 2: from where I had come from. 82 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 1: It was a whirlwind night. She and Tim tried new 83 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: things like caviare and expensive alcohol. 84 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 3: You could tell he was like me. 85 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:52,720 Speaker 2: He also felt a little out of his comfort zone. 86 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 2: We fit in, but we didn't, and I think that 87 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:56,760 Speaker 2: was something that really drew. 88 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:57,480 Speaker 3: Us to each other. 89 00:04:58,200 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 1: Tim was in DC to make a name for him, 90 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 1: and like Kimberly, he'd gotten there on his own merits. 91 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 2: Tim worked for a senator and he specialized in technology 92 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:14,680 Speaker 2: and agriculture. He also had to drive the Senator regularly, 93 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 2: so he was his personal chauffeur and had breakfast with 94 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:19,200 Speaker 2: him things like that. 95 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:25,600 Speaker 1: They began exploring DC together and the black tie events continued. 96 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 1: For their next date, Tim took Kimberly to a party 97 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: at the National Post Office. 98 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 3: This's this amazing building. 99 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 2: It's huge, and that has this marble entry and you 100 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:38,840 Speaker 2: just walk in and they had live bands and all 101 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:43,479 Speaker 2: this wonderful food, and you'd be hobnobbing with congressman. I 102 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 2: remember meeting Ruth Bader Ginsburg. She had just been confirmed 103 00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 2: and they were holding a private meet and greet with her. 104 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 1: Tim loved how ambitious Kimberly was. He was her biggest cheerleader. 105 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,919 Speaker 2: I never felt that he was intimidated by that or 106 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 2: my drive for success. He was just so proud of me, 107 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:05,480 Speaker 2: and he would always say, I'm really proud of you. 108 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 3: You're doing so great. 109 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: That admiration was mutual. Kimberly and Tim always wanted to 110 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: be around each other. They're black Tie dates turned to 111 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 1: dinners and long conversations. They met each other's friends and families. 112 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 2: Our relationship got serious pretty quickly, and we dated for 113 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 2: two and a half years. 114 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:29,040 Speaker 1: After a year together, Tim made his intentions really clear. 115 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 2: He told me that I was the woman for him, 116 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 2: and he knew right off the bat that we were 117 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:40,719 Speaker 2: just made for each other and that I was the 118 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 2: love of his life and he wanted to spend the 119 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 2: rest of his life with me. He said, I really 120 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 2: want to take you to this great restaurant. It's the 121 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 2: Inn of Little Washington. It's right outside of d C. 122 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:56,600 Speaker 2: And at that point I was like, I think he's 123 00:06:56,600 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 2: going to propose. It was just such a beautiful dinner. 124 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:04,039 Speaker 2: The whole dinner went by and he didn't propose. I 125 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:05,920 Speaker 2: was like, well, maybe I just got it wrong. Maybe 126 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:08,240 Speaker 2: he just really wanted to go to this place. And 127 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 2: then he put his hand on his heart and he said, 128 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 2: I don't feel good. 129 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 3: I was like, oh, are you okay? 130 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 2: Because we ate so much rich food and like we're drinking, 131 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 2: and he's like, yeah, there's something that's like poking me 132 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 2: in my chest. 133 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:25,840 Speaker 3: And I was like, do you mean call a doctor? 134 00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 3: Like what's going? 135 00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 2: Like, were you okay? 136 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 3: And he's like he pulled out. 137 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 2: A box and he opened it up and he said, 138 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 2: I want you to be my wife. 139 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:35,400 Speaker 3: Will you marry me? 140 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 2: I was like, oh, because I already thought he was 141 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 2: like dying, you know, and then as that he proposed, 142 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 2: and I just I said, yes, yes, I'm glad, you're 143 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 2: You're okay. 144 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:51,280 Speaker 1: Yes. 145 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 2: I remember going to sleep that night just so happy 146 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:58,240 Speaker 2: and so excited. I remember just feeling so over the 147 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:00,880 Speaker 2: moon and just excited to start my life with this man. 148 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 1: She and Tim saved up and paid for their own wedding. 149 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:08,280 Speaker 3: We got married in nineteen ninety eight. His dad officiated 150 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 3: the wedding. 151 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 2: I know, we had a really fun Louisiana, New Orleans 152 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 2: band and everybody was just having the best time, and 153 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 2: everyone was dressed up and dancing. 154 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: As they settled into married life, they tried to save 155 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: money wherever they could. 156 00:08:26,720 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 2: Dacy is so expensive. We were trying to put every 157 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 2: single cent we could into our future, and because we 158 00:08:33,800 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 2: worked so close together downtown, we would meet for lunch 159 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 2: and I would pack us a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. 160 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 2: We would split a diet coke and eat an orange, 161 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 2: and that's all we could really afford. 162 00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:51,960 Speaker 1: Eventually, Kimberly got a new job in the tech industry 163 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: and she supported them financially while Tim started an MBA program. 164 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:00,760 Speaker 2: He went to graduate school full time. So I worked 165 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:03,120 Speaker 2: full time and paid the bills. 166 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 3: Also put money aside to pay off this tuition. 167 00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 2: So I was supporting the two of us and working 168 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:12,960 Speaker 2: like a dog. And I'm never just like sleeping with 169 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 2: my BlackBerry next to my pillow, and I'd hear it beep, 170 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:16,440 Speaker 2: and I'd be like, oh, what's it saying? 171 00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 3: You know, I just I never slept. My nickname was 172 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 3: the Ballbuster. 173 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:28,240 Speaker 2: Because I wasn't afraid of anybody. And here I am 174 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:31,360 Speaker 2: five foot two sitting across the room in a board 175 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 2: meeting with CEO of these big companies. It taught me 176 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 2: not to be afraid of anything. 177 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: Tim's first job out of grad school was at a 178 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 1: fortune five hundred company in the healthcare industry. Now that 179 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,800 Speaker 1: they had two incomes again, they could finally begin to 180 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:53,240 Speaker 1: save money for their future. That's when Tim got really 181 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:55,839 Speaker 1: strategic about their savings. 182 00:09:55,960 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 2: He studied the stock market like it was the most 183 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 2: fascinating thing he had ever seen. He just was reading 184 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 2: up on how to invest all the time. And he 185 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 2: began day trading, and he was making a lot of 186 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 2: money from us, and he didn't spend a lot of money. 187 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 2: And then the company that he was working for kept 188 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 2: promoting him, so we were basically putting his entire salary 189 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:28,600 Speaker 2: in the bank and we were living off of my income. 190 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 1: By the time they were twenty nine, their financial situation 191 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:36,280 Speaker 1: had completely changed. The days of splitting peanut butter and 192 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 1: jelly sandwiches were far behind them. 193 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:42,360 Speaker 2: I remember seeing half a million dollars in our bank account, 194 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 2: and that's a lot of money. I think that for him, 195 00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 2: that was the turning point. He saw how quickly he 196 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 2: made so much money, and how that was investing and 197 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 2: how it compounded. It was just like the dream come true. 198 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,079 Speaker 2: And that's when I decided I'm ready to have children. 199 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: Tim was ready to grow their family too. 200 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 3: He was so excited. He was really sweet. He took 201 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 3: care of me. 202 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: Kimberly gave birth to their first child, a baby girl. 203 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 2: First time mom. I was so happy and just that 204 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,679 Speaker 2: motherly glow. He tag teamed with me. We worked out 205 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:26,600 Speaker 2: a system where I would breastfeed her at eight o'clock 206 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 2: and then go straight to sleep, and I would sleep 207 00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:32,360 Speaker 2: until about two or three. He would wake me up 208 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 2: for her next feeding, and then I would go back 209 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:36,840 Speaker 2: to sleep again and he would go to sleep. 210 00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:41,360 Speaker 1: Tim made it clear they were in this together. Soon 211 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 1: they found their groove as parents. They had a second 212 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:48,360 Speaker 1: daughter and then a third. Tim was climbing the ladder 213 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: as a healthcare executive. Fifteen years into their marriage, he 214 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,679 Speaker 1: was making enough for Kimberly to quit her job and 215 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 1: focus on parenting. 216 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 2: He was making a ton of money at that point. 217 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:01,199 Speaker 2: He was a senior vice president. 218 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:05,319 Speaker 1: Tim often traveled for work, and while it put a 219 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: strain on their relationship, Kimberly still felt connected to him. 220 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 3: The romance was still there. 221 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:14,840 Speaker 2: We still were going on date nights, and we had 222 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,320 Speaker 2: this amazing babysitter, and so we would go out every 223 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:20,680 Speaker 2: other Saturday, sometimes even every Saturday and. 224 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:24,400 Speaker 3: Do date night. So we were still very much getting along. 225 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 1: Now that they had extra income, Tim wanted to spend it. 226 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 2: He's like, we're buying a house in the mountains for vacation. 227 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:41,679 Speaker 1: It was a cabin in the mountains of western North Carolina. 228 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:46,000 Speaker 2: It was a magical place, and the kids we bunked 229 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:48,319 Speaker 2: them all up in one bunk room and we would 230 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:54,480 Speaker 2: boat and paddle board and canoe. We hiked every single 231 00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 2: trail and saw every single waterfall, and went up there 232 00:12:58,080 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 2: for Thanksgiving and had campfires making s'mores and going fishing. 233 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 2: It was so peaceful and so sweet. 234 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 1: The mountain house became a place where Kimberly and her 235 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 1: kids really bonded, But as time went on, Kimberly felt 236 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: a distance growing between her and her husband. 237 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 2: We stopped talking to each other at night time, like bye, 238 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:19,480 Speaker 2: have a good night. You know, how are the kids today. 239 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 2: We stopped doing that, and that's where I knew. I'm like, 240 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 2: we are growing so far apart. That's when the pandemic hit. 241 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:30,240 Speaker 2: We decided to go up to the mountains and spend 242 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 2: it there because it was scary. We're like, well, we 243 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 2: might as well go where there's nobody and we can 244 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 2: continue doing our quiet, isolated routine up there. 245 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:43,760 Speaker 1: It was a frightening time. Like many people, Kimberly was 246 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:46,719 Speaker 1: worried about how the pandemic would affect her daughters. 247 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:51,079 Speaker 2: I was definitely stressed, but I didn't want my kids 248 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:53,199 Speaker 2: to see that. I was like, we're going to be fine. 249 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:56,560 Speaker 1: But Tim, on the other hand, wasn't fine. 250 00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:58,280 Speaker 3: Tim was manic. 251 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:04,040 Speaker 2: It was almost this is though he was jailed. He 252 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 2: was one of those individuals that did not handle the 253 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,360 Speaker 2: pandemic well. He had been flying and traveling and all 254 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 2: of a sudden, everything stops and he didn't know what 255 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:14,640 Speaker 2: to do with himself, and he became very angry. 256 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 1: All of a sudden, little things started to set him off. 257 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 2: And it just became this daily fight. This is the 258 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,480 Speaker 2: first time I'd ever seen him behave like this. I 259 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 2: had never seen him so restless and so angry. He 260 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 2: was never an angry person like we rarely thought. You know, 261 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 2: we were always very calm the way we communicated, and 262 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 2: all of a sudden we saw this behavior and we're like, 263 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 2: who is this person? I felt like he was just 264 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 2: losing his mind. 265 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 1: As the pandemic went on, Tim continued having angry outbursts, 266 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 1: acting strange, and drinking excessively. 267 00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 2: He was pouring what I would call buckets of bourbon 268 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:03,480 Speaker 2: and buckets of vodka, and then would open up a 269 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 2: bottle of wine. 270 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:08,400 Speaker 1: One night, while they were watching a movie, Kimberly noticed 271 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 1: that Tim was engrossed in his phone. 272 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 2: He wasn't watching the movie, and I saw him scrolling 273 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 2: through a website and I saw lots of pictures of women, 274 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 2: and I said, it looks like you're really interested in 275 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:24,640 Speaker 2: what you're looking at. What are you looking at? Exactly, 276 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 2: and he said, oh, I had this headhunter that keeps 277 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 2: bugging me to take this other position. And I was 278 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 2: like okay. I said, well, it looks like there's a 279 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 2: lot of women on your phone. I said, would you 280 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:38,040 Speaker 2: rather watch that and look at your phone than watch 281 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 2: the movie we're watching? And he's like, no, I don't 282 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:42,240 Speaker 2: know what you're talking about. You don't understand. 283 00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 3: I'm working so hard. 284 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 2: And he got really angry with me, but he put 285 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 2: his phone down. And that's when I started really paying 286 00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:52,960 Speaker 2: attention to what was going on in my house. 287 00:15:54,320 --> 00:16:21,680 Speaker 4: I was like, okay, start looking. 288 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: Well. Kimberly and her family quarantined in their mountain house, 289 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: she started noticing changes in her husband. He was being secretive, 290 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 1: even aggressive. One night, she thought she saw photos of 291 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 1: women on her husband's phone and it kind of looked 292 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 1: like a dating site. He said it was something for work, 293 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 1: but she wasn't convinced. 294 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:43,280 Speaker 2: So I went into his suitcases and I started digging 295 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 2: through his personal effects, his toilet, try bag. I started 296 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 2: going through his desk and going through his clothes, didn't 297 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 2: find anything, went through his golf. 298 00:16:56,440 --> 00:16:57,360 Speaker 3: Bag, nothing. 299 00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:00,960 Speaker 1: She kept coming up empty. I really started to think 300 00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:04,479 Speaker 1: maybe everything was fine, after all, maybe she was just 301 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:08,359 Speaker 1: getting in her own head. But then her eyes landed 302 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:11,040 Speaker 1: on one final bag she had missed in her search, 303 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 1: Tim's gym bag. 304 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:15,119 Speaker 2: And I put my hands in it and I was 305 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:17,439 Speaker 2: feeling around and I didn't feel anything. And then I 306 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:20,120 Speaker 2: noticed there was a zippered compartment on the side, and 307 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 2: I opened it up and there was a treasure trove 308 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 2: of viagra, condoms, lubes, sex toys and they were not mine. 309 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:35,720 Speaker 3: I was like, oh my god, what did I just see? 310 00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:36,639 Speaker 2: What did I just find? 311 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,919 Speaker 3: Everything? I had always feared. 312 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 2: He was cheating on me. 313 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 1: She couldn't confront Tim right away because she had to 314 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:53,600 Speaker 1: drive her daughters to their dad disappointments, So she drove 315 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:55,359 Speaker 1: across town in a daze. 316 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,159 Speaker 2: And I'm sitting there in the dentist's office and then 317 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 2: I started to cry, and the dental hygienis comes out 318 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:02,920 Speaker 2: and she was like, I need to ask you questions 319 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:05,679 Speaker 2: about your children's teeth. And I remember, just like teeth, 320 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:10,879 Speaker 2: what are you talking about? I couldn't make sense of 321 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:13,640 Speaker 2: anything in my world at that point, and she kept 322 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 2: like asking me questions, like do your kids you know 323 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,159 Speaker 2: they need to have their X rays done? I'm like, fine, 324 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:22,159 Speaker 2: take their x rays and she was like, well, and 325 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:24,480 Speaker 2: they probably need a fluorid treatment. I'm like, get to them. 326 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:27,240 Speaker 3: What are you asking China? She's like, are you okay? 327 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:29,879 Speaker 2: And I'm crying and I couldn't get the words out 328 00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 2: of my mouth. My husband's cheating on me. It just 329 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:35,480 Speaker 2: felt so impossible. 330 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 1: Later that evening, when they were back home, Kimberly went 331 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 1: into Tim's office where he was sitting at his desk, and. 332 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,879 Speaker 2: I said, I need to talk to you. I placed 333 00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 2: the box in front of him and I said, I 334 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:55,439 Speaker 2: need you to explain this to me. And then I 335 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 2: just went quiet. The blood just rushed out of his 336 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 2: face and he just whispered, let's take this into the bedrooms. 337 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 2: We have some privacy. We went in there and I 338 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:12,280 Speaker 2: sat in the bed and he started pacing. 339 00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:15,920 Speaker 3: I said, I need you to explain this, and he 340 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:17,840 Speaker 3: said it's a mistake. 341 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:23,840 Speaker 2: I said, who is she? His wheels were turning. He 342 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:25,400 Speaker 2: didn't know what to say to me. 343 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:30,679 Speaker 3: At the time. 344 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 2: What I didn't know was he was trying to find 345 00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:39,879 Speaker 2: the right lies. He finally said her name was Anna. 346 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:43,280 Speaker 2: I said where did you meet? And he said the 347 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 2: whole foods down the street. I said, oh, I said, 348 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,600 Speaker 2: how old is she? And I was very calm and 349 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 2: so was he. But when he said she was twenty 350 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 2: one twenty two, I felt sick. 351 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:01,439 Speaker 3: This daughter was eighteen. 352 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 2: That's not too far off in age. I said he 353 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 2: was sex with her and he was like yes. I 354 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,879 Speaker 2: was so angry because I'm like, Harry, are during the pandemic, 355 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,199 Speaker 2: holding up, wearing masks in our face, like not communicating 356 00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:19,240 Speaker 2: with anybody, not seeing our friends, and you're having sex 357 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 2: with a cashier from Whole Foods, somebody you don't even know. 358 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:26,439 Speaker 2: And he was like yes. And I said, you just 359 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 2: betrayed me in every single sense, and I need you 360 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 2: to leave. 361 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,919 Speaker 1: He checked into a hotel. Kimberly was in shock. 362 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:43,119 Speaker 2: I don't remember the rest of the day. I just 363 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:44,600 Speaker 2: stared at my ceiling most. 364 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:44,880 Speaker 3: Of that night. 365 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,640 Speaker 1: After weeks in a hotel, Tim started trying to win 366 00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:55,600 Speaker 1: her back, buying her expensive gifts, apologizing profusely and promising 367 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: that he'd change. 368 00:20:57,119 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 2: And he's just like, I love you so much. I 369 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:01,119 Speaker 2: just love you. I want to help you with the kids, 370 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 2: and what can I do? 371 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 3: I want to make up. 372 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,439 Speaker 1: Kimberly agreed to let him move back in and they 373 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:09,440 Speaker 1: tried to make it work, but she suspected that there 374 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 1: was more he wasn't telling her. She wanted him to 375 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:16,480 Speaker 1: fully come clean. Whenever she would bring it up, he 376 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 1: kept changing his story, so she decided to find the 377 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 1: truth herself. There was one place she had it looked 378 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:24,440 Speaker 1: his computer. 379 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 2: And that's when I started investigating him. I started logging 380 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,880 Speaker 2: into his computers, and I learned. 381 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 3: That my. 382 00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 2: Tim, who I thought was the stand up, amazing executive 383 00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 2: father of my children, was a sugar daddy. He had 384 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 2: been paying young women to have sex with him. It 385 00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:00,639 Speaker 2: first started with him paying their bills, I'll give you 386 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,879 Speaker 2: money for rent, and then it went to him just 387 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:05,760 Speaker 2: paying them. 388 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,760 Speaker 1: The realization was sinking in. This was something she'd only 389 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:12,600 Speaker 1: seen on TV or in the movies, not something that 390 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:16,800 Speaker 1: happened in real life. But here she was finding out 391 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 1: her husband was a sugar daddy. A sugar daddy that 392 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 1: paid younger women for sex, paid for their lifestyle, financially 393 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:27,959 Speaker 1: supported their ventures, and gave them romantic gifts in return 394 00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:31,640 Speaker 1: for sexual favors. He was doing it all online. There 395 00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,359 Speaker 1: are websites for this where men can find their sugar baby. 396 00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 1: Tim was using them and he was using their money, 397 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 1: money that could have gone to their kids, their education, 398 00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: their home, and instead he was spending it on other women. 399 00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 1: Kimberly began looking at their bank statements. 400 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 2: I saw all these sums of money going out. I 401 00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:57,719 Speaker 2: estimated he spent about forty thousand dollars on sex workers 402 00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:01,760 Speaker 2: in the course of a year and a half. He 403 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,960 Speaker 2: would take it out in five hundred dollars increments, sometimes 404 00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:08,040 Speaker 2: a thousand, it depends on if he was having a threesome. 405 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:11,720 Speaker 2: He would meet up with them in a hotel close 406 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:14,960 Speaker 2: to where our daughters went to school, and he would 407 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:19,080 Speaker 2: spend a few hours with them, smoke some weed, and 408 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:22,160 Speaker 2: then pick our children up in carpool and bring them home. 409 00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:32,080 Speaker 1: Tim had another life online, one where he was constantly 410 00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 1: looking for his next sexual experience or his next sugar baby. 411 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:40,439 Speaker 1: Sometimes they were one off rendezvous five hundred and cash 412 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:44,160 Speaker 1: for a meetup, but other times he continued the relationship 413 00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:47,359 Speaker 1: and sent thousands of dollars to women, money for them 414 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:51,119 Speaker 1: to start businesses or pay their bills. As Kimberly looked 415 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:55,400 Speaker 1: through the digital trail, she realized this was almost an obsession. 416 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:59,240 Speaker 1: It had consumed his life and so much of the 417 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 1: family's money. 418 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 2: I confronted him with all of this, and this time 419 00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,600 Speaker 2: I had more than a box. He just started telling me. 420 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:13,159 Speaker 2: He's like, I have a hole that I can't fill. 421 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:15,360 Speaker 2: And he said, no matter what I do to try 422 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,439 Speaker 2: to fill that hole, I cannot seem to fill it. 423 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:22,320 Speaker 2: And he said, I've tried with work, I've tried with golf, 424 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,560 Speaker 2: I've tried with buying the house in the mountains and 425 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 2: hiking and doing all these things. Nothing fills that hole. 426 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 2: And he takes his fist and starts beating himself as 427 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:38,160 Speaker 2: hard as he can in the face, repeatedly, like punching 428 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:41,919 Speaker 2: himself in the eye and in the forehead. He kept saying, 429 00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,600 Speaker 2: I'm so fucked up. I'm so fucked up. 430 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:45,320 Speaker 3: I don't even know who. 431 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:49,040 Speaker 2: I am so fucked up. And I remember just screaming. 432 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,480 Speaker 2: I was like, oh my god, like I had never 433 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,320 Speaker 2: seen him violent, I had never seen him behave like this. 434 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,399 Speaker 2: And I grabbed his arm and I was like stop. 435 00:24:57,440 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 3: I was like screaming. 436 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,760 Speaker 2: I was like stop, stop, and he was bleeding, and 437 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 2: I was like, what are you doing. He's like, I 438 00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:04,840 Speaker 2: don't know who. Something's wrong with me. 439 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,639 Speaker 1: In that conversation, Tim told Kimberly that he wanted to 440 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,199 Speaker 1: end his life. She was worried about his safety and 441 00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:16,440 Speaker 1: encouraged him to get professional support. 442 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 2: So I kept saying, I really feel like you need 443 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,800 Speaker 2: to get treatment, and Tim refused. He said I can't 444 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,200 Speaker 2: take off a month because of work. 445 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:26,440 Speaker 3: Refused. 446 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:29,719 Speaker 2: At that point, I was like, I need to get 447 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 2: out of this marriage. 448 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: Any hope Kimberly had for repairing their relationship was gone. 449 00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:41,439 Speaker 2: And I said I want a divorce. He kind of 450 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:46,119 Speaker 2: went from this like super caring, love bombing husband to 451 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:51,159 Speaker 2: business executive. This was going to be a transaction, just 452 00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 2: like the transactions he had with the young girls. It 453 00:25:54,760 --> 00:26:00,240 Speaker 2: was just transactional. So I was as well, and he said, 454 00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:03,960 Speaker 2: I'll give you, and he gave me a number. You 455 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,159 Speaker 2: can have the kids, you can have the house. I 456 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,600 Speaker 2: will take care of you. I will take care of them. 457 00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 2: I will take care of. 458 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:11,800 Speaker 3: All of their school bills. 459 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:15,280 Speaker 2: I need you to walk away. And I just looked 460 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,600 Speaker 2: at him and I said, that number's really low. North 461 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,760 Speaker 2: Carolina is a fifty to fifty equitable state. I knew 462 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:25,200 Speaker 2: what we were worth. I had already pulled all the financials. 463 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:30,119 Speaker 1: Kimberly wanted half of everything. They owned together. That was fair. 464 00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 1: But the minute she said it, his whole demeanor changed. 465 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,640 Speaker 2: He was like, well, but it's my money. You haven't 466 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:43,520 Speaker 2: even worked. And I remember just being so dumbfounded. I 467 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:45,280 Speaker 2: was like, what do you mean. 468 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:47,000 Speaker 3: I put you through business school. 469 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,720 Speaker 2: I worked until our second child was born. I was 470 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,919 Speaker 2: making more than you. The large part of why we 471 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 2: have what we have is because we were able to 472 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 2: invest in properties and invest in stocks. And he's like, 473 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,720 Speaker 2: I was the one who did that. And I said, well, 474 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:03,880 Speaker 2: that's not the way the courts. 475 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 3: Are going to see it. And he's like, fine. 476 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,400 Speaker 2: I just want you to know if you continue down 477 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:13,160 Speaker 2: this path, I will take every single cent I have 478 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:17,440 Speaker 2: and every single cent you have, and I will spend it, 479 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:19,000 Speaker 2: burning you to the ground. 480 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 1: Kimberly found out that her husband had spent a lot 481 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 1: of their family savings being a sugar daddy to younger women. 482 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:50,480 Speaker 1: He was paying for things like their rent and their bills. 483 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:54,400 Speaker 1: He was also paying for sex with sex workers. When 484 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 1: Kimberly urged him to get help, he refused, so she 485 00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 1: was left with no other option but divorce. 486 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 2: I didn't want alimony from him because I knew it'd 487 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,439 Speaker 2: be a way for him to control me, and I 488 00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:09,880 Speaker 2: kept saying to the attorneys, I'm like, I don't want alimony. 489 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 2: I want a clean break. I need the cash settlement. 490 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,040 Speaker 2: I can dig in my heels until I hit the 491 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 2: core of this planet, and I did. 492 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:21,960 Speaker 3: Three weeks later, I. 493 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,639 Speaker 2: Think I finally warmed down and he agreed to a 494 00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 2: cash settlement. It was a thirty seventy split. I knew 495 00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:30,360 Speaker 2: at that minute, I'm going to be free of this man. 496 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: She got the money, but she wouldn't be free from Tim. 497 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 1: His breakdown was just beginning. In fact, Kimberly noticed an 498 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 1: uneasy feeling creeping in one she couldn't shake. 499 00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 2: Sometimes I felt like I was being watched, and I 500 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 2: felt like I was being followed. 501 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,600 Speaker 1: Tim moved into an apartment nearby. Kimberly wanted space from 502 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,880 Speaker 1: the whole situation, so she decided to splurge on a 503 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:02,040 Speaker 1: trip to the Caribbean for her fiftieth birthday. It would 504 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:07,080 Speaker 1: be her her closest friends, and her three teenage daughters. Finally, 505 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:10,080 Speaker 1: she could be far away from Tim and could let 506 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:13,920 Speaker 1: her guard down. But the first morning of the trip, 507 00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 1: something strange happened. 508 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,160 Speaker 3: I'm on the beach, I'm having my coffee. 509 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:19,840 Speaker 1: It's just me. 510 00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:24,520 Speaker 2: I'm enjoying the morning, enjoying the view, and there's no 511 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:26,360 Speaker 2: one around except for this man. 512 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 3: I watched him turn. He pulls out a. 513 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 2: Camera and start taking pictures of me. It's one of 514 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 2: those moments you're like, am I imagining this? I turn around, 515 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:39,160 Speaker 2: so I'm thinking, maybe he's taking pictures of the villa. 516 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 2: You can't see the villa from the beach. And I 517 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,160 Speaker 2: pretend to look down again, and here he is doing 518 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 2: it a second time, taking more pictures. 519 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: A man was on the beach taking pictures of her. 520 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 1: She was sure of it. She just didn't know why. 521 00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,640 Speaker 1: It was disturbing. But that wasn't the only upsetting thing 522 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:01,080 Speaker 1: that happened on their trip. 523 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 2: Two days later, we get a basket delivered and it's 524 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:09,120 Speaker 2: a gift basket and I thought, oh, well, maybe it's 525 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:12,080 Speaker 2: a friend sending me something because it is my birthday 526 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 2: weekend and whatever. 527 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:15,320 Speaker 3: And there was a note in it. 528 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 2: I think it said enjoy your trip that I paid 529 00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:23,120 Speaker 2: for my hard work. I spent my fiftieth birthday in 530 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:23,520 Speaker 2: a bar. 531 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 1: It was from Tim. 532 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:32,080 Speaker 2: It was a bag of cookies, I think, some chocolate 533 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 2: covered fruit and a bag of mixed nuts, and at 534 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:40,200 Speaker 2: this point the kids are like, oh my god, he 535 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 2: knows we're here, He's found us. I mean, they go 536 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:43,320 Speaker 2: into full panic mode. 537 00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 1: Something about this basket immediately raised alarm bells. One of 538 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:52,720 Speaker 1: their daughters had a severe nut allergy. Tim spent eighteen 539 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: years making sure everything his daughter ate was nut free, 540 00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:00,680 Speaker 1: making sure he packed the EpiPen. Kimberly and her daughters 541 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,000 Speaker 1: looked at each other, eyes widened. 542 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:07,320 Speaker 2: My daughter looked at the nuts and she's like, is 543 00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:08,240 Speaker 2: he trying to kill me? 544 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:14,040 Speaker 1: The vacation was meant to be relaxing, but it left 545 00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:17,480 Speaker 1: the family more on edge than before. At this point, 546 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,240 Speaker 1: Kimberly was dating other people. When she got back from vacation, 547 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:22,760 Speaker 1: she had a date planned. 548 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 2: We went out to this upscale restaurant. It was like 549 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 2: seven o'clock and a busy Saturday night, and I'm in 550 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:30,400 Speaker 2: a pretty dress and he's in a suit, and we 551 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:33,120 Speaker 2: order our cocktail and order an appetizer, and before it 552 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,800 Speaker 2: even comes out, Tim comes charging towards our table from 553 00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 2: the bar. 554 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,160 Speaker 3: He's got a drink in his hand and he was drunk. 555 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:43,960 Speaker 2: And I remember just being so panicked because I hadn't 556 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:48,200 Speaker 2: seen him since we had separated, and he got in 557 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:52,680 Speaker 2: our face and he's said, you're doing drugs and dealing drugs, 558 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,040 Speaker 2: and I know who you are, but he's like saying 559 00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,239 Speaker 2: it loudly, and people like stopping with their eating and 560 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 2: like looking at our table. 561 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:02,600 Speaker 3: And then the maid of d came over. 562 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:04,680 Speaker 2: And he left and he's like, you go okay, And 563 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 2: I'm like, no, no, But I was so shaken, and 564 00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 2: I remember going home. 565 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:11,480 Speaker 3: I'm like, how did he know we were there? 566 00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 1: Kimberly's head was spinning. Somehow Tim knew exactly where she 567 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:24,800 Speaker 1: was at all times. A few weeks later, Kimberly was 568 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,120 Speaker 1: at the doctor's office. Over the last year, her PABs 569 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,680 Speaker 1: mirrors kept coming back abnormal. The doctors told her it 570 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 1: was due to a past HPV infection, likely from the 571 00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:37,920 Speaker 1: unprotected sex Tim was having with other women. 572 00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,480 Speaker 2: I was sitting in the gynecologist's office with a robe on. 573 00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:46,200 Speaker 2: I heard my phone and I looked at it and 574 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:49,360 Speaker 2: it was a text from Tim, and it said, just 575 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 2: remember while you're there getting tested for your STDs with 576 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 2: all your boyfriends, you can't use our health insurance money 577 00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:02,480 Speaker 2: to pay for it. Just like shaking, like I could 578 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,080 Speaker 2: not even control my hands. I dropped my phone and 579 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:08,960 Speaker 2: I was like, he knows I'm here. He physically knows 580 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 2: I'm here. 581 00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:13,720 Speaker 1: She thought maybe Tim had been following her. That was 582 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,240 Speaker 1: until she brought her car in to be serviced. 583 00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:22,080 Speaker 2: It was just a routine service and everything went fine. 584 00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 2: I was pulling away and I noticed there was this 585 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:31,520 Speaker 2: device sitting in my console. I picked it up and 586 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:34,680 Speaker 2: I'm like, what is this. I called the technician. I'm like, hey, 587 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:38,720 Speaker 2: I think they left something in my car. He was like, oh, no, 588 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:39,920 Speaker 2: that's your tracking device. 589 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:43,560 Speaker 3: I was like what. He's like, yeah, that was. 590 00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:45,280 Speaker 2: Your tracking device. Sorry, we forgot to put it back in. 591 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,120 Speaker 2: He put a tracking device inside my car. 592 00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 1: Tim was tracking Kimberly everywhere she went, but he knew 593 00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: much more than just her location. Whenever they had to 594 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 1: talk to each other about their daughters or divorce proceedings. 595 00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:04,840 Speaker 2: He had been referencing conversations that I was having inside 596 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:05,360 Speaker 2: my house. 597 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:08,480 Speaker 3: One time, He's like, yeah, I saw. 598 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,959 Speaker 2: You playing volleyball with our daughter in the house when 599 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:15,239 Speaker 2: I was there. You would never let that fly. And 600 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:18,160 Speaker 2: I was like, could you look through my windows? And 601 00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,560 Speaker 2: I went actually outside and looking at my house. I'm like, 602 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:23,719 Speaker 2: you can't see into my house unless you're in my 603 00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,480 Speaker 2: backyard looking into my windows. 604 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:27,680 Speaker 3: He knew about a. 605 00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:28,760 Speaker 2: Trip that I was planning. 606 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,279 Speaker 3: I was taking a cruise, and he knew about it. 607 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:34,000 Speaker 2: He said, I hope you have fun on your trip, 608 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,960 Speaker 2: and I'm like, how does he know all of these things? 609 00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 1: It felt like Tim had eyes and ears everywhere. There 610 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:47,320 Speaker 1: was no escaping, and Kimberly was struggling. 611 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:52,360 Speaker 2: I was definitely in trauma mode, wondering when he was 612 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:55,680 Speaker 2: going to pop up again. And I turned into this 613 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,840 Speaker 2: paranoid mess. I was so jumpy all the time he was. 614 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,719 Speaker 2: I'm so angry. I had this feeling he was going 615 00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:06,760 Speaker 2: to come for me. I was always locking and unlocking 616 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,080 Speaker 2: the doors. I unlocked and locked my door so many 617 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,560 Speaker 2: times I actually broke the doorknob. 618 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,400 Speaker 1: She lived in this paranoid state for a whole year. 619 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:19,719 Speaker 1: Then one weekend, when Kimberly was out of town, she 620 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:23,040 Speaker 1: got a strange notification on her home security app. 621 00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 2: Somebody had gone in and changed my password to my 622 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:28,600 Speaker 2: home security system. 623 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:31,120 Speaker 3: And I'm like, oh my god. 624 00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:34,880 Speaker 2: And I logged in and I saw that he had 625 00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:40,160 Speaker 2: accessed my home security system, logged me out, logged him in, 626 00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:43,040 Speaker 2: self in, and made himself the master user, so he 627 00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:48,839 Speaker 2: could see into my home and he could hear the conversations. 628 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:53,719 Speaker 1: Suddenly puzzle pieces started clicking into place. It wasn't just 629 00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:57,040 Speaker 1: paranoia that like Kimberly to believe Tim could hear what 630 00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:00,719 Speaker 1: she was saying inside her house. He had hacked into 631 00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:04,719 Speaker 1: her home security system. From there, he would watch her 632 00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:08,320 Speaker 1: in her home and listen to her private conversations. 633 00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,040 Speaker 2: The reason he was able to do that is when 634 00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:15,560 Speaker 2: they changed over the account to my name, they failed 635 00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:19,560 Speaker 2: to log out all the devices, and even though I 636 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:22,719 Speaker 2: had changed the password, he was able to access it 637 00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 2: through face idea. 638 00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:27,799 Speaker 1: During the court hearings for Kimberly's protective order against him, 639 00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 1: he admitted to putting the tracking device. 640 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:30,840 Speaker 2: On her car. 641 00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:36,360 Speaker 1: Apparently that was legal. Then the line of questioning shifted 642 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:37,800 Speaker 1: to the home security system. 643 00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 2: My attorney's asking him how many times did you look 644 00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 2: into Kimberly's house and watch her? And he was like countless. 645 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:53,319 Speaker 2: And the judge popped her head up and she said, sir, 646 00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:56,360 Speaker 2: I need you to explain that when you say countless, 647 00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:59,279 Speaker 2: that means you can't count that high. Can you quantify that? 648 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,600 Speaker 2: It's like dozens? 649 00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:07,840 Speaker 1: On the stand Tim also admitted to hiring a private 650 00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:10,720 Speaker 1: investigator to follow Kimberly twenty four to seven. 651 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:13,600 Speaker 2: I mean, it's like one hundred dollars an hour to 652 00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:15,800 Speaker 2: do what to watch to me go to the grocery 653 00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:18,640 Speaker 2: store and turn my lights on and off. It was 654 00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:20,320 Speaker 2: just insanity. 655 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:21,919 Speaker 1: The judge did the right thing. 656 00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,439 Speaker 2: She ruled in favor that I got the restraining order. 657 00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:30,560 Speaker 1: Tim fought this on appeal, but ultimately Kimberly prevailed. It 658 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:34,360 Speaker 1: was a landmark case because before this, North Carolina courts 659 00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:38,680 Speaker 1: required proof of physical abuse or explicit violent threats to 660 00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:42,360 Speaker 1: grant a protective order. Kimberly's case created a precedent in 661 00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:46,160 Speaker 1: their home state. It was a big win, but Tim 662 00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:48,400 Speaker 1: was still spiraling out of control. 663 00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:54,560 Speaker 2: He threatened to have my two older children arrested. He 664 00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:58,240 Speaker 2: was claiming that they were part of a bitcoin scheme 665 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:02,680 Speaker 2: to blackmail him, and that he had proof, and he 666 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:06,319 Speaker 2: sent this to my attorney, like this wasn't on the 667 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:07,000 Speaker 2: bingo card. 668 00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:11,600 Speaker 1: Tim was spending obscene amounts of money. It seemed like 669 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 1: any semblance of control and order in his life was 670 00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:18,360 Speaker 1: slipping away. Kimberly's oldest daughter had gone off to college, 671 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 1: but she still had two of her daughters at home, 672 00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 1: and she was trying to hold everything together for them. 673 00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:28,960 Speaker 2: A few weeks later, on November twenty third, I was 674 00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:32,520 Speaker 2: out to dinner and I get a text from one 675 00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:37,200 Speaker 2: of his old girlfriends, something he dated and I'd always 676 00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:39,239 Speaker 2: liked her, and says I need to talk to you. 677 00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:42,560 Speaker 2: I was like, that's really weird. And I call her 678 00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:44,799 Speaker 2: and I'm like, hey, you know, is everything okay? And 679 00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:51,680 Speaker 2: she said, Kimberly, Tim's dead and I was like, what. 680 00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:56,880 Speaker 1: Tim had gone into the woods and taken his own life. 681 00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:00,680 Speaker 2: She's like, I'm so sorry, and I just was calm. 682 00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:04,360 Speaker 2: I was like, you know, I didn't even have to 683 00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,160 Speaker 2: say and I threw up. 684 00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:09,840 Speaker 3: I didn't cry. 685 00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:16,480 Speaker 2: I felt sick, I felt shocked, and then I felt relief. 686 00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:23,960 Speaker 2: And I hate that I felt that, but it's human nature. 687 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:27,439 Speaker 2: He had abused and tortured me and made my life 688 00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:28,200 Speaker 2: living hell. 689 00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,080 Speaker 1: Kimberly had to find a way to tell her daughters. 690 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:35,080 Speaker 3: I took the girls into my bedroom. 691 00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,560 Speaker 2: I said, let's sit down and talk about this. It's 692 00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:41,200 Speaker 2: okay to be upset, it's okay to be shocked, it's 693 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:44,480 Speaker 2: okay to be angry. The girls end up being named 694 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:49,240 Speaker 2: administrators to the estate. Obviously they're young girls. They decided 695 00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:52,160 Speaker 2: they couldn't do it. They named me and appointed me. 696 00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:56,240 Speaker 2: So now here I am with my ex husband managing 697 00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:56,840 Speaker 2: his estate. 698 00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:00,960 Speaker 1: In the weeks that followed, Kimberly went to old apartment 699 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,279 Speaker 1: to clean it out. When she stepped inside, she was 700 00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:06,960 Speaker 1: shocked at the state he had been living in. She 701 00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:09,200 Speaker 1: saw for his hand what he had been draining his 702 00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:13,280 Speaker 1: accounts on. It wasn't just private investigators and legal fees. 703 00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:15,960 Speaker 1: He'd been buying all kinds of things. 704 00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 2: He was a hoarder. To see like the state of 705 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,560 Speaker 2: his stuff, and it was expensive stuff. He had like 706 00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,879 Speaker 2: a chicken coop for chickens he didn't have, and pool 707 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:29,040 Speaker 2: equipment for a pool he didn't have, and watches, and 708 00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:31,920 Speaker 2: flipflops that were like from Target thrown in with a 709 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:34,480 Speaker 2: box of like a thousand dollar pair of Italian leather shoes. 710 00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:38,680 Speaker 1: There was even a box of fifty vintage pencil sharpeners 711 00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:42,799 Speaker 1: that cost two thousand dollars. 712 00:40:41,680 --> 00:40:44,880 Speaker 2: And a nineteen forties chipbox. He had an RV that 713 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:49,840 Speaker 2: he wrecked. He had motorcycles, a jet ski, two trailers. 714 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,360 Speaker 2: I mean hundreds of thousands dollars. 715 00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:53,920 Speaker 3: Worth of stuff. 716 00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:57,960 Speaker 1: One of the strangest and most alarming things he'd spend 717 00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:00,840 Speaker 1: his money on was a trained German shepherd. 718 00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:05,880 Speaker 2: He had it imported overseas, and it was a trained 719 00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:09,800 Speaker 2: killer guard dog. He spent close to eighty thousand dollars 720 00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:10,239 Speaker 2: on the dog. 721 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:15,080 Speaker 1: He eventually bought a second guard dog. At first, Kimberly 722 00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:18,319 Speaker 1: wanted to adopt the dogs herself. Then she had a 723 00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:22,520 Speaker 1: conversation with the trainer, who strongly advised her against interacting 724 00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:23,200 Speaker 1: with the dogs. 725 00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:25,960 Speaker 2: If I were to ever come around, I think that 726 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:27,040 Speaker 2: they were trained to attack me. 727 00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:31,279 Speaker 1: The trainer ended up taking the dogs for Kimberly. The 728 00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:35,719 Speaker 1: dogs became another what if, another decision Tim made that 729 00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:39,920 Speaker 1: left her speechless. For twenty years, she'd known Tim to 730 00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:43,560 Speaker 1: be a dependable man. She adored him and respected him. 731 00:41:44,360 --> 00:41:48,640 Speaker 1: She built a family with him, and then, seemingly out 732 00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,440 Speaker 1: of the blue, he blew up their marriage, blew their savings, 733 00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:57,200 Speaker 1: and turned against his own daughters. Worst of all, he 734 00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:03,120 Speaker 1: spent his final years stalking and tearing the family. Kimberly 735 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:05,080 Speaker 1: was trying to make sense of this as she sorted 736 00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:08,399 Speaker 1: through Tim's belongings. That's how she learned that a few 737 00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:11,319 Speaker 1: days before he took his own life, Tim had checked 738 00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:13,840 Speaker 1: himself into a rehab facility. 739 00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:18,560 Speaker 5: Tim had a lot of demons that he did not 740 00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:21,880 Speaker 5: share with me, and one of the things that I 741 00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:26,800 Speaker 5: learned after he passed away he had admitted himself into rehab. 742 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:32,200 Speaker 2: He went to a place in Kentucky and willingly checked 743 00:42:32,239 --> 00:42:35,680 Speaker 2: himself in and checked himself out. 744 00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:36,760 Speaker 3: A few days later. 745 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,759 Speaker 1: Kimberly called the rehab, hoping to learn more about his 746 00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:43,640 Speaker 1: state of mind while he was there, and any more 747 00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:47,120 Speaker 1: information about those final days leading up to his death. 748 00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,399 Speaker 2: I felt like I had this puzzle, but I didn't 749 00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:53,520 Speaker 2: know what the picture was and pieces were missing. So 750 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:55,920 Speaker 2: I called him and I said, I'm assuming he was 751 00:42:56,000 --> 00:43:01,479 Speaker 2: in here for substance abuse. And they're like, no, that's 752 00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:04,759 Speaker 2: not what we do. And I was like, well, why 753 00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,759 Speaker 2: was he in here? And They're like, he wasn't here 754 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:13,440 Speaker 2: for childhood sexual abuse. I was just shocked. 755 00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:17,400 Speaker 1: Kimberly knew that Tim had been a victim of childhood 756 00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:21,440 Speaker 1: sexual abuse, but she had no idea how significant the 757 00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:29,759 Speaker 1: trauma continued to be for him in adulthood. As she 758 00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,120 Speaker 1: worked to put together a painful puzzle of loss, she 759 00:43:33,239 --> 00:43:35,920 Speaker 1: also did everything she could to help her daughters through 760 00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:36,520 Speaker 1: their grief. 761 00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:41,200 Speaker 2: I still have his ashes here in my home, and 762 00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:43,920 Speaker 2: I talked to my daughters about what they wanted to do, 763 00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:47,000 Speaker 2: and we're going to take him up to the mountains 764 00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:49,960 Speaker 2: where we had so many happy times and had a 765 00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:53,120 Speaker 2: ceremony and service there and just remember the good times. 766 00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:55,839 Speaker 2: I feel like that's going to be a final thing 767 00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:56,920 Speaker 2: for us to like. 768 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:02,359 Speaker 1: End this chapter, Kimberly is still in the process of 769 00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:04,200 Speaker 1: finding her way back to herself. 770 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:10,200 Speaker 2: I have trouble finding joy like I used to. This 771 00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:13,960 Speaker 2: did such a number on me for so long. Now 772 00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:15,719 Speaker 2: I'm trying to find out who I am and what 773 00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:16,839 Speaker 2: do I really like to do. 774 00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:21,400 Speaker 1: Through everything, her relationship with her daughters remained strong. 775 00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:27,600 Speaker 2: I think they see the strength that I've shown and 776 00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:32,480 Speaker 2: the strength that's taken for them to overcome it. As 777 00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:34,920 Speaker 2: much as I hate that they went through it, I 778 00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:37,600 Speaker 2: tell them all the time, You're going to use these 779 00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:40,920 Speaker 2: skills that you've learned for the rest of your life, 780 00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:44,120 Speaker 2: and you will help other women, and you will be 781 00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:47,480 Speaker 2: a source of support for other people going through the 782 00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:50,480 Speaker 2: same thing. 783 00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:55,040 Speaker 1: We end every weekly episode with the same question, why 784 00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:56,480 Speaker 1: do you want to share your story? 785 00:44:57,840 --> 00:44:58,480 Speaker 3: I think it's. 786 00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:01,239 Speaker 2: Important for people to know when they do hit that 787 00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:05,080 Speaker 2: rock bottom moment and again I've hit it, I hit 788 00:45:05,120 --> 00:45:05,520 Speaker 2: it hard. 789 00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:10,000 Speaker 3: You can get through these horrible, horrible times. 790 00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:14,040 Speaker 2: Somebody can betray you, and you might just want to 791 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:16,600 Speaker 2: be like, I can't do this anymore, I can't think 792 00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:17,240 Speaker 2: of this anymore. 793 00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:18,880 Speaker 3: How am How am I going to get. 794 00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:22,920 Speaker 2: Myself out of this? Just keep putting one foot in 795 00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:26,440 Speaker 2: front of the other, and you're going to get to 796 00:45:26,520 --> 00:45:29,360 Speaker 2: the other side of the dark forest and see the 797 00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:34,560 Speaker 2: light if you just keep moving. Don't be embarrassed, don't 798 00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:37,280 Speaker 2: be ashamed, don't be afraid to tell your story, because 799 00:45:37,320 --> 00:45:40,480 Speaker 2: the more times you talk about it, the more you 800 00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:42,120 Speaker 2: can make sense of it and process it. 801 00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:45,080 Speaker 3: And that's been very helpful for me. 802 00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:54,200 Speaker 1: On the next episode of Betrayal Weekly, this was my 803 00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:54,760 Speaker 1: best friend. 804 00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:57,080 Speaker 6: This was somebody who was in my house every single day. 805 00:45:57,360 --> 00:46:00,680 Speaker 6: This is somebody who I told all my secrets too. 806 00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:05,960 Speaker 6: She did this because she wanted to She did this 807 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,680 Speaker 6: because she likes to manipulate. She did this because she 808 00:46:09,800 --> 00:46:10,520 Speaker 6: likes the control. 809 00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:18,080 Speaker 1: If you would like to reach out to the Betrayal 810 00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:21,000 Speaker 1: Team or want to tell us your betrayal story, email 811 00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:25,400 Speaker 1: us at Betrayalpod at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal Pod 812 00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:29,239 Speaker 1: at gmail dot com, or follow us on Instagram at 813 00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:33,440 Speaker 1: Betrayal Pod. You can also connect with me on Instagram 814 00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:38,040 Speaker 1: at It's Andrea Gunning. To access our newsletter, view additional content, 815 00:46:38,239 --> 00:46:41,600 Speaker 1: and connect with the Betrayal community, join our substack at 816 00:46:41,600 --> 00:46:45,440 Speaker 1: Betrayal dot substack dot com. We're grateful for your support. 817 00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:48,160 Speaker 1: One way to show support is by subscribing to our 818 00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:50,920 Speaker 1: show on Apple Podcasts and don't forget to rate and 819 00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:54,400 Speaker 1: review Betrayal. Five star reviews go a long way. A 820 00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:58,000 Speaker 1: big thank you to all of our listeners. Betrayal is 821 00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:01,200 Speaker 1: a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass Entertainment Group, 822 00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:05,040 Speaker 1: in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. The show is executive produced 823 00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:08,520 Speaker 1: by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fasin, hosted and produced by 824 00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:12,480 Speaker 1: me Andrea Gunning. This episode was written and produced by 825 00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:16,800 Speaker 1: Olivia Hewitt and Monique Leboard, with additional production from Ben Fetterman, 826 00:47:17,680 --> 00:47:21,319 Speaker 1: casting support from Curry Richmond. Our iHeart team is Ali 827 00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:25,359 Speaker 1: Perry and Jessica Krincheck. Audio editing and mixing by Matt 828 00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:30,279 Speaker 1: del Vecchio. Additional audio editing by Tanner Robbins. Betrayal's theme 829 00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:35,000 Speaker 1: composed by Oliver Bain's music library provided by mybe Music. 830 00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:38,839 Speaker 1: And for more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app, 831 00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:44,279 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.