1
00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:06,680
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff

2
00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:13,720
Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, welcome to the podcast. This is

3
00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:16,840
Speaker 1: Robert Lamb and this is Julie Douglas. Tell me this, Julie,

4
00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:20,840
Speaker 1: what is it about the human navel that makes people

5
00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:24,400
Speaker 1: question the very fabric of existence? Well, you say fabric.

6
00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:27,720
Speaker 1: I think of land, of course, but beyond that, um,

7
00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:31,040
Speaker 1: I think that I think of the proverbial sixteen year

8
00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:35,040
Speaker 1: old sitting around wondering why he or she is on

9
00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:39,920
Speaker 1: this earth made to endure high school? Um? Or you know,

10
00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:43,080
Speaker 1: why am I the daughter or the son of my

11
00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:46,920
Speaker 1: particular set of parents and so on and so forth. Yeah, yeah,

12
00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:49,360
Speaker 1: And then the navel makes one think of this because

13
00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:51,239
Speaker 1: it's like where does it begin? Where does it end?

14
00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:54,240
Speaker 1: That's right origins, you know, that's that's where we hooked up.

15
00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:56,920
Speaker 1: If you were willing pull on the navel like this,

16
00:00:57,080 --> 00:00:59,639
Speaker 1: the person unravel. You know, what does an audi mean?

17
00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:02,120
Speaker 1: What is any mean? This lint come from without or

18
00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:04,320
Speaker 1: from within? Because I always thought it came from within,

19
00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:08,320
Speaker 1: but I could it comes from a without. I think

20
00:01:08,319 --> 00:01:10,920
Speaker 1: the lint comes from without. I don't know. I have

21
00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:13,760
Speaker 1: a self cleaning belly button, so I can't really those

22
00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:17,119
Speaker 1: are great. I heard those are on the market. Yeah yeah, um,

23
00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:21,440
Speaker 1: they're kind of expensive, but they're well worth it. Yeah. Um.

24
00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:24,479
Speaker 1: But no, I mean I think that when you had

25
00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:28,800
Speaker 1: proposed doing this podcast, I thought about the navel gazing

26
00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,959
Speaker 1: for sure, But um on a cosmological level, yeah, yeah,

27
00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:35,440
Speaker 1: I think on like on the individual level, and I'll

28
00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:37,200
Speaker 1: throughout this podcast, we're gonna start with the individual on

29
00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:39,880
Speaker 1: sort of you know, span out like powers a tent,

30
00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,120
Speaker 1: you know, until we reach the you know, the boundaries

31
00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:47,880
Speaker 1: of of understanding, because we're vinglorious like that. Yes. Um,

32
00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:50,120
Speaker 1: So it's like on a on a very simple level,

33
00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:51,800
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, we all give those moments. It's just

34
00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:54,280
Speaker 1: this little like generalis like just one little nugget of

35
00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,760
Speaker 1: pure thought, you know, I mean, unformed thought. We we

36
00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:00,040
Speaker 1: kind of think, you know, here I am, I and

37
00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,760
Speaker 1: I exist. I'm thinking right now. You know, just just

38
00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:06,800
Speaker 1: stop for a second and do that, gentle listener, Yeah

39
00:02:06,800 --> 00:02:10,000
Speaker 1: that right there isn't that amazing? Yeah? You know, and

40
00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:11,880
Speaker 1: then other stuff comes crashing in. We end up thinking

41
00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:14,560
Speaker 1: about the grocery list or or you know, or we

42
00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:16,560
Speaker 1: we throw religion in on top of it and explain

43
00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:18,959
Speaker 1: everything away to a certain extent. But but for that

44
00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:21,440
Speaker 1: one moment, for that one moment, for that one brief,

45
00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:28,000
Speaker 1: glorious moment, you get a sense of the the gravitas

46
00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:32,960
Speaker 1: of this moment where we're actually existing. And and if

47
00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:36,600
Speaker 1: you're an astrophysicist, you have been thinking about this. You're

48
00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:38,880
Speaker 1: probably your entire life, not just nable gazing about it

49
00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:42,639
Speaker 1: when you were sixteen, and you're applying it to not

50
00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:46,480
Speaker 1: just hey, we're sitting here in a podcast booth talking

51
00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:50,560
Speaker 1: about this. Why are we in particular sitting here on

52
00:02:50,639 --> 00:02:53,720
Speaker 1: Earth in this solar system? What what makes us so

53
00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:57,959
Speaker 1: special or not special? Exactly? Yeah, that's that's that's what

54
00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:01,240
Speaker 1: people keep discussing time and time and end though there

55
00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:04,800
Speaker 1: was a time when, in the same way that you

56
00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:06,280
Speaker 1: know that that we're at the center of any of

57
00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:08,600
Speaker 1: these questions. You know, why am I here? You know what?

58
00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,720
Speaker 1: How did how did I get to be here? Um?

59
00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:13,919
Speaker 1: You know people have used to have the sen sort

60
00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:18,400
Speaker 1: of models for the cosmos. You had the geocentric model. UM.

61
00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:23,280
Speaker 1: That was sort of an early scientific way of understanding, um,

62
00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:26,280
Speaker 1: the visible Solar system and how the planets and everything

63
00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:30,040
Speaker 1: moved in our relationship to right and so geocentricism is

64
00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:33,240
Speaker 1: the Earth is the center of the universe and everything

65
00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:36,040
Speaker 1: else revolves around us. And uh, and that was a

66
00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:38,560
Speaker 1: big medicine back in the back in the day. But

67
00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:40,840
Speaker 1: then you ended up having a new theory come up

68
00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:44,200
Speaker 1: come along called the heliocentric theory, which said, actually, Earth

69
00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:46,760
Speaker 1: isn't the center of the universe. The Sun is the

70
00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:51,320
Speaker 1: center of the universe. I saw I saw something Africa,

71
00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:54,280
Speaker 1: which which thinker it was? But someone had like, no, no,

72
00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:58,160
Speaker 1: it was Tico Bray, the guy with the who's amazing

73
00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:00,640
Speaker 1: we had like the fake nose because he lost a

74
00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:03,840
Speaker 1: nose in a duel. Yeah, and he had a he

75
00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:06,360
Speaker 1: had like a pet deer that lived in the in

76
00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:10,280
Speaker 1: the mansion with him or the castle with him or whatever. Yeah. Yeah,

77
00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:12,120
Speaker 1: and he would like feed the deer beer. And then

78
00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:14,560
Speaker 1: the deer drank itself to death and fell down some stairs.

79
00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:18,240
Speaker 1: And then someone may or may not have poisoned Tico,

80
00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:22,520
Speaker 1: or he may have um his bladder may have exploded

81
00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:23,919
Speaker 1: because he was too drunk to get up from the

82
00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:26,679
Speaker 1: dinner table. There are different theories. He was a great man,

83
00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:30,000
Speaker 1: but uh, he kind of had like he was he

84
00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:33,400
Speaker 1: wasn't like fully ready to adopt the heliocentric model. At

85
00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:35,799
Speaker 1: one point he was that he said, you know, okay,

86
00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:38,120
Speaker 1: the Sun is the center of the universe, and then

87
00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:40,320
Speaker 1: the Earth revolves around the Sun, but then everything else

88
00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:43,520
Speaker 1: revolves around here or or it was a variation on that.

89
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:48,080
Speaker 1: But so yeah, but one of the early um, uh,

90
00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:49,720
Speaker 1: you know, one of the early guys that really committed

91
00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,320
Speaker 1: to this was Nicholas Copernicus. Uh. And to give him

92
00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:54,440
Speaker 1: more of a frame of reference, this guy lived fourteen

93
00:04:54,480 --> 00:04:58,120
Speaker 1: seventy three to fifty three, and you know, he's a

94
00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:01,520
Speaker 1: mathematician astronomer and uh. And yeah, he was cool with

95
00:05:01,560 --> 00:05:03,760
Speaker 1: the idea that Earth was not the center of everything.

96
00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:06,479
Speaker 1: And out of a lot of his thinking comes this

97
00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:10,480
Speaker 1: thing called the Copernican principle. And this just says that

98
00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:14,360
Speaker 1: there's uh, there's no there are no special observers, there

99
00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:17,800
Speaker 1: are no special origins or viewpoints and uh. And so

100
00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:20,960
Speaker 1: that if you have a theory about about humanity, about

101
00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:26,000
Speaker 1: humanity's origins or its place in the cosmos, um that

102
00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:28,719
Speaker 1: you know that that gives you know, humans a privileged position,

103
00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:33,719
Speaker 1: then from a scientific standpoint at least, that theory is bunk. Okay, Alright,

104
00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:37,640
Speaker 1: So the really intriguing part of this I think that

105
00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:40,040
Speaker 1: you had sent me is is something about a little

106
00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:44,240
Speaker 1: lady named Goldilocks. Yes, uh, and everyone's familiar with the

107
00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:47,200
Speaker 1: Goldilocks story. Can you tell us the story? Yeah, yeah,

108
00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:50,920
Speaker 1: you've got Goldilocks, she of the blonde tresses who breaks

109
00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:57,280
Speaker 1: in um to this house with three bears are the tenants, right,

110
00:05:57,279 --> 00:05:58,960
Speaker 1: And it's like a mother and a father and a

111
00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:02,520
Speaker 1: child bear. Right. Yeah, So I mean, you know she's

112
00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:04,800
Speaker 1: they're not there, so she can't terrorize them, but she

113
00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:08,240
Speaker 1: does rifle through their stuff. She eats their food, she

114
00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:14,000
Speaker 1: tests out their beds um, and she's very particular, this Goldilocks.

115
00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:17,040
Speaker 1: It's interesting I read that they are older models of

116
00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:19,080
Speaker 1: the story, because of course all these folk tales are

117
00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:21,960
Speaker 1: as old as time, and but in some of the

118
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:24,560
Speaker 1: older models of it, apparently Goldilocks was like an old

119
00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:28,120
Speaker 1: woman and the bears like catch her and like try

120
00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,120
Speaker 1: and like drown her and burn her and all these

121
00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:32,800
Speaker 1: other things. And then I think she still slips out

122
00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:35,039
Speaker 1: the window. But yeah, so at some point she switched

123
00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:39,039
Speaker 1: from like horrible old lady burglar to like shift her. Yeah,

124
00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:42,880
Speaker 1: she was a shape shifter, that was it. But to

125
00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:45,240
Speaker 1: this young innocent that we would all be really upset

126
00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:47,800
Speaker 1: about if the bear's mauld right. Yeah, it becomes more

127
00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:49,279
Speaker 1: of an innocent thing. And in a way, it's like,

128
00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:52,159
Speaker 1: if you're thinking of in cosmological terms, it's like, which

129
00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:55,880
Speaker 1: which model are humans? Are we the innocent child stumbling

130
00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:59,279
Speaker 1: through the universe or the um the nasty old woman

131
00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:01,680
Speaker 1: who comes in to steal things? I don't know, or

132
00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:05,680
Speaker 1: are we the bears? Maybe we're the bears? Um? Of course,

133
00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:07,560
Speaker 1: the whole thing is she ends up finding the porridge

134
00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:09,880
Speaker 1: that's just right, the bed that's just right, the chair

135
00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:11,920
Speaker 1: that's just right, because the other options are either you know,

136
00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:13,960
Speaker 1: too big or too small, too cold or too hot.

137
00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:17,000
Speaker 1: And if you look at our solar system you can

138
00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:19,880
Speaker 1: identify a similar situation with some of the inner planets.

139
00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:25,560
Speaker 1: Look at Venus, Earth and Mars. Venus, Uh, the atmosphere

140
00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:28,560
Speaker 1: is too thick, too dense, it's insane pressure crushed like

141
00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:31,440
Speaker 1: a grape, and it's too hot. Go over to Mars.

142
00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:35,480
Speaker 1: Not enough atmosphere, and you'll freeze to death. If you

143
00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:38,000
Speaker 1: happen to land on Earth, though, you'll find everything is

144
00:07:38,040 --> 00:07:41,960
Speaker 1: just right. We have thriving life everywhere because conditions are

145
00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,200
Speaker 1: fine for that to happen right Florida. It's sunny all

146
00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:48,040
Speaker 1: year long, right, and and there are a number of

147
00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:50,720
Speaker 1: different The thing that really gives people thinking is that

148
00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:53,760
Speaker 1: there are a number of different um situations that line

149
00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:58,120
Speaker 1: up just so you know, um, it's uh, you know,

150
00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:00,280
Speaker 1: it's like when when you start thinking about like if

151
00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:02,880
Speaker 1: my mom and dad hadn't met and you know then

152
00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,240
Speaker 1: and and hooked up, I wouldn't be here today. And

153
00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,840
Speaker 1: then if you started, you know, uh, pointing out other

154
00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,080
Speaker 1: things about it, like well, if my dad hadn't gone

155
00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:11,920
Speaker 1: to this school, he wouldn't have met her. And if

156
00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:14,720
Speaker 1: my mom, you know, had done such and such, then

157
00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:16,920
Speaker 1: she wouldn't have been you know, they're all these different factors.

158
00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:18,520
Speaker 1: You can start laying out right, and you can even

159
00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:20,840
Speaker 1: kind of go deeper back and say, if my great

160
00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:24,640
Speaker 1: grandfather hadn't dodged that straight bullet, or you know, his

161
00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,440
Speaker 1: grandfather hadn't done this, and then you can sort of

162
00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:30,400
Speaker 1: expand out from there and start to apply this to

163
00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:33,680
Speaker 1: the universe. Right, Like I'm just to run through some

164
00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:35,920
Speaker 1: of the things about Earth. Uh, the temperature is just

165
00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,120
Speaker 1: right for the to be liquid water. We have a

166
00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:41,520
Speaker 1: large enough moon to give us climate stability. The Sun

167
00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:47,040
Speaker 1: is stable and isn't you know, expanding and destroying us anything.

168
00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:50,479
Speaker 1: And compared to other suns, it's a pretty stable sun. Um.

169
00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:54,160
Speaker 1: It's uh, we have just the right core um only

170
00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:57,439
Speaker 1: of the inner planet's only Mercury and Earth have a

171
00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:01,200
Speaker 1: liquid solid core that creates this uh this um uh

172
00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:04,760
Speaker 1: this dynamo effect that produces an electromagnetic shield to that

173
00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:06,720
Speaker 1: ends up protecting us from a lot of the harmful

174
00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,960
Speaker 1: effects of the Sun and uh and yeah, so we

175
00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:12,240
Speaker 1: just happened to have that going for us. Uh. And

176
00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:14,360
Speaker 1: then we have the right neighbors, Jupiter shields Earth from

177
00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:17,280
Speaker 1: a lot of the stellar bombardment we'd end up suffering

178
00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:20,880
Speaker 1: through otherwise and would have very likely um um ended

179
00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:23,679
Speaker 1: um evolution before it really got rolling at some point, right.

180
00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:26,320
Speaker 1: So yeah, all these things are you know, situations where

181
00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:27,760
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, if it wasn't for that, would we

182
00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:30,200
Speaker 1: be here? Maybe not? So yeah, you on this that's

183
00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:33,960
Speaker 1: forty seven billion years in the making, about a couple

184
00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:37,760
Speaker 1: million years ago we came into existence or evolved in

185
00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:41,040
Speaker 1: to to what we are today. So it is pretty

186
00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,440
Speaker 1: amazing when you stop and think, um, when you clear

187
00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:47,800
Speaker 1: that grocery list out of your head or or whatever

188
00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:51,280
Speaker 1: else is popping up on your computer to distract you

189
00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,560
Speaker 1: to think, again, why am I here? Why I'm Why

190
00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:58,320
Speaker 1: are we here in this particular universe? Are we unique?

191
00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:01,480
Speaker 1: Are there other universes out there? Their other means? How

192
00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,800
Speaker 1: does how is that working? And so I think that's

193
00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,839
Speaker 1: why the Goldilocks principle is so very interesting because it's

194
00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:14,280
Speaker 1: it's not um. It's not a sort of uh, mathematical

195
00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:17,199
Speaker 1: proof in the sense that we have a theory um

196
00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:21,000
Speaker 1: that we can say, Okay, we have this overwhelming theory

197
00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:23,640
Speaker 1: and it's gonna it's gonna tell us exactly why we exist,

198
00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:28,920
Speaker 1: but it does lend some credence to the anthropic principle.

199
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:34,440
Speaker 1: And the anthropic principle is basically saying, to paraphrase Stephen Hawking,

200
00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:38,839
Speaker 1: that things are as they are because we are, which

201
00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:44,600
Speaker 1: sounds a lot like dey card part of my frolish,

202
00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:48,760
Speaker 1: which would be I think therefore I am Yeah. So

203
00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:55,000
Speaker 1: you have this principle which a lot of scientists, astrophysicists, theologians,

204
00:10:55,120 --> 00:10:59,880
Speaker 1: you name it, have seized on to try to explain

205
00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:03,760
Speaker 1: why we are able to hang out here in this

206
00:11:03,880 --> 00:11:08,839
Speaker 1: universe observe the fact that we're here and the fact

207
00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:10,679
Speaker 1: that we're supported by it. Yeah, and then you have

208
00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,439
Speaker 1: you have the Commernican principle in the background the whole time,

209
00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:16,280
Speaker 1: reminding you that there's nothing special about about Earth, nothing

210
00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:18,520
Speaker 1: special about humanity. So when you look at the at

211
00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:20,600
Speaker 1: everything being just right on the Earth, you know, it

212
00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:22,920
Speaker 1: leads to theories. You know, um that a lot of

213
00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:25,520
Speaker 1: people hold about there being other planets where life could

214
00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:29,640
Speaker 1: could potentially evolve because there's nothing nothing special about Earth,

215
00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,040
Speaker 1: then it couldn't be the only one, right, right, right,

216
00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:37,160
Speaker 1: So the multiple universes, and of course you can get

217
00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:39,360
Speaker 1: really deep into this and say there are parallel universes,

218
00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,280
Speaker 1: there's another universe where you and I are talking in

219
00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:46,120
Speaker 1: a completely different place right now, although maybe we're talking backwards,

220
00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:47,839
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, yeah, that you get into the

221
00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,160
Speaker 1: whole area of like it's like a Library of Babbel

222
00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:53,280
Speaker 1: kind of situation where all possible universes exist with all

223
00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:56,760
Speaker 1: possible variations and outcomes. Yeah, one way we're having a

224
00:11:56,760 --> 00:12:01,640
Speaker 1: different conversation, one where like we all ball caps, one

225
00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:05,160
Speaker 1: where our son was kind of a jerk and blew

226
00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:08,680
Speaker 1: up before we could evolve, right, Yeah, Yeah, because if

227
00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:12,360
Speaker 1: we're just gonna be anthropic principle, and again, anthropic means

228
00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:14,920
Speaker 1: of or relating to human beings or the period of

229
00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:19,320
Speaker 1: their existence on Earth. Um, there are several um anthropic coincidences.

230
00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:21,400
Speaker 1: They're kind of like those the list of things that

231
00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:24,080
Speaker 1: we lined up for the planet, you can make a

232
00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:27,320
Speaker 1: similar list for the cosmos itself. They just tend to

233
00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:30,199
Speaker 1: be a little more complex. Like uh, and I'm not

234
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:32,120
Speaker 1: gonna go into too much depth here because he's getting

235
00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:35,000
Speaker 1: kind of crazy. But when you compare the electromatic force

236
00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,840
Speaker 1: to gravity, we find that electromagnetism is thirty times stronger.

237
00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:41,880
Speaker 1: And that's fortunate because if the two powers were more

238
00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:45,320
Speaker 1: evenly matched, stars wouldn't burn long enough for life to

239
00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:48,760
Speaker 1: develop on an orbiting planet. So uh, and they're all

240
00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:51,120
Speaker 1: you know, things of that nature where if like numbers

241
00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:53,280
Speaker 1: were a little different, if the dye roll you know,

242
00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:56,520
Speaker 1: from the Big Bang were had come out just just

243
00:12:56,679 --> 00:13:01,520
Speaker 1: slightly skewed, then nothing might have nothing could exist or

244
00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:05,040
Speaker 1: or things would exist in a vastly different shape than

245
00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:08,319
Speaker 1: they are now. So that's I think why anthropic principle

246
00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:12,160
Speaker 1: is so intriguing, because it does give us a way

247
00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:16,600
Speaker 1: to say, okay, we are in this universe, and perhaps

248
00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:22,360
Speaker 1: everything isn't happening by chance. Right. The problem with this

249
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:26,120
Speaker 1: is that when we when we traps out of the

250
00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:30,880
Speaker 1: area of chance, we start to look for some sort

251
00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:35,640
Speaker 1: of theory. I'm gonna go ahead and say it's super

252
00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,800
Speaker 1: being God Creator, and that's what the anthropic principles sort

253
00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:42,480
Speaker 1: of points to when you think about it. Yeah, and

254
00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:44,360
Speaker 1: a lot of people end up using it as an

255
00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:48,080
Speaker 1: argument for um, you know, um, intelligent design and things

256
00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:50,480
Speaker 1: of that nature and the existence of God and other

257
00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:56,520
Speaker 1: things that can't actually you know, actually be proved you know, scientifically, um.

258
00:13:56,559 --> 00:13:58,719
Speaker 1: And a lot of this also, this comes from a

259
00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,560
Speaker 1: guy named brand and Carter was the guy who initially

260
00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:06,199
Speaker 1: sort of kicked off out there. Yeah, and he actually

261
00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:08,120
Speaker 1: I believed that he just put out two of these

262
00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:11,959
Speaker 1: two variations on the theory, weak anthropic principle and strong

263
00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:15,520
Speaker 1: anthropic principle. And if the cool kids tend to offense,

264
00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:18,000
Speaker 1: just call it ap franthropic principle, or if you're talking

265
00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:21,600
Speaker 1: about weakenthropic principle, you call it like WAP. I guess right,

266
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:24,120
Speaker 1: that is so wa yeah, or like they said, like

267
00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:27,200
Speaker 1: WAP is lack right. If they don't like it kids

268
00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:33,400
Speaker 1: these days, But weekend thropic principle is probably my favorite

269
00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:37,120
Speaker 1: because it's just so simple and it doesn't overthink itself.

270
00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:40,760
Speaker 1: It's actually kind of elegant. Basically, Carter just pointed out

271
00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:44,400
Speaker 1: that if our universe weren't hospitable to life, then we

272
00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:48,040
Speaker 1: wouldn't be here to think about it being hospitable to life.

273
00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:49,840
Speaker 1: That's right. It's like if your mom and dad hadn't

274
00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:52,200
Speaker 1: hooked up, Yeah, you wouldn't exist. You wouldn't be here

275
00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:55,440
Speaker 1: to think about the fact that you exist. So it's

276
00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:57,520
Speaker 1: I love it because it's kind of like that. The

277
00:14:57,560 --> 00:14:59,680
Speaker 1: weekendthropic principle is kind of like an end of the argument,

278
00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:02,160
Speaker 1: and it's elf it's kind of like, well, stop worrying

279
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:05,400
Speaker 1: about it, because it's you know, the answer is in

280
00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:09,280
Speaker 1: the question. Yeah, yeah, I I think, therefore I am

281
00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:11,880
Speaker 1: and quit thinking yeah yeah, And it's a it's an

282
00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:15,800
Speaker 1: unconditional truth. So yeah, you're right. It's it's very simple

283
00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:18,920
Speaker 1: in that way, and it's very comforting. And then you

284
00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:22,920
Speaker 1: have a strong anthropic principle, right, So that's basically saying,

285
00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:25,400
Speaker 1: because we live in a universe that supports life, only

286
00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:31,560
Speaker 1: life supporting the universes exists. Essentially, it's creating the observer. Yeah,

287
00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:33,760
Speaker 1: it's kind of like if you were inside, you know,

288
00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:35,680
Speaker 1: you're hanging out in your living room. You've never been

289
00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:37,320
Speaker 1: outside of your living room, and you know, she had

290
00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:39,800
Speaker 1: a fireplace and you and if you went with the theory,

291
00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:42,880
Speaker 1: maybe the world. I guess all houses have fireplaces, you know,

292
00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:45,440
Speaker 1: because there's nothing unique about this one, because it's the

293
00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,440
Speaker 1: only thing that you know, right, Or on a more

294
00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:50,600
Speaker 1: like true level, you could be like, this room has

295
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:53,240
Speaker 1: a roof. I guess all living rooms have roofs to them,

296
00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:57,040
Speaker 1: you know. So I guess that shows where this principle

297
00:15:57,200 --> 00:15:59,560
Speaker 1: has a bit of weakness is that you can't If

298
00:15:59,600 --> 00:16:05,120
Speaker 1: you can't observed beyond your own understanding, then how can

299
00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:10,880
Speaker 1: you presuppose that there are other universes that exist out there?

300
00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:13,880
Speaker 1: If you can't see it, then how do you know,

301
00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:15,480
Speaker 1: Because if you could see it, it it would be part

302
00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:18,440
Speaker 1: of your universe. Yeah, it's like, on one level, we

303
00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:23,600
Speaker 1: have to use our our selves in our world and

304
00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:26,160
Speaker 1: our view of the world as the model upon which

305
00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:28,160
Speaker 1: to base our theories and all, you know, but that

306
00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:30,880
Speaker 1: that can also develop certain problems, right, And then the

307
00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,160
Speaker 1: cool thing about science, I think is that we could.

308
00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:34,880
Speaker 1: We have our five senses and we rely on that,

309
00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:39,280
Speaker 1: but science sort of uh takes up where our five

310
00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:43,160
Speaker 1: senses peter out. You know, Um, those are five senses

311
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,840
Speaker 1: fail us. They do not always um accurate. Um. Our

312
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:51,320
Speaker 1: instinct isn't always accurate. So we have science, you have

313
00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:55,600
Speaker 1: mathematicians who are creating those models based on what we

314
00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,840
Speaker 1: know and then sort of trying to predict these other

315
00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:04,520
Speaker 1: um thoughts. Universes constructs that we can try to get

316
00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:07,080
Speaker 1: our heads around. And so I think that's why this

317
00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:11,400
Speaker 1: the anthropic principle is so important, because that's the principle

318
00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:15,800
Speaker 1: that is being used in m theory or string theory,

319
00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:22,480
Speaker 1: which presupposes that these other universes exist um. And that's

320
00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:27,080
Speaker 1: also it's Achilles heal, because well, hey, you've got this

321
00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:30,720
Speaker 1: sort of stand in theory the anthropic principles saying well,

322
00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:34,080
Speaker 1: if we can observe this, then we know we're in it,

323
00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:38,240
Speaker 1: and there's the possibility of other universes just like ourselves existing.

324
00:17:38,680 --> 00:17:42,040
Speaker 1: And yet we cannot bear this out. We cannot, we

325
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:45,040
Speaker 1: can we can't ring up the little large Hadron collider

326
00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:47,439
Speaker 1: and say hey, can you bear this out first? Simply

327
00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:50,920
Speaker 1: because we don't have the technology yet to prove it out.

328
00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:54,919
Speaker 1: And that's not true of other theories that we have

329
00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:58,080
Speaker 1: been able to use technology to to bear out the

330
00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:01,880
Speaker 1: results and say, ah, yes, this, this, um, this mathematic

331
00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:04,440
Speaker 1: prediction was correct. Yeah. I think the other day when

332
00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:06,960
Speaker 1: we're talking about this, you you pointed out that some

333
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:08,159
Speaker 1: of these things are just kind of a kind of

334
00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:12,080
Speaker 1: like place holders for actual answers. They're like scientific placeholders

335
00:18:12,119 --> 00:18:16,320
Speaker 1: for you know. Um. And the other interesting thing about

336
00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:19,760
Speaker 1: anthropic principle is that people kind of take take it

337
00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:22,560
Speaker 1: and spin off their own like variation of the anthropic principle,

338
00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:28,359
Speaker 1: and sometimes uh, you know, mind blowing or just crazy directions,

339
00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:32,000
Speaker 1: you know. Um, there are like thirty album I think

340
00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:36,399
Speaker 1: based on one estimate I read, but like the participatory

341
00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:39,879
Speaker 1: anthropic principles pretty wild, did you? Is that the quantum

342
00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:42,439
Speaker 1: space one? Yeah, well this is the one that spins

343
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:46,240
Speaker 1: off from some some stuff like the the Copenhagen interpretation

344
00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:48,720
Speaker 1: of quantum mechanics and the whole idea of like things

345
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:52,520
Speaker 1: not being actualized until they're observed and measured, you know, yeah, right,

346
00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:55,920
Speaker 1: and not and not actually even acting like we think

347
00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:59,920
Speaker 1: they act simply because at this one state it happened

348
00:18:59,920 --> 00:19:02,159
Speaker 1: to be here. In other words, you can't predict the

349
00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:06,320
Speaker 1: results every single time, and you know, not to get

350
00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:10,199
Speaker 1: into quarks. Um, I don't think anybody wants us to

351
00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:14,200
Speaker 1: go that deep, but sorry, go ahead. No, it's just like, basically,

352
00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:16,640
Speaker 1: the the idea is that only universes that have an

353
00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:19,159
Speaker 1: observers in them to observe it exists. It's kind of like,

354
00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:20,800
Speaker 1: you know, kind of a tree falls in the forest

355
00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:23,560
Speaker 1: kind of thing. In a weird way. It's like like

356
00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:26,879
Speaker 1: the universe. The universe can only exist if there's somebody

357
00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:30,040
Speaker 1: there to observe it and give it form. In a way,

358
00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:46,160
Speaker 1: it's kind of crazy right without the observer. Yeah, well

359
00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:51,199
Speaker 1: I was thinking about this too. Um, you've got Stephen Hawking,

360
00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:55,480
Speaker 1: who obviously some people think he is God and has

361
00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 1: created the universes and that maybe we don't know. Um,

362
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,240
Speaker 1: we don't have a mathematical constructor hear that up. But

363
00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:05,040
Speaker 1: we do have John Horgan, who was the former Scientific

364
00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:09,080
Speaker 1: American editor who actually took him to task. I thought

365
00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:14,000
Speaker 1: that was, Um, he has some big spheres for doing that. Yeah,

366
00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:15,800
Speaker 1: it's kind of it's always a brave move when you

367
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 1: go after go after Hawking or or you know, pick

368
00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:21,800
Speaker 1: at something. He said, yeah, yeah. I was like, wow, dude,

369
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:26,120
Speaker 1: I hope that you have bulletproof glass there. Um, well,

370
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:30,760
Speaker 1: not really, I don't think that astrophysists are gonna Hawking

371
00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:35,879
Speaker 1: was packing. I was thinking more of his followers, but

372
00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:39,439
Speaker 1: but now I think they're probably kind and gentle souls.

373
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:43,399
Speaker 1: But basically what he said is, Okay, you've got Hawking

374
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:48,480
Speaker 1: wanting to forward this idea of a theory of everything

375
00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:53,280
Speaker 1: too for short and uh in particular m theory, which

376
00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:56,239
Speaker 1: is an extension of string theory. Just if you look

377
00:20:56,280 --> 00:21:00,520
Speaker 1: at them, it's membranes instead of strings. And Hawking is

378
00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:02,480
Speaker 1: actually saying, you know what, we need to use the

379
00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,960
Speaker 1: anthropic principle in order to help bear this theory out.

380
00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:10,440
Speaker 1: And Horgan's basically saying, hey, there's there's a real problem

381
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,159
Speaker 1: with us. We can't that the anthropic is something that

382
00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:18,800
Speaker 1: we can't actually um say that there's any data to

383
00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:21,119
Speaker 1: to bear it out, but we don't have the technology

384
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:25,640
Speaker 1: and to to do this. And essentially, and here's where

385
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:29,119
Speaker 1: the it's kind of the beach slap. It's cosmology's version

386
00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:33,199
Speaker 1: of creationism. And he's loving that against Hawking and I

387
00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:37,080
Speaker 1: think you know, you know, this is not my wheelhouse,

388
00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:38,880
Speaker 1: but do you have to say, I think that there's

389
00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:43,040
Speaker 1: a point with us and you can't help but see

390
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:45,040
Speaker 1: where you'd want to have a theory of everything, where

391
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:47,760
Speaker 1: you want to have something unifying saying finally, we have

392
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:52,040
Speaker 1: reached the end of meaning. We understand exactly why we're

393
00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:54,719
Speaker 1: all hanging out here in this podcast booth at this

394
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 1: very moment um. But we just we're limited where you know,

395
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:03,080
Speaker 1: language fails us as well. We can't actually describe where

396
00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:07,640
Speaker 1: we're at at this point of revolution cognitive closure at

397
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,800
Speaker 1: some point, and it's just only so much we can do. Yeah, yeah,

398
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:14,080
Speaker 1: cogniti closure. I like that. Yeah. And then there's another

399
00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:18,800
Speaker 1: aspect of this UM which is called carbon chauvinism. Yeah,

400
00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,000
Speaker 1: this one is really cool, and it's just basically the

401
00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 1: idea that we are we are carbon based life forms UM,

402
00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:28,040
Speaker 1: and we often find it hard to imagine that there

403
00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:32,080
Speaker 1: are other UM that they're biochemical forms out there that

404
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:36,640
Speaker 1: are based on other recipes, if you will, right right,

405
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,480
Speaker 1: So that and in fact, I think they've used the

406
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:42,159
Speaker 1: example before of silicon. That's something that UM that you

407
00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:45,840
Speaker 1: can get actually some complex results from and they're even

408
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:49,560
Speaker 1: saying that, um, it's molecular chauvinism, that we just don't

409
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:52,480
Speaker 1: understand that there are other ways maybe to come to

410
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:57,560
Speaker 1: the table as a being, which makes me wonder about

411
00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,640
Speaker 1: extraterrestrials because they're you know, in all that there's really

412
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:04,160
Speaker 1: no discussion. Yeah. I mean like if you look into

413
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:07,000
Speaker 1: science fiction, and there's plenty of examples. I know, I've

414
00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,400
Speaker 1: read things with with silicon based life forms in them,

415
00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 1: and of course you're always encountering like energy beings and

416
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:16,159
Speaker 1: things of that nature. Um. So, so yeah, it's like,

417
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:18,680
Speaker 1: you know, if we we we put the carbon chauvinism

418
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,560
Speaker 1: the side would be able to you know, potentially imagine

419
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:25,040
Speaker 1: um or not imagine, but you know receival world where

420
00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 1: a universe where there are other very forms of life

421
00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:30,800
Speaker 1: out there. I have to ask you a really personal question.

422
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,640
Speaker 1: Where are you on the ET scale? Um? I don't know. Well,

423
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,480
Speaker 1: the ET scale has been interesting throughout my life because

424
00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,680
Speaker 1: I used to be terrified of being abducted by aliens

425
00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:44,560
Speaker 1: when I was in like junior high and before that

426
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 1: I kind of got out of it in high school,

427
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 1: so that that was a time where it's like I

428
00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:50,440
Speaker 1: was really terrified of them, and then I decided that

429
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:52,000
Speaker 1: I was going to make a conscious effort just not

430
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,280
Speaker 1: to believe in aliens. So I was really against the

431
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:58,359
Speaker 1: idea of them for a while. And uh, I don't know.

432
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:01,240
Speaker 1: Now I try and keep an open mind, so I

433
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 1: feel like they could be out there. I don't So

434
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: there's a whole separate podcast to be done on this.

435
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 1: But I mean, I think that a lot of what

436
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,440
Speaker 1: we end up perceiving in this world that we think

437
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,719
Speaker 1: are aliens, it's actually there are actually a lot of

438
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:22,200
Speaker 1: really good explanations, logical explanations for what those uh events are,

439
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,160
Speaker 1: or what those experiences are. But but no, I think

440
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:27,920
Speaker 1: there could be There could be life in this year. No, yeah,

441
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 1: my my intelligent maybe more intelligent. Yeah, And that's what

442
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,120
Speaker 1: I think is interesting. It could be Yeah, it could

443
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,920
Speaker 1: be a very super intelligent being or not so much.

444
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:39,879
Speaker 1: I don't know, just hanging out at the bowling alley.

445
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,320
Speaker 1: Nothing that there's nothing about the warning alleast by the way,

446
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: I love bowling. I have to say, um, but yeah,

447
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 1: I just had to throw that out there. It's just

448
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 1: because my own world view was tinged by this by

449
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,639
Speaker 1: my grandmother, who you know, I grew up hearing about

450
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:57,000
Speaker 1: how she and my grandfather on a lonely country road

451
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,919
Speaker 1: came across which she called little green men. So I

452
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:04,680
Speaker 1: always grew up with this idea of, well, cool, maybe

453
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:08,320
Speaker 1: these little green men do exist, and so, well, yeah,

454
00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:10,239
Speaker 1: we'll definitely have to get into this in a later

455
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,159
Speaker 1: to say yeah, we did, definitely. But looking at the

456
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,560
Speaker 1: inn profit principle and looking at ourselves in the universe,

457
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,639
Speaker 1: you gotta wonder why that isn't a larger part of it,

458
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:22,960
Speaker 1: particularly since Stephen Hawking has you know, pulled the trigger

459
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,880
Speaker 1: around the warning shots to say, hey, guys, don't talk

460
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 1: to the aliens, don't let them know we're here, because

461
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,119
Speaker 1: if there anything like us, then they're they're probably really

462
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,960
Speaker 1: they're really jerks. Yeah, they're going to colonize this um.

463
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,919
Speaker 1: So I think that's why this, this theory or this

464
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 1: principle really is interesting, because again we get down to

465
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 1: this individual level of you know, scrapping all of our

466
00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 1: grocery list and everything else and wondering why in the

467
00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 1: world and this carbon based life form and allowed to exist.

468
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: And I think the bigger problem here, um is that

469
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,399
Speaker 1: we're mortal. We know that we're going to die, And

470
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,639
Speaker 1: so I think this is why we're grappling with this

471
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:11,359
Speaker 1: so much as scientists, as human beings, um, because we

472
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 1: know that this universe forty seven billion years in the

473
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:19,399
Speaker 1: making is not essentially for us, or if we do

474
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,360
Speaker 1: think it's for us, then we think, well, why does

475
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:23,160
Speaker 1: it all have to end? And so on and so forth.

476
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:25,479
Speaker 1: So then you begin to reach beyond that, and you

477
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:29,160
Speaker 1: can see how the polled toward of this sort of

478
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 1: all unifying and or creation myth, this god like super

479
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,119
Speaker 1: being is so enticing. Yeah, I mean there's some really

480
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,960
Speaker 1: kind of out there ones to like finally, unthropic principle,

481
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 1: it's a variation that says that once intelligence, um, not

482
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:46,959
Speaker 1: intelligent beings, but actual intelligence like pops up in the universe,

483
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 1: then it's never going out that it's gonna pretty much

484
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:54,040
Speaker 1: thrive and eventually become God. It's gonna propagate itself. Yeah

485
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:58,120
Speaker 1: and and yeah, so you know take that and run

486
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,360
Speaker 1: with it with your imagination, because that's pretty out there.

487
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 1: Well that always makes me think of the computer simulation, Like,

488
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 1: are we just hanging out in a computer computer simulated

489
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 1: program right now? All of the matrix, um, you know,

490
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 1: is this is this even real. Is this a virtual existence,

491
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 1: which is of course in another one of the anthropic

492
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:21,879
Speaker 1: principles people explored. I love thinking about that kind of stuff.

493
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:24,080
Speaker 1: I just finished reading a book called The Disciple of

494
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:27,400
Speaker 1: the Dog, in which there is a cult um that

495
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:31,320
Speaker 1: believes it's it's it's members believe that the Earth is

496
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,879
Speaker 1: actually fifty billion years older than we think it is,

497
00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 1: and that the life in the world that we perceive

498
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: is actually um it's actually the dream. We're actually the

499
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:46,600
Speaker 1: dreams of quantum computers in the far, far distant future

500
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 1: that I guess got really bored and you know, end

501
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:52,600
Speaker 1: up dreaming of this this you know, past life for

502
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,120
Speaker 1: them to wander through. And so if we could see

503
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: through the illusion, we'd see that the sun fills up

504
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:01,240
Speaker 1: the entire sky and we'll uh, you know, consume the

505
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:04,439
Speaker 1: earth at any moment. Wow. So our existence is just

506
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: fodder for computers to to sort of work through their

507
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:12,160
Speaker 1: boredom issues. Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. The authors are Scott Baker,

508
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:14,480
Speaker 1: and he's he's like a philosophy dude. So he's always

509
00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:16,720
Speaker 1: all of his books end up like bringing all these

510
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 1: like philosophical questions about who we are and what makes

511
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,959
Speaker 1: you know, our heads work. Yeah, well, I don't know.

512
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: I think obviously in this podcast we're not going to

513
00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 1: reach the end of meaning. But I do feel that

514
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 1: we have reached perhaps the end of the podcast, end

515
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 1: of the podcast, so which actually makes me think of

516
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:39,960
Speaker 1: another philosophy Wabi Sabby, which I think most people think

517
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 1: of as embracing in perfection. But another and more nuanced

518
00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:48,720
Speaker 1: reading is that you're either emerging of nothingness or you're

519
00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:52,720
Speaker 1: essentially returning to nothingness, which I don't know. That's that's

520
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:57,200
Speaker 1: maybe more comforting to me, um, And at least it's

521
00:28:57,240 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 1: a it's a way to say, I think that we

522
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:03,640
Speaker 1: are now entering into nothingness. Yes, yes, so hey, if

523
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 1: you listeners have any thoughts on some of this heavy material, um,

524
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 1: then feel free to shoot them to us. Yeah. Yeah,

525
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,040
Speaker 1: you can email us at blow the Mind at how

526
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 1: stuff works dot com, and you can also find us

527
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: on Facebook and Twitter, where you can also find us

528
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: as blow the Mind. Yeah, and please, if your grandmother

529
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:24,600
Speaker 1: told you stories about aliens, we want to hear about them. Yes,

530
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 1: we also want to hear about your own cosmological navel gazing. Yes,

531
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:33,000
Speaker 1: tell us about your navels. Well, not too much, but

532
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: just enough for more on this and thousands of other topics.

533
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 1: Is it how stuff works dot com, The House stuff

534
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: works dot com. My phone app is coming soon. Get

535
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,120
Speaker 1: access to our content in a new way, articles, videos,

536
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:51,800
Speaker 1: and more all on the go. Check out the latest

537
00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 1: podcasts and blog posts, and see what we're saying on

538
00:29:54,800 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 1: Facebook and Twitter. Coming soon to iTunes two