1
00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:04,320
Speaker 1: Welcome to brain Stuff, a production of I Heart Radio,

2
00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:10,479
Speaker 1: Hey brain Stuff. Lauren Bogebaum here. Helen Ackley and her

3
00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:13,440
Speaker 1: family lived with ghosts for years in their turn of

4
00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:17,279
Speaker 1: the century Victorian in upstate New York. One ghost would

5
00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:19,680
Speaker 1: shake the children's beds to wake them up in the morning.

6
00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:23,560
Speaker 1: Another materialized in midair as Helen was painting the ceiling

7
00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,560
Speaker 1: of her living room and apparently approved of her color choice.

8
00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:30,280
Speaker 1: Her son once came face to face with a long

9
00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:36,200
Speaker 1: deceased Navy lieutenant outside the basement door. The Acquis didn't

10
00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:39,839
Speaker 1: keep their spectral guests a secret. Helen was quoted in

11
00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:43,080
Speaker 1: newspaper stories and the Reader's Digest about the family ghosts,

12
00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:46,160
Speaker 1: and the home in Nyack was included on the town's

13
00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:51,000
Speaker 1: Haunted House Tour. Everyone knew that the Acqui place was possessed,

14
00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:59,360
Speaker 1: everyone apparently except Jeffrey Stambowski. In nine Stambofsky, a transplant

15
00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:02,640
Speaker 1: from New York's City, bought the Acquis Victorian mansion for

16
00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:06,080
Speaker 1: six d and fifty thousand dollars without any knowledge that

17
00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:10,000
Speaker 1: the place was famously riddled with ghosts. When his new

18
00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:13,400
Speaker 1: neighbors clued him in, Stambofsky took the acquees to court

19
00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:16,760
Speaker 1: to cancel the contract and get his money back. In

20
00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:21,479
Speaker 1: the first trial, the judge denied Stambofsky's claim, citing caveat

21
00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:26,039
Speaker 1: emper let the buyer beware, but an appeals court in

22
00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:30,320
Speaker 1: New York reversed the decision, ordering Akli to return Stambofsky's

23
00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:34,000
Speaker 1: money in a colorful ruling that included ghostly quotes from

24
00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,880
Speaker 1: Hamlet and reference to the movie Ghostbusters. The court wrote,

25
00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:41,520
Speaker 1: in part, whether the source of the spectral apparitions seen

26
00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:46,440
Speaker 1: by defendant seller are parapsychic or psychogenic, having reported their

27
00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:50,160
Speaker 1: presence in both a national publication Reader's Digest and the

28
00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:54,720
Speaker 1: local press in nine and n two, respectively, the defendant

29
00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:57,480
Speaker 1: is a stopped that is prevented from going back on

30
00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,520
Speaker 1: her word to deny their existence, and as a matter

31
00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:05,880
Speaker 1: of law, the house is haunted. According to recent surveys,

32
00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:08,680
Speaker 1: eighteen percent of Americans say that they've seen or been

33
00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:11,239
Speaker 1: in the presence of a ghost, and about a third

34
00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:15,280
Speaker 1: of Americans believe that haunted houses are real. Since Jeffreys

35
00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:19,960
Speaker 1: Tambofsky bowed out, Helen Accley's house has attracted several celebrity owners,

36
00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:24,120
Speaker 1: although there haven't been any reported ghostly sightings in many years.

37
00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:28,200
Speaker 1: It was last sold in March for one million, seven

38
00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,720
Speaker 1: hundred and ninety five thousand dollars. When a house goes

39
00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:35,600
Speaker 1: on the market, nearly all states require the seller to

40
00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:39,560
Speaker 1: fill out a disclosure form reporting any known structural problems,

41
00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:43,600
Speaker 1: environmental toxins, or other material facts that could affect the

42
00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:47,880
Speaker 1: value of the home. But does that go for ghouls too.

43
00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:52,040
Speaker 1: There are currently no states that require home sellers to

44
00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:56,600
Speaker 1: voluntarily disclose alleged ghostly activities on the property before a sale.

45
00:02:57,360 --> 00:03:01,200
Speaker 1: In fact, only Minnesota even mentions haunteds and its disclosure law,

46
00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:05,720
Speaker 1: which freeze sellers from having to disclose any non material facts,

47
00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:09,880
Speaker 1: including if the home was the site of perceived paranormal activity.

48
00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:15,400
Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that haunted house sellers are home free.

49
00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:20,359
Speaker 1: The actuly verdict, while not officially state law, set an

50
00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:24,240
Speaker 1: important precedent. The court ruled that by not disclosing the

51
00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:28,400
Speaker 1: high profile haunting to the buyer it quote impaired both

52
00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:31,320
Speaker 1: the value of the property and its potential for resale.

53
00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:35,400
Speaker 1: For the article of this episode is based on How

54
00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:38,720
Speaker 1: Stuff Works. Spoke with Cindy Hagley, a California real estate

55
00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:41,920
Speaker 1: broker with the Hagley Group and president of Past Life Homes,

56
00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:46,320
Speaker 1: a consulting business that helps haunted homeowners sell their bedevilled properties.

57
00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:50,320
Speaker 1: In general, Hagley airs on the side of caution when

58
00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,960
Speaker 1: it comes to seller disclosures. She said, if it affects

59
00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:56,960
Speaker 1: the material value of the home, it must be disclosed.

60
00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:01,440
Speaker 1: That said, Hagley will only disclose a haunting if it's

61
00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:05,880
Speaker 1: open and notorious, meaning that there have been multiple sightings

62
00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:09,440
Speaker 1: and all the neighbors know about it. In real estate, lingo,

63
00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,120
Speaker 1: homes that are rumored to be haunted or where the

64
00:04:12,200 --> 00:04:14,920
Speaker 1: site of a high profile murder or meth lab are

65
00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:19,200
Speaker 1: known as stigmatized, as seen in the actly case. The

66
00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:22,719
Speaker 1: negative notoriety of a stigmatized home could affect the value

67
00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:26,720
Speaker 1: of the property, But if the haunting isn't notorious and

68
00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:30,479
Speaker 1: only the owners think they've seen or heard something spooky,

69
00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:34,919
Speaker 1: Hagley might not say anything. She explained. Sometimes a person

70
00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:37,480
Speaker 1: will call me and say, hey, my house is haunted

71
00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,120
Speaker 1: and I need to sell. Will you help me. I'm

72
00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,560
Speaker 1: kind of sensitive to these things myself, so if I

73
00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,040
Speaker 1: walk into a home and there's nothing there, I won't

74
00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:49,320
Speaker 1: disclose it. Even if your state doesn't force you to

75
00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:53,160
Speaker 1: disclose the mysterious scraping noises behind the walls or the

76
00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,680
Speaker 1: intermittent moaning in the basement. Sellers and their agents are

77
00:04:56,760 --> 00:05:00,679
Speaker 1: required to answer honestly when directly asked to question about

78
00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:05,360
Speaker 1: the property, So if asked specifically whether a house is haunted,

79
00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:08,320
Speaker 1: the seller or the agent has to answer truthfully to

80
00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:11,039
Speaker 1: the best of their knowledge about any encounters with spectral

81
00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:15,919
Speaker 1: entities and people do ask. Of course, ghosts aren't the

82
00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:19,200
Speaker 1: only thing that can scare off potential buyers. A lot

83
00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:21,640
Speaker 1: of people are understandably creeped out at the thought of

84
00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:24,560
Speaker 1: moving into a home where someone recently died or that

85
00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:27,159
Speaker 1: was the site of a tragic or violent death, even

86
00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,520
Speaker 1: one that occurred decades ago. So do sellers need to

87
00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:35,560
Speaker 1: disclose if their property is psychologically affected? Again, the law

88
00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:40,240
Speaker 1: is generally on the seller's side. Only Alaska, California, and

89
00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:43,719
Speaker 1: South Dakota's disclosure laws explicitly say that sellers need to

90
00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:48,480
Speaker 1: voluntarily disclose a recent death. In Alaska, the disclosure only

91
00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:51,840
Speaker 1: covers deaths that occurred in the past year, while California

92
00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:56,320
Speaker 1: goes back three years. In South Dakota, there's a slightly

93
00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:58,800
Speaker 1: gruesome question way down at the bottom of the state's

94
00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,080
Speaker 1: disclosure form that needs since you have owned the property,

95
00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:04,800
Speaker 1: are you aware of a human death by homicide or

96
00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:10,240
Speaker 1: suicide occurring on the property. In all states, though, if

97
00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:12,440
Speaker 1: a buyer asks about a death in the home, the

98
00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:15,440
Speaker 1: seller again has a duty to respond truthfully to the

99
00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:19,440
Speaker 1: best of their knowledge. Haguley said, if the buyer asks

100
00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:21,800
Speaker 1: what happened, I believe you should tell them everything you know,

101
00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:25,760
Speaker 1: because if the real estate agent doesn't, the neighbors certainly will.

102
00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,120
Speaker 1: When Hagueley's team is tasked with selling a home that

103
00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:32,919
Speaker 1: was the site of a high profile murder, they'll completely

104
00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:35,200
Speaker 1: redecorate the room of the crime scene and shift the

105
00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:38,599
Speaker 1: focus to other rooms. But she said when buyers walk

106
00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:40,960
Speaker 1: into the home, they're not going to recognize the place

107
00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:43,320
Speaker 1: from the photos that they saw on the five o'clock News.

108
00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:51,000
Speaker 1: Today's episode is based on the article do you have

109
00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,280
Speaker 1: to tell buyers your house is haunted? On how stuff

110
00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:56,160
Speaker 1: works dot com written by Dave Rouse. Brain Stuff is

111
00:06:56,160 --> 00:06:58,320
Speaker 1: production of by Heart Radio in partnership with how stuff

112
00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:00,279
Speaker 1: works dot Com, and it is produced by Tyler Playing.

113
00:07:00,760 --> 00:07:03,080
Speaker 1: Four more podcasts from my Heart Radio visit the i

114
00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:05,800
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to

115
00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:17,880
Speaker 1: your favorite shows. H