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Speaker 1: This episode of Thinking Sideways is not brought to you

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Speaker 1: by the monster that is definitely under your bed. You

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Speaker 1: should look right now, it's really scary now. Instead, it's

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Speaker 1: brought to you by the thing that might keep you

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Speaker 1: safe from the monster under your bed. That's right, pets

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Speaker 1: or pets that are waiting to be pets, or animals

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Speaker 1: that are waiting to be pets. Either way, go donate

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Speaker 1: to your local charity because pets are the best thing

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Speaker 1: ever and everybody needs a forever home, and you know

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Speaker 1: they help protect you from the monster under your bed. Well,

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Speaker 1: hey there, and welcome to a special episode of the

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Speaker 1: podcast past, the final week of our how Are We

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Speaker 1: In series and Halloween Extravaganza, a Halloween story. You got

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Speaker 1: to be creepy this week, not like last week. Yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah that one. Okay, sorry, it was a good one.

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Speaker 1: It was. Well, I'll tell you what. So this is

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Speaker 1: one of those shows where we're going to cover three

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Speaker 1: different mysteries in one show. So buckle up and let's

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Speaker 1: get right into it. Since I'm the one doing all

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Speaker 1: the talking at the moment, I'll start us off. And

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Speaker 1: they're Halloween, so they're they're creepy, they're creepy stories for Halloween.

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Speaker 1: So don't be listening to this in the dark by

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Speaker 1: yourself more do that's your thing. The first story that

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk about is the unsolved murder of

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Speaker 1: Leroy Carter. Actually, you know, before we actually get in

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Speaker 1: the story, you know, I just realized people who don't

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Speaker 1: know us who we are. We're just in such a

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Speaker 1: good mood, just want to go what is my name?

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Speaker 1: Your Joe, your Devon and I'm Steve. It's true. There

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Speaker 1: we go. Instance this is Halloween. Just be warned. They're

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Speaker 1: all kind of gross, creepy stories. So munchkins around, maybe

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Speaker 1: turn the sweat off till later, oh just in case. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So my story, the Murder of Leroy Carter, takes place

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Speaker 1: in February nine, eight one in Golden Gate Park in

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Speaker 1: San Francisco, California. By definition, cannot be creepy because it's February. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's the only let me, let me, let me warm

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Speaker 1: up to it. You're gonna be creeped out. Specifically in

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Speaker 1: Golden Gate Park, though, our story takes place next to

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Speaker 1: Alverd Lake, which is really just a teeny tiny little

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Speaker 1: body of waters like twenty by forty but they anyway. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well at the time in the park wasn't really a

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Speaker 1: nice place to hang out. It had a reputation at

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Speaker 1: night for having junkies and hoodlum's prowling around all the time. Hoodlums. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you know a lot of you when if you

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Speaker 1: read about this story, everybody brings up the fact that

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Speaker 1: it's right there at the end of Hate Street because

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Speaker 1: Hate Street is so famous. But it really doesn't have

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Speaker 1: anything to do with the story, but you'll see it.

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Speaker 1: So our story specifically takes place, or it begins on Sunday,

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Speaker 1: the eighth of February, when somebody found a body in

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Speaker 1: the bushes. The body was inside of a sleeping bag,

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Speaker 1: and at first everything seemed normal, just another normal dead body,

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Speaker 1: yeah right, And it all seemed normal right up until

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Speaker 1: the police removed the bag, the sleeping bag from the

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Speaker 1: bushes and the body from the bag, only to discover

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Speaker 1: that the head was missing. It seems like your head

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Speaker 1: is usually like near the opening of the bag. So

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Speaker 1: it's like, seems like they would have noticed that sooner.

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Speaker 1: But okay, I probably as it was just a really

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Speaker 1: short homeless guy. Yeah, I don't know, but so the

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Speaker 1: the head is missing, and every article I've read said

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Speaker 1: that in place of a head in the neck which,

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Speaker 1: by the way, the neck had been cleanly cut with

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Speaker 1: a sharp object. Uh, probably did it in one stroke.

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Speaker 1: But the investigators found in the neck shoved in there

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Speaker 1: were two corn cobs and a chicken wing. That's what

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Speaker 1: I used to replace heads normally. Yep, had a little placeholder. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Reportedly also about a dozen yards away. Sometimes you'll see

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Speaker 1: this fifties sometimes a dozen. Uh, there was. The mutilated

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Speaker 1: bodies of a couple of chickens were also found, so

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Speaker 1: that unsolved crime has also not been solved. Who murdered

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Speaker 1: these poor chickens? Yeah, people don't seem to care that

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Speaker 1: much about chicken. It's it's foul um o. This is

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Speaker 1: Halloween stot making fun. So let's get into the story

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Speaker 1: that we'll get serious here. So the fingerprints, uh, the

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Speaker 1: fingerprint of the body, and they would learn that it

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Speaker 1: was twenty nine year old African American Vietnam veteran by

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Speaker 1: the name of Leroy Carter. Leroy had a small history

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Speaker 1: of arrests, but nothing major. So it didn't explain why

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Speaker 1: he was headless in the park, Like he didn't get

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Speaker 1: whacked by doing some crazy job or making the wrong

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Speaker 1: people mad. I was homeless at the time, That is

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Speaker 1: absolutely correct. So he was sleeping in the park. Nothing

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Speaker 1: unusual about that for him, I guess it's true, But

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Speaker 1: but not to say that he deserved it. If somebody

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Speaker 1: I don't want anybody, I just want, there will be

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Speaker 1: no question about that in anybody's And that's not what

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Speaker 1: we said. So this is one in San Francisco, and

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Speaker 1: this is a case that immediately has the stink of

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Speaker 1: voodoo on it, and the cops that are investigating the

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Speaker 1: crime really don't want to do anything about it and

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Speaker 1: don't really know what to do about it. So they

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Speaker 1: turned the case over to Inspector Sandy Gallant. Now she

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Speaker 1: had made a bit of a name for herself in

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Speaker 1: dealing with odd cases. She had handled the investigation of

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Speaker 1: the San Francisco area members of the People's Temple. And

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Speaker 1: then you remember the People's Temple. This was a couple

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Speaker 1: of years after it. But they're the ones who all

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Speaker 1: moved to Anna and then took a couple of shots

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Speaker 1: at then Congressman Leo Ryan and and then famous and

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Speaker 1: then famously drank the flavor Raid and committed mass suicide.

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Speaker 1: So she was involved in investigating those people in some

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Speaker 1: of the locals members of the church that were still

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Speaker 1: in the area. Now, we discussed that in one of

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Speaker 1: our previous episodes. We did. Now, as you can imagine,

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Speaker 1: go on and all the other cops really don't know

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Speaker 1: what the heck they're dealing with. Like I said, they

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Speaker 1: figured it had to be something occult and voodoo wish,

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Speaker 1: but they didn't know what's going on. Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: the top of guys heading off head off and put

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Speaker 1: a couple of corn cops in there had a chicken

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Speaker 1: wing that's weird, and the just set it there. I

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Speaker 1: mean they stuffed it down with like a topic as

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Speaker 1: or something, didn't they. I heard that they were inserted

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Speaker 1: into the neck. I believe that would be the only

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Speaker 1: place that you could probably readily put so I figured

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Speaker 1: that way. Yeah, I mean I haven't I haven't be

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Speaker 1: headed very many people, but yeah, you know that's I

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Speaker 1: think that's the only big real hole there. Yeah. Now

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Speaker 1: Gallant she needs help, and she reaches out to a

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Speaker 1: guy named Charles well Wetley. He is the Dade County,

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Speaker 1: Florida corner that's like like South Florida. Yeah, that's Miami, right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: right in that area Miami did And she did this first. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I don't know how she what path led her to,

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Speaker 1: uh to talk to to Wetley, but apparently he had

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Speaker 1: dealt with similar or stuff like this, because she had

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Speaker 1: been led to believe that this might have been something

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Speaker 1: to do with the religion of Santa Ria, which yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a it's a cribba. Well it it initially it's

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Speaker 1: actually from Central Africa, and then the slaves came to

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Speaker 1: the Caribbean and then it morphed the Actually the the

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Speaker 1: history of that religion, it's pretty interesting if you read

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Speaker 1: about it, the way that they hit it within Catholicism

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Speaker 1: so that they wouldn't get in trouble with their their

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Speaker 1: slave owners. But so this this leads her down that

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Speaker 1: path's say, okay, who knows about Santria? Okay, Wetley, Well,

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Speaker 1: she gets all to him and he tells her that, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it probably is connected, but more than likely it's actually

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Speaker 1: directly linked to an offshoot of that religion, which is

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Speaker 1: Palo Mayombe. I really hope I pronounced that right, That's

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Speaker 1: how I did it. It's it's a darker, creepier off. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's there's already a little bit. There's much more sacrifice,

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Speaker 1: and we're gonna talk about some of the some theories

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Speaker 1: and and later on here we'll get into it. But

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Speaker 1: what actually, you know what, let's just talk about it

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Speaker 1: now because this is this is what's going on, is

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Speaker 1: Wetley is telling her that it's both likely that and

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Speaker 1: he's saying that what's happened is the head has probably

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Speaker 1: been taken to be used in I'm going to call

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Speaker 1: it a student like concoction to make a potion. Head's

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Speaker 1: gonna be boiled, it's gonna be then the remnants are

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Speaker 1: going to be used in some kind of black magic ritual.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what that would be. He didn't venture

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Speaker 1: to guess specifically what it was, but it was going

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Speaker 1: to be some type of ritual. Uh. Now, this offshoot religion,

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Speaker 1: the priests, Pilario's is what they're called, at least the men. Uh.

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Speaker 1: They use both animal and human body parts. In this case,

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Speaker 1: it would be the skull, the brain, the nose, the ears,

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Speaker 1: the basically everything that's on the head. Because I could

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Speaker 1: have just said the head to go into that potion

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Speaker 1: that they're making and then they can use it themselves

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Speaker 1: or they could sell it to somebody to use for whatever.

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Speaker 1: And they were going to use that that ingredient mix

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Speaker 1: for That's still a thing that you see, uh, like

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Speaker 1: a lot in Africa these days, where um, there's this

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Speaker 1: big plight of kids who are born albino in certain

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Speaker 1: African communities because there are religions that are still practicing

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Speaker 1: in certain parts of Africa where albinos are like, I mean,

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Speaker 1: they're this is like what they do. They think that

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Speaker 1: like they have this insane magic inside of them, and

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Speaker 1: they are often no, no, no, they're not revered. They

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Speaker 1: are often slaughtered human human children are slaughtered to like

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Speaker 1: because they have some kind of magic. Yeah, exactly. And

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Speaker 1: that's like it's crazy to me that that's still happening.

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Speaker 1: But like, this isn't like a made up thing. This

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Speaker 1: is the thing that actually we have even now documented

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Speaker 1: proof that that's happening still. So so practitioners of that religion,

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Speaker 1: this is this is serious. Series is not like a

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Speaker 1: laughing matter. It's it's it's definitely the real deal for them.

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Speaker 1: So what Whatley says is he says, listen, they has

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Speaker 1: been taken, Uh, it's going to be used in this way.

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Speaker 1: But here's the thing. Whoever did it is probably going

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Speaker 1: to return it. And if they return it, they will

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Speaker 1: return it to the sit to the site of the murder,

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Speaker 1: and they will do it forty two days after the killing,

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Speaker 1: because that was a part of this, the whole ritual.

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Speaker 1: You had to return Otherwise the whole thing doesn't work right.

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Speaker 1: It's it's a it's a piece of it. Wasn't there

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Speaker 1: another one like this where somebody sat, maybe recently even

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Speaker 1: where somebody said, no, the head's going to be returned

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Speaker 1: forty two days later, and they were like, yeah, okay, right,

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Speaker 1: it might have been this one that I'm actually thinking

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Speaker 1: it's I'm pretty sure it's this one. Because this is

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Speaker 1: this is the biggest irony of this story. This is

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Speaker 1: why I like this story so much. Is that he

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Speaker 1: tells goal out this and she says, okay, great, And

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Speaker 1: on the forty second day where the cops staking out

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Speaker 1: the park and checking it all out and wait for

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Speaker 1: the murder, no, none of them went. None of them

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Speaker 1: believed it. And somebody did find the head in the

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Speaker 1: weeds on the forty second day, So our killer nearby

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Speaker 1: where locked up dumped the head in the tall grass

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Speaker 1: and just walked away Sky. That's one of the comical

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Speaker 1: things about this story. I don't I don't want to

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Speaker 1: sound like I'm making like because somebody who did die,

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Speaker 1: but I'm just just imagining to see it in the

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Speaker 1: cop in the cop shop, they're all standing around, you know,

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Speaker 1: chewing on a donut and have some coffee. If somebody

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Speaker 1: who walks in and says, hey, you'll never guess what

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Speaker 1: turned up. Yeah at yeah, I met. There were some

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Speaker 1: sour expressions. I don't think that went over so well.

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Speaker 1: It reminds me of that scene in The Boondock Saints

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Speaker 1: where like the local cops are like no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: these guys are miles away and the FBI guys there

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Speaker 1: and he's like, no, they're going to show up, and

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Speaker 1: like as the other guy, the local cop is like there,

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Speaker 1: I know all these names. I just don't think anybody

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Speaker 1: else's um He's like, no, no no, they're gonna be miles away.

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Speaker 1: They like walk they walk into the police station like

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Speaker 1: while he's like ranting, And that reminds me of this

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Speaker 1: so much, where it's just like one person was like no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna happen, and everyone else just kind of blew

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Speaker 1: them off, and the case totally would have been solved

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Speaker 1: if somebody would have just taken him seriously. But now, yeah,

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Speaker 1: because it was inspired by this, I'm pretty sure Troy

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Speaker 1: Duffy man. Okay, at least Sandy got to like, you know,

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Speaker 1: like bad to them about it endlessly for years until

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Speaker 1: you know what She's She's made a real name for

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Speaker 1: herself since then, dealing with weird cases that have the

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Speaker 1: occult and magic seemed to be linked to them, and

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Speaker 1: she takes these things deadly serious. Now, if this case

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Speaker 1: it happens, say, ten years later, and she had caught it,

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Speaker 1: she'd have been there on the forty second day. But

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Speaker 1: in the beginning she was still just so new that

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Speaker 1: the whole thing. She's like, I don't, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Maybe well, I mean, realistically, things like this have to

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Speaker 1: happen for people to take it seriously. Right, So it

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Speaker 1: is a tragedy, right, but if if anything good came

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Speaker 1: of this, I'm sorry to say, something good could have

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Speaker 1: come to this. Hopefully it means that more cases in

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Speaker 1: the future and more contemporarily have been solved because the

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Speaker 1: investigators are taking it seriously and really saying like this

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Speaker 1: is actually a thing that happens, and we're going to

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Speaker 1: actually treat it with respect this time. Okay, Well, let's

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Speaker 1: let's get into the theories for this story. Okay, Okay,

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Speaker 1: So really there's a pretty shortlist of theories here. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The first one is that yes, it is Apollo may

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Speaker 1: umby thing, and that's what it was. And here's some

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Speaker 1: things to know. The there have been multiple cases where

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Speaker 1: the practitioners of this religion are stealing bodies or body

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Speaker 1: parts from graves. And the stuff that I've read has

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Speaker 1: led me to believe or understand that the fresher the body,

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Speaker 1: the stronger the power. That it does make sense, and

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Speaker 1: it just seems to me it would be easier. Frankly,

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Speaker 1: this may sound callous, but to just kill a homeless

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Speaker 1: dude in the sleeping bag then to go dig up

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Speaker 1: a grave, yeah, it's less likely get caught, uh, and

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Speaker 1: it's way fresher. Yeah. So here's there's a couple of

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Speaker 1: well known cases and I'll give you these here. So

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Speaker 1: this was in New York about a decade or so ago.

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Speaker 1: There was a pair of priests. They were a father

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Speaker 1: and son and they were found to have at least

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Speaker 1: two human skulls and some other human bones in pots

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Speaker 1: in the basement of their home, which the police were

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Speaker 1: pretty sure had been Pilford from a local graveyard. Then

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Speaker 1: a series of breaks. When you say in pots, pots

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Speaker 1: with water over over burners, it doesn't it never actually

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Speaker 1: specified that. I'm going to guess they were probably a

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Speaker 1: dry storage. They would only I don't think they would

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Speaker 1: keep them soaking until they needed him, because it's you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a recipe you do it for a certain amount

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Speaker 1: of time with certain things. So I doubt they just

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Speaker 1: had them sitting around pretty so in the freezer. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, man, I would pre brew because you

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Speaker 1: just stick a cork in it and then you know,

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Speaker 1: somebody says, hey, I'm gonna buy this thing from me,

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Speaker 1: and you say, great, here a hundred bucks. They don't

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Speaker 1: have time to question am I going to come back

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Speaker 1: to that? And I don't think that's I don't think

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Speaker 1: that's right, because if you think about it, there's a

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Speaker 1: certain mystique to saying, come back to me in forty

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Speaker 1: two days, I will have brewed your thing. That really

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Speaker 1: they could have been brewing there the thing, but you

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Speaker 1: don't know that everything takes the same ingredients regards. Okay,

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Speaker 1: there have been there is also there's another one. This

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Speaker 1: was also I don't know why these are out in

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Speaker 1: New York, but there was another one where a woman

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Speaker 1: had was found with a bunch of bones and it

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Speaker 1: turned out her followers had been the ones that were

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Speaker 1: going out and stealing the bones from the graveyard, and

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Speaker 1: they busted the guy. I remember, they busted the guy

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Speaker 1: with the bones, and he then turned around and squealing

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Speaker 1: on her and that's how they got her. Um, there's

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Speaker 1: and there's here's one that's a little more in line

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Speaker 1: with what we're dealing with with our case, which is

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Speaker 1: back in the eighties in Mexico City, there was a

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Speaker 1: guy by the name of a Dolfo Costanzo and he

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Speaker 1: started practicing the religion and by the end of the decade,

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Speaker 1: this guy had kind of gone off the deep end.

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Speaker 1: He got in bed with the cartels and so these

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Speaker 1: things that he was making, these spells were for the

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Speaker 1: cartel to help things go better for them when they

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Speaker 1: eventually got him, and you know, he would be shot

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Speaker 1: to death by day. I mean the authorities and correct

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Speaker 1: for the police. Yes, you're right. The police cornered him

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Speaker 1: and so he had one of his own people take

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Speaker 1: him out. But yeah, they found they found, gosh what

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Speaker 1: it was like thirteen bodies buried on his property, in

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Speaker 1: various states of decomposition, in various parts missing from them,

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Speaker 1: and the whole thing came crashing down on him because

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Speaker 1: he was in thirteen it was fifteen bodies, but he

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Speaker 1: had he had made the mistake or his people did,

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Speaker 1: of killing a US student who was there on spring break.

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Speaker 1: He was a premed student, if I remember right. And

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Speaker 1: then the US was like, hey, you need to take

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Speaker 1: this guy out. So then they went ahead and went

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Speaker 1: after him, and that's how the whole thing came crashing

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Speaker 1: down for him. So but I mean this the shows

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Speaker 1: that this does happen. It's not as if we've just

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Speaker 1: kind of made this up on our own. It also

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Speaker 1: might help explain the mutilated chickens, because I have I

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Speaker 1: have read a few articles that at least anecdotally link

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Speaker 1: chicken mutilation or other kind of ritualistic mutilation mutilation of

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Speaker 1: animals to this kind of spell casting. So I don't know,

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Speaker 1: if you know, I'm not a member of that group.

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Speaker 1: So I don't actually know the rules, right, but I

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Speaker 1: would assume that, you know, there'd be some sort of

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Speaker 1: connection there if it was a ritual. Right, poor chickens,

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Speaker 1: you know, we eat them, we steal their eggs, and

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Speaker 1: then we grab and use them and this stuff. It's

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Speaker 1: just like that. They're kind of jerks chickens. Yeah, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I don't care that it's coming from a guy who

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Speaker 1: has chickens. But but you know, the other thing we

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Speaker 1: talked about this a little bit earlier is not only

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Speaker 1: is this deadly serious of these people and it's real,

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Speaker 1: but it turns out for the priests, it is a

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Speaker 1: huge cash cow. Yeah, and so you could see the

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Speaker 1: appeal of let's say, let's just say somebody comes to

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Speaker 1: the priests and says, I need you to do this thing,

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Speaker 1: for this crazy, crazy thing. He says, oh, well, that's

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Speaker 1: gonna take the most powerful spell ever and to do that,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna cost you out a lot of money and

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to go to this huge length. So

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Speaker 1: that's gonna mean it's gonna be even more money. And

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Speaker 1: you know, realistically he doesn't maybe do as much other

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Speaker 1: than he does, as Joe said, sneak into the park

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Speaker 1: and find a sleeping homeless guy and chop his head

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Speaker 1: off with a machete, because I'm pretty sure it's a machete. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but then that would bump the price a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Murder somebody, very ingredients. Yeah, sorry, this is very calcium.

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Speaker 1: But I kind of like the idea of like you

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Speaker 1: go see your your whatever, which doctor, priest, whatever, and

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Speaker 1: you know, you say, listen, I need this whatever miracle

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Speaker 1: level thing done, and he goes, okay, well do you

355
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Speaker 1: have the head? And you're like, what do you mean?

356
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Speaker 1: Do I have the head? And he's like the human head.

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Speaker 1: I need the human head. And you're like, I don't

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Speaker 1: have the human head. What do you mean? And they're like,

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Speaker 1: oh that price, that like a hundred thousand dollar price

360
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Speaker 1: that I told you that was if you brought your

361
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Speaker 1: own head. You don't have your own head. Well the

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Speaker 1: cost yeah it doubled, so all right, your own head.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah that makes sense. But I like the idea, like,

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Speaker 1: you know, you go to this guy and he telling

365
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Speaker 1: me your issue, and he submits a bid too, and

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Speaker 1: it's got the itemized list. Okay, okay, murder helpless hobost

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Speaker 1: geth head. You I'm really sorry. This is like, we

368
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Speaker 1: don't think it's funny that like this murder happened on

369
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Speaker 1: we've turned this into a sitcom scenario. But also, I'm

370
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Speaker 1: really sorry to anybody. I actually, I guess I'm not.

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Speaker 1: I was going to apologize to anybody who practices pollo.

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Speaker 1: My don't kill us, but I don't really I'm sorry,

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Speaker 1: we don't put a hex on us. Let's finish up

374
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Speaker 1: the theory that. Yeah, okay, so the final bit of

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Speaker 1: the theory is, well, why was it leroy? And really

376
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Speaker 1: what it comes down to is it most likely he

377
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Speaker 1: was just in the wrong place at the wrong time

378
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Speaker 1: according to this theory. From there, we've got we've got

379
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Speaker 1: two other theories. One is that it's just a random

380
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Speaker 1: murder which some random killer went out there and sliced

381
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Speaker 1: his head off and thinking it was funny, shoves the

382
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Speaker 1: core cops in the chicken wing in his neck. And

383
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Speaker 1: then because of all of the press coverage, because by

384
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Speaker 1: the way, this thing was covered in the news a

385
00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:15,479
Speaker 1: little bit at the time, but it did get some coverage.

386
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Speaker 1: It wasn't like, you know, national news, but it wasn't

387
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,159
Speaker 1: the did they actually say the news that all the

388
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:24,359
Speaker 1: Santa stuff the head would be returned. I think that

389
00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:26,680
Speaker 1: that was in the paper. I was trying to find

390
00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:28,240
Speaker 1: articles from the time. But you know how hard it

391
00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:31,600
Speaker 1: is sometimes to a real especially if it's not like

392
00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:34,880
Speaker 1: a crazy story. But I mean you could see where

393
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Speaker 1: this guy says, oh, wait, I still have the head

394
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Speaker 1: because I was going to make it into an ash

395
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:42,960
Speaker 1: tray where the head is, but the cops wanted there. Oh,

396
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:45,199
Speaker 1: I'll just take it back. And then, you know, as

397
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:47,119
Speaker 1: Joe and say, this throws him off the trail for

398
00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,480
Speaker 1: when I do my next killing. Well, I will say,

399
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:55,919
Speaker 1: I assume the cops searched that specific patch where the

400
00:21:55,960 --> 00:22:01,399
Speaker 1: head did show up. But but but we're assuming, right, Like,

401
00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:04,760
Speaker 1: it's possible they must have searched it. But people do

402
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:08,240
Speaker 1: miss things, Yeah, they really, I mean they really do.

403
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 1: So it's also possible the head was there the entire

404
00:22:11,119 --> 00:22:14,000
Speaker 1: time and somebody just went looking. You know, somebody was like, oh,

405
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Speaker 1: we'll go look after forty two days and we'll see,

406
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,600
Speaker 1: and they went and they were like, oh, here's I

407
00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:20,720
Speaker 1: tend to take. Probably they didn't go looking after forty

408
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 1: two days. Some somebody was walking in the park and

409
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Speaker 1: they saw the head. Yeah. I also tend to I

410
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,919
Speaker 1: also tend to think that they would be able to

411
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Speaker 1: tell if it had just been sitting there for forty

412
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Speaker 1: two days, or if somebody had like boiled the heck

413
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Speaker 1: out of it, and somebody, you know, I could have

414
00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:40,040
Speaker 1: been sitting there forty two days, it would have been eaten,

415
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Speaker 1: not chewed on by the animals a lot. That's a

416
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,280
Speaker 1: that's a great point. We never ever see anything that

417
00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:48,400
Speaker 1: talks about the actual condition of the head right upon

418
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 1: its retrieval, so we have no idea, right, yeah, but

419
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:54,840
Speaker 1: presumably if it had been left out there the entire time,

420
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 1: they would have just been able to tell by that,

421
00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:57,879
Speaker 1: just the state of the head, you know, and all

422
00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,359
Speaker 1: the animal bites on it and stuff like that. I mean,

423
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Speaker 1: the only other thing I have, I mean, there's there's

424
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Speaker 1: really no theories here. The only other thing is that, well,

425
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:06,120
Speaker 1: maybe it was Chupy, but he's not known for doing

426
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:10,280
Speaker 1: good clean slices. He d you know, saws his way

427
00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:12,879
Speaker 1: through there, So I think we can clear him in

428
00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:16,040
Speaker 1: this one. I think it was probably voodoo. I think

429
00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:17,840
Speaker 1: it's probably well what about what about the theory that

430
00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:21,800
Speaker 1: his head fell off? It could maybe maybe some good

431
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,159
Speaker 1: Samaritans saw the head and thought, oh my god, the

432
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,280
Speaker 1: head needs to be like rehabbed or something. I'll take

433
00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 1: into rehab and that after fourties days, A gave up

434
00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:32,400
Speaker 1: and brought it back to screw you head, You head.

435
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 1: I don't think that's it. It's like a Walt Disney

436
00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:39,480
Speaker 1: situation right where they preserve the head, only no, I

437
00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:42,280
Speaker 1: don't think so. Well, you don't think they do that

438
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:46,679
Speaker 1: for like random homeless people in Central Park or Golden

439
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:51,119
Speaker 1: Gate Park, gar I don't think so. I got my story.

440
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:53,439
Speaker 1: What apologies to Chippy. I gotta say, I'm kind of

441
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:57,720
Speaker 1: buying into the whole voodoo story myself. Yeah, I think,

442
00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,080
Speaker 1: I mean, Chippy could have been the purchaser of said

443
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:05,040
Speaker 1: but I think I think Chepy's got enough mojo he

444
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:06,479
Speaker 1: doesn't need to go out and pay for it. It's

445
00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 1: probably true, yeah, but you know, just if there's one

446
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,200
Speaker 1: thing I've learned from this story, though, is that I'm

447
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,639
Speaker 1: never gonna buy used crock pot from anybody. It's brand

448
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 1: new in the box, they're pretty cheap. My family they

449
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:23,360
Speaker 1: just bought me one of those. Grab Yeah. Alright, well,

450
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,359
Speaker 1: so much for that one. I've got my own creepy

451
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 1: Halloween story. Yeah, this is a case of Christopher case.

452
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: Love this one the Christopher Case case exactly well put Yeah,

453
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,400
Speaker 1: this one, this one is about ten years more newer

454
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:41,400
Speaker 1: than the other one this happened. Yeah, that's more better,

455
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:48,560
Speaker 1: ye cross Uh. This begins in mid April. April nineteenth nine,

456
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:51,639
Speaker 1: Seattle police got a call from a woman in Fayetteville,

457
00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 1: North Carolina, asking him to do a check on a

458
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 1: man that she was concerned about. Police want buy and

459
00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 1: checked his apartment. And this is actually like the second

460
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:02,680
Speaker 1: or so time that they had stopped by the check

461
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:05,359
Speaker 1: on him. And they finally apparently found the door open,

462
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:08,800
Speaker 1: and they went inside and they found him in his apartment,

463
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:11,919
Speaker 1: in the bathtub with all his clothes on dead. Was

464
00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,720
Speaker 1: she a friend, She was a friend, Yeah, somebody, somebody

465
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:17,399
Speaker 1: that he had worked with apparently, and she just hadn't

466
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 1: seen him in a while. Yeah. They were now like

467
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:23,840
Speaker 1: living across country from which but they stayed in contact. Yeah,

468
00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:26,119
Speaker 1: our our guy in the bath The dead guy was

469
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,679
Speaker 1: named Christopher Case, and the phone call to the police

470
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 1: was from a friend of his named Sandy Souder. She

471
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 1: said that Christopher told her that he had been cursed

472
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,240
Speaker 1: by a witch and that he had called her repeatedly

473
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 1: to report that he was being attacked in the night

474
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 1: while he tried to sleep. I understand that, yeah, exactly.

475
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 1: I don't think Christopher had a cat. When police looked

476
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 1: around the apartment that they did find a lot of

477
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 1: crucifixes scattered about, especially he was in the bathtub. As

478
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 1: I said, they found like crucifixes around the bathtub, sitting

479
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 1: on the sitting sitting on the rim of the bathtub.

480
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 1: And they also noticed that somebody had poured a line

481
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 1: of salt around the perimeter of the apartment at the

482
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,000
Speaker 1: base of the walls, with extra little piles of salt

483
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 1: in the corners. And everything I've learned from the TV

484
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 1: shows Supernatural says that's keeping out ghosts and other bad

485
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:15,879
Speaker 1: creepiness like that. Well, I don't know. I don't know

486
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:18,439
Speaker 1: if I would take them all that seriously. But I

487
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 1: mean maybe in Supernatural, but I'm just saying in real life,

488
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:24,119
Speaker 1: it's chocol it's chalk lines. Really, no, it's Supernatural, it's

489
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 1: real it's it's the salt. Well, they have Fox Molder

490
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:29,920
Speaker 1: use salt in the X Files once to take people

491
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,399
Speaker 1: away his zombi demon kind of thing. So demons. Yeah,

492
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: ghosts and bad spirits. It's choco. I'm sorry, just trying

493
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:40,639
Speaker 1: to you know, educate our listeners. The ghosts they're getting

494
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,399
Speaker 1: the one you need it. Yeah, a little salt is

495
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 1: a good thing, and it's I can use it for

496
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 1: other things like cooking, Yeah, or you know snails. Yeah,

497
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: good point. Oh yeah where else they found salt also

498
00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: on the doorstep outside poured and geometric designs, which is odd. Yeah.

499
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:58,760
Speaker 1: And now the man who claimed to have the curse

500
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:01,640
Speaker 1: was dead in his bath There were no signs of violence,

501
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 1: no obvious cause of death. And by the way, I

502
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:06,000
Speaker 1: just in case you're wondering where there was no water

503
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:07,919
Speaker 1: in the bathtub. He did not drowned. He had his

504
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:12,439
Speaker 1: clothes on. I just assumed he did drown. No, no,

505
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 1: no water. It was not a bathtub accident. Um, there

506
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: was a bathtub death. Yeah. But let me give you

507
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:19,640
Speaker 1: a little background to the whole the whole thing, how

508
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,359
Speaker 1: this all began. And also a shout out to Jacob

509
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 1: our listener who suggested this story, although I think I

510
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 1: actually found it on list first. You know, one of

511
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,160
Speaker 1: those ones that has ten creepy mysteries that will make

512
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 1: it craft cair pants. You know that was signs of once. Yeah, exactly,

513
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,160
Speaker 1: back to the beginning. Christopher Case was thirty five years

514
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:38,720
Speaker 1: old when he died. He was raised in Richmond, Virginia

515
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: known Witch. Oh yeah, totally, worked as a disc jockey

516
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 1: in the East Coast before he got his last job,

517
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 1: which was at the Music Company in Seattle. Do you

518
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: use that company? Yeah? I m u z a K.

519
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:53,680
Speaker 1: They make elevator music or are they still around? So

520
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 1: he was working in Seattle doing that. In about a

521
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:58,959
Speaker 1: week or so before he died, he made a business

522
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,760
Speaker 1: trip to San Francisco, where he was introduced to a

523
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,760
Speaker 1: woman who thought that the music company might be interested

524
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:09,520
Speaker 1: in some ancient Egyptian music. Well actually, and also Christopher

525
00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:12,280
Speaker 1: himself was kind of interested in various weird old music,

526
00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 1: so he was kind of into it too. And I've

527
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 1: never got in a name for this mystery woman, knowing

528
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 1: much of a description except that she was older. And

529
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: I'm not sure what that meant, if that meant that

530
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:25,359
Speaker 1: she was older than Christopher Case or just old, but

531
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: that was how he described her to her his friend

532
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,520
Speaker 1: Sammy Souder. Again I mentioned her earlier. What what Christopher

533
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,160
Speaker 1: Case told Sammy souder was that this woman was quote

534
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 1: unquote intense. Apparently, he you know, was a little it

535
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 1: was a little weird. He felt like something about it

536
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 1: was a little bit off. And they met a second time,

537
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 1: which has had a restaurant and they had dinner. Uh,

538
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 1: and it was then as she told him that she

539
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: was a witch and apparently she said she wanted to

540
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,560
Speaker 1: have sex. I don't know how she put it, yeah,

541
00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 1: how she how she made a pass at him. Yeah,

542
00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: but apparently the whole thing was a bit off putting

543
00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 1: for Christopher because he just said no. Or maybe the

544
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 1: it was ugly, maybe it wasn't the way she put

545
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,480
Speaker 1: her at all. I don't know. Love the reenactment that

546
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:10,080
Speaker 1: Australia just yea crazy yellow eyes. It's the funniest thing.

547
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:13,320
Speaker 1: Got crazy yellow eyes and a sort of crazy expression

548
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: on you know. But but yeah, the reenactment is hilarious

549
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,720
Speaker 1: because she has this crazy looking yellow and you hear

550
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:25,720
Speaker 1: her voice more and he's all, I don't I don't

551
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: think that she puts a curse on him or you

552
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:29,720
Speaker 1: never know. I mean they portrayed as being kind of

553
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 1: a nice guy, but he might have been totally rude himself.

554
00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:36,000
Speaker 1: Maybe he might just laughed in her face. And you kid,

555
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,280
Speaker 1: I'd rather do it with dogs. Yeah. Yeah. And so

556
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 1: whatever she puts a curse on him, she's not pleased

557
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 1: about being rejected. Uh. And at first he wasn't stressed

558
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 1: about it at all. You didn't believe in the occult.

559
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:49,600
Speaker 1: This was not as according to his friends, he was

560
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: not some sort of occult type person. Which what's weird

561
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: about this story. Things did start to happen and he'd

562
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 1: wake up in the night. There'd bet he noticed strange

563
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: shadows moving around in his room. Uh. And once he

564
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 1: woke up and he found that he had little small

565
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 1: cuts on his fingers, you know, maybe kind of some

566
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 1: kind of defensive wounds. And that's what he told Sammy suitter.

567
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:10,440
Speaker 1: And this was I think a couple of days before

568
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,160
Speaker 1: he died, told her about that. And I don't know

569
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 1: if the cuts were still there when he died, if

570
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:16,920
Speaker 1: they found them at the autopsy or not. I don't

571
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,960
Speaker 1: remember hearing anything about that. I don't either. I get

572
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,080
Speaker 1: the feeling that they were on the level of paper cuts,

573
00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:26,080
Speaker 1: little cuts, yeah, a little bit he cuts. It's also

574
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 1: I you know, I have a tiny little cut on

575
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:29,920
Speaker 1: one of my knuckles that I noticed today. I don't

576
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 1: know when I got it. I'm pretty sure which didn't

577
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 1: give it to me in my sleep, but maybe. Yeah.

578
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 1: And it is weird when you get when you wound

579
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 1: yourself and you don't even remember doing it. You know,

580
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:40,560
Speaker 1: it's like, well, those little cuts are super easy though,

581
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,760
Speaker 1: especially paper cuts. You don't really notice some until you're

582
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:48,320
Speaker 1: like washing your hands or like cutting lemons or something. Yeah. Yeah,

583
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 1: Christopher Case was trying to sleep. He couldn't get any

584
00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 1: sleep because he was again he felt that he was

585
00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:55,720
Speaker 1: being attacked and of course the lack of sleep and

586
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 1: in turn could not have exactly helped his state of mind.

587
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 1: Its vicious circle, okay, is he began to research ways

588
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 1: to ward off witches. On Tuesday, April, that's two days

589
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: before he died, he went to a Christian bookstore and

590
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:13,280
Speaker 1: bought some crusifixes. And the store's owner was a guy

591
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 1: named Rodney Hgucci, and he actually talked to Christopher and

592
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 1: he's asked him what he wanted to the crosses for.

593
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 1: Christopher says, well, I'm under attack from supernatural forces and

594
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:25,200
Speaker 1: I want these crosses for protection. And he asked also

595
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:28,240
Speaker 1: if they had been blessed with holy water. I don't

596
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,320
Speaker 1: know what the reply to that was. In Case leaves

597
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 1: the house I think that night of Tuesday and stays

598
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:35,120
Speaker 1: in the hotel. He doesn't sleep at home. Yeah, he

599
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 1: doesn't want to supernom And it didn't help apparently, because well,

600
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 1: you know, dude, you can't hide from a curse. True. Yeah,

601
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: So the hotel isn't your house, it's you. Yeah, unfortunately. Yeah.

602
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:48,920
Speaker 1: The next day, Wednesday, April seventeen, he goes back to

603
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:53,120
Speaker 1: the bookstore. He buys some more crusifixes, and Rodneyhgucci said

604
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: he saw him again. He seemed more agitated, more exhausted,

605
00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 1: more just strung out. And at that point, at the

606
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 1: first time he saw him, he wasn't too concerned. He figured,

607
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,360
Speaker 1: guy's a little crazy. Second time, he's like, there's something

608
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:08,720
Speaker 1: seriously wrong with this dude or something and something or

609
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:12,680
Speaker 1: something really actually is going on here. Also that day,

610
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 1: Wednesday morning, Christopher Case talked to Sammy one more time,

611
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 1: told her he thought he might die from the curse,

612
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:20,960
Speaker 1: and she was concerned about him and kept trying to

613
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 1: call him back over the course of the day. He

614
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:26,480
Speaker 1: never answered once. The afternoon, Christopher Case wants to see

615
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 1: a priest and the priest he was interviewed for that

616
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: Australian TV show by the way, that we mentioned earlier,

617
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: it's called the what's it called the Extraordinary? Being Australians,

618
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,480
Speaker 1: they mispronounced the word. They called it like the extraordinary

619
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 1: or something like that. But anyway, you have the extraordinary.

620
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:45,320
Speaker 1: The priest said, the case is I'll quote him here,

621
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:48,160
Speaker 1: could feel this malignant power influencing his body and he

622
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:49,840
Speaker 1: was scared to death that it was going to kill

623
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 1: him unquote. So we got a number of people, Sammy,

624
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 1: a suitor, one other person supposedly also in Fayetteville. He

625
00:32:56,360 --> 00:33:00,560
Speaker 1: was unnamed. Yeah, there was two people that he was two, yeah,

626
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: two women in Fayetteville, the priest, the bookstore owner. Yeah.

627
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:09,239
Speaker 1: So he was obviously really concerned about this whole curse thing.

628
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 1: When Sammy got home Wednesday night back in Fayetteville, there

629
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:15,680
Speaker 1: was a message from Christopher on her answering machine, apparently

630
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:18,520
Speaker 1: his last words at least definitely to her, but maybe

631
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: to anybody. And comedy they played it on that that

632
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: re enact Michell And I'm not sure if that was

633
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 1: actually his voice on the tape or not. I have

634
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:30,320
Speaker 1: no idea, but he said, they're trying to kill me unquote. Uh.

635
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,160
Speaker 1: He also said, I'm I'm not looking forward to tonight.

636
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:37,880
Speaker 1: It's serious. Yeah. About a PM that night, Sammy called

637
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,160
Speaker 1: Seattle p D. He asked them to check on him.

638
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: They won't buy his apartment. They found the quote found

639
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:45,479
Speaker 1: the place to be secure unquote. In otherwids, the door

640
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 1: was locked and there was no answer when they rang

641
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 1: the doorbell. Uh. The police did notice, apparently at that time,

642
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 1: that somebody had poured a lot of assault around the

643
00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 1: outside of the apartment, like leading from the front door

644
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 1: to the back door. That's always good for your flower beds. Yeah,

645
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:00,440
Speaker 1: I know, I'm sure that. I'm sure the ardner was

646
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:04,280
Speaker 1: Really they didn't, but they didn't notice the geometric patterns

647
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 1: outside apparently not nobody said, yeah, I would mention that

648
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:11,680
Speaker 1: over a line of salt. If you were mentioning salt

649
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: at all, wouldn't you say, Like, also, there was this

650
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:16,480
Speaker 1: weird shape, you would think so, But I mean they

651
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 1: might not have found a head. Who knows. Yeah, but yeah,

652
00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:22,240
Speaker 1: they could have just like not just not really realized

653
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,320
Speaker 1: anything was going on. They just walked up ring the doorbell,

654
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,279
Speaker 1: not realizing they're stopping all over the whole salt thing.

655
00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:31,840
Speaker 1: They're the reason that could have been it exactly the tray.

656
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 1: And then the next day, Thursday, April eighteenths the Sammy

657
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: Sowder tried to call Christopher Case again, calls him multiple times,

658
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:43,520
Speaker 1: gets no answer. Spoiler roots because he was dead. Yeah.

659
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,279
Speaker 1: She called Seattle p D again and asked them to

660
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:48,400
Speaker 1: check on him. They went by his department at three

661
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 1: thirty pm. According to most reports that I've read, the

662
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 1: front door was unlocked at this time and they went inside.

663
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 1: They found the apartment was a mess. There were weird

664
00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,799
Speaker 1: little notes all over the place, crucifixes, salts. They wanted

665
00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:01,480
Speaker 1: to to at to him. And they found Christopher Case

666
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 1: dead in his bath tub, on his knees, has his

667
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,279
Speaker 1: head resting on the edge of the bathtub next to

668
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,399
Speaker 1: the faucet. Yeah, with his clothes on again, burned down,

669
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,799
Speaker 1: burned down candles all around, in crucifixes, and he was dead.

670
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,040
Speaker 1: And the officional Quarter's verdict, naturally, it's got a little notice.

671
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:18,520
Speaker 1: I sent you guys a couple of articles on the

672
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 1: local Seattle paper about it. It was a little strange,

673
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:27,839
Speaker 1: but the official quarter's verdict was a keep miocarditis, which

674
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 1: is heart failure, right, yeah, specified well, mile card itis

675
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 1: is like inflammation of the heart muscle. Yeah, Christopher was

676
00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:38,400
Speaker 1: in good health. I had no family history of heart disease.

677
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:41,640
Speaker 1: Friends said he didn't do drugs, didn't drink much, if

678
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 1: at all, and they said he was mentally stable. Some

679
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 1: people said he was less stable with his final days.

680
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 1: But I guess that's what the curs will do to you,

681
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 1: you know. But but he still died of heart failure.

682
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 1: But myocarditis is, as I said, an inflammation of the

683
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 1: heart muscle. Uh, it is often fatal. Fact, you know,

684
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 1: to three d people a year in the US die

685
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:04,960
Speaker 1: from it, so it's not uncommon at all. There are

686
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 1: a lot of causes. There's infection, including viral and bacterial,

687
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 1: both toxins, certain drugs, including some antipsychotics, some designer drugs

688
00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 1: can cause it. It can also be caused by an

689
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:19,640
Speaker 1: autoimmune disorder. So a lot of things can cause this thing.

690
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:23,160
Speaker 1: Also radiation. Oh so you're saying that this which was

691
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 1: dropping plutonium in his pocket, probably yeah, that could have

692
00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:30,839
Speaker 1: been it. Of course you I curse you look over there.

693
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:40,120
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah. Uh. And the Wikipedia does not list witchcraft

694
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:43,640
Speaker 1: or sorcery has causes of myocarditis. But you know what,

695
00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:46,680
Speaker 1: do they know? They're wrung a lot, right, So what

696
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:49,719
Speaker 1: caused his heart to fail? We've got several serious here.

697
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 1: One is that he was just frightened to death, which

698
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:56,000
Speaker 1: is the real thing. It can happen your heart, put

699
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:58,280
Speaker 1: that kind of stress in your heart, especially if perhaps

700
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:00,799
Speaker 1: he had some pre existing condition that none of us

701
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 1: knew about. Yeah, well there's that. It's the flight er

702
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:06,880
Speaker 1: flight or fight pattern. The adrenaline that just like surge

703
00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 1: us through your body, can, especially if it's sustained over

704
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:12,200
Speaker 1: a number of days, which it sounds like he might

705
00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:15,719
Speaker 1: have been, will like it'll just literally overload all of

706
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 1: your organs. And you know, if your heart is a

707
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 1: little weaker, it'll just give out. And there are people

708
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: like I I know a guy who just last year,

709
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 1: it was like, you know, much younger than me, who

710
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:27,239
Speaker 1: just one day his heart just kind of blew up,

711
00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:29,400
Speaker 1: you know, and no one had a clue. He was

712
00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 1: a totally healthy, very active athletic guy. Bam. And so

713
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:35,719
Speaker 1: it happens, And so there might it might have been

714
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 1: the case with little Christopher and just kind of a

715
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,800
Speaker 1: coincidence well, and not entirely been a coincidence that the

716
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 1: witch puts this thing on him. It's sort of and

717
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 1: then one odd thing, little sort of odd thing happens,

718
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: you know, and then and then he just sort of

719
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:50,760
Speaker 1: just attributes it to these could that have been the curse?

720
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,560
Speaker 1: And he starts starts really sort of thinking about it,

721
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:55,719
Speaker 1: and then it's something a little odd happens. Oh my god,

722
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:57,840
Speaker 1: it's real. It's a curse, and it just stresses and

723
00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:01,439
Speaker 1: stresses and stresses, and then just cycle. Yeah it could

724
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: have been. Yeah, uh so that's one theory. He was

725
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:08,280
Speaker 1: frightened to death, may be exacerbated by a pre existing condition.

726
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 1: What's our next there? It was witchcraft and I was

727
00:38:11,719 --> 00:38:13,680
Speaker 1: going to call some witches and asked, but then I thought, well,

728
00:38:13,719 --> 00:38:16,479
Speaker 1: what if the witch says, Joe, you must out sex

729
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 1: with me and then I get a curse on me?

730
00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 1: And I mean I didn't need that, really, we don't

731
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:23,279
Speaker 1: really need you. Guys wouldn't make the call either. So

732
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:28,080
Speaker 1: and so's people like to call people. But I was

733
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:30,680
Speaker 1: a little scared this time around. Uh So, I don't know.

734
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 1: I mean, maybe one of our listeners can can answer

735
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 1: this question. I don't know. If an actual, real life

736
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,799
Speaker 1: which is capable of putting this kind of deadly curse

737
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 1: on a person or not, I don't know anything. We

738
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 1: will find out. I'm sure sure's somebody less. Now. Yeah,

739
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:47,360
Speaker 1: there's another possibility, which was that it was just sheer coincidence.

740
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: Maybe uh, as I said already, it might have been

741
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,200
Speaker 1: a pre existing condition. It's but it's also possible that

742
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:54,279
Speaker 1: he just at that he just caught, like say, a

743
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 1: viral infection which you know, inflamed his heart muscle, and

744
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 1: it just happened to happen, happened around the same time

745
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,279
Speaker 1: at this curse happen, and then of course you know

746
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:07,080
Speaker 1: he's he's once again feeling some of the effects of

747
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 1: this in his chest, all this stuff that's going on,

748
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 1: it starts ticking. Oh my god, it's curs and then

749
00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:14,400
Speaker 1: he dies from it. But it was never never had

750
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 1: anything to do with the curse at all, not even

751
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 1: dying of fright. He just died of the hard condition

752
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:22,560
Speaker 1: out of and it's just a sheer coincidence. There's one

753
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,280
Speaker 1: theory that you have overlooked, which was that he could

754
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 1: have died from carbon monoxide poisoning. You know, if he's

755
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,839
Speaker 1: laying and sleeping in the tub, and it is surrounded

756
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 1: by candles, and especially if they're cheap ones, so they're

757
00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 1: not good clean burning because you know, when they burned crappily,

758
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:40,879
Speaker 1: they produce a little more than a nice clean burn would.

759
00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:43,880
Speaker 1: And at least I got the impression that he was

760
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 1: using you know, rather large candles, which means it would

761
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,879
Speaker 1: burn for a long time, that heavy gas would pour

762
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,840
Speaker 1: into the tub and eventually it would you know, force

763
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:56,719
Speaker 1: the air out because carbon monoxide is heavier than air.

764
00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 1: And if he's got his face in the tub, you

765
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 1: know things, carbon monoxide poisoning does have an effect on

766
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 1: your heart. It's one of the things that it does

767
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 1: that kills you. Interesting, it's possible, Yeah, his face was

768
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 1: barely in the tub, that was right, he was. His

769
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:13,319
Speaker 1: head was on the edge of the tub. The tub

770
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 1: could have been full of invisible gas. You know what.

771
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:17,680
Speaker 1: Initially when I thought about this was like, oh, well,

772
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:21,279
Speaker 1: I heard something about the tap was gonna going a

773
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:23,440
Speaker 1: little bit, and so I was like, oh, well, then

774
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:25,799
Speaker 1: there was water flowing, so it would have gone the drain.

775
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:27,440
Speaker 1: And then I realized, oh no, it's going to have

776
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:29,960
Speaker 1: a p trap on the drain, which means because p

777
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 1: trap stops sewer gas from coming up, which means gas

778
00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:36,879
Speaker 1: in the bathroom doesn't go down either. So that tub

779
00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:39,919
Speaker 1: could have filled up with carbon monoxide, or he could

780
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 1: have had a leak in the house and that's why

781
00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 1: he was freaking out, because carbon monoxide will do crazy things.

782
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:50,479
Speaker 1: Do you carbon monoxide leak? Like, what was the source

783
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 1: of it? Well, it would have to been more of

784
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:55,000
Speaker 1: like some kind of masking. Give me some kind of

785
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 1: gas leak rather than carbon monoxide leak. But it's one

786
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:02,200
Speaker 1: of those things like maybe he was eating too much salt. Maybe, yeah,

787
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 1: he was a salt freak. I don't think he had

788
00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 1: a gas leak though, because I mean it's possible that

789
00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 1: he didn't have a sense of smell and he couldn't

790
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:09,600
Speaker 1: detect the gas leak. The police probably would have noticed,

791
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 1: you would think that the lea but I still wonder

792
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:16,680
Speaker 1: about the carbon monoxide point. Yeah, I don't know if

793
00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:17,960
Speaker 1: they checked him and he would think they would have

794
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 1: checked for something like that, though I don't know. You

795
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:22,239
Speaker 1: would think they would. You would think they would have

796
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:25,839
Speaker 1: checked for a head, but we don't know. Good point. Yeah, um,

797
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 1: but yeah, I'm gonna go with I'm gonna go with

798
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,799
Speaker 1: pre existing condition, just exacerbated. So he was frightened to death.

799
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 1: But it was a pre existing condition. Okay, carbon monoxide.

800
00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:41,279
Speaker 1: I'm going with which alright, which one? But I don't

801
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:49,479
Speaker 1: I don't know first exactly. Well, my story is also

802
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 1: pretty maccabb it's I think more Micawber than any of them.

803
00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: More maca, more mica. And actually this one was suggested

804
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,759
Speaker 1: ad by some people. It was suggested by Candice and Matt.

805
00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:06,319
Speaker 1: Thank you for that. But we're going to talk about

806
00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:09,480
Speaker 1: the corpse bride of Mexico because I like brides, because

807
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 1: I am a bride, not that kind of bride. Hopefully

808
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 1: set yourself up. And by the way, just just to

809
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 1: clarify here, this is not Mexico's corpse, right, it's of

810
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:25,799
Speaker 1: course right this in Mexico. Mexico did not marry a corpse. Okay,

811
00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:29,879
Speaker 1: Mexico not. Yeah. It's also known as La Pascualita. It's

812
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 1: a thank you. I wouldn't been able to do that. Yeah.

813
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:36,600
Speaker 1: See I can pronounce things. I know what things are.

814
00:42:37,239 --> 00:42:39,200
Speaker 1: This is the creepy mannequin in the window of the

815
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,080
Speaker 1: bridal store in Mexico. You know the one is a

816
00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:46,719
Speaker 1: famous story. The legend of this is really simple. The

817
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:50,200
Speaker 1: bulk of the story comes from the theories, unfortunately, but

818
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 1: that's okay, we'll get through it. In nineteen thirty, the

819
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:57,839
Speaker 1: mannequin was installed in the same window where she still

820
00:42:57,920 --> 00:43:02,800
Speaker 1: resides to this day. What town it's in. It's in

821
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,480
Speaker 1: the region of Chihuahua. I don't know if it's in

822
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:07,919
Speaker 1: the city of Chihuahua. It might be in the city

823
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:13,680
Speaker 1: of Chihua. But this mannequin wears a beautiful, long white

824
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:17,239
Speaker 1: wedding dress. I think it's actually the same one that

825
00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:19,680
Speaker 1: she's worn this entire time. I don't think they've ever changed.

826
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:23,360
Speaker 1: I know they've changed the dress. They Yeah, I'm pretty

827
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,319
Speaker 1: sure that. I remember in the reading people who were

828
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 1: complaining whenever they had to go do stuff with the mannequin,

829
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,560
Speaker 1: they hated it. So I'm pretty sure they changed her dress.

830
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:34,319
Speaker 1: They hated it just because they were creeped out. But yeah, oh,

831
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:37,839
Speaker 1: you mean like a store shop an employee. P Yeah,

832
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 1: like an employee in the store. I did not read that.

833
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 1: I swear I read that, But I think you're making

834
00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:48,200
Speaker 1: that up. I could anyway. It's very It's always a long,

835
00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 1: flowy dress. Uh. The store was owned by Pascuala a Sparza,

836
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,480
Speaker 1: who had a daughter who was to be married just

837
00:43:57,560 --> 00:43:59,719
Speaker 1: a few days prior to the installation of this man

838
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 1: in in the window. And the daughter, it said, passed

839
00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:08,960
Speaker 1: away from being bitten by a black widow spider, like

840
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:12,040
Speaker 1: on the day or of the wedding, or like the

841
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:14,319
Speaker 1: day before the day of the wedding. It's super sad,

842
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:18,840
Speaker 1: it's tragic. So people speculated because the mannequin actually looked

843
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:24,800
Speaker 1: a lot like this daughter, they thought, actually, somehow, I

844
00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:27,920
Speaker 1: don't know how they think, but somehow that miss a

845
00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:33,840
Speaker 1: Sparza just somehow preserved the body of her daughter in

846
00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:37,920
Speaker 1: mannequin form and just like put her in her wedding

847
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:41,080
Speaker 1: dress in the window, and that she's there preserved there

848
00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:44,560
Speaker 1: sounds like it sounds like a great like Alfred Hitchcock

849
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:48,759
Speaker 1: sort of thing. Yeah, kinda, Yeah, it's a lot like that.

850
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:51,240
Speaker 1: What's that story of the Mummy that's in the carnival

851
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 1: ride that that turns out as a real body? You

852
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:56,840
Speaker 1: remember that one? You're talking about the real story or

853
00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,279
Speaker 1: the movie story, the real story, not the movie story. Yeah, yeah,

854
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:02,840
Speaker 1: I know what you're talking about. Yeah, there's there's a

855
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 1: ton of stories about like the haunted mansion in Disneyland,

856
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:09,120
Speaker 1: like has X number of real skulls in it. Not

857
00:45:09,280 --> 00:45:12,760
Speaker 1: true obviously, but whatever. So yeah, most of the discussion,

858
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 1: as I said, revolves around theories on this one. So

859
00:45:15,239 --> 00:45:17,799
Speaker 1: we're going to hop right into theories. And the two

860
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:21,920
Speaker 1: theories are either it is a mannequin or it is

861
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:27,759
Speaker 1: a corpse. Right, Yeah, it's basically yeah, that's about it. Yeah,

862
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:33,320
Speaker 1: so let's talk about the theory that it is a corpse. First,

863
00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 1: a corpse. It's the real corpse bride of the daughter

864
00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 1: of the owner of the shop, who died from a

865
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:43,520
Speaker 1: black widow bite the day of her wedding. We will

866
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 1: also see there's there's multiple means of death. You'll see

867
00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:50,560
Speaker 1: listed for this girl everywhere. Yeah. Sometimes you never got

868
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 1: like crushed by by like a gravel crusher. No, so

869
00:45:56,840 --> 00:45:58,560
Speaker 1: what are some of the other ones you saw? I

870
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 1: think I saw this the most, that's why. Yeah, well

871
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:03,240
Speaker 1: this was the most prevalent. But I seem to remember

872
00:46:03,360 --> 00:46:06,720
Speaker 1: something about like she was upset that she couldn't marry somebody,

873
00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,160
Speaker 1: and so she threw herself off a cliff. I've seen

874
00:46:09,239 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 1: that somewhere Okay, there's that doesn't lend itself to man

875
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:19,360
Speaker 1: a compensation as fair enough. Yeah, um so the mannequin.

876
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:22,879
Speaker 1: If you listen to these while you drive, I don't

877
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:24,640
Speaker 1: know what to tell you, man, I'm sorry, but if

878
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:26,480
Speaker 1: you're at your desk or you're near a computer, you

879
00:46:26,520 --> 00:46:28,840
Speaker 1: should google it if you don't already know the mannequin

880
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,960
Speaker 1: that we're talking about. Her hands are really super creepy,

881
00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:37,920
Speaker 1: Like they're the creepiest part. They're very realistic, super like

882
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:42,200
Speaker 1: hyper realistic. The rest of her, you know, the faces

883
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:46,760
Speaker 1: not necessarily lifelike, but more lifelike than a normal mannequin.

884
00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:51,840
Speaker 1: The hair is a wig, but you would expect that

885
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: from even a real preserved corpse. You know, if you

886
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:56,560
Speaker 1: were trying to do that, if you were trying to

887
00:46:56,640 --> 00:46:58,440
Speaker 1: preserve it, you would make a wig out of the

888
00:46:58,560 --> 00:47:03,400
Speaker 1: hair that that'd be a pretty quick turnaround process to

889
00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:05,920
Speaker 1: make away, because wigs make take like forty hours to

890
00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:07,920
Speaker 1: make good ones did it? But But also, you know

891
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,239
Speaker 1: the other thing about the contrast between the face and

892
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:12,759
Speaker 1: the hands is that your bride typically I don't know

893
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:15,839
Speaker 1: what's going on in Mexico or not, but it might

894
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:17,800
Speaker 1: be wearing a lot of makeup on her face, but

895
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:20,960
Speaker 1: not in her hands. That's true. I explain why she's

896
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:23,880
Speaker 1: kind of monochromatic in the face, but her hands have

897
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 1: the typical color variation that you see. You know, well,

898
00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 1: the hands, I mean the thing. Um, let me finish

899
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 1: describing this and then we'll talk more a little bit

900
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,080
Speaker 1: more about that has. Her eyes are clearly fake, like

901
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:37,440
Speaker 1: obviously like any kind of taxi army and anything. Her

902
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:43,840
Speaker 1: eyelash around that is what they say. Um, the eyelashes

903
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: are fake but look like real hair. I mean, you're

904
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:50,359
Speaker 1: just like fake eyeli And then, by the way, fake

905
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:54,680
Speaker 1: eyelashes are essentially for all intensive purposes real. And then

906
00:47:54,719 --> 00:48:00,400
Speaker 1: the eyebrows are real hair like stuck into the anakin.

907
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:02,960
Speaker 1: They're not just like drawn on like we've seen in

908
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:05,399
Speaker 1: some preservation efforts. And so what I want to say

909
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:08,680
Speaker 1: about the face is that there's no wrinkles or any

910
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 1: kind of fine lines or anything in the skin. It's

911
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:16,520
Speaker 1: it's very firm. It's very firm, yes, um, And that

912
00:48:16,640 --> 00:48:19,560
Speaker 1: doesn't really occur in real people. Even with makeup. It

913
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:22,359
Speaker 1: settles into especially in the thirties, your makeup is going

914
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:24,880
Speaker 1: to settle into your grooves a little bit so it

915
00:48:25,040 --> 00:48:27,319
Speaker 1: is less life like than the hands. But again, if

916
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:29,840
Speaker 1: you were to preserve a body, you would pull that

917
00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:34,480
Speaker 1: skin probably about as tight as you could. It is

918
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 1: said that she has very coast veins on her legs,

919
00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:39,799
Speaker 1: but I can't find any pictures of that. Well, when

920
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 1: has she ever been seeing what not wearing a full

921
00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:46,200
Speaker 1: length wedding dress. Well, according to Steve, when shop employees

922
00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:50,040
Speaker 1: have to change the corps, that's that's where that comes from,

923
00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:51,840
Speaker 1: as people who say they've worked in the shop, and

924
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:55,919
Speaker 1: that's that's where the very coast veins then come from. Yeah, yeah,

925
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:57,960
Speaker 1: it seems like you would have taken some pictures by now,

926
00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:01,879
Speaker 1: but whatever. And also there is actually a case, well

927
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 1: two cases actually of corpses being preserved on this level. Um.

928
00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:10,080
Speaker 1: The first one we're going to talk about is um Lenin,

929
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:16,520
Speaker 1: you know John Lennon's you can his corpse, Sorry, I really,

930
00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:19,279
Speaker 1: I mean Vladimir Lenin, the former leader of the Soviet Union,

931
00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:25,920
Speaker 1: who died a mirror six years before La Pascualita reportedly

932
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:31,040
Speaker 1: did on January twenty one, eight per actually not dead,

933
00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:33,480
Speaker 1: he's he's you know, they've been keeping him alive somewhere

934
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 1: in a laboratory corps is still around, It's still looking pretty.

935
00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 1: It's on display in Lennon's mausoleum in the Red Square

936
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 1: in Moscow since again, just a few days after he died.

937
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:48,600
Speaker 1: I think more than a few days, but they say

938
00:49:48,719 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 1: like just before it was a couple of days. Yes,

939
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,399
Speaker 1: his preserved corpse has been there for literally a million years.

940
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:58,640
Speaker 1: The thing about Lennon's corpse, because people talk about Lennon's

941
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:01,240
Speaker 1: corpse like a lot for this, right, The thing about

942
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:05,800
Speaker 1: Len's corpse is that, um, well, there are some issues

943
00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:11,040
Speaker 1: with preserving a corpse on this level. It's actually been

944
00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:14,160
Speaker 1: a major undertaking. It has been a lot of money

945
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:17,320
Speaker 1: on it. Yeah, one of the big problems that people

946
00:50:17,560 --> 00:50:21,600
Speaker 1: that the Embalmer's faced was, you know, Lennon was older

947
00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 1: when he died, and so there were dark spots and

948
00:50:24,719 --> 00:50:28,680
Speaker 1: things like that, and that continues to kind of get

949
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 1: worse as he's preserved. Lots of it's mold. But well,

950
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: there's a really big problem with Lennon. But they seem

951
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:40,480
Speaker 1: to be able to kind of correct that with a

952
00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 1: variety of different baths and yeah, basically so they kind

953
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:49,000
Speaker 1: of were I guess they kind of basically bleached his

954
00:50:49,120 --> 00:50:51,600
Speaker 1: body or his skin a little bit. Didn't they replace

955
00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:56,280
Speaker 1: a body partner? They've They have definitely replaced a number

956
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:59,239
Speaker 1: of Yeah, it's one of those things like George Washington's acts,

957
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 1: you know, and that sound like that one. Yeah, I

958
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 1: mean they, Yeah, they've replaced. There have been like damp

959
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:07,279
Speaker 1: spots on the skin. They I think they replaced an

960
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:10,600
Speaker 1: entire arm at one point, because I think, honestly, the

961
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 1: only thing they haven't totally replaced is his face at

962
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:15,520
Speaker 1: this point. And I was doing some googling and I

963
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:18,840
Speaker 1: can't tell, but I think they actually, like very like

964
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:21,760
Speaker 1: this past year, may have replaced him with a mannequin

965
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,279
Speaker 1: like this past year because in Night Uh in two

966
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 1: thousand and sixteen, not nineteen something in two thousand and sixteen,

967
00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:35,600
Speaker 1: it costs Russia thirteen million roubles of federal rubles, not

968
00:51:35,800 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 1: dollars to maintain his body. There's like a team of

969
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:44,080
Speaker 1: expert human jerk. He is human jerky. I would not

970
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,319
Speaker 1: be surprised if there's nothing really left with his hands,

971
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:47,800
Speaker 1: in his face and the rest of it's all just

972
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:50,840
Speaker 1: a frameworker mannequin down there. I've seen a photo or

973
00:51:50,880 --> 00:51:55,000
Speaker 1: two of his body um and his torso is just

974
00:51:55,960 --> 00:51:58,600
Speaker 1: creepy looking because of course he's got no organs, so

975
00:51:58,680 --> 00:52:00,880
Speaker 1: it's just his rib cage and it's just it's just

976
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:04,840
Speaker 1: skin and bolter, really looking. Yeah. Also, you may have

977
00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:06,680
Speaker 1: missed it because the boys were interrupting me, but I

978
00:52:06,760 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 1: did say thirteen million roubles to preserve Lennon in this

979
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:15,920
Speaker 1: creepy jerky state. Um, that's like, that's like over two

980
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:19,800
Speaker 1: million dollars American. That's a lot of money to preserve

981
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:22,200
Speaker 1: the body of like one person. And it's not really

982
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:26,800
Speaker 1: done particularly well, it looks because it's not necessarily easy

983
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:29,560
Speaker 1: to preserve a human body for that length of time.

984
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:33,640
Speaker 1: It really isn't. Uh yeah, but I want by the way, guys,

985
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:36,440
Speaker 1: if I don't want my body to be on public display,

986
00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:39,200
Speaker 1: just cream made me. I don't care what the fans say. Well,

987
00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:41,640
Speaker 1: I already bought the glass, the class coffin. Dude, you're

988
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:45,400
Speaker 1: we've already signed the paperwork that contract you thought you

989
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 1: were signing for for advertisements. Yeah, now I had the

990
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:56,359
Speaker 1: coffee tin already. Sorry. Uh So, like I said, Lennon's body,

991
00:52:56,400 --> 00:53:01,000
Speaker 1: he has a team of scientists literally dedicated to preserving

992
00:53:01,120 --> 00:53:05,440
Speaker 1: his body. We also have a true, actual, true story

993
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:07,919
Speaker 1: that is really creepy that we're going to talk about

994
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:11,239
Speaker 1: right now of a more amateur attempt that might be

995
00:53:11,360 --> 00:53:14,800
Speaker 1: more representative of what it would look like if just

996
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:19,640
Speaker 1: a random wedding dress shop owner we're trying to preserve

997
00:53:19,719 --> 00:53:25,920
Speaker 1: the body of her deceased daughter. Ready, just as a warning,

998
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:32,680
Speaker 1: this did not go well. No, no, this is the story.

999
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:36,879
Speaker 1: This is the story of Carl Tandler and the love

1000
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:40,160
Speaker 1: of his life. Long story short. After spending most of

1001
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 1: his life with a fake love of his life, he

1002
00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:45,759
Speaker 1: really finally met his one true love when he was

1003
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 1: treating her for tuberculosis. It's kind of sad that he

1004
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:50,120
Speaker 1: met her when she was kind of on our way

1005
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:52,560
Speaker 1: at the door. Well, it's weird because he says that

1006
00:53:52,719 --> 00:53:56,279
Speaker 1: when he was a child, one of his ancestors came

1007
00:53:56,320 --> 00:54:00,000
Speaker 1: to him and said, hey, this here, I am described

1008
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,480
Speaker 1: having to you the woman of your dreams, and for

1009
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 1: and for his entire life, he carried this image with

1010
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:08,719
Speaker 1: him and he even he married a different woman. He

1011
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:11,880
Speaker 1: fathered children with this other woman woman, and they seemed

1012
00:54:11,880 --> 00:54:14,000
Speaker 1: to live a pretty happy life even though she wasn't

1013
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:17,600
Speaker 1: the described one. And then one day at work, when

1014
00:54:17,719 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 1: he was like he was a radiologist. I believe he

1015
00:54:21,160 --> 00:54:23,800
Speaker 1: went a hospital, he worked in a hospital. He went to,

1016
00:54:24,120 --> 00:54:26,680
Speaker 1: you know, treat a patient who was suffering from tuberculosis,

1017
00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:29,640
Speaker 1: and he was like, oh, you're the woman my ancestor

1018
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:31,560
Speaker 1: described to me when I was for in a vision.

1019
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:36,120
Speaker 1: That's great, and became obsessed with her. He did everything

1020
00:54:36,200 --> 00:54:39,640
Speaker 1: he could to cure her to tuberculosis. But in those

1021
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:45,239
Speaker 1: days he probably didn't because he was using radiation to try. Yeah,

1022
00:54:45,360 --> 00:54:47,279
Speaker 1: but I mean, in those days, that's what they thought

1023
00:54:47,600 --> 00:54:49,839
Speaker 1: was maybe going to work. It was way before there

1024
00:54:49,960 --> 00:54:52,719
Speaker 1: was any kind of science point. This was right around

1025
00:54:52,760 --> 00:54:55,319
Speaker 1: the time people were taking radium pills, which we've talked

1026
00:54:55,320 --> 00:55:01,000
Speaker 1: about before people were actually doctors were prescribing cigarettes for tubercules. Yeah. No,

1027
00:55:01,160 --> 00:55:03,200
Speaker 1: it was like it was that crazy time where nobody

1028
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:06,040
Speaker 1: really knew what to do about tuberculosis, but everybody was

1029
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:11,520
Speaker 1: kind of trying whatever. So Carl made it worse or something.

1030
00:55:12,200 --> 00:55:14,839
Speaker 1: But he financed a lot of her recovery, and then

1031
00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:18,279
Speaker 1: when she finally succumbed to tuberculosis, he actually paid for

1032
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:22,920
Speaker 1: her entire funeral. He paid for the above ground giant

1033
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:27,960
Speaker 1: mausoleum that her body was interred in. And then nobody

1034
00:55:28,080 --> 00:55:31,280
Speaker 1: really knows how long it took for him to lose

1035
00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:35,560
Speaker 1: whatever tiny marbles he had left, but he did lose

1036
00:55:35,640 --> 00:55:41,000
Speaker 1: them pretty pretty drastically by claiming that his love was

1037
00:55:41,120 --> 00:55:43,720
Speaker 1: calling to him from her grave, begging to be released

1038
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:46,960
Speaker 1: from her stony prison. Well didn't he? Uh? Put a

1039
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:50,640
Speaker 1: I thought that he paid to have a telephone installed

1040
00:55:50,719 --> 00:55:55,200
Speaker 1: in mausoleum. It sounds like something he would have done. Yeah, yeah,

1041
00:55:55,239 --> 00:55:57,600
Speaker 1: I don't believe he did. Yeah, and he was just

1042
00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:01,239
Speaker 1: having these halluciness hallucinations and just kept thinking she was

1043
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:04,200
Speaker 1: calling to him and saying, release me, release me. If

1044
00:56:04,239 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 1: he had gone around the bend at this lost some marbles, Yeah,

1045
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:10,680
Speaker 1: So I guess he just decided, like, I don't know,

1046
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:13,120
Speaker 1: she's the love of my life, so okay, y'all'll let

1047
00:56:13,160 --> 00:56:17,000
Speaker 1: her all her free. So he took like a red

1048
00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:21,120
Speaker 1: right writer wagon, like a little red kids wagon with

1049
00:56:21,320 --> 00:56:24,560
Speaker 1: him to the to the mausoleum, and um took her

1050
00:56:24,600 --> 00:56:32,080
Speaker 1: body from the casket and put it, put it in

1051
00:56:32,239 --> 00:56:36,879
Speaker 1: the wagon and took her back home where he um

1052
00:56:38,520 --> 00:56:42,520
Speaker 1: used wire hangers to put her skeleton back together, put

1053
00:56:43,239 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 1: glass eyes where her normal eyes would be, not where

1054
00:56:47,239 --> 00:56:50,799
Speaker 1: her normal eyes would be. Yep, Going with it replaced

1055
00:56:51,200 --> 00:56:55,240
Speaker 1: her rotting flesh with wax coated fabric and some plaster

1056
00:56:57,440 --> 00:57:01,960
Speaker 1: a little yeah. Uh. Then he stuffed her body with

1057
00:57:02,120 --> 00:57:06,760
Speaker 1: rags and made a wig from her hair, and, judging

1058
00:57:06,800 --> 00:57:09,640
Speaker 1: from the pictures, put some makeup on her and like

1059
00:57:09,880 --> 00:57:13,000
Speaker 1: very crudely painted some eyebrows on her. It's super creud

1060
00:57:13,080 --> 00:57:15,600
Speaker 1: It looks like a paper mache mask. Her face looks

1061
00:57:15,600 --> 00:57:20,520
Speaker 1: like a paper mache mask. No, it's super creepy. So

1062
00:57:20,680 --> 00:57:24,760
Speaker 1: once he was done creating his monster monster love I

1063
00:57:24,840 --> 00:57:28,880
Speaker 1: don't really know, he ddressed her in some of the

1064
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:33,160
Speaker 1: clothes that had been left in his house because he

1065
00:57:33,320 --> 00:57:35,920
Speaker 1: again was a crazy person, was keeping all of her clothes,

1066
00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:42,720
Speaker 1: and put her in his bed forever unclean, where he

1067
00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:45,480
Speaker 1: may or may not have had sex with her. He

1068
00:57:45,680 --> 00:57:49,960
Speaker 1: did sleep with her body every night for seven years,

1069
00:57:51,840 --> 00:57:55,240
Speaker 1: and he uh, he was using a lot of perfume

1070
00:57:55,320 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 1: and a lot of disinfectant sprays to kind of mask

1071
00:57:57,960 --> 00:58:01,840
Speaker 1: the scent. But it took seven years for somebody to

1072
00:58:02,080 --> 00:58:06,000
Speaker 1: realize what was going on. He eventually got busted, he did,

1073
00:58:06,520 --> 00:58:09,280
Speaker 1: but it turns out the statue of limitations had expired

1074
00:58:09,560 --> 00:58:12,919
Speaker 1: on grave robbing after seven years, so he wasn't really

1075
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:18,680
Speaker 1: prosecuted for anything some of those things. I still feel

1076
00:58:18,680 --> 00:58:21,160
Speaker 1: you should have just been locked up on general principles,

1077
00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:25,680
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Yeah, I absolutely agree with that. Yeah,

1078
00:58:26,040 --> 00:58:27,720
Speaker 1: but the reason we tell you that story is to

1079
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:32,920
Speaker 1: tell you that's what creepy, creepy We wanted to shoehorn

1080
00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:36,520
Speaker 1: it in here. But also, you know, Lennin looks like crap,

1081
00:58:36,640 --> 00:58:41,560
Speaker 1: like jerky, and he's in a temperature controlled case, cared

1082
00:58:41,600 --> 00:58:45,000
Speaker 1: for by like a team of scientists that are constantly

1083
00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:49,080
Speaker 1: rehabbing him. This is a story of really creepy amateur

1084
00:58:49,600 --> 00:58:53,600
Speaker 1: attempt to get a corpse to be preserved on the

1085
00:58:53,720 --> 00:58:56,880
Speaker 1: level that we're talking about with Lopaskualita. And by the way,

1086
00:58:56,920 --> 00:59:00,280
Speaker 1: this attempt has failed horribly. So we have Soviet level

1087
00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:04,120
Speaker 1: jerky and we have speckled jerky. Yeah, basically we have

1088
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:08,160
Speaker 1: the spum. We're just going deep into disproving the crap up.

1089
00:59:08,560 --> 00:59:12,760
Speaker 1: Have you seen the pictures of this particular calls corp spread. Yeah,

1090
00:59:13,280 --> 00:59:19,640
Speaker 1: it's pretty pretty super creepy. Yeah, and not anywhere natural normal. Yeah. Yeah,

1091
00:59:20,280 --> 00:59:22,640
Speaker 1: So I if you don't have to take my word

1092
00:59:22,720 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 1: for it, like reading Rainbow, don't take my word for it.

1093
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:28,320
Speaker 1: Let's talk about some of the things that I've seen

1094
00:59:28,640 --> 00:59:33,360
Speaker 1: from actual funeral funeral directors and morticians around the internet.

1095
00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:36,520
Speaker 1: As we talked about, even if a body is involved,

1096
00:59:36,720 --> 00:59:40,360
Speaker 1: like Lennon's is, it's a team of experts to kind

1097
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:45,240
Speaker 1: of even halfway maintain the semblance of len is not

1098
00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:50,400
Speaker 1: in a storefront window in the sun every day in Mexico.

1099
00:59:51,240 --> 00:59:53,080
Speaker 1: I think he's in a He's in a sealed glass

1100
00:59:53,120 --> 00:59:56,000
Speaker 1: coffin which they can control the temperature. And isn't it

1101
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:59,840
Speaker 1: flooded with like nitrogen or something. Yes, No, there's intense

1102
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:03,960
Speaker 1: in there. Yeah. No. On top of that, the climate,

1103
01:00:04,040 --> 01:00:07,280
Speaker 1: as I mentioned, like you know, it's it's Mexico, so

1104
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:11,160
Speaker 1: it's going to be like extra hot. Yeah, and the

1105
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 1: oxygen is going to be crazy. And if I didn't

1106
01:00:14,120 --> 01:00:17,480
Speaker 1: mention this just to drive at home, we're talking like

1107
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:20,840
Speaker 1: seventy five years in the window, not like it was

1108
01:00:20,840 --> 01:00:24,840
Speaker 1: a couple of years. Seventy five years of no visible

1109
01:00:24,880 --> 01:00:28,720
Speaker 1: deterioration whatsoever. Seems crazy to me, but hey, it's just

1110
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:32,160
Speaker 1: that's just me. The hands is the thing that we

1111
01:00:32,280 --> 01:00:35,880
Speaker 1: do talk about a lot because they are super super creepy.

1112
01:00:35,920 --> 01:00:38,440
Speaker 1: So we're in the just just clarify, I realized I

1113
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:41,320
Speaker 1: don't know that. I'm sorry I did not specify. You're right.

1114
01:00:41,880 --> 01:00:45,640
Speaker 1: As soon as we started talking about creepy Carl dude,

1115
01:00:46,160 --> 01:00:49,560
Speaker 1: we started talking about it was it was a fake, okay,

1116
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:52,320
Speaker 1: it was fake versus being a real okay, just making sure.

1117
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:54,080
Speaker 1: I suddenly looked I was like, wait a minute, yeah,

1118
01:00:54,280 --> 01:00:56,640
Speaker 1: that's right. I think I must have deleted that out

1119
01:00:56,640 --> 01:01:00,040
Speaker 1: of Sorry. Sorry everyone. Yeah, so just it's just to

1120
01:01:00,040 --> 01:01:02,160
Speaker 1: be clear that were so we started out with it

1121
01:01:02,360 --> 01:01:04,720
Speaker 1: it is a real corpse, and now now we're back

1122
01:01:04,800 --> 01:01:08,200
Speaker 1: to and castrating that it couldn't be. Couldn't be. Yeah,

1123
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:14,160
Speaker 1: the hands, um are creepy, but I believe they are

1124
01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:17,920
Speaker 1: just really well done morticians wax. I was gonna saying,

1125
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:20,959
Speaker 1: it really looks like to me the hands because because

1126
01:01:20,960 --> 01:01:23,080
Speaker 1: when you look at the photos, you can see there's

1127
01:01:23,160 --> 01:01:24,959
Speaker 1: texture like you have on the top of your finger.

1128
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:27,880
Speaker 1: But more importantly, when you bend your thumb, that that

1129
01:01:28,040 --> 01:01:32,600
Speaker 1: wrinkle between in the joint between your pointer finger and

1130
01:01:32,640 --> 01:01:36,400
Speaker 1: your thumb just naturally, and she has that where a

1131
01:01:36,720 --> 01:01:40,160
Speaker 1: cast mannequin would not. So it's got to be somebody

1132
01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:43,040
Speaker 1: took a impression, you know. I was going to say,

1133
01:01:43,080 --> 01:01:45,480
Speaker 1: I suspect. What happened is somebody took a cast of

1134
01:01:45,560 --> 01:01:48,000
Speaker 1: a hand in a position and then filled the wax

1135
01:01:48,080 --> 01:01:50,640
Speaker 1: in and then went through and kind of you know,

1136
01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:55,120
Speaker 1: painted or carved away certain details of it, because like

1137
01:01:55,360 --> 01:01:59,880
Speaker 1: Joe said, there is some variation in the color. Eve.

1138
01:02:00,640 --> 01:02:02,720
Speaker 1: It looks at my white guy hand here and there's

1139
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:07,040
Speaker 1: many colors in it. Yeah, and that's what makes lapass

1140
01:02:07,080 --> 01:02:11,360
Speaker 1: Melita's hands. So but that can't be by a skilled artist.

1141
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:15,240
Speaker 1: Absolutely it can be, yeah, absolutely can Yeah. The last

1142
01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:18,560
Speaker 1: thing that I will say for this theory is um

1143
01:02:19,080 --> 01:02:23,000
Speaker 1: Lenin's body is a much better representation of what it

1144
01:02:23,160 --> 01:02:27,600
Speaker 1: looks like when you heart embalm quote unquote a body,

1145
01:02:27,800 --> 01:02:29,440
Speaker 1: which is pretty much the only way that you could

1146
01:02:29,480 --> 01:02:31,840
Speaker 1: preserve it for this long, which is you flush all

1147
01:02:31,920 --> 01:02:35,160
Speaker 1: of the fluids out with like super super strong chemicals

1148
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:38,959
Speaker 1: and that it basically just it flushes out your entire body.

1149
01:02:39,080 --> 01:02:41,520
Speaker 1: You have no moisture in your body anymore. And if

1150
01:02:41,560 --> 01:02:44,240
Speaker 1: you've ever you know, gone out drinking and then woken

1151
01:02:44,320 --> 01:02:45,880
Speaker 1: up the next morning and thought, oh my god, I

1152
01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:49,360
Speaker 1: look like death because I'm so dehydrated, because you know,

1153
01:02:49,520 --> 01:02:53,840
Speaker 1: my eyes are everything looks like extra wrinkly times that

1154
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:56,640
Speaker 1: by a million, And that's what you get when you

1155
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:59,960
Speaker 1: totally flush all the fluids out of body. He looked

1156
01:03:00,160 --> 01:03:03,080
Speaker 1: like you you you know the New Captain American movie

1157
01:03:03,160 --> 01:03:05,520
Speaker 1: that the first one of the new reboot. They came

1158
01:03:05,560 --> 01:03:07,440
Speaker 1: out a couple of years ago, and there's the Red Skull,

1159
01:03:08,080 --> 01:03:11,160
Speaker 1: the character the Red Skull. He looks like the Red

1160
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:14,520
Speaker 1: Skull to me. The way his face is hard. Yeah,

1161
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:18,720
Speaker 1: but a face anyway, but it is you. There's no

1162
01:03:19,040 --> 01:03:22,720
Speaker 1: moisture in the face. So the only way to realistically

1163
01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:26,880
Speaker 1: preserve a body for that long is to totally drain

1164
01:03:27,040 --> 01:03:29,600
Speaker 1: all of the fluids out of the body. But if

1165
01:03:29,600 --> 01:03:31,840
Speaker 1: you're gut, if you drain all the fluids of the body,

1166
01:03:31,960 --> 01:03:35,840
Speaker 1: the body is not going to look particularly life like anymore. Right,

1167
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:42,520
Speaker 1: So La Pascualita looks pretty relatively life like most Yeah,

1168
01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:45,480
Speaker 1: well she looks, yeah, she doesn't look looks like the

1169
01:03:45,560 --> 01:03:47,960
Speaker 1: skin is supple. Yes, probably the better we could say it.

1170
01:03:48,120 --> 01:03:50,000
Speaker 1: So I think moist is a little weird. Yeah, I

1171
01:03:50,280 --> 01:03:54,800
Speaker 1: realize that. Yeah. So I think overall, we just spent

1172
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:58,200
Speaker 1: you know, twenty minutes debunking a story that I spent

1173
01:03:58,320 --> 01:04:02,200
Speaker 1: five minutes talking about. But I don't think she's a corpse.

1174
01:04:02,920 --> 01:04:05,160
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, I know. Joe has like an

1175
01:04:05,240 --> 01:04:08,560
Speaker 1: additional theory to this whole thing. Oh yeah, there's always

1176
01:04:09,040 --> 01:04:11,560
Speaker 1: the curse theory. It's true. We have been talking about

1177
01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:13,520
Speaker 1: curses a lot. Why not talking about it a little

1178
01:04:13,560 --> 01:04:15,680
Speaker 1: bit more, you know, let's talk. I'm talking about tales

1179
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:18,280
Speaker 1: of them a cob and stuff like that. But supposing

1180
01:04:18,360 --> 01:04:21,120
Speaker 1: that our young bride was just thinking about it and

1181
01:04:21,160 --> 01:04:23,360
Speaker 1: imagining the life ahead of her, thinking I'm gonna get

1182
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:25,560
Speaker 1: married and I'm gonna have kids, I'm gonna get fat,

1183
01:04:25,640 --> 01:04:28,280
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get old, I'm gonna be unattractive, and and

1184
01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:30,600
Speaker 1: she just goes So she goes to the local shaw man.

1185
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:32,720
Speaker 1: He was like, lives in the mud hut at the

1186
01:04:32,840 --> 01:04:35,600
Speaker 1: edge of town. You know, that's the one that's festering

1187
01:04:35,640 --> 01:04:38,760
Speaker 1: by skulls and femurs done in crusive fixes and all

1188
01:04:38,800 --> 01:04:40,720
Speaker 1: that stuff. And it goes out and says, pay some

1189
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:43,680
Speaker 1: money and says, I I want to be young forever.

1190
01:04:43,720 --> 01:04:45,560
Speaker 1: I want to be just beautiful forever, you know, And

1191
01:04:45,640 --> 01:04:47,840
Speaker 1: so he turns her into a mannequin. Yeah, you know

1192
01:04:48,200 --> 01:04:49,840
Speaker 1: that's that. Yeah, we've heard that. We've all seen that

1193
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:54,080
Speaker 1: kind of story before. Twilight Zone and everything. She's just

1194
01:04:54,200 --> 01:04:56,600
Speaker 1: waiting for her true love to come kiss her. That

1195
01:04:56,720 --> 01:04:58,720
Speaker 1: ain't gonna be me, just on the off chance she

1196
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:03,920
Speaker 1: actually is a corpse something touch out. Yeah, No, I

1197
01:05:03,960 --> 01:05:07,080
Speaker 1: mean overall, I think she's it's creepy. I think she's

1198
01:05:07,120 --> 01:05:12,600
Speaker 1: an exceptionally well made face, especially for like the nineteen thirties. Well,

1199
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:17,560
Speaker 1: there's that was an era of some real artistry. Yeah,

1200
01:05:17,600 --> 01:05:20,280
Speaker 1: and so, I mean it's it's the age. I don't

1201
01:05:20,320 --> 01:05:24,000
Speaker 1: think the time is as important as just the fact

1202
01:05:24,040 --> 01:05:26,080
Speaker 1: that she was made. It's not when she was made.

1203
01:05:26,080 --> 01:05:30,520
Speaker 1: It's just somebody was really really talented. Yeah, kind and

1204
01:05:30,640 --> 01:05:33,760
Speaker 1: they're there. Definitely were talented people back in those days

1205
01:05:33,800 --> 01:05:36,680
Speaker 1: as much as today, probably more so. Yeah. I mean, yeah,

1206
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:38,480
Speaker 1: everybody was used to working with their hands at hell

1207
01:05:38,520 --> 01:05:40,200
Speaker 1: of a lot more in those kind of those kind

1208
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:42,960
Speaker 1: of endeavors, and we didn't have distractions like the Internet.

1209
01:05:43,000 --> 01:05:45,560
Speaker 1: People needed something to do. Yeah, it's true. We will

1210
01:05:45,640 --> 01:05:47,919
Speaker 1: never have another one of these because there's Facebook. Yeah,

1211
01:05:48,040 --> 01:05:52,680
Speaker 1: dang it. Facebook. All right, Well that is all of

1212
01:05:52,720 --> 01:06:01,840
Speaker 1: our stories in this year's Halloween Extravaganza. Yeah. Um, well,

1213
01:06:02,240 --> 01:06:05,080
Speaker 1: you I know you waited to get the most creepy

1214
01:06:05,200 --> 01:06:07,640
Speaker 1: stuff from us until the very end of this episode,

1215
01:06:07,680 --> 01:06:10,680
Speaker 1: so let me give it to you. It's our email address,

1216
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:14,560
Speaker 1: which is Thinking Sideways Podcast at gmail dot com. If

1217
01:06:14,600 --> 01:06:17,400
Speaker 1: you have questions or feedback anything like that, you can

1218
01:06:17,440 --> 01:06:19,680
Speaker 1: go ahead and send us an email. If you want

1219
01:06:19,680 --> 01:06:22,280
Speaker 1: to see a picture or links or anything like that

1220
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:24,400
Speaker 1: from the stories that we've covered today, those will be

1221
01:06:24,480 --> 01:06:28,520
Speaker 1: on our website, along with links to our episode list

1222
01:06:28,720 --> 01:06:32,160
Speaker 1: and merchandise, all that good stuff that is all going

1223
01:06:32,240 --> 01:06:36,720
Speaker 1: to be at thinking Sideways podcast dot com. You are

1224
01:06:36,920 --> 01:06:39,600
Speaker 1: listening to this episode right now, so you've gotten it

1225
01:06:39,720 --> 01:06:42,760
Speaker 1: from somewhere, whether you downloaded it or streamed it. So

1226
01:06:43,200 --> 01:06:46,600
Speaker 1: if you're enjoying the show, take the time to subscribe.

1227
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:49,360
Speaker 1: That's what helps other people find us, whether it be

1228
01:06:49,520 --> 01:06:52,720
Speaker 1: Apple or Google Play or Stitcher or whoever it is

1229
01:06:52,840 --> 01:06:56,840
Speaker 1: that you're using. Continue on enjoy and we'll keep putting

1230
01:06:56,880 --> 01:06:59,720
Speaker 1: them out there. And since we've complained about social media,

1231
01:06:59,800 --> 01:07:01,960
Speaker 1: but or we should probably talk about it, which is

1232
01:07:02,160 --> 01:07:05,280
Speaker 1: we are on social media. We have a Twitter account

1233
01:07:05,360 --> 01:07:08,200
Speaker 1: it's Thinking Sideways without the G in the middle because

1234
01:07:08,200 --> 01:07:11,600
Speaker 1: of that lovely character limit. We have a Facebook page

1235
01:07:11,600 --> 01:07:16,360
Speaker 1: and a Facebook group, so join the page or joined

1236
01:07:16,400 --> 01:07:19,600
Speaker 1: the group. And like the page. And of course we

1237
01:07:19,880 --> 01:07:24,320
Speaker 1: have a subreddit, so episode conversations happen in there, and

1238
01:07:24,840 --> 01:07:29,400
Speaker 1: that having all been said, go enjoy as much candy

1239
01:07:29,480 --> 01:07:33,439
Speaker 1: as you want because it doesn't matter. It's Halloween, yeah

1240
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:36,760
Speaker 1: they enjoy yourselves. Don't get scared to death, don't become

1241
01:07:36,760 --> 01:07:37,280
Speaker 1: a mannequin.