WEBVTT - Post Woke Cinema

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<v Speaker 1>Cool media.

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<v Speaker 2>This is it could happen here, a show about things

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<v Speaker 2>falling apart. I'm Garrison Davis. Today we're talking about movies,

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<v Speaker 2>one of my favorite topics that I never get to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about on the show, but I'm able to talk

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<v Speaker 2>about it this week because I've found a way to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about how movies are covering the death of Woke

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<v Speaker 2>and to help me in this doomed endeavor, I have

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<v Speaker 2>recruited artists and designer Bailey new poster.

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<v Speaker 3>Welcome Hi, It's lovely to be here.

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<v Speaker 2>Bailey also is behind the new top Cup City show

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<v Speaker 2>art which will eventually go public maybe in a few

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<v Speaker 2>weeks whenever I finally finished that episode, so keep pounding

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<v Speaker 2>me about it. So we're going to talk about two

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<v Speaker 2>films that came out this past July, Superman and Eddington,

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<v Speaker 2>which I think are actually very closely related despite being

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<v Speaker 2>very different from each other. I believe they're kind of

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<v Speaker 2>equal and opposite films. And I realized this after I

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<v Speaker 2>saw Eddington at a theater in Brooklyn and walked outside

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<v Speaker 2>to the posters for Superman and Editing being right next

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<v Speaker 2>to each other, which are very different, and then I

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<v Speaker 2>realized this is actually kind of the same movie, but

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<v Speaker 2>doing like or they're they're very related films right now.

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<v Speaker 2>I think they really are like the equal and opposite

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<v Speaker 2>of each other. Both are like uber contemporary, they're very online.

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<v Speaker 2>They have a sort of like gestural politics, and I

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<v Speaker 2>think they're both reactions to a conflicting view of American decline.

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<v Speaker 2>Both have surprised Tucker Carlson appearances, and both have failed cancelations.

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<v Speaker 2>There's a lot of overlap in some of the plot

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<v Speaker 2>points of this film, and I think what they're actually

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<v Speaker 2>kind of saying about current American culture, current current American politics,

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<v Speaker 2>and how it relates to social media. I think we

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<v Speaker 2>should first talk about Superman to get over that, so

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<v Speaker 2>we can I discuss Eddington because I need to discuss

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<v Speaker 2>Eddington in relation to Superman in some ways. So I

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<v Speaker 2>guess people have been enjoying this film. I think a

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<v Speaker 2>big part of why is how the film tackles geopolitics.

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<v Speaker 2>Oddly enough, the geopolitical conflict in the film was most

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<v Speaker 2>likely based on what it was written trying to pull from,

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<v Speaker 2>like Russia's invasion of Ukraine. But because the film took

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<v Speaker 2>a long time to write, by the time they shot

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<v Speaker 2>the film, there was a whole other geopolitical conflict happening,

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<v Speaker 2>which influenced at the very least the visual language of

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<v Speaker 2>the film, which which pulls from Israel and Palestine.

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<v Speaker 4>It's nice to see it, like represented, I guess on

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<v Speaker 4>a blockbuster film, like that's what it feels like.

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<v Speaker 1>It felt like nice to see it.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it's like an acknowledgment of the atrocities happening. Yes,

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<v Speaker 2>like essentially a Benjamin Nett and Yahoo stand in is

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<v Speaker 2>basically like the secondary villain of the film. And at

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<v Speaker 2>this point, I guess we'll just have to talk about

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<v Speaker 2>hashtag spoilers. If you haven't seen these and you want to,

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<v Speaker 2>you can. You can go see them if you're okay

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<v Speaker 2>with hearing us talk about it, and that might make

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<v Speaker 2>you want to see them more.

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<v Speaker 5>Then feel free. I don't think spoilers actually ruin a movie.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, like net and Yahu dying in the film

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<v Speaker 2>gets like a massive, a massive crowd reaction at least

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<v Speaker 2>when I saw it opening night, and and people definitely

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<v Speaker 2>feel a degree of like catharsists like watching you know,

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<v Speaker 2>superheroes stop the IDF from massacring you know, civilians who

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<v Speaker 2>are you were like you know, like like Arab civilians

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<v Speaker 2>like it's it's it's at that point they transcend, like

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<v Speaker 2>the Russia Ukraine aspect, and it's like very very clear

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<v Speaker 2>what they're visually pulling from.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I think the falafel card guy is the one, like, yeah,

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<v Speaker 4>that's crazy.

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<v Speaker 2>Lets Luthor executes a falafel card owner. And I'll talk

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<v Speaker 2>about more about how the film like riffs on Palestine

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<v Speaker 2>in a bed. There's there's other aspects I think of

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<v Speaker 2>how Superman is reacting to what James Gunn sees as

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<v Speaker 2>like American decline, because I think Superman as a film

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<v Speaker 2>is kind of a partially vapid take on like the

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<v Speaker 2>corruption of sincere positive futures and like the loss of hope.

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<v Speaker 2>It honestly feels very like Biden twenty twenty. It's like

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<v Speaker 2>a battle for the soul of America type thing. And

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<v Speaker 2>I also see this as like a reaction to the

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<v Speaker 2>victory of toxic masculinity, especially among like the twitch streamer

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<v Speaker 2>class and like manfluencers like Andrew Tait, and instead you

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<v Speaker 2>have Superman as this like goody two shoes boy Scout

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<v Speaker 2>the way he like he should be. And this is

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<v Speaker 2>the aspect of the film I think works. The best is,

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<v Speaker 2>honestly is their characterization of Superman. The cast is phenomenal.

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<v Speaker 2>David Cornsweat does a really good job, and I do

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<v Speaker 2>like this version of masculinity. It's it's still funny to

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<v Speaker 2>see like post online of people being like, Wow, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>actually gonna try, you know, being nice to my neighbors

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<v Speaker 2>now that I saw Superman, Like what the fuck.

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<v Speaker 4>To pick up my girlfriend today and be happy when

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<v Speaker 4>I'm around her.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So that feels a little odd, but like, I

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<v Speaker 2>guess it's good that people can feel like Superman when

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<v Speaker 2>they're doing good things, helping an old lady cross the

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<v Speaker 2>street or whatever. I think that aspect of like decline,

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<v Speaker 2>I sympathize with this like loss of like positive masculinity,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think a Superman can be a simpol for

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<v Speaker 2>that for new people who are addicted to watching like

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<v Speaker 2>sneak O or whatever.

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<v Speaker 5>I think that's probably good.

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<v Speaker 2>And in some ways I think this film, honestly, like

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<v Speaker 2>the exact same film would have been received a lot

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<v Speaker 2>worse if Kamala Harris was president. I think that the

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<v Speaker 2>fact that everyone feels so hopeless, like depress, hopeless and

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<v Speaker 2>defeated because of Trump. I think this actually contributes to

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<v Speaker 2>the positive reception the film is taking. And myself and

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<v Speaker 2>a few other people kind of even predicted this, like

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<v Speaker 2>back in November, trying to like forecast like the reception

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<v Speaker 2>of Superman and like Fantastic Four and like all these

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<v Speaker 2>companies who are trying to like save the superhero genre

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<v Speaker 2>from like eating itself right now. But for me, at least,

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<v Speaker 2>there is a more insidious aspect of Superman that I

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<v Speaker 2>do not see being discussed as much beyond you know,

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<v Speaker 2>James Gunn still still obviously upset that he got canceled

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<v Speaker 2>and is thinking that a core plot points in this

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<v Speaker 2>film is he's actually super bad and he shouldn't have

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<v Speaker 2>been canceled.

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<v Speaker 4>He shouldn't be canceled, and the people canceling him were

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<v Speaker 4>monkeys at Typewriters.

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<v Speaker 3>And which way, honestly that that part is true.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, people try to cancel James gun were monkeys, and

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<v Speaker 2>on one typewriters.

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<v Speaker 1>I thought that bit was great.

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<v Speaker 4>I thought that bit was very I was like, that's

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<v Speaker 4>very like one panel gag in a comic, which is

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<v Speaker 4>you know, wonderful, very The movie felt very great.

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<v Speaker 5>Morrison, totally, those are the aspects that I really liked.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, totally staying on the on the political subject, I

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<v Speaker 4>think you can draw a very good analogy between this

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<v Speaker 4>and or Not. Just this feels like this year's Barbie,

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<v Speaker 4>if that makes sense. Sure, like the kind of like

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<v Speaker 4>corporate political not girls get it done this time. Obviously,

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<v Speaker 4>this is like more of like anti not even anti

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<v Speaker 4>toxic masculinity. I think it's just pro this form of masculinity,

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<v Speaker 4>which I think is more productive.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but I also.

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<v Speaker 4>Think, yeah, there's like neolib stuff going on, and also

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<v Speaker 4>the fact that the movie, because it's a blockbuster, can't

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<v Speaker 4>properly handle anything like it kind of has to just

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<v Speaker 4>leave everything at the road, yeah, on the side of

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<v Speaker 4>the road by the end of it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>This is very much similar to Barbie, in which I

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<v Speaker 2>kind of had the same reaction to.

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<v Speaker 5>It's like they're like o K movies.

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<v Speaker 2>But I find the political posturing actually slightly insulting in

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<v Speaker 2>a certain way based on how shallow it is. And

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<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna I'm going to actually get into that more

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<v Speaker 2>on Superman here. I've seen people talking about how like

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<v Speaker 2>emotional they got during the scenes, like very evocative of

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<v Speaker 2>the Palactini and genocide like people like, you know, crying

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<v Speaker 2>and tearing up and feeling so seen and again. On

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<v Speaker 2>one hand, that's good, but that also gives me a

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<v Speaker 2>bit of an icky feeling. And someone else expressed this

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<v Speaker 2>very well, the co host of the Hit Factory podcast

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<v Speaker 2>at Deep Impact Crier on tweeter. She's the host of

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<v Speaker 2>the podcast Hit Factory. Wach was about nineties to cinema.

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<v Speaker 2>I think her name is Carly, and she expressed this

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<v Speaker 2>kind of soft disgust that was growing in me, but

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<v Speaker 2>both kind of during some of these scenes and frankly

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<v Speaker 2>watching people's reaction to it. She said, quote, that's the point,

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<v Speaker 2>isn't it To immerse you in a fantasy where civilian

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<v Speaker 2>life matters, to distract you from the reality where civilian

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<v Speaker 2>life does not matter, To offer you abstractions of already

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<v Speaker 2>abstracted images of imperial violence so that you could experience Catharsis,

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<v Speaker 2>escape and absolution. A movie like Superman exists to take

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<v Speaker 2>the literal spectacle of genocide filling our feed for two years,

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<v Speaker 2>and further mediate, slash, abstract the spectacle so it can

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<v Speaker 2>be transposed onto another product of empire and strategic interpassivity

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<v Speaker 2>to keep us ideologically and emotionally confined to its order.

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<v Speaker 2>Any empathetic impulse engendered by forms and aesthetics of imperial

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<v Speaker 2>violence and memetic rhythms of technology it trades in confines

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<v Speaker 2>us to the limits of the language of empire. It

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<v Speaker 2>keeps us operating on its terms. We need cinema that

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<v Speaker 2>ruptures familiar imperial forms and its rhythms unquote. So movies

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<v Speaker 2>like Superman and the way that they depict atrocities actually

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<v Speaker 2>like make us more indebted to the imperial system because

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<v Speaker 2>the imperial system can give us a product to make

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<v Speaker 2>us feel Catharsis about the violence that the empire actually does,

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<v Speaker 2>and that Catharsis keeps us going, like that's what allows

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<v Speaker 2>us to not like fucking destroy everything around us, because

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<v Speaker 2>we get enough of that Catharsis that it makes us

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<v Speaker 2>able to keep living. And that's in the end, what

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<v Speaker 2>products like Superman are kind of doing. They're making us

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<v Speaker 2>feel just good enough by expressing the displeasure we have

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<v Speaker 2>at what our government is doing, but still making us

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<v Speaker 2>like fully made married to the existence of that empire,

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<v Speaker 2>Like we can't live without it because of the comfort

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<v Speaker 2>it provides us. Including this cathartic comfort watching fucking Guy

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<v Speaker 2>Gardner stop the Palestinian genocide, which if you told me

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<v Speaker 2>that sentence like five years ago, I would have not

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<v Speaker 2>believed you. I would have not believed that a cinematic

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<v Speaker 2>depiction of Guy Gardner is going to stop the Palestinian genocide,

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<v Speaker 2>that that Hawk girl is gonna is gonna kill Netanyahu.

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<v Speaker 2>I would I would have not believed you for a

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<v Speaker 2>single second. And that kind of shows the level of

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<v Speaker 2>absurdity that we're kind of dealing with, and that aspect,

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<v Speaker 2>I think is what makes what Superman is doing actually

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<v Speaker 2>far more insidious than any of the controversial politics in

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<v Speaker 2>something like Eddington.

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<v Speaker 4>I also think that the whole like indebted to empire thing.

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<v Speaker 4>I think this is like the case in point example

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<v Speaker 4>of that considering Superman is literally a symbol of American values.

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<v Speaker 2>Or certainly has like become that, and like yeah, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>had a more positive version of that in some ways

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<v Speaker 2>during his like birth in World War Two as a

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<v Speaker 2>way as like a symbol of like Nazi resistance, but

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<v Speaker 2>instead now is you know, it very much turned into

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<v Speaker 2>like truth justice in the American way, to the point

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<v Speaker 2>where a lot of his you know, like immigrant aspects

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<v Speaker 2>have been have been kind of undercut in the in

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<v Speaker 2>the past, in the past few years.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I saw an article I didn't actually end up

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<v Speaker 4>fully reading because it was on the I forgot what

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<v Speaker 4>it was then the Washington Post or maybe it was

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<v Speaker 4>the New York Times where it was it was.

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<v Speaker 5>Like blocked or something, one of the big two.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, it was an author who I think was an immigrant,

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<v Speaker 4>and it was like talking about how Superman undercuts the

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<v Speaker 4>the immigrant experience and that he is like literally born

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<v Speaker 4>on the planet anyway, so it's not really like an

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<v Speaker 4>it's not necessarily he doesn't go through any like cultural conflict.

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<v Speaker 1>I guess, you know, totally.

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<v Speaker 4>I also wondered about, well, you know, I get I

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<v Speaker 4>guess it doesn't.

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<v Speaker 1>I guess it doesn't.

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<v Speaker 4>I was gonna I was gonna think about the taking

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<v Speaker 4>the immigrant aspect and then talking about one of the

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<v Speaker 4>main parts of the movie, which was his parents are

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<v Speaker 4>like you need to go and make a harem on

0:12:04.800 --> 0:12:07.520
<v Speaker 4>Earth or whatever, is sort of interesting.

0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:12.240
<v Speaker 2>Yes, the aspect that his immigrant background has been very

0:12:12.320 --> 0:12:14.800
<v Speaker 2>corrupted in this film, like there's like a certainly like

0:12:14.920 --> 0:12:17.320
<v Speaker 2>foreign evilness associating with Superman.

0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:20.559
<v Speaker 4>Now, Yeah, you're an immigrant, and like that's good and

0:12:20.559 --> 0:12:23.920
<v Speaker 4>that's great and very American, but you shouldn't be what

0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:27.680
<v Speaker 4>your parents were, your like foreign parents because they wanted

0:12:27.679 --> 0:12:31.360
<v Speaker 4>a harem of lovers and to like conquer the West

0:12:31.840 --> 0:12:35.000
<v Speaker 4>or whatever. Yeah, which, you know, considering the fact that

0:12:35.040 --> 0:12:37.960
<v Speaker 4>this was written during the Russia Ukraine thing and not

0:12:38.360 --> 0:12:42.480
<v Speaker 4>mainly during the Israel Palestine thing, I don't know if

0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:45.200
<v Speaker 4>that's like, but because that's in the movie, I have

0:12:45.240 --> 0:12:46.280
<v Speaker 4>to think about it, you know.

0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:48.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't think James Gunn was conceptualizing of that

0:12:49.000 --> 0:12:50.120
<v Speaker 2>when he wrote it.

0:12:50.240 --> 0:12:53.920
<v Speaker 4>I think it's an unfortunate product of what happened aesthetically,

0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:56.080
<v Speaker 4>but it's not that big of a deal, but it

0:12:56.200 --> 0:12:58.200
<v Speaker 4>is weird, Like it's something to think about.

0:12:58.400 --> 0:12:59.839
<v Speaker 2>That aspect did not bother me as much as it

0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:02.880
<v Speaker 2>did for some other people. For my overall thoughts in

0:13:02.920 --> 0:13:04.839
<v Speaker 2>the film, I think it's basically as good as every

0:13:04.840 --> 0:13:06.960
<v Speaker 2>other James gun film, which frankly just is not my

0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:09.080
<v Speaker 2>cup of tea. I've never really loved the Guardians films.

0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:11.600
<v Speaker 2>I don't think James Gun's a very compelling filmmaker. I

0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:14.200
<v Speaker 2>thought it was just fine. It definitely felt like episode

0:13:14.240 --> 0:13:17.080
<v Speaker 2>thirteen of a TV show that doesn't exist, which as

0:13:17.120 --> 0:13:21.360
<v Speaker 2>a comic book appreciator I like. As a film appreciator

0:13:21.400 --> 0:13:25.320
<v Speaker 2>I don't like, But certainly the more campy aspects I

0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:27.880
<v Speaker 2>enjoyed a lot. I think now is time to go

0:13:27.960 --> 0:13:30.760
<v Speaker 2>on a quick break, and then we will return to

0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:37.160
<v Speaker 2>discuss the anti woke cinematic masterpiece of the twenty twenties Eddington.

0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:51.199
<v Speaker 2>All right, we're back, So I would like to now

0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:54.440
<v Speaker 2>talk about Eddington for the rest of the episode essentially,

0:13:55.440 --> 0:13:57.680
<v Speaker 2>But like I said before, Eddington is the equal and

0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:02.000
<v Speaker 2>opposite of Superman. Both are both are very contemporary, very online.

0:14:02.200 --> 0:14:05.720
<v Speaker 2>Both their politics gesture and I think they're they're reactionary,

0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:08.800
<v Speaker 2>but they're specifically reactionary in very different ways. I think

0:14:08.800 --> 0:14:12.679
<v Speaker 2>they're they're reacting to two very different types of decline

0:14:12.720 --> 0:14:16.720
<v Speaker 2>in America, or like perceived decline in America. So Eddington

0:14:16.800 --> 0:14:21.760
<v Speaker 2>is directed by Ariastor, who made Hereditary, Midsummer and Both Afraid.

0:14:22.680 --> 0:14:25.240
<v Speaker 2>I'll talk more about my thoughts on ari Astor at

0:14:25.240 --> 0:14:28.360
<v Speaker 2>the end in a conversation with Jennie Danger. But I

0:14:28.400 --> 0:14:32.920
<v Speaker 2>think Eddington is not anti woke. Actually I was lying.

0:14:33.680 --> 0:14:37.640
<v Speaker 2>I think anything is a post woke expression of kind

0:14:37.680 --> 0:14:40.680
<v Speaker 2>of scared nihilism, or like like a depiction of the

0:14:40.760 --> 0:14:44.960
<v Speaker 2>nihilism inherent to American politics right now, like every everything

0:14:45.040 --> 0:14:49.040
<v Speaker 2>is a conspiracy theory, there's this specter of cancelation around

0:14:49.080 --> 0:14:52.600
<v Speaker 2>the corner, and like speaking specters, I think so so

0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:55.920
<v Speaker 2>much of both Superman and Eddington for me is like

0:14:56.160 --> 0:15:00.600
<v Speaker 2>there's this specter of wokeism that's haunting America, and both

0:15:00.640 --> 0:15:02.880
<v Speaker 2>films are trying to deal with that specter. I think

0:15:02.920 --> 0:15:07.680
<v Speaker 2>Superman partially mourns that wokeness, and Eddington deals with its

0:15:07.680 --> 0:15:10.400
<v Speaker 2>more like actual and like haunting and like in like

0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:13.520
<v Speaker 2>a ghostly quality, some of its more like uncanny qualities.

0:15:13.560 --> 0:15:15.080
<v Speaker 5>Sometimes more than.

0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:18.760
<v Speaker 2>Anything, Eddington digs into how we have created a profoundly

0:15:18.840 --> 0:15:22.640
<v Speaker 2>anti social culture, which even leftists contribute to and in

0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:26.000
<v Speaker 2>some cases actually conceptualize that as a form of like

0:15:26.080 --> 0:15:29.840
<v Speaker 2>based process, and how we've all become just reflections of

0:15:29.840 --> 0:15:33.000
<v Speaker 2>our Internet feeds and used politics as a justification for

0:15:33.200 --> 0:15:36.240
<v Speaker 2>personal cruelty, or the very least, use politics as an

0:15:36.240 --> 0:15:39.280
<v Speaker 2>outlet to channel anti social behavior in a way that

0:15:39.400 --> 0:15:41.680
<v Speaker 2>you can self perceive as being morally good. And I

0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:43.680
<v Speaker 2>think both the left and the right do this obviously,

0:15:43.720 --> 0:15:46.240
<v Speaker 2>Like the right does this with their like pedophile crusader shit,

0:15:46.760 --> 0:15:49.240
<v Speaker 2>never mind the whole Epstein thing, just just ignore that,

0:15:49.400 --> 0:15:52.160
<v Speaker 2>ignore all of the actual right wing pedophiles.

0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:54.800
<v Speaker 1>But well, it's entirely about aesthetics.

0:15:54.880 --> 0:15:58.360
<v Speaker 4>It's about absolutely Yeah, who looks like a pedophile to me?

0:15:58.600 --> 0:16:00.000
<v Speaker 1>And it's the gay person.

0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:03.920
<v Speaker 2>Ascetisized politics, right, it's because huge on I think political

0:16:03.960 --> 0:16:08.560
<v Speaker 2>extremism in general politics start developing more aestheticized forms. You know,

0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:11.640
<v Speaker 2>this is true among anarchists, and I think fascism more

0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:14.920
<v Speaker 2>more purely, I think is actually like politics ascetisize to

0:16:14.920 --> 0:16:17.400
<v Speaker 2>the point we are aesthetisizing, you know, like like people

0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:19.720
<v Speaker 2>and like culture and like race. Right, Like that is

0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:23.280
<v Speaker 2>a whole a way different version than you know, like

0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:27.160
<v Speaker 2>crust punks or like yeah, like like you know, black Bloc.

0:16:27.320 --> 0:16:29.840
<v Speaker 4>Did you see the uh? I don't remember what the

0:16:29.840 --> 0:16:32.840
<v Speaker 4>account was. It was like something of defense tweeted like

0:16:32.880 --> 0:16:36.800
<v Speaker 4>some AI like from one of those like mill military

0:16:36.960 --> 0:16:39.760
<v Speaker 4>fiction like accounts or something, And it was like a

0:16:39.760 --> 0:16:42.400
<v Speaker 4>picture of like a white dude holding like a fucked

0:16:42.440 --> 0:16:44.800
<v Speaker 4>up looking m for because it was AI generated and

0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:46.160
<v Speaker 4>he's got like a bald eagle.

0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:46.520
<v Speaker 3>On his head.

0:16:47.280 --> 0:16:48.760
<v Speaker 5>No, but that sounds great.

0:16:49.120 --> 0:16:50.240
<v Speaker 1>It got tweeted today.

0:16:50.400 --> 0:16:53.280
<v Speaker 4>It's like the fucking lamest thing I've ever seen, and

0:16:53.360 --> 0:16:56.360
<v Speaker 4>like I just don't even know, like not only the

0:16:56.360 --> 0:16:59.640
<v Speaker 4>fact that he's like obviously he's using a photo of

0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:03.320
<v Speaker 4>somebody else, but it's not even a real picture of anybody.

0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.159
<v Speaker 1>It's like a fake image of somebody that somebody.

0:17:05.800 --> 0:17:08.560
<v Speaker 4>Else made, like that he got off of like one

0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:11.320
<v Speaker 4>of those like gun larp aesthetic accounts.

0:17:11.680 --> 0:17:13.880
<v Speaker 1>I just found that very interesting.

0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:17.840
<v Speaker 5>I don't know, Bailey, what did you think of Eddington?

0:17:18.400 --> 0:17:20.359
<v Speaker 1>I adored it. I loved it.

0:17:20.520 --> 0:17:22.560
<v Speaker 4>The moment that I knew that I was going to

0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:26.919
<v Speaker 4>enjoy it was probably where it's revealed the energy plant

0:17:27.000 --> 0:17:30.320
<v Speaker 4>is called perfect Gold Magic carp or whatever, which is

0:17:30.480 --> 0:17:34.119
<v Speaker 4>like so funny, like all those AI guys making all

0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:37.760
<v Speaker 4>their products, like they're calling it Sourn's eye or whatever.

0:17:38.200 --> 0:17:39.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, yeah, so good.

0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:44.159
<v Speaker 4>But I adored it. I think that Joaquin Phoenix is

0:17:44.160 --> 0:17:46.880
<v Speaker 4>wonderful in it. He's a great actor. I think Ari

0:17:47.000 --> 0:17:49.520
<v Speaker 4>Astor is like one of the few directors that can

0:17:49.680 --> 0:17:55.160
<v Speaker 4>perfectly slot him into this like just neurotic impotent man role,

0:17:55.480 --> 0:17:59.480
<v Speaker 4>you know, very impotent you have, Yes, So the scene

0:17:59.480 --> 0:18:02.119
<v Speaker 4>that I really like that I think about probably the most,

0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:04.320
<v Speaker 4>or the character I think of probably the most is

0:18:04.359 --> 0:18:08.600
<v Speaker 4>the homeless guy. Yeah, the homeless guy who wanders into

0:18:08.600 --> 0:18:11.800
<v Speaker 4>the film and is the you know, he's a stranger,

0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:14.879
<v Speaker 4>walks into a strange town like opening of the film,

0:18:15.359 --> 0:18:18.399
<v Speaker 4>and then all of the scenes where he's like he

0:18:18.480 --> 0:18:22.040
<v Speaker 4>kind of bothers everybody, like he's you know, like in

0:18:22.200 --> 0:18:25.760
<v Speaker 4>Gavin Newsom's like anti homeless policies. You know, it's a

0:18:25.920 --> 0:18:30.080
<v Speaker 4>it's a very bipartisan we have a bipartisan anti.

0:18:29.840 --> 0:18:31.960
<v Speaker 1>Homeless thing going on, obviously.

0:18:32.359 --> 0:18:37.359
<v Speaker 4>And he is also like even when his character like

0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:41.159
<v Speaker 4>snaps and kills somebody, he like kills the homeless guy first,

0:18:41.520 --> 0:18:42.880
<v Speaker 4>which I found very interesting.

0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:46.000
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I think this is really crucial that when the

0:18:46.080 --> 0:18:49.960
<v Speaker 2>sheriff starts his murder rampage, the first expression of violence

0:18:49.960 --> 0:18:52.920
<v Speaker 2>that he feels personally justified in doing or feels CATHARSI

0:18:52.960 --> 0:18:56.520
<v Speaker 2>isn't doing, isn't isn't like the fake woke mayor, it's

0:18:56.520 --> 0:18:59.960
<v Speaker 2>not Antifa. It's the homeless guy that is the first

0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:04.800
<v Speaker 2>target of acceptable violence in the mind of the sheriff.

0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:08.480
<v Speaker 2>And I think that is a very accurate look at

0:19:08.520 --> 0:19:12.080
<v Speaker 2>American politics, and that's not something I've seen discussed very

0:19:12.160 --> 0:19:13.719
<v Speaker 2>much in relation to the film.

0:19:14.119 --> 0:19:17.920
<v Speaker 4>No, and I in a way, he's still impotent after that,

0:19:18.000 --> 0:19:20.560
<v Speaker 4>He's like he's he's not even enacting. I wouldn't even

0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:24.360
<v Speaker 4>label that as political violence. I just label that as violence, right.

0:19:24.480 --> 0:19:27.840
<v Speaker 4>Like earlier in the movie, all the like teen woke

0:19:27.920 --> 0:19:30.440
<v Speaker 4>protesters are like sitting out in the street, and the

0:19:30.440 --> 0:19:33.200
<v Speaker 4>homeless guy's kind of just standing and like he's.

0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:34.640
<v Speaker 1>Like, hey, man, I don't have any money. Like he's

0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:37.040
<v Speaker 1>not even asking for anything. He's just kind of standing

0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:38.560
<v Speaker 1>there and making them all uncomfortable.

0:19:38.880 --> 0:19:43.480
<v Speaker 4>You know, he is the specter of the other wandering

0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:45.960
<v Speaker 4>into this town and then everybody has to like and

0:19:46.000 --> 0:19:48.480
<v Speaker 4>he's like the you know, the beginning of conflict.

0:19:48.880 --> 0:19:49.080
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:19:49.480 --> 0:19:52.359
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, they're they're like the easiest group to other is

0:19:52.400 --> 0:19:54.159
<v Speaker 4>the homeless and the mentally unwell.

0:19:54.520 --> 0:19:56.919
<v Speaker 2>No, I think that that part of the film works

0:19:56.960 --> 0:20:00.600
<v Speaker 2>really well. And I guess this film is received a

0:20:00.800 --> 0:20:04.360
<v Speaker 2>mixed reaction, which I talk a little bit about with

0:20:04.359 --> 0:20:07.120
<v Speaker 2>with jan which you'll you'll hear in a sec. And

0:20:07.880 --> 0:20:11.919
<v Speaker 2>I guess I'll start by talking about how I believe

0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:15.160
<v Speaker 2>Eddington works as a as a piece of post woke

0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:17.919
<v Speaker 2>cinema and I was talking about this with someone and

0:20:17.960 --> 0:20:20.800
<v Speaker 2>they asked me what post woke was, and I was

0:20:20.840 --> 0:20:23.560
<v Speaker 2>a little confused, because that's a term that I feel

0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:26.159
<v Speaker 2>like I understand really well, but then I failed to

0:20:26.240 --> 0:20:28.639
<v Speaker 2>accurately describe it to them. And I think it relates

0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:30.719
<v Speaker 2>to this whole cultural moment that we're in now, especially

0:20:30.760 --> 0:20:33.840
<v Speaker 2>after the twenty twenty four election, where we're facing this

0:20:34.040 --> 0:20:39.000
<v Speaker 2>larger cultural backlash against you know, woke TM and how

0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:44.480
<v Speaker 2>that highlights like the limits of diversity representation and complicated

0:20:44.560 --> 0:20:48.840
<v Speaker 2>language to explain topics that might actually be you know, reasonable,

0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:53.680
<v Speaker 2>but by expressing them you sound very unreasonable. And I

0:20:53.880 --> 0:20:56.479
<v Speaker 2>think what post woke is and the reason why Eddington

0:20:56.560 --> 0:20:59.199
<v Speaker 2>is post woke and is not anti woke like like

0:20:59.520 --> 0:21:02.160
<v Speaker 2>Eddington's centrist movie. I think it actually is fairly political,

0:21:02.480 --> 0:21:05.439
<v Speaker 2>but it's post woke in such that it is a

0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:10.760
<v Speaker 2>continuation of radical politics, which incorporates critiques of the woke era,

0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:14.679
<v Speaker 2>what critics would describe as an overreach or excessive focus

0:21:14.680 --> 0:21:19.560
<v Speaker 2>on language or singular identity, trading inaccessible education in favor

0:21:19.600 --> 0:21:23.679
<v Speaker 2>of in group signaling to prove personal political purity. I

0:21:23.720 --> 0:21:28.399
<v Speaker 2>think post woke hues a shallow performative politics adopted to

0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:32.480
<v Speaker 2>provide social capital, and instead may deliberately flaunt humor, camp,

0:21:32.600 --> 0:21:35.680
<v Speaker 2>or irreverence in ways that may have been labeled problematic

0:21:35.800 --> 0:21:39.400
<v Speaker 2>or taboo during the peak of twenty tens online activism,

0:21:39.840 --> 0:21:42.920
<v Speaker 2>but often in a way that signals both accurate awareness

0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:45.080
<v Speaker 2>of social issues as well as an exhaustion with or

0:21:45.119 --> 0:21:50.239
<v Speaker 2>a playful rebellion against socially alienating language and ideas. And

0:21:50.320 --> 0:21:53.680
<v Speaker 2>this can include using irony, parity, and camp to engage

0:21:53.680 --> 0:21:57.760
<v Speaker 2>with social issues without the existential gravity or earnestness of

0:21:57.880 --> 0:22:03.040
<v Speaker 2>prior education focus eras, there may now be jokes, themes,

0:22:03.119 --> 0:22:06.600
<v Speaker 2>or performances that skirt or playfully violate previous norms of

0:22:06.600 --> 0:22:09.719
<v Speaker 2>cultural sensitivity, but not out of ignorance, but as a

0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:15.119
<v Speaker 2>conscious reversal or escalation, while actually emphasizing material support over

0:22:15.320 --> 0:22:20.320
<v Speaker 2>linguistic gestures and systematic pressure over individual personal action.

0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:23.080
<v Speaker 5>So that's what I mean by post woke.

0:22:23.160 --> 0:22:25.680
<v Speaker 2>I had to workshop this definition with a friend earlier

0:22:25.680 --> 0:22:29.359
<v Speaker 2>this morning, but I think that works for both. Like

0:22:29.480 --> 0:22:32.600
<v Speaker 2>what Eddington is doing, I think that works for what

0:22:32.680 --> 0:22:36.000
<v Speaker 2>events like Twins Versus Dolls is doing. How it's it's

0:22:35.800 --> 0:22:38.600
<v Speaker 2>it's it's not anti woke, but and it's not purely

0:22:38.680 --> 0:22:42.200
<v Speaker 2>reactionary against woke it is it is actually a continuation

0:22:42.359 --> 0:22:46.320
<v Speaker 2>and an escalation while adapting to fit the current political

0:22:46.400 --> 0:22:49.800
<v Speaker 2>climate and still like reflecting on some of the shortcomings

0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:52.959
<v Speaker 2>of the quote unquote woke era, which we see throughout

0:22:53.000 --> 0:22:54.800
<v Speaker 2>Eddington a lot in the form of like, you know,

0:22:54.880 --> 0:22:58.600
<v Speaker 2>performative politics, especially that like one like zoomer guy character,

0:22:58.760 --> 0:23:01.120
<v Speaker 2>oh ye who you know, goes on that whole rant

0:23:01.160 --> 0:23:05.280
<v Speaker 2>about like abolishing whiteness to his parents based on like

0:23:05.359 --> 0:23:08.200
<v Speaker 2>googling these concepts like thirty minutes ago, and now feels

0:23:08.200 --> 0:23:11.080
<v Speaker 2>like he has like an academic level understanding of whiteness

0:23:11.119 --> 0:23:11.960
<v Speaker 2>as a concept.

0:23:12.119 --> 0:23:14.840
<v Speaker 4>The intro to him, I guess it's the second it's

0:23:14.880 --> 0:23:15.879
<v Speaker 4>the second time you see him.

0:23:15.880 --> 0:23:16.880
<v Speaker 1>But he's at the he's.

0:23:16.720 --> 0:23:21.120
<v Speaker 4>At the party or whatever, and like he gives kind

0:23:21.160 --> 0:23:22.960
<v Speaker 4>of an opinion to this.

0:23:22.920 --> 0:23:24.160
<v Speaker 1>Girl that he has a crush on.

0:23:24.359 --> 0:23:28.000
<v Speaker 4>They're talking about like you know, whiteness and like privilege

0:23:28.040 --> 0:23:30.600
<v Speaker 4>and stuff like that, and he class yeah, and class

0:23:31.040 --> 0:23:34.919
<v Speaker 4>is the really like because clearly he I think I

0:23:35.040 --> 0:23:37.600
<v Speaker 4>think he's supposed to kind of be like a lower

0:23:37.720 --> 0:23:41.240
<v Speaker 4>class like character that then yeah, jumps up the ranks

0:23:41.280 --> 0:23:45.159
<v Speaker 4>through political opportunism. Right, yeah, yeah, he brings up class

0:23:45.160 --> 0:23:46.720
<v Speaker 4>and is immediately shut down.

0:23:46.560 --> 0:23:50.920
<v Speaker 2>And googles Angela Davis seconds before, but only but only

0:23:51.040 --> 0:23:53.439
<v Speaker 2>so that he can flirt with a girl more effectively,

0:23:53.880 --> 0:23:58.200
<v Speaker 2>which is very funny, incredible, It's so good. Other small

0:23:58.240 --> 0:24:02.200
<v Speaker 2>bits like that. I really enjoy that. The like fake

0:24:02.240 --> 0:24:04.440
<v Speaker 2>woke Mayor who's actually just like a tech company shill

0:24:04.920 --> 0:24:09.119
<v Speaker 2>has he him pronouns on his Zoom profile, very very

0:24:09.160 --> 0:24:09.760
<v Speaker 2>funny to me.

0:24:11.000 --> 0:24:13.840
<v Speaker 1>There are so many little things in this movie.

0:24:14.080 --> 0:24:15.359
<v Speaker 3>It's a lot of little stuff.

0:24:15.440 --> 0:24:18.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and like very obviously this is a film that

0:24:18.320 --> 0:24:22.080
<v Speaker 2>Ariasta wrote well like way too online during twenty twenty,

0:24:22.119 --> 0:24:24.320
<v Speaker 2>like he was in specifically Twitter, right, this is an

0:24:24.560 --> 0:24:27.960
<v Speaker 2>extremely Twitter movie, which is both works for the movie

0:24:28.000 --> 0:24:29.560
<v Speaker 2>and sometimes works against the movie.

0:24:29.840 --> 0:24:31.800
<v Speaker 5>I have no idea how this film is going to age.

0:24:32.000 --> 0:24:33.879
<v Speaker 2>Maybe it'll age very well because we'll use it as

0:24:33.880 --> 0:24:36.119
<v Speaker 2>like a cultural artifact to like look back on and

0:24:36.160 --> 0:24:38.560
<v Speaker 2>be like, yeah, that's kind of what twenty twenty felt like.

0:24:41.080 --> 0:24:42.600
<v Speaker 4>In a couple of years, we're all going to be

0:24:42.640 --> 0:24:44.640
<v Speaker 4>looking back on it and saying, how dare they made

0:24:44.640 --> 0:24:48.120
<v Speaker 4>fun of our new currency crypto, our new bitcoins.

0:24:48.200 --> 0:24:49.440
<v Speaker 1>Everybody has bitcoins.

0:24:49.520 --> 0:24:53.560
<v Speaker 3>All of the bitcoin stuff is really good, like I do.

0:24:53.720 --> 0:24:57.240
<v Speaker 4>Also, I like that they gave the I don't remember

0:24:57.280 --> 0:25:00.560
<v Speaker 4>his name, the black police officer, who's like kind of

0:25:00.960 --> 0:25:02.640
<v Speaker 4>another like main through line.

0:25:02.400 --> 0:25:02.920
<v Speaker 1>For the movie.

0:25:03.040 --> 0:25:06.600
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, but he his only other thing is that he's

0:25:06.640 --> 0:25:07.520
<v Speaker 4>really into crypto.

0:25:07.960 --> 0:25:10.159
<v Speaker 3>He's so funny, so good.

0:25:10.359 --> 0:25:16.080
<v Speaker 2>If anything, I think Eddington is really good at showcasing

0:25:16.280 --> 0:25:19.480
<v Speaker 2>types of guy. There's so many like type of guys

0:25:19.520 --> 0:25:21.960
<v Speaker 2>in this film, and I think that's that's one of

0:25:21.960 --> 0:25:24.400
<v Speaker 2>the real highlights. And at least for me, Like I'm

0:25:24.520 --> 0:25:28.879
<v Speaker 2>obviously been very politically aware and engaged since you know,

0:25:29.160 --> 0:25:34.040
<v Speaker 2>twenty eighteen or so, especially starting in twenty twenty, So

0:25:34.119 --> 0:25:36.880
<v Speaker 2>like knowing this film is set in twenty twenty and

0:25:37.000 --> 0:25:39.919
<v Speaker 2>knowing it kind of gets into what that year was.

0:25:40.000 --> 0:25:41.720
<v Speaker 5>Like, I actually was able.

0:25:41.560 --> 0:25:44.719
<v Speaker 2>To go into the film pretty pretty blind, and I

0:25:44.840 --> 0:25:48.360
<v Speaker 2>was able to start calling shots really fast as soon

0:25:48.400 --> 0:25:51.160
<v Speaker 2>as as soon as I realized like what Ari was doing.

0:25:51.960 --> 0:25:54.080
<v Speaker 2>So like, the film starts off as this like political

0:25:54.080 --> 0:25:58.359
<v Speaker 2>satire on like the absurdity of COVID lockdown America, and

0:25:58.400 --> 0:26:01.760
<v Speaker 2>then we get into this like crime thriller genre. Then

0:26:01.760 --> 0:26:04.560
<v Speaker 2>it concludes with this action genre, but at the very

0:26:04.560 --> 0:26:06.320
<v Speaker 2>start of the film, when it's just like this kind

0:26:06.320 --> 0:26:09.240
<v Speaker 2>of kind of quaint like like like parody of Lockdown America,

0:26:09.560 --> 0:26:12.800
<v Speaker 2>I was like, okay, so at like forty five minute mark,

0:26:12.840 --> 0:26:15.560
<v Speaker 2>we're gonna get George Floyd. Right at at one hour

0:26:15.600 --> 0:26:18.760
<v Speaker 2>in there's gonna be riots our you know, hour fifteen,

0:26:18.800 --> 0:26:22.440
<v Speaker 2>there's gonna be some like ANTIFA type situation. And I

0:26:22.800 --> 0:26:25.560
<v Speaker 2>called so many things. They just started happening like exactly

0:26:25.560 --> 0:26:27.800
<v Speaker 2>what I thought they were going to. So I was

0:26:27.840 --> 0:26:31.000
<v Speaker 2>not really surprised by anything in this film necessarily. I

0:26:31.119 --> 0:26:34.320
<v Speaker 2>saw everything it was doing like I saw it coming,

0:26:34.359 --> 0:26:37.560
<v Speaker 2>because I, you know, lived that for so much of

0:26:37.640 --> 0:26:40.520
<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty, especially like the twenty twenty protests in Portland,

0:26:41.000 --> 0:26:43.200
<v Speaker 2>but also my familiarity with it was also I was

0:26:43.200 --> 0:26:45.800
<v Speaker 2>also able to then like diagnose how the film was

0:26:45.920 --> 0:26:49.560
<v Speaker 2>subtly like diverting from reality and just showcasing what twenty

0:26:49.600 --> 0:26:51.719
<v Speaker 2>twenty felt like, and like what twenty twenty was the

0:26:51.760 --> 0:26:54.680
<v Speaker 2>minds of, like people who believed in conspiracy theories more

0:26:54.720 --> 0:26:56.639
<v Speaker 2>so than the actual reality of twenty twenty, which I

0:26:56.800 --> 0:26:59.800
<v Speaker 2>also discussed more with Jennie Danger later. But I think

0:27:00.400 --> 0:27:03.919
<v Speaker 2>like the genre switching and then setting up all of

0:27:03.960 --> 0:27:06.240
<v Speaker 2>these like twenty twenty hallmarks. I think the film does

0:27:06.280 --> 0:27:09.800
<v Speaker 2>really well doing like pretty solid foreshadowing and hitting all

0:27:09.800 --> 0:27:11.320
<v Speaker 2>the points you're going to have to hit if you're

0:27:11.320 --> 0:27:12.800
<v Speaker 2>gonna make a film about twenty twenty.

0:27:13.119 --> 0:27:13.479
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:27:13.640 --> 0:27:18.679
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, we have the Wayfarer pedophile closets.

0:27:18.400 --> 0:27:21.280
<v Speaker 5>Totally qan on cults, child trafficking.

0:27:21.400 --> 0:27:21.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:27:22.040 --> 0:27:25.440
<v Speaker 4>So I watched the movie Network like for four days

0:27:25.480 --> 0:27:26.320
<v Speaker 4>before I watched this.

0:27:26.800 --> 0:27:30.320
<v Speaker 2>Need I need to see Networks. Oh my god, Robert's

0:27:30.320 --> 0:27:31.720
<v Speaker 2>been trying to get me to watch it for years.

0:27:31.760 --> 0:27:33.480
<v Speaker 5>I just have never found the time. I guess I

0:27:33.480 --> 0:27:33.800
<v Speaker 5>don't know.

0:27:34.040 --> 0:27:36.800
<v Speaker 4>Ari Astro like explicitly brought up Network and said like

0:27:36.880 --> 0:27:39.439
<v Speaker 4>he was thinking about it while making this movie, but

0:27:39.480 --> 0:27:42.479
<v Speaker 4>that he wanted it to be more because the Network

0:27:42.600 --> 0:27:44.879
<v Speaker 4>is definitely more like it tells you what it means

0:27:44.920 --> 0:27:47.040
<v Speaker 4>sure kind of thing, and like what it thinks is

0:27:47.080 --> 0:27:48.280
<v Speaker 4>the right way to do things.

0:27:48.520 --> 0:27:51.719
<v Speaker 2>And this film purposely does not get into that too much.

0:27:51.920 --> 0:27:54.440
<v Speaker 2>It lets its own depiction tell you.

0:27:54.960 --> 0:27:55.320
<v Speaker 3>It doesn't.

0:27:55.359 --> 0:27:58.679
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't like stop you and explain whatever, like you know,

0:27:58.920 --> 0:28:01.840
<v Speaker 2>like what it's politics are. I think the movie does

0:28:01.880 --> 0:28:03.240
<v Speaker 2>the politics.

0:28:02.880 --> 0:28:07.280
<v Speaker 4>Yes, But I also I thought, in comparing it to network,

0:28:07.280 --> 0:28:09.479
<v Speaker 4>which I will try my heart is not to spoil

0:28:09.520 --> 0:28:14.199
<v Speaker 4>the network, but there there is definitely a theme in

0:28:14.240 --> 0:28:18.560
<v Speaker 4>this and in the network of like forces above this.

0:28:18.560 --> 0:28:23.480
<v Speaker 4>This movie is about political puppets about like non political actors,

0:28:23.560 --> 0:28:27.000
<v Speaker 4>right walkin Phoenix's character talks about how like he's not

0:28:27.119 --> 0:28:29.160
<v Speaker 4>for the government, he's for the people kind of thing,

0:28:29.200 --> 0:28:32.400
<v Speaker 4>so he's clearly doing like a populist thing. And then

0:28:32.720 --> 0:28:35.560
<v Speaker 4>by the end of the movie he's all the more

0:28:35.960 --> 0:28:39.200
<v Speaker 4>like he's literally a puppet, right Like he's he's like

0:28:39.520 --> 0:28:42.320
<v Speaker 4>just a sack of meat that is like it has

0:28:42.400 --> 0:28:45.760
<v Speaker 4>to watch his mom is not even his mom, mom

0:28:46.080 --> 0:28:47.920
<v Speaker 4>mother in law, mother in law, has.

0:28:48.680 --> 0:28:49.720
<v Speaker 3>Ex mother in law.

0:28:49.960 --> 0:28:54.600
<v Speaker 4>It's just incredible, one of the most horrifying concepts. But

0:28:55.080 --> 0:28:58.240
<v Speaker 4>this movie is about like, yeah, a bunch of stuff happens,

0:28:58.560 --> 0:29:00.840
<v Speaker 4>like stuff that's like they're trying to kind of throw

0:29:00.920 --> 0:29:01.720
<v Speaker 4>off the balance.

0:29:01.920 --> 0:29:05.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, people are trying to make political change while dealing

0:29:05.760 --> 0:29:10.200
<v Speaker 2>with this problem that politics is both very real, it's physical,

0:29:10.320 --> 0:29:13.600
<v Speaker 2>it determines almost everything about our lives, but it's also

0:29:14.200 --> 0:29:18.200
<v Speaker 2>very vague and nebulous and removed. So like, how do

0:29:18.240 --> 0:29:21.520
<v Speaker 2>you exert agency over something that is both real and

0:29:21.760 --> 0:29:24.800
<v Speaker 2>non real? To be a political actor, do you have

0:29:24.880 --> 0:29:29.280
<v Speaker 2>to literally be like an astroturfed paid actor. The people

0:29:29.320 --> 0:29:32.920
<v Speaker 2>that seemingly have the most political agency aren't even acting

0:29:32.960 --> 0:29:36.520
<v Speaker 2>on any personal agency but instead of just furthering the

0:29:36.560 --> 0:29:38.760
<v Speaker 2>interests of other entities.

0:29:39.080 --> 0:29:43.520
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, but the corporation's the big money people. Whoever's like

0:29:43.600 --> 0:29:47.480
<v Speaker 4>in the background, right the playing with the giant hand

0:29:47.600 --> 0:29:50.000
<v Speaker 4>holding the globe and the.

0:29:50.760 --> 0:29:52.520
<v Speaker 3>Antiva globe jet. Yeah.

0:29:52.600 --> 0:29:56.400
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, So Okay, here's a question because because when I

0:29:56.480 --> 0:30:01.280
<v Speaker 4>watched it, I thought that it was it's like paid actors, right,

0:30:01.440 --> 0:30:03.360
<v Speaker 4>Like they're paid like a paid clisson group.

0:30:03.600 --> 0:30:05.120
<v Speaker 3>That's what That's what I write it as.

0:30:05.320 --> 0:30:08.480
<v Speaker 2>I think it's left for audience interpretation whether whether or

0:30:08.480 --> 0:30:11.880
<v Speaker 2>not this is like the George Soros funded Antifa like

0:30:12.000 --> 0:30:15.360
<v Speaker 2>Specop's crew, who are genuine about their beliefs, or if

0:30:15.400 --> 0:30:17.800
<v Speaker 2>they're like a false flag crew who's just going around

0:30:18.120 --> 0:30:21.880
<v Speaker 2>so in chaos to promote like political discord, but not

0:30:21.920 --> 0:30:24.840
<v Speaker 2>for like ideological reasons, like just just through like false

0:30:24.840 --> 0:30:27.840
<v Speaker 2>flag attacks. I think it's intentionally left up to the audience,

0:30:28.240 --> 0:30:30.280
<v Speaker 2>and I think it's it's depicting that because of all

0:30:30.320 --> 0:30:33.560
<v Speaker 2>of like the Antifa conspiracy theories going around in twenty twenty,

0:30:34.080 --> 0:30:36.080
<v Speaker 2>and I view that as a it's like a manifestation

0:30:36.400 --> 0:30:40.640
<v Speaker 2>of how the right wing viewed this concept of Antifa,

0:30:40.680 --> 0:30:44.080
<v Speaker 2>even though Antifa is actually just teenagers wearing black hoodies. Yeah,

0:30:44.200 --> 0:30:46.040
<v Speaker 2>but they treated it as if it was this like

0:30:46.240 --> 0:30:48.360
<v Speaker 2>organized group going around.

0:30:48.480 --> 0:30:54.400
<v Speaker 4>Doing push ups on their private chat, smoking big cigars,

0:30:54.800 --> 0:30:58.680
<v Speaker 4>getting air dropped into into small towns to go exactly

0:30:58.800 --> 0:30:59.640
<v Speaker 4>blow things up.

0:30:59.800 --> 0:31:04.360
<v Speaker 3>Is exactly so funny of Antifa are coming in.

0:31:04.680 --> 0:31:08.800
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, And then that leads into what I think is

0:31:08.840 --> 0:31:12.000
<v Speaker 4>the best joke in the movie, the TikTok zoomer guy

0:31:12.600 --> 0:31:16.240
<v Speaker 4>shooting while holding his phone, and then like it cuts

0:31:16.360 --> 0:31:19.560
<v Speaker 4>immediately into like a now this uh like.

0:31:19.520 --> 0:31:24.440
<v Speaker 1>TikTok about the Antifa. It's like militia time is And

0:31:24.480 --> 0:31:25.200
<v Speaker 1>then he's like a.

0:31:25.240 --> 0:31:27.600
<v Speaker 4>Hype guy and he's got like a podcast where he's

0:31:27.600 --> 0:31:30.320
<v Speaker 4>talking about if Michelle Obama's going to run for president

0:31:30.560 --> 0:31:34.080
<v Speaker 4>or whatever, like so good, what did.

0:31:34.000 --> 0:31:34.760
<v Speaker 3>You what did you think of?

0:31:35.120 --> 0:31:40.160
<v Speaker 4>Kind of the the semi cliffhanger conclusion of some of

0:31:40.240 --> 0:31:44.400
<v Speaker 4>the threads, I guess because and I'm only thinking about

0:31:44.400 --> 0:31:47.320
<v Speaker 4>this as a cliffhanger because he's talked about it him

0:31:47.360 --> 0:31:49.400
<v Speaker 4>making a sequel if that makes sense.

0:31:50.160 --> 0:31:52.120
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, like a like like a loose sequel.

0:31:52.520 --> 0:31:55.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, with like some of the same characters.

0:31:55.440 --> 0:31:56.800
<v Speaker 3>I guess, I don't know.

0:31:56.800 --> 0:31:59.239
<v Speaker 2>I have felt pretty satisfied with how this wrapped up,

0:31:59.280 --> 0:32:02.960
<v Speaker 2>because I mean, twenty twenty did not have a real ending.

0:32:03.000 --> 0:32:05.040
<v Speaker 5>We are still living in the shadow of twenty and twenty.

0:32:05.080 --> 0:32:08.239
<v Speaker 2>There still is loose threads, like COVID still is a

0:32:08.280 --> 0:32:11.320
<v Speaker 2>thing that exists of We're still living with, like the

0:32:11.360 --> 0:32:14.480
<v Speaker 2>way political violence escalated and never fully went away with,

0:32:14.680 --> 0:32:19.280
<v Speaker 2>especially like January sixth, and how even the concept of

0:32:19.280 --> 0:32:22.920
<v Speaker 2>pedophilia still runs almost all of politics. Like this is

0:32:22.920 --> 0:32:25.280
<v Speaker 2>what politics is about, is like deciding who is and

0:32:25.400 --> 0:32:28.840
<v Speaker 2>isn't a pedophile. Yeah, like the whole conspiracy theory angle.

0:32:28.960 --> 0:32:30.680
<v Speaker 2>More people are conspiracy theorists now than I think they

0:32:30.680 --> 0:32:33.120
<v Speaker 2>were in twenty twenty, including like liberals. Oh yeah, no,

0:32:33.280 --> 0:32:37.320
<v Speaker 2>the whole like blue and on conspiracy theories, the alt

0:32:37.440 --> 0:32:42.080
<v Speaker 2>National Park, Blue Sky accounts, the Trump assassination was staged,

0:32:42.440 --> 0:32:44.680
<v Speaker 2>like all of that kind of stuff. Is like this

0:32:44.720 --> 0:32:47.720
<v Speaker 2>has just become all of what politics is.

0:32:47.960 --> 0:32:48.960
<v Speaker 1>It's what your mom does.

0:32:49.120 --> 0:32:52.200
<v Speaker 4>It's what like your mom or like your every one

0:32:52.240 --> 0:32:53.240
<v Speaker 4>of your parents.

0:32:52.920 --> 0:32:55.120
<v Speaker 2>Does and not just your right wing mom now like

0:32:55.160 --> 0:32:57.720
<v Speaker 2>this is like everybody's mom. Yeah, And I think that's

0:32:57.760 --> 0:33:00.760
<v Speaker 2>the sort of American decline that are Yeah is depicting.

0:33:00.840 --> 0:33:02.880
<v Speaker 2>As opposed to the type that James Gunn is depicting.

0:33:03.000 --> 0:33:04.640
<v Speaker 1>I think it's much more accurate.

0:33:04.280 --> 0:33:06.160
<v Speaker 5>I agree, and it's much more holistic.

0:33:06.440 --> 0:33:07.760
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I don't think you could.

0:33:07.880 --> 0:33:10.760
<v Speaker 4>I obviously, I don't think you could kind of really

0:33:10.840 --> 0:33:16.200
<v Speaker 4>hold the schizophrenia that the post twenty twenty post lockdown

0:33:16.600 --> 0:33:20.320
<v Speaker 4>political schizophrenia that we exist and currently I agree, where

0:33:20.360 --> 0:33:23.640
<v Speaker 4>like everything is ungrounded. You know, you can't do a

0:33:23.720 --> 0:33:26.000
<v Speaker 4>superhero story like that. I don't think there's like no

0:33:26.080 --> 0:33:26.760
<v Speaker 4>way to do that.

0:33:27.000 --> 0:33:31.400
<v Speaker 2>No, unless you use my favorite superhero, the Question Yes,

0:33:31.920 --> 0:33:34.680
<v Speaker 2>in which you could do that, and James Gutt if

0:33:34.680 --> 0:33:36.920
<v Speaker 2>you're listening, I will write to a Question film and

0:33:36.960 --> 0:33:41.960
<v Speaker 2>it will be crazy. But like in terms of like

0:33:41.960 --> 0:33:44.960
<v Speaker 2>like filmmaking, I think I think post woke as like

0:33:44.960 --> 0:33:47.000
<v Speaker 2>a filmmaking style, and like what our aster is doing

0:33:47.000 --> 0:33:50.120
<v Speaker 2>here is a reaction to the past, like ten years

0:33:50.160 --> 0:33:55.720
<v Speaker 2>of liberal self aggrandizing movies as content slop right, which

0:33:55.760 --> 0:33:59.280
<v Speaker 2>tries to get points for like diversity casting without having

0:33:59.280 --> 0:34:02.760
<v Speaker 2>any actual substance of politics or will like gesture to

0:34:02.800 --> 0:34:05.640
<v Speaker 2>things relating to class, even though it's made by these big,

0:34:05.680 --> 0:34:08.400
<v Speaker 2>you know, multi billion dollar corporations. And I think that

0:34:08.440 --> 0:34:12.640
<v Speaker 2>whole era produced this sort of schizophrenia because everything feels

0:34:12.680 --> 0:34:16.520
<v Speaker 2>so paradoxical and self contradictory. And I think part of

0:34:16.560 --> 0:34:19.360
<v Speaker 2>the feelings that evokes is what Eddington is trying to

0:34:19.400 --> 0:34:23.440
<v Speaker 2>pull on and depicting those feelings as a subject itself,

0:34:23.480 --> 0:34:25.879
<v Speaker 2>not just as like a background thing that we try

0:34:25.880 --> 0:34:29.000
<v Speaker 2>to either like acknowledge sort of or try to like

0:34:29.080 --> 0:34:32.440
<v Speaker 2>not acknowledge and like ignore. I think viewing that that

0:34:32.520 --> 0:34:36.040
<v Speaker 2>cultural schizophrenia as a subject, if anything, that's like the

0:34:36.080 --> 0:34:39.399
<v Speaker 2>main character of Eddington. And I think that's the part

0:34:39.480 --> 0:34:41.040
<v Speaker 2>that that worked the most for me.

0:34:41.360 --> 0:34:44.440
<v Speaker 4>I I yeah, I think it structure wise, A lot

0:34:44.440 --> 0:34:46.959
<v Speaker 4>of people were talking about like it feels like too.

0:34:46.920 --> 0:34:48.040
<v Speaker 3>Scattered of a movie.

0:34:48.120 --> 0:34:49.640
<v Speaker 4>I think I saw that a lot, and like the

0:34:49.680 --> 0:34:53.080
<v Speaker 4>critiques of it, and I think, like, sure, if we're

0:34:53.120 --> 0:34:56.920
<v Speaker 4>talking about like just you know, does it become a

0:34:56.960 --> 0:34:59.719
<v Speaker 4>little confusing to follow. Maybe, but it's like that's the

0:34:59.719 --> 0:35:02.520
<v Speaker 4>point and not to say like that's the point, so

0:35:02.560 --> 0:35:04.480
<v Speaker 4>it washes that away. But like I don't think you

0:35:04.480 --> 0:35:07.440
<v Speaker 4>can I don't think you can make a movie accurately.

0:35:07.680 --> 0:35:09.880
<v Speaker 2>You can't make a movie about that era without it

0:35:09.960 --> 0:35:11.040
<v Speaker 2>feeling scattered like that.

0:35:11.280 --> 0:35:14.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's why I really respect our astor. I think

0:35:15.440 --> 0:35:17.400
<v Speaker 1>I was talking to my partner.

0:35:17.200 --> 0:35:20.880
<v Speaker 4>Yesterday about who's the guy that made like Nosferatu and

0:35:20.920 --> 0:35:21.600
<v Speaker 4>all those movies.

0:35:22.400 --> 0:35:23.160
<v Speaker 1>Robert Eggers.

0:35:23.280 --> 0:35:27.640
<v Speaker 4>Robert Eggers very good filmmaker, but he's explicitly talked about

0:35:27.800 --> 0:35:28.920
<v Speaker 4>how he doesn't ever.

0:35:28.800 --> 0:35:30.480
<v Speaker 5>Want want to do modern films.

0:35:30.520 --> 0:35:33.719
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, a modern film, I guess. I haven't seen The Shrouds,

0:35:34.000 --> 0:35:35.560
<v Speaker 4>but I've heard very good things about it.

0:35:35.640 --> 0:35:36.600
<v Speaker 3>Me neither me neither.

0:35:36.960 --> 0:35:37.959
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I want to see that.

0:35:37.880 --> 0:35:40.200
<v Speaker 4>Movie because I think Cronenberg is another one who's like

0:35:40.239 --> 0:35:41.239
<v Speaker 4>I also want.

0:35:41.440 --> 0:35:43.320
<v Speaker 1>I watched a great lineup for this movie.

0:35:43.320 --> 0:35:48.200
<v Speaker 4>I watched Cronenberg's What's the Video Drome recently?

0:35:48.360 --> 0:35:48.680
<v Speaker 3>That's good.

0:35:49.320 --> 0:35:53.320
<v Speaker 2>I can definitely see Eddington kind of being a grandchild

0:35:53.360 --> 0:35:54.960
<v Speaker 2>of video drone in some ways.

0:35:55.080 --> 0:35:58.160
<v Speaker 4>I would also recommend. I've also I've been reading Mark

0:35:58.200 --> 0:36:00.000
<v Speaker 4>Fischer's Flatline Constructs.

0:36:00.320 --> 0:36:01.640
<v Speaker 5>This is a very Fisher movie.

0:36:01.840 --> 0:36:02.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, very Fisher.

0:36:03.360 --> 0:36:03.560
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:36:03.560 --> 0:36:07.680
<v Speaker 4>I literally I listened to the stupid Russell Brand audiobook

0:36:07.840 --> 0:36:10.319
<v Speaker 4>of Capitalist Real No.

0:36:11.120 --> 0:36:12.160
<v Speaker 3>Oh, that sucks.

0:36:12.280 --> 0:36:15.600
<v Speaker 4>I know, Russell Brand sucks, but I was at work

0:36:15.640 --> 0:36:17.719
<v Speaker 4>and I just needed something to listen to, so I

0:36:17.719 --> 0:36:20.080
<v Speaker 4>didn't like blow my head off and it didn't end

0:36:20.160 --> 0:36:22.920
<v Speaker 4>up working out actually because I was working my shitty

0:36:23.000 --> 0:36:24.040
<v Speaker 4>job and listening to.

0:36:24.719 --> 0:36:29.920
<v Speaker 2>Capitalists Brandy Russell Brand, Russell Brands capitalist realism.

0:36:30.120 --> 0:36:31.760
<v Speaker 3>Oh god, what a bummer.

0:36:32.040 --> 0:36:36.320
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, truly, Mark Fisher is only l Yeah.

0:36:35.640 --> 0:36:38.000
<v Speaker 4>It is unbearable to have to listen to his voice.

0:36:38.000 --> 0:36:40.680
<v Speaker 4>But it's a great book. I would definitely recommend reading

0:36:40.680 --> 0:36:44.040
<v Speaker 4>that if you want to go into Eddington even more

0:36:44.120 --> 0:36:47.600
<v Speaker 4>like locked In, I guess, but this is a very

0:36:47.640 --> 0:36:51.360
<v Speaker 4>like yeah, like uh you know, capital can convert anything

0:36:51.600 --> 0:36:56.080
<v Speaker 4>into the image of something else. There was one shot

0:36:56.120 --> 0:36:58.839
<v Speaker 4>that I really I found very evocative, which was the

0:36:59.360 --> 0:37:04.000
<v Speaker 4>shot of him walking Phoenix's characters having his haircut by

0:37:04.160 --> 0:37:09.759
<v Speaker 4>his whatever stepmom ex stepmom, and she's talking about like

0:37:09.800 --> 0:37:13.560
<v Speaker 4>conspiracy theory while filming it. That's good for TikTok, And

0:37:13.600 --> 0:37:17.480
<v Speaker 4>it's like this is so perfect and so morbid and.

0:37:17.400 --> 0:37:21.440
<v Speaker 2>Like, yeah, no, there's a little bit of like Butdriard's

0:37:21.600 --> 0:37:25.320
<v Speaker 2>book on America here, there's certainly a lot of Gedaboard

0:37:25.320 --> 0:37:27.120
<v Speaker 2>in this, and I think that also was part of

0:37:27.120 --> 0:37:30.239
<v Speaker 2>what relates it to me to Superman is how much

0:37:30.680 --> 0:37:35.480
<v Speaker 2>like Superman is accidentally doing gedaboard regarding the genocide and Palestine,

0:37:35.920 --> 0:37:38.560
<v Speaker 2>and how much I think that critique is actually built

0:37:38.640 --> 0:37:39.480
<v Speaker 2>into Eddington.

0:37:40.840 --> 0:37:41.000
<v Speaker 1>No.

0:37:41.160 --> 0:37:46.840
<v Speaker 4>Absolutely, yeah, I Superman is such an an interesting movie

0:37:46.880 --> 0:37:49.319
<v Speaker 4>to take on that subject because obviously, in a way

0:37:49.360 --> 0:37:51.840
<v Speaker 4>you're kind of like, well, good for James Gunn for

0:37:51.960 --> 0:37:53.640
<v Speaker 4>doing something daring.

0:37:53.800 --> 0:37:55.880
<v Speaker 1>I guess daring, I say with air quotes.

0:37:56.040 --> 0:37:59.680
<v Speaker 4>But it's also like you have the Israel Palestine stuff

0:38:00.360 --> 0:38:03.320
<v Speaker 4>right after a scene where Superman saves a green baby

0:38:03.840 --> 0:38:07.480
<v Speaker 4>from a river of like cosmic sludge.

0:38:07.280 --> 0:38:09.080
<v Speaker 3>Of like CGI squares.

0:38:09.160 --> 0:38:12.719
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, which, by the way, I'm sure I don't know

0:38:12.760 --> 0:38:15.120
<v Speaker 4>if this is the general consensus, but I thought that

0:38:15.120 --> 0:38:16.800
<v Speaker 4>that scene was ugliest sin.

0:38:16.760 --> 0:38:17.879
<v Speaker 1>And I kind of hated it.

0:38:18.520 --> 0:38:21.920
<v Speaker 2>Also, I hated the whole Pocket dimension. Yeah, aspect I

0:38:21.960 --> 0:38:23.759
<v Speaker 2>don't I don't know why they didn't do a quick,

0:38:23.840 --> 0:38:26.840
<v Speaker 2>like ten minute interlude into the Phantom Zone keep it that.

0:38:27.480 --> 0:38:30.600
<v Speaker 2>But no, I think that that whole Pocket Dimension like

0:38:30.680 --> 0:38:33.279
<v Speaker 2>forty minutes like derailed and stagnated a lot of the

0:38:33.280 --> 0:38:35.879
<v Speaker 2>film for me and did not look very good.

0:38:36.280 --> 0:38:39.239
<v Speaker 4>He's doing like Lex Luthor's Peter Teal, Lex Luthor is

0:38:39.239 --> 0:38:43.319
<v Speaker 4>Elon Musk Lex Luthor's which could work. Yeah, yeah, which

0:38:43.360 --> 0:38:45.319
<v Speaker 4>I think. I think I found it funny at least

0:38:45.320 --> 0:38:47.960
<v Speaker 4>I've said, like totally. I watched it and I thought like, oh,

0:38:48.000 --> 0:38:50.799
<v Speaker 4>I know what he's doing. You know that he's Peter Teal,

0:38:50.880 --> 0:38:52.160
<v Speaker 4>shut down Gawker.

0:38:51.880 --> 0:38:53.720
<v Speaker 5>Or whatever, crying men baby.

0:38:54.000 --> 0:38:54.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:38:54.440 --> 0:38:57.680
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, so it's like I get it, but I also,

0:38:58.200 --> 0:39:00.239
<v Speaker 4>I mean, it's been done before kind of thing, like

0:39:00.280 --> 0:39:03.359
<v Speaker 4>I don't find it, you know that I don't know,

0:39:03.440 --> 0:39:06.120
<v Speaker 4>but he hey, his performance is great. But then the

0:39:06.160 --> 0:39:08.799
<v Speaker 4>whole Palestine stuff is also capped off with a scene

0:39:08.800 --> 0:39:11.799
<v Speaker 4>where Lex Luthor gets like bullied by a dog. You know,

0:39:12.360 --> 0:39:14.920
<v Speaker 4>it's sandwiched between two things that are just like I

0:39:15.000 --> 0:39:17.440
<v Speaker 4>don't know if you can do this or if you

0:39:17.440 --> 0:39:18.960
<v Speaker 4>should do this, Like I don't know.

0:39:20.640 --> 0:39:22.360
<v Speaker 2>No, it is I think it's it's part of that

0:39:22.920 --> 0:39:26.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of cultural schizophrenia that I think that Eddington is

0:39:26.400 --> 0:39:30.279
<v Speaker 2>pulling on. Yeah, is moments like that in the David

0:39:30.360 --> 0:39:34.800
<v Speaker 2>Zaslov Winner Brothers Discovery Superman twenty twenty five.

0:39:36.280 --> 0:39:39.000
<v Speaker 4>Eddington just is you know, it's a film that is

0:39:39.000 --> 0:39:42.319
<v Speaker 4>like its entire thesis is that is the is the

0:39:42.480 --> 0:39:46.520
<v Speaker 4>jumping around, the just ret like his car is covered

0:39:46.560 --> 0:39:48.440
<v Speaker 4>in shit for the entire movie.

0:39:48.480 --> 0:39:50.320
<v Speaker 1>I love it so funny.

0:39:50.560 --> 0:39:53.439
<v Speaker 4>All the slogans are like kind of like they're all

0:39:53.600 --> 0:39:56.000
<v Speaker 4>trying to put in their own little thing, you know,

0:39:56.160 --> 0:39:57.800
<v Speaker 4>Like he's like, can we make it about bitcoin?

0:39:58.360 --> 0:39:59.480
<v Speaker 1>Can we make it about.

0:39:59.280 --> 0:40:02.880
<v Speaker 2>It's like a twenty twenty conservative Facebook feed brought to life.

0:40:02.960 --> 0:40:06.520
<v Speaker 4>Yes, Yes, it's a great movie. I love Eddington. I

0:40:06.560 --> 0:40:08.720
<v Speaker 4>think that this movie will age very well.

0:40:09.239 --> 0:40:13.120
<v Speaker 5>Well, what would you like to plug daily new Poster?

0:40:13.800 --> 0:40:15.719
<v Speaker 1>I think you should follow me.

0:40:16.160 --> 0:40:19.400
<v Speaker 4>If you have an X, you should follow me on

0:40:20.000 --> 0:40:21.239
<v Speaker 4>at what is it called?

0:40:21.840 --> 0:40:22.959
<v Speaker 1>At New Poster two?

0:40:23.200 --> 0:40:26.880
<v Speaker 4>On X. If you're on Instagram, you should follow me

0:40:26.920 --> 0:40:30.480
<v Speaker 4>at postalytical blame, which is a terrible username, but I

0:40:30.560 --> 0:40:33.560
<v Speaker 4>made it's my writing username, like ages ago, I think.

0:40:34.239 --> 0:40:37.360
<v Speaker 4>And then on Blue Sky if you use that, you

0:40:37.400 --> 0:40:39.919
<v Speaker 4>should follow me at what even is micha blue Sky?

0:40:39.960 --> 0:40:41.560
<v Speaker 1>I don't even use I'm gonna be honest, I don't

0:40:41.640 --> 0:40:42.239
<v Speaker 1>use Blue Sky.

0:40:42.360 --> 0:40:44.680
<v Speaker 2>But if you if we got to fix the vibes

0:40:44.719 --> 0:40:46.480
<v Speaker 2>on there, Bailey, we got it, we got we got

0:40:46.800 --> 0:40:49.799
<v Speaker 2>we got to get more like crazy crazy unhinged art

0:40:49.840 --> 0:40:50.399
<v Speaker 2>on Blue Sky.

0:40:50.600 --> 0:40:55.080
<v Speaker 4>Right, it's it's new poster dot, blue sky, dot social

0:40:55.160 --> 0:40:55.560
<v Speaker 4>or whatever.

0:40:56.000 --> 0:40:58.160
<v Speaker 3>So there you go if you need that.

0:40:58.520 --> 0:41:00.719
<v Speaker 1>There, there's the there's the plugs.

0:41:00.880 --> 0:41:02.760
<v Speaker 5>Well, thank you for coming on to talk about Eddington

0:41:02.960 --> 0:41:03.640
<v Speaker 5>and Superman.

0:41:03.880 --> 0:41:06.680
<v Speaker 4>Thank you so much for inviting me. This has been wonderful.

0:41:06.800 --> 0:41:09.600
<v Speaker 4>I love Eddington. I enjoyed Superman. So this is a

0:41:10.360 --> 0:41:11.040
<v Speaker 4>good talk.

0:41:11.560 --> 0:41:13.080
<v Speaker 5>There you go, Lovely Lovely.

0:41:23.719 --> 0:41:27.719
<v Speaker 2>For the last segment of our post Woke Cinema episode,

0:41:28.000 --> 0:41:31.040
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna play a conversation I had with Atlanta musician

0:41:31.480 --> 0:41:35.080
<v Speaker 2>Jane Danger, who we talk about her thoughts on the

0:41:35.120 --> 0:41:40.760
<v Speaker 2>film Eddington and the way it manifests twenty twenties hyperreality.

0:41:42.040 --> 0:41:45.160
<v Speaker 3>Just a little background, I guess, like I really like

0:41:45.280 --> 0:41:48.120
<v Speaker 3>ari Asta. I remember talking with you about Bo's Afraid

0:41:48.160 --> 0:41:51.279
<v Speaker 3>a while ago. I remember you weren't a huge fan

0:41:51.360 --> 0:41:52.640
<v Speaker 3>of it, not so hot.

0:41:52.680 --> 0:41:54.280
<v Speaker 5>I'm Bo's Afraid. I'm Afraid.

0:41:54.520 --> 0:41:57.520
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to like it too, because whenever people talk

0:41:57.560 --> 0:42:00.600
<v Speaker 2>about this like like like off putting long slows in

0:42:00.680 --> 0:42:04.399
<v Speaker 2>him up about like anxiety, like I want to like that.

0:42:04.520 --> 0:42:07.520
<v Speaker 2>Like Inland Empayer is one of the best films ever,

0:42:07.600 --> 0:42:09.960
<v Speaker 2>there's other other other films that do is that that

0:42:09.960 --> 0:42:13.320
<v Speaker 2>that also tackle its not just like David Lynch. Yeah,

0:42:13.360 --> 0:42:16.239
<v Speaker 2>and like the rest of Ariaster, I was always like

0:42:16.480 --> 0:42:19.400
<v Speaker 2>lukewarm to kind of positive on Like, I don't hate

0:42:19.520 --> 0:42:22.200
<v Speaker 2>him as a filmmaker. I don't have that as part

0:42:22.239 --> 0:42:25.400
<v Speaker 2>of my personality the way some people do. Yeah, I

0:42:25.440 --> 0:42:27.399
<v Speaker 2>think his movies are just fine. I think he does

0:42:27.520 --> 0:42:30.000
<v Speaker 2>dabble in or I guess he like overlies on a

0:42:30.040 --> 0:42:31.560
<v Speaker 2>degree of shalk value, which you could even see in

0:42:31.560 --> 0:42:33.799
<v Speaker 2>his earlier like Student films. Yeah, I think are like

0:42:34.200 --> 0:42:37.920
<v Speaker 2>very juvenile and not interesting. I think Hereditary is fine.

0:42:38.440 --> 0:42:40.799
<v Speaker 2>So ari Aster has always like been there, but I've

0:42:40.800 --> 0:42:42.720
<v Speaker 2>never been like a Ariaster in bio.

0:42:43.120 --> 0:42:45.480
<v Speaker 3>I think he's kind of cool to hate now, Like

0:42:45.560 --> 0:42:46.279
<v Speaker 3>I think with.

0:42:46.719 --> 0:42:49.120
<v Speaker 2>He's very cool to hate now people people people really

0:42:49.120 --> 0:42:51.160
<v Speaker 2>like hating him. But Eddington I think has done him

0:42:51.200 --> 0:42:53.399
<v Speaker 2>a lot of favors though among the people who used

0:42:53.400 --> 0:42:53.919
<v Speaker 2>to hate him.

0:42:54.000 --> 0:42:57.160
<v Speaker 3>I've kind of noticed that it seems like with Hereditary

0:42:57.160 --> 0:43:00.799
<v Speaker 3>in Midsommer, those were generally like very well received by

0:43:00.880 --> 0:43:03.600
<v Speaker 3>like the a twenty four crowd yea, and it was

0:43:03.680 --> 0:43:05.840
<v Speaker 3>kind of like, I guess the cool opinion would be

0:43:05.920 --> 0:43:08.359
<v Speaker 3>to be like those movies are mid and then like

0:43:08.680 --> 0:43:12.040
<v Speaker 3>Bo was Afraid is a masterpiece or whatever. I like

0:43:12.400 --> 0:43:15.400
<v Speaker 3>his horror movies. I think they're slick, well made films

0:43:15.480 --> 0:43:19.560
<v Speaker 3>with good stories. I love bo Was Afraid though, I

0:43:19.600 --> 0:43:22.239
<v Speaker 3>think it's incredible, but it is not the kind of

0:43:22.400 --> 0:43:24.120
<v Speaker 3>it's the kind of movie that like, as much as

0:43:24.120 --> 0:43:25.840
<v Speaker 3>I love it, as much as it means to me,

0:43:26.360 --> 0:43:29.480
<v Speaker 3>as seen as I feel by that film, it's not

0:43:29.560 --> 0:43:31.920
<v Speaker 3>the kind of thing that, like, if you don't like it,

0:43:32.239 --> 0:43:35.359
<v Speaker 3>I'm not gonna like convince you. You know, Like there's

0:43:35.360 --> 0:43:37.600
<v Speaker 3>probably like if you told me you didn't like Maholland Drive,

0:43:37.719 --> 0:43:40.759
<v Speaker 3>like I'd be like, you're fucking stupid and wrong, You're dumb.

0:43:40.960 --> 0:43:42.560
<v Speaker 3>If you tell me you don't like Bo Was Afraid,

0:43:42.640 --> 0:43:45.839
<v Speaker 3>it's like fair enough. It's it's sure certainly the kind

0:43:45.840 --> 0:43:48.680
<v Speaker 3>of thing that's not for everyone. I bring it up

0:43:48.880 --> 0:43:53.560
<v Speaker 3>mostly because I think with Bo and Eddington, it's a

0:43:53.640 --> 0:43:57.520
<v Speaker 3>very interesting thing he does that is kind of I

0:43:57.560 --> 0:44:01.000
<v Speaker 3>guess I compared to maybe like a French new wave directors,

0:44:01.040 --> 0:44:04.520
<v Speaker 3>maybe like something like Selene and Julie go Boding, where

0:44:05.360 --> 0:44:12.360
<v Speaker 3>the like protagonists are living in like a fake insane reality,

0:44:12.920 --> 0:44:17.160
<v Speaker 3>where in other directors, like most other films, like you'd

0:44:17.239 --> 0:44:21.719
<v Speaker 3>have someone who's like going insane and hallucinating and like

0:44:22.000 --> 0:44:25.080
<v Speaker 3>everyone's trying to kill them, et cetera. And then maybe

0:44:25.120 --> 0:44:26.480
<v Speaker 3>there would be like a cut.

0:44:26.239 --> 0:44:28.000
<v Speaker 5>Which is kind of what happens to Bow Is Afraid.

0:44:28.120 --> 0:44:30.799
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, but in other movies there would maybe be like

0:44:30.840 --> 0:44:33.920
<v Speaker 3>a cut away for someone else where they see like

0:44:34.000 --> 0:44:36.719
<v Speaker 3>the character like arguing to a shadow like the quote

0:44:36.760 --> 0:44:40.120
<v Speaker 3>unquote real perspective. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And I think

0:44:40.200 --> 0:44:44.040
<v Speaker 3>that bo Is Afraid it's like, it's no, this is real.

0:44:44.719 --> 0:44:48.160
<v Speaker 3>And I think Eddington does a very similar thing where

0:44:48.800 --> 0:44:54.520
<v Speaker 3>the beliefs of the characters are real. And that's why, like,

0:44:54.920 --> 0:44:57.279
<v Speaker 3>you know, all the conservatives, like I mean, if you

0:44:57.280 --> 0:45:00.080
<v Speaker 3>remember twenty twenty, they're like there's Antipho super soldiers that

0:45:00.120 --> 0:45:02.960
<v Speaker 3>are going out and doing terrorism. It's like so in

0:45:03.000 --> 0:45:06.040
<v Speaker 3>this world, in the Eddington universe, it's like what if

0:45:06.040 --> 0:45:09.240
<v Speaker 3>that was real? Like what if Fox News was actually

0:45:09.520 --> 0:45:12.400
<v Speaker 3>in motion here? And I think that's very interesting.

0:45:13.080 --> 0:45:14.600
<v Speaker 2>The approach that he does in Eddington, I think is

0:45:14.600 --> 0:45:15.960
<v Speaker 2>a little bit more subtle than the way there's in

0:45:16.000 --> 0:45:19.319
<v Speaker 2>Bo's Afraid, because you start the film way way more

0:45:19.360 --> 0:45:21.960
<v Speaker 2>as like as like you know, a political satire on

0:45:21.960 --> 0:45:26.759
<v Speaker 2>the absurdity of like pandemic era America, and then the

0:45:26.760 --> 0:45:31.920
<v Speaker 2>reality starts diverting from what we can agree as like

0:45:32.000 --> 0:45:35.080
<v Speaker 2>as like a shared consensus reality, and then it diverts

0:45:35.080 --> 0:45:37.400
<v Speaker 2>from that the same way reality diverted away from that

0:45:37.440 --> 0:45:40.120
<v Speaker 2>in twenty twenty for people, and we created this like yeah,

0:45:40.280 --> 0:45:42.280
<v Speaker 2>massive like reality fracture point.

0:45:42.600 --> 0:45:42.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:45:43.120 --> 0:45:45.799
<v Speaker 2>Like the first time I noticed this in the filmmaking

0:45:46.000 --> 0:45:49.000
<v Speaker 2>was there was like a news clip about like a

0:45:49.120 --> 0:45:51.719
<v Speaker 2>Portland riot in twenty twenty, and it had people like

0:45:51.760 --> 0:45:56.000
<v Speaker 2>exchanging gunfire on rooftops and it was played next to

0:45:56.239 --> 0:45:58.560
<v Speaker 2>actual news clips of like the Third Precinct burning down,

0:45:58.560 --> 0:46:00.480
<v Speaker 2>Like it was played off as like a real, legitimate

0:46:00.520 --> 0:46:02.719
<v Speaker 2>news clip. Yeah, and like I was, I lived in

0:46:02.719 --> 0:46:04.719
<v Speaker 2>Important in twenty twenty. I know that's not real, but

0:46:04.800 --> 0:46:07.280
<v Speaker 2>to many people viewing, they might not catch that. Yeah,

0:46:07.560 --> 0:46:09.600
<v Speaker 2>that might just be like that might just go into

0:46:09.640 --> 0:46:12.240
<v Speaker 2>the background. So at that point I realized that actually

0:46:12.320 --> 0:46:14.799
<v Speaker 2>the way that reality is getting diverted into film is

0:46:14.840 --> 0:46:16.800
<v Speaker 2>way more subtle. And then of course you get like

0:46:16.840 --> 0:46:19.720
<v Speaker 2>the Antifa super soldier private jet later and it's more obvious,

0:46:19.840 --> 0:46:24.080
<v Speaker 2>like what he's doing, But even like small things like that,

0:46:24.120 --> 0:46:26.359
<v Speaker 2>I started to really appreciate you, Like, no, you're like

0:46:26.480 --> 0:46:29.200
<v Speaker 2>getting into the mind of people who believe these things,

0:46:29.719 --> 0:46:32.400
<v Speaker 2>and that's what we're that's what's being depicted, Like the

0:46:32.440 --> 0:46:35.160
<v Speaker 2>feelings of twenty twenty are more important than the reality

0:46:35.160 --> 0:46:39.080
<v Speaker 2>of twenty twenty, and that is what he's trying to show.

0:46:39.800 --> 0:46:42.400
<v Speaker 3>That's even kind of like a meta in a sense,

0:46:42.480 --> 0:46:45.680
<v Speaker 3>because it's like if you watch that scene of like

0:46:45.760 --> 0:46:49.759
<v Speaker 3>the footage of the Portland like shooting and stuff, and

0:46:49.880 --> 0:46:52.800
<v Speaker 3>you as the audience are like questioning if that was real,

0:46:53.320 --> 0:46:58.480
<v Speaker 3>then it's like your consensus reality is also diverging from

0:46:58.640 --> 0:47:01.440
<v Speaker 3>the regular consensus reality. It's like it kind of makes

0:47:01.480 --> 0:47:05.440
<v Speaker 3>you a cipher for the characters, which which also leads

0:47:05.440 --> 0:47:08.960
<v Speaker 3>me to something something else, So something I don't see

0:47:09.000 --> 0:47:12.760
<v Speaker 3>a lot of people talking about. But the vagrant character

0:47:13.000 --> 0:47:16.560
<v Speaker 3>that starts the film where he comes in and he's

0:47:16.640 --> 0:47:20.279
<v Speaker 3>just like mumbling like messages, and if you've ever been

0:47:20.320 --> 0:47:22.920
<v Speaker 3>around like a you know, like a homeless person on

0:47:22.960 --> 0:47:28.160
<v Speaker 3>a bus or something, they like to mumble. And it's

0:47:28.640 --> 0:47:32.800
<v Speaker 3>I read that as someone who's like just essentially doing

0:47:32.920 --> 0:47:36.920
<v Speaker 3>what everyone else in this movie eventually comes to do

0:47:37.200 --> 0:47:40.440
<v Speaker 3>totally yes, which is just taking all of your like

0:47:40.600 --> 0:47:45.960
<v Speaker 3>internalized like messages, traumas like things you've heard, things you believe,

0:47:46.320 --> 0:47:49.520
<v Speaker 3>and just like grumbling it, spitting it out and to

0:47:49.680 --> 0:47:54.400
<v Speaker 3>anyone who talks to you, just incessantly, just like messages, messages, messages.

0:47:54.840 --> 0:47:57.960
<v Speaker 2>The similarity of that character to like the mom character

0:47:58.400 --> 0:48:00.520
<v Speaker 2>who does the same thing but is seen in a

0:48:00.600 --> 0:48:01.440
<v Speaker 2>very different way.

0:48:01.680 --> 0:48:03.120
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, because a house she.

0:48:03.080 --> 0:48:05.080
<v Speaker 5>Has like a home to live in and has like family.

0:48:05.280 --> 0:48:05.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:48:05.640 --> 0:48:09.360
<v Speaker 3>Absolutely, And there's no there's no place for a person

0:48:09.640 --> 0:48:12.040
<v Speaker 3>like the vagrant in this world, but there is a

0:48:12.080 --> 0:48:15.719
<v Speaker 3>place for all these other types of insane people, and

0:48:15.920 --> 0:48:20.400
<v Speaker 3>they're all able to find their little little niches and such,

0:48:20.800 --> 0:48:24.080
<v Speaker 3>when maybe in a world before that, in a world

0:48:24.120 --> 0:48:29.920
<v Speaker 3>before it was so easy to find such niches, maybe

0:48:29.960 --> 0:48:32.920
<v Speaker 3>like you would, I don't know, go to therapy, maybe

0:48:32.960 --> 0:48:36.960
<v Speaker 3>like maybe your family would would be concerned. It is

0:48:37.080 --> 0:48:41.080
<v Speaker 3>very interesting because people very are are very prone now

0:48:41.120 --> 0:48:44.279
<v Speaker 3>and it's like that's because they're able to like get

0:48:44.320 --> 0:48:47.160
<v Speaker 3>pulled into these cults. They find their own kind of

0:48:47.200 --> 0:48:51.480
<v Speaker 3>Austin Butler figure who's able to talk to them directly

0:48:51.600 --> 0:48:54.919
<v Speaker 3>and be like, no, come with me, You're okay. And

0:48:56.040 --> 0:48:58.240
<v Speaker 3>just to go back to the point of like messages

0:48:58.280 --> 0:49:02.240
<v Speaker 3>and stuff. I think that the uh, the Joaquin Phoenix character.

0:49:02.840 --> 0:49:05.040
<v Speaker 3>I think he starts out as a very like uh

0:49:05.160 --> 0:49:08.080
<v Speaker 3>like Hank Hill, like very I mean, he doesn't he

0:49:08.080 --> 0:49:09.960
<v Speaker 3>doesn't want to wear a mask. He's obviously leans a

0:49:09.960 --> 0:49:11.840
<v Speaker 3>bit conservative, but.

0:49:11.560 --> 0:49:13.239
<v Speaker 2>But he's like trying to kind of be like a

0:49:13.239 --> 0:49:15.279
<v Speaker 2>reasonable guy, right, And I.

0:49:15.960 --> 0:49:18.799
<v Speaker 3>See him as someone who's trying to like avoid the

0:49:18.920 --> 0:49:22.440
<v Speaker 3>messaging from everyone. Like even when people tell him about

0:49:22.480 --> 0:49:25.640
<v Speaker 3>like certain news stories and stuff, he's like, I don't know,

0:49:25.880 --> 0:49:30.440
<v Speaker 3>like he just doesn't know. And Yeah, in the process

0:49:30.520 --> 0:49:33.160
<v Speaker 3>of him like avoiding all these messages, what does he do.

0:49:33.320 --> 0:49:37.400
<v Speaker 3>He buys a truck and covers it in fucking messages.

0:49:37.600 --> 0:49:40.760
<v Speaker 2>In messages he starts broadcasting his reality to everyone around

0:49:40.840 --> 0:49:41.680
<v Speaker 2>him exactly.

0:49:41.880 --> 0:49:44.560
<v Speaker 3>It's like, uh, I don't know. I think that Normally,

0:49:44.800 --> 0:49:47.000
<v Speaker 3>normally I would call it bad writing for like every

0:49:47.120 --> 0:49:50.319
<v Speaker 3>character to be like a cipher. But I think what

0:49:50.320 --> 0:49:53.040
<v Speaker 3>what he does in this is is really really interesting.

0:49:53.200 --> 0:49:56.360
<v Speaker 3>Like I think it's uh, I don't know. I guess

0:49:56.400 --> 0:49:59.319
<v Speaker 3>like one more thing that I really like, do want

0:49:59.320 --> 0:50:02.319
<v Speaker 3>to say is like Ari Astor did an interview with

0:50:02.600 --> 0:50:07.720
<v Speaker 3>Will Miniker and Hesse of like Chapo, and he said

0:50:07.960 --> 0:50:11.200
<v Speaker 3>that he kind of wanted to make this movie like

0:50:11.239 --> 0:50:17.240
<v Speaker 3>a Rorshack test of sorts, and I think he maybe

0:50:17.600 --> 0:50:21.319
<v Speaker 3>overly succeeded in that definitely. And in fact, if I

0:50:21.360 --> 0:50:24.360
<v Speaker 3>had one criticism, it's that maybe I wish there was

0:50:24.440 --> 0:50:27.880
<v Speaker 3>like a few things like tied together that and I

0:50:27.920 --> 0:50:30.080
<v Speaker 3>just wish Austin Butler and Emma Stone got a little

0:50:30.160 --> 0:50:33.000
<v Speaker 3>more meat to do things. But aside from that, one

0:50:33.040 --> 0:50:35.799
<v Speaker 3>of the biggest criticisms that I'm honestly just going to

0:50:35.920 --> 0:50:38.799
<v Speaker 3>dismiss outright as people saying that this is like a

0:50:38.840 --> 0:50:42.799
<v Speaker 3>centrist movie totally, or comparing this to South Park or

0:50:42.840 --> 0:50:45.520
<v Speaker 3>something like that. And if you view this as a

0:50:45.560 --> 0:50:49.400
<v Speaker 3>centrist movie, I mean the liberals in this are like

0:50:49.920 --> 0:50:53.200
<v Speaker 3>kind of annoying, ineffectual. A lot of them don't really

0:50:53.239 --> 0:50:55.600
<v Speaker 3>believe what they do. Some of them do. I think

0:50:55.600 --> 0:50:58.439
<v Speaker 3>the girl character is very sympathetic, but like the younger girl.

0:50:58.760 --> 0:51:02.120
<v Speaker 3>But Joaquin Phoenix, the ostensible like you know, right wing

0:51:02.520 --> 0:51:07.040
<v Speaker 3>version of this, kills a child like he kills three people,

0:51:07.160 --> 0:51:08.520
<v Speaker 3>including like a teenager.

0:51:08.920 --> 0:51:12.840
<v Speaker 2>Like the woke characters engage with politics in a that

0:51:13.040 --> 0:51:16.720
<v Speaker 2>but and self serving way to mask their own insecurities

0:51:16.719 --> 0:51:20.000
<v Speaker 2>and shortcomings and for their own personal benefit. The right

0:51:20.040 --> 0:51:24.520
<v Speaker 2>wing characters murder and have rape cults, and.

0:51:24.640 --> 0:51:29.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, right, Like, I don't see how you could look

0:51:29.480 --> 0:51:32.200
<v Speaker 3>at the actions of the characters in this film and

0:51:32.320 --> 0:51:35.680
<v Speaker 3>just be like, yeah, I guess everyone is stupid. I

0:51:35.680 --> 0:51:39.480
<v Speaker 3>guess everyone is wrong, because it's like no, like I mean,

0:51:39.760 --> 0:51:42.120
<v Speaker 3>I guess everyone is a little stupid and everyone is

0:51:42.440 --> 0:51:44.759
<v Speaker 3>kind of wrong about things. But like, that's not like

0:51:44.880 --> 0:51:47.760
<v Speaker 3>what it's getting across. I think that's a very shallow

0:51:48.000 --> 0:51:48.920
<v Speaker 3>read of the film.

0:51:49.400 --> 0:51:52.719
<v Speaker 2>This is what people outside of the Brooklyn theater were

0:51:52.719 --> 0:51:56.120
<v Speaker 2>complaining about when I eavesdropped for like nearly forty five

0:51:56.120 --> 0:51:58.200
<v Speaker 2>minutes after the film, just to hear what people were

0:51:58.200 --> 0:52:01.560
<v Speaker 2>talking about. I love eavesdropping, I love snooping, So I

0:52:01.600 --> 0:52:03.560
<v Speaker 2>was really feasting out there, and yeah, a lot of

0:52:03.560 --> 0:52:06.680
<v Speaker 2>people upset at how quote unquote little this film had

0:52:06.680 --> 0:52:08.960
<v Speaker 2>to say. It's just it's just depicting these things but

0:52:09.239 --> 0:52:13.439
<v Speaker 2>doesn't have the audacity to actually like say anything about

0:52:13.480 --> 0:52:15.920
<v Speaker 2>them or like take a quote unquote stance, and like, yeah,

0:52:15.960 --> 0:52:18.919
<v Speaker 2>that's so not what the film is trying to do.

0:52:19.360 --> 0:52:22.640
<v Speaker 2>That the film is pointing out, like the social media

0:52:22.680 --> 0:52:26.640
<v Speaker 2>style engagement with politics is this incredibly self serving thing.

0:52:26.719 --> 0:52:28.640
<v Speaker 2>And it's this performance that we put on for other

0:52:28.719 --> 0:52:32.280
<v Speaker 2>people and sometimes put on even for ourselves. And twenty

0:52:32.320 --> 0:52:35.719
<v Speaker 2>twenty was a way because of the conditions of the lockdown,

0:52:36.000 --> 0:52:38.920
<v Speaker 2>the internet and real life combined in a way more

0:52:39.040 --> 0:52:41.960
<v Speaker 2>like totalistically than they have ever before. And then that

0:52:42.000 --> 0:52:47.319
<v Speaker 2>combination grew pressure and shot outwards into physical reality in

0:52:47.360 --> 0:52:50.120
<v Speaker 2>a very bombastic way, both for the twenty twenty protests

0:52:50.120 --> 0:52:52.799
<v Speaker 2>and eventually something like January sixth, Right, both these things, Yeah,

0:52:52.840 --> 0:52:54.440
<v Speaker 2>I think you can you can look at a similar

0:52:54.840 --> 0:52:57.839
<v Speaker 2>like political pressure like building and manifesting.

0:52:58.480 --> 0:53:00.760
<v Speaker 3>And it's not saying these things are equal.

0:53:00.840 --> 0:53:03.279
<v Speaker 2>It's not the centrist I'm better than thou for you

0:53:03.719 --> 0:53:07.320
<v Speaker 2>look at all these crazy guys, But it's it's talking

0:53:07.320 --> 0:53:10.719
<v Speaker 2>about how we as a culture associate with politics now

0:53:10.760 --> 0:53:13.600
<v Speaker 2>and like how as like American culture we associate with

0:53:13.640 --> 0:53:17.200
<v Speaker 2>politics now, and maybe that's kind of troubling and kind

0:53:17.200 --> 0:53:19.600
<v Speaker 2>of scary. That's like the horror of the film is, Yeah,

0:53:19.680 --> 0:53:22.120
<v Speaker 2>the way that we associate with social media politics now

0:53:22.160 --> 0:53:25.279
<v Speaker 2>is really frightening. Which isn't like a revolutionary thing to say, right,

0:53:25.320 --> 0:53:27.840
<v Speaker 2>This isn't like, you know, breaking new ground here, but

0:53:27.920 --> 0:53:30.600
<v Speaker 2>he is expressing something that everyone I think has felt

0:53:30.600 --> 0:53:34.600
<v Speaker 2>at a certain point. Sure, but it's it's presented in

0:53:34.640 --> 0:53:37.200
<v Speaker 2>a way that I think is it very much is

0:53:37.239 --> 0:53:38.680
<v Speaker 2>a Rorschack test for a lot of people.

0:53:39.120 --> 0:53:42.160
<v Speaker 3>I think a lot of people are uncomfortable. I think

0:53:42.239 --> 0:53:45.239
<v Speaker 3>some people just see too much of themselves, and like

0:53:45.480 --> 0:53:48.400
<v Speaker 3>I was speaking specifically to like liberal audiences, I think

0:53:48.680 --> 0:53:50.880
<v Speaker 3>a lot of them are seeing something of themselves and

0:53:50.920 --> 0:53:52.719
<v Speaker 3>they feel like they're being made fun of and they

0:53:52.719 --> 0:53:55.960
<v Speaker 3>don't appreciate that. I'll just say I was at the

0:53:55.960 --> 0:53:57.840
<v Speaker 3>Black Lives Matter protests and stuff.

0:53:58.360 --> 0:54:01.560
<v Speaker 2>I was there, and I don't feel that way. No,

0:54:01.600 --> 0:54:03.319
<v Speaker 2>I don't think I was being made fun of.

0:54:03.640 --> 0:54:07.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I don't like Like I think that, like that's

0:54:07.080 --> 0:54:09.759
<v Speaker 3>kind of on you as a viewer for like expecting

0:54:09.800 --> 0:54:13.040
<v Speaker 3>a movie to like look directly in the camera and

0:54:13.080 --> 0:54:17.000
<v Speaker 3>be like, I believe the same things you believe, you know,

0:54:17.200 --> 0:54:20.759
<v Speaker 3>because that's I mean, that's bad filmmaking, that's bad Riding.

0:54:20.680 --> 0:54:23.480
<v Speaker 5>Explains the exact type of communist that I am.

0:54:23.640 --> 0:54:26.120
<v Speaker 3>Right, Yes, I'm the exact kind of leftist you are.

0:54:26.239 --> 0:54:28.240
<v Speaker 3>We are on the same side and we're all laughing

0:54:28.239 --> 0:54:29.520
<v Speaker 3>at the same things together.

0:54:29.680 --> 0:54:32.640
<v Speaker 2>It's like, no, and if if your engagement with like

0:54:32.960 --> 0:54:36.520
<v Speaker 2>social justice and anti police brutality protests is shallow enough

0:54:36.560 --> 0:54:39.520
<v Speaker 2>to feel called out in a film like this. I

0:54:39.520 --> 0:54:42.440
<v Speaker 2>think that is cause more for self reflection for why

0:54:42.480 --> 0:54:46.080
<v Speaker 2>you participated in those things. Yeah, I agree, not a

0:54:46.239 --> 0:54:48.279
<v Speaker 2>fault of the film where it's not the film taking

0:54:48.320 --> 0:54:51.959
<v Speaker 2>a stance against those things. I think it's it's showing

0:54:52.000 --> 0:54:55.320
<v Speaker 2>there's certain types of people who participated in an extremely

0:54:55.360 --> 0:54:59.960
<v Speaker 2>performative and like self serving manner. Yeah, and like specifically

0:55:00.360 --> 0:55:02.880
<v Speaker 2>the way that like the main like like like zoomer

0:55:03.080 --> 0:55:05.759
<v Speaker 2>guy character who in the end becomes a right wing

0:55:05.800 --> 0:55:09.680
<v Speaker 2>grifter kylet. It's like it's I think this manifests this

0:55:09.840 --> 0:55:13.400
<v Speaker 2>like like like perfectly. Like I think his his character,

0:55:13.840 --> 0:55:16.800
<v Speaker 2>I think is one of the funniest characters in the film.

0:55:17.560 --> 0:55:19.600
<v Speaker 2>One of the best jokes is just him like liking

0:55:19.680 --> 0:55:24.719
<v Speaker 2>a tweet googling Angela Davos. So I think that kind

0:55:24.760 --> 0:55:27.399
<v Speaker 2>of stuff is more what it's talking about. And when

0:55:27.440 --> 0:55:29.320
<v Speaker 2>you have those types of people being some of the

0:55:29.360 --> 0:55:32.640
<v Speaker 2>most vocal people at these events, it contributes to this

0:55:32.760 --> 0:55:36.640
<v Speaker 2>like kind of psychosis. Yeah, and that I think that's

0:55:36.640 --> 0:55:38.520
<v Speaker 2>what the film is specifically saying.

0:55:39.280 --> 0:55:41.759
<v Speaker 3>I mean, do we forget that people like Sean King

0:55:41.840 --> 0:55:45.399
<v Speaker 3>were like popular in twenty twenty. Look, if you see

0:55:45.440 --> 0:55:49.640
<v Speaker 3>this and like the portrayal of like these liberal characters

0:55:49.640 --> 0:55:52.000
<v Speaker 3>doesn't apply to you. I don't know why you're mad.

0:55:52.560 --> 0:55:55.000
<v Speaker 3>I don't know why you would like look at that

0:55:55.040 --> 0:55:57.640
<v Speaker 3>and being like, oh, they're making fun of me and everything.

0:55:57.680 --> 0:56:00.920
<v Speaker 3>I believe because if it doesn't apply to you, then

0:56:00.920 --> 0:56:04.080
<v Speaker 3>it doesn't apply to you. And that was how I

0:56:04.120 --> 0:56:06.319
<v Speaker 3>watched the film, Like I didn't feel like any of

0:56:06.320 --> 0:56:10.479
<v Speaker 3>these characters applied to me, so I don't really care.

0:56:11.320 --> 0:56:14.839
<v Speaker 3>And I guess a final point is like I haven't

0:56:15.080 --> 0:56:18.520
<v Speaker 3>heard anyone else say this, but like Shriff Joe at

0:56:18.520 --> 0:56:21.640
<v Speaker 3>the end of the film is I feel like it's

0:56:21.840 --> 0:56:28.319
<v Speaker 3>very unsubtle symbolism to say that he's lobotomized with if

0:56:28.360 --> 0:56:30.640
<v Speaker 3>Ice stabbed in the in the head with a knife.

0:56:30.760 --> 0:56:32.319
<v Speaker 3>That's what happened to all of us in a way.

0:56:32.560 --> 0:56:36.520
<v Speaker 3>And I mean, it's funny that Ariastra avoided a lot

0:56:36.520 --> 0:56:40.399
<v Speaker 3>of mother related trauma up until the very very end

0:56:40.440 --> 0:56:42.920
<v Speaker 3>of the movie. The very last seed he had just

0:56:42.960 --> 0:56:46.440
<v Speaker 3>squeezed it in there. I know, I know which it was.

0:56:46.640 --> 0:56:49.919
<v Speaker 3>I know, and he's being like raised in the bed

0:56:49.960 --> 0:56:53.839
<v Speaker 3>and this kind of like angelic like ascension kind of thing.

0:56:54.480 --> 0:56:57.879
<v Speaker 3>I don't know. I think that it's I think it's

0:56:57.880 --> 0:57:00.920
<v Speaker 3>a pretty unsubtle and funny way of saying that, like

0:57:01.520 --> 0:57:06.399
<v Speaker 3>there's really for some people after going fully there in

0:57:06.520 --> 0:57:10.920
<v Speaker 3>like being insane, after like just plunging yourself into the

0:57:10.920 --> 0:57:16.760
<v Speaker 3>heart of all of this like chaos and unreality, that

0:57:16.960 --> 0:57:19.240
<v Speaker 3>the only thing that is going to save you is

0:57:19.240 --> 0:57:23.160
<v Speaker 3>a lobotomy, if nothing else. I think that's very funny.

0:57:23.480 --> 0:57:28.640
<v Speaker 3>So yeah, I enjoyed it a lot. I've wondered after

0:57:28.720 --> 0:57:31.439
<v Speaker 3>about a week after I saw it, I was kicking

0:57:31.480 --> 0:57:34.160
<v Speaker 3>it around in my head more and I was wondering,

0:57:34.240 --> 0:57:36.439
<v Speaker 3>like will this grow on me? Will this age well?

0:57:36.480 --> 0:57:38.840
<v Speaker 3>And I think it definitely has grown on me the

0:57:39.440 --> 0:57:40.640
<v Speaker 3>more I've thought about it.

0:57:40.720 --> 0:57:42.720
<v Speaker 2>Same it has also grown me more over time. Once

0:57:42.720 --> 0:57:44.720
<v Speaker 2>I got out of the theater, I was storting through

0:57:44.720 --> 0:57:46.400
<v Speaker 2>a lot of different feelings about what I just saw,

0:57:46.840 --> 0:57:50.480
<v Speaker 2>and it has definitely grown me over time. Where can

0:57:50.600 --> 0:57:53.080
<v Speaker 2>people find you and your work?

0:57:54.440 --> 0:57:57.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so I'm a musician. You can go to Jenidanger

0:57:57.080 --> 0:57:59.600
<v Speaker 3>dot com and find most of my links and stuff.

0:58:00.120 --> 0:58:02.600
<v Speaker 3>I have a new song and video out. I'm working

0:58:02.600 --> 0:58:04.200
<v Speaker 3>on a new album that should come out later this year,

0:58:04.200 --> 0:58:08.080
<v Speaker 3>and if you're in the Atlanta area, I'm playing a

0:58:08.120 --> 0:58:11.680
<v Speaker 3>show at the end of August at Bogs Social and

0:58:11.880 --> 0:58:17.240
<v Speaker 3>the Mainline Music Festival in September. But if you follow

0:58:17.280 --> 0:58:20.760
<v Speaker 3>me on like Instagram or whatever, you should have all

0:58:20.800 --> 0:58:23.120
<v Speaker 3>your updates there, and you can follow me on letterbox

0:58:23.200 --> 0:58:25.920
<v Speaker 3>at Jenny Danger. So yeah, thanks for having me.

0:58:26.480 --> 0:58:27.000
<v Speaker 5>Thank you Jane.

0:58:28.000 --> 0:58:29.919
<v Speaker 2>That does it for us at It Could Happen Here.

0:58:30.000 --> 0:58:33.360
<v Speaker 2>Thanks once again to Jane Danger and Bailey new Poster.

0:58:33.520 --> 0:58:36.160
<v Speaker 2>Follow them both online. They do great work. If you

0:58:36.240 --> 0:58:38.360
<v Speaker 2>want some good music, listen to Jane. If you want

0:58:38.400 --> 0:58:42.200
<v Speaker 2>some cool art, look up a Bailey new Poster. Oh boy,

0:58:42.560 --> 0:58:45.200
<v Speaker 2>I guess I will hopefully see you on the other

0:58:45.320 --> 0:58:52.280
<v Speaker 2>side of this post. Woke Nightmare, Bye bye.

0:58:53.640 --> 0:58:56.160
<v Speaker 3>It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media.

0:58:56.320 --> 0:58:59.400
<v Speaker 2>For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

0:58:59.440 --> 0:59:01.920
<v Speaker 2>cools one media dot com, or check us out on

0:59:01.960 --> 0:59:06.040
<v Speaker 2>the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

0:59:06.440 --> 0:59:08.360
<v Speaker 2>You can now find sources for It Could Happen Here

0:59:08.400 --> 0:59:10.200
<v Speaker 2>listed directly in episode descriptions.

0:59:10.560 --> 0:59:11.360
<v Speaker 5>Thanks for listening.