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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on

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Speaker 1: iHeart Radio and welcome back to Coast to Coast George

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Speaker 1: and Order with you, Rick Prato with us as book

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Speaker 1: black ops will get into this book in a big

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Speaker 1: way in just a moment. One more question about the

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Speaker 1: Ukraine Russian situation. Why couldn't they work this out at

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Speaker 1: the table before any kind of military conflict wreck. Well, again,

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Speaker 1: the negotiations is not their forte there's they don't. They

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Speaker 1: cannot make any argument and concessions that Putin is going

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Speaker 1: to accept. And he's always had his finger on the

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Speaker 1: military option. I think that that's his mentality, in his

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Speaker 1: background pushes him in that direction. So he's not afraid

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Speaker 1: of war and he is an aggressive individual. Yes, I

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Speaker 1: think the economic sanctions could have started a lot earlier.

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Speaker 1: I think our help for the Ukrainians should have started

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Speaker 1: a lot earlier. And again when I say we, I

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Speaker 1: mean the Western world, not just the United the States.

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Speaker 1: Now back to your book and your work as a

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Speaker 1: CIA operative. Did you have to get this book approved

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Speaker 1: once you wrote it. Yes, as a matter of fact,

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Speaker 1: this book is fully approved by the agency. CIA took

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Speaker 1: six months to approve this book, and I'm pleasantly surprised

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Speaker 1: how much they allowed me to talk about. And I

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Speaker 1: think that the main reason for that was the argument

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Speaker 1: that I make up front with the book. Is the

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Speaker 1: reason I've wrote the book is primarily because after all

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Speaker 1: these years working with some of the best people I've

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Speaker 1: ever worked with and watching TV just like everybody else does,

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Speaker 1: I got tired of the image that my agency has

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Speaker 1: is the most my line agency in the federal government.

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Speaker 1: And you know, our heroes, our patriots, are those people

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Speaker 1: that do the work that nobody even knows are always

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Speaker 1: described as im moral, treacherous, maniacal assassins like Jason Bourne,

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Speaker 1: that are being hunted down by their own government because

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Speaker 1: of some black program blah blah blah, or selling drugs.

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Speaker 1: And you know, after after nine eleven, we have one

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Speaker 1: hundred and thirty seven stars on our wall of men

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Speaker 1: and women in the agency that have given their lives

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Speaker 1: up for what we believe in, and we all those

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Speaker 1: individuals a much better opportunity to to be known and

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Speaker 1: some of their their their exploits documented, especially after all

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Speaker 1: these years. So that that was the reason for the book.

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Speaker 1: And like I said, I'm very, very surprised you read it,

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Speaker 1: so you know that there's quite a bit of information

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Speaker 1: there that it's going to be new. Uh. And you

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Speaker 1: know you you you said it earlier. To the contrast

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Speaker 1: between having the Cold War which never really went away,

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Speaker 1: you're seeing it again. But the terrorism, the phenomenon, the

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Speaker 1: terrorism came in and it was like a flash bang

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Speaker 1: for everybody to focus on just that. How did you

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Speaker 1: get recruited into the CIA? You know when um, when

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Speaker 1: I was about twenty years old, I joined a unit

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Speaker 1: in the Air Force called Para Rescue, which is a

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Speaker 1: one of our elite special operations forces in the war

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Speaker 1: in the United States. That is correct, and like Green Berets,

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Speaker 1: you know, we have our different expertise. We're primarily combat

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Speaker 1: medics that can jump out our airplanes, do scuba, mountain

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Speaker 1: climb and all that other acute and loot as necessary.

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Speaker 1: But our main goal always remains um bringing down back

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Speaker 1: down pilots or a team that goes in and it's

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Speaker 1: gets gets pinned down. Um. In Afghanistan, we had a

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Speaker 1: lot of Green Beret teams that were had pj's Para

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Speaker 1: Rescue me and with them for that reason. So but

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Speaker 1: anyway that during that time. I mean I went in

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Speaker 1: in uh in late seventy one into Para Rescue, and

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Speaker 1: of course I went because I wanted to go to Vietnam.

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Speaker 1: I felt that I owed this country a debt of

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Speaker 1: honor for what they've done for my family and myself,

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Speaker 1: and I decided to go into into the military. And

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Speaker 1: fortuitously I met somebody who introduced Pair of Rescue and

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Speaker 1: I did a few years with them, and then I

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Speaker 1: applied to the agency. I think it was in seventy four,

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Speaker 1: and back then, as you may recall, we were going

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Speaker 1: through an incredible nutrition post Vietnam, so they very nicely

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Speaker 1: told me we're not hiring, we're firing. Tried it again

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Speaker 1: in seventy nine, and this time they asked me to

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Speaker 1: start doing some contract work with them with our Special

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Speaker 1: Activities Division Ground Branch, which is the CIA's Special Operations

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Speaker 1: Forces for lack of a better word, and all the

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Speaker 1: all the people that go there come from that background.

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Speaker 1: So that exposed me to CIA management, and unfortunately they

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Speaker 1: were still not hiring. But then what happened was the

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Speaker 1: sen Denis declared themselves communists. They became part of the

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Speaker 1: Cuban tentacle that that was engulf in Latin America and

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Speaker 1: said spreading into Salvador and Guatemala in places beyond. And

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Speaker 1: um Reagan came to power and he said, we are

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Speaker 1: going to stop this and we started a covert program

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Speaker 1: called the Countress. That's right with Oliver. Oliver North was

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Speaker 1: part of that, wasn't he. Yeah, at the slightly later on,

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Speaker 1: I mean at the very beginning he was not um

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Speaker 1: but im material. The covert auction was a program that

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Speaker 1: at the end was successful because it forced the San

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Speaker 1: Denistas through military pressure through our surrogates, not through our surrogus,

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Speaker 1: supporting the freedom fighters that were there the Nicola when

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Speaker 1: freedom fighters that were there forced them to a carry

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Speaker 1: out a democratic election with oversight world oversight, and the

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Speaker 1: Sandinistas lost. So that that's that's that was. That was

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Speaker 1: a success story for the agents. See a shot in

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Speaker 1: the arm for the agency. What's happening in Nicaragua. Now

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Speaker 1: they're back to square one. I have a couple of

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Speaker 1: friends in the Mosquitia, which is the eastern side where

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Speaker 1: the Native Americans there lived. They're called Mosquito, Sumore, and

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Speaker 1: Rama are the three tribes that populate that area. And

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Speaker 1: he was telling me, says Rick, this is as bad

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Speaker 1: as it was in nineteen eighty one. Oppression is there,

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Speaker 1: the abuse is there, the starving is there. They're blocking

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Speaker 1: the roads there. As soon as we leave, everything falls

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Speaker 1: apart again, isn't that? Yeah? And again we cannot be

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Speaker 1: everywhere and at the same time, but we definitely need

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Speaker 1: to maintain some influence in places, especially in our backyard.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you got to understand, Nick, Caraguan, Venezuela and

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Speaker 1: those kind of places. They are in our backyard, the Ukraine.

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Speaker 1: It's a foothold by the West to threaten the mother

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Speaker 1: country blah blah blah with their fatherland, whether they call

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Speaker 1: it um. Well, if we adopted the same theory, which

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Speaker 1: I'm not saying that we should, why why don't we

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Speaker 1: go to Cuba? Cuba is a surrogate, violent, violent, aggressive

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Speaker 1: surrogate of the of the of the Russians, and it's

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Speaker 1: ninety miles south of our border. Absolutely is well, why

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Speaker 1: is it? Is it justified? Rick? When people talk about

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Speaker 1: the United States doing so many covert things in other nations,

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Speaker 1: is it justified or not? Well, let me explain it.

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Speaker 1: Is it is justified because it's how it's done. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's not the CIA or d IA or

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Speaker 1: any of the other sister organizations from the community. These

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Speaker 1: are things that are thought about and come from the

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Speaker 1: White House as a matter of fact. In our our

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Speaker 1: boss at the end of the day is the President

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Speaker 1: of the United States. UM. We do covert action four

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Speaker 1: things like Ukraine, things like Nicaragua, things like in Salvador.

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Speaker 1: We had a lot of our friends in Salvador, of

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Speaker 1: my friends in Salvador training to Salvadorians and butchersing them

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Speaker 1: to try to push back the communist guerrillas that were,

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Speaker 1: you know, taking over the country. So that's the kind

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Speaker 1: of COVID action we do. We also do COVID action

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Speaker 1: against terrorism. You know, we try to recruit, We try

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Speaker 1: to you know, if necessary, kidnap, somebody track them down

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Speaker 1: through technology or through human sources. But the bottom line

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Speaker 1: is we have to fight back, and if we sit back,

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Speaker 1: Ukraine is not going to be the exception is going

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Speaker 1: to be the rule. We could have taken out Osama

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Speaker 1: bin Laden we before nine to eleven. Why didn't we

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Speaker 1: do that? Yes, you know, as you mentioned, I'm a

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Speaker 1: Plank owner of the bin Laden Task Force in late

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Speaker 1: ninety five, early ninety six, the agency decided that they

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Speaker 1: were going to create a station dedicated strictly to Usama

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Speaker 1: Bin Laden And I'm a plank owner of that. I

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Speaker 1: started with Mike Shorier. Mike Shorier was a senior analyst

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Speaker 1: and I was a GS fifteen at the time, and

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Speaker 1: I was his deputy. I was a deputy chief of station,

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Speaker 1: and we started making book on Bin Laden. And I

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Speaker 1: will tell you in the mid nineteen nineties we knew

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Speaker 1: where not only did we know where, but Laden was.

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Speaker 1: I could have told you what he had for lunch. Wow,

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Speaker 1: because we had for we were photographing him and he

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Speaker 1: was there in a very h He was in Cartoon

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Speaker 1: Sudan at the time. Now it was this during the

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Speaker 1: year where the Soviet Union was in Afghanistan. That's how

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Speaker 1: that's how he started. He started when the Russian invasion,

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Speaker 1: the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. He was a mushahadeen and

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Speaker 1: we helped him, Yes he did. Yeah, we helped the

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Speaker 1: musjah Haddeen to fight the communism and as a matter

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Speaker 1: of fact, we gave them the tools and the training

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Speaker 1: to not back that that that aggression. Of course, you know,

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Speaker 1: the the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And and that turned around on us and the Laden

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Speaker 1: is a perfect example of that. But back to the

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Speaker 1: point that we had we you know, we had him

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Speaker 1: in our sights. There was no doubt in my mind.

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Speaker 1: I was seeing it every day and that was my

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Speaker 1: job as the ops guy. The the scenarios that we

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Speaker 1: could have used to disrupt but Laden in any any

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Speaker 1: way that you could think for and we proposed this

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Speaker 1: up the ladder time and time again, and the political

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Speaker 1: fortitude wasn't there. Yeah, it was, well, you know, he

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Speaker 1: really hasn't done anything. Well, he's training people to do

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Speaker 1: this kind of stuff. Where do you think it's going. Uh,

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Speaker 1: He's dealing with very radicalized you know, folks from all

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Speaker 1: over the world. You know, I described it Laden as

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Speaker 1: the scene from The Godfather. He was that guy that

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Speaker 1: could reach out and touch different organizations out there and

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Speaker 1: they would they would do his bidding because of the

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Speaker 1: money that he had, in the charisma that he had.

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Speaker 1: But at that time, we could have taken him out

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Speaker 1: of commission. And I don't mean just killing him, We

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Speaker 1: could have kidnapped him. Imagine if we would have done that,

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Speaker 1: You're talking chances are the coal bombing would have happened,

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Speaker 1: the bombing of our embassies in Africa would have happened,

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Speaker 1: and definitely, you know, nine and even probably would have

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Speaker 1: not happened. Right, And it's the same argument. You know,

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Speaker 1: imagine if we had shot Hitler in nineteen thirty nine,

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Speaker 1: same thing, same kind of thing. Now, didn't Osama bin

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Speaker 1: Laden come to the United States under someone assumed name,

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Speaker 1: under our invitation? I had heard that a long time ago. Rick,

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Speaker 1: I've never heard any proof of that. I've heard the rumors,

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Speaker 1: But as an intelligence officer, I don't you know, I

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Speaker 1: can't deal in rumors. They gave him some US name

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Speaker 1: like Bobby Moore or something like that, I wouldn't be

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Speaker 1: surprised me. And you think about it. If it was

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Speaker 1: a way of try to bring him into the full

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Speaker 1: and make him in an ally, it was worth it

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Speaker 1: was worth a shot. But once that shot wasn't worth it,

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Speaker 1: we we were tasked to focus on him. And let's

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Speaker 1: face it, you know that same little unit that I

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Speaker 1: helped start, which where I would think was maybe ten

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Speaker 1: of us at the time, it's the very same unit

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Speaker 1: that eventually years and years, like a couple decades or later,

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Speaker 1: we'll say able to finally pinpoint him and allow our

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Speaker 1: navy seals to shoot him in the face. Once the

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Speaker 1: KGB fell apart in the Soviet Union, what has replaced

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Speaker 1: it now in Russia, Well, they have their own intelligence service,

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Speaker 1: and you know, you can change the label from the

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Speaker 1: outside to the other. You know, organizations like like mine

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Speaker 1: are supposed to be a political That's the first thing

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Speaker 1: they taught me on the farm. We don't do politics,

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Speaker 1: and we don't do policy. We collect intelligence and we

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Speaker 1: carry out covert action at the direction of the United

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Speaker 1: States President. And you know, there those organizations are meant

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Speaker 1: to do one thing. Now, I think that the biggest difference,

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Speaker 1: which a lot of people do not understand, and again

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Speaker 1: move the reason that I that I am so proud

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Speaker 1: of the book is, you know, the Russians and the

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Speaker 1: Cubans and even the Chinese, the Communists countries that their

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Speaker 1: intelligence service primarily try to recruit for weaknesses. In other words,

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Speaker 1: the person that is cheating on his wife, or they

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Speaker 1: put a honeypot is a big deal. Is where they

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Speaker 1: send a very attractive woman to a guy who's you know,

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Speaker 1: in Germany, been there for two months working and he's

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Speaker 1: got access to classified material and they you know, she

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Speaker 1: seduces them, compromises them, makes them. We don't do that.

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Speaker 1: We do not. We try to recruit for strengths, individuals

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Speaker 1: that have the same convictions, whether they're in Country A

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Speaker 1: or Country B, to help us do the right thing.

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Speaker 1: Have you ever had anybody within the CIA reco rogue

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Speaker 1: where you had problems with them? Well, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: think not necessarily wrote, but as you know, we have

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Speaker 1: had individuals that that there were traders, you know, they

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Speaker 1: actually defected to to the to the Soviet Union from

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Speaker 1: at one time. We've had people that worked for the Russians. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And it's funny. None of those guys were recruited by

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Speaker 1: the Russians. They volunteered. Gee, why would they do that? Money? Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: primary money. Uh. The last guy that was really involved

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Speaker 1: with this, and I'm trying to remember his name because

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Speaker 1: I met him several times, Nicholson. Nicholson was a movie

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Speaker 1: about him. I don't know. There was a movie about

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Speaker 1: a CIA operative who went to the Soviet Union. Basically, well,

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Speaker 1: there was a guy way before him, even before I

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Speaker 1: got in, that went through the farm and did everything

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Speaker 1: else and then shortly thereafter, you know, started providing information

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Speaker 1: and ended up in the Soviet Union. But uh it's

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Speaker 1: intelligence services will continue to be intell religion services, and

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Speaker 1: there's a continuity from the KGB to now. It hasn't

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Speaker 1: changed whatsoever. Nothing in Russia has changed other than the

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Speaker 1: creation of these oligarchs that have this incredible power and money,

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Speaker 1: which again it's could be a thorn on foot and

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Speaker 1: side if they get further discontent with him. Exactly if

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Speaker 1: their money gets seized by us, who knows what could

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Speaker 1: have right that is right. Listen to more Coast to

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Speaker 1: Coast AM every weeknight at one am Eastern and go

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Speaker 1: to Coast to Coast am dot com for more