1 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:13,800 Speaker 1: Y'all, tonight is an important conversation that needs to happen. 2 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: I used to teach college. Our guest tonight still teaches college. 3 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:25,599 Speaker 1: In that level. It's a different place, it's a different 4 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:30,280 Speaker 1: time in your life as a parent dropping somebody off. 5 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,560 Speaker 1: I mean, you just think, man, the next four years 6 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: are going to shape them. They're going to have the 7 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: time of their life. They're going to have so many experiences. 8 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:44,600 Speaker 1: You're just thrilled for them. And tonight, Scott Duffy is 9 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:48,120 Speaker 1: going to help me talk about what happened in Providence. 10 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: So Scott Duffy, y'all remember he's been here before. He's 11 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: a good friend. Senior director of Training at Wilmington University 12 00:00:56,920 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 1: in Delaware, retired at the Supervisory Special Agent, and y'all, 13 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 1: he's also been a technical advisor for HBO Max. He's 14 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:12,399 Speaker 1: also one of the experts for the Wildlife CSI Academy 15 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 1: and a favorite, I might add. So Scott Duffy, welcome 16 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: back to Zone seven. 17 00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:23,480 Speaker 2: Chareyl. Good evening, and thank you so much. What a 18 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:25,199 Speaker 2: wonderful introduction. 19 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:31,720 Speaker 1: Always humbled all true, and that's all true. Don't have 20 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:36,360 Speaker 1: to pad anything for you, but you know, the last 21 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:39,760 Speaker 1: time you and I had dinner. You were talking so 22 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:44,920 Speaker 1: lovely about your students. You are so excited for them. 23 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:51,280 Speaker 1: You bring world renowned people to Wilmington, You expose them 24 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: to experts in all kind of genres and levels and disciplines, 25 00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: and just that joy on your talking about what they're doing, 26 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:07,920 Speaker 1: the things they're accomplishing. That to me is what from 27 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:13,480 Speaker 1: a teacher perspective, a professor perspective, that's the whole, that's 28 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:17,600 Speaker 1: the gig. It's almost like your child. You put what 29 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 1: you got in them, and then when you see them 30 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:24,440 Speaker 1: just go You are so proud, just like a parent. 31 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:29,360 Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah, you are a good reader of faces and 32 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 2: body language. I love. I loved my job as a 33 00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 2: police officer and a bi agent. I love what I'm 34 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 2: doing now at Wilmington University and of course at Montgomery 35 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 2: County Police Academy in Pennsylvania, where I get to teach 36 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 2: new recruits. So being at the beginning of their stages 37 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:58,399 Speaker 2: of life, their careers, whether it be in the college 38 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:05,919 Speaker 2: section where not all criminal justice students who are taking 39 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 2: my classes, or in the criminal justice field, they could 40 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:15,240 Speaker 2: be psychology. It a whole fast of backgrounds, but I'd 41 00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:17,919 Speaker 2: love being with them. I love listening to them their 42 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:23,720 Speaker 2: perspectives at such a young age, and I do my 43 00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 2: classic let me ask you a questions as all these 44 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,840 Speaker 2: young people, you know, having Instagram, TikTok and whatnot, and 45 00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 2: a lot a lot of their information coming through, so 46 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 2: I'd like to see where they're at with regards to 47 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:45,520 Speaker 2: their love of the criminal justice system. They're they're just 48 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 2: whatever you want to call it, their angsts, right, they're 49 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 2: I'm not so sure we're going down the right path 50 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 2: all those things. And and then I'd like to take say, 51 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 2: bear with me, however many weeks were together and see 52 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 2: if I always like to give them that positive side 53 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 2: of law enforcement because sow so so many just just 54 00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 2: dedicate their lives to just doing the good. 55 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 1: Yes, it is amazing. And you know, my daughter Caroline 56 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:26,560 Speaker 1: was at that same dinner and she asked you, what 57 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 1: is your favorite class to teach? And you leaned back 58 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 1: and you went, ooh, that's a good question. And what 59 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 1: was so fantastic to me was there's more than one. 60 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:41,240 Speaker 1: Like you're excited about a lot of things you can 61 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:44,080 Speaker 1: teach these young people. And at the end of that dinner, 62 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:47,039 Speaker 1: Caroline leaned up for to me she went, I want 63 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:51,560 Speaker 1: to take that class, and I went, me too. I mean, 64 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:55,040 Speaker 1: you're just so you just fire people up, and I 65 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 1: just appreciate that about you. And you know, I know 66 00:04:57,839 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 1: there's some lucky, lucky folks in Della where. 67 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,640 Speaker 2: Yeah. And you know, also the nice thing about Wilmington 68 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 2: University is we do so much in the online field 69 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 2: and when I'm talking to students who I can just 70 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:17,839 Speaker 2: see on a camera and it's amazing where they're zooming 71 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 2: in from, whether it be I've had military overseas saying hey, 72 00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 2: I'm in attend I'm taking a class, or you know, 73 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 2: taking a break from whatever it is they're doing, or 74 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:36,160 Speaker 2: across the world where different students come and just to 75 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 2: be a part of the class from this, that and 76 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 2: of itself is a pretty cool experience. And then every 77 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,880 Speaker 2: student gets to, I hope, learn from just the different backgrounds, 78 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:48,800 Speaker 2: cultures and perspectives. 79 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: And I think this love of teaching and just the 80 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 1: love of our students makes what happened in Providence all 81 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:02,719 Speaker 1: the more gut n because here you have young people 82 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 1: expand in their mind, broadening their world, and they're just 83 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 1: gunned down. I mean in the engineering building getting ready 84 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 1: for a final, taking a final, studying for a final, 85 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: and you got two people killed, nine people injured, and 86 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 1: they can't find it. 87 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 2: Zone in on what you had just said, people taking 88 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 2: a final. So just walking any hall of any school, 89 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:42,919 Speaker 2: but especially in a college atmosphere where you have everything 90 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:47,279 Speaker 2: going on. In a college. You can go to any 91 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:55,839 Speaker 2: college building, whether it be an engineering, sciences, you know, whatever, 92 00:06:56,480 --> 00:07:02,840 Speaker 2: criminal justice, and students are doing everything studying, group study, 93 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 2: self study, they're socializing. It is everything that happens on 94 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 2: the street is taking place in what is supposed to 95 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 2: be a place to let your guard down, where you 96 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 2: have no worry of the outside world, or shouldn't have 97 00:07:22,280 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 2: a worry of the outside world. You are, at least 98 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 2: you believe to be confined in a secure space. And 99 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 2: now at the end, I watched the students, you know, 100 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 2: at the beginning, all the nerves, and then as everybody 101 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 2: gets to know each other, as the semester goes on, 102 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 2: everybody is engaged and genuinely relaxing those nerves and stresses. 103 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 2: And then of course essays, tests, whatever have you. They 104 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 2: are designed to build a little bit of that stress. 105 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:05,080 Speaker 2: And then of course exams, the final exams what hopefully 106 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 2: get that grade that you need, you want, that you 107 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 2: work for, saying goodbye to friends, perhaps lovers that you've 108 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 2: you've encountered in that short period of time in college 109 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:27,200 Speaker 2: before everybody goes off on a holiday, whether it be 110 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 2: a you practice of faith or not. Right you are, 111 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:36,719 Speaker 2: everybody is leaving, and you're kind of like flushing out 112 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:39,719 Speaker 2: everything you've learned with that final exam, like now you're 113 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:43,680 Speaker 2: going to move on. You're can enjoy family, friends. There 114 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 2: should be no worry, especially as we have seen unfortunately 115 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 2: time and time again of these unspeakable acts of violence. 116 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 2: Whatever be the motive, but that somebody brings crashing down 117 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 2: to students who are simply in their most vulnerable place 118 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 2: in life. And then, of course not just the students there, 119 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 2: but just how it affects that campus itself. The whole 120 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 2: campus had to change and heartbeat, and then every campus 121 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 2: then has to constantly reevaluate, so students across any learning 122 00:09:38,559 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 2: platform is affected by this, and this just continues. 123 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:51,720 Speaker 1: To Man, it is so crazy because it was four 124 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:55,960 Speaker 1: twenty two in the afternoon. I mean, I don't think 125 00:09:56,120 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 1: anybody in that building had anything on their mind except 126 00:10:00,640 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: what you said, I'm going to finish what I've got 127 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 1: to do right here, and I'm going home, and it's 128 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 1: going to be a fantastic holiday season, right, And you 129 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:13,800 Speaker 1: know their parents, they've already bought tickets, they've already made plans, 130 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 1: they've already bought gifts. And you know the college. I mean, 131 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:23,400 Speaker 1: they send out alert to hide, to stay where you are, 132 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 1: to take cover, to silence your phone. They're trying to 133 00:10:26,320 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 1: let people know there is an active shooter on campus, 134 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:33,840 Speaker 1: which it's unimaginable to people. So I think when you 135 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:36,720 Speaker 1: first get that notice, when you're not in the building, 136 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:41,559 Speaker 1: you're not within earshot of hearing the gunfire, it's got 137 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:45,640 Speaker 1: to almost be like, is this real? Especially at a 138 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 1: place like Providence, Rhode Island idyllic. 139 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:54,199 Speaker 2: Right, Having grown up in New England, myself in Connecticut, 140 00:10:55,040 --> 00:11:00,720 Speaker 2: so just to stay below and now, of course i'm 141 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 2: a little biased with New England, just that every town 142 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 2: has a green and a gazebo, yes, and you know 143 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 2: something going on like a miracle on thirty fourth Street. 144 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 1: It is. When my sister first moved to Connecticut and 145 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:24,320 Speaker 1: I went to visit, everywhere I went looked like a 146 00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:31,080 Speaker 1: movie set. Everywhere. The bridge is, the waterways, the houses everything, 147 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: and you think, you know, a university of this stature 148 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:40,320 Speaker 1: in a beautiful state, in a beautiful city. I mean, 149 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 1: it's just not that anywhere is okay, not that anywhere 150 00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: is predictable, But you certainly don't say, oh, I bet 151 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:50,319 Speaker 1: there's going to be a mass shooting in Providence Trhode 152 00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:51,839 Speaker 1: Island at the college. 153 00:11:52,440 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 2: Then it happens, right, every student's nightmare, it is. And 154 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:05,080 Speaker 2: as we see time and time again, how the old 155 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 2: fashioned fire drills have turned into the active shooter drills 156 00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 2: and have unfortunately, having looked into these and covered these 157 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 2: time and time again, it seems like it's not if. 158 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:34,920 Speaker 2: But when that's the unfortunate reality we live in as 159 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:36,960 Speaker 2: it spreads throughout. 160 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 1: Well, don't you think another reason is because you've got 161 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 1: a soft target. But that target can get even softer. 162 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:50,240 Speaker 1: So again, you go into some campuses and maybe there's 163 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 1: a student there that's got a weapon that can stop you, 164 00:12:53,360 --> 00:12:56,079 Speaker 1: Maybe there's a student that's got some training that can 165 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: stop you. Certainly law enforcement that seem more than one 166 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 1: active shooter. But here it's almost like nobody was prepared 167 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,080 Speaker 1: to take this person on. 168 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, and this case seems to have all the air 169 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:21,440 Speaker 2: marks as law enforcement has learned because Right Jerald law 170 00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:25,720 Speaker 2: enforcement learns from other law enforcement agencies that have gone 171 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 2: through things. And not every department has that luxury of 172 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 2: the resources, etc. In the training, especially your smaller departments throughout. 173 00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:42,120 Speaker 2: But we are in a place in life, as this 174 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:47,960 Speaker 2: post Columbine world, that there are no more excuses for 175 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 2: not having at least the adequate resources where everybody at 176 00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:00,439 Speaker 2: some point is preparing not only law enforcement those but 177 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 2: those that we protect. Right that the universities, the college is, 178 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:08,960 Speaker 2: the high schools, the junior highs, et cetera, that they 179 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 2: have some sort of security measure in place and know 180 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 2: what to do through these alert these alice trainings, run 181 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:22,920 Speaker 2: hide fight trainings, and that situational awareness that is built 182 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 2: into now our brains. And so these students very smart. 183 00:14:33,640 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 2: You know, you're probably your best of your best that 184 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 2: have crammed, have stressed, have whatever it is to help 185 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:47,480 Speaker 2: them get to that moment. And that is it. All attention. 186 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 2: All eyes are in a paper with a pencil or 187 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 2: pen or a computer, and you have zoned out everything 188 00:14:58,080 --> 00:15:02,920 Speaker 2: else as well as you should take a test, and 189 00:15:02,960 --> 00:15:07,320 Speaker 2: then anybody who's not there taking a test simply whether 190 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 2: you've left the exam or we're getting ready for an exam. 191 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 2: They know this is just a few more hours, a 192 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 2: few more days, and then we can get home and 193 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:23,120 Speaker 2: uh and and then all that comes crashing the most 194 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:29,280 Speaker 2: sacred space, that that protected space is violated by such 195 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:36,320 Speaker 2: unspeakable violence. However, as we are seeing little little bit 196 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 2: of information that comes out still here or video there, 197 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:48,080 Speaker 2: this individual spent some time unlike our typical active shooters 198 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 2: that they idealize that they they then fantasize about it, 199 00:15:55,000 --> 00:16:01,200 Speaker 2: right and and then and and nobody's where what's happening, 200 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 2: So you don't have that break in that cycle of 201 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 2: violence that's going on inside their head to where they 202 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:13,400 Speaker 2: make a decision to execute it. And they come running 203 00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 2: in and you know, as an active shooter, a massive 204 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 2: shoot or what they want to do the most harm 205 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:23,280 Speaker 2: in the shortest period of time, that's what they thought about, 206 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:28,840 Speaker 2: maybe having a face in mind of somebody or someone 207 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:38,280 Speaker 2: that they think about and try to find. But once 208 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 2: they ultimately commit to doing such a horrifying act, planning 209 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 2: goes out the window. It is now just a mass attack, 210 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 2: and so they're not thinking of their escape and most 211 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 2: likely they haven't been hanging around thinking about they leave 212 00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:02,000 Speaker 2: wherever they leave, if they have their weapons of choice, 213 00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:06,159 Speaker 2: and then they go in. But this seems to be different. 214 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:10,440 Speaker 2: And the more we are starting to see, even though 215 00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:14,439 Speaker 2: little bits of information are coming out, you have a 216 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:19,800 Speaker 2: couple hours of an individual that they believed to be 217 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:25,240 Speaker 2: that of the gunman who's there in the neighborhood casing 218 00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 2: pacing that seems to go against what we believed to 219 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:34,359 Speaker 2: be that of a pattern the shooter. 220 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:41,640 Speaker 1: Tom Smith, former detective with NYPD. He and I were 221 00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:45,120 Speaker 1: texting each other when they first talked about the suspect 222 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:50,280 Speaker 1: at the hotel, and he literally texted me, that doesn't 223 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 1: fit the pattern, and we both kind of said to 224 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 1: each other, Yeah, I'm not going to post about that. 225 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: I'm not going to put that information out there because 226 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:06,000 Speaker 1: doesn't seem right. And you know, we do have video. 227 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:08,880 Speaker 1: I run across this all the time in my job 228 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: as a crime scene investigator. Two things people will say, 229 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:16,720 Speaker 1: I didn't think anything that I knew was going to 230 00:18:16,760 --> 00:18:20,320 Speaker 1: make a difference, or I was waiting for the police 231 00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:25,080 Speaker 1: to come and talk to me. Well, any little piece 232 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: of information, just a slither, could make all the difference 233 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:31,600 Speaker 1: in the world, especially if we hear the same thing 234 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 1: over and over and over. And the second thing is, 235 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:38,120 Speaker 1: we don't know to come interview you if we don't 236 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:43,119 Speaker 1: know you exist, so please please reach out. So what 237 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:45,560 Speaker 1: I tried to say is, look, we've got him on video, 238 00:18:46,119 --> 00:18:50,560 Speaker 1: which gives us a date in real time, a location, 239 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 1: and a direction of travel, which is so important. You 240 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,720 Speaker 1: know which way he's going when he's leaving, so that 241 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 1: tells the next neighbor, and the next neighbor check your video, 242 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:08,160 Speaker 1: and even if it's a tesla, go check your car. 243 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:11,159 Speaker 1: We don't know where he might have cut through or 244 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:15,640 Speaker 1: gone around or hidden for a minute, so check everything. 245 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 2: If you have a camera, it only takes a few 246 00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 2: minutes to go through your ring camera. You have an 247 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 2: idea of the time and then you know, especially with 248 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:31,720 Speaker 2: technology these ring cameras or even your savanillance video and 249 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:37,120 Speaker 2: businesses and so forth, they're so user friendly and they 250 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:40,960 Speaker 2: are designed to tell you, hey, somebody's out there is 251 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:44,719 Speaker 2: something that's queued up your camera, and don't waste your 252 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:47,399 Speaker 2: time looking at all the other debt space or your 253 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 2: camera's not picking up on action. Look at what is there. 254 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:56,159 Speaker 2: It takes a few minutes while law enforcement, as you 255 00:19:56,280 --> 00:20:00,679 Speaker 2: well know, right when you are getting hundreds or thousands 256 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:05,120 Speaker 2: of hours that then they have to go through those tapes, 257 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 2: those recordings real time. Yes, we are looking right for 258 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:17,240 Speaker 2: for that one shot that is going to catch him 259 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:21,159 Speaker 2: or her without a mask, or to catch a logo 260 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:26,479 Speaker 2: of a shoe or getting into a car, whether it 261 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 2: be their car or noob or some means of travel. 262 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 2: And that's it. And I believe people are finally looking 263 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:42,119 Speaker 2: at these things and providing law enforcement with it. And 264 00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 2: that's why we're starting to see it's not just a 265 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,879 Speaker 2: few minutes around that four twenty before and the after. 266 00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 2: Look at the casing and the. 267 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:55,720 Speaker 1: Pacing, hands behind his back. 268 00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:57,359 Speaker 2: Hands behind his back. 269 00:20:57,480 --> 00:21:01,639 Speaker 1: Oh oh gosh, that's so cool ritical to me. And 270 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,840 Speaker 1: I want you to jump in because you know you're 271 00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: at the federal level. You've been involved in major cases, 272 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:16,920 Speaker 1: you've done task force, you've done incredible things. Please, when 273 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: you're going to do a press conference, Number one, the 274 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 1: person has got to be trained to do a press conference. 275 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:25,800 Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be the president or the chief 276 00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:30,080 Speaker 1: or the director. It doesn't It needs to be somebody 277 00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:33,680 Speaker 1: that can articulate the mission, what you're doing. And give 278 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:38,000 Speaker 1: what they can give of the investigation. Because here's the 279 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: deal in a situation like this, when you are asked, 280 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,399 Speaker 1: we have video of him leaving the building, do we 281 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 1: have video of him inside the building? And your response 282 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 1: is something to the effect, we don't have confirmation that 283 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:59,959 Speaker 1: it's him inside the building. What How's that possible, Scott Duffy, 284 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:04,600 Speaker 1: how is it possible? So either they didn't want to answer, 285 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:08,280 Speaker 1: right because they don't want to say just like when 286 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 1: they were asked, well, they're saying, he yelled something before 287 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 1: he started shooting. Yeah, but we don't know what that was. Okay, really, 288 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 1: because you've got a whole lot of people that survived 289 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 1: that event, I think you do know what he said, 290 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 1: and if you would tell us, it may narrow down 291 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: the suspect. 292 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:30,160 Speaker 2: Poll pieces of information like that are important. You don't 293 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 2: have to give the exact phrases. You don't have to 294 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:38,639 Speaker 2: give You don't have to give every piece of information away. 295 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:41,640 Speaker 2: I get it. You do want to keep law enforcement 296 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,960 Speaker 2: does want to keep things close to the vest. However, 297 00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,800 Speaker 2: we're four days away from this and even though it 298 00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:53,800 Speaker 2: is still early in the investigation, and what I mean 299 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:59,960 Speaker 2: by early is that typically we have seen active shooters 300 00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:06,879 Speaker 2: where they are in custody or deceased very quickly after 301 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 2: the incident, and so law enforcement has provided a name, 302 00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:16,959 Speaker 2: and then ultimately the people want to know what's the motive. 303 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:24,240 Speaker 2: And sometimes that motive may never be realized because I've 304 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:28,159 Speaker 2: always believed and said that motive lies alone in the 305 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,479 Speaker 2: heart and mind of the one who is committing that 306 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 2: act of violence. And if that person is not in 307 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 2: custody because they are deceased, or they are in custody 308 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 2: but have refused an interview with law enforcement, then we 309 00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:47,840 Speaker 2: can only use the evidence that before uson gathered and 310 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:52,240 Speaker 2: say we believe this is the motive, some sort of revenge, 311 00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:55,400 Speaker 2: some sort of hate, some sort of mental health component, 312 00:23:55,480 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 2: whatever it may be. I do believe if what is 313 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 2: said that witnesses can reasonably ascribe to law enforcement, there 314 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:19,320 Speaker 2: should be something given to the public that can help 315 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:24,200 Speaker 2: somebody who may know this individual and say, oh, okay, 316 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,280 Speaker 2: that just struck a chord with me because that I 317 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:32,600 Speaker 2: heard from a friend, from a colleague, from a family member, 318 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 2: and wow, they've been missing the pasta play something that 319 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:44,960 Speaker 2: could generate a solid lead for law enforcement to follow 320 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 2: up on. 321 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:51,640 Speaker 1: Wales said, yes, And at this point you have an 322 00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 1: active killer somewhere. And like you and I were talking earlier, today, 323 00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:02,520 Speaker 1: there's been another murder of an engineer about an hour 324 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:06,880 Speaker 1: away from Providence. So is it the same killer? Does 325 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:10,639 Speaker 1: he have a list? Is it something about engineers? And 326 00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:13,200 Speaker 1: this is where intelligence is going to come into play 327 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:18,199 Speaker 1: with a lot of our federal friends. I know the 328 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:24,399 Speaker 1: majority of jihadist are engineers. Well, has somebody turned on 329 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,000 Speaker 1: their own? People? Like? What is going on? 330 00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 2: This? 331 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:33,719 Speaker 1: To me? Law enforcement cannot do this alone. They can't. 332 00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 1: Every single set of eyes and ears needs to be 333 00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,280 Speaker 1: out there. And I'll give you an example we saw today. 334 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 1: Now this happened days ago, but we saw just today, 335 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 1: you know, FBI and other law enforcement shoulder to shoulder 336 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:53,919 Speaker 1: searching yards for something he might have discarded. Okay, that 337 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 1: should have been done day one. People, when you go 338 00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,440 Speaker 1: outside to check your mail, or walk your dog, or 339 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,040 Speaker 1: get your over and off the bus, look around. Is 340 00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:05,720 Speaker 1: there a water bottle? Is there a cigarette butt? Is 341 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: there anything in his path of travel that was not 342 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 1: there yesterday? That should have been done. That's what should 343 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,000 Speaker 1: have been said at the press conference. Did you see anybody? 344 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:19,800 Speaker 1: Did you not see anybody but hear your dog bark? 345 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 1: Do we know where he went after the last visual 346 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:28,679 Speaker 1: we have? What got them to that Hampton end twenty 347 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 1: miles away? Why did that happen? How did that happen? 348 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:38,640 Speaker 1: How do you find this person? And they have guns, 349 00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,639 Speaker 1: but they're not the right person. But you can't find 350 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 1: this person. You need the public's help. 351 00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:50,000 Speaker 2: Absolutely, you need the public's help. And this is where 352 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 2: you provide enough information that gets the public thinking, hey, 353 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,679 Speaker 2: thank you very much. That is a question for someone 354 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 2: out there that has an answer or and a call 355 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,880 Speaker 2: can be made as opposed to as you said earlier, 356 00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:10,639 Speaker 2: if someone doesn't is not aware of what kind of 357 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:13,880 Speaker 2: cameras or what how many cameras? That first and foremost, 358 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:18,880 Speaker 2: you haven't gone to many crime scenes, you know, day one, 359 00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 2: early in that investigation, that crime scene is now secure. 360 00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:33,000 Speaker 2: Somebody designated detective, somebody in that pool of investigators has said, 361 00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,280 Speaker 2: hey boss, we got six cameras. Are you sure it's 362 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,119 Speaker 2: not seven? It's not eight? Nope, it got six and 363 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:44,760 Speaker 2: already on it pulling all the footage. Right. That's that's 364 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 2: within hours. Or hey boss, guess what, there are no 365 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:54,440 Speaker 2: cameras in this side of the building that sucks. Okay, 366 00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,600 Speaker 2: well all right, well let's let's now see where we 367 00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:03,440 Speaker 2: have cameras and start pulling the footage that is one 368 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 2: on one getting you the eyes and ears on something 369 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:13,280 Speaker 2: that can tell no lies. There's no trauma involved with 370 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:17,479 Speaker 2: a camera. The camera is simply stating the facts and 371 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:22,679 Speaker 2: ready to be downloaded to help an investigator say, Ahi, okay, 372 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 2: here's something that we now know that we didn't know before. 373 00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,920 Speaker 1: So I mean, it's not just Christmas break for the students. 374 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,080 Speaker 1: The teachers are gone, a lot of the maintenance is 375 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: going to be gone, the coaches are going to be gone, 376 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,720 Speaker 1: and so you know, law enforcement, they've probably scaled back 377 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,040 Speaker 1: a lot too. A lot of them are probably going 378 00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 1: to be able to take vacation. So you know that 379 00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:51,960 Speaker 1: campus is going to be somewhat deserted. Not everybody's leaving. 380 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 1: There'll be some international students that stay behind, but I'm 381 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,320 Speaker 1: saying for the most part, everybody's going to have somewhere 382 00:28:57,360 --> 00:28:59,280 Speaker 1: to be. They're going to go home with somebody else, 383 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 1: or you know, they're going home themselves. So I just 384 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:08,200 Speaker 1: think probably this person was super aware that things were relaxed. 385 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:12,640 Speaker 1: Everybody wasn't there. Maybe even law enforcement didn't have the 386 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:16,880 Speaker 1: same amount of people even patrolling. Do you think that's possible. 387 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 2: I think that's very possible. And as you know, every 388 00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 2: theory should be in red. In a war room where 389 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:33,800 Speaker 2: all the investigators are sitting at a round table, square 390 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 2: whatever and theorizing. What let's start. Let's start with the 391 00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 2: the each Let's go around the room. Everybody give us 392 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 2: a thought. Where is this a domestic gone bad? Is 393 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 2: this a love triangle? Is this a student that was 394 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 2: kicked out? Is this a veiled threat that turned into 395 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 2: a reaction? What every imaginable Is this a random act? 396 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 2: Is this somebody who has no connection to the area 397 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,160 Speaker 2: jumped off ninety five and said, I think I'm going 398 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:17,720 Speaker 2: to go find the first whatever? Right, every imaginable theory, motive, 399 00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 2: thought is put in red. And then you say, where 400 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,520 Speaker 2: does the evidence take us? Is it taking us closer 401 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 2: to one or further away? So? I absolutely, And of course, 402 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 2: like anything, you start with your inner circle. And in 403 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:43,600 Speaker 2: the classroom setting, what's that inner circle? The connection to 404 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 2: the students. I heard a colleagues say the victimology, absolutely, 405 00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:54,560 Speaker 2: and the question the further we get away four or 406 00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:57,720 Speaker 2: five days as we are getting away. The evidence is 407 00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 2: grown cold, evidence is being lost. 408 00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:07,720 Speaker 1: When I saw the video, I thought, well, this person 409 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:11,760 Speaker 1: clearly doesn't have an AR fifteen, so it looks like 410 00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:14,920 Speaker 1: a handgun. So he wanted to be closer, he wanted 411 00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:20,080 Speaker 1: to be more deliberate. Interesting. And then when he's pacing 412 00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 1: in front of that one house with the fence, he 413 00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 1: turns and he puts his arms behind his back and 414 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:30,440 Speaker 1: he's looking around and he's walking. He looks like a 415 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:35,400 Speaker 1: middle aged man, possibly from the Middle East. Am I crazy? 416 00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 1: Or does that how he looks to you? 417 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:42,720 Speaker 2: So, having traveled a little bit in my previous job, 418 00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:47,400 Speaker 2: when he put his hands immediately behind his back, my 419 00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:50,560 Speaker 2: first thought was, and as an investigator, if I was 420 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 2: in that room, I would be saying, as soon as 421 00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:58,840 Speaker 2: I saw that video, that's an international why because I've 422 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 2: experienced where I have been with plenty of my law 423 00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:10,600 Speaker 2: enforcement friends in the Middle East, where I even joked, 424 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 2: you guys all walk around with your hands behind your back, 425 00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 2: and it's so we and and that's what our jobs are. 426 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:24,600 Speaker 2: Right to make assessments, judgments and allow the evidence to 427 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:28,719 Speaker 2: say otherwise. But I would absolutely agree with you. I 428 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 2: felt at that moment when the very first video we 429 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:35,560 Speaker 2: saw of the man turning a corner, I'm like, ah, okay, 430 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 2: he's not running. He doesn't seem as we have seen 431 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 2: active shooters where they actually commit the act and they 432 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,760 Speaker 2: are so thrown off because they've realized this, what have 433 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 2: I done? And that's why they don't have an exit 434 00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 2: plan that it is I'm going to meet law enforcement 435 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 2: and going to meet face to face, and it's going 436 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:06,880 Speaker 2: to be my demise. The reality has set in and 437 00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 2: here it seems like, especially as more video, he's casing 438 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 2: and pacing well in advance where he seems to really 439 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:24,120 Speaker 2: be methodical, which tells me not random, but very targeted. 440 00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,000 Speaker 2: And then of the video with him putting his hands 441 00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:33,400 Speaker 2: behind his back, that seemed very natural. It was a 442 00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 2: very natural thing for him to do. And he wanted 443 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 2: to look in place, not out of place. But to me, 444 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:45,120 Speaker 2: I thought, boy, he definitely looked out of place and 445 00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 2: not from here, do I That was my first thought. 446 00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:52,200 Speaker 1: Okay, mine too, And that's the kind of thing to me. Again, 447 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:55,760 Speaker 1: any information they have regarding that, they should put it 448 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,880 Speaker 1: out because he's got to get gasoline somewhere, he's got 449 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:02,640 Speaker 1: to eat somewhere, he's got to sleep somewhere where if 450 00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,240 Speaker 1: we don't know who we're looking for. And I think 451 00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:10,400 Speaker 1: that's what's critical for me. Stop trying to protect or 452 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,600 Speaker 1: you know, make sure you only say something that you 453 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:17,040 Speaker 1: one hundred percent know, you already know, you already know 454 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,959 Speaker 1: what your victims have said that have survived it. Tell 455 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 1: it because you need people's help to find him. You 456 00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:27,560 Speaker 1: don't know where he is. And again now we've had 457 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:32,560 Speaker 1: another engineer murdered because he opened his front door. That 458 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:37,280 Speaker 1: seems targeted. That seems way too close, that seems way 459 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:41,719 Speaker 1: too you know, I don't like it. I don't like it. 460 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:47,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, and especially in light of everything else that is 461 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:53,000 Speaker 2: seems to be taking place around the world. Australia, we 462 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 2: are in the holiest of holy seasons, are we not? 463 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:59,120 Speaker 2: We are no matter what faith you have, it is 464 00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 2: the holiest of seasons. And so I remember a year 465 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:10,360 Speaker 2: after year, you know, receiving some sort of intelligence bulletin 466 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,840 Speaker 2: that says, beyond the lookout, this is a time where 467 00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:20,080 Speaker 2: law enforcement needs to be vigilant and looking out for 468 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,879 Speaker 2: you know, maybe a piece of intelligence came out. Sure, 469 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:28,480 Speaker 2: and it seems like, especially between last New Year's Eve 470 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:32,960 Speaker 2: where you had too. Well, you had the New Orleans 471 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,800 Speaker 2: and then Las Vegas, right, they seem to be connected, 472 00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:42,880 Speaker 2: but they were two different types of terror plots. And 473 00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:46,560 Speaker 2: and yet the season it's it's it's the season, and 474 00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:50,360 Speaker 2: so law enforcement is vigilant thing. And we just saw 475 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:55,000 Speaker 2: the New Year's Eve plot in Los Angeles foiled. There 476 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 2: is something going on, and I do believe if it's 477 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:05,319 Speaker 2: not connected, there are people coming out that are targeting 478 00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:07,640 Speaker 2: this season specifically. 479 00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:11,879 Speaker 1: And here's the reality. Even if it's not connected, we 480 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:18,280 Speaker 1: know one suicide causes another causes another. One school shooting 481 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:22,279 Speaker 1: causes another causes another. We know that you can call 482 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 1: it copycat, you can call it whatever you want, but 483 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:28,239 Speaker 1: we do know that occurs. It's almost like, hey, he 484 00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:30,839 Speaker 1: did it, the time is right, I'm going to do it. 485 00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:33,040 Speaker 1: So to me, that is a. 486 00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 2: Connectivity where the individuals may not be following orders from 487 00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:46,200 Speaker 2: one specific group or person, but they know enough where hey, 488 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:50,120 Speaker 2: we're coming out in this time to wreak havoc because 489 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:54,200 Speaker 2: this is a happy time of preparation time for so 490 00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:57,719 Speaker 2: many people, and ultimately we want to disrupt that. 491 00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:02,440 Speaker 1: And you know, you mentioned how Los Angeles just thwarted 492 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:08,520 Speaker 1: a terrorist attack that was outstanding police work. That's an 493 00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,440 Speaker 1: example of when more than one agency works together, what 494 00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:15,279 Speaker 1: can get done and lives can be saved. I mean, 495 00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 1: they had drone footage of them practicing blowing things up. 496 00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:23,840 Speaker 1: And you know one thing they mentioned is these folks talked, 497 00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:27,760 Speaker 1: they share things, they thought they were on encrypted apps 498 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:31,759 Speaker 1: and that sort of thing. But our intelligence community got 499 00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,600 Speaker 1: a hold of it. Put their picture on a wall, 500 00:37:34,719 --> 00:37:37,319 Speaker 1: like you said, get in that war room, put their 501 00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:40,000 Speaker 1: picture up, put their address up. What are they saying? 502 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:43,880 Speaker 1: What is their target date? Well, here we are and 503 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:47,480 Speaker 1: if it is the Holy season, it's pretty clear. It's 504 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:51,560 Speaker 1: pretty clear. Australia, Los Angeles, Rhode Island. 505 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:57,680 Speaker 2: Yes, And we know from research that these type of 506 00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 2: incidents incidents of hate, regardless of what your target of 507 00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:10,640 Speaker 2: hate is. That people don't think in a vacuum. They 508 00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:13,879 Speaker 2: are talking about it, they are chatting about it, they 509 00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 2: are doing something overtly about it, and somebody knows something, 510 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:25,600 Speaker 2: they've overheard something, or they can't imagine, Oh my gosh, 511 00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:30,680 Speaker 2: I would have never imagined the person would have actually 512 00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:34,480 Speaker 2: carried something out right. We all say stupid stuff, We 513 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:39,200 Speaker 2: all think out loud, sometimes to our friends or inner circles, 514 00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:44,480 Speaker 2: but no different in these type of situations, even if 515 00:38:44,520 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 2: they're lone wolves or they're lone actors or withdrawn from society, 516 00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:53,680 Speaker 2: they are putting that information out somewhere on a platform somewhere, 517 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:58,320 Speaker 2: and I would be hard pressed to believe that Providence, 518 00:38:58,400 --> 00:38:59,960 Speaker 2: Rhode Island is anything to. 519 00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:04,319 Speaker 1: Scott Duffy and I recorded this episode a couple of 520 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:08,600 Speaker 1: days ago. Last night there was a conclusion to the 521 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:12,080 Speaker 1: case where the shooter was found deceased. So we're going 522 00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:14,799 Speaker 1: to now just do a little tag at the end 523 00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:17,280 Speaker 1: and now we're just going to give a quick summation 524 00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:21,040 Speaker 1: about the things that it transpired overnight. Well, Scott Duffy, 525 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:23,080 Speaker 1: we were pretty close. 526 00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:27,840 Speaker 2: I tell you, Cheryl, what a night, right. I mean, 527 00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:32,200 Speaker 2: so much has taken place. How many states are involved 528 00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:36,839 Speaker 2: in this investigation, and I would agree, I think we 529 00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 2: were as close as could be without being in that 530 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:41,799 Speaker 2: war room of detectives. 531 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:45,560 Speaker 1: That's right. And let me tell you, I'm a little frustrated, 532 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,279 Speaker 1: and I don't know about you, but I think when 533 00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:51,680 Speaker 1: they refuse to give a description, they refused to show 534 00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:54,640 Speaker 1: the cameras on the inside, they refused to give a 535 00:39:54,719 --> 00:39:58,760 Speaker 1: name afterwards, and then they say things like he took 536 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:04,000 Speaker 1: counter measures to not be discovered. Change in a license 537 00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:07,840 Speaker 1: plate is nineteen twenty, Like, what are you talking about 538 00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:09,600 Speaker 1: as a countermeasure? 539 00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:13,000 Speaker 2: You know? And we both agree, as I can see 540 00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:20,120 Speaker 2: many colleagues across speaking about this. With regards to press conferences, 541 00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:23,720 Speaker 2: what is going on between the leadership and the investigators. 542 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:30,360 Speaker 2: There's some disconnect. I don't think. I don't think that 543 00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:36,480 Speaker 2: that could be understated or overstated. The detectives. I believe 544 00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:42,919 Speaker 2: that they were doing their work and hunting down which 545 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:46,040 Speaker 2: ultimately came down to the shooter who took his own life. 546 00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:53,000 Speaker 2: But the press conference is the information coming out. I 547 00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 2: think they got to go back and say, okay, own 548 00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:59,799 Speaker 2: up to Hey, what are the missteps? What are things 549 00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,200 Speaker 2: that we could do better? And we'll do. 550 00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:06,360 Speaker 1: Better best practices that's always what you should take away. 551 00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:09,600 Speaker 1: And here's the thing. Look at the number of people 552 00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:15,759 Speaker 1: that they targeted. Everybody was sharing photographs and I want 553 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:18,280 Speaker 1: to just kind of put this out there for people. 554 00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:23,400 Speaker 1: If it does not come from law enforcement in a 555 00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:26,960 Speaker 1: situation like this, I wouldn't share it. There were a 556 00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:31,279 Speaker 1: lot of students whose pictures were put up as a 557 00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:36,040 Speaker 1: person of interest and that's real dangerous and you can 558 00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:40,640 Speaker 1: truly hurt people because to me, when I saw the video, 559 00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:44,000 Speaker 1: it looked like a middle aged person. It looked like 560 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:48,240 Speaker 1: a middle aged, overweight man, and again with his hands 561 00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:53,680 Speaker 1: behind his back, looked like a particular culture. But when 562 00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:58,600 Speaker 1: you refuse to tell people that's what you're breeding, you're 563 00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:01,120 Speaker 1: breeding fear, and they're gonna be like, he looks like 564 00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:03,480 Speaker 1: this guy. No, he looks like that guy. No, Now, 565 00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:05,759 Speaker 1: we won't y'all to help us find this guy. Come 566 00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:06,200 Speaker 1: on now. 567 00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:10,160 Speaker 2: The public is always ready to fill in that vacuum, right, 568 00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:15,080 Speaker 2: and so they have their own ideas, and when the 569 00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:18,680 Speaker 2: leadership allows those ideas to fester, you can't then just 570 00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:21,520 Speaker 2: come back at the end and say, hey, stop doing 571 00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,839 Speaker 2: it now. It's always going to happen as part of 572 00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:29,440 Speaker 2: our culture. And yes, we all take a lesson from this, 573 00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:32,160 Speaker 2: but I would agree a lot of people putting out 574 00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:35,680 Speaker 2: names of individuals, names that you just can't pull that back, 575 00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:40,640 Speaker 2: and they walk around with a target on their back 576 00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:44,360 Speaker 2: saying what did I do? While at the same time, 577 00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:50,719 Speaker 2: you have information that could be put out a little 578 00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:56,680 Speaker 2: bit earlier in order to continue to direct the information 579 00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:00,560 Speaker 2: to where people who are listening, and people are listening everywhere. 580 00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,560 Speaker 2: Can say I think I have something to offer and 581 00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:08,360 Speaker 2: send it to a tip line or something else that ultimately, 582 00:43:09,520 --> 00:43:13,480 Speaker 2: you know, we all step back and we realized their 583 00:43:13,560 --> 00:43:14,280 Speaker 2: lessons learned. 584 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:18,600 Speaker 1: Well, let's talk about the Christmas miracle. You and I 585 00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:22,000 Speaker 1: talked about the general public. You can't have enough eyes 586 00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:24,399 Speaker 1: and ears. We said it, we were clear about it. 587 00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:29,680 Speaker 1: And along comes our witness. Along comes the person that 588 00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:32,520 Speaker 1: helped crack the case, or did crack the case as 589 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,560 Speaker 1: far as I'm concerned, because he had a person, and 590 00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:39,080 Speaker 1: he had a vehicle, and he knew that person engaged 591 00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,640 Speaker 1: that vehicle with their keyfob. This is a homeless person 592 00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:47,600 Speaker 1: named John who's living in the basement of the building 593 00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:53,040 Speaker 1: where the attacks occurred, who saw the killer earlier in 594 00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:58,719 Speaker 1: the day, followed him, watched him unlock a car and 595 00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:01,840 Speaker 1: then lock it back and walk away from it, almost 596 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,759 Speaker 1: like he thought, m I shouldn't let him see me 597 00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,480 Speaker 1: go to this car. He knew the car, remembered the car, 598 00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:12,440 Speaker 1: and then he went to Reddit and told them, y'all, 599 00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:16,800 Speaker 1: I'm dead serious. This is what happened. I engaged this person, 600 00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:20,440 Speaker 1: saw this person. I've got the car. This is what 601 00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:23,760 Speaker 1: law enforcement needs to be looking for. Day Z wrote 602 00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:26,800 Speaker 1: in on the car they went to the flock cameras. 603 00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:29,400 Speaker 1: And for y'all that don't know what a flock camera is, 604 00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:33,239 Speaker 1: law enforcement can put in a tag number or a 605 00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:37,319 Speaker 1: vehicle description, and those cameras will tell every time that 606 00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:41,080 Speaker 1: car hit a camera, and you can follow somebody from 607 00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:45,160 Speaker 1: Florida to Nebraska. And that's what they did, and that's 608 00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:46,840 Speaker 1: how they got to New Hampshire. 609 00:44:47,160 --> 00:44:51,920 Speaker 2: That is a miracle. Who knows what this person was 610 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:58,440 Speaker 2: up to. Next, the investigation hopefully will figure out that, Okay, 611 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:03,600 Speaker 2: this is what we believe took place through whatever his writings, 612 00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:09,560 Speaker 2: if they exist, did he have a kill list? Were 613 00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:14,480 Speaker 2: their additional people? I would like to see if the 614 00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:20,360 Speaker 2: investigation can close this door on what took him to 615 00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:24,839 Speaker 2: Brown University other than his past twenty some odd years ago, 616 00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,160 Speaker 2: What festered, what took place, what was that trigger that 617 00:45:29,239 --> 00:45:33,120 Speaker 2: brought him in? And unlike active shooters we have seen 618 00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:38,360 Speaker 2: in the past, this person was casing not just hours before, 619 00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:42,080 Speaker 2: but at the very least a week before, right encountered 620 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:48,120 Speaker 2: by additional people on that campus, around that campus. But absolutely, Cheryl, 621 00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:53,920 Speaker 2: thank God for this individual, this guy named John John 622 00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:58,000 Speaker 2: ought to receive not only that reward, but everything in 623 00:45:58,040 --> 00:45:58,640 Speaker 2: addition to. 624 00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:02,600 Speaker 1: One hundred percent. There needs to be a GoFundMe for 625 00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:06,359 Speaker 1: him right now. And here's the thing. If you look 626 00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:10,080 Speaker 1: at this crime and then you look at the second crime, 627 00:46:10,200 --> 00:46:12,319 Speaker 1: and we talked about this off air, but I want 628 00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:15,080 Speaker 1: to talk about it on air right now. Here's what 629 00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:20,880 Speaker 1: came to my head immediately. DC sniper was the shooting 630 00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:28,239 Speaker 1: at Brown A smoke screen, a red heron a I'm 631 00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:31,360 Speaker 1: going to make them focus on this, so they missed 632 00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:36,960 Speaker 1: the professor. I think this person thought, they'll never connect it. 633 00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:40,120 Speaker 1: It's in another state, it's another person. This was at 634 00:46:40,120 --> 00:46:43,040 Speaker 1: a school, this is at a home. They'll never see 635 00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:47,520 Speaker 1: it as the same perpetrator. That's what I think he believed. 636 00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:50,719 Speaker 1: I think the target was the professor. 637 00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:55,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, very possible. Right. Think about the amount of time 638 00:46:55,560 --> 00:47:03,760 Speaker 2: and effort he goes in case Brown University. Think about 639 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:06,560 Speaker 2: everything that he had put all his efforts in, and 640 00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:11,440 Speaker 2: at the very least you think that this witness John 641 00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:19,200 Speaker 2: being courageous enough to actually have a conversation to try 642 00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:22,799 Speaker 2: to get more out of him, that that would have 643 00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:28,359 Speaker 2: sent this shooter far from the campus, saying whatever it 644 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:30,520 Speaker 2: is I was planning on doing I'm now going to 645 00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:33,840 Speaker 2: go do somewhere else. No, he stuck it out. He 646 00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:41,799 Speaker 2: committed these acts of violence hours after that. So it 647 00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:46,400 Speaker 2: is very possible that his whole intent because he knew 648 00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:50,880 Speaker 2: where this professor lived, knew probably did his research, and 649 00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:55,960 Speaker 2: then goes and does what he does. That those are 650 00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:00,359 Speaker 2: two different mindsets. An actual shooter and in a targeted 651 00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:06,359 Speaker 2: individual in their own home, absolutely two different mindsets. It's 652 00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:10,360 Speaker 2: very possible that that was a smoke screen. He obviously 653 00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:17,040 Speaker 2: had some pass connection. But I can't imagine twenty some 654 00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:21,320 Speaker 2: odd years later feeling the need to go back and 655 00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:26,319 Speaker 2: do anything other than, hey, I have I'm familiar with 656 00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:31,040 Speaker 2: these surroundings here, so let me do something catastrophic in 657 00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:34,319 Speaker 2: order to disappear and do what I need to do. 658 00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:35,200 Speaker 2: Very possible. 659 00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:40,040 Speaker 1: Well, more answers are coming. More will come today. I 660 00:48:40,080 --> 00:48:44,480 Speaker 1: believe one hundred percent. There'll be a manifesto. They'll be 661 00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:48,319 Speaker 1: writing on social media. There'll be statements that he's made 662 00:48:48,360 --> 00:48:54,080 Speaker 1: to loved ones and brands. These folks never operate in 663 00:48:54,160 --> 00:48:59,840 Speaker 1: a vacuum. They are usually extremely verbal, extremely outspoken about 664 00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:03,360 Speaker 1: the things that they're upset about. Matt about it'll be 665 00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:07,880 Speaker 1: there somewhere if they don't already have it. But Scott W. 666 00:49:08,080 --> 00:49:12,560 Speaker 1: I appreciate your insight and your expertise as always. 667 00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:15,399 Speaker 2: Thank you, I thank you very much. 668 00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:17,719 Speaker 1: I'm going to end Zone seven the way that I 669 00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:23,239 Speaker 1: always do with a quote animals don't hate, and we're 670 00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:30,399 Speaker 1: supposed to be better than them, Elvis Presley. I'm Cheryl McCollum, 671 00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:31,520 Speaker 1: and this is only seven