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Speaker 1: You won't be able to find a bottle of cocoa

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Speaker 1: butter from the Olympic Peninsula of Portland after this. Dude,

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Speaker 1: I'm not messing with power lines, like, not even for

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Speaker 1: a horse leather swim bait. I'm not doing that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: obviously it didn't pay too much attention because it hasn't

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Speaker 1: worked out too wealthy now with the thrift shop equipment right,

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Speaker 1: it appears they're like a shipload of casual fish dabblers

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Speaker 1: in Vegas apparently, and the vast majority of them cannot

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Speaker 1: cast Good Morning, degenerate anglers, and welcome to Ben the

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Speaker 1: Fishing podcast that cannot eat at Cheat Cheese without pretending

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Speaker 1: it's someone's birthday so we can get another sombrero. I'm

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Speaker 1: Joe Surmelli a Miles Nulty, and I have never once

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Speaker 1: in my life eaten the cheat cheese, but I did

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Speaker 1: just I saw you put this in and I was like,

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Speaker 1: I never did that, but I did. I did. Just

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Speaker 1: now do a Google search so I could know what

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Speaker 1: the hell we're talking about. And cheat cheese has not

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Speaker 1: existed in this country for fifteen years now. I don't

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Speaker 1: know if you know that, so it looks like I

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Speaker 1: never will get to eat it one. I also have

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Speaker 1: no idea where it is you're going with this cheechee thing. Wait,

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Speaker 1: they're all gone, Like they've been gone around where I

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Speaker 1: live for a long time. But they're all gone. There's

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Speaker 1: no cheechee left in the in the United States, bankrupt

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Speaker 1: gone in two thousand four, though apparently you can still

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Speaker 1: find them in Austria, the United Arab Emirates, and Quait

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Speaker 1: if you're really needing to fix I can't believe it

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Speaker 1: was two thousand four. Was the last time I hated

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Speaker 1: a cheechee? Man? That's depressing that. You also just kind

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Speaker 1: of messed up my whole plan, like throwing this this

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Speaker 1: bummer news about chee cheese. Um, like the very loose

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Speaker 1: theme I was going forward. This episode is frivolous celebration,

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Speaker 1: you know, like like some of us used to do

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Speaker 1: that a crappy Mexican restaurant chains. Um. Because it's not spring,

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Speaker 1: so we're clear, but it is now at least officially March.

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Speaker 1: And that's at least a step in the right direction

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Speaker 1: for me. The end of February is worth celebrating eating

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Speaker 1: uh in my opinion. And this episode it's like, um,

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Speaker 1: the lame office party you get like right before you

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Speaker 1: get married, you know what I mean. Like it's kind

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Speaker 1: of awkward and everyone encircles you in the common area

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Speaker 1: and you toast with a plastic cup of champagne and

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Speaker 1: really really bad. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. It's it's strange,

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Speaker 1: but it gets you away from from reality for a minute.

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Speaker 1: But you do still have like TPS reports to finish

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Speaker 1: before you dip for two weeks and have the real party.

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Speaker 1: So like that's where we are in terms of the

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Speaker 1: show today, as well as like spring, like it's March,

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Speaker 1: like it's not spring. We're getting there, um and look

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Speaker 1: for the record, right listen. We love ice fishing. Ice

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Speaker 1: fishing is awesome. In fact, late march ice is some

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Speaker 1: of the best ice. We know this. But I'm just

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Speaker 1: tired of talking about it. And i want my open water.

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Speaker 1: That's what I want. Yep, yep, no, that's fair. I'm

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Speaker 1: I'm also sick, like I do have some open water,

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Speaker 1: but I'm sick of of when I go find it,

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Speaker 1: having to dodge arrant chunks of shelf ice that always

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Speaker 1: drift just below the surface and you can't really see them,

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Speaker 1: and they're always threatening to take you out at the knees,

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Speaker 1: or at least that's that's my experience. So uh, in

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Speaker 1: honor of of the impending reality that we hope will

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Speaker 1: be spring, Yes, that's right, yes, right, ghost of Rick James,

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Speaker 1: and we are ringing in the almost kind of soon

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Speaker 1: to be spring, we all hope by giving one of

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Speaker 1: you some really cool ship to throw. That's right. You

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Speaker 1: need to listen up, you need to pay attention right now,

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Speaker 1: do not fast forward. Uh you know how we've been

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Speaker 1: monitoring those degenerate Angler and Bent podcast hashtags on the

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Speaker 1: Graham right, So for exactly one week, there's gonna be

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Speaker 1: more up for grabs than stickers for using those. Okay,

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Speaker 1: our buddy Brent Hashimoto of Hashimoto Concepts has graciously donated

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Speaker 1: four packs of his amazing handboard soft plastic swim baits

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Speaker 1: plus one of his h C four hard swim baits,

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Speaker 1: to be given to the hashtagger of our choosing. So sweet,

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Speaker 1: you guys are also lucky, That's what I'm gonna say.

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Speaker 1: And and that alone is cool, but even better, the

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Speaker 1: winner gets to have the paint job on the hard

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Speaker 1: bait done to speck. So if you want a blue gill,

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Speaker 1: that looks like it just snooted a cloud cheeto dust.

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Speaker 1: You got it. You can have that, or maybe you

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Speaker 1: can I don't know. Maybe you prefer a swim bait

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Speaker 1: somehow themed around the four classic movie Break into Electric Boogaloo.

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Speaker 1: What that actually was my favorite movie when I was

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Speaker 1: five years older and uh yeah, yeah, I competed in

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Speaker 1: the first grade talent show as a breakdanswer. But whatever

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Speaker 1: your fetish happens to be, whatever you're into, Brent will

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Speaker 1: turn it into a lure just for you. Oh man,

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Speaker 1: I want you to win. We can do a Boogaloo laure. Um.

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Speaker 1: You've got between right now on March five and when

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Speaker 1: the next episode of Bent drops on Friday, March twelve.

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Speaker 1: To qualify, though, the shot with the tag or tags

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Speaker 1: has to be posted in that time frame, and we'll

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Speaker 1: be monitoring the Degenerate Angler and Bent podcast tags and

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Speaker 1: we'll post a winner on our Instagram accounts the morning

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Speaker 1: of Saturday. So impress us with a fish, make us laugh,

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Speaker 1: make us gasp, show us something ridiculous in your garage.

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Speaker 1: Anything goes kind of almost almost almost if you if you,

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Speaker 1: if you regularly listen to the show, you know what

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Speaker 1: We don't want to see, but do surprise us. That's

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Speaker 1: always good. And I just want to say huge thanks

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Speaker 1: again to Brent for offering his talents. Uh. If you

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Speaker 1: want to scope out his work, and I really do

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Speaker 1: recommend that you do that, check him out at at

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Speaker 1: Hashimoto Concepts. This stuff is super fishy, but also it's

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Speaker 1: just it's just pretty well made. It's just nice to

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Speaker 1: look at. You know, it's gorgeous. And and perhaps you're

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Speaker 1: one of those people who doesn't really fish lures. That's cool,

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Speaker 1: that's fine. Maybe maybe don't take anything this week. If

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Speaker 1: that's you, I disagree, I disagree with me. You can

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Speaker 1: still appreciate one of those beautiful lures even if you

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Speaker 1: are one of those live bait disciples. And and you

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Speaker 1: just have every intention of rolling right on through hard

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Speaker 1: water into open water with your bucket of minnows. No

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Speaker 1: judgment here. We have you covered two in this week's

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Speaker 1: installment of Finn Clips, where we tell you everything about

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Speaker 1: a fish you never knew you cared about. Joe is

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Speaker 1: going to shine some light on the fat head minnow.

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Speaker 1: And sure we've all probably stabbed, decapitated, jig trolled, and

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Speaker 1: suffocated dozens, if not hundreds of them, But what do

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Speaker 1: you really know about him? Have you really taken the

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Speaker 1: time to appreciate this ubiquitous bait fish. How much thought

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Speaker 1: do you give to the bait in your bucket? Probably

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Speaker 1: not much, right, I mean, you can't wait to throw

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Speaker 1: a shot of that football yellow perch on Instagram dropping

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Speaker 1: yet another comment about the Gorgeah city of the vibrant

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Speaker 1: golds and oranges. You change your profile picture to you

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Speaker 1: holding a slab croppy, but never is there social media

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Speaker 1: thanks and praise given to the live bait that may

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Speaker 1: have caught it. So today I'm shining the spotlight on

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Speaker 1: the fat head minnows swimming in your flow troll. And

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Speaker 1: even though you won't treat the next dozen you buy

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Speaker 1: any differently, you're gonna look at them differently while you're

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Speaker 1: impelling them on a hook. Fat Head minnows are members

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Speaker 1: of the Suprnidae family. Sound familiar, of course not, you

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Speaker 1: don't know Latin, but you are familiar with other members

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Speaker 1: of this family, like the common carp and perhaps the barball.

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Speaker 1: This family also includes true minnows and seeing many people

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Speaker 1: just refer to any tiny bait fish as a minnow,

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Speaker 1: but that's not accurate. Mud minnows, as an example, aren't

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Speaker 1: minnows at all. They're killie fish. Glass minnows aren't minnows either,

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Speaker 1: that's just to catch all term for anchovies and silver sides.

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Speaker 1: But fat heads are the real deal. Directly related to

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Speaker 1: the monstrous Colorado pike minnow, the largest true minnow that

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Speaker 1: swims in US water. The fat heads natural range is

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Speaker 1: pretty massive, stretching from Chihuahua, Mexico, as far north as

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Speaker 1: Great Slave Lake in the Northwest Territories. It also extends

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Speaker 1: all the way east to the U. S Coast and

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Speaker 1: Canadian Maritimes. Of course, these days, fat headed minnows are everywhere,

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Speaker 1: including Pacific Coast bodies of water and drainages from transportation.

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Speaker 1: Thanks to their popularity as a bait fish, but also

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Speaker 1: because they are some extremely tough little bastards. Fat headed

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Speaker 1: minnows can pretty much handle any curveball Mother Nature throws

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Speaker 1: at them. They can survive in water with extremely low

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Speaker 1: oxygen levels. They can thrive in extremely dirty or turbid water.

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Speaker 1: They can withstand high levels of acidity, and all this toughness,

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Speaker 1: of course makes them a great bait fish, because if

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Speaker 1: your bubbler dies while you're enjoying the moon's over Miami

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Speaker 1: at Denny's, or you're looking for action in that sewage

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Speaker 1: filled pond behind that Denny's. These little swimmers are gonna

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Speaker 1: go strong and perform well. But that toughness actually has

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Speaker 1: greater value than just helping you secure fish fry fodder.

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Speaker 1: The fat head minnow is used by biologists as an

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Speaker 1: indicator species. Think of it as an aquatic canary in

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Speaker 1: the coal mine. Essentially, fat heads can handle so much

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Speaker 1: more chemical exposure than other species that if the fat

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Speaker 1: head population is getting distressed in a particular waterway known

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Speaker 1: to have any sort of toxicity issues, it's a signed

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Speaker 1: to biologists that things are getting really bad. In fact,

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Speaker 1: the e p A Guidelines outline the use of fat

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Speaker 1: heads for the evaluation of acute and chronic toxicity of

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Speaker 1: samples or chemical species invertebrate animals. And speaking of chemicals,

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Speaker 1: how about this. Fat heads also have something called epidermal

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Speaker 1: club cells that secrete an alarm substance. Anytime those shallow

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Speaker 1: lying cells are damaged, such as when a predator species

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Speaker 1: bites or eats a fat head, that alarm juice flows,

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Speaker 1: signaling all the other fat heads in the immediate area

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Speaker 1: to swim away or hide. Furthermore, let's say there's a

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Speaker 1: I don't know pickerel that just muched a bunch of

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Speaker 1: fat heads. That pickerel is now coated with that alarm

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Speaker 1: substance too, So now the fat heads will recognize that

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Speaker 1: particular fish as a threat, hopefully before it gets the

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Speaker 1: chance to eat any more of them. Most good bait

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Speaker 1: shops sell fat head minnows these days. But what if

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Speaker 1: you don't have a good bait shop close to home. Well,

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Speaker 1: perhaps you have a pet smart You know those little

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Speaker 1: pinkish orange fish they call rosie reds that they sell

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Speaker 1: his feeders super cheap. Those are fat head minnows genetically

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Speaker 1: identical to the bait shop variety. Now, while that coloration

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Speaker 1: trait can occur naturally, it was actually an Arkansas bait

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Speaker 1: fish farm that figured out how to make it dominant,

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Speaker 1: sending billions of bright orange fat heads off to death

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Speaker 1: by aquarium cyclid across the country. Now, it's worth noting

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Speaker 1: that before using Rosie's, check your local bait regulations. While

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Speaker 1: unlike goldfish, Rosie's are fair game in most places, some

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Speaker 1: states are even specific counties outlaw them same time. I've

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Speaker 1: also been in many bait shops that sell bright rosie's

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Speaker 1: right alongside the natural color fat heads. And I've even

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Speaker 1: known a few croppy and stocker trout fellers that swore

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Speaker 1: them orange ones out fish them natural ones tend to one.

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Speaker 1: It's also worth noting that pet shop rosies aren't usually

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Speaker 1: as hardy as bait shop fat heads, mainly because good

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Speaker 1: bait shops actually care about their bait and keep their

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Speaker 1: minnows and chilled water, whereas pet store rosies tend to

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Speaker 1: swim in room temperature or even heated water. Now, both

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Speaker 1: those water temperatures hot and cold are perfectly acceptable to

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Speaker 1: the fat heads. But don't be shocked if you take

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Speaker 1: pet store roses out to the pond in winter, only

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Speaker 1: for them to be shocked to death when you send

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Speaker 1: them down thereby not dancing around on that hook long

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Speaker 1: enough for you to achieve instant glory or to produce

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Speaker 1: anything to dredge through that house. Ultry seafood breader burning

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Speaker 1: a hole in the pantry back at the ranch. Who

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Speaker 1: knew that the tiny little little fat heads that you

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Speaker 1: see in every in every aerated bait shop were so

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Speaker 1: environmentally significant I'd say that I didn't know, and dude,

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Speaker 1: that that alarm response. That's fascinating. It's fascinating. It's also

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Speaker 1: if you think about it too much, they'll If you

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Speaker 1: overthink about it, it's kind of depressing because, like, imagine

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Speaker 1: two fat heads rigged up and dangling close together, and

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Speaker 1: and one one just catches a whiff of the other

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Speaker 1: one's alarm juice is like, oh no, I should, I

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Speaker 1: should really get the hell out of here. But I

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Speaker 1: got this. I got this hook stuck in my face,

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Speaker 1: So I guess. I guess I'm just gonna get eaten too.

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Speaker 1: I'm done. That's morbid, and that would suck. I will

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Speaker 1: admit that I got I got kind of lost research

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Speaker 1: in that one. And we we don't give enough thought

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Speaker 1: to our live baits, like it's good to take a

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Speaker 1: deep dive and what's in your bait bucket? You're that

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Speaker 1: You're right, that is true in general, but in this

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Speaker 1: particular episode, right now, this week, that is not true,

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Speaker 1: because you're bringing in the bait fish by the bucket

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Speaker 1: for this one. If I'm not mistaken. You recently attended

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Speaker 1: the the annual Bunker Symposium and Chili cook Off in

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Speaker 1: Atlantic City. Did you not? Didn't that happen? I didn't

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Speaker 1: think I did. Yes, and we'll go from tiny sweetwater

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Speaker 1: bait fish to foot long salty bait fish. In fact,

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Speaker 1: in other good news, uh, striper season just open in

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Speaker 1: Jersey March one, so this is good timing anyway. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Every year, the greatest serf chunkers in Jersey meet at

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Speaker 1: the Atlantic City Marriott, or to be more specific, the

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Speaker 1: loading dock behind the Atlantic City Mariott to discuss the

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Speaker 1: state of man Haden, or what we call bunker around here.

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Speaker 1: And it's a it's a really great event and usually

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Speaker 1: runs until ten ten thirty or whenever security kicks everyone

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Speaker 1: off the property. Um. Anyway, it would take me forever

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Speaker 1: to go through all the meeting minutes, but I did

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Speaker 1: get a chance to sit down in person with frequent

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Speaker 1: Bent contributor and surfcasting legend Bob the Garbage Man Britana

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Speaker 1: on a newski. I want the minutes please. I think

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Speaker 1: whatever the hell those were would be highly entertaining. But

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Speaker 1: you know, since you're not gonna give us those, I

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Speaker 1: can only imagine that that. I'm sure Bob waxed eloquently

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Speaker 1: on on. I don't know, Bunker Biomass concert Asian efforts

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Speaker 1: or something. Didn't he No, no, not at all. He

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Speaker 1: refused to discuss anything related to that on record, but

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Speaker 1: I did get him to commit to recording a trivia

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Speaker 1: segment with me. You gotta be highly skilled for these shows.

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Speaker 1: You understand that. If I under are you well versed?

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Speaker 1: They are? You very smart man. All right, Today on Trivia,

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Speaker 1: we have an incredibly special guest. I am actually sitting

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Speaker 1: face to face special. You broke out all this Mickey

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Speaker 1: Mouse equipment from the thrift shop for me. You don't

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Speaker 1: like the equipment, This is garbage. I've seen better ship

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Speaker 1: of karaoke night. Okay, As I was saying, I am

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Speaker 1: sitting face to face in Atlantic City, New Jersey with

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Speaker 1: legendary striper chunk and expert Bob Brittana Ananuski, who is

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Speaker 1: better known up and down the entire striper coast as

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Speaker 1: Bob the garbage Man. And it is such an honor

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Speaker 1: to have you here. I feel very much like I'm

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Speaker 1: sitting in the presence of pure greatness. Well, yeah, but

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Speaker 1: I wish I could tell you the same. You don't

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Speaker 1: look like you fished a day in your life. A Okay,

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Speaker 1: that's that's not accurate. But for for what it is worth,

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Speaker 1: having grown up surfishing in New Jersey, I still, despite

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Speaker 1: that comment, Bob would say that you were one of

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Speaker 1: my childhood idols. Yeah. Obviously it didn't pay too much

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Speaker 1: attention because it hasn't worked out too wealthy and now

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Speaker 1: with your thrift shop equipment right right, anyway, for better

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Speaker 1: or worse, you have been catching trophy stripers up and

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Speaker 1: down the entire coast, and you have shared the beaches

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Speaker 1: with many legendary surfcasters over the years. That correct, Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you want to call them that, But most of

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Speaker 1: those guys, you know it was complete bums. Okay, regardless,

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Speaker 1: I've got a question for you today that sort of

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Speaker 1: ties into that vast network of notable anglers that you

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Speaker 1: fish with. Hold on a second, just to reiterate whether

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Speaker 1: I get your question right or wrong. You're still giving

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Speaker 1: me a ride over to the bus depot like you promised, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's the deal. That the bus is leaving in forty minutes.

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Speaker 1: I will honor that deal, and I understand your time

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Speaker 1: is in then let's get on with it. Yeah, okay,

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Speaker 1: that's what I'm saying. Here's your question. In September Night two,

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Speaker 1: al McReynolds, Jesus Christ, Yeah, go ahead. Al McReynolds caught

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Speaker 1: us seventy eight point eight pounds striped bass off the

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Speaker 1: Jetty Vermont Avenue right here in Atlantic City, New Jersey.

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Speaker 1: That stood as the all tackle world record for almost

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Speaker 1: thirty years. Please tell me. The question is do I

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Speaker 1: think he really called it? That is not the question

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Speaker 1: when I was actually gonna because he didn't. What I

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Speaker 1: was actually gonna ask is who held the record before McReynolds.

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Speaker 1: And I've got some multiple choice for you. Was it

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Speaker 1: a Tony Stets Jeff the Janita, But before him it

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Speaker 1: was actually stand the Bookkeeper, and before that Hobby of

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Speaker 1: the Russian and gas station Billy broke it twice each

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Speaker 1: in the same night. All right, that's not not according

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Speaker 1: to my research. And I'll also add two nights after

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Speaker 1: Alan Reynolds didn't catch that bass, my friend Audi Meldoff

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Speaker 1: caught a seventy nine in the exact same place. Huh.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm I'm kind of basing. I was kind

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Speaker 1: of based in my choices off the official I g

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Speaker 1: F record, And that's fine. But the bus is leaving

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Speaker 1: in forty minutes. Are we done here? And just like that,

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Speaker 1: strayper fishing history has been rewritten. Did you uh? Did

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Speaker 1: you get him to the bus station on time? At least? No?

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Speaker 1: He changed his mind. He decided he'd rather me give

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Speaker 1: him a ride to a board it up nail salon

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Speaker 1: in a completely abandoned shopping center. It just left him

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Speaker 1: there and didn't ask any questions. You know, that's just

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Speaker 1: that's just generally wise. You probably don't want to know

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Speaker 1: the answers. But uh, you know what we're gonna We're

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Speaker 1: gonna move on from that and hopefully we managed to

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Speaker 1: cobble together some answers that you do want to hear.

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Speaker 1: Two questions you hadn't thought about, because it's time for

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Speaker 1: fish news. Fish news. That escalated quickly, all right. I

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Speaker 1: positively have to give a shout out at the top

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Speaker 1: here to listener Ryan Motley. Now you may recall, uh

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Speaker 1: that I said not long ago it was my belief

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Speaker 1: that getting lucky the night before a fishing trip in

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Speaker 1: the bedroom was good luck. You're pleasuring yourself the night

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Speaker 1: before a fishing trip was bad luck. Yeah, that was

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Speaker 1: your contribution to our fishing Superstitions episode do you have Well,

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Speaker 1: I might have some good news for you guys. Okay,

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Speaker 1: to see, Ryan has been trying to catch himself his

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Speaker 1: first wild Oregon steelhead, and when he heard my theory,

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Speaker 1: he decided to put it to the test. And according

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Speaker 1: to him, he even got his fiance on board with this,

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Speaker 1: like he would give her notice in the days ahead

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Speaker 1: of a steelhead pursuit, and she was game, like, she

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Speaker 1: was down, like let's see if the works right. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: but he just he just kept scratching like it was

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Speaker 1: not it was not working despite his and her efforts.

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Speaker 1: So then his fiancee goes out of town he wants

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Speaker 1: to fish. So, as he put it, he had a

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Speaker 1: date with his right hand in the name of science,

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Speaker 1: and next day, bang, wild steelhead. That's his first one.

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Speaker 1: So it turns out you're wrong. Basically, this is a

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Speaker 1: correction that you're not giving us right here. It is

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Speaker 1: not because to me, it's very obvious what's happening here. Okay,

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Speaker 1: all Ryan has really proven is that my my theory

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Speaker 1: is reversed on the west coast. It's like a flip.

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Speaker 1: So my way works on the east side, his way

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Speaker 1: works on the west and I mean considering we're talking

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Speaker 1: wild steel here, which we all know isn't easy to

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Speaker 1: catch anymore. Every Walgreens and Oregan is selling out a

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Speaker 1: cocoa butter today. You know it. You won't be able

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Speaker 1: to find a bottle of cocoa butter from the Olympic

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Speaker 1: Peninsula in Portland after this. And I also have Ryan,

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Speaker 1: I mean thanks. However, I also have to say kind

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Speaker 1: of like shame on you, because dude, if your fiance

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Speaker 1: was willing to get busy every time you wanted to

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Speaker 1: go fishing, why why would you ruin that? Like? Why

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Speaker 1: why would you why would you make that? Why would

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Speaker 1: you say all this and ruin that? I think I

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Speaker 1: think he's making a questionable choice there. I agree with

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Speaker 1: because to make it worse, he even wrote in the email,

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Speaker 1: and I'm quoting here, now that I've discovered my new

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Speaker 1: found luck, I'm questioning whether the wedding even needs to happen. Dude, No, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: I appreciate no, No, that's it best. The one thing

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00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:35,399
Speaker 1: we agree on is disagreeing with that. So best to

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Speaker 1: luck to you, Ryan. But but thanks for that, Thanks

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Speaker 1: for doing that in the name of science. We all

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Speaker 1: we all appreciate it. I think more science, more, more

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Speaker 1: research is needed on this particular topic. I don't I

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Speaker 1: don't buy Joe's conclusion that it's a left coast right

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Speaker 1: coast polarity thing. I think that's just Joe's unwillingness to

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Speaker 1: admit when he's wrong. But I, on the other hand,

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Speaker 1: and am totally capable of admitting my faults. And when

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Speaker 1: I'm wrong, I smell a correction. Yeah, the one's dumb too.

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Speaker 1: I uh So last week I talked about the the

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Speaker 1: coal mining situation over there up there in Canada, and uh,

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Speaker 1: I think I got most of the information, Like the

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Speaker 1: hard stuff I got right, but the easy stuff I

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Speaker 1: screwed up. So I completely mispronounced the name of the

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Speaker 1: town around which all of this is circling. It's it's more.

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Speaker 1: I know it's called left Bridge, but I called it

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Speaker 1: Lethridge for some reason that I don't know. And and

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Speaker 1: some of are very pit some of are very polite.

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Speaker 1: Neighbors from the north wrote in very nicely correcting me.

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Speaker 1: I mean if I had if I had done that

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Speaker 1: work like something in Jersey, I would have got hate mail.

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Speaker 1: But but no, they're like, thanks so much. It was

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Speaker 1: really great. You know, it's actually so thank you for that.

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Speaker 1: And I apologized for screwing up the basics, but hopefully

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Speaker 1: I didn't mess up any of the big stuff. With

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Speaker 1: that out of the way, the housekeeping done, we are

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Speaker 1: now going to move on to fish news. And you

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Speaker 1: will remember that this is a competition. Neither Joe or

399
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Speaker 1: myself know what the other one is bringing the table,

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Speaker 1: and we were trying to compete for the heart and

401
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Speaker 1: the mind and uh and and really the love filled

402
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Speaker 1: the engineer. We're trying to make him, make him love

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Speaker 1: us with our stories. So with that, it's it's your

404
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:17,879
Speaker 1: week to lead off? Man, what do you what? Do

405
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Speaker 1: you got something good? I think I have some good

406
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:22,680
Speaker 1: things here. Um one is, one is poignant, and one

407
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:26,240
Speaker 1: is completely stupid. So we'll start with poigning perfect and

408
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,960
Speaker 1: we're gonna head over to Maine for a little lake

409
00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:34,680
Speaker 1: trout kerfuffle. That's causing quite a stir And oh no,

410
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:38,880
Speaker 1: have we we've done it again? Oh man, we had

411
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Speaker 1: a good run. We did have a good run. We

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Speaker 1: did ship. We've crossed swords. I'm actually disappointed it wasn't

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Speaker 1: your leadoff, because then I would have been like, well,

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Speaker 1: at least I don't have to do two stories this week. Alright, alright, alright, well, okay,

415
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,320
Speaker 1: at least we can both talk about it. It's it's

416
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Speaker 1: bound to happen time to time. Bring it on. I

417
00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:00,720
Speaker 1: was worried. I was worried about this, and so um

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Speaker 1: we fat first found this story a little over a

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Speaker 1: week ago, and since the original drop, there have been

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00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:10,919
Speaker 1: follow ups and all of this, at least from my sources,

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00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:13,960
Speaker 1: are coming from the Bangor Daily News. UH. And a

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00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 1: few weekends ago, the annual Sebago Lake Fishing Derby took place,

423
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:20,240
Speaker 1: and this is an event that draws a lot of

424
00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,160
Speaker 1: anglers onto the ice. And a few days after the tournament,

425
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:25,560
Speaker 1: local resident Kirk Christensen went out on the ice and

426
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,240
Speaker 1: discovered piles of dead lake trout UH, frozen on the

427
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,959
Speaker 1: ice around where where holes had obviously been drilled during

428
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,680
Speaker 1: the tourney. And according to the story, he found more

429
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 1: than a hundred fish left behind on the ice and

430
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:40,320
Speaker 1: naturally this infuriated him and he viewed at his wanton

431
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,879
Speaker 1: waste and he speculates that during the tournament, this angler

432
00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:47,320
Speaker 1: or a group of anglers was just looking for big

433
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 1: fish to weigh in and discarding everything else. Okay. Now,

434
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,639
Speaker 1: just hearing all that, you're kind of like, oh, what

435
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:54,879
Speaker 1: a bunch of s clowns. But there is a little

436
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 1: bit more to this, Okay, So this is this is

437
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,400
Speaker 1: from the story. Technically, lake out are an invasive species.

438
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:05,400
Speaker 1: Their non native to Tobago. The States stocked them there

439
00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:07,960
Speaker 1: in the nineteen seventies and now they compete with native

440
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:12,320
Speaker 1: landlocked salmon for food, especially smell. Earlier this month, the

441
00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:16,160
Speaker 1: Fisheries and Wildlife Department encouraged anglers to keep as many

442
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:19,440
Speaker 1: lake trout as they want. Um. And here's a quote

443
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,520
Speaker 1: I find interesting from Mark Laddie, a spokesman for Maine's

444
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:26,119
Speaker 1: Wildlife Department, says, while a catch and release message was important,

445
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:29,639
Speaker 1: several decades ago, we saw more fishing pressure and higher

446
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:33,280
Speaker 1: harvest rates by anglers. Present day fisheries rely on harvest

447
00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:36,359
Speaker 1: by anglers to maintain healthy fish populations and to achieve

448
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:40,479
Speaker 1: size quality management goals. The derby is part of the

449
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,679
Speaker 1: effort to remove trout from Tobago. Lotty said, so we

450
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:48,320
Speaker 1: can have healthy salmon populations. Now, if you missed it,

451
00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 1: what what he basically just said, they're in a nutshell?

452
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 1: Was that back in the day people fish for food,

453
00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:56,880
Speaker 1: and today they don't do that nearly enough, and sort

454
00:24:56,920 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 1: of the adoptive hardcore catch and release mentality, at least

455
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,639
Speaker 1: at this Kular lake has has ended up hurting the

456
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:05,960
Speaker 1: native salmon population because the lakers are so much more aggressive.

457
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,639
Speaker 1: And what what Lotti also said in the original story

458
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,520
Speaker 1: is that while he understands, you know, seeing these fishes

459
00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 1: not he says it's not ideal, but in a year

460
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:17,160
Speaker 1: with good ice, anglers can catch upwards of ten thousand

461
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:20,320
Speaker 1: lake trout at Tobago in a single year, So a

462
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:23,640
Speaker 1: hundred fish on the ice doesn't amount too much. It's

463
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:26,880
Speaker 1: just a fraction, he says. Uh. And to be clear,

464
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 1: and I'm sure we agree on this. I don't condone

465
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:31,399
Speaker 1: leaving a hundred dead lakers on the ice, but I

466
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 1: see parallels here with other things, namely snakeheads in Asian

467
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,959
Speaker 1: carp and when the message you're sending is kill them

468
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:42,080
Speaker 1: all because you're helping, uh, certain people are going to

469
00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 1: cling to that very very tightly. Um. And I mean,

470
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 1: I can't tell you how many times I found dead

471
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,240
Speaker 1: snakeheads that have been whacked in the head or stabbed

472
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,320
Speaker 1: and just thrown up onto the bank. Down here, so

473
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:55,199
Speaker 1: you catch them, you don't want to eat them, but

474
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:56,920
Speaker 1: the state is telling you to kill them all. So

475
00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 1: as far as you're concerned, you're you're doing a service

476
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,720
Speaker 1: and kill as many as you can. But the sad

477
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 1: thing here is the organization you're going to get there? Okay? Good?

478
00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:08,880
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, right there, I'm okay, I don't worry.

479
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 1: Do you do you want to split this one up?

480
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 1: Do you want to take over from here? Can? I can? So? There?

481
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:16,560
Speaker 1: There are a couple of elements there there. There's also

482
00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:19,199
Speaker 1: I also want to bring in. Right. You mentioned that

483
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:23,040
Speaker 1: this was initially reported on in the Banker Daily News, Right,

484
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:26,080
Speaker 1: and then there was a follow up op ed that

485
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 1: was written, yes, right, and uh and and I feel

486
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:31,760
Speaker 1: like I feel like I want to I want to

487
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,879
Speaker 1: drop a quote in from that op ed because I

488
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 1: think it's it's important to think about this. So so

489
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 1: John Holioke wrote in an op ed, and I'm just

490
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 1: going to quote him, and this is in reference to

491
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:45,720
Speaker 1: leaving those those piles of fish on the ice. He said,

492
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,560
Speaker 1: when anglers act like this and show such disregard for

493
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:52,760
Speaker 1: the species they're targeting, and they cast a cloud over

494
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 1: all of us who enjoy spending a day on the water.

495
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 1: Many of us love ice fishing, but there are plenty

496
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 1: of others who would rather see us all go away. Why.

497
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 1: Fisheries conservationists will tell you that ice anglers have the

498
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:07,440
Speaker 1: reputation of being game hogs and killing way too many fish.

499
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:11,080
Speaker 1: Lake dwellers who live on the shores year round will

500
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 1: tell you that many ice anglers are slops, leaving beer cans, trash,

501
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 1: and human waste on the ice when their day of

502
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,399
Speaker 1: fishing is done. Now, I don't totally agree with everything

503
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 1: that Holo growth there, but I think his central point

504
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:29,520
Speaker 1: is really important to this story, right, And so you know,

505
00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 1: to what you said, they were being asked to remove

506
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:36,639
Speaker 1: lots of lake trout from this system, but leaving piles

507
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:39,640
Speaker 1: of dead fish on the ice just feeds negative stereotypes

508
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 1: about all anglers and and particularly about ice anglers. So

509
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 1: there's an optics thing here at play. It is, And

510
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 1: I'm actually, I know we crossed swords here, but I'm

511
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 1: enjoying this because I was going to get there too,

512
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: and I read his story and I mean, you know,

513
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 1: he was even talking about how it's common to here

514
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,440
Speaker 1: guys say, well, the eagles got to eat, Like we

515
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 1: just leave them out here for the eagles. There's there's

516
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:03,639
Speaker 1: a lot of excuses flying around as to why you

517
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,600
Speaker 1: would do that. But the problem is, according to to

518
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 1: the story, there is no wanting waste law for fish

519
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: in Maine. So it's kind of like, from the state's perspective,

520
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 1: it's like, this doesn't look good, But I also can't

521
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:19,960
Speaker 1: get you for anything because I told you to kill

522
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 1: all these and there's so, yeah, they didn't do anything wrong.

523
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 1: They didn't do anything wrong legally speaking. Yeah, it is

524
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 1: pure optics. Now, I'm sure we would have both gotten here.

525
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,719
Speaker 1: But if there's one sort of sad thing about this

526
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 1: before you, before you get into that, I'm setting you

527
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 1: I promise, I'm setting you up for it. I'm not

528
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:41,960
Speaker 1: going to steal your thunder on it because we totally agree.

529
00:28:42,920 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 1: But here here, like I feel like we have to

530
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: put ourselves in the position of those anglers. Right, So

531
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:52,000
Speaker 1: you're out there, you're being told by the management agency

532
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: kill all the lake trout you can under twenty six inches,

533
00:28:56,760 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 1: help us out, help us manage this population. You hear that,

534
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: and you have a banner daid, you get a hundred

535
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:06,240
Speaker 1: fish whatever a hundred plus fish. I can kind of

536
00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 1: understand maybe you don't want to clean a hundred fish,

537
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:13,800
Speaker 1: a hundred small lakers. I can understand that. I don't

538
00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,600
Speaker 1: know if I condone wasting them. I don't know if

539
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 1: I personally could bring myself to do that. I'd have

540
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,440
Speaker 1: to be in the situation to really know. I could

541
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: not have. I don't think I could, but like so,

542
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 1: but I understand that tension of being like, man, I

543
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 1: want to be fishing and I'm catching these fish, and

544
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 1: they're asking me to pull them out. But I don't

545
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 1: know if I want to clean all these but at

546
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:37,920
Speaker 1: the very least take them home, like, just dispose of

547
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: them quietly, don't don't feed into this perception of anglers

548
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 1: as as a problem. Right, And so, up until that

549
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:49,920
Speaker 1: moment I was, I was kind of like understand, I

550
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,800
Speaker 1: wouldn't have definitelyly wouldn't have done what these folks did,

551
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,960
Speaker 1: but I could kind of understand it. But there's one

552
00:29:55,000 --> 00:30:00,080
Speaker 1: more wrinkle of this story. One hundred percent convinced is

553
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,400
Speaker 1: me that whomever did this are just complete and total assets,

554
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 1: no doubt in my mind. Yes, yes that, and I'm

555
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 1: glad I waited the sad thing that I was just

556
00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:12,440
Speaker 1: set up for is that the organization running the tournament

557
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 1: was fully aware that the state was promoting the taking

558
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 1: of as many lakers as you wanted. So they were

559
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 1: set up to take donations of all unwanted lake trout,

560
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: and they had worked out a deal with a local

561
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:28,960
Speaker 1: process and plant to clean them and freeze them, and

562
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 1: all of that lake trout was being donated to local

563
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: food pantries. So now like, at minimum, say what you

564
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 1: want about these guys, that's extremely lazy and selfish, Like

565
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 1: you want to kill three wheelbarrows full have at it,

566
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,760
Speaker 1: But like, holy shit, the tournament is giving you the

567
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,239
Speaker 1: out for your extra fish. All you had to do

568
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:51,560
Speaker 1: was get them over there. All you can't even be

569
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 1: bothered to drag the fish across the ice, Are you serious? Yeah?

570
00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,200
Speaker 1: Like to one just do the right thing and for

571
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 1: another donate fish that are going to be used to

572
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 1: feed people who need food. Like what's wrong with you? Yeah? Yeah,

573
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,560
Speaker 1: So if you just took that one element out, you

574
00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:13,080
Speaker 1: could you could sort of formulate some weak argument. But

575
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 1: with that, they're like, there's no excuse for that, And

576
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know if you dug in

577
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 1: any of the social commentary on this, but a little bit.

578
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: It's surprisingly mixed. I mean, you have a lot of

579
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 1: people who are just straight out appalled, but there's there's

580
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 1: also some who are like, uh, yeah, deal with it.

581
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:32,280
Speaker 1: That's what the state wants. They want them all dead.

582
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: So it's it's a lot of them mixed. It's a

583
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 1: lot more mixed then you think. You know that that

584
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,880
Speaker 1: guy who initially you know, broke the story, Christiansen, he

585
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 1: is the one who put it up on Facebook, and

586
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: you would I would have thought that the people would

587
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 1: come to them like yeah, man, that's that's that's rough.

588
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 1: But a lot of yeah, like you're you're, you're, you're

589
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 1: you're talking to deaf ears here. That's what they want,

590
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 1: that's what they encourage. So I mean, we don't certainly

591
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: have an answer here, but it's like this weird conundrum

592
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,520
Speaker 1: and sort of just speaks to mixed messaging. And like

593
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 1: I said, I've seen that with snakeheads. When you tell somebody,

594
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 1: and in some cases with those it was by law,

595
00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:10,440
Speaker 1: like if you catch that, you kill that. It's very

596
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 1: hard to convert everyone to eating them. I know how

597
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:14,959
Speaker 1: delicious they are, most people don't if they catch one.

598
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 1: It's dead on the bank. I see it all the time.

599
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 1: But that's kind of what you asked for, so it's weird. Yeah, yeah, well,

600
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: I mean, hey, we we had to cross over again eventually,

601
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 1: and it was good. That story was too good. I

602
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 1: was actually glad to tag team that one with you,

603
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 1: because yeah, I think that that turned out pretty well.

604
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,520
Speaker 1: My transition is that is that I'm going to kind

605
00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 1: of keep us on the topic of of dead freshwater

606
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 1: fish cats. That's that's my My transition here at least

607
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 1: is the transition too much here we're like dead fish

608
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 1: fish about that? What do you got on dead fish

609
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 1: this week? And you know what that to your point,

610
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 1: this isn't the best, Like, hey, it's Fredda and we're

611
00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:04,320
Speaker 1: trying to have a good time story. But h yeah,

612
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 1: it's still worth talking about. I'm I'm I'm not apologizing

613
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 1: for it, but it's it's not the it's not the

614
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,280
Speaker 1: biggest I have one of those. Don't worry. At least

615
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:15,840
Speaker 1: we're ending on a sad note. Um So, a consortium

616
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 1: of sixteen different conservation groups publish a report last week

617
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 1: titled World's Forgotten Fishes and this one's uh, it's a bummer, man,

618
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:30,200
Speaker 1: it's a bummer. It also got me thinking differently about fish. Usually,

619
00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 1: when when we hear about fish stocks, like on a

620
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 1: planetary scale, it's it's oceanic species that dominate the conversation.

621
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:40,680
Speaker 1: But this report focuses on the global status of freshwater fishes,

622
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 1: and it's both truly fascinating and its compilation of information

623
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:49,320
Speaker 1: about various freshwater fish around the globe and their importance,

624
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:53,880
Speaker 1: as well as deeply, deeply depressing. So we'll we'll go

625
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 1: with the bad news first. I'm prepared to be deeply depressed.

626
00:33:57,320 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: There you go. You're I you were war. Freshwater fish

627
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 1: are in far worse shape as a whole than I

628
00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:10,760
Speaker 1: and probably most of us realize. Eight species of freshwater

629
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:14,320
Speaker 1: fish have already been declared extinct. And for the record,

630
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 1: this isn't like an over there, somewhere else problems. One

631
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 1: quarter of the extinct freshwater species used to live right

632
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 1: here in the US. And it's also not like a

633
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,680
Speaker 1: back in the day problem, like, well, we did terrible

634
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:29,680
Speaker 1: things before, but now we fixed them. No, No, No,

635
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:36,279
Speaker 1: sixteen fish when extinct. Last year, thirty percent of all

636
00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 1: freshwater species on the planet are currently facing risk of extinction.

637
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:45,399
Speaker 1: Think about that for just one second. That's nearly one

638
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: third of all the things that swim in fresh water

639
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: at risk extinction. Populations of migratory freshwater fish have fallen

640
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 1: seventy six percent since nineteen seventy and big fish, the

641
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 1: ones that grow over seventy sounds and are sometimes referred

642
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:07,800
Speaker 1: to as megafish, are at six percent of their historic populations.

643
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,759
Speaker 1: So apologies to fill here because I'm about to make

644
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,040
Speaker 1: some extra work for him, but I just gotta state

645
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 1: this plainly. That's stub Yeah, I'm kind of like my

646
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,440
Speaker 1: jaws hanging. Yeah, this is not good, this is this

647
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 1: is terrible. I warned you. I'm also formulating questions, but

648
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 1: you have more to get through. The primary takeaways from

649
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:35,480
Speaker 1: this report are obviously pretty damn concerning, but I also

650
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,560
Speaker 1: learned a bunch of really interesting information about freshwater fishes

651
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,600
Speaker 1: that I just never knew before. For example, despite the

652
00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:44,920
Speaker 1: fact that fresh water makes up just one percent of

653
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:49,600
Speaker 1: the world's aquatic habitat, more than half of global fish

654
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:54,319
Speaker 1: species live in fresh water. Yeah, of the water on

655
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,000
Speaker 1: Earth of saltwater, but the majority of the bile diversity

656
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:00,279
Speaker 1: is found in that other one percent. I did not

657
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:06,759
Speaker 1: know that really damn Yeah. There are more than eighteen

658
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:10,120
Speaker 1: thousand different kinds of fish that live in fresh water

659
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:13,080
Speaker 1: for at least part of their lives. Mean that fresh

660
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: water fish make up almost a quarter of the world's

661
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:21,280
Speaker 1: vertebrate species. And and that's just the ones we know about.

662
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:25,919
Speaker 1: We're still finding all kinds of new freshwater fishes. Good

663
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,879
Speaker 1: news for you, Joe. Last year, a new snakehead was identified,

664
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 1: the dragon snakehead. Bad news. They live in underground caves

665
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 1: in southern India, so I don't think it would be

666
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:37,920
Speaker 1: casting frogs at the many times I saw those I

667
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:41,520
Speaker 1: saw don't get here. Eventually give it a couple of years.

668
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 1: All right. Over the past decade, an average of two

669
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:51,120
Speaker 1: new species of freshwater fish have been identified every week.

670
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 1: To fish a week, okay, but isn't that sort of

671
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 1: canceling out. It's like one a week goes extinct, but

672
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 1: we find two new ones. I don't think that's actually

673
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:05,960
Speaker 1: I think we're okay. Actually we're better. We're better than

674
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:09,880
Speaker 1: good with that information. That's how I absorbed news pieces,

675
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:11,799
Speaker 1: which is why you're so much better at this than me.

676
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 1: Good news is we find too, I'm finding more. They're

677
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:19,399
Speaker 1: not being created. They're not like making two new ones

678
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:24,839
Speaker 1: a week. We're just finding them other fun facts. Maybe

679
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:27,040
Speaker 1: you new this, I didn't. There are five types of

680
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,879
Speaker 1: freshwater sharks, one in Australia, one in New Guinea, one

681
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:33,919
Speaker 1: in me and mar one in Borneo, and one in India. Nope,

682
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,120
Speaker 1: I only knew they were freshwater sharks. I was not

683
00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:39,359
Speaker 1: clued into the amount five different kinds, and and and

684
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,319
Speaker 1: researchers actually know hardly anything about them except you know

685
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:47,520
Speaker 1: that they're critically endangered. That's about all we know, right, so,

686
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 1: and and and the other piece that I took away

687
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: from this is again, most time when we think about

688
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 1: fisheries on the global scale, and we think about commercial

689
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 1: fish harvest or the importance of fish in feeding people,

690
00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 1: we talked about the ocean. Yeah, but without freshwater fish

691
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 1: is a food source, hundreds of millions of people would

692
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 1: go hungry. This isn't just like a there there's an

693
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:14,719
Speaker 1: element to this that is truly impacting communities. So I'm

694
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:17,720
Speaker 1: just providing you with the highlights of this this conservation report.

695
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 1: And you probably know this. Conservation reports are are just

696
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:25,359
Speaker 1: strange documents. And I know that because I've helped write

697
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 1: a couple They have to do this this very tenuous

698
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 1: balancing act where they describe the situation in hands as

699
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:37,000
Speaker 1: dire enough that it needs to be addressed immediately, but

700
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:40,719
Speaker 1: not so dire that everyone reading it will just give

701
00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 1: up and figure the whole things lost cause, So why

702
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:46,879
Speaker 1: bother doing in the first place. Yeah, these reports need

703
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 1: to provide solutions that seem realistic and grounded in research,

704
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:53,520
Speaker 1: but not so complicated or detailed that the average smoke

705
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:56,400
Speaker 1: can't understand what they're talking about through like a handful

706
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 1: of simple bullet points. They've got a this is a

707
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 1: series is balancing act. I like a good bullet point exactly.

708
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,959
Speaker 1: I'm not judging there's nothing wrong with that that. Yes,

709
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,480
Speaker 1: reading the actual New York Times, I don't have time.

710
00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:15,600
Speaker 1: And when you dig intose bullet point solutions on these

711
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:18,120
Speaker 1: conservation reports, that's where you usually find the bias of

712
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,759
Speaker 1: the sponsoring organizations. That's where that's that that starts to

713
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: creep in, right, And that's one of the most interesting

714
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:28,840
Speaker 1: parts about this particular report. The primary organization responsible putting

715
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 1: this together was the World Wildlife Fund. W WF is

716
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 1: not back Country Hunters and Anglers or the Theodore Roosevelt

717
00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:41,000
Speaker 1: Conservation Partnership or American Sport Fishing Association or any of

718
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 1: the conservation groups the champion anglers as parts of the solution,

719
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:50,120
Speaker 1: but in this report they did m hmm. The report

720
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 1: spends an entire section giving props to anglers. It explains

721
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:58,920
Speaker 1: how recreational fishing generates a hundred billion dollars every year

722
00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:00,439
Speaker 1: and how much of that money goes in the local

723
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 1: economies who are the stewards of our freshwater resources. It

724
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:07,280
Speaker 1: tells little stories, right, because again it's all about storytelling

725
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:10,400
Speaker 1: getting people engaged. So it tells a story about the

726
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 1: hump backed mass here which has been drawing tourist anglers

727
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 1: and their money to India for the past fifty years,

728
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:18,919
Speaker 1: and how the income generated from those traveling anglers has

729
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 1: transformed former poachers into fishing guides, the same people who

730
00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:25,120
Speaker 1: were once decimating this fish population order to survive or

731
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 1: now incentivized to protect them in order to make a living.

732
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,399
Speaker 1: And the report explains how similar cases are playing out

733
00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 1: in sensitive freshwater ecosystems all over the world. Right. The

734
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: fact that anglers are important stewards of fisheries, or that

735
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 1: angling is a net positive to fish populations is not

736
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 1: news to anyone listening to this podcast, but for us

737
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 1: to be explicitly recognized in this particular report marks a

738
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,120
Speaker 1: change in how the more mainstream conservation groups are talking

739
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:56,320
Speaker 1: about anglers. They really used to look at us as

740
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:58,640
Speaker 1: the enemies, right, we were the sadists who are out

741
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 1: to torture innocent creatures for fun. And but I don't know, man,

742
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 1: it seems like they've finally come around. Like I'm not

743
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna hold my breath for a sponsorship call

744
00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 1: from Peter, but I'm I'm really happy to see that

745
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 1: we're getting our due from WWF at least, like it

746
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:17,080
Speaker 1: feels like a turning point to me. I think that's great, man,

747
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 1: and I agree with what you're saying, like to have

748
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 1: that recognizing that that what we do is is more

749
00:41:23,560 --> 00:41:27,319
Speaker 1: beneficial than harmful is terrific. But the thing that that

750
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 1: has stuck with me from the early part of this report,

751
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:35,279
Speaker 1: you said, sixteen fish freshwater fish went extinct in our

752
00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:40,000
Speaker 1: country last year. No no, no, no, no no no, sorry,

753
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 1: of the eight fish that have been declared extinct, right,

754
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:49,600
Speaker 1: sixteen went extinct last year. That's what I said. Sure,

755
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: that's what she said, because I thought you said they

756
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:53,600
Speaker 1: were they were they were in America. No, I said

757
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:55,319
Speaker 1: a quarter of them were in America. And maybe I

758
00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:58,440
Speaker 1: misspoke of the E D fish almost twenty Yeah, No,

759
00:41:58,520 --> 00:42:00,880
Speaker 1: I said it right. A quarter of the extinct freshwater

760
00:42:00,920 --> 00:42:03,360
Speaker 1: species used to live in the US sixteen one extinct

761
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 1: last year. You're you're conflating two different things. Okays, it

762
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 1: seems like math, understand. Let me let me break down simply.

763
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:15,760
Speaker 1: Eighty freshwater fish already extinct, about a quarter about twenty

764
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:19,080
Speaker 1: of those used to live in the US sixteen total

765
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:23,319
Speaker 1: globally one extinct last year. Got you? Okay? Like, what

766
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,240
Speaker 1: are some of the species? And Here's why I asked that, right,

767
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:28,480
Speaker 1: because I'm racking my brain trying to like think of

768
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:30,520
Speaker 1: one for lack of a better way to put it,

769
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:33,360
Speaker 1: that matters to anglers, so like it leads me to believe, like,

770
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:37,400
Speaker 1: are these like you know, minnow and gobi type species? Like,

771
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:39,799
Speaker 1: what what are some of the recent ones that that

772
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:42,879
Speaker 1: we recognize? Does this does the piece give that? I'm

773
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 1: just curious there aren't so many recent ones that anglers

774
00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:46,840
Speaker 1: would care about in the U S. Right, A lot

775
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: of the ones in the U. S. Are kind of

776
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:50,399
Speaker 1: the smaller ones, but um, some of the older ones

777
00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:51,920
Speaker 1: to go extinct in the US. Did you ever know

778
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 1: of a thing called the silver trout? Surely did not?

779
00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 1: Did not either. It was a native it was an

780
00:42:57,560 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: East Coast trout species native only in North America. Gone

781
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:06,399
Speaker 1: none of us, Like, how long has that been, I've

782
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 1: never heard of that before ever. Yeah, it was a

783
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:09,760
Speaker 1: long time ago. I think it was in the thirties.

784
00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:13,399
Speaker 1: But the more recent one, like the big one from

785
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:18,239
Speaker 1: last year was the Chinese paddlefish going extinct. Okay, that

786
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:20,400
Speaker 1: was the big one that got news in terms of

787
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 1: extinctions from last year. But I mean there's a whole list,

788
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:25,640
Speaker 1: right if you look at the study that lists all

789
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:27,839
Speaker 1: the A d that have gone extinct, and and a

790
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:31,480
Speaker 1: lot of them are are definitely the smaller things that

791
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 1: the dace and the gobies and and the stuff you

792
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:36,160
Speaker 1: might not notice, but not all of them, right, And

793
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:38,440
Speaker 1: and certainly not to downplay that, I'm not saying like, oh,

794
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 1: it's just Dason Kobe's like whatever, man, you know, long

795
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:47,480
Speaker 1: down the Oh yeah, no, no, And you know what,

796
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:49,400
Speaker 1: what can you say? It's great to not be the

797
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,839
Speaker 1: bad guys in this situation. But I mean it's still

798
00:43:52,840 --> 00:43:56,279
Speaker 1: a pretty depressing situation, super depressing. It's super depressing. But

799
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:58,600
Speaker 1: I will say I didn't I didn't have time to

800
00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:00,759
Speaker 1: cover it all. There are those the points that lay

801
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:02,879
Speaker 1: out here are the things that we can do. All

802
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 1: is not lost if we make some changes will be okay.

803
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 1: I mean the big ones are pretty obvious. Stop damning

804
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:14,680
Speaker 1: rivers and uh stop using them like toilets, and you

805
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:18,319
Speaker 1: know things will get better. Well that that's wadey. That

806
00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 1: gives us a lot, a lot to think about. Um,

807
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 1: So I'll end. I said we're gonna end with some fun.

808
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:26,400
Speaker 1: I'll end with a fish that if you saw in person,

809
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:30,360
Speaker 1: you'd want to make extinct immediately, like with a shotgun. Okay,

810
00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 1: all right, instantly, Okay, And this is a this sowhere

811
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:36,960
Speaker 1: on the same page. This is a dumb story. I

812
00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:39,279
Speaker 1: just can't leave it alone. But it has unlike what

813
00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:42,799
Speaker 1: you've just done, it has no value. Okay, I'm just

814
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 1: telling you that now you will not come away more

815
00:44:45,120 --> 00:44:46,840
Speaker 1: enriched as an angler. But this just has to be

816
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 1: done because several people forwarded me this story, but I

817
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:52,440
Speaker 1: have to give the shout out to listen to Matt Wagner.

818
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,799
Speaker 1: He sent it first, so he gets the nod, and

819
00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 1: this is making some rounds. But I'm using bro bible

820
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:04,000
Speaker 1: dot com as the source, which is obviously as credible

821
00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:07,759
Speaker 1: as the Washington Post or something. All Right, so it's

822
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:11,279
Speaker 1: one of these headline deformed shark with human face looks

823
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:14,239
Speaker 1: like it came straight from your nightmares. Now I'm going

824
00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:18,360
Speaker 1: to stop there for a second, because you know these headlines,

825
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:22,320
Speaker 1: this is the bullshit that's meant to grab non nature

826
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 1: oriented people. Like remember a while back, I had a

827
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:27,239
Speaker 1: similar story. Was fish with a human face looked at

828
00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:31,120
Speaker 1: me funny or whatever? The hell? It was deformed shark

829
00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:34,640
Speaker 1: one at some point, yeah, yeah, And it's like I'm

830
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 1: looking at this fish with a human face and like

831
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:39,719
Speaker 1: it's this big news weekly world news ship, and I'm like,

832
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:41,800
Speaker 1: it's a star gazer. What's the big is a star gazer?

833
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: Like I, I like taking a practical approach to these,

834
00:45:45,680 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 1: like it's not a big deal. And like the two

835
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:50,880
Speaker 1: mouth trout that I swear did not have two mouths,

836
00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:53,680
Speaker 1: it's a little under thing mandible just got ripped out.

837
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:59,520
Speaker 1: But I don't gravitate to these, but this one's next level. Okay,

838
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:02,399
Speaker 1: this is this one's next level? So just for fun,

839
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:04,960
Speaker 1: here are the opening lines of this article, which I'm

840
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 1: reading word for word, typos and all. Okay, I don't

841
00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 1: want to sound like an alarmist with everything that's been

842
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 1: happening lately, but it certainly looked like the gates to

843
00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:17,799
Speaker 1: Hell is leaking sea monsters again. And those gates can

844
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:22,239
Speaker 1: be found somewhere deep in the Indian Ocean. Okay, now

845
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:25,600
Speaker 1: here's now. You have no preconceived knowledge of this, right like,

846
00:46:25,640 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: you do not know because you haven't seen the photo yet.

847
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 1: Just hang on. So here's what happened. According to the story,

848
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:36,000
Speaker 1: a commercial fisherman near Roadie and now no idea where

849
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:39,360
Speaker 1: that is, uh, caught a shark in his troller net. Normally,

850
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:41,960
Speaker 1: the sharks are released alive, but by the time he

851
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:43,799
Speaker 1: got this one into the boat, it had died. So

852
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:46,080
Speaker 1: he kept it, not wanting to waste it. And when

853
00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 1: he went to clean this shark, he found that it

854
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:51,520
Speaker 1: was pregnant and inside there were three pups, two of

855
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 1: which were completely normal, and then you had this mutant,

856
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 1: deformed shark. And it's very easy to describe, Okay, So

857
00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:00,920
Speaker 1: if you just picture like a normal baby shark, like

858
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,279
Speaker 1: something like a gray reef shark, like a common just

859
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 1: shark shark, but instead of its eyes being on the

860
00:47:06,719 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 1: side of its head, they're under its snout, just above

861
00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:14,640
Speaker 1: its mouth. And did I swear we already covered this

862
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:21,840
Speaker 1: story like three months ago? No? No, Like it was

863
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:24,920
Speaker 1: the same setup. A guy in a trawler in Indonesia

864
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:28,319
Speaker 1: pulled up a shark, died, found pups inside, and one

865
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:30,480
Speaker 1: of them was like deformed to do a Cyclops. So

866
00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:34,280
Speaker 1: the setup is is exactly the same. It's the same setup,

867
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:36,680
Speaker 1: which which tells me that both these stories could be

868
00:47:36,760 --> 00:47:39,880
Speaker 1: largely bullshit. But this is not a Cyclops. I remember

869
00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:43,920
Speaker 1: that now, And Cyclops had one eye. I remember, this

870
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 1: is different. Bear with me, right, So so you think like, okay,

871
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: it's got eyes under under its head and you're like, okay,

872
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:55,320
Speaker 1: that's weird. Uh. And if it were swimming naturally horizontally,

873
00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:56,960
Speaker 1: I guess it would just look like a baby shark

874
00:47:57,000 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 1: with no eyes. But the photos show this thing vertically

875
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:03,480
Speaker 1: laying on its back, which gives you the illusion that

876
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:05,960
Speaker 1: this is a land creature that walks on two legs,

877
00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:09,160
Speaker 1: and it's peck fins are like little arm flippers, and

878
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:13,719
Speaker 1: it is one of the creepiest, most terrifying things I

879
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:16,480
Speaker 1: have ever seen. And I'm I'm, I'm sending you the

880
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:20,680
Speaker 1: photo right now. I want your reaction to this. Oh

881
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:28,759
Speaker 1: my god, that is not the same shark we covered before. No,

882
00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:31,600
Speaker 1: but the story is so similar it's making me think

883
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 1: that we're just getting sucked into fakes mutant shark like photoshops.

884
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:42,920
Speaker 1: Maybe I don't know if there are a lot of

885
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:45,399
Speaker 1: mutant sharks coming out in Indonesia these days. I don't.

886
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:48,280
Speaker 1: I don't know, Okay, So here's how from the story

887
00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:51,399
Speaker 1: it says it's unclear if this shark came straight from

888
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:54,319
Speaker 1: our nightmares or if it looks like something that a

889
00:48:54,400 --> 00:48:57,880
Speaker 1: toddler would make with Plato during Arts and Crafts time

890
00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:02,480
Speaker 1: at daycare. And to me, that's accurate. Like to me,

891
00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:06,759
Speaker 1: I see like a Gumby character like we never knew

892
00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:08,640
Speaker 1: about because it had been like locked in a psych

893
00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 1: word for decades or something. And it's got like a

894
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:14,520
Speaker 1: hint of Casper the Friendly Ghost, and like a touch

895
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:18,000
Speaker 1: of Stay Puff marshmallow Man. But to my eye, it's

896
00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 1: pure evil. And I'll put the photo on Instagram today, Dude,

897
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:23,920
Speaker 1: it could literally be the same shark story with different

898
00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 1: photos that have been photoshot. We might have been sucked

899
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:29,680
Speaker 1: right into that. But but this is definitely like new

900
00:49:29,800 --> 00:49:32,920
Speaker 1: in the news, so I believe you it's a different

901
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 1: It's different than the cyclop shark. I just the setup

902
00:49:35,719 --> 00:49:38,440
Speaker 1: is so similar that I'm like, I feel like we're

903
00:49:38,440 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 1: getting suckered here. Maybe we are, but I don't care

904
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:44,640
Speaker 1: because when you see this photo, I implore you to

905
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:46,400
Speaker 1: imagine like you've woken up in the middle of the

906
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:48,040
Speaker 1: night and this thing is standing in the middle of

907
00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:51,920
Speaker 1: your bedroom upright. It says nothing. It says nothing. It

908
00:49:52,040 --> 00:49:55,080
Speaker 1: just slowly cocks its head to one side before attacking.

909
00:49:55,600 --> 00:50:00,360
Speaker 1: It is terrifying, and I'm I usually explain away all

910
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:04,000
Speaker 1: these natural oddities. This one is straight up terrifying. And

911
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:05,879
Speaker 1: by the way, the guy who caught it thinks it's

912
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:09,000
Speaker 1: lucky and we'll be preserving it to keep in his bedroom.

913
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 1: M hmm, yeah, so that's it. I definitely don't want

914
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:16,480
Speaker 1: that in my bedroom. So it's it's become he's apparently

915
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:18,640
Speaker 1: he's making money from people stopping to look at it,

916
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:20,640
Speaker 1: so I mean, good for him. It could be a

917
00:50:20,680 --> 00:50:22,799
Speaker 1: better living than shark trolling over there. I don't know,

918
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 1: no doubt, but tourism play right. Yeah, well, Phil, I

919
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 1: guess Phil's kind of just gonna have to base this

920
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:33,600
Speaker 1: off of either are two independents, or maybe we both

921
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 1: win because we worked so well together on the crossover.

922
00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:39,440
Speaker 1: We'll see what Phil has to say and then not

923
00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 1: transition into the sale bin and we'll be looking up

924
00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:45,640
Speaker 1: in the trees, stetted down on the water for this one.

925
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:51,799
Speaker 1: For at least attempting to bring some levity into that

926
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:55,400
Speaker 1: bummer of a fish News segment. Joe Surmelie is the

927
00:50:55,440 --> 00:51:02,480
Speaker 1: winner Food waste Extinction, Nightmare Sharks. I could really go

928
00:51:02,640 --> 00:51:11,280
Speaker 1: for a river horse segment right about now. There it is. Oh,

929
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:15,319
Speaker 1: we're sticking with the sail bind. Okay, okay, why did

930
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:17,000
Speaker 1: you put the hand to pay? You don't know what

931
00:51:17,040 --> 00:51:19,080
Speaker 1: I'm getting? Man? What you didn't have to be so

932
00:51:19,200 --> 00:51:22,000
Speaker 1: hurtful with me? So angry? All right, So we've got

933
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 1: a slightly different spin on the sail bind this week. Normally,

934
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:27,640
Speaker 1: we use this space, as you guys know, to make

935
00:51:27,719 --> 00:51:32,560
Speaker 1: fun of something Fishy posted in an online classifies for him,

936
00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:35,600
Speaker 1: but thanks to a listener email, we're using it this

937
00:51:35,640 --> 00:51:40,560
Speaker 1: week to basically give props to a young man's side hustle.

938
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:43,360
Speaker 1: That's what we're doing here. Oh yeah, and and deservedly

939
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 1: so so. Listener Matt Caully emailed us to tell us

940
00:51:48,160 --> 00:51:51,279
Speaker 1: about his son, Sawyer. This kid is just he is

941
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:53,880
Speaker 1: our kind of hustler. He runs totally. He runs a

942
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:57,359
Speaker 1: little lure racket on his local lakes, kind of like

943
00:51:57,400 --> 00:51:59,080
Speaker 1: what you might have heard about some kids doing on

944
00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:02,719
Speaker 1: golf courses, but so much cooler. Before we get into

945
00:52:02,760 --> 00:52:06,560
Speaker 1: the details, though this the story has echoes of a

946
00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:09,240
Speaker 1: fish News segment we did a while ago about birds

947
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:12,120
Speaker 1: getting tangled and lost fishing gear. And if you remember,

948
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:14,560
Speaker 1: we we did this whole thing where we encouraged everyone

949
00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:16,400
Speaker 1: to pick up the ship you find hanging in trees

950
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:19,000
Speaker 1: when you go fishing. But I think it's safe to

951
00:52:19,040 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 1: say that even the more conscientious and and frugal of us,

952
00:52:24,880 --> 00:52:26,960
Speaker 1: we we tend to stick to the low hanging fruit

953
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:32,120
Speaker 1: when it comes to trees. Sadly, that's accurate. I mean, like,

954
00:52:32,600 --> 00:52:35,920
Speaker 1: if I spy a danglar in easy reach, I'll absolutely

955
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:39,319
Speaker 1: grab it and do my part. Um. But I I mean,

956
00:52:39,360 --> 00:52:41,880
Speaker 1: I feel like a schmuck for saying this, But if

957
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 1: getting something out of a tree requires like climbing or

958
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:48,920
Speaker 1: physics equations or tools, or it's gonna take more than

959
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:52,440
Speaker 1: three minutes away from my fishing. I probably float on by,

960
00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:55,680
Speaker 1: like I'm just I'm not built for for tree climbing,

961
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:58,680
Speaker 1: so it would have to be like, are really rare

962
00:52:58,920 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 1: or spending lore Again, this is terrible too, but I'm

963
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 1: just being honest. I'm not I'm not really like hard

964
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:07,799
Speaker 1: up for lures or flies. So even if there's a

965
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:11,319
Speaker 1: perfectly good rapple up there, I'm not risking like a

966
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:15,600
Speaker 1: fight with with Mr Gravity, who usually wins over like

967
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:20,799
Speaker 1: one more original rapple floater. It's just honest. I hear

968
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,799
Speaker 1: that I don't mind a little tree climbing. When I

969
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:25,560
Speaker 1: see stuff, I try and grab it, but I know

970
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:27,359
Speaker 1: I miss a bunch of stuff. The ones that get

971
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:32,680
Speaker 1: me are the power lines strung across the river. Oh yeah,

972
00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:36,920
Speaker 1: and because those always have like the mother load cornucopia

973
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:40,560
Speaker 1: of shiny hanging things and mono spider webs. But dude,

974
00:53:40,560 --> 00:53:42,839
Speaker 1: I'm not messing with power lines like, not even for

975
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:44,880
Speaker 1: a not even for a horse leather swim bait. I'm

976
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:48,759
Speaker 1: not doing that away fish under them though, right that

977
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 1: buzzing every every power line hole in every river's fishing

978
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 1: is it's really you're catching something under there, like a

979
00:53:56,120 --> 00:53:59,239
Speaker 1: brain tumor. But anyway, go ahead, back to the top

980
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:02,520
Speaker 1: of your hand, back on track here. Matt sent us

981
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:05,759
Speaker 1: an email titled tree fishing and explained that his son

982
00:54:05,840 --> 00:54:09,840
Speaker 1: Sawyer is really into retrieving lost lures from the trees

983
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:14,680
Speaker 1: around their local lakes, which sounds cute, right, Like it

984
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:18,359
Speaker 1: sounds just kind of adorable. But Matt also attached a

985
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:21,120
Speaker 1: photo of one of his kid's recent halls, and it's

986
00:54:21,120 --> 00:54:26,520
Speaker 1: not cute, it's jaw dropping, like it's amazing. He claims

987
00:54:26,880 --> 00:54:28,920
Speaker 1: in the email that this pile we saw a photo

988
00:54:28,960 --> 00:54:33,359
Speaker 1: of represents just a couple of days effort, and no joke.

989
00:54:33,440 --> 00:54:37,320
Speaker 1: There are dozens of quality baits. We're talking like hundreds

990
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 1: of dollars worth of gear easily. And this is not

991
00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:43,399
Speaker 1: a rusted out pile of gas station snell riggs. These

992
00:54:43,440 --> 00:54:48,480
Speaker 1: are quality, brand name goods that look fresh out the package,

993
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:53,560
Speaker 1: like maybe thrown one time right right into a tree. Yeah,

994
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:56,880
Speaker 1: I mean they're pristine, right, And my question was this,

995
00:54:57,320 --> 00:55:00,279
Speaker 1: how is he getting all these dates? Right? Like? These

996
00:55:00,320 --> 00:55:03,360
Speaker 1: are not lures that people just walk away from, you know,

997
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:06,840
Speaker 1: if they're even remotely accessible. And then the original email,

998
00:55:07,360 --> 00:55:09,960
Speaker 1: Matt mentioned Sawyer only does this in the winter and

999
00:55:10,120 --> 00:55:12,759
Speaker 1: doesn't get in the water. So I assume I just

1000
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:16,920
Speaker 1: naturally assumed. Okay, he's walking the tree line once these

1001
00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:20,600
Speaker 1: ponds and lakes freeze, right, He's he's using the ice. Yeah,

1002
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:22,759
Speaker 1: I mean, I've seen people do that. Turns out that

1003
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,520
Speaker 1: is completely incorrect because we did a little follow up

1004
00:55:25,960 --> 00:55:27,920
Speaker 1: and wouldn't you know what, Matt and Sawyer live in

1005
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:33,160
Speaker 1: Las Vegas, so there's no ice in Vegas. But fun fact,

1006
00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:35,200
Speaker 1: which I didn't know it, but I also don't really

1007
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:38,080
Speaker 1: think about it, the leaves do still fall off the

1008
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:42,400
Speaker 1: trees in the winter in Las Vegas. I know. But

1009
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:44,800
Speaker 1: I honestly I thought all the trees they were plastic,

1010
00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:47,560
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, Like, I didn't even know

1011
00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:52,719
Speaker 1: that they were real. Everything else there is plastic um. Yeah,

1012
00:55:52,760 --> 00:55:56,560
Speaker 1: So okay, so the real leaves in Vegas do fall off,

1013
00:55:56,600 --> 00:55:59,600
Speaker 1: and it makes the picking better and easier. So Matt writes,

1014
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: Sawyer amazes me with his creative ways of getting lures out.

1015
00:56:03,760 --> 00:56:07,040
Speaker 1: He used to use a thirty ft collapsible painters poll

1016
00:56:07,400 --> 00:56:11,360
Speaker 1: that he rigged with a few magnets and razors. The

1017
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 1: razor cuts the line and the hook would then stick

1018
00:56:14,960 --> 00:56:17,719
Speaker 1: to the magnet, but that got two on wheeldy. So

1019
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:20,359
Speaker 1: now he just uses a cut piece of bamboo. This

1020
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:25,440
Speaker 1: kid is mcgever. He's like, he's like mgeiver and inspector

1021
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:29,440
Speaker 1: gadget that goes fishing. I'm just super impressed. And Dr

1022
00:56:29,520 --> 00:56:33,640
Speaker 1: Claw throw him in there. And we're not the only

1023
00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:37,319
Speaker 1: ones who recognize uh Sawyer's intellect because these are these

1024
00:56:37,320 --> 00:56:40,799
Speaker 1: are well trafficked places, right, these are They sound like

1025
00:56:40,960 --> 00:56:44,520
Speaker 1: urban ponds, so you know, obviously people see him doing this.

1026
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:46,479
Speaker 1: You see a kid walking around with a thirty foot

1027
00:56:46,520 --> 00:56:51,520
Speaker 1: painters poll ridd with razors and magnets, and you're like, yeah,

1028
00:56:51,960 --> 00:56:56,640
Speaker 1: so so so people follow him around and then asked

1029
00:56:56,640 --> 00:57:00,520
Speaker 1: to buy the lures he's pulling out, and and according

1030
00:57:00,560 --> 00:57:03,040
Speaker 1: to again, according to Matt, so keeps most of the

1031
00:57:03,120 --> 00:57:05,520
Speaker 1: lures for himself because you know, he never he never

1032
00:57:05,560 --> 00:57:08,920
Speaker 1: knows what he's gonna need stock up. But he has

1033
00:57:09,080 --> 00:57:12,279
Speaker 1: sold a few back to the people who lost him.

1034
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:15,640
Speaker 1: He calls it a finder's fee, which is at a

1035
00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:21,240
Speaker 1: boy perfect yes, yes, perfect, pure pure vegas hustle man

1036
00:57:22,280 --> 00:57:26,280
Speaker 1: totally yeah. Yeah, And even though I mean, Vegas isn't

1037
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:29,000
Speaker 1: exactly what you'd call a superfichy town, right, but it

1038
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:32,320
Speaker 1: does have a pretty big population. And uh, Matt says,

1039
00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:34,960
Speaker 1: Sawyer is operating at public ponds that have bass and

1040
00:57:35,120 --> 00:57:38,439
Speaker 1: get a winner trout stocking, which was telling because that

1041
00:57:38,440 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 1: that explains the mash up of tiny inline spinners all

1042
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:45,000
Speaker 1: the way up. There's like striper's size jerk baits in

1043
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:49,200
Speaker 1: a file, just an in an insane array. Um, but

1044
00:57:49,320 --> 00:57:52,760
Speaker 1: it appears they're like a shipload of casual fish dabblers

1045
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:55,920
Speaker 1: in Vegas, apparently pounding the piss out of this water,

1046
00:57:56,640 --> 00:58:00,400
Speaker 1: and the vast majority of them cannot cast at all.

1047
00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:06,520
Speaker 1: Sawyers getting from what we can derive from that, Uh,

1048
00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:08,520
Speaker 1: it doesn't change my opinion that I have. I have

1049
00:58:08,560 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 1: no love for Vegas whatsoever. Yeah, me, They're sorry, Matt

1050
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:15,280
Speaker 1: and Sawyer. It's just not my place. It's not no

1051
00:58:15,640 --> 00:58:17,400
Speaker 1: have friends there. I love you all, death, just not

1052
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:19,200
Speaker 1: my place. But if I'm ever forced to go back,

1053
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:21,680
Speaker 1: as I have in the past, I can tell you

1054
00:58:21,720 --> 00:58:23,840
Speaker 1: I will be skipping the casinos and I will be

1055
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:26,120
Speaker 1: hollering at Matt to see if his kid will take

1056
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:30,760
Speaker 1: me Tree fishing Sawyer, we did. We appreciate your moxie

1057
00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:34,480
Speaker 1: and your entrepreneurial spirit. We should mention I feel like

1058
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:37,320
Speaker 1: we should also mention that Sawyer offered to send us

1059
00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 1: some of his recent haul. You did specify note no

1060
00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:43,280
Speaker 1: swim baits or whopper ploppers, which is just sound those

1061
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:45,840
Speaker 1: standards personal status. But I I want to respond to

1062
00:58:45,840 --> 00:58:48,600
Speaker 1: that here and say, no, man, you we're good. You

1063
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:51,480
Speaker 1: have earned those You should keep them and be on

1064
00:58:51,520 --> 00:58:54,640
Speaker 1: the lookout for some sweetass stickers to boot. Well, Miles

1065
00:58:54,640 --> 00:58:57,560
Speaker 1: is speaking for himself. I would take the whopper ploppers

1066
00:58:57,560 --> 00:58:59,680
Speaker 1: if he were willing. I mean, and are pass up

1067
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:02,960
Speaker 1: a whopper ploper? Uh? Yeah? Good stuff though, man, And remember,

1068
00:59:03,040 --> 00:59:06,840
Speaker 1: if you find something ridiculous fish or fishing related uh

1069
00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 1: for sale online, be it on Facebook, offer up, Kijiji,

1070
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:13,240
Speaker 1: or the dark web, shoot a link to Bent at

1071
00:59:13,240 --> 00:59:15,960
Speaker 1: the metator dot com. If we use your submission on

1072
00:59:16,000 --> 00:59:19,040
Speaker 1: the show, we'll set you up with a little Bent swag.

1073
00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:24,880
Speaker 1: So in that giant selection of recovered lures where pretty

1074
00:59:24,920 --> 00:59:27,439
Speaker 1: much all styles of bait were represented, did you happen

1075
00:59:27,480 --> 00:59:30,919
Speaker 1: to notice which one was missing? I did? I did.

1076
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:33,560
Speaker 1: I had wanted in particular that I think was missing.

1077
00:59:34,280 --> 00:59:35,760
Speaker 1: So if you guys want to know what it is,

1078
00:59:35,800 --> 00:59:37,680
Speaker 1: you're in luck because in this week's end of the

1079
00:59:37,720 --> 00:59:40,000
Speaker 1: Line segment, Miles is going to tell you all about

1080
00:59:40,440 --> 00:59:43,800
Speaker 1: that one bait apparently not dangling in the trees at

1081
00:59:43,840 --> 00:59:47,400
Speaker 1: that kid's personal treasure trove in Vegas. Okay, it's a

1082
00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:49,560
Speaker 1: story of a different kind of hustle and the power

1083
00:59:49,720 --> 01:00:01,040
Speaker 1: of internet. Chatta. Well, that's not allowed enough, Burt. The

1084
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:03,400
Speaker 1: chatter bait is perhaps the only lure in the past

1085
01:00:03,480 --> 01:00:06,840
Speaker 1: fifty years to define a whole new category of baits.

1086
01:00:07,520 --> 01:00:09,960
Speaker 1: The story of this lure demonstrates how the tackle industry

1087
01:00:09,960 --> 01:00:13,280
Speaker 1: has changed, but also proves that new lures don't need

1088
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:17,840
Speaker 1: high tech injected mold plastics or robotic inserts to get bit.

1089
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:21,640
Speaker 1: A chatter bait looks deceptively simple. It's a skirt of

1090
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:24,520
Speaker 1: jig with a hexagonal metal blade attached to the eye.

1091
01:00:25,080 --> 01:00:29,160
Speaker 1: The brilliance behind this design only reveals itself when fished.

1092
01:00:29,760 --> 01:00:32,760
Speaker 1: That blade caused the jig to vibrate and wiggle. It

1093
01:00:32,840 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 1: also clacks against the jighead, producing sound and flash. So

1094
01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:39,600
Speaker 1: the chatter bait is like a swim jig, crankbait, spinner

1095
01:00:39,600 --> 01:00:43,520
Speaker 1: bait hybrid. Like all my favorite end the line stories,

1096
01:00:43,880 --> 01:00:47,720
Speaker 1: this one starts in a home workshop. Ronnie Davis spent

1097
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:50,600
Speaker 1: his career as a research and development lab technician at

1098
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:55,600
Speaker 1: a company the designed tire materials. After retirement in Davis

1099
01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:59,640
Speaker 1: turned his attention to bass fishing. I guess I'm different

1100
01:00:59,640 --> 01:01:02,120
Speaker 1: than fisherman in them in the way that when I

1101
01:01:02,200 --> 01:01:07,280
Speaker 1: go to the lake bass fishing, there's not about lure

1102
01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:10,360
Speaker 1: only end of my lay. No matter what really is,

1103
01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:14,760
Speaker 1: it's something I've created, are altered to the point if

1104
01:01:14,760 --> 01:01:19,360
Speaker 1: I'm wherever I'm fishing the fish and saying that before

1105
01:01:19,400 --> 01:01:23,480
Speaker 1: from anybody but me. For more than a decade, Davis

1106
01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:26,920
Speaker 1: tinkered with the concept that would eventually become the chatter bait.

1107
01:01:27,560 --> 01:01:30,600
Speaker 1: His inspiration came from an early nineteen sixties were called

1108
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,960
Speaker 1: the Walker special hexagonal chunk of metal with a couple

1109
01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:36,640
Speaker 1: of trouble hooks attached. That lure didn't really take off,

1110
01:01:36,720 --> 01:01:40,000
Speaker 1: but Davis never forgot how its particular shape wobbled in

1111
01:01:40,040 --> 01:01:41,960
Speaker 1: the water. He figured that if he could find a

1112
01:01:41,960 --> 01:01:45,080
Speaker 1: way to incorporate it into a jig, he'd be able

1113
01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:47,800
Speaker 1: to impart that same movement in a more versatile and

1114
01:01:47,800 --> 01:01:52,160
Speaker 1: weedless bait. Ronnie Davis never considered selling his inventions. He

1115
01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:54,680
Speaker 1: just kind of like building stuff and wanted an edge

1116
01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:57,120
Speaker 1: in the local tournaments around his hometown of Rock Hills,

1117
01:01:57,160 --> 01:02:02,480
Speaker 1: South Carolina. Davis his son, On, however, saw commercial potential.

1118
01:02:03,360 --> 01:02:05,600
Speaker 1: For a couple of years, the two had friendly disagreements

1119
01:02:05,600 --> 01:02:08,120
Speaker 1: over bringing the lure to market. The younger Davis wanted

1120
01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:11,080
Speaker 1: to start selling the baits, while the older was never

1121
01:02:11,080 --> 01:02:14,520
Speaker 1: satisfied was always convinced that he could improve the design.

1122
01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:18,479
Speaker 1: In two thousand four, Ron Davis finally convinced his father

1123
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:21,200
Speaker 1: that the lure was ready. Ron quit his job as

1124
01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:24,480
Speaker 1: a tennis pro and founded rad Baits. Their first year,

1125
01:02:24,920 --> 01:02:28,120
Speaker 1: the company sold only five thousand chatter baits, but Ron

1126
01:02:28,200 --> 01:02:31,520
Speaker 1: had confidence not just in the potential of his father's design,

1127
01:02:31,880 --> 01:02:34,760
Speaker 1: but in his own understanding of how the bass industry

1128
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:39,040
Speaker 1: was shifting for generations. New baits got popular through phishing media.

1129
01:02:39,320 --> 01:02:42,080
Speaker 1: As I've talked about in previous episodes, lures like the Rappola,

1130
01:02:42,120 --> 01:02:45,000
Speaker 1: floating mental or the Devil's Horse gained much of their

1131
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:47,840
Speaker 1: attraction in the market from rite ups and national magazines.

1132
01:02:48,200 --> 01:02:51,600
Speaker 1: More modern designs like rubber worms and spinner bates found

1133
01:02:51,640 --> 01:02:54,080
Speaker 1: their way into the psyche of anglers through Saturday morning

1134
01:02:54,080 --> 01:02:57,440
Speaker 1: fishing shows. Ron Davis was pressing enough to see that

1135
01:02:57,480 --> 01:02:59,760
Speaker 1: bass heads in the early two thousands were tuning into

1136
01:02:59,800 --> 01:03:04,720
Speaker 1: some thing different. On Saturdays tournament standings, Ron gave chatter

1137
01:03:04,720 --> 01:03:07,240
Speaker 1: baits two up and coming pros. In two thousand five.

1138
01:03:07,520 --> 01:03:10,920
Speaker 1: One of those anglers, Brian Thrift, won the co angler

1139
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:14,040
Speaker 1: division of an FLW event using the chatter bait, but

1140
01:03:14,120 --> 01:03:18,120
Speaker 1: he didn't tell anybody about it. Afterward, Ron called him

1141
01:03:18,440 --> 01:03:22,440
Speaker 1: hat in hand and asked Thrift to please let people

1142
01:03:22,440 --> 01:03:24,000
Speaker 1: know what he was throwing the next time he did

1143
01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:27,840
Speaker 1: well with the bait. Thrift faced a dilemma. The chatter

1144
01:03:27,880 --> 01:03:30,000
Speaker 1: bait was a bit of a secret weapon, something he

1145
01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:32,560
Speaker 1: had confidence in that virtually no one else on the

1146
01:03:32,600 --> 01:03:35,320
Speaker 1: tour had, and as a young tournament angler trying to

1147
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:38,800
Speaker 1: build a career, that's a significant advantage. But he liked

1148
01:03:38,800 --> 01:03:41,720
Speaker 1: in respect of the Davis's and wanted to see them succeeds,

1149
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:44,680
Speaker 1: so he agreed that he would. Eight months later, Thrift

1150
01:03:44,760 --> 01:03:48,080
Speaker 1: fished and won his first fl W tournament as a

1151
01:03:48,120 --> 01:03:51,320
Speaker 1: pro on Lake Ogachobi. He caught fish over eight pounds

1152
01:03:51,360 --> 01:03:53,480
Speaker 1: every day of the tournament. And had several days where

1153
01:03:53,520 --> 01:03:56,560
Speaker 1: he caught multiple fish over eight pounds, all on chatter bait.

1154
01:03:57,320 --> 01:03:59,919
Speaker 1: He kept his promise to Ron and openly talked about

1155
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:03,520
Speaker 1: a new lure he was using. In the next FLW event.

1156
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:07,600
Speaker 1: Four of the top ten finishers we're using chatter baits.

1157
01:04:08,520 --> 01:04:11,520
Speaker 1: Words spread across the internet almost instantly. In a matter

1158
01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:15,880
Speaker 1: of days, Rad had received orders for a half million units,

1159
01:04:16,360 --> 01:04:19,000
Speaker 1: and they're projected annual sales went from a hundred thousand

1160
01:04:19,080 --> 01:04:23,280
Speaker 1: lures to two million. There was just one problem. They

1161
01:04:23,320 --> 01:04:28,320
Speaker 1: had no possible way of filling all those orders. So

1162
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 1: Ron contacted z Man Fishing Products, of South Carolina based

1163
01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:35,880
Speaker 1: company that at the time manufactured and distributed lure components.

1164
01:04:36,560 --> 01:04:38,720
Speaker 1: RAD Lures and z Man reached an agreement to co

1165
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:42,640
Speaker 1: brand and distribute chatter Baits, allowing them to dramatically increase

1166
01:04:42,680 --> 01:04:46,200
Speaker 1: production capacity and fill all the incoming orders. And this

1167
01:04:46,280 --> 01:04:48,280
Speaker 1: is probably the spot where you expect the happily ever

1168
01:04:48,320 --> 01:04:51,720
Speaker 1: after to come in. But that isn't actually the end.

1169
01:04:52,320 --> 01:04:55,200
Speaker 1: Not really. Remember how it intro the chatter bait by

1170
01:04:55,240 --> 01:04:58,200
Speaker 1: talking about how simple it is. Well, that simplicity meant

1171
01:04:58,200 --> 01:05:00,680
Speaker 1: that just about anyone with basic tool and know how

1172
01:05:00,920 --> 01:05:04,560
Speaker 1: could make their own. Six months after chatter Bates became

1173
01:05:04,560 --> 01:05:07,400
Speaker 1: the darling of the bass tournament scene, there were seventy

1174
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:10,760
Speaker 1: different knockoffs for sale, which was a problem for a

1175
01:05:10,800 --> 01:05:13,320
Speaker 1: bait and a brand that was just starting to take off.

1176
01:05:14,280 --> 01:05:18,120
Speaker 1: You remember the genius who invented the spinner bait, Yet

1177
01:05:18,200 --> 01:05:20,560
Speaker 1: neither do I, and and neither does anyone else, because

1178
01:05:20,720 --> 01:05:22,440
Speaker 1: though whoever that was may have been a hell of

1179
01:05:22,440 --> 01:05:25,960
Speaker 1: a lure inventor, they weren't all that business savvy. But

1180
01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:29,680
Speaker 1: see the Davis is they are. They filed several patent

1181
01:05:29,760 --> 01:05:32,560
Speaker 1: applications in two thousand four, including a patent on metal

1182
01:05:32,600 --> 01:05:36,640
Speaker 1: blades attached directly to the eyes of way to jakeheads.

1183
01:05:37,240 --> 01:05:39,960
Speaker 1: Though it took nearly five years and reported hundred thousand

1184
01:05:40,000 --> 01:05:44,480
Speaker 1: dollars that Davis's were awarded those patents, Ron spent years

1185
01:05:44,800 --> 01:05:49,120
Speaker 1: tracking down intellectual property infringements. Even after the Davis has

1186
01:05:49,120 --> 01:05:51,400
Speaker 1: sold chatter Bait to z Man in two thousand eight,

1187
01:05:51,640 --> 01:05:55,160
Speaker 1: Ron continued sending out seas and desist orders. Everyone in

1188
01:05:55,200 --> 01:05:59,080
Speaker 1: the business knows not to mess with chatter baits. In

1189
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:03,200
Speaker 1: Rick Klun won a Bass Elite tournament using a homemade

1190
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:08,360
Speaker 1: chatter Bait knockoff afterwards, he told the cameras, that's cloudy

1191
01:06:08,400 --> 01:06:10,960
Speaker 1: winding conditions. I say, which the face. I called it

1192
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:12,919
Speaker 1: a trick, sure too, but it's just a chatter bait

1193
01:06:13,000 --> 01:06:16,400
Speaker 1: copy that I don't say z Man and saying the

1194
01:06:16,840 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 1: z Man, I like what they do. They make you,

1195
01:06:19,760 --> 01:06:22,040
Speaker 1: they see you, and they said, I wish all companies

1196
01:06:22,040 --> 01:06:24,880
Speaker 1: could do that and protect stuff in this business. Z

1197
01:06:25,000 --> 01:06:28,400
Speaker 1: Man went from being a midsized lure component maker to

1198
01:06:28,480 --> 01:06:30,880
Speaker 1: one of the big names and modern bass lures. The

1199
01:06:31,000 --> 01:06:34,160
Speaker 1: Davis has sold the chatter Bait for an undisclosed amount,

1200
01:06:34,200 --> 01:06:36,720
Speaker 1: but enough that ron will never have to go back

1201
01:06:36,760 --> 01:06:40,440
Speaker 1: to being tennis bro. His father, Ronnie, is still designing

1202
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:43,920
Speaker 1: lures and still convinced that his bait, the lure that

1203
01:06:44,040 --> 01:06:48,680
Speaker 1: changed bass fishing completely, can be improved. There's got to

1204
01:06:48,720 --> 01:06:55,080
Speaker 1: be other ways to create the same type action without

1205
01:06:55,160 --> 01:07:00,400
Speaker 1: infringing on the original chatter bait Patton and what I've

1206
01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:02,920
Speaker 1: been waiting on for this this many years. Somebody's got

1207
01:07:02,920 --> 01:07:11,040
Speaker 1: to do it better. So that's all we got for

1208
01:07:11,040 --> 01:07:13,640
Speaker 1: you this week. As you continue counting down the spring,

1209
01:07:13,760 --> 01:07:16,680
Speaker 1: remember if you catch a record striper, don't bother submitting

1210
01:07:16,720 --> 01:07:19,080
Speaker 1: it to the I g F A Uh, you won't

1211
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:22,200
Speaker 1: survive the apocalypse, but fat head minnows will. And all

1212
01:07:22,200 --> 01:07:24,120
Speaker 1: it takes to be a hustler is a bamboo stick

1213
01:07:24,280 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 1: or the foresight to patent something before you try to

1214
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:30,320
Speaker 1: make a buck off it. Nice. Yes, uh, keep those

1215
01:07:30,360 --> 01:07:34,680
Speaker 1: sales and items, bar nomination, awkward photos, comments, critiques, and

1216
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:37,560
Speaker 1: just about anything else you feel like sending coming to

1217
01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:41,800
Speaker 1: us at bent at the meat eater dot com. Yes,

1218
01:07:41,920 --> 01:07:44,720
Speaker 1: please do, and don't forget. Your use of the degenerate

1219
01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:47,960
Speaker 1: Angler and Bent podcast hashtags over the next week could

1220
01:07:48,000 --> 01:07:50,800
Speaker 1: put you on the path to pre spawn glory. With

1221
01:07:50,880 --> 01:07:54,520
Speaker 1: those soft baits and custom hard swim bait from Hoshmoto concepts.

1222
01:07:54,880 --> 01:07:58,040
Speaker 1: I'm not eligible, but I'm gonna take back my break

1223
01:07:58,040 --> 01:08:01,560
Speaker 1: into one earlier and say that if I one, I'd

1224
01:08:01,560 --> 01:08:11,960
Speaker 1: have the hardbad painted like Tigra. How about you, I'd

1225
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:14,160
Speaker 1: ask for a magic eye pattern. It reveals an image

1226
01:08:14,160 --> 01:08:20,880
Speaker 1: of Willem to folk