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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

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Speaker 2: Right now, Darak kazer Shahi, the CEO of Uber, sitting

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Speaker 2: down with Tom Giles in conversation live on Bloomberg.

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Speaker 1: Let's listen.

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Speaker 2: It came out of Uber earlier this week. Thank you

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Speaker 2: Natalie Lung for breaking that story about some changes upper management.

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Speaker 2: You promoted Andrew McDonald to chief operating disser. You were

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Speaker 2: quick to say you're not going anywhere anytime soon. You

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Speaker 2: also said in your note something that was a little

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Speaker 2: bit of a little enigmatic to those of us on

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Speaker 2: the outside that with Max stepping up, I intend to

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Speaker 2: put focus on our six strategic shifts, spending more time

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Speaker 2: with our tech teams.

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Speaker 1: Tell us about what are the.

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Speaker 2: Six strategic shifts and why do you need to spend

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Speaker 2: more time with the tech teams.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think if I talked about all six would

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Speaker 1: be here the whole time. But for example, one that

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Speaker 1: we talk about for us is coming much more of

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Speaker 1: a company in terms of the lifetime relationship with our customers.

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Speaker 1: And one of the reasons why actually I wanted to

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Speaker 1: bring back in as president COO. He's been at Uber

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Speaker 1: longer than I have, for thirteen years. He's an incredible

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Speaker 1: veteran incredible operator. Is that the power we see in

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Speaker 1: the Uber platform continues to increase. Now what I mean

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Speaker 1: by that is we have a relationship with you on

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Speaker 1: the ride side, a lot of you using Uber to

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Speaker 1: come here, Thank you very much. And then are Uber

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Speaker 1: eats business is almost as large as an Uber rides

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Speaker 1: business and growing very very quickly and accelerating if anything,

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Speaker 1: and looking at a customer right now, the way the

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Speaker 1: business was built, we essentially had a mobility business that

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Speaker 1: mac ran delivery business that Pierre Dmitri ran did a

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Speaker 1: terrific job, and it was almost like two businesses interacting

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Speaker 1: with you as a customer. And now the focus for

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Speaker 1: us is really moving to lifetime interaction with a customer,

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Speaker 1: looking at you not just as an Uber customer Uber

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Speaker 1: Ease customer, but overall as an Uber customer, and how

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Speaker 1: do we continue to build that relationship. For example, the

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Speaker 1: membership program that we've got Uber one gives you no

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Speaker 1: delivery fees and discounts on rides. We've got thirty million members,

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Speaker 1: and people who use multiple products on Uber tend to have,

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Speaker 1: you know, transact with us much more, tend to have

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Speaker 1: much more satisfaction with the product. And that's one of

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Speaker 1: the reasons I wanted to get an experience operating executive

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Speaker 1: to really focus on the overall relationship with a customer

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Speaker 1: rather than separate p and ls.

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Speaker 2: I think you said one in five of your customers

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Speaker 2: are using both mobility and delivery.

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Speaker 1: It's about now. It's closer to a third now, So

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Speaker 1: it's increasing statilist, so it's moving.

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Speaker 2: In the right direction, right, What do you do to

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Speaker 2: get that number higher? And where do you want it

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Speaker 2: to be in say three years.

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Speaker 1: Well, listen, we want to get to fifty percent. And

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Speaker 1: once we get to fifty percent, I want to go

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Speaker 1: higher than that. And it's about the little interactions every day.

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Speaker 1: For example, when I got a ride to the office

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Speaker 1: the other day and along the way, I was offered

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Speaker 1: a coffee from Phills to be ready for me along

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Speaker 1: the way to the office, right, And so it's those

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Speaker 1: little interactions that are value add to the consumer. It's like, great,

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Speaker 1: of course I want my morning coffee and if it

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Speaker 1: can be ready for me right on the way to work,

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Speaker 1: that's awesome. That is also a way to kind of

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Speaker 1: get me to use Uber East. For example, if I

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Speaker 1: didn't use it now. I use EAS all the time.

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Speaker 1: But it's these little interactions powered by AI, power by personalization,

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Speaker 1: understand the context of where you're going and there's a

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Speaker 1: coffee shop close by to give you that opportunity. It's

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Speaker 1: those experiences that we have to build more and more,

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Speaker 1: which is one of the reasons now I'm going to

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Speaker 1: work more with the tech teams because you know they're

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Speaker 1: they're the ones building these experiences.

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Speaker 2: I want to spend a little bit of time talking

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Speaker 2: about your relationship with Autonomous Yeah. Sure, it's been a

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Speaker 2: up and down for Uber over the years, even preceding

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Speaker 2: your tenure. You have stakes, and a lot of AV

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Speaker 2: companies talked recently about wanting to monetize some of those.

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Speaker 2: Can you tell us a little bit or your stakes

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Speaker 2: and your equity stakes? Generally you didn't specify av's but

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Speaker 2: I am curious. Have you identified where you want to

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Speaker 2: focus where? What do you want to free the cash up?

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Speaker 2: Is it about developing deeper relationships with a select number

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Speaker 2: of AV partners.

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Speaker 1: What's the strategy? So we want to essentially support the

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Speaker 1: AV ecosystem and continue to help that ecosystem develop and

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Speaker 1: then av's penetrate into the marketplace. Av we think represents

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Speaker 1: a safer way of transportation. Ultimately, we think it'll expand

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Speaker 1: the marketplace as it makes kind of safe transportation and

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Speaker 1: cities available to everybody. So we're big fans of AV

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Speaker 1: and generally we're working with multiple partners in the ecosystem

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Speaker 1: waymore for example, in Austin and Atlanta coming up wave AVRI.

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Speaker 1: There are probably eighteen partnerships that we have in the

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Speaker 1: AV ecosystem, and we want to help these players develop

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Speaker 1: by investing in them in some cases, but really by

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Speaker 1: working with them to bring their product to market. These

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Speaker 1: are technologies that are unbelievably promising, but they've taken billions

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Speaker 1: of dollars to develop and you know, ten plus years,

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Speaker 1: and it's one of those overnight successes that's kind of

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Speaker 1: taken twenty years of development, but it's finally ready to

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Speaker 1: hit market, and we want to help the ecosystem get there. Separately,

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Speaker 1: we have large stakes in many companies, you know, well

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Speaker 1: over five billion dollars that we think we can take

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Speaker 1: some of those steaks and essentially recycle them into additional

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Speaker 1: investments in the AV ecosystem. So over a period of

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Speaker 1: time we'll get it right, We've got a ton of

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Speaker 1: free cash fow of the companies one way or the other.

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Speaker 1: You know, the goal is to build up the av

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Speaker 1: ecosystem around our network.

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Speaker 2: Build up the av ecosystem. You guys have the UI

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Speaker 2: for example, that works really well. You have that customer

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Speaker 2: relationship that maybe some of them don't. So is the

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Speaker 2: idea you really want to kind of concentrate on a

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Speaker 2: fewer number or is it just keep the broad brush

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Speaker 2: broad number of av partners.

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Speaker 1: I mean, obviously we want to make sure that we

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Speaker 1: partner with the right players, and I'd say safeties is

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Speaker 1: the most important area. We want to make sure that

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Speaker 1: they pass with flying colors through our safety case, which

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Speaker 1: is actually pretty tough. But to the extent that the

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Speaker 1: tech is there, the team is there, safety is part

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Speaker 1: of the culture we want to work with them. So

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Speaker 1: there's a right now there are a number of promising

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Speaker 1: partners and you'll probably see the number of partners increase

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Speaker 1: for us.

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Speaker 2: Okay, you mentioned your relationship with Waimo. We had Sundar

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Speaker 2: last night. Asked him about when when he's going to

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Speaker 2: be able to take away from Mountain View all the

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Speaker 2: way up to San Francisco, We're not quite there yet,

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Speaker 2: but there are genuine concerns about the ways that you

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Speaker 2: are both a partner and a competitor to Weaimo. What

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Speaker 2: is the conversation like internally and with your board over

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Speaker 2: how you continue to deepen that what is a valuable

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Speaker 2: relationship as far as I can tell, but also keep

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Speaker 2: it from becoming something that starts to undermine your business.

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Speaker 1: Well, the relationship with Weimo. I think the press and

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Speaker 1: to some extent investors love to create drama because well

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Speaker 1: the hell. But you know, the type of relationship that

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Speaker 1: we have with Weaimo is very similar, for example, to

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Speaker 1: the type of relationship we'll have with a Starbucks coffee.

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Speaker 1: They're a great partner with Uber Eats, and at the

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Speaker 1: same time, Starbucks wants to have its own app and

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Speaker 1: wants to have interactions directly with the customer. And it

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Speaker 1: isn't an either or it's an ant. So we offer

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Speaker 1: Starbucks and Eats and they compete with us in some

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Speaker 1: ways with a Starbucks app and with their loyalty program,

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Speaker 1: and that's fine. That's the way business goes. Same thing

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Speaker 1: with Dominos Dominoes three years ago, was it going to

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Speaker 1: work with the platforms now works with the platforms and

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Speaker 1: in the same way. In San Francisco, yes, we compete

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Speaker 1: with Weamo to get rides here, but in Austin Atlanta,

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Speaker 1: we absolutely work with them. And what we're seeing in

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Speaker 1: Austin is, frankly, the launch is going better than we expected.

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Speaker 1: Number one is safety and obviously Wemo's the best at it.

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Speaker 1: And number two is customer love. And our customers are

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Speaker 1: loving kind of the delight and surprise of getting Awamo

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Speaker 1: and they're coming back. So I do think that this

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Speaker 1: is going to be It's not either or we're going

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Speaker 1: to be working together. Weimo is developing its own channels

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Speaker 1: and at the same time we can work together very

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Speaker 1: constructively as.

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Speaker 2: We head toward an increasingly a the future. I know

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Speaker 2: you've been asked about this before, but what are some

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Speaker 2: of the new ways that you're seeking to overcome that

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Speaker 2: challenge of reassuring drivers who are still an incredibly important

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Speaker 2: part of your ecosystem very much You have their backs,

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Speaker 2: but we also love these way moods that have no

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Speaker 2: driver in.

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Speaker 1: Them very much. So. So one is growth helps a lot, right,

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Speaker 1: So our business is growing almost twenty percent a year,

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Speaker 1: and on average we're going to need more drivers on

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Speaker 1: the platform for the next couple of years, and I

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Speaker 1: see that continuing for some period of time. So I

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Speaker 1: think drivers generally on our platform are going to be

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Speaker 1: more busy, are going to have more to do, and

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Speaker 1: the number of drivers on our platform and caurers on

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Speaker 1: our platform is going to grow. That's one. The second though,

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Speaker 1: is we're putting significant efforts in creating more work and

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Speaker 1: earnings opportunities for drivers and couriers. Right we started with

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Speaker 1: driving who we might to delivery. Now you can actually shop,

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Speaker 1: and there's a subsegment of careers et cetera who you

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Speaker 1: know will love their local Walmart, for example, or Albertson's

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Speaker 1: and you know shopping those stores or for Walmart, we

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Speaker 1: deliver those packages. And now we're actually going further where

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Speaker 1: we're developing now what we call Uber AI solutions, where

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Speaker 1: drivers are actually now labeling maps, translating language, looking at

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Speaker 1: AI answers, and grading AI answers. So, you know, one

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Speaker 1: way to look at Uber is that we are essentially

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Speaker 1: a transportation platform will help you go anywhere, get anything.

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Speaker 1: Another way to look at Uber is that we are

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Speaker 1: the largest on demand work platform on Earth and the

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Speaker 1: first use case for US is actually transportation, and now

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Speaker 1: we're expanding use cases into other use cases and knowledge

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Speaker 1: work is one of them. So I think as long

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Speaker 1: as we grow, as long as we are honest with

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Speaker 1: our drivers and couriers in terms of our expectations and

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Speaker 1: now expand the number of opportunities to them, I think

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Speaker 1: will be more than fine.

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Speaker 2: You're you're actually getting your drivers, You're encouraging your drivers

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Speaker 2: to help the AI and make it smarter. The AI

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Speaker 2: that's gonna it's it's going to be put.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's going to be a part of our life

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Speaker 1: going forward. And this is it's good work. And uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, certainly our drivers are qualified to do it.

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Speaker 2: How much of how much of their time do you

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Speaker 2: find their spending doing I assume this is like in

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Speaker 2: the course of a of a day's drive.

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Speaker 1: It's very it's very small compared to the overall workload. Right,

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Speaker 1: we're doing over thirty three million trips a day now

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Speaker 1: in terms of our main line segments. But it's a

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Speaker 1: Uber AI Solutions is a very very promising segment growth

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Speaker 1: segment for US, and I think in five ten years

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Speaker 1: it will be a significant part of the overall opportunities

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Speaker 1: that we're giving to our drivers and careers.

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Speaker 2: I want to talk about Bill Ackman sure his relationship

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Speaker 2: with Uber. It's nice to have a an activist who's

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Speaker 2: friendly as far as I can tell us about the

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Speaker 2: ways that you are interacting with Bill and how he

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Speaker 2: is encouraging Uber to be better.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So Bill is one of the legendary investors out there,

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Speaker 1: and so I was very happy, Like I'm a fan

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Speaker 1: of his kind of investing fundamentals, long term, making big bets.

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Speaker 1: So I've always admired Bill. So when we found out

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Speaker 1: that he was a shareholder, is like right on. And

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Speaker 1: the cool thing about Bill as a shareholder is he

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Speaker 1: uses the product. He is intensely interested in the product's

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Speaker 1: and he's talking to his drivers, so he gives me

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Speaker 1: a lot of feedback and actually a couple of features.

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Speaker 1: You know, for example, he was leaving dinner one night

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Speaker 1: and he wanted to order ubers for his kids and

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Speaker 1: his parents, and for some technical reasons, we couldn't do

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Speaker 1: that at the time, and we built that feature based

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Speaker 1: on that idea, and it's proven to be a really

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Speaker 1: cool feature. So you want the kind of long term

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Speaker 1: investor that Bill is. But what's cool about it is

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Speaker 1: that he's actually, you know, he's brilliant, but he uses

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Speaker 1: a product and he uses in a constructive way. And

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Speaker 1: we've got a great relationship.

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Speaker 2: Speaking of relationships with folks on the East coast, you

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Speaker 2: you know, Silicon Valley has this really interesting relationship with

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Speaker 2: the Trump administration right now, this need to engage, but

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Speaker 2: also recognizing that there are policies that the Trump administration,

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Speaker 2: like any administration, is pursuing, that may not work so

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Speaker 2: well for the tech industry. No taxes on tips something

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Speaker 2: that's part of the legislation, something that you would say

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Speaker 2: you support. Can you talk about kind of the dialogue

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Speaker 2: that you have with the president and what kind of

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Speaker 2: feedback are you giving him on that, what kind of

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Speaker 2: feedback are you giving him on the tax bill more generally?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so we want is taxes on tips is we

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Speaker 1: think a terrific piece of legislation. It will, if passed,

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Speaker 1: save our drivers and caurers hundreds of millions of dollars

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Speaker 1: in taxes that they would have otherwise paid. So we

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Speaker 1: are big supporters of that.

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Speaker 2: And I've put a specific number on that over a

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Speaker 2: time period, it's.

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Speaker 1: In the hundreds of millions. I don't know the specifics,

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Speaker 1: but it's significant, and we think it's a appropriately targeted,

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Speaker 1: you know, to a segment of the population that we

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Speaker 1: all want succeed. And I've been very supportive of that

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Speaker 1: directly with the President and our folks, with the staff,

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Speaker 1: and I see generally we engage with every administration out there,

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Speaker 1: both in on a federal level and on a state level.

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Speaker 1: We certainly engage with the Trump administration, and what I

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Speaker 1: like in terms of what I'm seeing is that it

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Speaker 1: is a pro growth, pro business in terms of kind

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Speaker 1: of common business interest administration, and we'll continue to engage

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Speaker 1: with them constructtively going forward.

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Speaker 2: There's a lot of rhetoric around immigration and a lot

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Speaker 2: of policies around immigration that have a mixed effect. What's

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Speaker 2: your message to the Trump administration when it comes to

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Speaker 2: limitations on immigration. You rely on immigrations, immigrants for build drivers,

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Speaker 2: for your engineers, across the board.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So I think I'm an immigrant. You know, I

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Speaker 1: came here when I was nine years old. So I

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Speaker 1: am absolutely pro immigration generally for the US. But I

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Speaker 1: think there's no question that we should secure borders, and

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Speaker 1: so I think from that standpoint, we're very supportive our

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Speaker 1: drivers and couriers have been quite supportive of President Trump

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Speaker 1: as well for similar reasons. And I think with immigration,

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Speaker 1: you know, there is a dialogue for us to be had,

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Speaker 1: which is what is the right level of immigration in

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Speaker 1: this country, How you know, we select, how we qualify,

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Speaker 1: et cetera. That I'm hoping that we get to have

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Speaker 1: that dialogue as a country. And I think that dialogue

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Speaker 1: suffers from kind of the two sides shooting at each other.

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Speaker 1: But I think that if we can just come together

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Speaker 1: and recognize that this is a largely immigrant nation and

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Speaker 1: immigration done right can benefit society. Done wrong, it can

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Speaker 1: go the other way. So let's just focus on doing

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Speaker 1: it right well.

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Speaker 2: For example, and it's not necessarily that we're building a

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Speaker 2: wall on the northern border, but you, on your earnings

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Speaker 2: called talked about the ways that some of this sort

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Speaker 2: of unwillingness to come to the United States because of

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Speaker 2: some of its political stances toward foreign countries starting to

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Speaker 2: affect your business.

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Speaker 1: We've definitely seen Canadian immigration into the travel to the

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Speaker 1: US come down from historical levels. The good news for

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Speaker 1: Uber is that we're a global company, so to the

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Speaker 1: extent that Canadians are traveling to Europe. They use Uber

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Speaker 1: in Canada and they'll be able to use Uber in

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Speaker 1: Europe as well. So for US, the effect on the

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Speaker 1: business is changing business mix. Okay, But as long as

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Speaker 1: people travel and the global economies are doing well, which

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Speaker 1: they are, we're going to interact with consumers one way

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Speaker 1: or the other.

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Speaker 2: Have you seen any shifts since the last weight in

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Speaker 2: on this topic?

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Speaker 1: The biggest one is a Canadian shift and that has

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Speaker 1: there was a i say initial significant effect and we're

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Speaker 1: seeing some of that continue, not all of it continue.

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Speaker 2: You talked about the consumer sentiment holding up. What have

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Speaker 2: you seen since you last talked to the public about that.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'm not going to update obviously we're in the

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Speaker 1: middle of a quarter. But generally we have seen for

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Speaker 1: the past two years and that has continued until last quarter.

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Speaker 1: The consumer remains strong. We're not seeing any effects in

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Speaker 1: terms of, you know, lack of confidence, et cetera. We

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Speaker 1: look to see if consumers are trading down first am,

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Speaker 1: all the kinds restaurants that they're eating at, or are

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Speaker 1: reducing the size of let's say, the shopping baskets. We

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Speaker 1: don't see any signal whatsoever. The US consumer and generally

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Speaker 1: the global consumer has remained resilient, and obviously I'm hoping

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Speaker 1: that continuing.

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Speaker 2: I want to take just a couple of seconds before

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Speaker 2: I get kicked you get and I get kicked off, I.

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Speaker 1: Get kicked off. I think you're staying.

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Speaker 2: I understand that you are considering stable coin as a

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Speaker 2: vehicle or uber.

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Speaker 1: Talk about where.

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Speaker 2: Your considerations are and how that might benefit your business.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we're still in the study phase, I say, but

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Speaker 1: I think stable coin is one of the for me,

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Speaker 1: more interesting instantiations of crypto that has a practical benefit

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Speaker 1: other than crypto's a store value. You know, obviously you

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Speaker 1: can have your opinions on bitcoin, but it's a proven commodity,

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Speaker 1: will and you know, people have different opinions on where

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Speaker 1: it's going. But I do think that stable coin is

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Speaker 1: quite promising, especially for global companies that are moving money

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Speaker 1: around globally, to create a mechanism for us to essentially

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Speaker 1: reduce costs in terms of moving money internationally. So that's

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Speaker 1: super interesting to us and we're definitely going to take a.

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Speaker 2: Look taking a look at it closely. Dara, thank you

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Speaker 2: so much for joining us, Thank you for having tech

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Speaker 2: is great to have you here. Please, thank you for

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Speaker 2: giving me a round the block.

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Speaker 1: That was Bloomberg Senior Executive editor for Global Technology Tom Giles,

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Speaker 1: sitting down with the CEO of Uber, Dara Kosher shahe

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Speaker 1: at the Bloomberg Tech Summit out in San Francisco. Seen

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Speaker 1: and heard live here on Bloomberg TV and radio.