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Speaker 1: Happy earth Day. And by happy earth Day, I mean

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Speaker 1: the Earth is dying and people are killing it. Yeah, welcome, welcome.

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Speaker 1: Did it happened here the Earth Day episode?

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Speaker 2: Now now, now, quick question me? What is Earth?

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Speaker 3: So?

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Speaker 1: The Earth is one of many, many, many planets in

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Speaker 1: the universe. It was, it was, it's cagealed rock. There's

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Speaker 1: some like melty ship in the middle of it. But

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Speaker 1: on the outside there's a part of it that's nice

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Speaker 1: to live on, and it'd be nice to continue to

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Speaker 1: have it be that.

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Speaker 2: Ah. Okay, that's this is different than what I had

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Speaker 2: been raised to believe. But but but i'll i'll humor

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Speaker 2: you here, please continue.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and so okay, we were going to be talking

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Speaker 1: today about on one of the many attempts to destroy

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Speaker 1: the Earth. And also Garrison this year too.

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Speaker 4: Hello, yes, hi, I'm I'm I'm here also for the

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Speaker 4: Earth for the Earth.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And this is a special episode featuring a bombing,

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Speaker 1: so it ah, I love a good bombing. Yeah, this

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Speaker 1: is very exciting. Actually, tally speaking, it's two bombs. So

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Speaker 1: it is near midnight on July tenth, nineteen eighty five,

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Speaker 1: the crew of the Green peace boat Rainbow Warrior, which

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Speaker 1: is docked in the harbor of Auckland, which is New

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Speaker 1: Zealand's largest city. A thing that I learned Robb researching

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Speaker 1: this episode.

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Speaker 4: Wait, really, that's the New Zealand's largest city.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there's not. There's not a lot in New

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Speaker 2: Zealand other than Hobbits and that one show about vampires.

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Speaker 1: A lot of cheese too that they make, make a

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Speaker 1: lot of make a lot of milk. So they Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the greenpiest boat is. It's docked in this harbor. Most

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Speaker 1: of the crew is asleep or some of them are

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Speaker 1: playing cards, and they are They are relaxing after having

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Speaker 1: celebrated the birthday of one of their crews. Suddenly, a

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Speaker 1: massive shock rips through the boat. Water starts flooding into

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Speaker 1: the ship. The lights go out, and the crew thinks

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Speaker 1: they've been hit by a tug boat by accident that

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Speaker 1: lasts a couple of minutes until a second explosion hits

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Speaker 1: the boat.

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Speaker 4: Mister President, a second explosion has hit the boat.

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Speaker 2: Nine to eleven joke, Yes, very excellent, good work.

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Speaker 1: So the crew the light like the people fleeing nine

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Speaker 1: to eleven. The crew flees the boat, but they realize

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Speaker 1: that their photographer, a guy named Fernando Perieira is missing,

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Speaker 1: and peri Era like hasn't quite realized that the boat

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Speaker 1: is like under attack, and so he runs back to

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Speaker 1: his cabin to grab his camera, and then the second

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Speaker 1: explosion hits and the boat sinks so fast that he

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Speaker 1: never has a chance to get back up and he

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Speaker 1: drowns to death. And the crew very quickly realizes that

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Speaker 1: this is not an accident, and rescue divers discovered there

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Speaker 1: are massive there's like massive holes in the ship from

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Speaker 1: where it's been blown up from the outside, and they

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Speaker 1: eventually determined that this boat, which is again a green

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Speaker 1: piece boat that is doing non violence of with dis obedience,

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Speaker 1: has been sunk by limpet mines.

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Speaker 2: Oh boy, oh, I love a good limp at mine.

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Speaker 2: I'm so happy that we're getting limp at in this episode.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we're getting We're getting limpet mines. We're getting

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Speaker 1: there'll be some special Forces boats later or I say

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Speaker 1: boats is one boat, but yeah, we're gonna we're going

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Speaker 1: through all of the sort of naval combat plates here. Excellent,

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Speaker 1: but this raises the question who would commit such an

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Speaker 1: act of terrorism on the I can't actually say on

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Speaker 1: the soil of New Zealand because it's technically in the

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Speaker 1: water of New Zealand.

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Speaker 4: In the waters of New Zealand.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, off the coast of New Zealand. Sure, yeah,

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Speaker 2: we get it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. But okay, So to answer this question, we need

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Speaker 1: to talk about the anti nuclear movements. And you know,

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Speaker 1: there's been a kind of rewriting of history about what

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Speaker 1: the anti nuclear movement was actually about to basically like

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Speaker 1: sort of purely focused on the anti nuclear movement as

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Speaker 1: something it's just about nuclear power, but that was never true.

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Speaker 1: The movement was always way more larger than that, and

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Speaker 1: a huge part of it was about opposing nuclear weapons,

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Speaker 1: both in terms of like opposing nuclear tests and in

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Speaker 1: terms of fighting for nuclear disarmament on the fairly simple

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Speaker 1: principle that having weapons that can kill everyone on Earth

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Speaker 1: around is a bad idea.

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Speaker 4: Well, I mean, the bad idea if you don't want

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Speaker 4: to destroy the entire Earth.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, that's true.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, if you want to destroy the Earth, that's a

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Speaker 2: pretty good idea.

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Speaker 1: Actually, unfortunately, I'm on a living kick right now, so

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Speaker 1: I'm now destroying everything on Earth.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's good that you can admit your bias

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Speaker 2: upfront though.

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Speaker 1: That's y Yeah, this is a very important thing in journalism.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So you know, okay, so when we were talking bit about

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Speaker 1: nuclear testing, because it doesn't it doesn't happen anymore nuclear testing. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So we used to just like detonate nuclear bombs like

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Speaker 1: in the air.

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Speaker 2: Damn right, your goddamn right, we did.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And it turns out this this kills enormous numbers

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Speaker 1: of people. But the problem is that it kills them

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Speaker 1: very slowly with increased cancer rates, which is very difficult

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Speaker 1: to sort of track or like prove direct causality. And

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Speaker 1: you know, this is aided by the fact that when

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Speaker 1: countries are nuclear testing, they are almost always killing people.

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Speaker 1: Well they're almost always dropping this the yukes on indigenous land,

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Speaker 1: which means that they're killing people who are the government

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Speaker 1: and most of the countries just like does not care about.

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Speaker 1: And you know, you can you can literally map colonialism

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Speaker 1: and sort of the value that a given like a

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Speaker 1: given state placed on people's lives by where they tested

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Speaker 1: nuclear weapons. So, for example, the US tested nuclear bombs

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Speaker 1: and places like the Bikinia Toll, the Marshall Islands, a

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Speaker 1: former tribal land in Nevada in New Mexico, and in Hatesburg, Mississippi. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so Jesus ribs, all those are bad except except Mississippi. No, no,

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Speaker 1: that was also bad because I guess, get guess, get

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Speaker 1: guess what race the population of Hatesville, Mississippi was. Okay,

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Speaker 1: all right, yeah, they got paid ten dollars to get

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Speaker 1: real located quote unquote, yeah, this is this is this

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Speaker 1: is not a white it's not a white city. They

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Speaker 1: are blowing up with a nuclear bomb.

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Speaker 4: Not like it's not like a gated community for white

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Speaker 4: men in their fifties or something.

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Speaker 1: No.

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Speaker 2: No, no. The only good nuclear testing we did was

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Speaker 2: back in the day when they used to set off

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Speaker 2: nukes right outside of Vegas and so all of the

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Speaker 2: Vegas people would watch the nukes go off and then

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Speaker 2: get irradiated. That was that was kind of funny. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Also they also were radiated the area fifty one people

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Speaker 1: one time, and that was also extremely fun.

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Speaker 2: They sure did. And there was that like guy, I

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Speaker 2: think it was uranium. There was like one of the

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Speaker 2: dudes who was on the Manhattan Project. There was this

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Speaker 2: like dude who there was like an accident and he

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Speaker 2: just sucked down a bunch of nuclear fuel and they

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Speaker 2: had to like he could never work in a lab

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Speaker 2: again after that, and he every for like decades afterwards.

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Speaker 2: His breath tested positive for like radioactivity, but he loved

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Speaker 2: to be like eighty something like it didn't it doesn't

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Speaker 2: seem to have heard him. He said it tasted kind

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Speaker 2: of like like sour candy.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so he's tasted there forbidden nuclear water. Yeah, no

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Speaker 1: one else has to. Now we know what it tastes like.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh oh yeah. Donald Donald Mastik was he was

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Speaker 2: sprayed in the face with liquid plutonium chloride and swallowed some.

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Speaker 2: But apparently that's fine, So there you go. Everybody drinks

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Speaker 2: some plutonium, you'll live a long life.

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Speaker 1: So the US, I guess, I guess also tests it

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Speaker 1: on their nuclear scientists. But yeah, so that those were

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Speaker 1: the US. The USSR testa nukes and Kazakhstan, which there's

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Speaker 1: an amazing story about Barria going where there's nobody. Nobody

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Speaker 1: lives in this part. Nobody lives in Kazakstan, so we'll

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Speaker 1: be fine.

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Speaker 2: Mm hmm.

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Speaker 1: It's like, okay, Baria, people, in fact you live there.

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Speaker 1: China tests this nukes on a site called lop Nor,

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Speaker 1: which is in shing John because of course it is,

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Speaker 1: and the French do their test in the Sahara in

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Speaker 1: Algeria until the Algerian Revolution forces them out, which good

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Speaker 1: for them, death of betrayers, the Algerian Workers' councils, et cetera,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. But this means that the French

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Speaker 1: now no longer being able to bomb like thesessions in

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Speaker 1: Algae area. Yeah, they they they start testing the nuclear

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Speaker 1: weapons on particularly the Moreau. I don't know how to

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Speaker 1: pronounce this summarily sorry, what is a toll in the

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Speaker 1: in the south the South Pacific?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that sounds close enough.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, Yeah, And so they they start these tests

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Speaker 1: like in secret. So there are there are people on

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Speaker 1: islands nearby who don't know that Theo's nukes going off,

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Speaker 1: Like they don't even have bomb shelters. Right, it's really

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Speaker 1: allowed these days.

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Speaker 2: Anybody notice how loud it's gotten here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, you know, you could see the fucking

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Speaker 1: mushroom cloud right Like these people, you know, the French

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Speaker 1: military sciences are like, oh, it's fine, They're not going

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Speaker 1: to be in the fall out. They're unbelievably in the

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Speaker 1: fallout radius.

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Speaker 2: If anyone ever tells you you're not in a fallout radius.

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Speaker 2: That's your first sign that you are, in fact in

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Speaker 2: a fallout radius.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's never it's never a great it's never a

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Speaker 1: great sign. I don't think that's happening.

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Speaker 2: I don't think anyone has ever assured a group of

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Speaker 2: people that they're not going to be exposed to radiation

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Speaker 2: and been telling the truth.

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Speaker 1: Here's the thing. Here's the thing. If if they had

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Speaker 1: merely gone to these people and said you're not going

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Speaker 1: to be exposed to radiation, it would have been better,

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Speaker 1: because then then at least it would have had a chance.

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Speaker 1: They just didn't tell these people at all. They were

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Speaker 1: testing a news sure, they just blew it up great,

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Speaker 1: and so they detonate like they detonate nukes all over Polynesia.

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Speaker 1: In Actually a few years ago, there was a there

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Speaker 1: was a thing called the Moreau Files, which was a

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Speaker 1: bunch of investigative journalist Scots together. They got a bunch

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Speaker 1: of classified French military documents. They did they got some

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Speaker 1: scientists together, and they did a whole thing about you know,

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Speaker 1: the sort of influence that the effects of this nuclear

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Speaker 1: testing has. And I'm just going to read from that quote.

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Speaker 1: According to our calculations based on a scientific reassessment of

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Speaker 1: the doses received, approximately one hundred and ten thousand people

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Speaker 1: were infected, almost the entire Polynesian population at the time time.

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Speaker 1: Good god, so they radiated like the entire population of Polynesia.

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Speaker 1: This is this is great.

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Speaker 2: So I mean that's not ideal. That's not ideal. I'll

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Speaker 2: give them that.

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Speaker 1: And Okay, so I obviously nuclear testing has negative effects

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Speaker 1: on humans. I feel like I don't need to explain

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Speaker 1: how nuclear testing has Dropping a nuclear bomb on a

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Speaker 1: place has a negative effect on the environment, that seems sure.

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Speaker 1: Are you sure?

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Speaker 2: Pretty obvious? I think we're all more or less caught

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Speaker 2: up on nuking things being bad for them, except well,

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Speaker 2: except for underwater aquatic lizards, which seem to do really

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Speaker 2: well when exposed to nuclear tests.

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Speaker 1: Yeah they look, they can. They have atomic breath.

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Speaker 2: Now they've got absolutely yeah, big big. They get to

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Speaker 2: star in a movie with a surprising number of members

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Speaker 2: of the cast of Simpsons. Yeah, it's it's all, it's

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Speaker 2: all upsee. Oh and that Ferris Buehler I think was

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Speaker 2: in it. So that's pretty good. Yeah, did these people

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Speaker 2: get to star in a movie with Ferris bueller, No.

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Speaker 1: They died of radiation poisons.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's unfortunate. That's unfortunate.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and so these tests and some other tests of

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Speaker 1: the US are doing. The Marshall Islands are the origin

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Speaker 1: of Green Piece. So there there have been environmental groups

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Speaker 1: like the Sierra Club have been involved in anti nuclear

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Speaker 1: activism because again, bad, bad for the environment, dropping dukes.

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Speaker 1: But okay, so the activism that the Sierra Club people

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Speaker 1: are doing is based on bearing witness, and the Green

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Speaker 1: Piece people rightly are like, fuck bury witness. They are

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Speaker 1: dropping nuclear bombs. We are going to try to stop

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Speaker 1: these bastards.

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Speaker 4: The way you can beat a bad guy with the

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Speaker 4: nuclear bomb is a good guy with the nuclear bomb.

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Speaker 4: I'm introducing a new initiative to arm all Green Peace members. Okay,

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Speaker 4: the personal, personal tactical nuke no da crocket.

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Speaker 1: This is this is I am not kidding. France's rationale

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Speaker 1: for why they have nukes, which is that the thing

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Speaker 1: is literally called like this like the weak deterring the

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Speaker 1: strong or something. And it's like, ma'am, you are France,

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Speaker 1: Like come on, okay, yeah, sure, France is acting for

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Speaker 1: the protection of the week against the strong.

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Speaker 2: It's like, oh, my I mean, look, I would, if

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Speaker 2: I had the option, I would keep a nuke in

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Speaker 2: my basement, you know, just in case, Yeah, someone someone

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Speaker 2: comes to my house. You know, we've got I've got

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Speaker 2: the option then, right, like what what if? Because like

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Speaker 2: right now, okay, say Pakistan decides to try to rob

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Speaker 2: my house. I don't have a counter to their nuclear arsenal.

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Speaker 2: But if I keep you know, and I'm not even

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Speaker 2: talking about like six to ten megatons in my basement,

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Speaker 2: that's enough, I think to discourage aggression. Right or if

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Speaker 2: like my neighbor decides to call the city on me,

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Speaker 2: you know, I've got an option.

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Speaker 1: There's a problem with this plan, which to how are

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Speaker 1: you getting the nuke from your apartment to Pakistan?

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean it's if they come to my house, right,

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Speaker 2: that way I can I can nuke all of my

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Speaker 2: stuff so they won't want it, and that way they

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Speaker 2: won't rob me in the first place.

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Speaker 1: Right, This this makes about as much sense as actual

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Speaker 1: nuclear actual nuclear doctrine. Yeah, it's it's worked.

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Speaker 2: For decades, miya, Like, I don't know what your problem

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Speaker 2: is here. If it if it's worked for for all

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Speaker 2: of these great powers, you know it can work for me.

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Speaker 2: Or I could do what the British do and send

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Speaker 2: you know, some of my some of my people out.

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Speaker 2: I could send James or Garrison out underwater with a

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Speaker 2: nuclear weapon and just have them always waiting in the

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Speaker 2: sea to nuke my adversaries if somebody takes me out,

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Speaker 2: much like the British nuclear fleet. See, we we as a.

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Speaker 1: U when race are really good at coming up with

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Speaker 1: good ideas. We have our ideas. Our ideas are amazing,

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Speaker 1: they rock. We never have any bad ones.

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Speaker 2: It is funny that there's just like some guys who

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Speaker 2: are expected to like follow a dead man's orders at

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Speaker 2: the end of the world for unclear reasons. Like there's

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Speaker 2: just a letter and it's like, if all of your

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Speaker 2: loved ones die, open this letter and do whatever it says.

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Speaker 2: You are really funny when you think about them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so okay, So in the late sixties and EARI

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Speaker 1: seventy there's people who are like, this is a terrible idea,

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Speaker 1: we should not, in fact drop nuclear bombs. And these

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Speaker 1: groups in the late sixties become green Peace in nineteen

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventy two.

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Speaker 2: Okay, great for them, good for them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, so we've talked about the like the

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Speaker 1: French having to move the nuclear program into into the Pacific.

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Speaker 1: After being read out of Algeria, green Peace starts doing

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Speaker 1: direct actions against French nuclear testing mm hm and so so.

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Speaker 1: In nineteen seventy two, Dave mctagger's, one of the founders

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Speaker 1: of Greenpeace, sails his boat into a French nuclear testing area. Now, okay,

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Speaker 1: I I I have my issues sort of in principle

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Speaker 1: with like nonviolence as you're like pure organizing political principle.

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Speaker 1: But if you are willing to sail your boat under

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Speaker 1: a nuclear bomb to stop it from going off, that

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Speaker 1: is that is pretty based.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, man, I have trouble. I have trouble like coming

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Speaker 2: up with any any any critiques of that.

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Speaker 1: No, this rips and like the other thing is like,

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Speaker 1: you know, this isn't This isn't a stunt, right, like

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Speaker 1: they are they are actually prepared to get nuked.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, No, that's that seems like a pretty commitment.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that it's it's sick. And so they refuse to

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Speaker 1: leave and the French, the French Navy eventually gets so

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Speaker 1: pissed off that a French Navy ship rams their boat

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Speaker 1: like a fucking try ream in.

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Speaker 2: Where to get them alone.

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Speaker 1: So they're they're forced out because they're rammed by a

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Speaker 1: triream I of us. We've all been there, so sometimes

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Speaker 1: sometimes you just get you just get rammed. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: it happens so true. So they they green Peace tries

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Speaker 1: to go to the International Court of Justice to get

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Speaker 1: a ruling to force France to stop the testing, and

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Speaker 1: the French government steaks out what I I I claim

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Speaker 1: is like the primary status political principle, which is that

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Speaker 1: what is justice to a man holding a gun? And

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Speaker 1: they just absolutely ignore the International Court of Justice. So

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Speaker 1: they in ninety seventy four, they're trying to do another

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Speaker 1: set of nuclear tests and this time, you know, so

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Speaker 1: green Peace is like, okay, well we're gonna we're gonna

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Speaker 1: send like a flotilla of boats out this time.

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Speaker 4: Did you just say a flotilla?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Is that a word? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, that's a group of boats.

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Speaker 4: Scarce, that's like a that's like a murder of crows thing.

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Speaker 1: No, yeah, but it's a very common name for a

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Speaker 1: bunch of boats.

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Speaker 4: I've never I've never heard that before.

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Speaker 2: Now you have flotilla, Yeah. L Ron Hubbard had a

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Speaker 2: flotilla of boats that he made Teenager's pilot and jump

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Speaker 2: off of when he was angry at them.

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Speaker 1: You know, I was thinking about this. I think this

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Speaker 1: is actually the first flotilla of boats that we've had

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Speaker 1: on any of our shows that.

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Speaker 2: Is good, that's not that's not commanded by l Ron Hubbard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, or like the Moodies, it's a it's a whole

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Speaker 1: it's a whole sort of line of bad. But this

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Speaker 1: is this is a good flotilla. But the Navy this

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Speaker 1: time is like, Okay, we're not going to mess around

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Speaker 1: with these people, like and you know, let them get

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Speaker 1: inside the testing zone.

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Speaker 4: Uh.

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Speaker 1: They so they just bored mctabart's ship and just beat

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Speaker 1: the shit out of him and his crew. And so

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Speaker 1: the the the French Navy claims that like, oh, the

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Speaker 1: Green Peace people just like turned around on their own,

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Speaker 1: and uh, mctiggert, you know, Tiger's like very badly visibly hurt.

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Speaker 1: So he like shows up to the press and the

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Speaker 1: French Navy goes, oh, I mean he's like mctiger is

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Speaker 1: like he is he he is, but blind in one

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Speaker 1: eye for several months, like he is very very badly beaten,

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Speaker 1: and the French Navy claims that was actually the result

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Speaker 1: of a fall, which I will allow you to draw

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Speaker 1: your own conclusions. Adure. Yeah, I'll I'll let you draw

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Speaker 1: your own conclusions. But parallels between the state and domestic abusers.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, Unfortunately for the French Navy, the green Peace

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Speaker 1: crew have managed to like get the beatings on camera,

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Speaker 1: and they're able to smuggle like the film canister off

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Speaker 1: the boat and get it to the newspapers, and so

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Speaker 1: the newspapers the next day just have a bunch of

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Speaker 1: like pictures showing the French Navy just beating the shit

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Speaker 1: out of these like random green piece people, and this

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Speaker 1: eventually actually works. Right, there's there's there's sort of there's

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's there's a sort of political pressure campaign

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Speaker 1: that Greenpeace is waging. There are these there are these

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Speaker 1: campaigns in the French courts to get the government to stop,

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Speaker 1: and eventually, in nineteen seventy four, the French government agrees

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Speaker 1: to stop conducting atmospheric tests and nuclear weapons. Now, Robert,

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Speaker 1: do you know who else stopped conducting atmospheric testing after

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Speaker 1: years of public pressure campaigns? The US and the USSR, Yes,

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Speaker 1: but also the products and services.

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Speaker 2: Oh that supports this podcast. Yeah, no, I meant most

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Speaker 2: of them. Most of them. Ah, we're back, and you

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Speaker 2: know that I'm hearing now that we did have an

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Speaker 2: ad from Blue Apron in there, who does continue like

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Speaker 2: low earth orbit atmospheric nuclear weapons testing. But you know,

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Speaker 2: it's the only way to get your food boxes to

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Speaker 2: you in a timely manner. They have to use the

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Speaker 2: Orian drive, which is a special spacecraft engine that relies

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Speaker 2: on popping nuclear weapons out of the back of a

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Speaker 2: spaceship and using them to accelerate it to near light speed.

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Speaker 2: It's actually that's a you can look that up. It's

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Speaker 2: a pretty cool idea. We should do it.

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Speaker 1: It is very funny to me that it's like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: we have this incredibly convoluted drive that's powered by nuclear

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Speaker 1: weapons and it gets you to around the speed of light.

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Speaker 2: Maybe it's it's not even convoluted. It's literally just the

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Speaker 2: spaceship poops out of nuke and it makes it go faster. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's a fun idea. I'm gonna be honest with you.

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Speaker 2: I think it's a fun idea.

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Speaker 1: Is but like it can't even get you to like

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Speaker 1: the next Solar System very fast.

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Speaker 2: Well, nothing probably ever can, which is why we're all

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Speaker 2: doomed to die alone in the dark.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, very sad. Other thing that's sad, Okay, So the

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Speaker 1: French government agrees to stop doing tests in the atmosphere, right, however,

403
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Speaker 1: this is just atmospheric tests. I never agreed to stop

404
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Speaker 1: doing like non atmospheric tests. So in nineteen eighty five,

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Speaker 1: the French government is gearing up to do another round

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Speaker 1: of nuclear testing, and green Peace is once again bringing

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Speaker 1: a flotilla to try to stop them. Now green Peace

408
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Speaker 1: are already in nineteen eighty five, they've been involved in

409
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Speaker 1: another anti nuclear well okay, really it's this, it's all

410
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Speaker 1: the same anti nuclear campaign. But so the other people

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Speaker 1: who are dropping nukes in the Pacific are the US.

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Speaker 1: And when they they nuke the Marshall Islands, the people

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Speaker 1: of this island called Runga Lap began suffering from radiation exposure,

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Speaker 1: even though they were also once again told by the

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Speaker 1: American government that they were fine. And so the US

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Speaker 1: is going to drop another nuke and they refuse to

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Speaker 1: evacuate these people, and so green Peace like brings their boats,

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Speaker 1: like brings the Rainbow Warrior, and so these people ask

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Speaker 1: like green Peace for help. So green Peace like evacuates

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Speaker 1: them all to another island and like brings like construction

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Speaker 1: materials and supply so they can like set up on

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Speaker 1: a new island. And it's this really I don't know,

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Speaker 1: it's it's a really sort of grim look into what,

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Speaker 1: you know, like what this nucrot has that actually means,

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Speaker 1: which is that a bunch of people who've been living

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Speaker 1: in a place for hundreds of years are forced to

427
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Speaker 1: flee for their lives, like you know, the state won't

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Speaker 1: the state won't even like ethnically cleanse them, right, like

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Speaker 1: they are forcibly relocated from their homes, but the state

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Speaker 1: won't even do it because the state's like, no, it's fine,

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Speaker 1: you're just gonna die radiation poisoning. And so they have

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Speaker 1: to get someone else to like move them, and it's,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, it's really bleak. These people survive, which

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Speaker 1: is good, but the US doing neucrotesting in the Marshall Islands,

435
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:36,000
Speaker 1: which I'm betting at least forty percent of you don't

436
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:43,920
Speaker 1: know of the US control. Yeah, it sucks, so okay,

437
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:47,600
Speaker 1: So they get done with this evacuation, they're back in

438
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,439
Speaker 1: Auckland and then their flagship they're able to Worrior gets bombed,

439
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,880
Speaker 1: and Greenpeace talks later about how they actually got really

440
00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:57,640
Speaker 1: lucky because you know, when I remember when I said earlier,

441
00:22:57,640 --> 00:22:59,640
Speaker 1: there are people who were still awake, like playing cards.

442
00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:02,600
Speaker 1: If those people had been in their cabins, a bunch

443
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 1: of them basically would have drowned immediately because the cabins

444
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:08,080
Speaker 1: got flooded instantly by the first bomb. So they got

445
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:13,800
Speaker 1: very lucky. Only one person died. I to this day,

446
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,239
Speaker 1: I do not understand why the people who did this

447
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:19,720
Speaker 1: thought they could do this without killing anyone. It's baffling

448
00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:23,919
Speaker 1: to me. I don't know. At least they claim they

449
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,560
Speaker 1: weren't trying to kill anyone. So New Zealand police start investigating.

450
00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:31,159
Speaker 1: You know, hey, there's been a like a terrorist attack

451
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 1: on a boat in our harbor.

452
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 2: Sure, and that seems like a thing you'd look into. Yeah,

453
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:36,400
Speaker 2: I get that.

454
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 1: They get very, very lucky. And they get lucky because

455
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:41,639
Speaker 1: there are two people in this boating club who are

456
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:43,720
Speaker 1: like watching the harbor trying to see if it like

457
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:47,080
Speaker 1: trying to catch someone who's been stealing diving equipment. And

458
00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:49,120
Speaker 1: in the middle of the night they see a man

459
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:53,959
Speaker 1: in a black wetsuit carrying a Zodiac inflatable speedboat ashore

460
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:57,399
Speaker 1: and get into a fan. Now, okay, so it's including

461
00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:59,639
Speaker 1: me which bottle of Zodiac? This is for people not

462
00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 1: familiar with boats. Zodiac makes something called the mill Pro,

463
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 1: which is a a like it's an inflatable speedboat that

464
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: is used by like most of the world's special forces units.

465
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 1: And so these two guys are like, this is really sketchy.

466
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:17,119
Speaker 1: They and so they they're you know, they put two

467
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,199
Speaker 1: and two together when they realize that a boat's been

468
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: blown up, and they're like, oh my god, it was

469
00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,760
Speaker 1: probably these guys. So they go to the police and

470
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 1: they're able to get the license plate of the van,

471
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 1: and so the staff at this like van depot have

472
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,000
Speaker 1: to like sit there and like stall the two people

473
00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:35,000
Speaker 1: in the van and keep them from leaving long enough

474
00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 1: for the cops to show up with something. I really

475
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:41,320
Speaker 1: really desperately want a video of this just sounds really funny.

476
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,600
Speaker 2: I do love the idea of like the average people

477
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 2: who work at like a car rental company being asked like, hey,

478
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,359
Speaker 2: could you do like a little bit of counter terrorism

479
00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 2: for us today? Just like a sco SHIVI it in

480
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 2: between denying people rentals because they don't have a credit card.

481
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:02,040
Speaker 1: It's amazing and okay, So that the cops show up

482
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:04,320
Speaker 1: and they arrest these this couple who are claiming to

483
00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:07,800
Speaker 1: be newly weds, but the New Zealand government quickly discovers

484
00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:14,919
Speaker 1: that both these people have forged passports from Sweden, and

485
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:18,920
Speaker 1: so they discover their real names. And uh, by god,

486
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:22,000
Speaker 1: is that the mercies? That is a man with Get

487
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:25,200
Speaker 1: it is the French c I A. They have planted

488
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,960
Speaker 1: this bomb and there's the French.

489
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:32,960
Speaker 4: Ci A called hold on, because we can't just say

490
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:34,159
Speaker 4: the French c I A.

491
00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 1: It's the Directorate General for External Security or the g

492
00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 1: s E. That's a much worse much Definitely.

493
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 4: We're gonna we're gonna go back to calling it the French.

494
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm gonna read the secret police. I think we

495
00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:53,160
Speaker 2: can all agree. Secret police need to have three letter

496
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 2: acrons C I A, g R, U, F B I. Like,

497
00:25:56,680 --> 00:26:00,320
Speaker 2: it just doesn't work with four. You need to have

498
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:03,639
Speaker 2: one kind of sinister sounding name, like the maccabaat but

499
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:08,159
Speaker 2: like the DGS. Oh my, I'm sorry that sounds like

500
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:12,359
Speaker 2: a bank. Yeah, I mean it is, the it's the

501
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:13,440
Speaker 2: Direction General.

502
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:18,280
Speaker 1: Get it. Daggs absolutely trash.

503
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 2: You have been you have been suppressing people for so long,

504
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:25,280
Speaker 2: and you don't have a better secret police name than that.

505
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:26,119
Speaker 2: That's shameful.

506
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:28,640
Speaker 1: Yeah. By the way, their address A six.

507
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,479
Speaker 2: That's a great fucking name for your secret name.

508
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: Good, incredible or.

509
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 2: Am I five whatever the real one is.

510
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:36,560
Speaker 1: Yeah. Anyways, if you if you ever want to go

511
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 1: like take a visit to these people, they're at their

512
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 1: headquarters is on one forty one Boulevard Mortier, Paris, France.

513
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 1: It's at forty eight eighty seven forty four north to

514
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:51,680
Speaker 1: four oh six seven. Elude.

515
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,119
Speaker 2: I don't need to go back to France. Yeah, go

516
00:26:54,160 --> 00:27:02,439
Speaker 2: fuck with the DGSSE. I'm not that big a It's fine.

517
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,680
Speaker 1: So they catch these agents whose names are I shit,

518
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:11,040
Speaker 1: you not Gene Camas and Jean Luke Kisstaire.

519
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 2: No, yeah, that makes sense.

520
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 1: No, So the police catch these two, there's like ten

521
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 1: to other well, there's like eight other people involved. Two

522
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: of them get I think like maybe two one or

523
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:27,520
Speaker 1: two of them get caught in Australia. But the Australian

524
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:29,359
Speaker 1: police aren't able to hold them long enough for the

525
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 1: forensic evidence to come in, so they have to release

526
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 1: them and they flee and there's this whole thing where

527
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:35,960
Speaker 1: like they flee at a yacht and then again on

528
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,639
Speaker 1: a submarine and the submarine shoots the yacht to sink it.

529
00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:43,119
Speaker 1: As it's a whole thing, and I actually, okay, it

530
00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 1: probably is worth mentioning here that as as as silly

531
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 1: as the French CIA's name sound name sounds like, they

532
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:53,560
Speaker 1: have one of the most extensive networks of surveillance, the

533
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: sabotage of any intelligence agency in the world. It never

534
00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:00,880
Speaker 1: gets talked about, but they have people everywhere. They are lethal.

535
00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:08,400
Speaker 1: They absolutely suck. But yeah, so they get caught and

536
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:15,920
Speaker 1: the French order an investigation, and their first investigation concludes

537
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 1: that like, well, we asked, well, okay, so these people

538
00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:20,679
Speaker 1: are our spies, right, but we just asked them the

539
00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:22,679
Speaker 1: spy on green Peace. We didn't ask them to do

540
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 1: a bombing. And everyone's like okay, yeah, sure, French government.

541
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 1: So the French yeah yeah, well no, okay, so you

542
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:35,040
Speaker 1: you you may have caught two of our spies dragging

543
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:37,159
Speaker 1: a Zodiac boat. Well with a guy, a guy at

544
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 1: a website dragged zodiac boat into a van, but doesn't

545
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 1: mean he did the bombing. And the French media does

546
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: their own investigation and like quickly concludes that like not

547
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:48,240
Speaker 1: not only did the French order the bombing, the bombing

548
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 1: was personally signed off on by French Defensive Minister Charles

549
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:58,080
Speaker 1: Herdu and also quite possibly French President Frenchois Mitterrand.

550
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 2: And well, okay, at least Mitaarran's got a good name

551
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 2: for an evil president.

552
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, this is interesting, right because if you know

553
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 1: your French history, for tho those of you who know

554
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 1: your French history, you will note that Midiarran is a

555
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,400
Speaker 1: man to the French left. He's the prime minister, he's

556
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 1: the president from the from France's Socialist party.

557
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 3: Right.

558
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 1: He has like, okay, he has a program of amnesty

559
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 1: for Italian communist terrorists. Were like, if you're able to

560
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: make it to France, they won't extradut you.

561
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 2: That's pretty cool.

562
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:28,240
Speaker 4: The communists would never have a new killer bomb.

563
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 1: So it's very famously on Antonio Negri, who's the guy

564
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 1: who writes a bunch of books that are very famous

565
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 1: in the early two thousands, he's like, he's one of

566
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 1: the founders of the Autonomists. He flees to he uses

567
00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 1: this to flee to France after the Italian government accused

568
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,239
Speaker 1: him of being the mastermind of the Red Brigades, who

569
00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:48,600
Speaker 1: had just kidnapped and killed for more Prime Minister Alden Morrow.

570
00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 1: So Negrid gets himself parliamentary immunity by getting elected as

571
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:54,720
Speaker 1: an MP and then flees to France, which is just

572
00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:57,880
Speaker 1: very funny, and then Metaran refuses to extra d item.

573
00:29:57,920 --> 00:29:59,440
Speaker 1: So okay. So on the one that you would think

574
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,280
Speaker 1: that midiran And is like, I don't know, kind of

575
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 1: cool I.

576
00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 4: I don't, I don't think so, I don't.

577
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Miniran I okay. So in terms of sort

578
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:13,840
Speaker 1: of being sympathetic, Midran is like a is a kind

579
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:18,000
Speaker 1: of different kind of neoliberal than the kind that we

580
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:20,400
Speaker 1: that we sort of know. So I would classify in

581
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 1: terms of sort of neoliberal like neoliberal politicians right, like

582
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 1: neoliberal heads of countries. I think there's sort of like

583
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 1: three kinds of them. There are sort of the right

584
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:32,160
Speaker 1: wing hardliners people like Thatcher, like Pinochet and Reagan. The

585
00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 1: Reagan's weirdly, Reagan is slightly less hardline than like Thatcher is.

586
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,720
Speaker 1: But yeah, so okay, so there's no there's those people.

587
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 1: There's the sort of like third way neoliberals like Clinton,

588
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,680
Speaker 1: and Tony Blair, who are like I guess like liberals

589
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 1: in the American sense, but are still sort of like

590
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,880
Speaker 1: real hardliners on economics. And then there's a group of

591
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 1: people I would call like the the quote unquote socialist neoliberals,

592
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:59,800
Speaker 1: like Midrans and Italy's longtime Socialist Party prime minister Betino,

593
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,720
Speaker 1: Like I don't know if I can actually call him

594
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 1: the most corrupt man in Italian politics, but like he's

595
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 1: like at least in the top five, but he's prime

596
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 1: minister for like twenty years, and he's also like this,

597
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:14,440
Speaker 1: So these are these are people who are nominally socialist

598
00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:17,479
Speaker 1: and we'll talk about like doing socialism, but then are

599
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 1: also like implementing neoliberalism. And you know, I think the

600
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: closest thing to this in the US is like if

601
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 1: Carter had beaten Reagan, we still would have gotten neoliberalism,

602
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 1: but it would have been sort of like softer than

603
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 1: it was under Reagan. So you know, you have your

604
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 1: sort of kinder, gentular form of neoliberalism. And do you

605
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 1: know who else advocates for a kinder, ingentular form of neoliberalism?

606
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:45,560
Speaker 2: Oh not Blue Apron No, they support going right back

607
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 2: to the old days. We're talking like East India Trading Company.

608
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:53,600
Speaker 2: In fact, as we speak, Blue Aprons flotilla is on

609
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:57,040
Speaker 2: the coast of India right now, ready ready to try

610
00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 2: their hand at making another raj in Calcutta.

611
00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 1: I wish you could all see Garrison's face.

612
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 3: It's amazing, It's fine, it's fine.

613
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 2: Ah, we're back.

614
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: So all right. The consequence of this is that, you know,

615
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,880
Speaker 1: despite the fact that Midaran is like nominally a socialist,

616
00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,720
Speaker 1: he is completely committed to nuclear testing as part of

617
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 1: his nuclear deterrence program.

618
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:32,640
Speaker 4: Funny funny, How that funny? How that always happens?

619
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know. Now, supporting colonialism is not out of

620
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 1: character for veteran who is part of a previous coalition

621
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 1: government in the fifties had presided over the guillotining of

622
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:49,960
Speaker 1: Algerian rebels. But his his reaction to his government and

623
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 1: possibly also him personally bombing the Rainbow Warrior is not good. Yeah,

624
00:32:57,000 --> 00:32:59,720
Speaker 1: that's nice to hear, at least not a not a

625
00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:02,840
Speaker 1: great look, buddy. Yeah. So so, because French people are

626
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:06,480
Speaker 1: extremely normal, the reaction in the French public about their

627
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,440
Speaker 1: government carrying out a terrorist attack is that there's a

628
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: giant nationalist upswell, and people get really angry because they're

629
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 1: demanding that the two French intelligence agents who again are

630
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:22,560
Speaker 1: serving ten year manslaughter sentences in New Zealand for bombing

631
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 1: a ship involved in non violent civil disobedience in the

632
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 1: harbor of a country that France is not at war with.

633
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 1: People are mad that they are like being held in

634
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,280
Speaker 1: prison and they're demanding they be released.

635
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 4: That makes sense from like the French nationalists sides.

636
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:42,120
Speaker 2: It's the French far right.

637
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:45,480
Speaker 1: They're pretty pretty far right, like like again like they

638
00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 1: lots like lots of just like non far right people

639
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 1: in France get involved in this, and they had this

640
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: whole thing about the way they talk about it is

641
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: amazing that they talk about it in terms of liberating them.

642
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 1: It's like they just murdered a guy with a bomb,

643
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 1: like the multiple but they used two bines to blow

644
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 1: this ship up. Like And so the Minigan's government's response

645
00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:11,920
Speaker 1: is they start putting sanctions on New Zealand's exports.

646
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 4: That's funny, that's funny.

647
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:16,560
Speaker 1: And this is this is a huge deal for New

648
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 1: Zealand because there they have a you know, New Zealand's

649
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 1: economy is like in large part in agricultural based export economy,

650
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 1: and they export just an enormous amount of cheese to France.

651
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:28,319
Speaker 4: I did not know that.

652
00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, so I New Zealand is like one of

653
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: the words leading dairy producers.

654
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:32,919
Speaker 2: Yeah.

655
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:36,600
Speaker 4: I thought they mostly just made those like elfin Dwarf

656
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:37,800
Speaker 4: and Wizard movies.

657
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,000
Speaker 2: But oh yeah, I mean they do make a lot

658
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 2: of money producing limbus cakes, which which can keep you

659
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:45,080
Speaker 2: going for an entire week.

660
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,040
Speaker 1: You know, I'm realizing, I'm realizing now I'm not gared.

661
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 1: Do you know the story of how of how New

662
00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,920
Speaker 1: Zealand was like dragged into supporting the Iraq war and

663
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: sending troops to a rock? No, okay, okay, I need

664
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 1: to tell the stories. I'm realizing there's some of our

665
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 1: listeners who might not have heard this a lot time

666
00:35:00,239 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 1: I told the story. Okay, So in the Wiki leaks papers,

667
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:07,440
Speaker 1: it comes out that New Zealand. New Zealand sent troops

668
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 1: to a rock because so New Zealand had had a

669
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: milk for oil program where they would trade milk to

670
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,840
Speaker 1: a rock for oil, and the US threatened that after

671
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 1: the after they invaded a Rock, they were going to

672
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 1: cut off the milk for oil deal. And this was

673
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:26,720
Speaker 1: this was like Fonterra. They're like the giant, Like milk

674
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 1: Cooperative in in New Zealand was so powerful, and the

675
00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:33,839
Speaker 1: New Zealand government was like, fine, don't don't don't cut

676
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:37,480
Speaker 1: off our dairy, our milk for oil program, we will

677
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 1: go to war. So yet New ze New Zealand. New

678
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 1: Zealand did not go to war from oil. And New

679
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:43,760
Speaker 1: Zealand went to war for the milk market.

680
00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:46,880
Speaker 2: And and that's why we called it a coalition of

681
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:54,319
Speaker 2: the willing yep. New Zealand is a truly a cursive place.

682
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 2: And and you know, and the it is. I don't think

683
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 2: New Zealand's the cursed one, and that is true.

684
00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 1: But they also like, this is the this is the

685
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:05,600
Speaker 1: second time that New Zealand is going to capitulate to

686
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:08,520
Speaker 1: like through the demands of a violating perialists in order

687
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:09,840
Speaker 1: to save their cheese market.

688
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 2: I mean, that's that's like a fair criticism of New Zealand.

689
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:17,040
Speaker 2: But as an American, I do feel like I don't

690
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 2: really have much room to like talk shit on this particular.

691
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:24,600
Speaker 1: It is our fault that this is happening.

692
00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just am not gonna blame New Zealand for this, Okay,

693
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:28,680
Speaker 2: that's fair.

694
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 1: That's fair. I will kind of blame them for this one.

695
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:35,040
Speaker 1: This is also France's fault. So what what they're able

696
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:37,880
Speaker 1: to do is they're able to well, okay partially also

697
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 1: so like eight of the other people who are involved

698
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:44,239
Speaker 1: in this bombing like are just got out free, and

699
00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:46,000
Speaker 1: so New Zealand is like, hey, will you guys like

700
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:47,520
Speaker 1: send us these people so we can try them in

701
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 1: fact like no, absolutely not, in fact, we will impost

702
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,759
Speaker 1: sanctions on you. And what they're able to do is

703
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:55,440
Speaker 1: they're able to force New Zealand to like enter youn

704
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,040
Speaker 1: arbitration even though again they've already arrested and convicted these

705
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,680
Speaker 1: two guys right because they obviously did it, and the

706
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,319
Speaker 1: un and typical un fashion goes okay, So France is

707
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 1: powerful and New Zealand isn't, so fuck them, and they

708
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 1: negotiate a deal where like these two French officers are

709
00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:14,640
Speaker 1: gonna be like released and stationed in this like tiny

710
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 1: island at the French control for three years. And so

711
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:22,239
Speaker 1: the French doesn't they don't even do that. They pull

712
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:27,400
Speaker 1: these guys out in less than two years. So New

713
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: Zealand is doesn't. It doesn't go great I mean, I

714
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: don't know. I say it doesn't go great for them

715
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:38,480
Speaker 1: in the short term, they suffer a series of catastrophic defeats.

716
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 1: In the mid term. The French eventually get ordered to

717
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:43,680
Speaker 1: pay eight point one million dollars to Greenpeace, who use

718
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:46,680
Speaker 1: the money to make another boat called a Rable Warrior

719
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:51,040
Speaker 1: two and continue to like sale fleets to stop French

720
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:55,040
Speaker 1: nuclear testing. And I'm gonna I'm gonna read some green

721
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: Peace's website quote. In nineteen ninety five, the Rainbow Warrior

722
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 1: two was bordered by French com as it led further

723
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:05,840
Speaker 1: protests against nuclear testing Amia Toll. When green Peace activists

724
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 1: were asked for their names, they only gave one, Fernando Perieira,

725
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 1: which is the name of the guy who the French

726
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 1: had killed earlier. So they have their I'm Spartacus moments,

727
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: and you know, eventually it takes a very very long time,

728
00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:25,720
Speaker 1: but they win. In nineteen ninety six, France and China

729
00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 1: do like one last nuclear test and then signed the

730
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 1: Comprehensive Nuclear Test Ban Treaty. Indian and Pakistan do a

731
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 1: pair test each in nineteen eighty nine, but since then

732
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:38,720
Speaker 1: no country has tested a nuclear weapon except North Korea

733
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 1: who does it all the time. But you know, I

734
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:44,920
Speaker 1: don't know what Greenpeace is supposed to do about North

735
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 1: Korea testing nuclear weapons.

736
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:49,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look, you can't and it is I

737
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:53,719
Speaker 2: will say this, like from a real politique point of view,

738
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:56,320
Speaker 2: you know, there's an argument to be made that, like, yeah,

739
00:38:56,400 --> 00:39:01,880
Speaker 2: the the kind of balance of nuclear power certainly provides

740
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:04,680
Speaker 2: a degree of protection to some countries. But my argument

741
00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:09,320
Speaker 2: would be not having tested your weapons makes them more frightening.

742
00:39:09,360 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 2: If you're France and you're like, look, man, anyone who

743
00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,360
Speaker 2: tests us. We don't know what's gonna happen when we

744
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 2: fire these things. We don't know if they're going to

745
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 2: go to the right place. We have no idea what

746
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:19,400
Speaker 2: will happen when we fire our nukes. So come on

747
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,560
Speaker 2: and fuck with us, but literally anything could happen. That

748
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 2: just seems like a better threat to me.

749
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:29,120
Speaker 1: I'm not going to advocate that one, but.

750
00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 2: I think that's the stance. I think that's the stance.

751
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 2: You know, build increasingly large weapons and never test them

752
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:37,920
Speaker 2: so that we just know if shit goes down, we

753
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:38,839
Speaker 2: could all die.

754
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:44,880
Speaker 1: You know, Okay, well it doesn't it doesn't involve nuclear testing.

755
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:46,839
Speaker 1: So I'm coming around to this.

756
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 2: Position, never never test them. Just build increasingly large doomsday

757
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 2: devices and be like, no one knows what'll happen if

758
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:59,839
Speaker 2: we have a war. Why not, maybe none of them work.

759
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 2: We all get to really think about what we've been doing,

760
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:05,880
Speaker 2: you know.

761
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,800
Speaker 1: I in all seriously though, this is a massive victory.

762
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:11,360
Speaker 1: There are there are millions upon millions of people across

763
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:13,040
Speaker 1: the world, and millions of people who have yet to

764
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 1: be born who are going to live their lives free

765
00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:18,319
Speaker 1: of the effect of radiation poisoning because people stood up

766
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:19,360
Speaker 1: and fought nuclear testing.

767
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know.

768
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:22,800
Speaker 1: This is the message that I want to sort of

769
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 1: end Earth Day with with, which is the people who

770
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,480
Speaker 1: are destroying this world are incredibly powerful, and they are

771
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 1: willing to kill protesters in order to keep their power

772
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:32,799
Speaker 1: and keep made me the world further. But if you

773
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:35,320
Speaker 1: just keep fighting them, no matter what that throw you,

774
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: if you just every every single time they hit you,

775
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:40,279
Speaker 1: if you just come back and keep fighting them again,

776
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 1: you can win. And this is this is the way

777
00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:44,240
Speaker 1: that it happens.

778
00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:48,000
Speaker 2: All right. Well, that's that's a good that's a nice

779
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:51,359
Speaker 2: that's a nice note to end on. So everybody get

780
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 2: out there.

781
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:56,080
Speaker 4: And getting nuked once and then everything's fine.

782
00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 1: Yeah.

783
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, get nuked once and you'll be okay. Like that

784
00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:04,359
Speaker 2: science to drink the plutonium. It's surprisingly easy to not

785
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:08,240
Speaker 2: die when you get exposed to unbelievable quantities of radiation.

786
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:12,719
Speaker 2: That seems like a responsible note to end on.

787
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 1: It Could Happen Here as a production of cool Zone Media.

788
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,840
Speaker 4: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

789
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:26,000
Speaker 4: coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

790
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:28,600
Speaker 4: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

791
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:31,240
Speaker 1: You can find sources for It Could Happen Here, updated

792
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:34,360
Speaker 1: monthly at coolzonemedia dot com slash sources.

793
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:35,360
Speaker 4: Thanks for listening,